Beckham's Nepo Baby Nightmare

The Rest Is Entertainment is presented. by Octopus Energy. Now, the moment. someone becomes properly famous, they. stop traveling as a person and they. start traveling as a situation. And yes, I am talking about the world of. entourages. >> It's amazing. Anytime you do a TV show. when someone properly famous comes on, it's all you you can just have a spread. bet as to how many people they're going. to bring with them. >> Most people don't actually need a. bodyguard and a fixer and a straw lady, but not having to start from scratch. every single time you get in contact. with someone is actually undeniably. appealing.

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Hello and welcome to this episode of The. Rest Is Entertainment with me, Marina. Hyde. >> And me, Richard Osman. Hello, everyone. Hey, Marina. >> How are you, Richard? >> I'm all right. Uh, it was the BAFTAs. last night. Uh, another remorselessly. unsuccessful one for House of Games. >> Yeah, your streak is now incredible and. sadly, it's your last. >> That's me done, yes. >> Last eligibility. So, >> think maybe a sympathy BAFTA, but. nothing. You know, genuinely, that this. is how these awards ceremonies work. I. was giving out an award as well to.

>> to to Martin Lewis. And so, when you do. that, someone comes to get you from your. seat to take you around to the back in. advance of doing it. But, the one I was. giving out was quite soon after the. daytime BAFTA. And so, she said, "Oh, and of course, if you've won, then. actually I'll collect you from the side. of the stage, not from the audience.". And as we were getting closer to our. award, we hadn't been collected. I. thought, "Oh my god, this is it. We've. finally done it. This team, this. wonderful team, I can leave them with. this BAFTA for nine years of this. incredible work, Uh, and then no, we. still didn't win. But there it is.

>> Thank you for taking me inside of the. action on the awards night. >> I'd like to say we had a fun evening, but. even then. But but do you know what? To. be fair, Scam Interceptors have won it. I was delighted with that. I was. delighted that Catherine Parkinson won. >> Oh, that was terrific. >> Delighted Last One Laughing won as well. And I thought Greg Davies did a great. job as well. So, that was my BAFTAs. >> Right. What are we talking about today, Richard? >> a fun one today. We're talking about. nepo babies um uh in in a very specific. way. There's a couple of absolutely. jaw-dropping bits of nepo babyosity.

that have uh turned up in the last week. or so. And I'm I'm going to do a. sociological deep dive into what it. actually means being a nepo baby. I. mean, don't people just do what their. parents do anyway? And don't we pass. down our genes to our kids anyway? So, I'm going to I'm going to try and debunk. a few of those myths. >> I am looking forward to that. We will be. taking a look at the blast radius of the. final settlement in the Blake Lively and. Justin Baldoni pre-trial settlement. That case has supposedly gone away, but. we're going to be looking at who of.

those three principals how how their. careers have been damaged. And I'm When. I'm talking about the three principals, I'm obviously talking about Blake, Justin, and Ryan Reynolds. >> And of course, generationally, their. kids. >> Yeah. >> Because, you know, it's going to fit. their nepo careers in the future. >> the nepos in all the way through. >> And we're also going to have a little. chat about ITV Entertainment. There's a. new show called The Neighborhood, which. has become sort of a poster boy for TV. flops. And we're going to talk about. whether that's fair or not. And a a. little bit of inside gossip about the. all the I'm a Celebrity um. uh hoo-ha as well. And also, I've got a.

little uh ITV announcement of my own, which we'll put in there, too. >> Right. Let's get on to the nepos. >> Yeah, shall we? >> In the last week or so, a bit longer, um. there've been a number of sort of nepo. announcements or pre-announcements, I. would say. North West. >> Yes. >> Um the 12-year-old daughter of Kim. Kardashian and Kanye West has released. an EP. There's six tracks, and it's. called North West Forever. >> I'm just going to look at the uh how. many plays it's had on Spotify. >> It's been relatively well received, I. should say. >> what? It's actually not bad.

>> Yeah. >> It's actually not bad, but but of course. it's not bad because you know. >> Mhm. >> Yeah, 24 million uh likes for child-like. things, pissing on my hand, 3 million. listens. I mean, listen, that'll do you. >> pissing on a hand. >> That'll do you at 12 years old, won't. it? >> I mean, come on. Harper Beckham is the. Beckhams are trademarking something. called HiKey by Harper, which is. apparently going to be a a skin care. beauty brand. >> She's 14. >> She is 14. So, maybe we'll start with. her, shall we? >> Yeah, shall we It's such a tricky one.

because we'll say a number of things, which is well, I'll say a couple of just. a couple of provisos which which will. make me more comfortable talking about. it. Kids can do whatever they want at. any time. That's all fine. And parents. want the best for their children. Those. are the two provisos. Everything else is. on the table. >> Yeah. Um. I would say that her mother's brand is. doing very well. Actually, weirdly, Victoria Beckham's skin care and beauty. does miles better than the fashion and. is potentially her route into becoming a. huge kind of sellable company. Now,

there's very strong rumors that Harper. is going to launch her own brand. She's. 14, and it's going to be called HiKey by. Harper. It's interesting that the. Beckham name isn't in there, I think, for a brand that tends to put its name. in everything. >> Yeah, you think people won't make the. connection? >> I I I don't know. It's interesting that. it's not in there, but whether or not. it's happening, I think for sure it's. happening because Victoria has already. started sort of put laying a backstory. on the various things she's done to. promote her own beauty brand saying. she's been sitting on my knee for.

meetings ever since she was tiny. Oh, like all tweens, she ruined her skin by. having skin care that wasn't ready for. it, and she wants to create something. that's particularly in that age space, as we know. I mean, we certainly covered. it on the podcast before, although never. enough, the phenomenon of sort of tween. skin care and tween obsession with. extremely expensive high-end skin care. >> we didn't seem to used to need. >> Which we didn't seem to used to need. I. mean, as I, you know, like to say to. them all, your skin will literally need.

never be better than it is right now if. you do nothing. And she's made a number. of public appearances and she made. presented an award to her mother at a. Harper's event maybe a year or so ago. But recently she was sort of on hand for. a beauty launch that Victoria did during. the school term, which I don't know, in. New York. >> Come on. >> know. Yeah, I mean, I. >> You can't miss double French for that. >> I mean, sadly, as I've said, there is a. space for this. Brands are now targeting. under 10s skin care brands. You see.

people to putting their daughters as. young as five or six influencers with. their own daughters. doing unboxing of products. I I I mean, it is incredibly bleak. I don't know. Is. she going to be a CEO at 14? I don't. know. >> Is she going to be a. >> Come on. >> billionaire at 18. So, if you if you own. a skin care brand, if you're Victoria. Beckham, let's say you're a normal skin. care brand owner, two decisions. Firstly, do I launch skin care brand. aimed at teens who don't particularly. need it. Okay, so that's a choice. That's a choice that capitalism has.

always made and they'll always say at. the end, "Actually, yes, I do cuz my. competitors will do this. Um so, I need. to do it as well and all I'm doing is. serving a market. That's all I'm doing.". >> not growing, I'm failing. >> If I'm not growing, I'm failing, exactly. So, you know, I I I get that. Then, do you think. I've really, really been in the news. recently cuz I we've really fallen out. with one of our children because he's. been in the public eye since he was a. child. >> Please may I quote the statement? >> Yes. >> From Brooklyn. My family values public. promotion and endorsements above all. else. Brand Beckham comes first. Family.

love is decided by how much you post on. social media or how quickly you drop. everything to show up and pose for a. family photo op. >> There'll be plenty people who listen to. this in the car who will have. 14-year-olds in the back of the car. And what an insane way. to bring up a child. It is insane. There. will be people that This Last years of. The Apprentice, the woman who won. Karisma, who's absolutely brilliant, and. had exactly this story. She had, you. know, trouble with her skin when she was. a teen. Nothing worked for her. And so,

what she did, she went and got a degree. in in in biochemistry, and then has. built a brand, and then went on The. Apprentice and won The Apprentice, and. you know, and is brilliant. She's. absolutely sensationally brilliant. There are Victoria Beckham knows this. very well swathes of 14-year-olds who. have issues with skin care products, who. are not launching lines because you. can't. That is not open to you. You have. a 14-year-old who has these issues, and. you can find a way suddenly to put that.

child in every newspaper in the country. Should you choose to do? No, you. shouldn't choose to do. But it's what I. genuinely This is where I lose sympathy. I really really really lose sympathy. It's a child. It's a child of the. >> learn. I'm so sorry. Have we not just. seen what's happened? Some people never. learn. I I I find it absolutely. extraordinary. >> If you're an influencer somewhere and. you're 14-year-old and you do Instagram, and suddenly I 100% get that because. it's the giddy thrill of suddenly you. are in the public eye, and that's. exciting, and you're building something.

That is not where Victoria Beckham is. It's not where the Beckhams are. The. Beckhams already have an empire. They've. seen every single thing that can happen. if you put your children through that. kind of kind of publicity now. They've. seen all of it. >> bits of it. I mean, what on earth are. you thinking? And lots of people want to. sit there and say, "Oh, it's lovely. She's interested." Or whatever. She's. got ambition. No. This is just totally. bleak. In some horrible industry that is. now catering to younger and younger and. younger girls. And as I say, it's just. the absolute jackboot of the patriarchy.

down on your neck from what, the age of. five or six? You're doing unboxing skin. care videos. It's awful. And we. shouldn't think it's wonderful. And the. overarching thing often in these cases, and maybe we'll talk about this, you. know, maybe we might as well talk about. North West as well. Again, look at the parents. Sorry, hate. to say it, but the overarching thing. here seems to be that these children. can't have a normal life. Which isn't the case. There are an. abundance of celebrity children who do. have a normal life.

Almost all of them. And that they are. only suited and the Beckhams. particularly have always felt it because. you've seen what they each of the. children, I mean, there were moments. where is Romeo going to be a tennis. star? No, he's not. Okay, he's I'm sure, you know, in the end they'll end up. doing modeling and brand work and that's. but the sense that they are only suited. for the public eye or branches of show. business. And by the way, I think these. influencer led brands are the are a. branch of show business and even beauty. or whatever, you know, you're not a CEO, you're not as your apprentice winner, you're not building up from the ground.

up. It's not the same thing. And I I. think it is it's sort of extraordinary. and particularly given what's happened. to them this year. The downside, the. risk reward is so extraordinarily high. on the risk side of it. And just saying that, you know, my child. is driven, they know what they want. Well, I mean, just the word no is in the. vocabulary and until they're 18, why. don't you use it? >> Yeah, cuz also who knows what Harper. would have grown up to do? Something. interesting, something unusual, something helpful, it's possible. You.

know, if a 14-year-old, say if Harper. had just designed and invented a brand. new stent which would revolutionize. heart surgery that no one had seen. before, by all means, by all means. monetize that. But not this. You might. as well say, you know, what? She. couldn't find. a cigarette she liked and so she's. created her own. >> You know, and I don't and I this is. absolutely no shade at all on the child. who like all 14-year-old girls has got a. number of views about all sorts of. things. I. I did myself and so does lots of other. people. >> Every 14-year-old child would do what.

Harper is doing, and it's It's not about. every parent of every 14-year-old child. >> way. I mean, we might as well move on to. her to North West. It's not about her. She's had a social media account since. she was very young. She was posting to. her mother's account before that, to Kim. Kardashian's account. Age 12 is extraordinarily young, but. then, you know, you saw Beyoncé and. Jay-Z's daughter, Blue Ivy. She was They. have some rule that you're not allowed. to go to the Met Gala, which was last. week. You're not allowed to have the You. go to the Met Gala if you're under 18,

but of course, she was there, and Nicole. Kidman's daughter was there. And I. genuinely don't think it's the kindest. thing in the world to do this to people, but it's almost as though there can be. no other business than that family. business. >> It becomes sort of like the royal. family, which is, you know, if you are. born into the royal family, you do. understand that you have a certain life. ahead of you. >> I've heard of those. >> You. >> I've heard. >> I mean, I mean, exactly. A lot of people. born into it. >> They should have had an open audition. process for the Prince Harry.

>> But could they've got anyone that good? >> There's a TV show. >> They couldn't have got anyone that good. >> That's the interesting thing about him. is he probably would have won it anyway. >> Fair play to him. >> But I get it. If you're the royal You. know, so royal family, you understand. immediately you have to put your. children on a certain track and teach. them certain things, and this is the way. the world is going to be for you, and. this is how we deal with it. And it seems there's certain show. business families for whom they've gone, "Well, this the same with us." If you. >> have always been to some extent. There've been acting dynasties and. >> Yeah, not like this, though. >> I know. Why am I trying to make it sound. like the Rust Belt, you know?

Shouldn't they not be all automatically. entitled to the job their daddy did? You. know, sometimes it's a sawmill, sometimes it's a mine, and sometimes, you know, it's selling eyeliners. >> So, here's the so the sociological. thing. So, nepo babies, there's a lot of talk about. it, and there are an awful lot of people. in show business whose parents were in. show business one way or another. And the two ways you can argue against. it. One, but lots of people do what. their parents do. And And a huge amount. of truth in that, and actually a growing. amount of truth in that. The last labor. survey, which is like 19 uh which was.

2022, I think, 20% of doctors. had their main breadwinner parent. growing up was a doctor. So, that's. that's one in five doctors had a parent. who's a doctor. You sort of see that. 28% of people working in agriculture had. a main breadwinner parent who worked in. agriculture. Even even teachers, 10% 10%. of teachers had parents who were. teachers. So, >> I wonder what it is in investment. banking cuz some unbelievable morons go. into that and earn seven figures. It's. one of my hot takes. There's no easier.

way to make money than being in money. >> Oh my god. Yeah, exactly. >> of the biggest morons I know probably. made a huge amount of money and they. would really struggle elsewhere. >> Um construction, 17% of people in. construction, their parent worked in. construction. So, we do that and we all. of us understand why we do that. You. grow up seeing what your parent does. It's either appeals to you or it doesn't. appeal to you. If it does appeal to you, you immediately have a mentor who can. show you the ropes. Also, you know, can. get you work on the site during the.

holiday. And so, we get it. The you can. end up in the same job as your parent. and that you might want to as well. Does it automatically mean that you are. brilliant at the job. that you are doing? And that's the tricky thing cuz we see. it in TV all the time, TV and film. There are actors who are children who. are actors and you kind of go, "Yeah, but they're an amazing actor." So, of. course they of course they they're uh. you know, they they got there on their. own merits. The only sociological kind. of comparison I can make was with sports. cuz that seems to me to have a very. similar skill set, which is if you're an.

amazing actor, do you pass on those. amazing acting genes to your children. and then they become an amazing actor. and therefore they achieve because they. have that personality type and you know, So, sports you look into and actually. sports far far far fewer. >> So many fewer, yes. >> nepos. Lots of siblings, funnily enough, which tells you a a of it is nurture, you know, the the the Williams sisters, the the Brownlee brothers, the. Klitschkos. I mean, an insane amount of. siblings. >> Neville's. >> The Neville's, all three of them, exactly. But, if we get rid of the 1860s.

and the 1870s with old Tom Morris and. young Tom Morris, no father and son or. mother and daughter have ever won a golf. major, ever. So, loads and loads and. loads of kids go into golf and go into, you know, but none of them have ever. matched what their parents did. Likewise, there's lots of kids who who. had parents who were the sort of amateur. golfers and stuff, and they've. absolutely massively done better than. their parents. But, there is absolutely. no correlation. Same with tennis as.

well. There's not a single example, apart from the Suttons again, which were. many, many, many years ago, of a parent. and a child both winning. uh a Grand Slam tournament. The. Sebastian Korda might do it at some. point, but no examples of it at all. So, absolutely lots of examples of kids who. have the skill set, but they never quite. match what their parent does. And that's. the best way I I can look at it. There's. fathers and sons as well. You know, look. at you know, Maradona's son never really. sort of pulled up trees. Um you know,

Erling Haaland, his dad was a. footballer, but not kind of world-class, world-class footballer, you know. Whereas, in acting, there are so many. parents and children who have won or. been nominated for Oscars. I mean, Henry. Fonda, both of his kids, Jane and Peter. Fonda, Jon Voight and Angelina Jolie, Liza Minnelli when she won her Oscar, both of her parents have got Oscars. Vincente Minnelli and and Judy Garland, Jamie Lee Curtis, Janet Leigh, both. nominated for Oscars. Jamie Lee won one. Walter Huston, John Huston, Anjelica.

Huston, all Oscar winners. The Coppolas, of course. Laura Dern, Diane Ladd, both. nominated for the same film. They're. mother and daughter. And Bruce Dern as. well. >> Rambling Rose, exactly. And Bruce Dern. as well was nominated for an Oscar. Kirk. and Michael Douglas, Michael won, of. course, Kirk didn't. Isabella Rossellini. and Ingrid Bergman, uh Goldie Hawn and. Kate Hudson both nominated. I mean, that's the highest level you can reach. in your profession and it happens time. and time and time and time again. And no. one is saying these are not talented.

actors cuz they definitely are. What. we're saying is are they more talented. than people who didn't get their. opportunities. A really, really, really. fascinating thing I I saw the other day. and this to me encapsulates the whole. thing and it came from a guy I like. very, very much is Bryan Cranston. So, Bryan Cranston I think is I love Bryan. Cranston. I'll listen you know, he's. interesting whatever he talks about. He was talking about his daughter, Taylor Dearden. >> Who's in the pit and who is great. >> Genuinely great actor. By the way, there's lots of genuinely great actors. who never, ever got on a stage because.

they didn't have the opportunity. He's. talking about how she got her break and. she got her break in and again this is. zero shade on her. Zero shade on her cuz. she works incredibly hard and all that. stuff. It's always which is always the. case. So, that proviso. She got her break with a speaking role. on Breaking Bad, an episode directed by. Bryan Cranston. And Bryan Cranston is. asked about this and he says, "Well, it's interesting cuz this is sort of the. opposite of a nepo baby thing. Cuz I knew this line was there. and I'd said to Taylor, you could. audition for that. And she said, "I. don't really want to." He He said,

"Well, if you don't want to, you don't. have to, but you you could do." And he. said and then he said she got really, really brave and said, "You know what? I. will. I actually will audition for. this." He said, "At that point, I said. to the Breaking Bad people, I won't be. in the room when she auditions and you. must only give her this job if she is. the best You have to just only if she is. the best that she gets the job.". >> To repeat, this is the show in which he. is the leading man and is directing that. >> that particular episode. And God bless. him when he's saying this, you can see. he genuinely means it. So, I get it and.

every parent wants to do the best for. their kids. They absolutely 100% do. But, the one key to any sort of social. mobility, the single key and I see it. time and time again with the people I. grew up with and the people, you know, who I then was in education with, is you. have to get into the room. You have to. get into the room, and Bryan Cranston. got her into that room. >> Yeah. >> And once she's in the room, that's her. business, you know, and she takes care. of it. But almost no one can get in that. room. >> was really, "Dad, you're not helping.".

>> You know, it's really bad. >> Please don't say anything like that. online. >> But you know, and that's the key. You. have to be in the room, and most people. don't know where the room is. They. wouldn't have a clue about how to get. into the room. And if they did, if every single person. had the same opportunity that Taylor did. and did, then the Oscars of the last 60. years would look very different. >> I have to still say that we talk so much. and you hear so much of people talking. about nepo babies and showbiz, and I. agree, you know, and everything we've. said today.

But let's be honest, the worst nepo. babies are like, you know, I don't know, Don Jr. or I don't know, Kim Jong-un. I. mean, you know, these these The. Murdochs. >> Yeah. >> But I mean, they're it's all it's. >> new Ayatollah. I mean, he's useless. Come on, he was in the job two days, he's one leg down. But seriously, okay, these the you know, we never see him in public. These. >> Kim Kim Jong-un. >> Yeah, like a yeah, absolutely. That guy. and what's his name, Aliyev, the one in. Azerbaijan. I mean, there's some real. horrors out there. >> Yeah. >> And those are the worst nepo babies, and.

we just it's. >> We are an entertainment podcast, so we. talk about entertainment, but don't. think for one second that the entire. history of capital is to do with nepo. babies. It's to do with people. ring-fencing every single penny they. ever stole from you and giving it to. their children and their children and. their children. That's how that's how. our world runs. We're allowed to talk. about the entertainment bit of it. If we. want to talk about some the. socioeconomics of how the whole world is. put together, um then we can do it a. later date, but it's um. let's let's clean our house first. But I. I just would say to anyone a home who's.

got a kid who wants to be in that is. getting in the room is the key thing. And to anyone who is a gatekeeper in any. way whatsoever. The amount of times even at Endemol when. someone say, "Oh, can my kid do work. experience?" And we absolutely put a. rule in and said, "No, your kid cannot. do work experience. Work experience has. to come from somewhere outside the. building. It can't be from someone else. in the industry. It can't be from. We cannot do that. It has to be from. open applications. You have to open up. industries to people because. >> And class is we always say the hardest. thing for them to do that with. For.

definite. >> Class is that is the hardest of all. >> bits of it, it's the hardest bit and. it's the bit we have a big problem with. in this country. >> And probably the 10 greatest actors ever. to live have never acted cuz they never. got the chance and the 10 greatest. writers ever to live never wrote because. they didn't get the chance. And you. know, it's it's all out there and you. know, you you just have to open doors in. a in a slightly different way. But yeah, listen, every parent wants to do the. best for their kids and that's why it. happens. And so there's there's there's. no shade on the kids in any way. whatsoever, but uh. >> But there is on the parents.

>> Sometimes, yeah. Sometimes, on certain. parents. I certainly think letting your. 14-year-old have a skin care line. >> My god. >> Yeah. My god, which is which is where we. came in. Shall we go to a break? >> Let's go to a break. >> Where our children will be reading the. adverts. >> This episode is brought to you by Lloyd. who you can rely on to keep life running. smoothly. Now, you know what isn't. celebrated enough is the behind the. scenes work that makes successful. entertainment seem so smooth.

>> You know, you go on to any sort of set. and there's the talent and everyone's. you know, having to run around after. them. But the people having to run. around after them are the runners and. there is not a single successful. television show that isn't powered by. brilliant runners. >> Whenever you hear a director or actor. say, you know, we're all just one big. happy family, I always think, yeah, and. you're the children and the people who. are like running around are actually. always the youngest people on set cuz. runners are always really young. It's an. absolute first job in the business. >> And the other key thing is if the.

runners are good, you don't notice them. cuz nothing goes wrong and it's very. similar to your bank. You just need them. to be there when you need them. >> Well, like with the Lloyds app, you can. check lots of handy things, little. details, what payments you have coming. up, what subscriptions you're paying. for. It is this kind of helpful smart. stuff that makes 14 million people bank. on Lloyds. >> And that's based on Lloyds internal. customer data from March 2026, but we. just want to say thank you to all the. runners and thank you to Lloyds.

Here's a I think this is a great. question from Khalid Khalid Said. He. says, "As someone who's been. extraordinarily famous for possibly the. longest time of any famous person, can. you describe how being famous has. changed in your lifetime? What did it. feel like to be famous in the '60s. versus today?". >> Yeah, I think the big difference is in. yourself. Uh when you're first famous,

um you love it. >> Mhm. >> Cuz it's what you're trying to achieve. So, you actually get a little hit or you. you know, something goes well and people. in the street know you, you love it. >> Yeah. >> There's never any of this sort of oh, people are bothering me. Yeah, you know, there's none of that. >> None of that. >> The modern affliction. >> Yeah, no, we I we loved it, you know. And you learn to deal with it. I. remember going to a gig once and I took. the train out out of London to the.

station near this gig and I was I walked. in just on my own to the gig and there's. a little gang of girls FOUND ME AND. AND they're all screaming around and I'm. going, "Girls, girls, calm down. Calm down. Now, listen, here's the deal. If you keep quiet, I'll do your. autographs. We'll walk in and it'll. would great." So, you you learned how to. deal with that and they would they got.

it and they were very good. And realized they get some special time, you know. As time's gone by, the times have changed. So, now. phones. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Phones. So, if I meet someone, it's like, "Oh. Oh." And they're reaching for the phone, you know. Um I say, "Um I'm sorry. I don't do. pictures.". And that is like radical these days.

>> Cuz I I told that I'm name-dropping now. I told that to Oprah. She goes, "You don't What? You don't do pictures?". I said, "No." She said, "Why?" I said, "I don't want to.". You know, and it's like it's as simple. as that. >> Welcome back, everybody. That was a. small part of our interview with the. legend, Paul McCartney, which. >> Sir Paul McCartney. >> Sir Paul McCartney. We absolutely loved. doing it. He was a complete joy. Um that. is uh available for everybody on. Thursday, but if you can't wait, it's. available for members now.

Uh. >> It's so nice doing those interviews with. listener questions rather than our own. It's It's a really nice vibe to doing an. interview, I think. And so, you have a listen and see if see. if your question got answered. >> quite cheeky ones, which I might have. not actually. ask myself. Let us talk about Blake. Lively um and Justin Baldoni settled. their long-running feud, which was. in 2 weeks is going to come to trial. Yeah. Uh they settled it last uh Monday. And um she appeared at the Met Gala.

completely unexpectedly just a couple of. hours later. I don't think it was. settled for any money. There was a. statement, which I have to say I find. completely hilarious. I mean, this is. the defining without any question the. defining Hollywood feud of the era. >> You love a statement as well, don't you? >> Okay. Well, I love a statement. This. This is a statement. The end product, the movie It Ends With Us, is a source. of pride to all of us who worked to. bring it to life, raising awareness and. making a meaningful impact in the lives. of domestic violence survivors and all. survivors is a goal that we stand about.

It's like, wait, that's what this was about? I'm so. sorry, cuz it didn't feel like that for. a while. But just as a reminder, very. very brief reminder, started off with um. behind-the-scenes conflict of It Ends. With Us, which was the 2024 movie. adapted from the Colleen Hoover. bestseller, was a smash hit. Baldoni is. a sort of male feminist hero who wrote. and directed it and starred in it. Blake. Lively, who's a bigger star, also. starred in it. Very quickly escalated. into lawsuits of sexual harassment and. counter suit smear campaigns and all.

this sort of stuff. It will have taken. eight figures in legal fees to get even. before we started the trial. >> Being a lawyer is a grift, isn't it? >> isn't it? >> Why is that paid so well? >> Uh it's it's. >> But genuinely, why is it? I've never. understood why it's paid so well. >> don't you think that of all the jobs. that is vulnerable to AI, it's surely. one of these incredibly, you know, these. incredibly. expensive on the clock things that are I. don't know. I mean, I think that will be. I It'll be interesting to see what. happens there. And I think. >> was a lawyer, I would just start a law.

firm that charged half the money. >> Yeah. >> Because I still think you're making a. lot of money. >> Yeah, you Yeah. >> And you're making 5 million instead of. 10 million. That's That's okay. >> seven figures. Yeah. Today we're going to talk about how this. has affected the careers of Blake. Lively, Justin Baldoni, and in my view, as I said, the third principal, Ryan. Reynolds, who's Blake Lively's husband. Should we do the Justin Baldoni first? >> Please. I still I still I still I still. I still I still would not recognize him. if I passed him in the street. >> Okay, well, that is That to me is the. most interesting cuz what It's one of. those things where the case has been. going on, so what? The movie was a hit,

whatever. Sorry, who the hell is this. guy? He's like a clean-skin. He came. from nowhere. He played a sort of. telenovela character from 2014 to 2019. He was a sort of male feminist. He. seemed to have done some TED Talks. I. mean, he proposed to his wife, I. discovered. So much came out in this. case that it's just so detrimental to. everyone. He proposed to his wife in a. 27-minute video which he put on his. company's YouTube page. >> Wow. >> Which I guess is a character note. >> Is that available?

>> Um yeah, yes, you can see it, I think. I think. it's still available. As for what will. happen to him, I mean, at the start of. this, I said, "Bye-bye, Justin." I stand. by that particular verdict. Um. maybe he'll direct some low-budget. something or other. I He's kind of an. egg, I have to say. I read through it, I. think he behaved in a creepy way. I read. all of the stuff of this case over a. long the long period of time it's been. running. >> Yeah, I think I Yes, I think on my. judgment some of the behavior and his. own messages and his emails Yeah, I.

don't. >> I don't love it. >> Uh yeah. Um so, obviously, the case was. taken up bizarrely in that the way that. our culture will work now by sort of. conservatives and all right figures. So, maybe he'll I don't think I don't see. him as going in that kind of slight like. Laurence Fox as he usually plays I can. get work or like Kevin Sorbo, former. Hercules, you know, starring in those. type of movies. I don't really see that. So, maybe he'll direct low-budget. things, but I don't think we're going to. be hearing a huge amount more from him. Blake Lively, this is I mean, it's. fascinating, you know, really big in. Gossip Girl on TV, but she This is her.

star and and she's obviously married to. a huge star who we're going to get to. This was her step up to and to the top. A-list, I think, really. From the discovery, which is the process. the legal process file which we get all. the emails related to this case. But So, before she even launched her actions and. her sort of um her campaign against. Justin Baldoni, we now know what the. Sony executives were saying about her. The Sony were the people who bankrolled. the movie. The chair and CEO of Sony. said, "She did bring it all on" This is.

before she This is before it's become. Lively v. Baldoni. This They never think. these emails will be made pri- public. >> did bring it all on herself by refusing. to listen to advice and by selling her. products. Remember, she used this movie. about domestic violence to launch her. new hair care range. The head of comms. at Sony, she orchestrated all this drama. in a totally unsavvy and amateur way and. basically threatened Sony and now is mad. it backfired on her. Another Sony. executive, this is my favorite one. because it's this tells you everything. about the entertainment industry, privately writes an email describing her. as a terrorist.

When the movie comes out, writes to. Blake, Blake, 50 million, your blood, sweat, tears, brilliant smarts, heart. and soul in every single frame. My god, it's incredible. Thank you 50 million. times and it's only Saturday night. >> Wow, Sony. >> God, Sony executives must really love. seeing their emails in public cuz. >> How are people still writing things in. emails? >> Remember again, it's all before she. launches the legal action action says, it's quite ironic cuz she has a huge hit. movie to head headed to 300 million plus. and she'll probably never work again or.

not for a while. Although even Hathaway. recovered. Tom This is the Tom the CEO. of Tom Rothman CEO at the time of Sony. Pictures. Tom thinks she's probably. bizarrely unhorrible right now. This is. before anything became public. That. Hathaway reference is interesting. That. is a reference to Anne Hathaway at the. time of the Les Misérables sort of Oscar. campaign which she eventually won the. best supporting actress Oscar. There was a huge backlash, public. backlash, internet led backlash against. Anne Hathaway. I think that was probably.

just down to sort of misogyny. She They thought she was too staged, too. ubiquitous, too keen to please, you know, too something. >> Yeah, yeah. >> But there wasn't really anything that. you could say she'd done. Um so there's no particular reason. So. to go back to Blake Lively and whether. she could recover in that same way cuz. Anne Hathaway is obviously has recovered. from that. I do not think so. She had a. whole load of witnesses lined up. So. much have been struck out by this point. What they were really going to say in. the trial is Blake Lively is. commercially toxic. You're going to have.

a parade of people saying, yeah, I know, she can't get this work, she can't get. that work. We've got a million units of. our hair care unit that we can't shift. Are you really going to get up on the. stand and say that? >> I would I would launch a podcast called. Blake Lively is commercially toxic. >> You would get some real numbers because. people do not like her. Um, so she's you. know, what if you look at her upcoming. projects, there's a film in development. directed by Paul Feig. Will that go. forward? I don't know. There's a sort of. element where you think, you know, like.

in pantomime it happens and you know, for a certain amount of years you play. the old woman plays the principal boy. and then suddenly it's like, oh, now. you're the wicked queen. I don't know if she graduates from. nice girl to next woman. >> Yeah. >> Um, because they made just do go through. these cycles and backlashes and what. have you. Okay, now let's get on to the. real degraded brand here because Ryan. Reynolds, now he was an absolutely. Teflon A-lister. He is very clever, he's. successful, he writes, he performs, he.

has a gin brand, he. >> He's the co-owner of Wrexham. He's got. He's diversified in all the ways the. modern celebrity must be and he's got a. sort of guy next door sort of fun kids. watch movies with him. He's a kind of. four quadrant guy basically. >> Now. we've all now seen his texts which are. so sort of withering and as to be. brutal. People now think People think. they know stars. They've got a certain. persona, but now we all know Everyone. knows stars act like this or they.

suspect they do, but we now can see it. By the way, everyone in Hollywood who. has to work with talent doesn't love. that even though he's not their client. necessarily, no one loves that this has. come out because the whole business is a. business of artifice and wonder. Once. you see the people who seem like so. chill and really fun and just like a. laugh a minute guy behave like this. behind the scenes in a way that other. people would perceive to be bullying or. just like unbelievably the big I am. persona which I know I always bang on,

but it's taken a beating for for. definite. I think that that settlement. was to salvage him more than her cuz I. think she's regarded as a busted flush. now but you've got to protect that. investment. Do you think Taylor Swift. has former former best friend forever? All eyes on the Taylor Swift wedding cuz. if those two aren't at it that's not. going. >> Oh my gosh. I mean that would be I mean. I'm sure they will be but we're almost. at moved to the Cotswolds territory if I. can say. I mean they'd be a lovely addition. wouldn't they?

The scorched earth let's move to the. Cotswolds. >> The poor old Cotswolds. >> Never litigate if unless it's I mean. I've written about this so many times. before but don't unless it's desperate. don't litigate. What you've seen here is. at every single stage of this. their talent representative should have. said don't do this. Clearly what they. have shown themselves to be by. continuing with it are stars that are. uncontrollable or have just not taken. the advice and if there are if the. advice has not been at every stage let's. exit this gracefully. There's different.

ways we can go about this then the. advice has been incredibly poor for. >> Yeah. >> Or maybe this is a hangover of people. thinking that Hollywood's old ways which. is sort of legal far power status far. power by saying well we'll get rid of. you from our agency Justin Baldoni cuz. obviously these two are more important. to us that those ways would work and. that actually the really uncontrollable. thing in this case even though the stars. might have seemed uncontrollable is the. internet and you cannot under you can't. predict where it will go and you can't. predict backlash maybe you can who knows.

synthetically stir them up but you don't. want to get into one of those cases cuz. again the risk reward is too is is not a. balance in your favor. >> Cuz even 20 years ago we never would. have heard a whisper of this. >> No. >> Absolutely it would have disappeared a. couple of lawsuits blacklisting. everything dealt with certainly 40 50. years ago I mean this stuff happened all. the time but now you can't hide. anything. >> Everyone who has has lost here except. potentially Cotswolds estate agents who. could be in for a big. >> always win.

>> Why not just be a lawyer or a Cotswolds. estate agent? >> Estate agent. That's the. >> It just seems like that's the right. move. Yeah. >> Talking of estate agents, talking of. lovely bucolic neighborhoods, uh I want. to talk about the new ITV show, The. Neighborhood. The reason we're talking. about it is so you you may not have. heard of it, you may have done. We've. talked before about uh BBC, ITV, Channel. 4 taking fewer swings but bigger these. days. A far far fewer shows in the. mid-market and they're spending all. their money on three or four like really. really really big swings uh each time. And at the moment, that's all sort of in.

the tail of the comet that was The. Traitors, which showed that you can go. from a standing start and create like at. this huge phenomenon which really kind. of energizes terrestrial television. Almost always, these things fail. ITV's. new version's called The Neighborhood. and for whatever reason, it's become a. poster boy for how dare they. >> Can I quickly describe the premise of. the show just because quite a lot of. people haven't seen it. The premise is. it's it's set in this dedicated village, a holiday village um in fact, and but in. the Peak District and it's like a whole. it's almost like a 360° immersive set.

Would you describe it as that? Six. families move in, some other families. kind of come along along the way. They. do neighborhood challenges. There are. evictions in the form of something. called removals. There's a £250,000. prize. and Graham Norton is the host. Now, obviously he is one of the biggest stars. on TV. Um they've got everything in this. So you you know, there's a town square, there's a pub, there's a cafe, all of. that sort of stuff. >> It it it's a primetime show. >> Yeah. >> It's so now already been pulled from. primetime because it was doing so badly.

It got it it was getting half a million. viewers, which is um not what you would. wish for. Um and I mean it's replaced by. things like, you know, Speak the. Chasers, celebrity versions, and. Davina show on repeat, which are getting. higher viewers. Yeah, it's very. difficult because there and there have. been a quite a few show We should say. that by By way, this is not alone and in. the old days, it would have failed with. 4 million viewers. It was still a. failed. I don't think it's but now it. fails with. half a million. No, lots of shows like. The Fortune Hotel or The Inheritance.

Rise and Fall was that one called Yeah. Um there are various shows, these big. swing shows that have not worked. It's. interesting. I'll be talking to people, you know, within. that that business sort of saying, "Well, in the It's easy to forget that. it's sort of one in 10 maybe works and. becomes a big thing anyway and that. nothing can have a chance really now. beyond the first series, which is. something different than would have, you. know, happened before.". It's no longer the case that people will. turn up even if you've got one of the. biggest names and best loved names on.

TV, Graham Norton. They don't feel they have to until. people say, "Have you seen that thing? That's good." Until they've had a. recommendation from someone or. something, some outlet, something they. trust. >> Yeah. >> They don't actually turn up to look. >> Well, there is only one way to to to. draw people in and that's to make a show. that people want to watch and you know, you can start on 900,000 and then your. second episode. I mean, the don't forget. when Traitors started, the overnights. for the first couple of episodes were. terrible. >> Yeah. >> I mean, you know, really low and. everyone was like, "Oh, no, that's a. flop.". >> Bizarrely, it became a huge show.

catch-up even after the final had aired. >> But if people It's like anything. It's. like a book. It's like a song. If a few. people watch it or listen to it and like. it, they'll recommend it and that's how. that's how a show goes. Every single. person making these things wants this to. be a Yeah. a hit. The pedigree of this show is not just. Graham hosting it and he's absolutely. one of our best presenters. It's it's. lifted who make I'm a Celebrity and all. sorts of shows and The Garden who make. 24 hours in Police Custody. I mean, it's. really amazing chops.

I think the format is perfectly. acceptable. It's sort of like Big. Brother but for families. I mean, that's. an interesting pitch and by the way, we. found this an amazing location which. already exists. It's great. It's a place. called Durrant Lake Holiday Village. You. can rent it out if you want to. On. there, if you look on their website at. the moment, it's like. come with the TV stars are I think okay. And know it quite as well as you'd hoped. but I think it's a great pitch. It's a. really interesting pitch. There's. wonderful things like with the removals. things that everyone's staying inside. the house so they're looking out of. their window just to see if they're. about to get.

removed. When you watch it. I I I hadn't watched I hadn't watched. the first couple and I watched it when. everyone had said oh my god this is. terrible this is a disaster and etc. etc. And I watched it I thought it I. really rather enjoyed it because you. know in other generation it would have. been a perfectly acceptable mid-size hit. but because we've only got a couple of. these a year now and there's a lot. there's a lot of pressure on them it it. has to hit immediately. And absolutely. shows there's like a certain little. sprinkling of stardust on shows like.

this which is whether it's casting or. whether it's serendipity but I think. they set up everything they could set up. to make this a hit. It's a really. interesting location. I think it's a. perfectly acceptable idea for a a show. Some good bits of casting you know. I like how it looks and the people. behind it are super super smart. Viewers. if they watch something and it's not for. them. it's not for them but I do you know I do. think Traitors started exactly the same. started very very very low and just grew. and grew and grew and grew and yeah this.

this one it looks like it's not going to. but it's the idea saying oh my god who. commissioned this? I tell you who. commissioned it everyone. Every single person at home if they were. working at ITV would commission this. If. Lifted and The Garden came to you and. said here's our location. I said look. it's it's an eviction show. but people like eviction shows but. that's something that people like. What's the twist? The twist is oh it's. family so should we see family you know. it's not just families but it's. households. So there's like like a house. for the uni students. in there.

and they're saying that Graham's. interested in doing it so you know. you've got a a big face and a big name. who you know go on shows and and and and. puff it. and they spent plenty of money on it. Almost impossible to have a successful. television show. >> I I agree and I have to say that I think. what people are doing now and I I so. many people now say, "As much as you can. see they have in Hollywood, maybe we. just reboot something that there's some. kind of residual memory of some IP that. we did you know or we. you bring Hell's Kitchen back because.

it's huge in America and now we do it. here you know but ITV Studios make that. or you do people might turn up for that. for the sort of some. >> For the old stuff. Whereas I like I I. like that the channels are still taking. big things off things like this on new. shows and it's so hard and if I was. making this show now if I was at the. channel it's like it's so demoralizing. and we're not no one feels sorry for. anyone we get that but everyone is. trying to have a hit with a new show. here and you can say oh god it's so. derivative. Every show you've ever. enjoyed is derivative. It's all. Gogglebox well that's Soccer Saturday. I.

mean it's everything is derivative. You've you literally. it's impossible not to be derivative. You want to be derivative but incredibly. entertaining. Studio Lambert who make. The Traitors, who make Gogglebox, who. make Race Across the World. Three of the. three ideas which are absolutely not. original and what Studio Lambert do is. they make them absolutely brilliantly. >> Yeah. >> And you know all three of those shows. are shows which absolutely could have. failed. Absolutely. >> But they made other things like Rise and. Fall and they've done it brilliantly but.

it just it hasn't taken. >> Yeah The Inheritance that's one of those. and you know the viewers just go this. this one is. >> It's still a fantastic hit rate by the. way. I mean please. >> Oh it's. >> But people don't see it. >> best hit rate in the in the. in the business absolutely. Greatest. feeling in the business is when you have. a hit and when you do something where. the viewers go this is the version of. that that we wanted but no one. beforehand is is predicting that. You've. just got to give good people time and. money to make good ideas and and and you. hope it lands. So I I really enjoyed The. Neighbor Don't. >> Something that landed as me if I may say.

on ITV that is an old format we know. very very well and this is even a sort. of. re-tried of that format, the I'm I'm a. celeb All Stars thing that took to. place, you know, a couple of weeks ago, the final. I mean I'm just going to talk about this. really briefly because I think something. quite interesting has happened within. that. >> Yeah. >> The final was essentially a reunion. show. Bearing in mind they shot this. show in South Africa in last September, I want to say, and yet the the final. took place live in London in April over.

a period of 28 minutes. I am I can't. believe it because did it it felt like. 28 days but also like 28 seconds. It was. pure chaos and drama. I loved it, in my. view in a good way. These huge showdowns. mainly between Jimmy Bullard, the. eventual winner, Adam Thomas. By the. way, when he's crowned the his face was. just like I mean talk about the hollow. crown. It really was. You've never seen more one anyone David. David Haye who, you know, it was a. I didn't think any of those three.

gentlemen had covered themselves in. glory if I may say so but obviously. David Haye remains the worst always. There was this huge amount of people. shouting I take full responsibility for. my actions while taking absolutely no. responsibility for their actions. Sanita. walks off at one point. Gemma Collins. then thinks, "Hang on a second, she's. walking I mean I should have been the. one to walk off." And then this. extraordinary green fabric confection. flounces off after Sanita. They they. were pursuing Ant and Dec into the car. park afterwards. They had to It was.

unclear who could go on any of the after. shows. In fact, even the. the king of the jungle couldn't. Everyone has been on podcasts since. telling their side of the story. The. reason I'm going to say I love this, first of all is because it was. absolutely hysterical, but you see the. afterlife of it rolling on. That is. something quite new. That's something. that is an old format. We know it's an. old format. And this is very American. what's actually happened. This whole. idea of effectively a reunion show when. something's which is what the housewives. do. It's it's huge. It's These reunion.

shows are the biggest things. Everyone's. waiting for the reunion show when. they've all seen how they've been. portrayed, which didn't used to exist. >> That's the key. So, it's a normally on. I'm a Celebrity you'll have a reunion. show, it'd be the next week, and people. haven't really been able to catch up. with everything. This is months later, so everyone knows exactly how they've. been portrayed. They've seen every. single bit of social media comment, and. they are absolutely ready to go at each. other. >> claims to be what It was claimed that he. was suing ITV for 10 million pounds for. for giving him a villain edit. Um he's. now said this is absolutely ridiculous.

I would never sue for that little money. It's much, much more. The whole thing is. just pure poetry. Um but it's very. American that, and to have done that, and to suddenly And when things escape. the bounds of the show, and then you. realize that like, "Oh my god, this is. sustaining about like almost, you know, 2 weeks on it's sustaining several of. our leading podcasts. The fallout from. people turning up and and and saying all. sorts of things on it." Shows like this. now have to leap out of the leap out of. the confines of the, you know, the. transmission slot, and even on the. everyone it they sort of need to be.

happening and to be kicking off all the. time. >> you talk to everyone who's working on. that show, and it's literally hilarious. People who worked on that 28-minute. thing just going like the phone calls. they're making. Everyone's like, "Is. this okay? Is it. Is this seems like something terrible. has happened.". And just just. >> Remind me what our duty of care rules. are. I don't. By the way, you can still watch this on. ITVX. And also they say, "How can it. only be 28 minutes?" It's hysterical. It's absolutely hysterical. Um Jimmy. Bullard just shouting at the audience, you know, that "Sorry, for us this is.

just a job. For us. >> He was He was on some point of. celebrities, and we go and talk to him. beforehand, Jimmy Bullard. And I shook his hand and said, "Hi, Jimmy. I'm a Fulham fan." And he goes, "Oh, really? I used to play for Fulham.". I said, "Yeah.". That's. That's why I told you. Exactly that. Um. can I make an ITV announcement? >> to just say, "Can you?". >> I can indeed. So, I've just I obviously. I've left the House of Games and. Pointless and all of that. You know, I. wanted to do a bit of TV, and people. pick.

>> Okay. >> I haven't breathed in that bit. >> You know? So that's the thing that I. want to do. And this show gives me the opportunity. to do that. It's a really it's a it's a. really really fun show. And you know, everything fails etc. etc. But I'm I'm.

I'm I'm looking forward to doing it very. much. >> Autumn schedules, Richard? >> Um I don't know actually cuz we're. filming it in the autumn and it's it's. again it's it's Studio Lambert and. Talpa, the team behind behind. The Traitors and so the Americans and. the Brits and various other territories. will do it at the at the same time. Um. but we yeah, we've done loads we've been. doing loads and loads of run-throughs. the last couple of weeks. It's really. fun. Every version of it has been. >> Oh, this is so exciting. Yeah, I mean, listen, we shall see, but it's a it's. it's nice for me and it's eight episodes. rather than 110 and I can do that and. write as well.

>> number. >> It is a different number, exactly that. Any recommendations this week? >> I am loving Legends. >> Oh, that's what I was going to. recommend. >> that. Oh, sorry. I'm sorry. Why would we. not if you can only get one. recommendation? Well, Legends is written. by Neil Forsyth. >> I love Neil Forsyth. >> I love him so much. Did Did the gold If. you love the gold, and I certainly did, and it's with the same team he he did. the gold with with Objective. and. >> I was. across the aisle from Joshua and Maguire. from The Gold. I was like, "Oh my god.". I was so excited. And anyway, that's You.

don't need to know that. >> Well, it's it's a fantastic cast. Steve. Coogan is sort of the lead, but it's. long and strong this cast and it's about. undercover. customs. operatives in the '80s going undercover. to beat heroin smuggling rings. It and. it's it's it's sort of based on. something that's real, but it's never. really been talked about and just I just. think Neil Forsyth is brilliant. The way. Objective makes it, it's fantastic. It's. just a great crime story. >> like if Guy Ritchie had a sense of.

humor. You But you know what I mean? Like. there's there's stuff in there really. early on where you go, "It's just a. great gag. It's believable. It comes. from character." I'm There's still. tension, all of that, but it's. absolutely real people talking in a real. way. Both series of The Gold I just I loved. and this is a yeah. >> on BBC. This one's on Netflix. Um. >> Let's Let's recommend both of those. >> Yes. Yeah. That about wraps us up. We. will be back with someone you will have. heard of on Thursday. >> It's Paul McCartney. >> We loved interviewing him. If you want.

to listen to that beforehand, it's. therestisentertainment.com for. membership and ad-free listening. Otherwise. >> And apologies once again for. having no visuals in this episode. >> We are very sorry we have no video in. this episode. >> But lovely for people who only listen in. an they'll only ever listen because it's. like like everyone's on the on a level. playing field. >> I just want to say I looked incredibly. hot, maybe my best ever, but fine. >> Yeah, I was wearing I was You know what? I thought I thought just for once I. would wear a top hat.

>> Yeah. >> Uh and but now I just now I feel like it. was it was a curse. >> It's just wasted. >> Yeah, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Next week, hatless. >> See you on Thursday.