Ken Burns (Full Episode) | Conan O'Brien Needs A Friend

[music]. >> Hi, my name is Ken Burns and I feel. hopeful about being Conan O'Brien's. friend. >> Well, Ken, you shouldn't be because this. is the takedown interview. >> Right. >> Of Ken Burns. This is you have coasted. way too long. >> 50 years of coasting. >> Uh. just oh everybody loves their Ken Burns. This this is the end of that streak for. you. >> That's why all the henchmen are here. >> Yeah, get him, boss. >> [laughter]. >> Get him, boss. >> I have with me two people who don't.

read. >> [laughter]. >> I'm pretty sure they don't write. >> We read magazines. >> They Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot about Us. magazine. That does count [laughter] as. >> Us magazine? >> Yeah. Uh is that still a magazine? I. don't know. Okay, whatever. Um. >> [laughter]. >> my 1990s is showing. Uh. >> [music]. >> Hey there. Welcome to Conan O'Brien. Needs a Friend. Joined by Sona. Movsesian. >> Hi. >> Matt Gourley is out. He is on paternity.

leave and we wish him and his lovely. family the best. God, I'm smooth. And. then. David Hopping joining us. How are you, David? >> How are you? >> Uh Sona, you um. you said that you heard from your father. >> Yes. >> Gil. >> Gil. >> Uh was this yesterday or the other day? >> last night, yeah. >> Last night he called you and he was. unhappy. What happened? >> He texted me. He was angry. He saw a. clip online and he got angry about. something I said. And you know, my.

parents are you know, they're. traditional people. >> Yeah. >> And I am I'm I have I got a mouth. And why are you laughing so hard? >> you know what, Sona? You're a modern. woman of the world. >> Thank you. >> You've been here, you've been there, you've been to Porter Square. You have. been You've seen it all. Some say you've. done it all and your father. >> Yeah. >> was born in a very small village. >> Yes, he was. >> Where was this? >> This was in in Turkey, what used to be.

Armenia, thank you very much. But yeah, he was born in Turkey and he um was in a. small village, immigrated here. They're. traditional people, my parents. And I. say a lot of things on this podcast that. are not traditional things. And so. yesterday he texted me and he's like, I. can't believe you talk like that on the. on the podcast. And he said, you you're. you're a mother, you have kids. Like he. he went on for and I was like, oh my. god, my dad's actually upset. >> Yeah. >> But I. couldn't think of which clip he would.

have been upset about. >> I say jizz so many times on this. podcast. >> I talk about dicks. I talk about. vaginas. I talk about like heated. rivalry all the time. I couldn't I was. like telling Taka, I was like, did I is. there one thing that was egregious? >> saying to Santa Claus, thanks for the. gift. >> [laughter]. >> And Santa's like, what? You know what I. mean? And then he's got to think about. the 55 billion gifts he's giving out. >> [laughter]. >> Right? But you are yeah, you're the. Santa Claus of filth. You just.

constantly [laughter]. it's butts, it's buns, uh you know, you. you love it. Uh and so what did you say? Did you. defend yourself to your dad? >> No, I was just like I I really needed to. figure out which thing upset him. >> Mhm. >> So I said, which clip? And then he said, me I appeared on my friend Rick's. podcast. >> Rick, yeah. >> You Rick Glassman. And he I was on his. podcast and he we released a clip not. even from this one. So I'm like, clearly. he never watches this podcast cuz.

otherwise he'd be really pissed. >> Yeah. >> It was that podcast and I I watched. >> talking about that got him. >> the I said the word like twice. >> Okay, wait a minute. >> And he was upset about it. >> So what is it? So he can't ever listen. to this podcast? >> Never. >> Because I saw some of you with Rick and. it was very tame compared to what you do. every day here. >> Yes. >> Now, let me paint a picture for the. people listening. Your father. uh is a very distinguished, very. handsome. >> Yes. >> uh an older gentleman. He's got a uh big.

white mustache. >> Okay. >> does he not? >> I knew where you were going with the. mustache. >> Does he not. >> He's always had a mustache. >> Pinocchio, Geppetto. He [laughter] does. Does he not? Does he bear a resemblance. to. Geppetto? Just say. >> Yeah, a little. He's a little. Geppetto-ish. >> Yeah, have you ever noticed that your. brother. has hinges where his joints should be? Have you ever noticed that? [laughter]. AND DOES YOUR REMEMBER when you were. growing up, your brother would say, "I.

wish I could be a real boy.". >> [laughter]. >> Do you remember? Do you remember? >> Oh, you're you're actually asking me. >> your father carved your brother. >> Okay. [laughter]. >> That he is in fact Geppetto. Um. and I do hope that someday Danny becomes. a real boy. But that is yes. >> I'm fine with my dad you saying these. things cuz my dad does not watch this. podcast. Obviously. Cuz how can he not. be mad about the thousands of things. I've said on this podcast? >> uh you are just I'm thinking of like a. sprinkler shooting water. You're a.

sprinkler that just shoots filth, but. you get filth on every single part of. the lawn. You know, the lawn is is. [snorts] saturated with filth. >> Why are you acting like you're an. innocent guy? Which one of us has a a. voice for their penis? Not me. What's. your penis's voice like? >> Hey, leave me out of this. [laughter]. Hey, everybody back off. Cut it out. >> [laughter]. >> I was just in here in these briefs. minding my own business.

>> [laughter]. >> My penis is always reading a tiny copy. of the New Yorker. >> Oh, this is great. >> [laughter]. >> There's some good cartoons in this one. >> Um. >> This is your You created this. environment. >> Uh. >> Okay. >> Anyway, that's not the point. The point. is that your parents need to accept who. you are. I think that's important. They. need to see the real you and I know you. get into it with your mom a lot. You. guys have your differences because I.

think that you were quite. um. I think you were a lot to handle when. you were growing up. Were you not? >> I was. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, I was. >> how are you and Nadia doing these days? >> We're cool. I love her and I love my. dad. >> Of course you do. >> And I do there are times when I say. things where I think, "Oh man, their. friends will listen to this one day.". But then I kind of forget what I say. And also, I mean, my dad like he was. just like tone it down a little. And I. was like, "I don't know how to do that.". >> you can't. No, you can't.

You can't do that, you know. >> something about if we have a. conversation about dicks and stuff, like. how are we not supposed to talk about. dicks? >> out that you're usually the one that. brings it up. You know, the topic is not dicks and. then you chime in a little bit. >> Yeah. >> That's say, "I've seen a dick or two.". >> [laughter]. >> That's not what happens. You bring I'm. usually talking about Woodrow Wilson and. then you say, "Did he have a cock?". [laughter]. And I'm like, "Well, I guess he did.". >> Oh my god. >> Uh but you know what I mean? That's.

usually how it goes. So, this is on you. and you'll have to pay for this. >> poo poo pee pee humor. >> Yeah, yeah, you do. >> do. I that's my. >> to say I can relate somewhat because um. my parents very, very staunch, good, old-school Catholics. >> Yes. >> And they watched every episode of my. show starting in 1993. and what a cavalcade of horrific sights, sounds, and smells. And um and they were.

always they would always just my you. know, my mother would say. we do a show with the masturbating bear. and then, you know, a talking whatever. >> money shot Lincoln. >> Lincoln and all this stuff and my mother. would say, "Well, I just thought you. looked lovely last night.". >> [laughter]. >> That tie you were wearing. And she would. always go to the thing that she because. she And so, she never not once said, "Oh, you know, you got to stop that.". Not once. Oh, my god. She knew I was bringing in. the Benjamins.

>> [laughter]. >> And that meant they got a ham for. Christmas. Anyway, hey Gil, we love you and your your. daughter's doing a great job and I agree. with you. She's she's horrible. Okay. [laughter]. >> He almost nice. >> He didn't say I was horrible. My dad didn't say I was horrible. >> No, but I did I also give him a lot of. credit. He carved your brother. He. carved him. >> You start off being nice to my dad and. then you started talking about how he's.

doing it. >> times in my life have we been in a. restaurant or anywhere and I have. secretly taken my napkin, scrunched it. up and turned it into a giant mustache, put it under my nose and said, "Hey, Sona Gil wants to talk to you." And I. have a maybe 2 and 1/2 ft long. white mustache under my nose. >> I don't think we've ever had a meal. without you doing Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Yeah. >> It's like you wear glasses and not being. able to do a bit. >> If there's and if there's no. if I didn't have a napkin for any. reason, they hadn't put out the napkin.

yet or there was a mistake, I would tear. the tablecloth. >> Yeah. >> off the table smashing all the plates, put it under my nose and say, "Your. father's here to speak to you.". >> Yeah. >> That's the beauty of our friendship. >> able to watch this. >> Or it's a it's a podcast. You really. should be listening. Here we go. Today's guest is one of the most. influential documentary filmmakers of. all time. His latest docu-series, The. American Revolution, is available to. stream on pbs.org and the PBS app. And. >> If we leave he's the guest.

>> He is the guest. >> After this [laughter] intro. >> He is the guest. And I'm curious to hear what he has to. say. about and jizz. >> [laughter]. >> and butts and buns. and poo-poo and pee-pee. This wonderful, wonderful [laughter]. historian who has brought the fabric of. what is America. >> [laughter]. >> into our lives, refreshed it, and uh is a just the very best that. America has [laughter] to offer poo-poo.

pee-pee. Ken Burns, welcome. Uh Ken, I am thrilled that you're here. We've spoken a couple of times, but uh I. your. your your series on the American. Revolution uh was an absolute delight. Loved it. And fascinating for me because I grew up. in Massachusetts, right outside Boston. in Brookline, Mass.

And there's a couple of times when. you're explaining. um the the Siege of Boston, where you. cut to a map, and in the slight low left. corner it says Brookline and shows a few. hills. And I stand up. >> [laughter]. >> like a nerd and cheer, and I'm like, "Brookline!". >> [laughter]. >> And then try to act like I can take. credit, though my people were still. firmly in Ireland at the time,

uh hitting each other with sticks. So, >> [laughter]. >> uh so there's no way I can claim any. credit for uh. >> Well, if you look in the bigger maps as. they pull out in New Hampshire, there's. always Walpole, this tiny little. village. The only reason why I justified. it, I've lived there for 47 years, is. that Walpole Gazette was this very. well-respected, well-read, up and down. the colonies sort of rag sheet that you. know, had opinions and thoughts and and. and and was part of it. So, I I. justified the little hometown shout-out,

too. >> Well, um. >> [laughter]. >> and I saw what you were doing and I. thought it was pathetic. I told you this would be the the. takedown. >> This is the takedown, right? >> Um. you know, it's I'm such an easy. point to make. Everything that. everyone's dealing with in your series. are things that we are dealing with now. And at the time, I don't know, when is. this come out? >> It's been out. >> No, you're I mean I know yours is out, but I'm talking about this. Yeah, this. podcast, okay?

>> I was told this was live. >> Yeah, yeah, this is going to. >> I did Joe Rogan, it was live. >> No, yeah, no, it wasn't. No, no, Joe. Rogan's [laughter] a different. situation. Right. No, Joe Rogan's different. He's. brave, he's puts it out live. We are We. sit with These are sent to a laboratory. >> Right. >> Where they're scrubbed of any opinions. >> Right. >> or, um, you know, possible woke. diatribes. So, uh that's just [laughter]. not going to happen here. But. you know, at the time.

And it will surely be another crisis. when this is airing, but at the time. that this drops, this episode, um, will. be, uh, about a month from now. Right? >> This episode's probably going to be two. to three months from now. >> Two to three months? >> April, yeah. >> Why are we even here? This is insane. >> Yeah, what's the two to. >> to three months from now, I mean we I. don't know where we'll be. >> We have a very packed release schedule, but we wanted to make sure this. happened. >> Okay. Well, I would like to I mean, I. was really excited about this one. I I. hate the other guests we're talking to.

I mean, I loathe them. The one that whatever's one is out now. or the one last week or the one two. weeks from now, these people are my. enemies. >> Good friends of yours? >> Yeah, awful. >> [laughter]. >> Dreadful people. I was excited about this, and now you. tell me that it's coming out a year from. April? >> [laughter]. >> The release schedule is always movable. if we if we want to. >> The 256 is really important, too. >> [laughter]. >> I said, LET'S DO THIS. >> LOOK, LOOK, WE'RE GOING to be. celebrating 250 [laughter] if we survive. until.

Yes. Yeah. Yes, you're right. With hope. Yeah.

Right.

Ranker.

Yeah. >> is to is to be disciplined like Odysseus. tied to the lashed to the mast where you. where you can see hear that the those. echoes, but you don't go, "Oh, isn't. this so much like today?" I mean, the.

revolution has a failed invasion of. Canada. It has a standing army that. precipitates this war in Boston. It has. a big. continent-wide epidemic or epidemics. plural that kills more people than the. revolution and also. engenders a huge debate on the part of. Washington about inoculating the army. And finally. which many historians think is the best. military decision he made. So, you know, plus ça change as the French who came to. our aid and without whose help we don't. have a country would say.

>> Yeah, well, the. uh. again, watching that and as you said. smallpox is a there's a a terrible. scourge that looks like it's going to. cost us the war. Uh and um what to do. about that and they're making decisions. about inoculation that. we're struggling with today, which is a. little mind-blowing to me as the son of. a a scientist and physician. Um I I have. a hard time with that. >> Yeah. >> But, um you know, I so many people will.

say to me, "Oh, but you know, now we. have the internet." And I think, "Yeah, that's true, but they had broadsides. back then. They had They had their. version of the internet. They had people. saying irresponsible, inflammatory. things all the time and everybody's. reading it.". >> Sam Sam Adams is a failure as a brewer. and a tax collector, uh but he's really good as a. propagandist who says, "My job is to. keep my fellow citizens alive to their. grievances.".

>> Yes. >> Sound familiar? There are people today. within whose interest it is to keep up. the divisions between people rather than. show the fact that these divisions, which accounts for your and my 51 52%, are a mile wide but a kind of an inch. thick. And that what you want, the. ability to transcend the dialectic of. yes and no, one and zero, red state, blue state, is to tell a good story cuz. it has a kind of benign Trojan horse. effect. It kind of oh, yeah. This is who we were, this is who we are.

It's very, very similar. Same same. degree of virtue and venality, same. degree of generosity and greed, same. degree of, you know, make up your own. alliteration. >> Yeah, and I think you know, when I grew. up, there used to be this kind of. hagiography about the American. Revolution and we would get these. textbooks, you know, George Washington chopped down the. cherry tree and I cannot tell a lie and, you know, these people were represented. us as the represented to us as these. marble men who were infallible and then. what I've loved about my lifelong. obsession with history is you see.

um. you know, George Washington is a very. impressive man in a lot of ways. He's. also a slave holder. We we always have. to accept that both sides of the story. We both we have to accept that and I. like my, you know, these humans to be. human beings. >> Yeah, and I think that's the only way we. can actually take a measure of. inspiration from them. If they're just. the gods, then they don't do something.

We just feel like mortals. We're flawed, we know that. They're not, they're. perfect, they never tell a lie. But I. think we go back to heroism, the Greeks. were trying to talk about it as. something that was a war within people, between. warring factions, you know, some you. know, that Achilles had his heel and his. hubris to go along with his great. strengths. And that what they're setting. up are stories, good stories that remind. us that we are all likewise um divided.

within ourselves and we have chances to. sort of tilt towards that virtue or tilt. towards that venality. And so I think. with the revolution it's understandable. why we've made it bloodless and gallant. You know, we we got some big ideas in. Philadelphia. We don't want them to be. diminished, which we think if we admit. this is a bloody civil war, a bloody. revolution, and a bloody world war, the. fourth or fifth over the prize of North. America. And that George Washington, the. man without whom we don't have a. country, and there's very few times in. world history where you can say it's. literally one person that holds it.

together. Deeply flawed, as you point. out, rash, rides out on the battlefield. risking his life, which means the entire. cause, uh makes a couple of really bad. tactical. >> Really screws up in New. >> Really screws up in New York and at. Brandywine and a couple of other places. where the just the luck doesn't fall. But he's able to inspire people to fight. in the dead of night, pick subordinate. talent without any worry about whether. they're better generals than him. He's. happy to. >> Can I just say something? This is what I. do. Yeah. Now you're going to say. >> [laughter]. >> talk about you're going to say oh this.

is insane. but I I'm very like Washington. I am. first of all I'm tall very tall very. tall. >> He was maybe six six. >> six two. >> Sure everyone here is inoculated against. smallpox. >> Right. >> Um I I pick looking around for the. people I've picked who I think are good. Okay, well this isn't a good example. this room. [laughter]. But. no, but I think I'm I'm very much like. Washington. [laughter]. Um. >> So his other his biggest and most. important thing besides convincing. people that they were not Georgians or.

New Hampshirites but Americans and. deferring to Congress is that he gave up. his power twice. So these people we're. going to really be so proud of you when. you just walk away. >> Yeah. >> [laughter]. >> Well, I don't like the way this has. gone. Um I do want to say one thing about. Washington that's long interested me. He. was kind of wide in the hips, wasn't he? Kind of a pear-shaped guy. I'm sorry, but he was. I hate to body shame our. first president [laughter] and someone. who. >> Hard to know. There are no photographs. and you got to trust Gilbert Stuart or.

Copley or others to give. >> Gore Vidal was the one who really. pointed it out in in one of his books. >> has some axes to grind, some founders to. take down, you know. >> Yeah. He really he portrays Washington. as humorless and goes out of his way to. talk about his wide hips and his big. butt. Um no, I'm sorry. Those are just. things I needed to get out there. Now, Ken, you're probably regretting being. here. You [laughter] think? I'm. You got enough friends. You're saying, "Well, how did this turn. this quickly?" [laughter].

Um. but. uh. >> How did you get me into. >> [laughter]. >> You know, more publicists have been. fired. after a Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend. taping. It's always the first thing. Why? Whose idea? You said. >> [laughter]. >> um. >> We do have something We have a few. things in common. One thing is that I. have read I'm addicted to reading. history and my. um my wife loves fiction. And she's.

always trying to get me to read fiction. as if eating my vegetables. >> Right. >> You know, eat your vegetables. And. um I I just have this burning desire to. know what happened. And if she's reading. this wonderful, powerful novel, I'm. like, "Yeah, BUT WHAT HAPPENED? THAT'S. JUST MADE UP." AND SO, she has wonderful. photos of me when we've gone on. vacations over our long marriage. on different beaches in a different. beautiful settings reading the most.

turgid, dark. uh books about, you know, uh. the gulags. >> Right. >> [laughter]. >> Yeah. I'm sitting there with like a rum. punch next to me. But she could be reading, you know, Solzhenitsyn. No, no, she's very well read and she's. always reading um yeah, she's reading. great stuff and she has convinced me. She's she's. >> No, no, no, there is as much drama in. what was and what is as anything the. human imagination makes up. But it's not. a choice because.

you you're going to lose Shakespeare if. you're not going to let people make. stuff up, right? You're going to lose a. lot of wonderful insight that comes from. whatever the license is that people take. to to sort of focus on our interior. lives and. why we're here and what we're supposed. to be doing and making of it. >> Yeah. I have to say even a. one of my I probably my favorite book is. a historical novel. Um The Killer Angels. Which is. >> me into the to do the Civil War. I.

finished reading that. >> true? >> Let me tell you this. I gave David. McCullough gave it to me. I finished. reading it on Christmas Day 1984. I was. visiting my dad in Michigan. Um and I said I know what I'm going to. do for my next film. And he said, "What's that, son?" And I said, "The. Civil War." And he goes, "What part?". And I said, "All of it." And he just. shook his head and walked out of the. room. >> Yeah. [laughter]. >> You know? >> Yeah. >> And um it was it was because the Civil. War had been looming over all the. subjects of the film I'd made in really.

bizarre ways on the on the Brooklyn. Bridge, on the Shakers, on the Statue of. Liberty, on on the Congress, on Thomas. Hart Benton, on on all the stuff Huey. Long, all of the stuff I had done. >> Mhm. >> And that or we're doing and that I just. couldn't figure out that this seemed to. be as Shelby Foote once said, you know, it's a American history is this clear. river that flows into a bloody lake that. flows out clear again. Not true, but the. idea that everything has to pass through. the Civil War was important to it. So,

yeah, I mean I Killer Angels. Have you. read uh The Raven by Marcus James? >> I have not. No. >> Very antiquated uh book um. 1920s. He won the Pulitzer Prize, I. think, for this or another one. He did a. biography first on Andrew Jackson, but. then he did one that The Raven is on Sam. Houston. And there is so much that. happens to Sam Houston before he's even. heard of the word Texas. I mean, he is. this close to the presidency. He's sort. of holding the governorship while Andrew.

Jackson is is uh at president. He's. going to be the next president for sure. He marries this young girl, his wife, and at some moment she leaves him. No, we do not know to this day why she did. Something sexual, an old lover, whatever. it was. He resigned the governorship. He. went to what is now Memphis, swam across. the Mississippi, and became big drunk, a. kind of dangerous, loose cannon Indian. agent across the Mississippi. And he.

still hasn't heard. He's had fought. duels in. in Congress. I mean, it's just about If. somebody gave me $180 million. and said you had to do a feature film, I'd do the life of of Sam Houston based. on on this. >> On the Raven. >> on the Raven. >> Well, you know, it's these There's so. many things that really happened in our. history and just in history in general. that if you wrote it as a screenplay, someone would say, "Eh, >> This is too much. >> Yeah. >> You know what I mean? This is You lost.

me. You know, Avatar is more believable. than this. You know what I mean? This thing you got a little crazy here. when he swims across the river and you. think, "No, no, this is all. >> All true. >> And and I think that's what's always. attracted me. so much to it. My dad was really into. history and I got into it and I. realized, "Oh, it's just stories." And. you know, Sona is. Sona is always giving me a hard time. You always make fun of me for reading so. much history. >> Well, you read a lot of history, but. like you don't read like 50 Shades of. Grey, for instance. I recommended books.

to you and you completely ignore me. >> Have you read 50 Shades of Grey? >> [laughter]. >> Haven't. >> Okay, this is your next. Your next This is your next documentary, Ken. >> I [laughter] did the blue and the gray, but. >> No, no. It's like the blue and the gray, >> [laughter]. >> but a little different. >> It's bluer. >> Imagine the Civil WAR WITH SPANKING. >> [laughter]. >> UH YEAH. UM, LISTEN. >> Foote [laughter] said Shelby Foote said. to me once, I was struggling over how to.

tell something and he goes. and you how to tell that like a very. complicated thing between. Chancellorsville, Vicksburg, and. Gettysburg and and he just said God is. the greatest dramatist. Meaning just. don't stop doing what everybody else. does, which is do either all of. Vicksburg before Gettysburg or do all of. Gettysburg after Vicksburg. You divide. it up and say when it happened, you. know, and just stop and go. >> Tell what happened. >> Tell what happened. And then he said, just think about it. Um, Lee surrenders. to Grant and a few days later Lincoln,

who's been working 18 hours a day, has. enough time to go to the theater. I. mean, I I've had a few projects which. which shall remain nameless with various. places in this town where people are. wanted to adapt something we've done. And the stuff that's good is the stuff. that's true. And the stuff that's made. up is the stuff that just cut doesn't. work. >> work. >> You say. he would never say that. Or he would. never do that. Or why did you need to. add that because this is already a life. that has that kind of if you brought it.

to a producer they go that can't. possibly have happened. Like the. building of the whole story of the. building of the Brooklyn Bridge, which. was my first film that PBS showed, was. exactly that. You could not make it up. >> I think there's um. I like anything that makes you stop cuz. I. spent so much of my life in New York. City living there and every time I pass. the Brooklyn Bridge. I think about what went into making that. and it used to be just this thing. Oh, there's the Brooklyn Bridge. And you we.

can all do that. But when you realize. that this is before people know what. happens when you submerge humans, you. know, at great depths. >> caissons disease. >> Uh, yes. And you put them in these. caissons and you submerge them down but. they don't know and and people are dying. these horrible deaths and. all the thought that went into it and. the lives that went into it and then. what it meant when it was completed and. it's beautiful and so I just appreciate.

when I read history. one of the things it does is it usually. makes me a little more optimistic which. is a strange thing to say because most. of the history I'm reading is very you. know many dark things happen. but I meet a lot of young people. who have this attitude that these are. end days and the the world is on fire. and it's all over for us. >> I had a friend in the financial industry. in in 2008 in the fall said this is a. depression and I said. you know in our depression.

in many cities. in America the animals in the zoo were. shot and the meat distributed to the. poor when that happens I'll agree we're. in a thing to me the optimism is a. natural recourse cuz you've you've seen. I mean there's something unprecedented. about the level of the perfidy and where. it's taking place. at this moment. but I've seen it in the story of Huey. Long I've seen it in in other places and. so you just realize you know you want to.

be on guard you just you know that other. 49% is talking really loudly but you you. can't history is a great great teacher. great great teacher. >> and it's also. uh. it's like a friend that can calm you. down and give you a little bit of. perspective when things are very dark. I've had so many people say to me it's. never been worse in this country than it. is now and I'll. yeah and I'll say uh. okay. um have you heard of the Civil War and.

do you know what was going on in the. Civil War and was going on in Vietnam. but we we um. we have. a lot of work to do and we have to be on. guard, and we have to speak up, but. um. there's so much, I mean. there's so much to be hopeful about. >> Yeah, great. >> And that. needs to get out there. And I think one. of the things that I've liked so much. about your work is that it's taking I. mean whether it's jazz or baseball, uh.

you're taking these things that are a. really important part of America and who. we are, and you're telling us about this. wonderful gift, but at the same time. you're telling us all the darkness. that's involved. You're just telling the. truth. You're not trying to push it one. way or the other. Yeah, calling balls. and strikes. And uh. I always. walk away feeling this sense of. nourishment. >> Yeah. >> That I've been taken care of. >> We live in a world, and that waitress.

and so many people are it's a highlight. reel. That's all it is. So, Babe Ruth, to take somebody ancient in baseball, only hits home runs on that highlight. reel. Babe Ruth struck out almost three times. as many times as he as he hit a home. run. Um he also comes up once every nine. times at bat, which means that sometimes. everything falls to a middle infielder. or a second baseman. The recent seventh. game of the World Series was exactly. that case, where the big the big. superstars didn't do the thing that the.

second baseman did, and that was the. difference. And I think that's a really. good simplistic analogy uh to history. You've got to call balls and strikes. And you have to be able to understand I. mean, you see the ball players who all. they hit the home run and they cross. home plate, and they thank God for. delivering that. They never do that when. they hit into a game-ending double play, right? >> Right. >> So, if there is that oversight. >> it's I always think if you're going to. thank God, you also have to blame him. >> Yeah, I've [laughter] always. >> And I want to see people doing that, striking out AND GOING, "I DEFY YOU,

GOD!". >> [laughter]. >> YOU KNOW, THE ONLY THING I'VE ever seen. is Pedro Martinez is is pulled off the. mound when the Red Sox are beginning to. lose something and he looks up as he's. being pulled off. I've never seen I. talked to him about it. I said I've. never seen anybody do it. But you go. back to the revolution, most of the. founders become particularly Jefferson D. is. They believe that there is some sort. of supreme being, supreme architect, divine providence, the supreme architect. of the universe, whatever they call it, who is disinterested in the affairs of.

us and it and makes no distinction. between faiths. What an unbelievably. great way to understand it. So it's my. obligation to sort of be better. Pursue. happiness was not objects in a. marketplace of things, but lifelong. learning in a marketplace of ideas. It. to be more virtuous to earn the right of. citizenship, but then also present. myself as moving closer through my. actions to whatever that higher being. is. It's a really great way to conduct.

yourself and they also understood the. first amendment which we say free speech. and because of Minneapolis, you know, right to protest and assembly, the. number one thing is we shall make no. establishment of a religion. Every other. country on Earth had been born with a a. set official religion. Here's the stamp. and we didn't have it. And it has been. one of the blessings for us and we speak. about the political benefits and they're. they're they're legion. This is the. enlightenment applied to a physical. thing, a government, but it's also the.

religious thing in which you are just. trying to pull the fuel rods out of what. everybody does is they make a they, a. them. It's the it's the it's a playbook. of the authoritarian. This is the bad, the radical this or the enemy. They are. the cause of all our problems. Yeah. The. enemy within, you know, for Hitler it. was the Jews and the Jehovah's Witness. and homosexuals and and Marxists and I. mean Bolsheviks and whatever it might. be. Everybody looks to say it's them and.

you know, I've made films about the US, but I've also made films about us, right? That's it. There's an intimacy. there as well as a majesty and. complexity and even controversy to the. US. But the thing I've known after doing. this for 50 plus years is there is no. them. There's no them. No them. >> Yeah. >> And and and our obligation is to try to. remember to tell people there's no them. in some way in story form. And that's. what you were talking you're just. leading off. >> us. >> with with just you know, just how much a.

story can have this sense of. boy, this is just like it was before and. just like it was before is very much. like what's happening now. >> What's also. uh there's this belief if you don't read. history or you think or you're not. interested. there's this belief that the way things. are now is the way they've always been. also in a in a inaccurate way. So. >> Right. >> there's this notion I think a lot of. young people probably think well the. Republican Party has always meant um has.

always been. um. tied to like fundamental Christianity. and I think no. No, they would have been. for a long time that is exactly. Republican Party and Republicans. start from the beginning of the party's. establishment would have been kind of. horrified by that idea that it that we. were tied to that. That's a more of a recent invention 1980. >> got a map of the political parties and. just twist. I mean by.

there was the last Cabot Lodge to run. against a Kennedy in or anybody in was. 62 and Ted Kennedy took the seat vacated. by. the Senate seat of Massachusetts and he. lost and. um. he loved Ted Kennedy. He said, "Yeah, we. voted for the same things. I don't think. I disagreed with him on anything. I. voted for civil rights." And you think. you know, wait a second. The Republican. Republican Party was founded in 1854 in. a schoolhouse in Ripon, Wisconsin.

to end slavery. The Whig party had died. They were looking out of the ashes to. start something. They put up a. candidate, John C. Fremont, the. Pathfinder. In '56, he loses. And then. this guy, this bizarre tall, thin lawyer. prone to bouts of debilitating. depression. wins the election in 1860 with 40% of. the vote as the beginning of the. Republican Party as a national force, the most successful party. Unfortunately, also because it often.

tacked. to different places and and basically. gets is really good at convincing people. to vote against their own interests. I mean, that's been the last 50 years of. the Republican Party, but I mean, up. until when when Johnson took Kennedy's. Civil Rights, which Kennedy couldn't. have passed took it and got it through. and then the Voting Rights Act, he knew. he was losing the South. But he'd he was. a Southerner Democrat. You woke up on on. January You woke up on election day and. you had every one of the 11 states of.

the former Confederacy in the Democratic. Party column. You could count on those. electoral votes. And now you wake up on. election day and the Republicans count. on it. Ronald Reagan began his. traditional post-Labor Day campaign in. Philadelphia, Mississippi. That's in. Choctaw County. Um he did not go there. to honor Goodwin Cheney and Schwerner, the three civil rights people who were. murdered there. He went and began within. the first few paragraphs in to talk. about states' rights, which was virtue.

signaling. I don't know if virtue's the. right word, but signaling to his. audience. And then one by one you watch. You'd already seen it happen. The former. states of the Confederacy that had been. solidly anti-Republican because they. were trying to promote racial equality. switch over. And it's just It's been. It's breathtaking to watch just the. changes that the just the two parties. let alone the various three parties that. kind of like fish live parasitically off. the various parties. It's It's a. wonderful dynamic fluid thing. Harry.

Truman said the only thing that's really. new is the history you don't know. That's really great. I mean confounding. thing cuz we live in this. narcissistic present. So therefore we're. all chicken littles, the sky is falling, it's worse than it's ever could be and. you don't have the agency to pull. yourself out of the nose dive that. you're you're put yourself into. >> Well, this and and this is uh. there's never been a what I one of the. sentiments I agree with is there's never. been a better time. to be alive than right now. And uh just.

in terms of. >> the only time to be alive right now. >> Yeah, but you know, I'll have people. say, "Well, come on, Conan, things are. really bad. Why do you think it's uh. Give me one reason why. uh this is the best time to be alive and. I'll always start with child mortality. rates.". >> Yeah. >> You realize that for almost all of human. history. uh if you had children, there was a very. good chance that most of them would die. That's That was just the way it was. That's why there are few There's no.

industry around making toys for kids or. portraits of kids for a long time. because they don't last that long. Very. few of them make it. Um. >> Big market for small caskets. >> Yeah, it's just awful. But no, it's. really but it's awful. Sorry to bring. this up. This is really dark, but. >> graveyards in New England and you've got. um four, three, 18 months, six, eight, 12 and then. and then 96 and 100. You're like you. >> No, no, if you got past your your if you.

got past. uh into your teens, um you probably lived to be 98 and wrote. the Declaration of Independence. >> [laughter]. >> But. but what's um. No, it was just I there's I would like. people to be a little more conscious of. all the ways in which we're very. blessed. >> Yeah. >> And I also when I when I watch the the. American Revolution series, one of the things that. impresses me is just.

the stunning good luck. >> Yeah. >> I mean, the idea that that so many. things broke our way during the American. Revolution does make you believe in. providence and it reminds me of this. quote that I'm going to butcher right. now. I think it was Otto Bismarck said, there is a divine providence um that. protects uh drunkards, children, and the. United States of America. >> Yeah. >> And it's just like this wonderful quote. where I don't know what's going on with. America, but they always seem to get. away with this stuff. [laughter]. >> Yes. Well, this has happened in in the early.

days of the Revolution when the. improbable successes along with mostly. failures happened. They all saw it saw. it as a sign of providence that that. they would be like the walls of Jericho. You would just blow the trumpet and. they'd fall down. Think about it. The. odds on Lexington Green in that morning. of April 19, 1775 are zero of success. >> Mhm. >> And six and a half really long bloody, this is what we don't admit to, bloody. years later Civil War, Revolution, and. Global War. um is 100% and the the phenomenal good.

luck in the midst of some really bad. luck and bad decisions and stuff. Go I. mean, it's. a lot of it has to do with the size of. the continent. It has to do with the. weather. It has to do with the distance. 3,000 miles from the home office. So, a. letter coming takes longer than letter. going back because of the Gulf Stream. And so, you just I mean, Franklin, this. writer comes up to his his uh place in. Paris and he's trying to get the French. in and he needs some little victory just.

to convince him. And then the writer. goes and he walks out and he says, "Philadelphia fell." And he goes, "Yeah, which it had through Washington's. neglect at at Brandywine." And um and he. turns away and he goes, "But wait, there's better news. That a couple. months after that, the Battle of. Saratoga took place. Washington had. nothing to do with it other than sending. two of his best generals, Daniel Morgan. and a guy named Benedict Arnold, who was. the hero of Saratoga." And. it's the it's not only a little thing, it's a gigantic the surrender of entire.

British army. And Franklin goes, "Whoa.". He goes right to the conclusion. >> Why didn't you read me that one first? >> and then. >> [laughter]. >> he asked him first. He I mean, he was. pessimistic in disposition towards the. news he was about to get. And then they. go to Louis the 16th and within a couple. months, they've got two alliances, one. of which is essentially $30 of paid, an. army and navy, you know, guns, whatever. you need, that are going to be the key. to the American Revolution. >> French completely saved our bacon, something we probably occasionally like. to forget. And also, the French, because.

they. gave us so much money and so much help. during the Revolutionary War, go. bankrupt leading to their revolution. They had other problems, too. >> When the Declaration came, yeah, there I. mean, the British constitutional. monarchy was pretty good place form of. government to live under. And and that's. why you're a loyalist in the colonies. and and there you you're excused. We. didn't make loyalists bad people. We. just made them they you know, this your. prosperity, your education, your good. health, your property that you own,

whatever it might be, has come from. that. The French are more oppressive and. and then when Franklin's there, they. adore him and he's speaking the same. language. >> He's a rock star in France. He's like. Frank Zappa. >> famous American on Earth because of his. scientific stuff, but he's charming and. he's witty and he and he also shares. sympathy with Montesquieu and the others. of the French Enlightenment, not just. the Scottish Enlightenment. And then. when the Declaration happens, he prints. it up and asks all the newspapers to. print it, so they print it. So ordinary. people are reading, yeah. And you the.

power of this, the importance of the. Revolution just in the ideas cannot be. denied. This thing promotes revolutions. Our declaration promotes revolutions for. more than two centuries. When Ho Chi. Minh, on September 2nd, 1945, that's the. date that the Japanese are surrendering. unconditionally on the USS Missouri in. Tokyo Bay, he declares Vietnamese. independence and he is quoting Thomas. Jefferson from that second sentence. And. standing next to him are OSS officers.

who have saved his life earlier in the. year and are supporting him. And within. a month they're going to be told by the. State Department, "Oh, he's a commie. You can't do that." He, you know, and. you would just say. if we had stayed with him and then. followed the Geneva Convention and. allowed the election of him in '56, there'd be 6 million more human beings. haunting the earth. >> Well, there's it's amazing just how many. times things just keep flipping and. flipping and flipping. So, you know, Stalin, our best friend and our buddy up.

until about 1946, yeah, you know, or. 1945-46, and then it switches. And so, um I have. a propaganda poster of Uncle Sam and I. think it's Chiang Kai-shek and uh um. Churchill and Stalin as all these good. buddies who are tormenting a little. Hitler. And it's like Uncle Sam's arm is. draped around our good buddy Stalin. And. you Then they get the word after the. war, we're switching that now. >> Yes, right.

>> He's now the villain of the story. We. got it. Okay, he's the bad guy. And this. happens so many times in history. It's. kind of fascinating. >> So, the biggest I mean, the. >> I'll be later seen as a good guy. You'll. see soon. >> [laughter]. >> The 20th century uh is the bloodiest and. it has. the biggest killers are Mao. followed by Stalin and distant third is. Hitler. It's really unbelievable. And uh they. were our ally. The Second World War is. won by. American manufacturing followed by. Soviet sacrifice followed by American.

and followed by Western allies. sacrifice. It's really. it's a it's a triumph. In 1945, more. than 50% of all things manufactured in. the world were manufactured in the. United States. And it And I mean, to. understand exactly what happened. And. And Stalin had that you know, the the. Russian fear as Putin does of needing. all the buffer states. And so, he was. going to hang on to it. And there was no. army that could that was the size of. his. There was no energy to decide as as.

Churchill's fulminating, go take it. back. To go take it back, nobody was. going to do it. And so, we ended up with. a post-war paralysis. But we ended up. with the Marshall Plan. One of the. greatest things Americans have ever. done. You know, we do things for other people. because that's a good thing to do. Not. because we're not serving ourselves. >> Yeah, historically we've we've we have. done a lot and that's just because it. was the right thing to do. >> And then we we had a stasis. Now, you. can spend your entire life and many. people do listing the crimes of the.

United States. But as you were. suggesting earlier, if you start with. the Declaration and the Constitution, particularly the Bill of Rights and and. uh land grant colleges and the Homestead. Act and national parks and child labor. and GI Bill and Social Security and. Interstate Highway and Man on the Moon. and affordable I mean, you just like. the list of positive things that we've. done. And yet we've been told that the. enemy is our government. And it is in. the interest of people.

to make that happen. To to to remind. people that we're divided and there's. them and there is no them. >> I have to just ask you and this seems. very superficial, but you just listed. about 35 things with great eloquence and. fluidity. I'm guessing we're a sort of. the same age. I can't do that anymore. I. can start to list things and then I go. uh uh. uh. Well, you know what I mean. Uh. How do you do that? >> really bad cuz I'm 10 years older than. you. So, >> Are you really? 72? Are you Are you 62? I'm 42.

>> [laughter]. >> Yeah. I saw a doctor this morning. No, I'm 60 I'm 62. That was Did you see. her He didn't see her do that? >> I'm very im- You could never. >> I can't. If I was listing the. ingredients in my smoothie, I couldn't. do that. I did them in kind of. chronological order, too. >> that. >> [laughter]. >> I'm looking at you do THAT, AND I KNOW. I'M SUPPOSED to be like, "No, these are. really good points." But I'm still I was. just stunned. [laughter]. HE JUST SAID SO MUCH STUFF WITHOUT. LOOKING AT NOTES. >> [laughter]. >> I'M very shallow, Chad.

>> [laughter]. >> I'm thinking of the acts that were. passed. The TWC, the MIO, the WWN, the. labba da habbara, the sibbida dubbida, [laughter] the ribbida rabbida, the. simmida mabbida. So, you know your. >> I WAS SO IMPRESSED AND THEN YOU THE. whole time you're just like, "My brain. no working.". >> [laughter]. >> IF YOU WANT TO FEEL BAD about yourself, have a conversation with Ken Burns. >> [laughter]. >> That would be a picture a picture camera. sweeping past. Black black and [laughter] white photos. of me looking sad, and you and you hear.

a Shokan Farewell. >> What what we often do is start in the. photograph off in the dark, a vague. thing, and then pan to the extra. close-up of the eyes, and and you and. you begin to feel the tragedy of it. >> As Conan's mind slipped away, >> [laughter]. >> he knew. that he had to retreat to the idiocy of. a podcast. >> [laughter]. >> Let's make that documentary. You'll have.

three viewers. You will be stripped of every award. you've ever won. >> the idiocy of podcast for a second? Like. this year promoting I mean, I always do. that. There's no money in PBS to go out. and promote stuff, you know, to speak. of. So, you can't put billboards on. Melrose and Beverly, you you know, saying or the buses or the subways or. whatever across the country. So, you go. out, and we did 40 cities, 80. screenings, uh you know, 250 interviews, radio, satellite tours, TV and radio. And also, this time, more podcasts. I. think I think there are.

352. million podcasts in the United States, and I now have done half of them today. Today [laughter] is the half half half. the. >> So, what you're saying is we're the last. stop. >> [laughter]. >> No, no, no, I'm sure they're going to. give me more. >> Conan realized mama mama. >> You're the last stop. >> I'll I'll do the I'll do the music if. you want. You can just sit back. >> [laughter]. >> Be mad. It's hard for me to talk and do. the music. Not that I can't.

Conan knew that there was he was the. lowest of the low. >> [laughter]. >> My dearest Sarah. >> Conan writing home, my dearest Liza. >> [laughter]. >> Ken Burns today said he'd done every. podcast, and now he was doing it. >> [laughter]. >> WELL, I WILL. >> [laughter]. [laughter]. >> THIS IS ALL THIS IS MAKING ME SO HAPPY. RIGHT NOW.

>> I thought you were going to fill in. >> Oh, sorry. >> [laughter]. >> My dearest Liza. >> Yeah. >> His brain doesn't work anymore. >> Yeah, so I'm just making me so happy. that you're singing that tune. Um. >> I've been singing that tune and dining. out on that tune for 36 years. >> I often I downloaded it onto my uh I. have I have this. This sounds um self-serving, but I do. like to work out. Um. the check this thing out, this body. Uh. but that's not the point. The point is I.

like to listen to. a hard, fast, like rock and roll music. for your when your heart rate's up, cuz. that really gets me going, and then I. can run on the treadmill and lift the. weights and do everything I have to do. But I I dropped in there a long time ago. into my workout feed a Shokan Farewell. And it will come on and I'm I'm just. I won't take it out, but when it comes. on, I stop working out. >> [laughter]. >> I just Maybe it's just to restore your. heart rate and. >> Yeah, exactly. I just stop whatever I'm. doing.

>> in the middle of your workout. They say. is really good. >> Yeah. >> [laughter]. >> And to think about everything this. country has been through. >> Yes. >> So, a Shokan Farewell. was not. >> It's not contemporary to the Civil War. >> It's not contemporary to the Civil War. That's a. >> song that one of your. >> session musicians. >> session musicians came up with? >> Yeah. So, he his name is Jay Ungar. He's. a Jewish kid from the Bronx who wrote. the most beautiful Scotch-Irish lament. I've ever heard in my life. Um I'm not. even sure at the beginning he knew what. he had. It was so filled with heart. A.

friend of his, one of his co-musicians. had given me an album they'd put out and. I was just doing needle drops and on the. fourth song of the first side, I heard. this thing and I went, "Wow." He runs a. music camp, still does, in in the. Catskills, uh near the Ashokan. Reservoir, part of the New York City. thing. And they were breaking up for the. summer and everybody was heading back to. the new school year and he sat down in. like 15 minutes or so, uh wrote Ashokan. Farewell. And. it is I I I guarantee that today, whatever today is, it is being played.

100 times at a funeral or a memorial. service or a wedding. or a renewal of vows. And sometimes it's. with this letter that's uh Sullivan. Ballou, a Rhode Island soldier wrote. back to his wife before his death at the. first Battle of Bull Run. And um it's. it's it I. I've just never come across a a piece of. American music that works. And I like. the fact that it was a Jewish guy from. the Bronx who turned out a Scotch-Irish. lament. >> Yeah, yeah. He wrote it for a Bar.

Mitzvah. >> Yeah, right. >> [laughter]. >> The original title was it. >> [laughter]. >> The horror. >> Look at you. More comedy. >> Can. >> The horror. The horror. >> [laughter]. >> Very good. You're you're killing it. I. I feel very threatened right now. Very. threatened. >> [laughter]. >> Um. >> But you got to pick subordinate talent. that you know is better than you, right? That's what George Washington did. And. look what he got to be, the father of. our country. Like he didn't know he was.

George Washington. He didn't know there. was going to be a dollar bill or a. quarter, a big spiky thing in the. national capital named for him, or a. state on the other side of the continent. called that's named for him, and every. other state has a county or a town. Like. he had no idea. >> Yeah. >> That's That's what was going to happen. >> No, he just um. It's so fascinating to me that I The. some of them must have been aware. Some. of the founding fathers must have been. aware that I'm going down in history as. a great man. Whether it was Jefferson or. >> You know what it is? They're aware of. you. They're aware of you. They talk.

John Adams talks about the millions yet. unborn. They are all speaking about like. this is not just for right now. We're. doing this. Like Tom Paine says, "Not since the time of Noah do we have a. chance to make it over." This is why the. world turned upside down. Everything had. been the same. For a thousand years your. family had worked the same plot of land. in Wales or Scotland or Ireland or. England, and now you had you you had the. possibility of owning somebody else's.

land, Indian land, but you you had you. could see that things could change and. that all of a sudden everybody up to. this point had been subjects, and now. they were this new thing called. citizens. And a few sentences after. pursuit of happiness, a few phrases, Jefferson says, "All experience has. shown that mankind are more disposed to. suffer while evils are sufferable." It's. not hard to parse. It means that. heretofore everybody just puts up with. the authoritarian boot. And you know. what? We're not going to do that. anymore. We're not going to do that.

It's going to take extra energy. And I. think whenever we're in a bad spot, it's [clears throat] because that energy. has atrophied, and that we've forgotten. that we have that energy not you within. me. Not that somebody else is going to. take care of it but that I'm going to. do. And you're seeing one of the good. things about all these young people who. are you know, what's the matter with. kids today? They're running for office. They're at you know, they're mayor of. New York. They're you know, they're. doing stuff. And that that is a. democratic impulse in the face of the.

idea that no, evils are not sufferable. We don't have to do this. We do not have. to put up with this is not the war with. Tennyson wrote that nature is is red it. meaning r e d in tooth and claw meaning. everything's bloody and everything's you. know, Stephen Miller says you know, the. mightiest win. It's not about that. We we invent. civilization to forestall the law of the. jungle. And what you have are guys who. are saying, "No, it's just the law of.

the jungle." That's what authoritarians. say. >> Yeah. Well, I I mean. we are again. I say one of the things that I most. admire about your work as I watch it and. I feel reinvested. That's the word I. come up with is that I'm reinvested in. this experiment and it is an experiment. and we just have to keep working on it. Um. >> line of the film and it's not giving it. away, Benjamin Rush the only physician. to sign said the American war is over. but the American Revolution is still.

going on. Doesn't mean like Jefferson, I'm sure he would wish he could take it. back that tree of liberty has to be. watered with the blood of patriots every. 20 years. No, it means that we designed. a system so we can figure out how to do. that without the bloodshed. >> Right. Right. Unbelievable. Well, uh thank you so much. for being here. And um this is remarkable. You have to. come back and I you want to do all the. other podcasts first. >> Yes. No, no, >> [laughter]. >> let me let me let me get to some of the. half a million more that I.

I've I've to. got to do. Yeah. >> You know, we have a pretty big audience. on this one. So, I you know, you might. want to skip some of those other ones, you know? Yeah. [laughter]. >> Five. >> Plus you and me, that's seven. Yeah. No, Eduardo doesn't listen to. this. >> Oh, he doesn't [laughter] listen to it. >> He's on Telegram. He has no patience for. this Yeah. >> six including you and me. >> Yeah. Exactly. >> Well, that's good. >> six that really go go out and buy stuff. So, that's important. [laughter]. Um Ken, I could talk to you for maybe 40. hours and just be the happiest guy in. the world and not. >> down with that. >> and not.

>> [laughter]. >> Yeah. >> Well, I have a brief nine-part response. TO EVERY QUESTION. >> [laughter]. >> LISTEN TO KEN BURNS' 14-part response. >> Yeah. >> Um. but I I've taken such solace in all in. your work. It's just. uh. um it does nourish me in the very best. way and I do think all of this goes. beyond politics. I like to try and step. out of that divide and try to say to.

people that we. I believe we all want similar things and. we uh and I think there's many more. uh good people than bad people. Uh and. this is uh I mean, I I love this country. and I always think we can do better and. I think we will and I just get that from. your work and I get so inspired. >> I think obviously, if you know where. you've been,

you can know a little bit better where. you are. That's the optimism in in the face of. the Chicken Littles of this narcissistic. moment, but you also know where you're. going and so you can begin to see in the. midst of, you know, being like that. little kid in um in in Schindler's List, completely submerged in. >> Mhm. >> That, you know, he's he's submerged in. cuz he's. dedicated to living and so that our next. job is repair and restoration and we.

should be thinking about that rather. than oh is the sky is falling oh it's. really it's been worse you know this is. the worst it's ever been in American. history it's not. >> Yeah. >> and and. you know things will there's a fluidity. and the only thing that's certain is. that it's going to change in some way. and you have to actually be prepared to. catch that change. >> Yeah. >> that's that's the biggest thing. >> there's. uh. better times are coming and we have to. prepare for that. >> happy days are here again yeah. >> um all right well Ken.

again if anyone out there hasn't. listened to the American Revolution. series. um. we actually they can watch it too. listening [laughter] is a podcasty kind. of thing you know. but but [laughter] we we spent 10 years. assembling images. >> play the music. >> no photographs. >> I swear to god. >> [laughter]. >> I swear to god um. I didn't realize.

that there were images that went along. with the show. I watched it on television. but my face was averted from the screen. >> oh okay. >> told it was quite beautiful. >> [laughter]. >> as Conan's eyesight failed and he. listened to the broadcast of Ken Burns. special. >> [laughter]. >> Conan was filled with joy. >> they're pretty dense literate thing you. can listen to them too it's okay. [laughter] but there's some nice there's. some great paintings and some cool. reenactments and. >> you know it's it's beautiful and I don't.

know why I said listen I think. >> cuz we're doing a podcast. >> no I think I was really thrown when you. made that long list fluently. I [laughter] think I I was in shock that. my brain has atrophied to this degree uh. >> do you want to practice the list. >> oh okay. >> deck. >> oration. >> oration. >> constitution. >> constitution bill of rights. >> you jump ahead land. >> Grant Colleges, Homestead Act, National. Park. >> Yeah, National Park. >> Child labor, we forgot to say even.

anti-trust laws, you know? That's pretty. good. Um. Uh then I think there'd be all the New. Deal programs and then. >> Let's Let's list them. >> Social Security, labor's right to. organize, uh. WPA which created 10,000 landing strips. and the Civilian Conservation Corps with. all that work on the parks. I mean, if. you landed at LaGuardia Airport. >> airport New Deal. Went through the. Triborough Bridge, New Deal. Lincoln. Tunnel, [laughter] New Deal. Right? Skyline Drive, New Deal. Right? All the. bridge All the dams in in the Lincoln.

Highway, all the dams in in the. Northwest. That's all. 10,000 landing. strips, a billion trees. We're not even. out of the New Deal. >> The peanut is neither a pea nor a nut. >> [laughter]. >> It's a legume. >> Thank you very much. >> I still know. And that's my list. >> Yeah. >> Uh Ken. please go out and do more amazing work. Also, this book is gorgeous. It's. absolutely gorgeous. >> I've worked with for 45 years. It This. is the the.

most wonderful book. He has put his. heart and his soul into it. >> No, and it's just gorgeous artwork, to. your point, and uh. and I spent I just I opened it randomly. to a page of some Revolutionary War. powder horns that were etched engraved, and I was just geeking out over them. thinking, "I got to get a powder horn.". >> [laughter]. >> Went on Amazon. Nope. >> No powder horns? >> No No Revolutionary War powder horns. >> You took a powder horn. >> Uh exactly. Okay, I'll do the comedy. around Now you're doing the comedy, too?

>> [laughter]. >> I'm getting my ass kicked. >> Hey, Ken, you were here for the takedown. of me. >> Yeah, I know, and. >> It's not happening that way. >> Ken, thank you so much. This is amazing. >> really fun. Thank you.