Why Are You Gay? Milo Yiannopoulos Explains.

Of all the great memes and clips on the internet,  Fat Kid falls off bike being of course the top of. the list really in the last 13 years, 13 years  this week, almost nothing created on this planet. has surpassed in popularity or sheer hilarity an  interview that took place on Ugandan television. in December of 2012 on a show called Morning  Breeze, the morning show of Campala, Uganda. in which a trans activist, a woman who now  identifies as a man, came on and was asked.

a series of questions by the host. And if you  don't know what we're talking about, here is. a two-cond clip that reveals the essence of the  conversation. Why are you gay? Why are you gay? It's Let's play that again. Why are you gay? It's  still the funniest thing that's ever been on the. internet. But why is it funny? And why does almost  everyone find it funny? Left, right, straight,

gay? Well, because it's kind of the key question  and it's kind of the question that no one in the. United States is allowed to ask. Why are you gay?  And of course, it's being asked by an East African. with kind of a quaint semic-colonial accent. And  you know, conservatives can laugh at it, liberals. can laugh at it. Really, this is the kind of the  only way a white liberal in the United States.

could ever laugh at a black person. If it's an  African expressing non-PC views on homosexuality, why are you gay? And of course, people in the West  laugh because the guy's an idiot. Why are you gay? We all know why you're gay. Why are you gay?  Actually, we're laughing in part because we're. not allowed to ask that question. It's settled,  though no one's really explained what about it is. settled. If you were to ask the average American,  why are people gay? They would probably say, well, they're born that way. And then if you follow  it up with, well, how exactly does that work?

They would have no idea and tell you to shut up.  Because again, like so many myths or things that. we think we know, we don't really know. We  can't really explain it. But we do know for. dead certain, we're not allowed to talk about it.  So when some African morning show host in Uganda, wherever the hell that is, asks it out loud, we  can't help but laugh nervously, why are you gay? If you watch the whole interview, and actually  it's worth watching because it's really revealing. um both about Uganda and about the West, the first  thing you notice is how polite everybody is. That.

tone, why are you gay? continued throughout  the entire interview, which lasted over an. hour. just watched it and the morning show  host, whether you like him or dislike him, was just unfailingly polite to the guest who was  him or herself also unfailingly polite. And they. were just sort of talking past each other. The  trans activist couldn't really explain why he. or she was gay or whether gay was different from  trans or what was good about being gay. That was.

another question the host asked. Why would you  want to be gay? And the trans activist just like. didn't really have an answer. What was amazing was  the sweetness of it. It was not a hate crime. Was. not even approaching a hate crime. No conversation  like that could take place in the United States. But the host was coming from a position of total  certainty that this is just weird and wrong. And. that is the consensus in a lot of the world. And  it's certainly famously the consensus in Uganda.

and the consensus in the United States across  both parties and pretty much the whole educated. population is they're horrible because they think  homosexuality is wrong. And we know this because. about 10 years later in Uganda the legislature  passed almost unanimously with only I think one. dissenting vote a law against something called  aggravated homosexuality. Aggravated homosexuality. as of 2023 is a death penalty offense in Uganda.  What? Aggravated homosexuality? A death penalty.

offense? That's medieval. But how is it defined in  Uganda? Well, if you read it, and you can cuz it's. online, the Ugandan government defines aggregated  homosexuality as gay rape of children, gay rape of. the elderly who can't consent, people over 75,  gay rape of people who are mentally deficient,

and the intentional transmission of deadly  diseases to another person. So it's rape. and murder effectively are against the law. In  fact, capital crimes in Uganda. H it's a little. different than advertised, but you would never  know it because the entire American political. class erupted as one when this law passed in  East Africa, thousands of miles away, with a.

nonrelevant trading partner with no real military.  In other words, there's no actual reason to care. about what Uganda does. But everyone here did  care bipartisanly. And we're actually not going. to expect you to take our word for it. We're going  to go right to the CIA for the answer, meaning. Wikipedia. This is the Wikipedia description of  the response. President Joe Biden weighed in. This was two years ago. This is 2023. President  Joe Biden condemned the law, calling it quote, "a.

tragic violation of universal human rights." and  quote the latest development in an alarming trend. of human rights abuses and corruption in Uganda  corruption. So here the Ugandans the Ugandans. had the timmerity to exercise a democratic  process using a legislature elected by the. people of Uganda to pass a law almost unanimously  with one dissenting vote and that's corruption.

It's almost as corrupt as the anti-gay marriage  initiative in California that voters passed, but judges wisely struck down in the name of  democracy. Okay, so that was Biden's response. But it wasn't just Biden. Here's Senator  Ted Cruz, the self-described conservative. from Texas. Here's what he said. He tweeted  this. He put this in writing as he so often. does and we're quoting any law criminalizing  homosexuality or imposing the death penalty for. quote aggravated homosexuality is grotesque and  an abomination. All civilized nations to join to.

should join together in condemning this human  rights abuse. So, it's uncivilized to penalize. gay rape or the intentional transmission  of a deadly disease. That's uncivilized. Seems kind of civilized. But at the time,  nobody agreed. This was grotesque. The kind. of thing that only Africans would do. It's one  step up from cannibalism. Can you believe it?

Penalizing gay rape and the intent intentional  transmission of AIDS. What do I think of next? We'll throw you in a stew pot, savages. You'll  notice that uh Uncle Ted called it an abomination. and the Anglican Communion agreed. Here's  Justin Welby, the Archbishop of Canterbury, the leader of the rapidly dying Anglican  Communion, which would include the Episcopal. Church of the United States, the the State Church  of England. He wrote to the Archbishop of Uganda,

Christian brother to Christian brother to express  his quote grief and dismay at the Church of. Uganda's support for the Antihomosexuality Act.  The head of the Church of England was filled with. grief at the thought that rape would be banned  and the intentional transmission of AIDS, etc., etc. But it didn't stop with expressions of grief  and condemnation and tweets from Ted Cruz. No.

It got right to the hard stuff, to the things that  matter, meaning money and foreign aid. Here's the. World Bank. Immediately, the World Bank swings  into action. The World Bank announced it would. halt lending to Uganda response to the new law. No  more lending. No more money for you. We're cutting. you off. The financial institution noted that the  act quote fundamentally contradicts the World Bank. group's values. Oo, what are the World Bank's  values? That'd be interesting to know. You know,

in a sane country, contradicting the World  Bank's quote values would be uh a sign of virtue. Probably probably get a merit badge for that. But  the World Bank was outraged. They know sin when. they see it. banning gay rape. We'll tolerate a  lot, but not that. And then finally, Joe Biden in. October of 2023 spun fully into a frenzy at this  point, watching taking the lead of the World Bank,

announced that Uganda would be expelled from the  group of subsaharan African countries that benefit. from tax breaks under the US African Growth and  Opportunity Act, AGOA, because of the country's. quote gross violations of internationally  recognized human rights which violate the AGOA. eligibility criteria. So that was 2023. So bottom  line, no more money for you. What happened next? Well, Uganda didn't starved. Next year there was  a famine. I mean, not to laugh at famine, but it's.

almost unbelievable. So you you ban you ban gay  rape of children and the elderly and the mentally. disabled, and we're going to starve you out. And  boy, did they. The United States shut it down. International aid institutions followed suit and  the next year Uganda had a famine that is still. ongoing. 50% of children in Uganda today suffer  of the symptoms of malnutrition, stunted growth,

anemia. 50% half of all Ugandan kids are starving.  And of course, Uganda has never been a rich. country. It's had a lot of turmoil. Edamin was  from there. Uganda has some problems for sure. But the year after the West collectively  withdrew aid from Uganda, billions in aid, they have a famine. And it's all because  they banned gay rape of children. Okay. So,

I guess the point here is our values are pretty  clear. We're for this and we're totally against. questioning it. And if you do, we will hurt you.  So what is that? Why are you gay? Maybe that's. a question worth asking. But of course, nobody  has. And then you wake up one morning and you. realize that supporting homosexuality, which  is very different from like not hating gays,

no one should hate gays. And most Americans  don't hate gays. In fact, when was the last. time we met an American who did hate gays? I  know I ever have. At least in the past 30 years, no one hates gays. You know a million gays and  some of them are awesome people work for you or. your friends or whatever. It's not about hating  gays. It's about being forced to say this is an. affirmative good and if you disagree with that,  then you are affirmatively bad and we're going.

to stoke a famine in your country to punish  you. That's literally where we are. And some. of us should have been paying closer attention  as this movement never formally declared, not. the gay rights movement, but the terror against  anyone who opposes gay rights, whatever those are, worshiping homosexuality. We should pay closer  attention. Going to refer you to one of the. great clips of the entire Biden administration.  When people look back on the B administration,

there will be, of course, an endless loop of him  falling off his bike or identifying his sister. as his wife or clips designed to show how confused  and scenile this poor guy was. And those will in a. lot of ways represent the administration. But it's  the moment of clarity, those occasional moments of. clarity where Biden was really saying something  on purpose cuz he meant it and he wanted to tell. you what was important. Those are the clips that  actually define the four disastrous years of Joe. Biden. And above all, I would argue this clip  tells you everything you need to know about.

the values of the US government, of our popular  culture, of the West collectively. And once we. understand the values, we can assess, are those  the right values? And can a civilization continue. with those values? But first, the clip. Here's Joe  Biden describing a trip to downtown Wilmington, Delaware with his dad in 1962. I remember getting  out of a car when I was trying to be dropped off. at the local um uh city hall to get a job to be  the only white employee in the east side of town.

in in in the neighborhood in in the projects as as  a as a lifeguard. My dad was dropping me off so I. could he go around the block. I'd run and get the  application. And two well-dressed men kissed one. another as I was open the door. And I had seen  that before. And I turned around and one walked. off to the Deont building. One walked off to what  used to be called the Hercules Corporation. And I. looked at my dad and he just looked at me said,  "It's simple, honey. They love each other. It's.

just basic. There's nothing complicated about it.  That's how I was raised for real." Like, it's the. greatest clip ever. And there's just so much. I  mean, you you could really spend all day getting. taludic on it, just dissecting it and trying to  figure out what it means. I mean, there's so many. parts to this. First of all, Biden's dad called  him honey. That's weird. What What dad calls his. boy honey? Honey. Strange. Um, and who knows what  it means. Not implying anything, but it's weird.

Well, Grand Canyon University is not like most  American colleges. It focuses on the things that. actually matter. It is not a ripoff. It is the  real thing. It's private, affordable, Christian. university located in the heart of Phoenix, one of  the largest universities in the country. Actually, at Grand Canyon University, education is more than  academics. It is about opportunity. The chance. for every student to live out the right to life,  liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Rights are. not given by the government. They were bestowed at  birth, at conception, by God. That's just a fact.

And Grand Canyon University is not going to lie  to your kids and claim otherwise if it tells the. truth. So, I know you're thinking, "A quality  education is rare, so this probably costs a. fortune. Colleges constantly jack up their costs.  They probably do the same." Well, they don't. Actually, GCU has maintained the same tuition for  17 straight years. They're not in education to get. rich at the expense of students. The whole thing  is actually about learning. How refreshing. With.

flexible online classes, hybrid learning options,  GCU offers 340 academic programs. Students benefit. from a collaborative learning environment,  dedicated faculty, personalized support to help. them achieve their goals. The pursuit to serve is  yours. Let it flourish. Find your purpose at Grand. Canyon University. Private, Christian, affordable.  GCU.edu. Um, but the main thing to notice is this.

is 1962 that this supposedly happened in downtown  Wilmington, Delaware. And in 1962, what was the. state of America's views about homosexuality? Not  an individual gays. This has always been a very. very tolerant country for all minority groups  actually uh by any any global standard. Um, but uh the country's official views on like gay  sex, for example, well, it was a felony in 49. states in the summer of 1962, the only state in  which it was legal, Illinois, had just legalized.

it several months before. So having gay sex in the  United States when Biden claims this happened, was. a felony pretty much everywhere. A felony. Very  few people ever went to jail for it because no. one was really interested in enforcing it. But the  laws of the United States mirrored those of pretty. much every country in the world from then going  back maybe to Athens. Like people have always. been against this. It's always been officially  discouraged by every single society. The question.

is why? That's worth a conversation at some point.  Probably not just random bigotry. Every society. that we know about ever has had an official  policy against gay sex or forms of gay sex. Why? Again, can you explain to me without  getting hysterical? Maybe there's a reason. there. Who knows? But that was a state in the  United States uh in the summer of 1962. So the. idea that Joe Biden's drunk used car salesman  dad turned to him, this brutish Irish guy who.

Biden has described many times and says, "Honey,  honey, it's just love. It's okay. It's just love. Two guys making out outside the Dupont building in  downtown Wilmington. It's totally normal." Uh is. so transparently absurd. Um, it's such an obvious  attempt to graft modern values onto an antique uh.

setting that it's so clearly fake that amazingly  no one laughed. But no one did laugh cuz no one. was allowed to laugh. But that's absurd. You  ask anyone who was alive in 1960s. You just use. common sense. That didn't happen. But notice  how Biden frames it. He said he was getting. dropped off to get a job as the only white man  working in the hood, breaking the color barrier. It wasn't just a summer job. It was a victory for  civil rights. And he was the kind of guy who would. do that because his family had a long commitment  to civil rights as evidenced by his father's.

kind of casual acceptance of homosexuality. Just  love. It's just love. Okay. So, what do we learn. from that? We learned that Biden's of course a  fabulist. We knew that. But in this specific clip, he's lying for a reason to transmit to the nation  its essential values. And at the very top of that. list is we are for homosexuality. That's number  one. It's right up there with civil rights. People. get to vote. People get to have Kay sex. That's  America. That's our culture. Okay. So, it probably.

shouldn't surprise you that the self-reported  incidents of homosexuality and its many varieties. in the United States rose dramatically during  that period. And here are roughly the numbers. So, about a little over 10 years ago, 2012, among  young people in the United States, about 6% said, "Yeah, I'm not heterosexual." So, that would be  in the range that, you know, we've been told for.

many years was natural, right? maybe 10%, a little  under 10% of people say they're not heterosexual. and whatever, you know, gay, lesbian, transgender,  bisexual, whatever, but they're not one man, one woman, monogamy people at all. Um, so that was  the number a little over 10 years ago. Last year, the number among young people was over  20%. So, a little more than a decade, you have a three-fold increase, 300% increase in  self-identified non-heterosexual orientation in.

a little over 10 years. H what are we looking at?  Well, we're looking at demographic collapse among. other things. Um, right. But what is the phenomena  actually? Where does this come from? Or to put it. in Ugandan terms, why are you gay? Well, let's  see. We have been told for the course of my life.

that you're born gay. It's like handedness or  eye color or height. It's just something that. you're born with. God created you that way.  You are unique. Your iris, your fingerprints, your sexuality, they're all unique to you.  And that's something not to be embarrassed of, unless you're a white man, in which case, of  course, slink away in shame, be denied admission. to college or a job. But for everyone else, your  immutable characteristics are something that you. celebrate, that you should be proud of. They not  something that you chose. They're not something.

you can change. And this is the story that all of  us have been told. And most of us, me included, sort of kind of believe that. Okay? And if that's  true, of course, you could never ever show bias. against someone on the basis of his immutable  characteristics because that's wrong. It's also. uncchristian. And that is true. It is uncristian  to attack someone on the basis of something with. which he was born. Of course, really no one has  put this in clearer terms than the former mayor.

of Southbend, Indiana, the former transportation  secretary, and as of today, the leading candidate. for the Democratic nomination in 2028, Mr. Pete  Buddha Judge. Here he is. I can tell you that if. me being gay was a choice, it was a choice  that was made far, far above my pay grade. And that's the thing I wish the Mike Pences of  the world would understand that if you got a.

problem with who I am, your problem is not with  me. Your quarrel, sir, is with my creator. Take. it up with God. He made me this way. Notice the  self-s seriousness. The sort of JFKesque gaze. into the distance. Your quarrel, sir, is with my  creator. little drama queen. Yeah, maybe. Okay. But that doesn't really answer the question. Why  was Pete Buddha Judge dating chicks for the first.

part of his adult life? By his own admission, he  was dating women, like a bunch of women. He was. openly heterosexual, including in the US military  after the repeal of Don't Ask Don't Tell. So, it's. totally legal to be gay in the military, but Pete  was still heterosexual. So, The answer I think. most people come to is, well, he was just ashamed  of being gay. Like, he couldn't be his true self. He couldn't kind of let it out. Maybe that's true.  Though, those of us who were living in the United.

States 10 years ago, remember that there was no  sanction against being gay. Tons of gay television. is filled with gay people. Those of us who worked  in television around gay people, great gay people. actually, just being clear, really nice, good  people all day long. There was nothing weird about. being gay 10 years ago, 15 years ago, when Pete  Buddha Judge was like, "I couldn't come to terms. with my own sexuality because his parents are  so oppressive." No, they were actually lifestyle. liberals. They're big left-wingers, his parents.  So, probably unlikely that his parents were like, "Don't be gay, son." If you watch this show,  you know that we love Pure Talk. It is amazing.

wireless service with absolutely the best prices.  And all the time we've been telling you about Pure. Talk, we've never seen an offer like the one we're  about to describe. And here it is. Unlimited talk, text, data with a 30 gig hotspot for just $29.95  per month. Not just this month, every month for. life. This is Pure Talk's top tier plan. $29.95  a month. You'll save over 50% a month every month.

for your entire life and you stay in the exact  same 5G network that Verizon and AT&T offer, but for $1600 a year cheaper for a family of four.  That's wild. It's provable. By the way, this isn't. some false claim. It's not disinformation.  It's real. Pure Talk's customer service, meanwhile, is located in the United States, not in  Bangladesh. Nothing against Bangladesh, but you're. talking to Americans. You can understand. They can  switch you in just minutes. You keep your phone, keep your number, and you start saving in a really  big way. Unlimited for life. $29.95 a month. This.

is a short-term offer. Long-term consequences.  Short-term offer. puretalk.com/talkertoswitch. today. puretalk.com/talkertoswitch to America's  wireless pure talk. Taxes and fees not included. Go to the site to get all the details, but  those are the basics. So, it's a completely. fair question. You were dating chicks not that  long ago, a bunch of them, and all of a sudden. you're getting all self-s serious about how  God made you this way. Explain how that works.

It's a totally fair question, especially since  Pete Buddha Judge's whole identity is wrapped. up in being gay. His whole identity, it's  not like Pete Buddha Judge is running for. president because he's had such an incredible  career as a public servant. He fixed Southbend, Indiana. He's just a really good mayor. Nobody  thinks that. Ask anybody in Southbend. He was. just a really good driver in the US military.  who's an awesome transportation secretary. He.

was a joke as a transportation secretary. Did air  travel get better under Pete Buddha Judge? Did the. roads get fixed? Did anything improve in American  transportation during Pete Buddhajud's tenure as. transportation secretary? No, he wasn't just lame.  He was awful. And in case you don't remember, here's his signature achievement as Secretary of  Transportation, identifying racist roads and the. interstate system. The interstate system was built  to keep certain groups in and certain groups out.

So it was built on a racist system. Correct. Yeah.  Often this wasn't just an act of neglect. Often. this was a conscious choice. There was racism  physically built into some of our highways. There was racism built in to the highways. There  was rebar and a concrete substrate and of course. gravel and then asphalt poured over the top. But  mixed in there probably in a drum at some point. was actual white racism. It was mixed into the  roads and that's why people judge had to tear. them up. That's it. That's a real clip. That's not  AI as you may remember. Like that's insane. That.

was his tenure as Secretary of of Transportation.  Not being mean to him and it's like not even worth. dredging that up again except to make the point  that being gay isn't just this thing about Pete. Buddha Judge. It's the whole point of Pete Buddha  Judge. It is the reason that he has the plurality.

of support from Democratic primary voters who  are not black. His support among black voters, they're more in the why are you gay camp? They're  not impressed at all. In fact, I'm trying to do. the math here. I think his support people judge's  current support among African-American Democratic. primary voters is let's see around zero. So  0% in that range meaning nobody like no black. people. They're not going for it. Why are you gay?  You can almost hear them saying that. But among.

white liberals, Pete Buddha Judge's gayness,  the fact he's married to a dude called Chason. and has somehow acquired babies somehow. How do  you get babies? Just sort of buy them somewhere, whatever. He has these babies and he is the model  of whatever a modern gay man. That's the whole.

point. He is a civil rights hero because of who he  sleeps with. Pretty amazing. So, two two obvious. points to make about that. First, do you remember  when they used to tell us, "We don't care what. happens in your bedroom." Do you remember that?  We want to keep politics out of the bedroom. We. want to keep politicians out of your bedroom. This  was a way to justify the Holocaust of abortion, of course. But the line sounded kind of appealing.  Yeah, politicians probably stay out of my bedroom.

That seems fair. Now your bedroom is the whole  point. You got politicians running on what they. do in their bedroom. And on the Democratic side  succeeding, that leads very obviously to the. second point, which is there are a lot of rewards  in store for someone in the Democratic party, an ambitious politician, someone who really only  cares about the goal, which in Pete Buddha Judge's. case has always been becoming president. Is it bad  to come out of the closet and announce that you're.

gay? No. No. No. That's like the only way you're  going to get to the White House. That's the only. way. That's your ticket. Being quote gay. Huh? So,  given that that's obviously true, and given that. this guy dated girls as an adult, it's totally  fair to ask the question, why are you gay? Like. what is this? Starting to think that maybe it's  not genetic or entirely genetic. And if it is,

show me the gene. We've decoded the human genome.  We can tell you where the gene for eye color comes. from. Where's the gay gene? Maybe there is a  gay gene. By the way, lots of things we haven't. decoded yet. Maybe it's there. Are you looking for  it? Are you trying to answer this question? No. The whole game is to make you be quiet, ashamed  because it has something to do with sex. And what.

are you a creep focused on sex? You're obsessed  with gay sex. Sort of a variety. You're obsessed. with Israel. No, actually not. But you're way up  in my face about it. And so I think it's fair to. ask you a couple of very simple, straightforward  questions, foundational questions like, "What is this? Where does it come from? Why is it  good? Why is being gay better than not being gay? And if it's not 100% genetic, clearly isn't.  If you've had a 300% increase in 10 years,

probably not genetic, unless our genetics are  changing at lightning speed, unless evolution. is a much faster process than Derwin ever  reckoned. If it's not entirely genetic, then what are the other factors? And since  apart from moral concerns or the concerns of. human happiness, does this actually make you  happy? And what does it mean to live as a gay. person in the United States? What exactly does  that look like? Like what's your life like? How.

many people do you have sex with? How are those  unfair questions? Since you're the one throwing. it in my face and telling me I'm not allowed to be  against it, maybe I'm allowed to ask the questions. I don't really want to ask, don't really want  to know the answers to. But since you've made. it the northstar of our moral system in the United  States, since you're willing to starve an African. country because they disagree with it, maybe it's  time for me to ask those questions because you. push me to on this and a lot of other issues. If  you just back off a little bit, if we could just.

return to the status quo of say 1985 where yeah,  they're gay people, they're great, they're off, you know, whatever. They're here, they're there,  whatever, but they're not pushing gay sex on my. kids in school. That's clearly not a good idea.  Tell me why it is a good idea. And of course, it's a crime to intentionally infect someone  with an infectious disease. And of course, it's in fact the hallmark of civilization  to make rape illegal, gay or straight.

What? But since you blew up all those previous  assumptions and now made them illegal, Uganda, you know, made this crime punishable by death,  you made their law punishable by famine. So, who's more serious about it? You are. Since you  did all of that, how about we just slowly in a. non-hysteryical, obviously non-hateful way ask  what are we looking at? Why are you gay? Why is.

that a good thing? What is it exactly? And there  are a lot of people we could ask about this, but. we thought, believe it or not, the most articulate  person we know to answer these questions is Milo. Yiannopoulos, who was very famous 10 years ago  as a what was he called? Conservative provocator. running around the country making the case against  liberals as an open, in fact, flamboyant gay man. And that was part of the shtick, right? It's like,  we've got a gay guy, too. What are you going to. say now? You know, we've got black conservatives,  too. You can't call us racist. We've got a gay.

conservative. You can't call us homophobes.  And so, Milo was unleashed on the world. And. then in literally one day he was cancelled really  destroyed as a person um in a sort of nonscandal. that uh like so many of that period and of this  period sort of took him right off the stage. You never heard from him again. But during the  period when he was flitting around America on his. dangerous [ __ ] tour spreading uh whatever it was  libertarian economics or something uh to the kids,

it became obvious that this guy was actually  really smart. you know, even for those of us who. were never that interested in the dangerous [ __ ]  part of it. Um, if you listen, you thought, "Wow, this guy's not dumb at all. He's actually very  thoughtful. Um, very thoughtful, high IQ, high IQ. guy who thinks about things." Uh, so over the last  couple of years during text conversations, um, I. became aware that Milo had decided that he didn't  want to be gay anymore. And I thought that's kind.

of interesting. I didn't know you could decide you  didn't want to be gay. And then you read about it. and it turns out there's a whole industry movement  and laws designed to prevent you from deciding not. to be gay. Huh? Parts of the United States have  banned conversion therapies. You're not allowed to. talk to a psychiatrist about not having samesex  attraction. Wow. What is that? It's like once. you're in, you can't get out. It's like mandatory  gayness. What the hell are we looking at? Well, it's the season to give gifts to those you love.  And there is no greater gift than the first gift,

the gift of life. With the abortion mafia doubling  down, there's never been a more important time to. fight back against them. And for children, which  is really all that matters, children. Our friends. at Pre-born are the ones to go to. They're the  ones we trust. We've got a partnership with. Pre-born. And that partnership helps preserve the  joy of life and supports mothers in need. Mothers. who didn't expect to be pregnant, but who have  decided to have that baby. Every day, Preborn's.

clinics rescue hundreds of children. Because  when a mother sees her baby on an ultrasound, the chance that she will choose life doubles.  That's a real statistic and it makes complete. sense. She understands this is a person. This  is the future. This Christmas, gifts from this. show's listeners will be doubled. That means twice  as many ultrasounds, twice as many babies saved, twice as many mothers receiving care for up to 2  years, twice as many people entering this world. Americans, we know that people at pre-born, they  have our total endorsement. There are a lot of.

frauds in the charity world. They are not frauds.  They're totally real. Their work help heals this. country. When ultrasound is just 28 bucks,  all gifts are taxdeductible. Dial pound 250, say the keyword baby, pound250 baby, or visit  pre-born.com/tucker. pre-born.com/tucker. And so it seemed worth a sit down conversation  with Milo Yiannopoulos and just ask him sincere. questions like, "What is this? Why did you decide  to change? What's it like changing? what does it.

mean to be gay in the United States specifically?  And so that conversation follows and we hope you. enjoy it. You're really nice to do this. I'm glad  you came. I want to begin with the only person. that have me on. I'm joking. I'm joking. No, I'm  actually really interested. I'm interested in. this topic. I've never been interested in it. But  but I want to begin by asking you, isn't it? It's. icky. Well, sort of in personal, but you know,  it's occurred to me, particularly when I have. interviewed Republican politicians, particularly  neocons over the years. I sexuality comes out.

comes to my mind. I've always wanted to say in a  Ugandan accent, are you gay? Why are you gay? So, let me let me ask, are you gay? Were you gay?  Like, what is gay? Nobody's gay. Nobody's gay. Um, after that clip, which is the best thing on  the internet, uh, he changes the question, the interrogative to a declarative, uh, he says,  "Why are you gay?" And she start you know it. starts talking. He says you are gay. It becomes  it becomes a statement. And this is where he goes. uh this is where he loses me because um nobody is  gay. Um we've been encouraged to think of this.

It's an icky subject like straight men don't want  to think about. No no it's okay. I mean it's it's. reached you invited me. Um well I invited you  because I have not you know not wanted to be. engaged with the topic at all. I don't have strong  super strong personal feelings about it but all. of a sudden it has become like a defining fact  of the west that we have a huge gay population.

like sodomy but no one wants to talk about giving  aid um with with you know the with with strings. attached. So I what metaphor am I reaching for  strings attached? Um uh yes you can but only if. you have a gay pride festival, right? Um what is  that? Uh exactly. What is that? Yes, it has been. And all of these things um and with the with with  the with the collapse in people uh uh identifying. as trans, you're beginning to now see what some  of us have always known about homosexuality, which is that this is a product. I mean, there  are some people obviously who were probably always.

going to be gay. Tammy Bruce. Um, but you know,  like maybe she might be the only real lesbian. She might be the only real lesbian. I believe when  Tammy Bruce tells me that she was only ever into. women. I believe her. Uh, you know, and and and  I like her, by the way. I think she's great. But, uh, but she's like the only real lesbian with gay  men, which is completely different. Um, we see the. we see the numbers go up, the numbers go down.  This is not without some change in environmental.

factors. This doesn't make sense. If we believe  the old lie, born this way. if we believe uh. what was in fact invented in the 1980s as a public  relations strategy born this way. So what happened. uh back in the days um uh gays were in the 80s  and with AIDS and all the rest of it wanting to to. um to to be out and proud and and and to to wear  their sins on their sleeves and somebody came up. with this this uh idea um which which caught on  and worked um and it was twofold. One is, well,

what if we say that being gay is like being black  or being a woman? Yes. Uh, then they're a bigot. We're not weird. And so it takes the the religious  um the moral majority's sinful lifestyle choice. argument and it scrows them because now they're  saying like you're wrong to be a girl or you're. wrong to be black. Exactly. It was invented it was  invented wholesale by the activists in the 1980s. And the second part of it was um and this is in  a book called After the Ball, which is kind of.

defined how gay activists were going to um uh well  it really it was very influential because it it it. was really the book that told gay activists how  to get this revoling sin that most people don't. even want to think about up front and center,  familyfriendly, and ultimately to um the state. where we let them adopt children. Um which  is a whole thing we'll get into. And that was. don't talk about bodily functions. Don't talk  about eluvia. Just talk about love. Just talk.

about love. Talk about it in terms of love. Like  love is love. Love wins. Um and we see this to. the present day. Never talk about, you know, the  stains on the sheets, the promiscuity, the drugs, the um the glory holes in Berlin nightclubs.  Never talk about any of those things because. those things will repel women. And you need moms  with gay sons to affirm their homosexuality. And. and so what is that homosexuality? Long answer for  a short question. I understand. Um uh in almost.

every case and in certainly in every male case,  it is a trauma response. It is not a sexuality. It. is not part of what you are or who you are or or a  component of your personality or a function of. It. is it is a set of behaviors that is uh um uh that  emerges in people with a number of very easily. identifiable common um uh ideologies. One of them  is um well so so so for instance um among gay.

excuse me among black and Jewish uh Americans they  report uh statistically significantly higher rates. of homosexuality. Why could that be overbearing  moms and absent dads or in the Jewish case nebish. fathers and you know uh you know like Jewish my  my Jewish friends I always call their their their. marriages are like lion taming you know uh where  you have a sort of um nebish scholarly bookish. dad and a larger than life mom who you know wants  one day decides she's going to be a rabbi you know.

um that or in the black community of course is  the fatherlessness and it's a why why if you're. born this way if you don't have some other better  explanation. Could it be the case that there are. more gays among black and Jewish populations?  Well, something's going on here. Why are we. getting more trans and more gays and then less  gays and less? Why? Because this is in fact a. symptom. In fact, this is a product of something.  It's the result of something. Well, this was. Freud's position which was kind of conventional  wisdom for the better part of a hundred years.

that this was a response to the environment and  particularly to the relationship with the mother. that a young boy has and a relationship with  his father. I mean, but this was this was like. people just assumed that was true when I was  a kid. They were not gay haters or homophobes. That just that was a state of knowledge on the  subject. One of the one of the only things Freud. got right was that. Um, and it's funny that, you  know, the way that that's actually in line with. the Catholic Church teaching and now has become uh  now you see the uh the terminology in the medical.

industry has begun to change as well because um  you know they they uh now gay people are sort. of saturated everywhere. You you know like when  you get a it's kind of like America, you get a. whole country full of people who are very similar  but will think they're really really individual. That's deep. Yes. Yes, I do know what that looks  like. And and and and you know, sort of America. is a very faggotized country in all kinds of ways.  That's the technical term. Um you have to if you.

want to know the truth about homosexuality, you've  got to go to black YouTube uh and listen to the. girls. How do you get to black YouTube, by the  way? Um well, you know, it's a sort of tumbling. It's a tumbling kind of thing. You find one  good video by somebody who's like Steph Carrick, you fetached. They just Sorry. Um, and then uh and  then you know you'll tumble through the algorithm. I'll send you some links. I'll post some links on  my Twitter and I don't know if I dare, but that. but you're saying that's the more honest YouTube.  It's the only honest YouTube. It's the only honest.

anything. Um because uh you go past the churches  and you'll see, you know, the white homo demons. stealing your man. And it's not the pastor  who comes up with this stuff. It's his wife. it's his wife uh who's got this, you know, who who  was trying to set her girlfriend up with somebody. and that was all great. Um but but uh but he went  he went off with a dude which is you know like. even which is sort of uh equi um uh distant for  them from going off with a white girl or whatever.

But uh no the only honest place where you people  will just be like did it fagotize you know and. then they'll go and then amazing LeBron fagotize  and they'll go they'll go through it all. I mean. the for me the nippless Ultra of this genre would  be um Black China's mom. Do you know who that is? Of course you don't. You remind me of a line from  Black Adder sometimes, you know, because you you. have this sort of like lovely kind of like onenu  kind of thing that you do. Um uh and it's like,

well, no, I've just I don't know anything. Um  but do you remember that line from Black Adder? Like slumbering ultragenarians who claim never to  have heard of the Beatles. No, but I get it. He's. talking about high court judges. I've never  actually heard of Black Adder before. So I. You're kidding. I'm actually not. What? I don't  even know what you're talking about. But that's. okay. It's not about me. I'm just trying to Fry  and Rowan Atkinson got famous. You're not black. I don't know. There are huge gaps. I'm not I'm not  a knowledge. Baby Jesus and the Orphans. Well, you.

say this. Yes. But anyway, look. So, so, so Tokyo  Tony is her name. And she's Anyway, you can Google. Tokyo Tony. That's your end to black everything.  Um, anyway, she's great. There's a whole I mean. YouTube now. The only interesting bits of YouTube  that still get views are like the these black. shows. like o these massively overproduced shows  with these incredibly elaborate sets and they've. got like, you know, 43 people live watching, but  the archives and the clips like go crazy. Anyway,

man, I've got I've got a a series of delights  ahead of me. Well, you don't have many black. people in the show, so you've got me instead.  Um, so I'll be I'll be your uh I'll be your. African-American contingent. I'll introduce you  to these things. So, um No, I I I'm kidding. Uh uh. so so um so this is you're describing a world into  which a lot of conventional propaganda has not yet. filtered or they're resistant to it or something.  It's interesting because why are you gay? Are you. gay? um the the um the origin of um of of of the  of the born this way I've just I've just described.

I've just explained the um the reality is that  um these communities who experience this problem. a lot right the black community particularly  because of fatherlessness a lot of gay black. kids there's just a lot of them um have this very  blunt and truthful I I mean look looking at me. now it's impossible to imagine that I used to be a  homosexual. Um, but it hadn't entered my mind. No,

but but but I knew you during your flaming  stage, so I I had heard. Yeah. No. Yeah. Yeah. But but but there are so many like flaming  young black men in America today especially. Um, and this is a problem this community is  dealing with. And they don't, you know, uh, black America is like commendably impervious  to a lot of the, uh, the woke PC language stuff, you know, like very creditably skeptical  of vaccines. Um, they won't go along with. a lot of this stuff. Like, you know, uh, uh, the  proposition whatever in California, gay marriage,

why it's black women who are like holding on  the floor. So, I love Candace Owen so much. You. like the ungovernability of black women is the  only thing that might possibly save America. U, you know, as embodied in our friend, uh, Candace,  who is just like, you know, she's ungovernable in. the best possible way. She's not going along with  it. She She is to put it mildly. Yeah. Fair. She. is not going along with it. And Candice is a  very beautiful, polished, you know, intelligent. uh uh and uh sort of microcosm of a trend  that you see everywhere in black America now,

which is like ain't doing that. Ain't doing that.  Definitely ain't doing that. Wow. And and and it's. very interesting. So So um they will be very  resistant to this stuff. they kind of intuit it. what white people I think have forgotten because  you know we're just all so like bomb so weak and. demoralized and like kind of overburdened with  this nonsense. The truth is that homosexuality. and in particular conversion therapy is the first  thing upon which the liberals tried what they.

later did to Trump which is just this this wall  of uh uh fake news misinformation propaganda. It's the first time. I mean, this there there's  other examples around wars and things like that, but when it comes to social issues, it's the  first time I think the press just says, "Oh, hell no." Except they didn't do that cuz they're  white, but uh you know, they move. Sometimes I. lose the characters get confused. Going to put  Rwanda away. Um no, I you know, the the the the.

um the first time that the media decides this  is a social issue we care about enough because. we're going to lose our gay friends. um uh that  we're going to just lie and demonize and and and. give the full fake news treatment that we later  saw in its most sophisticated form leveraged, praise God, unsuccessfully against Trump again  and again and again, right? Um so, so they start. off with this with this, you know, you were  born this way, honey, you are born this way, honey, you are beautiful, whatever you are.  No, you're like that because you got raped by.

a priest. Or you're like that because your mom  was overbearing and your dad wasn't around. or. you're like that because you failed to form um  uh uh platonic stable attachments to other men. as a child for some reason. Maybe you didn't  have a good male male role model or whatever, but there are is a relatively small number of  identifiable and repeated ideologies that mark. somebody out as being, you know, vulnerable to  this. And you look into the histories of gay. people, they'll all deny saying, "No, it's  just me." Uh but it's not. And they know,

they know because I knew and they know and I  talked to them privately when there's no cameras. there. I could squeeze it out of them eventually  that you get there. Um, yes, there's something. about their sexual activity they know isn't right.  And it's not just the tech in the technical sense. that the that the sex is sterile and therefore  can never be part of um uh uh the holy sacrament. of marriage because it can't be co-procreation  with God. Right. Yes. um co-procreation with. God meaning um you know you you make a physical  body with your wife but then God puts a soul in.

right and that's why it's the the most precious  sacrament because you know you do the others. you do your confirmation the rest of it but it's  leading up to you getting to make something with. God right which is the real reason that Lucifer  is so mad and that because the angels can't do. that right uh the angels don't get to participate  in creation with our Lord but every single human. being does you know um and feel that too when you  have kids. You even if you don't know what it is, you feel there's something supernatural going on  here. This is going to sound completely pathetic,

but I I like I I have some kind of some kind  of pathetic simulum of it. Now I've become a. cat dad. Uh just in the terms of like caring for  something helpless. Yes. Um, and it's bringing out. of me something that I know is going to lead to  fatherhood because I'm responsible for this being. that loves and laughs and they do uh, you know,  and and uh, you know, and requires regular not. just maintenance but affection and to be tended  to and love. Like I love dogs. I'm like I used to. be more of a dog guy, but I live in a I live in a  um, a house on the National Register of Historic.

Places, so I can't have dogs. Um, and uh, so I  I just I got a cat one day, you know, just cuz. just because somebody found it in an engine. I was  like, I'm so alone. So I said, "Sure, give me give. me give me give me a give me a damn kitten." And  at that point, I wasn't sure I was going to drown. it, wear it, or or or or nurture it. Um, but but  I was just like, "Oh, okay." And being responsible. for shaping the personality, which anybody who has  animals, who loves animals knows that is is 100%.

real. um responsible shaping the personality,  nurturing that that being into either being a. parent itself or just into being a companion or  or to being the best that it can be, right? Um. it it's it's bringing something out in me, you  know, um that wasn't present when I was having. a lot of what most people would regard as well  what homosexuals would regard as very desirable. kind of sex, you know, with a with a particular  kind of person or whatever. Um, so this you you.

get to the base of it and and you get to the heart  of it. If you're sort of one-on-one with a gay, they will they won't just talk about the emptiness  of their life or the fact that the sex is sterile. or whatever. They will know that there's something  not quite right. And so and that its origin is. there at something that was not quite right. Have  you ever been addicted to anything? Oh yeah. Okay. Big time. So you know there's that moment when  your mind is flooded and it's all you can think. about. Yes. And it's all that you can you you got  to get it out because if you don't do a line or.

have a a smoke or or do something, if you don't  if you don't get it out, it's just going to be all. you can think about for the rest of the day. It's  just driving you crazy cuz it floods your mind. Yeah. I've been addicted to one or two little  things, you know. Um and I realized my sex works. the same way. Yeah, I believe that. realized that  when I was on a plane, I'm sitting down. Hey, team.

1A. I'm sitting on the plane. I'm like, "Yeah,  I'll have a genic girl." And then, you know, like. a basketball player, well, not basketball player,  little gay nerds, but you like a football player. would sit next to me. Uh like it would take hold  of me. There were times I had to like go to the. bathroom and like, you know, Yeah. because I cuz I  had to get rid of it because it was it was taking. hold of my mind. It sounds like a demon. Yeah.  Because it's what it is. I joke I say Golgaroth. the seaman demon you know he he comes out the way  he doesn't doesn't visit me very often anymore you.

know but it's like it's totally real I mean that  stuff is all it's all real but it but but it I I. realized that so I don't do cocaine anymore but I  you know it'll shock people to learn I used to be. a bit of a cocad uh you know when I was you know  that rush of dopamine y the rituals associated. with it as well you know I was like oh my god  that's that's how I feel about sex and that's that. can't be right. It can't be right. No, it's a it's  literally a I'm not talking about gay sex, but any.

that is literally a perversion. Yes. And it is a  demon and it's also other things too because these. things go hand in hand, you know. Um may I ask how  in your own if it's not too personal, how did you. wind up? We're there now, aren't we? Okay, I think  we are. Um but I just told you I wanked on U81722. Crack one out in the bathroom. People are never  going to sit next to me on planes again. I think. we're good. Anyone who's ever been Well,  I drink alcohol in the morning. I mean, you know, anyone who's ever been possessed,  that doesn't count. Give me a real one. Anyone.

who's ever been possessed by an obsession knows  that it can totally destroy your behavior. But, um, we spend so much time talking in our society  about, you know, gay and it's all good. Of course, you know, gay is good and gay rights are good. In  fact, they're the marker of human rights. They're. the only human right really. Um, but this is the  only human right people still care about. Oh, your. your right to be sodomized. Your right to wake up  in the morning like and you're like, "Oh, okay.

You're you're ready to go, are you?" And hear  that voice in your mind. And it's not a sultry. voice. It's not a sexy voice. It's go and get it.  It's, you know, it's like it's it's it's Gorgoth. Anyway, sorry I'm interrupting you, but but it is  that's dark. I've thankfully never It's one of the. few problems I don't have. But I I get it. Um,  that's why grind are so dangerous, you It's just. like within 20 minutes they can be in the living  room. You know, I want to ask you about that, but. first let me ask about your own life cuz you never  get to ask, you know, everyone's telling you how. proud they are to be gay. And that's great and all  that, but it's a sin, by the way. Pride is a sin.

Well, I agree with that. But um you never get to  ask like what how did this how did you start being. gay? Like specifically described with you know the  way I remember PG way, right? If you insist. No, the way I reme we've done enough. I know. The  way I remember it is I just did it to piss. off my mother, but that's not true. Um I think  that's that's self- mythologization, you know, like I I I did take a lot of drug dealers home  when I was it was Were you close to your mom?

When I was in high school, she married uh so so  so I'll answer your question. I'll I'll skip back. first. Let me let me do that first. So my dad  was in organized crime. Um funny, charismatic, brilliant. Uh there are things about like maybe  Alex Jones that remind me of him a little bit just. in that kind of like um just in manner, you know.  Um like a bit of a bruiser but with the heart, you know, like like you know like um you know  like he's a bad guy with a heart of gold. Yeah.

Yeah. I've known a few. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.  No, like I I cleave to that kind of personality. Uh it reminds me a little bit of the good bits of  my dad, right? But there was another section which. Alex does not have which which which was that you  know he was a bad guy and I saw him do really bad. things to people. I would come down I told this  story before but I would come down sometimes the. kitchen door would be closed and I would hear you  know Nikki Nikki uh I'm giving up a life of crime. Uh I'm turning over a new leaf. I'm not going to  do anything that's going to give me any more than. 18 months. You know it's funny but it's all about  goals. Milo. Yeah. But he was a bad guy and I saw.

him do things that really frightened me. And um  you know he was in pubs and nightclubs in in a. uh you know running running the clubs and the  security and sort of like you know he's gone now. so I can say it laundering millions you know.  Yeah. Blah blah. Um uh between those two you. know like the security these security guards are  on $120 an hour. Huh. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Officer.

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Aren't you tell them tell  them what you're on? He's like 110 120 120. Yeah. Um, so he used to let me sit in the  in the booth and like do the stamps and I. would watch people go in and I'd watch the  behaviors of like low socioeconomic white. working class like in their 20s just, you know,  just drinking and effing, you know, and and and. then I saw some of the things my dad did and  they would start with that joke. They'd start.

with that very charming joke. They start with  that alluring joke. And my dad had like a degree. in he had my dad had a masters in fine art. He  was a great sculptor and painter. But that but. that was the charming bit of him. The dark  bit was you know like he would say to people. um can I use bad language on the show? Yes.  Yes you may because you can bleep it. But my. dad would say like listen just cuz you're in  a wheelchair don't give you the right to be. a [ __ ] Uh and he would grab the wheelchair  spin it around and like walk people up to to. you know like to parking lot edges and stuff  like that. And I'm sitting in the car like.

um you know or or he'd go collecting which means  protection rackets. And he would um and he would. uh um you know I would overhear like Julian could  you take your glasses off please? I don't want to. get glass in my finger when I poke your [ __ ]  eye out. It's very charming, very funny, like. very Tony Soprano kind of like that kind of ilk,  you know? Um, but but I saw some of it and I think. maybe somewhere in my head I was like, "Yeah, if  that's being a man, I think I'm out." Because I.

was a child. I was frightened. And then my mother  left him and married a a new guy. And he was very. like sort of a nice guy now, but but um he would  go through all my stuff like if I had papers, you know, if I was reading something for school or  whatever, he would like when I was out go through. every page and just sort of leave it like this  just just that I knew that he'd been in there, you know, and that kind of like invasive like  like just horrifying like it was just for for.

a very sensitive artistic child like me. Um,  you were already on my way then, you know, having I had a much larger than life grandmother  who was like, you know, egging this stuff on and. and by this time I had had some interactions,  sexual interactions with a Roman Catholic priest, uh, who's dead now. Has been dead for a long time,  but that had obviously, you know, that fed into it. as well. Wait, wait, stop. Stop. That obviously  fed into Right. Well, if you're being molested. Yeah. Well, yeah. Oh, also the molestation. No,  but but really for me, this is this is where. it's important to to do the other stuff first  before you get Oh, and I was raped by a priest.

But but um but but but this sort of psychological  torture as I pursu as I experienced it was you. know sort of like I had no private space anywhere  and I knew that all the men in my life were just. not things I wanted to become. Yes. And then I  cast my See if you let me get to it. Uh then I. cast my mind back to a lovely old rich man in a  frock, Father Michael. Uh, and I I Yeah. And I. and I who had not been like that with me. And one  of the things that got me into trouble 10 years.

ago was when I said I felt like the kind of the  aggressor in that situation. I didn't know what. bad stuff it had done to me. And at the time I  didn't. Um, you know, I made a couple of jokes. that got GOP Inc. uh hot and bothered cuz they're  all [ __ ] um and they weren't they weren't. happy about the some of the the truths that we're  talking about today kind of toppling out you know. um and so these things combined the having what  I perceived to be at that time I perceived as a.

child to be consensual sexual experiences with  a older man who was a kindly he was kindly. sweetheart you know he was I think of him now as  a harmless old queen you know of course what he. was doing was not harmless. Well, you have a right  to any opinion you want about the experiences that. happened to you. Apparently not. Well, I've  been retired for some time as a result. Um, well, I continue to believe that people are  allowed to formulate their own opinions about.

their own lives. I think you should be able  to talk about your rape however you like. Uh, agree with that and not necessarily have to go on  live international television and apologize for it. like I did, but I'm not bitter. Um, so fortunately  unfortunately I I I carved out a a much I have a. a a new kind of career and a new life now that I  much prefer is more satisfying, lucrative, blah. blah blah. We'll do it later. So I haven't gone  crazy like so many of my friends. And it's funny.

watching them cuz I see some of the in the way  that their personalities have become kind of empty. and sharded and become filled with wickedness. I  see some of the things that I have been working. over the last 10 years to get away from that  created this this sexual behavior, they've. become faggotized, you know. Well, there does seem  to be um a connection, but it does, you know, the. incidence of closeted homosexuality on the right  is like over overwhelming. It's like way above.

what you would imagine is statistically probable.  three straight guys on the right. It's like Alex, you, and I have a floating wild card just in case  I forgot anybody. Who else? Who else is there? I. mean, maybe the Tates, but who else is there? What  is that? Um I don't understand it. There's such a. long um there's such a long relationship, a long  happy marriage between conservative politics and. homosexuality. And it's easy to joke about it and  say, "Oh, it's it's um you know, all of the bells.

and smells and frocks of the religious dimension  to it all, or it's the uh pomp and circumstance. of power, or is it the New Testament is really  tough on homosexuality. So, I don't see it as. a that's not certainly not a Christian thing.  It's not a Christian thing." But of course, it's. easy to understand with the sort of obscene obese  heresies of the type that obtain in this country. I mean I mean in a country where prosperity gospel  can thrive. You're right. Who would be surprised, right? It's not an authentic face as we would  know it. I sometimes tease you about your your.

denomination, but Episcopalian Episcopalian church  is is is as close to us as it's possible to get. and was designed to be um a mirror to high  Anglicanism which was indistinguishable from. Catholicism and that you know at its sorry at its  best it's it's a very similar um uh creed you know. to and and and with very similar style and similar  beliefs you know. Yeah. So, but but but as soon as. you wander away from that in America, just like  mental. So, but what is and I'm not attacking. anybody and I never want to out people because  I don't know it's not my business, right? I've.

never done it. And uh I mean maybe I live I live  to out people I live out. On which subject? Cory. Booker. Um I did. But what is that? Why is there  Why is it so common on the right? Well, of course. on the left too, but on the right with closeted  gays. Like I don't get that. Interesting question. I've never heard a really good answer to. I'll  be honest with you. Uh I I suppose I should have.

a good answer to that, but I don't. And I I think  but I think if it's about anything, it's about the. exercise of power over others. Yes. Because I feel  that. I have no idea exactly why that's true, but. I feel that that's true. What's the worst thing  about magic? It's not that you can turn a person. into a frog or you can uh make yourself look more  beautiful or you can whatever. What's the worst. thing about magic is that it robs others of agency  that you can make them do things they don't want. to do. The worst and most sinister bit of magic  is that you can uh trick someone or compel someone.

against their will to fall in love with you or  to or to throw themselves off a cliff. Kind of. slavery. Yeah, exactly. The the most frightening  thing about magic is its ability to compel the. wills of others. Yes. Right. And that's what I  think homosexuals are seeking when they because. they feel so powerless in their own lives and have  this understanding that they are are broken people. without agency over their own sex lives, over  their bodies, over that down there. Like I don't.

even have control over me, but I'm damn well going  to have control over you. Like that's I think a. lot of it. And and so if you if you dovetail that  in with the I know you're telling the truth here. I don't fully understand what you're saying,  but I it comports with a lot of what I've seen. I feel as though if you if you are a person who  intuitits that you have a lack of of control of. power of of agency over your own drives, your own  desires, your your own um uh urges and the even.

your biological anatomical uh your your physical  responses like I can't stop getting aroused by. men. What is that? uh you're going to want to  exercise power elsewhere over others. That's. so interesting. And being sucked into the nexus  of intersectional, you might you're going to be. tempted by explicit magic as well as the implicit  magic of of whatever. And so, you know, dovetail.

that with right-wing authoritarianism and and  and and and I have to say, I'm sorry to say it, I must say it some dimensions in some respects. I  can see that that might be something that attracts. homosexuals to the Catholic Church, for instance.  Um, just the illusion being being a bishop. I. mean, or National Review magazine, you know, which  is You don't just save me. It's all right. I'm. happy to talk about the the the Catholic element  of I mean, the bishops are all [ __ ] I mean, they're all whoopsies. They're allies gays. U I  like I like that one. It it contains within it.

a kernel of the sort of slapstick that I think  we have to one of the ways I got myself off it. was was was imagining myself in that situation  as ridiculous. Like I can't even perceive that. I would do something so ridiculous like laughing  at it became cuz you know laughter is the death. of arousal, right? Totally agree. So I read this  some I read or or or something like that went off. from the back. Anyone who's ever been laughed at  naked can tell you that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

never have, but um uh uh I haven't either. Um no,  but but I mean, you know, like it's it's it's I. think it's a favorite famous like British  uh particularly a British like injunction, you know, that laughter is the death of arousal  or whatever. Um uh and and I just thought, okay, well, how about if I start thinking about it as  ridiculous? Because it is ridiculous. I mean, like you and the football team, like it is  ridiculous. Uh and so that's one of the ways. I but but no this this this that is so true. Uh  seeing themselves as powerless even to control.

their own bodies and knowing on some level I  think the homosexuals seek out those places. Um. and you know you see this is why you might want  to bomb Iran in Venezuela. Yeah. Bomb bomb bomb. bomb. What's gayer? What's gayer? I'm not saying  he was a practicing homosexual. Wasn't is there. anything gayer than John McCain's like bloodlust?  uh seen through this or his proteges seen through. this prism. I mean he's even got the fat friend.  It's his daughter. Um you know like he he even b.

he even bred the fat best friend. You know like  is there is there a is there a more ostentatious. like [ __ ] hag in America than Megan McCain?  You know she hates herself. She's fat. She's. crazy. She's every gay man's dream. Uh you  know can't dress. Um uh you know she she's. she's Why is that every gay man's dream? because  they want to visit upon their female friends. um the cruelty they wish that they could perform  on their mothers. Whoa. Whoa. Um they want to.

make her feel fat and ugly and ridiculous because  that's what their mother did to them and there was. no dad around to protect them and their mother  was just this overbearing terrible, you know, sort of the Yungian and devouring mother. Um all  of this has been banned in the United States. So, I don't even think people are familiar  with these concepts anymore, right? So, so I'll try to keep it simple. Uh, imagine like  um imagine like a a female like Lutheran pastor. or a or or a a female Jewish rabbi and they're  like, you know, hey, it's great to grieve.

That's for a TV show. But, but like  one of those, right? This is horrible. overbearing monstrousness that on some level the  homosexual knows is what's made him like this. cuz he know dad wasn't around so mom did it right.  This is why by the way this is why trans were so. popular because it got parents off the hook. If  you got a gay kid you know you did something but. if your kid has a disease and was born into  the wrong body. Well that's not your fault is. it? And you got all this sympathy and oh all your  friends are like oh you got a trans kid. How tough.

are you? No you got a [ __ ] cuz you you raised  a [ __ ] because you're a terrible parent. Uh you. know that's what's really going on. They want to  avoid that. So instead no I'm going to chop its. ding-dong off and say it's got a disease. Like  that's why it was so popular with single moms. Amazing. That's why that's why trans were so  popular single moms. Um because it got them off. the hook. It means they didn't turn their son gay  when they know they did. They know they did. They. know they did. And the sons know they did. And  the sons grow up being cruel to women because of.

what mom did to them. So they're hostile toward  their moms. Even though many gay men I've known. this close relation, but but it's a toxicity. It's  it's a it's a codependent relationship that they. know is they can't so sometimes they can't visit  this cruelty on their mom because they have this. close relationship with their mom but they do it  on other women. It's m it's it's redirected right. it's uh transferred onto other onto other women  cuz they love a mommy like why would I do that. on my mom but on some level they know that's  she did that she did that. So, so they force.

women into ever more uncomfortable and ever uglier  outfits and throw them down runways on, you know, in 10-in heels or they um What? So, you think the  fashion industry is is acting this out? Of course. it is. I mean, what other explanation could there  be for the intolerable ugliness of the catwalk? You are blowing my mind on so so many levels.  I can't even I mean sure we used to have when.

society was working properly you would go have  you ever seen Mrs. Aris goes to Paris? No. It's. a lovely movie about a char lady a um housekeeper.  Yes. Housekeeper. Yes. To to Americans um see how. you know a char woman and you've never seen Mrs.  Aris goes to Paris. Um who who dreams of one day. owning a couture Dior dress like the person that  she works for. Right. and she saves up and she. saves up and there's calamities with her money  and you know some some boyfriend loses whatever.

and eventually she manages to go to Paris and she  manages to get the dress right and when society. was properly ordered there were these aspirational  um beauty standards and these aspirational. lifestyle goals included gorgeous tailoring  and beautiful um uh um silhouettes for women. that accentuated their uh you know their gorgeous  characters not like that now is it not like that. No. And and it's funny. I don't know much I don't  know really anything about fashion, but I love.

female beauty, of course. But you don't see any of  it on the catwalk. Exactly. In fact, you see the. opposite. You see the opposite. You see you see  manufactured ugliness. Gay men turning women into. the demons they see themselves as. Um, you see  gay look look at look at the most who's the most. celebrated woman on the stage at the moment is  is the the um Gorgon opposite Ariana Grande whose. name I forget now. Um, you know this this the the  noseratu like black noseratu um who's seems to be.

sucking the life force out of poor Ariana who's  I think gonna die within the next few weeks. Uh. if you've seen if you've seen that singer's um  physique lately um she sort of but this this this. this appalling apparition um Cynthia or something  I think uh of course she's called Cynthia. Um. you know with these with these claws you know and  you look at the silhouette and you're like that's. literally Noseratu. It's literally not. And I know  a gay man did that. And of course, a gay man then.

put her on stage in Jesus Christ Superstar as  our Lord. Did you know that? No. Have you seen. you seen the person I'm talking about? Right. No.  Okay. Well, you'll Google it later. But um it's. this spindly. It's just just straight up goblin  looking black woman like and and I you know, I'm. not trying to have like a a rose a a um a Roseanne  moment. Um although she was right. Um you know, whatever. But this woman is like, you know, like  like ugly by any racial stat. is just monstrous.

looking, right? Just just what our mothers might  have called deeply unfortunate, right? Um and. practically circus level. And of course, she's the  heroine of of the billion dollar franchise now, Wicked. And she's um and she's on stage as Jesus,  which which so it's an act of hostility is what. you're saying. Exactly. Exactly. And and and so  the these gay men who feel the will of Gorgoth.

inside them like do it, do it. Uh you know, and  and and who go turn these women into the demons. they see inside themselves. You know, the demons  they see acting on. This is a lot deeper than I. expected when I when I texted you to have this  conversation. Um it's more than you would imagine. from a guy wearing this t-shirt. No, it's not  actually. And by the way, can I say one thing. that's bothered me for years? When I was a child,  there was a lot of creativity coming from gay men. in the United States. Like they all gone now.  I know. And it's Dave Rubin is is responsible.

And not him personally, but I mean like but  do you know what I'm talking about? I mean, of course. And why? Because a lot of free thinking  and I was related to one of them and I spent a lot. of time in my house, lived under my house when I  was a kid and gay died of AIDS, you know, but and. had a lot of problems. But in some but I will say  creative freethinking like truly freeth thinking. vid doll was like the archetype. This is burkian.  They're no gorid dolls in gay world that I'm aware.

of. They're all like conformist and supporting  the the man like what the only the only ones. these days exgay. Um but but do you know what I'm  talking about? Yes. And it's Burkian. It's because. creativity arises out of order. There has to be  limits. And if homosexuality is not prescribed as. wretched and kept at the fringes where it belongs,  creativity dies. And what do you get? Because you. don't have those people playing with the limits.  You don't have the the taboo breakers. You don't. have the uh artists, the creatives living at the  limits of society. They're brought instead. And.

I have to say I think the gay gay community such  as is one of the least creative most conformist. elements of our society. I never thought I would  say that. They become the enforcers just like. they're the enforcers. the Ptorian guard for  Apple and Microsoft. Like what the hell? Just. like the white women of folklore who uh you know  are are responsible for all evil, but they become. like turbocharged Karens, you know. Um, and and  and it's the white women who welcome in the the. white single moms typically, uh, but single moms  generally, I think, who who who bring in um, uh,

drag queen story hour cuz there's no gay people  like banging down the door to to to There's no gay. people like, excuse me, can I come read your kids?  Do you mind? Can I come read stories your kids? Like, no, they're not. Uh, uh, they're not. Uh,  but there are demons out there who will come do. it if you invite them because what do you have to  do with demons? Open a portal. Uh, open a doorway, you know? So these these women open the doorway  and in comes, you know, um uh three little pigs.

Uh um but the gays now have taken this role.  They've taken the um uh the the the the mantle. over from you know what we used to we mean  we used to say it, didn't we? We used to say. uh uh white single moms are root of all evil like  as you know kind of half joking uh because of all. the crazy stuff they support, but now it's  homosexuals. I I have to I have to be honest. with you. I bear some responsibility for this  because it was me uh 10 years ago mainstreaming.

homosexuality in the Republican party is the great  regret of my life more so than anything I've done. to my own soul which is a lot. Um it's the great  regret of my life um because it has given rise to. horrors I never imagined. I mean say Lenon said  you know all revolutionaries come to hate their. children you know. Well, the gay horrors that  I've given birth to, Lady Mara, Nick Fuentes, I mean, they keep me up at night. They keep me  up at night. Um, I mean, why did you mention. Dave Rubin? What's his role? Well, because he is  at the vanguard along with another of other gays.

in public life of um introducing children into the  equation because it's when you when you when you. do what I did, which is like gay like everyone  else, you be normal gay. I remember and I this. is the thing I regret more than anything else  in the world. There's a video of Ross Matthews. in 2017 on Twitter saying, "So, I came home and  um landscapers have been in. We're getting more. citrus. You can never have too much citrus." And  I people ask me, "Ross, what do you think about. this this Milo guy?" And I'm like, "Mo, Milo, how  low can you go?" I don't know who this person is,

but I read it. And he says, "I'm getting letters,  this Milo guy. He's resigning from Breitbart or. something." And he says, "I'm getting letters from  people who say, uh, you make it okay that I have a. gay son because if he grows up, he doesn't have  to be like Ross Matthews." And I was like, "No, they should be like Ross Matthews. They should  be like Ross Matthews. They shouldn't be like. Dave Rubin." Like, like you might not even know  unless you watched him for a little bit because. this domesticity of homosexuals has killed all the  things that were good about gays that made them.

like tolerable. uh and and and and instead has  given them this grotesque parody, this simulacum. of domesticity which has in which has of course  in their neverending hunger expanded to include. babies and now we have the Bajage couple buying  black children. I thought you weren't allowed to. buy people. I thought Oh, no. You can if you're  a homosexual called adoption or surrogacy or.

whatever, but you can buy them. I thought it was  called slavery. In fact, you have to buy them cuz. it's and it's quite expensive. Um, is it some  online slave market or doesn't cover? No, no, no. It's it's the government. Um, uh, as you know,  um, but Dave Rubin has like Franken sperm babies. like he he mixed his eluvia with that of his  husband. I mean, this is real. This is physical.

gave it a stir and hoped for the best and I  just whichever one we get we get implanted. it in some highly paid woman we'll never know  the name of the real mother of those children. um and uh you know he and his he and his his  his uh uh catammite are on on on the internet. you know with these signs like it's coming with  these two dates and I'm like yeah your damnation. that's the date you're counting down to the the  the the date you're how was that conservative.

Oh, because it's family, you see. Because it's  uh it's the the the the the slight of hand like. that's going on is they're like, well, gays are  just like everybody else, so we should behave like. everybody else, which means we should have kids.  And if we can't physically have kids cuz our sex. is this like demonic sterile horror show, then  we'll buy them and then we'll look like we've. got I mean, that's that's how bad it is. That's  how bad it is. And so you have the I love I don't. know if it says anything about Republicans versus  Democrats, but but you have like Dave Rubin who.

for whom buying a child is not good enough. It  must be his own, you know, like like like the. the the the the conceit of that. So on the right  you've got this sort of techno conceit Franken. baby and on the left they adopt blacks. Like,  you know, you've got these two uh wispy, wiry. [ __ ] who adopted two black babies. Uh I mean,  isn't Buddha just the most interesting character.

of our age? Like, I mean, he doesn't look like he  looks like an intensely boring homosexual. Like, it's everything gay people shouldn't be. But  it's so interesting the fact that I mean, clearly he wasn't gay like at the beginning. Well,  he had girlfriends, right? So, he wasn't gay, but he made himself gay. I made that point  um because actually I had gay men who worked. for me who were more in tune with this than me.  I'm not in tune at all. I just didn't I thought. Peter put a judge was a joke. But um they said,  "Well, he's not really gay." And I was like, "No.".

And so what does that mean? I Well, his sexuality  like all se like all homosexuality is a function, a product, a symptom. What is his homosexuality a  symptom of? It's of his vaultting ambition. Uh uh. Bajage timed it perfectly so that post Obama uh  the gay guy with the with the black kids perfect. presidential candidate. So to the I think to the  heterosexual brain it's like are you really saying.

a guy would switch his quote sexuality in order to  get a better job? Uh yeah. Yeah. Women do it all. the time. Lesbianism is got nothing to do with  male homosexuality. Just look, everybody knows. they got a college girlfriend who was a they got  a girlfriend who was a lesbian in college. Yeah. Everybody. Like, you could barely find a woman  who hasn't played around with a woman. Um, Queen. Victoria didn't believe that this was sex or that  two women would do that with one another. And she. refused to accept that women even did that um very  wisely, realizing that lesbianism wasn't real. And.

uh so lesbian lesbianism wasn't illegal in Britain  for a long time when male homosexuality was. But. um female sexuality is known in the studies  to be far more malleable. Women go backwards. and forwards between men all the time. And and and  and you know, lesbianism is like a is is is a is a. um social and political decision. It's a series of  social and political decisions. I mean, women want. uh companionship. They want stability. They want  safety. They can find that in a woman, you know, like you can find that in a in a Butch Dyke just  as easily as you can find it in American man these.

days. Um I'm sorry. Uh you know, at least at least  she can cash in her Harley-Davidson. What have you. got? Um, you know, but um, sorry that leather  jacket's got to go for something. Uh, you know, the warehouse full of eyeliner you've got. Um,  no, I I um I joke, but only slightly. We've seen. women do it. Seen women do it. They do all the  time. They choose to be less all the time. So,

so, so you don't find it, you don't find the I  realize it sounds extreme and implausible. Well, too I to me anyway it's like really but we're  dealing with a sociopath here. We're dealing. with somebody who's who's entirely divorced  from his own emotional from his own feelings, right? We're dealing from somebody dealing with  somebody who will do anything, go anywhere, be anything. I mean, are you telling me like is  it is it so crazy that he would get a he to have.

a boyfriend and and adopt these kids? Is that so  much more insane than a gay man uh uh living in. the closet and having and having a wife and having  sex with her and producing children with her? Is. that so nuts? Like, okay, so there probably more  sex involved. Is it Is it Is it like Isn't it just. like that on steroids? Like is it so bonkers? And  that's where gay people should be, by the way, in the closet praying to get better. Um uh but  but is it so wild? It's not wild. No, you're. right. I just hadn't thought of it that. And and  gay men have been doing that for centuries. Well,

I know I know a bunch of them. Yeah. Of course  we Well, you work in and I used to work in uh. conservative media and uh uh uh it's all of them.  It's everybody. It's everybody. They're all [ __ ]. Um they're all gay. All of them are gay. All of  them are gay. Like everyone is gay. I haven't. said anything about it for like 30 years just  because of my just general Anglo commitment to. not get involved in other people's business. But  it's so noticeable. I I just don't know what I.

clearly there's something going on here. Yeah. I  I think it's the exercise of power of others as. we talked about really smart but in this case the  Buddha I find him fascinating because because he's. he's misjudged but only slightly what would be  required to be the perfect presidential candidate. like in 2028 2024 right and he starts off and  he's got girlfriends he's in the military he's.

living a normal like American life and then chasen  I mean like if you want to they say that um exgays. often go for like uh uh near eastern women um cuz  they're not sexually demanding and they look like. boys from behind you know like Malaysian girls um  you know when they come to have wives uh but isn't. chasing kind of like the closest thing you can get  to a girl um closest you know sort of if you need. a similacrim of a woman you flip him over it could  be a girl you know um I don't think I know what.

Jason looks like. His well, you're you're blessed.  Um, his husband is is, if you don't know that, then you might know the expression aged out twink  or uh but but um he he's about as the most the. most effeminite man that you could you could Oh,  is that true? Yeah. Um not in the kind of like So, so there's whereas Pete has that kind of fake  radio voice like Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know Yeah. Yeah. So, so you know, um, and  it is a fake voice because you can get you can.

find recordings of him earlier and and he's got  more into it the more gay his life has become. Really? Yeah. Like the the the the base, the  diaphragm. It's like like talk from your stomach, Pete. Talk from your You can imagine chasing  before he goes on stage. Remember, babes, from. your stomach. He's like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah." Like  from down here. Just imagine, you know, remember. what Lindsay said? uh you know the speech coach  who taught him how to sound heterosexual you know.

whatever but no no the the it's it's going down  it's like sinking it's like there's something in. there working its way through this like achingly  slow form of peristalsis gradually finding its way. down eventually he's going to sound like Gorgoth  um uh you know when he realizes his full potential. um no he he he um he's fake he's not gay He's not  gay. He's not gay. There's a doubt in my mind. Uh. he's not gay. But he's performing homosexuality  because and including having the sex, you know,

uh but probably not a lot of it. I mean, you don't  imagine them, you know. Well, I don't want you to. imagine anything cuz I don't I don't wish to to to  leave a unpleasant taste in your mouth like that. But I I'll I'll I'll I'll suggest to your  viewers that there it's not a particularly. sexually active couple, which might also explain  how it's possible for somebody to do that, right? In the same way that a that a a DL gay guy  wouldn't be a particularly sexual husband, right?

Are uh gay marriages monogous? That's funny. Oh,  you mean it? Well, I sense that they're not having. known some Um, but are any I guess is what I would  ask. I mean, I think you get that sort of elderly. antiques dealer in Kentucky kind of, you know, you  get that's so good. You know, so good. We have a. senator like that. Um, uh, who, you know, I think  if if he if he found a husband who was prepared. to put up with um I really shouldn't I really  shouldn't, but look up the ladybugs. Uh, look look.

up his ladybugs. Um, it's on it's on the internet.  We have so many senators like that. That's crazy. Well, I think people know the one I mean. Um Oh,  the actual one from Kentucky. No, no, no. Um um. little bit over. Uh you know, you know, you can  imagine he sort of invites his friend Jasper in. for a mint jeulip. Uh you know, you know, and it's  like, do you want to just sit there while I get. myself uh dusted up? You know, like like um yes,  of course there are loads loads, but I'm thinking.

of of the one in particular that everybody  kind of um you said you don't out people, so I feel like No, sorry, sorry, sorry. I'm not  going to use Mitch McConnell's name. Um but it. was Lindsey Graham. Sorry. Um but but u um No, I  uh It's a shame, isn't it? This the falling over. the the the like how long are you going to stagger  on? They're determined to turn themselves into the. goblins that that dictate their behavior. Well,  that's the thing about And I'm not Yeah, it's that. there's there's so bloodthirstiness that's just  really distressing and offensive to me. But but.

think about it like this. the sassy, vindictive,  catty cruelty of the homosexual. Imagine what he'd. be like if you gave him a nuclear button. Right?  It sounds stupid, but it's it's a continuum. It's. a spectrum, right? And so those gays that have  the will to power, they go get some and they use. it to bomb people or to um bully or to I mean, how  much must they all get off on the fact that they.

are all having sex and nobody would dare touch it.  Nobody nobody outs them. Nobody says a thing and. all living lies to their cons. This is I mean we  were joking earlier about um about outing people, but like that's why I have a thirst for it because  it's hypocrisy. It's public apocry. I'm not. interested in outing like, you know, Joe Simpson  who has a corner store, right? I'm interested. in outing people who are misrepresenting  themselves to the public and I'll, you know,

somebody just got married with wedding pictures  and with engagement pictures that are so absurd. I. know. I figured him out, by the way. I figured him  out. I could never work out this guy. I was like, what is it that's off with you? And I realized he  always wants a bigger laugh than the joke he tells. commands. And it's because he's actually obese but  in the body of a merely fat person. Like if you. think of him as like 400 pounds, he suddenly makes  sense because he's always doing this, you know,

uh and you're like, "Oh, you're a fat person.  You're a giant fat person." So he's like a. a really fat gay in the body of like a a merely  slightly overweight gay. Um and and and suddenly. his personality begins to make sense. He does all  these like fat, you know, like he's got these like. fat ticks that fat people do to like get a bigger  laugh than than than their wit would normally. allow for, you know, you know what I mean? Like,  and everybody and everybody laughs long anyway. because they're fat. Uh, you know, the fat people  are just funny cuz they're fat. Uh, you know,

and he's like he's he's like he acts like he's  funny cuz he's fat, but he's not fat. You're. talking about Cy Booker. Yeah. Yeah. So, just back  back to the question though, is so is monogamy. an expectation in a gay marriage? I think well I  think it's an aspiration. I think it's a I think. it's a I think it's a stated ambition. Uh but  but you know like all ambitions you know we we we. state something we know we can never reach because  in grasping for it we we we you know we achieve.

greatness and so so maybe they only have sex with  20 people a year instead of 200. Um you know and. that's that's gay that's that would be that would  be gay fidelity. That would be good. Really? Oh, yeah. I'm not even I mean, maybe I'll tell you,  but like because there's no woman there to enforce. it. So, I've always Exactly. And the And normally  no kids to the blah blah. How could you lose your. children? Blah. This is why this is why living um  this is why living on the DL in marriage with a.

woman is the optimum environment for a homosexual  because all of the social cues are pushing them. to do the what they know that they should be  doing anyway, which is working on eradicating. these disordered urges as the religious uh uh um  um religious uh excavates would put it or or or um. uh unwanted samesex attraction as the reparative  therapists would have it. Um, whatever it is,

all of the the the cues and the pressure is moving  them in the right way. And so, no, I mean, that's. that's it's good. Alan Turing, for God's sake, you  know, was living like that. Who was Alan Turing, you know, the he was living like that and and they  castrated him anyway, which seems a bit mean to me. after the war after he after he'd won the war  for them. It's like, okay, that's that's all. brilliant, but we're going to chemically castrate  your seemist to me. I was like, God was like, "Oh, God. Can I let him crack one out after he won  the bloody war for you?" God. All right. All.

right. So, Britain can Brits can be savage  like that, you know? So, do you know um like. the happiness level of people who are involved in  like promiscuous gay sex? like what's it when you. when you um live that kind of life, you're living  you're living deep in profound denial and it comes. from I read something in in maybe it's the  Atlantic or or or Mother Jones, one of some.

of all places, you know, some leftwing gay guy who  just wrote about this really beautifully. I'll try. to find it in Twitter after this, but um he said  when when when when homosexuals are young, they. realize they have to put on different faces for  different people. I guess the racial equivalent. be code switching, right? Yeah. Um and they re  and and the effect of this on a person who has. disordered urges unlike someone who just happens  to be black uh is that it begins to like create. cracks and ultimately that turn into like shards  in the personality like bits of the personality.

like burst ping ping off like a chandelier that  the floor and it's so sad. Yeah. And it produces. the space for profound denial of the type that  most homosexual men find themselves in where that. flooding of addictive urge is mistaken for healthy  and normal sexual um uh attraction. And so I kind. of stumbled when I when I looked into I just woke  up one day and I was like and I was married to a.

dude to my shame and I who's now like the ex-wife  from hell. My god. Um you know look if there's no. other reason to like not be gay just imagine like  how bad a black homosexual ex-wife is. Like so I'm. not I'm not even going to go there. You don't  even want to know. It's like, "Oh, sorry. With. two sports cars a year wasn't enough." Okay. All  right. Okay. All right. Um, don't even. But, um,

I when I woke up one day and I I woke up one  day and I looked over and I was like, "Oh, no. I don't want to do this anymore. Like,  hell is real. I don't want to go there." And. it just hit me like all after it was growing, you  know, a while. I was just like, "No, no, I really. don't want to go there." And I no, um, what am I  doing? And the way that I started to address this, I kind of stumbled upon a crude version of what  the enlightened like they don't call it conversion.

therapy anymore. They call it reintegrative  therapy. Um because it's reintegrating those. shards and those and those broken and those broken  bits of like memory that lead to the wrong output. We can talk in detail if you want to, but um I I  I stumbled upon kind of like a crude version of. that. So when I was trying to stop myself from  doing this stuff, I was using like hot oil on. my thighs. I was like doing things, you know,  like like like that hurt and I was trying to.

rewire my brain cuz I read a lot of, you know,  psychology, anthropology books and stuff like. that. So I thought I thought I know sex urge  is such a basic and powerful urge. It's got to. be hard. I thought I knew what I was doing. So I  was like, every time I get aroused, I'm going to. go and do something that hurts, you know? And so  I took the I took the um you know like paying my. taxes. No. Uh you know I I um you know like having  sex with black people. Uh no no no. Um uh I I I. I did something immediately to try to to to redo  that. And there's there's a there's a much better.

way to do it. Uh which I can talk to you about.  Um, I was I was I think I was recognizing in that. that I had this that something had jumped the  tracks in my brain, right? And I was having a a. an incorrect response to a particular stimulus as  a result of damage, trauma, whatever. And that um. and that is a little bit like being a PTSD victim  or or or some other kinds of sexual devian, right?

Um, and that I I knew I knew that I could train my  way out of it because at the same time I had been. returning to the Catholic faith of my childhood.  And I had been speaking to a dear friend. She's a. very brilliant uh professor in Chicago. She's a um  world's leading expert on marrying devotion in the. middle ages. And she, you know, she was she was  she was kind of like feeding me this rich material. about, you know, training the soul in virtue  and and and and and I was I was, okay, well,

if I can do it about that cuz I'm getting pretty  good at that, like what about this? And so I I did. this stuff and and I and I I got myself as far as  celibacy, which is where I I'm coming in January. It'll be 5 years. Um Oh, celibacy. Yeah. And the  good thing about the male libido is the less you. have, the less you want. uh which married men can  tell you is this is the only reason they're still. married. Um you know uh no it's like sugar  though the more you eat the more you want.

It is exactly like that. Why? Because it's an  appetite not a sexual uh orientation. It's an. appetite. It's an addiction. Um and the more that  you have cocaine or aderall, the more that you are. likely on a given Tuesday afternoon to be like,  "Ooh, lime would be nice." Or, "Ooh, why don't I. have a little little um little instant release 30  milligrams? That'll get me through the you know, um, it works the same, it functions the same, it  is the same. I remember reading during the AIDS, uh, period about, you know, like the number of  sexual partners a year, which is like crazy high.

I think it's all banned. You're not allowed to  talk about it anymore, but um, uh, and thinking, you know, if those were all like hot girls, would  I want to sleep with 75? Probably. You wouldn't. be able to get through it. Honestly, I don't think  most straight men would. be like, "Yeah, you know, I mean, you know, men are obviously pigs and  like variety and all." You hit on something real, which is that Well, I'm trying to be as honest  as I can. I'm sure I'll be mocked for this, but I did wonder like if it's because there's  something wrong with the act itself if you're.

doing with that many people, right? Yes. Now,  there's a component of it where it's like the the. women are setting up the friction there. They're  the ones with the precious jewel, you know, that they're setting up barriers to, right? Men  will put out like if if a man wants to have sex, like they're normally the person asking for the  sex, right? They're normally the ones who are. seeking the sex. Women normally the ones who are  um I won't say withholding it, but uh regulating. the access to it, let's say, as the enforcers, for  sure. Um take that away and of course and put two.

men on there and you're like, well, if they both  want it, they're both going to do it all the time. Of course. But that doesn't really explain the  Exactly. That was my thought. It's like if there. was no limit. If if good-looking women wanted to,  this is my younger self thinking of this. If they. wanted to sleep with me as much as I wanted to  sleep with them, I still don't think I'd sleep. with 75 of them in a year, cuz that sounds kind of  gross. Well, I mean, by gay standards, that's um. uh practically celibate. I mean, maybe not these  days with the boring gays that adopt the children.

who don't have sex with each other and just molest  the kids, but um but by by the old-fashioned gay. standards of the taboo breaking promiscuous  drug. I mean, look, I grew up in London, taking a lot of [ __ ] drugs, going to a lot of  clubs, going to aa and then of course, you know, like in London you had a circuit of clubs, trade  and beyond and and and uh DTPM at whatever. Um.

there was like a circuit every weekend. It was  four continuous days, right, which you could only. really do with drugs and and during that time  stops off for sex. Um I mean 75 is like takes. you up to February actually. I mean I probably  was a lot worse than usual and I group scenarios. and whatever, but yeah, I mean it doesn't fully  explain the grotesque extent. And by the way, it's always the the gay couples that are basically  lesbians that live sterile like they live these.

like sexless lives who are incensed when you dare  to talk about gay promiscuity. It's not because. gay promiscuity doesn't exist, it's because they  don't have access to it. Um uh but most gays do. And what what we what we are thinking about in  our in our hypothetical example of of of two men. doesn't explain the full grotesque extent of it.  And it's because there is something unsatisfying. about gay sex. Um, well, that was my assumption.  And and you're correct. And it's it's it's.

so so Catholic natural law and and and the way  that low therapies work, they start with this. presumption that things are working properly  when they are performing the function for which. they were designed. Yes. Right. Clearly a an erect  member going into the wrong orifice is not doing. um is not performing the function for which  it was designed. Right? So sex that ends that. way too cannot possibly be satisfying. It's not  permissible uh spiritually. It it's not satisfying.

physically. So if you take Catholic church  teaching for instance just no I think that's. real and that's true for eating and it's true for  beauty and it's true for the sex is sterile. No, but every pleasure that's like a righteous  pleasure satisfies you. Yeah. Only 15 of them, right? But like justice feels good. You know,  when you see somebody wicked get the comeuppants. and you're like, "Yeah." And that feels like a  lot of that feels it feels a little like um uh.

as you say, righteous pleasures. Um all of which  tend toward the kind of satisfaction that you uh. that a lot of people describe getting um in holy  communion. It's filling, right? It is filling. It. is filling. That little wafer is very filling,  right? Um the further you get away from that, the less satisfying things are by volume. If you  like that tiny little wafer, which is complete, you feel like you don't need to feel, eat, drink,  think, pray anything else the rest of your whole.

life. You just feel like perfect in that moment  like like you have because you are just in that. brief moment in dialogue with with our Lord in  in some fashion and you're like that's my Sunday. vibes, you know, like whatever it is. And it's  not until Monday morning that life kind of comes. comes back at you. The further you get away from  that, the more stuff you need to approach the same. level of satisfaction. Think about like um uh uh  the the fake sugar you have, right? Uh over here.

um the the the cornstarch, whatever it's called,  how much Hershey's chocolate you have to eat to. feel the same as two squares of Capri, right?  Or how many Reese's Peanut Butter Cups equals a. steak. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Well, I really  noticed that. I mean, by the way, you you know, Halloween candy, you can I don't know. I don't  know much about calories, but you could eat like. millions of calories, but you can't eat six pounds  of steak. It's just not possible. But the point. is that not the sugar is bad necessarily, but that  um this fake sugar that has that waxy taste that's.

not really you need so much more of it to feel  satisfied to get your sugar hit. That is totally. right. And in so doing, you have so many more  calories, right? And you start to get fat and. uh and and and then then then you need not just  six Cokes but eight Cokes a day instead of one. Like so so homosexual sex is sterile. It's not  capable of leading to production, excuse me,

of procreation, right? You cannot make a baby  with gay sex. It is spiritually unsatisfying in. addition to being and of course these two things  are connected, physically unsatisfying too. And when you start to think about like everything  working performing the function for which it was. designed like doing that for which it was intended  you start to realize why gay sex is like is is is. not hitting you know and this is the basis  this is the start this is where the therapy.

begins it begins can I just ask you one extra  question before you describe how your life has. changed and I don't mean to rush on to that no  no I'm fascinated by it but I I just find it so. interesting. So, so you spent like an hour and  20 minutes describing the hell that you lived. You thought it was hellish. Mhm. You left. Um, and  you, it sounds like you feel better and certainly. resolved. Yeah. But you're not encouraged to  feel that way. Like there's something about. the life that you live that's treated like a gang  initiation or something like you can check in but.

you can never leave. Like you're not welcome to  leave. Well, just look at the comments you get. like um forgive the language, but um under every  post that I will make online or every every you. know, on the rare occasion I I might say something  about this in an interview, one phrase keeps. popping up over and over again in the comments.  You can't unsuck a dick. Meaning, there's no. salvation for you once you're gay. You're gay.  You're gay. You're homosexual. That's it. Who's.

pushing that? the stain that that leaves, right,  which is profoundly uncchristian. I mean, we think. about Isaiah, right? You know, your sins may be  scarlet, but they'll be washed white as snow. Um, but Saul became Paul, right? Doesn't exist for  these people. And it's often leftist, but not. always. Um, insisting on this per the permanence  of this stain. And it's there's more to it than. merely just uh I hate you and I want you to hurt  or you're doing something stupid or whatever. It's.

it's it's there's something more going on and it's  people are terrified by the idea that this might. not be an intrinsic part of a person's personality  or nature. Why why are they afraid of that? I. thought we were for personal choice. Well, we're  all a bit afraid of that, aren't we? cuz we're. all kind of like, you know, we see other people  who are are um doing well in life or who have got. themselves out of a sticky situation or, you know,  who left their phone on the table when they went.

to the bathroom in the break um or or whatever  and and who um and who lash out against others who. do seem to be achieving something redemptive. And  isn't it true that one of those characterizations. of the demons is that they're you know in the  presence of the light in the presence of good of. the word of God they hiss and spit right and it's  not necessarily these people are gay themselves.

but they they to confront the horror that a gay  person might be able to ungay means that whatever. whatever you've got going in your life you could  fix easy you know like but you don't want to do. you you don't want to get better you want to  stop. Cuz if he can stop having sex with men, knowing what a powerful compulsion urge that  is for most men, you know, that might mean I.

have to stop drinking. That might mean I have to  stop taking drugs. That might mean I have to stop. being a fat ass. That might mean I have to stop  being cruel, being vindictive, abusive, malicious. Uh and I think that part of it is certainly that  we have become a society that encourages vice over. virtue that aggressively pushes sin. Yes. Why?  Because dumb, dependent people are easier to. control. Because dumb, dependent people living  paycheck to paycheck, enslaved not only to and.

we and we live in a particularly evil um uh uh uh  uh environment now where we're not just enslaved. to things, we're enslaved to the mechanisms by  which we get them. Compound interest, you know, uh. uh you know, our our car payments, all this kind  of stuff. 50-year mortgages. Yeah, thanks Trump. uh how many years of that are we just paying down  the interest before we own a brick in the house? You know, um we're now enslaved to these these  like meta addictions or these additional layers.

of of problem which mean that we can't even do  anything about our lives cuz one missed paycheck. and we're you know um we can't do anything. We  can't do anything about it because we're locked. in from every single angle into our addictions,  into our compulsions, into the bad food that we. eat at the supermarket because it's cheap and  the um and the TV we watch we know we shouldn't. and the video games that are fine by themselves  but which you know 20 hours 20 hours over the. weekend like that's a lot, bro. Uh you know, just  all this stuff and it's packaged and it's pushed.

and it's encouraged and just look at the sponsors.  I looked at the sponsors of um Jimmy Kimmel's show. when he was taken off the air and it's donuts and  banks. Look at the sponsors of Jimmy Kimmel show. and you're like, "Oh my god." Like these are evil,  wretched, terrible people who just want you fat, stupid, and quiet. There's no question in  my mind you're telling the truth. It's too.

obvious. We want you dumb independent. And do you  think the relentless promotion of homosexuality. is part of that? Because it is relentlessly  tirelessly promoted. Period. Anyone says it's. not a liar. What is more incapacitating? What is  more incapacitating? Having no control over your. own sexual desires. And just look at how comfy  capitalism has made itself with homosexuals. Like, oh, you've got no kids. Well, perhaps you'd like  these designer clothes, you know? Oh, you don't. have any dependence? Well, maybe you'd like to  spend way more than you should on this cruise,

you know, or or or what what I mean, a boat  cruise. Uh, you know, uh, oh, you you you you um. uh all your disposable income is yours to spend.  Well, um, perhaps you'd like to try. Would we do. you have a special uh this evening, sir? Um, like  our our pan roasted blah blah blah blah blah blah. Um, you know, the the the the used to call it the  pink pound in England. this um uh disproportionate. ability of gays to spend which has a a reinforcing  effect. It's like a like a like a um uh I don't.

know the economic term, but you probably do.  It has like a a magnifying or or or or um a. fortifying effect because of course gays spend  more, so you market more to gays, so you get more, you know, so you get more of them. Um and then  other people begin to acquire gay taste, which. has happened to women and is now happening to men.  um because it's seen as a prestige or a luxury or. a or a desirable kind of lifestyle. So you see men  as the um uh charming uh ladies of YouTube would. tell us um who are are are acquiring gay habits  and get I mean like soul cycle for I mean please.

uh like what are these people doing? It's like  you're in like her and you want me to see your. ass. Got it. Cuz this is doing nothing. What other  gay habits are men acquiring? Uh definitely. Um. uh food, which I mean like if you're if you're  a chap. So I was in the hotel last night um as I.

was thinking about the show and I looked at the  menu and I was like there's nothing on here for. men. It was all these like seafood um uh a bit but  hand whatever. And the guy that was serving me had. a huge ginger beard. Um God bless him. And and  I said, "You don't eat here." And and he said, "Well," and I said, "You don't eat here. Where do  you eat?" And he said, "Okay, fine." And I said, "Is there anything on here that you would eat  aside from this?" Uh, and it didn't say how big. the fillet was, but I was like, "What is it? 6  ounces. What do you need four of those?" And he.

was like, "Yeah." You work like, "You wouldn't  eat anything because there's nothing for men on. the menu." Cuz it's all this like airy, fairy,  unsatisfying, calorier, full of like, you know, flavor, but no protein food for girls. All food  for girls. Look at the menu in your favorite. restaurant. Look at the menu in every restaurant.  There's no food for men on it. I mean, like, where where is it? Uh even even like a heroic  meat like lamb. It's like $78 for this little.

this little like thanks. Thanks so much. What  is that? That's not man food. So food for sure. I mean clothing. Let's not even um uh uh sexual  habits. Women uh have become pagotized by by the. promiscuity culture that their gay best friends  um you know like to to sort of have a nudge and a. wink kind of relationship with. Like, oh, I don't  do it, but who's this? Oh, just Jamal. You know,

um uh who's this? That's not the guy that you  were with like 3 days ago. Quiet girl. Um sorry. about her. You know, like just all that kind of  stuff. Um and and and men just the the way in. which the self-destructive um sacrifice the the  the relinquishment of of of the will to the most. addictive version of everything. It's very gay.  Very gay. The most addictive version version of.

everything. So, like if gay sex is like addiction  where it just floods your mind with like the. chemicals where you can't get it out of your head  like we were talking about right at the beginning, right? Well, the food has become like that and  the clothes have become like that and and the you. know like men buying designer clothes has always  been a bit sus to me. Oh, I totally agree. Like. I'm I mean I do it because I'm like I've got  about another 3 years where I can still get. away with this and then I'm going to have to just  be straight. Well, I can still do it, you know,

and then I'm going to have to find like some some  like uh I'm going to have to find my own nudge. and a wink thing like oh no they're not they're  arolano. Oh, that's the it's the um it's the late. Pope Benedict the 16th uh favorite shoemaker  from you fagotage you know stop it you know I. have to give all this up but um but somebody's  been heterosexual all their life like what are. you doing in Dior well I mean they only make shoes  I think no no there's male deal now what are you. doing it's Chanel that doesn't do men's clothes  um what are you doing in Dolingabana what are you.

doing in Versace why are you spending $1,000 on a  pair of shoes that is not like a like a tactical. ical or a and even that stuff. Oh my god. Like the  the faggotization of like the the of the you know. you can go now you can go to crypek and you can  get the um Versace of camo. uh like which which. their sales people will even call it that not on  the website cuz men don't like that but but like. there's now like designer camo uh where like I  mean I know I have it but uh but but you know.

uh fagotized fagotized everything is look  at the consumer choice who's making these. decisions women and we and we have this is  women women in the marketing departments. women in the in the advertising women on social  media everything's going gay and and and and and. It's justified. And just same with the pink pound  is self-reinforcing. This thing we always say, "Oh, women make most of the purchasing decisions  in most houses." Shut up. Like, doesn't mean every. man has to go out looking like he wants to drop on  his knees in a in a in a um in in a public park or.

in a toilet just because just because his wife  chooses what washing powder they use. Like, stop. it. Everything has gone gay. Everything's gone.  I mean, just just just every bit of life. I mean, music um I mean, now we now we force heterosexuals  to listen to Lil Nas X um you know, and and and. and this sort of uh um you know, endless turnover  of of um of of pining homosexual kuners um that we.

call pop stars. There aren't any anymore because  um pop stars require a kind of like heroic manly. virtue. I think that is just just gone now. It's  just not there anymore. So, if you wanted to. weaken a society to the point of collapse,  fagotize it. It's not feminization. That's. a that's a mistake to believe that. It's not  society is not becoming feminized. It's becoming. faggotized. It's become it's it's it has been gay,  you know, and it's um and and and it's it's like.

the difference between epheminacy and femininity,  right? You look carefully at the behaviors. It's. like it might have started off feminized like  you said, oh, the HR departments have kind of. like feminized language in the corporate sphere  and blah blah. It might have started that way, but the gays took over very soon afterwards. And  so now we don't have a feminized public square. We. have a faggotized public square. And it's hardly  surprising given that everybody in Congress and. everybody in the Senate and everybody in the party  and everybody on TV and everybody else that you've.

ever heard of on television and everybody on  all the TV shows are gay. It's not a shocker. uh that this would be the result because even if  they might be living um uh uh DL lives, they still. like what they like and they're still going to do  it. Oh yes, let's have that little cocktail, you. know, like they still do it. You see at DC like  these these men in DC like drinking their little. champagnes and things and so when you are I mean  a lot of this it's like walking into a room full.

of women and there's all this stuff going on but  you have no idea what it is. a a daily occurrence. for me. But um you know something's going on but  you you know you don't quite get the right the. wrong frequency. You're not recognizing it because  it's not feminine because you'd recognize it if it. was feminine. You'd know what you were looking  at. But when you go to Washington when you were. flitting around Washington as a when what was your  dangerous [ __ ] tour? Is that what it was called? Yes. And I think I think the verb would be flit  or perhaps flounce. There was some flouncing. I I.

saw it. Um there was there was a bit of flouncing.  Do you know the funny story? um a perfect sorry to. cut you off again. I've been doing the whole  day, but um uh a perfect illustration of the. fagotization of society. I'm my bus, my giant  dangerous flag bus is in a parking lot um just. outside Washington DC and um uh Mike Pence's  advanced team are planning to put him in the. same hotel and they have to change hotel. Yeah.  No, stop. But they have to change I mean he's like. spiritually gay for sure but but he had to change  hotels and divert his I mean this is the the you.

know this is the the incoming vice president of  United States right uh to make way for the [ __ ]. Just saying it wasn't like the first time they  could they could have come to me and said would. you mind because we have like the the the vice  president-elect like whatever or or coming in this. is 2017 so he is the vice president by then. um uh  uh you know, we have the vice president, you know, coming through like would you and we would have  said, "Yeah, sure. We'll we'll we'll you know, we'll go to the we'll go to the residents  in." Um but no, they just they just changed.

all of his plans, not mine, to make way to  make space for the [ __ ] Perfect analogy, isn't it? Perfect. But you picked up that vibe  a lot when you're in Washington. Oh my god, the number of people who Sorry, you  told me you don't help people. Um no, I think allegations have been roundly  disproven, haven't they? Um, no, but you know, the number of people who would  just I mean they didn't quite say hop on my lamp, but So you I mean cuz you're on that wavelength.  Well, 10 years ago I was very beautiful and uh.

I didn't notice. Um No, of course you didn't  notice. Been been upset about it ever since. Um Tucker never said I was No. Um uh no,  I was I was very good-looking. you know, I was in shape and all was the rest of it. And and  and and now I mean, it was it was it was like a. daily avalanche. Like really never needed to visit  Niagara Falls. I just like it was like I've got a.

I've got I've got a giant torrent coming. But let  me let me I won't finish that metaphor. But um no, just just just No, it's like a torrent was. So,  how has your life changed dayto-day now that. you're celibate and getting away from trying  to over overcome your gay sexual impulses? I. don't really have them anymore. Not not not  often. Um, my life is so so I've learned well.

the first thing to say is that dogs have  stopped barking at me. What? Um, I mean, I used to set dogs off. like really set dogs off.  Like they would go crazy around me and when I. Yeah. Yeah. with hostility or affection. I mean,  they can sense evil, you know. Um my spiritual I. can only tell this joke because it's my spiritual  director that said it. I said, "Do you think it's. cuz they can sense evil?" He said, "No, it's  cuz you don't smell like blacks anymore.".

Look, the priest said it. Um, let the record  reflect I'm not laughing. Uh, you know, dogs have dog dogs dogs have a famous complex  relationship with with with certain people. Um, uh, I'm sure that's not what it was, but  but, um, maybe. No, but but, um, you know, the biggest thing that happened to me Wait, can I  stop? Did dogs literally is Are you being serious. about dogs? 100% serious. I mean, like, there's  two photos of me like snuggling with puppies like,

"Okay, you got me." But other than that,  almost every other dog like would just go. nuts anywhere around me. Uh my my I I I set up  a loving firm last year with a friend and and. um and her dogs just went ape anytime I was even  in the vicinity until I started making these. changes and then it was like and now they're like  it's it's it's bizarre. I I mean I'm a cat person. now cuz I kind of have to be but but um but I'm a  great lover of dogs. Like I think you are too. um.

a great lover of dogs and you know what they lack  in intellectual sophistication versus their feline. compatriots. They make up for in like intuition,  you know. Yes, they do. They like they're like. babies. They're like they got a little holy spirit  in them or something. They're just like they know. good guys from bad guys. Dogs just couldn't be  around me. That's amazing. I sure not all all. gay people have that the thing. But but it's just  just a sign of something that changed. The biggest. thing that changed for me though, which is not  like a big the biggest thing to me because I live.

quite an internal life, you know, like most of my  most of my life is up here, right? Um the biggest. thing that happened to me is I started caring  what happened in stories. Like spoilers started. to bother me and I couldn't figure out what that  was about. Um like 10 years ago when the a Star. Wars movie came out just before Christmas when  no one had had the chance to see it, I tweeted. Han Solo dies. Uh you know, like a thousand people  unfollowed me. How could you? Ah, you know, you're. the worst person. I was like, what are you talking  about? It's like a stupid space movie. Like,

get a grip. But I started to care. Maybe because  I started to care what happens to me. I've started. to care what happens in stories. Like, the plot  matters. I'm no longer just looking at the surface. at the um well, at the surfaces in in it. I'm not  looking at the dresses on the women or the accents. or or or at least not just looking at those things  anymore. Like I want to know that the story has a. happy ending because I think you know cleaving  to my faith more closely I've become more aware.

that the universe has a happy ending and I want a  happy ending and that's the biggest thing that's. happened to me like in my in my head in my soul  you know. Did you not care about yourself as much? No, of course not. Of course not. But I've gone  from I went from somebody who liked Oscar Wild. because I liked the witty lines and the sparkling  surface of it to somebody who appreciates.

instead now or at least reads it differently now  for the for the subversion for the the little. eddies in language he uses which are are meant to  to to show you know that this this kind of like. disintegrating way of life. And I and I read  it historically now history like I never read. history books because nothing mattered before or  after. It's just like today cuz I'm in a grip of. an addiction. But now I read biographies. I never  did that before. Um well cuz a narcissist doesn't.

care about other people's lives. Right. But I  knew I knew stuff but I didn't like I didn't. want to know details. And I and I now I feel I  mean MyersBriggs is a lot of old [ __ ] but but. I'm like my my personality type such as it is  is completely changed and I don't know exactly. really. Yeah. I mean I know I look and sound like  pretty similar but the way that I cuz I have the. same sense of humor like I have some bits of  personality that I have but the way that I. acquire information has changed. like I like I  forget the distinctions because it is a letter.

ship but but you know like the intuitive to the  sensory or whatever it feels feels now like I can. I feel more in tune now like before there was  kind of like a sheet of glass like some critical. ironic distance between me and the world where I  didn't really want to engage with it you know and. now I'm like I want to grab the wood sorry I'll  rephrase that um I want to like now I want to. grab a different kind of no I I I want to I want  to like know what it's made of and where it's from.

and and and look at it and think about it and and  like so this is how you ended up, huh? You know, you know, like like that that didn't used to  occur to me at all. I'd just be like, "Yeah, it's cool. I love the aesthetic. It's really  nice. I love what you're going. What is this. shabby chic?" You know, and I just wouldn't know.  Um and now I'm just like, "This is alive. This is. like it it like I now I get I didn't get when you  first started I was like like this about the set. and now I'm like, "No, no, no, no, no. Now, so  you were a prisoner of ironic detachment. Yeah.

Yeah. Like this this kind of like everything's  got to be meta, everything's got to be whatever. because I was afraid of engaging with the  material critically. Yes. And authentically, you know. Um I was afraid of engaging with the  material and and and now I'm not. Can I just say, can I just brag indirectly? Mhm. Even when you  were I first met you in the green room at some. Fox show years ago, many years ago and you were  in full full [ __ ] Yeah. Yeah. So ridiculous. It was a lot. It was a lot parody of parody of  a gay man. Yeah. I thought I thought you were.

deep anyway. I I could see that in you. Sorry,  not bragging. I always thought that. I mean, it was a compliment to both of us while No, but  I I perceive that. Now when I do gay things, I do it in like a Margaret Thatcher accent cuz now  it's not really me anymore, you know? Like it was. a compliment. No, I saw that though. I saw that  instantly like first day. I remember we were Yeah, I remember exactly where we were standing. But but  when you see somebody that way, I mean, they're. they're There are gay people who are not deep, you  know, um, uh, Dave Rubin, you know, people just.

there's no one shallower. There's no there there's  nobody behind. There's nobody behind there. It's. just that and you read his book, you know, you  read his book and it's like Candace made me read. his book. Really? She made me I mean his book like  don't burn this book. I'm like I'd have to buy it. first. I'd have to know I' have to have heard of  it. Like I'd have to acknowledge it really is a. book. What? No, please. the spacing like this of  like the margins and oh my god if I mean you know. uh uh from from having so many successful books  like all the publishing tricks like you know.

if if your manuscript comes in short you're like  yeah blah blah blah uh you know we probably both. had that happen to us from time to time um there  was this there was this rumor that I um there was. this rumor that I didn't write my books there  was this team a fleet of um of assistants and. so the first interview I gave about my my book  about the the last pope um the book had been out. two months and I um sounds brilliant. I can't wait  to read it. But he just was like, well, you know,

when you actually have like stuff going on, you're  too busy to write it and then you write other. people's books when in the fellow periods. Anyway,  um so you know, actually have a famous friend who. never read any of his books. No, of course. And  he had a million of them. Come on. Billy probably. But that's very much a TV thing. Yeah, it is.  It is. It is. And I was on tour and stuff. So, but I did actually write mine as it happens. I had  a research assistant. But um actually a very great. guy uh Alan Bkari who's now writing a book about  Gamergate the great uns untold story about how. Trump happened um which is completely topic for  another day but um what was the question? Well the.

question was uh how you've changed as a person.  I I I do I still go off on tangents. Yes. But you. were saying that you have an appreciation for the  future and for things beyond yourself whereas you. didn't before. I'm back in the room. Um, now it  now now now I will I care what happens at the end. of stories. Like I I used to read it for the wit  and try to remember the sparkling dialogue to play.

to semi plagiarize it in conversation or whatever,  you know. Yeah. Um, and you know, I see a little. of this change in another friend of mine in George  Santos. Um, what a good guy he is. I I can't help. but like him. I always like him. can't help but  totally agree. I always liked him. I was just. like, "Oh, he's so likable." Um, and he's likable.  He would be likable if he was thin, which is how. likable he is. I never thought of that. He'd be  likable even if he was skinny. That's how likable.

he is. Uh, he's especially he's especially lovely  as being jolly. Um, I've noticed in him some. little changes, some adjustments along these lines  since he's had his reckoning and his, you know, I mean, he had to confront something. I make a  prediction. Guarantee you the guy doesn't die gay. Guarantee you George doesn't die because he's  going to see his behavior, the Walter Mitti stuff.

as being in dialogue with, dependent on, congrent  with the other damage. Guarantee it. Guarantee it. I'm still uh so uncomfortable with this topic  that I'm not going to broach that with him, but I think you're qualified to do that. Well, I'm  on um Tim with him soon, so maybe I will. Um so, how do you change? Like what's the process? This  thing that we're not allowed to talk about which.

is and I can't gay conversion therapy. They don't  call it conversion therapy anymore. But but that's. what it was called, right? They were trying to  ban it. So like you you were required to be gay. I remember thinking like and by the way I've never  been anti what are you converting from and too? No, but also the idea that you're not allowed to  change like what that's when I realized thing. Why. are you keeping people gay against their will? you  keep you. Well, that's when my mind, as someone. who's always been, I guess, progay or whatever,  I'd never really been that involved in it. One.

of the least attractive things about you. Yeah, I  agree. I agree. But I started my brain started to. change a little bit when they were like, we're  going to ban gay conversion therapy. And I was. like, I thought the whole point was you can be  whatever you want to be, which I was kind of for, but now you're gay. You must stay that way. It's  respectable for you to be progay if the basis of. your pro of your progayness is that they're trying  to force people to stay gay. Well, that No, no, that's when I started to change. I was like,  "What are we talking about here? You're not. allowed." So, you're going the wrong way. Yeah.  No, you're just you're just off on this. Um, that.

just blew my mind when they tried to ban that. I  was trying. This is not what they told me it was. They're trying to force people to stay gay against  their will. Yes. I mean, it's bizarre. There's a. Supreme Court case right now. The the um ruling  will come next year about whether or not bans on. gay conversion therapy are constitutional, whether  it's legal to do it. So, we'll find out. Craziest. thing I've ever heard. Um, well, a Supreme Court's  kind of like it always struck me, at least until. recently, I guess, with the injection of the DEI  like lunatic. Um, isn't the great the greatest.

chart you've ever seen. The greatest graph of my  life. How much Katanji Brown Jackson talks. It's. it's the greatest it's the greatest chart I've  ever seen. Self-esteem is in inverse proportion to. ability. Yeah, we're aware of that. Yeah, it is.  Yeah, it's the greatest chart I've ever seen. And. then you got and then you got old Clarence in your  life, right? That one word. It is the greatest. shot. I thought Uhhuh. Uh I just saw it and my  reaction was that tracks and we had in the Supreme.

Court and probably maybe I mean it's sort of down  the line, isn't it? Democrat up until recently it. was, you know, it was really just like Catholics  be Jews on the Supreme Court. Um it I don't think. there are any Protestants on the Supreme Court. Um  I don't think there are now. And I don't There is. one. Neil Gorsuch is an Episcopalian. Yeah, but  you're you're you're you're just over the fence, you know. No, but I mean there was a you got a  little you got a little toe in the tyber. You. this country was founded and created by Protestant  men and there's not a single one of the Supreme. Court. Yeah, there was a fifth of them Catholic.  Um the small ones. Um so only in Rhode Island,

but whatever. Another day. um when um when you  see that kind of civilizational clash as it seems. to me that it is one um I I can't help but hope  if they're not going to do Oberfell that they at. least let people get away from being gay. Like at  least let people leave. At least let people leave.

Um because I had to fumble my way with hot oil on  a stove and like hurting myself to eventually get. to a point where I was not seeing a particular  stimulus and automatically having a particular. arousal response. Is that what you want? Is that  what is that what they want? Is that what they. want everybody to have to do to sit at home  and abuse themselves? to sit at home and like.

hurt themselves, to get rid of these unwanted,  disordered urges that are making them miserable, that are hurting other people, that are hurting  them, that are the product of trauma, that are a. trauma response. Is that what you want? You want  people to sit at home and do it to themselves? I. don't think so. I think it's what they want.  I think destroying people is what they want. But but but I don't think it's what we want, you  know? I agree. So, how how do people change and. what is the process? Well, um, the father of this  stuff, the most I mean, there are some quacks. Oh,

I bet. I'm not gonna lie about it. But the father  of the stuff, the most respectable stuff with the. highest success rate um uh the guy's name was uh  Joseph Nicolosi. And uh I can't find most of his. books on Amazon. Um but actually, yeah. Why? Well,  cuz they're suppressed. Um, so that just tells you. that right there. If they're banning books.  Okay. Yeah. Okay. Well, I don't I'm I'm not.

such a I'm not such an anti-book ban guy. You're  a more of a free speech fund. What were the Nazis. burning? What were they burning? Ask them. I  know. I'm I'm very aware of that. No. Well, I guess what I'm just saying I'm more of a free  speech fun. I am I am a free I have evolved into. more of an authoritarian over the last 10 years.  Well, I'm not even having that debate. I'm just. saying that you know what's important to people.  You know what they're lying about by what they try. and hide. Sure. That we can we can agree that's  right. And we can also agree that all of the.

um uh all of the Jewish trans doctors  need to have their books burned. um when. he wrote about this stuff over decades had a very  um uh tempestous relationship with the bodies in. psychology and all the rest of it and psychiatry  and and and but but you know he he's he's the.

person to read um if you want to understand how  people become gay and how many of them have got. out of it. So his for me the most important book  is shame and attachment loss. It's kind of got a. a yellowy green cover. Um and and the good news  is that although um uh Dr. Nicoloi has left us, his son Joe Jr. um is still in the practice and  is still training therapists today. He's based. in California um obviously uh and um uh and so  he's still working today and and today the the.

way that the therapy um uh that um Joe Jr. does  uh presents itself is is okay. It looks weird. It. looks really weird. It's peculiar looking. It's  almost funny looking when you see when you know. because sometimes they'll film a session as a  demonstration, you know, but it and it almost. looks sort of like a like something you might see  from Ali Mciel like smile therapy or something, right? But for a lot of patients, it's showing  enormous progress and progress we measure as.

um the amount of arousal same unwanted samesex  feelings like are just like I didn't wait a minute. did I don't think I like got the hots for anyone  this week you know. Yeah. So people become people. have uh gay sex um uh urges for a variety of  reasons, you know. So that the the without getting. too specific, you know, the passive partner in a  gay um encounter is um uh looking to take on some.

of the masculinity he feels he lacks. And that's  in a literal physical way uh and in a emotional. way too, right? Um he's seeking to to to um absorb  in some fashion the manliness he feels he's he. he doesn't have um really. Yes. And it makes  sense, don't it? Like when you think about it,

I've always wondered what that was. But yeah,  if you're if you're if and it's a way of of. interacting with the kind of men you've never  been able to interact with or who've never like. taken you seriously or that you've always kind  of like admired from afar or whatever because. you have had this like jump tracks thing in your  brain from from neglect or abuse or whatever it. is. And so you seek you want to be you want to  you feel like it's it's like getting charged up. And this is where the magic comes in again as  you know like this is how magic works. You know. like magic artifacts got like charged up with evil  power like that's what you know grace doesn't work.

like that. You know God doesn't work that way. Uh  the infinite limitless uh generosity and charity. and grace of God doesn't work like that. You don't  have to like recharge your your reserves. Another. reason gay sex is unfulfilling because it's  refilling a battery that's always depleting. It's. like a slow puncture, you know, and you just top  it up. You can never fill it up. you can top it up. for a moment with with an encounter like this.  Um those urges in the first place come from um.

uh a memory or a thought or something that's  leading to um this arousal this this this this. uh disordered urge and the way to get rid of  it feels a little like some people will will. have heard of maybe CBT although it's different  in some important ways. Um the the the therapy. is three-step. The first um the first thing  that you do is you you produce that state. So. you think about or you look at something that  will take you to the place that would have pre.

produced arousal previously and then you introduce  something unexpected into the brain. And the idea. is that you rewire the brain in it in it in  its plasticity to expect a different outcome. when it has that stimulus in future, right?  So, um the way I did it was to hurt myself. So, if I saw a basketball player, I'm not basketball  cuz we're all gay nerds like I said, but football.

player like I said, um sitting down next to me  on a flight or something, I wouldn't get aroused. like the blood wouldn't stop flowing. I I would  get like, you know, like that um or something, right? vaguely or at least wouldn't get that that  um arousal response. The way that the therapists. do it, which is better, is is a um a sort of like  just a completely unrelated feelings neutral kind. of a thing, right? And the way it looks is just  remarkable. And the third step is just repeat.

it because there's only two ways you can persuade  the brain of things, which is emotional connection. and repetition. Nothing else nothing else works.  That's those are the only two means of persuasion. that work. Emotional connection or repetition.  So, so this is why um all the late night comedians. who aren't funny anymore, their job is not to be  funny. Their job is to associate certain things. with certain emotional reactions and then to  do that every night of the week forever. So, uh Trump e and then the next night Trump e. And  this eventually persuades people that Trump bad,

right? Because they're associating an emotional  um uh reaction uh to to a thing. Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat. It's just programming. It's  programming. It's programming. They don't. have to be funny. That's not their job. It is  not Jimmy Kimmel's job to be funny. It's Jimmy. Kimmel's job to repeat and that's why it's so  boring and repetitive, right? They repeat and. repeat and repeat and repeat positive happy  like Camela is so brave. Trump's hideous. Oh, disgusting. Isn't he gross, isn't he? Oh, that fat  ginger uh orange [ __ ] whatever. You know, they.

they they're not talking about him in terms of  policy. They're talking about in terms of disgust. Yeah. Because that's a emotional thing. And again,  again, again, again, eventually people are like, "Trump e, you know, of course happening." So, it's  programming. It's why the comedians aren't funny. You're welcome. Um, this is that for virtuous ends  because it's what works on the brain. Um, and it. very often uses, um, so, so this is people find  this strange, but so Aquinus talks about how grace.

builds on nature, right? uh Thomas Aquinus. Um  uh and and so there are ways in which our bodies. are are are are machines. They they they function  according to mechanisms and respond to stimulus. And although there's a spiritual dimension to all  of this, the way our brains work, it's trainable. It's trainable like a dog is trainable.  It's trainable like anything is trainable.

And so the way this therapy looks and I provided  you with a couple of little examples in video. um uh so that you can see it yourself  afterwards. The way this therapy looks. is first of all the the original stimulus will  be produced and then there may be a pattern of. like following a pen around or a particular  kind of tapping on the knee or something. It's just intended to be like a neutral uh  different outcome from that initial response.

So that no longer does the brain go to arousal,  it goes to something else. And that the it's very. common if you you see in PTSD survivors, if you've  ever been um to the VA, you'll see a lot of like. this going on in like the treatment rooms.  You're like, "What the hell is that all?" Um. uh that's that's what it is. They're they're  produced. They ask them to remember something. traumatic from their service and then something  it's just kind of little thing. And what's going. on is the best way I can kind of describe it is  it's like when you press control delete and then.

a couple of other things and the computer reboots  without the virus. Now, you know, like that's not. quite how computers work, but um uh you know, it  reboots and you're no longer in that situation. again. You can do that with the brain, but  it takes not just one reboot, but it takes. uh repeated um uh raising of the they call it  the schema or the target, the thing that produced. that unwanted response and then immediately the  introduction of an unexpected outcome. So your.

brain's like, "Hang on a second. This happened,  so I was expecting that, but then this happened.". And then over time your brain learns to just  do that instead. And that instead could just. be like something you know completely anodine or  it could be like I did which is you know a kind of. clunking amateur version of it which was you know  something something painful or unpleasant. And and. the third step just do it over and over again. And  eventually you see people just have less of those. desires. It's the most peculiar thing but it is  being borne out in the studies. And the so Joe Jr.

I I I brought this with me. I'll leave it with  you if you're interested. But um 144 people uh. in a randomized placebo blind trial. It works. It  works. And it works because this these homosexual. urges are not so totally unlike other forms of  trauma, other forms of damage, other forms of.

um uh uh deviance. This this same thing, it  works on people who are obsessed with rape, like a guy who can't get off unless he's thinking  about raping a girl. Now, rape is something that. women love to fantasize about, but perhaps don't  necessarily enjoy the reality of, even the reality. of play of it, right? It's something women love  to think about, but you know, you you you you. act that one out without warning, you you're  sleeping on the couch for a minimum, you know,

um uh it can it can help men to enjoy uh sex  lives that don't involve uh coercion, you know, because they have that sort of thing. And and the  same much of the same uh technique is used with. people who have other kinds of trauma, who have  other kinds of trauma responses as a product of. of bad things that happen to them or as a product  of just something going a bit wrong where that. that track is jumped, you know. Um and so this  though it looks very odd is based on decades of of.

uh research and builds on other therapies for  other kinds of trauma. and it looks like it's. working. Now, I didn't have this kind of therapy.  I will say that uh like I said, I kind of bumbled. through on my own cuz I'm, you know, stubborn  and and and uh and a loner. But this has started. to work for people. When you look back on the  life that you led 10 years ago, how do you feel? I feel ashamed. Um, I feel embarrassed  and disgusted by the things I did,

but I feel ashamed particularly about 10  years ago about how many people I I you know, I thought I was like laying it on thick with  this sort of like Damen average kind of um, you know, uh, a high bouquet performance on  stage and I realized people weren't picking. up the layers maybe and every talk I ever gave  in the Q&A I said if I if I could not be gay, I would push that button, you know, and nobody  ever like that never registered with people. all that they Why? I don't know. All they got  was being gay is okay now and being rightwing.

Being gay rightwing is okay now. And I know that  I pushed that button with the left to annoy them. and and and because it was absurd at that time.  But people never got the message when I said if. I could possibly I I never gave a speech in my  life where I told people go be gay. I said my. first ever appearance on television was with Boy  George like 20 years ago. And I said I feel that. something is wrong inside me. And I didn't have  the the vocabulary to articulate this. And he's.

like, "No, honey. You're perfect just the way  you are. I can't do what Josh, but um you know, I was like, "No, no, I feel that something is  wrong in there." And and everybody around the. table just left, you know, like thinking like,  "Oh, there's a self-hating homosexual." Well, I'm not hate. I wasn't hating myself. I was  hating the things that I was doing because I knew. they were hurting me. And I knew even then, and I  never gave a speech in my whole life where I said, "Go be gay." Have you ever talked to other gay  men who have the same feeling? Yeah. Yeah. Um, I think because I mean not many of them will  articulate it like I do because I am a little.

bit cuckoo and I don't mind kind of living in  public and talking about my feelings. Like my. Twitter is just like this well aside from 8  years missing. Um, it's just this like insane. stream of consciousness where I'll just say the  most like ridiculous, absurd, outrageous things, but it's because people are getting like a a a  tap straight in, you know? Um, it's just what's. going on in there today. Um, so I'm comfortable  living that way and I'm comfortable expressing. myself and talking about myself. And I think  now I have a duty. Now I have a responsibility.

to others because of cuz the message didn't  land. Like I was I I I was I was not intending. to give birth to this huge generation of gay  Republicans who now just I think it's openly. like openly fine to to to trafficking babies and  to be a gay Republican and I feel a great deal of. responsibility for that. I hate myself for that  a little bit. Myopoulos, thank you for everything.

you said, for your honesty. I appreciate it.  Thanks. and your insight, which is amazing. Christmas is back and so is our merchandise shop  at TCN. Visit tucker carlson.com to see what we. have to offer. And it's awesome. Everyone has a  long list of people they need to shop for this. Christmas. Our new line can help you brighten  the day with gifts they will actually love. Not. the kind they're going to throw away or thank  you for, but not mean it. Actually, good stuff.

that's great for everybody. ornaments, wrapping  paper, Christmas sweaters. For real, the TCN shop. has everything you need. Dozens of new styles and  designs perfect for the gift giving and spreading. the Christmas spirit. That's tucker carlson.com.  We hope you have the very best Christmas.