Why Trump’s White House Is About to Get Very Ugly | Inside Trump's Head

As the end comes for the Trump administration, and the feeling may be that it is ending much sooner if. with with Tuesday's election is that everybody. is going to be so much more focused on getting what they can. while the getting is good, which is going to increase the pressure, increase the the resentments, increase the competition around Trump. And it's going to be a bloody.

Michael Joanna. Happy happy Halloween. Are you really happy about it? I came back. Somehow I doubt that. I walked back from a dinner last night through Soho. I live in downtown Manhattan and it was just full of slutty. cats and slutty witches. And it seems to go on forever now.

Halloween. I felt like last weekend it was like this. It's like this weekend. Girls with fallopian tube, short skirts. and everyone just looking absurd. Why? No I won't. I want to clarify this. Fallopian tube. Short skirts. Do you mean that they are displaying their fallopian tube? I mean, they're so short they could be displaying their fallopian tubes. I'm like, why are. Why are people dressing like this just because it's Halloween?

It's sort of weird to me. But tell me about your costume. You have little children. For which I thought Halloween was actually invented. No. No. And it is, is there? There is. I mean, it does go on forever out here. There was the Halloween parade through the town. of Amagansett yesterday at noon. They get off from school on or a half a day on Halloween. But there are all of the kids from,

from K through the sixth grade, making their way through town, collecting candy. from every storefront, bags bulging. with candy, and, and even I actually turned out to look, we were in a costume. Were you in a costume, Joanna? Of course. How long have you known me? Of course. I'm dressing up for Halloween. What were you wearing? What was your costume? I,

I'm being sarcastic. Oh, good. Good, good, good. I was that Michael was wearing a costume. You can just go as yourself, though. You said that last week you beat in Manhattan, and you kept being. stopped by people who listened to the podcast. Yes. I win as a podcaster. Yes. When to support Costa. Very good. Well, I saw that your, there was a rather nice piece. We should give a shout out to Ed Pilkington. and thank him for a rather nice piece in the Guardian about the two of us,

though he does describe you as describing yourself. as a as 70s porn star. When you had all your hair and you said you had a mustache. I can't imagine you with a mustache. No, nor. nor can I at this point, but I, I can't. I can't imagine how the 70s actually occurred. But they did. They did. And now we're in the what are we in the 2026?

We're three days of the midterm election. And you and I will be live on election night starting at 8:00 in the evening. And we're just going to stay until we've got some interesting results, until we have a sense of the shape of what's to come. Or until we drop. We're not going to drop Michael. We're not going to try. I might drop this is a late evening for me. I'm a you know, this this actually begins with my bedtime.

Well, and I never make it through election night. I'm always like, oh, God. Partly because. I get depressed and then partly because I just get tired. It goes on to two too long and too late. All right, well, we'll get as far as we can. Michael, you're not sounding very buoyant about it for people. The point is that we will be keeping people up to date with what's going on. Let's put set the context that this could be the, the the,

the historic night in the modern era. And for those of you joining us on election night, feel free to send us your questions and your comments. Your Limerick will be reading them out on Tuesday. Send us your poems. Send us your inspiration for getting through Tuesday. Send us your alcohol recipes for getting through Tuesday. What will you be eating? What will you be drinking? How will you get through the night? And we hope that you'll join us. And we've we've made our predictions, so we'd love to hear yours too.

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But of course we have lots of new people joining us every week. I'm Joanna calls from the Daily Beast. You are, I'm Michael Wolff, and I am, well, most relevantly, the author of four books. about the Trump, about Donald Trump's political career. I'm in. It has occupied my life for the past ten years, and this is a podcast where we attempt to understand what's going on inside.

Donald Trump's head, because he's really created a government of one. where all the people around him are slavishly loyal to him, and his decision is the only decision that really matters. As we've seen. So, Michael, how how would you assess his performance in this final stretch? A very good question. And I think that is the question that's an election night question. I mean, I mean, his performance seems daft to me,

but it has seemed daft over many, many years. and yet effective. He he did. he did a, he did a rally, I think. Yes. Yesterday that was, that was extraordinarily Trumpy. going this way and that way. Who knows what he was talking about. Who knows why he was saying the things that he, that he was that he was saying,

many of them incomprehensible. So I would, in any logical world say, well, that's that's it, folks, but that's not the case. And it may well be that this final, this swing, this, this, this, I mean, he got around to paying attention to this, and really, he hadn't been paying attention to this, and he was forced into paying attention, by the by the, by the possible dire.

consequences of, of this election. And he got out there and I don't know, we'll see if it if it makes a difference. I mean it could as well completely backfire. And this is the Donald Trump election. And Donald Trump is the issue in some in some sense. the only issue or and he is the front man. of all of the other issues that are dominating this, this election,

especially the war, affordability, these are all around Donald Trump's neck. So putting him out there is certainly a reminder to many, many people why they should not vote for Donald Trump. The question is, is it also a reminder to those people. utterly culturally infatuated with Donald Trump to get out and vote? That's the that's that's the question we will answer.

or try to answer on Tuesday night. Okay. Well, today we're going to be talking about the big dip, big fall in Fox News and whether or not that all goes. well for Trump, we're going to be looking at six House races on Thursday. We went through the Senate races that are super tight and made our predictions. And I want to change one of my predictions because it turns out that Ken. Paxton has had to. The Republican candidate in Texas.

for Senate, up against the Democrats, James Talarico. And of course, Paxton was personally chosen by Trump. I don't think you can change a prediction. I can't change my prediction. No, but the circumstances have changed. Well, well, you know, I thought Paxton might win, but now I see. he's canceling his rallies because literally nobody's turning up. And at one point, there was a solitary clap in a very small audience. There was a solitary clap for something he said, and he said, thank you for that clap.

But we're going to talk about House races. We're going to talk about election interference. Is it actually a real thing? We're going to talk about the golf course and the Kennedy Center. My son plays on that golf course, and he's distraught at the idea of it being turned into a fancy golf course. We're going to be talking about my favorite Halloween special, RFK. Real Food Podcast, which excelled itself. We're going to see our Health and Human Services.

secretary attacking a pumpkin with a knife. And you would think he was restaging the OJ Simpson case. It's it's really unnerving. Is it? What kind is it? Just a regular old, kitchen knife. It's. like this. The whole thing is just extraordinary, as indeed are the. the comments are essentially setting up his base for 2028. My, my wife has a whole set of specialized instruments just for carving a pumpkin.

When I grew up, there were no such things as pumpkins in the UK, and instead we used turnips and it is impossible to carve a turnip. It takes days. It's it's six times as dense as a pumpkin, because the point about a pumpkin. is there's the shell, but then the stuff inside is is soft with a turnip. A turnip is solid throughout. It's just it was never incomprehensible discussion to me.

Okay. Well it started. Why are there no pumpkins in the United Kingdom? I don't know, there probably are. Now. I feel like everything's been Americanized, but when I was growing. up, the tradition of a jack o lantern actually comes from Ireland. And they used turnips for it. That's all I'm saying. Anyway, the most important thing is. I got the color of Melania's costume wrong when I was discussing her yesterday. with Hugh Doxey on the Daily Beast podcast,

we showed a picture of her because she turned up at the white House. to enjoy Halloween with her husband or enjoy like, be a bit strong. But she was wearing what looked like a very, very dark dress. It was actually brown. I thought it was black and she looked very designer, which. But much more importantly, you have an update. on your legal case against the first lady. Speaking of Melania in Brown. Yes. So we have, as of yesterday,

filed our appeal to the. to the federal judges ruling. That was a ruling now quite a number of months ago. And so one of the things that I have learned in my career. as a litigant with the first lady. is how long things take long, not only longer than you might imagine, but literally ten times longer than you might imagine.

So we have finally filed this appeal, and that's after after a number of months. of, of the of the procedural hurdles in which to file an appeal. And then I said to my lawyers yesterday, I said, well, when can we expect. a decision on the on the appeal? Well, answer unknown, but, you know, maybe late spring. So I mean it's in its it it is in an agony. and part of what goes on here and part of their goal,

their goal is to keep is to, is to delay this as long as possible. and to keep it from going forward, in other words, to stall it out. Why? Well, the answer is because they don't want to give any kind of evidence. They don't want to be put in the position. to have to supply any kind of information. All of that information would be to their detriment, I think.

I think we can conclude, but at any rate, the appeal was filed yesterday. and it has two substantive points. And and. again, we are now the they create these these. these loops that it takes you it takes you an endless amount of time. to get back to the place in which you can go forward. So the this was again, again.

set this this was filed in New York state court. The Melania Trump and her lawyers moved it. as they have the right to do to, to federal court, in which then the federal court has to. then make the determination whether it belongs in federal court. It gets to federal court on because, because they are maintaining. that there are two that that the,

that the parties, each of the parties, me and Melania live in different states. when we are maintaining that actually. we both live in the same state, New York state, and that she is at, And she is. a concert in Trump Tower. where she lives, not as she maintains in Florida. So the federal judge, isn't that still a story.

that the first lady lives in Florida? She doesn't live in the white House. I mean, that is an admission of sorts, isn't it? I'm not sure that people understand that. Or perhaps people don't care. No. Well, that's that's not you could. You would be. then if you lived in the white House, you could still be, as Donald Trump. certainly certainly appears to be a resident. of a citizen of Florida. He votes there. Not only does he vote there, but he he genuinely lives there.

Okay. Melania Trump genuinely lives in New York City. And I mean, that's where that's where she physically spends most of her time. That's where her businesses are located. That's where her, her social life occurs. Now, she went into federal court and said, yes, well, she votes in or her lawyer said she votes in,

in Florida. Well, you can vote in Florida just by virtue of having. a piece of property there. That's that's not that does not define. where you actually live, where you are a citizen of. And that's kind of I mean, the law, the law actually, in a very holistic way, spells out the definition of citizenship. So, but the federal Court just merely accepted that and did not,

did not provide. So in that kind of thing, you're moving to federal court. It's on you to prove to prove that there is a reason. You have to prove you are a genuine citizen of Florida, which we maintain. She did not and we maintain. And we had asked for discovery. Let us have discovery. Let us question Melania Trump about her, where she actually lives.

And that was rejected by the federal court. We have now appealed, and we are asking for, for the court to. allow discovery, which would be a. which would be very difficult for the First lady. to acknowledge that she does not she not only does not live with her. husband in Washington, she doesn't live with her husband in Florida either. They are actually separated. So, so they will do everything to resist that.

And then we are also also asking the the the federal judge. refused to rule on the merits of the case. She she actually abstained. That is the word she abstained from ruling on, on the issues. pertaining to the New York state law and the New York state law is. you cannot use a the threat of a libel suit. or the threat of a libel suit to intimidate the, the,

a speech that is otherwise perfectly legal. Okay. So lots of people have asked me what's been going on with it, and I've said, oh, it's, you know, the wheels of the law grind slowly and Michael is still on it. So I think people will be relieved to hear the case has not gone away, that you're very much on it. Your lawyers are very much on it. And there may yet be a day where Melania Trump.

sees Michael Wolff in court that, Michael, I will be on the front row. for if I have to get up at 5:00 in the morning, well, many people will be on. Yes, on, on. You'll have to save their seat. But it's just to understand this and it's very and obviously people. ask me all the time is that is that you create these, these, these loops which are digressions from the, from the real case. In order for the real case to proceed,

we have to get it back into New York State court. And that is the long the long road that we are now on. and on Winding road, which we believe will be successful. Well, Michael, good luck with it. And I know that people I know a lot of listeners have contributed. to the GoFundMe account and are cheering you as you try to bring justice. and use the Trump's own defense mechanism, which is using the law against them.

Yeah. And no. And again, you know, I mean, we are I am, my lawyers and. everybody who's involved with this case, incredibly grateful. for the resources that so many people, 25,000 people, I think maybe even more at this point, have made possible by small, small dollar. contributions, because the point is the. the leverage that the Trump side has is we will just run you to the ground.

You can't afford to do this. And so far we can afford. And that is upsetting to them to say the least. Well, obviously keep us posted with what happens with this new appeal. The end of spring seems a long time, but I guess they're trying. to run out the clock so that she doesn't have to appear while he's still president. Right? Well, I think they're trying to. run out the clock so that I get exhausted and go away. Well, they've picked on the wrong man.

They've picked on the wrong man. The idea that you would. get exhausted and go away, they really have. No, I mean, you can see why people would get exhausted. and you can see, I mean, also exhaustion combined. with financial ruin is a, is is a pretty potent weapon. Well, and it's something that Donald Trump has done throughout his career. Right. Every day your personal information is exposed somewhere online.

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We have to, I think, talk about a story that I am fascinated by, which is this story of Trump's former lawyer. talking about the law, Alina Harbor, who represented him in court. You reported back watching her being shouted at by Donald Trump. Well, let me let me just just go take us back to the beginning. of the Alina Harbor story. So the Alina Harbor story begins. in Trump's club in Bedminster,

new Jersey, his golf club and country club, and with Alina Harbor beside the pool. Now, Alina Harbor is there because her husband, her then husband, a. a parking lot magnate in new Jersey, was a member of. of Bedminster and Alina Harbor, was it she. She is a lawyer and had a small practice.

in new Jersey, a very small practice. And be more of a lawyer than Katie Zechariah. She was more of a lawyer than. Katy Zacharias because I feel like there are gradations of lawyers now. Yes, but, but she was. she was not the kind of lawyer. that customarily receives. a becomes comes to represent the president of the United States,

nor the kind of lawyer who almost became an, the U.S. attorney in, in new Jersey. She is not that kind of a lawyer. She is not the kind of lawyer that Donald Trump. decided that she should be. So at any rate, she she was introduced into the Trump circle. because of because of the social through the social circle.

at the Bedminster golf club. And, he started to give her little. assignments, little legal assignments that curiously, his other lawyers refused to take up, you know, and they were they were always his kind of harassment. Sue that person, you know, that's that is the Trump way. And, Sue, go into court I don't care. And he has this is this kind of defines.

a kind of a key pillar of his, of his political life, which is, is to use the courts in these, these kind of abusive ways that lawyers usually resist. And actually, his lawyers have many of his lawyers have resisted. And then he gets rid of them and he finds lesser lawyers. So Trump's whole career is kind of based on lesser lawyers, lawyers.

who will do things that more respectable lawyers will not do anyway. That's the, the, the way that Elena Harbor comes into the Trump fold. And and also she's she's good looking. So that's, that's suddenly becomes, that's a point of Trump, a point of pride. And as we discussed many times in during the campaign,

during his trials, he would say, I may not have the smartest lawyers, but I've got the hottest. Elena Harbor now has a new husband, Elena Harbor Mildren, which should actually use her full name, is now married to her. Meldon, who interestingly, could be 29 and she has told people he's 29. But on closer examination, in an excellent piece, The New York Times has discovered that he's probably actually 25.

She says she's 41, but you suspect she's actually possibly older. I think she says she is 42, but she. Yes. No reason that she could not also be lying about her age. But it turns out that Elena harbor as or Elena Milton as we should call her, and Elena Milton sounds so much less interesting than Elena Harbor, doesn't it? Elena Harbor. sounds like you might have some exotic sort of Middle Eastern background.

It suggests kind of money and dates and the fragrance of oranges at night. I think Milton is a bit more down to Earth. Harbor, I think, was the parking lot. King Elena Milton has married this young man. Good for you, Lina. She turns out to be a bit of a cougar. Perhaps because of the bikini. At Bedminster, which first attracted Donald. Trump's attention, as you pointed out in one of your books. One of your four books. And,

and and. with along, by the way, then a long, a long segue with Elena Harbor. with her, her lawyers and her PR people calling to say that if, if, if I said that she was. beside the swimming pool in her bikini, they would sue, while at the same time. admitting yet that yes, she was beside. the swimming pool in her bikini, but that has no relationship to.

why Donald Trump selected her to be his lawyer, which I'm willing to say. Maybe it didn't have anything to do with that. Maybe he thought she was a brilliant legal mind. And he may have. He may have seen the brilliant legal mind just throbbing with brilliance. on the side of the pool, because as we know, he's a man who's. who sees talent where others don't, regardless. The Elena Harbor story has sort of exploded. First of all, she joined a new company called Concord Partners at the beginning.

I just just let me interrupt here. because I have a question, because the last time. we were apprized of Elena. Harbor, she had been appointed the U.S. attorney in New Jersey. She'd been appointed acting. I think she'd been appointed acting because it requires Senate approval. And she didn't have Senate confirmation that that was the rub. And that became the rub,

that the Senate was not willing to confirm her in this role. Donald Trump had selected her, the Justice Department, but Donald Trump had ordered the Justice Department. to put her into that role and to seek to nominate her for, for that, that job. And she didn't get that. And then she. kind of disappeared. Where was she? She, she obviously she had tried, apparently to come.

to look for a job in the white House and none was forthcoming. So that was the last time we heard of Elena Harbor, which was not that long ago. And there was no, at that point, Mr. Mildren on the scene. Right. And Pam Bondi, I think it's fair to say, had tried very hard to squeeze her into that role as U.S. attorney in New Jersey, but it was clear she wasn't going to get Senate confirmed. Well, yes. And on Donald Trump's instructions, yeah.

I'm sure Pam Bondi was like rolling her eyes about this, but, even Pam Bondi, I think everyone was has has rolled. their eyes about Elena Harbor. Also during the campaign, just as a little more background on Elena Harbor. So the question is this morning, you're so lucky, Elena Harbor. It is that Trump was always calling, calling her a side and and about how how much she swore.

You have to clean up your language. You sound like a you sound like a sailor, was what he put it, which is some old reference, and, and also for her drinking, she, he would frequently. Oh, like like judge. Like judge. What's her face? Who's the district attorney in D.C.? Yes, who we've talked about many times. Judge Jeanine, her husband went to jail for tax evasion. That's right.

And then she turns up as the US attorney in DC. Go figure. Anyway, Elena Harbor comes back onto our radar because she. signed a contract with a new company called Concord Partners. Unclear what Concord Partners does, but she's being paid $10 million a year. It's a four year contract with room for another $10 million bonus. And shortly after, the father of the woman. who appears to have set up this company, Concord Partners, a man called who Leo Herrera receives.

a pardon for some, financial shenanigans. And it appears that Alina Milton, as she is now. married to Terran, who may or may not be 25. or 29 and will get into his businesses in a second. He's got a stack full of businesses, which we're going to get into, but it looks as if a leaner,

was was essentially facilitating a pardon. Now, she, of course, has denied this, but the but the even beyond that. And so she's gotten this this money and Trump is furious. not furious apparently because she is effectively. selling influence and saying. that she could provide a pardon or, or at least that is creating a situation in which it looks like.

that is what she, she is providing. That's not what Trump apparently is upset about. What apparently he is upset about is that he's not getting. a piece of the action, and he's demanding from her. that she contribute part of the money to his library. Library. Let's do air quotes here. And and that is in the, in the Mafia business. I think that that's, that's called the vigorous.

He wants his vigorous. He wants the big what's his big. So the other thing we should mention is that Alina harbors. Milton, married to the 25 or 29 year. old who knows, said that her husband, Turan, 25 or 29, who knows, had actually made a donation to Rick Grinnell, who until recently was running the Kennedy Center. But the money had never managed to get to the Kennedy Center anyway.

Apparently, she raised this with Donald Trump, who then investigated, I think I think raised his mild. She stormed into the white House, made a, you know, a. major challenge, a major kerfuffle about this, a trying to align everybody in the white House. on, on on her side against Rick Grenell. Okay. And then it transpires that the money, which is,

I think $17 million, so a substantial sum. has actually gone to a company. that Rick Grenell is involved in. that might help her husband. Correct me if I'm wrong here, get a contract in the Congo because, yes, the Congo, the Democratic Republic of the Congo in Africa. So where that crops in, we don't know. Except it turns out that Turon says. that he has a contract to build a data center in the Congo.

That's where all the data centers are now going, apparently. And he's also, it turns out, got a shrimp packing business in Venezuela. He's got a cement business in Venezuela. But as the times reporters dug in, it turned out that there were various. financial issues with the shrimp packing business. and indeed with the cement business. And far from being a billionaire, it looks as if he is a bit of an exaggerated.

Should we put it that way? Yeah. Let me. rather than to say. the times dug in, this is what it's supposed to look like. It this would instead be that the white House. has decided not to side with Alina Harbor, but the side with Rick Grinnell. And so whatever is the actual story here, it would appear that Alina.

Harbor is is on the outs. Nobody wants Alina. So Trump and Alina getting into it and shouting at each other. came from the white House. But why would the white House leak the fact that Trump wanted a vig of. Alina's new, is that to warn off other people trying to monetize their process? I would say that that probably comes from the Alina side. So what this indicates is that they are that they are in a,

they are in a huge fight. And and then the other story about Elena's. harbor in Rick Grenell is, is probably part. of the white House pushing back against Elena Harbor, pushing back. So what we're seeing in a broader sense, and I think we will be seeing much more of this, is the white House. imploding that everybody against.

everybody else, everybody fighting for their own survival. and piece of the pie before all this falls apart. And does Elena Harbor assuming because it. certainly in the same piece it suggested that. Concord partner was being pressured to drop Elena harbor, that she had signed a four year contract, but now they're under pressure. to somehow terminate that contract because the president doesn't like it.

Do you think Alina Harbor stays with Concord Partners? How does this resolve who who knows? I mean, I don't even know what Concord Partners is. Apparently, no one knows what Concord knows. That's the point, right? It's Concord Partners is nothing. So it's, this is just a way to to. I mean, it would appear that this is a way. to, This is a Lena harbor's. payment for the influence. she can arrange with the Trump government.

And it would seem that the guy got a pardon. So, you know, he got what? What he paid for. Although it seems very expensive, I think he could have gotten. a much cheaper pardon, but on a larger basis here. And what we what we see. is what goes around, what. reflects the entire Donald. Trump ecosystem, which is influence everybody.

It's all about influence and Mr. mold drin mold drone, Milton, Milton, is basically kind of represents himself. as having influence around the world. That's what strong men, the strong men in the kind of authority. in despotic roles, that's what they do, is that they sell their influence. That's how they maintain their power.

Is by is by putting it up for grabs. for other people to make money off of. So everybody then makes money off of this central power in the middle. And that's also what happens with Donald Trump. And that's why Donald Trump wants his cut. But that's what so many other people around Donald Trump are also doing. And this is going to get more intense as Donald Trump. as as the end comes for the Trump administration.

And it may come much. It may the feeling may be that it is ending much sooner if. with with Tuesday's election is that everybody. is going to be so much more focused on getting what they can. while the getting is good, which is going to increase the pressure, increase the the resentment, increase the competition around Trump. And it's going to be, bloody.

well it's going to be there's going to be many more people competing to. if the polls are correct and there is a blue wave, let's look at some of the House races because it's so. I mean, it's unlikely that. any of the Republican candidates we're going to talk about get reelected. So they're all going to be frantically running around waving their Trump. proximity flags, trying to raise some, some cash. I guess the first one we should talk about.

is, well, what about Anna Paulina Luna? She's in Florida's 13th district. She's a former model, Michael. She's a former model. She's a former military. Last she was in the Air Force and she's a big believer in. I can't say this with a straight face. She's a big believer in UFOs. She is on the UFO committee. And she's been in Congress since 2022.

And I want to say she's a friend of Laura Loomis, but maybe I'm just saying that because her name is Anna Paulina Luna. And I get the two of them confused because they look quite similar. and they're all competitive. So I doubt if they are. If they are friends, it's it's who can be more MAGA than the than than the other. But it's interesting that finally, finally these. the crazy MAGA people are beginning to have a, I think.

a real impact on the fundamental MAGA. brand, if it can be called that. MAGA represents. the crazies, and she's a real conspiracy theorist. She's got conspiracy theories on JFK, on UFOs. She was on Joe Rogan discussing it. And it feels like she's also just, I would say, super attention seeking. So she's never met a television appearance that she doesn't want to do. And she's up against someone I've met, actually, a very impressive former Air.

Force brigadier, a woman called Leila Gray, who's never been. in politics in her life, never assumed she would ever get into politics. Saw Ana Paulina Luna and thought, I can do better than that. for the people of Florida. This is the 13th district, I think, I said. And. impressive talks about responsibility. He talked about being a servant leader and just seems, well, it just seems altogether in a different category. And Trump has has, has done a late campaign Florida trip.

I mean, he had he had yeah, he was in Daytona last night where. recording this on Saturday morning. and he was at Daytona last night, Halloween morning. He had decided not to do this trip, and he had not to do several, several trips. He had tried to, worm his way out of. And then he had been pulled back, in just when he thought he was out, they pulled him back in.

So what was that about? Because it was it about the fact that the protesters now. are getting much more traction. And of course, the clips of the of the protesters. And there was a wonderful moment where there was a sudden silence. during one of Trump's speeches and someone shouted, shove your ballroom. up your fat ass! And even Trump laughed at that. Trump was taken aback. A man who never laughs. turned away from the microphone, and you could see him smiling.

And of course, that clip went viral. Everybody saw it. Not only Democrats see it, but Republicans see it. So and protesters are getting smarter. about how to capture a moment and then have it go viral. Was that one of the reasons you think that Trump has stopped. doing this, that the protests are more the protests are more effective? You know, he gets tired. I mean, I think he probably just said I just, you know, you know, let's let's not do this. I mean, this that's a that is a Trump thing that, you know, to do.

I mean, Trump does only what he wants to do. And if he decides he doesn't want to do it, it's very hard to get him to do it. It's very hard to get him to focus. I mean, you don't tell Trump what to do. And, and if he got to the point of saying, I don't want. I don't want to do this anymore, I. then you don't do it. Now, in this case, he was pressured. I mean, the entire Republican Party come and says, come on.

You know, this is every, every we're really in and every last vote situation. I mean, you have one job, Mr. President, and that's to get your base to come out and vote. We're not going to we're not you're certainly not going to change the minds. at this point of Democrats or independence or people who have become. who have, who have once voted for you and now hate you.

That is gone. But but the the hope is. that the Trump fan base, those, those those voters who are. called low propensity voters. He can come out if he holds a rally, they'll come out. I mean, whether that works or not, we don't know. But that's the thing. And he was pressured to go back and to do these, these this final swing.

Interesting. Because we remember him from 2016 going out on a on last minute campaigns. And it seemed to be effective for him there. Do you remember Hillary Clinton was hanging out with Beyonce and Trump. Remember that? Was he. Yeah. Yes. No. I mean I think that that that that probably did help. But that was 2016, which was many, many, many years ago now. Well, he was 70 then. He's eight. And he was. Yeah. And he was also running.

You know, I mean the, the history of this has, has, has been this Trump works when he's on the ballot. Trump has the opposite effect when he is not on the ballot. So. so we'll we're going to see very shortly. Well, you must have seen the contretemps with the Reuters reporter where. the Reuters reporter says to him, sir, why aren't you doing any rallies anymore? Why are you doing tele rallies? And he says you're disgusting.

Your fat look at you completely out of shape. People say I'm tired. I'm not tired. And actually, at that moment, I thought, he doesn't look at all tired. He looks kind of vigorous. But I guess that's because he was in conflict with the reporter. And he likes an enemy, and he was suddenly energized by it. Yeah. No. Anybody he can shout at insult. He's he's suddenly energized. Come. Comes alive. Yes. He said yesterday he was giving a shout out. to some of the people that go to almost every rally that he does.

The front row Joe's, one of whom unfortunately was arrested earlier this week for. for apparently having caches of. of child abuse pornography on his, on his computer. But he gave a shout out to some of the others who haven't been arrested. And he said, this is my he said he's done. since 2016, 1100 rallies.

I mean, he really is like an old entertainer. And you could imagine him. perhaps behind the curtains before he's about to go out complaining. And this works. I mean, one of the things and I remember in, in, in 2016. and then again in 2020, you, you know, the Democrats are, are, are saying, well, these, these these rallies are, you know, they don't work. This is old fashioned. This is not the way politics is done anymore. And and you know, Trump works.

even that thing in Daytona rare I mean just wandering all over. God knows what. What was he talking about? Well, he's talking about John Huston's. ass, which has become a new theme because it gets him attention. And everybody's like, oh, is he by curious? Is he finally coming out? And he's always like, I think it's not my thing. But he goes on and on about John Huston's ass. He's the senator in Ohio. He's up against he's the incumbent senator up against Sherrod Brown,

who is a Democrat. who lost his seat at the last election, but looks like he's going to come back. But he's obviously figured out that this is something that gets him attention. So he's now got a long riff about John Huston and how fit he is, you know, and we we. discussed this on the on the podcast the other the other day with me. pointing out that Donald Trump was once a handsome man. Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. A beautiful boy.

I think that I characterized him as. and with enormous blowback from, from many of our commenters who seem to be unable. to grasp that, that a man they detest. might also have been at one point in his life, quite good looking. I'm not sure we've had as much blowback on a point we've made, other than about data centers, and people. just cannot accept because they see,

the ugliness in Donald Trump. They cannot imagine that, that people find him attractive. Anyway, let's go on to, to Lauren Boebert. Lauren Boebert, another one of my long time favorites. It must be everybody's favorite. Go on. Well, Lauren Boebert, you will recall, is the, is the Congress person who found herself. in a movie theater.

How would we put this poor. poured and poor in, and might you say poor? Do you mean PAWED not POURED? Yes. That's what I mean. Yes. A public display of affection. I believed on both the part of the man she was with and on her part in, in. I emphasize public and display and,

I think otherwise it could be described as if people don't quite understand. what we're saying as enthusiastic groping in. Yes. In, in, in a, in a public place, in a movie theater. And the lights were down, but unfortunately, there was a telltale. little blue light of her vape, which she then denied when she was challenged with it. And they said, no, look, we've got it on CCTV. He was vaping and there, indeed she was vaping, so she had to apologize.

The thing I find confusing is that she represents Colorado's fourth district. I would have thought Colorado could find a more. normal candidate than Lauren Boebert. Colorado supposed to be the best place in America to live. It's always topping those lists of, you know, highest quality of life because. people cycle and there's the mountains and it's clean air and it's beautiful. Colorado is gorgeous, and yet they produce Lauren Boebert, didn't she? Correct me if I'm wrong here that didn't she shift.

Did she shift her district? Yes she did. She did she she moved district to find a more Republican one. But it doesn't look as if that's going to help her. She's challenged by. And I love all these veterans coming out, retired Navy. rear admiral and a former National Security Council. official with a real national security resumé. Very different to Mike Waltz's, And so she couldn't be more different to Lauren Boebert, whose son.

unfortunately got arrested and who seems somewhat. and one never wants to judge parenting because it's complicated. but seems somewhat of a feckless parent. and of feckless politician. No, I'm just trying to imagine that's just. That would be almost,

almost a positive election, enough. to no longer have Lauren Boebert to kick around. Well, the interesting thing was also, she wasn't at a new movie. She was at a a, I guess it was an anniversary. play of Beetlejuice. Just go figure. Lauren Boebert groping away in Beetlejuice. It's just all so grim. It's all we have. Lauren Boebert in public way to in public. Then we have, Tom Kane of the disappearing Tom Kane.

Not in public at all. He's missed he missed a hundred votes, more than a hundred votes. And, and he seems to have been in. How do we say this? Well, he's. the son of a former Republican governor of new Jersey. He was a popular governor. Popular governor. And he himself has been an,

a not too energetic, Republican congressman in new Jersey. And he apparently. And what are they? They're kind of fascinating to depression. And he went away, and he went away and away and stayed away. and then reappeared. Right. And reappeared and then said, reappeared and said, hey, I'm back, and I want and I want to still be in Congress.

I would pay no attention to the fact that I was, That that something bad happened to me and I was away for a very long time. But I'm back, and we don't want to make fun of mental health issues. Depression is real. But he managed a stock trade while he was depressed. But he was apparently active on the stock market, as they say, and he didn't tell anybody why he was awake.

Now, can can you think of any job, Michael? Imagine being a surgeon. Imagine being a banker. Imagine being a teacher where you just disappear for four months. You don't answer people's queries as to where you are, and then you pop back. as if nothing's happened and ask everybody to carry on as normal. Well, the result of this would appear to be defeat. And that seems to be what Tom Kane is headed to or headed towards.

Well, and he also has a former vet that he's now up against. Rebecca Bennett, very impressive Democrat helicopter parent. I mean literally a helicopter pilot like Mike Cheryl, who was in Congress for new Jersey and is now the governor. Really impressive. So by Tom, you're going to get more time to go and do some stock trading. You might not have as much insider information from Congress. and what they're voting on and against, although he did miss a hundred votes.

But he'll have more time to play with the market. And who knows, perhaps he was pressurized, as happens in so many families. Where you have one parent in a specific profession. and the child is sort of fall into it. And maybe Tom wanted to be a dancer. Maybe Tom wanted to be a football player. Maybe Tom wanted to be a primary school teacher. Yeah. It's very possible that politics, politics itself. has depressed on key.

What if he turns out that that's what it was? What if it was Donald Trump depressing him? Yeah. Well. Okay. Can we come on to the man that truly deserves. to lose his seat, possibly even more than Lauren Boebert? And that is Max Miller? Well, let me just ask the question. How is he still running? Why is he still running? You know why he's still running? Because Donald Trump called him and encouraged him to stay in the race. Thank you. Yes.

You know, we discussed this a great length. Max Miller, who is a so. Well, you tell the story of Max Miller's son in law of. of Senator Bernie Marino. You know, you just this is you can't make this up. So a Bernie Marino is the senator from Ohio. Actually, he's the senator who defeated, Sherwood, Sherrod Brown, Sugar Brown,

who now appears to be on his way back. to a to the Senate. John Husted ass, famously muscled ass, and Max. Miller married Bernie's daughter. So Max Miller, on top of everything else is. is, we might reasonably assume, a social climber, a climber. And so he married the senator's daughter,

became a congressman himself, and then, and then beat up the senators. daughter did all kinds of terrible things to the senator's daughter. Well, and apparently broke his two year old collarbone. Well, that's what the senator's daughter said. And matter of fact, so. So what? Whatever happened, he he got himself embroiled. in a,

in, in a, I mean, in a, in a terrible breakup and, and yet. and yet is, is is, is still the Republican, the Republican candidate for Congress. And he was an adviser to Trump sort of around 2016, has had a lot of proximity to Trump. So when he got into trouble and the Emily Marino made the accusations.

against Max Miller public, and eventually, actually. Bernie Marino came out and said, this man is not fit for for public office. I know a lot about this. And then there was the famous scenario where it turned out. that Max Miller had refused to return their daughter's cuddly toy, the cuddly toy that she has to have to go to sleep with her every night. And Bernie Marino, that was, oddly, the incident that appeared to prompt. Bernie Marino. to come out and say he's a horrible man and he shouldn't be running for office.

At which point Max Miller looks as if he couldn't quite decide what to do. Incoming call from his mentor, Donald Trump, who says, you got to fight this dude. You got to stay in and fight. So that's what Max Miller is doing. So like Ken Paxton, he is personally supported. by Donald Trump and very much looks as if he's going to lose. So all of these people and the point here is that is that these people. Max Miller, Tom Keene, Anna Paulina. Luna and Lauren Boebert.

represent the Republican Party. And. and this is just an indication, one indication of the problems they have going into this election. that the party has become peopled by. How do we describe these, these, these people. as people who clearly should not be holding public office, and maybe it's the only thing they think they can do at this point,

because they're not people that are regular. employer would likely want in their company. No. And it's it's another story. And I think, I think one of one of a theme that will that history will explore. about how how MAGA became such fertile. ground for such for opportunists who, who were unemployable anywhere else. Well, hasn't politics always been that, though?

No, I don't think so, actually. I mean, I think I think politics has been. has been a profession of largely a profession of politicians about people. who work their way up, who are people who are who are relatively serious. about their jobs, fairly, sometimes quite good at their jobs. They like they like politics. They like, they like the, the, the the politics is about is about about is about process.

is about I mean, politics in its in its best form. It's it's about it's about the complex nature of. of achieving things with many people. And, and it's not actually all that glamorous. It's not actually something that you would, you would do as, as just a,

as a headlights thing. or as a get yourself on television thing. It's a, it's a boring job. Yes. I guess I'm thinking about people who've been on the margins of politics, but now it feels like MAGA is packed with these people, or the Republican Party has become packed with these people because politics, and this is, again, a Trumpian thing, has not been, has, has diverted from being about about government itself. boring and has then become about notoriety.

and fame and. and the and the, the media attention that you can deliver to yourself. And if you do that, then you then you, at least in the past number of years, have been able to make yourself a political career and get in on the. on the. political, you know, gravy train, the money train. and then ultimately get a job on Fox, I suppose. Fox, Fox, Fox.

Well, we should talk about the fact that Fox is ratings are significantly down, which doesn't bode well, I don't think, for Donald Trump to you. Well, I mean, it's an interesting I mean, the, the star of Fox News. and this has been true for ten years on failing. Even even in the instances where where Fox is trying to has tried. to get away from this, the star of Fox News, Fox News has been Donald Trump. That's what people come to Fox News to hear about is Donald Trump.

And so in in the ratings have, have have tracked that and. and gone up and up and up actually in contrast. to the falling ratings of other cable news stations. So the fact that it is going down now, there's probably a couple. of issues that Fox might be. Finally, as of.

experiencing what other cable cable. television channels are experiencing a just drop in ratings across the board. But it may also be that their star has lost. his luster. He's lost his luster. Well, he may he he still trying to squeeze. Washington for everything he can. And his latest, ploys of course the golf course,

the public golf course where they've been frantically chopping down trees. A judge has ordered them. to stop justice raised and said, enough already. With the golf course. You've got to have a proper process here. Something that we know Trump has no interest in. He likes to act and then ask for forgiveness later. Or not even forgiveness later. But my son is particularly annoyed by this because he loves the golf course. He's been playing golf there. He lives in D.C., doesn't have the money to join.

a swanky golf course, as lots of people don't have the money to do. Loves this course, and it now looks in danger of being taken. over by Donald Trump and turned into Bedminster Light. Well, it's also just this other thing that, and I think that this is backfiring. on Trump badly in this campaign, is this determination to remake. Washington, this determination, an all advice, all legal rulings, all,

ascetic logic. to do what he wants to do with Washington, D.C.. And I think that that's, that's insulting to a lot of Americans. Well, we haven't even talked about the reflecting pool. But if you go to D.C. right now, we know tourist numbers are down. In fact, I saw one report that suggested that tourism was down by 50% in D.C. because people knew that the city was sort of under construction,

and it's some of the construction just to stop. So reflecting pool now completely paneled or from the public, you can't see it there. You certainly can't go and stare in the reflecting pool, grass damaged in all sorts of parks. Massive building works going on to the white House. So that shrouded in scaffolding after the east wing was demolished. And I think people are. It's such a physical manifestation of this overreach in Washington.

and this incompetence of this government, that they can't even get the reflecting. pool right, that that people don't want to go and see it for themselves. I can't help thinking it's. also another expression, this not wanting to go to Washington, D.C., an expression of distaste for Donald Trump. So, you know these these signs. and we'll, we'll, we'll see if they're what they mean. But Fox ratings down.

Tourism in Washington down. These are again more signs of what Donald Trump. what this this election might, might be like. And and it might be. Well there was an interesting piece in the, in the Washington. Post the other day about about the the four scenarios. in such a divided electorate, you know, in the ones in the one scenario. which, which you have the polls being pretty much accurate.

And if that's the case, then the, then the Democrats will take both the House. and the Senate creating a new world for Donald Trump or. But it being so, so close. that with just a little, a little, the polls being off in just a little, a little bit in the Republican, in the Republican direction would mean that, that.

they don't that they're, that the Senate is going to stay out of their reach. On the other hand, if they go a little off in the other direction, it will. it will be a potential blue sunamganj. that will that will change American politics for a generation. And it's not all plain sailing in the Democratic Party. I mean, we both read the piece this morning.

about the tension between Haley Stevens, who. lost out to Abdul Al Sayed. for the Democratic nomination for Senate seat in. Michigan. There are so many seats up for grabs now. I'm like, which one was it? Was it was it Iowa was in Kansas. No, no no no. Many states, Michigan so many states. And James Clyburn, hugely important person in the Democratic Party.

from South Carolina, is coming to go to church in Detroit. and has asked Haley Stevens to join him. And she put out a statement saying that Abdul El-Sayed would be joining them now. Abdul al-Sadr said he would rather Haley Stevens doesn't accompany them, and that her her fiance has said that. he cannot vote for Abdul El-Sayed because of,

an ad which focused on. the amount of money the US is allegedly spending on Israel. So I wonder what's going to happen there? Well, yeah, we all wonder. But the interesting thing, I mean, things to note here is that the. is that the Haley Stevens point of view is, is the is a pro-Israel point of view, which is which exists is still a. is still a strong.

thread in the Democratic Party as it is in the Republican Party. But it is now it is against the opposite trend also. So so this is this is one of those things on this particular issue. that, that will have. a marked influence, how this goes on the future. of the Democratic Party and especially going in into 2028.

Abdullah Al Sadd has made this thing, I mean, as as mundane in New York, made this a thing that, that, that the that the situation is in. Israel is a moral, a moral issue. should be a moral issue for the Democratic Party. And Haley Stevens essentially taking the other point of view. that the issue of Israel's should be.

a moral issue for the also should be a moral issue. in the opposite way for the Democratic Party. So, yes. And I think they they a pack a supported it. I want to say to the tune of $60 million in her primary. against Abdul El-Sayed, and he narrowly won over her. But she has been a popular congresswoman, up until recently in Michigan.

And she was an adviser to Barack Obama. She worked on restoring the car. industry, the auto industry, when it was suffering in 2008. So she has good local, practical experience on the ground in Michigan. But nevertheless, she she she is and was a terrible campaigner. Ghastly. And yeah, he's a fantastic campaign. He has so that that will be an, a former podcaster.

So he's also a performer. He knows how to rile people up. He knows how to get them engaged. I watched him at a rally this week, and he's just so comfortable. at the microphone. He's like a comedian. He just can riff very naturally, super talented at the at the microphone. So on Tuesday night, when we when we do this. until we, until we until we draw, now that'll be interesting to see. I mean, a lot of these interesting races, by the way, could go into.

they may be decided after we drop. Oh for sure. We're going to be on this on Thursday to. we may not have a result on Tuesday evening. Well no, but but we should have a result for Darlene Graham and Annie Andrews. from South Carolina. We should have a result for Susan Collins and Troy Jackson. Yeah. No, I mean, that particular seat, that Darlene seat. If Darlene goes, then then then everybody's going every night. I mean, a. lot of people are going to feel incredibly irritated that Darlene.

just inherited her brother's seat when she herself was admitted in a debate. She has no idea about national security. I actually think she's less of a litmus test. than Susan Collins. Yeah. So I, I don't first thing, I think Susan Collins will probably win in that in that race. Well, we both thoughts. Yeah. And that will tell us not too much. But the Darlene thing is in, in such a Republican state.

always has been a Republican state with, with and with then with Darlene. so intimately hooked. to Donald Trump, she exists only because of. because of Donald Trump, not even because of her brother. She exists because of Donald Trump. And so so we'll see. So, Michael, my favorite, my favorite podcast is back with a new episode. And we've got some clips of it here.

This is not supposed to be a horror. podcast, but when you're watching, it's hard to feel anything. other than horror watching it. All right, let's play the first clip, please. We've done on food reform has incredible impact. Food sales. Real food sales. Right. Real food. We talk about real food. Those sales are up close to 10% year over year. We've seen a decrease in obesity. The Secretary Kennedy talks a lot about for the first time in 40 years. I mean, is that the same knife.

I wonder that he used to chop off the raccoons. penis, the roadkill raccoon that he found, and he sliced off. the penis to investigate later and put it in the family freezer. What is that mother doing letting her child so near RFK junior with a knife? I'm hoping this is a rhetorical question. Oh, well, I was just I mean, I cannot I cannot fathom the popularity.

of these podcasts, although I will they are they are they popular? Yeah, it's a good question. I mean, there were 200 comments. and they were all like, I love RFK junior, I love RFK junior. A lot of people feel very strongly on his stance on food. This was how to make Halloween cookies. And it was with a family called the Diamandis family. Mr. Diamandis works for the Department of Health and Human Services, and there's a wonderful bit.

He's got three daughters, two of whom are absolutely adorable. And the middle daughter, Caroline, is an absolute talent. She should have her own podcast because she kept the entire conversation going. These things are so awkward. Wait a minute, wait a minute. So you said that there are two three daughters, two are adorable, and one is a dud? Is that. No, no, I'm not saying the other, but the other is. old enough to know that she's being played here. And today we have a big Halloween treat. And at the home of FDA.

Acting Commissioner Kyle. Devonte. I just love that girl. Just giving him side I the whole time. She's fantastic and the middle daughter is just she needs her own podcast. But it is so awkward watching RFK G now. I've now watched all his vodka. I mean he seems awkward. He seems like, why am I doing this? I've been forced into this. So why are all of the.

I mean, there's a whole set of of of. Trump would be Trump podcasters. that all of them seem to say, I wish I were anywhere but here. Well, he's completely unable to talk to people and that there are sort. of exchanges where they ask him things and he just doesn't follow up. He's terrible with children. The adorable middle daughter, Caroline says, you know, should should we make a ghost? And he says, let's make a cat.

I mean, he is just so unpleasant with them and it's so forced. I've never watched anything more awkward or more forced, but I urge people to watch it just to see how strange he is, because we've talked a lot about him being strange. We've talked a lot about him reintroducing measles, which I think is his biggest achievement since being the. Health and Human Services secretary. These videos show inadvertently how peculiar and unfit.

he is to do this job well. We have also talked a lot about his potential run. for the Republican nomination in 2028. So, let this be awarding. I've let this be a warning. There's nothing scarier on Halloween than the specter. of RFK junior running for 2028. Let that be your Halloween message from Michael Wolff and myself. If you have been. Thank you. Thank you for joining us this morning. This Halloween morning, go and don your costumes and get out there.

And we'll be back live on Tuesday. And a big thanks to our production team Ryan Murray, John Romero, Heather Passaro, Rachel Passa and Neil Rosenhaus. So the good news is we have so many BBC tier members now. There are too many names to read out and we really appreciate your support.