Abortion: Mission Impossible | The Weekly Show with Jon Stewart

at at long last have you no decency are. you suggesting that the mainstream media. has not picked up the Nuance of this. Supreme Court. [Music]. decision hey everybody Welcome once. again to the weekly show with John. Stewart I'm John Stewart and uh I. apologize if that was too enthusiastic I. have yet to understand in terms of a. podcast how to open it up what level of. enthusiasm is appropriate.

for when people are just listening to. something as opposed to on cable. television when you're coming in and. very clearly somebody's making popcorn. or something else so that that may have. been too forceful and I'm sure that our. grand producers Britney mic and Lauren. Walker who are here with me would be. able to tell you last week we had our. military-industrial complex show we. learned shockingly that there is waste. fraud in abuse in a lot of the budgets.

of our military-industrial complex but. even more interestingly we learned that. our military-- industrial complex may be. strategically counterproductive we may. we may actually be sewing more chaos. than than we are not this week's episode. is fascinating so we obviously we have I. don't know if you know this I maybe this. is giving the tea on production on a a a. glimpse behind the curtain.

we have meetings where we discuss what. we would like to cover what we would. like to talk about so uh this week I. voted for uh Celtics Mavericks Celtics. Mavericks come on it's the championship. Tatum Brown they finally did it uh but. we're gonna we're actually going to do. abortion we thought are you suggesting I. vetoed you no what Lauren how could you. come in in a defensive posture on on. that no we have it's a again we're we're.

listen it's an issue that this myth. ayone uh judgment that came down and and. was promoted as this win for abortion. rights but was really kind of a just. kick the. can uh there's so much going on around. it but I think more. trenchantly it represents again there is. Broad support and we talked about this. for abortion rights for for women there. is a broad democr itic majoritarian.

support but because of the way our. system is set up that is under fullon. assault and it's just one more thing. that I believe has people. feeling that our system is is not. responsive to the needs of the people. that it's supposed to represent would. you guys agree with with with that. totally and I think just to bridge last. week's episode and this week's episode. yeah uh.

last week the house voted on the defense. bill that included a provision blocking. abortion uh coverage from the Pentagon. more specifically they're trying to. reverse a pentagon policy which allows. service members to be compensated for. time off and travel if they need. reproductive care right so it just shows. you the attacks come from everywhere can. fit into any bill and the extent to. which they will not allow it.

anywhere that there is there is no. opportunity small enough for them to. inject that in there uh and and that's. that's for sure although to be fair it's. the house and they're Knuckleheads and. my guess is it probably doesn't get past. the Senate but who who the hell knows. anymore with the way things fun hope not. jez we'll try anyway let's hope not by. the way that was uh Britney mic with. just filthy language just if I may for. those of you for those of you at home. who are watching and this obviously is.

geared towards uh six to eighty olds I. just want to let them know that that I. did not in any way condone the use of. the word [ __ ] no course well done I've. learned from the best though no you've. learned from you you've learned from the. saltiest speaker of all so I apologize. uh for all of that uh but our guests uh. this week are are fabulous to discuss it. so let's let's get to them right. now okay so we're gonna welcome uh our. honored guest Melissa Murray our old. favorite NYU Law Professor co-host of.

the strict scrutiny podcast which I say. slowly so I don't fumble it and Jessica. Valente she's the founder of abortion. everyday.com an author of The. forthcoming book abortion our bodies. their lies and the truths we use to win. uh welcome uh to to the conversation. thank you we are. discussing ways that our system uh is is. somewhat dysfunctional and and leads to.

a certain. dissatisfaction uh with the kind of. tenants and foundations of the democracy. and I think the abortion issue is one of. those it's an incredibly complex. complicated issue there's people of good. faith on all sides then there's also. those that have weaponized it but it. felt like after Row the country had. found kind of a status quo that felt. majoritarian to some extent but the. forces of the anti-abortion movement. have chipped way at that through legal.

means but we also want to get to you. know we kind of have this idea that the. things they can't make a legal they make. impossible and so I I wanted to start. there Jessica if I could I'd start with. you what are some of the things that. have been done that aren't necessarily. legal challenges but have made it so. that it's unbelievably. difficult I mean part of the problem is. there's so much um and if it's and. they're not they're not relying on any.

one attack which is really smart so if. one fails they have a million others. waiting in the wings but I think you. know the things that I'm most worry. about uh are travel bands which I feel. like are not getting enough media. coverage at all people sort of don't. know that they exist or they think that. it's something we don't have to worry. about because right now it's primarily. targeted towards uh. teenagers and and all the little sort of. chipping away things that they're doing. around myth Stone and abortion.

medication specifically because they. know that that's how people in. anti-choice states are ending their. pregnancies right there was some new. numbers that came out that showed um. 8,000 people a month were getting uh. pills from Pro Choice States and so they. know that women are getting around their. bands they're really pissed off about it. and so they're sort of doing everything. that they can to as you said make it. impossible to get Melissa let me ask you. so that that brings up how they're doing. it Le so they're they're setting these.

boundaries I don't know much about how a. travel ban uh is is placed legislatively. or is enforced and Mya prone the big. news was oh that ban failed at the. Supreme Court but it's not as simple as. that is it it was it was actually not a. particularly robust Victory no no I. think that's right thanks for having me. it's great to be back um let me add on. time anytime meliss thank you um like. again the Dogma has caught the car on. this issue uh I want tack back to.

something that Jessica said yes you know. before dos and the fall of row we had. become antiz to the fact that you had to. wait two days if you wanted an abortion. that you had to travel and take time off. of work if you wanted to do this and. have an ultrasound and all of these. things that were medically unnecessary. but were designed to chill individuals. from wanting to go through with this and. to have abortions we come to accept that. as normal and now in this post row. landscape we are coming to accept the. fact that a quote unquote noral ban is.

one that prohibits abortion at 15 weeks. like you were exactly right about this. new Supreme Court opinion that was just. released it preserves the status quo and. I just want to underscore that that's. not great the shat the status quo is. shitty and so it preserves that shitty. status quo and I think the way to think. about that challenge what is the when. you say the status quo what is what what. do you mean by that because I so the. court in this case this was a challenge. to M Prestone which is one of the drugs. in the two drug medication abortion.

protocol and it was a challenge to the. fda's approval of Mone and then also to. the fda's regulations that were released. during the pandemic that made mistone. easier to access because it allowed for. its distribution. do tell Health all of that I think the. way for your listeners to think about. this challenge to mop prisone and those. regulations is that this was the. anti-choice movement's effort to ban. abortion in blue states where it's. accepted where the constituents want. access to reproductive Freedom so it is.

completely anti-democratic because they. are importing their Red State values. into these other places so I I want to. make that clear the status quo that we. have now is we have a patchwork where. red States ban it and blue states allow. for it and you know there's some. crossover because women who want this. will go to Blue States or will seek out. help from Blue State Physicians and. that's what they're trying to end and. that's basically what the Supreme Court. preserved this was not a decision on the. merits they never got into whether the.

FDA it was on this jurisdictional. question of standing were these. anti-choice doctors the alliance for. hipocratico prisone nor had they ever. had a patient who had been harmed by. mistone because nor are they hypocritic. well they're hypocritical but not. hypocritic not hypocritic no one like. there are very few women who have ever. been harmed by myh priston because the. drug is incredibly safe and so it was a.

real challenge for them to find. plaintiffs who could make out anual. injury to challenge the regulations of. this law and so instead you had these. doctors making absolutely specious. claims that their injury was in losing. the aesthetic value of seeing a baby. born of seeing their inudo patient. brought to life um at that was the. injury it it wasn't a physical oh they. were hurt it was they would never. generalized grievance moral objection to. abortion and the court rightly said that.

that that's never been enough under. article 3 of The Constitution to sustain. jurisdiction in federal court but the. fact that we had to go to the Supreme. Court to say that is absolutely crazy. because everybody knows that so well. it's also this should have been struck. down well before for God's sakes they in. the same session made it so that bump. stocks are available so this thing that. actually does bring Grievous harm to. people through turning a regular gun. into a machine gun yeah that's cool.

butst with it imaginary but but this is. the thing John so the court issues this. decision says no this is a completely. specious standing claim we're going to. kick this out of court we're not even. going to decide this on the merits and. then you have the mainstream media. heralding this as a victory for. Reproductive Freedom are. you Melissa M at long last have you no. decency are you suggesting that the. mainstream media has not picked up the. Nuance of this Supreme Court decision I.

will say when I go on MSNBC I make sure. that the Nuance is picked up I don't. know that everyone doing this but people. are talking about this as a victory it's. not a victory or if it is it's a very. muted Victory and it's not going to last. they are going to find new plaintiffs. that will challenges and the only winner. the relent it's Relentless well but this. is the point the winner here is not the. pro-choice movement it's the court. because the court gets to appear. moderate on the issue of an AB of. abortion at a time time when millions of.

people are galvanized about abortion as. an electoral issue we have an election. coming up in a few months this court. does not want to be a part of that. election and that narrative and so this. is a win for the court they get to be. moderate they get to be consensus driven. and rule of law oriented but in fact. they've merely preserved a shitty status. quo that they brought into being and. kicked it down the road Jessica I want. to ask you because uh we bring up you. know we sort of talk about these things. in the well in red States it's this and. in blue States it's this but it's. obviously never as simple and there are. certainly uh blue cities in red States.

and red uh voters in blue States and and. never the twain shall meet but uh the. fact. is you know the hurdles that they put up. for people is the thing that is really I. think made it so difficult for women to. make these choices you know Melissa. talked earlier about these these travel. bands and and the like but so if you're. in a city a blue City that broadly. supports abortion but you're in a red.

State let's go with you know Houston and. Texas yeah what is your what is your. option what is your recourse I mean it's. really either travel right which you. have to have enough money to do you have. to have support to get out of the state. um or you can get abortion medication. shipped to you in the state but you have. to risk okay if someone finds out about. this if a ex-boyfriend someone who. doesn't like me finds out that I had. abortion medication shipped to to me. they can make my life hell they can.

bring a lawsuit because Texas has um the. ability to bring civil suits against. anyone who AIDS and abets in an abortion. and so there's a real chilling effect. wait. what oh yeah yeah yeah yeah don't don't. bury the lead there what say say that. again sure so Texas has something that. is sort of informally called The Bounty. Hunter mandate where you can get the. hunter mandate for pregnant women well. this is how they get around it because. they never want to seem as if they're.

attacking the actual pregnant person. they say anyone other than the pregnant. person so someone who drove them out of. state someone who helped them get. abortion medication in one case um a. woman's abusive ex-husband brought a. lawsuit against three of her friends. yeah who helped her to allegedly get. abortion medication into the state and. end her pregnancy and so now you're set. up with this system where if you have an. abusive ex partner who wants to make. miserable they can go ahead and they can.

sue your friends um for for helping you. to get care and what that means is that. all of these people who may have had you. know the ability to travel the ability. to to get abortion medication Shi to. them are terrified they're terrified. that they're going to ruin their. partner's life um ruin their their. friends and I'm sure the doctors then. must be terrified that they're going to. get prosecuted as well let me let me. back this up ju ju just for a moment. because these are the things that sort. of shock the conscience but I want to. talk about a little bit before this.

happened isn't the pressure that they. brought to bear on abortion providers uh. isn't the pressure they brought to bear. of oh if you're going to do that kind of. care your uh facility has to be like a. hospital and you've got and then uh. through sort of intimidation of the. doctors they made it so that there's. very few clinics so that even within the. state people had overwhelming travel. hurdles especially if they didn't have. the kind of resources that you know. people might have to have to get that.

something done even before these types. of more Draconian measures have been put. into. place haven't they put into place. effective bans prior to this yeah I have. a guest column at my newsletter today. from a woman who lost Vision in one of. her eyes because her um abortion care. was delayed in Maryland before row was. overturned so they had these laws in. place for a really long time and I think. you're talking about trap laws which is. um targeted regulation of abortion.

providers and so yeah they did. everything that they could even in. pro-choice States so for example if. you're an abortion provider in a pro. choice State they say well you need to. have admitting privileges at a local. hospital right the problem is a local. hospital is not going to give an. abortion provider admitting privileges. because they never bring patients there. because abortion is so safe that they're. not bringing any patients into the. hospital and so they've set up this. system where it's essentially impossible. yeah exactly and so they just made it.

increasingly difficult to keep um. clinics open even if it was ostensibly. legal let me ask you a question Melissa. is there recourse in states where it's. legal to go after other states let's say. because they're interfering with. interstate commerce if a red state is. preventing you from traveling into a. blue state for a procedure couldn't that. be construed as interference at some. level no I I think that's right and I. think there are a number of blue states. and and blue State AGS that are.

contemplating the prospect of dormant. Commerce Clause challenges to the fact. that essentially these red states are. imposing their own public policy. preferences on the citizens of blue. States who don't share them and there is. actually a very interesting case in the. Supreme Court a couple of terms ago not. about abortion but ironically about pork. production um the state of California. had particular rules pork production um. the state of California not surprisingly. had particular rules about how the pigs.

that were slaughtered and then used for. pork products were kept and you know and. the pork industry challenged these. regulations on The View that because. California was such a large state with. you know such a demand for these. products that their public policy. preferences for humanely raised and. pastured pork products then basically. were exported out to other states that. didn't share them and so I remember the. oral argument in this case really keenly. because everyone seemed really concerned.

about the dormant Commerce Clause and. about interstate commerce and the. prospect of very large states exerting. their will on smaller States and it. didn't seem to be about pork products at. all and I think it actually was a shadow. debate for what would happen in the post. row world and so what was. the decision in that case well let let. me check um National pork hang on are. you wait you can't Google during a. podcast that's that's cheating Melissa I. just want to make sure I just I want to. make sure that I'm right okay the court. affirmed the dismissal of the complaint.

so it's like a it's cited with. California but if it were. presented right almost well yeah I mean. if if it's same idea sort of a. jurisdictional question but I imagine. the debate and the disposition of the. case might have been really different if. it had been something like abortion or. guns and not necessarily P that's right. I want to get into that because that's. that's interesting to me because I do. think there will be unforeseen. consequences and cases that come out of.

this when you follow the logic so uh I'm. going to present some other logical uh. Maneuvers on this I'm sure most of them. are facial and make no sense but I'd be. happy to have you uh address them anyway. uh so now you have in Texas if somebody. abets someone in the driving to Illinois. or whatever it is and then they always. want to say things like well but we do. make an exception for the health of the. woman if if she is in danger correct is.

that for the most part I know there are. some that don't but isn't there an. emergency care for the health of the. woman they ex yeah supposedly Good Luck. Good Luck qualifying I mean here's the. thing I think you see it all the time. and you see it in the context of the. Bounty Hunter law these laws aren't. necessarily meant to survive legal. challenges their greatest efficacy can. be in the short term where they chill.

what would be otherwise lawful conduct. so you're right there is an exception so. take Texas's law for example Texas. provides that you know if you are. getting an abortion it has to be for. these sort of exent circumstances and. those exent circumstances include when a. patient has a quote life-threatening. condition and is at risk of death or. substantial impairment of a major bodily. function but it doesn't Define what the. substantial impairment of a major bodily. function is isn't pregnancy in itself.

it's not a benign process isn't that. couldn't that be considered a. substantial impairment all of that and. so you know without actual definitions. it's left to the Physicians to make. these judgments knowing that an. enterprising attorney general like say. Ken Paxton might come down really hard. on them if he doesn't agree with their. medical judgment so in these. circumstances I think doctors feel like. their hands are tied they know what they. would do in their medical Judgement they. just don't know where medical judgment.

begins and the law ends and if they take. the chance if they take the risk there. can be real consequences um consequences. legal consequences for them I mean legal. consequences and collateral consequences. like you know if you are a party to some. kind of legal proceeding even if you. ultimately Prevail you have to document. that for purposes of lure and and you. could have your license you lose your. license all that you might not be able. to get insurance I mean it's a real. conundrum for them Jessica has that. impacted people in a in a human way in a.

real way yeah I mean this is what I was. going to say there's right there's what. the law says and then there's what. actually happens in real life to human. from the yeah to human beings which. would be nice to think about every once. in a while human beings not vessels yes. not vessel so the um the example that. you gave right let's say someone wanted. to to to travel the person depending on. the county they are in Texas several. counties in Texas have passed what. they're calling um anti-trafficking laws.

abortion trafficking laws that again. allow a civil suit to be brought against. someone who uses the roads of that. particular County to bring someone out. of state for an abortion and so it's. this slow chipping away at our ability. to travel and that's like a really. terrifying thing to me even even given. uh uh uh the mother's health being in in. question well this is part of the issue. as as Melissa said there's no real.

standard on what that means wasn't there. a case of a woman there was a woman who. uh she her it was an 18we miscarriage I. think but the fetus was her water had. broken and wasn't going to survive but. she herself was not in that moment they. have to wait until. the she had to go home and get sepis I. think she had to go home and get sepsis. okay that'sand zarowski so here we go so. now we're going to get to now we're GNA. flip the thing and this is all informed.

by I think sort of my experience with. this uh and this has to do with my. family my wife uh so we won't even get. into IVF which is what we had to do to. have children so it's incredible to me. to live in this world now where uh the. children that we desperately wanted. would not be able to be had because if. these people get their way uh there'd be. no IVF my wife after her second child. this is after she was born hemorrhaged. uh this was probably 3 days post uh.

birth right we were home uh she was in. danger she needed blood transfusions we. were incredibly fortunate to have uh. good health care we were able to get her. in she was operated on under an. emergency basis on that night right but. my point is. this pregnancy can always be a risk to a. woman's health this idea that it has to.

be based on uh a fetal abnormality or. something going wrong uh you don't know. so who then is. liable let's say in in the case of our. thing let's say she didn't want to carry. that baby to term she was forced to by. the state and post birth hemorrhaged and. died well who's responsible for that if. you can arrest people for abetting. somebody driving into.

Illinois who is responsible for the. death of. women who are going to have emergency. complications arise and how come that's. not part of the conversation and and. what do you think we can do about that. Jessica I'll ask you first and then and. then Melissa sure this is part of what. the the case in Texas where 20 women. sued Texas for the extreme Health uh. issues that they had because of the. abortion ban and essentially what. happened is they blamed the doctors.

right they said the law is not the issue. any um you know reasonable doctor would. have given Care at that point and this. is something that they've sort of set. themselves up to do for a long time to. blame the doctors to say you just don't. understand the law the law is fine as it. is you should have given the care um and. so once again the liability goes to the. doctors given the you know the right. judge and the right court if a woman. dies in childbirth for a baby that she. did not want to have it is only the. doctor that is liable not the state for.

forcing her into that pregnancy Melissa. is that correct that's that's basically. what they're saying the Texas Supreme. Court scotx if you will issued a. decision at the end of May on the zoski. case and basically said yeah these seem. good to us and doctors know what they're. to do and and they should do it and they. should provide this care like there's. not a problem here and this is a a court. that's entirely Republican this was a. unanimous decision from the court and.

again completely stripped of any. Humanity for either the pregnant patient. or the doctor who genuinely is worried. about whether or not they're going to. lose their livelihood if they make a. decision and their patients who are not. just at risk of death but I mean there's. a lot between a valid and viable. pregnancy and death I mean you can lose. your fertility if you go septic like. lots of things can happen it's not just. but even beyond that it it can create.

hypertension it can pregnancy is not a. benign process but John this goes to. your point about democracy we have right. now highly gerrymandered state. legislators who are making these laws. these legislators are not comprised of. Physicians they're not even comprised of. women of reproductive age it's a lot of. men um many men who are not in the same. age bandwidth of as most women who are. in their Prim reproductive years and the.

idea that you are being your views are. being reflected your interests are being. accounted for in the legislative process. that's just a fallacy I mean these are. geriatric legislators made up of men who. are not doctors making laws that. will legislate for doctors and their. patients and they're not the. legislatures aren't affected by this but. their patients are and again I just want. to emphasize the way in which the anti. Choice Movement has ginned up all of.

this like James Bop who is the. spokesperson the head of the national. right to life committee argues that the. Physicians are the problem the laws are. clear and if they're not clear enough. for the Physicians the onus is on the. Physicians to suggest fixes that's. literally what he says they should. suggest the fixes doctors aren't. legislators whose job is it it's the. legislator's job Melissa and Jessica I. want you to address this there is no fix. for a process where some women die how.

do you fix pregnancy to make it so that. there is no chance that a woman dies if. you force someone to carry a and I. understand there's at a certain point in. the development of the fetus and the. embryo or the embryo to the fetus and. then in that that the rights of both. tend to converge right I get that but. starting on that Journey you cannot. guarantee a woman that you'll be okay. okay you just can't no especially in the.

US right where maternal mortality is so. awful right and I have to say just. getting back to um the scenario we were. talking about before even if someone is. able to get that Health indicated. life-saving abortion in a lot of these. states because the way they've written. the law in such a way that instead of. giving standard abortion procedures. they're giving women C-sections or. forcing them into vaginal labor even. before viability even when they know.

that there's no chance for the fetus's. survival and this is one of the ways. that doctors are trying to protect. themselves from liability but it's also. written in the laws if a life-saving. care is needed and they need to end the. pregnancy you need to give a Maternal. Fetal separation which means C-section. or forced vaginal labor um and it's you. know just getting back to the actual. real life suffering that is happening. that's for some women that's the best. case scenario that the life-saving care. that they get is an is unnecessary you.

know major abdominal surgery John this. goes back to the point I think you made. earlier we're fighting for the shards of. reproductive Freedom like the. opportunity to have Physicians make. exigent decisions on behalf of their. pregnant patients we're not fighting. Upstream for what would reproductive. Freedom look like in an ideal world. because for now that is gone I mean the. court preserved the status quo on me. aistone they're already three states who.

are teed up and ready to bring that case. on the ground that they have been. injured. bying yeah they have different they have. a different claim of standing their. claim is going to be that as. anti-abortion States the availability of. meh Prestone and medication abortion. flouts their ability to regulate. abortion can't that be flipped Melissa. can't that be flipped so let's say there. is a family that lost a daughter a wife. because they were forced to endure a. pregnancy and they died during that. pregnancy and can't that. can't that then be flipped but let me.

let me also and this F I mean but here's. the thing like we literally. contemplating scenarios where our. victories are built on the backs of dead. women no no no listen Melissa it's this. is an awful scenario I am I am literally. just trying to figure out how battle. this relentlessness I think you B like. that's a polit I mean that's how row. came into being like stories like Jerry. Soro who was a mother of two who was.

literally butchered um in a hotel room. trying to end a pregnancy she did not. want is there any other law that compels. a person ostensibly to save someone. else's life so the idea being well the. abortion is to save uh a baby's life. once it reaches a certain gestational. age and do the thing but let's say for. instance my. kidney would if I were to give it to. somebody it would save their life could. I ever be compelled to do that you're.

never placed in a situation human beings. other than like the military draft where. the government compels you to do. something where you might lose your life. or have otherwise harm but we're doing. this to women are we not we're. compelling them so I don't know outside. of Prince Harry who says in his. autobiography spare that he was born to. allow for extra organs for Prince. William if Neary like leaving that to.

the side like you know I yours your. example is an extreme one but I think. the anti-choice movement would put up a. different example and that example would. be vaccinations vaccinations like the. idea that um mandatory vaccinations to. secure Collective public health is an. intrusion on your bodily autonomy that. that you may not want but I think again. and there can be harm there can be harm. I think that's right there there can be. harm um I think differences between a.

vaccination even one that is you know. very quickly rolled out um and pregnancy. and the real harms of pregnancy I think. you can make a pretty clear distinction. between those but I think that's the. example that they use and in fact Amy. con Barrett in the Dos oral argument. that was the example that she used she's. like you know speaking of bodily. autonomy what about vaccinations and I. was like oh here we go again um so you. know this question of bodily autonomy. can go both ways like they have made a. lot about this in the context of masking.

and vaccinations and well masking I say. is not but but vaccination they do make. the claim yeah but I mean they make that. claim in those two contexts and seem. completely oblivious that you could make. the very same arguments in the context. of abortion right right Jessica is that. you know for the women that that you're. trying to uphold and and represent you. know what is in your mind kind of the. mental health of of a community that Fe. feels trapped by this idea and sort of.

placed into a you know a secondary. position in society right I mean I I do. think you know in in anti-choice States. it's just constant fear I think that's. safe to say there's just constant fear. right and in pro-choice States and I. have this conversation a lot with my. daughter outside of the immediate. physical impact that that these bands. have on people it does something to you. as a person to know that your country. doesn't see you as fully human right.

like there is an emotional toll to. know that you don't matter there was um. a woman in Oklahoma who you know another. one of these post row horror stories. where she was miscarrying she she. couldn't get care she had to travel out. of states spend thousands of dollars and. she said I'm not going to get pregnant. again because now I know my life doesn't. matter now I know I don't count so why. would I ever put myself in that. situation because as soon as you're. pregnant in this country you do not.

count you do not matter and that's a. really difficult bitter pill to swallow. yeah that's tough Melissa is there are. you finding on the horizon are there the. types of legal challenges to uh this. where where do you see this with a. little bit of light at the end of the. tunnel or do you think it gets darker. before uh things begin to to shap up I. want to emphasize you know the limits of. law here law is not necessarily a place.

for imaginative solutions to real. problems if you're in the courts you're. necessarily in a defensive posture so. I'm not thinking about legal solutions. for this I mean I think there can be. cases but as I said those are the cases. that are going to be built on a. foundation of utter tragedy like. literally we'll be litigating from the. posture of dead women I think the bigger. opportunity is in the political or. electoral space right um we live in a.

distorted democracy um the court has. made it much harder for individuals to. register their preferences through. representative government because of its. rulings on Jerry mandering um it's made. it harder to register your preferences. at The Ballot Box because of laws that. allow for voter suppression and look the. Constitution is already gerrymandered to. favor rural white are that's. so I mean so I just want to say that.

like I understand the challenges like we. truly live in a distorted democracy we. have to recognize the fact of that. Distortion but understand that that. Distortion can be counteracted by. overwhelming participation Collective. action right so you know we have an. election coming up the court is on the. ballot in that election you know Justice. is Thomas and Alo in addition to having. emotional support billionaires are. septarian and if Donald Trump is elected.

they will step down they will retire the. day after the inauguration and they will. be replaced by teenagers and this 6 to3. conservative super majority not only may. be expanded to 7 to2 or 8:1 it will. endure even longer because the judges. will be younger so we are fighting. defensively right now in every every. Forum but the Electoral space is where. we have the opportunity to really help. counteract this if you can prevent.

Donald Trump from appointing new. justices to fill Thomas and Alo seat. from filling any other seat that's a win. right now and like and we have to take. that win we have to look at state courts. where you know all of these challenges. on our abortion are shifting not in F. they're shifting from federal courts to. state courts those state courts have to. be in a position to make rulings that. are consistent with the will of the. people um we have to have legislators. that are ready to enact constitutional.

amendments to their state court to their. state constitutions that would protect. reproductive Freedom we can't just focus. on the president we have to be down. ballot we have to focus on keeping the. Senate the Trump Administration was so. successful at adding movement. conservatives to the federal court. completely transformed the federal court. and the Biden Administration has done a. great job counteracting some of that but. there needs to be eight more years of. work on this and you've got to have the. Senate to do that so this is not the.

moment to be divided in our big tent. it's the moment to come together as a. big tent to overwhelm the Distortion. that's tried to divide us and limit our. Authority Melissa that's a phenomenal as. as my daughter would say I believe you. may have eaten eaten and left no crumbs. that was a I believe that's that I think. that's what she said to me that's what. the young people say the young people. say you ate and left no crumbs uh it's. that that is an unbelievably trans and. fabulous point and and one that has to.

be uh at the Forefront because to be. frank the other group is tenacious and. strategic and they understand how to uh. overwhelm them uh you know and take out. the bottom of that Jessica is there. anything else that that you wanted to. add uh before I let you guys go yeah. just building on something Melissa said. it does give me a lot of hope when I. think about just how popular abortion. rights are and if we can get to that. place where we're where we're focusing. on the Electoral bit um this is an issue.

that people like to talk about as if. it's something the country is evenly. split on or R like irrevocably polarized. over it's not we're not 5050 we're not. 5050 there was there's been several. polls that uh have come out this year. that showed 80% over 80% of Americans. don't want any government involvement at. all in pregnancy they do not want. abortion to be regulated by the law at. all this is something that is really. important to voters and it goes across.

parties so that is something like as. horrible as all of this is and it is. horrible to talk about this every day. and to to write about this and to do. this work it gives me so much hope. knowing that Americans really do. understand what's at stake and how. important this issue is well I I thank. you guys both uh so much Melissa Murray. NYU Law Professor co-host of strict. scrutiny podcast and my go-to well Lissa. you know you're my go-to you whatever. whenever I get into trouble I would say. what would Melissa Murray do how would.

she break this down that's what I I like. how you said I don't call Melissa Murray. to be my lawyer but I do refer her as go. my goto Law whatever it is uh and. Jessica Bend founder of abortion. everyday.com and author of The. forthcoming book abortion our bodies. their lies and the truths we use to win. guys thank you so much for being here. thank. you wow I look I don't want to say. Melissa Murray blows me away every time. I hear from her but holy God the. information being held in a normalized.

head that's just just got a normal sized. head and yet all that information and. and Jessica you know you can tell uh you. know Melissa's attacking from a legal. sense Jess is really feeling I think the. human burden of this and boy she. articulated that so well yeah the the. personal story is I mean. they they break my heart every time like. I just like I I I can't. my head around the the conversations and. and and and and how this is still.

happening but yeah well she and the way. she said it you know look even with. these legal victories remember it's on. the backs of dead women and you just. think oh God that's right you know. sometimes we forget in these theoretical. and now there's that Lauren what was. that case in Idaho that's now coming up. the Supreme Court this term is meant to. decide on Idaho the United States where. Idaho is pushing back against a federal. law that allows uh emergency see. abortion in the case of the life of the. mother so wait literally saying even if.

the life of the mother is in Jeopardy. nope sorry yeah holy [ __ ] uh well wow. just a lot to certainly a lot to chew on. there but and and the call to action. from Melissa uh at the end I thought was. just boy what a great reminder of what's. really at stake and and fabulous uh that. is the weekly show for this week as. always you can't do it without out uh. lead producer Lauren Walker producer. Britney mic The Man Behind the glass Rob.

vlo video and engineer audio editor and. engineer Nicole Boyce our fabulous. researcher Katherine Newan and as always. executive producers Katie gray and Chris. MC Shane if come on fantastic Best In. The Biz Best In The Biz for God's sakes. where can they find Us Britney we are. weekly show pod on Twitter uh weekly. Show podcast on Instagram threads Tik. Tok and the weekly show with John. Stewart on YouTube We're on.

Instagram yeah we are what would we do. on Instagram just take. picts yeah don't look. John yeah I don't I I unfortunately for. me it's it's a desert out there if. you're got to get pictures of me but uh. fantastic guys thanks so much and uh uh. we'll see youall next. week the weekly show with John Stewart. is a Comedy Central Podcast it's.

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