Trump's Secret Plot to Help Sex Charge Pal Exposed | Inside Trump's Head

They have not at any point of the Trump the Trump grift, which is now ten years running, getting worse and worse and worse. and more lucrative and more lucrative for him, and we are. ignored. I think if you like Donald Trump, then. you have to like the Griff because they go part and parcel with the man. He's a businessman. Of course. he's going to take take advantage of every opportunity that comes his way. Remember the other thing about Donald Trump, extraordinary thing is he's transparent because he says people don't care.

But I deserve to know if we get right. He is specifically said and no one cares. How do we call the the country to moral attention? We don't know how to do that. Michael. Joanna, for those of you who haven't watched this podcast before. I'm Joanna Coles of The Daily Beast, and I'm Michael Wolff, not of the Daily Beast. Well, you're sort of of the Daily Beast visitor to the Daily Beast,

a partner of the Daily Beast, Merck partner, author of four. books on Donald Trump and other books on other people. Yeah, but nobody is interesting as Donald Trump. We have so much to get to. Graham Plattner, Belgium, overturn this. What a great troll. We've got the president on Vance's podcast. I will be doing a deep textual analysis of that conversation. So we should just for new people joining the podcast, we should just take 30s to.

ask them to subscribe and be explain what we're doing here. We are doing something that I think. think virtually no one else does because. no one else has. For the ten years, people like me and Joanna and. and the media everywhere has been covering Donald Trump. It is from the outside looking in.

There's a guy, why does he do what he does? Aghast everybody when he does what he does, permanently outraged. We are permanently outraged. And and our method and I've been doing this through through. four books, is to think of this guy as singular. I mean, he's not part of a political process. He's not like any politician. He does things independent of even. the people around him, of his advisers.

And it all comes down a that this is a government of one, and this is a government of one which is motivated by. whatever is motivating him at any given moment. And that often has no logic, no purpose, no gain for him even. And it is all instinctual. It is all mercurial. It is like a performer. He's responding at any given moment to his audience.

And actually, sometimes he's not responding to his audience. He's just responding to whatever somehow got inside his head. And that's where that's our challenge, to go in into that head. So there's so much to poke around in today. What is inside his head over the spectacular Belgium win.

and the knockout of the US team after last night. We're recording this on Tuesday morning. As we know he called Johnny Infantino, the head of FIFA, several times to get him to overturn. the red card that the referee had given to one of the US players, and he was supposed to be out of last night's game. Trump intervened. They quoted article. 27 as if it was the UN or something,

which allows you to overturn a referee's decision. They rescinded the red card out, went. onto the field and Belgium having appealed the decision, and that FIFA said, well, we're not overturning the decision now, one. decisively, for one. I mean, it was an extraordinary game. and it was as if the US were defeated before they even got on the pitch. And I can't help wondering. if they just didn't want to be the center of all that attention.

Well, I can tell you who does want to be the center of all that attention. And that's Donald Trump, right? And does he care about that? The US team was defeated. You know, just yeah, sure. In a only in a passing sense I mean Trump. Trump is a sports guy. Murphy maybe more than anything else, maybe more than a real estate guy. He's a sports guy. That's what he likes. And he likes to be the guy.

He likes to be the the the manager, the team owner. And he likes to be reaching down, making. decisions, overruling everyone else he likes. It is for him a power move, right? Has he ever owned a sports team? Yeah, yeah, he owned the soccer team in. Oh, that's right in New York, right? Yes. He did, didn't he? And that was the sort of. Yes. When he. And he likes rich guys who own teams.

As a matter of fact, I have a story I have a story. Go ahead. And this is that, that kind of thing. If he has Uber control over. moving the pieces, the sports pieces around. So in in this this would be in the first administration. His friend Bob Kraft. who owns the Patriot the New England Patriots. is in trouble because he's been.

he's been busted for frequent frequenting. Korean massage parlors in Palm Beach. And he's he's it's not it's not. it's it's not a good moment for for Bob. He has legal difficulties, but even more importantly. and more threatening to Bob is that he has difficulties with the NFL. Roger Goodell is threatening the head of the NFL.

Right. Is is is threatening. You know, whatever, whatever, whatever. A commissioner can threaten sanctions or removing you. from from from team ownership. Just that's his over the sex scandal. Yes. I mean, this is a this was a, you know, a major moment. Yeah, I remember because it was a sort of strip mall thing, wasn't it? And everybody was like, why does a guy who's so wealthy have to go to a strip mall for sex? Yeah, no.

And just in the background, remember, of Jeffrey Epstein in, in West Palm Beach and Jeffrey Epstein saying, you know, Bob Kraft gets take out and I get take in, at any rate. So his friend Bob craft's friend Donald. Trump is on the phone with him, Donald Trump, the president of the United States. So this is Trump won. Yes. And Donald Trump is advising him on his.

how to handle a sex scandal, which he's got some experience, some experience. And and. Kraft says, yeah, yeah. No, I think we got up my lawyers this that the other thing. But you know, what I'm really worried about is, is, is, is the NFL and Roger and what he's going to do. And Trump says, don't worry about Roger. I'll take care of him.

And what happens. Well nothing happened. So he went on and he still is. He is a Bob Kraft has been. has returned to being a respected member of the billionaire community. And he married a shrink. Teams. Right. He married a shrink much younger than him. And they live happily in the summer in the Hamptons. Because from time to time, I get invitations to go to his house. Okay, well, there, there, there you go. But but this in this conversation, I actually.

no one else knows about this conversation except the the. the principals to it and me, because there were several other people on the phone. and having this discussion about Bob Kraft and his problems. And one of them shared this with me. Okay. Well, that is, well, isn't it Donald Trump has his boys helping out boys. Well, it's. And and even beyond it, of course, it's it's billionaires. helping out billionaires. Right.

But even more importantly, it's Donald Trump in this sports mix. You know, that's you know, Dana White is his one of his close friends. Yeah. You know, that's. he comes alive in this in this thing. It really is what he would, would have probably. in, in an, in another life preferred to be doing. If you've been sitting on a. business idea, Shopify makes it easy to make it happen.

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So that brings us neatly sex scandals to Graham Plattner. I am prepared. I was not expecting to eat crow quite as let's let's let's do the background. Cram, cram. This is not good news. He's going to have to step aside. What is Trump thinking about this? Because Trump is going to enjoy this. Trump is very much going to enjoy this I think. Look, well, let's I think you should eat a little more crow here. Well I was I was excited about Graham Platanus candidacy.

I thought he seemed energetic, exciting, authentic. Yes, there was stuff in his past, but he seemed to have addressed it. This is. Yeah, this is kind of. Did I say, well, you didn't know that. he was going to be accused of rape by a ex-girlfriend, but I did not see his path as a straightforward. Yeah, and it's too risky a seat. And what's at stake. is too much for the Democrats to take the risk of a couple of things.

I think it's interesting what's in what's in Trump's head. because he's going to be conflicted about this. I mean, he likes having a any Democrat damaged, and this is damaging. And this may help him hold hold the Senate right on. On the other hand, he is always on the side of anyone, of any man accused of sexual abuse in almost any shape or form. So he's going to be maybe on the phone with Graham Platinum giving him.

No, I'm sure he is him. It's, it's it's a horrible accusation to, you know, he turns up drunk in the night or, you know, she lets him in. and then he's just intoxicated and determined. No, no. Totally. Well, but. And then let's let's balance this against everything. And this is. I mean, an interesting perspective. Everything that Trump has been accused of, which is actually vastly more than this.

He's been courts have found him guilty of of well and the. the the numbers of women who've come out with almost identical stories. Okay. But you know, 28 at this point, you know, serial. accused sexual abuse, a court found for Aegean. Carol. But that's not the situation Graham Platanus in. And this was a hasty you know, it was a hasty rush to get him in.

What do you what do you mean? Just clarify that. You mean that's not the situation. Graham Platner is, and it sounds actually very close to the situation. Graham Platner is, although there aren't many. I just mean that Graham. A handful of women. Certainly. Right. I guess what I meant was that Graham Platina wasn't a celebrity, that that Trump has a sort of Molly. has a sort of Teflon exterior. It turns out Graham Platner doesn't have. Well, we didn't know that that, you know, I mean, that's that's an interesting that's a question I'm going to ask you.

But but we didn't know that, you know, Trump. Trump's Teflon exterior is because he. You know, he. he he didn't go away. He didn't he didn't when faced with this. and the grab them by the pussy moment. Right. You know that was a that was the the nadir of his campaign. The, the. the Republican National Committee came and said you have to withdraw from the race.

And he didn't. And that's what the fact that he was. then elected is what gave him the Teflon coating. But he had to get elected first. So, so and that was Melania said, oh, it's locker room talk. Locker room talk. Well, it's I mean, it's a lot of things, including Steve Bannon. Then at the at the subsequent debate with Hillary Clinton, the front. rows were filled with with the women who had accused Bill Clinton.

So yes, you can say that this is handled in a. they handled this in a politically astute way. But even more importantly, it says Donald Trump, you know, never, never admit, never confess. Right. Well, like we never write, never complain, never explained. I don't know these women who are these women? I don't know them. But so question for you, do you think we are. recording this on Tuesday morning?

Graham Plattner has until next. Monday right to to withdraw, which would give. the Democrats the ability to nominate someone else. If he doesn't, then he's on the ballot. And and I and I guess going forward. Do you think he will withdraw before next Monday? I do, I do think he will withdraw. I'll probably be proved completely wrong and he'll be encouraged to brazen it out. But I don't think he will win against Susan Collins if he brazen it out.

And I think he has to step aside. Yeah, I mean, that's perfectly reasonable logic. I don't know. I mean, I think we're in a new climate, new politicians, new behavior among politicians. and I and and I don't. And we can go to a Trumpian model. And remember, Graham Plattner is also a Democrat.

and a progressive Democrat also exists in a Trumpian model. You know, that that he's he's not from politics. His life story is not at all. a political life story is rough. Edges are what gives him his credibility, his appeal, his attractiveness. And and from from a personal standpoint, he really only has, you know, two choices.

to hang his head in shame and to be never heard from again. To get beyond this by going through it. I don't think he can go. Not that I'm at all advocating that. That's a good idea. I thought, you know, I'm my feeling has always been that he was a. an odd and probably inappropriate candidate. And you always said that. And I was. I was charmed by him, I interviewed him, I told you he was in Norway at the time.

He'd gone there for IVF because it was so much cheaper. to have IVF in Norway than it is here. Although you can get IVF, or at least you can get the meds now at Costco at massively reduced prices. But at the time he was in Norway, he was. He seemed to have. thought about all the things he'd been accused of. You know, totally inappropriate comments on Reddit,

you know, an alleged Nazi tattoo which he'd got when he was drunk. I mean, he's clearly someone who has or has had problems with alcohol, which, you know, if you go to an ER room on a Friday. or Saturday, half the problems there to do with alcohol it. this country has such issues with alcohol and we really don't deal with it at all. All the emphasis goes on drugs and opiates and things. anyway, that's a different thing. But Graham Platten. has a problem with alcohol or he did have a problem with alcohol.

It's led to all sorts of unfortunate behaviors, clearly has to step aside. and let someone else who is a better candidate take on Susan Collins. It's too risky for the Democrats. Well, it's too it's too I mean, he was risky. I mean, risk for the Democrats is a is a kind of odd variable here. because he was always risky. Yeah. He was. Now he's more risky. Yeah. But I'm just I'm, I don't know I, I think. I suppose I agree with you that in all likelihood.

he will step aside because he should step aside. But that doesn't mean he might not in this new climate. Yeah. In this new world. And and is this actually where he gets his attention that he brazen it out? He's denied the allegations. The woman seems very plausible. She was very plausible on you, on CNN completely. And and I think and I was thinking about this. This morning as I was thinking about this, I was thinking that there is a good, good book in about scandals,

modern scandal, scandals, beginning with Bill Clinton. So the two most successful politicians of our era. era defined broadly, right, are Bill Clinton and Donald Trump, each accused, I mean, each. is surrounded by such scandal. And then you have Barack Obama, also very successful to term winner. Not a whiff of scandal, scandal free,

scandal free. Why are you being so silent? Are you going to come up with an Obama scandal? I don't think so. I'm just. I'm just trying to think. I'm just trying to think also in terms of in terms of success, you know, I mean, Obama is certainly has been a successful Democratic. politician, a 60 successful president, reelected president, but the kind of.

but with a coolness in a distance. and an illusion and in a remoteness that I, that I think. that I think in this political time. didn't, doesn't didn't serve him well, doesn't serve him well, and that the connection that people have felt to Bill Clinton. and Donald Trump has been palpably, much more direct. Right.

And they have they have charisma. Well, it's also the sense that, you know these people, right? You know, you really deeply believe that you know them. You know, what's you know, it's interesting that we do this thing inside. Donald Trump's head because many other political commentators don't. But much of the country actually feels they know what's in Donald Trump's head. And and they like it.

And they lost a lot of them like it because they feel like he says it like it is. Okay. Well, I still think Belgians overturn this was the best troll of the week. If we're giving awards this week, overturn this. So I wonder if anybody is. watching and invested in Trump meme coins. 900,000 people did, and they've lost collectively $3 billion. 3.8. So 4 billion, 4 billion rounding up, which is rounding up.

So what I wonder is what's in their head? I mean, I mean, wouldn't you say that these. that there should be a collective, a revolt at this point? If you were among the 900,000 people who lost this money. because remember, they lost this money, Trump made billions. Well, what did he make on it? I raised 4 billion, 1.4 billion.

And on his meme coin alone, I think he made 600 million. I mean, so what are these people thinking? Oh, they thinking, are they thinking? I just got into late. If only I got in early. It's my fault. They may. They're there. Yes. I'm a terrible. Or are they thinking it's going to come back? It's going to come back. It's just low right now. Bitcoin's low right now. At least I'm in the crypto game. because obviously this is a crypto can't fathom I mean first thing, who.

who are these people who would invest alongside Donald Trump? I mean this is like this is the classic rigged market. Of course, Donald Trump, the House is going to win. Of course you're going to lose. Now, having said that, of course. many people are already. there's a whole industry of people of betting against the house. And they don't they don't revolt. So I guess I've answered my question. Well, it's sort of it's a bit of a legal scam, isn't it?

Because what what Trump did with setting up World Liberty. Financial, which also sounds like one of those things, has just been. it's like Meghan Markle's American or was it. American Riviera orchard or was it American Orchard Riviera? It was just a name that had come up on a I. I think this also felt like they put it into AI. Come up with plausible name for, you know, crypto grift and the Trump meme coin. And of course people lost money on Melania's going to the Melania coin.

I mean, it's so shameless. It's just extraordinary, this grift and it's the president owing it. No. Well, I. it's the 900,000 people. Yeah. We are still outraged. I mean, people say that everybody's over Donald Trump's outrage. We are still outraged by this, aren't we? Aren't you outraged by it? No, actually, I mean, in principle, I'm out.

Principle, of course. But but the the other the other point of outrage is to. is is a real a real. emotional moral reaction to, to. what is grievously wrong, unfair and corrupt. And, and you know what, gate?

I remember Watergate when one was actually. that was that was a moment which which. JD Vance just excused. as he said it would be a 12 hour cycle. Yeah. In which the, the country came to moral attention. and clearly they have not here they have not at any point of the Trump. the Trump grift, which is now ten years running, getting worse.

and worse and worse and more lucrative and more lucrative for him. And and we are inured, I think does. do you think where do we accept it as part of Donald Trump, which is the, the. the other thing, if you like Donald Trump, then. you have to like the Griff because they go part and parcel with the man. He's a businessman. Of course, he's going to take. take advantage of every opportunity that comes his way. I wish I could take advantage of every opportunity like that, not I,

but but. but the the but the man on the street. Right. But do you think the man on the street looking at Donald Trump thinks, oh, that's amazing. He's such a good businessman. He's made $2.2 billion. He's an amazing businessman. Thank goodness he's my president. Apparently, depending upon which side of the street you are on. Yes, that's what you feel. And do you also think all politicians are corrupt?

At least Donald Trump is successful and corrupt. First thing I do not think not. You are corrupt. No, I don't either. But do you think the public thinks that I. I mean, you know, there's been so much about Nancy Pelosi. I think all the Congress, I think depending upon which side of the street. actually on both sides of the street may, may feel this. I mean, politicians are obviously.

not a favored class at the moment like journalists. So, so yeah, I think that that is that that is also part of it. Remember the other thing about Donald Trump, extraordinary. thing is he's transparent. because he says people don't care. But I deserved him to know if we can't. Right, right. No. And and he is specifically said that no one cares, right. Well, I wonder if people do care. and if the Democrats will be able to use it as part of their,

you know, part of their strategy to win back the house. And. Well, I'm sure I'm sure they will. They will try. But this is the kind of thing that also can backfire. You know, you focus on an issue that people really don't. It doesn't resonate with them. Yeah. Okay. Sure. Donald Trump is tell me something I don't know. Right? And wouldn't it be better. if the Democrats were talking about this in Maine than Graham Plattner? Because Susan Collins has also had some good investments,

I believe, along the way I you know, I just I don't know. And the Democrats don't know. What do we talk about? How do we how do we present something that is that is. how do we call the the country to moral attention? We don't know how to do that. Well, we should if you're listening to this, send us your comments on this. Because this this is the kind of thing that gets viewers. and listeners really excited.

And we would love to know. Do you think people have lost moral outrage about Trump? I mean, when you when we hear from our commenters. abroad, no one can believe this is happening here. And of course, Trump is at the NATO summit right now in Turkey. We had photos of him taking a walk with President Erdogan this morning. What? And we're, you know, we've still got Iran going on. in which we will get to, I hope.

Well, we can get to it now, but. Well, no. Well, just I want to make another, another point because in this, in this, in this moment of what's the issue? What's the. Where do the Democrats focus? You know, what seems to be going on is that it's not about it's not about issues. It's not about focusing on these these kinds of this political script. It's about looking for a new kind of person, well, new kind of person.

Let's talk about Nigel Farage, new kind of politician in the UK. who today announced over money I mean similar. And of course Britain's saying oh it's Trump levels of money. It's absolutely not Trump levels of money for Nigel Farage. He took remember levels so much more in the in the UK. You know $100 in the UK. And people are right. But people are up because there's still a sense of moral outrage. that even after Boris Johnson and Liz Truss as prime ministers.

But but Nigel Farage, it came to light, had taken a $5 million gift from a businessman. And there are several other points of, of corruption around Nigel. So it seems to be converging in on him. Yeah, he's clearly on his own kind of Farage and grift, but in a really interesting political stunt day, he's resigned his seat and is then standing again.

for the same seat, Clacton in East, in East Britain, East England. So he's basically saying to the, to his constituency, to the voters, people are accusing me of all this stuff. Yeah. Do you care? And you can register whether you care or not by voting me back in. Yeah. It's a really, really which is, which is relevant to the Graham Plattner. thing that I think that he, that he, he may take this position to.

Well, he may obviously may not. And I don't know what he's, what he's going to do, but it would be to the same effect. This is who I am. This is what I've done. Do you care about this more than you care about. having me elected to represent you for affordability? And again, that goes to the thing. And it's not just about affordability. Again, I think it's a wrong thing to put this on issues. It's it's it's about the new political man.

Yeah. I am the new political man. You know, it's. my only thing about Platinum Farage is that it's one thing taking money. And people are going to think, oh, for age has got rich friends. I want someone in power who's I totally agree, rape is different. Yeah, that's what it is, obviously. But I'm thinking, I just wonder if this other thing. is, is about the person. The person? Yeah, it's about the person standing.

It's about personality politics, you know, characters. We there's there's a there's a point that I want to get in here. because in thinking about this and thinking about. about all of the Democrats who have, who have, who have recently overthrown. the establishment people coming out of, we don't even know these people. Who are they? And suddenly their winning elections and they're going to go to Congress. And I thought, what do they have in common?

They're all good looking. That's kind of a weird kind of thing. In contrast to standard issue politicians. who generally look. Look, look. from terrible to in to we don't notice what they look like. So it's from sort of Mitch McConnell at one end. Admittedly, he's older now, but Mitch McConnell to Abdul.

Alcide in Michigan who's upsetting things there. We saw a moderate candidate also this also that him against the the. his opponent was named does not come to me at the moment. who is the encumbered standard issue looking. She's not the incumbent Haley Stevens. She's not the incumbent. She's a it's an open seat.

and and she's, you know, perfectly I mean, not not someone who would be. who would be particularly noteworthy and looks department fine. You know, just the, you know and and in. not long ago that would not have been a consideration. Politicians look like politicians. They're not movie stars. Right. But but now they have to be an AOC has talked about this. You have to have the ability to communicate on social media. And so it helps if you're attractive.

It really helps if you're attractive. Yeah. Well, I don't know. I mean, I myself do okay on social media. So that would, that would. Well actually that's contrary to to that. That's fair point. That's a fair point. But you're not running for office. You're not running for office. I am not running for office. You should run for the Hamptons. You could run to represent.

You'd have to win in the blue collar district of Huntington. Right. Very, very tight seat. Not liberal. Yeah. Other than the Hamptons. Yeah, but anyway, I'm too old to run for office. I wouldn't say not according to. Yes. Markey, who's going to be 80 when he goes into the Senate with his 50th year of. of public service behind him, or Janet Mills, who was the candidate that. Graham Platner won over for the primary in Maine Democratic, actually. But that's but this is part of the point.

Why are these people running there? They're good looking. Partly because they're young, right? No, but they're good looking because they are. And they're good looking. Good looking because they're good looking. They're good looking. Yeah. Well Maloney George and Maloney is quite good looking. And there was a I mean I hate to say it. because it's nauseous but this is the Italian prime minister. Yeah the Italian prime minister. But Donald Trump truth sold a picture of her. looking adoringly at him and said, restraining order.

And of course, you know, this is because he claims that she demanded a selfie. last time they met and that she was obsessed by him. She was like, why are you doing this? Completely untrue. Why are you doing this to your allies? Do this to your enemies. And now he's trolling her even further. I mean, she must just want to slap him across the face when she sees him. She would not be alone, right? No. That's true. I mean, just remarkable. The what those poor euros have to put up with with America.

And of course, Pete doing his six month review of American troops in Europe, the Pentagon. That's that's not. Well, what is that? Just threatening and noisy and doesn't mean anything. I mean just one of those other degrees in in. Trump land in Trump world inside Trump's head. What is it with the Europeans? Why would you go after after Europe? Why would why would you create that schism?

And just digression that the Roman Catholic Church just had a schism. last week. I was trying to explain the nature of schisms. What to your children? To my ten year old daughter. And I lost her interest. Well, I'm sure she's figured it out by now. She seems very smart, but nevertheless, I mean, the the European thing is, is meaningful.

It will be one of those things. And and I think we can start to make a list of what are the things. that Trump is going to leave us with and the, the kind of reshaping of, of the world, the reshaping of politics. And one of the things is this is this schism with. this ever increasing schism with Europe and, and. and remember the importance of that that, that, that, that has held the world.

in its semblance of, of peace and prosperity. for 80 years. Yes it is. And now that is, we are we are clearly at this point. because of Donald Trump moving beyond that. We don't have that anymore. It's almost disappearing. I mean, the NATO meeting that begins. today, you know, NATO. probably won't survive this, certainly not in the.

in the form that we have known it in the form that has, relatively speaking, maintained the peace for so long. Is there an argument here that Europe should have been paying. more for their own defense? Of course, there's an argument. It's always good if somebody pays more, but that's never been by making. that the chief, the chief criteria of this. relationship misses the point of this relationship.

Well, of course, Trump's missed the point of the relationship. because he doesn't listen to what the point of the relationship is, and he probably doesn't understand what the point of the recession. And it also actually is more basic than we think it is. It is Trump being the center of attention. Right. And it needs to be I'm the center of attention of NATO because I'm. I'm going to going to ruin it or I'm going to make these demands on it. I'm more important than these, than these, than these Europeans.

Actually, it's an interesting thing that that, you know, during the first administration. Aides would say that these that these European meetings. were annoying to Trump because he had to appear as one among. among this group of people when he was so much more. the United States and him. as the president of the United States were so much more important. And he kept trying to trying to reconfigure it so. he would be in the front.

And they would be they would be behind him right about building. Right? Of course, it's all about billing. And his name has got to be first. Yeah, but the middle powers, as Mark Carney refers to them, are, you know, creating their own defense mechanism now. Yeah. I mean, there was so. there was a good story in the Wall Street Journal this week, a great story, actually, going into some detail. of about everything that had kind of kind.

of fractured in the European relationship, in the European friendship. Anyway, I, I recommend it, I read it and in fact, that's where they described. America or British intelligence source said. America was now like The Crucible meets Wolf Hall. All right. Do we want to talk about the ayatollahs funeral? Do you remember Ayatollah Khomeini. funeral in, I won't say, the late 80s.

I remember watching it and it it just felt so different. to any kind of state funeral that we that I had ever seen. I mean, the the sort of wooden coffin got passed along from people. They didn't seem to be any official pallbearers. It's just like the crowd carries it along. Do you remember it? A funerals are particularly important in the Shia culture. You know, the the so dramatic. The book, the book that we've been that we've been.

that we've been recommending King of king of Kings. is, is it's actually kind of kind of extraordinary. and describing these kind of mourning rituals. Well, I mean, I was rewatching and they become political too, which is the other thing that that that becomes a. kind of central, central. principle of political organization. is these, these funerals which happen on a regular basis. Well, and the other thing that's so noticeable about the more so different.

from at least the culture I'm used to, is just how noisy they are. So people are wailing, they're banging their heads. I mean, the Brits don't when when their heads know when. Diana. Princess Diana's coffin came along. Complete silence. When the Queens coffin went past complete silence, the crowd silences themselves, as opposed to the wailing that goes on in. Well, certainly in Iran and actually in African funerals too. Anyway, it's just the difference in culture in new Jersey.

Yeah, of course you whale in new Jersey, but you wail in new Jersey and you don't even need a funeral. But did you happen to watch the Ayatollah Khomeini funeral this week? Well, I saw I wasn't glued to the television, but. Right. But I mean, again, just it sort of. No, no. And it's. No. And it's extraordinary. And it also goes to the goes to the point. What was the point about this war? What was the point about actually killing this guy?

It was to overthrow the regime. So now we have this demonstration that not only is the regime not. has it not been overthrown, but it it appears to have. mobilized the country. Right. And they didn't rise up as Donald Trump instructed them to, having promised that help was on the way when they did rise up in January, by the time he decided to bomb it, at the encouragement.

of Benjamin Netanyahu, they decided not to know. And it's still there's a thing. So we still look on this from the outside. We literally don't know what's going on. We have no idea. And we have no idea whether Donald Trump doesn't know what's going on there. And, you know, there were two stories, conflicting stories. This this week, one of the New York Times, one in the Washington Post in the times. story said momentary unity at a funeral mass, deep divisions. among Iran's leaders in the.

the thrust of. this story was that it's all on the verge of coming apart. Basically, the Washington Post story was Iran's regime survived. the war and is now savvier, ruthless and more hard line. Right? So completely conflict story completely. And I think that that goes to the point a no one knows what's going on. And, and and.

to the further point that we've we've just had this. we've just had this war and and we don't know what it means. We don't know what it's accomplished. We don't know. We don't know what it has left us with. I don't even know if ships are moving in and out of the Strait of Hormuz. now, on everybody's lips are are they? Is traffic back to normal in the Strait of Hormuz? Well, it's certainly not back to normal. And it's certainly, you know, I think it's a day to day business.

Right. Do you get bombed? Do you not get bombed? It feels like it's going to be I mean, it's a different. I mean, it's a negotiating. I mean I mean, it's essentially the negotiating point here. Right. And then is it just going to end up being a kind. of series of skirmishes that happen from time to time? And it's basically a forever war, the very thing he campaigned against? Yeah, I think, yes. How could it not be at this at this point?

I mean, he has I mean, nothing has. The more important point is nothing has changed or little little of. of of importance has changed. from before the war till after the war. It is still the same situation of an Iranian regime that is. that has enormous amount. of, of power and influence and that use is intent.

upon using that power and influence in ways that. necessarily continue to make it our enemy. Right, and totally destabilize the region which was beginning to settle down. So nothing improved by it. I want to go to my favorite podcast, my favorite podcast, which, as you know, is storytime with the Second Lady,

because when we read, we grow, because when we read, we grow. She does an incredible grin after she said that someone. her producers obviously said, you must smile more. And I think there is someone on set holding up something which they smile. because she goes from completely solemn straight face. to suddenly a half moon of a smile. And you know she's been told to smile more. This is a podcast that may have an audience of one. That one person may be Joanna Coles.

I'm obsessed by it. And of course, this week. she had on the president, she had on the president. And she asked him, I mean, just just to set the scene here. This is a podcast, theoretically about books and reading. So for children, children. But their fantasy is for children. So here's here's the thing that Donald Trump has literally. zero interest in books and children. Right. And reading and reading. Right? Yes.

So she asks him, do you know what books do you read? Do you have any time to read for fun these days? So I end up reading mostly newspapers. I usually read stories about myself. He doesn't even read about anything else, so he would never have read those two. conflicting stories in the post and the times about what's going on in Iran. As we know he has a resistance to information. Can I go back to when I asked him this question? Go on. So in in the spring.

of 2016, he's running for president, begins. to be looking like actually, he might get the nomination. Still, that seems preposterous. and totally preposterous that he would be elected president. But I'm interviewing him, and I ask him the question that that. that all presidential candidates get asked, what's your favorite book? And I can see I can still see now. the look on his face, which was a kind of shit.

You got me. God, how did I. How could he not have not prepared on this? And you know, most politicians of course, say the Bible, but even that I think. I think maybe he had he said that's not credible, that I could say that. Right. So you could see him search and then suddenly. and literally his eyes light up and he says, all quiet on the Western Front. Oh, I remember you saying this, right, which you'd obviously.

had to read at school. Yeah, yeah, it just came out from somewhere. He just brought up a title of a book. He had a good book. Very good book. If any had read it. Well, she asked him that. He says he reads about himself. And then each visitor to Usher's podcast is asked to read a book for the children. Last week it was JD Vance reading Winnie the Pooh, which he overcomplicated. I mean, it was absurd how he over complicated and he overexploited it. But Donald Trump didn't do that.

He chose a children's book which was produced by the white House. Preservation Society, I think, and it's about how it's called President's. Play, and it's about how presidents relax when they're in the white House. President John F Kennedy enjoyed sailing on the water. while President Grover Cleveland relaxed by fishing. And so the bushes relaxed by playing horseshoes. Let me just go a little background on on what would have happened.

that this would come out there. He's going to do this. We need a book. Yeah. Of course, in every body in the white House. would have been running around madly. What what what book is he going to read? It's a picture book, so he doesn't even need to read it. Yeah, well, that's another thing to write. Does it have any. He. Did he just know he just turns the pages and he describes. Well, that would be a big, big thing, you know, because always the discussion. within the white House is and this is from the first administration,

what is the level of his reading dysfunction? I mean, no one quite knows this, but they understand that words reading. site, you know, all of this, kind of this kind of thing is a problem. Well, he he talks people through. So you know Nixon is bowling, Jimmy Carter plays tennis. And it's and these things are so inadvertently revealing. because he then gets to Obama who's turned the tennis court into a baseball court,

a basketball court. Sorry. And and then there's a picture. There's a painting of all the president's. There's a painting of Obama looking tall and lean and popping a ball into. into a hoop. And he goes, no, here is Barack Hussein Obama. He's playing basketball. I don't think he's any good at basketball. He's probably not any good at basketball. And he like, fixates on it. And then he must have been fixating on, I think, the Obama opening of the library. and all the ex-presidents together hanging out without him.

And I'm sure he was thinking of it, or having fun. hanging out without me, which is a very good title of a Mindy Kaling. But but he then says, wouldn't it be wouldn't it be interesting. if I got all the ex-presidents again? We were to. We went to a football game. We could all sit together, watch the football game. Wouldn't that be great? And you're like, what are you talking about, man? What are you talking about anyway? Obviously it was the most watched podcast they've done. He scored higher than JD, scored higher than Cheryl Hines who,

as I constantly remind you, read a book. about The Wolf and the Three Little Pigs. And when asked why, I said, I like pigs. I'm speechless. I'm speechless. Speechless. Wholly worth ten minutes of your time. The whole surprise here, I think it's why would they have? Why would they have done? What is the point of this? It's subversion. I think it's Usher's way of of encouraging.

something that clearly. Trumpian don't really care about, which is encouraging children to read. Yeah, I don't know. The funny thing is, I mean, she seems like such a captive in this thing that I can't imagine. She's totally she's that she's doing this willingly. So somebody must have somebody must have gotten this idea. Well, she should do this, and I.

my guess it's it's JD that this is a JD production. Hey, sweetie. Because at one point when he does, he reaches over and taps her knee and he's like, hey, sweetie. Maybe he maybe it was his idea. I think it's you got to get out there. We got to find something for you to do. We want people to like you. We need people to like you. Yeah. This is part of the of the JD campaign, so. And I think this is probably a measure of the JD campaign, so. Okay.

Well it's so it's not looking good. It's not looking good. But but more to the point, Usha looks miserable doing it. She's clearly very uncomfortable in front of the camera. And this is a woman who, as I keep saying, was a gate scholar at Cambridge. I mean, super smart. Nothing to do with YouTube. Doesn't know. Of course not. It doesn't. But. But why isn't she doing something with her skills? Why is instead of this which makes her look plainly uncomfortable, is not playing well, you know, it's a super smart woman.

and she's been relegated to sort of this silly podcast. Well, I mentioned. I mean, I don't I mean, I mentioned this this is, this is by choice. She doesn't you know, it. If your husband is running for president, it's very hard to hold a job. because you, especially at that level, if she's not, she could visit. military wives. There's tons of stuff she could do. She could go and see children in a hospital, children who've got cancer.

There's so much she could do that would be more beneficial than this nonsense. And also, what's so funny? I can see you've you've you've thought about the job of First lady. What I did think is funny is they have. they have a pile of of yourself in that role. No. I would have thought of myself as president. Except I can't run as president. Can't run as president. But the thing that's interesting is they have for her.

set a pile of books which are stacked to look as if they are real books. And of course, they've just. carried them into the Oval Office, which is where they do the interview. and plumped them down right next to Trump's chair. And Trump can't sit still either, so. he can't just sit and read the book, which actually JD could. He's sort of all over his chair behind the desk. No, he's sitting on a chair next to her, and he keeps saying how. fabulous and fit she looks and how popular she is in the white House.

And people really like you here. And then actually, again, he's kind of appealing in that he. he looks at himself and he says he doesn't play golf at the white House, which I think Harry Truman had done. Because he wants people to know that he's working for them. He's working for the American people, despite the fact he spent, I think, a quarter of his presidency playing golf. But he then makes a joke about he doesn't want to be. the least fit president ever, or the fattest president ever. I think Taft was was bigger than Trump.

But Trump, it was clearly on Trump's mind. Yeah, well, Trump has got to be up there. I mean, he's a 300 pound guy. Whatever he says, that's 300 pounds and he's 15 pounds. heavier this year than he was last year. I mean, you have no idea what it is. The, the the the sense of his massiveness when you're with him. I mean, it's daunting, right? I'm sure it's daunting. No. And I'm sure it's a very helpful tool when you're in the room with someone. Yeah. No, I mean, even I was on the times.

that I've been on the multiple times I've been been with him. It's it's the thing that you are most aware of. His physical. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't think John Thune intimidated by his height because he's taller. It's just height, however. No, it's his it's a mass. He's like a bison. He's physically like a bison. There's something and maybe something else about the way he animates.

I mean, it's a it's it's a it's a presence. It's a presence. Any updates in your case against Melania Trump? Well, I think I think you're you're up to date. We we were in court last week, and, and the judge. reproached the other side, but there's no decision on that. And there's no now the other side. We're just waiting to see whether they go.

They go forward with their threat to file sanctions, which is just something that you do to make us. spend more money and, and, and wait out the clock, cause more delay. And actually, the interesting thing about this is as this is. this is outlined to me and, and by the lawyers and how it plays out. that if they, they will go, if they go forward. with this bid for sanctions, this is how much this can cost.

They go forward with this bid for sanctions. It will then be the judge has pretty much said that, that she will throw this out, but then they will appeal. that to the second circuit and then the second circuit. will throw this out, and then they will appeal it to the Supreme Court. Now, this is not even the main focus of this case, but this is. then a tributary of this case that will end up costing that's,

you know, probably all in. That's a, you know, that's six figures. Certainly. Right. Well, as someone pointed out, one of our comments pointed out, this is like John Dyson, Jarndyce in Dickens's Bleak House, where they spend. so long on a case over of estate that they all run out of money. The whole thing is spent in the course, right? The only problem here is that, of course, the Trumps and the United States. government will not run out of money. Right? Whereas. whereas I. might well, you're hugely supported by people that you have raised.

a lot of money on GoFundMe, and I'm sure people. will be prepared to help you if it gets to the point. where you've run out your initial fund, but they must be banking on that. It's just how people use the law. It's it's remarkable. Yeah. Now, and I'm not sure I told you that. So when they were in in court, my lawyers saw. on, on their screens the, the opposing.

counsel's screens as the judge was admonishing them. So they didn't get to use this, this, this material. But they had us up there ready to, to use. snippets of our of inside Trump's head. Yes. Well, I wonder I wonder which part it was. Which do you know which bit it was? I don't I don't intriguing, intriguing. Well, if you have been thank you for joining us. We'll be back on Thursday.

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