I Know Exactly Why Trump Bombed Iran Again | Inside Trump's Head

He arrives there and it's, what do I do to claim all of the attention? This personality quirk has translated. into an effective foreign policy, which is to say, our foreign. policy is not to cooperate with our allies because our allies are irrelevant. We are the focus. We must be the focus. And by we, Trump means I must be the focus. That then becomes the profile of America's place in the world.

No other interest matter. No other nations matter. No other leaders matter. Michael. Joanna. Where to begin? Perhaps by introducing who we are. I am Joanna Coles, and I am from Yorkshire. And? And I have been in New York for many years and doing.

running women's magazines. So what I'm doing here on a Trump podcast, I have no idea. What is that? Michael? What is that? I came here as the bureau chief for the Guardian, and I am Michael Wolff, who writes books about Donald Trump. I don't know what that was, and I happily edited. Cosmopolitan and Marie Claire to powerhouse female juggernaut media. But how did you get from. It's a curious so make the connection, which I'm interested in, between.

editing a women's magazine and being in the politics business. Now I have an answer for this. If, if if you don't, well, give me the answer then. Well, because I actually think and I think it's highly relevant. to what we're doing here, that Donald Trump is not a political person, that that he comes out of that, that he is a much more. of a cultural phenomenon than a political phenomenon, which would give you great cred to talk about him.

Good. Okay. So I don't really mean that. Well, I mean, everything in a, in a, in a, in a kind of in a jab way. But this particular thing I think is an important thing. And it's an important thing about what we do here. that the and I think the, the, the world is, is handicapped. by the fact that it is forced to look through a political media at Donald Trump.

And when you do that, I think you see him incorrectly. So and that's why we're here. And in fact, I don't. I mean, I think somebody could argue that I've written about politics, you know, for many, many years, but I really haven't. I've always written about the media and its relationship to politics. So and obviously, Donald Trump is is a reflects. that part of a phenomenon more about the media than about politics.

And I'm interested in people and I'm interested in characters. And Donald Trump is simply ban on the most interesting character in the world. And I'm also interested in how one person can manage. to dominate the news cycle in the way that he does. And it's just been a remarkable week at NATO. The only person that really has competed for attention, and that's. because he's nowhere to be seen is Mitch McConnell.

Is there any proof of life? If there's anybody listening or watching this podcast. and you have proof of life of Mitch McConnell, please, please surface it. It is remarkable to me that all these people are claiming. they've talked to him yet no one, no one has a single picture of him. What has happened to Mitch McConnell, Mitch McConnell or as someone? As someone. Mechanical. Mechanical. Mechanical. And the conical,

as someone referred to him. I can't claim that I originated this phrase, but it's very good. Rigger tortoise. Has he got rig a tortoise? What a good line about Mitch McConnell. Let's do the the postmortem on Mitch, because I think he's actually. a kind of fascinating figure in. a fascinating figure as a Trump satellite, which is what the poor man has become. Well, and why hasn't Donald Trump said anything about him, either? That's interesting. because as we know, he can't resist saying anything about anybody.

I did think also at one time I would really like to do. an episode on Donald Trump's cultural influences, because I think the time he grew up is really interesting. Far fewer channels, no social media. And I think there were certain movies along the way. that probably influenced him disproportionately. So, you know, like Wall Street or Pretty Woman or. I actually think or or more, more.

As much to the point, The Godfather, which influenced an entire generation, two generations. of men of men, less women, I think. But but certainly men. Oh my God, not the Godfather. There's always a moment when you're dating. Someone wants to talk about The Godfather, and you just want to. You just want to yawn and put your head down and wake up after. No, no. A whole, you know, a whole business world.

Actually, I recently wrote about this God. God knows this kind of flash on what I've recently written about. And then I think, and I think, when did I write about that? Oh, yesterday. But but. yes, that came to that came to influence the entire, the entire 80s culture. of money, of business with Donald Trump. as one of its chief exponents. So. All right. So we'll we'll come back to that and let's do a special episode on it.

And I don't know whether or not he ever watched entourage on HBO, which I thought was a. Well, it was, but but no, but let's I take that back. I doubt he did because he's he was. then at the point in which in which he was not. You couldn't settle him in front of a television. He was if he wasn't on the television, he was not not interested in watching it. But entourage was about his agent, right?

Ari Emanuel. Yeah. Yes. And but I was reminded of entourage yesterday seeing him at NATO. And I want to come back to Mitch McConnell. I want to talk about the Aegean, Carol, judgment and the fact. that he may finally be forced to pay Aegean something as. she's been slowly wending her way through the courts like you have. I want to come back to Graham Plattner, who suspended his campaign since we last talked on Tuesday. But but let's talk about NATO.

Yes, NATO, NATO, because this really, really sums up it's a Trump moment. It sums up exactly who he is and what he does. And so I had a white House conversation. just just before he got on the plane to go to NATO. And I said, and I said, because and this has always been in the. in the history, the ten year Trump history. of the staff around him.

has it's always been a kind of moment. of holding their breath when he goes to NATO, because it's someplace that he dislikes, intensely dislikes being there. And we discussed this, this the, the, the other day. that he doesn't like to be among a group of equals. It just doesn't like it doesn't like the look, doesn't like what it. the the what it what it says the meaning of this,

it just runs against everything in his, in his, in, in his being, particularly the picture, the ritual picture that has to be that has to be taken there. So so I said to this person, I said, I said, so what's he going to do? And this person says, I don't know, but he's going to do something. And I think that that's exactly what we've seen here. He arrives there and it's what do I do.

to claim all of the attention? And and I mean, this has been a series of, of kind of things, including including going back to war in Iran, which I think is very plausible, very plausibly just there that is obviously going. to upstage the NATO meeting, then coming back to Greenland, then coming back to dismissing everyone dissing Europe.

So essentially, how could he. not but become the center of attention here? But the thing is, and I think this is the fundamental point, that to remember, that's what this is about. This is about attention. Donald Trump is about attention. He's not about policy. He's not about accomplishments. He's not about a first. He's certainly not about cooperation, which is the nature of of NATO.

It's just about attention. And to understand that, you have to, I think, to fully understand it, you have to understand that there is no meaning beyond that. It's not about anything else. It's not. It is the only intention here is. the attention paid to him. And I think you can probably extend that out, that this is that we've seen. What is this ten years of the Trump era been about?

It has just been about what gets him attention. Interesting. Do you think actually that he really bombed Iran again. just because he could and for attention? Well, I'm sure that that was a factor in this. And it may have been the overriding factor. Yes. America. has always built its way forward through disruption, through reinvention, through people overcoming the challenges before them. Today, the idea shaping America's future are being built collaboratively.

by communities, innovators and entrepreneurs. all looking in the same direction in storefronts, community. centers and towns most people drive through without stopping. People are using technology and creativity to solve real problems. in practical ways building opportunity, optimism and momentum from the ground up. We're already writing America's next chapter. We're building what's next now?

Wow. I mean, it is strange when you hear earnest. and utterly sincere journalists trying to make sense out of what he does. And, you know, I read several accounts of dueling messages. and conflicting messages coming out of NATO. And on the one hand, he's supportive. And he he gave that strange speech saying there was so much love, so much love. And then he goes, I'm not going to say the love is all about me, because people are going to say, I'm conceded. He's conceded. I mean, it's just it's fascinating the way he does these strange.

sort of stream of consciousness. But this is all it is all focusing attention on him. On him. Yeah. Of reversal. Okay. This this was an incredibly hostile X number of hours. Hostile in every respect. Right. And then he suddenly gets to say no, no. It was a love fest. Again the attention comes back to him. Right. And also and the the photo, the group photo.

which you referenced in Tuesday's podcast, I was watching it. as they assembled them, and I hope we can play some of the footage, because what's fascinating is you've got the back row, then you've got the middle row, then you've got the front row. Trump obviously wants to be in the middle of the front row. If he's got to be in a group shot at all. So there's a very funny part where Mark Rutter, the head of NATO, secretary general of NATO, shakes. every leader who's there by the hand and then leads them off the stage.

And you can see how annoyed Trump is that he has to come and do this. And he sort of sidles up and he's really talking to the audience. and thanking the audience inasmuch as there is one. And then he gets shown off the stage so you can see he's irritated. And then in the group photo, they have him slightly off center. on the bottom row, and again, you can just see him bridles. that it's not all about him, and he's got to stand with this group. and he's next to cheer Starmer who's on his way out. So I'm sure he thinks Keir Starmer's a total loser.

And the whole thing is just it's so revealing of this craving. for attention, this, this tiny child who just never got enough of it. and who throws temper tantrums and knows exactly how to get attention. Yeah, well, I don't know. That's an interesting thing. Never got enough of it. I mean, I think maybe actually it's the opposite is true. He has always gotten too much of it. And that has created an addiction, which obviously has to be.

has to be a. satisfied with evermore attention. Evermore, evermore. Well, but to me, his craving for it suggests that it was something. lacking early in whatever he gets, it's never going to be enough. Well, apparently it is never going to be enough. We can certainly agree on. We can agree on that. Well, you know, it's and it's interesting how this has this personality.

quirk has translated into a, you know, an effective foreign policy, which is to say that that our, our foreign policy is not to cooperate. with our allies because we are our allies are irrelevant. We are the focus. We must be the focus. And by we, Trump means I must be the focus. And that has that then becomes, becomes the.

the profile of America's place in the world. No. No other, no other interest matter. No other nations matter. No other leaders matter. Well, I did think of entourage when he was there because he had Marco there. He had. there he had, I think Howard Nick was there or was it Scott Besson was there, but he had an entourage of these men, none of whom said anything.

And then at the end, when Trump was leaving the podium. at one point and taking his boys with him, and it reminded me, and this is why I was going back to, to sort of cultural moments. and cultural memes. It reminded me. a little bit of Danny Zuko in Greece with his kind of wingman around him. It's like Trump travels with his wingman. And then Marco, the Secretary of State for the United, you know, the United States and our national security. advisor and goodness knows how many other jobs he's got.

Grabs a glass from the podium and a file. as as he's leaving, as if he is literally the secretary, not the secretary of state, but cleaning up after Trump because Trump. has left some notes behind and he sort of skips down behind them all. But also Trump's insistence on sort of saying, Marco's here. Marco thinks it's great. Don't you, Marco? Instead of. calling him Secretary of State, this weird familiarity. as if they're all there just to support him, it's.

It's like Gladys Knight and and the pips. It's just the weirdest thing. Yeah. And that that is. That is literally how he sees it. These are my my people. My guys. Do you think it's. because he doesn't have any friends and he wants to sort of hang out with no, no, no no no he doesn't want to hang out with these these these people at all. He wants toadies, he wants lackeys. He wants everyone to wants it to be seen.

that these people are in a state of subservience to him. Right. So it's a power play is just reinforcing his own power as the leader of the gang? Yes. No. And he likes these people to reinforce him because that's their job. Isn't that did not just give the best speech of my life. Oh, you just gave the best speech of your life. And that's what this is to be in this little bubble. That's what it is like. I mean,

it's it's it's a kind of the, the feeling when you hear. these people do it, you just you cringe with your own shame. You cringe with your own shame. I wish I could be a fly on the wall for the conversations that they must have. when Trump isn't in the room and they don't think they're being spied upon. I mean, how can they even have these conversations? But, well, they they don't really. I mean, it doesn't I mean, occasionally and occasionally, if you have a relationship. with some of these people, they will give you a perspective.

But but it's very important. And they don't really talk among each other. Nobody really shares their views of Donald Trump among each other. because of the obviously the, the, the, the fear that anyone would any. one might betray another which they would, which they would, of course they would. But also you're in this role. You can I mean, it's very hard to break that role because you if you broke, if you break your role and suddenly say, oh my God, what what have I done?

What have I become, then you would have to kill yourself. So that's very, very dramatic for Thursday. They they all maintain it is. you're in this existential position and it is all about survival. I know what I have to do in order to survive this. And if I do survive this, well, then, you know, Marco Rubio, I might become the president of the United States,

JD Vance, I might become the president of the United States. They won't, by the way. But, you know, they of course, think that because they couldn't go on, if they didn't think that there was something beyond this. I did an interview yesterday with Ashley Sinclair, who's a former MAGA. influencer for Turning Point and a baby mama of Elon Musk's. And I asked her if she thought. JD Vance would get to be president. And she said no.

He has the charisma of a wet napkin, which I thought was rather a good description. Anyway, let us talk about the way Trump and his entourage. left Turkey because it was not as they arrived, and I was imagining them all having so much fun on the new tricked out. grift Force One as they set off for Turkey, and they're probably all just enjoying the sumptuous leather seats. and the gold and the snacks and all of the things on a new plane.

And then, to their great disappointment, they have to come back in just plain old, old Air Force One. Do you want to explain why? Apparently the Secret Service put its foot down and said and said that. that the that the Qatari Air Force One. had had vulnerabilities and that given what was going on in Iran, they were they they raised the threat level.

Apparently. Now, you would not notice this. No, this from what Trump said. And he said exactly the opposite, which is that interesting thing. that obviously this this this happened. That is what what happened. Why else would you would you. I'm the only two reasons that you would not return in the, in the preferred plane, which is that either the plane itself had some kind of mechanical problem. or there is this other concern that it is.

not was not properly retrofitted with the necessary security. And there were there were worries. and if not, if not threats, and they would have had to have gone. to this match, this, this, this would have been a confrontation. The Secret Service says you cannot go back in this, in this, in this plane. And Trump would have been,

you know, I mean, it's that interesting moment when, you know, in. the president can theoretically overrule the Secret Service, but not necessarily. And, and especially if the Secret Service makes it. a matter of effectively national security. I mean, I suppose you could have you could have framed that, said that. in some in some way that was at least relatively close to the truth.

Instead, Trump lies blatantly. and and said that had nothing to do with it. And we're just showing off Air Force, the new Air Force One to I think they have. it landing at some military base, and we're just showing it off. Right. We're going to let the soldiers come on board and have a look at it. I mean, obviously not not true. Right. So why does he have to do this? Well, I mean, in part he staked the lot on this absolutely.

ridiculous, preposterous thing of taking this GIF plane. from from Qatar, from the Qatar. Who who would have likely. Fitted it with all kinds of things. that might be harmful to the. the plane security and to the and to US interests. But leave that aside. Pay no attention. And that is this, that, that that has that is what this episode has become.

Pay no attention to the obvious. I think the focus on the nature of the law of his need. to to do this, of his, of his, you know, it's effectively a strategy and has always been I just deny it. I don't want that to be the reality, I deny it. I don't have to accept that. Well, he was asked by a female reporter, was there a specific threat. that they were responding to by changing the plane?

And he said, well, I'm the number one target. I'm the number one target. And then he added helpfully, and if I go down, you go down to. This is not how one hopes president speak. But of course, he does speak like this, because he is the president, and we shouldn't be looking for normality. We should be trying to understand who he is. But it was not an amusing that his grift force one that he is. so proud of, with its endless lounges and bedrooms and its nine. half bathrooms and its four full bathrooms, turns out.

not to be up to the job of flying an American president. to a NATO summit in Turkey and bringing him back. So this will be interesting to keep our eye on this story, because I would say that this indicates that there is something wrong. with this plane. Interesting, interesting. And I also wondered. if he got back on the old Air Force One and started kicking it again, just going to the sort of childish thing that he would be stomping around going,

I hate this plane. Oh, look at this horrible sofa sort of kicking the table. No, I can guarantee. that's exactly what, what what he would be, what he would be doing. I mean, he's strangely aware of his environment. Or perhaps it is that loss of control. over his environment, and he has this idea in his head. of what things should, should, should look like and be like.

I mean, it's it's so it's a it's a level of taste, although it's. of course at all times incredibly bad taste. But, but the idea of, of, of of how furniture. should, should look of how things, of. how clean, how things should be cleaned. I mean, it's a it's a weird set of fixations. almost in every situation that he is in. This is not the way it should be. This is the way I like it.

I go to a I, I go to a hotel. Well, I don't want to wear those slippers if they're not in cellophane. So. So aides have to go out to get him the slippers in cellophane. This is not the kind of candy I like. This is the kind of candy. So it's all it's. I think you could say it's one. It's childish at this level. I want what I want when I want it, but it's also a kind. of a particular,

a particularity that is obsessive to, to a degree. Well, and I think probably also he doesn't want to be on the plane. because it was Biden's plane, and before that it was a bomb as plane. And so that's all before. that, actually, it was his plane and then it was Obama's plane. But that sense of obviously, I think what he likes about Grift Force One is that. he's the first president to ride it, and he's going to take with him. It's. Yeah. I'm sorry. Sorry for interrupting, but. which is perhaps the first time I've.

I nearly passed out. Michael. I almost did a coffee spit, but I have a have a thing because it just. I just flashed on that that when he travels, when he's out on the campaign trail and he has to stay overnight, which he hates to do, but when forced to do that, then it's very particular about the kind of hotels. that he likes to stay in, that he's that that he's that he's willing to stay in. And, and it's always a chain hotel and it always is the newest chain hotel.

Right. Because he because he equates new with luxury or new with clean perhaps. And yet we know from. from reports that he throws. his ice cream cartons and his candy wrappers. on the floor of his bedroom in the white House. He's a messy eater. Yeah. No, no, I mean, it is. I mean, it's I mean, one of the one of the great descriptions.

I had was, was in this hotel, particular hotel room, I think this was in, in, in Iowa with literally the candy wrappers. This was compared to like, like fall leaves on the ground. You just went you just threw them. The poor cleaning out that noise as you walk. through of of of not leaves, but of the wrappers from the Milky Way's air. Well. And and also there were reports when he stayed in London.

with the royal family that he'd left the bedroom in a terrible state. The royal cleaners were completely surprised. that the American president would have left the room in this, in this situation. But it's a sort of I guess it's a kind of weird, passive aggressive thing. And other people clear up after you. So another person that's got some clearing up to do, Graham Plattner. platters, has suspended his campaign and left the Dems in Maine in a mess.

With two weeks, just over two weeks to find a new candidate. to face down Susan Collins and try and win back the Senate. No, extraordinary. And it goes to where the Democrats are at this, at this, this point in time, not only the broader the broader goals to win back the Senate, but the more specific question of how did they get into this mess. Right? And there was a.

editorial board column in the times today. We're recording this on Thursday morning saying that the problem with Plattner. is that the Dems are looking for personalities. to mask the apparent fact they have no policy. And that may be the first person to have read a well, I often I don't always agree with them, but I thought I thought this one. was a good one, that in fact what they're trying to do is say. personality is not a platform, the Dems need a platform.

and we really don't know what the platform is. What do they think about the economy? What do they think about immigration? What do they think about AI? We know that they think never Trump, but we don't know much else right now. I mean, it's a little off point because I mean, this is a local race. This is a, you know, a grain Platner is not running for. or was not running for president of the United States. He was running for a Senate, a seat in the.

in the Senate from Maine to represent Maine in the Senate. That's how we work. I mean, this is actually you still have to have some policies. that differentiate you from Susan Collins. Well, we do know what. Graham. Well, yeah, we don't know. But in in Graham Plattner I'm not I'm not sure that that would be the. that's the most relevant issue to people to people in Maine. I mean, we do know that he was that. certainly in contrast to Susan Collins Collins that he was.

I mean, he had staked out this, this thing that this is the, the the. you know, I'm a I'm a working man, I represent. That's who I want to represent. I represent a whole range of, of, of economic views that are, that are antithetical to, to corporate America, to billionaire America, to Trump America. and, and to boot.

And very specifically, I, I have taken a position against Israel. So there are very I don't know what the times is talking about actually. Actually, they're very lonely that they don't like these views, that these are, that there are a series of views taken by. certain by Plattner. and by other of these insurgent Democrats. that are, you know, clear policy views. I mean, they may not be policy views.

that are embraced by the rest of the Democratic Party, because the Democratic Party might be lagging behind on this issue, or the Democratic Party might be at an internal war. But there are real policy issues that are going on here. I think that the issue is that Schumer's a selected Janet Mills, the 78 year. old governor of Maine, to to run for this seat. And I'm sure with a perfectly, you know, with a with a logic.

that that might have seemed obvious but was unchallenged, which is, well, she's a vote getter in Maine and and why not? Without focusing on the fact that one of the central issues. among the Democratic electorate is that is a generational issue. So, so suddenly Graham Plattner became the contrast gainer. He was not a a 78 year old.

politician, a career politician, selected by a. by the by the rest of the Geran. of the Democratic Party. And so, so I think what we can put this part of this problem. back onto Schumer, who is a problem for the Democrats, a larger and larger problem for the Democrats. And, you know, and then there is this, this, this other thing.

that there is a clearly a. style. Dichotomy within the. the appreciation of what. a politician should be. You know, Democrats have been you know, I don't know. I mean, Democrats are fake. Plattner is real. You know, Democrats, professional Democrats. have have become are.

And this is true in the Republican Party too. And we'll get to Mitch McConnell have become this this, this administrative class. And and they bear. you know, little little. there. They just don't there isn't just no identification. with people who suddenly want to identify with politicians.

And Graham Plattner offered that I'm a real guy now. That became his problem. You know, the problem with real people. is that they are real and that they have real problems. And the fact that Graeme Plattner, you know, seemed well, he seemed rough, a little rough around the edges, which people thought would be a good thing. And of course, it turned out he was. I mean, we can go further than that. He seemed kind of like a drunk and well, he seemed like it turns out he was a drunk.

It seemed like he was a reformed drunk, that he'd had a, you know, I mean, people were making excuses for him saying he had PTSD. from his service in the military, but he wanted to serve. I got an interesting text from someone who's involved. in getting some of the veterans elected. You know, there's a whole group of young veterans. who've served who want to carry on serving beyond the military. And I got this note yesterday about Plattner.

Yeah, Plattner is a hot mess. He's a guy who did this running for largely good reasons to serve purpose. But of course, there is his ego cover of time. I didn't realize. he'd been on the cover of time, and he is deeply because this time, and no one time magazine actually doesn't matter really exist. It doesn't really exist. So. Well, that's why I didn't know he'd been on the cover of Out There. Yes, but he carried on. He's deeply wounded. It's believable to me that he put himself on the woman who just came out.

publicly in such a way, especially if he was heavily drunk, as she notes. he was, and then never had the decency or courage to speak with her after. If that is true, that she reached out and asked for an apology. And there is, of course, other stuff, probably not yet in the public domain. On top of it all, I'm not sure he can hack it as a senator. If he was elected, he should drop for his own sake and others. Well, obviously this is and this is somebody. who just came to this conclusion yesterday.

No, no, this was this was before Plattner had dropped out. But it was just someone who's been very involved in looking for. different kinds of candidates to address your point that a lot of, well, not a lot, but some Democratic candidates feel fake. or feel like they're they're tied to a party line. A lot of Democratic candidates, a lot of also Republican candidates feel fake. I mean, they are they have they have.

You know, it's an interesting thing in the in the age of mass media coverage, they've protected themselves in such a way, protected them, their lives, their language, their look, their feel in ways that made them opaque. And suddenly you have a you have a media, social media. who wants a different kind of authenticity, a different kind of personality, a different kind of look and feel. So those people are at odds.

And this is, of course, magnified by Donald Trump, who is to say the least, real appalling, of course. But he is. He is. He's also a hot mess, a hot mess of a president. Exactly. And then we have all the things. I mean, what he has been accused of is, is certainly as bad. or worse than what Graeme Plattner has been accused of. And that's a whole other issue of why the Democrats are.

are in this, in this position and confronting this at a level. that the Republicans don't seem to believe they have to confront. Right. Well, it's a good thing that they're getting rid of. of toxic candidates, Eric Swalwell being another one. It is. But then it then it becomes the thing. What is a real person? And a real person seems to have to be a toxic person to, or else you're not real.

I don't know, I mean, well, it would be nice to have some real people who aren't accused rapist. Of course he's he's denied the allegations. We should say. Platanus, denied the allegations of rape, said it's not true. Yeah. And it's. But but even so, even before PTSD, well, maybe it's not such a good idea to. to have your, your favorite son a.

Survivor. Well on the allegations are very similar to what Pete. faced during his Senate confirmation. Right. Exactly. From the Republican side, I mean, think of RFK Jr. I mean, you can go down the list of Republicans that have. that have shrugged, essentially just shrug this off. Yeah. I mean, Pete. also accused, you know, Joni. Ernst said that she was very concerned about it. looked like she was going to be a holdout and then was confronted.

with leaking details of her own messy divorce. and quickly hopped back on the bandwagon to confirm him. But but almost identical allegations. And again, both men clearly having had a traumatic war. So do you think that Aegean Carol will finally get. some money out of Donald Trump? He's doing everything he can to avoid it. But it looks like yesterday a judge made a decision that it's enough and it's time.

And Donald Trump has to pay her the 5 million she's due. I think that is that is in escrow. So the judge has ordered that to be released. So I guess it does go to her. I don't know if if the Trump side can appeal that and, you know, and try to at least try to delay that, that result. But it does sound like that's going to happen.

now and I don't know what. So the other the other judgment, which was 83 million, is still wending its way through the court. So that is she has she has yet to get that. But that also, by the way, is in in escrow account. for I think, I think he had to put up a bond for that. So this, this money is all of this.

money is there and all of this money. should eventually get to her, which is not going to make Donald Trump happy. Well, it'll go to pay her lawyers because this has been such a long case. Right. And well, if there's this is. I certainly hope her lawyers are not going to cost her $90 million. No. Well, I hope so, too. I hope so too. But no Aegean Carol, who I think leaves. a relatively modest life, actually will hopefully enjoy this.

And she said she was going to give the money to women's. causes and, you know, sexual violence causes. Now the, the other and I remember the moments during the campaign when these. when these judgments came down and in which it, it appeared that. that Donald Trump would have to, would have to put up the cash. or put up a bond or put up so much money to ensure the, the, the bond.

that it looked like it would force his, that it could come close to forcing his bankruptcy. and that he would have to be that there were certain major assets. for the Wall Street building that he that. that he owns, for instance, that, that the court would have. the court was literally on the verge of, of, of taking his property.

Now, let's compare that to the $2 billion. he has earned in the. in the 17 months, 17 months that he has been. president. Hopefully Dean Carol will actually get some cash then. So would we give cash for a proof of life video of Mitch McConnell? How is it possible that he's lying there and no one has sneaked out a photo?

I you know, I, I'm I'm interested in two things here. I'm interested in the fact that that that that people are. so on top of this, I mean, as and I think, I think we've, we've, we've discussed this or at least. you and I have discussed this and I mean, Mitch McConnell is. is of little consequence at this at this point. I mean, he's no longer a figure. I mean, we've known that he's been sick for a long time, significantly sick.

He stepped out of any kind of holding any kind of power within the Senate. And he's not running for reelection. So what's the issue about him? And I think to answer my question, I think he's profoundly. hated and he's hated probably for, for. for, you know, an historic reason that he is the guy,

one of the Republicans who could have stopped Donald Trump. And also understanding that Mitch McConnell was never a Trump. believer, actually, he was always a Trump hater and Trump hated him. And yet Mitch McConnell never raised the finger. And he he he very well could have. I mean, in the impeachment in.

in after Trump's. Trump's second impeachment, Mitch McConnell could have was aware. that he could have and considered that he might. well come down on the side of conviction in the Senate. And if he had come down. on the side of conviction in the Senate, Trump would have been convicted. And Trump, therefore, would have been been precluded from running for office again. So Trump certainly, the second Trump term is in Mitch.

McConnell's was in Mitch McConnell's hands and is on Mitch McConnell's head. Well, and I'm sure that's true from the Republicans. I think a lot of Republicans hate him to and of course, the Democrats, because he held up the appointment of Merrick Garland, the Supreme Court, thus delivering. Who was he delivering at that point? Was it Neil Gorsuch, but delivering. a concert at the beginning of the conservative court?

And of course, his hostility to Obama once. they won back the Senate in the midterms after Obama's. first well, during Obama's first administration. I mean, that's certainly true. My gut, though, is that the hatred here and it's a hatred among Republicans. I mean, Republicans, you know, there there there's a. a not so secret underground of Republicans who would have breathed. an incredible sigh of relief if Donald Trump had been convicted.

and if there was no second term of, of, of of Donald Trump. And they couldn't do this because Mitch wouldn't do it. So there's a whole conspiracy theory. that Mitch McConnell is essentially on life support. He's in the hospital. They're keeping him alive. So there's no need for a special election in Kentucky, where he's still got his seat until November. The election in the special election in Kentucky would produce another Republican.

Well, except that Andy Beshear, your friend, who's the governor of Kentucky in Democratic governor. in a red state, gets to a point, the senator. Except that's not true, except for the fact that that is not true. He doesn't get to a point he doesn't get. There has to be a special election. That was actually the law change a couple couple of years ago, precisely in anticipation actually, of of this.

So in theory, Andy Beshear, who's the governor, Democratic governor. in a in a red state, has said has demanded a public health update. He's been hospitalized now, Mitch, for three weeks. And the governor has finally said, what's going on here? We we need some kind of progress report. Yeah. I mean, but to no, no real point.

I mean, I guess the point is transparency and one has the right to know, and certainly that would be the side that you would want to, especially. the Democratic governor would want to be on the Democratic governor, who is himself likely running for president. So this is a bit of posturing, because the truth is that if. if Mitch is is dead or incapacitated. or whatever, the standard would be that you have to in in Kentucky,

you have to call a special election that would result in another Republican. So the, the, the the issues here are not are not. Not really all that meaningful. There is not going to be any change. in the, in the, the nature of the, of the Senate. if Mitch McConnell if there has to be a special election. So I really think it's just it is a person that Mitch McConnell. comes out of this as a.

As a, as a truly hated figure. because of, because he did not stand and could have stood in the way. He did not stand in the way of Donald Trump's reelection. And the irony here is, of course, that Mitch McConnell. hated Donald Trump and Donald Trump hated Mitch McConnell. And I'm sure Elaine Chao, Mitch McConnell's wife, also hated Donald Trump.

She was his transport secretary. She also worked for under George Bush. And of course, she had a sister who died in a terrible scenario. where she was in a Tesla which went under water. She by accident, backed into a piece of. a body of water on her property and ended up dying, couldn't get out of the car after spending the evening with some girlfriends. and and Elaine Chao, who is herself the daughter of a billionaire,

has been in China since her husband's been ill, which has led to all sorts of conspiracies. And Marjorie Taylor Greene, clearly anxious and fulminating for attention. and missing her platform in Congress, has been saying that it's very clear. that she's a spy and that this is all very odd indeed. And Laura. Loomer, who we know is the president's sort of whisperer of certain things, has has been telling everybody that Mitch is now in a persistent vegetative state.

So with friends like Laura Loomer and Marjorie Taylor Greene. or what do you want? And this is becoming a kind of theme. Well, we don't have three yet, so it's just two. Three makes it a theme. But but the this coming on the heels of the new Jersey. congressman, Tom Kean, Tom Kean, who was mysteriously in the hospital for. or mysteriously. out of commission for weeks and weeks.

Yeah, missed 146 votes. Yes. And who has just returned to announce that he was. he was suffering from depression and and had been, as we used to say in new Jersey, institutionalized. Can you think of any other job where you disappear for three weeks? Nobody knows what's happened to you and then your your mates. So John Thune, in this case, Senate majority leader, says it's all good.

I spoke to him. He's absolutely fine. He's absolutely fine. I mean, if if you disappeared from the podcast, Michael, that would make no sense if you disappeared from the podcast. And I called and said, well, where's Michael? Where is he? And someone said, oh, he's absolutely fine. He's absolutely fine. But you just disappeared. You would be we would stop doing the podcast. How is it possible that these politicians get away with this? No wonder people feel that they're not represented properly. No wonder no one can do this in a job.

No one can just disappear for three weeks, you know. I'll bet. I'll bet CEOs often disappear for not without telling, not without telling their shareholders what's wrong with them. I'm. You know, I would not be so sure about that. But, I. mean, the John Thune thing is, is interesting. because if Mitch is dead or in a vegetative vegetative state. or in some other way incapacitated, incapacitated.

And John Thune has said, I spoke to him and he's fine. Well, that's the disparity. there is is going to be pretty hard to spin. A matter of fact, so hard to spin that I would think. that actually, it probably is. There is probably some way John Thune knows that there is some way. to spin this, that John, that, that, that, that, that Mitch is probably,

you know, not in great shape, but he'll, he'll, he'll emerge to walk. with, with two people supporting him on each side and, and he'll wink or something or blink or. and that. will be, that will be a stand in for a living. Mitch I don't I. Otherwise, I don't know how Jonathan could have said, well, John Thune said, I spoke to him, which he may well have done.

We don't know the Mitch McConnell. And very specifically they they didn't say Mitch McConnell spoke back. I mean, John, who might have said, Mitch, I've been told you can hear me. It's John, your friend. We're all rooting for you. We don't know that, Mitch responded. I hope your friend Governor Bashir gets to the bottom of it. Do you think he stands a chance running for the Democratic leadership? Well, I think I mean, my friend, my my friendship is based on a dinner in the Hamptons.

You know, the politicians come through the Hamptons because this is where the money is. And occasionally I get invited to a dinner with a politician. Why? I'm not sure. Because, believe me, the money does not come from me. But. And he. probably one of the interesting guests. And he was, I know, I mean, I found him a very, you know, reasonable and approachable and, and intelligent and all of the good things that you can.

that you might say about a man who was going to. Sume a, you know, a in administrative. driven, policy driven office. And that, I guess, would I guess, I guess is good on. But the other side of that was he was boring to a fall. spoke in policy paragraphs.

It was like, you know, everybody I mean it was a small dinner, but everybody looking at their watches or checking their phones. Oh that's good. So he was boring to a fault. So he does all the things that you want. a serious president to do, but he's too boring to be elected. Yeah. So I mean, and I think that is the thing that's the, the moment that we, we are. we are in logically you would say, what does it matter. if if he's boring, if he is a command over the job,

if he's a reasonable person, if he has thought this through, great. But that's not the reality. The reality is that you want to, you know, a, you know, PTSD drunk. Well, we also want proof of life videos of Mitch McConnell. So if you have one, let us know, please. So we will be back on Saturday to discuss a question.

that both of us are very vexed by, which is has Donald. Trump won the Epstein files. So we're going to get into that on Saturday. Have they beaten the rap? Has he beaten the rap? We have a ton of limericks. I discovered an entire email channel, which I didn't know about, which has got loads of limericks in it, but I've just chosen one for today. And this is by Alexandra Corker Hamill.

I love the beast. Knightley and Daley the elephant rather acts snail. I join in the laughter about guys they are. after and wish we would have an Old Bailey. Old Bailey being the symbol of justice. It must be a British. I think it's Limerick. Yes, I think it's a British Limerick East. Well, if you have been, thank you for joining us. Don't forget to subscribe to The Daily Beast if you haven't. We're independent media. The reason we can bring you these conversations is because we are.

genuinely independent, and your support makes a huge difference to us. You can become a friend of the beast. You can be a beast tier member. with all sorts of benefits, but please subscribe if you haven't. And big thanks to our production team. Michael. Take it away. Ryan, Rachel, John, Neil, Heather and Max the intern. Max the intern.

So the good news is we have so many beast tier members now. There are too many names to read out and we really appreciate your support.