Why Melania's Epstein Bomb Is Only The Beginning | The Daily Beast Podcast Livestream

I'm Joanna Coles, this is the Daily Beast and we are doing a live. to catch up with an insane week. Who am I here with? The best editor? In town, Hugh Daugherty, who's had a haircut this week. Had a haircut. It's been a big week. Thank you to everybody for joining. I see somebody here from Scotland, my native country. Thank you very much. Ireland. Excellent. We are not here to talk about my haircut. Well, we could talk about your haircut, but we're also. here to talk about Melania's statement yesterday, which obviously gives me the opportunity to mimic her accent.

I still don't understand why the First Lady of the United States. can't speak in a voice that represents her country. It's incredible to me that she hasn't been able to have lessons. She's been here 30 years anyway. We can't talk about accents because I have an accent. You have an accent. I'm not criticizing anybody. Other accents. Rather, but this is a lot to talk about.

That isn't a it's what she said, not how she said that. Is it what she said, or is it what she didn't say? That's so for people who haven't been paying attention. And seriously, how can you possibly avoid it? Melania. Yesterday, the first lady of the United States, who was last seen standing smiling with the Easter Bunny, came out and said, well, you tell us what she said. Oh, well, she spoke for about 2.5 minutes. and she, she absolutely.

I've what I'm going to do. I'm going to set the scene a bit. Okay. So, our a brilliant white House correspondent for a Thomson. was in the white House as she is just about every day, and she and the white House reporters knew that there was a, that. there was a notice that Melania Trump was going to make a statement at 2:30 p.m. and they said, I make a statement. There's a special statement. They believed we have the whole text.

If you were, they believed that this would be. something about be based. or about Ukraine or something that was in, you know, the normal sweep. of what the what the first lady talks about even saw the right. This is really unusual. The first lady is going to make a statement. This is really unusual. Then they were told it was going to be in the grand foyer. And anybody who has seen the white House, you know, you. we often we see the press briefing room, we see the Oval Office.

The grand foyer is where big things happen. And the reporters went there. They assembled. She came in at 2:30 p.m. on the dot, walked through those doors. and she immediately. shocked them all by saying the lies linking the. with the disgraceful Jeffrey Epstein need to end today. And everybody was completely shocked that she was talking about Jeffrey Epstein. She went on to say that what has been said about her, where lies.

she said that she did not have a relationship with Jeffrey Epstein, which is, you know, a pretty jaw dropping thing to want to address. And she said that she had not met. Jeffrey, not met Donald Trump through Jeffrey Epstein. She also promoted her book, Melania which I know both of us have read. And, which, you know, contains her. account of how she met a at a party in 1998.

and she went on to say that she had never been on Epstein's plane. and that this is where it gets really consequential. And this is why what we're talking about is why this this was just lighting a fuze. There is so much more to come. She said, that Congress had to do its job. and that the victims should be interviewed under oath. And that's really that's that's the most consequential thing that she said. Because that's going to open months and maybe years of,

of Congress acting on this. So she says also in the statement, and thank you for that, because that's a very good, debrief of what she said. We still must work openly and transparently to uncover that truth. Now, her husband has done everything. to try and stop the Epstein files coming out. And of course, it's one of the few times when Congress behaved as one. And following Ro Khanna and Thomas Massie, the Republican who,

who put a finger up to Trump, the entire. basically every politician in America declared released the Epstein files. Pam Bondi did eventually release the Epstein files. But it was very much a feeling that they just dumped. absolutely everything to make it as difficult as they could for people. to find anything in the Epstein files, lots of victims names weren't redacted.

Lots of important men's names were redacted. Yes. So the idea that the first lady is calling for transparency around the victims, I mean, this seems at odds. with exactly what her husband was trying not to do. Well, what we should say is. she didn't mention her husband in the statement. In the context of speaking about of of being willing to speak, she mentioned her husband in the context of how they knew Jeffrey Epstein.

And she says, and this, you know, is perhaps insightful. into the life that Melania and Donald Trump laid beforehand. Donald and I were invited to the same parties as Epstein from time to time. I think this was just while. putting some of those pictures up on screen of those parties, because when she says they were invited to the same parties from time to time, we know that they party together.

In 2000 at Mar a Lago. Mar a Lago is owned by Donald Trump, so you can't passively. have been invited to this party. It was Donald Trump's party. And the picture pretty notoriously. also shows Ghislaine Maxwell and other pictures from that same party. Sure. Prince Andrew so. when she spoke. about her husband, she simply said this was the context in which we lived. We had overlapping social circles in New York and Palm Beach.

I know you and I, Joanna, are both in those social circles, so you might be. I'm definitely not. Definitely not in those social circles. But this is really this is really extraordinary. First of all, how out of touch right. Inflation is up. There's a war on. People are really worried about how much their bills are. And we're talking about the social scene in Palm Beach among billionaires, which is an intriguing point. But what's more important here is what does she say about her husband? She doesn't say he's innocent.

She doesn't say he's going to testify. She says, oh, we were in the same social circles. So it's not a big endorsement of her husband in this. It's not a big endorsement of her husband. And we are pretty confident they don't live together. She appears to live in New York. And of course, Anthony Scaramucci, who works for Trump, says that actually Melania Trump hates her husband. And I thought that was a very funny moment on Easter Monday when the president was. with the first lady and a child, looked at the first lady and said, who's that?

And he said, she's a movie star. She's a movie star because he wants to be married to a movie star, because it's part of his image and how he wants to present and think of himself. And of course, she's not a movie star. She appeared in a vanity documentary that Amazon paid. in total, about $70 million fo. So can I just say one thing? First of all, I can't crawl inside Donald Trump's head. But we know somebody who does. And I know in the comments.

there's a fair few people are saying, why are you speaking to me? Where's Michael Wolff? Well, we'll be speaking to Michael Wolff tomorrow. We have our next episode of Inside Trump's Head on Saturday. And of course, Michael has his case against the First lady. He's bringing an anti-SLAPP suit against us, so we will be talking to him about that and where the case is. And he's got interesting things to say about it. But I think behind that question is also the question of. why did the First lady deliver this statement yesterday? Why now? Why is she bringing this up now?

She could have talked about it in her documentary, which she chose not to do, but there was no one apart from the director, Brett Ratner, stopping her from talking about this. And it's very interesting, her first line of the statement, I have never been legally accused. or convicted of a crime in connection with Epstein's sex trafficking, abuse of minors, and other repulsive behavior. I think I know someone who has been accused of repulsive.

Well, at the moment. you're dividing the comments, Joanna, by the way, with that accent. Oh, I am, I'm sorry, but it appears, I think it's fair to say there is an equal number of people. who are, for the accent, an equal number against. Okay, well, TV a f says my accent. Hilarious. So thank you. I'm on that side. And also put your put your questions in the call. Yes. We want your we want your questions. So you're right. She didn't address it in the documentary. I know she says that it should be addressed.

under oath in Congress by the victims. And that's really one of the things that is incredibly divisive about this, and is incredibly interesting about what's going to happen next. Okay, before you say that, let's just play a clip. Oh, let's hear the real accent. Let's hear the real accent. And then you can, I would like to say that my accent is kind of caricature of an accent. It's not supposed to be accurate.

To be clear, I never had a relationship with Epstein. or his accomplice, Maxwell. My email reply to Maxwell. cannot be characterized as anything more. than casual correspondence.

Thank you. Drew up. Oh, that was my idea. Oh. Hahaha. So she's really. I mean, first of all, we've seen her emails to Glenn Maxwell. We've seen the photos. She at one point says that the photos are I, but the photos. we've seen are from Mar-A-Lago and we're in circulation before. Anybody ever heard of a one? As Linda McMahon, the education secretary, referred to artificial intelligence.

that makes you feel hopeful about the education for America's children. And she thought it was a meat sauce. Anyway, coming back to Melania, why did she make this statement? Well, Hugh, that's the question. Everybody wants to know the answer to this. Everybody. And I said Father. Thomson was in there watching with a lot of other white House reporters. They were absolutely shocked. And then why why would why would you address this? The, the you know, the white House has been under huge pressure.

because of the war, because of a war of choice in Iran. It's been under huge pressure on prices. It's under pressure again today on prices with inflation hitting a four year high. But the most toxic thing is Epstein, the most consequential scandal of this administration has been Epstein. It's like a sort of like, bring it up Watergate. It's yeah, it's it's ever expanding and I think. we know that some people in the white House were confident that had been kind of.

put on the back burner, maybe had gone away a bit, and that they could breathe a mega psi of relief. because it also splits the MAGA movement. So here it is. It's exploded out into the open. And it's not just somebody else, it's Melania herself who's exposed it. So why? I will be honest. We do not know the answers. I'm going to offer some theories that have been floated. that are very, you know, have persuasive elements. And the first theory I'm going to create. Oh, sorry.

Before we do that, I just wanted to point out that Donald Trump told a reporter Ms.. Now that he didn't know that Melania. was going to deliver this, he's in the middle as well. As almost everybody is. pointed out, he appears to have put himself. in a very tight corner over the war with Iran. The only advantage of the war in Iran appears. to be that it stops people talking about Epstein. And here is his wife pulling him back to a story.

that his dog to his present didn't see. That has lost him an attorney general. and must be a source of enormous conflict. in their whatever their relationship of a marriage is. And they appear to have their own. You know, it doesn't appear to be as lots of other marriages, and certainly lots of lots of other first marriages, but it must be a source of enormous conflict between the two of them.

that Trump has appeared in the Epstein Files as many times. as he has, more times than Harry Potter in the Harry Potter books than Lord. And he is very good people. So obviously we there must be some sort of conflict. She is incredibly sensitive about any mention of Epstein. We know that, David Rothkopf, a brilliant columnist, brilliant chief global affairs columnist, says the only.

logical reason and I say go in the Daily Beast website, read this piece. It's brilliant. And the only logical reason can be. that this is to distract from the mess that is Iran. He also says there is another possibility. that Trump is so out of it that he doesn't know what is going on. The Trump knew. Trump must have known that Melania was going to do something. We knew that Melania was going to do something. because her team put it out the previous day, right?

It was it was in the diary, right? It was on the official white House diary. when he was phoned up by Ms.. No. Reporter. He said, I'm very busy. I'm in the middle of a war meeting. But he was still able to talk, you know, and he said, I didn't know I was blindsided. And they said he was blindsided. So other sources have said he didn't know he had a heads up. What? Quite what that means a heads up, unclear. But let's just take this back a moment. and say, is this to his advantage?

And it doesn't look like it. Nobody. Trump has never won anything out of Epstein. Interesting. So do you think she's done it deliberately, or do you think. I mean, a lot of people are saying in the comments. and there are some brilliant comments, actually. I wish I could read them all. They're moving and they are moving so fast. I'll just say right now there's a fantastic one here from. Kirsten Ray. Simmons and saying, yeah, Putin doesn't bother to speak English.

So why does Melania bother? There's some very, very funny comments on Putin's fluent in English, and. apparently he doesn't speak it in public because his accent so weird. Oh fuck, that sounds high pitched, but we know he speaks it right. And also, I wish this is from Skylark Jones. I wish Melania, in her announcement, had said she wants the rest of the Epstein. files released, but surely it must be also incredibly unusual. Maybe this is the first time ever, because goodness knows.

this is an administration where they break all norms. That the first lady has basically told. Congress to actually do something, right. I mean, this I call on Congress to provide the women who've been victimized. by Epstein with a public hearing specifically centered around. the survivors and her obsession with getting at the truth. Then and only then, will we have the truth. Well, she must have a sense of what the truth is. Well, I think it's really important to see.

lots of Democrats have already been have you know, we know that Democrats and Thomas Massie particularly, and other members of Congress, Nancy Mace, for example, who's very much a maverick. MAGA figure, has been desperately has been really frantically. getting people in front of Congress, getting them to go under oath. and asking them what went on and what they knew. The survivors have had their voices heard by. by the by the, you know, the committee that's looking at Congress to some extent,

there are many of them who say, hold on a minute. Yes, we want to have our voices help, but this is a diversion. because the people who can answer the questions. are not the people that this happened to, but the people who were around. Epstein knew what was happening, understood his activities, and can answer questions on that. And that's where this comes back to. But who? Who is the person who's mentioned in the Epstein files? Apart from Jeffrey Epstein, it's Donald Trump. So do you think she wants Donald Trump to be interviewed?

I mean, she does say now is the time for Congress to act. Epstein was not alone. A really telling line, because we know her husband. was Epstein's best friend for at least ten years. Several prominent male executives resigned from their powerful positions. after this matter became widely politicized. Right. So it sounds like she's asking for Congress to talk to her husband. It does. And I think here's here's the big danger.

We we think reasonably at the moment that it's very unlikely. that the Republicans maintain a majority in the House. after the after the elections, January 3rd is going to come. The Democrats are going to be in charge, and they have power of subpoena. Who are they going to subpoena? We know already that they are talking about Melania. And if they subpoena Melania to speak. about what she knew about Epstein, she's opened herself up, first of all, by making this. statement, she obviously knew she she must know more than she said.

How do you formulate this statement? It's not it's not a complete list of everything she knew. So she's opened her up, opens herself up, the logical person. And they have said this over and over again. The person they want to hear from is Donald Trump, Donald Trump and all. And also we should hear from Melania Trump because she was a model. and so much of this was about the modeling agencies. And on Sunday we had on the podcast. And if you haven't seen it, I really urge you to watch it, because it's a very moving interview with Stacy Williams and Carrie Otis.

Well, Carrie Otis is still a model. Stacy left the business long time ago just out of disgust, I think. But listening. to them talking about the levels of sexual abuse. that the models experienced from the model. agency owners and the complicity of the agents. within the agencies and the bookers from all sorts of brands. And the abuse of the women that just went unspoken.

and the humiliations they experienced in the hands. of these so-called high level fashion photographers. Is, is really shocking. And it's hard not to think that Melania wouldn't. have seen that if she hadn't experienced it. Now, she wasn't a top model. She was really a catalog model. She never quite made it to the level, certainly, that Stacy Williams, ditto. Carrie Otis, both of whom were incredible supermodels in their day. And Stacy was in, you know, on, on the,

did I think eight consecutive, Sports Illustrated, which really was the kind of, singer qua non of of modeling engagements. And Carrie Otis was just the face for so many kind of brands. But even they experienced this. And Carrie Otis talks about being trafficked. and that Gerald Marie, who owned the agency. that she was working for, they took her passport. They charged her for the accommodation that she was staying in.

He repeatedly abused her and she was 17 and didn't. really understand and sort of thought, this must be what modeling is like. And then her book is her behavior spun out of control as it would do. But, you know, Stacy talks about what it was like going for dinner. with Patrick Demarchelier, probably one of the most, if not the most respected fashion photographer of his time. And then him going around the table at dinner with a load of young models.

and asking them to describe their underwear to him, and him behaving in this horrible, lecherous, grotesque, predatory way which was clearly very prominent in the business. So I would love to know from Melania what. what she experienced in, in that business. And how I mean, there have been so many questions. about her own visa that she came here on what's known as the Einstein visa. You know, as a person of, exceptional merit.

So which I think the sooner she appears. in front of Congress and talks about her experience modeling, the better. So this is where, again, it's going to get fascinating because somebody who knows everything. about how she got here and what happened next is a man called Pogos. Purely on Pogos, Paul has said he will testify in front of Congress about his knowledge. So he was an employee is a model. Is was a model agent?

Yeah. Had his own modeling. I just want modeling agency. And he found Melania. scouted, I believe is the term right out of just the voters as a term. Scouted Melania in. 1996, brought her to New York, and it was a party that he was holding. at the Kit Kat Club, at which Melania says she first met Donald Trump. And in her book, she describes somebody who is clearly poll was, introducing Donald, her and Donald Trump.

And then they become an item. They become a couple, they get married. She becomes first lady of this short version, which shouldn't in almost. any other circumstances be an incredible fairytale. Yes. And yet keep this picture on the screen. Sorry. Just. Right. Nope. Okay. Yeah. It's a fascinating picture. The pose. Polly is the man on the right of that picture. He's Italian born. He has been an ambassador since 2011. Not for the United States or for Italy, but for the country of Dominica.

Which allowed. him to to call himself ambassador. The woman who is the other woman who is in the picture is called Amanda. And garu, she is a Brazilian model with whom Po was. until we had a long relationship and had a child. There's been a huge amount of discussion about her online today, and some of this we're able to verify. So I'm just going to stick to what we know. and what we have constantly at The Daily Beast reported and are reporting on. Right. Amanda and Garu is in the Epstein files because her testimony.

about being brought on the Lolita Express. from Paris age 17, is in there. And she described this book by Jeffrey Epstein. Well, she was brought on Jeffrey Epstein's plane by POA was, poorly. and posed, poorly. Put her on the plane. Also on the plane, she says, were 14 and 15 year. old girls, she believes 14 and 15 year old girls. who really did not appear to ha to be professional models.

And this was in 2002. This is absolutely when Jeffrey Epstein was, we know, committing crimes of which one of which he had actually pled. guilty to, but, you know, committing multiple crimes in plain sight. So her testimony is obviously fascinating. We want. everybody would want to hear somebody who says she was on the Goleta Express, but she went on to have a relationship. And a child with Paul was on. She was 17. He was 32.

He knew Jeffrey Epstein. He is in the Epstein files. He communicated with Epstein, his assistant forwarded emails to Epstein. They were and they tried to go into business together to buy elite models. Paul was Paulie's testimony is going to be fascinating. He also has a long connection. to Donald Trump, not just introducing Melania and Donald Trump at a party. This was not a random thing. He worked for Donald Trump. He was in business with Donald Trump. I know he has a special I'm good.

I'm going to mangle his title, but I believe he is a special representative. of Donald Trump around the world. He is a constant presence over time at Mar-A-Lago. And here's why this picture is so interesting. This picture is from the first. Donald Trump inauguration where Paul was, Paulie. and Amanda and Carol were on the same table as Melania Trump. They were guests of honor. They are incredibly close friends. He is willing to speak under oath.

What is he going to say? Well, what is Amanda been saying? Because Amanda has also had her own story. And Paolo Sampaoli and Amanda and Gary are no longer together, right? This is where it really gets interesting. They are not together and she has been deported or she she deport. She removed herself, but she was detained by Ice. She allegedly. had overstayed a visa and as well as being detained by Ice,

she was involved in a very bitter custody dispute over this. No teenage, child. I believe a son with Paul was, poorly. She is now, and in her native Brazil, where she has given. an interview to a global. I'm sort of mangled again as pronunciation. If only I could speak the Brazilian accent. I unfortunately only do Scottish, but, she has spoken to a global, and she hasn't said anything about Trump or. But Melania. But there's every belief that she has a long term knowledge of Melania Trump.

She has a long term friendship with Melania Trump. We have little doubt about that. There are photographs of them together. Pose on public. Put these photographs on his Instagram. Happy New Year message, I believe in 2022. with that picture that we just had up on screen. So why would Amanda and Carol not testify? She may not technically be a victim in Melania's definition, we don't know. She hasn't suggested. that she was a victim of Jeffrey Epstein, but she was an unlovely to express.

She was then in this modeling world. with one of Jeffrey Epstein's business associates. Polo was an Pooley, and then she was in the same world. The Trumps. This is going to be fascinating. Get her under oath. Why not? Why would the Democrats not do that? Democrats, are you listening to who you talk to? Because Amanda and Gary would have incredible, incredible color. to add to this, investigation over the Epstein files.

Is she allowed to come back if she self deported. because she has allegedly overstayed on her visa? Is she allowed to come back? But. And also, how did she come to Self-deport? I think the simple answer is that she was in custody and chose to leave. Do we know why she was in ice custody? We. Well, we know that it is alleged that she had no valid permission. to stay in the country. She has said that she was in the process of applying for a green card. And given that she had a U.S.

citizen child and a relationship. with a former relationship with Poe was, poorly, then it would. pretty much have been a slam dunk in normal immigration terms. Obviously, we're talking about immigration under the egis of Stephen Miller and, Ice Barbie. So I think she may have chosen to go. Could she come back? I mean, it surely is within the power of Congress. to ask witnesses to come and testify. It would certainly be eyebrow raising if she was not granted,

if she was asked and not granted permission. Well, perhaps she could testify. She can testify remotely. You know, the January 6th committee took Ivanka Trump, Ivanka Trump's testimony remotely. So why not take it from Brazil? And when is. Paolo's, police supposed to give him, well, evidence? He he volunteered this yesterday. The immediate aftermath of the Melania statement. And we haven't heard yet from the Republicans who lead the.

the oversight committee investigation into the Epstein files. To to set a date. Clearly, if they don't set a date. Right, you know, the Democrats aren't going to be waiting for that 1st January the 3rd. But but they get a gavel. It's incredible to me. that they could have persuaded or basically the Clintons had no choice. They actually get the Clintons to give evidence. And yet Paolo's and Polly hasn't yet given evidence. Donald Trump hasn't yet given evidence.

Melania Trump hasn't yet given evidence. Yes. And this this hangs over it, Hillary Clinton, but an incredibly robust session, with them answered every question that was asked of her. And they may not have liked those answers, but she had a glancing. acquaintance is a strong word with Jeffrey Epstein. He was at this on the on the fringes of the Clinton Global Initiative. Her husband obviously had a lot more to say, but her husband.

presence in the Epstein files is minimal compared to the presence of Donald Trump. Sorry, Clinton isn't as in the Epstein files and quote marks, because Jeffrey Epstein was fascinated by the figures of public life. There's no direct communication of correspondence. There's absolutely no suggestion that they may have discussed. They may have they may have spoken briefly. We know there's a picture of them shaking hands, but there's nothing beyond that. But Melania Trump parted with Jeffrey Epstein.

in 2000 at Mar-A-Lago with Ghislaine Maxwell. She emailed G, who called her sweet pea. There's so much more to be caught at right now. The whole thing is absolutely sort of fascinating, actually. I'm just going to say, for people who have joined us. Yeah, many of you are wondering, where's Michael Wolff? I know I said to some of you know this already, but Michael Wolff. is going to be with Joanna. Yeah, we'll be doing our regular episode of Inside Trump's Head tomorrow. It'll be on YouTube at 2 p.m. and wherever else you get your podcasts later in the evening.

I am not pretending to be team with Michael Wolff. To be clear. No, no. Well, I'm, I'm we're we're we're debriefing Melania's statement, but. but a lot of people are saying online. this looks like a lawyer has written this for her. Yeah. And it's it's possibly defensive. And she's she's trying to get out ahead of something. Well that's exactly everybody is speculating. This is the front running is the there's the phrase in DC. We are not aware of anything, but.

there are all the hallmarks here. of some lawyerly approach to something. She spoke about fake images. I'll just be honest. I'm not really aware that there are a huge number of fake images circulating. People are going to put in the chat and offering where to find them, but, well aware of that. I've seen loads of other fake images as I up time. I see them on Truth Social from from her husband, but. fake images of her with absolutely no real images of her.

With that I've seen. Yes, a framed picture of Jeffrey Epstein and Melania in at the time. Canals in in the, a framed picture in the day on the desk in his home. in his Upper East Side townhouse. See, not but fake images. Don't know. So, yes, it sounds like front running as it's called in DC. Front running. Okay, so let's just do a final, a final portion, of this on or I should say we have notes.

That's the framed picture that we have a post screen, right, right. And, I don't know what this says about a but Jeffrey Epstein, that's the same photo. that became famous because, in fact, it's got Donald Trump and Glenn Maxwell. Right. But he cropped them out, right? No, no, the whole thing is sort of fascinating. and very strange for her to say that she didn't know them and she didn't. have a relationship with them when there's evidence that that she did. But I should highlight a couple people saying, Was Melania blinking in.

Morse code? We are going to go back and go frame by frame. I personally, I do you have do we is there anybody in the comments. who can comment translate Slovenian Morse code? That's very funny. I've written a little piece about her today on Substack. Just saying that. She's basically, it feels like she's in the witness protection program. Right. And then every now and then she comes out and, she's allowed to say something and then she goes back. But it seems that she blindsided Aspen yesterday, and it would be a crazy.

turn of events if he essentially decided to bomb. Iran when he did, to distract from the Epstein files. And now she's made her statement. about the Epstein files to distract from the war in Iran. I can't quite believe that there that that that that cynical, but the extraordinary truth is stranger than fiction. Yes. And if anybody had said and this just goes back.

to the people that were standing, going, I can't believe what I. You were the reporters were in the grand foyer. saying to each other, I can't believe she just did that. I don't understand why. And we we had some discussion off line, with my colleagues in DC and, you know, a couple of friends. When's the last time that there was a statement in the white House. that nobody had any clue when the person started speaking. what they were going to see and that it was a bombshell. And usually just, you know, to put this in context. And, John, you and I both have the experience of this.

The white House is going to make a statement. There are rumblings beforehand. Officials kind of whisper about what it's about. We know that it's going to be in this direction. We may not know the words, but we know they're going to address something. Or it's just so obvious. from everything that's happening that has got to be about this. The only time that we can find that. myself, David Gardner Thomson, through your ways are my colleagues in DC. The only parallel we can find. for a statement that the person said, I'm going to make a statement,

walked out and then shocked. Everybody is 2011 when when Barack Obama. revealed the death, the capture and death of Osama bin laden. Yeah. Which, of course, was the day after the white House correspondents, which made me think that Donald Trump, because he's supposed to be going. to the white House correspondents this year, will try and trump Obama. by doing some kind of, of huge thing. So the thing that I also find interesting is that she says, my attorneys and I have fought these unfounded and baseless lies.

She's obviously been talking to her attorneys. in putting this statement together. So, again, puzzling that Donald Trump, the president, didn't know that his wife, the movie star, was going to come out and and talk like this. So this is a separate conversation. She appears to have been having with her lawyers. They put this statement together. Weird that he doesn't know about it all said he didn't.

So historically she has shared. attorneys with her husband. She has previously taken legal action against the Daily Mail. and to use Charles Harter, who's a prominent actor, defamation attorney, and the. you know, it was the same, you know, it was done. It was done from on. Melania Trump, I should say. The Daily Beast has been on the receiving end of letters from her attorney. Brittle.

The brittle firm down. Alejandro. Indeed. Alejandro. I again apologize for my pronunciation. But Scottish ones I'm great on. But. she said attorneys. We don't know what tourneys she is using. We do not know what's going on, but yet how would he not know. if conventionally it has been his attorneys that are involved? There are a lot of unanswered questions. And all of these, by the way, if she's under oath, that's that's a context where you have to answer.

Well, she seems determined to find truth. So we will hear from my will. More on this tomorrow. Just like his own separate case. Yes. He's suing the first lady. The first time anyone has sued a first lady. So he will bring us up to speed with that. And whether or not I don't know there's any developments in that case. which may also have provoked her to come out and speak. But Michael will be sharing that with us tomorrow. So let's just figure out what's going on in Pakistan right now.

We know that JD Vance has been handed what is frankly, a poisoned chalice, to try and figure out. some kind of ceasefire slash peace deal. What's the latest that we're hearing? So as we are speaking, JD Vance is in the air. There's already there's already tensions here. The Iranian delegation has arrived. First, and who even are the Iranian delegation at this point?

Yes, that's a good, good point. Which you want. Would you want to be the Iranian delegation they got on a plane? That kind of seems brave, but I think I would have gone by donkey. Yes. So I'll do this remote, right? I would have done it on a remote from deep, deep, deep and a very deep, deep. So the Iranian delegation have already arrived. Wyckoff, Steve Wyckoff and, Jared Kushner are on their way as well, though there's a whole problem here.

Who's in charge? There's a big question for the American delegation. Is JD Vance leading it? Okay, he's the vice president. But we know truthfully that Wyckoff. and, Kushner are far closer to Donald Trump on this. Donald Trump. has already been pretty public that JD Vance didn't really back his war. quite as much as he would have liked to, but then he forced them into it anyway. And he, we assume, has been sent because he is willing to close a deal on. better or better terms, but on the fastest possible terms he can,

because he JD Vance, doesn't benefit from an Iran war for his 2028 run. If that's what's going to happen, what is the interest of Wyckoff and, Kushner. and these three people are going to have to get together and negotiate. with the Iranians that a lot of people have been pointing out. And I think David Rothkopf will be with us with you on Monday, I imagine. have quite a bit to say about this, because the negotiations be underway. But the Iranians have years, decades of experience in negotiating.

deals and, quote marks and those who do them. John Kerry, for example, was en masse know last night. that these are really, really tough people to negotiate with. They are incredibly prepared. They know the American weaknesses. They know what the difficulties are. And, you know, frankly, they're going to try and fracture the negotiator, the negotiating team. They're going to put up roadblocks to everything.

And let's be honest, the other what sounds like this, they have closed the Strait of Hormuz. One oil tanker is now dark in Iran. One oil tanker went through it to day one. And normally it's 100 that go through it. The Strait of Hormuz is effectively closed. And what seems remarkable is that we started this bombing campaign assuming that, s strength. was going to be the determinant factor. And yet the Strait of Hormuz,

what seems incomprehensible and. and we're hearing a lot from people in. in the comments on here and in our regular Daily Beast podcast comment. How was this not anticipated? Because as Ben Sherwood, our partner at The Daily Beast, is always saying, you know, when you are red teaming world events, the Strait of Hormuz is often. used as as a possible sort of starter. match for World War three because,

you know, 20% of the world's oil goes through it. Yes. I should just point out, by the way, that, quite rightly, one of our commenters. pointed out. the Iranian delegation was escorted by Pakistanis by the Pakistani Air Force. So maybe that would make you less nervous, right? I still, I don't know, but yes, this is it's kind of incredible. We didn't really. you know, we didn't really know if the Strait of Hormuz. could be closed by Iran before this war happened. Well, no, we do. And it wasn't the answer that anybody would have wanted.

And we know as well, David Gardner, our, DC bureau. chief, spoke to intelligence sources this week, and they said that. they all knew that the Strait of Hormuz was a serious risk. But Donald Trump ignored that risk. Pu Pu put it aside because he believed that the Iranian people would rise up, and he believed that they would, in fact, be helped rise up because. the CIA had sent guns to the Kurds, the ethnic group in the north of Iran,

and that these guns, they believed, would then be sent on to the protesters. Iran wracked by protests before this war, 40,000, as many as 40,000 have been killed by the Iranian regime. Is this these are not good people. And the belief that Donald Trump had formed. was that it was an absolute certainty that this newly armed, populace would rise up and overthrow the Iranian regime. This didn't happen. This land includes the straits, the street of the Strait of Hormuz,

which I consistently say wrong. Apologies. They've closed the Strait of Hormuz. JD Vance is going to land with the Strait closed, with Iran probably saying, well, it's not really US built mines there. It's very dangerous. By the way, can you pay us in Bitcoin. And at the same time, Iranian, proxy groups in Iraq. are attacking the US embassy, something that has been. under Under-covered. I think there have been attacks on the US embassy.

It has been under-covered. There was as we know, there was an American journalist who kidnaped by an Iranian linked group. She has thankfully been freed. But there is all sorts of kinetic action, as the military call it, going on. And J.D. Vance has to strike a deal, and he has to strike it fast because his boss needs this to go away. And what I find interesting is that Donald Trump thinks of himself. and presents himself and presented himself to the American people. as a not being interested in foreign wars, but B as the great dealmaker.

Yes. Now, JD Vance does not have experience in making deals. He doesn't have experience in being a politician. He spent two years in the Senate before he got chosen to be vice president, on the advice of Don junior. So Donald Trump has sent him to do. what he knows is probably an impossible task. He knows that JD Vance wasn't for the war. And in fact, in the excerpt from the upcoming Haberman and Jonathan. Swan book called Regime Change, JD Vance appears certain.

And we don't know this, but he yet. it appears that he was one of the sources for it because as they're sitting around. the table discussing whether or not they should go to war, almost. everybody is sort of saying, well, be careful, but we support you, Mr. President. And and JD Vance says, well, actually, I'm not in favor of it, but I will support you if this is what you want. So it feels as if in his strange, perverse way, Donald. Trump has sent him to do the impossible because he wants him to fail. Yes.

I think that's something Michael Wolf has mentioned repeatedly. And I know, you know, I'm I'm no expert on the skill of Michael Wolf, but Donald Trump has consistently. killed off people who he thinks might rise to the top. He you know, we know what happened with Mike pence. He literally had calls of hand. Mike, Mike Pence on January the 6th, a man. who'd been so loyal to Donald Trump.

when you knew there must have been moments when he was just a rake. I mean, he was a right wing Republican, let's not forget that. But he was essentially an institutionalist. He was an institutionalist, an ideological, true believer. He thought, I think it's fair to surmise that. Donald Trump was going to achieve the goals that he wanted. Mike Pence wanted a pro-life, you know, anti-abortion, anti-choice, right? Federal government. He wanted conservative justices on the Supreme Court. He wanted probably to reduce taxes, although, you know, that didn't.

quite happen on the Trump one. But he thought that Trump was going to help. the conservative movement as he saw it, achieve those aims. So fast forward JD to JD Vance. JD Vance. didn't see any of that beforehand, but he quickly recently, relatively recently. got into bed with the biker movement and with Donald Trump. and rose to be vice president. But Donald Trump does not like people competing with them. Well, and he also, I think, remembers. that that JD Vance called Trump America's Hitler.

Yeah, he he said he was heroin for the masses and in a weird federal way. in that reptilian brain of his, you know, that Trump hasn't forgotten that. And he sent JD Vance to Pakistan to do the impossible. Yes. And I think it I we can't predict what's possible and what is impossible here. What we can, I think very safely predict is that the Iranians. are going to tighten the noose. on Hormuz, on the Strait of Hormuz whenever they need to.

And there were dreadful figures this morning about inflation, consumer price index 3.3% year over year. That's the highest it's been in four years. Inflation is what drive what drove people. in many analysis to to vote previously for Donald Trump. And it hasn't been solved. And this is making it worse. What I think. this how does this tie back to to Melania. Is. if that's the problem and Melania's distraction that's not a good answer.

Look over here. There's a bigger explosion isn't really how you stop people. looking at the first explosion and thinking things are okay. They're not okay. They're not okay. All right. Well, I've loved talking to you. We're going to try and do this most Fridays, every Friday, if we can use. I'm going to bring on my accent. Your accent is perfect. You don't need to do anything. I'm concerned you are going to continue to divide. Continue to divide people over accents.

I think the movie I think it's a majority actually, I think it's majority. And I like your accent. Well strata various who's two seven, one eight says my hate. My wife hates the use of the accent. I don't mind you mocking her at all. One of the few differences we have stay together. I don't want you to break. We don't need another divided household accent. I'm really only doing it for you know, I do it to bring some levity. to what is actually an incredibly serious situation.

It's really is it really is this. We're talking about a thousand women who were victimized by. Jeffrey Epstein, who haven't had their day in court. It's an incredibly serious situation. Many of their names were not redacted in the dump of the Epstein files. It's already claimed one attorney general. I'm pretty sure it will claim another. This is the story that will not leave Trump alone. And in an unforeseen, you know, gobsmacking development, his wife has drawn.

attention to the scandal that is dogging her husband. and saying the victims must appear before Congress and tell. I'll just finish with one thought, which is the last time we did. a live stream. Joanna, a couple weeks ago, and we were talking about. one particular story that that's come out of Epstein, which is that Trump was accused by a 13 year old. or or accused by somebody of raping them when they were 13.

And that has been vehemently denied, I should say, by the white House. But by the definition of. victim, this, this person, this, this poor woman has received a settlement. from the Epstein estate on the basis that she that she claimed it's. I'm I'm using the word claims. I think that's unfortunate. She she testified that she had been sexually abused by Jeffrey Epstein.

She is an Epstein victim. By the standards that Melania applies. You should be testifying to Congress. And she was interviewed by the FBI for a separate case. She was and key elements of her account have been corroborated. Other parts have not. So, you know, we we we do not have the facts to make a judgment. about whether this is true or not, but. this is an Epstein victim, her her attorney,

Lisa Bloom, who's a famous, slightly controversial figure, but a very famous attorney, has said that she wants this. She wants Donald Trump under oath. She wants other people under oath. This, this, this is not a woman. This woman could go under oath in front of Congress. If that's what happens because of Melania. And she would be asked about her accusations against Donald Trump. when she was 13. That would be an explosive, explosive, scandal in its own right.

That's only one of 1000 of these awful stories. So why haven't Congress called her yet? Well, I think the simple answer is that the Republicans are in charge. And until the Democrats are in charge, the Republicans are obviously. not going to do something that is problematic for Donald Trump. There's a there's a skirmish in this battle. happening already, as we know about Pam Bondi. She was due to testify on April the of course, April the 14th.

I might have got my dates like it's this upcoming week. Yes. She was supposed to testify and she trying to get. Or the Trump administration is trying to get out of it. by saying, oh, she's no longer attorney general. The Democrats are furious. Republicans on this committee are furious. Nancy Mace is among those who has said she must come and testify. We haven't heard from James Comer, who's got the power because he chairs the committee. That's this is, you know, a taster of the difficulties.

that are going to come if the the point of which Democrats want to see, we want to hear from the woman who made the accusations. about what may have happened to her when she was 13, what about all the FBI agents who interviewed her? These are people that the Democrats can see they want to hear from. They don't have control at the moment. The Republicans really don't want to harm Donald Trump. All bets are off if the Democrats flip the House. I wonder if the Republicans do in some way, however, want to harm Donald Trump. I mean, what you're beginning to see now is the Republican resistance to the war.

Right now, a lot of, a lot of the ones that have spoken out are not necessarily Congress people. Marjorie Taylor Greene we saw left Congress, but so many people in the MAGA. base are now saying this war is not on us. Why did you start this war? This war is a big mistake. Iran was not a threat. We said that. Well, Donald Trump said he'd obliterated their nuclear facilities. last last summer when they ran the, when they ran the bombing campaign. Then anyway, here it's just it's amazing, a remarkable development.

And where only one year. And what is it, three months into a four year term for four years, four years? But we have the midterms in November, so that may change. the the balance of power. What I'm looking forward to is hearing. you speak to Michael Wolf tomorrow. Tomorrow. I'm looking forward to it. To Michael Wolff always brings something unexpected to the table. And of course, here's, as we know, the first person to have see the first lady.

Yes, this is all unprecedented. I want to say, thank you to everybody in the comments, amazing comments. And can I just Lisa and I just so funny. It's caused one thing. Many of you are debating my accent quite rightly. I am from Glasgow. Hope that settles at Glasgow School. Nothing wrong with Fife by the way. For those who thought I was from there, I. in fact started my journalism career there. But, that's that's. an easy to settle debate about accents.

The debate about whether Joanna, you should be doing accents. harder to debate or harder to debate, but I do it to try and bring levity to. what is an incredibly serious, it's gallows humor, in a way, and I think we should end on Pat mic 92916 saying, I really like how Joanna and Hugh discuss the topics. They show us their reflections based on information they have gathered. Yes, that's what we try to do. Thank you for joining us. Join us next Friday. when we try to unpack what we're sure is going to be another crazy week.

It's the one thing we can be guaranteed I can't wait. Thank you, Joanna, for coming. Oh my God, I just need to sleep. Hugh. I just need a weekend of sleep. Thank you for joining us. Have a fantastic weekend. Don't forget to join me and Michael Wolf for our next episode. of Inside Trump's Head tomorrow, 2 p.m. on YouTube. And I think 10:00 or.