The Basement: James Fox | UFO Disclosure, Varginha, and the Captured Creature

Today I'm talking with James Fox. He. spent three decades investigating UFO. cases, and he's produced seven. documentaries, including The Phenomenon, which hit number three in all genres. when it dropped. And back in 2007, he. organized what's still considered the. most credible civilian UFO disclosure. event in history. 14 military and. government officials from seven. countries, all at the National Press. Club in Washington. But here's what. makes James different. He doesn't chase. headlines. He knocks on doors. He tracks. down military records. He befriends.

witnesses for years before they'll even. sit down with him. His latest. investigation, the Virginia incident in. Brazil, took him there four times in the. last year. And what he found is. significant. He found a neurosurgeon who. claims he had face-to-face contact with. a captured non-human being. [music] We. learn about a military officer who died. weeks after handling one of the. creatures. And for the first time, all. the locations that James talks about. line up on Google Maps. We're going to. get into all of it. Let's go downstairs.

[music]. Today we're talking to James Fox. This. is exciting. One of the most prolific. documentary filmmakers working in the. UFO space. I don't call it UAPs. Uh he. got a start early assisting his father, writer and photographer Charles Fox, conducting interviews for Rolling Stone, Sports Illustrated, and Car and Driver. that foundation in rigorous journalism. shows in his work. James has spent three.

decades, three decades, uh, investigating UFO. cases, producing seven documentaries, including Out of the Blue, I know what I. saw, the phenomenon, which is my. favorite, the program, and in 2007, he. organized what's still considered the. most credible civilian UFO disclosure. event in history, bringing 14 military. and government officials from seven. countries to the National Press Club in. Washington. His latest film, Moment of. Contact: New Revelations, which is a. follow-up of Moment of Contact 1, expands on his nearly 30-year. investigation into the Vargia incident. in Brazil, a case involving nonhuman.

beings, military capture, and one. mysterious death. So, remember, we're. not here to convince or persuade. anybody. We just want to hear the story. James, this is not a professional. operation. Um, but I am very excited to. talk to you. Thanks for coming in. >> Oh, that was a that was a great intro. I. got to meet this guy. [laughter]. >> You got to meet him. His name is I think. his name is Chad GPT. >> Oh my gosh. [clears throat]. >> Okay. >> So, how do you first, how do you go from. working with your dad and interviewing.

Stephen Hawking to becoming like the. pre-minent UFO documentarian? >> So, funny. I I've talked about this in. the past because my father used to. always say to me, he was he was a. quadroplegic with MS. And so I very. early on I was I was kind of his legs. his secretary his physical therapist. [clears throat] his you know his his. chauffeur. and he had to you know continue working. cuz that's what he did and he had to. travel cuz that's what he did and so I. was his leg. So I got very early on I. was driving like 11 years old but I got.

to go and meet some of the subjects and. he had a wide range of stuff that he. would do and oftentimes he would want to. like meet somebody. So he'd make up a a. story idea, propose it to various, you. know, news organizations and get. approval and we could travel on, you. know, expense, you know, expense paid. travel, whatever. And um but he always. say to me, son, you know, whatever you. want to do in life, I support it fully. I don't care if you want to be a janitor. or a lawyer, you know, that's that's. what matters, that you're happy. And.

then when he found out that I was going. to looking into UFOs, I was in my. mid20s. He he was he was so he was so. concerned about my future. And he was. like, "There's [clears throat] nothing. to it. There's it's a dead end street. Don't waste your life." He was pleading. with me not to do it. Like not only. that, but he had members cuz I was born. in England. A lot of my family lives in. England and then they married Frenchmen. and Italian people, whatever. They're. scattered across Europe. And he had them. writing writing me letters. Your.

father's very concerned. Maybe you. should reconsider the path that you're. taking in life. Like, you know, really, Dad, like just because I said, I'm kind. of curious in this and I'm looking into. it and you know, and I thought, well, I'm going to I'm going to show him. And. so, I was like, I'm making a documentary. on, you know, UFOs. People are like, you. out of your damn mind on what, you know, and uh and I did. It took me four years. It was 100 million times harder than I. ever anticipated. I was like, Jesus, editing is insane. like, you know,

B-roll. I need B-roll. What was B-roll? Like, >> is this the one you sold to Discovery. when you were 28? >> Yeah, it was called UFOs. Uh, 50 Years. of Denial. Sorry, it's been so long. since since I did that one. >> I guess it's been 100 years of denial. since. >> Yeah, I know. I know. It's Now it's up. to like 500 years [laughter] of denial. Yeah, I did that and I got to the end of. it and I was like, but that was really. hard. Like really hard. >> Yeah. >> My god. And I had no money and I was, you know, I had met this guy that I'd. done some PSA work, public service.

announcements with another company that. I had apprenticed with to learn kind of. video production and stuff like that. And he was like, ah, you're doing this. documentary. He goes, um, you know, go. out and and you know, do do this, this, this, and this. And he gave me this. whole list, laundry list of stuff I had. to do. And he goes, 99.9% of the time. when I told people to go do that, I'd. never see them again. And I was happy. about that. But he goes, "Son of a. you came back a year later and. you did everything I told you to do." He. goes, "So I felt obligated to help you.".

So he was sneaking me, Boris Zubof, he. was sneaking me into this production. facility that was like $100, hundreds of. dollars an hour, right? It was I mean. back then and um [clears throat] we'd. come in on Friday like yeah we're just. going to do a couple of hours and then. we'd stay up all Friday night all. Saturday all Sunday just coffee and just. like you know because cuz you know and. then we had to leave before you know it. opened back up on Monday morning and. Boris bless your heart Boris like he. really helped me make that that film. happen when I was doing I had a noner.

editing a nonlinear editing system. called a toaster flyer if you remember. I'm sure on the amigga. >> Exactly. And uh I remember when I was. setting that up, the the guy goes at the. store, he goes, "Uh, Winter Circle in. Berkeley. It's probably not even around. anymore." He's like, "Well, I tell you. what, James, I've got um I've got these. two 4 gig drives or you can pull out all. the stops and get the 9 gig drives.". Nine gigs.

How much is 9 gigs? will never fill it. But. >> it was $2,400 [laughter] a piece for for. one 9 gig drive and I got two and he let. me pay in installments. So I was editing. the movie in like 15minute segments and. then I'd bring them into to this. post-production house and we we we. splice the film together with Digi Beta. and all that, you know. Anyway, so that. was my first film and then I finished. that. >> Well, hang on. Did your dad get to see. that? >> Oh, sorry. Yes. Going back to that, very. good point. Uh he did and he was he was.

like pretty damn impressed. But I'll. tell you what got him I'll tell you what. got him. He was very impressed. My whole. family was I mean I sold it to Discovery. my first documentary. It took me about. four years and I sold Discovery and I I. tell you man I felt like I clammed to M. Everest. I mean it was it was really. taxing and really difficult. Way more. work than I ever anticipated making a. documentary. You know I was like poke. the camera and uh you sold it. I sold. it. I know. It was incredible. Right. [gasps]. I had put out requests for interviews.

during the time of production with that. doc that they never got back to me. And. post Doc and the release, I got. accepted. I got invited to go to Russia. and I got invited to meet with Mercury. astronaut Gordon Cooper. Well, Gordon. Cooper was an iconic figure of my dad's. generation. >> He was an amazing man. >> Oh, yeah. last American astronaut to. orbit the planet alone in little tin can. and and um I thought well you know.

normally I would travel with my father. on assignment and this time I said dad. how would you like to come with me and. meet Gordon Cooper. so he came with we got his wheelchair. van loaded it up me and a couple people. got my camera gear my I did all my own. audio and camera then and um and we did. this interview and my dad was looking in. the eyes of Gordon Cooper and he was. like son of a what Why would this. guy lie? Had a landing at Edwards Air. Force Base that was filmed. He talked. about processing the film footage. He'd.

seen the film footage. Of course, as. with all film footage, two men in suits. showed up in a courier jet from. Washington DC and was never to be seen. or heard from ever again. And then on. top of that, he had these sightings of. these discs in the ' 50s over Germany in. the in these planes. And my dad just. walked away from that going, "This guy's. not selling his story. He's not selling. a book. He's iconic figure of my. generation. He's a hero. He's not crazy. Why on earth? What would motivate him to. lie? And that was a turning point for my.

father. He that really got him going, maybe my son's right. Maybe there. is something going on here. When he. died, he was one of my biggest fans. >> That's amazing. >> Oh, that's what justification for that. >> Yeah, I know. Unfortunately, he wasn't. around to to see the phenomenon because. I worked on that for eight years. I. started the phenomenon right right when. he died and then it took me 8 years. Maybe it took me longer than 8 years cuz. I started it concept at 43, filming at. 44, finished and promoting at 52.

>> Woo. >> Yeah, >> that's a long time. And it's really. funny. >> I had some editors come in with me cuz I. edited for three or four years of that. movie. It was a lot of work. Cases all. around the world, whatever. And uh and. this one editor, Ben Gallon, he goes he. goes, "Oh, dude, who's that who's that. who's that guy? Who's that guy over. there on your you know, the film. footage?" I was like, "No, that's me.". He goes, [laughter] "Really?" [cough]. I was like, "Yeah, that's when I first. started." Like 9 years ago, whatever,

you know, all brown hair, you know, you. know, no wrinkle, you know, whatever. But, you know what I mean? It was really. funny. I was like, "Yeah, that took the. wind out of my sales on that one, >> you know." But, um, yeah. So, uh, so. that's that's kind of how I got started. And I never anticipated like that I was. going to be the UFO guy making UFO docs, right? >> Well, what was the click that made you. suddenly get interested in that? >> Well, so I had a friend of mine, this. guy Renee Harris, from high school, and. when we graduated from high school, I. was like, "Hey, let's fly to Europe and.

let's drive across. Let's get a car in. London and drive to Portugal." So, we. bought this like we flew to London. together. He had way more money than I. did at the time. >> Best friends to have. >> Yeah. Yeah. He Yeah. and he he uh we. bought a Fiat 131 and we drove we. painted the doors red. We thought let's. spice this car up. It was white so we. like painted it red on the hood and the. whatever. And then we drove it to. Portugal. and uh ended up having to ditch it in. Portugal and came back. But we went. across Europe together, really really. good friends. And then he was like, you. know, I'm just hungry all the time in.

Europe. He's this big guy and he's like, you know, the the food portions are so. small in Europe. I need I need more. food. I guess he's like and everything's. so expensive and he wanted. [clears throat] to go home. So he went. home a little early. I stayed on for oh. man I ended up becoming an Opair. I went. to London sold clo clothing door to door. sleeve clothing store. The clothing. store that comes to you, you know, had. the door slammed in my face and then I. worked as an Opair in the French Alps. Um not speaking any French. And uh and.

then I when I came back to the states. quite a bit later, you know, we re kind of fell out and. then we reunited in our early 20s and he. was into UFOs and I was like, "What a. shame. [laughter]. >> This guy's nuts. >> This guy's lost his mind. He's one of my. best friends and I'm going to have to. cut him loose." And I he was talking. about Roswell and this UF I just I mean. I was like, "Oh my god, this is tragic.". So then I um I brought it up with one of. my uh people that I was working with at. this um I was I was apprenticing at this.

production facility in San Francisco and. this this guy Richard Vanickle and I. looked up to him. He was he was very he. was 10 years my senior and very. experienced in production. He was a. great guy, very smart. I said, "Guy, you're not going to believe no my friend. and Roswell." And he goes, "Oh, James, yeah, you didn't hear about Roswell.". I'm like, well, yeah, I heard about it, but I mean, what do you No, I heard. about it. And then he started getting. like, oh, yeah, the military actually. announced the recovery of a flying. saucer and UFOs, and he was very.

wellversed and everything. And I had a. lot of respect for him. So, I thought, well, I'll look into it. And the more I. dug, the more I realized, oh my god, there's something going on. >> And there was the inspiration for the. first doc came from that. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, excuse me. [snorts]. Not that not that exact meeting, but I. decided, okay, I'm going to look into. it. Just like Varia, I reluctantly. looked into that case. >> Sure. >> I mean, I I heard about that case in the. '90s. I heard about Rua through Steven. Spielberg when I was making my first.

documentary on UFOs in the '90s. >> We had a mutual friend, Janet Yang. Sorry. Um, had a head cold a couple days. ago, but um Janet Yang. uh was friends with Spielberg and I was. making a UFO. doc and I thought, well, of course he's gonna grant me an. interview because I'm making a UFO doc. and I'm James Fox, you know. I was like, and uh he got back to us and he's like, yeah, not gonna meet with James, but uh. he's doing a talk on UFOs. He should. know about this landing case that. happened in Africa and that was in Rua. Zimbabwe at aerial school in '94. I.

think he told me about it in '97 96. >> and I was I was like, yeah, I'm not. going to waste any time on a Yeah, sure. A UFO landed at a school and occupants. got out and interacted with the school. children tele telepathically. I'm not. wasting a second on that case. And I. didn't. And the same thing with. Virginia. Mhm. I heard [clears throat]. about Varia in the late '9s when I was. making my second UFO documentary. And my. British friend who and co-producer at. the time, Tim Coleman, very smart guy, he's like, "Oh, yeah, mate. We got to we. got to look at this this, you know, cuz.

we map out the film. Generally speaking, it's like, hey, let's you know, Bentwaters 1980, uh, you know, Tyrron. Iran in 1975. Uh, how about we'll look into the. Phoenix Lights case and how about you. know what I mean? We kind of map the. film out that way and then we stitch it. together with narrative whatever. >> The Australia case I think you covered. >> Yeah, that was in the phenomenon. But. but in any case, at the time I was I was. mapping it out and he was like, "Yeah, let's put this one on the chalkboard, you know, and this, you know, you hear. about this UFO crash in Brazil and and. the live aliens walking through the. town." And I looked at him and I was.

like, I picked the wrong partner. >> It sounds nuts to me. I was with I was. with my my my buddy Boris and he looked. at me kind of sideways and I was looking. at him sideways and then I looked at Tim. and I said to myself quietly I I think I. picked the wrong partner. This guy's. nuts. Like you know, not only did I not. look into the case for over 10 years. So. I finished out of the blue. Then I did. director's cut for out of the blue. Okay. Years later, then I did a 2-hour. special called I know what I saw for I.

ended up selling that to A&E. was. broadcast on the History Channel and um. then I got invited to and that was. before and I never looked into the. Vargia. refused to. And then I flew to I. got invited to Brazil, a place called. Perowibbe, and I and I met with AJ, this. guy AJ De Javard, who's a Brazilian UFO. researcher, magazine editor, and um. before I left, this guy named Jeff. Sagansky, I think he was head used to be. head of like Sony Pictures, and he was. always very instrumental behind the. scenes helping me get distribution for. my UFO films. And I was always really.

grateful cuz he never wanted a pennant. or anything, but but he found out I was. going to Brazil and this was like. 2010 maybe. I never look at the exact. date 2010, 2011, something like that. And he's like, "Oh, James, you're going. to Brazil. You got to look into that, you know, that ver and I I cringed. I. physically I cringed." And but Jeff was. I had so much respect for him. I I was. like, "You know what? I'm not going to. sit there and tell Jeff he's nuts. because he's been too influential. He's. too much of a nice guy." But I said, "Yeah, yeah, sure, Jeff." "Yeah, yeah,

sure." "No, I'll definitely look into. that." "Yep, I'll report back for sure.". "Yeah, bye." Click. And I was like, "I'm. not wasting a second on this case." So, just to give your audience like, "I. understand. I've see people online. There's no evidence and where's the. photographs?" And I I get it cuz I have. that. And I'm not out here trying to. prophesize and get people to join my. cult of believers. I'm I really mean. that when I say it. All I say is listen. to the firsthand eyewitness. testimony because it's very compelling.

>> We'll be fairing. Before we get into. Bara, which we'll definitely cover in. detail. >> Yes. >> How how have you managed to stay stay. >> sane? >> No, >> I don't I don't want to use the word. credible because it's cuz it's it's not. [clears throat] really the right word, [snorts] but how have you managed to. just you have so much integrity and. respect from not just the UFO community. from but from everybody. How have you. stayed that guy, the the most probably. the most trustworthy voice? >> Well, you know, I' I've made mistakes,

you know, and I try I really try hard to. um if I don't believe something, I won't. put it in a film, right? And if I have. any question, I'll say, you know, and. generally speaking, I do as much. background research as I possibly can. I. reach out to as many people within the. that I trust within the intelligence. community, people that can do like full. background checks. I call people up. I. want to see their military records. I. want to see like for instance there was. a controversial character named Jason. Sans and Jason um had an account of an.

alleged u close encounter of the third. kind that happened at Nellis test range. back in the '90s. very compelling like. wow it's it's really compelling and. especially when you hear you know we. know about close encounters of the third. kind um you know we know about I I've. heard a number of reports of people that. worked out at the base that claim for. you know that there are entities out. there I what am I it's a tall I don't. know but um I checked his military. records I checked in with all the intel.

folks that I possibly could I did. background on the on the UFO footage. that leaked from that period. Um, I even. contacted his ex-wife and I got I had to. pay her because she was like, "I'm not I. have to go up in the attic and dig. through all these box dusty boxes and. I'm not doing that." She didn't like. them. Obviously, horses are like that. >> I'll give you $200 per picture. >> I had those pictures like 3 days later. Bam. You know, of him exactly where he. said he was in the it at the b all the.

pictures, all of his military records. I. talked to people in the Senate. They sat. in a skiff with him. They're like, "I. know he's got PTSD and he might say some. off-the-wall stuff, but that guy was. there. He has named classified, you. know, legacy program names that we got. in trouble just for asking about. They're like, I know he's got some. issues, but that he's legit. He's he was. where he says he was, and we think that. encounter happened." So, I decided to. report on it. And I got lambasted by. people out there like, "You connected.

yourself with Jason Sans." It's like, that was a tough call. That was a tough. call. I was the one that accidentally. outed him. Um, so I make mistakes. And. did I make a mistake with that one? Would I do things differently? Maybe. But this is tough because we're now in. an arena where we're having these. incredible allegations of crash. retrieval, legacy UAP crash retrieval. programs. These are, you know, really. serious allegations. Where's the proof? Right. So we there's there's no smoke.

without fire. We sense where there's. people testifying under oath as to the. existence of a crash retrieval legacy. program. I've interviewed aerospace. engineers and physicists that are. directly involved or claim to be. directly involved that would love to. give us more information, but they need, you know, so I do the best I can. Sometimes I make mistakes and I try to. be kind to everybody and I try to stay. in my own lane. Where are you with the. whistleblowers and the the current. narrative, the folks coming out of the. Grush, Alzando, the guys that come from.

military intelligence that that. [clears throat] have clearance, they. clear their talking points through DoD. Where are you with this? Is that is it. real? Is it disinformation? >> Well, so here's what I here's what I say. to the people out there that that. criticize these whistleblowers. Fair. enough. Because they say, "I'm sick and. tired of hearing these allegations, and. where's the proof?" Instead of. criticizing them, why don't we recognize. the fact that they're saying that they. want to tell us the classified details. needed, but they are concerned about.

their personal safety. They're concerned. about the consequences. They're. concerned about their clearances. Those. are legitimate concerns. So instead of. criticizing them, why don't we figure. out how to create a platform that will. enable them to testify under oath to a. bipartisan group of lawmakers publicly? Right? So that's like one of the. questions that I'd asked aerospace. engineer Dr. Eric Davis. He's making. some incredible allegations, right? And. he's like, "Look," I said, "Yeah, but. this is really frustrating cuz you're. telling me there's crash retrieval and.

there's pictures of aliens and all this. other stuff, but where's the" And he's. like, "Look, you get President Trump tomorrow to wave. the magic wand and give me immunity, I'll give you all the details you. needed." So instead of focusing our. attention on attacking these people, why. don't we just call their bluff and say, "I tell you what, let's push members of. Congress." This is what I've been doing. recently. I just met with members of. Congress in the task force in Washington. DC like 10 days ago. Yep. Right. And I'm. trying to get them to look into the. Varjini case. I'm trying to find out.

like how can we get hearings on more. witnesses? How what sort of an. environment can we get to create a. platform for all these people that claim. to have all this knowledge that want to. come forward? They're terrified of the. consequences. Why don't we create that. platform? Why don't we focus on that? Because whether you believe Grush or. not, if it's true what he's saying, it's. the biggest story in the history of. mankind. >> Of course, let's call his bluff. Let's. focus on getting the president, the.

executive branch, the, you know, to say, "Hey, wave the magic wand. give these. guys immunity. They're dying to testify. Let's do it. What are we waiting for? >> Even Eric Davis said he would. He'd say. everything. >> He said he would. He said it to me on. camera cuz I was really frustrated, too. And I'm sitting there going, you know, and people just sit on the sidelines and. criticize. I'm like, why don't we call. their bluff? Why don't we focus more on. resolving this issue as opposed to like. that guy's lying, he's deep, you know, scop and this this that person. It's. like I don't, you know, I don't want to. hear it. All I know is that people are.

testifying under oath. Under oath saying. that there's a crash retrieval program, biologics, all that stuff. What about. the um what was his name? The ICIG. intelligence uh community inspector. general uh that apparently David Grush. said he'd given all the classified. details needed to verify his claims in a. skiff. Um Thomas Mheim, Thomas, is it. Thomas Mheim? I think it was. But why.

don't why don't we put him let's. subpoena him and get him to to give us. those details. Why don't we focus on. that? There's no talk of that. Do you. see what I'm saying? Of course. >> So, it's like we need to all get. together. We need to stop bickering with. one another, criticizing online, and. focus on a common goal like to to to. make this happen. And that's what I was. trying to do in DC. That's what I was. trying to do with the press conference. What is it going to take? You know, Kirk. McConnell was talking about it. He said. in on the skips with firsthand witnesses.

>> that was pretty extraordinary. He talked. about the environment. There are some. people like Christopher Melon for. instance is saying that Congress. actually has the authority to do this. Not even of course. >> the executive branch for sure. But the. president of the United States can just. wave his magic wand and what does he got. to what's he got to lose? >> Nothing. There'd be statues of him all. around the world. There would be. >> not everywhere. But but I agree. >> But if he you know. >> but where's the resistance where's the. resistance coming from? Who's in charge? Well, so I talked to people in the task. force just like 10 days ago. Um, we had.

a closed door meeting which actually. Leslie Keane and Ralph Blumenthal just. wrote about it today. That story came. out in the debrief. I would highly. recommend you viewers go check it out. >> 100%. >> Um, cuz it got pictures and very. detailed account of what what happened. >> But they said that the push back they're. getting from the DoD is significant. the. intelligence agencies significant. like what's happening and the and some. of the threats you know I mean grush I. mean I've heard I can't reveal what I've. heard but what I've heard was if it's.

true that's pretty scary what you know. like basically coming in your house. while you're gone and leaving notes and. other things. >> Sure. >> You know just like you know we can touch. you anywhere kind of stuff. Well, I. mean, wherever you stand on someone like. Lazar, believe it or not, the government. made his life difficult for a good long. time. >> Yeah, for sure. >> So, George, >> I trust George Knap's reporting on that. >> I do as well. I trust I trust him more. than anyone. >> I really do. I have tremendous respect. for him. >> So, what why don't they want us to know.

what there's some advantage that they. have? >> Okay. So, let's just let's. [clears throat] live in an alternate. reality for a moment. [laughter]. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And let's just imagine that this. is all true, okay? Let's imagine that. UFOs have crashed. Let's imagine that we. have biologics. We have we've captured. some alive. Let's imagine that we have. this technology in a lab somewhere. Let's just say that the observed. technology, you know, with UFOs, and. it's well documented for over 80 years.

and some goes way back, but whatever. We'll just talk about the modern UFO. wave. These things exhibit a technology. that's light years advanced from. anything we have in our possession. Even. today, listen to David Fraver. Listen to. the various pilots over the years talk. about have flying rings around the. fastest jets and they got no wings and. no tail and no no visible means of. propulsion. They can hover, accelerate. from a standill to out of sight, blink. of an eye, right angle turns at high. speed. I mean, they go Kirk McConnell. talked about the radar tapes. I mean, we. have radar of these objects with no. wings. These tic tac shaped objects.

They're in space. They drop down to sea. level faster than a second. Like, >> you know what I mean? >> 22,000. >> G's 80,000 ft in less than a second. Okay. [clears throat] So, whatever these things are and who's ever. piloting these things, if you could. weaponize that technology, you're going to you're going to control. And of course, that's how the military. thinks. So, let's just again in this. alternate reality, let's just imagine. that that's all true right now. Do you.

think that those in control of this. technology, whether they've figured it. out or not, there's a lot of controversy. on both sides, some people say we have, some people say we have it, some people. say we understand the technology, we. don't quite know how to replicate it. because the power it would take to. generate blah blah blah blah blah. But. what incentive would the defense. department or the various agencies that. are in control of the special accessed. you know super ultra secret programs uh.

how would they benefit by sharing that. technology with the rest of the world? >> They would not. >> Okay. So well how about like imagining. if that hand that technology got out to. the Russians or the Chinese, right? So, and they weaponized it. They put a nuke. on it. Like, you know, I could just see. I could see that being an issue of. national security. Sure. So, we've been. slightly pivoted a little bit, but the. the the so-called biologics, they call. them biologics, the the non-human, you.

know, intelligent beings. That should. not be an issue of national security. So, we're kind of pivoting to that. We've talked about that at the event, but um. they would have to admit that. Earth is under some sort of observation. Um. we have definitive proof that we're not. alone. We have biologics. We've been. lying to you guys for 80 plus years. Roswell is real. Magenta was real. 30s. in Italy. Um, we don't know who they.

are, where they come from, or what their. agenda is. I I I I don't see an. incentive to disclose that either. >> Okay. >> Um, I. >> that's a fair answer. >> Yeah. And I don't not I don't agree with. that. And a lot of people don't agree. with that. People have a fundamental. right, right? And what we're talking. about that's happening in the United. States, it's a global issue. This is. going to impact the whole world. [clears throat] You know what I mean? I. remember when I met with this is. probably one of the first times that I. actually thought about the implications.

and I'm all for disclosure. I don't. care. It's the truth is the truth and. people should know and if the technology. has to stay a national security issue. issue for all the reasons we just. discussed then fair enough but at least. confess that you have it. >> So say we have it. Look, we're not. sharing it. We can't let our enemies. have it. But we do have it. >> Yeah. I think that there should be an. admission of that. I I really do. I met. with um Big Robert Bigalow. because. right after I did I know what I saw and. I got a uh an email from his I still.

have the email. I got an email from his. uh secretary and she's like oh Mr. Bigalow wants to congratulate you on a. job well done my film. um I know what I. saw. [clears throat] And I was like, "Oh. my god, Robert Bigalow, this guy could. fund my next, you know, >> and uh so we ended up having lunch in in. in Las Vegas and at his house and um. he's like, you know, you know, kid, cuz. I was probably in my late 30s or maybe. very or maybe I was 40, but yeah, probably maybe 40." He's like, "You. know, kid," he goes, "You know, we.

looked into it. I probably poured more. money into the phenomenon. I had. intellectual heavyweights in the. scientific community and NIDS and this. and little did I know he was working on. OAP and ATIP at the time. contract from from Harry Reid, >> but he didn't he didn't tell me about. that. But he was like, you know, and do. you understand like the impact that. disclosure would have and la? And I was. thinking to myself, >> like, you know, no, what what I mean, Kumbaya, group hug. Wow, we're not. alone. It's going to this unifying, you.

know, global, you know, that's that's. the way I always looked at it. I thought. it'd be really cool. We'd see ourselves. for who we really are as one race, one. species, one planet. How cool would that. be, >> right? And he just looked at me and he's. like, "Man, we did a study on this and. this the impacts would be significant.". He's like, "You take every and he said. that and I don't know. I'm starting to. think that maybe maybe he's right or or. maybe it's just the thing that the world. needs right now, you know, because uh. yeah, I think it would have a unifying.

It might be initially quite shocking. onlogical shock or maybe religions might. have some issues with it. Hey, Mike. >> Um, but uh. >> but I think the Vatican is is a little. more open to this idea now. >> It's really funny you should say that. because. uh we reached out to someone who's to. speak at our event. I probably won't. mention her name, but uh she's like, "Oh, it's really funny that you you know. uh that you reached out and and made a. request for me to present at at at your.

uh at your event in DC." She goes, "Because highlevel people at the Vatican. are just telling me about this new. witness that you found uh on the Vargia. case. They think it's really significant. and they said you got to watch this, you. know, you got to watch this video. because if true, it's the most. significant development in the history. of the phenomenon and and I have to say. I think it is." [clears throat] So. anyway, >> I agree. Um where do you stand? My. favorite landing video is the Hollowman.

Air Force Base video. >> Yeah, I mean the the video that we don't. have. [laughter]. >> We don't have which we do. We do. [clears throat] have it, but we don't. Um, what do you think about that? What. happened there? >> Oh, just like every other case that I've. ever investigated, including Sakoro and. Rua and Varia. I don't know. I used to. always think like. that's impossible. And I remember the. first time I literally the first real. serious time that I'd heard about the. the Hullman landing case, I laughed it. off pretty quickly and [clears throat].

um and then I started investigating. Sakoro and that Sakuro is very close. stones throw. I started reading articles. from a woman named Carell Lorenzan of. the UFO bulletin and uh she had. described some med and she apparently a. pretty reputable source at her during. her time. She had described some. interviews that she had done with people. at Hullman Air Force Base that had. described this incident. One from the. air, one from the ground, some other. people, very good articles. And I. thought, hm, that's interesting.

Continued my investigation into Zakoro. and I ended up stumbling upon that. documentary uh UFOs past, present, and. future with uh Enegar and um Sandler. And um I'll make the story quick, but I. um I met with both of them and Ammon was. like absolutely convinced that it had. happened and. uh they were producing their documentary. in the early '7s and they were working.

with a guy at the Pentagon named Colonel. William T. man who I interviewed and uh. he was basically giving them cart blanch. to do this UFO dock in the early '7s and. giving them unprecedented access to all. these bases and NORAD and like it was. incredible what happened back in the 70s. [clears throat] and um apparently. uh and this is one of the reasons why I. believe this happened um and I was. sticking my teeth into it kind of as a. side project. I didn't even report on it.

because I was just like, "Whoa, let me. check this out, you know, as I was doing. other stuff making the phenomenon." And. uh I got to know Ellen Sandler. I went. to his house. >> Uh I was going after some footage that. he actually still has of of a of an. incident that happened at Vandenberg in. the 1960s. >> of an Atlas rocket and a UFO going. around. And he had that and I he. actually made a deal with me to buy it. I was going to give him like 25 grand. and then he was going to show it to me. I had to put the money in an escrow.

account and he was going to show it to. me and if I didn't if I liked it and it. was everything he said it was going to. be he kept the money I the thing off I. go and the last I got the money and the. last minute he pulled the carpet out and. he's like you know I talked to my. lawyers and it's really risky and this. that the other thing and I I'm really. well off and I don't need the risk. I. was like, "Dude, really?" So, I've been, you know, anyway, during this time, um, and I was also. interviewing Coleman and Ammon, which. I'm going to release all those. interviews pretty soon for free on the. internet. And Allan's like, "Oh, I saw.

that footage and I was driving my car. when he told me this." I was like, "Excuse me, what? You saw the footage. from Vandenberg?" "No, no, I saw the. landing at Hullman.". [clears throat] I said, "Okay, hold on a. second." pull the car over, stop, engine. off. Okay, you're telling me, Alan Sandler, that you saw the landing at Hullman? He. goes, "Yeah, I sure did. It was shown to. me by a guy named Paul Shart at Norton. Air Force Base.".

Okay, so why is it that Emger doesn't. know that? That's weird. So, I closed my eyes and I. got him to give me the description. Now, he was like, "This was clearly not fake. It was a real film footage of a real. flying saucer that really flew and. really landed." And he goes, "James, just like in a sci-fi movie, the door. opened. It didn't have any seams or. anything. It just opened up and plump.". And he was like, I think it was, you. know, our technology back in the 70s, we.

have a flying saucer and we set it up as. like a a training video as to what we do. if we made contact. I don't agree with. him and either was Emman, neither did. Paul Charle, but I don't know if he knew. and he was just trying to like who. knows, but that's what he said. So I. said, "So you're telling me it's not a. special effect?" He goes, "No, man. This. is real footage. It was shown to me by. Paul Ble emaggar happened to not be at. the base that day." And the very next. morning, two men in suits showed up. You. never saw this like da da da. And it.

took the footage and it was gone. And so. for whatever reason, you know, Allan. didn't tell Enegger. And I got actually. got on the phone. I got the interview. somewhere and I was like, "All right, Emgger, I'm here with Allan or maybe I. was with Eminer and had Allan on the. phone. I was with Eman." And I was like, "Do you know that Allan saw the footage? Why didn't you tell me?" You know, so. Allan saw that footage and he described. to me in vivid detail. And if you want. me to tell you what what he described, of course, I'm happy to tell you. [clears throat]. >> I've seen the landing, but I haven't.

seen the doors open. >> So, okay. I Okay, I have not seen the. lightning, so I haven't seen any of it. But in any case, this is what he told. me. >> It's gorgeous. Oh, man. >> He said he said that there were three. discs coming over, escorted by military. jets coming over Hollowman Air Force. Base. I I can't remember. It was. daytime, but I can't remember if it was. afternoon or morning. I I'm sorry. I I. just can't remember. >> But it was it was day. >> It was daytime. No question about that. So there were three discs coming in at. rather high altitude and that uh two. when it got to a certain proximity of.

the base, two of them peeled away and. one came down and he said it came down. almost like a leaf like kind of like it. was unstable and maybe had some issues, you know, whatever. I was like, "Yeah, that's kind of how they fly." Came down. and he goes, "Landed on some pods.". I said, "Well, was the camera like on a. tripod? Did they anticipate it coming?". And I believe he said it was cameras on. a tripod. So they were expecting it. so-called. I guess they would be. >> And um and he goes, "James," he goes, "The most incredible part, this is the. part I never forget." He goes, "There.

was no door. Like it just like a seam. There was no seam. It just opened like. he goes and just dropped down. Two. um. entities, I guess, came out." He didn't. really describe what those look those. ones looked like cuz I should have. asked, but he he did describe what the. other one looked like. And it had like a. a like Egyptian head. thing, Egyptian. um tight fitting suit, uh I think he.

said big eyes with the vertical slits, very small nose, very insignificant. mouth, and he had what what appeared to. be some sort of what would be a. communication device in his hand. And. that came off, met with some base people at the base. with a jeep. >> Mhm. >> That one got in the jeep and and and off. off they went and then and I said, "Well, what happened?" He said, "Well, the film footage stayed for a minute and. then it just cut and the disc was still.

sitting there when it cut and they were, you know, the steps out and it cut. That. was it." And uh I was like, "Maybe this. footage does exist." And then I started. talking to other people about it. you. know, Hal put off and Eric Davis and. Christopher Melon like what you know and. to this day Allan's in his 90s and he's. like if you know where to look it's. probably still in the archives. I don't. know if Arrows found it. I know that I. did Eric Davis say he saw it or he knew.

someone that did see it. Um President. George W. Bush apparently was aware of. that footage and they had a conversation. about it. So I I actually believe that. footage exists. Obviously, I can't prove. that, but that's that's my background on. that on that story. >> Have you come across anyone who um could. describe what the reason for that. meeting was? >> Absolutely no idea. >> It's connected to the project Serpo. story, but it's just so wrapped up in in. disinformation, it's really hard to know. what why they they were there.

>> Well, the information that I just. discussed with you, I feel is pretty. damn solid. >> Like, it's really solid. That is like enough for me to go, am I. positive the film footage exists? I. don't know. One can never be positive. unless you see it for yourself. But I. would say uh high level of probability. that that footage is real and it does. exist. And they almost got to use it and. I think I don't know how it got out. And. Paul Shart had gotten a call from. Colonel Coleman who was like, "Hey,

these guys are coming to the base. Make. everything available." And I guess he. had just processed it and he was like, "This was real. Like this is not an. act. This was Paul Sher was convinced of. it." He ended up dying in a head-on. collision with his wife. Both died. But. he did go on one TV show and talk about. it with Eenegger and Emgger was. absolutely convinced that the footage. existed. He was absolutely convinced. They almost got to use it in their their. in their film. And um and and the. recreations were based on exactly what. that footage shows. >> So the military there was clearly um.

anticipating that meeting. How long, how. far back do you think that goes? The. communication, coordination with the. military, does this go back to Roswell? >> I just have no idea. It's all. speculation. All I can tell you is what. I know, what what I personally. investigated. And the. >> Well, that's why we all trust you. Yeah. Is because you say I don't know. >> Yeah, I I don't. And it's just. [clears throat] like people go with the. Vargi case. Well, this happened here and. there was seven days later the girls. saw. I'm like, yeah, I know. That's odd. Were there multiple crashes? Did the Did.

the creatures hang out? Did they have an. escape pod? Did they go travel through. the water? How did they get there? It's. a few miles away, several miles away. Like, I don't know. >> You know, the girls describe this. creature. And I believe those girls and. those are one of the reasons why I. really started digging into the Vargia. case. >> We're still teasing that one. We're. still teasing that. And and actually, when we get into that case, cuz you're. such a magical storyteller. if I step on. like any punchlines, if you're building. the story, let me know and I'll I'll let. you I'll let you do that for this. segment, which we're only going to do.

for another 5 10 minutes. >> Um, >> so what's the earliest case that you. believe? Do you believe Roswell? Do you. believe the multiple crash theory? >> Oh, I know. I could tell you why I. believe Roswell if you want. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, um, first of all, I really. believed, you know, uh, Jesse Marcel. >> Yes. I was friends with his son who. handled the debris, Jesse Marcel Jr. who. was a medic in the in the military. >> And he had the debris that had markings. on it, didn't he? >> Yeah. Yeah. He Well, the the dad came. back from the ranch with Mac Brazzle.

Yep. >> And one other military guy and he was. woke his kid up in the middle of the. night like, "You got to see this stuff. I'm waking you up. You got to see this.". And he showed him the material, the. paper, the I beams with this symbol, blah blah blah. >> And um. >> I knew him, so I knew someone who. handled the debris. There's still pieces. out there, by the way, cuz I knew other. people that when when I when I would go. to Sakoro, there were the plains of San. Augustine and Magdalina and uh Dal and. that whole area. What? Talk about remote. high desert like plains. Wow, beautiful.

But I talked to a gentleman out there. and he's like, "Yeah, there's there. still some of those pieces of of Roswell. out here." I said, "How do you know?" He. goes, "Cuz I know the ranchers that have. it. In fact, I got to touch one of. them." I was like, "Really? Do you think. they'd talk to me?" He goes, "I don't. think so. They don't talk to out. outsiders and they don't talk to anybody. about that." So, I had a lead on that. I. have the guy's name, but that's a side. story. Roswell, um, of course, you look into it. They. announce they make the announcement that.

they recover this thing. Then they. recant whatever how many hours later, they have that press conference. They. throw debris down on the ground. Right. Well, two out of the three, you know, Remy and Dose and Marcel. Remy kept. shut, but Dubose and Marcel both went on. the record later. That was a cover story. for what really crashed. It was not of. this earth like you know I cover it in. in the in the phenomenon quite. extensively. But I was making um probably out of the. blue probably it was probably out of the.

blue. It might have been my first UFO. doc in San Francisco I was telling you. about and my my partner at the time. Boris Zubof uh lived in this apartment. complex on the top floor with a view of. Dolores Park. Really nice. And he he he. one day he goes, [clears throat]. "My um my land lady, she's in her 80s, wants to have tea with you." And it was. in the '9s. I said, "What what about?". He goes, "I don't know." She found out. we were doing a documentary on UFOs and. she wanted to have tea. I was like, "Okay." Um I'll have tea with her. Sure.

>> I love tea. >> Yeah, I love tea. I'm English. I was. [laughter]. My dad drinks used to drink 20, 30 cups. a day. And I I used to jokingly see like. how many cups of tea can I bring my dad. before he says, you know, he doesn't. want. One day I just bought him like cup. after cup after cup cuz he's always. asking. It's kind of a pain in the ass. to make him a tea. And I got to like 25. like and he's like I'm good, you know. [laughter] It's like wow. Yeah. So. anyway, we have tea and she says um. um you know I I don't want to you know I.

don't want to go public or anything. I. just I found out you're doing this. documentary on UFOs and I want you to. know that I think it was her husband or. someone that she was I think I think it. was her husband that was deeply in um he. was a high level uh scientific. researcher for the for the government. and back in the back in 1950. he told me and she goes I haven't talked. to anybody about this she was in her 80s. telling me this she didn't want any. money she didn't want to like go on the.

just wanted me to Now she he said that. that a UFO a flying saucer crashed in. the desert of New Mexico and there were. aliens recovered. He told me that in. 1950 nobody was talking about that. She. goes, "I've held it in all this time.". And she goes, "This guy was like so. solid and so credible and so honest and. he told me that like that happened and I. thought, why would she make that up?". >> No reason to make it up. And you take. that with all the rest of the stuff.

that's going on and all the military I I. had the distinct advantage. I got to go. to the 50th anniversary of the Roswell. crash and at the time it was 1997 July, you know, there were a lot of people. still alive because if you're in your. 20s or 30s, you're in your 70s and 80s, right? A lot of people that I got to. meet. I was so glad I got to go that. firsthand witnesses of all different. walks of life, you know, witnesses of. debris and whatever. Um, so that's. that's primarily why I'm totally and of.

course I've talked to and tell folks I. even know where the I I was told where. the alien bodies were from Roswell and. the individual that told me where they. were in California Southern. That's. where they went to. >> I'm just that that's what it was said to. me. And I said to No. Yeah. No. And I. said to this individual, I can't reveal. this individual's name, but we were at. dinner having wine and it slipped out. >> and I was like, >> I was thinking that I thought they'd be. on the East Coast. Really? Like. >> you should always bring wine to. >> interface. Totally. And uh and then the.

next day I brought it up and the. individual was like, "No, I didn't." I. said, "You did. Actually, we I heard it. loud and clear." "No, I didn't.". [snorts] "Uh, you did." No, no, I. didn't. Isn't. >> that funny? >> It just like slipped out. So, apparently. the there's some body at least one body. from the Roswell in Southern California. I'm not sure exactly where, but I heard. Southern California. >> Yeah, I heard one went to went to Los. Alamos. >> Would have gone to the east. I thought. cuz I was told recently that that I. don't know if it was the live entities. or the entities in general on the east.

coast. I got that much out of this. individual. It's like, well, where, you. know, cuz I want to know where the damn. bodies from from Virginia went, >> right? And um oh you know I think I know. and I was like uh. can you tell me more like east coast? And I went and then the individual is. like that's that's all I'm giving you. I'm not saying anything more. >> Oh god. >> And. cuz I'm like curious too like even if I. can't report on it publicly I still want.

to know. Right. >> So I was asking this until Yeah. We had. we [laughter] had a we we we we were. together at the uh Age of Disclosure. premiere in New York City and we watched. the movie and there was a Q&A and then. afterwards there was drinks at a bar and. like like got what food or whatever and. I [snorts] saw this person I've been. really wanting to talk to and I talked. to him once before. standing over the bar with a drink. I. was like good [clears throat] sign went. over there got myself a little whiskey. Hey, you know, we start chatting it up.

and uh I didn't want to be too forceful. cuz I can be a little overwhelming. sometimes cuz I'm so curious and I you. know I'm I get so excited. But I was I. was like I was like you know I I heard. that you know there's not really like. that many people like in the real know. like that with the percentage of you. know how many people really know the. bigger picture. He goes, "About. 10 10 people on the planet have the. bigger picture.". Wow. Whoa.

What would you consider like where. you're at? And he's like, "Probably one of 30.". >> Wow. >> And I was like, "Okay, what about like Hal Putoff?" Cuz. Halputoff told me. He goes, "You know, James, this is how much I know. This is how much I've shared with you.". He's like, "Hal's probably one of 50, I. would say.". My god. So I said,

>> "Hal shows up in all these stories.". There's other things about Hal that I. can't really discuss with you, but I had. some weird telepathic stuff with him. that. >> you like mindmelded with how put on. >> I'd like to do Let me stay on point with. this one because I can't really [snorts]. >> um. so I said uh cuz I you know and I didn't. want to pry too much because you know. you people clam up you know when you're. when you're too aggressive but I was but.

I was really dying and I actually saw. Leslie Kaine. uh on the other side of the room and she. was hanging out with people from like. either the CIA or the FBI. I can't. remember people's task force. I'll tell. you that story a little later cuz that. was funny. All the guys serving drinks. were CIA. >> Yeah. Well, no, they were knowingly out. like we're here like, you know, and um. I see Leslie look at me and she saw that. look on my face. Leslie's known me for a. while, like probably almost 30 years, a. little under, but she looked at me and. she saw she goes, "I know that look.".

Cuz I was, you know, I was really. focused. I really wanted to hear from. this person. So, I said, "Uh oh, you. know, couple sips.". Um, I heard that. Um, I don't know. Some. people say the bigger picture is a. little scary. >> Little scary. >> A little scary. He's like, "Yeah, yeah, I could see that." I'm thinking, "You can see that? Like, why can you see. that? Like, how?" So I said, um, I like.

paused and like, you know, tried to be. measured and calm and I said, uh, well, like, like how scary? Well, you don't. need to be worried. Okay. Well, what do. you mean by scary? Well, intent. >> Intent is scary. >> That's what he said. >> Oh, you got to get more. >> I'm right on the cusp of like, all. right, what's the intent? That was my. next question. But I was like, you know,

and this person with a cocktail came up. and slipped in between the two of us and. oh my god, I've been wanting to talk to. you and d I'm like, so now that's on hold. >> I told you you can't trust those. bartenders, man. [laughter]. >> I just want to I just want to know what. the hell's going on. All right. You. know, I want to know what's going on. And [sighs and gasps]. >> well, let's take a break. >> I don't know. Maybe if I'll ever know. what's going on. >> I don't know if we ever will. [laughter].

Um, if anyone will, you'll get to it. We'll take a quick break. We'll come. back. We'll talk about Virginia. Fascinating. >> Perfect. >> All right. All right. Back with James. Fox. Um, when I first heard about the. Virginia case in Brazil, I thought. there's no way there's anything to this. It's it's a it's a brown slippery alien. When the I was there's nothing to it. And then uh I started doing some. research and of course my primary source. was Moment of Contact and I was like. >> this happened this story happened.

>> Do um I know that you your newest doc is. sort of an addendum to the first one. Do. you want to do you want to tell the. original story or would you rather us. cut it in? >> Well, no. Yeah. Uh [clears throat] um. I've got some clips too. I'll show those. in a little bit. Okay. But um first of. all I want to say I completely. acknowledge and and and respect that. position. I see it online. I get. attacked all the time. you know and I George Nap told me he. goes don't read the comments. Generally. generally speaking I try not to read the. comments and every now and again you. read them and kind of.

don't do it. >> cuz some people are just like you know. really rude. Like you can have a. spirited debate and you could be. skeptical. That's fine, but don't be an. You know, like. >> if you're on Reddit, you don't know what. you're talking about. >> Just really rude. Like just really rude. It's like, >> how many times have you been to Brazil? >> So many times. Four times in the last 12. months. Four times. Wow. In the last 12. months. I was just there a couple days. ago. >> And uh that's why I look like. [laughter] And.

>> but uh um so I totally respect that. opinion. And I'll say I I myself was. there and again I'm not putting this out. as the gospel. I'm clearly saying that. as someone who's investigated UFOs for. over 30 years, investigated this. particular case on and off for over 16. years, um I feel that at the very least. even those most skeptical can look at.

this firstirhand eyewitness testimony. Even Michael Shurmer said to me, "Well, that's pretty compelling stuff.". >> Mhm. like you know Michael Shurmer. Skeptic magazine pretty compelling. stuff. Why can't we agree to like say hey. something significant happened? People. saw UFOs. People saw UFO crash. People. saw UFO in distress. People saw strange. creatures. They were intelligent beings. with large heads, big almond shaped.

eyes. The doctor described one of the. creatures as being more more white with. the same eyes, same big teardropshaped. head, um same telepathic communications. through the eyes. The girls described. something, you know, more brown, suffering, hot heat. The other one was. an air conditioned environment in the. ICU. Are they chameleons? Can they are. there different species on one cra? I. don't know. Now, I know this story well, so if you find me stepping on any of. your reveals, let me know because you're.

a storyteller. >> And I think that's why your docu. documentaries are so good is because you. clearly are a storyteller and it doesn't. sound like. >> I don't want to insult you. It doesn't. feel like journalism. It feels like you. unwrapping the story and the mystery for. us, which I love. So, >> I think I think it's really important. that it's it's beautiful. David West, who's my DP, just he takes he's as into. the photography and the B-roll as I am, the topic and the and and the subject. matter. It was a really nice. combination.

Um, a film should be entertaining. It. should be beautiful. It should be an. experience, right? It should be but it. also should be educational like and with. a serious tone. And I like to have fun. too as well cuz like without humor like. you know, come on. when I make some. funny jokes in the out takes and stuff. >> The out takes at the end of great. >> but I also think about like the skeptic. in the room and that's great there. There should be we shouldn't just. believe nobody should just believe me.

because I'm saying a UFO crash and live. aliens. I don't expect you to. And I and. I remember when I got back from the last. trip when I made moment of contact, it. was like 2021, late 2021 or maybe it was. early 2022, something like that. And I. had CNN at my house in Vermont and with. Leslie Kaine and they were going to do a. little piece on me for the show they. were doing. And they were like, "Oh, you. just got back from Brazil. It's so. exciting. We heard that you're. investigating and blah blah blah blah. blah. Well, we'd love to talk to you.

about this on camera." And I said, "Yeah, that's not going to happen.". Like, "Why not?" I said, "I'm happy to. talk about the phenomenon. I'm happy to. talk about out of the blue, whatever, you I said, "No, cuz you guys are going. to look at me like, you know, you need. to up the dosage of the medication that. I'm not even on, and uh I'll wait for. the film to come out, and if you guys. want to cover it, then that's fine. And. I'll remind your audience when when the. first cut of Moment of Contact dropped, people were looking at me like I mean, people that I was really close to. I. mean, I had a reputation of doing the.

phenomenon, right? I interviewing high. level intelligence officials. I was the. only one to get to Harry Reid on camera. before he was diagnosed with cancer. like, you know, that was I I had a level. of access that I never had before and. and success that I'd never really had. before. That film really transcended the. UFO community into a much broader, more. mainstream audience, which was one of my. objectives. And so I kind of. >> that was a that was a top 10 doc when it. came out, I believe. >> Yeah. No, it was number three in all. genres, right? Number two or number.

three? >> In all genres. >> In all genres. Yeah. >> Wasn't Veno supposed to be? >> Yes. So, so you looked into it and you. said, "Oh, I got to go.". >> I looked into it for years and I filmed. and I cut it all out. >> You said, "I need to do a whole. >> I need more." I didn't I said, "We need. to find the crash witness. We need to. find more of this witness. We need to d. >> Thank goodness." Yeah. And I was like, and my counterparts in Brazil were. devastated when they found out. Absolutely dev. Remember the work we'd. done already. >> And I said, "Marco,

sit tight. I promise you we're going to. go back to the drawing board. We're. going to do just this film needs an. entire dedication to just this this case. needs to be a film on its own and we. need to go back and do more you know. research and we've been investigating. So the film dropped at a time when we. hadn't had congressional hearings. We. hadn't had David Grush talk about. >> this is 23 when it dropped. >> No, I dropped this in uh 2022. >> Okay.

>> Yeah. I can't remember the exact date. I. I'm sorry, but I dropped it in 2022, >> which is an eternity in this field. >> And we had the first congressional. hearings either earlier that year, but. then no mention of crash retrieval. It. was Andre Carson, Representative Andre. Carson put this on. There were no like. witnesses in the audience. It was like. really sterile and but it was still, you. know, a hearing and then but we hadn't. had David Grush. we hadn't had all these. crash retrieval allegations, you know, bodies, you know, and I remember when I.

was not even done with the case, I mean. the film yet, Lou Alzando was contacting. me and he was like, "I need a copy." I. was like, "Well, Lou, it's not done yet. I don't care. I need a copy. I need it. now." I was like, "Okay." I was telling. my partner, Boris, hey, can you do an. export with a with a security, you know? And um he's like, "Yeah, you know what's. going on?" I was like, "I don't know. Apparently, it's really urgent. He goes, "You have no idea who's watching this. right now." And what he was doing was he. was trying to demonstrate the Americans.

involvement. So, he was particularly. interested in the second half of the. film just so he can show various people. like, "Hey, this is real. This is. serious. This is happening. Look at this. case in particular." Not that he was. basing everything on that one particular. case, but but he was showing that case. And then, little did I know there was a. build to that huge congressional hearing. with David Crush. I mean, that was a. pivotal moment. Y, >> you know, and I. >> I had people telling me like, you're. really going to jeopardize the. reputation that you've spent so long, you know, putting together and your.

access to tell folks and now you're. going to report on this alleged crash. and these live aliens walking through. the town. Like, dude, really? And I. said, man, I'm telling you, I've been. I've been going there for years. I've. been knocking on doors. I've been. meeting with the firsthand witnesses. I'm telling you, there's something to. this. Just hear me out, you know. And um and I. put my neck out and I dropped that film. and um. I would say it did moderately well and. it was brought up on a number of. occasions and Joe Rogan had had me on.

for the program and I know we sent this. other film out for him but he didn't. watch it because he felt the same way I. did. This is as if anybody else. would. And then a couple people on his. show, they were like. James Fox's new film, like you know, and. I I was watching it happen because. people were like, Joe, you know, they're. talking about your movie on Joe Rogan. And it was like one and then another. person brought it up. Then there was. like a little I another little mention. and then a couple weeks go by and I'm in.

workout class. Bunch of middle-aged. dudes getting together older than. middle-aged and uh we all just get. together with the dudes only class doing. exercise [laughter]. whatever. Yeah. Just you know we have. fun. and we put music on and we work out. really hard and we all have a good laugh. and you know and uh every now and again. I'll check my phone cuz sometimes like. my son's got an issue at school or. something and I check my phone and it's. Rogan and he's like he's like bro oh my.

god I just watched Moment of Contact. Holy Like that. I was like oh. thanks so much. I'm I'm really glad you. liked it. He goes he goes uh you want to. come on my podcast next week? And I was. like does the pope is the Pope Catholic? [laughter] And he puts LOL. like he was. really funny and um so that really kind. of catapulted it and then of course you. know you know the congressional hearings. and all that stuff started happening and. it all started going down and I remember. when I was watching the congressional. one of the first times that my son. wanted to go play with me and I was I.

sat there in this chair and I was. watching it live cuz I couldn't be there. from my phone and I just had tears. flowing down my face just constant flow. like a waterfall all the whole time. watching it going all the ridicule all. the laughter after all being made fun of. and now this is starting to come out and. I can't tell you what that felt like for. me. someone who's just been ridiculed. and laughed at. And that's why it's like. today I'm getting heckled and people are. complaining about the, you know, there's. no photographic evidence and it's. You know, it's like, okay, so.

what are you doing? Are you going to. Brazil four times in the last 12 months? Are you knocking on doors? Are you. meeting with neurologist neurosurgeons. and forensic pathologists and all these. different, you know, firsthand. witnesses, tracking down military? Like, what are you doing? Like I understand. you don't think that I want the. photographic evidence. You don't think. that I'm going after that with. everything in my might. I'm going on. every big podcast across Brazil. We have. the biggest. We're getting mentioned. right now on the biggest platforms in.

all of Brazil. The events we just did at. the National Press Club and the and the. film and the italoo's testimony is. exploding across Brazil right now. 23. million followers, 20 million follow. It's like it's happening, right? We have. a one of the biggest platforms in all of. Brazil. They invited me on it, but I. couldn't be there cuz I was dead. I was. here to be with you and I need to go. home cuz my my kid hasn't seen me. forever and there's but but but. is going and other people part of my. team are going. So, it's exploding. across Brazil. I'd love to see, you.

know, we did we did this big event at. the National Press Club where we flew in. witnesses to to meet. We also had that. meeting I told you about earlier with a. closed door meeting with members of. Sydney members of Congress, people in. the task force and just saying, "Hey. man, you don't have to believe these. witnesses." They were very impressed. with those witnesses. Neurosurgeon, forensic pathologist, you know, it's. like, "Okay, what did you see?". >> Face to face contact. >> Anyone who watches your second Yeah. watching investigation, sorry. watch the. last stick around for the last scenes of.

your second cut because they're so. touching, but it really drives home that. the these folks are telling the truth. >> I tell you, man, like we there's people. are like, "Well, Dr. Elo, you know, in a. video statement said that, you know, he. only saw the video." I was like, "Yeah, that was us. We were going after him two. years ago because we have someone who's. been, you know, you need to talk to this. doctor." So, so we've been doing that. We follow, believe me, I follow every. lead. we've been going after and Marco. Leo, my partner, was really put boots on. the ground. I'm always helping support.

his operations when I'm back in the. States and uh he gets he gets finally an. interview just a meeting with Dr. Italo. and it was on a Zoom call. We'd heard. that he'd seen the video and so that's. what we're going after. Who showed you. the video? Where's the video today? like. that. That was my my sole purpose in. life during that meeting on Zoom was and. he and he confesses that he did see the. video and we found out the name of the. person that shot it unfortunately died. of a heart attack, but that person had a.

widow. He had a a mistress who had a a. child with that mistress. We befriended. them. We prevented the window widow. We're digging through his her deceased. husband's affairs in his office. Brought. his computer home. Like people have no. idea like what we're doing behind the. scenes. There's other operations. happening right now that I can't even. talk about, but I have a laser-like. focus. Now, after that meeting, Italo, I. didn't think to even ask him if he saw. the creature. I didn't. >> Well, but take us back to 96 first. >> I will just wrap this up real quick. And. Dr. Italo said,

>> "Yeah, I saw the creature." And then he. sat down very briefly with my partner. and he said, "I didn't see the he was. at, did you see the bean?" He goes, "No." But then he had a heart attack and. he had, you know, cancer health issues. And that's when he decided a year later, I'm going full monty. And it went out. But yeah, let's back up. >> So, what is it? January 96. If I. remember, there's a farmer and his wife. see a cigar- shaped, school bus shaped. object floating over their field. >> Uh, Enrico and Orina Defas.

>> Yes. Defas. And um, so that happens and. then we get. >> Very believable. >> Very And then there's Carlos Duza, right? >> Carlos Duza and a new witness, Fabio. Fabio Forado. Oh, right. >> That we just got and for the first time. ever, we got Google Maps. Now, you don't. know how things are going to line up. >> Google Maps like that's that's [snorts]. impressive because it was like, well, this person, where do they live? Well, where did these guys and where does, you. know, Ardino and where did Carlos say? And for the first time ever in this new.

cut, we like we got Google Maps and we. were like, oh my god, >> boom, boom, boom. Right here. Like it's. right there. >> It So, I get goosebumps cuz and the same. thing for I mean, yeah, I did the drone. shots and I would get locations for. different various interviews. Oh, you. saw the blockade here. You're the the. the media that had the blockade. Okay, it was here. The girls had the encounter. here. That makes perfectly good sense. why they'd had the blockade. Three. blocks away. Yep. Just a couple blocks. away. And then the capture, guess what?

Just a couple blocks away. Then the. family of doctors that we interviewed, we got a full aerial view for the with. the drone just a few blocks away. The. family that night saw an operation of a. disc flying slow and low over the area. This is the first time you put it. together. Like, holy was this an. extraterrestrial rescue operation? Like, I'm sorry. I know this is really hard to. swallow, but if the account should be. believed, that's exactly what it was.

And we actually have a footage of a disc. taken at night. It's one of the best. night disc foot footage. It's in the. documentary. And we we we repackaged it. cuz I was like, well, hold on a second. That was shot here. How far away is. that? 2 months after 1996. Oh, wow. Could be connected. Don't know. But um. this family describing this this disc. flying, they were like, I was looking. for something. I said, how do you know I. was looking for something? the whole. family like because it was super slow. and it was going to the end, stopping,

coming back, going in, stopping. I'm like, "Wow, if that's true, that was. a extraterrestrial search and rescue. operation." And guess what? It was right. over where the girls saw the beam. It's. exact. If it was going to be looking for. anything, that's the spot where it would. be looking. >> So, take us through Duza, the girls, the. blockade, and then the capture. >> Yes. So January 1996, there are sightings of a cylindrical. shaped object. Like people described it. as a big school bus or like a cigar.

shaped and it it was like um a metallic. kind of polished aluminum whatever and. uh had no didn't make any very little to. no sound at all. And it didn't have any. visible means of propulsion. Uh almost all the witnesses described it. had a gash in the back of it. one guy uh. the new witness for um Fabio Forado he. said that it was in he clearly was in. trouble and it was making some kind of. weird noise. It seemed to be in trouble. but he looked at it from above so he.

didn't see the gash. Um but they they. see this thing in distress. They're all. expecting it to crash. Carlos Susza who's an ultralight pilot. and a geography teacher is driving up to. the north from Sao Paulo going up to uh. Theres Garsonius I believe this was in. the state of Minister Ice and and uh. very early in the morning he's going to. go meet his buddies going to go flying. ultral lights early in the morning 5:00. or something and uh he's driving on. Fernando Diaz I think it was freeway and.

he sees uh just outside Varenia this. farm called the Molini farm he sees. scar-shaped object to he's like, "What. the hell is that?" Like, "It's. struggling." He's like, "Whatever it is, it's it's barely staying in the sky. Like, it's coming looks like it's coming. down.". He thought maybe this is some sort of. experimental military thing or maybe. it's a blimp or like what the hell? And. then it staggers and then it just goes. boom and hits this field in this goes.

off the freeway, drives up this dirt. road, gets to the impact site. He's. like, "Oh my god, whoever's, you know, flying this thing, they're they need. help." That's what he was thinking. >> He's a pilot. >> Yeah. He gets out of the car and he he. said, "James, the first thing I noticed, which I wasn't expecting, is normally. with a plane crash, you'd smell like. kerosene or, you know, uh uh jet A fuel. or whatever, you know, that that's the. kind of anticipated smell you'd get from. a from a plane crash." He goes, "This.

wasn't like that. This was like ammonia. and and like really strong rotten eggs. or something. He goes, "James, it was so. strong. My eyes were watering. I had. grabbed my shirt and I pulled my shirt. over my mouth and my nose like Jesus. Christ, what the hell?" And he's looking. around. He's looking at it and and he. picks up a piece. What he said was like. just like aluminum looking. And he, you. know, shaped kind of like this. And he. picks it up and he goes, "James, it was. light as a feather. It was like barely. feel it in my hands." And.

um just when that was happening, he was. going to put it in his pocket. The. military trucks came in from the. opposite direction, but he said he. crumpled it and then when he released. it, it went right back in its shape, which reminds me very much of Roswell. >> Yes. >> Now, >> so so this happens. He gets threatened. at gunpoint. Um he he leaves terrified, like really threatened. Seriously. threatened. I mean, those guys. threatened everybody. everybody that we. interviewed, either the blockade or even. the the media for asking questions. You.

ask one more question, you're going to. jail. You know, this is a national. security issue. Jose said that across. the board to everybody. He leaves, he's. totally freaked out. At the time, he was. still thinking like some sort of. experiment. He saw something he. shouldn't have seen, obviously, but but. he was he wasn't thinking. extraterrestrial. He he just wasn't. Um. he stops at a gas station a few miles. down the road just to comp get a coffee. He goes in, he orders a coffee and then. in this black kind of dark blue or. whatever car pulls up. Two men in suits.

get out, tall suits and um they knew his. name. They knew where he lived. They. knew his wife's name. All this stuff. You didn't see what you saw. You talk. about this. You're going to have some. serious problems with your life. Like D. and threatened him and then left. And. one of the witnesses at the gas station. apparently said, "You can't let those. people talk to you like that. you need. to get their license plate number and. here take this piece of paper and go get. their license plate number and report. them. He goes out there and there's no. license plate on the car and it's gone.

>> Mhm. >> So. he hears he starts hearing reports in. the media about these girls saw this. strange creature and that's when he was. like maybe it is connected to what. I saw this UFO crash like oh my god. maybe it was not of this earth. So he. meets with a researcher named Cladio. Kovo. Cladio Kovio gives one on camera. statement from him then he vanishes for. 26 years and that was one of the things. when I was talking to my partner Marco. Leal co-producer uh I said we we got to.

find Carlos and they did we did. ultimately did find him after 26 years. and I I don't know if how long how long. it took him to finally meet with me in. Sa Paulo and then I said would you be. willing to go on camera out to this back. to the site for the first time in 20. whatever it was 26 years and Um, and he's like, "Yeah, yeah, I'll do. that. I'll come with you guys.". >> Convincing. >> Oh, no. Well, we massaged the friendship. for a while. Oh, hell yes. Are you. kidding me? The guy didn't have there. was nothing to gain and everything to.

lose. But Marco de developed a. friendship. We slowly just like, "Hey, we're taking this investigation. seriously. We really want to talk to. you." I'd have to talk to Marco, but it. was months and months and months. And. then I came there in 2021. And that's. when I said, "Hey, maybe you'll come. meet us in South Pal. We stayed at a. hotel in Sello. He met with us. We. talked, got to know each other a little. bit. And then I asked him, "Hey, we. really love to take you out to the side. to the site." And we did. So anyway, fast forward uh January 20th, which was.

like a almost a full week later, and. these girls, Katya, Valkyia, and Lilani, ages 14, 16, and 21, were walking. through, taking a shortcut, walking. through this field. It was like 3:20 in. the afternoon. January 20th is hot. It's. that's a summertime. Yep. >> Really hot day. And uh they said that. [clears throat]. I was just at the cinder block wall. They said that there was some graffiti. on the cinder block wall in this field.

they were going through and that that. kind of caught their eye. They're. looking at this graffiti and then they. look they were like, "That a statue?". Like what the hell is that? And there. was like this creature like kind of. slumped over and just looking I mean not. really moving just kind of sitting there. up against the wall. The wall was here. and one of. >> And they're right here right there. >> Right there 10 ft away maybe 8 ft away. And all of a sudden I think Liliana. who's 16 like screams like oh my god.

what is that thing? and it turns and it. looks at them, locks eyes. and there's communication with the eyes. Liliana is 16. She's got a younger. sister, Varia. She grabs her younger. sister. I mean, there she said there was. communication. This thing was stressed. It was terrified. It was suffering. It. was like really wanting help. But they. were thought it might be the devil. It. had red eyes. Like, you know, it was. oily and suffering and the heat and.

really suffering. This thing was. suffering. Grabs her younger sister. Valkyia, leaves Katya who's 21. They. hight tail it out of there. She gets I. don't know how far, 100 ft, 150 ft. She's like, "Shit, we left Katya.". So she's like, "You stay here, Vulcaria." And she left her 14-year-old. sister there. And she ran back. And. Katya had just locked eyes with this. being like. for a prolonged period. She grabs Katya, yanks her out of there.

And Katya to this day, I was just with. her a couple days ago. Katya is like, I. was going to help it because it was. saying to me, either help me or leave me. be. Like, don't hurt me. Help me or. leave me be. She's like, I wanted to. help it. And she's like, and I didn't. And I ran away from it. And then it got. captured and I feel so bad. I don't know. what happened to it. She really said. that. She's like, I think about it all. the time. So anyway, [clears throat] um. the girl's hightailing out of there and. about 5 5:30,

uh two military police officers, one by. the name of Eric Lopes, people pronounce. his name differently. Lis Lopes L O P E. S. [clears throat] They're on patrol for. something unusual. I don't think they said an ET is roaming. around, but it was some definitely some. kind of strange creature, some whatever. just on the patrol and his friend and. fellow police officer, military police. officer, Marco Shares, was off that.

night, but he called him up and he said, "Hey, I got this crazy like, you know, assignment man. I'm supposed to be. looking, you know, oh, you want to come. with me? Sure." Gets in the car and. three blocks, two or three blocks away. from where the girls had seen it, couple. hours later, that creature goes right. across the road in front of him, screeches the brakes. Marco Shares. without a moment's hesitation leaps out. the back of the car and he grabs it with. his bare hands and puts it in the car. and they take it to they take it to Bon.

Bon part I just learned that the exact. hotel I'm sorry I can't remember the. name of the hospital the first one. apparently some person came out some. doctor came out and took a look at the. creature was like get that thing out of. here I don't know what that thing is and. so they go to regional hospital yes they. drop it off at regional hospital and. then. >> Marco now there's speculation because. the autopsy report Marco got like. scratch under his arm. They weren't sure. if it was a previous existing abscess. and that maybe the bacteria that killed. him from the creature came from his nail.

or came from the whatever open cut or. that he got scratched by the nail of the. in the process of it wasn't aggressive. It didn't put up hardly any bit of a. fight, but he got this infection. He was. hospitalized within a week or two and he. was dead within a little 3 weeks. something like that. Um, and we've interviewed his sister. We. interviewed just recently in the new cut. of Moment of Contact, New Revelations of. Alien Encounters. It's the first time. I've ever really put that kind of. blatant thing in a title, but but it.

really is alien in the sense that, you. know, we've got now this neurosurgeon. describing facetoface contact all the. girls with a creature that was alien to. them and alien to everything they'd ever. seen. But we have the two forensic. pathologists, one that did the autopsy. and then the other one, Dr. Janini who's. owned the company IP IPD labs that did. the analysis on the tissue samples and. he's like he's like it's a rare bacteria. on earth but this had evolved in a way. that that was super resilient to any.

kind of back um antibiotics or any kind. of treatment. He goes, "I've never seen. it behave in that fashion anywhere on. Earth and I've done over 50,000. autopsies my business that bacteria.". And he says it on the record like, you. know, and then he gives a statement. which you can provide your your audience. with. Um, so that's pretty. unprecedented, you know. And then, um, well, I don't know if you want to go. into we got the capture and then and.

then now for the first time um because. we didn't really know what had happened. to the creature that was dropped off and. there were multiple cap at least two and. now we're thinking there's possibly more. because more reports coming in, more. details. We got the chief of police, uh, Pedro Aguiar who got his testimony for. the first time ever. He and he died just. months later. Thank God we got that. >> and we're working with his family. >> Um. >> and he he didn't testify in the first. cut, did he? >> Oh, no, no, no, no, no. He kept he was.

like a bar soap in the bathtub. Right. He was like, cuz we had heard that we. had heard that he had a photograph. >> and that's why we were going after him. cuz I was going after honestly mate like. I was going after I had enough in my. opinion there was enough credible. firsthand eyewitness testimony in the. first cut for me to go all right now the. only thing missing is that photograph or. that video piece. So that's what I was. that's what I I had a laser like I still. do. But that led us to a bunch of. people, a whole bunch of people. Some of. which I still need to remain nameless. because it's ongoing and I don't want,

you know, the military to get there. before I do. So, I'm having to be kind. of somewhat secretive. But I can assure. your audience there's no one on the. planet that wants that more than I do. Trust me. And if I sat there and. explained to you the the the the lengths. that I'm going to, that our team is. going to, Eleni Cross, by the way, is a. new producer on the new cut. I throw a. shout out to her cuz she's amazing. Um, I'm working with someone who's actually. completely bilingual now. With Marco, I. love him to death, but his his English. is not, you know, so it's really. frustrating, but now I'm getting crystal.

clear communication with all the people. It's like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. Um, but we we were we were led to him to. the chief of police by photographic. evidence and then, as it turns out, we. find out that he too participated in the. event and saw the creature. So like more. and more static comes out and we're now. starting to think that the creature that. Dr. Echelo, the neurosurgeon at regional. hospital saw was the first capture. because he saw it during the morning of. the 20th and there was the capture by. the um two there was um fire department.

and when you're in the fire department. or the police department you're with the. military. It's all connected to the. military. And so we now have details uh. of [clears throat]. um the chief of police, Pedro Aguar, both from three of his children, his. wife and his lawyer, all on camera for. the first time. And um and now we have. vivid details of what he saw that first. capture. And we think that that possibly. is the one that that the what what the.

girl saw was not the same creature what. neurosurgeon Ethlo saw because I was. like, "Well, wait a minute. when were. you at the hospital? He was like, I saw. that thing in the late morning. Well, that capture happened in the morning and. that was also alive. So, now we're. >> They're both alive, right? >> They're both alive. Yeah. Yeah, they're. both alive. So, now we're thinking, but. there's also reports of of a dead one. We got the guy at Regional Hospital that. did the X-rays that wanted to be. anonymous. Marco went after him for. five, six years when he was still. working at the hospital.

>> No, no, no. It was just No, no. Confirmed. Yeah. Yeah. I I participate. I took X-rays of it. It was in a bag, blah blah blah. >> But we finally got him to go on the. record. Thank God. And he's vanished. ever since then. And then we got. military act. So we knew. >> Didn't they steal his or grab or Yeah. They took all of it. >> All of it. He's the [snorts] first time. in history. And they were like, "Thank. you very much. Shut your pie hole.". >> Yeah. So, uh, but anyway, sorry I'm. rambling cuz there's so many little bits. details that I'm learning. But I'm. thinking now that we have. >> that first morning capture on the 20th.

that took place with the firemen. Now we. have vivid details of that for the first. time as of three days ago that that's. probably the ET that Italo saw. Now were. they different um races or species. slightly different variations of they. all have the big teardropshaped head or. are they like chameleons? Can they. change when they're suffering? Do they. smell when they're scared and suffering. in the hot heat? Maybe they excrete. I I. really don't know. It's all speculation, right? >> Can you describe like what what the. creatures look like? Cuz these were. typical grays.

>> Mm- Yeah. So, uh, what the girls came. within a few steps of in broad daylight, all three of them, uh, was a, um, about. 3 and 1/2 ft tall, uh, creature, spindly. arms, spindly legs. Some people say like. it had like toes like this with another. one that maybe came out the side for. stability, but maybe in unless they're. walking. Um, and it had a big teardrop. shaped red eyes, big head, tiny mouth,

slit for a nose. Um, no no no no no real. ears to speak of. And and the girls. described it as like an organ, like. almost like a heart, like the skin was. like a heart, like oily, excuse me, like. that, but like no hair. >> The oiliness is the strangest detail to. me. >> Yeah. Well, I wonder like they all said. it was suffering in the hot. It was a. really hot day in the in the summer, all. sunshine. It was suffering, cowering, frayed. Did it exude that? Did it change. color? I don't know. >> One one of your witnesses was made a.

really interesting statement about that. that I hadn't considered that maybe. >> he said it looked like latex or silicon. >> Yeah. >> So maybe it was a a suit of some kind. No, it definitely was a scam because I. cuz we interviewed military acts who. who' seen it in the in the hospital. That one was dead and that was at. Humanitas Hospital. There are other um. we have names of other doctors at. Humanitas that are aware of of of it and. are not according to my context. I'm.

really in with the medical community. now. I'm like I mean we just I just flew. them to to DC. I mean we're like family. now. We go to the local restaurants. We. hang out with all these, you know, top. neurologists and forensic pathologists. and and uh so and they know what's going. on, believe me. And I'm knocking on. their doors and. >> and uh I think it's. >> I think u they're seeing that Dr. Elo, who by the way has everything to lose.

and nothing to gain. And if he's lying. >> and he was in the room with this thing. >> face to face contact for 3 or 4 minutes. with a live being of nonhuman. intelligence communication through the. eyes limited but he said that despite. being in captivity it had control of the. room. His testimony is it's so riveting. and. he said that he you know I was like all. right well let's just say he wasn't. ready to fully the fact that he admitted. seeing the video a year or so earlier.

was incredible. He wasn't ready to come. out. I mean the implications of a. neurosurgeon who runs the department at. this at this are significant for a. number of reasons. >> and Virginia is a military town. >> Yeah. And his like okay you just have to. look for a motive right? He's not selling a book. He's not. selling a dock. He's not selling his. story. He would have to be lying because. I'm friends with all of them now. His. wife. He'd have to be lying to his wife.

He has to be lying to his kids, both his daughter and his son who just. became a father a couple days ago. his. co-workers, his colleagues of 45 years. in the medical community, cardiologists, neurosurgeons, forensic pathologists, lying to all of them. In fact, I have a. video that I'd like to show for you cuz. I brought the doctors together just a. few weeks ago. First time the known. doctors, the ones known involved with.

the case, um Dr. Cesario, who worked on. the military police officer, Marco Shu, before he died, he's like, "I threw the. kitchen sink in a man. never seen. bacteria not respond to any of the. antibiotics we gave him. It's like it. just doesn't happen. I. >> I confirmed it independently. They shut. down that hospital for a couple days. >> That was another that was Yeah, that was. that's where they did the X-rays. Yeah. But so we got Dr. Cesario. We got Dr. Italo, the neurosurgeon. Dr. Cesario, I. think, is a cardiologist. Dr. um Dr. Janini, who founded IPD labs, who.

studied the tissue samples, who said. that he's never seen a variant of this. bacteria in his life. If you give a. statement on that, you can feature that. Then the guy that did the autopsy of the. deceased male brought them all together. for the first time. How long have you. known to love? How long have you known? Just like 35 years, 45 years. This is. like, do you believe him? And they're all just. like, yeah, why? Where's the motive? He's not asking for a dime. He's lying. to the whole community. He's still doing.

brain surgery at the hospital. all of. his staff, his wife, his daughter, his. son, his co-workers, his colleagues, not. asking for a dime, not selling anything. >> The most compelling, >> what's his motive? And if it's true, and. I'm pretty damn convinced it is, cuz it. lines up with everything. If it's true, it's the most significant development in. the history of the phenomenon. We've. never had it before where we've had. face-to-face contact with a captured. alien. No testimony, particularly of his.

stature. It doesn't exist. You don't. It's like people that poo poo this case. It's like if you look into it, there's. never been this much firsthand. eyewitness testimony in the history of. any UFO crash cases ever before. >> Didn't Dr. hear it in his mind? Didn't. it communicate? He had he said he said. there's a lot to learn from the eyes of. that being that it had the most. tranquil, peaceful, compassionate, non-judgmental stare that he's ever seen.

from anything. And then he kept. describing it as a higher level of. intelligence. He also revealed some. details because I really went through it. before we did this event at the National. Press Club um which you guys can watch. on uh I think it's NewsNation covered it. live. It's out there for free. you can. just watch it on YouTube, whatever. Um, but I really hammered him hard on cuz I. wanted to get every possible detail I. could in the short period of time at the. National Press Club. >> And he was like, "Yeah, the bean my. first time I looked at it cuz he was.

like, he goes, well, first of all, my. partner Marcos Vinesis did a little. procedure. I think it was like a suture, whatever, a little stitch or something.". And he goes, "I was in there for an. unrelated issue in the hospital." And my. partner, Marcos Venice's, fellow. neurosurgeon, grabbed me. And normally, he goes, "Normally, when he grabs me in. the hallway, it's like, "Someone's. dying. I need your help immediately." He. goes, "It was urgent." Grabs him and. takes him into the ICU. And there was a. makeshift ICU with like a like a.

makeshift curtain kind of thing. And. then before that, he's got a video that. he's showing him on this screen. of some procedure he just did. And he's. like, "What the hell am I looking at? What is that? And he described maybe. children get this really rare thing. where their heads can really swell up. and weird deform deformities, whatever. He's looking at he goes, "Yeah, man. It. doesn't look like it's from her. What. the hell is that?" And the doctor, Marcos Vines, goes, "It's right there.".

So he draws the curtain or goes around. the other side and he goes, I said, "How. long was it before you knew it wasn't of. this earth non-human?" He goes, "The. second I looked at it, I was like, "Holy. shit." Like, and he looked at it and he. goes, "My medical profession was. initially like, okay, I look at a. patient. Is it in distress? Is it. breathing? Is it, you know, and he did a. quick evaluation.

and he was like determined that like it. was it was okay, it was stable, whatever." is looking at it and then the. creature. looks out the window and it was a blue. sky. and looked out the window like longingly. like it wanted to be out there and then. it looked back him in the eyes and. that's when he said he got. the real communication that happened. What he was no longer looking at as a. patient, he was looking at it as as an. entity as a high higher level advanced. intelligence entity. And he said it just.

had like like it was looking at him as. though he was a child. Do you know what. I mean? And here we got a neurosurgeon. who's like running the whole department, operates on people's brains, plays piano. like Mozart, and he goes, "It was. looking to me almost like a child, not. condescendingly, but like it was so. advanced, so much hired like an angel.". So he described it as an angel. >> He did. And um and I just say to people. out there, it's like, you know, you have. to look. First of all, we tracked him. down and we we wore him down and then he.

had a heart attack and he was living. lying in the ICU staring at the ceiling. after we had already confronted him on. the video cuz that's what I was I was. after the video. And he um he's like, "If I if I come through this, I'm I'm. not cuz Marcos Venice died of a heart. attack in 2018." He goes, "I'm not going. to let the story to the grave. The. younger generation needs to know this. happened and I'm a firsthand witness. And so we went back at we went back as I. do in January of 2020. Was that 2025 or.

January 2025? Was that a year ago? Yeah. We went back and that's when we we. interviewed the two forensic. pathologists and we've been trying to. get a hold of Italo cuz we knew like the. video, you know, didn't know that he had. a heart attack. Didn't know that he had. like prostate cancer and surgery and all. this other stuff. And um and we got the. other and he would respond and then he. would disappear and it was like you know. I jokingly said it was like grabbing a. bar of soap in the bathtub because he. was like poo poo poo you know like ah he. was just there and then Dr. Armando.

credit to you mate who who did the. autopsy on the deceased military officer. and provided the tissue samples to Dr. Janini. He's like I was like yeah you. know and while we're here we really want. to talk to Dr. eat and he keeps like. kind of responding then disappearing. like he wants to or he seems conflicted. like. and then he was oh yeah and right there. in the middle of the interview just. walking and you know talking and he's. like tomorrow morning go to the hospital.

and he wants to meet you on the backside. 10:00 time it was backside of the. hospital okay what's he going to you. know we were like got all the. camera crew ready and that's when he. stuck us through maternity ward down the. corridors through the hospital. All. cameras rolling. Put on some gear. I'm. like, "What's happening? Why am I. putting this gear on? Takes us into the. ICU." That's where it happened. >> In that room. >> In that room. >> Oh my goodness. >> All on film. We captured it as it. happened. And I honestly I don't even.

think he was prepared to go full monty. until like that the morning of. And like. our partner Alini uh production partner, she's been amazing. and she's got a. really So does Marco, but she has a. really um uh a wonderful non-threatening. presence about her. You just look her in. the eyes and you just go, "Okay, I'm in. I'm in good hands here." You know, and I. know that he grabbed her hand and he and. she was looking at me like, "Okay, I'm. just, you know, here I go.".

[clears throat] Took us through various. corridors. Then all of a sudden, I'm. putting on medical, you know, mask and. what am I doing? Like I don't. Everything's happening so quickly. We. were all just takes us into the ICU and. it was like this is where the video. No, this is where the creature I saw. Huh? I. was like, it all came out and then the. staff of the managers and everything. came and started screaming at him and he. was like, "Fuck, I think I might have. just lost my job." [laughter] And it was. like, "Oh my god, I'm just trying to. process what just happened. Holy.

We have a neurosurgeon. who just confessed. that he had direct contact with one of. the beings in captivity for 3 or 4. minutes in that bed right there. Do you. know what I mean? >> Yep. I don't think he was prepared for. how emotional he was going to get. >> So then we get kicked out like he's like. I think I might have just lost my job. We get we go out and we're like well. let's carry on this conversation. Where. are we going to go? We walk out and. we're on the sidewalk now. How about. this cafe? Boom. Walk into a cafe. and.

we take over the cafe. We all set up. setup shop and I was trying to get more. out of him and and I was like I'm just. trying to process. We all were at one. point I think it was David. No, I don't. know who maybe it was me. Grabbed a. camera. I think I I did I actually. grabbed the camera from Dave West my DP. and I just panned it across cuz I was. like I need to see everybody's faces. right now cuz this is incredible. And. you look look carefully even the sound. guy who was somewhat skeptical when he. started on this journey with us and now. he's like holy. >> Mhm. And uh and you see Marco like wipe.

his forehead. We're all processing. And. um. and then I said to him, "What does it. feel like after 29 years to come to talk. about this?". And he was like, "I I feel like I want. to cry." And he started to cry. And then. the camera turned on me. [sighs and gasps]. and I was trying to talk, but the words weren't coming out. And I. really didn't want to like I I like I. didn't want to cry cuz I you know what I. like you want to keep it together and.

stay composed and but I couldn't talk. Like I was like. I wouldn't be doing this for all these. years. All the laughter, all the. ridicule, all the hecklers if I didn't. really believe this. Like life is too. short. >> You know what I mean? >> It was the most part my sister died. Like life's too short for. >> And I'm not saying like you have to. believe this case. Don't don't believe. it. Check it out. Listen to the. testimony. If it's true,

and I'm putting my career on the line. here, but if it's true, this is the. case. It's going to prove it once and. for all. >> Remember Carlos's reaction when you took. him to the scene? How emotional he got. >> Oh my god. >> You can't fake that. >> You don't need Leon Leonardo DiCaprio or. Brad Pitt anymore. It's like, no. >> And then I get choked up. And then it's. like I've known this doctor. I mean, we. met on the phone. He jokingly calls me, "Oh my god." Because when he confessed. to seeing the video, he was I was like, "Oh my god." Where's the video? >> Yeah. So, well, we could talk about that.

in a minute. >> Okay. >> Um, [snorts]. uh, you know, he hugs me right there on. camera and he holds me like holding my. hands like really like we bonded right. there in that moment. Like, can you. imagine the weight off his shoulders. like and the risk like he's got. everything to lose. And again, I'll tell. your audience like this guy is not. selling anything. He hasn't asked for a. dime for his story. He's still doing. brain surgery. He's like, "I'll take a. public lie detector test tomorrow with. my hand in a Bible. Whatever you want.".

I saw this thing and the younger. generation need to know they're real. That coffee shop conversation was the. light. Unbelievable. >> How do you you know? So again, I. understand the skepticism and I know the. the the the need for videotape, photographic evidence. There's nobody in. the world trying harder than I am. Okay? I promise you that. And I can tell you. that the military is is following me, following this case. No question about. it. We're just trying to get to the. people first. And I have a proton email,

which I'd actually like to provide to. you because I'm telling you any. witnesses because before people were. getting in touch with me on regular. email, and I'm thinking that's not a. good idea. I'm under surveillance. Like, so we got a proton email now. And I'll. provide that to you. Maybe flash it on. the screen. people can reach out to me. because we're looking for folks on the. American side. We're looking for. videotaped evidence. We've announced a. very large reward for said evidence. I've done it on huge podcasts all across. Brazil. We're doing more podcasts right. now, TV episodes. And we're stronger.

together and courage is contagious. And. I've been saying that to people. We're. stronger together and courage is. contagious. And and believe me, there. are other doctors and there are people. that are watching very carefully what's. happening right now. Are there any. videos you want to show us? We have. about 15, maybe 20 before the next. break. Um, >> okay. I think this is important. Sorry, I'm wipe my nose here. Um, this this is. this is just a couple weeks ago. I. happened to be with Amomar from Yes. Theory. His team actually filmed this.

And [clears throat] um in Vin, Brazil, and we're at Dr. Armando's house, who. was the guy that did the autopsy on the. deceased military officer. And it was. the first time in history we brought all. the known doctors together. And so I. just wanted you to share this little. video and I'll play it for you. >> Question. I'd like to volume. >> I'd like to ask Janini how long. >> Oh, it's okay. I don't need to hear it. Yeah. >> And I thought we had subtitles, boys. No. Yeah, there we go. >> It's all in English. Oh, yeah. Some of. it's not. [laughter]. >> So, basically, hold.

on. >> And where did you shoot this one? >> I shot this at house in Bar, Brazil just. a few weeks ago. That's Dr. Janini who. studied the tissue samples analysis. forensic pathologist. Guy to the right. is Dr. [clears throat] did the autopsy. And then Dr. Eo right there [laughter]. grabbing his arm. He um he had face to. face contact with a living entity at. Regional Hospital on January 20th, 1996.

>> And I'm asking these guys, how long you. known him? Do you guys believe him? >> And everyone's like, I've known him 45. years. I've known him 35 years. He's. still doing brain surgery. like, >> you know, I just think it's important. that they've got their wives there. All. their wives are there. Their children. are there. Like. >> this is like real. You know what I mean? Like these guys. I I just can't imagine why. how he would benefit from I I just I'm. at a loss. >> Yeah. Right there. Yeah. So that's and.

anyway, I don't have to go through all. of these, but I want you to um if you if. you're seeing this or not, but we don't. need to watch this, but. >> whatever you play, we'll see. >> Yeah. So this is I'll just describe. this. This is uh I took video statements. from um firsthand witnesses, children, wives. That's one of the sons of a. firsthand witness that was in military. police. This is his daughter. This is. his wife. all saying, "Yeah, my husband.

was a firsthand witness. He saw the. creature." And it's important because he. said he was a firsthand witness. His. name is Pedro Aguiar. He was the former. chief of police and he's the one that. participated in our film and then died. >> Now, he told us on film that he was the. first to he did see the creature. He did. participate in the event, but he didn't. go into any specifics. But it's one. thing to like, you know, go on camera. and say that, but then when he tells his. wife and he tells his children, "Yeah, man. This happened. This is real. I.

participated." And then we talk to his. lawyer, it just changes everything. And. this is the actual site. So on the other side, I'll I might. actually play this kind of fun. So you. know, um the uh cinder block wall where. the girls came within 8 to 10 feet of. that creature in broad daylight. Y. >> so on the other side of that wall just. like that far away is a mechanic shop. So we went over to the mechanic shop and.

we actually got one of the one of the. witnesses who was on the other side of. the wall while the ET was there and he. talked about like he got there right. after the girls had seen it and saw the. imprint where it was. He smelled the. smell like the sulfur. Everyone. >> I smelled it. He smelled it. Yeah. >> There he is right there in the blue. shirt. >> Exact location saw the creature. And. this guy's a mechanic. >> That's a cinder block wall. And right on. the other side of that wall was the. mechanic shop. He was there that day. Isn't that crazy? Unbelievable. And he's like, "Oh yeah, I walked right.

over here. I saw the thing on the. ground. I smelled it. I I missed it." So. he was working on a car when the girls. were looking at an ET like right there, you know? It's so crazy, you know. Anyway, there's a bunch of other. statements that So, we. I had uh Lilani Valkyia and um Katya. applied for visas. We had military acts. who drove the creature, all of his.

military records, all of his photographs. of the truck that he was in in the. operation. driving the creature. We had Marta, the. sister of the deceased military officer. We had um. >> What about Marco's wife, the the officer. who died? It was Marco, right? >> Yeah. Well, I'll get to that one second. We we we we um I hired an immigration. lawyer. They were going to come. The. military guy who drove the bloody. creature was going to come. And he goes, "Look, I'll meet with members of. Congress behind the scenes, full.

identity, show them who I am. I drove. the creature, blah blah blah, but and. I'll also go up to the podium, but I'm. going to go up there with a mask." And I. was like, "That's Yeah, great." And I've. told the audience before I was able to. track down who that guy was. He's a. legitimate person. He's legitimate. >> I've seen all the photographs. He's I I. actually got a statement from him with. showing me all the photographs. I'll. probably be releasing that soon for. free. Um so people can see, but I'll. have to blur certain things out and. change his voice. Um. but all their visas unfortunately got.

denied. There's like six as we go. through all the different names. But. yeah, devastating. And I even had. Congressman Burles's office working on. getting their approval. Uh, one was. approved, Katya was approved on the on. the spot. They all went together. Um, uh, Lily, let's see, Liliani was denied, Marco was denied. Uh, and then there. was, uh, Military X, Marta, and Katya. They were under additional review. So,

it was like three under two denied, three under additional review, and then. one approved. So that was a pretty good. ratio. So. >> yeah, but denied on what grounds? >> Uh, who knows, man. They don't really. get say anything. Just like, uh, ask a. couple questions. No. So anyway, but. then we get Congress in involved, immigration lawyer, and we're going back. and forth. And then after they kept waiting, too. Like I was like, could you guys where. are you guys? Like I'm doing this event. You know, I'm doing this event. Like. could you know? And then long story.

short, they waited, waited, waited, waited, waited, waited till the last. possible like towards the end of. December. In fact, I got back I got back. on Christmas day. My son's like, "What. do you get me for Christmas?" I said, "Me." And [laughter] I Yeah. And um and. uh so. God, maybe the 20th, 15th, I don't know, of December. Even the one that was. approved, all done. So, [clears throat]. uh we flew back to Brazil and I did. statements and those are some of the. statements. If you want, I provided them. to you. You guys can show the various.

statements inside a podium. The city of. Virginia with help of the mayor gave us. this official space with the Brazilian. flags. It's a great backdrop. And we. did, you know, short 90-cond statements. from the various people that had their. visas denied and other people as well. that did. And anyway, you should play. some of those for your audience. >> We'll put those in. We'll put in the. autopsy photos. But I want to know about. Eric Lope Lope. Did you ever get a hold. of him? cuz his scene in the first first. was unbel.

to shoot you guys if you didn't leave. the property. >> Well, I got a new development just a. couple days ago. Uh there was another. security guy that met with him and he. said that he was he was like, you know, I wasn't I don't think I would have shot. James, but I was. [laughter and clears throat] I was. seconds away from taking my gun out and. fire pop cuz he he did have a gun as we. suspected he did, but he was going to. shoot a couple in the sky first. >> That's what he that's what he said. But. we did get a hold of his his wife. Now. his wife. funny story. His wife is the sister of.

Marco Sharice, the deceased military. officer. >> Yes. >> Marta. >> No. Oh, Marta is the Sorry. Yeah. Marta. is Marco. Yeah. So, sorry. >> Uh, Marco Shereice, who handled the. creature and died, >> had two sisters. >> Okay. Marta and his other sister, I'm. sorry I don't remember her name, but she. married Eric Lopes after his death. because they were they were really good. friends and they'd known each other,

right? And so I contacted her through. Marta. Somehow I got her number. We went. through either Marco or somebody else. What is it going to take to get and this. is after he threatened to shoot us. What. is it going to take to get your husband. to come forward? She said, "Bring my. brother back to life.". >> Ah, >> and he'll come forward. Yeah, but we're. still working on them. We're still. working on them. Other people were. working on them. Uh the mayor sent a a. police officer around to his house a. week ago. A police officer liked to talk. to him and he didn't want to talk, but.

he he might he might he might talk. He. might at some point talk if he sees what. Dr. Italo did. He might. >> he he might he might. It's getting more. attention now than ever before. And um. yeah um again I just say that this is. you know this we've had this debate for. decades crash retrieval Roswell all this. stuff all the congressional hearings all. the allegations from top you know. aerospace engineers physicists that we. have a crash retrieval leg a legacy.

crash retrieval program um and this case. could could really settle the debate. once and for all. >> It really could. Um we'll take another. quick break. When we come back, we'll. talk about whatever you want, but I. would like to get into how suddenly the. United States Air Force shows up on this. case. >> Yeah. Yeah, for sure. >> All right, we'll be right back. >> Back with James Fox. >> Um, >> that's a nice ring, too. [laughter]. >> That is it. a big turning point for me in um moment. of contact cuz I was riveted and then we.

get to I don't know about twothirds. through and suddenly you're interviewing. someone who was a. aircraft controller. >> Oh yeah. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. >> And now the US Air Force enters the. picture. >> Yeah. >> So it seems like we've got Virginia. Compasa. and USAF as they call it USAF. >> Yeah. Did you see the uh the foyer. request that we did in 2022 and we got a. response in 2025 from the CIA?

>> Yes. And the response was. >> yeah access we can neither confirm nor. deny due to the National Security Act of. 1949. Your request is denied. It's like CIA what the hell was with CIA. said what? >> Really weird. Yes. So, I think it was 2021. when I was shooting for the whatever. time and that's when we finished uh. shooting for Moment of Contact, the.

first version of it. Um, and it's been. going on for 16 almost 17 years. My god. And uh the flight control officer. uh Marcos Feres Fis Es. came forward on a podcast. He's like, "Yeah." and he's friends with this other. flight control officer. They were. they're friends. And he [clears throat]. said, "Yeah, this, you know, on or around the. 20th of January, this USAF flight was.

coming in." I was like, "Usaf, United. States Air Force, USAF, excuse me." And um and he goes, "It. didn't have all planes coming in from. outside the country have to have. government, Brazilian government. authorization to land. This plane didn't. have that." And um he goes, I have to deny a plane without this. authorization. A high level Brazilian. military official came in the room and. said, "Let the plane land." And it. landed uh at an airport in um Campinus.

I have the name of the airport we talk. about in the movie, but um and. either [snorts] one helicopter or two. helicopters came out of it. It was. probably a C17 according to all the Air. Force people that I've talked to. Uh it. was a cargo plane. helicopter went to Brazil, came back. It. was two helicopters came to Israel. because it came back, loaded some stuff, excuse me, loaded some stuff on the. plane and bing bora is what he said.

Went back to uh America, undisclosed. location. So, we um filed a foyer for. all incoming flights from the US into. Campenis in January. I think I put like. maybe January 10th or something to the. end of the month. It was all January. >> like two weeks or something. >> Yeah. For a two three week window window. cover up our base went like a week extra. on both sides. >> And. honestly the response came so late I. forgot that we even sent the foyer and.

then in 2025 we get a response from the. CIA and that's when they you know. denied. So now we actually made this. plea at the National Press Club last. week. Was it last week? 10 days ago, whatever. Um, a a United States Air. Force colonel, uh, spoke and retired. Also, a fighter pilot had a really. dramatic encounter with UFO in 1980 over. Europe, Northern Europe. It's an. incredible story. But he uh he's like,

"Look, let me just tell you the the" and. he talked to members of Congress, too. He's like, "Let me just tell you if that. flight happened, and I suspect it did, uh, there's going to be paper trails.". And he went through all the different. scenarios like the the you know the. flight you know the flight distance of. full tanks is 2500 miles. The distance. is 4,500 miles. Therefore it had to have. air support. That's going to be a paper. trail. When it landed had refuel. There's a receipt who paid for the fuel. That's got to have a I don't care if. it's a classified mission. It's got to. have a flight plan going back. There's.

another paper trail. And goes through. all the various things. And we did that. primarily for members of Congress or. ourselves. It's like hey [clears throat]. you don't have to believe this case. you. can find it compelling enough to dig a. little deeper. So now we have members of. Congress that are willing to you part of. the task force. Hey, let's go find those. flight records. Let's see what we can. turn up. So now it's just like. hopefully, you know, they're not they. probably are. Of course they are aware. of the fact that we're going after these. records. So hopefully they're not like. getting rid of them, you know.

>> Yeah. >> So yeah. >> Did you say you have tail numbers or any. identifying information on those? >> We Yeah. So we the the um colonel uh. identified every single uh C17. in the fleet at that time and there were. I don't know there were a handful of. them from various bases and got every. single tail number cuz we have. photographs of what could have been one. of the flights because there was. somebody in 1996 but it wasn't at. Compenas. It landed somewhere else to. refuel and some Amazon some researcher.

told me about it. So we want to see if. we can read that picture carefully. enough that we could make out a couple. of the numbers. So the Air Force colonel. has been finding all the tail numbers. Now he's getting flight records for all. those tail. This is all happening right. now. So we're trying to find that. specific plane flight landing where it. landed cuz we could find out like where. it landed. We could find out potentially. like who the crew were, how many people. are on board, where those people are. today, right? Yep. He estimates that 30. to 40 people at minimum Americans would.

know about that flight, were involved. with that flight directly or indirectly. So that's where we're making a plea to. anybody on the American side because. wouldn't [clears throat] that be great? >> Yeah. What do you think was loaded on. that plane? >> The bodies. >> ET ET and uh. >> two bodies if the. >> I don't know how many bodies. I don't. know how many bodies. I would say at. least two. At least two. uh and and. probably some of the debris, I would. imagine, but I don't know.

>> what gives United States military. jurisdiction over that. >> You know, a reporter asked a question, that very question a couple years ago to. an intelligence official. You know what. they said? Because we can. >> write a check or. >> or we're coming in or. >> we're going to get it. >> We're coming in. >> the easy way, the hard way. >> Yeah. I mean, we just took out a. president in Venezuela. >> True. >> Yeah. >> True. >> So, we got a UFO crash. My understanding. is that the Americans were aware of. these this UFO coming in and alerted the.

military officials in Brazil. And I've. heard that from a number of researchers. In fact, I've even gotten close to. getting a name of who provided that. But. anyway, I've heard that from a number of. pretty credible sources. >> Yeah, I was able to track down. [clears throat] some information about. um. craft being seen in that area over that. time and then it kind of goes dark. M so. my suspicion is that uh that there were. some radar hits about those craft in. that area or or at least one of them and. then someone got involved and said.

>> stop tracking it. We got it. You guys. don't need to worry about it. That's my. suspicion. >> Yeah, I'm optimistic. I mean, you know, only takes one courageous American to. come forward, you know, and reveal that. We get the flight numbers. Maybe they don't come forward publicly. Maybe they come forward in a skiff with. me certain members of Congress, part of. the UAP task force. There are a handful. of Congress people that I that I. actually trust that I think really do. want to get this information out to the. public that are really seriously and and.

and authentically interested in um. knowing more and being more transparent. because they feel like everybody has a. right to know about this stuff. And so. I'm optimistic on that front. And you. know, like I said, like we had meetings. and and Leslie Kane's article that. people should look up, Leslie Kaine and. and Ralph Blumenthal in the debrief. gives a very detailed account of our. meetings, our closed dooror meetings on. on the hill with firsthand witnesses on. the case and our plea to them like, hey,

you don't have to believe these guys. They found their testimony very. compelling and they were very very. interested in what the doctor had to. say, I can assure you. And um really. asking very detailed questions to him. When is it you have a neurosurgeon. describing face-to-f face contact with a. live entity from non-human intelligence? Right. Y. >> never before in history. So, uh there. seemed to be a genuine concern, a. genuine uh willingness to to uh do some. digging behind the scenes and then and. then Congressman Burlesen attended the.

the conference and spoke as did a. senator from Brazil. So, um you know, this could be the beginning of the. beginning. >> It could be. >> could be the beginning of the beginning. What is it about Brazil? Because we have. compelling cases going back to at least. the 70s like the Claris case. >> 50s. >> to the 50s. >> Uba tuba. >> Uba. That's right. >> Yep. There's actually metal material. >> That's right. >> High level high 100% magnesium. I can't. remember what the but it's very unusual. and it would be it would the I'm told.

I'm not a metal metallergist but I'm. told by like I think it was Gary Nolan. and Jacqu Valet who've studied the metal. samples isotope isotope. they looked down into the the. microscopic level. >> Yep. >> Um that it would be extremely. expensive to replicate what they found. in that beach in 1957. And it was. reported something exploded and it. rained down all this debris on a beach. in Ubatuba. That was 1957. >> That's right. It was it was witnessed by.

by a fisherman actually rained onto his. boat and killed his dog. >> Oh, really? I didn't hear that part. Yeah. >> Yeah. That uh some of that metal was. tested and they found using an electron. microscope that it was arranged in a. lattice that could serve as a as a wave. guide for electromagnetic spectrum in. the terraertz range, >> which is something that we couldn't we. couldn't do that in the '50s. I just. remember Gary Nolan telling me that it. would cost so much money to replicate. even today. >> Right. >> So that was impressive. But then you. have uh Colaris in the 70s. Very.

fascinating case. First case I've ever. heard of where there seemed to be some. level of hostility. >> That's right. Do Well, tell us about the. case. Tell us what you know. >> Well, what I know is I I haven't done a. deep dive into this case. Jacqu Filet. has. I think Jacqu Vallet has probably. written a book about it. Um there were. this was this went on for a while. It. might have been the whole year of 1977. It might have been longer, >> but there were um UFOs scene. Uh there. were beams coming down from some of the.

UFOs attacking some of the people in the. village, burning their skin, or maybe. they were taking skin samples or blood. samples. I don't know. That's what was. reported. There's other uh testimony. the Americans got involved and they came. and then there was film footage of an. object the size of a football field. shape of a triangle coming out of the. Amazon. Um that footage apparently. exists. There were a bunch of. photographs that I actually feature in. the first cut of Moment of Contact. Original photographs that were released. by the Brazilian Air Force.

>> Yep. Over a thousand photographs. >> There was also uh Yeah, exactly. And all. kinds of documentation. All kinds of. stuff come out of that case. >> Yeah. Yeah. If you guys want to look, if. you want to look this up, this is. operation prau, which means which means. saucer or plate. >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh yeah. Yeah. Plat. operation plateau or something. Yeah. It's a plate or whatever. A disc. >> Um and uh and there was a military. gentleman who actually feature his. testimony in the first cut of moment of. contact. And uh he went on camera and he.

had died under extremely mysterious. conditions. He apparently had a close. encounter of the third kind. He actually. saw the entities. And that was in the. 70s. They like hanged himself in this. hotel or something crazy. You have to. look it up. But um. >> hung himself from the almost the base of. his bed. It's very strange. >> And that I think that was just about 2. or 3 weeks after he gave testimony. >> Get that on camera testimony. >> Yeah. To uh to to Jarrett. >> Yeah. Yeah. Really good. I mean, thank. God for I know. It's terrible. So that's. that case. Then you had UFOs over Brazil. 1986.

>> Was that the year of the saucer? >> Uh it's called UFOs over Brazil. Yeah. That's kind of what it's known. Uh 1986. and they had a press conference. They. had the pilots. I mean, quite honestly, it was very similar to the two. consecutive weekends in Washington DC in. 1952. >> The right almost like an invasion, you. know, and they they engaged with them. the in the airplanes. I I again I. feature some of that in the first cut of. Moment of Contact if you guys want to. check it out. And then of course you've. got uh Vargia.

which quite honestly I think I can't. think of a better crash retrieval case. particularly involving the Americans uh. known uh in the world. I think it's the. I think it's the best most well. doumented and it's getting better by the. day. >> Yeah, it is. There's something about the. Amazon that intrigues me, >> you know. Yeah. I I and I apologize to. your audience for this. I mean, the only. case that I know extremely well, and. I've done sort of. a glance at the other cases, but the one.

I put a laser-like focus on is Vargia. So, it's I know. >> that case pretty well. I've been really. digging my and I learn new stuff every. day. I'm trying to more pieces of the. puzzle and there's still missing pieces, but. >> but like I said earlier, I think it's. this is the case that could uh settle. the debate. >> for sure. How long did it take the US. Air Force to get involved in that? >> Almost immediately. >> Really? >> Yeah. Because according to the flight. controller, uh it was on around the. 20th.

>> Okay. >> So, it would have been, you know, the. same day or maybe the next day after the. girls saw the creature, like all that. activity and hoopla. Um, I don't know. the exact date, but it it was on or. around the 20th of January, and the. flight came in, and all the military. people I talked to, everybody involved. in the case all say, I can't say this for sure, but rumor has. it the Americans came, the Americans. came, the Americans came, the Americans. came, they came to Kimpenus, and we have.

the very gentleman that was one of the. people in operation of the transport of. one of the beans, possibly two of the. beans, from Humanitas Hospital. and went to as a military base. Apparently, they backed the trucks up to. the wall for I don't know a few hours of. the night and then they continued their. journey on Dome Pedro, I think it's. called, freeway all the way down to. Esposex military base in Campinas and. then that's when the Americans landed. And actually, it's so funny too cuz you. hear all the accounts of the people that.

we talked to. It's like, yeah, they all. even including the military chief of. police, he said the same thing, campenis, and that's when the Americans. came in. So it's like the everything. makes sense, you know, the accounts of. the plane came in here. This is where I. dropped it off. It all went here. Like. it just big cargo transport plane, helicopter coming out the back going to. Virginia. It's like what the hell else. were they doing there? >> Was that um was Dr. Itelo's patient was. that being still alive? Yes, >> it still was alive. >> Fully alive. Well, yeah. I mean, I don't.

know how long it stayed alive, but it. was fully alive and fully doing well on. the 20th. >> Wow. So, when you spoke to Eric Davis, he talked about. alien species. He talked about the. grays, the Nordics, a lot of these. So, what's the taxonomy of this. particular alien that was in Virginia? I. mean, how many species? I know we're. speculating, but this is a storytelling. show. >> Yeah. Yeah. This is really This is Okay. So, there's a uh a segment with Jacqu.

Valet because he was unable to attend. the press club meeting that we had and. it was January 20th, the 30th. anniversary of the incident and that's. when we held it in Washington DC and we. presented cuz Jacques couldn't be there. and Jock goes out on a limb and. describes various cases and different. types of creatures or beings or. non-human intelligence, whatever you. want to call them. And I think that you. should you should uh show your audience.

that clip because it's very interesting. He talks about exactly what you're what. you're [clears throat] mentioning now. >> Do you get a sense of are [snorts] these. beings from other planets or are they. here? What do they want? >> I wish I knew. >> Speculate. Well, [clears throat]. >> I mean, it's Yeah, I. >> I I mean, from all the different people. that I've talked to and all the. different alleged firsthand witnesses to. close encounters with the third kind, there seems to be. different races, different agendas,

different um I mean, cuz you got, you. know, the quintessential, you know, almond shaped eyes, black eyes, gray, spindly arm, spindly legs. That seems to. be, you know, the worker be or whatever. Some of them think that they're. uh biologically engineered, you know, entities with an intelligence. Uh what. do what do I know? I you know, that. seems to be some people describe brown. skin or white skin or gray skin, but the. big eyes, the big teardrop shaped head,

the three digits, I think three fingers. and a thumb, uh seems to be fairly. consistent. But then you got people like. Travis Walton. Mhm. Describing creature. human looking, you know, like. beautiful blonde, blue eyes humans, like. very attractive. I guess they call them. the Nordics. >> The Nordics, the tall whites, whatever. >> Uh. you've got those types. And then you've. got, you know, if the the account is to.

be believed, you've got, you know, Jason. Sans in his convoy in 1994 talking about. this and he was was really odd is that, you know, he was dressed in military. outfit and Jason said they were all like. looking at his boots and his boots and. he's been walking through the the dry. desert and dusty desert. His boots were. immaculate, like spotless, but he. described the big eyes, but they weren't. almond shaped. They were just really big. and dark and no no real ears. Yeah. No.

ears. No, you know, >> [clears throat]. >> um, and that's a different type. And was. that entity, if it's true, was that. entity capable of projecting how it. wanted to be seen. Sometimes you wonder. about that. Like why was his military. outfit spotless, right, >> in the desert according to the witness, you know? Um, so. We could be dealing with all the above.

We could be dealing with like. interplanetary. Maybe there's some that. live under the oceans. Maybe maybe they. live on the back side of the moon. Who. knows? You know what I mean? Like maybe. they're right here. Maybe they're. interdimensional. They come in and out, right? >> Just like tune, you know, change the. frequency a little bit. >> I I really don't know. I'd love to know. I'd love to know how many different. species or races. I'd love to know what. their agenda is. I'd love to know why. they don't make their their presence. more overtly known.

Um because you look at like I've I've. studied a number of different like you. know so-called landing cases whatever. you know [clears throat]. I can go into detail with that but. >> please do. >> well like. I okay I'll just go into a little bit. 1964 was April 24th 1964 there's a. police officer by the name of Lonnie. Zamora he was in hot pursuit of a. speeding car. It was like was it late. afternoon? It was around coming up on. 5:00. And um he saw this eggshaped white.

egg-shaped thing whiz across the road in. front of him like maybe off in the. distance, some kind of flash. He thought. maybe it was like a dynamite shack that. might have I don't know, something he. needed to go investigate. So he. terminates his his police chase. He. takes a right and he goes up this dirt. road and down in a royal. he sees an egg. Basically, it could be a. tic tac, right? An egg-shaped object. It. had a little symbol on it and two small.

childlike creatures. stepping around on the bottom just like, you know, outside on the ground. Excuse me. He's like looking. He's like, "God damn, is that that like is a car. crash? Two kids? Like, what the hell am. I looking at?" And one of them, excuse. me, one of them looks him right in the. eyes and he's startled. The the creature. was startled. Lonnie was startled. So Lonnie. breaks contact and he drives cuz like So.

the the road, let's say the. [clears throat] road is like here, right? The road wraps around like that. He's here and he sees the landed craft. and the entities and he gets face. contact. By the time he got around to. here to get a closer look, the craft was. still sitting on the ground spooling up, but the hatch had closed cuz he heard a. thump and the creatures were gone and. the craft departed. Now, if you look at.

where the craft landed just on the. outskirts of town, I don't know if it. had a problem, if they were gathering. soil samples. God only knows. I have no. idea. But they did it in a spot that. would minimize any potential exposure. They landed in this little recessed. aoyo, right? So they would minimize the. chance of being seen and where they were. spotted, they were evasive and they got in and. left. They could have established some. level of communication, could have. driven over there. They could have, you.

know, they didn't do that. They left. Now, if you look at. um the Travis Walton case, which I. consider a very credible case because. there were like seven witnesses um seven. witnesses of the craft and his alleged I. would say abduction. I think I don't. think it was an abduction. I think that. he got into the way of the propulsion of. the craft and and affected him somehow. and they came back and got him brought. him back to life and then dropped him. off. Now, if you look at where. [clears throat]. where they dropped him off,

where they took him was a very remote. area in the in Snowflake, Arizona up in. the mountains. I've been there several. times. It's remot. Okay. He would have. died if they would have dropped him off. where they picked him up. They didn't do. that. They dropped him off on the. outskirts 5 days later on the outskirts. of town if the accounts would be to be. believed. They dropped him off on the. outskirts close enough to like a pay. phone or, you know, where you can get. help. But they did it at night and they. did it in an area that was a dip down. where they could like drop him off and. then get the hell out of there to. minimize any potential for any exposure.

So they cared enough. >> to for his well-being, but they also. didn't want their presence known, widely. known. Do you know what I mean? I do. >> So you look at like cases like that and. you go, "All right, well, you look at. what they do, what they do, and then you. look at what they don't do." And. sometimes the what they don't do. is evidence of of potentially their. objectives or their agenda, you know, because if they wanted to make. theirelves overtly known, they just.

hover over the next. >> football game or, you know, Super Bowl, whatever. Game over. >> Yeah. Take me to your leader. >> But they don't do that. >> Nope. >> They did some pretty bold maneuvers. I. call it like the um show of force during. the 1940s and50s u when they were fleets. of them flying over America. I mean it's. all the newspapers especially 52 the 52. wave was phenomenal. >> Mhm. >> Um and you look at the White House. buzzing the capital building in 1952. consecutive weekends scramming military. jets. That's pretty provocative, right?

You look at the case in um. uh what was it? June 13th, 1997. Don't. quote me on that exact date. Sorry. March March 13, 1997 in Phoenix. That. craft even according to the governor F. Simington was. >> Oh, this is the Phoenix lights. >> Phoenix lights. I investigated that on. and off for 10 years. And I interviewed. families that said they were lying on. their front lawns watching this colossal. mammoth like a floating city like float. over the top big boomerang shaped thing.

where they could look up and see metal. compartments, blah blah blah. >> For hours this thing was up. >> Oh yeah. It went from the north all the. way down to the south ended up like. Tucson over it flew over Interstate 10. I mean, it was witnessed by so many. people including the governor, >> right? >> And uh that's pretty provocative. >> Like flying low and slow and it was done. at a time when everyone was out of under. the night sky trying to get a glimpse of. the Hellbob comet. >> So that's provocative. I mean that's. that's something, right? And you got. Hudson Valley sightings, you got the. Belgian sightings in the late 80s, early.

90s. Provocative. I mean, I interviewed. a police officer who was involved in the. Hudson Valley in the 70s. I don't know the exact year, but he said this massive triangular. shaped size of a football field object. was floating over the top of him. I. talked to the police officer myself. He. goes, I was kind of curious. I took my. flashlight out and flashed it at the at. the object. And this is in the 70s. And.

he goes, "Son of a that thing re. responded.". Bam! A laser beam light down at my feet. >> Wow. >> He's like, "Shit." I wasn't know if that. was like a friendly gesture or if that. was like a shot across the bow. Like, so. there's been some very provocative Do. you know what I mean? >> I do. >> Um, but they don't make themselves. overtly known, which also makes me. wonder. I I you know, >> Yeah. Like I said, you you look at what. they do and you look at what they don't. do. We've got um clearly something's.

happening. Clearly uh the military or. someone knows what's going on. Do you. ever find yourself frustrated that. you're almost playing a cat-and- mouse. game? >> Very much so. >> Yeah. I mean, like, you know, the. Virginia case, like, you know, I'm all. in on that right now. And um. there's nobody on planet Earth that. would like to. find that photograph, find that piece of. video footage. Now we have names and. people that had it from people that have.

seen it. I just got a new name a couple. days ago from a doctor, a neurosurgeon, and we were texting back and forth with. them and um like, well, I'll talk about. whatever, but I don't want to talk about. ver, you know, Virginia. You know, it's. like, but he, this individual confessed. that he was shown the video for Marcus. Phinesis was but not on the record yet, but we're going to continue working on. him. So, we have names. We're hoping that people are watching. all the attention this case is getting.

and that people are going to, you know, decide, "Hey, man, if I'm ever going to. come forward, now's the time." Cuz. people in their 40s are now in their. 70s. People in their 50s, now in their. 80s, you know what I mean? Like, now's. the time. So, it would have been 30. years ago. So, how old would have Dr. Elo been? He's 74. So, he would have. been what, 40, 50, 60. He'd been 44, right? >> About 44 when it happened, >> you know? He's 74. So someone in their. 40s, they're, you know, they're on the. cusp of retirement, you know, probably a lot less to lose,

wanting their grandchildren to know the. truth. So I'm I'm encouraged. I think I. think it's it's ripe. Now is the time. that this stuff could come out, and it. is coming out, but more. We just need a. few more doctors. We need the video, and. we need the American side to come. forward, and then we've got a slam dunk. >> Yeah, it's the American side. I think. that's the bottleneck there. >> We're working on it. >> I hope that video still exists because a. lot of people are invested in making. sure it never sees the light of day. >> That's for damn sure. [clears throat].

That's for sure. We were in contact with. people. after um after the first cut came out. We were contacted by a number of people. Sometimes, you know, you can kind of. tell cuz I I've been contacted for years. by witnesses. You can just kind of tell. when you get one that you go, "Okay, this is raising an eyebrow." And that's. when. you know someone will it's very short. It'll be like I've got what you're. looking for you know kind of thing as. opposed to writing me like a novel. It's. like you know what I it's like.

>> and and um and [clears throat] they. could have been joking but. >> uh you get back in touch with them and. they're just gone. It's like well why. did they you know and so makes me. paranoidly thinking like am I being. watched again? We did a a proton email. which you're going to put on the screen. >> Yep. >> For people to get in touch with us, particularly anybody on the American, anybody who witnessing the Vargia case. And. >> not to be rude, but if you have a whole. UFO story that's unrelated, please save.

it for another time. I just want to put. a laser-like focus on on Vargia uh video. or any participation in the flight um. from Campenas back to the States. I did. get contacted by one individual via. email. He said, "It's been weighing on. me and my family for decades." I was. like, "Oh my god, we did it." You know, and then I was, he's like, "You contact. me like this." I'll show you the email. You contact me like this. Just, you. know, conversations terminated if you. did. So, I did everything he told me to.

do. Waited about 36 hours after he sent. me the first email. It was like, "Oh, my. this isn't who you think it is. My email. got hacked and uh I don't know anything. and goodbye.". So I just thought really. So I waited. like 6 months and then I sent a separate. email not part of that thread based on. the email address. Hey this is so and so. tree service you know I'm coming to cut. your hedges cuz I was hoping like maybe. he'd be like sure. >> I just need to meet with you to give you.

an estimate you know and I was like do. you know what I mean? >> Cuz I thought well maybe. And then I. finally got some little response and I. thought and then it was just. [sighs]. >> how do you how do you vet your stories? How do you how. >> well you got to go meet the people. I. mean I you know also you know I tell. people because I had people telling me. just last year like we've got I've got. the video as a woman I got the video you. need to come. I I'm giving it away for. free. I just I can't this is a burden. I. don't want this in my life anymore. I.

want it out of my life. Like just get it. away. I think it was her husband's or. something. And I said, "I'll. [clears throat]. come." But I said, "I can't just drop. everything in the middle of I'm editing. movie. Fly, excuse me, fly all the way to South. blah blah blah in Brazil without any. kind of roof. Like I, you know, I'm just. I'm sorry, I can't do that." And we went. back and forth for a long time. And I. said, "Just show me like two frames, just one picture, and I'm on a plane. tomorrow." And then after like months of. back and forth, she like, "You don't.

come down. We're ter." And that was it. That person's gone. Did she have it? Was she bluffing? I. don't know. But I wasn't willing to fly. away to Brazil just because someone said. they had it. Maybe she did have it. I. don't know. But why wouldn't you show me. one screen? Send me one screen and I'm. there. >> What What pictures have you seen that. that you were convinced like this is. legit? >> Oh, I would say one of the best. photographs ever. It's in my film the program which you.

can watch for free on YouTube movies and. it's bloody good man. We got the back we. got a bit of background on it as well. Taken in 1990 Calvine Scotland. and David Clark is the researcher that. uncovered it. And it's a long story, but. I'd heard about this case because I. interviewed Nick Pope who was part of. the mod u UFO desk in the '9s. And um I. probably interviewed him in the early 20.

well I talked to him in the early 2000s, probably very early 2000s. And I was. like, "Oh, you were at the UFO desk. What was the best case?" You know, like. what what did you see? You know, Nick Pope [clears throat] goes, "Oh, there was two hikers in Scotland.". And he didn't say Calvine. He just said. Scotland. Broad daylight, six prints, beautiful like diamond shaped, you know, like craft hovering in the sky with a. military jet going around. I was like,

you got to be kidding me. >> You can see this online if you guys want. to look at it. >> Yeah. The combine UFO. >> I pestered him and I pestered him and I. pestered him and I he goes, we had a big. poster of it on the wall and the UFO. desk. He goes, I don't know. I don't. know. I don't know. And I said, "Nick, no one threw that picture away. It's. still somewhere." Like, "What about the. names of the guys that you worked with? They're retired. Where are they now?". Like, I pestered them, and pestered. them, pestered them. I can never excuse.

me. I could never get it out of them. And then this researcher David Clark, he finds some foyer documents, release. documents from the British from the. Ministry of Defense. And it one of them. was like redacted. It was like the Royal. Air Force press officer blocked [snorts]. out in blah blah blah Scotland. And he's. like, "Who is the Royal Air Force Press. Officer in Scotland?" It is.

Oh. Um, uh, Craig Lindsay. So, he contacts Craig Lindsay and long. story short, which went on for a while. Craig Lindsay. had gotten a call from a local. newspaper. Maybe it was like the. Scotland Yard or D something. Any look. it up. And they said, "Oh, you know, we're we're here trying to, you know, get a quote from the RAF about this uh.

about this UFO photograph." And he's. like, "I don't know what you're talking. about. What are you talking about?" They. said, "Well, there's these two mates, these two guys that are going to publish. this story, and we just want to comment. on what this might what this could. possibly be. It's got a military jet.". He goes, "Well, I haven't seen it, so I. don't know what you're talking about.". They So, they said, "Well, we'll send. you a print." So, they sent him a print. He's like, "Holy shit." like this is. it's good. And um. so he immediately I think he con what?

Yeah, he does contact the MOD and then. the MOD contacts him and he starts to. investigate. He meets with the witnesses. at a hotel. They tell him their account. They said it was hovering. It was. silent. They were terrified. They were. cowering beneath the tree. When it was. hovering there, they was like, "What are. we looking at?" They had a camera and he. said uh they said that a military jet. came in and at that point they got. enough courage the military jet did a. full pass. It went in around the entire.

object and the six I think it was like. six or seven prints. It was picture. so all the pictures is relatively the. same object, same spot, same tree, all. that ground everything with the jet in a. different position. So, uh, you know, Craig was like, "Well, what kind of noise did it make?" And the. witnesses were like, "It didn't make any. noise at all. It was just completely. silent." He's like, "Well, I don't. know." He's a Royal Air Force press.

office. I don't know any planes at. anything without any wings, without any. visible, you know, blah blah blah. And. then as he's in the middle of this. investigation, he gets a call from the. MOD and they were like, "We'll take it. from here. Thanks." And that was the end. of that. Well, he keeps that print in a. book and kind of forgets about it. Then. he retires and it's whatever 30 33 34. years later and he finds the damn thing. and he gives it to he gives it that's. the only reason why we have that. photograph. Yep.

>> Thank God to Craig Lind Craig Lindsay. cuz they buried that story. >> And. >> and I interviewed Nick Pope and he was. like they wanted to bury it and they. did. And then and then at the last. possible. like minute of production with the. program, the documentary I was just. talking about. Uh there was a guy I. always get his name wrong. Um Greavves, Richard Greavves, and he's like he's. like, "You're he called me. He's like, "You're mispronouncing my name." He's is. it Griev? He's like, "No, it's.

Greavves." Greavves. And he and he. describes what happened. He goes, "I I. knew those bloss. I was, you know, he he. was up there and he said they were on a. cigarette break couple days after. They're about to go public. >> Black car rolls up. There are these men. in black again. Heard the heard about. him a thousand times. >> Y. >> and he said they came up, they got out. of the car and what he what the way he. describes the guy smoking behind the. wheel. It's the funniest thing. Richard. Greavves should be a comedian because.

the way he described this guy smoking, I. was like I've never heard anybody. describe the way inhaling so hard it lit. up the whole cabin on the inside of the. car. is really sucking the cigarette. down. And then he's the driver stays in. It was a Mercedes. Two guys get out. They cigarette breaks over. [laughter]. Yeah. Take the two guys pissing rain. outside in the pissing rain talking to. them. They're all the other workers that. were not participating in the event. itself. Didn't take the pictures, didn't. witness. They were looking through the.

window watching this whole pissing rain. It was raining so hard and they were. just standing in the pissing rain. getting drilled by these two men in dark. suits, long overcoats. He said they came back in and I'll never. forget this. He's like, "Why is a. ghost [laughter]. just, you know, scared the shiza out of. these two witnesses, >> started drinking heavily, sleeping in. their cars at night at the at at at at. the hotel, and then they vanished after. a couple of weeks, and they're to this. day, they've never been seen again." H.

that story. Yeah, that is such a good case. Now, >> the pilot, it was a. the Harrier jump jet is what I was told. It's in the picture. Most likely, they. said it's pretty likely to be a Harrier. jump. >> That pilot would have been, what is that. was 1990, so that would be like what. >> uh 36 years ago? Coming up on 36 years. So, 36 years. Let's say the pilot was in. his mid-30s. Could have been up to 40,

maybe 35, 35, 30, 35. >> Well, he would be a 65 now, maybe 70, 65. or 70. If you're out there listening, you've got my Proton email. Give us a. call cuz I can guarantee you he got a. hell of a view of that thing. >> Oh, yeah. >> He flew all the way around it. And he. probably had gun cam rolling. >> Mhm. That That's a That's right. They. buried that picture. banished the witnesses. Those guys. wanted to come forward. They were at the.

local newspaper. They were they were. getting their story out with all those. prints. Really good story. And that's another. Men in Black story. I'm like, "Oh my. god, how many times I got to hear this.". >> That's why it's so hard to even reach. out to you because. >> could be the last email you ever send. >> Well, yeah. I Yeah. I You know, I'm. being watched. There's no question about. that. >> For sure you are. >> No question. Funny how because I was at. this is really funny. I was at uh the.

premiere for Age of Disclosure and uh. Leslie was hang Leslie Kane. She was. hanging out with met bunch of dudes in. suits. Just as typical looking, you. know, I think they said they're from the. agency. I'm pretty sure that's what they. said. Thought definitely like, you know, and uh I was like, "Hey, nice to meet. you. Hello, blah blah blah." You know, we're talking like whatever. I'll talk. to anybody. You know, people are people. I'm not hiding anything. They know what. I'm up to. So, I'm talking to the guy. and was chatting it up and I was like, "Yeah, cuz I I did this film on this UFO.

crash and in Brazil, they're all, "We. know exactly who you are.". >> Sure, they do. >> Yeah. [laughter] I was like, "Oh my. god." I mean, it was a little creepy, but but it was funny, too. You know, and. um when I did the event at the National. Press Club just a couple days ago, whatever week, I can't I've been to. Brazil and all over the damn place. Not. that long ago. It was the 20th of. January. What are we whatever. Okay. So, I see three dudes in suits come in and I. knew two of them because Yeah, because.

I've been in touch with some of the. people within the task force. You know, I went I went into a skiff with. >> John Klauscowski and people from the Air. Force Office of Special Investigation. >> They let you into a skiff. >> Took me into a skiff. Yes. >> What did you see in there? >> We'll talk about that in a second. Okay. These guys showed up at the event and I. saw them come in and I was like, "Hey.". And they were like, they just kind of. looked at me and kept going. So about. like 15 minutes later, things are. getting going. Everyone's settling down. and getting ready to present. And I was. with my sister Kelly and I was like,

"Hey, Kelly, get a picture of me with. these, you know." So I walked up and he. was like, "Mm-. >> no, no, no photo no photo, dude. Not. now." Like, "No, but we're here, you. know." And uh yeah, we went back. started. But the the other thing was I. was invited. um I probably won't reveal who who made. the arrangements cuz I don't I don't. know if that's okay or not, but I was. invited into a skiff which is super. weird because me like they did a 20 48.

hour background check and then all the. security and. um I was I was flying back to Vermont. from Washington DC and I checked out of. my hotel when I was when I had the. appointment and I went uh I went into it. was not far from the Pentagon. I went. into this building, met in a parking lot. and walked through this building, went. to had to go through security, took all. my stuff. Oh my god. And I go through. and then uh and then there were these. glass tubes. I think I left Did I leave.

my bags there? I probably did. There. were these glass tube things. One side. opened and you stepped in it that closed. and the other side opened. It was just. like scene out of a movie or something. and then went down these corridors and. we got to an area where he goes, "All. right, now you need to get rid of all. your electronics and you need to put. them in the log." I said, "Can I use the. bathroom real quick?" Cuz I wanted to. take a picture of the pass, which I did. >> You did? >> Yeah. Yeah. I took a picture of the. pass. I got it. >> Where can we see that? >> I'll show it to you. I'll share it with. you. You can show it on the thing. >> Okay. Yeah. >> It says uh uh.

>> it says court required. >> Just [laughter] like that. I'll show. you. I took it in the bathroom. >> They're probably going to find out about. that. Whatever. Sorry. >> Last gift. >> Had to do it. I'll I'll send it to you. for sure. So, >> so then uh take all my, you know, everything I had electronic gone and. then just vault looking door just. exactly the door you'd expect, right? You know, opens it up big thick thing. Go inside. I'm like, "Fuck, I'm in a SC.

Holy shit." But it was it was a big. room. Like it was big like cubicles and. all kinds of hallways and He's. like, "Yeah, this entire area is a. skiff." It's all part of the task force. The head of the UAP task force, John. Klascowski. So, we walked down this. hallway. >> What building are you in? Where are you? man. I'm not far from the. Pentagon. Yeah, not far from the. Pentagon. I thought it was actually at. the Pentagon. It was just just really. really close. >> And um. take me down a hallway. I can't give you. this guy's name. I would gladly. I can.

only give you this other he wouldn't. appreciate it. Go down this hallway and. there's an open door on my left and a. closed door on my right. And he's like, "I I'll be right back." And he leaves me. there. I'm standing there and I see a. table h maybe about the size of this. I. think it was more ovalshaped or maybe it. was round. Can't remember. But I was. like probably a couple girls and a. couple guys and they're all in suits and. they're talking and I'm tuning I'm. tuning in cuz I'm like might as well. You know, the brain has an incredible.

capacity to like filter out anything. else and just really hone in on. >> No, I could see you sidling over. >> Yeah. And so I'm listening to the. conversation. Like I'll give you an. example like if you ever take a like a. tape recorder to a restaurant dinner, it's not recording what you heard. It's. recording all because it doesn't filter. it out, right? >> But I was able, you know, we can do. that. We can filter out surround noise. and really focus on what we want to. hear. So I'm like tuning into these. guys. >> I'm like, "Oh, what are they, you know, what are they on about?" And then one of. them abruptly gets up, comes over to the. door and closes in my face, you know,

and I [laughter] was like, "Shit.". >> So then uh one guy who met me uh outside. suit, he comes, opens up the door, and. then John Klauscowski comes in and. they wanted to show me this footage that. they were going to possibly release. I. said, "Don't release that. It's. ridiculous. It's not going to gain you. any credibility. You guys cannot do. that." And then we talked about. I talked about you know Rua I talked. about Vargia I talked about Sakoro I.

talked about I was just like you know. and and this and this and you guys know. that you know ultimately what we're. dealing with is a certain percentage of. these things is non-human intelligence. and what's the plan to tell the public. you know we're not going anywhere this. this story is not going away what's the. plan. and John Klesclowski the head of Arrow. right now goes goes, "James, I can't part my hair without approval.

from the DoD. >> and and you can quote me on that." So, basically what he was saying is his. hands are tied and it doesn't matter. what he what he what he ultimately finds. or uncovers or learns, right? I'm. convinced that, you know, they clearly. found the the legacy. God, I could tell. you another story, too. The legacy UAP. crash retrieval program. Um, >> now you've got to tell the other story.

>> Yeah. Well, I just, you know, >> Well, what is the plan, do you think, before you get into that? >> I think there are some people that want. it out and some people that don't want. it out. And the people that are in. possession of the goods. don't want it out for the most part. But I really think it's important that, you know, the people in the UFO. community, I mean, we don't need the. government against us. Everybody's. bickering among each other, which is. absurd. We should focus on a common. goal. But I'm really like pivoting to. the point where like I want to say to.

people, look, you don't have to believe. Gush or Lou or Chris or whoever. >> Um, >> how about, you know, we call their bluff. and we create, we help create, we help. support Congress. Congress really needs. to hear from you. like they've made that. abundantly clear. We need to know that. our constituents and other people that. we have your support in put putting our. necks out. But but to to figure out a. way how we can get immunity to the. witnesses that want to come forward and. how we can provide additional um witness. whistleblower protections that's very.

very important because there are threats. people feel even if it's just their. security clearance they lose that they. have no job right so the threats have. taken away their security clearance some. people are concerned about their. personal safety there's there's those. issues um and they lose their job it's. like you know they lose the they can't. support, they can't feed their family, you know. So it's like now they're. talking about a fund that that we could. put in place. Uh so if they do lose.

everything, they get financial. compensation because and people are. like, "Oh, well that's not really fair. They're getting taxpayer dollars." It's. like, well, if what they're saying is. true, that's the biggest story ever. Everybody should have a right. I don't. think, you know, that people would have. that big of a problem with getting some. compensation to some of these. potentially the most significant. witnesses in the history of mankind. So. anyway, these are all initiatives and. things that that I feel strongly that we. should we should um support.

>> and put pressure on. >> whether you believe it or not. Like you. might say like, "Wow, what's this guy. have to gain by coming forward?" What. does David Grush have to gain? Quite. honestly, I don't really see anything. He had to retire early. He didn't get. any of his pension. >> Yep. you know, like, you know, you got. all these threats and I mean, I don't. know. I mean, call us bluff. >> Yeah. I think the Pentagon walked back a. lot of even what he said. >> Oh, of course they did. That's what they. do. >> I don't Do you feel like it's a. Is it a slow Are they preparing us for.

an actual disclosure? Is this a limited. hangout or is it like, well, we'll give. them a little here. We'll give them a. little. >> I think it has to come. I mean, I just. come from we the people. We have to. start really continuing the pressure. It's one of the reasons why, you know, like. I had to move mountains and walk on. water. I told you earlier to do that. event at the National Press Club and I'd. love to see the government do something. like that. They're doing exactly the. opposite. But it was really hard. Like. we hired a PR firm. We had a former.

White House press secretary, assistant. press secretary, all sending out the. press conference, all the various news. outlets. And you know, we had really. good attendance. We had a handful, very. small hand. Well, we had a lot of. cameras. There were influencers there, but only a handful of news outlets. I. mean, we did the best we could. You. know, we like I said at the time, I was. like, it was a very solid base hit, but. um. you know, we had a story that was going. to go out in a very big news.

organization. It would have been really. historic. And uh and that got squashed. at the last second to the point where we. couldn't pivot to somebody else. And. there's about closed door hearings. But. there is a again I'll remind your. audience there's there's a great story. out in the debrief by Liza Kane and. Ralph Blumenthal. Go check it out. It's. free. It's online. It's got photographs, details of the meetings. >> Um yeah, it's it's it's good. Yeah. >> Well, I think you're doing the right. thing by doing the podcast circuit. because these shows we have a larger.

audience than the major news outlets. You're speaking directly to people now. You know, it's like I started thinking. about it and I was like, we don't even. really need the mainstream media. anymore. We're just going straight to. the people. >> James, this is the mainstream media. >> I know. It's crazy, right? [clears throat] I know. It's It's nuts. I was hanging out with this guy the. other day. >> and um he's like, "Yeah, man. I got 10. million followers." I was like, "You. have 10 million [laughter]. followers?". >> I know. Eat your heart. Eat your heart. out. >> Unbelievable. >> Yeah. Unbelievable. And then um then I.

was you know podcast coverage that's. happening right now in Brazil. Right now. in Brazil 22.8 million followers. Another one 30 million followers. Like. that's a significant amount of people. that you have outreach to. You know look. at Rogan. >> Yep. >> You know you guys. >> Yep. >> It's extremely impressive and that we're. doing it organically. We're doing it. grassroots. We're doing it we the. people. You know, that's why I was. telling you earlier, I really. appreciate, you know, I I I appreciate. the support and I'm not asking anyone to.

categorically believe this happened, but. but hey, how about support for. additional investigation? How about Wow, there's a lot of really compelling. eyewitness testimony. Let's dig a little. further. >> There is. You're a very important. person. Um there I have two things I. want to get to before we let you go, but. it when you were talking about the. skiff, you said, "Oh, I can tell you. another story." Do you remember what. that was? >> Yeah. It was it was such a tease. >> Okay. Well, so how can I tell you. without revealing this person's.

identity? >> Um. their position, what their role. >> No, if I do that, that'll that'll give a. dead giveaway. Um. >> then just tell the story. >> Okay. Well, so when [clears throat] I investigated. Sakora New Mexico case, I was, you know, I really I do a deep dive like I, you. know, you look at someone like Richard. Dolan or or Stanton Freriedman or, you. know, some of these really serious, you. know, researchers and authors of very.

detailed books and their. historical perspective was like a. walk-in encyclopedia. I mean, these guys. are incredible. I am extremely familiar with a handful. of cases that I personally have. investigated, boots on the ground in. Africa or China or wherever the hell I. am, South America. And I and I stick my. teeth into a case minimum 5 years, sometimes 10, sometimes 20, whatever. And um I was investigating the Sakoro.

case and I got to know his wife Mary, his daughter Diane, his son Michael, his. co-workers. This is all over a 5-year. period. And every time I came to Sakuro and. particularly to Mary's Zamora's house, I'd see this beautiful white Ford pickup. truck parked out in front, flat tires, hood popped a jar, whole cabin filled. with garbage, bullet hole through the. cab. Uh back they had a beautiful truck.

though. It had It was a stepside 1972, I think. 72 wooden bed, but it was kind. of rotted out, but nice. I mean, the. body was in pretty good shape. It didn't. have any really rust cuz it was in a dry. desert environment. I kept looking at. that truck. I'm like, damn, that thing. is gorgeous. Needs work, but wow. Long. story short, I bought the truck off Mary. >> Okay. >> Uh-huh. [snorts]. >> And I've been slowly fixing it up and. and it runs great. I after 5 years, I.

put it I had the engine rebuilt, but. it's the same engine 360 big block. >> 72 what? Oh, Ford F100. Okay. >> F100. >> And uh I I got all the wood um for the. bed and I I was under under that thing. for like weeks with the sawsaw because I. was working on it, you know, as much. time as I had during the production of. the phenomenon. And I was under the. truck with the sawzaw cutting all the. little nuts off. They were all frozen. and it was raining down like I I should. have had goggles on. And I and I put new. wood in the bed with a buddy of mine,

Mike Aken. And uh it was funny because I ordered. the kit and then I put it all. It was a. huge undertaking. My god, that was. difficult. We had to paint it with like. marine based uh you know, lac lacquer, whatever. Anyway, uh and the metal strips in. between the wood started rusting out. within a week or two. And so I was like, "What the hell, man? I just all this I. mean, okay, it's a truck and it's. outside, but I just did this. Like, come. on." So I contacted the company and. they're like, "Wow, you know, you didn't. ask for the stainless." I was like,

"Well, you guys didn't even give me an. option." I'm like, "How do I supposed to. know?" So anyway, so I'm slowly fixing. the truck up. I had the original seat. reupholstered. The guy was like, "This. was really challenging. I had to rebuild. all the springs and I got a new. dashboard cuz you could poke your finger. the dashboard from the hot sun.". Seriously, just poke your finger right. through. I did the headliner and the. floor carpeting myself and I did a. terrible job. I didn't get that done. But for overall and had the engine. rebuilt, it's a beautiful truck. So, uh, I had an individual come that's.

investigated UFOs in an official. capacity for the United States. government from 2017 to 2020, whatever. the hell. [snorts]. And uh, we took my truck out to dinner because I. don't know, for some reason I didn't. have the other car. My partner Rebecca. might have taken him. I was like, "Hey, I just got this truck." He's, you know, he's like, "Oh, I love old trucks." you. know, and you this is great. It was. really cool cuz just like this is Long. Morris truck, you know, we're driving.

this old 72 truck out these country. roads and we go out to a lovely dinner. We have some drinks and uh and. afterwards, you know, we kind of loosen. up a little bit. We go back to drop this individual off. at his at his hotel. and um. get to the hotel. and it's dark. I don't have a cabin. light. I don't have it. It It does work, but the doors are closed. It's dark. We. park in front of the hotel and the door.

guy or the valet door guy comes out. He's like, "Hey, can I get you?" I said, "Oh, no. I'm just dropping him off." And. and um. and he left. The engine's off, lights. are out. It's pretty dark. There a. little bit of light coming from the. hotel, but we were pretty far away. So, it was like almost like just silhouetted. a little bit inside the cabin. It was. dark. We had a whispered conversation. And it was like.

that moment when maybe you're on a date. and you drop, you know, you you drop the. girl off or the guy, whatever, and. there's an awkward moment where you're. not sure like, you know, >> where we should come. Do I go, you know, you invited me in or whatever. >> Worst moment ever. >> You know what I mean? Like that awkward. little moment, you know? But it was kind. of like that. I was like, "All right, well, are you getting out or do I, you. know, are you, you know, and just. silhouettes?" It was like a scene out of. a movie. I'll never forget it so long as. I live. Just silhouettes in the truck.

Dark. And it was like, "We found the. legacy program.". I was like, "Fuck. Yeah, we found it.". And it was like, you know, and then some. more details. And I just sat there. quietly going, >> can't tell us the details? Nope. Ah, >> no. I can't. I just can't. >> Why do we call that legacy program? Did. that end or legacy program? I guess. because it's been going on for such a. long period of time, I guess. >> But is that the still ongoing program or.

>> I guess it would be. I I'm assuming. Yeah, definitely. Uh-huh. Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, Senator uh Rubio, he talks about I mean, you know, you. read between the lines. I mean the. latest cut of moment of contact we have. Senator Rubio on news nation saying that. you know extremely credible people. firsthand you know claimed to be. firsthand working on the stuff the. legacy program like I mean very like wow. you know what I mean it's happening it's.

amazing how many people are not paying. attention you know all the congressional. hearings how many people even know you. had four congressional hearings. >> no very few. >> it's just so it's so incredible to me. you know that more people aren't like I. know that Life's tough and you know. we're working and paying bills. You. know, I get all that, but this I can't. believe more news outlets aren't. focusing on this. Like we got, you know, president, you know, sexual, excuse me, pecadillos, like, you know, they put so.

many resources into it like, you know, whether it's Trump or Clinton or. whatever, like they're just fixated and. like millions of dollars like, you know. what I mean? >> I think it's intentional. Then you've. got like what could be the biggest story. in history and no and they're not doing. anything. >> I think they want us fighting about. politics because that way we don't see. what's going over here. >> 60 Minutes finally does a little thing. on UFOs. I'm told it was the most. popular thing they've ever done. I I'm. pretty sure if it's not number one, it. was number two. Most popular thing.

they've ever done. Okay. >> New York Times 2017. One of the most. popular stories they've ever gone to. print. >> Yep. >> Do you not recognize that New York Times. and CBS? Hello. Like, what are you guys. doing? Do some digging. Is it take. people like me to do to do your guys'. work? Like, really? Could you imagine if. we had the full force of like, you know, media to take this seriously and really. stick their teeth into it and all the. financial like come on, man. I'm I used. to be not convinced about the connection.

between mainstream and like DoD. intelligence, the influence there, but. now I'm like. >> that's all it's all wrapped up. >> It's got to be connected. >> Of course, >> it just kind of has to be. I mean, I I. don't want to, you know, it just it. feels that way. >> Yeah, it has to come from out of here. >> It feels that way. And it might be just. as simple as like, hey, you know, all. those connections and stories that were. feeding you, yeah, you just go ahead and. leave this to the side, otherwise we're. done. You know, and someone needs to. grow a pair and just start and do it. Just do it. The support would be.

incredible. >> Yeah. But they'd have to do it really. publicly [clears throat] because these. people do disappear. >> Well, they would be doing Well, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. >> That's kind of that's kind of freaky, too. >> Tell me about um about Gary McKinnon, his story, what you think about him. >> I love that guy. >> He's amazing. >> He was great. I finally got to meet him. and he's in the program as well. Did you. see the program? >> I did. >> Well, you could also watch that for free. on YouTube movies.

>> Stop saying for free. Go. support your work. >> It's a great platform. They've got 300. million whatever followers and it's a. great platform. >> Your work needs support. >> Anyway, so. um somebody got in touch. Somebody. somebody I knew knew him. I wish I could. remember who that person was, but. >> give us a quick recap on on what Gary. did with NASA. >> One second. Because it catapulted in the. mainstream in the late 90s, early 2000s, I think it was. Oh my god. It was. everywhere. He was in the news. The. presidents were talking about him. All. the prime minister.

>> prime minister was talking about him. >> and uh always but he was way too. inundated at the time. They were making. songs about him. He was working with all. these famous art news musicians. It was. incredible. Free Gary McKinnon. So. somebody reaches out to him. He hears my. name and he's like gets right in touch. with me and he's like, "Oh my god, my. hero." I'm like, "Dude, me? What? you. like, you know, we're both super stoked, you know. So, Gary McKinnon. >> based on probably the uh one of the.

claims from a NASA alleg sort of a NASA. employee. uh don't remember the woman's name, but. he she had testified at 2001 press. conference that uh Dr. Steven Greer had. done and she basically gave a specific. location where photographs are, you. know, manipulated from NASA that show, you know, UFOs. >> Yep. >> Excuse me. So, he was like, you know, I'm going to go find out. So, he he started hacking.

>> Excuse me. >> Now, hold on. He didn't He just found. computers that with access. He didn't. like illegally. I'm trying to I'm trying to help Gary. out. I'm trying to help Gary out. >> He'll admit this now. Yeah, it's water. out of the. >> Is he in the clear? >> He's in the clear now. >> cuz Obama wanted his neck. >> I [snorts] know. They couldn't have They. could not have. >> um Okay. Well, okay. Let me get into the. story real quick and I I'll just go into. it. It's one of the biggest computer. hacks allegedly in history. And he said.

that I think it went on for a while. I. don't know if it was a year or two. years. I can't remember. It was a while. And he goes, "You know, I was going. through I would go and he talks about it. like it's like, oh yeah, it's like, you. know, walk in the park." He was like, "Of course, you just, you know, I was. like I was like yeah maybe easy to you. but somebody like me I don't know what. that you're talking gibberish I don't. know what you but he'd go through these. servers in the states from different you. know maybe a library or whatever right. and he would so that would be the. signals and that would it would end. there so and then he'd go from there and.

he'd go into like NASA NSA CIA whatever. and he goes he started getting lazy and. just going around and going straight and. he got into something at Johnson Space. Center I think it was kind of where the. woman said that these things the these. things would be and he was on dialup. and he hit pay dirt and he said there. was this cylindrical interestingly. enough. >> Mhm. >> cigar- shaped craft. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. Cylindrical shaped craft in like.

outer space. He goes, "It could have. been the Earth. I think it was the. Earth, but I couldn't say for sure. There was the clouds blah blah blah but. it was. just coming down coming down and he was. just sitting there with baited breath. going oh my god this is like oh this is. my eure we called it his eureka moment. and he goes I was like oh my gosh and. it's just like this cylindrical shaped. thing he goes it clearly had no he's. like it was otherworld you know and then.

it I think it was going down going down. going down going down and then the. cursor moved moved. >> Yes. >> And the screen went blank. And he's. like, it was my Eureka moment and also. my What have I just done? Like. [laughter]. I don't know how long it was that he. woke up to Men in Suits over his bed in. London. >> Over his bed. >> Over his bed. >> I didn't know that. Wow. >> Yeah. And then it was like. >> And they took him into custody, didn't.

they? >> Oh, are you kidding me? They wanted to. extradite him and lock him up for 70. years. Yeah. >> 60 or 70 years. >> Now, I think, and this is speculation, and Gary might agree with this, I don't. know. Um, I think that. ultimately, cuz the the British and the. and the Americans go along generally. together, I think that ultimately the. Americans. uh they wanted to extradite him. publicly,

but had that happened, he would have had. due process. It would have been a big. spectacle and the de the re there would. have been a revelation of everything. that he saw in a very public court case. >> He has to tell his side. >> So this is just again this is me. speculating here that you know the may. the Americans said to the British, hey. look, we're going to push for his. extradition. You're going to deny it cuz. we don't want a big public hearing cuz. that's what it'll be. He was everywhere. in the news. Look, anybody just Google.

Gary McKinnon. Oh yeah. >> Yeah. So they ultimately denied him, but. he said he was ready to take his own. life. >> He did. >> Yes, he did. He's like, I'm not going to. go rot in a prison for the next 65. years. But he was already I think he had. I think he had the he had he knew how he. was going to do it. He's like, yeah, I. was going to take my own life. [snorts]. I'm not going to go sit in prison for 60. years. Hell no. >> Did he talk to you about the uh the list. that he found about the offspace fleet? >> Yeah, he talked about uh they were. non-aterrestrial. officers. >> Yes. And it's funny actually because.

and again speculation here. I started. thinking about the alleged encounter at. Nellis test range in the in 1994 of this. non-aterrestrial officer. He's in. officer gear. He's got he's clearly not. of this planet. so-called. >> Um I it did make me think of him and it. did make me think of him. Do you know. what I mean? >> Yeah. Because. I don't know. I was like, is that what.

they're referring to? Non-aterrestrial. officers or are they talking about. astronauts? >> Well, they had names. >> Yeah, you did. Yeah, I don't think he. remembered those names, but yeah. Uh. yeah, I don't I don't know. Yeah, I. don't know if you remembered all that, but anyway, it's a fascinating. fascinating case. Fascinating case. And. it goes along with like. all the people that have been talking. about this cadra of highresolution, you. know, some case 4K.

[sighs] super clear photos of UFOs of. craft that are just. >> God knows we have sensors everywhere, right? All these drones with high-res. cameras and everything like that. It's. like, >> yeah, of course they would be. They We. got Yeah, sure. We got phones and cell. phones and pictures show up all the time. on the internet. But how do you know. what's real and what's fake? And who's. got the time to go through it all? Do. you know what I mean? >> Yep. >> But the military, they've got the sensors, they've got the. the cameras. I mean, they if anyone's.

going to have that kind of data, it. would be the military. And everyone says. they have it. And Gary McKinnon found. some of it. >> He sure did. >> He got to see it. >> What was your um what was your I guess. it's now infamous interaction with Buzz. Aldrin. Oh god. [laughter]. >> Excuse me. Jesus. >> You don't have to fold your arms. You. can relax. This is a place for sharing. [laughter]. >> I'll give you the short version. >> Um, >> he didn't punch you in the mouth.

[laughter]. >> I know. I put your hand in the Bible. Uh, okay. So, I worked on a movie set called The. Legend of Obie Tagert. And it would have. been. probably mid 90s, my guess. Yeah, I was. working on my first UFO doc. I think I was working on Yeah. And uh. Mickey Rooney, his wife Jan Rooney, and. there was another actor, is it Ned.

Batty, that got that was in now you. going to do some praying, boy, and you. better pray good. You remember that one? >> Was that deliverance? >> Deliverance. Yes, sir. Okay. He was. there and I just seen deliverance like a. year or two earlier. So I couldn't help. but think about I was like, "Dude, I. just saw you." [laughter]. >> You squeal like a pig. >> Oh god. God, that scene was like brutal. >> Oh my lord. No. >> Please don't Google. >> I remember the first I had no idea what. that was. One of the I watched it in.

England. >> Oh, >> in the '9s. >> and they were like, "We're going to. watch Deliverance." I was like, "Deliverance?" I was like, and it got to. that scene, I was like, "Oh, Jesus, no. God, please." Anyway, [snorts]. so I was an extra on this movie. I was a. prison guard for M for Jan uh um. [clears throat] and one of the Rooney. and uh as usual, they're like, "Oh, so. you know what what else are you up to?". And I was like, "I'm doing a UFO. documentary." And they were like, "Oh, I.

was I was kind of expecting the typical, you know, [snorts]. laughter and ridicule, whatever." But. he's like, "Oh, you know, my wife and I are really good. friends with uh with Buzz Aldrin.". And um yeah, he told us some pretty. crazy stuff like he's seen some stuff. I. was like, "Really?" Oh, yeah. You know. what? We'll we'll get you in touch with. him. So that happened. And then a friend. of mine in Kentfield, California was he. was bartending an event. It was an art.

sale. It's an art dealer sale, whatever. And there was a woman named Fean Potter. there. And she was Buzz Aldron's sister. So between her and I met her at a place. called the West Bank, the Left Bank, sorry, Lariv Goo. And um and then uh Jan Rooney. and Jan Rooney's dad was a general in. the I think it was the Air Force and he. talked about Roswell a little bit to. her. But any case, between those two, they set up an interview with me with.

with Buzz Aldrin. And. uh. he he ultimately agrees to give me an. interview about his UFO sighting. And he goes, "But I'm going to be on. book tour. I'm going to be in the south. of France. So, I borrowed some money, got a little. crew. He was like, "This is where I'll be. Come down and I'll meet with you." So, I. arrived there in Monte Carlo.

And Monte Carlo is probably the most. expensive place on earth. And I had a. small budget and I was chewing up that. money every day. And I kept, you know, getting in touch with them and it's. like, you know, traveled all this way, blah blah blah. Oh, yeah. you know, tomorrow, tomorrow, tomorrow. So, I. finally got to like, I don't know, whatever, fourth day. And I said, you. know, Mr. Aldrin, I can't be too. bullish. He goes, you know, I said, Mr. Mr. Aldron, with all due respect, I you. know, I traveled all this way. You you. did agree to an interview and and um you.

know, I I can't stay here forever. This. place is really expensive. I I traveled. all the way down here. He goes, "Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. Meet me in my. hotel lobby tomorrow morning at whatever. 9:00, whatever time it was. no cameras rolling. I said, "No, no, no, no. Won't have any cameras rolling." So, the next morning, we got there a little. early. We're having like a quisson, this. really fancy hotel, and it was like a. $10 cup of coffee back then. And um the. concier comes up to me. He says, "Mr.

Fox," I said, "Yeah, you have a. telephone call." I like, "Come over. there." And it's buzzing. He goes, "I I. can't do it." [snorts]. He goes, "Uh, [sighs]. Paul Allen has just invested in STEI, search for extraterrestrial. intelligence, right?" conservative. Those guys are looking for all the. way across that, you know. >> And uh he goes, "I can't jeopardize. I'm. trying to develop a rocket to get. citizens into space, yada yada yada. I'm. working with Congress. I I can't do it. And how how's my story going to change. anything anyway?". >> Oh, come on. >> And I said, "Well, with all due respect,

sir, it takes people of your stature to. come forward and help elevate this. topic." Blah blah blah blah blah blah. >> And Edra Mitchell did it. >> Yeah. But Ed Andrew Mitchell wasn't a. firsthand witness, but he met with. firsthand witnesses and he knew about. Roswell. But there's another reason why. I believed Roswell. But you know, he. didn't deny any like, you know, he. didn't say, "Hey, I had a sight in the. way of the moon." Who the sister told me. that he had chased a disc. I think it. was in the 50s. Yeah, probably late 50s. Chased a disc rattled. Apparently, sister said he was rattled. He chased.

this thing up to as high as his plane. would go. Couldn't catch it. And then. they saw something a little less uh a. little more ambiguous or something that. something that followed them to the. moon. Something like that. And uh but I. never got a story. And then I went on. Larry King with him in like 2007, maybe 2006, 2007. And it was like I. don't know 8 years later, something like. that. Couldn't tell you exactly, but I. had to look at my records. And uh and I.

went on with Fe Simon, the former. governor of Arizona. And to my. unbelievable shock, I went into the. green room and there he was getting his. makeup put on. And I was like, "Holy. I'm about to go live with Buzz. Aldrin and the former governor." So I. take a picture of him. Probably did it with my phone. Yeah. 2007. Yeah, sure. I did it with my. phone. I have the picture. I got it. somewhere on my computer. And um she's. like, "You're sir, you're not supposed. to take pictures in the green room." I. was like, "Oh, I'm sorry." Kept it. Yeah. [laughter] And he's like looks at.

me. He's like, you know, he's kind of. like and um and then he goes on and I. was like, I'm going to I'm going to I'm. going to really get this guy cuz I was. still pissed about what happened. And Fe. was like, you know, this guy's, you. know, he's very respected and land on. the moon with Neil Armstrong, blah blah. blah blah blah blah blah. Really be. careful. Yeah, I know. Allegedly, [laughter] I know people I know there's. that whole debate. my my really good uh. friend, one of my best friends, and he. was my neighbor and we were so tight and.

he's like, "We didn't go to the moon.". And we would always have these debates. and we loved each other. We didn't care. He was like, "Yeah, cool." You know, >> but uh he just sat there and he lied. He. just sat there and lied. >> Just sat there and lied. And I just sat. there and just watched him lie. >> Uh you couldn't [clears throat] say. >> it poked a little bit. There's a guy. Darcy Weir who did a film that covered. it. He co he found the amazingly enough. he found the clips of me on on the show. and. >> Yeah, I know. Darcy interviewed me about. it, blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. >> But um yeah, that's that's my story.

>> Oh, what a shame. >> I know. Can you imagine? That was in the. '9s. >> Yeah. Any other astronauts? >> Edgar Mitchell. Um. >> any firstirhand witnesses? >> Yeah, there was a was that Mercury. astronaut guy that took a picture of a. UFO. That was pretty incredible. trying to remember his name. Sorry, I'm exhausted. I've been up I've. just barely been getting sleep lately. I. mean, I always been I had the National. Press Club event and I flew to Brazil. and I was sick in Brazil and I was all. that stuff. Then I flew back here like.

boom boom boom. So, I'm sorry if I seem. a little tired. >> No, no, you're good. [laughter]. >> But, uh, yeah, there is a guy. It was in. the 60s. It was part of the Mercury. program and he took a pretty damn good. picture of a UFO and I think it might. have been some filmed footage too. Josh Garnet. Darn. >> That's okay. We'll find him. >> Yeah, you'll have to find it. It was It. was Mercury Mission. and I know his name, but I just I'm at a. loss right now. Anyway, >> well then the la the last thing we'll. let you go.

>> Yes, sir. >> Are there any are there any UFO photos, stories, or anything that's out there. that that people tend to believe that. you don't that you say that's not it? >> Yes. Um. Billy. uh he's he's um he's in Swit Switzerland. and I'm always told Billy Myers. >> Yes. >> And you know some people can criticize. me. It's fair to have a you know look we. can have opinions and we can agree to. disagree. I'm not trying to be. disrespectful to anybody.

>> Everyone can make up their own mind. >> My personal opinion based on what I've. seen. I haven't met the guy so I have to. add that to the story but my personal. opinion is that um that he has. definitely presented some fake. photographs. Now some people say well. yeah because some of the earlier stuff. was legit but then it dried up and so he. wanted to keep getting attention so he. faked some stuff and I was like well if. you faked one you faked two ah it's kind. of tough for me to go well was he.

telling the truth? Yeah you I don't. know. Uh but but I'm also told that. there's a certain force field because a. lot of people go why is it always. blurry? It's a little fuzzy. There's a. there's a a field around that that kind. of affects the environment. >> Sure. >> Gravity field or something. I'm not a. physicist. I don't tell you. But in age. of disclosure, uh how put off has talks. about the nature of propulsion and how. that bends warps folds the space around. it when it causes it to be a little.

blurry. And I was told that a long time. ago that if there's a crystal clear like. defined edge around the craft, generally. that's considered to be fake. >> Yep. >> Excuse me. Yeah. >> Cuz they're warping. >> space a little fuzzy. >> cuz you see a lot of discs where the. surface is almost moving. Those I tend. to believe. >> You'll see that too. But no, but even. like you know um 1950 McMinnville, Oregon, uh the Trents, you look at that. photograph and boy that's pretty damn.

good. people that had the some of the original. prints and zoomed in on it. You can see. it's blurred around the edge. So, it's. pretty authentic. And yeah, two. witnesses, broad daylight, multiple. angles, points of reference, very good. photograph. >> Is there anything that we didn't cover. today about Virginia or any of your. other work you want to get out there? >> Um, if you support my work, please go. watch Moment of Contact: New Revelations. of Alien Encounters. I worked so hard to. get that out there in timely fashion.

included a very quick snapshot of some. of the relevant aspects that's been. happening in transparency, pushing for. transparency in the US government. The. first 20 minutes is all new and then and. then some of the most compelling. firsthand eyewitness testimony in the. history of phenomenon. If you believe. it, I tend to I believe Dr. because I. can't find a motive. He's not selling a. doc. He's not selling a book. He's not. asking for money for a story. He's still. still the lead neurosurgeon at the. hospital still to this day. And I'm.

sitting there going, I've met his wife. I met his kids. I met his co-workers. I. went had a whole tour at the hospital. All the people he's been working with. So, he'd have to be lying to everybody. [clears throat]. >> There's no way. He was too he was so. affected by it. >> See why he would do that? And he goes, "I'll take a public lie detector test. tomorrow with my hand on a Bible." Like, what does this guy have to win by? Why. would he do that in his twilight years? I just Yeah, look me in the eyes, man. You the tears holding on to me. He's.

like, I'm telling the truth, man. I'm. coming forward because younger. generations need to know this is real. >> Moment of contact. Definitely want to. watch that. Um, I bought it on Apple TV. I'm assuming it's it's everywhere. >> It's on Amazon, Apple, Google, Fandango. Yeah, I think I gave your crew a link. that you hopefully will be in the video. It's a genius link and you just click on. it. It'll take you to various platforms. I appreciate you having me on. I really. do. >> Sure. We got your proton email. Anywhere. else that we can find you. >> Oh, yeah. Good idea. Thank you. Uh, find.

me on X, formerly known as Twitter. It's. James It's James C as in Charlie Fox. James CF Fox. And you can I post all. everything relevant that I do there. I. do have a an Instagram account, but I. got a couple 20-year-olds running that. one, so I [laughter] don't take it as. often as I should. How do I do this? >> I'm in the same boat. James, thanks so. much for coming in. This has been a joy. >> Thanks for having me on. I really. appreciate it. >> All right. Bye, everybody. So, that's. James Fox's investigation into Arginia.

Now, here's what we can verify. The. incident that happened in January 1996. [music]. Multiple witnesses, civilian and. military, reported seeing both a craft. in distress and strange creatures in and. around [music] the town. A military. police officer named Marco Sherez died. about 3 weeks after allegedly capturing. one of the beings. His official cause of. death was listed [music] as sepsis and. pneumonia from what doctors called. benign bacteria though they never. identified its source [music] and that's. documented in the autopsy. The big claim.

here is Dr. Idel Vventerelli's [music]. testimony. He's a practicing. neurosurgeon at Regional Hospital in. Virginia. 45 years [music] in medicine. still performing brain surgery. He says. he had 3 to four minutes of face-to-face. contact with a [music] live non-human. entity in the ICU on January 20th, 1996. [music] He's not selling a book. He's. not asking for money. His colleagues, other doctors who've known him for. decades, [music] all went on camera and. vouched for him. Now, what I keep coming.

back to is what James said about motive. [music]. If Dr. is lying, he's lying to his wife, his children, his colleagues, his entire. community. Why would he do that? There's. no upside. and he's offered to take a. [music] public lie detector test with. his hand on a Bible, something he. doesn't take lightly. This is either the. [music] most significant testimony in. the history of UFO research or it's an. elaborate hoax with no motive, but I. think it deserves [music] serious. investigation either way. You can watch. James' documentary, Moment of Contact: New Revelations. [music] It just.

dropped. And his National Press Club. event from January 2026 is on YouTube. for free. And if you have any. information about the [music] Vargi. case, James has set up a secure proton. mail for tips. Until next time, be safe, be kind, [music] and know that you are. appreciated. Oh [music]. yeah,

I play Bib and Area 51. A secret code. [music] inside the Bible [singing] said. I would. I love my UFOs and paranormal [music]. fun as well as music songs hanging like. I should. But then [music] another conspiracy. theory becomes the truth, my friends. And it [music] never ends. [singing]. No, it never ends.

I [music] feel the crap. I got stuck. inside M's home with MK truck. I feel. [music] only aware. Did Stanley Cubric fake the moon landing. alone [music]. on a film set? I would shadow people. there. The Roswell [music].

just fought the smiling man. I'm told. and his name [music] was cold and I. can't believe I'm dancing with the fish. and [music] your fish on Thursday night. all through the night. All I ever wanted [music] was to hear. the truth. all through the night.

>> [music]. >> The math man sightings and the solar. storm still [music] come to have got the. secret city under ground. Mysterious number stations, Planet. [music] Circle, Project Stargate, and.

where the dark watchers found [music]. in a simulation. Don't you worry though. The black night. so I [music] can't believe I'm dancing. with the fish. on Thursday night [music]. and. all through the night. All I ever wanted [music] was to hear. the truth.

My all through the night. [music]. when they change you. all through the night.

loves to [music] dance. Because [music] she is a camera. loves to dance when the feeling is. wasting time. [music]. Heat. [music]. Heat.

>> [music].