What Generals Really Say About Trump and Hegseth | The Daily Beast Podcast

The guy who is the least qualified secretary. of defense in our history, and they're going to lecture. the career leaders of our military at this particular moment. I can tell you, I've spoken to a bunch of generals and admirals and people close to them, and I can tell you it is not going down well. So having a pep rally in Virginia, led by a couple of nitwits, is not what the United States government or the United States. military needs right now.

Welcome to the Daily Beast podcast. I'm Hugh Daugherty. I'm executive editor of The Daily Beast, and I'm filling the seat for Joanna Coles. If you are a returning subscriber. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being with us. Thank you for your comments. We love to see them and they help us shape our future interviews. If you're a member, a big thanks to you. It couldn't be easier to join. Just go to join on our YouTube channel and you will see the amazing perks you get.

One of those amazing perks! I will be in the comments later to translate for people. who can't understand my Scottish accent. And if. if you if if you are among those people, I do apologize. I've done my best and even Stephen Miller cannot make me change it. It is our absolute privilege to be joined this morning. But David Rothkopf David is The Daily Beast's absolutely unmissable columnist. He served in the Clinton administration. He edited Foreign Policy magazine, and he is now.

and the supremo of the Deep State radio Network, for podcasts. And he is the guru on everything that is happening in our political life. in DC and beyond. David. Good morning. I can see that you are neither slumped over your golf buggy. or patrolling the streets of Chicago in Carmel. It is our pleasure to have you. Well, it's a pleasure to be here. I don't understand anything you're saying because I don't have translation. to Scottish.

But I will try to make my way through this anyway. Tim, Apple's new headphones are going to have that feature, I am told, which. No no I yeah not I have the I have I ordered them here see I have them. I just haven't set it up to translate. It's it's a very specific translation. And they are they are seeking the, the. they will need to get you know my permission for obviously. I want to start with something that's happening very close to you, actually in Quantico at the Marine Corps University.

That's where Pete Hegseth has summoned more than 800, generals. So every every one, two, three, four star general in the Marine. Corps, in the Army and the Air Force, every every Navy admiral. and all the top enlisted members of each of those branches. have all been summoned for, what apparently is just a pep talk. And as we learned over the weekend, a course. Guess who wants to get in on the pep talk one Donald J. Trump. Because no event is incomplete without them.

I'll just say this if you are, you know, one of the greatest, most informed, most knowledgeable people in national security. I'll just start with the really basic question. Is this a good idea? That's a leading question. Of course it's not a good idea. It's not a good idea on several levels. You know, on one level, you're putting all of your leading, generals and admirals. in the same place as a bad idea from the security perspective.

On a more practical day to day level, since I, I don't think somebody is going to seize that, security, you know, threat. The reality is we are distracting. the leadership of our military, for an exercise which seems likely to be an empty exercise. This is part of a pattern, right, because what the administration is doing is saying,

we want to have the strongest military in the world, but we'd like to deploy a bunch to our borders, but we'd like to deploy a bunch to our cities, but. we're going to alienate a bunch of people within the military, because, we're going to embrace the history of people of color in the military. We're going to erase the history of women in the military. We're going to erase the history of the LGBT community in the military, and we're going to fire a bunch of people from those communities,

because we're going to say that they were hired, for diversity reasons. So they're already doing things and day after day after day. that are reducing readiness. And the United States military, even as they say, they, you know, they want to have this big, tough, military force, but that and, you know, add to that, why are we bringing them together? We're bringing them together to hear. the views of America's. most famous draft dodger, Donald Trump.

And this frat boy, who's spent a few years in the military. But whose life subsequent to that in veterans organizations. and everything else was, you know, marred by scandal and mismanagement. Who is completely unqualified? The guy who is the least qualified secretary of defense. in our history, and they're going to lecture. the career leaders of our military at this particular moment.

It is not going down well, I can tell you, I've spoken to a bunch of generals. and admirals and people close to them, and I can tell you it is not going down. Well, this is, seen as a waste of time, and, it's it's it's it offends them at a pretty fundamental level. It might be people, you know, thinking, oh, well, you know, getting, getting together, you generals, boat.

companies have all hands meeting all the time. You know, we were talking about about Apple. Apple has all hands meetings and everybody turns up. What's the what's the difference here? Why is it so important that we have independent thinking. or you know what, what are the things that we should be looking for? Well, look, I mean, the, the, the secretary of Defense runs. one of the largest, most complex organizations on Earth, an organization. that is supposed to be devoting itself in real time all the time to the protection.

of the United States, to raising our readiness to be able to fight, any foe that might, seek to attack us and, to enable us to be able to use the military. as a tool, diplomatic tool to help us. achieve our goals as a nation. This meeting helps achieve none of those things, you know, getting them all together in a room to listen to this, frat boy.

and this draft dodger lecture them about a warrior ethos is, you know, it's ridiculous. It's low comedy. To talk about lethality, which the Hexa talks about all the time. to the leaders of the most powerful fighting force. that has ever been assembled in the history of the world. Nobody doubts the lethality of the United States. Department of Defense or the people within the Department of Defense.

The only thing they know is we are weaker today than we were nine months ago. Why are we weaker? Because we've weakened our alliances. Why are we weaker? Because we've strengthened our enemies. Why are we weaker? Because, as I said earlier, we've reduced the readiness. of our forces, and we've gotten rid of a lot of qualified leaders. who are super helpful in leading those forces. And so what what Haeg says is doing here,

consistent, by the way, with what he's done since he arrived in. the office, is actually damaging. the Department of Defense and actually weakening us. And, you know, you can see this and everything else. He couldn't keep staff together. There were scandals within his office. Nobody wants to work with him. It's it's ridiculous. And it's what you would get if you got a Fox TV news host. to cast play as the secretary of defense, which is what we've got going on now.

You know, we've got this guy, and he's, like, flexing like he probably did. at 100 bars over the course of his life, saying, look at me. I'm a tough soldier. And not stop and say, as a secretary of defense. is supposed to do, how do I make America stronger? How do I make America safer? What do those those generals and admirals that you speak to and those around them? What what is their what's their fear?

What do they think is coming next, or what is going to happen. as a result of this sort of meetings that could have been emails and calls, play and performative, versions of governing? Well, it's, you know, essentially, as one guy said to me, but essentially letting the air out of the tires, right? We are slowly making ourselves less capable, and we're doing it at a time when it's very clear.

that the civilian leadership upon which the military defends, the president of the United States, the secretary of defense, people. who are holding senior positions within the defense community, people holding senior positions within the intelligence. community, are, among the least competent that we've ever had. I would add to that, by the way, that, you know, one of the critical factors. in maintaining our national security is, not surprisingly,

the National Security Council. And, you know, I've written two books on the National Security Council. I'm kind of a historian of the National Security Council, and I only say that to make this have a little more impact. We effectively don't have a National Security Council right now. It has been weakened to the weakest point since its creation in 1947. by the National Security Act of 1947. We there is no national security advisor or the interim advisor of Marco Rubio,

who obviously has three other jobs. And, the the president doesn't take advice. He doesn't read intelligence. He doesn't get briefed by experts prior to his meetings. He doesn't takes experts with him on his way to his meetings. So we've already lobotomized the U.S. government. We've decapitated our own armed forces,

and we are weakening them simultaneously. And this is a problem because the world is a dangerous place. Russia's being more aggressive along the borders of NATO. Israel is, destabilizing significant parts of the Middle East. The Iranians are responding to an attack that we made, that hurt them, but has not stopped them. And the development of their nuclear program, there are conflicts elsewhere in the world. China is eyeballing Taiwan as we speak.

And, people in the military consider that to be. the most likely next major conflict. So, you know, it's not like there's nothing to be focused on here. And that is doesn't even begin to address, you know, the fact. that we're in a technological transformation point. where AI and cyber and other kinds of new forms of warfighting, unmanned vehicles and so forth, autonomous unmanned vehicles,

are on the horizon that need to be developed. They need to be developed with real seriousness of purpose. So having a pep rally in Virginia, led by a couple of nitwits, is not what the United States government or the United States military needs. right now. Hi, I'm Hugh Daugherty. Let's be honest, news these days can feel like a maze of opinions, spin, and half truths. How do you know what's really happening? That's what Grow News comes in as an app and website that brings together articles.

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for unlimited access to worldwide news coverage using our link below. Grow news see the story from every angle and stay informed with confidence. It's worth asking or saying. Of course, there was actually some sort of military deployment. over the weekend, and it wasn't, it wasn't one that was abroad or but protecting NATO against Russia. It was 60 National Guards in Oregon were federalized. to go and stand outside,

federal buildings in Portland. I mean, how does that go down at the top of the military and people. who are concerned about national security? Well, I mean, it doesn't it's idiotic. Right? The president put out a social media post and truth Social. in which he said War two. He referred to war torn Portland, of course. You know, immediately people on social media. started posting pictures of like, birds singing and flowers. popping up and peaceful Portland, you know, Portlandia, you.

Know, nightmare, nightmare lines for brunch. Yeah. Right. Right, right. And you know, it's very difficult. to, you know, get a donut because there's so many people out there getting donuts. But there's a war going on in Portland, right? But he said it was war torn. And he said he had to send the troops in to fight Antifa. I point out now, as a as every time. that I get an opportunity to Antifa is not a thing. There is no Antifa.

Okay. It's not a real organization. It is kind of sort of an ideology, kind of sort of the ideology. that we embraced when we fought the Nazis and the fascists in Italy. You know, we we were the leading anti-fascist, the leading anti-fascist. of all time in America is Franklin Delano Roosevelt. Right? But that aside, you know, he's his kid. They're making up this imaginary enemy that is fighting us in an imaginary war. But he's deploying real troops to go fight it.

And, you know, he walked it back a little bit. But is this a distraction? Yes. Does it alienate people in Portland? Yes. Does it alienate the National Guard? Who doesn't want to be, you know. Because what they end up doing. is picking up garbage, as they're doing in Washington. D.C. they do a daily update. of how much garbage they have picked up and how many fences they have painted. Right. And, you know, is this what people want to do? And by the way, the people in the National Guard, you know, they have real jobs.

They're called in the National Guard service. They do not get paid a ton of money. They are sacrificing their time and and, and, and energy to do ridiculous stuff. because it makes the president feel like a real man. And, you know, I understand it. He's an old guy, and he wants to flex what used to be muscles, and he wants people to treat him in a certain way. But this is not the way to do it. And, one by one, he is alienating,

leaders and cities. and states across America, people in his National Guard. And I hope citizens who realize that this kind of, you know, playing at, at conflict helps nobody. But there is there is a real conflict that is not being played. That is real. That's one of political violence. There is a we saw yet again over the weekend, violence. There was an attack on a church in, in Grand Blanc Township in Michigan.

And it's very clear that the the main suspect, I think, pretty much. confirmed, though, by the police is a man called Thomas Sanford, 40. He had a Trump sign outside his house. He was wearing a the pictured on social media, wearing a 2020, cry. We brought the crime. Wore a liberals t shirt. with a picture of Donald Trump smoking a cigar like there is this. There has been this wave of political violence. And I just want to talk a bit about that for a minute.

There is not a wave of, of, of political violence as it is being portrayed by the media. Okay. Because. there is very, very little. to speak of, left wing violence. There is a wave of right wing extremist violence in the United States, and there are plenty of studies that show it. The former head of the FBI cited right wing. political extremism as the primary threat. We face terror threat in the United States.

We know that other studies that have shown this, have been quashed by this administration. And, you know, I it's it's a it's a very real issue, but a bunch of what we've seen and we don't know what the motives were. of this guy in Michigan, just like we're not 100% sure of what. the motives were of the guy who shot Charlie Kirk. You know, a lot of a lot of these things get blurred together. by political opportunists to serve their purposes.

Here's the reality. We have 400 million guns in the United States of America. We have more guns than people in the United States of America. We're the only, major country in the world. that has this kind of a gun, problem, but it's it's it's beyond a problem. It's a pathology. Because, we have perverted the words. of the Second Amendment, which doesn't give everybody the right to own a gun. It says very specifically, that if, you know, in order to support,

well, regulated militias, people may hold a gun, but, of course, there are no militias that are the militias that, call themselves that are certainly not well-regulated. And, you know, the kinds of weaponry envisioned. when the Second Amendment was written is not the kind that we've got right now. These weapons of war that can kill hundreds. of people, fire hundreds of rounds in a, in a in a minute. And and.

so we have this pathology in the United States. We don't take care of it. Why? Because political leaders on the left and the right are afraid of the gun lobby. They're paid off by the gun lobby. Our system has been corrupted by the gun lobby. And, and so we've got that as a problem. At the same time, we don't put enough money into mental health care. We don't put enough money into, enabling people who have problems.

to seek answers for those problems. There is a stigma associated with getting mental health care in the United States. And, you know, that's a pretty dangerous combination, right? You've got a bunch of alienated, angry people who have an inability. to deal constructively with the feelings that they've got. But what they do have are weapons of war, and they can go and do what. this guy did in Michigan and do what happens in the United States. every day or two, which is they can take it out on their neighbors,

they can take it out on innocents, they can take it out on schools. And so, you know, the, you know, more people have died from, gun deaths in the United. States that in the, in the course of the past, you know, in this century than have died in all the wars that we've fought in. So it's not political violence. It's it's something worse than that. It's societal dysfunction. It's a breakdown of our ability to govern ourselves.

Rational. It's a breakdown of our ability to take care of ourselves. But it relates to the prior story. And in one very important way, which is that. the principal job of a government is to protect its citizens. And we are not protecting our citizens when we divert the attentions. of the military to nonsense, we are not protecting our citizens. when we, make it possible for everybody. with any kind of a problem to have a weapon that allows them to lay.

waste to the neighborhoods, to the communities in which they live. You also talked about you also say diverting a government. And at the very top of it, right now, we have a pretty big diversion going on. that the Department of Justice, at its most senior levels, is being used to go after Trump's enemies. That's I mean, we've we saw the prosecution of James, the beginning of a prosecution of James Comey with him being indicted.

And you mentioned, Christopher Wray, the Trump's handpicked FBI director, from his first term, who absolutely told Congress that right wing, right, far right wing violence was the the most pressing domestic terror threat. Trump threatened him with prosecution or at least investigation over the weekend. Adam Schiff he tweeted about or posted on Truth Social. about over the weekend, saying he should be in jail. It how do you.

how do you get past this? How do you get you know, how do you not? Or when you talk to people in the particular the national security world, what sort of message is that to the outside world? And what's the what's the endgame? Well, I mean, there are multiple messages here. First of all, just picking up on the security theme that we were talking about. When you, do what they've done inside the Department of Justice, you essentially unilaterally disarming, the United. States and its ability to protect itself from right.

wing extremism or any kind of extremism in this country. And in fact, parts of the, Department of Justice and the FBI. that focused on such sources of, potential violence that the United States have been shut down, defunded. We've also, by the way, shut down and defunded parts of the, FBI and, and other parts of the government that protect us from foreign cyber. attacks, that protect us from Russian meddling in our invest in our elections.

Because all of these things are things that, Trump and Stephen Miller. and the people around them, Kash Patel, Pam Bondi, all, have viewed through a political lens. You know, you don't make America safer by taking the people who led the largest. violent attack against the United States government in modern history, which is the January 6th, coup attempt, and pardoning that.

and then putting some of them in the United States government. So, you know, from a point of view of dealing with terror threats, dealing with domestic threats, dealing with, the kind of things that, we've been talking about here, the government has been gutted and weakened. But, you know, you're talking also about something else, which is, well, if they're not using the FBI and the Department of Justice.

for what they should be using it for, and they've also, by the way, not, you know, it's just a sidebar, you know, they've they've they've stopped. the investigations of prosecution of white collar crime and other kinds of things, that, you know, Trump takes personally and his friends take personally. because they're involved. Right? Yes. They've. Been taking I know they've taken it personally. Right. But they're just saying, you know, okay, everybody, you know, you've got a free run. at this, but, you know, there's something.

even more pernicious going on, which is, manifest in this Comey thing. And the the threats of doing it to others, which is, you know, Trump has gone full authoritarian. He's saying this is not the Department of Justice, is it? The Department of Donald Trump's retribution? And we are going to use it to harass, to penalize, perhaps to jail, perhaps to bankrupt, to destroy the reputations of the people that have gotten under Trump's skin.

Many of those people, by the way, have gotten under Trump skin. because they actually follow their or honored their oath to the United States. Constitution followed the facts where the facts lead, which is what. the FBI and investigators are supposed to do, and found out that Donald Trump. was a corrupt guy doing corrupt things, and they wanted to prosecute him for it. And he wants to go after all of those. But this is, you know, a breakdown in our constitutional law.

You know, there going to be some tests real quick. because the Comey case is going to come up in a few days in front of a judge. And the question is going to be, is the judge going to look at it. and say, this is nonsense and throw it out? Trump's. already, you know, kind of prepared the ground, if you like, for that by saying, oh, this was a Biden appointee. The system's rigged against me, even though it's his system. Real. Well, of course. And, and and, you know, the, the, the they, they've been doing that.

from the beginning to, where they're trying to discredit the court system. And you have the ridiculous spectacle of Chief Justice John Roberts. going out and saying, well, I don't like these attacks on our courts. And it's like, dude, you made it possible. You gave the guy immunity. You gave the guy, you know, the ability to exert his exact powers. as president in a way that no president has ever had before. They did it last week, again with, with regard to cutting foreign funds.

that were allocated by the Congress, they've essentially given the president. the power of the purse, even though that's the opposite. It's the it's not the intention of the Constitution, which gives it explicitly to the to the Congress. But this is the post constitutional era. of law enforcement in the United States. This is an era in which. norms, laws, traditions, standards, and the word of law are all being set aside.

And the only thing that matters is the whim. of the mad president who thinks there's a war going on in Portland. You know, you know, and this is. that this should scare everybody because, as you know, many people have said, if they can go after a guy like Comey, who is the former deputy, if, you know, it was former. head of the FBI and the former deputy at DOJ, a very distinguished.

Guy and, and a Republican. But, yeah, and, and a Republican who probably paid more to get, Trump elected over Hillary Clinton than any other single individual if he. But if he's going after them and senators and prosecutors and so forth. How far is he from going against you? And I got to tell you something. You're sitting there, you're listening to this at home, and you think, oh, he would never come against me. But they passed an executive order last week.

in which they described threats against the United States, that they could then. go after and that they were targeting, you know, as subversive as being. anybody who spoke out against capitalism, anybody who spoke out in a, in an anti Christian way, anybody who was part of this Antifa that doesn't really exist. They're planning now to.

and there was a story about this over. the weekend shift, the allocation of federal funding. for universities to universities. that share Trump's views. So we are rewarding people who share Trump's views and celebrate Trump. And we are putting in the crosshairs of our legal system, everybody else. And if you've tweeted at any point something critical of Trump, something critical of a system that creates oligarchs and billionaires.

and leaves ordinary people left behind, something critical of, I don't know, right wing evangelicals, something critical. of Israel, by the way, which is another thing that they're trying to, make illegal. Then you're on the list. There's data out there that points to you, and you don't know how you're going to be penalized. You know, you may not be the target of illegal investigation, but will what will you be the target of?

Will you become a target within your own organization as they start. looking at the names of people who might alienate the government? I was talking to somebody who's on one of his lists yesterday. Last week I had lunch with them and they had. just that, almost gotten a job. And then the people at the jobs said, now we can't hire you. because if we hire you, it sends. a message to the administration, that we, you know, don't care about what they're saying.

It's a thumb in the eye to the administration. And I know lots of people who are not getting jobs. because they've been critical of the administration. And this is part of the plant. It's not just the high profile prosecutions. It's stigmatizing everybody who doesn't support the administration. and relying on the support of weak institutions, corporations and media. organizations and academic institutions and not for profit institutions.

To give into that. and say and I know, but I was talking to sorry I stopped after this, but I was talking to a guy who's a professor at a leading university, and the the faculty of the university was being subjected to, detailed investigation by the administration of the university. to see where they were running afoul of this administration.

Is this like McCarthyism? Yeah, but but it's much worse. It's much more. It's much bigger. It's much more organized. It uses big data. It's much it's much broader. You're right about big data. I makes this a little bit more, you know, that everybody is traceable all the time. Yeah. And you know, this is, you know, people say, well, you know, if we go too far down this road, this is an authoritarian country, or we go too far down this road where police think.

boys and girls, we are too far down the road. We are an authoritarian country. with an autocratic leader, who is acting in the ways that the heads of police states act. That's where we are. And to suggest you know, it's around the corner. Is is is to be is divorced from reality. As a president who thinks there's a war going on in Portland that president.

I just want to shout back to I an absolutely brilliant column. you did last week, which was about. what happens to MAGA and the succession, and you pointed out. that the Micah movement is changing. and taking these authoritarian trends. have focused so far on Donald Trump, but that what we saw. with the memorial service to Charlie Kirk and with a lot of the discussion around.

that, was a very explicit Christian, nationalistic version of it. that is coming. afterwards, is that part of the plan is this opportunistic? I mean, I mean plan whose plan? There are a lot of different plans out there. But I think there's a recognition in, you know, the leadership of MAGA. and the Republican Party that Donald Trump is going to be 80 on his next birthday. and he is, clearly faltering and weakening as a man.

And he probably is not going to be able to stay in office past 2028. I mean, we can't rule anything out, but he probably won't. And so there's going to be a need for a succession, I have to say, watching the Charlie Kirk memorial, you could see the shape of what that would look like, because it was the first event that I have seen in the past ten years. That could be considered a Maga. event, where Donald Trump was an afterthought.

He was not the center of attention. The center of attention was Erica Kirk, Charlie Kirk's widow, and JD Vance. and and the message that they had was a very unified message. that, you know, this movement and the words of Erica. Kirk, it's a religious revival movement. And that the terminology they used. was not, terminology of Trump about immigration. or the grievance driven terminology, although that was there.

But, it was the terminology. of televangelists of, of, you know, that of, of, of using the language of Jesus instead of the language of Trump. And what I said in the column was that, you know, this strange thing is happening. where the future of MAGA is going to have as its front man, not probably the most, you know, corrupt and, you know, you know, human that we've ever had in high office.

in the United States, Donald Trump, but Jesus Christ himself. Now, the problem with that is this is not a, you know, a movement that also embraces the ideas of Jesus Christ. about welcoming the stranger about, you know, being kind to your neighbors, about, you know, following a golden rule. about tolerance and understanding and compassion. It is one of exclusion. And if you listen to Charlie Kirk's messages or you listen to the,

you know, Stephen Miller rant to the middle of this thing, what you've got is, white Christian nationalism. And just worth pointing out. that the most famous Christian on earth right now is, in fact, an American. It's the Pope, and he is not somebody. that aligns with with much of this movement at all. They certainly have commonalities, I imagine, on the issues,

you know, on pro-life issues. But but he is condemned to their views on immigration. He is condemned. And I think, you know, one of the things that they've done while they're sort. of appropriating the image of Jesus and appropriating the words of Jesus, is that they have stripped away. the meaning of Jesus out of all of this. And look, I'm Jewish, so, you know, you don't want to take my. theological analysis of all. That Jesus was as well. So.

Yeah. Well, thank you very much for that. We we we always like it when that's pointed out. But but but but but you know, I think that, you know, this is about exclusion, and it's about turning back the clock. to a world in which white people were in charge, men were in charge, women played a role of, you know, trad wives. You know, it's, and and, you know, Handmaid's Tale kind of thinking. and, you know, that's that that seems to me.

to have been a core of MAGA for a long time, but post-Trump. It's the one that's most organized because you've got all of these. sort of networks of right wing churches. And now there's, and, and groups like Turning Point, Charlie Kirk's group, which want to and. are able to drive this forward. and, and, and you know, why is that important? Well, I think a lot of us wake up in the morning and things,

look at our watches and say, you know what? Trump time is that? How many more minutes and hours of Trump do we have? Right. And and the reality is his days are numbered. His time is limited. Whether it's by the Constitution or it's by Father Time. Right. And so, you know, but that doesn't mean the end of this. It doesn't mean the Trumpian tactics or the takeover by the, executive branch of the rest of the government,

or the ability to ignore the law is just going to be used. by Donald Trump and badly for the next couple of years. It could be used by these people badly. And, you know, I would, since I brought it up before, you know, as. somebody, my father grew up in big ships, you know, Hitler's Austria, you know, and they used much of this same language. and they define themselves as a Christian group,

to the. expanse of all the other groups that don't share their beliefs. And we've seen where that can lead in the world. And we have seen it. We see it now, right? We see Donald Trump. using essentially a giant military or militarized police force. to round up people who are brown, who don't speak English, who, it may have been great contributors to our society for, for decades,

but they're throwing them into prisons without due process. They're throwing them out of the country without due process. They are now using the Department of Justice to targets. people with who don't have the same political beliefs. And they're planning on expanding that. So, you know that what they're saying is we're going to use the government. to punish the people who are not like us, who do not agree with us. And this has happened so fast. It has been breathtaking.

And you know, Viktor Orban is probably sitting there. starting to take notes on how to Trump do it. Vladimir Putin is probably doing the same thing. because it is happening so fast in this country. And I would I would say, look every day and, you know, like, what if there's a government shutdown? What if there's a government shutdown this week? What programs do they turn off with that? How do they redirect funds? How do they seize emergency powers in the context of all of that,

the each time they have an opportunity to do it, they do it in a way that puts you at risk, and that limits your fundamental rights. David, can you give us some hope? Is there some positive note we can we could finish on. For a day? Yeah, sure. There's lots of reasons to be helpful. First of all, Father Time is undefeated. So you know that transition is going to come. Secondly, a lot of these people on the the,

you know, the Republican, right, the JD Vance's of this world. are obviously devoid of the skills. or the abilities of Donald Trump to say, hey, I'm something different. They all start to look the same. Also, there are more people who disagree with them and agree with them. You know, if you look at polls in the United States and say, how many people want gun gun reform or how many people want fairer taxes, or how many people want a clean environment, how many people want education reform or how many people,

you know, want, health care for everybody? It's always two thirds. or three quarters of the American people who want those things. And those people can be. mobilized in New ways now, using new technologies, social media, things like this where, you know, you guys with your podcast yet.

audiences comparable to the audiences. that once only went for network TV shows. And we are we are privileged for them to come to us and very aware that. the responsibility that's on us as journalists. is huge, to be truthful, to be accurate. But also, you know, like Donald Trump wakes up in the morning. because he's a creature of decades ago, right? Yep. And turns on Morning Joe. He's full boomer. And I've been right. He is full at me, too.

Sorry, Gen Jones, I'm Gen Jones, okay. But, he turns out morning to. I've been on Morning Joe. I like the people on so forth, but he turns out. Morning, Joe. Morning, Joe averages 700,000. viewers per episode, and of those 700,000 viewers, 60 or 65,000 are 25 to 50. Okay, this broadcast on and on and on. Your Daily Beast YouTube network will get.

maybe half as many total audience, but in two or 3 or 4 times as many of the target audience. Yes, of the people that you want to reach the most. So that to me is a sign of hope, because what it means is there are many, many platforms. that can't be bought up by Trump leaning oligarchs or, or give opportunities for people with with fairly limited resources.

I mean, I have a little podcast network, Deep State Radio Network, where we do 15, 17 podcasts a week, several dailies. We do The New Republic daily. We do them on a variety of these subjects with experts, and we get 2 million downloads a month. You know, we're tiny, we're much smaller than what you guys are. But that makes an impact, right? And they're not hundreds there, thousands of platforms like that out there. So the majority of people don't agree with these guys. There are mechanisms to mobilize those people every day.

The people in power alienating those people more. And so I think ultimately. the the wheels are turning in a way. that can get us back on track as a country and look back at this dark period. As a dark period, do you feel better? I feel I feel almost uplifted. David. There's nobody I would. rather have navigating me through this dark period than you.

There was enough hope there. That is the train. But it's not, is it? The train coming towards us? That's good. I do think it is, actually. No, no, it's just the light is light. I hope there's light at the end of this tunnel. David, there's no better place to keep up. with your insights than Deep State radio Network, which we absolutely recommend to everybody. Thank you for joining us. Thank you for your amazing insights. And please, please come back. We always want to hear more from you.

And we look forward to your next appearance. David, thank you for joining us. Thank you for helping us navigate a dark time and bring us some light. For more of David's brilliant insights, please check out the Deep State. Radio Network. Nonstop coverage of a pivotal time in American history. We want to know, what did you think? Do you have hope? Is it dark? Are you worried about Trump censoring you?

We want to know. Send us your comments. Whether there is no censorship and as Joanna would always. say, please be best. Thank you to David Rothkopf for joining us. Thank you to our production team, Devin Roger Reno, Annabelle Newsome, and our editor, Jesse Gilbert. Want to give a special shout out to our BBC level members, Karen White, Heidi Riley, and Connie Rutherford? Thank you, thank you, thank you. You are the beast.