LIVE: Michael Wolff & Joanna Coles Discuss Trump & Venezuela

Michael. >> Joanna. >> Well, here we are on a Sunday morning. We were not expecting this when we spoke. confidently about 2025 being peak Trump. We were we weren't expecting um. >> an invasion, a takeover. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. What is it? Well, this is.

>> a war. A war. >> A war. Is it a war, though? Is it a war? >> No, no, it's a it's a war. It's gone. We. We've had the war that lasted um a very. short time. Now we're into the. occupation. >> Now we're into the occupation. So this. is. >> which is by the way which is by the way. uh in fact a a almost a scarier. condition than war. Always the scarier. condition. Right. Um, so just for. anybody joining us, I'm Joanna Kohl's of. the Daily Beast.

>> and I'm Michael Wolf. >> and this is an emergency episode of our. podcast, Inside Trump's Head, where. we're going to go inside Trump's Head to. find out what the hell is going on in. there and what was that press conference. yesterday. But before we do, for anybody. who didn't see the press conference, here's a little clip. We're there now, but we're. going to stay until such time as the.

prop proper transition can take place. So, we're going to stay until such time. as we're going to run it essentially. until such time as a proper transition. can take place. >> So, Michael, who knew we're gonna run Venezuela now? MAGA American first. What are they. thinking? I know your phone has been. burning up since this news all broke. Um, what are you hearing? What are you.

hearing from around the president? About. an hour after the press conference, I. spoke to a source of mine very close to. Trump. and um and what this person said and. this was rendered with let's say I would. say laconic understatement. and this person said well his language. was a surprise to all of us.

Now my interpretation of that. is that everyone all all of the people. even the people on the stage were. stupified by this announcement that we. were taking over Venezuela. that we were. going to run an entirely dysfunctional. country of 30 million people and that it. was going to be done by these people.

standing behind Trump on the stage. He. took a direct question, who's going to. do that? He says, "Well, these guys. here." Um, so, um, Pete Hegsith, um, here's Venezuela. So, I think everybody was I I I don't. think this is what was supposed to. happen here. I think literally they were. supposed to say say this was um we've. had a successful military operation.

We've um our we've been wholly. successful on our objective which was to. capture Maduro. this this um um a um um. who has who has been resisting American. justice. We're bringing him here and as. in when we did this in Panama with. Noriega, that's it. Win-win victory. Everything Everything went went um as it.

was supposed to be. And um uh and we're. great and we've we've done exactly what. we said we were going to do. But instead. he is suddenly saying we are going to. run Venezuela. Um and um I and I think I. think we're in this we're somewhere. between. grandiosity and dementia. >> Wow. So you think he just made that up.

on he just made he committed America to. running Venezuela on the spur of the. moment? ad libing our foreign policy. >> off the cuff. Yes. I mean, and let's. let's think about what would be. necessary here in order to do this. First of all, first of all, this is. going to cost hundreds upon hundreds. upon hundreds of billions of dollars. that has to come from Congress. No, no.

Congress, first of all, is is first of. all, the Democrats are never going to. accept this and and Congress is full of. full of MAGA people who theoretically. are not going to accept this. So, um um. so where's this money coming from? Also, this is a this is a Congress that is. looking at, especially from the. Republicans, are a difficult midterm. election. Now, we're going to we're.

going to allocate a a a a a monster. fortune to Venezuela. Tell that to. American voters. Then then the other. thing um um then the other thing was. that that um. um and I'm I'm just distracted because. I'm getting. >> No, no, the comments are coming up. We're getting used to doing the lives. and I'm like, whoa, where did that come. from? So um um then the other thing is.

that he was announcing okay where was. the money is going to come from it's. going to come from oil. M. >> so even that that presupposes that. American oil companies are going to. commit and it's a kind of a once in an. era commitment of capital um to a a a. wholly destabilized country um with a. political system that that certainly. nobody knows what's going to happen here.

and also you have to. you have to depend on Donald Trump. I I. mean what what corporate executives with. shareholders looking over their their. backs would would do that especially. also given now that we're in the middle. of an oil glut. >> So I I I can't think of any aspect of. this that could could in any world be. thought out. So I if he was making it up.

on the fly and several commenters are. saying yes completely clear he was just. rambling when he was standing up there. and and I want to get on to dissecting. the the press conference with you. because I thought there were all sorts. of signals going on. But what was the. plan? Was the plan then in theory just. to extract Maduro and his wife Celia and. then just leave Venezuela to it? Um, >> here here here's here's what I um.

this is sort of my informed. interpretation speaking to people and. I'm not sure that anyone quite knows. what was going on but I think um but I. would say and again this is partly. speculation but speculation based on a. lot of conversations. is that. is that. I think this became a personal thing. with him. Maduro, he kept he kept he's. been threatening Maduro. He's been.

Maduro has been has been giving him the. finger basically dancing in public and. um you know it was very much um um very. much a challenge to Trump. So then it. became okay let's let's do the Noriega. thing, get rid of Maduro. The military. said, "Yeah, in in this absolutely. dysfunctional country with a. dysfunctional military, we can probably. accomplish this with in short order.".

And then the CIA weighed in and um and. said the vice president um uh Rodriguez. um. >> Deli Rodriguez, >> right, is um and it sounded like they. were having conversations with her and. it was kind of like she's and and I'll. I'll bet their analysis was she's better. than Maduro. Um, I mean, she's still a. leftist and she's still part of the the.

Maduro regime, but she's better than he. is. Um, so we'll get rid of him. She'll. step in. She'll be more responsive to. what we want there. She won't certainly. won't be as obstreporous as Maduro was. And and uh and we're good. You know, we. got we got we did what we said we were. going to do. Maduro, we have a we have a. government. We've now installed a. government or accepted a government that.

is somewhat more congenial to us. We're. really not destabilizing it. We're not. saying we're going to bring in Mashado, which is also another interesting thing. because that's always been a sort of. underlying pretext here is that the. Maduro government was illegitimate. Um, and that there was that there was a. dulyeleed other government in exile. >> Um, but forget that. And I think it was. the CIA said Rodriguez will play ball.

Um, so we're good. We got Maduro. We. have a somewhat better government. Um, and we can uh we can just we can claim a. victory. Got our headlines. Good. But. now again, we've taken over it. We've we. are running Venezuela. >> So, Donald Trump said at the press. conference yesterday, Marco Rubio spoke. to Vice President Rodriguez. Uh it's all.

sort of organized. And then several. hours later, she came out and made a. statement uh saying, you know, there's. only one president of Venezuela. I think. that that was that all planned, do you. think? I'm I'm willing to say that that. was probably she's just saying what she. has to say. She's probably on plan. I'm. going to take over. I'm going to have to. make a bow to my people, the country. I. can't I can't I can't Now, this is.

funny. I can't look like a hopeless. American lackey when when Donald Trump. is announced, well, we've we have a. hopeless American lackey who we've just. put in there. So, can you imagine being. Nicholas Maduro, going to bed on Friday, saying good night to your wife? Night, darling. I'll see you in the morning. And then suddenly at 2:30 in the. morning, there's a knock on the door. And 48 hours later, not even 36 hours. later, you are uh you are in the.

Manhattan detention center alongside Sam. Bankman Freed. >> Yeah. Well, he's a thug and that's where. he he he belongs. I mean, this is a kind. of kind of faceoff between thugs. Donald. Trump is a thug. Maduro is a thug. The. thugs are now going after each other. >> So, so what did you think of the press. conference? You said that you you you. thought this decision, Trump saying, "Oh, we're going to run Venezuela is. halfway between grandiosity and. dementia." You have fought the dementia.

diagnosis. uh hard when I've posited it and. certainly when we've had Dr. John. Gartner coming on and analyzing various. symptoms. What did you think of Donald. Trump's. rambling explanation of. >> I think it's very possible and and I. have discussed uh be before I mean. remember when um the mom donnie moment. in the white house when I knew that. people around. >> around um uh all the people around Trump.

were like that was for them that was. like a what the [ __ ] moment. Um and he. went completely off script. Um instead. of taking Mum Donnie to task um and. everyone sort of was was anticipating. that was going to be a a Zalinski moment. and a moment that would lead into the. midterms. Mum Donnie was supposed to be. a midterm midterm issue and suddenly. Trump was embracing him and um and it.

was a love fest and that was a one of. those moments when the people around. Trump were saying well you know this was. a little bit losing the plot. Now losing. the plot is just another um another um. way to say um he's losing his mind. Well, he's going to be 80 this year, so. it's a lot to take on. Certainly, Pete. Hgse, I I thought it was interesting. So, Donald Trump's rambling away. Next.

up, Pete Hegth, who literally has a. piece of paper and looks terrified to. say anything that's not on that piece of. paper. And half of his time is spent. lording Donald Trump. And then we get to. Marco Rubio who seems to be highly. sentient, speaking off the cuff, seemed. to be engaged. No JD Vance. Where was JD. Vance? What vice president wouldn't want. to be in this room? So where was he? And. I thought, oh, current advantage uh.

Marco Rubio. >> Yeah. Well, unless um unless um uh uh. Vance had a really horrific case of the. flu, um I I I would say this this was. not a politically positive sign for him. >> Absolutely. >> Unless is it possible that he has made. an excuse not to be part of it so that. >> zero zero possibility for that? >> You don't think that he's doing the kind. of I I'm I can't be there. Donald would. love to have been there to support you.

I will be here when it all falls apart. to rally the MAGA base. >> No, I mean no. >> All right. So, what is MAGA thinking. about this, Michael? >> Well, I I I I think that they don't. know. I mean, this is a this is this is. a either dementia or a complete sellout. of them or both. Um and um I mean the. MAGA principle which is America first. which is profoundly isolationist in a.

1920s. context re really um you know we have no. business there we have no advantage. there a pox upon all of their houses we. don't care um and we certainly don't. want to expend American resources and. American lives. something that we have that we have done. that the that the United States elite.

and the United States establishment. which which we MAGA people are stand. forth right against has done nothing but. expend American resources and American. lives for nothing over the last. generation. Um, we want to have we we. want no part of that. Uh, I am Tucker. Carlson. I want no part of that and I. will oppose anyone who tries um to say.

otherwise. So, what are they going to. say about um. about the fact that we're suddenly in. Caracus? Um I I I can't I can't begin to. imagine. You Yes, I can imagine. They're. going to say they're going to say, "What. the fuck?" Um and um and I think that. this will be a serious. I can can can the Trump can the Trump.

administration overcome that? They could have overcome that if this. was grabbing Maduro getting out. Then it. would this would be you know a head a. Trump headline. two weeks from now. there'll be other headlines, etc., etc. But now, if this is true, we're going. into we're going to take over Venezuela. I don't know how you explain that to the. base. Now, this brings up another aspect of between.

grandiosity and dementia, which is that. this none of this may be true. Trump. spouts off. He goes into a news. conference, you know, and remember the. people around him are actually familiar. with this. You never know. And this goes. back to this is a government of. headlines and a government of one. Trump. goes out there. He's always looking for. the headlines. He he is it's unclear. what he's going to say at any given.

moment. And he said this thing, we're. taking over Venezuela. We own Venezuela. Um, and that may may well not be true. I. mean it may well be that that he has. done he got Maduro. Maduro is out. They've put in the um the somewhat more. quiescent vice president and that's it. And and and then from there he will just. claim victory. We we now run run. Venezuela. Um they do everything we want.

them to do. Uh great. and nothing really. significantly changes. >> So, so I guess it sort of depends how. soon it all starts going wrong. I mean, there are tons of big drug cartels, armed cartels in in Venezuela. So, this. is going to be a free-for-all in terms. of people trying to exercise their own. power there. But there are many comments. and and I want to address this and it's.

it's as we as we know it's actually. quite difficult keeping on top of all. the comments but clearly one of the. comments here is distraction distraction. distraction. To what extent is this. literally a wag the dog? We're going. into an economy that feels uncertain. People's health care premiums literally. went up on the 1st of January. We've got. Epstein files. people revelations coming. out from the files every day. Distraction, distraction, distraction. >> Yeah. Oh, abs. Absolutely. But the.

problem here with this D I mean Duro. grabbing Maduro getting out military. everything. >> I mean a great television moment. That. was that was that was distraction. Um. >> um occupying an another country is. is is not really a distraction. I mean. it it actually is a distraction that's. going to demand a distraction. Um that. cannot go well. Um occupying a country.

cannot go well. Um um I mean even if you. ultimately p ult ultimately prevailed. and you and and and there is no. prevailing um it's it comes it comes. with with you know just enormous issues. problems costs uh setbacks lives lost. Um so um so no now of course yes it.

could be a distraction if the if if if. then Donald Trump now pronounces this is. um we've taken over the country and. everything is going smoothly and we do. nothing which is also very possible if. not likely. >> So Venezuela could just sort of slowly. disintegrate and that will. >> well it's already it's already it's. already disintegrated. So Venezuela, the. chances the chances if we do nothing of.

things going getting worse in Venezuela. are probably remote. It's as bad as it. can be. And and um without without. Maduro there, it probably has a chance. of of it might have a chance of. improvement. I guess it could get worse. if other people if there's suddenly if. there's suddenly contests for power and. um um and we have to see what what what.

that's like. Um but you know also that's. something else that Trump could spin in. um spin to his advantage. >> Right. So, if you're um if you're in. Denmark now, are you seeing this as are. you feeling anxious about the future of. Greenland? >> Yeah, I think everybody should be. feeling anxious about just about. everything at this point. You don't know. what the between grandiosity and.

dementia is becomes very hard to predict. the outcome of anything. Um, yes. I. think if Trump finds, well, this went. this this went well and everybody's. happy. Um, and I'm getting headlines. Um, uh, yes, let's let's, uh, let's take. over Greenland. Sure. >> Well, and as as Pete Hex said, f around. and find out. That seems to be the new. phrase. I mean, it may well be the.

opposite. >> Also, we seem to be we seem to be. threatening Colombia. we seem to be. threatening Cuba. Um. >> that was also a. >> Trump likes to threaten threatens. You. know, Trump needs enemies. That's what. he does. Um and of course now as you've. rightly pointed out, we're in the. chapter that he has to go abroad for. enemies. And um. um.

uh you know I I think this is exactly. where where where we are. I think. >> I mean we're in this uncharted territory. because because we really don't nothing. makes sense here. Nothing even has the. illusion of making sense and it becomes. then impossible to predict um what's. going on even when Trump says this is. what I'm going to do. Is it possible. that this unleashes the enemy within? So, Congress has been completely.

bypassed here. Uh, frantic congressmen. scrambling all over the networks this. morning on the Sunday shows and CNN. trying to put their point of view, saying this is completely illegal. Uh, our new mayor of New York said that he. had called Donald Trump to register his. uh dismay at the flouting of. international law. Um, does He left. Do. you think he left a message on the. machine? >> He says he personally spoke to him and I.

was like, "Dude, I just need you to fix. the homeless issue in New York before. you worry about what's happening in. Venezuela. That's what you've been. elected to do in New York." Anyway, that's by the by. But do you think this. um enliven. the many enemies that Donald Trump has? As you're always pointing out, people. hate him. They hate him. Um, and. everybody's circling and looking for his. Achilles heel. Does this become it? >> Everything Donald Trump enliven his.

enemies. So the question is, is that. balanced by everything Donald Trump. doing uh somehow giving um a sucker to. his to his base. So that's the tradeoff. and that's the zero someum game that he. has has has has played. So it's actually. more important to ask what this does to. his base. Um because if it begins to. undermine the base if begins to if there.

if there are more and more questions and. questions have been building over the. last number of months Epstein Epstein. Epstein um um etc. Then I then I think that's a that's a. pretty profound problem. >> Yeah. And I do think the coincidence of. the timing with the health care premiums. doubling and tripling for people on the. first of January that this couldn't to. me this couldn't be worse time worse. timing. Why on earth are we worrying.

about Venezuela when people hear. >> Well, that's from a logical but from a. but from a distraction and a headline. point of view then that's the thing. Nobody's talking certainly nobody is. talking today about health care. premiums. We are talking about about. running Venezuela. I mean. >> yeah I mean it one shouldn't I mean we. always come back to we shouldn't laugh. but what else can you do? uh unexpected. and also as we pointed out in one of my.

favorite episodes of the podcast and if. you didn't see it, we put it out on on. Christmas Day about the um about the. ability to run America as if it were a. television show that the presidency is. simply a spin-off of The Apprentice and. all the time he's just thinking in. what's the next cliffhanger? What's the. next plot development? What's the. narrative? Who's going to be fired next? I did think it was very significant that. JD Vance was nowhere to be seen. Nowhere.

>> as as I say unless it was the flu. Um. that's that's that's probably that's a. problem for him, you know, and and it. may be that he was may be that he I mean. let's let's let's play this out a. second. Um JD is the MAGA guy in the. administration. that was the. uh you know I mean he had he had two two. jobs um uh when he was selected to be.

the vice president to represent the base. to the to the tech guys uh represent the. White House to the tech guys and um. Trump to the tech guys and to um and to. be the the the consistent MAGA voice. Um, now it's curious that those two. things are actually at many points um. contradict each other, but nevertheless. um we shouldn't be afraid of. contradictions in the Trump White House.

Um, so it may be that he was judged as. the, you know, the MAGA guy. Let's keep. him off the stage. We're not in we're. we're we're now we're we're now beyond. MAGA. Um, Marjorie Taylor Green, we. can't trust these people anyway. So, we're forging a new something or other. Um, possible. Yes. >> I like the comment here from someone. Operation Epstein distraction. That's. from Mystic Alman Baby. Um, I'm trying.

to read these comments as well as as. listen to you and read out the ones that. are I want to try and read out some of. the polite ones. This is the year that. the neocons will discard Trump. That's. from Jason Brew. And Vance is just. shortterm. Oh, that's disappeared on me. They're moving very fast, all these. comments. >> Well, I don't know. And I don't know. about the neocons. I mean, actually, he. seems to he seems to now be gravitating. toward the neocon. >> I was going to say this feels like a. neocon maneuver.

>> And and and away from the um uh the MAGA. people. Um you know, al although I'm not. even sure from the neocon point of view. where Venezuela fits in. Um, you know, I. I mean, Venezuela is not, you know, I. mean, the neocons have a very well. elaborately constructed idea of. geopolitical power and and it sort of. emanates, of course, from the from the. Middle East. Um, and suddenly we're in.

Venezuela. Uh, which is is a is a it's. it's hard to put that into the context. to the traditional context of America's. world role. Now, I mean, there is some. background to this and um and the recent. the recent foreign policy announcement. was heavy on on South America and Latin. America and. >> this is the policy that came out in. November. >> Yes. Um and you know and that seemed to.

be. I mean broad broadly that was divying up. the world into spheres of influence. There was the Russian sphere in which in. which Ukraine was kind of dismissed. Uh. there was the China sphere, Asia, etc., etc., and goodbye Taiwan. Um and um and. there was the American sphere, which is. all of the all of the Americas. I mean,

this is a a kind of um you know, 19th. century way to look at the world. Rather, not even a 20 certainly not a. 20th century or 21st century uh way. And. then there's there's also another aspect. of of this that. that the that the that the play the. Venezuela play the play of looking at um. at Latin America is a is a is a state. department is a rub Marco Rubio thing. It's a Florida thing. Um you know and it.

comes out of Cuba and remember Cuba is. is quite intimately related to. Venezuela. I mean, you know, these are. the two leftist reg clear leftist. regimes Cuba supporting Venezuela. Um, and so that has that has Rubio's. fingerprints on it and Rubio has been. arguing within the administration that. about that Venezuela is a is a is a a a. trip point. And then also Steven Miller.

has been you know you know Steven Miller. which which is the immigration his. immigration immigrant obsession and it's. really an obsession with um with Latin. America. Um those are the immigrants. that he is most attentive to. Um and and. so there's an idea within that. administration that people how how do. you how do you keep people in the.

countries in their home countries um. >> right by pro by promising them more. economic development by I mean Trump. kept saying we're going to make people. money the people of Venezuela are going. to like this I mean and it's an. interesting role for the vice president. who was in charge of the Venezuelan. economy and who's deep Marxist, whose. father was a Marxist, she's a Marxist. So, it's going to be an interesting. political maneuver for her to be taking. orders from Marco Rubio and Donald.

Trump. >> Okay, but let's assume that that's not. the case. I mean, that's what they say. We're going to we're going to take we're. going to we're taking over. We're giving. the orders, which is just a you can't. even imagine how that how how that would. would work. I mean I mean literally. let's understand if you are taking over. a country you have to you you you take. it over. You put in an administrator you. put in all kinds of American. representatives. You have military on.

the ground. Um you have to take over. virtually all of the institutions in in. in the country. So the idea of taking. over a country is not um we're going to. call you up sometime and and um and have. a discussion with you. Let's have a. let's take over a country by Zoom calls. Um this is. >> Yeah. Or or or by truth social. Maybe. this will be Venezuela run by social. There will be edicts going out, frenzy. edicts going out in the middle or or in.

the early hours of the morning that. Venezuelans will wake up to. >> Okay. So this is where we're at a level. we really are at a level of absurdity. We can we can write this um we can write. this book. >> Well, I think the film has been done. right. Wag the Dog. I mean, it's it's. >> I you know, people people are always. referencing that film, but a I don't. actually remember what happened in that. in in that film, but it's and its point. was that you had a problem at uh you.

have a political problem at home and you. mask that problem by going to war. Um. >> and it stars Dustin Hoffman. I watched I. think it stars Dustin Hoffman. I watched. it and I enjoyed it. Yeah. But but the. point being that it's foreign. distraction from home problems, >> right? But I you know I I mean that. doesn't seem to be I mean the problem. with that that film as a metaphor is. that foreign distractions are are become. almost immediately become become flash.

points. Um right. >> and um I mean it is profoundly after all. of the foreign distractions, catastrophic. foreign distractions we have had over. the last generation to then pick up and. say let's we're going to do it again and. we're going to do it even with less. preparation and um with less with less. rationale for how this actually affects. Americans which is the other thing thing. in this in this news conference. you.

could you could tick off how many things. that the president was saying that were. absolutely not true. Now this is of. course not in any way unusual or. surprising but when we are talking about. taking over a country it would be it. does it does I I would say demand a. little more realism uh than the fact. that this is a narco state when it's a.

you know um you know a significantly. less of a narco state than the many. narco states that still exist. >> right and and we know that He just. pardoned one of the narco premers, the. Honduran president, who'd been funneling. uh drugs into the states and famously. said, "Let's stuff white powder up the. noses of the gringoes." And was jailed. for 45 years. And Donald Trump decided. that he, you know, it was a miscarriage. of justice and he needed, you know,

Biden had got over excited with him and. he needed to be freed. I mean, he. literally funneled in 50 tons of cocaine. into the United States and he's he's. been let go. So, there's no logic to his. fascination about narco terrorists. Someone also making. >> which we should also just just a. footnote. I'm just making a mental. footnote for myself that um that um that. Venezuela is a deeply deeply deeply. corrupt country. Um and um such corrupt.

corruption provides enormous numbers of. opportunity for Donald Trump and the. corrupt people around him mostly most. specifically his family. >> Right. And and it's run by well it's. there also very prominent drug cartels. and drug gangs. Trump is clearly. obsessed by Torrent Dagua that he keeps. doing. >> Well, I you know, I'm not sure how that. that's that's another thing. I mean, Trump says says this, but these are um. uh you know, in in a in a little quick.

primmer on what's going on in Venezuela. Um I, you know, I think it's clear that. they are significantly they have. significantly less power than drug. cartels in Mexico, for instance. Um um. >> well should Claudia shine not that I. particularly know because nobody. particularly knows about Venezuela. I. mean it is suddenly a new oh my god you. know we we have a uh who who does know.

about Venezuela? Who are the experts in. Venezuela? Um uh you know who Pete. Haggsith I mean all of those people. behind the behind the president looked. um confused. They did look confused and and Marco. Rubio's trying so hard to keep a. straight face and he just looks. increasingly kind of alarmed. His eyes. looked like they were growing bigger and. bigger as Trump was up there on his kind.

of rambling weave. But a couple of. points, one person just made a very good. point that actually Donald Trump has. done a takeover of the Kennedy Center. and it's really not going well. So he's. put his name on it. He put his guy Rick. Grenell, the former ambassador to. Germany in there. And yet the Kennedy. sent him the star acts are cancelling. and they can't sell enough seats. So the. takeover of something at home is not. going very well. So uh how can we how.

can we make sure that things go better. in um in Venezuela? So if you're Mark. Carney in Canada, the premier of Canada, are you sitting there thinking criy, he. might come in here and literally make us. the 51st state? Because to your point. that I think Donald Trump probably does. see the world in terms of why don't why. doesn't America. >> well, you know, I think that he sees. this inside Trump's head. I you know, I. think it's I have a military. I have to. do I can use this. But but but you know,

at least up until now, I don't want to. do things that I'm going to get in. trouble for. I don't want to do things. that are so that are complicated. First. thing, I I can't really think about. complicated things. I can't do details. I can't do nuance. I can't sit through a. PowerPoint. So, so this was the leap. here to take over Venezuela, which is. why I I I I I think it just came off the. top of his head and um and will be in.

all kinds of ways shortly walked back. I. don't think he's going to do that. I. think he looks for things. What's the. headline? What's the win? How do I get a. win? Um you know, I I I mean, taking. over Canada, no. um um taking over. Greenland on the other hand, I could I. might be able to get a win there. Um. >> it is all about the win and the fact. that off the cuff he set himself up for.

an inevitable. loss to lose in trying to run Venezuela. As I say, I I I think that that was a. Trump moment and um and they'll figure. their way out of that. >> Okay. So on it was either Thursday or. Friday, he went off marble shopping to. buy or to check the marble flooring for. the rebuilding of the East Wing and the. Trump ballroom. >> I I thought you, by the way, said he he.

went um off his marbles shopping. >> Well, I thought or or maybe I mean I. first heard it, our executive editor. came and said, "Oh, Trump is marble. shopping." And I was like, "Has he lost. his marbles?" Um, but he was marble. shopping for the East Wing. Do we. anticipate Are you hearing anything. about that that getting built? Because. that would be another It's a potential. win. It's also a potential loss if it's. hideous, but but it's a potential win if. he gets that built.

>> Uh, yeah, we'll have to check in on. that. I don't know. I don't know where. that is. I I do know there's a court. case about that now. Um so um so he's. being sued about that and um well I I. don't know maybe um maybe he'll be. stopped. >> Okay. >> Construction is hard. >> And construction is hard. >> Not as hard as rebuilding a country, but. it's hard. >> stages. So he's actually laying out for.

himself a very difficult presidency this. year. He's got the midterms. He's got. the doubling of health care premiums and. in some cases the tripling of health. care premiums and he's got to build a. new ballroom. His wife has got her case. with you, her legal case with you. And. we have lots of questions about where do. you get your cardigans? And EP, just. remember Epstein, Epstein, Epstein, Epstein, Epstein. Because even though it. goes, even though he distracts, even. though it fades, it comes back again and.

again because it is at his very core. It. is his essence. Donald Trump and Jeffrey. Epstein are the same person. >> And we've still got a million. pieces of the files to sift through, >> right? And then and then let's not let's. let's not let's remember the most. important aspect of this is that we have. an we have um uh an an economy that is. servicing the rich and not everybody.

else. >> All right. Where do you get your. cardigans? Someone's several people have. asked about this green cardigan which I. know is your festive holiday cardigan. which we've remarked on before but for. anybody new joining us Michael has a. splendid wardrobe of cardigans which are. frequently on display. Uh where is this. one from people wanting to know. >> I think I will have to look on my thing. but I think this is a a Ralph Lauren. cardigan. >> Okay. Well, it's very nice cardigan. Uh.

some people are saying that you're. interrupting me. Some people are saying. I'm interrupting you. Thoughts on that? >> I um it has occurred to me during the. past 40 minutes that I in this um case I. am interrupting you. >> Okay. I I will take it. I will. >> But I have it's born out of passion. I. just can't believe I cannot believe it. We're taking over Venezuela. Just. >> Okay. Someone says Sarah Bailey says, "You look cute in the green cardigan.".

Thank you, Sarah Bailey. >> Yeah, take that to the bank. Um, all. right. Well, Michael, we'll be back on. Tuesday. Thank you everybody for joining. us live on Sunday morning, but we felt. this was too important to let it get go. past. And also, we we slightly predicted. wrongly, I think, for the year. Or. perhaps perhaps we didn't because. perhaps this turns into a total quagmire. like other things have done like other. >> Yeah. No, no, no. I I mean I I I think. we're I think we're we're right. that. was, you know, 2025 was the high point.

Um, and it is now a much more uh a much. more complicated world for Donald Trump. And in Donald Trump's self destructive. fashion, he is making it even more. complicated. >> Okay. Well, Michael, we'll be back with. more inside Trump's head. Do you think. do you think at the moment he's just so. excited from the military operation. which does seem to have gone ahead. flawlessly? No American lives lost. An.

astonishing extraction which clearly. surprised uh Maduro and and his wife. Although there was I loved Trump's. description of Maduro making for the. room of his safe making for the door of. his safe room and getting to the door. but not being able to open it in time. >> All of which may or may not be true. you. know, you know, these things occur. He. he he he makes up um. >> um he you know, he goes with the where. wherever the narrative takes him. That's. where Trump is. >> Well, it's sort of describing what it.

would look like on television, right? So, he's like this is if this were a. television drama, this is what would be. happening. It's a kind of new version of. Homeland really. It's Donald Trump as. Kerry Madison. Sort of. >> Sort of. Yeah. Um All right. Well, Michael, happy Sunday. Happy the rest of. your day. We'll be back with more of. what's going on inside Trump's Head. Please join us then. And if you've. enjoyed this podcast, please uh put your. comments uh on YouTube. And don't forget. to subscribe to the podcast and.

subscribe to the Daily Beast. And thank. you for your comments. I promise you we. are going to get better at reading the. comments as we're going along. Mine are. a bit small for my eyesight right now, so I may have to to use readers next. time we do this, Michael. But I suspect. this is not going to be our first. emergency podcast of January. Thoughts? What is this? >> Okay, everybody, thank you for joining. us. Devon Rodriino, thank you for doing.

this on your Sunday morning. More to. come. And we'll be back uh well, we're. back with Dr. John Gartner this. afternoon, but Michael and I will be. back on Tuesday.