GOP Playbook: Democrat Edition w/ Tim Miller & David Faris | The Weekly Show with Jon Stewart

TIM MILLER: I just don't want them. to be like, fuck it, because Donald Trump won twice, this whole thing is over. And so now, we're just going to act like Trump. That's what I don't want. JON STEWART: It's not "fuck it.". And my only response-- and, Tim, I'm wary that--. I know you have a hard out and you've got to go catch a plane. TIM MILLER: That's so embarrassing that you. said that publicly to people. JON STEWART: Did I say plane? I meant--. TIM MILLER: I would never hard out Jon Stewart, people. He's just making an excuse. He actually has something to do. JON STEWART: He's hard outing me. [MUSIC PLAYING]. Hey there, ladies and gentlemen.

Welcome to The Weekly Show podcast. My name is Jon Stewart. It is October 1. Rocktober. It is Wednesday. It's mid-afternoon. The government currently is shut down. And maybe it'll be back this afternoon. Maybe it'll be back next year. I don't even know, other than a shit ton of people losing. their jobs, Donald Trump has been basically. administering over this country as though there. weren't a government.

So I don't know, in terms of the amount of things. that he does, that that will even change. And perhaps he will accelerate it. But I do give the Democrats credit for finally putting up. in a moment where they have had zero representation, the one. moment of leverage they identified two. simple things that they would do. to keep the government going. And it has to do with health care. And I am glad that they are at least taking this stand in this.

moment, whether they get what they are asking. for or whether they don't. It is pleasing to see Chuck Schumer rise--. rise with the voice of a powerful, aging Borscht. Belt comedian and do that. Meanwhile, the thing still happen so fast and furious.

And I just want to point out, just one thing that gets. slightly buried in all of this, and that is, just as an aside, Donald Trump thought it might be a good idea. for our military to practice military shit. on American cities. And it created a little bit of an uproar--. not that much. And I just have to co-sign the idea--. it is so hard to get in real game work.

The preseason stuff, it's very difficult. to prepare your team for when those first games. are going to come down. So I absolutely understand-- he's going. to get us probably into a war. He tried with the bombing of Iran. or not being able to really be forceful against. Vladimir Putin. And, boy, he's making a great case here. These guys got to get in the work. And why not let them get in that work on people.

that didn't vote for you? That makes total sense. Just some pre-real world bombings and invasions and such. of cities that don't matter--. you know, your New Yorks, your Chicagos, your Baltimores, your Philadelphia. You know, your enemies within--. why not practice on them? I think it's a great learning exercise, and couldn't have been a more reasonable.

comment by a commander-in-chief in front of 800 generals. And I also, obviously, like any good personal, they ended their addresses to the generals. with the universal phrase that Sun Tzu first used. many, many centuries ago--. no fatties. Anyway, we will continue our discussion of the Democrats.

that we started with Ken Martin of the DNC. We're going to continue it this week with our guests to discuss. even further what we believe might. be positive or negative strategies. for Democrats to follow. So here we go. [MUSIC PLAYING]. Ladies and gentlemen, on this historic and action packed day. here in the United States of America, we are lucky to be joined by David. Faris Professor of Political Science, Roosevelt University.

And he's a contributing writer for The Nation. And, of course, Tim Miller, host of The Bulwark podcast, comms director for Jeb Bush in 2016, and bon vivant--. all around excellent commentator. in many different ways. Guys, thank you so much for joining me today. as I try to avoid the shadows and sun. that are coming through here. This is where we'll start. The Democrats, people who voted for the Democrats, have no representation on a federal level at all--.

not in the judiciary, not in the executive, not in the House of Representatives, not in the Senate. They've got nothing. The Republicans have needed them. not to do whatever the fuck they wanted for as long. as they wanted. This is the one chance where they need 60. votes in the Senate to do it. And the Democrats have drawn the line. to try and get something. In your mind, and I've been begging them to do something--. in your minds, and we'll start with David,

is this the proper use of the one whiff of leverage. that they have in this moment? DAVID FARIS: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I don't think they should. have rolled over the last time that Trump needed 60 votes. JON STEWART: Come on, David. Yeah. Let's fight. DAVID FARIS: And I think it's an opportunity. to focus the public's attention on a variety of things. that Trump is doing, including the lawlessness, which you can shoehorn in through the fight about. health care. So I do think this is a huge opportunity for the Democrats.

to use their very limited leverage. I mean, who knows, maybe they'll nuke the filibuster. and it'll all be moot, right? But certainly, I think from a strategic perspective, yeah, they have to make a stand here because there might not. be another opportunity to put the lawlessness, the expansion. of executive power, the empowerment, all this stuff that Trump has been doing since January--. this is a pretty unique opportunity to litigate that. and to try to win that public relations battle, while, of course, keeping in mind that real people's.

lives are being affected. JON STEWART: Boy, well, that's--. Tim--. TIM MILLER: Yikes. JON STEWART: He brings up an interesting point there. Do they have the litigators? Not that Chuck Schumer isn't--. as his shoulders slowly begin to roll over into his nipples, do they have the litigators to make that case in public? TIM MILLER: Are the nipples growing or just. the shoulders shrinking? JON STEWART: I don't know. It's the high holidays. I can't comment. TIM MILLER: Here's the thing--. so in a vacuum, I agree that this the Democrats. should fight. I agree on principle they should fight.

I don't think there's any reason. that they should be at all complicit. in Trump's lawless government. And if Trump felt like he needed Democrats in Congress. to do things, he should have come to them before he. put the tariffs in place. And he's illegally taxing the country with his tariffs. that should have gone through Congress. You know, and it's not stopped him before to act lawlessly. or to act against the norms or the traditions of the Congress. if he wants to do something. So I don't think there's any reason for the Democrats. to be part and parcel of it. Here's the problem, though--.

what's the strategy? What's the end game? Like, how do they get out of it in a way that makes them look. strong and not weak again? And listening to David, I start to get nervous, right? Because he's like, well, this is. a good opportunity to draw the public's. attention to Trump's behavior. This is a good opportunity to win. the public relations battle. Do we have the horses to do that? Like, right? I mean, do we think that Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer. are capable of winning a public relations battle against Trump? Part of that is a knock on those guys. Part of it is just that that's Trump's skill set. If Trump is good at anything, it's winning.

public relations battles. And so I don't know. Like, that is the part of it that I. think that, like, there's not going. to be a strategic victory. Like, Trump is not going to retreat, and we're no longer going to have masked ICE agents. in the streets, and Congress is going to vote on tariffs, or whatever the issue is. He's not going to fund Medicaid, right? Like, he's not going to retreat on the policy. So if you have to win the PR, then you got to figure out how. you're going to win the PR. And that part, I'm a little skeptical of. JON STEWART: Well, that's a good point. And maybe we should tease this out, because there's. two things going on here. One is, oh, let's draw attention to his lawlessness.

I mean, he gave a speech on the day they shut down. the government that the United States Army should practice. in American cities to get ready for whatever. invasions are coming up. You got to work it out somewhere. TIM MILLER: Are you in the enemy. within that he mentioned that the military should go for? JON STEWART: I would assume so. TIM MILLER: But you're not uniformed. He said, we don't know who the enemy within. They're more dangerous than the enemy without, and you don't know who they are. JON STEWART: You don't know who they are. TIM MILLER: Yeah.

JON STEWART: But it's important to think. about invading Baltimore. It's kind of like an off Broadway, kind of like working on your thing. and getting ready for when you want to go there. But I want to draw attention, because there. are two things here. One is they've drawn attention to health care. They've said all this is about is restoring. funding into Medicaid and making sure that the subsidies. that were going to go into the Obamacare. are going to be put back in here. And here's where I take issue with the Democratic Party,

whether it's about winning a PR battle with Trump. or doing any of those things--. I don't know. But, once again, the Democrats are in a position of defending. the status quo of policies that most people in the United. States think suck. Meanwhile, on the same day Trump rolls out Trump RX--.

hey, I'll just threaten Pfizer with 100% tariffs. and then just open up a prescription drug outside. of the middle managers and sell directly. to the public at a discount. It is malpractice for the Democrats, in my mind--. and, David, we'll go with you-- to not have the forethought. and creativity to think about programs that would fix what. Americans hate about things like our health care system, but, instead, decide we have to shut the government down.

to protect these things that most people think. are failing them in the first place, David. DAVID FARIS: Right. I mean, like, so what you really need here. is a time machine, right? And you need a time machine to go back, and, like, come up with popular health care proposals, and not be in this position of being, like, our big thing is tax credits or these like little sort. of marginal adjustments to health care policy that. are not especially popular. So, yeah, they're in a pickle in that sense. Although, I mean, I think the polling. is there for the ACA in general,

like, is more popular than not. But, obviously, the failure to address health care in any kind. of systematic way, I think, contributes. to the general frustration with our political system. Democrats are just as guilty of that as anybody else. And Jeffries and Schumer are not the ideal message. carriers here. I mean, if you look at polling going back to the early 21st. century, consistently, the least. popular people in the country are congressional leaders. And so I think that you have to be realistic about that. JON STEWART: Isn't that the malpractice, though, of. the Democratic Party, David? There is no-- like, the fact that you.

would need a time machine--. Democrats, forever, have been saying what we need. They always run on the audacity of hope. They run on audacity, and they end up. governing on the timidity of what they think they. might be able to get through. And, Tim, haven't we learned now from Trump, like, how in God's name is he coming up. with socialist programs like taking 10% of companies. and having the government directly distribute.

prescription drugs, and the Democrats are stuck going, if you just give us more subsidies for the insurance. companies who are raising their rates 75% to 80%, won't that be fine? How did we find ourselves here? TIM MILLER: Well, we could do a whole podcast. on the history of that and the timid Democratic leadership. But I'm going to do something really countercultural at first. here. JON STEWART: Boom. TIM MILLER: I'm going to praise--. I'm going to say, well, Hakeem Jeffries might. have a point on one thing.

Here's the thing-- people are getting their health care. premiums right now, right, because they're. re-upping for the year, and they're going up. And so it is an opportunity not to defend the system, but to just say, hey, that cost on your bill that just went up, that's this guy's fault over here. And that's another thing that the Democrats were not very. good at, going back to the Biden administration, because Biden wasn't that good at talking, was that he wasn't that good at saying, like, I get credit for this. Like, this thing got built in your town. I did that, right? Like, he never did that. So this is an opportunity just to say, simply,

not to defend the health care system, but to say, your costs are going up right now. It's this guy's fault. And the reason why they're going up. is because they just passed this bill that's. more tax cuts for rich people. And the other thing that we're going to do, by the way, is, in addition to your health care costs going up, the fucking bill at Walmart is going. up because of his tariffs. And he's taking that money, and he's using. it to bail out Argentina. He's using it to bail out farmers. And he's using it to buy Intel. Like, I do think there's a way into that that is potentially.

resonant, like, if you got the right messengers for it. and if you're fucking drilling him on it. JON STEWART: Right. And do we believe, David, that they will. have the right messengers? Because what Tim just said, boy, that's a very coherent case. That's something that you will occasionally see. But that does not seem to be well presented in any kind. of a disciplined way. DAVID FARIS: No. And, I mean, again, I think, like, we have this problem,

right, which is that our congressional leaders are not. our best communicators, right? They're not our most charismatic people. in the party. JON STEWART: How dare you, sir? I'm going to show you a video of Chuck Schumer holding hands. with with, I believe, Maxine Waters, shouting, we will fight. DAVID FARIS: Yeah. Yeah. TIM MILLER: People want fighting, Jon. They said they want fighting. I mean, and he said he's fighting. What is your problem? DAVID FARIS: And he's terrifying. I mean, he's terrifying. Like, nobody wants to fight Chuck Schumer, right? JON STEWART: Exactly. Every day, the loudest, the most inflammatory.

takes dominate our attention. And the bigger picture gets lost. It's all just noise and no light. Ground News puts all sides of the story in one place. so you can see the context. They provide the light. It starts conversations beyond the noise. They aggregate and organize information just. to help readers make their own decisions. You can see how many news outlets have reported. on the story, whether it's underreported,

overreported by one side, or the other side, or whatever side of the political spectrum. Ground News provides users reports that easily compare. headlines, or reports that give a summarized breakdown. of the specific differences in reporting. across all the spectrum. It's a great resource. Go to groundnews.com/stewart, and subscribe for 40% off. The unlimited Access Vantage subscription brings the price. down to about $5 a month. It's groundnews.com/stewart or scan the QR code on the screen.

DAVID FARIS: I think we have to set our expectations. realistically about how much of the public conversation. Schumer and Jeffries themselves are going to be able to drive. I think it's about setting kind of a party-wide messaging. strategy and pointing out it's not just about the ACA. subsidies, right? Like, everybody's health care costs are going up. Like, my health care costs are going up. It's, like, a nightmare time. And this has been happening for years and years and years. where the cost of health care are raising--. JON STEWART: Far beyond the cost of living,

or inflation, or anything. DAVID FARIS: Faster than the cost than inflation, right? And if you go back to, like, the Harris campaign, there wasn't any particularly good ideas to systematically. address that. That's, like, a party-wide failing going back. many, many years that you can't rectify in the moment. here as much as you can try to use this as an opportunity. to plug in to people's frustrations, their fears that their health care costs are going to go. up, and try to win some kind of, like, again, not, like, a strategic victory, but some kind of PR victory. where people associate the Democrats with the people.

who are trying to prevent your health care. costs from going up. JON STEWART: Yeah. But, guys, we're dancing around something here. We're all talking about, like, if they could just message it. a little better, and be a little bit more disciplined, and get some people, what I'm saying. is the malpractice is Kamala Harris has 107 days--. that's not enough time to put together my coherent thing. Well, that ended in November. It is now almost a year later. How the fuck is the most interesting health care.

proposal just rolled out on a morning by Donald Trump. about the government directly selling. prescription drugs, to use the leverage of the government? The malpractice here, in my mind, isn't messaging. It's that they don't know where they're messaging us to. They have not created a platform. or infrastructure that addresses, directly, the needs.

They are still dancing around the old paradigm. I think that's my point. Tim disagrees. TIM MILLER: I kind of do. JON STEWART: You at home listening to the podcast, I'm sensing frustration on his face. TIM MILLER: I kind of do. Yeah, this is why I never would have been a good White. House Press Secretary. You can just-- or I'm a terrible poker player. Do play poker with me. You know exactly what I'm thinking at all times. Look, man, I agree with you. So I don't disagree that the Democrats should have. a fucking health care plan and the Democrats should have. a vision, and a direction, and someone should.

emerge to try to lead them. But, like, that's not actually necessary to be. politically successful. I mean, as the former Republican here, may I remind you that Mitch McConnell did pretty. good for a few years as the opposition. to Barack Obama just saying, you will do nothing. And I will blame everything that bad happens on you. JON STEWART: That's a good point. That's a good point. TIM MILLER: And to me, that's kind of like-- that's. a useful first step, right, is fighting Trump, doing everything you can to slow him down. And then when bad things happen, many of them. Trump is to blame for, so you can credibly.

say he's to blame for it-- but even. for some of the other ones, like, sorry, man, the buck stops with you. You wanted to be a wannabe authoritarian, this bad thing is happening, we're going to blame it on you, and we're going to do so relentlessly, and we're going to remind people why. the current status quo sucks. And that's, like, an easier thing. to do than what you're asking. And so I just feel like my suggestion to them. might be, like, the first little baby step. towards doing things better. JON STEWART: I think that's actually a fine retort to that.

And I would agree with you that there is something to meeting. in the basement of a steakhouse on the day of the inauguration. of Barack Obama and saying, we will deny him everything, and putting that into play, and doing it, and doing it really well-- and not getting them. Supreme Court justices, and not getting. them legislative victories--. TIM MILLER: And not having a health care plan. JON STEWART: And not having a health care plan within that. David, are you seeing them--.

right now, they're doing neither. So I'm going to say, are you seeing the plan. that Tim is talking about slowly starting to coalesce, along with maybe the bubbling up of the thing. that I'm talking about? DAVID FARIS: I wish I saw that, but, no, not really. I mean, like-- [LAUGHTER]. JON STEWART: We had an opening for sunshine, David. DAVID FARIS: Yeah. No, sorry. I mean, going back to the inauguration, right, Congressional Democrats, like, one of the first things they. did was to help pass legislation. that a lot of people in their base didn't like. And, like, you set aside the merits of the legislation. of the Laken Riley Act, I think the instinct of the Democrats.

from the very beginning was to find ways to cooperate, find. ways to moderate, to make it look like they were. reasonable people on the theory that Trump had just won this, like, magnificent mandate to govern the country. And, like, we have to accommodate. ourselves to that reality. And I think what people in the Democratic rank and file. have been screaming for, like, months, and months, and months is that that's not what we want, right? It's not just that. It's not what we want. It's not the path back to power. What Democrats need to be doing here,

fundamentally, is making sure that Trump is holding. the bag for all the bad things that are about to happen, kind of what Tim was talking about, right? Like, when you sit down with Republicans. and you negotiate good faith compromises, like, not only can you not trust the president. to carry them out, but you're helping. the president politically. And I think that they should not be doing that. I think that's, like, what the base has been. so animated about is they want confrontation. rather than cooperation. I think that's why people are, like, maybe briefly, momentarily happy right now, because the Democrats do.

appear to be making a stand. It's just a matter of communicating what. that stand is about and then following. through that narrative thread. Like, because this crisis will pass, right? Like we're talking about this like this. is going to be the thing that people remember in '26 or '28. JON STEWART: Oh, this crisis will. pass probably three hours from now when a new crisis arises. The speed, the circadian rhythm of national crises. is so different now--. the churn of it is what's so dizzying. DAVID FARIS: That's because the president keeps.

starting them on purpose. You know what I mean? Like, we've never really had a president who's, like, animating principle is, like, let me cause. one crisis after another. He wakes up in the morning, like, how can I cause. a constitutional crisis today? And we're all living with that. It's very stressful. JON STEWART: It's like second hand ADHD. Like, he is the statement president. He likes proclamations. He's not a big fan of follow through. But we're all getting that second hand ADHD. And it's discomforting. DAVID FARIS: Yeah. I mean, he's the president that's made us all realize.

that we have an unhealthy relationship with our phones, because we all want to, like, take. the New York Times app off and not have to deal with this. Like, you want to be able to, like, sit down to dinner. JON STEWART: New York Times app? You dinosaur. [LAUGHTER]. DAVID FARIS: Is there something else? JON STEWART: I'm on Discord right now talking. to all my dissatisfied friends. Tim, is it just that it's the churn. and we're not able to keep up in a disciplined fashion? TIM MILLER: There just really is no precedent for it. And so I think that you have to think about him.

in a completely different paradigm from any. politician before. And, like, one example I always use with this. is back when I was a Republican, 12 years ago now--. feels like a nightmare, feels like a lifetime--. I was on Mitt Romney's campaign. And Mitt Romney said something very stupid about how. 47% of the country--. JON STEWART: I remember. TIM MILLER: -- OK, at a private fundraiser. And if Donald Trump had said that exact--. if you just put that paragraph, about 47%. of the people being takers in the middle.

of his rambling speech yesterday to the generals, it wouldn't have even been mentioned. Like, nobody would even talk about it, right? Like, that thing derailed Mitt Romney's campaign. Like, Trump yesterday talked, again, about making Canada the 51st state in front of the generals. No one even mentions that. Like, it didn't even come up in the news coverage. because there was so much other crazy shit that him and Hegseth. said yesterday, right? And so it becomes challenging for media to, like, cover it. with the right amount of focus because he benefits from-- it's.

the same way as, like, whatever, a hockey team or basketball team. that's fouling on every play. Like, the refs, eventually, don't. want to call a foul every time down the court, right? And so it becomes challenging for the media coverage. And it becomes challenging for people to understand, like, what is a real threat? What should I care about? And he benefits from that environment. Like, the only way to combat that environment--. now I'm mixing metaphors, I've gone from basketball. to war-- but it's to, like, do asymmetric warfare back at him. And instead, for some fucking reason, for 10 years, like,

the Democrats and a lot of the media folks. have been using the same playbook. while he continues his completely different paradigm. JON STEWART: What Tim is getting to is. this unprecedented figure. And it does feel a bit like he's ChatGPT 5.0. and we're all walking around with AOL floppy disks. And we put them in. And we don't know how to handle this particular. But I think that interpretation, for me,

allows the Democrats to skirt the malpractice that I think. has occurred within their party over these last, I'm going to say, 40 years. DAVID FARIS: 40? JON STEWART: Well, to the rise of what I would call, like, establishment, status quo neoliberalism. that allowed them to shift their focus from labor.

to capital. I mean, there's a larger economic conversation, but, yeah. To me, their policies shifted from helping labor. to helping capital and investment. and got very comfortable with that class of donor and voter. DAVID FARIS: Can I ask you if that's true? So maybe that's true. I don't know. JON STEWART: Oh, by the way, I don't know if any of this. is true. This is just me talking shit. TIM MILLER: Yeah. Every Democrat I have on, I ask this question.

And so I come from a place, as a capitalist, I'm more sympathetic to the Democrats' pivot on the merits. But I'm open to the fact that, like, my policy preferences. are actually bad politics. That's possible. Is it that? Or is it the culture? Is it culture? Like, is it economics, or is it culture? Because I had Joe Manchin on the pod about a week. and a half ago, and I asking him about this. I was like, West Virginia used to be a Democratic state. You were the last of the Democrats to win there. Why did Democrats lose West Virginia? And then he goes into your answer, right?

We lost focus on the working people. Our economic platform changed. And I was like, but are you sure? Like, even if you had whatever populist. left economic platform, if you also, like--. are the people in West Virginia really mad about the one trans. girl that is in on the lacrosse team? And isn't the culture, like, and the feeling. that the culture left them, and that the people. that are celebrated are more diverse and live.

in the big cities--. and, like, isn't that really what underscores all of this? And I don't. And that's a much more challenging nut. for the Democrats to crack than to say, OK, well, if we just. do a little bit more lefty economic stuff, then. that'll solve our problems. JON STEWART: Oh, I agree with you that that. doesn't solve their problems. And I do think where that conversation has merit--. and, David, you can jump in on this--. I think if you look at where the Democrats seem. to be focusing their efforts, it was in diversity.

but not economic diversity. I think there's an argument to be made that diversity--. I think part of it is in the way. that they talk about that-- that diversity suddenly. became the one trans girl that was playing on the sports team. But what I would say is it's in the way. that I think, for instance, there is no such thing. in my mind as an entitlement. It's about investment. There is no such thing as diversity. It's about opening up tributaries.

to areas that have been deserts as far as opportunity. So I think, oftentimes, we talk about diversity. as though it's separate from economics, right, or equity. And I'm saying I don't think it's separate, and that if you are forcefully making economic arguments, diversity is included in that. It's just that it seemed like there's diversity.

and economics within it. And I'm saying it's economics. And within that argument is diversity. Does that make any sense to you? DAVID FARIS: I mean, you can walk and chew. gum at the same time, right? I mean, you can have a coherent economic message--. JON STEWART: We're talking about Chuck Schumer. DAVID FARIS: OK, maybe not him. But a lot of people could. And I think part of the problem here. is that if we're going to come back to culture war issues, like trans women in sports, it's like Democrats did not. really put up a fight, right? So they had, like, the worst of both worlds where they seemed.

to have a policy in place that people didn't like, but they also weren't willing to defend it. And the same was true during the Biden administration, I think, various immigration policies, right, where, like, we were doing things that maybe had some, like, bad optics right here and there. And you had the president, who was not. just incapable of defending those policies. on their own terms because he was kind out of it--. it was that the whole party didn't want to, right? And that allowed the opposition to focus. on the public policy issues.

JON STEWART: To be fair, he did have. shitty immigration policies. And they were exposed when they got trolled. by the governor of Texas. And when he sent buses of people and everyone went, we don't have the resources for this. And they're like, welcome to our world. DAVID FARIS: Right. And they rolled over for it, Jon. So they were busing and flying people to blue states. and dumping them in the cities, right, Which was not. popular here. And then you had the Biden administration, who was responsible for some of these folks being here,

not willing to take action to unlock the various resources. that could have, like, fixed at least the perception. problem, right? So you had bad policy with bad optics. and no one willing to go and even explain. to people what was happening. And that allowed the Republicans. to define the whole issue for us. in ways that I think was really damaging, apart. from the policy mistakes. TIM MILLER: I don't know if you had the most compelling. messenger defending the most left view on cultural issues. that does anything for the Democrats. with their problems in a lot of the red states.

and purple states. JON STEWART: Part of that, though, Tim, is do you really believe that most. Democrats think an important issue is. trans participation in sports? Like, I think that was much more the obsession of the right. that allowed defined-- because the Democrats are more, look, it's a question of inclusion versus, I don't know, competitive balance-- whatever you want to call it. I think most Democrats look at it like, how many of these kids. are there?

Like, they don't really think about it that much. But they allowed the right to define. that as a core central tenet of the Democratic Party, when. I don't think it was in any way--. the reason why they didn't really go to the mat. for it is probably because they thought, well, like, how many of these kids are there? Are they really dominating? Like, what's going on? TIM MILLER: And I guess that's just. a failure of understanding, like, voters. I just think we hear a lot from sometimes. from Democratic strategists is, well, they should really just focus on the kitchen table issues.

And when they say "kitchen table issues,". they're talking about finances, they're talking. about economics. And, again, if the Democrats want. to have a more populist economic platform. and talk about that, I think that would help them. But people also talked about trans girls. in sports at the kitchen table. Like, it was a popular-- like, there. might not have been that many trans. girls participating in sports. I understand that. It's not a critical issue for most people. But for whatever reason, the Republicans. were successful in that because it animated people. People felt like there was a sense of unfairness,

that it was an interesting question. It tickled something in people's lizard brain. that made them, like, want to respond to it. And so you can't, then, ignore it. You can't ignore it. You've got to engage on it. JON STEWART: And they engaged on it poorly. TIM MILLER: Yeah, they engaged on it poorly. And, by the way, the street also works both ways. Like, Trump's not the only one that can play these games. Like, the Democrats can find random issues. to get people talking about them that the Republicans do. that are unpopular and think about things. that appeal outside the base around all these issues.

JON STEWART: Let me tell you, I think that's exactly true. And I don't understand why-- remember, there was a big ad. in the presidential campaign--. Kamala Harris is for they/them, Donald Trump is for you. I don't know why Democrats don't go, that's right. Donald Trump is for you. If you ran an international sex trafficking ring that didn't--. and show Ghislaine Maxwell. Donald Trump is for you, if you are. a billionaire tech company owner who.

wants to get out of tariffs. Donald Trump is for you. Like, and define who "you" is and use that against him. Hey, folks, I know most people look at me. and they think to themselves, well, that's. a fashion player right there. That dude, he knows what's up. I'm surprised he's even got time. to do the podcast knowing that he should be in Milan. sitting with Anna Wintour. But, actually, you know what I am?

Comfortable. You might be thinking, well, sure, if you wear. the same t-shirt as last week. But do you know where you can find. clothing that fits into this? A company that I actually love--. it's so comfortable and durable, you wear it non-stop. Quince. Quince has got all the fall staples. You actually live in denim, the boots, the leather jackets, the unbelievably soft--. what do they call them? They're 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters, starting at, like, $60.

Come on. No, I'm not talking about Des Moines cashmere. Mongolian cashmere. So what makes Quince different? They work directly with ethical factories. They cut out the middleman. You get top quality materials and craftsmanship. at half the price of other premium brands. Keep it classic and cool this fall with long lasting staples. from Quince. Go to Quince.com/TWS for free shipping on your order. and 365-day returns.

That's Q-U-I-N-C-E Quince.com/TWS, free. shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com/TWS. Like, David, this gets to your point. And I wanted to talk to you about this. You wrote an article saying a lot of the shit that Donald. Trump does can be applied right back to Republicans. that they don't. And, to Tim's point, they do have opportunities to do that, but they don't take it.

And I think we have a tendency to blame. the consultant class, the political class, the thing--. but this party is ripe for the type of takeover. that Trump was able to pull off in 2016. I'm sure of it. And what does that look like, David? You did kind of a thought experiment on that. DAVID FARIS: Yeah. I mean, the thought experiment was, like, OK, the Trump. administration is obviously operating on this theory that, like, no one will ever get their hands on this, like, Earth scorching apparatus that they're building. out of the White House, right?

And so I'm not necessarily endorsing a lot of the things. that I floated as, like, what we could do, right, but it would fit into those general categories. And it's, like, constant culture warring, like rename Reagan National Airport. George Floyd National Airport. Just you wake up in the morning and you're like, how can I make the other side angry, and miserable, and deflated? TIM MILLER: Can I just say, I think. that would probably backfire. DAVID FARIS: I know. Yes, yes, yes. JON STEWART: That one in particular. TIM MILLER: That's not any of my Reagan love coming in. There's no bad ideas in a brainstorm, but just throwing that one out there. DAVID FARIS: No, no, the point is not that this.

would make us popular, right? The point is, like, to highlight the absurdity. JON STEWART: This was the beginning. of the contract for America. This is how it starts. DAVID FARIS: Colin Kaepernick National Airport. I don't know. JON STEWART: There you go. DAVID FARIS: You could imagine, like, 50 different ways to do this. JON STEWART: Take A Knee International Airport. DAVID FARIS: Right. But I think the Democrats need to start thinking about, like, if the Supreme Court--. the Supreme Court still has not ruled on a lot of the things. that Trump is doing. They've issued rulings on the emergency docket. But, in theory, like, the ability of Trump to just, like, fire people on the National Labor Relations Board,

for example, that remains to be litigated. in a decisive fashion. And I think that Democrats need to start thinking. about how can we use--. if these principles are allowed to stand, if the next Democratic president takes office. under the unitary executive theory, under the Roberts' court's creation. of an imperial presidency, how should we approach that? Are there things that we could do. that would be good public policy, and then highlight the things that I think are, like, well, this is ridiculous, right? Like you don't want to govern in a way that I call it.

abuse of federalism, where you're picking on blue states. You're highlighting-- you're, like, threatening. to invade only blue states. You're talking about people in those places. like they're subhuman. I live in Chicago. And I'm on, like, year 10 of the President of the United. States talking about the place that I live like it is. like a rat infested hellhole. And it's very exhausting. And I don't recommend that we do that. But I do think it's worth thinking about, like, how could the tables be turned? JON STEWART: David, I think I would say, I think you have to.

And I think the way you look at it-- like, Republicans are. allowed to decide that they have pocket veto power over how. their tax dollars are spent. I'm not spending my money on NPR. because that doesn't agree 100% of the time. with the things I say. I don't understand why Democrats. cannot do the same thing. Look, there are tax exempt--. I'm not religious. Why is my tax dollars--. I don't know anything about Argentina's economic crisis. Why are my tax dollars going-- why doesn't the left use.

the levers of government power to demonstrate that that shit. can't-- it's what I used to say about, like, you want to give me all the money spent on the Iraq war, I will gladly fund condom distribution, like, myself. Shouldn't they do that? I've upset Tim again. TIM MILLER: You've upset me. Yeah. You have. It just goes against my nature.

This all just goes-- this is, like, why--. I'm like, I left the Republican Party because these guys. are acting like assholes. And now I'm in, whatever, the pro-democracy movement, so-called, and the people around me are like, no, we need to be assholes like them. And I'm like, you're kicking me out too? I'm going to be on an island? There's part of this that I agree with, I guess. At some point, there has to be some de-escalation. This is probably not the right conversation for that. I think there are places for escalation, though--. [LAUGHTER]. -- strategically. Strategically. Like going after churches probably, and naming. things after George Floyd--. God love George Floyd, and people should name things.

after them if they want. I just don't know if those are going to be. political winners, per se. I think there's some things that might be, though. Like, what about if these guys break the law because they're. going after American citizens, people with masks, you better watch out, because the next DOJ isn't going. to be Merrick Garland's DOJ. And we're going to hold accountable the people that. broke the law and harassed American citizens. and legal residents. And we're going to go after the people that orchestrated it. We're going to go after the people that took $50 grand. in a Kava bag and did corruption.

And we're going to go after people that. did crypto corruption, and paid this president money, and thought that they were going to get. something on the back end. If you put six figures into this president's. cryptocurrency, the next DOJ, when the Democrats get back. in charge, are going to come after you, and you better be worried about that. And if you're El Salvador and you're. taking people against due process. and putting them in a gulag, well, when we're back in charge, we're going. to treat you like North Korea. And so I hope that your economy is doing OK, because you're not going to be trading with us anymore, right?

I think there are ways to, like, butch up and play political hardball--. [LAUGHTER]. -- that is not, like, just kind of appealing to the basest. instincts of, like, the most progressive. person in Williamsburg. I think that there are also ways to do it. where, like, Joe Rogan might be like, yeah, I'm for that. Yeah, these guys are making a point. JON STEWART: But, see, that's interesting to me. because that seems far more tenuous, getting back into crackdowns.

I mean, look, the Supreme Court has made it clear corruption. doesn't exist unless somebody writes down, thank. you so much for this $50,000. I will now, very specifically, carry out--. they've made doing all that--. TIM MILLER: That's true for the president. But the Supreme Court doesn't get. a choice when it's just a prosecutor. and 12 people on a jury. I mean, this administration has turned all of the prosecutors. against immigrants. We could turn all the prosecutors. against white collar criminals next time and see how it goes.

Good luck. JON STEWART: Think about the grinding wheels of justice. and how good lawyers can defer all that for four years, or six years, or 10 years. I'm talking about things like-- and this gets us back into-- we. keep talking about Republicans and Democrats in Washington. What about federalism? There are block grants that go to states. Trump has been very clear, if you don't agree with me, I'm going to withhold money. Well, that is something absolutely.

that can be weaponized in the other direction. But forget about weaponization. David, I want to ask you about this. The Democrats have zero power at the federal level-- zero. I don't know that they can even get into the restaurants. I'm not even sure DoorDash delivers to Democrats. in Washington, DC. They've got nothing. But there are blue states that still have a modicum of power. and a modicum of control. And why don't those states find ways to combine that power.

to put a response to the United States. President threatening their funding if they don't. go along with his shenanigans? I think governors and states could be a place where. an effective counterweight to Trump could be, because they actually have power in those places. DAVID FARIS: Yeah, no, absolutely. And I think in terms of DC, don't. forget that we run a sex trafficking ring. out of a pizza restaurant. We can always get in there, OK? JON STEWART: Right. Into the basement.

DAVID FARIS: Into the basement. Right. JON STEWART: Yes. DAVID FARIS: So, yeah, no, this actually is happening, right? So, I mean, I think Democratic governors are among the most. important political actors in the country right now, because all eyes are on them. There's efforts to-- for example, there's efforts to create like a vaccine collaborative group. So when the federal government pulls the funding. or pulls the support for, like, the flu vaccine. or the COVID vaccine, you have blue state. health departments willing to step in and fill those. gaps, right? And I think that that's absolutely. what they should be doing.

I don't think that they should stop at vaccines. I think there's all sorts of things. that are under threat, like predicting the weather, for example. Like, we've cut the National Weather Service to the. bone, right? Like, I think, like, blue states. are going to have to step in there. if they don't want to get hit by a hurricane they. didn't see coming. JON STEWART: But that's a question of bailing out. their own citizens from the irresponsibility. of this government. I'm talking about something different. And, Tim, you're going to love this. TIM MILLER: Oh, no. You want vengeance. I can see it. JON STEWART: Oh, Tim, I so appreciate-- you. and I are now finishing each other's sentences.

TIM MILLER: I live in Louisiana. I'm worried about what's happening. Am I going to be not allowed to travel to California. at the end of this proposal? I'm a little nervous. I want to go to LA in a couple of weeks. JON STEWART: There has got to be a manner by which, look, a lot of these states are giver states. They send more money to the federal government. than they receive in return. There has got to be a way to staunch that flow, even if that means-- well, that's not legal. Yeah, none of this is fucking legal. Legal went out the window years and years ago. Let the Supreme Court catch up.

And, by the way, the Supreme Court makes decisions now, and Trump doesn't even abide by those. So, at a certain point, there has. to be some coordinated effort to battle the levers of power. that Trump has identified. Wouldn't that make sense, Tim? TIM MILLER: Water wars. We're banning Arizona. We're going to block the water out of Arizona. No--. JON STEWART: Tim, now you're singing my song. TIM MILLER: Yeah. You guys are going to--. the desert heat. Watch out next summer. JON STEWART: Thank you.

TIM MILLER: Look, man, there are. elements that I'm with you on. I am for aggressive political pushback. Obviously, everything that Gavin has been doing is great. JON STEWART: Oh, the trolling is the only thing that works. TIM MILLER: Yeah-- JON STEWART: It's been great. TIM MILLER: I think there are things that Democrats. on the Hill could be doing to gum up the works even more, slow them down. Like, look at what Tommy Tuberville did last. time, remember? I can't believe we're complimenting him. He's like, you don't get any promotions in the military. until you--. like, there's shit that one senator can do, and we're not seeing enough of that. I would like to see that.

I don't know exactly what levers of power California. has now-- you should have Gavin on and ask him. The area I think I do kind of agree is projecting. If we get out of this, if the fight is successful, if Trump. is made to fail, if the Democrats are. good at highlighting how he's ruining people's lives, and he is, including people that voted for him, then. the next time they're in charge, the Joe Biden model of, you know, I think the way to win. is we're going to build a lot of infrastructure. in red states, and eventually people will like us--. I think that method is tried and failed.

And I think that a next Democratic administration. thinking about, no, actually, how can we. invest in the dynamic parts of the country that are growing. where people are potentially voting for us. and maybe good luck out there to our friends in. West Virginia. JON STEWART: A little bit of to the victor go the spoils. and a little less what I'm talking about, which is, all right, let's identify--. let's reverse engineer the shit that he's pulling.

TIM MILLER: You can sell me on that. [LAUGHTER]. I want to kick his ass in politics. And I think that, like, little troll stuff they did-- like, the humanity of the immigrant troll. that you mentioned earlier, of sending. people to Martha's Vineyard and then being like, fuck you. And, like, we're going to do ASMR videos. of people in chains. Like, I don't-- like, that stuff grosses me out. But the concept of, oh, OK, you're. going to have to live with some of your policy choices here.

Like, we are going to do PR gimmicks that drive home. the unpopularity and barbarity of some of the things. these guys are doing, I'm for that. And that's the kind of stuff Gavin's doing. And that's why people are responding to it. JON STEWART: And I would almost go the other way. And, David, this goes to the thing you were doing, which is, boy, we have seen how the country responds maybe. just to the idea of action--. the idea that the government--.

I remember in the immigration fight. back with Biden-- and Lankford and. Oklahoma had come up with a plan. that was very conservative. And they had done all the bipartisan work. And they had put it all together. And they talked to Joe Biden about the crisis. And he said, it's important that Congress. be given a chance to do their job and put together this. And it took eight months to a year for them to get it. I think a Democrat from now on will go,

I'm fucking shutting the border tonight. I'm doing it. Executive action will be the coin of the realm, because I think you're starting to understand--. [LAUGHTER] Yeah. TIM MILLER: David, you go, yes. I'm talking too much. David, talk. I'm objecting my no to this. I don't want kings. I don't want MAGA kings. I don't want progressive kings. Sorry, go ahead, David. JON STEWART: For those of you at home, you couldn't see Tim's reaction-- two big thumbs up. and a smile from here to Sacramento. He's so excited about this new plan that I am floating.

But, David, that is the way. Look, Trump is-- how can he be out-socialisming. Bernie Sanders? But he is. DAVID FARIS: Well, there's ways we can do this. But, again, some of it depends on like, what, are the powers that we inherit. when we take power next time? JON STEWART: All of them. DAVID FARIS: Is impoundment left to stand? If so, like, you can just take all the ICE funding. and build, like, abortion clinics on federal land. all around the country. Like, there's things that you can do. Like, there's things that you have to threaten to do. Because I don't think that they believe will do it.

JON STEWART: But you don't even have to do a culture war. You could take that money and you could put it. towards not culture war shit, but the things that diagnose. what really ails this country, like elder care, child care, like, being a mom to kids or being a dad to kids. If you're not working, that's a job. We should be able to subsidize those kinds of-- like, doing the actual things. Not culture war shit, not, obviously, naming airports after people they hate,

but taking money and action that directly-- because one. of the reasons the Democrats lost, and I'm convinced. of this, whether it's culture, or economic, or not, is that the government has proven itself to be at a remove. from the genuine needs of the people that have voted. in those representatives. It is isolated and insulated. And executive action that addresses. that in a forthright way, using the full power and weight.

of the federal government behind it, I'm sorry, I think that would be effective governance. DAVID FARIS: I agree. But I also think, like, a lot depends. on the first six months. So it's like you could do some of the stuff. You could repurpose money that's being spent to, like, support evil people in masks, like, abducting people, and you redirect that spending to address the country's. actual social problems, right? And in the long run, though, I kind of. agree with Tim in the sense that I do think Democrats. are going to have to-- JON STEWART: Sons of bitches. DAVID FARIS: -- spend some energy. rolling back the imperial presidency, right? Like, so we get into power, we do all this stuff, and then we're just going to hand it right back to them.

I think that we have to work through Congress. to dismantle some of this stuff. You have to pass new legislation. I'm sorry, you have to expand the court. so that the court is going to roll back. some of these decisions that are absurd, that are destroying our democracy. TIM MILLER: Jon, you've just given up on liberal democracy? My heart is sinking right now. You've just given up on balance of powers, federalism, pluralism, liberal democracy? It's over? We're just going to trade dictators back and forth? JON STEWART: So here's what I'm giving up on, to some extent--. a broken system that is being justified, as though the checks.

and balances that are in place are somehow. sacrosanct and were brought on high by divine creatures. of being. It was a 20-year argument and back and forth. It was a series of zoning board meetings. And if it's not serving the needs--. and, by the way, executive power has. always expanded and shrank. And lord knows, like, Donald Trump is creating. sovereign wealth funds. And the next Democratic president better. understand how to spend it positively.

than to go back and go, hey, man, I don't think. this is good for me to have. So I think we are making a mistake by valuing this model. And I'm not talking-- do I believe. in a constitutional republic? Abso-fucking-lutely. But I think--. I did get a thumbs up there just now. TIM MILLER: It's just a deep breath. JON STEWART: But I believe that--.

can I give you guys an example of-- this. is an experience that I had, and I'll try and make. it as short as possible. We were trying to get funding for veterans that had been. exposed to burn pits so that they could get. health care through the VA. And they were not getting covered. We went down, and we had a meeting. with Republicans and Democrats in Congress, explained the problem. These folks had been fighting already by that point. for 10 years through Iraq and Afghanistan. deployments and all that. The Congressional leaders went, oh, my god,

this is a terrible problem. But we're really busy. Could you guys write it? And I was like, oh, fuck. So this is why legislation is completely taken. over by special interests. But, yes. So we gathered all the stakeholders--. VFW, Wounded Warriors, American Legion, TAPS, all the VSOs of veterans. We got the Congressional Veterans Affairs. committees in the room. Everybody's in the room together. And I say, what would solve this problem? And they say what would solve the problem.

And it's pretty much what the PACT Act ended up being. And then for the next two hours, they negotiated against themselves. out of what would solve the problem to what. they thought was possible. And that is the point I am making, that we need. to stop doing what we-- negotiating against ourselves. to what is possible, and start addressing, in a forthright and clear minded manner,

in unison, what is necessary. And that's the difference. Your thoughts? DAVID FARIS: I mean, I've been saying for a long time, Jon, like, Democrats should use the power that they have. They should use the constitutional power. that they have. One of those constitutional powers. is expanding the Supreme Court, for example, which is a perfectly legal thing that they could do. JON STEWART: But you don't--. the problem isn't the expansion of the Supreme Court. It's the politicization of the process. of getting in justices-- or maybe it's. the lifetime appointments.

You'd be setting into play actions. that you wouldn't be able to control. You think that that would get you what you want, but it's very likely that it wouldn't. DAVID FARIS: Well, and you have to have one eye on, like, what's the next crew going to do with this power? And I think that's one thing that Republicans. are not doing right now. Like, they are clearly behaving as. if they do not anticipate Democrats will. ever do anything like this. And I think that's part of the problem. for Democrats is that they are not credible threat-makers. Like, Republicans don't ever-- like,

they just don't believe that we will counter-escalate. And they have pretty good reasons to think that. TIM MILLER: A couple thoughts on this. One, I actually think that's a misunderstanding. of Republicans. I think the Republicans are in a world of misinformation. And they're in a huge bubble. And they think that the Democrats. are already acting lawlessly. I think they've convinced themselves that the Biden. student loan effort and the effort to steal the election--. and, in some cases, Biden did exceed his powers. In other cases, they imagine it. JON STEWART: Wait, the Republicans in Washington. believe that? TIM MILLER: Yeah. JON STEWART: Or you mean the voters writ large?

TIM MILLER: Mike Lee believes that. Ted Cruz believes that. And some of them fake it. Some of them fake it. But, like, there are portions of them that believe. that and that justifies it. So I think it's not worrying-- they're. not not worried the Democrats are going to do it. They think that we're already there. Again, I think that's irrational, I'm just trying to explain what I think--. JON STEWART: Right. Right. TIM MILLER: -- the mindset is of them. As far as the Democrats are concerned--. I don't know, Jon, I heard your PACT story, and I thought that was beautiful. That could have been in a Ken Burns documentary or something. about how democracy worked. And it took too long, right? And that sucks for the people that suffered.

But in the end, like, there was resolution. And I just-- what I want is from the Democrats. is to play political hardball-- like, to play political hardball. Not to say, oh, I'm giving up on the politics. of liberal democracy and a constitutional republic. But I'm going to play the game as hard as they're playing it. And that would be--. you mentioned expanding the Supreme Court. One thing that we at The Bulwark. were arguing for when Biden won was instead of doing a stimulus.

package, that money is just going to disappear in the air. eventually, you're not going to get any long term credit out. of it, why not use your political capital. immediately to make Puerto Rico and DC a state? Now, you've got three or four senators. Now, you've created some structural advantage for you. long term. That's just, like, one example, right? That could have been a thing that they. had pushed for instead of doing some more amorphous stuff. So I think that part of this is a longer. conversation going out there on the internet right now--. Democrats should compete hard to figure out. how to win in other states and compete harder in Ohio,

and Iowa, and find different types of candidates, try different things. So, like, to me, like, that is, I think, where the hardball comes in. I hear what you're saying. I want them to be responsive to the needs of the people. I just don't want them to be like, fuck. it, because Donald Trump won twice, this whole thing is over. And so now we're just going to act like Trump. That's what I don't want. JON STEWART: It's not "fuck it.". And my only response-- and, Tim, I'm. wary that I know you have a hard out. and you've got to go catch a plane. TIM MILLER: Oh, that's so embarrassing that you. said that publicly to people. JON STEWART: Did I say plane? I meant--.

TIM MILLER: No, I'm never--. I would never hard out Jon Stewart, people. He's just making an excuse. He actually has something to do. JON STEWART: He's hard outing me. What I would say is every time I hear people say they've got. to figure out how to win in those states, it always feels backwards to me. It always feels like we've got to strategize as opposed. to sitting down and being what I think Donald Trump is, a good diagnostician about what's really wrong, and then come up with creative, and interesting,

and actionable plans that can directly affect what's wrong. and fix it, and know that by doing so, you will then be successful politically. I think to go around and strategize about, we've got to figure out what to do--. and, like what's wrong in fucking rural America? Come up with plans that will address that, and you will improve your chances in those areas. Not, what if we all curse more like regular people?

Like, that's what's fucking them up. And, by the way, I was on the vanguard of that cursing thing. TIM MILLER: You were. JON STEWART: I just want to point that out. So who's voting for me? Come on, guys. Who's with me? TIM MILLER: I'm interested. You said a couple of concerning things. I think that you're better than some of the names. being thrown out there, I guess I would say. So creative ideas considered from my standpoint. DAVID FARIS: Only if you have your own currency, Jon. Sorry. That's, like--.

JON STEWART: David, any last words from. you before Tim, who just really in a very diva-like way, said--. he just kept-- as we're talking, you can't see this on the podcast, he keeps pointing to a fake watch on his wrist. And he just keeps going tick tock. TIM MILLER: Like my idol, George H.W. Bush. I'm just checking my watch the whole podcast--. when are we getting out of here? [LAUGHTER]. JON STEWART: Tick tock, mothafucka. David, anything on the end note there? DAVID FARIS: Yeah. I mean, I think, like, if you're. trying to think about how to compete in Ohio, or Georgia, or whatever, like, I.

think that's really important. But I think it's also we have to--. I think it's less about, like, detailed bullet point policy. plans and more about convincing people. that Democrats have identified the problem. and will do something about it. Like, who is responsible for the rise in health care costs? Like, who are the villains here? Republicans are very, very good at identifying. a set of villains, and then harping on them, and turning people against them. And it's not that I think we should play the game exactly. that way, but I do think it's important for Democrats. to communicate to ordinary working people who are. struggling that we know who the problem is,

and we're going to do something about it. And that's not, like, I've got a bullet point. plan from the Center for American Progress, that's like, these are the villains. We're going to get them. And we will deliver for you. And I think that's something that you just don't. see that much from Democrats. And I think we need to see more of that. JON STEWART: Boom. Tim, you cosigning? TIM MILLER: Well, I'm OK with villains. There are a lot of villains out there these days. [LAUGHTER]. And I don't love bullet point plans. So we're all aligned on that. JON STEWART: Ladies and gentlemen, three people who. fundamentally agree on most things.

have come to a fundamental agreement on most things. within this podcast. Job well done. David Faris, Professor of Political Science at Roosevelt. University, contributing writer at The Nation, and Tim Miller, host of The Bulwark. podcast and travel influencer. He's off right now--. I don't know where he's going, but he's going. TIM MILLER: We'll see you guys. JON STEWART: Thanks for joining, guys. DAVID FARIS: Thanks for having me. [MUSIC PLAYING]. JON STEWART: For those people that were listening at home, they might think to themselves, well, that episode.

vibrated at a very high level. I knew that Tim had to get out of there, and I also knew that I really wanted. to make sure that David and Tim got everything in there. So I have not taken epinephrine. [LAUGHTER]. I just wanted to make sure--. it probably seemed like I was recording that at 78. as opposed to our normal. GILLIAN SPEAR: If you're listening at 1.5 speed, go back.

BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Yeah. Perhaps at 0.5? JON STEWART: If they go 0.5, they will find an incredibly. well-paced, very informative hour and 45-minute podcast, as opposed to what appeared to be, like, one of those English cheese wheel runs where they throw. the wheel, and everybody just runs like. a motherfucker down the hill. And that-- can I tell you, though, what reasonable fellas.

GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Yes. Butch up, Dems. That's good advice. JON STEWART: Right. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: I want that on a t-shirt, for sure. JON STEWART: "Butch up" would be a pretty good bumper. sticker for the Democrats. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. JON STEWART: Anything from either one of those guys. that you thought, like--. I kind of thought, like, David would go into, like, let's name. everything after George Floyd. And Tim would just be like, no. I understand the premise. I'm just saying you might not want to really enrage people.

GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. I mean, I really-- like, let's invest in blue states. I mean, we have this kind of, like, winter is coming problem. with the future census where it's like, we're going to lose. all of these seats, these electoral votes to all. of these red states because everybody's. moving out of blue states. Like, what if we made it materially. better to live in blue states? Could-- the places that we govern, could we work on that? JON STEWART: I mean, I feel like it is. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah.

I mean, I do-- people don't love paying taxes. But maybe if we made them appreciate where their tax. money is going better. And, wait, all of a sudden, in this state, you have cheaper health care. All of a sudden, in this state, you have better roads, you have better schools, you have better--. JON STEWART: Bars. GILLIAN SPEAR: Maybe-- maybe we could. stave off this apocalypse by just. making life better for people. JON STEWART: You're talking about leading by example. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. In these states that we already govern. We already have all these people. living under Democratic rule.

JON STEWART: Why not demonstrate competency? GILLIAN SPEAR: Why not? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Gillian for president, seriously. JON STEWART: Done. Gillian Spear. GILLIAN SPEAR: Good job, me. Yeah. [LAUGHTER]. JON STEWART: I like it. What do we got, Brittany, from this week with our viewers? I don't know if everybody's just still shell shocked. I'm sure everybody's shell shocked. There's so much news--. GILLIAN SPEAR: From the Mets, probably, yeah. JON STEWART: Oh, don't--. Gillian, now, was there any real need--.

BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Well, funny you should mention that. JON STEWART: I'm in such a buoyant mood. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: We're going to get there. Just hold your horses. JON STEWART: All right, Brittany. What have we got? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: First question--. Jon-- they spelled it with an H. JON STEWART: How dare they? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Strong start. JON STEWART: I'll have them know my family. couldn't afford an H. [LAUGHTER]. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Given current events, what do you think of the strategy of when they go low, we go high? JON STEWART: Oh, god. I really thought you were going Mets. I thought, given current events,

where do you place the Mets 4-0 loss to the Marlins on a scale. of the Ukraine-Russia war and Donald Trump threatening. to invade American cities? Oh, I think that's--. I don't think that that's an actual Democratic strategy. I thought that was a phrase in a speech that Michelle. Obama used, who is a remarkable speaker. and a remarkable leader. But I don't think in any way the Democratic failings can.

be tied to, we won't do those things. I think they are adrift philosophically, directionally, and policy wise. And it has very little to do with whether or not. they would fight dirty. I'm not even sure they know what they'd be fighting for, other than preserving certain things. that they had fought four years ago. So that's-- yeah, that's what I would say. Meanwhile, the White House every day. is unrolling another socialist platform where I'm like,

yeah, why don't we do that? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Why didn't we think of that? JON STEWART: There you go. Now, the next one's going to hurt, isn't it? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: No, it's the third one. JON STEWART: Ah, OK. GILLIAN SPEAR: Wow. Foreshadowing. JON STEWART: That, I can deal with. That I can do. All right. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Why hasn't Trump. tried to cancel you like the other late night hosts? Does he not get basic cable? JON STEWART: There's no question there. It is a function of relevance. I don't think we are on the radar. I've had my experiences him with the past with tweet.

fights at 2:00 in the morning. I take great pride in the fact that Donald Trump once, at 2:30 AM, just tweeted, I think in all caps, "Jon Stewart is a pussy.". And, listen--. GILLIAN SPEAR: That was the nickname he gave you? Just pussy? JON STEWART: If that's what-- well, that was after--. I had come up with Fuckface Von Clownstick, because he was. saying my real name is Jonathan Leibowitz, and why I appreciate my Jewish heritage? And I said, well, he doesn't like. people to but his real name is Fuckface Von Clownstick.

And why would-- and that set off a whole--. I mean, it's absurd to even think about it. But that's what happened. This is obviously before he was the commander-in-chief. of the United States. But I think-- and I'm, very happily, I think, we continue to do what we do. And the hope is that the company that we work for. continues to appreciate what it is that we do.

And I'm happy to continue doing it, for sure. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Preach. JON STEWART: Preach. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: All right. JON STEWART: All right. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Here it is. JON STEWART: Yeah. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: So, Jon--. JON STEWART: I expected it, if that's the question. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Mets owner Steve. Cohen apologized to the fans for the historic collapse. Are you good with that? JON STEWART: Oh, sure. No. As long as-- listen, it's Yom Kippur. As long as there's atonement. As long as-- I don't know how long.

it is that the Mets would have to fast to atone for something. along those lines. But, no, I am not good with it. But it just goes along with--. Mets fans are like--. did you ever see an abandoned mall, and there's just stuff that's starting to grow? Like, that's what we are. Like, the Mets-- the Mets are a semi-abandoned mall that you. drive by, the Mets fans, and you go, like, didn't there. used to be a Macy's there? Like, that feeling of a hollowed out,

should-be vibrant, great piece of real estate. But you sort of expect that if you go there, it will be overtaken by mycelium. and whatever small woodland rodents. are populating it in there. I'm just always excited at the interesting ways. that they do it. They've done fast collapses, like in, I think, 2008. They were in the lead, first place,

by 7 games with 17 to play, and they fucked it up. They have other things, like their star power hitter Yoenis. Cespedes, just decides to, like, go bull roping. and tears his complete knee apart in a divot. They find ways to entertainingly collapse. GILLIAN SPEAR: They keep you on your toes. JON STEWART: Thank you. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah. That's worth watching for. JON STEWART: Yeah.

There's going to be one where they all get mono. Like, they're going to be in first place, and they're going to be hours away from going. to the World Series. And they will all go to a makeout party and get mono. GILLIAN SPEAR: That was my favorite, like, last year, the Giants went to Mexico City. And, like, the next, like, three games, they were like, so everyone's got food poisoning. JON STEWART: Can I tell you something? That will be the genesis of the next Mets collapse will most. likely be explosive diarrhea.

And you know what? If that happens, there'll be no need to apologize. GILLIAN SPEAR: Yeah, we all get it. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: There you go. JON STEWART: I think we'll all understand. Brittany, how do they keep in touch with us on the socials? BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: Twitter, we are WeeklyShowPod. Instagram Threads, TikTok, BlueSky, we. are WeeklyShowPodcast. And you can like, subscribe, and comment. on our YouTube channel, The Weekly Show with Jon Stewart. JON STEWART: Boom. Is that where the question-- do most people question on. the YouTube? Or is it-- like, what do they do it on? Twitter? No. BRITTANY MEHMEDOVIC: They're hitting us from everywhere--. Instagram. Yeah, YouTube comments. We check them all. JON STEWART: Insta.

Do we throw a filter on there? Do I look like the one that Trump. is using now for Jeffries? Yeah, whatever it is, I want to look, like, golden. Well, I want to thank you guys very much. Once again, quick shoutout, Lauren Walker, who is our lead producer, was not-- a little. under the weather. We're sending out good vibes out there. She'll be back. Producer Brittany Mehmedovic, producer Gillian Spear, video editor and engineer Rob Vitola, audio editor. and engineer Nicole Boyce, and our executive producers.

Chris McShane, Katie Gray. We will see you next week. Bye bye. The Weekly Show with Jon Stewart. is a Comedy Central podcast that's produced by Paramount. Audio and Busboy Productions. [MUSIC PLAYING].