The SIMPLE (& Proven) Way To Earn $100,000 From Nothing! | The Money Making Experts

I've got three boxes here. One of them. contains $1,000. One of them contains. $10,000. And one of them contains. $100,000. And you three are the avengers. of entrepreneurship on the internet. So, you're going to tell me what you would. do with that amount of money to build a. scalable business. >> So, do I get to give the money? Is that. how this works? >> Okay. So, I would three highly. successful entrepreneurs with three very. different perspectives. This is the. ultimate master class in creating and. scaling your businesses to make. millions. There's two paths to making.

money quickly if you don't have any. And. the first path is go find the best. entrepreneur and go work for them. Learn. as much as you can. >> Totally agree. Like Kim Kardashian was. Harris Hilton's assistant and she. learned the playbook for being famous. And then she took it to a new level. >> And then the second way is high risk but. highest reward. Go do it yourself. >> And the first business that you start, you're going to be learning the game of. business even more than you're learning. the business that you're doing. Things. like if you wait 8 seconds after you ask. someone to buy, you close 30% more. sales. And there are actual studies now. that show that if I'm a woman, you make. more money if you do one thing. You wear.

makeup, which is wild. >> And what about making content? >> Building a content empire that builds. your business. This is brand new to a. lot of people. And so a lot of creators. online don't think about how do I. monetize on top of this, >> right? And I can name some Tik Tokers. with 50 plus million followers that have. had failed launches because they have. views but they have zero influence. And. in order to create influence, there's. four things. So number one is. >> okay so let's go on to simple actionable. frameworks. >> So I have a framework in order to raise. money. >> I have a framework for pitching.

>> and I have one that can increase sales. by 20 to 40%. >> And then if you want to know if your. business is going to make you money or. not we use the moat strategy. >> and there's a lot more. So let's go. through all of this. [Music]. Daniel, Cody, Alex, I feel like I have. waited a long time to have this. conversation with you three because in. my mind, you three are the avengers of. entrepreneurship on the internet. And. for very different reasons, you do very. different things. You have very. different perspectives. You run very.

different businesses. But for those. people that are sat at home and they. have an idea and they're mulling whether. that is the idea worth pursuing, is. there a framework for knowing if it's a. good idea or a bad idea? What we use. that comes from private equity. If you. want to know if your business is going. to make you money or not or investable. or not, we use the MOAT strategy which. is basically M stands for margin. So you. want a business that actually makes you. money, doesn't just generate revenue. And so a good business typically has at. least 15% net margin. So that's the. money you put in your your pocket, right? >> So that's profit.

>> Yeah. Yeah. >> Exactly. And then uh the O stands for. operations. So operations being can this. thing actually scale over time or will I. really have a job, not a business? And. what's the difference there? >> The difference between the two is if you. have a job, not a business, that might. be for instance without AI, if my entire. business was just me talking. continuously to camera and I'm an actor, it's really hard to turn acting to a. business, right? >> You're trading time, >> right? You're still an employee. You're. just self-employed as opposed to a. business owner. And there's a real. difference between a CEO and a. self-employed person. And then the A.

stands for advantage, which is, do I. have an unfair advantage in my business? I think over time all arbitrage windows. close. So, if you don't have some sort. of advantage, it's hard to stay in. business over a long time. An advantage. might be I have distribution because I. have social media, so I can get more. eyeballs. I can figure out how to talk. to 2,000 people quickly because I can do. it via video as opposed to knocking on. 20 doors. H or it could be logistics or. it could be uh 10 years of experience in. an industry. And then the T stands for. TAM, total addressable market, which.

goes back to the doggy teeth issue, which is, you know, is this a real. market that enough people are interested. in that I can build a business that is. big enough for me? And, you know, to. Alex's point, I don't think everybody. should try to play the trillion or. billion dollar uh game. In fact, I think. it can be quite miserable to to strive. for billions. And so the the total. addressable market for your local fruit. stand in your community may be a perfect. amount of income for you, but let's. actually know what amount of income is. reasonable for you. And the cool thing.

about entrepreneurship in like today's. age, the data is available everywhere. >> And so in private equity, you would take. this model like that. So you'd go moat, you would I take them and for each one, I rank them one to 10 and businesses. So. margin, operations, advantage, total. addressable market. each one of them. A. 10 is perfect. A one is the worst you. could have. And businesses that are. better than 30 across all four, well, that's a fund it. That's a fundable. business model. Businesses that are less.

than 30 but more than 20, that's a fix. it. You've got some problems in the. model. And businesses that are less than. 20, that's a flee it. This is probably. not right for you and a hard business to. do. >> I think it's not just the people who are. looking for a new opportunity or people. who don't currently have a business. I. personally think at the moment every. single person on the planet who has a. business should assume that their. business is on borrowed time because AI. is going to disrupt everything and in. that disruption everyone has the. opportunity to rethink whether they want. a different opportunity or whether they.

want to pivot. It's the perfect time. I. look at simple things when I'm thinking. about is it a good opportunity. I think. every good business is built upon. somebody's case study. So when I look at. not just businesses as a thing on their. own, I think businesses as a thing on. their own have to be taken in. consideration with who's the. entrepreneur. So your entre like. something that's a great opportunity for. Cody may be just a disaster for me and. like and likewise. >> So I'm looking at the background of the. entrepreneur. Do you have a case study. to leverage? Do you have knowledge? Do.

you have a network? Do you have. resources? Have you got a reputation in. something? Because those are the things. that we can then leverage. And then I'm. just going to have a look at three. little things. I'm going to say this. idea that you've got going forward. Does this address someone's pain? Right? Is there some sort of problem that this. solves? And that to we could measure. that, right? Because people pay to move. a metric. They love to move some sort of. a number. So, is there a pain that we. can measure and can I take people out of. that pain based on my story? >> The next thing is does that type of.

person who I'm going to solve that for, do they have money to spend? Because. ultimately 60% of all the money is in. the top 10%. So the top 10% have about. 60% of the available disposable income. So groups that t tend to have money is. business owners, executives, people. who've got accumulated wealth. Um you. know, so you're looking at like some. sort of indication that you're selling. to a group of people who have money. Underneath that top 10%, Amazon's. already got them, McDonald's has already. got them. Like that's a saturated part.

of the market. You looking for that top. 10% who've got disposable income. And. then the final part is passion. Like are. you passionate about this? And my. definition of passion is a willingness. to suffer. So it's not do you get joy. from it, not are you super happy from. it. It's are you willing to suffer for. this? Are you willing to have delayed. gratification um would an objective. third party who looks at your behavior, who looks at the way that you show up in. the world, would they agree that you. seem to be willing to push through. difficult times in order to have this?

So those are some of the conversations. I'd have with anyone. And not just. people who are starting out, people who. have already got a hundred million. dollar business. >> It's like the adult marshmallow test. basically. >> Yeah. I think Cody had a had a great. framework in terms of thinking about. this from an investing perspective for. the people who are considering starting. their first business. I like the pain. passion profession angle of like. typically it'll be something that comes. from a personal pain that you overcame. whether it's you had an eating disorder. or you have kids who have allergies and. you figured out how to pack lunches or. you figured out how to store stuff for. twice as long because of some unique.

thing that that you retrofitted a cooler. with. whatever some passion which is. just like a hobby that's that's you're. deeply interested in or it's a. profession so something that you already. currently do like in a way this is I. think one of the easiest self-. entrepreneur you know self-employment. path is just going from employed to. self-employed doing the same thing that. somebody already pays you for. >> so like you don't need to worry about. like market risk of like I wonder if if. accounting is still going to be desired. by other people like right now because. everyone's so interconnected like remote. work and being able to be fractional. like many people can start kind of mini.

consulting businesses doing, you know, because a lot of businesses and. entrepreneurs are very um bad at. allocating resources. And so they have a. lot of quote full-time employees that. are working 20% of their effort and. still keep, you know, keeping their. paycheck and at the end of the day like. they do enough to keep their job, but. not so much that they are nearly at. their full discretionary effort. And so. all of a sudden you think, okay, well, I. could probably do the same work for half. the price and the entrepreneur be. willing to pay it, but I could do that. same work for half the price for five. times the people and make three times as. much and do it on my own time. And so. that becomes I think a great like foray.

into entrepreneurship. Now what do you. have to learn there? It's like well you. already have delivery down because you. already do the job. You just have to. learn how to promote. It's just like how. do you reach out to people and ask them. if they want what you have and then get. them to trade you money for it. Um but. that like at least takes half of it out. of the equation. And almost all three of. those pain, passion, profession, you. already have kind of the back end. Like. you have the pain, you figured out the. thing. Uh the passion, you've already. spent all this time loving this thing. So you've already done a lot of the the. work and research. And so really you. just need to learn the front end which. is like how do I promote and how do I. sell, right? how to get someone to give. me money for it. And then in terms of um.

how much money you make, I think Dana. had a great perspective of like, you. know, sell the rich, like they're the. ones who have the money. And if you uh. sell rich people, you get to sell at. rich people prices, which is more fun. Uh and so I mean, I'll give you a simple. example. Um I have a CRO company that. that we do a conversion rate. optimization across our sites and our. portfolio. And so if that company go. works with an e-commerce business and. they, you know, add 10% to, you know, topline and goes from 1 million to 1.1. million, they make $100,000 of value. If. they work with an e-commerce business. that's doing $100 million a year and.

they do the same exact work and they add. 10%, they add $10 million a year. So. it's a hundred hundred times more in. terms of value that's being created. And. so fundamentally, you have the value. they create, your ability to negotiate a. slice of that pie, how unique that is. As in, for example, I could have plenty. of sales guys are like, "Hey, Alex, I. could sell millions of dollars of stuff. for I'm like, "Yeah, but so could every. other salesperson." So, you have. significantly less uh you know, negotiating power even if you have the. negotiating skill just because many. other people can do it, right? And then. the third the the final component is. risk. And that's the one that I would.

multiply everything by, which is how. much risk you take on. >> People often say this idea of selling to. the rich, but as you explained it there, what what it actually sounded more like. is sell to the person who's going to. yield the most returns from your skill. >> And I I reflect on this because I spent. the first half of my career doing social. media marketing. Yeah. I think I said. this when we sat down that I used to. work with fast fashion companies or. fashion and the net return. >> of me selling them all dresses was tens. of thousands. I then left that business.

and spent two years working in. psychedelics in the biotech industry. where if this was around the g the meme. stock thing where if they could. galvanize people on social media to care. about their stock the upside the swing. was billions of dollars. I was the only. employee in this biotech firm that ended. up listing on the NASDAQ for $3.2. billion. And so their remuneration to me. for the six months contract was many. many many many many millions. >> Yeah. >> Because they they made billions.

>> So for me they they thought they were. ripping me off. >> Yeah. >> And and I think about funnily enough. when you put the same company on. different stock markets. >> the the company is worth wildly. different. And I think the same about. our skills where think about the stock. market where you're trading your skills. >> I've got a I got a small example of that. really small example. There was a guy. who we worked with who was an. occupational health and safety uh. consultant and inside the workplace in a. typical office he would charge a couple. of grand a day. >> uh to go in and it was about 10 days so. about 20 grand to do an occupational.

health and safety. And I asked him the. question, "What is the most dangerous. workplace you've ever worked in?" And he. says, "Well, there's this type of. manufacturing that has lasers, freezing. stuff, boiling stuff, lava, you know, the sharks, you know, the whole thing, right? Whatever it is, and not actual. sharks, but you get the idea." And I. said, "Do you know how to solve the. problems of that workplace?" And he. says, "Yeah, I absolutely know how to. fix those problems." I said, "Why don't. you position yourself and why don't you. run a campaign that you're one of the.

best in the world for that and that. you're actually going to just run a. campaign around that?" Um, within a year. his day rate had gone to 20,000 a day. from 2,000 a day and a typical. engagement had gone up to 400 grand. >> Mhm. >> Mainly because he went from, you know, the same skill set, but he applied it to. a a much, you know, more valuable. environment. Podcasting is somewhat. similar, you know, because if I podcast. in the UK, the amount of money I get per. view from YouTube is half versus if I do.

the same activity, the same amount of. effort, the same amount of hours in the. United States, the platforms pay me. double for the same amount of views. And. I think many of us are like trying to. get a pay rise from our boss or. whatever, but actually thinking about. are you trading your skills on the. highest return market is a great way. We. I used to hire writers at my old company. and those writers would be paid you know. 30 $40 $50,000 whatever it was in the UK. when when I was working in biotech and. we were looking for someone that could. write about biotech it was a quarter of. a million the salary it was five times.

more for the same fundamental skill of. writing. >> I think that I think that a lot of times. when you're starting out as a brand new. entrepreneur it's scarier to sell to. rich people. You're like I don't know. rich people. I'm not a rich person. I'm. going to sell to my friends. That is. very normal. That's the people that you. have the closest proximity to. But the. problem is is that means you have to. play the volume game. And the volume. game is actually really hard. It's hard. to get a lot of people to buy your. thing. Incredibly difficult. It's. actually much easier to get a few rich. people to buy your thing. And so, you. know, we had this home inspection.

company and I didn't know it at the. time, but. >> he was telling me they were having like. major cash issues in their business. And. uh and I could kind of tell because when. an entrepreneur is under stress, like. you can sort of see it, you know, it's a. it's a a visual thing, too. and he was. about 45 days away from uh running out. of cash. And when I was sitting down and. talking to him, I was trying to. understand his business. Home inspection. has been around forever. It's a. normalized business. This business. works. It functions. It has good. margins. It's a rollup for private. equity. The business model is not the. issue. So, what was the issue? The issue. was their clients and their pricing. So,

he was trying to be the home inspector. for everyone at a lower price point. And. what does that mean? It means it was. actually really hard for him to. advertise because he wasn't niching. down. He was competing with all of the. major players and he had very little. margin because he was competing for. people who couldn't afford very much in. their home inspection costs. We made one. change which is we just said in front of. his business name and in all of his ads. luxury home inspections instead of just. San, you know, San Diego home.

inspections or whatever city he was in. previously. And that one change. increased his margins by 45% and they. saved his business. He didn't do more. volume. He didn't hire more people. He. didn't get smarter. He didn't get. better. He just sold to rich people. instead. And because that increased the. surface area that he was covering, so. each house was like, I don't know, thousands of dollars instead of a couple. hundred bucks to inspect, his business. was saved forever. And so I I think. protecting your profit is so crucial. when you start a business. And nobody.

tells you that because it feels safer to. sell things cheaply to people who don't. have very much money. But there's that. old adage which is, you know, try to. work with a $50 client and they will. say, "I need everything under the sun. for this $50 I'm going to give you." And. then go to a $50,000 client and they'll. say, "Why are scent?" And so, you know, so. >> in the beginning, go for the $50,000. And the last thing I'll say on that is. also when you're a young gun. entrepreneur, a lot of times people who. have money, they got there through. business nine times out of 10. They see.

themselves in you as a young hard. worker. You can often get away with. things when you are young working for. somebody who is rich and sees themselves. in you, especially in service businesses. that you just can't at volume when. you're selling to people that really. need that last dollar. And so I think. that's why most businesses go. servicebased business. You trade your. time for money in some sort of way. Then. you productize the service. So now you. make the service so other people can run. it too. And then finally you turn it in. technology software as a service. you. increase your margin at every single one.

or your profit at every single one, but. they're the same business. You're just. smarter. You're you're a higher level. entrepreneur when you're able to create. tech around it. And but really all tech. is is process at scale. And so it sounds. scary when you're just starting out, but. it it's it's really just the difference. between 10 years in entrepreneurship and. learning and not. >> I think when you um when you're starting. out, you a lot of times you sell out of. your own wallet to to Cody's point. So, it's like you have no dollars in your. wallet, so you assume everyone else has. no dollars in their wallets either. >> And you're so afraid of getting.

rejection that you continue to lower the. price until you get here. You hear. people say yes. But just as like a. benchmark for people who are starting. out is that like usually you're. appropriately priced when seven out of. 10 people are saying no. Um that's like. about the appropriate price. So if you. have like if I you know see a business. and they're doing 80% close rates as in. like 80% of uh the people they talk to. say yes, they usually have a double or. triple in pricing just sitting there. If. they're at like 60% close rates, they. usually have a one and a half to 2x. price increase that's sitting there. If. they're at, you know, 40 to 50, they've.

got a 50% price raise in there. And if. they're right at that, you know, 30-ish. 35%, then they're usually appropriately. priced. And if they're at 20, they just. need to learn how to sell better. But. and so, but fundamentally, I say this. because usually, you know, in the. beginning of entrepreneurship, you're so. afraid of hearing no. Um, but the. reality of it is that you need to be. hearing no more than you hear yes to. know that you're being appropriately. priced. >> because you like I way back in the day I. had a gym. Um, and I had I can't. remember how many members it was, but uh. I I said that's it. And I decided to.

triple my prices, which is a pretty big. move. Uh, we have a recurring membership. base. And so I gave everyone a trial of. the new level of service I wanted to. give. I wanted to go from large group to. semi-private. And um, I tripled the. price alongside that. and I lost. one-third of my customers. Um, but I had. twothirds of the people at three times. the price. And so I made um two times. the revenue and I cut my costs by. twothirds. >> And so I made a lot more money. >> And it was probably better for your. clients as well. More exclusive. experience. >> 100%. And it was like right as I was.

beginning to learn how like pricing uh. worked with profit in a business. And so. it and by doing that tripling in price, it didn't like triple my profit. It did. way more than that. And so like when you. have a 10% or 15% margin business, like. Cody saying, if you actually can pull. off a double in your pricing, it'd be a. 6x or 7x increase in profits. >> So there's a lot more sensitivity to. that price number. What's interesting is. that it's really just like, you know, a. lot of like, how do I raise my price? It's like you do the exact same thing. you normally do and then right when. you're about to say the number, you just. add a zero and then and then you just.

act the same. Dan Kenny had this great. quote. He said, um, go as high as you. can without cracking a smile. Uh, and I. think that's usually a pretty a pretty. decent place to start. Yeah. And if. nobody is giving you push back on. pricing, that means you're too cheap. immediately. Like I mean value metrics I. think are so un listen the thing is like. if you're a serious business person, you. want to make more money, pricing is. going to be really interesting to you. If you're not a serious person wanting. to make a lot of money, pricing seems. like such a boring conversation. This. will never go viral on the internet. except for people who actually are in.

the game of business and they understand. that pricing save saves businesses. And. the the thing that I learned that I. thought was like wrong at first, and I'd. be curious if you guys were the same. I. thought it was wrong to charge different. people different prices. I was like, "No, no, everybody gets the same price. That's the right way to do business.". And then I realized there's something. called value metrics, which is basically. your prices should be a representative. of three things. Usage, so does somebody. use this service a ton? Then you should. charge them more. Do they have a lot of. users? Do lots of people use it on their.

behalf. Or then finally, uh, value. How. much value do they derive from it? Do. they make a ton of money? Um, you know, can they have some sort of quantifiable. return? And if you're charging everybody. 90 bucks a month for whatever your. service is, you are wasting a ton of. money from a segment of your clients. that would pay you way more. >> Like Typeform is a good example. I I. started using Type Form, started using. it myself. They charge me $50 a month. Then I started running tens of thousands. of surveys through there and I put my. whole team on there. Now I'm paying. $1,000 a month. It's the same [ __ ].

tool. >> Yes, it is. But I'm using it way more. and I've got more of my team using my. account as well. So they're charging me. a thousand just over $1,000 a month. >> and they only had to acquire you which. is amazing. So from acquiring one person. and you're like you know your cost of. good or their cost of goods don't. escalate at the same rate at all. So. that's how these SAS companies get this. 80% margins. >> That's it. When you look at uh this this. little pyramid of customer segmentation, you get 1% of people who have 15% of the. budget, 9% of people have 45% of the.

budget. 90% of people combined 40%. Right? So when you actually break that. down, you have one person willing to pay. 15 grand, you have nine people willing. to pay 5 grand each, and you have 90. people willing to pay 445 each. So you. are almost always better off going I. think the best place for most small. businesses to go is that 9%. And the. reason is the top 1% typically shop on. pedigree. They want to work with the. best businesses out there. They want to. win work with the ones who have won.

awards and the ones that have been. around for a long time. >> Relationships. >> and and through trusted relationships. >> The 90% they shop on price. They have a. fixed price and they only want to shop. on that price. The 9% shop on passion. They want to follow someone who's an. interesting uh who has an interesting. new take on things who's putting. together a group who's done some. education or entertainment around it. So. the this 9% I would call that the. affluent niche. And that affluent niche. is really good place to start. And that. 9% are the ones that are closest to. moving into the 1%. So you can grow with.

a client over time, which we saw a lot. >> You could help get them up to the 1% and. then then they'll take you and introduce. you to all the others. >> This was one of the really fascinating. things for me when I was running a. marketing business, which is I think you. you referenced this Cody, which is when. I started the company, I was working. with founders who had a 10K budget and. the amount of times they would call me. because of that 10k budget because that. was do or die for them. And then when we. signed Uber and Coca-Cola and Samsung, the budgets are massive and they they. call me less. >> They sign things off quicker.

>> The meetings are easier, life is easier. And that's just one of these sort of. interesting phenomenons with um with. client services, I guess, and service. businesses generally is the bigger the. budget, it typically it requires the. same or less units of effort to keep. them happy than someone whose life is on. the line because it's their five grand. out of their own pocket. I think part of that you earn too as an. entrepreneur. I think I mean I'll speak. for myself. I uh you start out selling. way too cheap. >> Um because you also need the money.

because as much as it's like a nice it's. very comfortable for me to say like yeah. you need to add a zero to your price. tag. If I don't get paid for the rest of. my life it doesn't matter. >> And so I have a lot of leverage and. people can feel that. That's really. interesting, >> right? Whereas I mean this is also like. if you behave as if, right? If I behave. as if I have a significant amount of. money, then I tend to attract people who. are going or basically somebody else who. also has a lot of money will recognize. that behavior and say, "Okay, this guy's. a player." And so then they'll be more. willing to do business with me. Now, it's tougher when you don't have that. and you present that way, right? Which.

is so I think that a lot of this kind of. does become earned because like either. you're faking it, which is not my not my. recommendation, or you just do a decent. amount of volume and you realize you're. like, "You know what? can't charge $99 a. month for this. It doesn't make sense. for me. And then you have a different. level of confidence going into this. where you just look at someone, you're. like, I just can't do it for that price. >> That's the word confidence, isn't it? >> Yeah. Well, that's how I how. >> does one build that confidence or. portray that confidence when really they. don't believe it themselves. >> You outwork yourself, right? You do you. do so much volume that um you get bored. of it. Like when you can basically train.

out your your affective response or your. emotional response to a given activity, then at that point I would say like you. are ready. And so whenever I hear. someone, he's like, "How do you get rid. of nerves?" I was like, "You're just not. you haven't done it enough times like. until you're bored and you hate it.". >> At that point, I'm like, "Okay, now. you're ready.". >> Is that what like self-belief is to you? >> To me, yeah. >> There's two two types of confidence. There's a confidence that comes from. repetition. And I think it takes courage. the first 30 times and then you get a. little bit of confidence and then it. takes courage and then you get. confidence. But I think it's like 30.

block little blocks of 30 repetitions. and then you get rewarded with a little. bit of confidence upgrade. That's one. type of confidence. There's another type. of confidence which is an abundance of. options. So, let's say you run a lead. generation campaign and you want to get. 10 clients and you're hoping to sign up. 10 clients and a thousand people. respond. You end up with this with or. without you energy. And the with or. without you energy is I'm going to be. fine with or without you. I'm going to. definitely make my 10 sales. I've got a. thousand leads. I've got 10 sales I can. make. So, therefore, it's out of.

balance. Mhm. >> I I go back and forth on this because. the good thing about today actually is I. think people do less than ever but think. that they do more than ever in. entrepreneurship. And so we have a lot. of mental masturbation that goes on. I've thought about this a lot. I've. really pondered it. I've wondered about. this. I've worried about it, etc. Right? I've watched all these videos. I've. consumed all this stuff, but I've. actually done nothing. >> Keep watching the videos. >> Like and subscribe. But you know I if if if I if you take.

the quantity advice then what you do. when you try to go get a job let's say. whether it's it's a job uh that that you. have in your business or you're trying. to get an actual job then you just go. and you apply to 15,000 of them. I. actually think you'd be much better off. by applying to five and doing as much. work as it would take to reach out to. 15,000 to obsess on those five. And so. even if you haven't done 10,000 hours of. painting uh somebody's house, if you go. and sit down and you sit down with uh. AI, get in front of Perplexity and you.

write down, okay, what is the average. painting job cost? What are the problems. that come up with painting jobs? Uh who. are who is the most expensive? Um how do. I upsell them? And you put together a. package that is like here is everything. that you think you need to know. data-wise on this job that I want. Like. you will be the 1%. Nobody preps for. anything anymore to the degree that you. need to execute. And so I don't think. you always have to do the job if you do. the preparation to show that you care. about the job. And just think about it. like how many times have we all had.

people reach out to us and they're like, I want to come work for you or I want to. come get this job and they're like, hey, can I send you a video of XYZ and if I. do it then then you'll hire me or can I. do a sales pitch for you? You know what. you should actually do? Make the video. Make the video. Put together an entire. prep document. Put together a strategy. document on why I should hire you. And. make it so that it is almost impossible. for somebody to say no to you because it. shows how obsessed you are in a world of. super curious, uninterested, not that.

deep obsession. And I've hired God, I. probably hired 15, 20 people solely. because obsession is rare and competence. is rare. And if you can show those two. things, you can be people who have been. doing it for 20 years. Because I know. many painters. We we own one of the. bigger painting franchises in the. country and I know very many painters. that have all the experience but they. don't know how to properly communicate. it and show the preparation that they've. already done. >> Let's talk about that because that's a a. function of really sales. I guess that's.

sales that's marketing. Um, I was. mulling the other day because I've I've. just hired someone called Harry who's. our new head of happiness in our in. Flight Story. And she and she didn't. just make a seven-minute video. She also. sent the video via unsaturated, less. noisy channels. And it made me think. about this framework of the resonance of. the message and the high signalness of. the medium. >> because as you all know, you're getting. DMs from people that say, "Any jobs. going?" that's like low emotional.

resonance and a terrible medium. So I. think of it as like this four sort of um. square quadrant where in the top right. of the quadrant you have message the. 7-inute video but then figuring out how. to get it round back past the PAS not. into the saturated inboxes maybe into. the post. I think post is so like. unbelievably unappreciated as a medium. in a world of like laziness where nobody. wants to like go to the post box. you. you're all on the receiving ends of. thousands of DMs and messages a month. and sometimes some of them get through.

Sometimes some of them result in someone. being offered a job or you investing in. their company. So if I'm listening at. home and I'm thinking, okay, I've got. four people here who get thousands of. DMs. What is the secret that penetrates. your your fortresses? >> I would be careful reaching out to. people who get who have millions of. followers because it's hard for you if. you've never had millions of followers. um or even hundreds of thousands of. followers. It's it would blow most. people's minds just how much traffic is. moving on in the background on any given. day. There are plenty of people who have.

10,000 followers or 20,000 followers or. they've got a very successful business. They don't get a,000 emails a day. They. get maybe a thousand emails a year. So. there's a there's something that you can. reach out with which is called a proof. story which you mentioned. And the. format that I like to use is I did. something special. I recently worked. with a extremely famous uh YouTuber. >> um who has over 22 million followers. >> and we were able to spin out a new. business. >> um which became very very successful and.

exitable. >> um and that business uh got you know 10. million worth of revenue in the first. six months uh and I project managed the. whole thing and I can explain exactly. how we did that step by step. So that. the format is I did something special. with a certain type of person. We got a. great result. Here's what the result was. and here's how I can explain it step by. step. >> And what's in that for me or am I making. the the link? >> So I'm reaching out to you with my proof. story. Yeah. >> So I'm telling you this is this is what. I've done. >> and are you asking me for something? >> I'm saying would you like to know how we. did it step by step? Now the other way.

we can do this that works pretty well is. to do this in the public domain. So, for. example, you could reach out by actually. posting a video or a or a post on. LinkedIn or on Instagram or um or on uh. X. And what you can do is have five, six, seven, eight friends who then jump. in and start commenting on it. Now, for. me personally, if you've tagged me in. something in the public domain and. people are now commenting it, so that. the the the the thing might be I've got. a little bit of advice for Daniel. Priestley.

>> and I go, oo, what's going on here? Right? And then I see that there's a. public video and I see several people. commenting on it. And then I look at the. video and it's a proof story and it's. really complimentary. I really like your. stuff and here's what here's going and. here's the here's my proof story. And by. the way, Daniel, I'd love to get in. touch. Drop me a DM. I'm I'm going to. check that out because it's in the. public domain. >> because. >> well because it could be negative. It. could be. >> like I don't know. >> I want to know what the heck's what. what's being said there, right? I I.

think the real thing is don't confuse. famous with rich. Like you guys. shouldn't care about us and reaching out. to us. There are people that are richer. than all of us even though we all have. some means as far as I understand. There. are people that are way richer than us. that nobody knows that nobody's reaching. out to that want to give you their. money. And so I think a lot of people. spend time focusing on fame as opposed. to rich. And when you're young, who. cares? Like you can't eat fame. Fame is. not lasting. We will all be totally. irrelevant probably sooner than we even.

want to. >> speak for some. >> like and subscribe. >> Alex will be remembered in 500. >> So like it, you know, for young people, I do think sometimes uh because we get. DMs, we think that it's important, but. if you're watching this, you should. really be obsessed with just making. money and then you can be sitting at a. table like this and not worry about, you. know, slipping into our DMs. I mean, the. richest guy that you know probably. started a sprinkler head company, lives. down your street in a big house, and if. you went and asked knocked on his door.

and asked him how he made it, and if you. could do a service for him, he would. probably let you. >> So true. >> I wouldn't mess around with famous. people. >> The people that gave me my first leg up. in the world of business were no one. They didn't have followers. >> They were some guy who had built a. business similar in the city and was now. living out in Monaco, living an isolated. life. It was someone who'd sold some. kind of company was running uh you know. some kind of marketing business but and. they were at that level. They were. probably at the $50 million level in. terms of net worth and they were. delighted to have an email from me. tickling their ego.

>> of course. >> and saying that I was reading their blog. etc. >> Yeah. >> It's very exhausting to do the very deep. level of work that you do in order to. get a high level client and then have no. response. Right. That can be that can be. really you know extinguishing from a. behavior perspective. But if you do that. work for, you know, Steven Bartlett and. then you make the post and you say, "Hey, this is this like I'm a XYZ, you. know, whatever designer and I've worked. with these types of clients and let me. just show you my breakdown of what I. would do. I think his stuff's awesome. This is just some stuff I would do." And. then I tag you, then I'll probably like.

things is enough people will see that. that you'll get it sent to you from. somebody else who you will answer the. response from messenger messaging type. perspective. like somebody whose DMs you. will open will be like, "Hey, I don't. know if you saw this. >> team member.". >> Right. Exactly. Um and you do respond to. them. >> I do. Yeah. >> And so all of a sudden it's like that's. actually how you can get in, but you. also get all the free exposure of the. work that you're doing. And then another. person who might not be you and it might. be me and saying, "Hey, I like Stephen. stuff too and I thought this was a. pretty good breakdown. Um hey, do you. have services?" Uh you know, in exchange.

for money. >> Yeah. I'm I'm nab that [ __ ] Um, and so. and so yeah, I actually actually really. like that perspective because it doubles. it allows the work that you do for your. lead magnets to basically double as. content and so doubles as promotion. And. so you get you kind of get multiple. bites of the app, which I think is. really uh good. >> And I think if you do do it though, be. sure you're good because. >> because you know the truth of this. happens all the time with you and I. I. mean there we go back and forth because. people will say online like, I built. everything that Alex Formoszi owns. Can.

I come work for you, Cody? Yeah, you. know, I received those emails, too. I. built. >> He'll have this. He has the same people. You know, I built everything Cody has. How? And then, you know, kind of. funnily, I'll be like, "God, I don't. remember that person ever working for. me." Like, did. >> did this actually happen? And so, I do. think this is just a little listen, you. got to hustle when you're young. You got. to do things you're going to cringe. about later. I am so on board for all of. that. But also remember that the world. is small, especially with people. pause. on that cuz I think this is an important. point is all the people that have had.

the biggest net impact on my success, my. career in my team, they don't they don't. seem to have time to be telling the. world that they did everything. >> Yeah. >> I mean, Jack is a good example. Jack is. Jack was here from episode one of the. podcast, but Jack in my view is doing. the like least personal branding, milking the cow, and he's in my view. arguably the most responsible. >> Yeah. >> for all of this stuff. And there's. almost this inverse correlation between. someone that works for you for three. months and then builds a personal brand. off the back of that. >> and is on stage claiming, you know, the.

success versus the people in the in the. trenches. >> in the circle. Yeah, >> it's a it's a bit of a side point, but. um one of the things people are so. fascinated by is this idea of passive. income. >> And I think I think they're fascinated. by it because it's a promise of big. returns for no work. And that's you talk. about offers a lot. That's like the. perfect offer. >> Yeah. What what's your what's your thoughts on. passive income, Alex, and is it. something we should be aspiring for? >> So, um, first I think it'd be helpful. for everyone to even define in terms of.

how to think about passive income versus. active income. So, one is that people. often discuss it in binary terms, passive versus actum, when it's really. more of a continuum of how passive is it. versus how active is it? And that way it. becomes way less black and white. When I. think about passive versus active, um, when people are starting out, I. generally just discard it entirely. because they typically don't have. sufficient capital in order to actually. make meaningful passive income and they. would get significantly higher returns. on increasing their active income. And. virtually every extremely rich person. who self-made as my asterisk generally. has gigantic active income and only.

begins to look at passive when they have. so much money from reinvesting in their. higher return things, which is what got. them this very large active income that. they're like, where else should I put. it? And then at that point it's really a. question of diversification which is. like how much more do I not want to. double down on the main thing and that's. a completely personal question and I. don't there is no in my opinion there's. no right answer to that um of because. that's a fundamental like how much risk. do I want to take um which I see is. entirely personal but I'll give you a. very a real example of like an. investment I made you know 5 years ago. which was um we did ex exited the.

business um and I had more time on my. hands and I was like okay well why don't. I just start spending you a couple. million bucks a year on making content. Now, that had basically zero return in. that time period, but if I were to look. at the return on capital for that, you. know, $2 million a year I did for the. first few years compared to today was. probably the highest return capital that. I made. But is that was that a passive? No, it's definitely not passive. It was. 100% active in from an investing. perspective. And so, this is when people. are like, what do you mean by investing. yourself? I mean that right like you're.

investing in either the skills that. you're acquiring the businesses that. that you have and a very simple. investment a lot of times uh can get you. ideally leverage on your time and so I. would rather think for the person who's. starting out not like how do I make this. passive I would say how do I get more. leverage on my active and so like I. could start by shoveling snow in the. beginning and then once I save up enough. of my shekels then I'll buy a snow. blower and all of a sudden I can go from. doing you know one driveway an hour to. doing three driveways an hour and then. boom I tripled my income. Now, for that.

one week that my cash flow is down. because I had to buy the equipment, I'll. I'll have made less money, but then I'll. very quickly recoup it. Now, to the same. degree, that's in a capital expense from. an equipment perspective, but you can do. the same thing from a skills perspective. of I give a classic example of a. phabotamist as somebody who draws blood. Um, in the US, I think they make. somewhere in the neighbor of like $25 an. hour or something like that. It doesn't. take very long in order to become a. phabotamist and it doesn't take a lot of. money. And so, you know, a couple weeks. you do the studies, you get your cert, and then all of a sudden you take. minimum wage and as long as you're not. in San Francisco, you will have double. or tripled your earning capacity in just. a very short period of time. And so,

that's a very good return on capital. And so, that's where I think about the. best investments for people who are. starting out who have call it sub. $10,000, sub maybe $25,000. It's like I. put all my money into how I get more. leverage on my active, which is either. going to be more skills or or more. actual physical equipment in order to. get returns on the skills I already. have. >> Interesting. more leverage on my time. >> I I personally like the idea of asset. income versus passive income. So if you. actually look at what's really going on. with passive income, it's that there is. a an asset and that asset is in some way.

generating income. So for example, you. own a house and you get rental income or. you write a book and you've got. intellectual property and that. intellectual property generates a. royalty income. So first there's an. asset. Income follows assets. So the. first thing you need is an asset and. then you get the yield from the asset. And there's traditional assets which are. very very good if you've already made. money or you already have money and you. want to park it somewhere and you want. to stay ahead of inflation. >> Traditional assets are terrible for. trying to make money. >> Give me an example of a traditional.

asset in this definition. >> Um I think of something like art, wine. and watches as more like a speculation. but or or perhaps a store of value. But. then there's something else which is. called a performance asset. And a. performance asset is typically. intellectual property, media, code, or. data. And when you have these. performance assets, if you can build. these, these are ones you don't have to. buy, you build them. So, for example, you could write a book, and now you've. got intellectual property. You could. build a system like a a SAS platform.

Uh, and now that SAS platform is in some. way an asset, and you can rent that out. to to more people. uh you could build a. database of a thousand people and build. a relationship with those thousand. people and then every time you write one. email it goes out to a thousand people. and they've got a little newsletter. So. that's a performance asset. So typically. when you look at um the people around. this table we're actually got we we're. very lucky to have a lot of performance. assets big followings uh lots of media. and content um books that we've written.

So these are kind of like the. performance assets that anyone can. create. It used to be until very very. recently that you just couldn't build. assets like you couldn't. It was very. very difficult. But we live in this. magical moment where almost anyone with. a phone and a laptop can start creating. performance assets with intellectual. property, media, data, and code. And uh. and then you can basically start the. process of building those assets and and. then those assets produce more income. >> Here's my conspiracy theory about. passive income. And uh I think that.

passive income, it's a tax code, right? It is a real thing. It exists. You pay. less money to the government if you have. passive income than active income. Like. that's where the word comes from. But I. think the reason that it's been so. idealized is because there's an entire. industry where people have told all of. us for decades that they are better at. managing our money than we are. That's. the mutual fund industry, that's the. investment industry, that's the real. estate industry, that's the private. equity industry. and they have said we.

are uh professionals and thus we will. charge you 2 and 20. We'll charge you uh. an investment fee on top of your assets. for you to give us the professionals. your money to beat inflation over time. The problem is is that to your point. they will never make you wealthy. Investing overtime in those assets are. are great for beating inflation or. making sure you have downside protection. for your cash over time in order to. allow it to grow and have. diversification. But they're very bad if. you want to get rich. If you want to get. rich, you're not going to get rich in.

mutual funds and sitting it in somebody. else's private equity fund. The people. who get rich off those things, they do. the active income. They're the ones who. are running the private equity fund. They're the ones that are running the. private equity companies and they're the. ones that are running the real estate. And so there's this fascinating world we. live in actually where people think that. it is better and more sophisticated to. not teach you how to become capable of. running your own business and creating. active income, but that instead uh. you're more sophisticated if you're on.

Wall Street. And and so I think that. passive income was actually in a lot of. ways a way for the wealthy class to gain. a lot of our assets. >> But people click it. And this is why. there's a generation of younger people. as well that are obsessed with trying to. figure out how to make passive income. It's it's it's clickbait, isn't it? >> I think it's forex trading, >> but I think it's almost deeper than. that. I think it is actually that um it. sounds, you know, if Alex says this, I. say it too, but like invest in yourself. People are like, "What does that mean? What do of course I'm trying to but how.

do I invest in myself? That's hard. I. don't know exactly how to do it. What. are you trying to sell me courses or. tell me to buy your books or whatever?". And that's the the reaction. But the. truth of the matter is is that you will. never be able to have the return on. investment in somebody else's asset that. you will in yourself. You just won't. >> Okay. So, let's go on to that then. Investing in yourself. If you were starting out in your career. today without the skills that you have, without the audience that you have, and. you had to choose how to invest in. yourself, what is that investment you.

would make in yourself today in 2025? >> I'm going to give two answers. So um so. I started at zero once and then I've. lost everything twice. And so I have the. I have done that three times now. Um. starting from zero without a reputation. um or money. And so um what I did in all. three times was the same thing which was. the first thing I did was I learned how. to advertise which is how to let people. know about the stuff I have. The second. thing I did was that I went to people. who had an existing business and I said,

"Hey, for as little as little money as. possible, what would you do to fulfill. your existing services. and then when someone uh I would then. use the advertising that I had, so at. the time it was Facebook ads. Um, I. would run ads and then I would sell. those leads into that business based on. the pre-determined price. And so let's. say it's a a chiropractor or for me it. was a gym. So I went to a gym owner. I. said, "What would you, you know, take. for a member?" And they said, you know, we would actually take them for if you. can just bring them, you can keep the. money. We just want the customer for.

free. And so I said, okay, well, the. first six weeks of the time that they. spend money with you is mine, and then. after that, they're all yours. And they. said, "That's fair." And so then I just. spent money and I sold into someone. else's business, and I kept everything. above the spread, which since the basis. was zero, I kept all of the money, and I. had zero cost of delivery. So literally, it was just cash collected minus CAC, all of that was profit. And so when I. started over from zero the third time, um I was able to make $100,000 in the. first month when I needed it. >> because you had that skill of. advertising.

>> And so when we say like invest in. yourself, it's just a it's a it's a very. uh amorphous term, but fundamentally you. have to learn the the the skills of. generating money. And so you're going to. have to have some level of promotion. You have to let people know about your. stuff, which is either be through. content, through paid ads, through. outreach, right? Or it's going to be. through affiliates. So somebody already. has an audience you negotiate some sort. of thing with. Honestly, so many. businesses, like you can go to a. chiropractor and say, "Hey, you know, how little will you do 10 sessions for?". And you'd be amazed if I say, "Hey, I. can bring you a hundred people. How. little can you do 10 sessions for?" They. might say 20 bucks a session. Now, I.

might sell it for 200, but that's on me. >> And I make my 90% spread. I don't have. to do anything. I just have to promote. and sell. And so, that is an example of. something that like I have done and did. do each of the times when I needed to. make money in the beginning when I had. nothing. >> What skill that you currently have? >> Yeah. would get you back to being a. hund00 million entrepreneur. >> So, it's a really good question. I think. it's actually stacking skills. So, a lot. of a lot of times like when this. question gets asked um basically the. assumption is that you have to stay in. the same vehicle. And so, like the.

fastest way to make $100,000 is not the. fastest way to make $10 million, but I. might make $10 million faster if I. started with $100,000. And so, if I have. zero, then I'm going to do something. that costs zero capital and is pure. skill, which is exactly what what that. was. right now to make let's say to. actually start running those ads I might. need $1,000. And so it's like I might. drive Uber for a,000 bucks, get my. thousand, then spend the,000 on ads to. make my 30,000 and during that process I. can reinvest that to get the hundred. Okay, great. Now I've got the hundred. Now with the hundred I can flip that.

into and the key of each of those is. that none of those are really businesses. per se and that like I can just walk. away from them whenever. I don't have. ongoing delivery or ongoing commitments. and so that gives you a lot of. flexibility. And I mean, I think there. are a lot of entrepreneurs, at least the. ones that I know, um, have have had. these moments where they needed to. generate a lot of capital in a short. period of time and have a few kind of. like fast money skills that they don't. flex normally because there's there's. caps to them, right? What. >> I think is cool about entrepreneurship, too, is we can all do it. You have to. find your unfair advantage. One of your.

unfair advantages is you're very good at. paid promotion and getting to the. masses, right? That was never really my. unfair advantage. I think there's two. different ways you could do this. One. would be promotion. So, are you an. incredible salesperson to go direct to a. ton of people? The other way is. partnerships. And I think you can think. of these different ways. Promotion could. be BTOC often, which is like going. direct to consumer. Um, often. partnerships is B2B, going to a few big. people. Um, I think of partnerships as. employment, which is a very fast way. often to make money, too. Like Jack.

might make way more millions with you. than he does individually. And so, my. background when I didn't have any cash, I didn't know how to go to people. directly. I didn't know how to do paid. ads. I wasn't sure how to do promotion, which is a volume game that you have to. be good at. So, I went towards. partnerships. I said, I can get to. fewer, bigger, faster. I can't get to. many fast. And so, I think there's like. two paths to making money quickly if you. don't have any. And and the first path. has less risk, but perhaps midsize. returns. And that is go find the best.

entrepreneur, founder, business builder. you can find who you can still get to on. a daily basis in some way and go work. for them. Learn as much as you can, earn. as much as you can. As you learn more, ask for more continuously over time. This is how I mean Cheryl Sandberg is. one of the richest people in the world. and she's never had her own business, right? She's only worked for other. people and she's doing just fine. So I. think that's the first way and that. would be what I would call partnerships. or employment. And then the second way. is to go do it yourself, right? which is. high risk but probably highest reward.

And in that instance, you have to go and. figure out how to get people to buy your. things continuously over over time. But. like when I didn't have money in the. beginning, um you know, I had just I had. gotten out of finance. I didn't want to. work for somebody else again. I was. pretty miserable. I had worked for a. billion hours for people in investment. banking and asset management. And uh I. had massive gold in handcuffs. Like I. made a lot of money. And um I had no. brilliant idea. I didn't have a business. idea. I had no idea what to do next and. I'm pretty riskaverse actually. I was. like way too scared to go do do what you.

guys all did which is start businesses. from scratch. And so instead I partnered. up. I went to another company that. needed to raise capital and get a few. investments in it. And I went to them. and said, "I can raise money from a few. of these people that I know. If I do. that, can I negotiate a little bit of. equity in the company? Can I negotiate. upside return for the money and dollars. that I bring in? And I want to I want to. be a partner in the company." And so you. don't always have to start your own. thing. If you can negotiate with. partnerships, I think sometimes you can. skip to the front of the line if you're.

not a great natural salesperson, you. know, or marketer. And so you really. just need to decide which one. And. neither of them are better than any. others. They're just better for you. >> The amount of resources you have access. to is a factor of knowledge, network, and reputation. So you're at all times. you're trying to build your knowledge. You're trying to build your network. You're trying to build your reputation. A lot of people are worried about the. knowledge, but they've probably done. interesting things already in their. history. They probably if they looked. over the last 3, four, five years, they. could say, "Actually, I've done all.

sorts of things, but I've never told. anyone about that, right? I've never. actually explain to I've never posted on. LinkedIn. I've never posted an update. telling people what I've done. So. therefore, I've actually got things that. could build a reputation, but I've never. leveraged that reputation." If you're a. young person, especially, network is. actually you've got a superpower with. network. And I'll tell you why. Because. if you go to a private bank that. normally banks people with 3 million, but you say, "I want to be an. entrepreneur. I want to come to some of. your entrepreneur events that you host, they'll bring you along cuz you're. you're an ambitious young person." If.

you go to a large accounting firm and. say, "Do you ever host big events? Could. I attend some? Can I jump on a. newsletter that lets people know about. the events?" They'll invite you along. And I'm talking about like Ernston Young. and KPMG. Every single week, they've got. some thing that they're doing in their. offices. They've got experts, they've. got rich people, they got all that sort. of stuff happening there and they'll. invite you along. So, you've got this. ability to build your network, you got. this ability to leverage uh your. reputation. I actually don't think that.

you can make good decisions about the. knowledge on your own. I think you need. someone who's at the higher level to. tell you this is the skills you should. go for. These are the things you should. do. So, for example, at the time that. Alex did ads, it was a great time for. doing ads. But now fast forward to. today, it's probably better to study AI. and and to bring that to the table. So. sometimes those rep sometimes those. things change. So let's say you figure. out what is your reputation? What can. you talk about when you're in front of. people, you go networking, you go to a.

few of these events, you outreach, you. get yourself in front of some people, and you actually ask the question, what. kind of skills do I need? What what sort. of um I need to build my skills? I need. to build my knowledge. What do you think. would be a valuable thing uh to do? because people who are at that next. level up, they're they're noticing what. they what they need. Uh they're noticing. what's hot, what's not. Um so they're. going to be able to teach you or or. guide you. And and um to Cody's point, you know, you you want to have a mentor. in your life. You want to have someone. who's who's been there, done it. You. want to, you know, partner with a bigger.

organization and get some of those. Before Kim Kardashian was Kim. Kardashian, she was Paris Hilton's uh. assistant and she learned the playbook. for being famous for being famous. and. then she took it to a new level. Took it. to a new level. So she she uh she did an. apprenticeship and then she applied the. apprenticeship. >> One of the things that all of us have in. common is we make content and it's. almost a bit of an elephant in the room. that no one's no one's really doubled. down on when I asked what what you guys. think is the most sort of like. undervalued skill or the best place to. invest in yourself. I was actually.

expecting you all to say start making. content for a variety of reasons. Not. just because you want to build an. audience so you have more customers, but. actually. >> and I can see it on all of you. It's. helped you to think better. >> It's helped you to communicate better. It's helped you to sell better. When you. get that chance to sit down with that. investor or that rich person, you said a. second ago, you said earlier that if I'd. sat old Alex here, one of the big. differences is this one's much more. focused, concise, articulate. So, I'm. wondering what you guys think of that. content as a undervalued, underappreciated skill in the world.

we're heading in. >> If I'm starting to today rather than. when I had, you know, zero, there's. still a huge amount of attention that. sits on social media, if not more. And. there's even more demand for content now. than there was. And so you can supply. that and get compensated for it. And. you'll have to do repetitions for a. period of time until eventually you get. good. And then you can develop an. audience and then you obviously can sell. things to them. >> I think um content content's a little. bit of an interesting one because. content works when you've got. intellectual property to leverage. So I. remember Alex popped onto my screen the.

first time and he says, "I've sold my. company for $40 million and I've got. nothing to sell you. I'm just going to. tell you how I did it." Cody's the same. She's like, uh, you know, I, uh, I was. working at Goldman Sachs, but then I. left Goldman Sachs to earn more money. through laundromats. I'm like, that's. interesting. That's fascinating. Right. So, I'm going to watch that content. because there's some interesting. intellectual property there. Um, my. channel took off when I started talking. about I've done seven startups that went. zero to a million in the first 12. months. So, it's that ability to have.

some intellectual property that people. are going to want to get to. I can think. of a bunch of examples of creators that. hadn't done anything but their ideas. were the value. So if you think of. someone like George Mack or even James. CLA or lots of other of these sort of. like J Shetty online writers who. >> J Shetty had a great one which was uh. I've got monk wisdom for the modern. world. >> and we've got Ali Abdal I left the I. quit being a doctor to be a YouTuber. M. >> so there's these little hooks that work.

and. >> does everyone have a you don't have to. have sold a business for tens of. millions or made millions. >> from I think there's some intellectual. property that you've got but bear in. mind that there was a different time. where you could just burst onto the. scene and we now have AI generated. content so if you imagine like airplanes. and they're at the airport and the fog. rolls in and if you're on the ground. it's very hard to take off but if you're. already up in the air it's very easy to. stay up in the air and it's kind of like. the AI content that's coming in is is. that fog Right? There's just going to be. thousands of AI generated content pieces.

just flooding onto everyone's feed. And. if you don't have a really good hook, you're just not going to drown out that. noise. >> You guys must all be thinking about. this. >> I have I have so much I'm all right. All. right. So So. one thing I think everyone has to decide. on if they're going to start making. content is am I an entertainer or am I. an educator? Right. Right off the bat. And so I think AI content for sure will. have tremendous leverage on. entertainment more so than education. because the big underlying thing that. Daniel's hitting at is that you have to. have proof, right? Like like an AI. avatar cannot come in and say I sold my.

company for free. They can't. They. didn't do anything because they don't. exist in the real world. Which is why in. my opinion like the absolute foolproof. method for making educational content is. dop Epic [ __ ] and then talk about the. epic [ __ ] you did. Period. And so like I. um so yes I'm in you know I'm in LA. Yesterday we also um we had the school. games winners come out schools platform. that hosts online communities and the. winner of the last school games. So 90. days he got to like 300 and something. thousand a month from a YouTube uh. channel that he started 16 months ago. So he started 16 months ago making. videos about AI. Now what was his.

interesting thing? So he was just always. into AI learned about the tools and then. he started helping small businesses for. like $1,500 $2,500 a month where he. would just help them implement these. automations that would save them money. and time. And then people were like well. how did you do that? And so he just. basically would just explain each of the. automations that he made for each of. these businesses on his channel. And he. made one video a day explaining one of. the automations. And then he said, "If. you want I have a group that's whatever. $300, $400 a month that shows you how to. build the same automations." To your. point about the education is like you. just need some proof. And it doesn't.

like you don't have to like the bigger. the proof you have the wider basically. the wider TAM you'll be able to reach. because more people be I'll just put the. words impressed. if you just are in your. 20s and to be fair, you just quit. Goldman Sachs. It's like that is enough. of a thing that because that's it's a 1%. type deal, right? But you can also you. can 1% through achievement. But the. other side that I think people widely. underestimate is you can 1% through. volume of work. So if I said I read 200. books last year, >> let me show you the 200. They're all.

dog, you know, dogeared. Let me tell you. what I learned. Like I'd be like, well. shoot. Because I think everybody wants a. bargain on time, right? Like I went on a. 100 speed dates. this is what I learned. It's like, well, I don't want to go on. 100 dates, but like anyone can do that. So, it's either 1% achievement or 1%. effort, but this one you can do. And. even if you have zero outcome, there's. still stuff that you'll learn. And then. that will people find interesting that. you can build an audience around. And if. you do that enough times, eventually you. do achieve something that is. interesting. And then that kind of. becomes permanent. But at the end of the. day, like proof always beats promise. I. >> I also think anybody can go viral online.

with one of two things. We've talked a. lot about experience. So if you do have. experience, if you built a billion. dollar and assets under management. business, gone to Goldman, built seven. startups, that's incredible. That's not. normal. That's totally fine. But that. means that you could just have the. everyday other e of starting the. experience. I think we we obsess on. expertise. Expertise is the way to make. content online and make millions. But. what about just the experience? You. could say, "Actually, I've done nothing. I'm a college dropout. I've [ __ ]. around a lot. I don't have much figured.

out, but over the next year, I'm gonna. try to make a million dollars. And you. can go just as viral, if not more. I. mean, a good example would be like Ryan. Tran, who who I love, who's in Austin, Texas, too. And Ryan is just like, I'm. trying stuff, and this might fail and I. have no idea, and you guys can come. along. The proof could actually be you. just trying a thing and it not working. one way or the other. And so I think the. only problem with this type which is. experience as opposed to expertise is. that with expertise you have attention. and intention aka intent to buy whereas.

if you're just experiencing thing you. might have attention but what are you. going to sell because you don't have. like a value derived from it where's. your intent I mean if you think about. who are the biggest creators online. only fans the Kardashians you know what. are the biggest websites online porn. sites that's a lot of attention but the. intent to buy is going to be low for any. of those over time at large. And so I. think you have to ask yourself, okay, if. I get a ton of attention, let's make. sure I'm really thoughtful on what I get. attention for. And then let's think.

about once I have that attention, where. do I actually have some sort of. expertise or value that I can trade in. order for people to have an intent to. buy? And I think about it like this. Rihanna, huge star, right? Big. celebrity, billionaire now because of. Fenty Beauty. Drake, giant celebrity, arguably more views, more hits than. Rihanna, worth one, one six, 1/8 what. Rihanna is worth. Why? Because he has. ton of sub attention, but he hasn't. actually done much to get intent to buy. from him. And so Rihanna's just.

categorically better, if we define. better as bank account and scoreboard on. uh net worth, than Drake is at. monetizing their intention. And so, um, I think that a lot of creators online. think too much about views, likes, subscribes, and don't think very much. about how do I monetize on top of this. because nobody stays relevant forever. online. And so, I think while you're in. the spotlight, you do have to think. about how you going to convert that. funnel in some way. >> That's a really great point. A lot of.

the people you see blowing up online, they do have a backend that monetizes it. because to your point, it costs money. you know, I probably spend 40 50,000 a. month just on retainers of people who. are working on that stuff and. >> content. >> Yeah. Content related stuff and you know. because I have businesses that can. monetize that then it it worth doing but. it's hard to compete with that if you. don't have a back end. The the other. option is to work with someone who does. have a business and they do have. experience. they do have something to.

talk about, but they're busy and they. need someone to project manage this. because one thing that's happened is. that to the traditional business owner, this personal brand thing and this. building a content empire uh that builds. your business, this is brand new to a. lot of people. So, there are plenty of. people who've got a $50 million a year. business and they're going, "Oh, should. I show up online at all? Maybe I. should." and they're just starting to. tiptoe into the water and they've got a. story, they've got a back-end business, they can monetize it, they can allocate. budget to it, you could be the person.

who does that and you'd be, if you did. do that, you would be one of the very. special people in their life. Um, I had. a guy come to me a couple of years ago. and said, "Daniel, I just cannot believe. you've written five books at the time. You've got seven different companies. You've got all this stuff going on and. you've got a few thousand followers and. I've had a look online. You get like. 10,000 views a month." And I'm like, "Yeah, but I'm busy. I'm running my. businesses." And he came to me and said, "I will project manage you into the. millions per month." And he just.

literally picked this up, a guy called. Martin, right? And he just said, "I I'm. going to do this and I'm going to turn. up at your house, do a day of filming. every month. I'm going to edit it. I'm. going to chop it all up. I'm going to do. all this stuff and I'll project manage. the whole thing." Now, the two of us are. very uh close now. We've got a good. relationship. And he's now got an idea. for an AI startup, and I'm going to back. that. Every single one of you watching. this right now has something to offer, whether it's knowledge or skills or. experience. And that means you have. value. Stands, the platform I co-own, who are one of the sponsors of this.

podcast, turns your knowledge into a. business through one single click. You. can sell digital products, coaching, communities, and you don't need any. coding experience either, just the drive. to start. This is a business I really. believe in. And already $300 million has. been earned by creators, coaches, and. entrepreneurs just like you have the. potential to be on Stan's store. These. are people who didn't wait, who heard me. saying things like this, and instead of. procrastinating, started building, then. launched something and now they're. getting paid to do it. Stan is. incredibly simple and incredibly easy.

And you can link it with a Shopify store. that you're already using if you want. to. I'm on it and so is my girlfriend. and many of my team. So, if you want to. join, start by launching your own. business with a free 30-day trial. Visit. stephvenbartlet.stan. stan.store and get. yours set up within minutes. >> If you guys were starting from zero. today. >> with AI in the picture and all of these. platforms and the way things are going, I I spent I've spent a lot of time. thinking about the next big opportunity. in content and I think about the next. big platform. Where would you be.

starting today based on who you guys are. and the skills that you have and the. things you're interested in is probably. a better way of saying it. Would you be. on LinkedIn posting once a day? Would. you be on Tik Tok making videos? Would. you be on YouTube starting a channel? Would you start a newsletter? And with AI in the picture, I think it. changes the answer because content is. going to become very easy to make. So. where does the value acrew to? Like. where does the value move to in a world. where every kid a kid in Mumbai could. make uh a real or a quote picture now.

with Chat Gyt? So where is the value. going to acrew and how are you going to. milk that cow? How are you going to. capitalize? Like what is the one thesis. you have about the future of content. that you haven't told anybody yet? Tell. me. >> Well, >> I'll tell you mine. I'll tell you mine. >> I want to ask a question too for. everybody at the end of I'll give you my. my quick thing. One, I will say like um. and I'd be curious if you all agree. When I first started making content, um. most people that I knew thought it was. really cringe. Actually, they're like uh. why would you make content? If you've. actually had any success that you.

supposed to have had, why would you be. so idiotic as to be on the internet. making content, it can't be true that. you've done these things if you're. making Tik Toks all day? And um and I. think they totally miss the boat that. like the 21st century concern uh. currency is attention and attention. could be bought with ads or attention. could be bought in a different way but. through organic content creation. And so. you go like cringe to content to. conversion. And actually, I think all of. us would probably agree it was a pretty. good play, but like I'm sure Did you.

guys all get laughed at when you first. got on the internet? >> Of course. >> Yeah. Right. >> Never. >> Like still get laughed at now. >> I still get I still get laughed at. So. like I just want to prepare. If you get. online, be prepared. People will think. you're idiotic and. >> and your friends the shedding period. where you transition to. >> 100%. And and people who are serious for. whatever reason have not figured out. that there is a huge arbitrage. opportunity with being known. Even if. even if you don't care about the views. and all I have as something that's a. differentiator is that if I ping Stephen.

you'll respond to me because I am. somehow I have some prefence online. Same with Alex, you know, right with all. of us. And so one I just want to say. that up front because it will suck. You. know, I'm in these creator groups and at. some point it just happened yesterday. I'm in a group with like some of the. biggest creators in the world and uh all. of them were listening. I mean maybe 50. responses of a moment where um everybody. hated them on the internet. it was super. dark. You know, they couldn't stop. watching and reading the comments and. they felt like there was like a fight. orflight situation from a bunch of.

strangers. And so, I think it's worth. just saying content can have a little. bit of a downside and you got to like. protect against that, but like also go. full [ __ ] bore into it because who. cares? Uh, you'll be forgotten anyways. And, um, >> embarrassment is the price of entry as. they say. >> Yeah. >> And we've all all faced that and had to. go through that to get to the other. side. Now, I want your content secret. We talk about social media and I think. um there's been a lot of talk about it. shifting really more towards interest. media rather than social media. Right. So I think this is extremely important. because what what Cody was referencing.

earlier is again entertainment versus ed. education. And so Rihanna and Drake I. see both as entertainers. Now what's. interesting is that where do they have. influence? So she used the word intent. but fundamentally I say like how do we. increase the likelihood that someone. complies with a request or complies with. a solicitation. Right? Right? If I tell. you to do something one, I mean, we've. all seen some creators who have tiny. audiences, but if they say, "Hey, go do. this thing." You know, they have 100%, not really 100, but they have a huge. conversion on a very small audience. And. then other people, you know, I can name. some Tik Tockers right now that have, you know, 50 plus million uh followers.

that have had 13 failed launches because. they have views, but they have zero. influence. No one listens to them for. their advice. >> And so, um, in order to create. influence, there's four things. So, number one is, and so I just remember. SPCL, right? So, you have status. So. somebody who controls scarce resources. So a bartender at a bar, there's alcohol. behind them. It's a scarce resource. In. the bar, they have status. When they. walk outside of the bar, no one cares. about them. But in the bar, they have. status, right? So that get so they give. influence. The second is power. And so. power is basically um say do.

correspondence, meaning if I tell you to. do something, follow these instructions, and a good thing happens, then you I. I'll increase the likelihood that you. comply with requests in the future. And. so like for example, Martha Stewart uh. was the first self-made female. billionaire. And I think there's there's. a huge amount of reasons for that. And. one of the biggest ones is that she. literally gave people recipes and they. followed their recipes and they had a. good thing happen. And then people told. them they were great and this cake was. great and this lasagna was amazing. Their family, their friends, they got. they also got status. So a massive good.

thing happened after following explicit. directions. And so then when she said. follow my next directions and by this. thing, people said okay the last 10. times I did it, it worked. I'll do this. too. And so that's why she had so much. influence. The next is credibility, which is do you have proof? Right? Now, all of these can um happen at the same. time or separately. So, I'm trying to. give more isolated examples for each of. them, but like one thing can check. multiple boxes. So, if I say, "Hey, I. sold a company for $46.2 million." I. have money, which is where the status. comes from, but I also have credibility. that the stuff that I do works. I. wouldn't have power yet though until I.

say, "Hey, if you take what you're. currently doing and then add a bonus, urgency, scarcity, a guarantee, you. know, think about a value equation, all. of a sudden you can sell it for way more. money." And then you followed those. instructions and then you do make more. money. Then you're like now I'll be more. likely to comply with this person's. requests in the future. And so then that. person gains influence. And then the the. fourth L is likeness, right? Do they. look like me, right? Do they act like. me? Which is both, you know, physical. but also psychographic. Like do they. have they share the same values as me? Are they similar? And so if I have two. people that both have SPC, so they have.

status, they have power, they have. credibility, and then one of them just. also looks like me, I'm more likely to. listen to that person. So each of these. are additives. So if you have all four, you'll be more influential, right? And. so, um, lading this back up to. conversion, we think, okay, well, if I'm. going to make content with the purpose. of conversion, then I want to make stuff. that demonstrates these four things, right? And so, that is why educators. typically have significantly smaller. audiences, but can usually. >> generate a lot more money than. entertainers can. And entertainers. typically can monetize almost. exclusively through sponsorships as the. most efficient means or vehicle. Now,

where does an entertainer have. influence? Rihanna is beautiful and so. she does have credibility in terms of. beauty. She does have um and then. especially if she starts making content. around that stuff, she takes her. entertainment audience but she's talking. about something she has credibility to. and then she can add power to that. because people start following what she. does, right? And then they start looking. a good way and then they say, you know. what, she really does know what she's. talking about here. And then all of a. sudden when she does point people to, you know, to to a thing that that that. they can buy, then they're more likely.

to do so. And so it's it's it's how do. we merge those two things together? And. then when we're making the content, and. I think a lot of people we're starting. out are very obsessed with views, which. I would strongly recommend, especially. in this interest media time, that it's. it's so irrelevant. And what I mean by. that is if we think, all right, I want. to I want to start a a bait and tackle. drop shipping business, whatever, right? You for for fishermen. Well, if I just. start making videos on philosophy, I. might get way more views than I do if I. make, you know, videos on bait and. tackle stuff. But the likelihood that.

the people who are watching philosophy. also want bait and tackle is very low. And because the content is now the. targeting for social, like if if. anyone's run ads before, you have to. select, okay, I think I want 42 year. olds and I want, you know, men and I. want, you know, whatever, right, as you. go through it. But the thing is is that. the algorithms are so good and the AI is. so good at understanding what the. content is about. And they also know. what type of people consume this type of. content, they just do the targeting for. you. And so if you want to reach a. certain type of person, you just only. make content that that certain type of. person wants to consume. It's actually. easier now than it was before. And so. you can have a 40,000 person audience,

but that 40,000 person audience might be. made up entirely of fishermen who buy. tackle, which I'll bet you you'll crush. >> And so, um, that is how I kind of see. the the the quote future of of media at. least, um, is that if you want to have. maximum persuasion or conversion power, we want to make content that is. explicitly for a specific audience. And. we want to demonstrate the proof that. we've done, right? We want to have. things that they want. We want to give. them instructions that they follow that. good things will happen for them. and we. want to look like them. And if you do. that, you have somebody who's gonna make.

a lot of money from an audience. >> That last point is super interesting as. well. How do I make myself look more. like my audience? And I think. relatability. >> and humanizing yourself is one of the. great ways to do that. >> I think it's a very fair point. I mean, I also think it's not just physical. traits. So, you know, let's say that you. don't look like the audience that you. want physically. what are the values. that that audience has that you can have. them see themselves in you and and you. know it's kind of like whether or not.

you like the guy who cares but let's say. you know Trump for instance really looks. not a lot like his audience. predominantly you know in suits and ties. constantly sort of a blueblood. billionaire from the east coast how does. he associate with this group of people. when really he doesn't look like them on. average well it's because they believe. that he has a similar moral compass to. them they believe that he has similar. ethics to them. And so I don't think. that creators have leaned into this. enough. And I don't mean to become. clickbaity or political or or divisive.

or anything like that. I mean that it is. rare to see people in business h take a. stance that could hurt their business. values, for instance. And Chris and I. have a rule which is we don't have close. friends that haven't done something. publicly that could be against their. best interests. I I just don't want. friends that don't have that that. haven't done that because I think that. the world is really hard and I want to. see if somebody's going to have like. moral fiber before I become quite close. with them. >> Super interesting. >> Yeah. And so I I think you could do that. as somebody who is a content creator.

today like be value aligned with your. users and show that and um also to the. point about the algorithm becoming about. interest based. It's also becoming value. based. We're seeing echo chambers emerge. around ways of thinking, right? >> Well, I the content that I saw of you. that most interested me was when you. were talking about um how important. ownership is and you were talking about. just the philosophy of ownership and you. said there's a group of people who want. you to own nothing and be happy about it. >> and I was like I really resonate with.

that. I want people to own their. businesses and I want them to own their. stuff. And I liked the fact that you. were standing in front of a huge. audience taking that position and. everyone knew that it was a little bit. of a a position to take and it wasn't. specifically content about how to build. a business, but you were sharing. something about yourself. >> I have a belief you don't actually ever. sell anybody anything. You only find. those who are already predisposed to. want the thing that you are selling. >> And if you believe that, then I think. your business gets easier too, easier to. target people. That's why I never kind. of got off on that content. You know, it's really big online on sales where.

it's like here's how you close them, you. know, here's how you do this. Here's how. you you switch them and you give them a. hot dog and then they buy the car. because you gave them the hot dog. because of reciprocity and you're like, "Huh, I've never bought a car because. somebody gave me a hot dog." But. apparently this is what works on. Instagram. And so I don't think that's. actually true. I think you just find. people at a trigger moment that they. want something and then you give it to. them. >> Mhm. Regarding content, for me. personally, I find that the only reason I'm going to. create content is if it's in alignment. to a mission that I've got. So I don't. actually want to create content. I don't.

want to be out there naturally. I would. much rather be a way more private. person. Um, and you won't you won't find. a lot of stuff about my family or my my. kids, my you know, very rarely do I post. anything like any of that sort of stuff. But for me, I do it in alignment with. the mission. I really believe that if. you're on a mission, you've got. something you want to achieve in the. world, you're going to need other people. to believe in it. You're going to need. other people to get involved. Um, you're. going to want to hire talented people. Those talented people are going to want. to, you know, see you online first. And. it's all about the building.

relationships at scale. And content is. just people discovering someone new like. you would a friend and then getting to. know someone. And I think the big play. in a postAI world is having really deep. relationships with a lot of people using. long form content. >> uh where you share who you are, what. you're about, what's your mission, what's your origin story, what's your. vision, >> um what are your values and people then. say in a very noisy world I will pay. attention to what Steven says. >> I agree. And so to give my answer to.

this question, my thesis here in the. world of AI is actually that if you look. at who has the most loyal engaged fan. bases, it's not necessarily podcasters. We're doing pretty well, but it's not. podcasters. Podcasters can sell out. arenas and when they go on tour, they. can sell out globally. Streamers. >> And it's I think it's because of this. the depth of the parasocial relationship. is the the equity value of the. connection. And I was sat with a. streamer who's 18 years old, massive in. Europe. And we were on we're playing at.

Old Trafford for the for the soccer aid. And I got just got to sit down with him. So I was like, "Explain to me what you. do." He goes, "So I wake up in the. morning." I go, "Then what?" He goes, "I. sit there." And I go, "For how long?" He. goes, "Eight hours." And I go, "What do. you do?" He goes, "Like nothing." And I. go, "How many people tune in?" He's. like, "100,000." I'm like, "Concurrently. 100,000 people sit there with you." He. goes, "Yeah, people are quite lonely. I. sit there and what we do is we watch TV. together." Now the So when when we got. to the the stadium, 70,000 people in the. stadium, we're playing soccer. The. stadium when they announced your name,

the size of the cheer correlates to the. amount of hours you spend with your. audience. The streamers are the. celebrities. >> The podcasters sometimes come in, but. the the actors almost, you know, but the. but the streamers own the stadium. When. you play Soccer Aid, it doesn't matter. how much money you've got or how big. your following is, the streamers are the. ones. the streamers have this particular. streamer has less of an audience than. me, but he sits with them for 7 to 8. hours a day, >> deep connection. >> So, if we think about depth as the as. the metric that you you can you can. exchange on, especially if you have.

authority in a niche and you're. educating, as Alex was saying, >> that's why I think a lot about my behind. thes scenes channel. I think it's when. we go on tour, it's so funny. We we do. we did a tour in Australia and. remarkably I'd say about 50% of people. were talking to me about Dario and then. 50% of people were talking to me about. behind the diary which is the behind the. scenes channel where you get to know me. a bit better. >> and that that channel has a fraction of. the viewership and actually that same. thesis is the reason I started. podcasting. I was doing Facebook watch. videos. They were getting tens of. millions of views, which by the way, no.

one remembers because no one remembered. any of them. And no one came up to me in. the street and said, "I love that. two-minute viral philosophical video you. made about motivational fluff." No one. ever said that. Then I started this. podcast and it got a thousand downloads. And it felt like I was like Oprah. Winfrey. Like people were coming up to. me and I was like, "Oh, there's this. interesting correlation between like the. depth of the medium and the resonance. and the memorability and therefore the. value." So just pursue depth as much as. you can. the strength of the parasocial. relationship. >> part of the brain that has short-term.

memory. We've driven a truck through. that. >> You know, we've now got just hundreds of. things a day that hit that. But then. there's this other part of the brain. where I've spent seven hours with. someone and if that's the depth. >> Are you guys thinking about that? >> Because you guys, you all make content. which is educational but is less. personal. And I mean you you two. podcast, Alex and Cody, you both. podcast. You don't podcast yourself. >> I'm a guest. >> You're a guest. but you don't like run your own podcast. So, are you thinking about a deeper. format for for yourselves? What are you.

thinking about? >> Yeah. Well, there's two things I want to. talk about there. One, I think it's it's. depth, but I would also wonder if it's. not rawness like in an era in which we. cannot trust what we see anymore because. of AI and anything can be recreated, reproduced, and overproduced. Increasingly, a stream is interesting. because it is raw. it is it is for a. thous% whatever is happening on there is. happening in real time and thus we can. actually trust it and so I think as I.

mean we've all seen it content has. gotten so produced and overdone and that. actually I think decreases trust because. we can't tell if something is real or. not because it's been edited and. filtered and overlaid. >> we say with our 40 person teams yeah. great. >> but it's true but think about think. about the content even like this is like. sort of tact practical, but um maybe a. year ago, the big content uh change in. video on Instagram was that you had a. lot of um B-roll and images overlaid on.

top of videos. And I don't know if you. guys have noted, but that doesn't work. very well anymore. Actually, the more. that you have third-party assets in your. video and it's been overdone, the less. the video works, >> the more you're just walking along with. your handout, >> right? Because it's it's more real. So, I think it might actually be like depth. and rawness. >> Rawness. Yeah. Authenticity, I guess. >> Yeah. [ __ ] hate that word, but yes. >> Yeah. It's like 60 minutes versus Joe. Rogan, you know? 60 minutes is like just. it's just. >> no cuts. >> No cuts. Yeah. Yeah. >> And then when it comes to am I thinking. about this for our channel? Yeah. I.

mean, I think about it. We we have. something that we teach everybody which. is like the marketing affinity loop. And. and basically it goes like this. I'll. show the graph so you can see it, but. you start with awareness, right? And. that awareness is what we're all talking. about. How do we get more people to just. see us? And then we go to consideration. Okay, I maybe I like this person. Maybe. I'll follow them. I'll give them a quick. follow. And then we go, well, I actually. I like them. I follow them. And I might. buy something from them. Okay, that's. interesting. And then I might not only. buy something from them, but advocate. for them. Write a testimonial, a review,

something like that. And then finally, I. might be loyal to them. Aka, I'll refer. a friend. I'll sign up for their. year-long program. I'll buy again and. again. And so, we go from awareness to. consideration to purchase to advocacy to. loyalty. And like, if you can get most. people stop at awareness. Very few. people can get somebody to go from. awareness to purchase. Even fewer people. can get them to advocate for them, leave. a review, and the very very fewest refer. a friend. And so like the holy grail of. business is always have your clients.

tell other people nice things about you. And so I think in content, what I think. about is I don't always care that people. buy things from me at this point. Like I. I love money, don't get me wrong. I want. to keep making it, but I actually really. care that they're loyal and they tell. other people about what we're doing. And. that is something we now measure for. videos. We can actually now measure with. like a little UTM link how many of all. of our videos get shared and how many of. those shares actually go to a a purchase. or something that goes a little bit. deeper. And so I I am thinking about. that. But then I think you also have to.

decide what's your personal line is. So. for me, I can't imagine wanting to. stream all of my life continuously. because I'm not sure that's good for the. audience actually. I think they should. live not watch. So it's like I just have. a line that like I kind of don't want to. cross. >> Yeah. >> And Chris and I actually have a rule. too. We only post so much about our. relationship. We actually because it. always does well. So the team's like. just full send Chris shirtless nipples. every day. The internet loves it. And. and and Chris has been really good about.

saying no, we have to keep some things. sacraant. And so I think you have to. decide how deep you want to go down the. rabbit hole in order to win. >> Yeah. I've I've been the same with my. kids. it's their decision as to whether. they want to build a profile and how. they want to build it. So you won't, you. know, I won't put them in that position. The depth that I'm loving is writing. books because someone who reads a book. like you really get to go deep with a. book. Um, and also live experiences. So. every year for the last four years, I've. taken about 80 of my clients to the uh. to the snow and we go skiing. and those.

80 clients who if if someone has gone on. my ski trip, the level of loyalty and. depth because we've shared fund. together, I'm about to take 30 clients. to Neker Island and spend a week with uh. Sir Richard. And I' I'm convinced that. just doing that with 30 people will. build, you know, lifelong like. friendships. So this idea that like. there, you know, that you do stuff in. the online and offline world, you know, that you actually figure out who are the.

people who are at the core group, those. real uh dieh hard fans, and then let's. do something together and and and do fun. stuff together. Go skiing, go to. islands, go sailing, that sort of stuff. >> Alex, I see you wrote uh it looked like. you drew the universe or something. >> Oh, I was thinking about um again, it. was we're just talking about like. authenticity. Um, and so with each with. each of like SPCL, right, all of them. exist in a continuum, right? And so I. can say credibility. I could say, "Hey, I sold a company." But I if you see a PR. article, that will increase the.

credibility. If you were uh somebody you. heard about it from somebody else, that'll increase the credibility of that. specific credibility driven event. Likeness is the same thing. And so I. think um like the connection between. streamers and having huge influences. that they have tremendous likeness and. that because they are quote authentic. and that there's very few there's. there's very little ability to distort. you have basically when you what you see. is what you get. And so if you're the. type of person who likes that particular. streamer then you'll have super strong. you know affinity towards them and. you'll be likely to you know comply with. their requests like show up to a stadium.

so that you can support me. Um but you. know even authenticity is again a term. it's like how do you define authenticity. right which I see is how you how you act. when you have no risk of punishment and. so. different way of saying this is like how. do you act when you're alone when no one. else is around and so I see the. discrepancy between how you behave when. you're alone and how you behave in. public as basically your authenticity. you know score right the question is or. the problem is that no one really knows. how you behave when you're alone and so. >> unless you're. unless you're like streaming all the.

time. >> right yeah and So, >> so you're saying authenticity is that. there's not a difference between how you. act when there's when there's no risk of. punishment and how you act normally. Is. that okay? Got it. >> Right. And I think that also being like. very candid for all of us is like they. were like sure we have audiences that. can punish us with their comments I. guess but our like we've all built. enough of call it a fortress if you will. of currency network relationships etc. that like even even within our companies.

like if you go into the room like I can. be really authentic in my company. because no one can fire me right like my. risk of punishment is low is is lower. than saying employees is and So, it's a. a relatively I'd never use this word, but it's a relatively privileged, you. know, um position to be in to to be more. authentic because no one can really. punish you. And I think this is kind of. the the essence of the like [ __ ] you. money that people want to get to, which. is like I just want to be me, but I. can't be me because I have this risk of. punishment. >> And so, um since degrees of freedom. basically, um I think your happiness is.

is very correlated with your degrees of. freedom. >> So, Elon's authentic. >> I mean, I don't think anyone would argue. that he's not authentic. They might not. agree with him, but I don't think they. think that he's he's trying to pull one. >> I do think that when like if you're. going to go online, one of the ways to. inoculate yourself against being. cancelled or to inoculate yourself. against caring so much is to do. ridiculous things every so often that. are super authentic to who you are out. loud because then what happens is the. people that hate you, they leave. Uh and.

the people that like you kind of like. you a little bit more or trust you a. little bit more for it. So I think um. you know one of the things that that I. do not really on purpose but it it is. just like it's like getting a vaccine. You go out on the internet and you say. something that you know other people are. not going to like but you believe. strongly in. And when you do that kind. of consistently over time I also think. that increases your trust because we've. all met like other creators that you're. like. >> ah man like you're just never going to. say anything that's not PC. Like I can.

think of two in my head where I'm like. they're never going to say anything and. if it could hurt their audience, they're. not going to say it. And that just. decreases my trust level. And I think. the audience is really smart. People are. smart. And so um I think you should. inoculate yourself more often. >> Before we move on to a little game that. I've prepared for us here, um I you're. all very good at pitching and you all. have your own frameworks for pitching. >> So I wanted to to pause on that for a. second. What is Daniel? What is your. framework for pitching a business or an. idea? There there's two things to start. with which I believe that.

entrepreneurship is the journey of a. thousand pitches. That basically what we. do as entrepreneurs is we pitch stuff. into existence. Um and the penalty for. an average pitch is that you do a. thousand pitches and you get nothing to. show for it at the end of it. And the. payoff for a great pitch is that you do. a thousand pitches and you end up with. 10 to$100 million. You end up with an. amazing team of people and lots of. customers and everything everything's. great. I think treat entrepreneurship as. the journey of a thousand pitches and. also treat pitching as.

this magical thing where you get what. you pitch for and you can't switch it. off. So for example, if you say the. economy is bad, the economy is bad, the. economy is bad, as if by magic the. economy is going to be bad. Uh if you. say I'm seeing lots of opportunities. right now, I'm seeing lots of. opportunities right now. You you start. conversations where people go, oh I I've. seen an opportunity as well. So, whatever you're out there talking about, you tend to bring those conversations to. the surface and then it's a. self-fulfilling loop. With that said,

you have to have a framework for. pitching. If you're going to do a good. pitch, it's got to be a framework. I've. got social pitching framework, scheduled. pitching framework, and sales pitching. framework. So, social pitch, name, same, fame, pain, aim, game. >> What's a social pitch? >> Social pitch is on social media. >> Yeah. or um in a social situation, it's. basically a situation where you've got. about 30 seconds before someone thinks. that you're being uh too obtuse. >> Okay? >> Right? So, you've got about 30 seconds.

of people's attention, and you're going. to say, "What is your name? What are you. the same as that they already. understand? What makes you famous or. different? Uh what are you aiming for. right now? What's your bigger game? Or. what pain do you solve? What are you. aiming for? What's your bigger game?". So, there's a few things you can put in. there and it rhymes so you can remember. it in a in a social situation. scheduled. pitches, I always do something called. capstone. And it's clarity, authority, problem, solution, traction, or the why, either way, opportunity, next steps, and.

an emotional ending. Right? So, that. spells out capstone. Now, is that the. best pitching framework? Maybe, maybe. not. Maybe there's better frameworks. But the point is is that you've got a. framework that you're not just winging. it. You're not just, you know, randomly. spewing words. you've actually gone. through the process of thinking through. your pitch uh in a framework approach. One thing that's really fascinating is. the three of us have a framework for. everything like we we're just like very. framework thinkers and I've noticed that. with a lot of entrepreneurs. Um do you.

guys have pitching frameworks? Be. shocked if you didn't. >> Yeah, I do. I mean I think I'm like lazy. intellectually and frameworks help you. remember things and so if you don't have. very good memory then it's just easy to. put it in something that can make sure. that you remember it. It's why when we. were in school, you know, they used to. make us sing songs about how to remember. the varian states. If if if I wanted to. raise a bunch of money from other people. that didn't know me and I wanted to. never have a problem raising money. again, I didn't want to use any of my. money ever, I would use what I learned.

in venture capital, which is the. mightest touch. And and basically, I. think you need one of these four in. order to raise money. You don't have to. have all four, but if you do, that makes. it really, really easy. The easiest one. is profit, right? If you have a business. right now that's making money profit in. your pocket, you can raise capital. You. can raise money from people as long as. that amount that you're raising is. reasonable to the amount of profit. If. you don't have any profit, but you have. growth, let's say like Replet, we were. talking about a big AI company, great. You can raise a bunch of money if you.

got growth, too. The third thing, if you. don't have either one of those, you. don't have profit, you don't have. growth, but you have a history. I've. sold a company before. I've built this. before. you can raise purely on the fact. that you've done this before. And if you. haven't done any of those three, you've. done nothing in life, then you need a. really good story. And the story is. something that you can often raise money. off of. So I believe that we are going. to create the next XYZ. And if we do. this thing, then you will all make. money, I will make money, and we will. change the world together. And so I call. it the touch because I think people who.

accum if you can accumulate this over. your life, it's not that hard, right? So. eventually at some point you'll have a a. history which is your proof. Then you. can craft a story. You'll get better at. it as you continue to grow. You will. learn how to get profit in some way. And. because you've driven profit before, you'll know how to get growth. So I. think like almost any entrepreneur over. time, if you focus on those four things, can raise money. And you start with only. the story when you have nothing. >> Alex, I have a lot of pitching.

>> Yeah. >> Um I I I'll say first and foremost like. if you're trying to sell anyone. anything, um proof will always be. promised. And I can say that, you know, a thousand times in a row. Like you. could literally say nothing, get on. stage and then just hit next on. testimonials for 60 minutes and you will. close a percent. Like literally the last. slide just says like go over there to go. buy something and you could say nothing. and you will you will sell. >> Why? >> Because I think um proof acts as a as a. as a an an approximation of something. that would happen uh for the prospect. And so like the only reason that like.

that proof works is that they think, oh, some element of this is like me. And so. if I do the same thing that this person. did, and the closer the proof is to the. prospect, the more compelling it is for. that specific prospect, which is like. when we used to um, you know, run ads. for different markets, we'd go into. like, you know, an entirely black market. and surprise surprise, if we had black. testimonials, the pages would convert. better than if we had white testimonials. and then flip-flop in the other. direction, too. And so, right, and so we. want to show as many different types of. proof as we possibly can. And obviously, not all proof is created equal. You can. have live proof versus recorded proof.

You can have a demonstration of. something that like us using the thing. is going to be more compelling uh than. than than not using and just describing. it, right? If I have a um like and so. there's there's a bunch of things on. proof. But that's just like big thing. number one. And so that's why for me if. somebody's going to sell something, I. recommend most people just get five or. 10 clients for free up front with the. primary purpose of getting proof because. you're going to make more money on the. proof than you will have trying to, you. know, just get the the tiny amount that. you can charge with absolutely no proof. Mhm. >> So, it's like, don't do that. Just get. 10 and on your 11th, you'll be able to.

charge 10 times more because you'll be. able to say, "Hey, look at the 10 people. that I helped." And realistically, you'll get more out of that than they. will because you probably suck. >> Yeah. >> So, so it's probably for everyone's best. interest that you don't charge anything. Um, but from an actual like closing. perspective, and I'll talk about this. from a from appointments, I think to use. uh Daniel's language, I've taught the. closer framework for a very long time. Um, which is C L O S E R. Uh, and so C. is clarify why they're there, which is, and typically anybody who's going to be. in that appointment has taken some. action. So whether that's they. responded, you know, to a post, they.

commented, they liked, they actually, I. mean, if someone's already set an. appointment or they walked in the door, like there's always some like why'd you. pick up the phone? Like there's always. some reason like, "Why'd you give me 5. seconds?" There's always something. they've done that you could say, "Hey, so tell me why, right?" And so then. you're you're you're clarifying why. they're there, why they're still. listening. So you listen to them because. we often think about sales as me just. hitting you with [ __ ]. >> So the perfect salesman says nothing and. only ask questions. >> because there's nothing to disagree. with. >> And fundamentally they're going to. believe way more of what they say than. what you say. So you want them to say.

it, not you. And so you clarify whether. they're there. See, >> it reminds me of spies. I've interviewed. a couple of CIA spies now and every. single one of them, I was expecting some. like incredible technique or whatever. They all say, "No, we just spend six to. eight weeks in the back of the cab. listening to the Iranian taxi driver to. figure out what that his son has a. health issue that we can then leverage. later to get him to turn against his. country." For the first eight weeks, you're just listening to him offload. And they're like, "It's crazy how people. will just offload if you let them. Everyone wants to talk.". >> Oh, 100%. So, one is, you know, clarify.

where they're l is label them with a. problem that you can solve. So it's like. okay so it sounds like you're here you. respond to my ad you DM me thing or you. you whatever it because of this reason. is that right? Right. So you get. confirmation on the problem uh which is. L. Then you O which is overview past. experiences or past pain. So it's like. what have you done so far to try and. solve this? And this is important. because uh motivation is the equal. opposite of deprivation. So the more. deprive someone is of something the more. motivated they are to solve it. And so. like if you haven't eaten in an hour. you're probably not that motivated. If. you haven't eaten in two days you're. very motivated. If you haven't slept in, you know a day or you're normal.

motivated. I guess that was a bad one. But if you haven't slept in 3 days, you'll be incredibly motivated to sleep. And so we want to find we want to find. what they're deprived of and then try to. increase that deprivation uh in the. conversation. Basically, uh make them. more aware of the deprivation, the. things that they don't have, right? Then. once we have, you know, enough. deprivation that it's very clear it's. like, okay, this is this is what why. you're here. This is you agreed with. this is the problem that you want to. solve. You've tried all these things and. it hasn't worked for you. I can imagine. how frustrating that would be. Um S,

which is then you sell, right? you sell. the vacation, which typically is just. three points. Um I I usually keep it to. three cuz most people can't remember. more than that anyways. And the three. points are usually you can always find. three. And if you need two, you can. chunk up if you've got five. And if. you've got, you know, two chunk down as. in like break into smaller pieces. But. like when I was in the fitness world, it. was fitness, nutrition, accountability. If when I was selling, you know, mortgage leads, it's like you want the. leads to be unique, you want them to be. timely, and you want them to be. exclusive, right? And so like or. qualified. And so it's like there's. always three things that you can usually. triangulate. But when you say the three. points, you don't then feature, you.

know, Jarble about the the points. You. then just usually put like a one. sentence analogy of of what that thing. is. So, it's kind of like this. And so, these are like little 30 secondond sound. bites to make the three points. That. should never last longer than 90 seconds. cuz um most people waste all this time. on the selling part and that doesn't. really matter because the more we can. talk about them, the more they're going. to want to buy. Um and then E, like at. the end of that, you say, "Cool, ready. to get started, ready to rock and roll, ready to start on Monday, whatever it. is." And then E, E and R around what. happens if they say no, right? You. explain it with their concerns. E, and.

then R is you reinforce the decision. And so R was actually something I added. much later when I was teaching, you. know, many sales people because um after. they would like explain away and then. close, they would just like see you. later. I got the credit card. It's like. you're dead to me. Um but the R is like. no, no, like reinforce the decision like. I think it's a great decision. I'm going. to introduce you to Polly. Paulie's. going to get you onboarded. And then. Polly also continues the R and being. like you know Jack definitely helped you. out. Let me let's get you all squared. away. There's no safe like Simply Safe, the. sponsor of today's episode. A few years. ago, someone broke into the Diary of a. SEO studio and stole all of our cameras.

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second shipment. That's. ketone.com/stephven. And I'm so honored that once again, a. company I own can sponsor my podcast. A. lot of people say that 70 60 80% of our. communication is body language. Do you. think much about that, Alex? You have a. with or without you energy body. language. It's a casual It's a very. casual body language, which in fact. reinforces your authority in a way. So. do you think about if people are right. that 60 or 70% of our communication is.

the things we don't say. Do you think. about training people on how to hold. themselves, how to be you kind of. alluded to something there which I think. people don't think about which is. actually the less you say sometimes the. higher conviction and the more I believe. you. >> Yeah. >> And some people can oversell because. >> Yeah. So, I'll So, I'll because I think. getting So, I'll just There's so many. variables here, but I'll just try and. focus on the ones that um a lot of. people sell over the phone and even via. Zoom, it's harder to see body language. as well, which nowadays I think a lot of. selling happens in those two. environments, even more than in person, even though that's where I came from,

which I actually think is the best place. to learn because you have to control. every variable. And then you have far. more leeway on the phone or on Zoom than. you do in person. >> And so, to that extent, um there's. basically five things you can control. about how you talk. And so you have your. speed of talking, like how t how fast. you talk. You have your cadence. You. have your um basically your um your. annunciation, like do I pronounce every. letter in the words that I'm saying? You. have the volume that you speak at. because if I talk too low like you on a. phone, it doesn't really matter because. they're just going to increase the.

volume. But if I lower what I'm saying. right now, it sounds more important in. person. It's more important to volume is. more important in person. And so those. first three I consider there's kind of a. persuasive tone which all three are. constant. And the only point of those is. to maximize comprehension. It's just. that they can hear you, that they can. understand what you're saying because. you're talking in a speed that they can. understand. Like I'm somebody who talks. fast and I have to I have to pull back. how fast I talk when I'm in like a. selling situation. There's only two that. you that I teach sales people to try and.

actively control, which is going to be. pauses. to draw attention. and when do I raise my voice. And the reason that those are the only. two things you really need to teach a. salesperson outside of the persuasive. tone, which is that that you're going to. talk at a certain speed, which usually. about 150 to 170 words a minute, because. that's the amount of speed that most. people can understand. You're going to. enunciate the words, which is going to. force you to actually speak at that. speed. >> Um, and you're going to talk loud enough. they can understand you. This sounds. very simple, right? Like this sounds.

like so simple, like I can't believe. people don't do this. Except they don't. and they don't close. And so the only. things that you have to teach a. salesperson and these are so important. Like there's been three independent. studies that are like massive. metaanalyses of sales people, the sales people who one speak less. close more. And number two, the sales. people who know when to shut up most. importantly after you ask for the sale, like if you wait 8 seconds after you ask. someone to buy, you close 30% more sales. >> if you wait 8 seconds. >> Yeah. So you ready to start?

>> Okay. So. >> Mhm. And so people they'll like they'll. close themselves but the sales people. are so afraid of that silence that they. then jump back in. It's like you had the. sale just shut up. And so I used to talk. about how emphasis was super important. And so like a very easy example to. demonstrate this in terms of. communication is that if I say I didn't. say he hit his wife. I didn't say he hit. his wife. I didn't say he hit his wife. I didn't say hit his wife. Those all.

mean very different things. But. fundamentally it's just cuz I change. where I pause. Right. Mhm. >> What word? So, I'm emphasizing a. different word. And so, I used to talk. about emphasis a lot, but I've I've. trained more and more and more and more. sales people over time. I just say, when. do you shut up and when do you raise. your voice? That's it. The rest of this. we we speak in the exact same tone. And. the reason that I feel very confident. about this is that AI is doing. increasingly good job at ads. If I don't. know if you you've noticed this, but. like a lot of ads are just being voiced. over AI and they convert higher because. people can understand them. >> I think a huge part of it is just they. can comprehend it. they can actually.

hear all the words and it's set in a. tone that's loud enough and there's. annunciation and they actually get it. cuz most like it's like one of the. easiest ways you can improve copy on a. website is just get it below third grade. reading level like 50% of people can't. read above sixth grade. >> in the US. >> it's crazy. >> so you're you're alienating 50% of the. market now you might think oh well those. are the idiots no I know plenty of. people I mean like I've got two friends. who dropped out of high school and are. super super successful entrepreneurs. barely can write their names and they. like they make fun of it, but like. they're smart. They just didn't weren't.

educated. Those are different things, right? And so I say this to say like if. if you're if you're in these selling. situations and you're like because what. happens is you get nervous, right? You. get this fight, flight, freak out, the. ones that Daniel was saying earlier. And. so your adrenaline kicks up and so you. want to talk faster, you want to talk. louder, uh you interrupt the other. person. And all those things are. antithetical to closing. And so just. teaching someone to be okay with pauses. can increase the likelihood that people. pay attention to the words that they. say. Because all we do is we draw. attention when we pause. You have short.

pauses that draw attention. And then you. have long pauses that solicit response. If I pause long enough, what do people. do? They talk. >> And I just think of someone as being. higher value if they if they're taking. pauses. Mhm. >> Um, one of my one of my great mentors. early in my career, he. there's something about the way that he. spoke, he was incredibly slow with the. way he sp he was like that. And the. minute he started speaking when when my. company were over there and having these. men mentorship sessions with him, everybody would stop and just like was. fixated on him. And then I remember this.

girl who worked in my New York office, he was. >> opposite. >> And it's just it's just the use of your. this instrument. Yeah. >> Um, do you think much about that? Do you. think much about how you present. yourself? Do you think much about your. body language? >> I think it it's natural. I think more. important is the distinction between are. you coming across as a newbie? Are you. coming across as a standard worker be or. are you coming across as high status, key person of influence level? And each. one of those has body language. associated. It has different ways of.

presenting yourself. But it's a. self-identity thing. And if you can. shift that selfidentity, you can. naturally become more of a key person of. influence. When we meet someone, we. within a few seconds, we evaluate their. status level relative to us. And you. can't switch it off. And there's plenty. of evidence to say that like. unfortunately, you just do it. automatically. I've seen people. completely change their life by just. simply changing the way that they pitch. from a a newbie worker B to a key person. of influence. I can think of an example. There's this woman who I asked her,

"What do you do?" And she said, "I'm a. financial planner. I can help anyone. with their financial planning. If anyone. wants to talk about their wills or any. of those sorts of things, then that's. what I can help people with, right? And. it sounds workery. And her her body. language was kind of like this. >> Uh I asked her a question. I said, "When. did you do something special that was. really transformational, something. something important?" She said, "Last. month, I went out to the countryside. I. worked on a farm and I worked with the. owner of the farm and their kids and. their grandkids to get alignment between. the three generations. the farm was.

going to be sold off to private equity. and instead I helped them to get. alignment as to how they're going to. keep the family farm. And I said, "How. did you do that?" And she said, "Well, I. used to be a city girl and then I. married a country boy and I I learned. how to do it." I got her to change her. pitch and I said, "Pitch yourself as a. key person of influence at that." So she. stood up in front of the group and she. said, "For the last 20 years, I've been. working with rural families who own. farms and I help them with their. financial planning and I secure their. family farm for the next two. generations.".

>> And her body language just went like. like key person of influence and. everyone just responded differently. And. when I asked the audience, in the first. instance, what do you think her day rate. was? Everyone said $500. I said, in the. second instance, what do you think she. charges per day? 10 grand. And it was. just the ability to pitch yourself as. that key person of influence in the. room. >> You know what's fascinating is there are. actual studies now that show for women. in particular that you make more money. if you do one thing which is you wear. makeup which is wild. So they did.

there's three studies that have been. done totally different groups one by. Harvard one by Stanford and I can't. remember it was either Oxford or. Cambridge and the studies showed that. women who there was no attractiveness. differential between them but one wore. makeup consistently uh at work and one. didn't. They made anywhere from 20 to. 40% more money inside of this study. What I thought was really interesting. about that, because I'm not really. historically a makeup girl, although. being fully face painted for this, is. that that actually makes sense in a lot. of ways because we do have this initial.

reaction that we always have uh with. people. You know, we judge somebody like. you talked about almost immediately. And. so when I saw that study, I thought, well, first of all, that's interesting. You don't have to be smarter, better. looking uh or anything else, and you can. make more money just by the way you. present yourself. And so I thought. thought, well, what about the way that. you dress? Is is that also the same? And. there are studies that back this as well. that in fact you can make more money as. a man for dressing one way and as a. woman and women are interesting because. you are not the norm.

>> What am I missing? >> You got the lumberjack. >> I've got 20% sitting on the table right. now. >> But what's fascinating is, you know, I. like things where you don't have to you. don't have to be better than anybody. else. You can just use human psychology. to make more money. And so if I'm a. woman, I know that the way that I dress, so when I pay attention to my dress and. dress professionally, whatever that. means in this instance, in the study. that I saw, it was like, you know, what. what I would have on a blouse, a suit, something like that, women make two. times more than men when they dress when.

they dress better. Men, it actually is. less important. Still more important. though, if you dress professionally in a. suit and you don't have all the other. proof and things you have, you have this. sort of interesting thing that's like a. you have sort of um diametric. opposition. I make a lot of money and. yet I care so little about money that I. dress in a wife theater. Yeah. Exactly. And so and so men make somewhere between. 15 and 18% more when they dress in. suits. So I think there's a a real um. argument to be made for if you're going. to pay attention to the way your voice. sounds. That takes some training.

Doesn't take much training to change the. way that you look professionally and and. how you dress. And the only other thing. that I would talk about on sales and. pitching is we tell all of our company. people. Um the line is show don't tell. We increasingly do not believe the. things that were heard. So like think. about a sales pitch that goes like this. Um you know uh we for instance have a. lot of home service companies. So these. home service companies are selling a. homeowner on let's say landscaping. And. so I'm going to come and we're going to. clean up your lawn and here's what we're.

going to do and this is how much it's. going to charge. I'm going to charge and. this is how long it's going to take. And. you can tell the client that we're an. expert at this. I've been in business. for 42 years. We have, you know, 1,000. reviews on Trustpilot, etc. Or you could. do something that'll double your. conversion, which is simply bring a. phone or an iPad with you and say, "Can. I show you what we did for your. neighbors down the street?" And just. show them the image of it. Just go, "We. do have a thousand Trust Pilot views. I. don't right here. We could see what the. last one said. Click on it. Show them.

the Trust Pilot review." You don't have. to train that. And I really like my. salespeople to not have to become. experts but to be enabled by what's. called sales enablement or technology. just to show because we are a visual. species. And so wherever possible if you. want to increase your conversions I tell. my team you are not allowed to close a. sale without showing something. >> Some visuals. >> you have to have a visual because it's. just a trust transfer and a higher. signal. What's wild now is that in that. same business, you could take a photo.

>> just right there in chat GBT say do the. landscape gardening and then show them. this is your house. Exactly. >> Fully landscaped. People are vis 70% of. the brain is visual processing. >> Exactly. And then you believe it and. then you've already seen it happen. >> I work with a lot of entrepreneurs and I. get them to create a brochure. >> like a physical brochure for their. business and people are like what on. earth am I creating a brochure for in. 2025? I because the the act of creating. a brochure gets what's in your head, out. of your head, and into a document we can. all explore. And I I still think a.

brochure is actually one of the coolest. things that an entrepreneur can do as an. activity to really just solidify what. they do. >> I saw you scribbling again, Daniel. >> Oh, I have lots of things, but yeah. No, I was thinking about like uh makeup. versus suits and whatnot. And so, you. know, one it's like if you have if you. have zero status, you have no credit, like SPCL like we went through, then. it's like, well, then what are the. smallest versions of that that you can. demonstrate? And so, I would also bet. that if the girls did makeup like hooker. makeup and then you also do like. professional makeup, I'll bet you. there's a very different outcome that.

happens because if you have like. understated business makeup, then that. probably signals a certain level of. status and they will treat you like. other people that they have treated in. the past because that associates with. the status people had. Same thing with a. man in a suit. Like literally fancy. pants, right? Um, it's like this guy's. got fancy pants, therefore he is must be. 15 18% better on average. Now, to to to. comment on on on Cody's point earlier, it's like I have other statusinducing. points that are superior to a suit and. so I don't need one, >> right? So, like how how do I get away. with that? It's like, yeah, like having.

a suit only means that you have $500, right? >> But billionaires don't wear Louis. Vuitton because in the status game. they're playing that would be an inverse. signal of wealth. >> Exactly. Yeah. Who you're trying to And. then um to Cody's point about proof, like proof is always number one, right? And so like. trust pilot reviews is a kind of proof. Somebody down the street is a closer. approximation which is a higher form of. proof. And so proof is always going to. be number one what you can lead with. You can almost immediately in any sales. process if they don't have one of these. just implement a video sales letter and.

increase sales by 20 to 40% with like. really doing nothing else. Um sometimes. more. And so that typically is like, okay, what's the what's the promise that. we're gonna, you know, what do we do? What's the pain that we're solving? What. is the uh plan or sorry, what is the. proof that we have that we can solve it? And then what is the plan for the rest. of this video? And then typically after. you have you've demonstrated each of. those P's, you then say great picture. number five. Uh which then gives you. kind of the visual road map. And then. after that, I typically like to have.

people just respond to the all of the. biggest objections that people have. around whatever the specific service is. um as the main points of the video. And. then after that, you just make your call. to action or you just reinforce the. appointment. Say, "Hey, like if you like. this video, text me this keyword. That. way, I know you watched it and we'll. give you an extra 5% on whatever." And. that way the salesperson knows the. person watched it. Um and it gives them. incentive to do so. So it's like, "Hey, if you watch the video, you get 5%.". It's like, "Oh [ __ ] that's amazing." Um. but then that way they know that they. actually watched it. The one other thing. that I've found that is the most. powerful sales closer.

>> is to pitch the assessment. And to pitch. the assessment is, I don't know if I can. help you, but if we answer these 40. questions and we go through this. assessment, then we'll figure out. whether we can help you or not. So, it's. kind of like if you went to the doctor. and said, I don't know whether you need. anything, but we'll put you through a. blood test and and an X-ray and then. we'll see. So one of the biggest way I. I've scaled multiple companies where you. pitch the assessment. You just you don't. tell people whether you can can or can't.

help them. You just simply say the next. step is to take an assessment and when. we do the assessment it will tell us. whether I can help you or not. And it's. one of the best sales closing. techniques. >> There's a lot of psychology around that. They did that the study where they had. the boring focus group and they had one. group of people who were allowed. straight into the boring f community. group and then they had the other group. of people who had to take a survey to. get in and the group of people that took. the survey to get into the boring. community group all said that it was. great in there. >> So much better. >> And there's something about how friction. upon entry makes you value the thing.

more. >> bazillion%. Like I can't I cannot I c I. can't emphasize this more. Like in every. single CRO split test that we increase. friction or increase the quality of. leads, we make more money. >> CRO split test. >> So conversion optimization test that. you'd run across a a landing page or. funnel or sales sales motion. Um like. when you add more friction and it's good. friction ideally, meaning you're not. getting out bad people, you're getting. sorry, getting out good people, which is. bad friction. You want good friction. which gets out bad people. >> Yeah. um you will typically always.

increase the cost per action. So your. lead cost will go up, your cost per call. will go up, but your show rates will go. up and your close rates will go up and. your cash collected will go up. >> And it seems counterintuitive to apply. friction to a process, but. >> and I can almost promise that like it I. I have so few examples where it didn't. work that I almost believe that it's law. at this point. And I think it's law. because it's so counterintuitive because. it's scary to add friction because you. know that you're actively decreasing. your lead flow and increasing your cost.

per lead. You're decreasing your calls, you're increasing your cost per call. Like that is frightening for just about. every business, which is usually why it. works. >> At the Louis Vuitton store, they put a. security guard to keep you out and then. it pushes the prices up. >> Yeah. Like they they after co none of. them stopped doing because they're like, "Oh, wow. We made more sales during CO. because we had people wait in line and. showed scarcity.". >> It's like, isn't it? You don't even get. to pick the bag you get and you have to. join a waiting list. Then they interview. you to buy the bag. >> and then they decide whether they should. let you have. >> what do you bring to the table.

>> That's how Ferrari works. You're not. allowed to buy Ferraris unless you go. through this list. And if you're ever so. shown to to flip them or sell them, you'll never buy another Ferrari again. So. >> I've got three boxes here and these. three suitcases contain different. amounts of money. One of them contains. $1,000. one of them contains $10,000 and. one of them contains $100,000. You're. going to pick a suitcase and you're. going to tell me what you would do with. that amount of money if you were. starting with that amount of money today. to build a scalable business.

>> So, >> do we keep the money? >> He wants to buy a watch. >> I'm like, I'm feeling 100,000. >> All right. What do we got? >> Oh, I have $1,000. >> So, do I get to keep the money? Is that. how this works? >> Yeah, you can keep it. It smells smells. like money. Okay, so I have $1,000. So I. would um take the $1,000, put it in my. pocket, do nothing with it, and I would. watch YouTube videos on AI integration. into small businesses. And then I would. go to small businesses, and once I had a.

specific integration that I would do, which I would probably bet would be. around likely email list activation. because that's typically like fastest, easiest money that most business owners. have, is their contact list. They've. got, you know, they've been in business. 10 years. They've got, you know, 8,000. customers they've sold over that whole. time period and maybe a list of, you. know, call it 20,000 leads that they've. had. They never email them ever. If they. do, it's just like, here's our random. discount that we send once a quarter for. Christmas or whatever. And I would say, hey, um, I will email those people and I.

will uh get everything approved by you. and don't pay me anything. Just pay me a. percentage of the sales that we generate. afterwards. How's that sound? And that. offer tends to do well. And I know that. because I've done it. So, that's what I. would do. in the thousand dollars, I. would, you know, go buy Leila something. for a little bit of time so that she can. stay with me until uh I make the money. for my my email reactivation campaign. >> See what I get? I got the 10K. >> Ah, >> all right. We're going around the circle.

here. Um, I like it. I would find the person who would buy. what I was selling for the highest. dollar amount humanly possible, which. means I would probably go to private. equity companies. So, Alex gave me the. idea for Main Street. I I know that Main. Street businesses are like often cash. crunched, right? They don't have a lot. of money and they often cannot extract. enough value from a lead that I need. them to. So, Alex would need to find the. perfect company to do that and there's.

lots of them or he would build his own. which would be great. I think in my. specific instance, I want to go to the. people who are already good at. extracting the most value humanly. possible. So, I'd probably try to go to. a private equity firm. And I would. >> What's a private equity firm? >> It's basically a fancy way for saying. that people use their own money to buy. businesses as opposed to public equity. where people use the stock markets. dollars to buy businesses. And so, examples would be like u you know KKR, Carile, uh Cberus are some of the. biggest in the world. >> So, they go around buying people's. businesses with their own money. >> That's right. Yeah. Yeah. they find.

entrepreneurs right about the point. where they cannot take it anymore and. they buy those businesses and then they. they grow them hugely and and and again. because I'm better at partnerships I. would want to go to them and I would. want to say and it really what's. interesting is I bet all of us are going. to be really similar the money actually. doesn't matter and so even though I have. $10,000 10x what Alex has it doesn't. actually matter because what I would do. still $10,000 is not enough for me to. make a couple million which is what I. would want to do with this so what. actually is the differentiator what is.

the business model I choose? Who do I go. to sell it to so that I can get the most. value out of it? And with these PE. companies, what I would do is I would go. to them and they're buying companies all. the time. And so there's two ways to. sell to a PE company and I'd see which. ones I could get them to sign up for. On. one hand, there's something called a. deal sourcing fee, which is if you can. find companies that are in the niche. that PE companies want to buy, they will. pay you for sourcing the company. Um, and I know this because I pay deals. fees. And so I would go to private local. private equity companies. You're not.

going to be able to get to Cberus or the. big guys. So I would go to the ones in. my local neighborhood that you could. find by searching on AI to say local. private equity companies buying these. types of companies. I would reach out to. the GPS. Those are the general partners. of the company, the guys who run it. And. I would say what type of companies are. you actively purchasing right now? What's your investment thesis and. dealbox? And if I could get them to. respond to me, great. If not, I'd. search, what do private equity companies. typically want to buy? what what is the. deal box or investment thesis of a. private equity company? I would find. that dealbox and then I'd play the game. of doornocking. I'd go to a bunch of.

these businesses and try to find. companies that wanted to sell and then. when they tell me they want to sell and. I have a buyer, which is the private. equity uh company, the private equity. company will pay me either a percentage. of the sale or a flat fee for sourcing. it. >> What might that look like in terms of a. percentage and dollar number? Yeah, I. mean, if you're like a a. non-institutional player doing this, I. think you would go to them and say, "Can. I get like 10k for every company that I. source you that's over a million dollars. in revenue that's profitable and within. your dealbox?" They'd probably say yes. The normal sourcing fee is somewhere.

between 3 and 5%. But you're not going. to get that when you're brand new. So, but I like the idea of making 10K on one. deal to start. Then, what else am I. learning while I'm doing this? I'm also. learning simultaneously how do you buy. businesses? What type of businesses? How. do you find businesses for sale? I think. this is the highest leverage activity I. know how to do. Like I just I know more. how to buy a business that's already. making money and make it make more money. with a higher degree of certainty. because if it's already profitable, it. gets out of the valley of death, which. is where a company starts and never.

actually makes any profit. And so I. would start there and then what would I. do for that? Well, the second that they. see that I'm good at sourcing deals, there's going to be they're going to be. throwing offers at me. But what I might. do instead is go to those GPS and say, "Hey, I'm pretty good at doing the. hardest part of private equity, which is. finding the deals. Why don't you guys. back me for me to find the deals for. you?" Maybe they'll invest in my company. for me to then run a private equity. firm. Or maybe they'll say, "Come work. for me, and then I can make a couple. hundred,000. I can learn what I think is. the best uh skill out there to learn, which is dealm. And I can use my.

leverage, which is knowing what a. company's worth and how to buy it using. other people's money in order to. increase uh my earnings. And that's. >> interesting. You'd both use the money. for personal things, probably just pay. your rent or take your. >> doesn't make a difference at that level. And I mean, >> no, >> even the hundred is close to I mean, it's more than 10 in one, but. >> yeah. And and this is just one idea. I. think there's so many things you could. do with one and. >> but they're all very similar in their. fundamentals. >> where you go to find some like the. leverage comes from going tapping into. existing networks. You find an existing.

business and either you're selling the. business as the product or you're. selling the product of that business. Right. Exactly. So you're selling either. way and all of it is promotion. You're. selling and you're trying to get a. percentage of upside. I'm getting a. percentage of because like to Cody's. point, a lot of mainstream businesses. don't have money and you're like, "Cool, pay me on money that I make you and. they're usually very very generous with. money they don't have yet.". >> Um, same same for, you know, a deal that. we haven't made yet, I'll give you, you. know, a fee for those things. Again, it. depends on the timeline. If I have 30. days, then like.

>> getting a deal done in 30 days will be. tough. >> Um, but like getting a brick and mortar, it's like probably do that in 48 hours. to get somebody to say yes to free money. for like no risk and I do all the work. It's an easy offer. So again, I think it. dep that's where like the constraints of. the initial prompt is like how much. money and how much time. If it's a year, it's like all of this changes. If it's. 30 days and I have nothing, it's like. well then we want to generate as much. cash as we can in little time as. possible with no risk. >> Yeah. >> Daniel's about to invest in the S&P 500. >> Right. Because. >> he's like, I take your your $10,000 and. I raise you. Yeah.

>> So I have 100,000. >> So. >> he's leaving with it. >> This this is a dangerous amount of. money. >> Yeah. This is the worst case scenario. for most people because if you have a. thousand, you know, you don't have. money. If you have 10,000, okay, you. might get a cleaner, you might get an. assistant, you might do a few little. things with it. The danger of a h. 100,000 is you can kid yourself into. thinking that you've got money. And it. will make your head spin how fast you. can blow through $100,000 if if you.

don't know what you're doing. If you. give me a Formula One car and ask, "What. am I gonna do with it?" I'm gonna crash. it, right? if I can get it even started. in the first place. So, I've got to come. up with something that the first problem. that I have is I don't have the. knowledge. I don't have the network. I. don't have the reputation. So, here's. what I'm going to do. I'm going to. leverage Cody's. I'm going to go to Cody. and I'm going to say, "Cody, can I do a. deal with you? I would like to start a. business. I know you've got lots of. ideas that you just don't have time for. I'm going to invest $100,000 as debt for. equity for 10%. So, I'm going to put 100.

grand in and that'll come out of the. business at some point, but debt for. equity on 10%. and I'm going to do sweat. equity for 10% and you keep 80%. And. it's your idea and it's your network and. it's your reputation, but I'll be the. person who's heavily invested in this. And the only condition is that as the. business becomes profitable, we can. repay the 100 grand. Um, and then once. it's repaid the 100 grand, either you. buy it or we can sell the business. Now, what I'm doing there is I'm. basically acknowledging I don't know. what I'm doing. I'm acknowledging I.

don't have the reputation. I don't have. the knowledge. um all I have is this 100. grand and I have a very strong desire or. will to be an entrepreneur. Now, what's. going to happen is that probably with an. hour of Cody's time per month, she's. going to be able to say, "Here's the. idea. Here's here's my CFO. Talk to my. CFO. Here's my head of marketing. Talk. to my head of marketing. Here's my. friend who's actually got even more. money and wants to invest." And she's. just going to like fire off a few emails. and she's going to love the idea because. it's her idea. And I'm going to I'm. going to work hard, right? And what's.

cool is that when the time comes that. that business becomes valuable, I've got. one buyer on the table. Cody's either. going to say, "Hey, look, I'll buy you. out because it's only 20% and now I own. the whole thing." Uh, or we go to market. and Cody will know someone who can buy. the business and I get 20% of the exit. So, but the key here is that just that. acknowledgement that the it's really. it's the knowledge, the network, and the. reputation that is the valuable bit. And. the money is a bit of a red herring. >> And you're going to get Cody's skills. because you're going to be in her. proximity. you're going to get a little.

bit of her reputation. >> at the end of that deal. I will then. have knowledge. I'll then have. reputation. I'll then have uh all of. those things will have leveled up for. me. >> You know what else is interesting too? It's really what you're proposing is is. something that I used to not like and. since have think and since think that. when you find the right ones, it's it's. really fascinating which it's a. franchise model. You're essentially. saying which is what you do when you. come to a franchise. If you come to. Resibrands, you go, "Okay, I have. $75,000. I don't know anything about. window cleaning. I don't know anything.

about running a business. But I do know. that you know how to do it. And I know. that you have all these case studies, aka proof of other people just like me. that have done it. So, I'm actually. going to pay you for this business for. the right for you to take a percentage. of my ownership forever in perpetuity. Um, but I will teach you how to or you. will teach me how to run the business. And so I think that's actually I I think. I used to think that franchises weren't. good for entrepreneurs because I am. relatively unemployable and I don't like. to be told what to do. But for people.

that have never run a business before. like what you're saying is like I'm. paying you for the right to learn. because you have a proven system that if. I use it over time I have a lower. likelihood of failure because we know. the truth which is 90% of startups fail. >> Most startups never make any money. you. pay for the right to maybe potentially. one day make money. And so I do think. stealing other people's homework is is. real and valuable. I. >> I wanted to ask you all a question which. I have an answer to. So I assumed you. would but maybe you don't, which is what.

is the one thing about entrepreneurship, wealth creation, finance that you think. most people undervalue that you you put. a a disproportionate amount of weight. on. So like for me, I can think of a. game in business. I think of business as. a set of games we're playing. I can. think of a particular game in business. that I don't think other entrepreneurs. understand the value of and I'm. wondering if you all have an answer to. that as well. Is there one game in this. game of business, one fundamental game. that you think most entrepreneurs. listening now don't appreciate and they.

should from the entrepreneurs you've. worked and invested in and being one. yourself? >> Well, I think I'll say one that everyone. here at the table will agree with. But I. think that brand and distribution is. still wildly undervalued. M. >> I mean I think that's the reason that. all of us decided to get into it is. because you just I mean at least I saw. just the wild discrepancy between cost. of of building brand and building. distribution versus the value of that. distribution and you know the the primes. the lunches the you know some of these. in insane zero to many billion dollar.

case studies uh term huda beauty proper. proper uh whatever it is for yeah like. there's there's so many examples at this. point that it's almost trite um I still. think it's undervalued distribution, which is building an audience that you. own. >> that has a high likelihood of of. complying with requests, >> aka brand. >> Yeah. I mean, well, I think that's a. very good one. And and the reason that. we know that it's so undervalued is. we're all offered things all the time. that do not I mean, I remember talking. to my president of my company, and I was.

the former president of Mr. Beast. It. was interesting is he said like every. deal we looked at, >> we almost regretted doing it. Like we. couldn't I think you and I talked about. this. We we we couldn't do a deal that. the other party fully understood the. power of our distribution upfront. We. almost had to like prove it, put in a. bunch of milestones on a later date. because the deal is so good. And I found. the same thing in the deals that I did. Like we've talked about like I mean I. did a bunch of deals early on where I. bought businesses and they couldn't. benefit from distribution. All my. laundromats, my car washes, like it.

doesn't matter that I have a big. audience online and so the leverage. wasn't there for me. So I think um I. think distribution and brand are huge. Uh the secondary thing that I do not. think most entrepreneurs understand is. financial engineering. The richest. people in the world are rich if if they. didn't get it from daddy and mommy and. they didn't get it from uh investing in. third party companies. They got it from. um they got it from owning companies and. buying them over time. Like every. billion there is not a billion dollar.

company that exists that hasn't bought. other companies. It doesn't exist. When. you say financial engineering, how do. you simplify that for someone that's 16. years old? >> Man, understanding how to get other. people's money, to say it really simply, like how to get other people's money, which sounds a little scammy, except. it's not. You know, most businesses are. bought with the SBA loans, loans from. the government that allow you to buy a. business. Businesses need lines of. credit. That's just money from the bank. for future state. So, like if you. actually understood how money and. finance works in your business, it's.

harder to die because cash flow is what. keeps your company alive. And also, it's. easier to buy your competitors because. whoever is most funded wins typically. >> Um, and so I think. >> I think more entrepreneurs need to. obsess on the thing that uh isn't the. magic. Like the magic is coming up with. an idea, having the grit, doing the. brand, doing the distribution. That. stuff's actually really really hard. financial engineering is is modelable. It's just it's the same every single. time. It's just been gatekept by by Wall.

Street. >> money games. I I had this I had such an. epiphany moment when I was like 20 23 24. years old when my um a German group had. basically bought the majority of my. company out and I got to spend a lot of. time because we now had this German. office. So, I was there a lot and I just. observed this one individual who I shan. and I I I'm there building this business. and pitching to clients and doing all. this hard work and I met him and he. says, "I don't want to do any hard work. I just want to do deals.". >> And I was like, "Tell me more." And I. lent in. I'm like, "What do you mean. deals?" Cuz I'm like, "I'm not sleeping. here." And this guy looks like he's.

sleeping like tremendous amounts of. hours. And he was like, "I just want to. play money games. >> I want to be in the middle of the. transaction of the deal and taking. some." But then he's also when he says. money games is like leverage and. arbitrage. >> raising money against an asset, overvaluing that asset and buying lots. of cheaper assets with the value of the. expensive asset. >> And he made a lot of money doing exactly. that and almost never working cuz he. understood exactly what you're saying is. that really really rich people. understand money games.

>> Just how to use money leverage to make. more money. >> Look at the Forbes 100 list. It's all. comprised of people who do financial. arbitrage in one way or another. >> How do I go learn that skill? Do I have. to go work in finance? >> No, you don't have to work in finance. But I mean, the best business school is. always be in business. So, get into. business and then obsess on one like I. think it's like tiered. Bottom level is. like understand a P&L. Most. entrepreneurs don't have a profit and. loss statement. They don't actually. track their profit and loss statement. I. mean, we invested at a $60 million a. year year business. The guy didn't have.

an up-to-date profit and loss statement. It's incredibly common. I'm sure you see. it. you look at a bunch of businesses. too. Second level after a profit and. loss statement is do I understand where. my financing is coming from? All you. need to do to understand that is talk to. your bankers like do you have a bank. that will lend you money? Understand. why. Uh explain to them what you do and. see if they understand it and how much. money they'll give you. And then the. third level of the game is go and talk. Every like learning that needs to be. done is just getting in the room with. other people who have their Tuesdays are.

like your dream days. So I think you. know you want to get in a room with a. bunch of people who are doing deals. That's how you do more deals. >> When I um I told you earlier we were. talking about psychedelics before we. started recording. >> Yeah. >> Um when I left my last company I had. that year and a half where I invested in. this massive psychedelics company and it. was the pandemic. So we're working from. everyone was working from home. I was. working from the billionaire's apartment. in London. And I got to see in the. leadup to the IPO he did 10 IPOs a year. So I got to sit in his kitchen and he we. used to work over there and I just got. to see what was going on. And all he was.

doing was making phone calls to people. with lots and lots of money and he was. giving them access to the IPO before it. IPOed at a valuation which we all knew. was going to 10x. And I just thought, oh. my god, like this is how rich people. make money. They have some kind of. access or arbitrage and they move money. around to capitalize on on these. multiples. And I thought, [ __ ] hell, like that's. >> that's the game. >> Get around billionaires. I know it's a. crazy thing, but you started a podcast. >> I've done a podcast. Well, >> I'm slightly older than you guys. Like,

I remember before the internet, before. YouTube, before all of this sort of. stuff. There was no access to the this. information. You couldn't get this. information. And now you can you can. listen to podcasts. You can chat to chat. GBT. You don't even have to get in the. room and like it's it's all on the. internet. And it blows my mind because I. remember a time before that. I I love. what you said. I totally agree with what. you said. I'm going to go with um the. one game that most people don't. understand is bananas. That's the end of the podcast.

>> In lesson one of every economics class, they say if you've got 10 bananas and a. 100 people want a banana, you're going. to have high prices and profit. Demand. outstrips supply. If you've got 10. bananas and only one person wants. banana, you're going to drop the price. of those bananas and you're going to. make a loss and your business is going. to go badly. And what most people do not. understand is that the whole game. relates to constrained supply and excess. demand. And if you can't constrain the. supply and create excess demand, you. won't get a profit. You can take. something like Google Maps, which.

probably costs 500 million to set up and. and launch satellites and everything, they have to give it away for free. because they have infinite supply. They. have they can supply everyone on the. planet with Google Maps. So, because. there's infinite supply, they just give. it away for free. But Google Ads, there's a limited number of people who. can advertise on every search. So. because that's limited, the the price. goes up. So I have a client who saves. lives and they do first aid training and. they're an amazing person and they.

literally save children's lives and all. this sort of stuff. And she's telling. me, you know, why aren't I able to. trade, you know, charge more money? I'm. literally saving lives. I'm a really. good person and I'm very valuable. I say. because the whole game, no one that. that's not the game. The game is demand. outstrip supply. So you need to. constrain the supply of something and. you need to manufacture excess demand. and unfortunately as as much as you. might be the most amazing human being if. you can't manufacture demand and supply. tension you can't make a profit.

>> I was hoping and thinking someone might. say hiring. >> because for me my answer is hiring. That's the first thing I go to. I. remember Richard Branson sitting me down. when we spoke in New York and saying. listen I built one of the biggest groups. in Europe and my CFO had pulled me out. of the room and said I don't know what. net profit is and he says my CFO got. crayons and a piece of paper and drew. fishes in a net in an ocean and said. Richard that's your net profit and then. they walked back in the room and he was. at the time running one of the biggest. groups in Europe. When he said that to me, I was like, "Wow." He was like, "You don't really. need to know much if you're a really.

masterful delegator.". >> And he said I was a dyslexic thinker. So, I was always forced from the very. beginning to just find someone to do it. That was exceptional. And actually, the. further I've gone in my career, the more. just like you figure out like. >> the game, this game, that it's actually. just a couple of fundamental things that. sway the outcomes. Like most of the. returns come from like a couple of. things. In business, I've just come to. learn the further I've got that my. returns come from truly exceptional. people, binding them with a culture and. then setting them the sort of strategy. or more technical things that. >> I would agree with that. And the reason.

you can find such amazing talented. people and so could Richard Branson is. because first he could create excess. demand for that role and then you could. choose from that list. >> So I go back to when I was 18. I was 18, broke, drop out of university, parents. aren't speaking to me, shoplifting food. I managed to get a guy called Chris who. was running a business to. um stop his business. He was he was. double my age and successful to stop his. business and to decide to come and build.

a social network with a kid who was. stealing Chicago town pizzas in. Manchester who had never built a. technology company before in exch I. didn't pay him in exchange for 30% of. the company. And this goes back to this. whole thing about offers. My pitch, my. offer at that time, I was trading in. future money, equity, and he believed in. the value of the future money. So I say. to kids all the time, actually, you. don't need to be in my position now. You've all got future money. And the. future money is determined by how good. your pitch is. Yeah. >> Your sell is. >> But I think that goes back to that like. how I talk about pitching for money. That's your mightest touch. You didn't.

have profit. >> You didn't have growth. You didn't have. a track record. What did you have? An. incredible [ __ ] story. Yeah. So if. you got nothing else but a story, then. you can hire people much smarter. >> Exactly. >> This actually brings me to a point that. I haven't told the world about yet. I've. just built something called culture. test. You can find it at culture. test.com. Essentially, the thinking is. that one bad hire, as I'm sure all of my. guests here will agree, can ruin your. business. It can ruin your idea. So, culture test helps you figure out and. spot red flags and people you're.

thinking of working with or currently do. work with by making a personalized. culture test survey and it scores that. person in terms of how aligned they are. to you and your mission. It has been a. gamecher for my business. We've culture. tested about 40,000 people. I just wish. I was doing this before. Check it out. Cultureest.com. Make your own culture. test. Use it and thank me later. Alex, you you've got this book about to drop. called 100 million money models. What is.

the one money model in this book that's. added the most to your net worth? >> So, it's more the concept. So, like each. of the the so offers had the value. equation which is kind of the core. concept that the book was built around. Uh the lead's book was about the core. four um the ways to promote anything. And so, $100 million money models is. about client finance acquisition which. is fundamentally how you get customers. to fund your own expansion. And so Cody. said this earlier, but depending on the. source, it's roughly like 80% of. businesses fail because of uh poor cash. flow or they they just don't have enough.

money, right? And the other 20 is. probably just people just give up. And. so as long as you don't give up, the. reason you go to business is you just. don't have cash flow. And so that book. solves cash flow, which is why the sub. headline is how to make money, which is. pretty pretty on the nose. But. fundamentally like each of the examples. that I had in my business um and I. define that within client fun. acquisition as I define it when you have. like a $100 million money model is that. you're able to get a customer to pay you. twice as much as you spend on them in. the first 30 days. And by doing that the. the more specific equation would be that.

your 30-day gross profit from a customer. exceeds two times CAC plus COGS meaning. CAC is in cost of car customer plus cost. uh COGS which is cost of goods sold. So, how much does it cost me to get them? How much does it cost me to deliver. them? Times two. If I can get that from. one person, then for the rest of my. expansion, all the customers finance the. acquisition of the next customer and. then cash flow is no longer a constraint. of the business. You'll still have. constraints, you'll still have supply. constraints, you still have hiring. constraints, you'll still have other. constraints, but cash won't be one of. them. And so, as a result, you can grow. B pretty much as fast as you can handle.

And so, that is how I've grown all the. companies that I've started without. funding and been able to grow very fast. in each of them um is with that core. concept. Thank you. Thank you for uh choosing to. be here today. And I invited you here. because you're the three people that. guide me, that I listen to, that I think. have the most credible, important. information that can guide my audience. And I know who they are. They're people. that want to improve their lives in some. subjective medium to that the northstar. that they have. And you all represent. different perspectives and also. different strategies. But there's so.

much so many overlaps that I think. actually getting three people like you. around the table to understand where we. overlap and where you think the same is. incredibly powerful. Um, I highly. recommend everybody goes and reads Cody. Sanchez's book, Main Street Millionaire, >> how to make extraordinary wealth buying. ordinary businesses, which is really. what, you know, one of the things Cody. has pioneered the idea of um, and made. accessible to the masses because most. people didn't think you could do that. So many of my friends are now buying. boring businesses, as Cody says, because. Cody has laid out a framework to do that.

and to create wealth in this book. And. my favorite book of Daniel, if I was. over subscribed, how to get people. lining up to do business with you. And. there's so many that I could have chose. from, but also you all have YouTube. channels and your YouTube channels are. amazing. So, I'd ask my audience, I'm. going to link them all below, to go and. check out your YouTube channels. Um, Daniel, you're just starting out on. YouTube. You're getting you're getting. your your feet wet in YouTube. >> But, but Cody and Alex have been making. so much incredible actionable content. I. love one of your new your new formats. where you sit with someone and you sort. of redesign their business with them.

and Cody's been making some of the most. entertaining and informative content on. on how to get going with with simple um. companies and businesses for the longest. time. So, please go check out their. their work and go follow them on social. media. These are the people that I. admire the most in this space. And if. you like what we do here on the. Darvisio, you're going to love what they. do. So, thank you so much everybody for. being here, for being so generous with. your time and hopefully we'll do this. again sometime soon. >> This has always blown my mind a little. bit. 53% of you that listen to this show. regularly haven't yet subscribed to the. show. So, could I ask you for a favor.

before we start? If you like the show. and you like what we do here and you. want to support us, the free simple way. that you can do just that is by hitting. the subscribe button. And my commitment. to you is if you do that, then I'll do. everything in my power, me and my team, to make sure that this show is better. for you every single week. We'll listen. to your feedback. We'll find the guests. that you want me to speak to and we'll. continue to do what we do. Thank you so. much. [Music].