Jim Downey & Norm Macdonald Were Both Fired From “SNL” | Conan O'Brien Needs A Friend

I've always believed that God is in the. details that it's a drag and you sit. there and you have to try and get it. right but I say I think Twain says the. difference between. the right word and almost the right word. is the difference between you know. lightning and a lightning bug it's just. like that when you get the right wording. when you get it just right. it makes a difference and I think the. work that you and Norm did on update. is proof that well you guys worked. really hard you got fired for it because. unfortunately the the uh the you know.

one of the people at the top at NBC was. a good friend of OJ was his closest. friend what's his closest friend uh and. uh you got fired for that and. um but you've always thought that was a. kind of a proud moment for you because a. lot of people reached out when that. happened and identified that that was. the wrong I had so many so I mean it was. really. um I have to say I. I'm not the most uh.

sensible person in my personal life you. probably know me well enough Conan and. pick that up but I I'll testify that I. didn't. um. I I had I'd gotten divorced uh um that. year basically so I was sort of um. you know I I maybe I was feeling uh kind. of you know it's kind of ornery and and. like but certainly and also like with a. little less responsibility Norm I know. took it much harder than I did I I sort.

of looked at it philosophically and said. you know what it's like. you know the AE Houseman poem to an. athlete dying young you know. um before fame outran the man kind of. thing and and if that's maybe I have. that backwards too but but anyway. um we you know we. we react off and maybe it's that's. better than risking that where you Peak. and then it's down here yeah yeah and.

and with we didn't get that we weren't. put in that position of having to you. know to make that decision it was made. for us but um I know that um Norm. the story about that I know you know. this story. um but I think people who are fans of. Norm deserve to know this about him he. they the network went to Norm and said. we want to get rid of Jim Downey uh. um and and we just want you to to know. you're cool with that right he said no. no if you can't fire him if you fire him.

I quit and they go that's crazy I mean. you know he's he's not helping you you. know uh the segments to mean or whatever. and um and he said well no I'm I'm not. doing it without him and he never told. me that and I didn't hear that for years. I heard it from some Network Executives. and I I and and part of everything else. if that had been me. that would have been you bet Norm would. have heard you know you want to talk.

about it yeah of course I mean come on. Norm didn't I mean he was uh very. stoic old world he came from a different. Center oh yeah I mean I remembered when. he when he died you called me and you. said you were mad at me initially you. said I can't believe you didn't tell me. Conan and I said I didn't know none of. us none of us knew Lori Joe knew and his. mark gervitz his manager knew well his. mother and his son knew yeah and and his. brother so outside of family was like.

three people and he didn't and I know. why he didn't I mean I've been told and. it made perfect sense so I believe it. that he um. he just didn't want it to ever be about. anything but being funny he didn't want. to be brave or fighting a good fight or. you know he didn't want to do. heartwarming stuff and. um he just wanted to be but I was a. little hurt that he didn't tell me but I. mean I talked to him. I guess I know you may have talked to.

more recently than I'd had but I talked. to him. certainly the summer of 2020. we were. trying we were trying to get him on my. last uh late night show. which is uh two years yeah it was but. not long before he passed and we were. trying really hard to get him to be. because I wanted nothing more than to. him to be one of the last guests and. he was considering it but then wouldn't. do it and then and I think he didn't he. knew that he didn't he also didn't he. knew that his appearance was kind of. changing and he didn't want to yeah but.

you know if I I know this is shifting. from one kind of Bravery to another but. he. one of our my proudest moments was a. joke we did and I I think it was a Frank. joke Frank Sebastiano but it was um. there's a certain type of annoying. with exactly what we're talking about. the kiss ass stuff but it was um it was. a joke where we took the world's most. innocuous kind of C-section news story. and it was it was we would clip a real.

news story and show it on the monitor so. that the audience knows this is a real. thing we didn't make it up and um we did. that for most of our our things and um. um so the story was like you know. Denver city council approves traffic. light for you know you know Martin. Avenue and so um and so it's we go it. goes enormous like this week the Denver. city council finally on its third. attempt voted funds for a new traffic.

light on Martin Avenue then he turns. dramatically to another camera goes. maybe they would have voted the funding. earlier if instead of a traffic light it. was it was for rich white men. we break up a lower third applaud now. but that's the kind of stuff that. there's not really a great place to. laugh in that joke right that's a thing.

that like Norm we would we would do our. our run through like we would work on. the jokes a bit during the week but. mainly Friday night and we would that's. when especially I would do a lot of. rewriting and refining and then I'd run. through stuff with norm and then. Saturday we do a run through and then. we're always screaming we were always. kind of late getting in the studio. really late because they were come on. guys we're losing time so we'd come down. to our run through and we'd make a few. kind of changes maybe think of some. things for Norm to add and then um.

then we'd have a dress. and then my attitude with Lauren. Michaels the producer the big guy was. always like tell us how long you want. the segment to be we're like because. we're the most easily baloney sliced. segment you know and my attitude and. Norm kind of agreed it's like Norm. wanted a certain he didn't want to feel. that like we you know we had to have we. were entitled a certain amount of the. show but I always argued like anything. if we're cutting lean we're in good.

shape you know yeah so I mean sure we'll. always cut the fat that you everyone. should do that but if we also have to. give up something we don't want to give. up it's probably a good indication no no. it's and and so and anyway if it's. something a lot of our stuff can be done. next week yeah you know and so. you know we we used to we would do six. minute updates we I think we did a five. minute they do like 12 minute updates. now you know and they did them before us. and and Norm I will say this normal is. not crazy about features yeah he wasn't.

crazy about having other people on the. segment you know always any and. sometimes I had to like get him to be. more involved with him yes but um Seth. Meyers was the best ever at interacting. with I mean he was great at that I wish. Norm had been a little more. playful like the guy always took away. from you and I think about you're in my. head a lot over the years that I've been. writing and all the years that I've been. doing things and you're surprisingly. easy to masturbate too.

um. but you're also in my head for another. reason uh no you're in my head because. uh because. there's an ethic that I got from you and. I also got from Robert Smiggle and and I. I try to pick from the best which is. if I can lose it yes trim the fat but. also sometimes cut into the muscle like. and then and uh and lose if you're. losing something for time that you.

really love but you love that other. stuff more. uh you're you're in great territory and. this thing is really Gonna Fly yeah and. I think that's great I remembered by the. way the reason I brought all that stuff. up it's because I was just killing time. to remember. Norm was the guy who you know and and. performers because you're you're a. hybrid you know uh performers really. don't want to give up stuff they got a. huge laugh ever Norm would totally throw. out something if he if he came to.

suspect it was not the kind of laugh we. wanted and by the way he doesn't that. that doesn't mean like it was dirty or. something if it was like cheap or easy. or whatever and the thing is you could. give Norm a choice like okay this. is absolutely guaranteed to kill it'll. get a mini Standing Ovation but it's. hacky and we both know it this. is guaranteed to die I promise you will. get you know death camp silence but uh.

it's brilliant Norm would. unhesitatingly go for the silence on it. never it not you know and I but I would. go yeah I would too but I'm not the guy. out there yeah he is and I always. love that about him he would. never reject something because it's. funny but they're not gonna get they're. gonna laugh you know and I I had fights. with even with people that you and I. both respect who just oh man it killed. it killed you go yeah but come on man.