Charlie Sheen’s Craziest Hollywood Stories and Why He Refuses to Believe the Official Story of 9/11

So that interview that you did in 2011, the famous  Tiger Blood interview, I watched that and I have. never forgotten it and I never will forget it.  And here was my takeaway. My takeaway was this. is a guy who's obviously on drugs. Like there's  a manic quality to it, which I recognized. Um, but despite that, the life force and the talent,  it was just so obvious. And I thought to myself, how many actors, how many people could be  whatever, an eightball in the bag or whatever.

was going on with you personally and talk like  that and and reveal so much of themselves. I. just thought there was something really great  despite the craziness that came out of that. interview. And when I heard that you had,  you know, gotten sober and were happy and. pulled your life together and all stuff, I was  just I was just thrilled. Thank you for you. I mean that. I just want to get that out of the  way. Thank you. And that's why I wanted to talk. to you. I just thought that interview revealed  something really impressive about you. Wow. Wow.

[Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music]. Not everyone felt that way. I don't think No, that  is um that is the only I mean I'm the only person.

to compliment that interview up to this moment in  time in my life. That is the only positive review. I've ever received with that interview. Oh yeah.  So this is this is I could just I'm going to sit. inside this moment for a second. I wasating on  a drug curve having you know used drugs candidly. and I'm very against drugs just to be clear but I  was like if someone can talk like that while he's. impaired that's crazy. Thank you. Um what did  what did people other than me think about that.

interview? Oh just that it was the uh it was  it was it was the beginning of the end. It was. uh it uh it was the moment when when the um yeah  when when when it it just I had completely left. the reservation and there was Well, that that's  fair. Yeah. Um that that um I think people might. have uh respected the commitment to it that uh  that that I that I knew there was no turning back, you know. I do respect that. Right. You burned  your boats. Yeah. If you're going to go, I mean,

all the way. It's the only direction that you  know, right? Um, you you you definitely went. How long So, do people approach you and say you  got to make a change or do they stop talking to. you or like how what was the response? Oh, you  mean right after that? Yeah. Um, yeah, it it I. um there was there was fallout. there was Fallout,  you know, especially what was going on with the. network and the show and you know, all the um  all the all the high stakes elements in in play,

you know. Um yeah, I I I it's weird because I'  I've I've watched it and I've watched it just. on this recent tour as it's been referenced and  played in in clips and stuff and and it's it's uh. it's like watching somebody else. Yeah. Yeah, it's  like it's like I kind of look the same. I mean, I look kind of the beat up version of me, the very  fatigued version of me. Um sound asleep was not,

you know, something I not on the menu. I picked up  there. Yeah. No, no. Um and it's interesting the. um the quality of my voice. Did you notice that  just the gravel and the depth and the thing? And. I was like, "Yeah, that was from the testosterone  cream, which I was doing heaping amounts of in the. in in the book. I describe it as slathering on  like a like a freaking Pawns commercial." So,

what that's it's it's interesting that everyone's  all for hormone treatments now, right, for kids, but I think it's still forbidden to want to use  testosterone cream. I've never used anything like. that, but I'm interested like what does that do?  It was um in the doses it was it was prescribed. and and and recommended to be uh applied at  um that uh you know following those dosage. guidelines. Um it was it was for enhanced you know  sexual enhancement uh more lean muscle mass more.

energy. uh when you exceed those, you know, uh  40x um then it it it it can metabolize into what. what's essentially of a roid rage. Wow. So there  that was a lot about what was going on during that. whole thing. That's why I couldn't that's why I  couldn't pull the train back into the station, you. know, that once it uh once it got away from me um  you just become the Incredible Hulk pretty much.

Yeah. Yeah. Um but it's but just during this time  and even you know working on some of that that. chapter in the book um it there there's something  that dawned on me. It's like I turned into the the. I I became that thing that of which I I I detest  most and that was a bully. Yeah. Became a bully, you know, and and I could say I was bullied as a  kid and I wanted to see how it felt from the other.

side. So what? Right. Um it it didn't it didn't  feel good from the other side. You know, bullying. is still like not cool. Yeah. Still sucks. Um  would you recommend testosterone lower doses? Um I would I would because I've in in recent years  have have have have used it responsibly and have. have gotten have gotten the results that were  promised or that that that I was expecting. Yeah. Is there a downside um to responsible use? I I  don't I don't I hope not. I don't know. I don't.

know. They are finding a downside, you know, in  long-term use to uh HGH to human growth hormone, you know. Um I believe that. Yeah. If it's gonna  if it's gonna make things grow, then if you got, you know, if you got a tumor or something that's  that's kind of been lurking, it can bring that. thing um into, you know, some larger form. Yeah.  Yeah. Men with prostate cancer have typically.

have their testosterone reduced medically.  Gotcha. Because it it feeds the tumor. So, that makes sense. Yeah. I don't I don't  use shaving cream or fluoride toothpaste, so it's like not my world. But I'm interested.  Have you tried the toothpaste from uh Wellness? No, I used the Dr. Bronner. Oh, okay.  Okay. Yeah, we grew up on Dr. Bronner. So did I. That's why I use it. Yeah,  we ate his chips and everything. Yeah, it was a Southern California thing in the 70s. You  remember Healthy Hanza? No, but I just, you know,

you use the Castile soap with all the weird  sayings on the side. We are one. It was like. a hanging from the hippie era. That's the stuff  my mom bought us. Exactly. That's exactly how I. grew up. Yeah. And I still use it to this day. Oh,  really? Yes, I do. Wow. I no longer use Dr. Zog's. Surf Wax. Remember that? Best for your stick.  That's right. That probably doesn't exist. But um. so you got better. You got sober after that. How  long did it take from that interview till soiety?

Um so that was 2011. Yep. Yeah. No, it it it  got pretty dark after that. Um, even though I. did another somehow managed to do another TV show  like still in the middle of all that, you know, I mean, I was able to pull it back and and and and  present, you know, nicely enough. Um, you know,

at least walk into a room and and and Well, can  I actually can I just go back just a sec? One of. the things I loved about that interview was the  hostility that you so clearly had. I mean it just. was obvious toward like the whole class of people  who profit from the creatives in Los Angeles, right? And you know the agents, the managers,  just that whole constellation um of people and. you clearly were at war with them and yet the way  the system is set up even now we were telling me. at breakfast like it's necessary like you you  can't really work without participating in that.

system. So how did you fix those relationships?  time just over time and and and just uh you know. working on myself. Um and and uh yeah and and  you know those relationships can only be fixed if. um if both parties are still in the game. Yeah.  You know um so I think I think that helped. Um,

but the stuff I talk about in the book uh about  that time was that um it was that tour that that. really um was ill advised, you know, and that  was not my idea and and I'm still not sure how. I allowed myself to get talked into it, you  know. Um yeah, everybody blames Mark Berg, but it wasn't Mark's really really wasn't Mark's  brainchild. It was it was Live Nation. They they. they watched all of that and like they're they it  through their filter they saw that as taking that.

on the road. Yeah. We got to get this man into  expensive hotel rooms. Exactly. Exactly. Yes. In. in in front of a crowd full of paying customers.  Most coffee companies sell weakness. Basically. watered down drinks from faceless corporations  that don't care about the American family. Black. Rifle is very different. Drank it this morning.  It's American brood. It's unapologetically.

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so many performers wind up with these really  tragic personal lives, which is like being on. the road is not good for you at all. Yeah. No,  it was especially really not good for me. Um, I mean on a good day it's not good for a good  person, but an addicted person is just going. to like So what what happened? What was the It  was it was 21 cities in like 31 days uh with no. act. With no act, but Jeff Ross did come in and  and and rescue uh a good portion of it. So that.

was Did they call Jeff like midway through? And  they called him like right after the second show. Yeah. I mean, we we we bombed right out of the  gate. So, what was that like? It was awful. It. was awful because I Did you know that it was bad  when it was happening? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. No, it was it was an absolute train wreck. It was It's  complete bad [ __ ] No, it's fine. And I'm sorry. to laugh at your mouth. I'll I'll I'll take it  because there's a thing I talk about in the book.

that uh you know the the the Hemingway's uh u you  know u to to to become a man you know his his his. list right you got to uh you got to you got to  fight a bull you got to have a son and plant a. tree. Yeah. Right. He left out um being booed off  stage in Detroit on opening night. Yeah. It was. We didn't make it. Uh, we didn't make it to the  second act. Wow. And then Simon Rex, you know,

he is No, he's an actor and and and he done some  rapping and he had this one song that I really dug. and so he was going to perform it, you know, and I  was getting pelted with stuff like like not food, but like programs and shoes and whatever anybody  could throw and he was in the wings and so I. started like motioning him out. So, you're  actually on stage. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And. it's it's it's it's turning violent. There is we  are like on the verge of bedum. And so I wave him.

out and I and I switch places with him. I'm done.  It's over. And he tried to do his song and they. kept they went harder on him. And then he told me  afterwards he said, "Dude, you can't like you have. to." He says, "You completely overlooked the fact  that you that you brought a a a white rapper out. on stage in Detroit who wasn't Eminem and expected  the crowd to be satisfied, you know." Wait,

but we're skipping over like the key part, which  is what did you do to make the crowd so mad? Um, stuck to the script that was absolute dog [ __ ]  this thing that I built back home thinking, "Yeah, then we'll do this, then we'll do that, and then  then the girls will come out and just all this. stuff that I was imagining would be crowd-pleasing  stuff, but they just literally wanted me on stage. just screaming those dumb slogans." They wanted  more Tiger Blood. Yeah. They wanted, you know,

more seven g rocks. They wanted more Adonis DNA.  And what I, you know, finally explained in the. book is that none of that the biggest irony  in this whole thing. None of that stuff was my. original material. I didn't I didn't I didn't  I didn't cook all that all that stuff up. No, it came from a phone call from a baseball player  like 3 days before I sat down for the interview. And it was it was I think it was delivered as a  pep talk like in some dugout. No. Um there's a.

guy named Brian Wilson. He he he used to pitch for  the Giants. They called him the beard, right? Um, great ball player, super dude. And I was watching  a highlight package of him one night and I just I. I don't know, there was something about his  magnetism, his presence, all of it. Right. And I told my friend Tony Todd, I said, "Get get  him on the phone. I want I want to speak to that. man." Right? And the next day I was on the phone  with him and um I think it was before the season. started and he he just he he just volunteered. He  said, "It's hey, it's a pleasure to talk to you,

man." And it was already known that that that  um you know, the trainer left the tracks with. my show and the beef with Chuck and all that  stuff was already in play. So he says to me, he says, "You know, we're not like other people.  We're not we're we're we're different, man. We got we, you know, we got we got tiger blood  running through our veins. We got a uh we got. a substrate of Adonis DNA that doesn't allow guys  like us to ever lose because we're always winning,

right? This is all him giving me this material.  So, and he's he's probably thinking, "Cool, man. That's going to that's going to make him  feel better at least for at least for today." And. uh you know, maybe maybe he'll he'll you know,  make some progress with this other mess, right? And then the interview comes around and there  was something that she did. It was not no part. of it was her fault. I mean, no part of it was the  ABC lady. Yeah. Andrea Canning. And so she made a.

crack to the two gals that I had shacked up with,  right? And then she tried to continue like onto. her next question and I was like, "Whoa, whoa,  whoa, whoa. You you owe them an apology." She. was like, "Um, okay. My bad. I'm I apologize.  I'm sorry." I'm like, "Thank you." And so then. she tried to continue the interview and I started  grinding on it. I wouldn't let it go even though. she apologized and we should have just moved past  it and we didn't. And um and so that's that's. when the whole thing just came out. I I suddenly  felt like I'm I'm going to be delivering another.

interview and checking every box that they want  and I'm supposed to show remorse and I'm supposed. to show you know all of those all those things  that that you know that that that you sit down and. do that interview and and deliver you know which  I mean that was the point of the interview right. that was set up because you have to go through  this ritual right yeah I think that's what they.

were expecting and I think I might have agreed to  it on those terms and uh yeah, I I I I flipped the. script sort of midway through and then it I had  all of his material and it was just sort of like, you know, it was there, man. It was on standby. It  was kind of kind of on a loop just looking for the. right venue and there it was and it all just flew  out and that that's what started that whole thing.

Did he call you? Did he see it? The the ball. Oh  yeah. He was probably like, "Oh my god, what have. I done? What have I done? I gave I gave my best  stuff to the wrong guy." Or the most right guy. ever, you know? So I felt maybe I'm shallow. I'll  just I felt like you created a kind of art. I felt. like that was like a Thank you. I did think that.  No, that's awesome. Thank you. Um and most lines. are other people's lines, so there's no shame  in that. Thank you. Okay. Good. Good. Yeah. Um, no. And oh, and for years I didn't want I didn't  think it was fair to to kind of lasso him into.

the craziness. So I always kept it kept kept him  out of it. I kept Brian out of it, which I felt. was the right thing to do. And then and then over  time I did start admitting that yeah, that that. that wasn't my material. I didn't come up with  any of that stuff originally. Um, and then with. the book and this tour, I've just said, "Yeah, it  was it was it was Brian. It was that guy." Do you.

still talk to him? Um, yeah. I spoke to him about  a year ago because we asked him uh to be in the. dock and he said he was going to do it and then  he had a he just changed his mind. Didn't want to. And that's fine. That's fine. Um, he doesn't have  to revisit it. Um, I I kind of do. So, and well, I. was telling stories in about it in the dock where  I was already anticipating them cutting to him for.

his side of it. So, it would have made sense if if  if he was there, but no, I don't there's no love. lost at all about that, you know. Yeah. I mean,  I don't know. I'm again totally pro- sobriety. On. the other hand, it's just nice to see vigor in a  man in a world filled with men without vigor that, you know, I'll take a little craziness. I just  wrote that word to somebody yesterday. Which. vigor? Yeah, it's much needed. Yeah. No, somebody  wrote something to me. Hey, this thing or did you.

guys do this something something? And I and I  I was sitting there for like four minutes and. I finally wrote back with vigor. Yeah. Exactly. So  yeah, we knew a little Teddy Roosevelt and I saw a. little cocaine infused Teddy Roosevelt in that uh  in that interview. So you go on tour, Live Nation. decides, hey, we can profit from this guy. Yeah.  Not to impute low motives to Live Nation. No, of course not. No. No. Yes. Um and so you and you  bomb the first two nights. So then they call Jeff.

Ross, the Toastmaster General, to come in and  save which not stupid actually. No. Did he do. a good job? He did a great job. Of course he did a  great job. But what what surprised me is that the. the set that he rolled out with uh he showed up in  a hazmat suit like he was there to clean up a you. know the radioactive spill, right? Which he kind  of was. Um and the crowd loved it and his jokes. were terrific and I'm like wow. And then I just  figured he would be then we get to the next city.

and um he would come out with a different set.  Um and he didn't. He just stuck to the the the. ones he had assembled and built and and and they  already killed and he figured that the next city. hadn't heard them yet, but everything was in the  paper because there's no internet or something, right? Yeah. Um and he just stayed with it, you  know. And then one night he couldn't make it. So, um do you know who Chuck Zto is? Yeah. Yeah.  So Chuck was helping me with security during.

the tour and I said, "Chuck, I think it's going  to be funny if like you you come out and just. take the podium and say Jeff Ross couldn't make  it tonight, so uh I have I have his material. and I'm just going to go through them one by  one." And he did and it bombed. It bombed, but. it bombed in a You security guy read Jeff Ross'  set. Yeah. Yeah. Wearing his leather jacket and. the whole thing. Not Jeff's truck. It's like so  meta, actually. I would have enjoyed that. Yeah,

I I did enjoy it. It's kind of high concept. I  was on stage for a stadium show backing up. Yeah. Yeah. So, Chuck Zto filled in for Jeff Ross. Hate  to brag, but we're pretty confident this show is. the most vehemently pro- dog podcast you're ever  going to see. We can take or leave some people, but dogs are non-negotiable. They are the  best. They really are our best friends. And so, for that reason, we're thrilled to have a new  partner called Dutch Pet. It's the fastest growing.

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more. Use the code Tucker for 50 bucks off your  veterinary care per year, your dogs, your cats, and your wallet will thank you. So, when you get  off stage the first two nights when you bomb and. people are throwing things at you, giving you  the old uh Islamic shoe treatment, um like what. do what do your what do your people say when you  get back? They're like, "Good job, Charlie." Um, no. They were like, "Huh? Okay, we we really have  to sit down and figure out if there's any way like. what it's going to cost you to issue like all  of those refunds." They were, "Yeah, refunds.".

Yeah. Actually, the second, it was really just  the first night. I was wrong about that because. something did happen between Detroit and Chicago.  Um something usually does. Yeah. Right. Between. those two cities. Yeah. Right. Especially on a  tour bus, right? Um, no. So, I um I said, "Okay, um everything that that we had planned uh to just  leave it right where it belongs in, in the toilet. where it wound up in the sewer, in the gutter.  We we are we are scrapping everything." And they.

said, "Okay, all right. Good start." Um good. You  know, okay, cool. Sheen, you're reading the room, man. Um and so, was it the shoes? Yeah, partly it  was that last high heel. Um and and and I said, "I uh I think I have a fix." They were like,  "Well, do you want to share it?" I'm like, "No, no, I don't have it yet. So, I'm going to ride  the uh I'm going to ride the the tour bus. Um. I'm not going to fly. I'm going to take the bus  from Detroit to Chicago by myself and I just need.

I need a notepad and and two pens." And I did. And  I just rewrote the entire show alone on that trip. knowing that it was it was do or die because they  were already because I knew that tour was also. um it was it was the child support tour. Oh yeah.  Yeah. Cuz Warers was hanging on to all my dough. They were keeping my dough hostage because I had  violated all the morals clauses and I they acted.

in bad faith and therefore they didn't have to pay  me what they owed me, you know. I was like, "Well, hold on a minute." Anyway, they ultimately  had to, but um I had to sum to get my get. my scratch. Yeah. Yeah. How about that? So, I  couldn't surprised. So, anyway, so that Yeah. So, I did go on that thing. Um there there there  were there were some noble motives behind it. or motivation rather, just to have some dough  to, you know, keep everybody housed and fed,

right? because you have a big tribe. Yeah. Yeah.  Big enough. Um and so bigger than average. Bigger. than average. Yeah. I mean that as a compliment.  Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. And and and. plenty of room at at any any any stage of it  at any any any table that that we sit down at. There's plenty of room for everyone, you know.  Beautiful. Um Thank you. And so we get to Chicago. and so I go there in the morning and they're like,  "What are you doing here?" the talent never shows.

up until 5 minutes for, you know, soundcheck or  whatever. And I said, I just need to see I need. to see the theater. I need to feel the building.  I'm like, okay. And where were you playing in. Chicago? Do you remember? Uh, I couldn't tell  you at gunpoint. Chicago theater, probably. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was nice. It was vintage. It felt  um Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Y. So, so I basically. decided that it was just going to be like with  a moderator, right? Smart. Yeah. And and I said,

I just need two chairs, you know, just that at  the, you know, facing each other just behind the. curtain. And I wrote this letter, and I'm sure  it's on video somewhere. And um and I wrote and. one of the chairs just behind the curtain so I  could come I could walk out first deliver this. this love letter to Chicago about you know what  happened in in Detroit. And the whole thing was. a mislead about you know I've I've I've fought  in the jungles of Vietnam. I've I've been through.

the the the the the hellscape of of you know the  volcanoes of you know just this whole like you. like mythological uh just this thing where it felt  like and then the whole thing kind of ends with. uh and that was just opening night in Detroit and  I said uh and then then the whole place went nuts.

and I knew I had them and then the curtains parted  and we sat in the chairs and we just talked about. everything. We just talked about it. How did how  did it play? It played great. And then everybody, you know, all the Live Nation guys and, you know,  the agent types and everybody that was around, they were like, "You rescued the show, man. Good  for you. You rescued the show." Well, sincerely, good for you. No, it was it was it was cool.  And so we went with that and then that kind of. petered out because it wasn't like at the at the  energy level that everyone was asking because you.

weren't pivoting against disaster. Exactly. Yeah.  Yeah. And then that's then a little bit later they. that's when they brought Jeff in because they're  like, "Okay, we got we got we got our you know, we got we got our bearings. Let's let's let's  ramp it up but in a in a in a s, you know, just in a in a in a sensible way, I think." What  did you think of working live like that? Um, it was exciting. Yeah, it was exciting. Yeah.  And I I I made the decision to um start entering.

from the back of the auditorium, you know, like  not from backstage, but from the audience side, like from like the exit door. Yeah. Yeah. Just  um I don't know. I don't know why. Just um it. was just cool. just everybody was expecting me  there and I I would run up the aisle high-fiving. everyone, you know, just to break it up, just to  keep it I don't know. Yeah. No, it was a trip. I'. I' I've seen the shows that you've done. Yeah.  No, I love it. I I hope that that whole form.

continues whether I can participate in it or not  because I think it's important for people to be. physically present with each other. You seem  really comfortable in those situations. Well, I like people. Yeah. I like to smell people.  Yeah. I don't like that's my main problem with the. internet is I think it just disagregates people  from actual people. There's no it's like there's. a person there but everyone's sort of reduced to  his dumbest opinion or most provocative opinion. I'm not against those obviously but I think  that's not the whole story about people and it's.

just I just like people. It's like good to be with  people. I like physical contact. I hate the co era. because of its lack of physical contact. I just  I mean these are not like groundbreaking ideas, but no, I just like being with people. Sure. Yeah,  for sure. What's the point otherwise? Yeah. So, how much were you partying on tour? Not really.  Yeah. See that and I covered that in the book. also is that they sent the head of the network,  Les Moonvest, to my house with the with the with.

the Warner jet like fueled up and idling on the  runway to take me to rehab. like right after the. ABC interview. Yes. And I said uh I said I I I  appreciate it. Um it's also less not lost on me. that uh this is the first time that the Jets ever  been made available to me during the whole run of. two and a half, right? Was to put me in rehab.  That's fine. Um and I said, "But I'm going to. I'm going to do this at home. I'm going to do this  at home." And then the look on his face was man,

I felt he he he he was saddened. He he actually  felt for me. I could I could see that for him. Yeah. And it had nothing to do with commerce.  And I and I write that in the book. Good. I also. describe him as a as a good dude and a [ __ ]  gangster. Yeah. Well, no one's yelled at me yet. about that because we're supposed to keep him  right parked in the cornfield. Yeah. I mean, I think the assumption is in this business and  especially in your part of the business, you know,

you got to be pretty tough character to get to the  top, right? Yeah. I don't think non- gangsters run. big entertainment organizations. They don't,  right? They never They never have. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Not an insult. I'm not judging. Sure.  Um but yeah, no, I think it requires that. So, um So, you never went to rehab? No, I I I did  a rehab at home. What's that? Not a rehab. Not.

a rehab. Well, there were a rehab with cocaine.  No, there were there was no dope. There was no. drugs. There was no Yeah, there was girls. There  was girls and testosterone cream. That's the one. thing I didn't quit. And that's that was probably  the one thing I probably should have stayed on the. coke and got gotten off the cream. Can you imagine  like a doctor like recommending that? You know, that's so interesting. I've never heard that  before. You think the testosterone cream used at. 40x recommended doses was worse for you than the  cocaine? I Well, I I I I think it was doing more.

damage to my psychological state. Interesting.  Yeah, cuz the the coke is is kind of predictable, of course. You know what you're going to, you  know, how it's going to Yeah. how you're going. to behave in certain situations. Yeah. Um and that  other stuff was just like it was a trip to the. outer limits, you know. Really? Yeah. But like the  really like kind of the the angrier part of the. outer limits like the the testier part, the more  edgy part. Yeah. It's like the more than cocaine.

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you know, it's good to get off the, you know,  the narcotics, but like testosterone cream when. slathered in the amounts you're slathering is like  pretty heavy. Did anyone ever say that to you? Um, yes, but but a couple months before that. Um, do  you know Nick Civetes? He's a director. He's a. writer. He's old friend of mine. He's the son  of John Civetis. Yeah. Nick directed and wrote. The Notebook. Yes. Everybody's favorite romantic  comedy, right? It's not a romantic comedy. It's a.

love story. Um, so sorry, Nick. I called this film  a comedy. You might want to cut that. Well, you. laughed and cried. Yeah, you laughed and cried.  Yeah. So, um, he we were in Palm Springs and. I don't know at what stage in the in that whole  thing that that whole time it was, but he did say, "Hey, man, I noticed um that you you you're using  like a lot, you know, you're you're he they they.

recommended like that, you know, the size of a  dime and you had like five silver dollars in your. hand." Yeah. And he said, "You just um just think  about think about cutting back a little bit.". And I was like, "You got it, man. Thank you. Good  advice. I appreciate it. Just ignore ignore." Um, so yeah, he No, but you mean like in the moment in  that thing while it was going on, did anybody say, "Yeah." Um, I didn't really broadcast what I was  doing. I don't think people would think to look.

for that exactly testosterone cream. I mean, I  didn't even really know that was a thing, but if I. had known it was a thing, I wouldn't really think  about it, you know? I would think like the crack. is the problem, but it turned out So when you  Was it hard to stop using the illegal stuff? Um, yes and no. I I missed it just physically for like  like a like a week, you know, but I wasn't on any. any opiates, so the Coke detox is pretty quick,  you know. Um, but it's um the other stuff gave me.

the energy and and just the different mindset  to just to not even think about what my body. was feeling. Yes. You know, um, so then cuz you  asked like how how long Yeah. So then that that. um but when I came back from the tour is when I  is when I I went I I went dark. Interesting. Went.

dark and stayed dark. Yeah, usually it's the other  way around when people are on the road. Yeah. No, it um I I I just wanted to finish it. I just  wanted to honor that commitment. As as crazy as. as that commitment was, I knew there was there was  um there were a lot of there there would have been. a lot of consequences I didn't want to deal with  had I not done every city, every you know, every. leg every leg of the do your job. Yeah. Yeah. So,  and you're pretty work oriented anyway, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I have I have that gear. Yeah. Yeah.  You know, me too. That's important. It is. Yeah. But it was after that I think I think the comedown  from it just finally like landing and and sitting. with the damage I'd done to myself and my career  and my, you know, and and and then, you know, h how that affects my family, you know. Um, yeah.  I just had to just just close the blinds, turn off.

the phone, and Yeah. Yeah. Get back into the hard  stuff, you know. How long did that last? Uh, about. 3 months, four four months, I think. Maybe longer,  maybe sixish, but not six years. No. No. Because. then a couple other things happened as a result  of that dark place, you know. Um, but as far as. finally putting it down for real, um, it was yeah,  it was it was December 12th, 2017. So, how I guess.

my core question is how and I'm asking this not  for purant reasons, but to inspire others like how. did you do that? Cuz I do think there are a ton of  people who want to do that but keep failing. Sure. Um, I I just I my body was really starting to send  the kind of messages that that you you either pay. attention to or you die from. Yes. You know, I'd  never had the shakes before. I'd never had the DTS.

before. Oh, did you get the DTS? Yeah. And just  just from and not from being off of anything for. a week, just from like going to bed drunk and then  waking up and not being able to function until, you know, I got a few pops in me just to just  re realign my compass. Steady. Yeah. Yeah. So. that was that was one. And then how scary are the  DTS? Um terrifying. Yeah. Terrifying. People die. from that. They do. Yeah. And then, you know, and  and I I for the longest time I thought, you know,

I thought Nick's portrayal in Leaving Las Vegas,  Nicholas Cage, um I I thought it was over the. top. I'm like, that's an exaggerated example of  it. And no, he nailed it. Like spot on. Just the. thing about you can't you can't you can't take a  drink because you'll you'll break a tooth. Yeah. And then and then, you know, a couple days later,  you're puking blood. So, your body is like saying,

"Hey, man, yeah, we we have these these these  this built-in warning system, this these flashing. red lights for a reason, you know." Um, and then,  um, and what's interesting is, you know, I think. people imagine that the delirium tremens are like  something that 80-year-old winos get, right? But. you like weren't that old and you'd had a job  the whole time, right? So, you're functioning. Yeah. Actually, and you still got them. Yeah.  Yeah. It hits you faster than you realize. Oh,

yeah. Yeah. And then you're the example of that.  You're the character in that story. You promised. you made a sacred vow to yourself that you would  you would you would never star in in that story, you know? It's just like, so there's a lot of,  you know, self-loathing. there's a lot of but. then you know I have an athletic background and I  and I I'm I'm competitive and so it it was about. a challenge of okay it's me against this thing  how how tough are we h how much tiger blood is.

really running through these veins you know the  substrate yes and so um yeah and there's a there's. a there's a really nice moment in the book um just  a there was thing with my daughter Sam, you know, in a in a car one day. Just like it isn't like  this grand event where I, you know, got in a.

shootout with the cops and hijacked a blimp and  wound up, you know, just a blimp. You know what. I'm saying? Like if you could hijack a blimp,  I'd be impressed. Yeah, me too. Yeah, that's. that's a box I've never checked, but it's not a  bucket list moment. So that's good news for the. blimp industry, right? Um yeah, and it was just it  was this really personal um very soulful, painful. moment with my daughter that just made me realize  in that moment it was it was time because there's.

a there's a theme in the book about, you know,  talkers and doers, you know, and u it was time to, as I say in the book, to there was nothing left  to say. It was time to shut the [ __ ] up and. get busy doing. And then that like that night and  the next day, took a few volume, had a few beers, and then the next morning decided, we're done.  We're done for real. And it just happened to be.

Cassandra's birthday, my oldest daughter. Oh, it's  just timed out like that cosmically, you know, that that there's there's themes and tones in the  book about that kind of stuff where, you know, certain circles close when they're supposed to,  you know, and certain things align because they. have to, you know, everything's about timing  because that's just the way it is sometimes. Yeah. It's pre-written. Yeah. Um or feels that  way anyway sometimes. Um what So, what was that.

like? So, it's one thing to decide. Lots of people  decide, right? Everyone struggling with addiction. has made many decisions on Sunday morning. I  got to shut this down. Sure. But then you don't, right? Because it's awful. So, was it awful? No.  Really? No. It was it it was it was I mean it was. a little shaky for a week, but I I knew that I  had enough experience with, you know, Star Stop, you know, for a bunch of years. So, I I knew, you  know, what what that path in front of me was going.

to look like. But it was it was a really short  path. Really? Yeah. I knew it wasn't going to be, you know, a long walk into the you you know the  the end of the forest. No, it was like it was like. from here to the that park bench right over there,  you know. Wow. Yeah. And I just I just rewrote I I. I I wouldn't commit to the same stories I'd been  told to worship for so long. I said, I'm going. to rewrite everything about this. What were the  stories you've been told to worship? Uh just the.

stuff in the you know in and around the rooms of  AA that you know you're really you've been to AA. before? Yeah. A combined 21 years. What? Yeah. So  it isn't a guy that just did a few meetings and. went ah it doesn't work for me. It's a guy that  really committed to it and did the steps like a. bunch of times. You did? Oh yeah. Absolutely. I  sponsored people. I was I was deep into it and but. um but it never felt like it was celebrating the  victories. It was always u making everybody just. in my experience making me rather um be prepared  for impending doom for the ultimate disaster that.

I was always on a collision course with you  know that as long as you've got something some. um you know some disease on board that is that  is ultimately going to control your behavior. um I couldn't I couldn't I couldn't subscribe  to that any any longer. I couldn't do it because. add to that that subsequently, you know, I  have a legitimate disease on board that is.

life-threatening and you know, I take medicine  every day and it's not life-threatening. It's. as manageable as as diabetes, right? Um but but I  and then the doctor said, "If you don't take this. medicine, you'll die." And that's not something  that's not like you don't um there's no other. version of that conversation, you know, that is  that's that's undebatable, right? So you just you. follow that protocol and stay alive and and live  a you know a happy healthy fulfilling life, right?

Yes. But AA says um you know you got other disease  on board if you don't go to these meetings every. day or make that a part of your of your of your  regular you know your your your your curriculum. you know um then what's what what's in you will  will kill you. So I took the pills I'm alive.

didn't go to a single meeting and I'm coming up  on eight years. That's a That's amazing. Well, I'm. just a rare example of a guy that that understands  the the the you know, the physiological reality of. a disease you can see under a freaking microscope  versus one that I think was born out of necessity. to uh keep people aligned uh through fear, you  know, and I'm going to get yelled at by a lot of.

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to deemphasize that part of me. Like why would  I want to marinate in ugly things? Don't want to. stay positive and forward-looking. I like the a  meetings I've been to or brought other people to. really. Um I like the the honesty and camaraderie  of it, but I do think you're making a a point. that's impossible to ignore. you you don't want to  focus on it's not healthy to focus on the downside. all the time. No. And that's what you're they in  that that you're reminded of and and it's it's.

it's drilled in anytime you step in, you know, and  then that if if their slogan is keep coming back, that's implies that you're going to be coming  back because something else has taken control. and and and it was and it's this it's  it's what they call a no fault disease. Just that it it it went bad again and it's not  my fault, you know, it was I always felt it was.

my all my problems have all been my fault. 100%  my fault. Likewise. Likewise. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Otherwise, it's like nothing to apologize  for, right? Yeah. Um Yeah. No, I I um it it just. I I never felt uh I never felt celebrated there.  I always felt um there was just like an just this.

weird air of suspicion and and um expectation,  you know. Um yeah, I don't I don't I don't miss. it. I don't miss it. and and you know I I didn't  I didn't put down the bottle to then you know. close all the bars or or or uh you know convince  others that this is this has to be their path as. well. I didn't that's not you know I got I quit  drinking to to to live in the real world. Yeah.

Happily and successfully you know and I agree  with you on that. Yeah. There's a where there's. a bar right behind you that I've never touched  but I like bars. I can't I I hate drunkenness, but I love bars. Sorry. Yeah. No, there's  a there's an energy in a bar you can't find. anywhere else. And in fact, in the decline of bars  in the United States mirrors a kind of societal. collapse where no one is with anyone else. I mean,  again, I'm a sober person. I don't like I don't. drink. I would never drink. I hate alcohol.  However, I love the idea of people getting.

together and laughing and telling vulgar jokes  and like hugging each other in sloppy ways. It's. like that's a bar. I like that. Yeah. Or to watch  the big game 100%. Yeah. And like that's actually. died. People have gotten less sober at the same  time. Everyone's on something it seems like to me. But there are no bars. Nobody goes to the bar.  Oh, that that's gone away. I think so. I mean, I'm a little bit cut off, but I it does feel that  way. Interesting. Interesting. I mean, do you know.

people who like go to the bar? Do you know anyone  who picks up members of the opposite sex in a bar? I've no one has shared a story like that in recent  memory. Exactly. Yeah. Interesting. So, I'm not. like endorsing, you know, bar hookups or whatever,  but as compared to what like I don't know, it's just important for people to be together.  That's all I'm saying. I agree. And that was a. place for them to do it, which I always liked.  But I but I have to add that, you know, anyone. that's doing AA successfully and and it's a part  of their life and and and and and it's the reason.

that they can have the the the life that was  given back to them or that they claim, you know, reclaimed, then absolutely. Well, of wonderful so  many people. I completely agree with that. I mean, I'm always talking up A, though I don't, you  know, I'm not I'm not an A guy, but I But no, I think you're making an important point, which  is you don't want to Alcohol is the center of. your life when you're addicted to it. And the goal  is to make it not the center of your life. Right.

Right. That's how I've always felt. I don't want  to think about alcohol actually. I don't either. I don't either. If I'm Yeah. I thought about it  a lot while I while I was drinking. I know. while. I was drinking. And I don't I this this idea  that you have to identify as an alcoholic. Oh, I agree. And it's like how how is someone still an  alcoholic that you know the guy doesn't has hasn't. had a drink in 20 years, right? I'd much rather be  identified as a father or something matters to me. Yeah. There there was a guy in one of our private  groups and I can't say who. Yeah. Um super famous,

great dude. Um and he would ident they go around  the room, hi Dave alcoholic, Charlie alcoholic. And if it would get to him, I'm so and so human  being, and he refused. And they were like, well, that's not how we do it here, man. He's like,  you're not allowed to be a human being here. Like, no, of course you are, but it's important you  identify with your disease. And he's like, uh, no, first and foremost, I'm here on Earth because  I'm a human being, right? And in this room,

I'm a human being. and I'm here to address some  issues that I have, but I'm not I'm not going to. uh just reduce myself to a label. And I was  like, that guy. Yeah. Did he stay sober? I. I think so. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. An AA meeting in  Hollywood must be wild. It's awful. Why? It's.

awful because it's not just about that. And that  second A is just that's they they honor that as as. you know as little as as possible. Oh, is that  true? Yeah. No, it's hey, I heard you were at. the Sundowners meeting at uh you know Fifth and  Broadway or whatever. It's like Yeah, but I went. there cuz was supposed to be anonymous second day.  Yeah. Um, and yeah, there's there's a lot of um,

you know, people that want to give you a script  actually. Yeah. Or want to hit on your girlfriend. or just just creepy stuff that you that you're not  going to get at home alone watching a ball game, you know? Oh, that's kind of there was an element  there that was just never just felt just like. skeby at times. And there were other meetings  that were like, okay, all right, this makes. sense. Cool. I like these people. And then at some  point it turns. At some point it turns. And that's.

this is just my experience. Wow. So you said when  you did that interview lots of people judged you, lots of people scolded you. Then you go on a tour  and you bomb the first night, people judging and. scolding you. Who were the people who were kind  to you throughout all of the dark moments that you. had? Um family. Yeah. you know, um, you're close  to your family. I was Yeah. interested in that. Yeah. Um, my ex-wives. Really? Oh, yeah. Yeah.  They were very supportive. Really? Yeah. How'd you.

do that? Because, um, you know, I have kids with  both of them except for my first wife, Donna, but. uh, with Brooke and Denise. Yeah. So, you know,  we decided early on, you know, after the after the. splits that um you know, our our our stuff is is  is is incidental is secondary. It's Hi there. is. it's it's it's it's about the kids, you know. We  have to have a a children first u northstar, you.

know. Um yeah, lots of people set that goal. And  I'm saying, yeah, it it would it would it would. run through peaks and valleys, but um but when it  when it's good and is good today, um no, they were. really supportive. Really? Yeah. The whole time.  Uh 80% of the time. That's amazing. 70% of the. time. Yeah. I'll take it. We'll take it. So, but  your and your family was kind to you the whole the.

whole way? Yeah. Yeah. They um you know the the um  a guy with my kind of history and you know the the. um you know not not not so much a chronic relapser  but a guy that would get some time and then just. blow it all up. Yeah. Um you know it's the it's  the trust thing that you can't you can't get back. in a day or a week or a month. And so when I what  I decided to do was not make the big announcement,

not say I've I've quit drinking everybody and  they're like, "Here we go again." Right. Yeah. And I was just going to just do it. And then  as soon as someone made a comment about, "Hey, you're looking look a little you look clear.  You look uh you look content." Yeah. As soon. as I started hearing stuff like that, I would then  volunteer the the the changes I'd made. You know,

it's called a soft launch. Okay. I like that. I  like that. You don't do the immediate tour. You. just start doing it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And much  more effective. Much more effective. Dials down. the pressure. Yeah. A little bit. Do you think  were people like your work peers supportive? Any. um Well, or nice to you. I guess that's what  I mean. You mean like former work peers? Yeah. You know, people outside your family who you  know. Yeah. Absolutely. So you there were loyal.

people. I guess that's what I'm asking. Yeah,  because I didn't really haven't had the big job. um in in this in like this time, which is fine.  Which is actually probably better, which is good. that I had all this time to gain some perspective  and and and just work on myself and and be like a. responsible available father to all these kids,  you know, and grandkids. How many kids you have? uh five and three grandkids. It's amazing. It's  pretty cool. Yeah, you're a biblical patriarch.

Thank you. How about that? Is it like I'm always  I always wonder about, you know, the studios, the manager, the agent, even the accountant,  the lawyer, you know, all the people around, right? actors and in related businesses and like  they have kind of a mixed incentive like they you. know you're not doing well but they want to keep  you working sort of like the athlete who gets you.

know the novacane rather than the surgery because  he's got to play the game. Do you feel like they. any of them actually try to help or they just kind  of want to keep the money coming? um in that in. that extreme example um that I lived through um I  think there was there was a a want to help from c. from specific individuals um I don't think they  knew how or that I was um I was reachable enough.

to to to receive it. Yes. you know, so I think  they had to kind of um decide is it is is it, you. know, kind of like, you know, weighing the pros  and the cons. Is is he going to be at least if he. goes back to work, is that enough of a full-time  thing with distractions and responsibilities that. um that that that that will be deterrent enough,  you know, or have we sent him just back into the.

lion's den, right, just covered in fresh blood,  you know? Um, so yeah, I I probably I don't think. I was ready to go back to work on anger management  on the show about a year after the whole two and. a half disaster, right? And I don't think that was  advisable. However, it's still it it comes down to. me giving that final yes. Yeah, I'll do this.  So I do I I have to own that that part. Well,

yeah. You see, you said there were threads  throughout this whole experience, times, the timing of certain events that made you think  there was a supernatural quality here. I mean, did you how would you identify? Is that God? Like  what is that? Yeah. It's interesting. I got asked. this with Bill Maher just uh last week. Bill Maher  asked you about God? Yeah, he did. Yeah. Really?

What world is this? What is happening? I don't  know. Um, Bill Maher is asking about God. We are. in a brand new age. Yeah. No. And I I I wasn't  happy with my answer. All right. Well, now you. have a chance to reply. I have a chance to Yeah.  I I I there's most days I don't know what else to. call it. Yeah. That's what I should have said in  that moment. Most days I don't have a better word. or anything else for it. It is exactly that and  just my whatever my interpretation of that is, you know. Um, but I, yeah, it just kind of caught  me off guard and yeah, I should have just leaned.

right into it and I did a little bit of a tap  dance, you know. Um, well, it's kind of weird. to I mean, we're, you know, about the same age,  didn't grow up in a world where people talked. about God at all. Right. Right. Did you? No.  Well, my dad, devout Catholic growing up and. and rather than that, um, you know, he he he he  always, you know, let us know that that was his.

his personal journey and we were we were welcome  to climb on board, but it wasn't anything that he. was he was going to mandate, you know. Yeah.  And so, so we did have exposure to it in our. house our entire life. Um, really? Yeah. Yeah.  And it never uh What did you think? Um I didn't. I I I I saw some, you know, I saw a lot of  goodness with it. Um I saw other stuff I didn't.

want to align with. Yeah. Um and yeah, it's, you  know, I was I was talking to Lexi just yesterday. You know, some days I'm all in. Yeah. Yeah. I'm  like, "Okay, then sure." Well, you you know, can I describe it better? Do do I have a better  prediction? No. There's other days I'm like, I. don't know. I don't know. You know, so not people  will read the book and you know, there's not a.

chance they say, "Oh, that guy's an atheist."  Right. But there is a chance they go, "Oh, he's. curious. He doesn't quite he hasn't fully figured  it out or or So, you're God curious, you would. say." Yeah. Sure. Yeah. And and I don't think  that's um and that's not me just wanting to say. that in your presence. That's me having time to in  my presence. Well, cuz you know, right? Just Well, I don't know. I mean, I'm hardly an authority  on the subject. Um No, but I understand the the. you know, what it means to you. It's come to me  now. Yeah. I mean, I you know, again, things are.

changing so fast and I'm I don't have the answers  to most questions, but I definitely have become. convinced that God's real for sure. Yeah. No,  that's inspiring to to to see that level of of of. acceptance. Well, don't you feel it? Kind of.  I do. I do. But and but there's still there's a. part of me that you know just still wants to be  a science snob. I get it. Yeah. Cuz you were I.

mean for for the longest my whole life. Yeah. I  mean, I'm I'm not I was always pro things about. it I like, but I mean, I would I don't think  I would ever say in public, I know God's real, cuz that's like freaky. And also, there  are cultural connotations attached that. are just different from the culture that I grew  up in, like completely different. So, you know, it just found it sounded kind of phony or  not really like me or whatever. But then. things changed so much in the world and I saw all  this stuff and that blew my mind and I was like,

"Wow, God is real. I can't believe this. And  then when you say it, you're like, actually, that's not crazy. Everyone's always thought  that. Can't believe I was like embarrassed to. say that. So then once I do think that once  you say it, something in you changes. That's. been my experience. Not that I have a  ton of experience or would, you know, feel qualified to give advice to anyone. I  certainly don't. But yeah, I I I don't want to get. there and be wrong. You know what I mean? Yeah.  Well, you don't. There's the thing. I told you.

There's the thing. But isn't there some like um  Aren't you allowed to wait till the last minute? I think um once you know it's it's just it's  kind of like a lot of things. You arrive in a. place and you're like, "Yeah, wait. I've always  known this." Interesting. I've always knelt this.

and it's totally what I thought. Right. You  do occasionally feel that way about things. Of course. Yeah. No, I I'm not controlling any  part of all this, right? That I know for a fact, right? So, and it doesn't have the the feeling  of randomness, does it? No. No. There's too many. signs. Nothing's a coincidence. Exactly. It's just  it's everything's connected. Exactly. And people. are connected. Yeah. And how do you how do you  explain deja vu? Well, you kind of can't. And then.

you realize that actually the real religious nuts  are the science snobs interesting who are sort of. desperately backfilling against the evidence like  well what does that mean? Well shut up. They're. just like so desperate to cling to something  that is just absurd. I'm not saying that that. the physical world can't be measured in a lab. Of  course it can. And I'm grateful for that. And I'm. grateful that you know for its byproducts like I  don't know automobiles and penicellin but I'm not.

against science but the idea that science explains  everything is itself a religion and really kind of. the dumbest religion ever concocted interesting  and the people who espouse it know that it's. dumb and that's why they're so brittle and so  given to lecturing you about it. There's no. Mormon missionary who's ever been judgier or more  persistent than Tony Fouchy. Trust the science. Wow. Does any Christian ever say that? Trust  the religion. Not that I not that I've ever hurt.

you. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the science religious  wackos believe in conversion by the sword. Like, do what we say or we'll hurt you. Right. That's  not a religion I want to be anymore. Neo, me neither. No. No. That's bad. Doesn't sound  loving. Doesn't sound Doesn't doesn't sound. forgiving. No, it sounds dangerous. Actually,  sounds kind of like al-Qaeda a little bit. So, um I'm I just think and it's sad cuz who acts  like that? Only people who know they're wrong act.

like that. Interesting. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Yeah.  There there's actually a line in the book that. um I don't know where I read this or heard this,  but they they somebody smarter than me described. science as a u as a an ongoing uh uh historical uh  series of corrected mistakes. Exactly. How about. that? Yes. Yeah. It's just kind of institutional.  It's it's a method for satisfying curiosity and.

understanding the physical world. And I'm totally  for that. Completely for that, but at its heart is. skepticism and an acknowledgement that you don't  know the answers to the most obvious questions. And so, keep trying to find the answers. Sure. I  I'm 100% in favor of all of that, of course. But. what it's become is the medieval church. Brittle,  rigid, punitive, stupid. laughable and the second.

you describe it with no emotion, any normal  person's like, "Well, that's insane. I don't. want to be part of that." Right. Right. Yeah. Yes.  Um Yeah. And and um but I'm you know, I'm not I. I I'm not going to try to solve the unsolvable,  right? You know, and and I'm fine being completely. mystified by it. Well, that's the beginning of  wisdom is to admit you're mystified, right? Yeah, cuz you're admitting you're not all knowing. No.  Yeah. And and and Yeah, for sure. Not all knowing.

Well, speaking of mysteries, how did you wind up  knowing Alex Jones? How did I wind up knowing Alex. Jones? Um, he it was his early videos. It was his  early documentaries. It was the stuff he produced. himself like on VHS. How could you have seen that?  I've I I How did I see it originally? Um, you're. like in Los Angeles making movies. Yeah. Um,  it's wild. I've always been a guy that likes to. just needs to peek behind the curtain. I've always  been a guy that done my own research. Always been.

a guy that just never not always satisfied with  the official story about anything good. And um, you know, and and I've you know, I create fiction  for a living. Yes. I'm pretty good at spotting it. Um, in in people, I just want to pause on that.  I create fiction for a living. I'm pretty good. at spotting it. Yeah, it's a good quote, right?  It's a great quote. It's true. Yeah. Thank you.

Thank you. Um and so, you know, uh dad played both  Kennedys, you know, when we were growing up. So, we had access to JFK stuff that wasn't in the  public sphere, documentaries and and you know, um unedited zruder stuff. And so we were, you  know, I talked with with with Rogan about this. a little bit last week and we were you know, so  we we've always had a had we're just raised to.

um you know, take take a deeper dive. Um look  at things just with a more just polished through. a more polished lens, you know, um or skeptical  lens. And so, um, yeah, I I, uh, you know, be it, uh, JFK or 9/11 or Oak City or Coline, we just  did 911, doc, and it was an amazing experience.

for me to be involved in this because I not only  bought the 9/11 story, I was very resistant to. anyone who questioned it because it felt like  disrespectful or desecrating the graves. I don't. know why I had that incredibly embarrassing um not  at all noble reaction to people's honest questions. about 9/11. So it took me a long time to uh want  to rethink it and then once you do you realize. like it's just a tissue of lies. At what point  did you start asking questions about it? Um 0405.

uh whenever Loose Change dropped. Yeah, that was  the first Well, no, actually on the day really. on the day. Yeah, there were things um and Millio  and I had to cuz everybody like rushed to Malibu. We were like in the city. I was in a highrise. I  didn't know how far this thing reached, you know, like everybody just had to get the b get back  to the folks house like, you know, let's let's.

reassemble at base camp, you know. And Ameilia  and I were out on the deck and I said, you know, man, at your parents. Yeah. Yeah. And I I said,  "There's something about the way that building. came down. I'm just I don't know." And and you  know, by that point, we had seen different angles. of it and it was really um it was, you know,  there was there was a lot of content to to digest, you know, horrific content, might I add. Um and  we just Yeah. And then I I just just thought,

nah, because that would entail, of course,  right? All of these things. You just shut it. down in your head. Yeah. We talked each  other out of it cuz that would entail, right? It's interesting though that two guys  in the business of like manufacturing images, right, would focus on that image and say that  there's something about that that's weird, right? And so I kind of just let it I let it,  you know, just didn't didn't go near it. Yeah. And then um you know it led to what it led to  um the the the the whole world was different.

You know the whole world was different.  It's never returned to what it was. No, it really hasn't. No. There there's pre and  there's post. Yes. Um and then that I watched. that documentary. I I' I'd been, you know, a fan  of Alex's early stuff, you know. Um and that's, you know, just him. So, you knew who he was on by  911? Yeah. How How did I find He's my friend. I.

would mean no disrespect. I love him. He's coming  in a month. But I'd never heard of Alex Jones on. 911 and I was in the news business. I don't know.  How would you have heard of him? That's amazing. Um just you know spending time like in those on  those research channels in in uh just in in that. part of the um of of you know th those subjects  you know it's interesting that you so you have.

long felt like you want to look at other sources  of information. Of course. Yeah. I've I've always. done my own research. Always. And then um do you  know other people did you know other people around. 911 who'd already were thinking like this like  maybe reality as pres as as presented to us is not. entirely real. Um the people would believe things  only so far. Yes. And so I would back off and I. say you know what we're just going to we're just  going to focus on two things. just just two things.

and if you can explain those I will I will uh I I  I I'll submit to the official story. I'll just say. all right fine. However you however you you say it  had to play out I'm in. Right. And uh it was but. explain these anomalies. Yeah. Building seven and  the Pentagon. Yeah. Just help me out there. You. know, I've got to believe that the Pentagon is the  most protected and documented, you know, surveiled.

uh building in the history of the known  universe, right? Turns out not. Well, I'm saying I think we just have videos from  the uh parking parking kiosk. Yeah. Yeah. So, that's that's the thing. And then and then that  is weird, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. and then building. seven. It just you can't you just can't you can't  watch that and say that is the result of a fire.

that burned for five hours on two floors. You  can't sell that to me. And and and and you know. that for years that was always met with that is  disrespecting the victims. And I'm like I don't. Okay, how how is that disrespecting the fallen  heroes? How if you're just looking for the truth. behind what is clearly not what how how it was  explained clearly. I mean a three-year-old could.

look at that and know you know that looked like  that hotel in Vegas that we watched them bring. down intentionally, you know. So that's how I  met Alex was reaching out. You trust your eyes. You've always trusted your own perceptions. Yeah.  And but I I did this in the middle of two and a. half at its peak decided to to be vocal about 911  network and the studio they were like oh my gosh.

there's actually a commercial because one of the  advantages we had with that show promotionally. was the NFL and because we were a Monday show  all of Sunday all the CBS football games on. Sunday were just you know every 20 minutes the  for us and that is like a built-in thing to keep. the ratings and the momentum and the eyes and  all of it. Yeah. And it was it was great. It's. the best tool you could possibly have. Um so  they made a commercial like a promo and it's.

probably on YouTube somewhere. Someone out there  is going to find it, right? Um, and it opens with, um, Char Charlie has a lot of questions. And then  my character would be, "Hey Allan, uh, you know, where'd you hide the beer? Uh, hey, Mom, where'd  I leave my car? Um, Charlie's really curious. Hey,

uh, yeah, you know, is that is that is that  uh is is that is that is that a silk bra or is. that polyester?" Whatever. like actual lines from  the show to support Charlie's curiosity. Charlie. Harper, right? Yeah. But Charlie in the world like  going into places that on a corporate level with a. giant hit show your lead actor is not supposed to  be doing. So they tried to make it kind of like, hey, he's doing these things, but don't worry,  he's still he's still in our world doing them.

You know, they they just it was it was kind of a  brilliant piece of propaganda if you think about. it. It really I was just thinking that it's a  judo move. You take the energy and you pull it. in your direction, right? Yeah. And I remember  watching it and I was flattered that they like. put all that energy into this thing that that I'm  sure was upsetting a lot of people and I never. saw it again. Did they ever say anything to you  directly about your questions about 911? Kind of, but not really. like things like um maybe it's not  the best time to be doing this kind of research,

kid. Maybe uh you know, take a little a little  pause for the cause. Um yeah, it was and and yeah, they they but they didn't like you know, show up  at my house, right, like they did for you know, going crazy on dope. um or testosterone. Um but  yeah, they they they were they were nervous and.

so and I did pull it back. I did organize  a symposium in LA though. It's a three-day. event called a weekend of truth. Alex Jones was  the key speaker in the middle of two and a half. Um seriously? Yeah, I did. Yeah. Yeah. Did you  feel that your job was at risk by doing that? I thought the other stuff was more important  than than my job. Really? Yeah. No,

I It just How many lead actress on hit shows  put anything above their job? Um, cult of one. Yeah. None. None. Well, dad My dad has at times  gone heavily against the grain in the face of, you know, the same type of pressure. Yes.  Um, but yeah. Yeah. No, that was And then. um when Alex and I got together and you know  I sent him that email I I told you about and.

and my last line was zero hour is upon us. So So  just for people who weren't at breakfast here. Yeah. You said that you saw something he did and  you just emailed him cold. I did. I said, "Hi, Alex. I'm a fan for years. U perhaps you've heard  of me. My name is Charlie Sheen." I said, "Uh, we we we have to talk. Zero hour is upon us." And  he and he called in 10 minutes. Amazing. Yeah. And.

then flew out to see you. Yeah. Yeah. And then we  thought, okay, let's build a secret weapon. Let's. do something that that like uh is unique and and  and uh you know uh let's do something with in in. the media. let's use the media to to try to um I  guess this would have been 0708. Yes. So we got. together and we and we wrote this piece called  20 Minutes with the President. And what it was, it was a fictional um um retelling of this 20  minutes that I was granted by Obama. And it was me.

sitting down with him um asking him 20 questions  about 9/11 and and asking him that that based on. on these this the irrefutable bullet points that  that if if he would consider activating, you know, reopening um a new 911 commission. And we put  it online and what And this was But you didn't.

actually get 20 Minutes with Obama to ask. No,  it was all made up. It was all made up. But the. research that Alex and I um dug into that that  we that we because you know we we it could have. been a hundred uh it could have been 100 questions  could have been 100 minutes with the president and. um we we we drilled down into the 20 things that  were really bulletproof really bulletproof. And so.

uh we we published it online and and we let it  kind of marinate for about 20 minutes before we. added um the following um has has has not taken  didn't actually take place but we're hoping one. day that it that it could or that it might or so  we did let kind of the hysteria build a little bit. that people thought holy hell man Sheen and Obama  they right this thing actually happened and cuz we. didn't want to prejudice it with it being, you  know, a work of fiction right from send and uh.

it was a little bit of a manipulation. Um but  so what right I mean did anyone from the Obama. White House reach out to you? There's a guy um he  was the deputy press secretary. His name was Bill. something um and Burton. Yes. Yeah. He called me.  I got the memory. Well done. Thank you. Yeah. Cuz.

I knew his name was the same two initials. Yeah.  He called me and I said, "Uh, how's it? Hey, uh, thank thank you." And he's like, "Yeah, that that  that that thing that you and your buddy wrote, uh, that that that meeting you're looking for,  never going to happen." Those were his words. Never going to happen. I said, "Well, that's a  shame because it really should." He said, "Okay. All right. Good luck to you. Have a nice day." It  was like a 14se secondond phone call. Yeah. But.

anyway, so yeah, and I guess and then Alex said,  "Look, when this thing goes out, they're not going. to debate any of it cuz cuz we, you know, we told  uh it was Bill O'Reilly, it was Heraldo Rivera. We. said, "We'll we'll sit down and debate you just on  these 20 things." And nobody bit. And Alex said, "Look, they're just going to call you." Nobody  bit. No. Nobody Nobody Nobody took the challenge. And you're at the height of the show's popularity.  Yeah. Nobody took the debate challenge. You're one. of the most famous actors in the world and you're  offering talk show hosts the opportunity to be on.

their show, right? To talk about something that  is really interesting and controversial and they. say no. They said no. Yeah. What do you think? Now  what do you think that is, Charlie Sheen? That's a. little weird. It's a little weird. Having been in  the talk show business, I can promise you. Yeah, it was. Oh, you should have called me, man.  I would have done it in a second. Yeah. Well, uh, probably scolded you for your ridiculous  questions, but I still would have done it, right? Yeah. Um, are are are disrespecting the memory of  the victims. Yeah. How dare we? Finding out why.

they were murdered is disrespect, right? Wow.  Now, I know it's insane and I'm I always force. myself to admit that I had these views because I  want to be less judgmental toward other people. and reminding yourself what an [ __ ] you are  is a really good way to be less judgmental, but also because it's like it's a feature of human  nature that we don't want to know the truth about. things actually. Interesting. Don't you think  that's true? Well, it's clearly not true for you,

but it has been true for me. I don't want to  know. I don't want to know that. What What. do What do we then do with that with that  information? Trust me, I'm not defending. that attitude at all. I'm ashamed that I had it,  but I just think it's more calm. And I think of. myself as like one of the most open-minded people  I know. I mean, I am very, very open-minded. I'll. entertain any possibility because I've seen so  much that you cannot entertain any possibility, right? But um if I have felt that way, that means  that it's probably just how people are built and.

you have to convince them that they should know  what's true, that the truth does matter. Actually, it does. It does. Um, but Alex said, "They're  just going to paint you as as crazy." Well, of course. But and and I and I said, "Really?  That that's like they can't get more creative than. that?" He says, "No, they're just going to call  you crazy." And smash cut to like a week later. and it was it was literally it was Bill O'Reilly  and it was Heraldo and they just dismissed me. in one sentence. Well, Charlie Sheen's obviously  crazy. No. Yeah. Yeah. Someone can find that clip,

I'm sure. Handmaidaidens to Power. Wow. Oh, that  is it. Yeah, that is. But then I saw Bill O'Reilly. outside of um Dr. Oz one day. I saw him in the  parking lot and he was just over there. I guess he. was the second guest or he'd already come out or  something. And I started walking right up to him. He kind of a big dude, right? He's huge. Yeah. He  said he's not going to punch me, are you? I said, no, I'm not stupid. I don't want to get my  ass kicked. He's like I said, I just came.

over to give you a handshake. Just want to shake  your hand. He's like, oh well. Oh, okay. Well, good to meet you. I said, "Nice to meet you." And  he's like, "Yeah, sorry about the dubs." I said, "I don't I don't care. I don't care. You know, I  get it. It's showbiz." That's what I said to him. It's showbiz. What did he say? He laughed and  then we both went in and and had a pretty good. um episode with us. So, but it was a trip. He He  was like he was on his heels a little bit. Yeah.

He's not as comfortable with human contact. Yeah.  That's pretty disgraceful on on all of our parts. And uh I wouldn't I don't think I would have  called you crazy cuz objectively it's not crazy. to ask about why the greatest tragedy in American  history happened. That's that's I didn't I didn't. think it was. It's not. And and it's still not  shutting people down for asking sincere questions. is, you know, very hard to defend, I think. Yeah.  Wow. But anyway, that that's the Alex Jones kind.

of origin story, you know. That's amazing. I just  wish I could tell you where I actually acquired. the videos and it had to have been online like  mail order stuff. So, you really cared? Yeah. Yeah. And he just the stuff that I'd seen, he just  was a guy that was just on the constant hunt for. for the truth and just, you know, for the right  reasons. Yes. Not to exploit it, but to but to. expose it and share it and do something about it.  I think that's all noble. And I and I think that.

of him, you know, um and I think, by the way, he's  been vindicated on by time. I think I don't think. quite as many people mock Alex Jones as crazy  anymore at all. They can't. No, that's exactly. right. He called 911. Really? Did you call 911?  I don't think he did. No, I didn't. Nobody did. Nobody did. Alex Jones did. So, right there, we  know that he's worth taking seriously. In fact, it's worth asking, how did you do that? I've asked  him many times. Never gotten a straight answer, but we know for a fact he did. It's documented.  So, that's incredible. My dad spent some time. with him. Really? Yeah. Because um we asked dad  to read the president role cuz we wrote it like.

a play when it gets to the thing about the actual  conversation that we have and we wanted to hear it. out loud to see if it sounded like legit exchanges  of of of dialogue. And he was currently playing. the president, right? So he and I played the  scene and um you both had big shows at the same. time. Yeah. On on the same lot. We'd visit each  other like at lunch. Not often. Not often because.

we were both super busy. But yeah, they over  overlapped by I think two seasons maybe three. Uh Warner the Warner Brothers lot. Yeah. And then  so dad spent some time with Alex and anytime he'd. leave the room dad was like I don't know man.  I think I think this guy's ex CIA. I think he's. too smart. He knows everything. I think he's uh  I think he's got a background that uh was like. this thing. Yeah. Um which was him complimenting  Alex. Well, and it's the way that people talk now.

It was not the way people talk then. So that's  just that's interesting. I mean now that just. sounds like Twitter, but then people took things  at face value, right? I mean do you remember Well, obviously you were in a different world. So, how  did other people in Hollywood react to the So, so you're at Nou and Malibu and you say, "I don't  really understand how Tower 7 came down." What do. people say? Um, it's not it's it's there's more  resistance to it than alignment. Yeah. Yeah. not.

not not so much anymore, but at the time in that  moment when, you know, I was like the lone voice. out there, at least in my industry. Um, but  it was a lot of support from Yeah. You know, Architects for Truth, Pilots for Truth, all all of  those various associates, actual experts. You mean. those guys? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so you're just  reminding me how did this interview get started, set up in the first place? I totally forgot about  this. like you wound up at this table this morning.

because why? Because um I saw a promo on somewhere  on online, not even on YouTube, um that uh Sean. Stone had directed a six-part documentary called  All the President's Men, and the only place that. it could be viewed was on your platform. Yes.  And so I um I I signed up and I watched it all.

six episodes uh in one day. Wow. Yeah. And um and  and had to sit down and have a conversation with. myself about just everything that uh well it it  it goes back. It just it it it was it was a gear. I was familiar with because it was it was it was a  down it was a downshift that that that made sense, you know, because it goes back to a guy that does  his own research. Yes. And I hadn't for so long. I.

hadn't done my own research for so long. And um  you know I I I decided that when the the second. Trump victory, right, that I was not going  to allow myself to feel how I felt during the. first one. I just wasn't going to do it because it  just wasn't it wasn't healthy for me. It wasn't It. didn't It didn't No. No part of my life got better  feeling like that every single day and being.

told who I was supposed to despise and why I was  supposed to despise them, you know. And you were. on that list. Yeah. And um I was on the despise  list. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's And so, you know, apologies. Um I'm I've been so despised  for so long it the sting is gone. Yeah. No, but. I watched that documentary and it just I I now I  was armed with some fresh data. Did you know Sean.

Stone? Yeah, I've known him since Wall Street. He  plays Michael Douglas's tiny child in the movie. No way. Yes. I've known him since he was a child  and then I reconnected with him as an adult and. we had talked about a project here or there. He  would write a script and send it to me. I'm like, he's a good guy. He's a great guy. Really smart.  Really texted me right now. I know. I know. Yeah. Strange. Yeah. And so I um you know I would read a  script that he wrote and say it's it's not for me.

but it's really good, you know, and then I didn't  talk to him for a while and then saw that he'd. done this and and and done it brilliantly.  And so it just it created a a desire to to. uh just you know embark on what I can describe as  an experiment. an experiment. You're just changing. the channel. Just, you know, stop listening to the  chorus of of nonsense that uh, you know, in the in.

the the another thing that that that Twilight Zone  that I was stuck in for. Yeah. It's just so dumb. The funny thing is that Sean did that series.  We we didn't um produce it for him at all. He. came to us with the series. I think I'm actually  in the series. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so he came to my. house and I, you know, sat for it and everything  and I like Sean a lot. I really like his I know. his dad and I and I admire his dad. I do agree  with him on everything, but like I think he's an.

honest guy and I think he's a brave guy and he's,  by the way, earned the right to have his opinions. as far as I'm concerned, having dropped out of  Yale to serve in the infantry during Vietnam. And. like he's a good man. Uh Oliver is anyway, but he  uh I don't think he could get it aired anywhere. That's the crazy thing. Interesting. Yeah. Things  have changed so much, right? That the level of. open-mindedness in the world that he grew up in is  just gone. There's just no open-mindedness. It's.

like here's the story. Deviate from it. We'll  kill you. Right. It's like it's crazy rigid. Do you feel that? I do. I do. Um Yeah. But it it  it just really it brought me to a place to to to. continue with further research. Yeah. Into into  some of these subjects, you know, and and and to. uh as I said, change the channel, you know, and  and and um you know, like most experiments, uh.

the the the results are constantly evolving. Yeah.  Right. Um but but so far I'm I'm I'm pretty happy. with those results. It's kind of wild who you wind  up talking to and agreeing with. Yeah. Isn't it? Oh yeah. Yeah. Well, also if you're if you're told  to feel a certain way about someone because of. this specific set of examples or reasons or  whatever and then you decide one day you're. you're you're going to investigate on your own. Oh  yes. And and then you you come to something that.

is the the exact opposite of how you were told  to feel. Oh yes. Because you decided to I don't. know be autonomous maybe, right? And and just  exercise of live as a free man. Yeah. There's. that part. Yeah. Yeah. And so uh it's it's been  quite liberating. The distance between what you're. told someone is and what you discover when you  spend time with the person is it's really vast.

I had that experience with Oliver Stone. I'll be  honest. I mean, I always thought Oliver Stone was. a cook, a conspiracy nut. I was told to believe  that. I accepted it uncritically. Years later, I wind up at Oliver Stone's house in Los Angeles  alone. Just me and Oliver Stone about something. specific. And I'm like, I can't believe I'm Oliver  Stone's house. Like, wow. You know what I mean? That I'm sure you've had this feeling. Maybe  you have it right now. I'm having it right now. I am. So, sorry. And I'm like, and have been for  the last hour. Yeah. So, I'm like midway through.

this conversation with Oliver Stone, and I'm like,  Oliver Stone is a really nice man, a courtly man, very smart. Yeah. And has thought through  everything that he's saying. And by the way, I agree with everything I've heard him say.  I don't agree with the things I've heard said. about him, right? Like those are bad. Sure.  But what he's actually saying to me, I'm like, I completely agree with you. and and also you're  a decent person. And so I'm like why did I and.

then I really felt misled I guess is what I I'm  trying to say. Yeah. I had been lied to and that's. not the only case where I've been lied to and  where I uncritically accepted those lies. And. so then you feel stung by that like what? You  lied to me because you didn't want me to have. this conversation. I don't know who I'm referring  to when I say you but like the media environment. that I grew up in and that my views were formed  in was dishonest. really dishonest and probably. intentionally so. And probably part of the  design was to prevent me from ever talking to.

people with whom I might share common ground  because that would be a threat to the people. lying to me. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. No, you're  you're you're you're telling my story, too. Well, it's just I wouldn't have had this experience  if it weren't for my job where, you know, the one upside is I can talk to a lot of people.  You know, you can have people's phone numbers. You. can call them. Sure. Why is he calling me? Okay,  I'll take the call. Like, you have the chance to. actually meet people that you hear about. But  I think for most people who have normal jobs,

like how would they ever wind up at Oliver  Stone's house? They wouldn't. No. Right. So, they would never know that they not only  that he's a good guy and worth listening to, but also that they've been lied to. They have no  idea cuz they're never going to get out within, you know, a thousand yards of Followers Stone or  whatever. Right. Right. Yeah. So, the deception is. really uh subtle and incredibly effective. Sure.  But it's it's it's uh you know what it's taught. me is is just to go just to you know trust going  back to basics. Yes. and and not uh until I have.

an experience with a person that you know that I  I I can't rely on the opinions of others because. of you know just how you know however they've  chose chosen to see the world. Exactly. You know. or or experience the world. You got to spend the  weekend in Moscow. that will make you as angry as.

you've ever been because not because you know you  know I'm not Russian. I'm not moving to Moscow. I. don't want to move to Moscow. I want to live in  my country. I don't love Russia for some weird. reason. I just I was angry because I was like  this is nothing like I thought it was. I'd never. been here. It's very hard to get there. You're not  going to go there by accident. You have to really. try to get there. Probably won't even succeed.  I did succeed and I learned like, oh my gosh, they've been lying about this. And so then I  tried to say, you know, we've been lied to about.

what it's actually like. You can make your own  judgments about the politics and Putin or Ukraine. or whatever. It's totally up to you. Decide what  you think about that. But the physical reality. of that city is undeniable to anyone who walks  through it. And so I say this and it's like, "Shut. up Putin, dude." I was like, "No, no, no, no.  I'm not defending Putin." Or maybe I, you know, whatever. It has nothing to do with Putin. Look  at the city. This is insane. And you lied about it. and I'm mad at you. Shut up. It's like that will  blow your mind. Don't go there. Okay. Yeah. Cuz.

you don't you don't need the aggravation. Okay.  No. No. No. No. No trips planned there anytime. soon. You can't I was there in '94. Oh. When it  was tough, right? Yeah. Yeah. And um we shot it. was bad. I mean, not the worst film, but it should  have been a great film and it and it wasn't. It. It was a disappointment. It's called Terminal  Velocity. It was a skydiving thing with uh Nastia. Kinsky. And whatever. What was she like? She was  She was pretty cool. She was pretty cool. Yeah,

she's sexy and fun and and what happened to  her? Um I She's still around, right? I mean, I don't know. I I think she was dating Quincy  Jones at the time. Yeah. And so they um their. relationship was a little bit bristly, you know,  so she'd be on the phone with him in her trailer. and then and then she'd come on of the set and and  at times, you know, was still carrying the tail. end of that conversation into the scene. But I I  had a terrific time working with her. Um I hope.

she's doing well. But so we went there just for  like four days or it was myself uh Chris McDonald. Um yeah anyway and I get to the airport and  Chris and I are just on the way there. I mean how. long is that flight? 14 long. Yeah. Yeah. We're  hammered and I'm in the airport and there's a guy. before I can even like find my bags who's who's up  in my face screaming taxi taxi taxi taxi. Right.

And I just I don't need a taxi. I know there's  a car waiting for me. I don't speak Russian, you know. And I'm like, I'm fine. I'm fine. No,  no, no. He's like, taxi, taxi, taxi, and I just at. some point it somehow got to [ __ ] off, right? I  bet pretty quickly. Um, no, it about 2 minutes. I. I was trying to be patient, but I did say [ __ ]  off out loud, but it wasn't like [ __ ] off. It. was just [ __ ] you know, [ __ ] off, man. Um, I  just kind of threw it to the to the to the clouds.

And I guess [ __ ] off there means something a  lot different than it means where I come from. And the guy lost his [ __ ] mind. He It's pretty  tough here too, I would say. Even in English, right? But he he started repeating, "Fuck off,  [ __ ] off, [ __ ] off, [ __ ] off." And he he. tried to go he tried to get to me. And so whoever  was with us had to get between the two of us and. like keep this guy from like really doing some  damage, you know? At the airport. At the airport.

Yeah. So I after that I only saw the hotel and I  saw the set where we shot and my trailer. That was. it. Yeah. I was like, "Okay, this is the rules are  a lot different." Well, 94 was kind of a famously. low eb, I think, for Russia. Yeah. That's my  Russian air. Lots of killings. So, you were. you're on a media tour for the book and The Dock,  and you were doing Rogan last week when Charlie.

Kirk was murdered. Yeah. You were actually in the  middle of the interview. We were. Yeah. Yeah. And. um like we just had the bathroom break. I said to  Joe, I said, "Um uh I is it cool? Can we pause so. I can I can hit the head?" And he says, "Yeah, we  you know, we can we can wrap it up pretty soon.". And I said, "Well, um, let's just cover let's just  do a couple more minutes at the end to just cover. one more thing and then we can wrap it up." He's  like, "You got it." And then so they the they the.

the producer pauses and and as soon as he as soon  as we're clear, he says, "Uh, Joe, there's there's. there's breaking news. Uh, and it and it's and and  and it's and it's really bad and it's everywhere. and it's really bad." And Joe's no. He says,  "Joe, don't look at your phone." And Joe's like, "Tell me." And he says, "Breaking is really bad."  And Joe says, "What's going on?" And he says, "Uh, Charlie Kirk's been shot." And he's clinging to  life. And it was just, it was suddenly everything.

was different, you know, for all the wrong  reasons. Um, it was just awful. It was awful. And. then we like 30 seconds later, we we go out  into the lobby and one of his security guys. says to Joe, "He just died. Charlie's dead  and then it's went from bad to just it's as.

as awful as it could have been, you know, and it  was I hate to say it would felt surreal. Yeah, it always does. I don't want to be disrespectful.  Um that's not disrespectful. That's the experience. that every person has when something that  shocking happened. He sat together and then we. couldn't really get the details. Um, then we went  we finally wound up in the bathroom and Joe said, "We we we need to talk about this on the air." And  I said, "Yes, we do." And so we came back on. And. then I guess what they've been playing a lot is  is us coming out of that moment. And for me, it.

was that it was I immediately went to fatherless  children, husbandless widow. And it was just that. that part of it breaks my heart. Yeah. you know,  um, and it's just and for what and for what, you. know, I mean, I I I I've been as mad and in in as  in in complete disagreement, just absolute total,

you know, nuclear frustration with people and have  never thought like, well, now this is this has to. be the next logical step. this is the thing that  I now must do because of how they've made me feel. with their words. It's just that that that's  where we're where where we've arrived. That's. where we're at, you know. Um if if if if that's  the case, we can't stay here. No, we can't. Um and.

um what what his wife said at his memorial um  pretty powerful, you know, is a is a is if you. thought you were going to silence him with that,  this will be my my my cries, my tears will be will. will be the battle cry. Yes. That that you'll hear  around the world. And she's not wrong. No, she's. not wrong. That happened in the first hour. Yeah.  you know. Um, but yeah, you just take the politics.

out of it. Take take all of it out of it and it's  it's a it's it's it's a father. Yes. that, you. know, that loved his children and his family and  his wife and just, you know, and was committed to. to the things that he, you know, was so passionate  about. And all he asked people to do was, you know, just just debate me, you know, and and  he set the example of showing up that prepared,

you know, and and challenging others to to to  to be equally as prepared, you know, and even if. they weren't, even if they stumbled or fumbled or  didn't couldn't get their thoughts or, you know, didn't look the part or whatever, he never  demeaned, he never belittled. He never criticized. He didn't do any of that stuff. He wasn't there  to make fun of people. He was he was there to. inspire. He was there to, you know, maybe just  create just a even just the tiniest little spark. of something for someone to maybe feel something a  different way and and and that cost him his life.

Really? You'd want to live in that country where  that happens. I mean, no. Um, and it does, you. know, it makes people that are in the, you know,  that that have to be in the public for the their. professions, you know, it's like, do you know, I'm  sure a lot of people are feeling that, you know,

that there maybe a little more censorship, you  know, personal censorship, you know, of course. Yeah. like, whoa, that's that's what the deep end  looks like now. I think I may better just stay in. the kitty pool for a minute, you know? There's no  question. Yeah. And and like everything else bad, it divides people from each other. So all of  a sudden, you know, people don't want to be. near each other. You know, it causes physical  separation, right? Which is a hell. It's what.

we do to prisoners. It's what we do to prisoners.  Interesting. I think Yeah. You don't want to be. shut in alone. No, it that's the worst thing. And  this just divides. It makes people suspicious, makes them hate their neighbor. Everything about  it is evil. And um I think it's just important to. say that. Um all right, so I want to end I never  do this, but I just really believe in it. Uh I.

want to end on a product testing moment. Amazing.  I want to do that because as as noted, you know, I don't drink and um I'm happy with that.  And I've discovered a product called Athletic. non-alcoholic beer, which has convinced me that  non-alcoholic beer can be amazing. I discovered. the same product, Athletic. So, I just there was  such a stigma, you know, 23 years sober, I never. had a non-alcoholic beer because I'm straight.  And then they sent me this and I was like, "Wow, that's incredible." Just the taste. So, now I'm  like all about non-alcoholic beer. It's like the.

greatest thing ever. And it doesn't make you as  fat as other things that I like actually turns. out. Right. Right. Yeah. For sure. Not. Yeah.  And um so you have a non-alcoholic beer. I do. I do. And I'm not a spokesperson for this. I'm  a co-founder and a consumer I assume. Yes. Yeah. Because um you know it's it's quitting you know  booze eight years ago. um that that um you know. I said always loved beer, still like beer and you  know tried like like you did pretty much all the.

non-ACs that were out there. Um and I'm not here  to [ __ ] on any of them but but they taste like. you're a lot of them do. Not that I would know,  but um but but the good ones are are are good. They're not for for me they're not great. And I  thought, well, how can I how can I affect this? How can I you know how how can I make this better?  not just for myself but for the world at large, you know. Yeah. And so um I aligned with um with  with three companies but in in in partnership.

with uh Silent Spirits with Ryan Perry, who's the  gentleman that was with me today. Yeah. Great guy. Um with our uh brewery partner is Harpoon out  of Boston. Wow. And our distribution is uh is. uh zero proof. Yeah. And so, um, but unlike, you  know, just being like invited into a a a finished.

product and being the pitchman, which would be  the normal thing for a celebrity to do, or sorry, an actor, right? Um, I I've I've been working  on this as long and as passionately as I have. um with the with the book and the dock. And it was  interesting because kind of the mantra in my house. with my kids and excited about the things I was  doing, it was always it was always book duck beer, book duck beer. These three things were happening  at the same time and we're and we're evolving at.

the same pace. And then we didn't we didn't  realize until um this tour actually started. that we got to a place where we can start taking  orders like first week of October and shipping. through e-commerce uh a couple weeks after that.  So this isn't like because it has no ethanol, you. can ship it. Exactly. Yes. And this is something  that I was um I was in on the development of this.

and in on every stage of building the recipe.  And I'm not a beer expert. I'm an expert on what. I like and what I know to be, you know, the the  the different levels of quality, you know. Um so, so and they were they were really relying on me  as not just a co-founder but a consumer. Yeah. you know, and it's the there's another thing  that's kind of cool is that um just during this.

this eight years, the amount of people that I  I'll see at a restaurant or a ball game or or. just on the street, they'll come up and say, "Man,  I I I I always wanted to have a drink with you, and you know, I'm glad that you're sober, but I'm  sad that that that we can't do that. Now we can.". I love that. Now we can have a drink together.  I feel that way. And so I'm gonna taste it. Do. you mind? Cool. This is wild AF. I guess you can  fill in the acronym as you so desire. Alcohol-f.

free or whatever that might stand for. All right.  Now, you can tell I've been off my game a little. bit cuz I totally screwed up the head. All  right. So, there's going to be some there's. going to be some foam slurping at the beginning.  Cheers. That's all right. I'm barely German. So that's great. Thank you. That's excellent.  Thank you. Um what I that just tastes like beer. Well, it is beer. Yeah, it's actual No, I mean  it's it's actual beer just without the alcohol,

you know. So what you realize when you have it is  that and I drank beer, you know, in the morning. for years and really enjoyed it. But it was the  alcohol that I was looking for, but it was also. the alcohol that made it not that great. Right.  Right. Right. So when you take the alcohol out, the hops really come to the four. Sure. And hops  are just an amazing plant. Kind of a string. I. think they're relative of cannabis actually,  which I don't smoke, but still, aren't they.

hops related to I think so. Maruna. Yeah. Well,  whatever it is, they have this really flowery, interesting taste that's a little bit biting that  offsets the inherent sweetness of the malt, but. they're kind of like overwhelmed by the ethanol in  a normal beer, but they come out in this. Do you. feel that? I do. I do. And um it's, you know, it's  a it's a craft logger. Yeah. And what I the the. the model that I was urging to to you know not to  get deep into the science of it but please do well.

I don't have the I don't know the science just  make it up. Um no I was like you know what you're. using nuclear technology for the first time ever  in the brewer process. Right. That's that's what. we're doing. Yeah. Um, no. It's just like, you  know what? What? Like our our target is, you know, like what what's what's a great beer that that  is commonly served at a ball game, you know,

and I want I want something that that that, you  know, not not not mirrors that, obviously eclipses. that is more feels a just a little more a little  more full. Yeah. A little fuller, you know. Um, and real, not thin and watery. Should we give  it the spananiel test? What is it? Well, oh, the. spananiel test. I'm just going to let them I've  got my spananiels. Come here. And I'm going to.

let them Okay. So, that Yeah. Yeah. And then did  Is that Is that a pass or a fail? No. No. That's a. full pass. Now, this is a legit grouse dog. Okay.  Okay, we went yesterday. Um, she's got an amazing. nose and if this dog doesn't like something, it's  immediately obvious. Oh, no. She liked it. Okay, good. I'm not going to let her have any cuz God  knows where that tongue has been. Exactly. And.

also, um, you know, there's obviously a tiein with  with Wild with Wild Thing. That's why the badge. is the is the profile of of that character,  which is kind of cool. But wild can also be, you know, connected to how people perceived me  for so long. Why did they perceive you that way, do you think? I mean, just just a little Charlie  Sheen joke there for a minute. Yeah. Yeah. The the.

the universe of evidence perhaps. Yeah. Um was  fairly overwhelming. There wasn't much debate. about that. Yeah. Exactly. Um but yeah, it's uh  it's it's alcohol-f free. It's as So when you. drink this in the morning, you feel no guilt  at all? None. None. Cuz I got to be honest, I'm not I legit enjoyed beer in the morning.  I mean, it's just a I did too. I did, too, for. sure. Yeah. Yeah. And um of course, I haven't done  that in a long time, but this is this is a way.

to get your breakfast beer in with no downside.  Exactly. And I started drinking it uh and and all. I had to work with for the longest time was was  the prototypes, but they would send it to me as. it kept evolving. And I was uh drinking it during  workouts. What What were the other people present. thinking? I wonder. There's Charlie Sheen. He's  drinking beer during a workout. Does seem like. a tiger blood thing. I was just working out in  my bedroom alone. Yeah. Wasn't like in a gym, but I heard somewhere years ago that the German  weightlifterss used to chug beer. Of course,

to get all the carbs and stay did it. I mean Oh,  did that famous movie of him from the 70s. He's. like drinking a giant Stein pumping iron. Yeah.  Wow. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So, I just do it on a on a. rower. Drinking on a rower. Yeah. On like an urg.  Yeah. You know, like when you on a row Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Not while I'm actually like holding the  can and rowing, but I would pause and have some. have some pops. And then Would you ever shoot  like bedroom video of that and put it online?

I mean, I I I I didn't um I don't I I I I try  to shoot as little bedroom video as possible, you know. This is the new Charlie Sheen. Um but  no, I I I I think people are going to really. really respond to this. Well, I already have.  Good. So has my dog. So anyway, Charlie Sheen, thank you for taking all this time. This is  amazing. It's been great. Yeah. No, it's it's. it's an honor to be here. Thank you. It's an honor  to have you. Thank you very much. Awesome. [Music].

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