The Mystery of the Death Valley Germans | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

[music]. >> Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeart Radio. >> [music]. >> Hey and welcome to the [music] podcast. I'm Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's. here, too. And this is Stuff You Should. Know. Um I don't really think you could call. it part of our ongoing true [music]. crime suite, but certainly unsolved. mystery suite, I think. Yeah, semi-solved mystery, I guess at this. point because we're talking about what's. known as the Death Valley Germans.

Pretty good band name. Uh but it's in fact a a very sad story. from July of 1996 when a blended family. of German tourists came to the United. States. for a 3-week tour of California and. Nevada and were never seen again alive. Yeah, they just vanished into thin air. essentially in Death Valley National. Park. Um and they've I mean it's it's weird. Like essentially there was one guy who.

will meet later who got it as close to. solve this possible just from sheer. determination. But the family that you're talking. about, um they were made up of Egbert. Rimkus, who's 34. He was an architect. He was the dad. Uh George, I'm not sure. how to say George without an E. You took. German, are you familiar? Uh no. I I I. guess it's George. Okay. He was 11. He. was Egbert's biological son. Um Connie Meier, Cornelia Connie Meier.

She was 27. She was Egbert's girlfriend. And Max was Connie's uh biological son. from a previous relationship. He was. four. And Egbert had gone through a fairly. difficult divorce recently. And so this. trip was essentially um meant to be like. a fun bonding experience for the four of. them to kind of form a a family unit in. this new you know new reality, these new. circumstances they were in. Yeah, so uh. they got to LA on July 8th. Um they had.

a return flight to Dresden, which is. where they were from, for July 27th. And the the on the docket was about a. week or so in the LA area, uh head on. over to Las Vegas for a few days, um go. to Death Valley National Park, check. that out, uh head over to Yosemite from. there, and then go back to LA and fly. home. It's a it's a pretty standard. little um itinerary for that that kind. of you know 3-week adventure, I would.

say. Yes. Uh and for the adventure, they they. rented a car, a '96 Plymouth Voyager. minivan. Um and they rented it from Dollar Rent a. Car. Being German, they would have. rented it from Dollar because that's the. American subsidiary of Deutsche Mark. Rent a Car. Yeah, uh-huh. And it was due. back on the 26th of July, which is the. day before their flight back to Germany, right? That's right. The problem is is uh. Dollar Rent a Car never got their. minivan back. And the family didn't make.

their flight to Germany. And not. everybody noticed this. I mean certainly. no one in America paid much attention, but remember Egbert had an ex-wife who. was the mom of George. And George's mom, Heike, um she was she wanted to know where her. son was. So she alerted the authorities. and very quickly Interpol put out an. international alert for four missing. German tourists last seen in Southern. California. Um and here's their. itinerary. And it went absolutely.

nowhere. This is the end of July, beginning of August 1996, and nothing. happened for months. Yeah, uh I think. about. uh. I guess until October 21st when a ranger. was uh flying around in a helicopter. looking for meth labs and he said, "Hey, this is a very remote part of Death. Valley, a Plymouth Voyager minivan with. three flat tires um. that had clearly been you know mired in. the in the sand.".

immediately they're like, um so immediately they're like, "What is. this thing?" Um once they figured out. who the family was and this was who was. missing, uh they were nowhere to be. found. There were no signs of life. Uh. there were no signs of death. There was. nothing at all. And so the the mystery. of the Death Valley Germans was uh born. right there in one of the most. inhospitable places on Earth. Yeah. Um and that the whole thing wouldn't be. solved or close to being solved for. another 15 years. Um and for those of us.

who aren't familiar with Death Valley, it's a national park like I said that. straddles um California and Nevada. And. it is. it's. it lives up to its name. It's it doesn't. have the highest temperature ever. recorded on Earth, but it has the second. highest and it's very close. The highest. temperature ever recorded in Death. Valley in the summer of 1913 was 134°. F. Yeah. 56.7°.

C. Hot. I think the record was in El Azizia, Libya in 1922. It was only 2 and 1/2°. hotter than that. So clearly Death. Valley is very hot. And um even in a. regular summer, it's still crazy hot. And in 1996 in the summer, remember. they're in there uh hanging out in late. July, which is the height of the summer. of Death Valley. The daily high. temperature, the average, was.

was the low. Yeah, so it's scorching hot, which is. just you know it's very dangerous. conditions, especially if you're. uh. not used to that kind of thing, not. prepared for that kind of thing. >> Yeah. Uh apparently Death Valley is. something that was I guess 2 days ago. years old when I found out is a very. popular uh tour site for Germans. >> Yeah. Um there was a a writer in the. 19th century named uh Karl May, spelled. m a y. Uh German writer, had never been to.

Death Valley, but wrote a bunch of um. hugely popular travel adventure books. set in the American Southwest including. Death Valley. Um some were made into. spaghetti westerns including one called. The Valley of Death in 1968, but this. dude. whom I've never heard of sold 200. million books. So like you know one of the top-selling. authors of all time. And so Germans as a. result became fascinated with with. making that trek out to Death Valley, and that's what this family did. Yeah, you didn't know that?

I had never heard of this guy, had you? No. Oh, okay. Um so this is popular with. German tourists, but that's not to say. that all German tourists who go to Death. Valley die or get lost or even don't. have a good time. Like Well, of course. it's a very popular place. But people do. die in Death Valley National Park every. year, every summer in particular. And. between 2007 and 2024, 68 people died in. Death Valley. That's a lot of people who. died simply from being exposed to the.

local weather. Um they died of. hyperthermia, most of them. I think 20. or not most, but 20% died of. hyperthermia, which if you've ever been. in a hot sauna that got too hot for your. comfort, that you imagine dying from. that. That's dying from hyperthermia. I. think the rest um. who died from exposure died from. dehydration cuz that can come on really. quick, too. Yeah, for sure. Um so a day. after this minivan is discovered by. helicopter in Death Valley,

uh the ranger came back with the local. sheriff on the ground to check it out. Uh or maybe they flew out there, who. knows. But at any rate, at some point. their feet were on the ground. >> Mhm. They opened the van up. They like I. said there were three flat tires. Uh it was stuck up to its axles in the. sand. And uh they they determined that it had. driven for at least a couple hundred. feet on the flat tires. The whole thing. was covered in dust. You know, clearly. hadn't been uh you know seen by anyone. else or disturbed. There was the things. you would expect to find from.

disappeared people on an adventurous. vacation like this. Like uh their. luggage and their clothes. Like nothing. really weird. Empty water bottles, empty juice containers, a couple of. unopened bottles of Bud Ice beer, >> You remember that? Yeah, it dates this. thing in in the mid-'90s. I was never into the ice beers. No, I. think if I remember correctly, it just. it got you more crunk than the average. beer. Uh I I feel like that was how they. sold it. Who knows? I mean that was. before things like high gravity beers. really came to the forefront. So maybe.

it was like, you know, these things have an extra percentage of. ABV. Yeah, I think the slogan was Bud. Ice get you plastered. I remember the dry beers, too. I thought. it was fancy in college at one point, so. I was drinking Mickey's Big Mouths Dry. Oh, at this point, speaking of fancy, I. was drinking Zima. Oh. I never went down the Zima road. Oh, they were they went down easy. I. What was the flavor? What was it? Like a Sprite? Uh yes. It. was it was close to that. Like you. wouldn't take a sip of Zima and be like,

"That's Sprite." But that's probably the. closest thing you could just mention off. the top of your head. Some people put. Jolly Ranchers in it, too, to flavor it. even further. >> [laughter]. >> Uh it all it also had a bit of like a. a dry like in the sense that champagne. can be dry. It had a little bit of that. Nothing. that you'd be like, "Wow, it's really. dry. drink." But it And I think ultimately it. was malt liquor, which really could get. you plastered, too. Yeah, I used to. drink the Mickey's Big Mouths in. college.

>> Mhm. And the occasional giant Schlitz tallboy. can. >> Yeah. Uh those were the days. I keep it pretty simple these days. But. but yeah, but you're right. That Bud Ice. definitely dates it to the mid-'90s for. sure. And there like you said there This. is kind of important, that's why I'm. going back to it. There there were a. couple of bottles of unopened Bud Ice. beer still in the minivan. Yeah, uh and. then one other just sort of small clue. as far as to show where they'd been. There was a business card uh from the. Seahorse Resort in San Clemente, which.

is where they stayed while uh I guess in. the LA area, which is. um not super close to LA. So, I guess. maybe they wanted to be between LA and. San Diego or something. I don't know. I. think they just saw pictures of the view. and were like, "There.". >> Maybe. Cuz the view is very nice. So, um there was a guidebook there, too, in German. A guidebook that they. purchased or that was purchased at the. Furnace Creek Visitor Center at in Death. Valley. And like I said, it was in. German, and so they went to the visitor.

center investigators did later, and they. found that on July 22nd, there were two. German-language guidebooks sold at the. visitor center at Furnace Creek and none. on July 23rd. So, with that, they. started to be able to begin to retrace. their steps. That was the first clue. that they were able to kind of. extrapolate from. Yeah, so their second clue came when. they found um. undeveloped rolls of film and cameras.

So, uh sort of like the end of The. Hangover, they were able to get those. developed and piece together, you know, at least roughly by way of the pictures. they took at least, um what they had. done on their trip, maybe even uh as. we'll see, clues to to where they um. like the last picture taken, obviously, would be the most instructive. Uh so, from these pictures, they. realized they stayed in San Clemente for. a little while. seeing the LA area. They drove up the. California coast and then over to Las. Vegas, Nevada. Mhm. And there, they.

stayed at the Treasure Island Hotel, which also dates this in the mid-90s. >> Mhm. And there, they found that. uh the father uh Egbert had called his. bank in Germany on July 12th, tried to. have another 1,500 bucks wired to Bank. of America in San Clemente, but they. sent it to the wrong bank. And at. Treasure Island, he uh you know, he was. clearly in need of some dough. He was he. even faxed his ex-wife and said, "Hey,". which also dates this, "uh can you send. more money?" and she never responded.

Yeah, what I didn't get and I didn't see. anyone explain it is why he was just. like, "Oh, well, they sent it to the LA. branch of Bank of America rather than. San Clemente. I guess there's nothing I. can do to go get it." He just never went. and picked up the $1,500. Well, maybe he. didn't know. I don't know. Yeah, I mean, I would. still spend some time trying to figure. out where my $1,500 are. And that's. about $3,000 in today's money. So, I it. seems like he just shrugged it off from. what from his actions. I just think.

that's really strange. Yeah, it it I. mean, it also could have been one of. those things where where they were like, "Well, sir, we don't know which bank. it's in. Stop bothering us.". And and like we can find out in a week. Yeah, it could be. And you know, they. had a schedule, so who knows? Yeah, so. the long and short of it though is they. were low on funds now. >> Right. And luckily, if you're going. through national parks like Death Valley. and Yosemite, uh and the only thing. you're doing after that is making it. back to the airport to turn in your car. and take your flight home, you can get. by on some pretty low funds. You can.

still buy some Bud Ice. It wasn't. particularly expensive. Yeah. So, they seemed to kind of be making. their way. uh low on funds. Um and that actually. helped track them a little bit further. uh later on. Um but there was one other. clue, too. Uh and it was an American. flag. And it had um Butte Valley Stone. Cabin on its label. That's where it. belonged to in Death Valley. It's. locally called the Geologist Cabin.

And I think it is it does what it says. on the label, which is it houses. geologists who are conducting. experiments out there. So, there's food. there, there's water there, but they. keep it locked. If you're a geologist, it's kind of like a gas station. bathroom. You have to go get the key. first before you start using the. Geologist Cabin. So, they seem to have. just taken the flag as maybe a souvenir. or something like that. Like I know if I were in the Black. Forest and I came across a German flag, I would take it.

and then take it back to America as a. souvenir. Yeah, I guess that's what this was being. used for back then, because I think now. you can actually stay there. Um. >> Oh, really? Yeah, it's like a. uh you know, along the the Appalachian. Trail and just sort of all over a. national parks, there'll be like a a. remote cabin that, you know, you come, you can stay there. There might be some. food and water rations if you need it, and you're supposed the idea is that. you're supposed to leave something. >> Yeah. and leave it better than you found. it. Uh because I've seen pictures of. people that, you know, in the. 2010s that have have stayed there and.

like it's it's a destination for people. who are into Death Valley, cuz it's. super cool-looking. It's out in the. middle of nowhere. It's like a stone. cabin. And it's on a lot of people's list of. like, "I want to go stay at the. Geologist Cabin." So, I guess that just. wasn't the deal back then. >> Right. Uh cuz it was locked up. What I. don't get, well, we'll get to what I don't get later. Okay. Should we take a break? Um yeah, I think that's a good spot. All. right, we'll take a break and we'll come. back with more on the Death Valley. Germans right after this.

>> [music]. [music]. [music]. [music]. >> Okay, Chuck, so where we left off, they. had pilfered the American flag from the.

Geologist Cabin. And right like all of. this stuff, this is just the stuff they. found in the van. This is as far as the. search has gone. Yeah. And so, the. rangers of the park start conducting. their own investigation, and they go to. like um Furnace Creek Ranch, which is a. resort, um kind of upscale. There's a. Camp Crowne, um but you have to pay for. all those, and there was no record of. the family staying at either of those. places on July 22nd or 23rd or anytime, really. Um one of the other things they did was.

check logbooks. Apparently, they pick up. logbooks even at um uh. sites that don't have anyone working. there. They'll still have a logbook. And. they struck gold at one of them, the. Warm Springs Mine logbook, which is an. abandoned mine um above Death Valley in. the mountains, I guess, on a ridge. And. you can get to it um. uh it's a road. There's a road that goes. to it. It's nothing uh that you would. normally call a road, but in Death. Valley National Park, it might as well. be a luxurious eight-lane eight-lane.

highway. Yeah. >> Uh it's gravel, it's rough, but a. Plymouth um Voyager can can get on this. road to Warm Springs Mine. And in the. logbook, they got a huge clue that would. help track them down later. Yeah, they signed it. Uh it was in. German. Uh apparently, it was barely. legible. Uh and it said, "We are going. over the pass.". Uh signed Connie, Egbert, George, and. Max. Um so, on October 23rd, this is 2 days.

after the minivan is found, uh they. finally conduct a big 4-day search. looking for this family. Uh about. 250-plus people, couple of helicopters, eight horses, um a lot of these were. volunteers, but dozens of them were. trained uh search and rescue people. >> Right, no slouches. No slouches. Uh. well, there was one slouch, but he. didn't last long, cuz it was Death. Valley. They're like, "Go home, Eugene.". Exactly. And the only evidence from this. 4-day search was an empty bottle of Bud. Ice.

and uh a butt print, basically, in the. sand next to it, where someone had. clearly sat down and enjoyed that Bud. Ice. It was about uh 1.7 mi away from. the van. And uh yeah, clearly somebody. took a little break in the shade and had. that that sweet sweet. extra. potent ice beer. >> Right. Um and they they could even figure when. um. they probably figured it was Egbert. because the size of the butt print was. fairly large. Um well, that's how I saw.

it described. I think they I think. they're just saying larger than, say, a. woman's or a child's, which is the only. other people with them in this party, right? But it was on the east side of the bush, so that if he was taking refuge from it. in the shade, that means that the sun. would have been uh in the western part. of the sky. So, he would have been. sitting there in late afternoon, which. seems ludicrous to even point out, but. it would come into play later on. Yeah, that's right. So, um. again, in that visitor's log, it says,

"We're going over the pass." Uh the only. pass near there was is called Mengel. Pass, M E N G E L. >> Mhm. And if you look on a map back in. 1996, before you had, you know, smartphones and things like that or. people on the internet saying, "Hey, don't go this way.". >> Right. It looks like it's pretty. possible to drive from Warm Springs, go. through that Mengel Pass into an. adjacent valley, and then hit a dirt. road toward Yosemite, which was their. their next destination. Uh they didn't. know you know, they didn't have the.

knowledge that uh it wouldn't it wasn't. going to be just like a little sort of. rocky path, but something you really. really need a 4x4 vehicle for, like full. stop. It's not like, "Well, maybe we can. make it in the Plymouth Voyager." Like. you you can't make it down this road. with anything other than a 4x4, and even. that's dicey. Yeah, I saw that not only. do you need a 4x4, you need an. experienced driver who has who can get. through this stuff, too. Like you can't. just put some yahoo in a 4x4 and expect. them to make it. It's that dicey. Maybe.

a winch. Yeah, probably. Yeah. Uh yeah, you just like go from. boulder to boulder winching yourself. over the pass, right? Yeah. So, to get. to the pass, you go by the Geologist. Station. And remember, they had the flag. from the the Geologist Station. So, now. they're really starting to retrace their. footsteps. The problem is is the van. wasn't anywhere near the road to Mengel. Pass. As a matter of fact, it wasn't. really near anything that was a road, an. actual road in Death Valley. It was. essentially like they just drove through.

the middle of the desert, which is how. they found the van. Yeah. So, after this. 4-day very extensive search by at least. 250 people, all they found was the beer bottle at. the bush and the butt print. Yeah. That. was it. Those were the only physical. clues that they found. And, you know, there's a lot of stuff going on in Death. Valley at any given time in the whole. area of Southern California. So, these. rescue groups got called off to other. stuff and the park rangers went back. about their business and the case just.

went totally cold for years and years. and years. And it probably would have. stayed that way if not for a guy named. Tom Mahood, who we'll meet in the in a. second. But in the interim, that that vacuum between the end of the. initial search and Tom Mahood picking. this whole thing up, um people just kind. of came up with their own theories to. explain it because it was just so they. just vanished off of the face of the. earth, it seemed like. Yeah, so, you know, one of the I guess.

it was probably the most popular theory. and it makes sense in some ways is that. this was an intentional disappearing. Like, hey, let's this family set it up. to make it look like they've been. disappeared because Egbert it was he was. going through a pretty rough custody. battle with his ex-wife. It was a pretty. contentious divorce. And apparently there were rumors that he. had talked to his co-workers about like. kind of dropping out and moving to Costa. Rica with his. with his son. And so, people are like, yeah, this they. they purposely disappeared so he could.

just get away from his ex-wife and have. sole custody of his son. Right. Um one of the big problems with that is. like if you're on a trip in LA, you. could disappear way more easily than in. Death Valley. It's kind of a dumb place. to stage your disappearance, you know? Uh well, I mean, I think staging a. disappearance there is different than. disappearing. You know what I mean? I. guess I do. What about psychos and crooks? Sure. You know, they were they were looking. for meth labs out there by helicopter.

So, the idea that there was a drug gang. or just some ne'er-do-wells out there, uh or just some some random psychopath. was rumors that circulated. Yeah, it. didn't hurt that the Barker Ranch where. the Manson family hung around um is not. too far away. Yeah. >> some people are like, well, there you. go. I guess there's some. 100-year-old Manson family member that. they ran across that who killed them. Yeah. Uh and then there was a this was.

the probably the most conspiracy. theory-minded of the conspiracy theories. or the theories of what happened to. them. Not too far away. in the middle of the desert, in the. middle of nowhere, uh is the China Lake. Naval Weapons Center, which is a. military testing range. I've seen top secret. Uh it seems to be. quite top secret. And of course, anytime. you have a top secret military testing. facility in the middle of nowhere, people are like, they're doing crazy. stuff there. Yeah. >> And the idea was that Egbert, either.

being a curious person, was drawn to the. site. This is the real reason he wanted. to go to Death Valley, was so he could. sneak into China Lake Naval Weapons. Center and see what they were working. on. Or perhaps he was a spy or something. like that. And that the family had. gotten caught trying to get into the. weapons center and had either been um. sent to like a. a ghost prison or killed and buried in. the desert. Who knows what the. government will do when their.

uh this is the the the technology. bandied about on the internet when their. hybrid propulsion systems are at risk. Yeah. Some random German shows up. Yeah. But also, I mean, could you get. more vague than hybrid propulsion? Like, what's it propelling? What is it a. hybrid of? Yeah. But it's just so like. futuristic sounding. Yeah, for sure. Uh. I was driving down the highway the other. day and I saw a pickup truck next to me. that had a. uh I don't know what it was. It was a.

military green like. something or other. Like it was in the. it was in the bed of a pickup truck on. like a. um. on a pallet. >> Mhm. But, you know, it had a screen and. buttons. and it was square. and it was clearly military. And then I. looked at I can't remember the name of. the company that was transporting it, but I looked up the company and it said. like, you know, we manufacture things for the. for the warfighter. Huh. I was like, what the hell is that.

next to me on the highway? Maybe it was. a military issue chicken coop. It might have been something. It was. probably something that silly cuz these. guys were just driving it in a pickup. truck. There were no. they didn't look armed. I mean, they may. have been armed, but it's not like it. was surrounded by Humvees or something. like that. >> Right. But it was definitely something weird to. see, you know? I'm I'm curious. Hopefully one of our listeners can can. tell us what that probably was. Yeah. It. was like a trash compactor or something. Um okay. So, this is where it would have. been left. Like he was looking for. hybrid propulsion, they ran across the.

meth manufacturers, he intentionally staged the the. disappearance. Um that's just that was. it. Like everybody was like they're. we're probably never going to figure out. what happened to them. But there's this. one guy who I mentioned earlier who. found out about this. His name's Tom. Mahood. He's a retired civil engineer. Uh he lives in Orange, California. And. he um he got bored in his retirement and. started looking for things to do and did. a whole bunch of different stuff. But. one of the things he did was desert.

exploration, which is a very specific. kind of hiking exploration. Like you can. find yourself in real trouble really. quickly in the desert. So, it takes it's. a certain set of skills, right? Um and. so, Tom Mahood had this and he got. interested in the story of the Death. Valley Germans and he put those two. things together and he became kind of. obsessed with solving the whole thing. That sounds like a pretty good place for. our second break, hey? Yes. We met Tom. Mahood and he's going, "Guys, cut to.

break. Build the tension.". >> I was going to say I think Tom Mahood. would would approve, too. All right. We'll be right back with more on Tom. Mahood right after this. >> [music]. [music]. [music].

[music]. [music]. >> All right. So, Tom Mahood is on the. scene. Uh like Liam Neeson, he has a particular. set of skills. >> Mhm. And he had heard about this case in 2008. for the first time. And uh in 2009, 13 years after their. disappearance, he said, "You know what? I'm taking it upon myself to figure out. what happened to this family.".

He went out to the site. He went out to. where the van was found. He brought a. camera. He retraced the steps all the way to the. beer bottle bush. Uh that butt print was long gone. >> Mhm. Uh I like to think that Tom maybe. sat in that spot and had a Bud Ice if he. could get his hands on any in 2009. >> Right. He looked around, headed back home. When. he got home, he was looking at the maps, he was looking at the pictures and he. said, "Wait a minute. I have a theory. about how they ended up there and where.

they might have gone.". Yeah. Um and remember that 4-day search was. really thorough. Like if you read Tom. Mahood's blog otherhand.org, he has an extensive multi-part um. uh description of this whole thing, the. case, his search, all that stuff. Uh called Hunt for the Death Valley um. Germans. It's totally worth reading. But on this, he he praises the the search. Like he's. like, "This was a really good search, but they didn't search everywhere." One.

of the places they didn't search was. south. The reason they didn't search south is. because there's nothing there. He would. have to be a complete idiot to try to go. south. The only thing there is China. Lake Naval Weapons Center and that is. really remote. It's in the middle of. nowhere. Then he started to try to think. about why somebody would go south and he. put himself in the mindset of some. German tourists visiting America in a. national park and that's how he ended up. cracking the whole thing.

That's right. So, he. was like they're low on money. So, that's a that's a bit of a clue or an. indicator of what they might do. They didn't have a lot of time. It was. July 22nd and they needed to be back to. LA in 4 days and they still wanted to go. to Yosemite. That was on their. itinerary. >> Right. So, there was a time crunch, there was a money crunch. And then one. of the last pictures on the camera, you. know, I mentioned obviously the last. ones would be the most instructive as to. pinpointing where they were, what they. were doing, was sunset in Death Valley.

And the ranger said, "Hey, this is we. know the sunset. That's. Hanaupah Canyon on the west side of. Death Valley. And we know it's taken on July 22nd. because it was, you know, pictures were. dated. And that was the night they arrived at. the park. Um we knew that they couldn't. afford to camp out at Furnace Creek or. get a room at that hotel. And so, you. know, like most national parks that or I. guess all of them, there are places. where you can back country camp for. free. Just, you know, there areas and a. lot of times you have to.

like apply and fill out a little thing. so they know where you are, but you can. camp in the back country at Hanaupah. Canyon. And this is just not a very touristy. area as far as Death Valley goes. It's. the east side is more tourist-friendly. and this is again on the west side. Yeah. Hours and hours away from the. welcome center. At least have you been. to Death Valley? I've not. Uh I. did a TV commercial for a couple of days. in Death Valley. Okay, so it's huge, right? Yeah, I mean I was just in one little. tiny part of it, obviously.

>> it's massive. Please it looks big on a map, yeah. >> there you go. So, this clue to Hanaupah Canyon. kind of showed, I guess being in the. mindset of Egbert kind of helped Tom. Mahood figure out what their next move. would be. And so if you look at a map. and you're in Hanaupah Canyon and you're. trying to get to Yosemite, it would make. sense to go this route past the Warm. Springs Mine toward Mengel Pass, right? And so he knows now that he's kind of in.

Egbert's head because it's all this. stuff is kind of making sense to him now. why they did what they did. And. ultimately again, they're trying to look. for the fastest, cheapest way to get to. Yosemite from Death Valley. So they went by the geologist again, not. open for business at the time. And Mahood essentially says that he. probably thought it was a visitor center. or something like that. But it wasn't, so they continued on. And. as they were driving to Mengel Pass,

they came upon roads that were like, okay, this is not a good road. This is. not even a gravel road. This is. kind of rough, but the minivan can take. it. If I drive slowly, if I drive. carefully. And Egbert was doing a fairly good job. it seems. But when they got to Mengel. Pass, which is all they had to do was. cross Mengel Pass, make it a little. further and they could take a road to. Yosemite. But when they got there, they were. stopped dead in their tracks. There was.

just no way to pass it. Yeah, not even that sweet sweet Plymouth. Voyager. Uh if this episode isn't sponsored by. Bud Ice and Plymouth Voyager, then we're. doing something wrong. >> Yeah. Yeah. We need a time machine I guess. It. could live alongside the 2012 Camry. Probably. The 1996 Plymouth Voyager. It's really Are you. >> [laughter]. >> And then just the sound of a Bud Ice cap. being twisted off. And somebody glugging it and then. hitting the ground. Uh so they realized that they can't get.

through there. They have There's the. only way to go is back. Uh it would have. been around, you know, between 12:30 and. 1:30 p.m. By this point at least 105°. So they backtrack to that geologist. cabin. It's still locked. And this is what I meant earlier when. what I don't understand. What At this. point I don't understand why they didn't. break into this cabin. This is dire circumstances. And get some some food and water.

Here's the thing. Tom Mahood explains. this really well. He's He was saying, no, these are German. tourists. They're safe in America. They're in a national park. To them it. was not a dire situation yet. That they. were still on on track. They were just. having a little trouble. And the map. that they had was misleading them all. over the place. So he, being in Egbert's. head, said Egbert made the decision. Rather. than go drive all the way back to the.

visitor center to. get out of the park in a way that you. know how to do, but that's going to cost. you many, many hours and it's going to. take a really long time to get to. Yosemite, why would you not follow these. roads on the map that are essentially a. shortcut to Yosemite? It's going to take. hours off of your trip. If the map shows. a road there, why would you not take it? And the problem is their map showed them. roads that. either were really misleading and. weren't really roads. or weren't roads at all. That was the.

map that Egbert was dealing with and. that was what ultimately got them. killed. Yeah, the one thing I couldn't find was. what. the gas situation was like in that car. I didn't see that either. I looked too cuz that that would have. really factored in obviously because. if you've ever taken out west road trips. or anywhere in the world where there's. just few and far between gas stations. that that. I mean I almost got trapped a couple of. times low on gas, you know. >> Yeah, that's nerve-racking. So we don't know the gas situation. He's.

in his head speculating the stuff. Seems. pretty logical to me. Um the shortcut that they took started. off pretty easy. They're almost lured. into it. Uh because they felt like, all. right, with this Plymouth Voyager, I. know this car. It can take it. Uh but eventually they descended into. Anvil Canyon. And this is where the road. becomes a wash. It's a dry creek bed. Um. dry creek beds are, you know, there's a. lot of sediment, a lot of loose gravel, uh a lot of sand and it's really easy to.

get stuck in one of those. I've been. stuck in one of those. >> Yikes. And the only way to kind of to. avoid getting stuck is just to keep that. thing going forward as quickly as you. can. I'm not dangerous, obviously, but. just kind of keep those wheels going. forward. What you don't want to do is. stop. And it looks like that's what. Egbert was doing was trying to go pretty. quickly through that gravel. And that's. ultimately what how he got those tires, you know, popped. Right. What How they. ended up in the the middle of the sand. up to their axle is there is a fork.

right behind them. And the fork. veered to the They took the veer I think. to the left. and realized, oh no, we want to go to. the right. This left isn't actually the. road. And he tried to cut over through. the I guess median between them and that. was just nothing but sand that they got. stuck in. So now they're stuck. And Tom Mahood makes the case that they. still didn't view this as a survival. situation yet. This is a deeply.

inconvenient issue that surely they. could get help with, right? I mean. again, they're in a national park. But. they're 4 miles from the geologist. cabin. That's that's something they. could do. But again, this is totally in. the wrong direction. And they're hoping. to find somebody a little closer to help. them pull their van out of out of. trouble and get some new tires. So this. is where. they think that Egbert walked off with a. bottle of Bud Ice and sat in the shade. and tried to figure out what to do next. Yeah, I mean clearly he he's not worried.

about survival if he's drinking a beer. Right. Because that will dehydrate you. even further. Not sure if Egbert knew. that. But he's German, plenty of beer over. there. You would think he would know. that. And again, in his defense too, now that. I'm coming around to this idea, he may. not have even known like who knows what. you can see in the window of that. geologist cabin. if there were like, you know, big water. bottles or something within plain view. or not. So he may not have thought like, hey, maybe we should go back there and. get some rations at least. >> Right. Cuz he may not have seen any.

Again, just speculating here. But. directly south of that site, again is. that China Lake military base. And what. Tom Mahood reckoned was, hey, maybe he knew about this base and maybe. he figured at least there will be people. there. Maybe there's a perimeter fence. with cameras. Maybe there's some dudes. patrolling the perimeter. Uh but it it the very least, even if. it's a top secret place, um we could probably go get some help or. something and they could drive us out of. here, you know. >> If we show up at the fence of a secret.

military base, they're going to come to. us, essentially. Yeah. >> Makes a lot of sense. And on the map that Egbert was using, the the border of the China Lake Naval. Weapons Center is marked off. So to him. it looked like that fence, that. perimeter fence was just a few miles. walk from where they were now, where the. where the van was stuck, right? >> Right. The reason why they didn't search south. uh.

in the initial 4-day search was because. China Lake doesn't have a perimeter. fence. It's so isolated in the middle of. this very deadly desert that they're. like, if you try to hike to us, you're. going to die. We You're so dead, we. don't even need to put up a fence. And so this is Tom Mahood figuring this. out. Like if you are in Europe and you. go to a military installation, there's. going to be a fence. It's going to be. patrolled. And that would been a really. smart idea to just take the shortcut to.

the military installation to get help. Unfortunately, it was just doomed not to. work out because there was no fence. whatsoever. And. at some point Egbert figured that out. And then. it started to sink in that they were in. really big trouble. Yeah, so Tom Mahood wants to find at. least some human remains at this point. He's uh. I don't want to get in Tom Mahood's. head, but um. and say like he was obsessed, but he was. very much into the idea of finding out.

what happened to this family. Let's just. say that. >> Yeah. He got his friend uh Les Walker and. said, all right, let's get together. another team. Let's go search south this time. Um about an hour after they started this. search, he found an empty wine bottle. under a bush. He said, here's another. clue. Then he found a crumpled up piece of. paper. He thought it might have been. toilet paper at first. Uh he it turned out it was pages from a. daily planner in German. So he said, I'm really the trail is hot. at this point, like literally and. figuratively.

And not too long after that, his buddy. Les radios and says, Tom, we have some. bones here. Yeah. So. I guess Les Walker had come to the base. of a a cliff that was about 30 ft tall. And it would make sense that this is. where you would find the bones of. somebody stranded in the desert cuz it. was the only place that was offering. shade. Yeah. And the bones were strewn. about. They were sun-bleached, but the. thing that gave it away that these were. definitely the family, the the remains.

of the family, Cornelius' wallet was found with them. Like all the credit cards had her name. on it. And so Les and Tom left the bones. in situ, but they took the wallet. because they were afraid that they were. going to be taken for a couple of local. yahoos who were trying to. who came up with the wild story, but now. they had physical proof that they had. discovered the Death Valley Germans, and. that got things moving really quickly. Yeah, so this was 9 miles from that. abandoned minivan. So, to make it 9.

miles in that kind of heat uh really. speaks a lot to their tenacity trying to. get out of there and trying to save. themselves. Very, very sad. >> With young kids, too. Yeah. I mean, Max was 4 years old, right? >> Yeah. That's just Yeah, it's devastating to. think about. Um they were like you. mentioned 4 miles from the border of. that naval base. Uh and they were headed in the right. direction. Like they were. kind of doing the right thing to what. they thought was a reasonable idea of. rescue, you know, looking back. Um.

they uh you know, they they got those. bones DNA tested. Uh I think they were. positively matched with only Egbert, is. that. >> Right. Uh but that's not to say that it wasn't. Connie. Uh it's obviously Connie. Um. they there were no confirmed remains of. the children. Uh that part is very troublesome to me. still. Yeah, the the the closest they. found was a small shoe that it was so it. was so beaten up that it could have been. Connie's shoe. It could have been a.

woman's small shoe, but it also could. have been a kid's shoe. So, that's the. that's the only physical evidence they. found that could possibly be linked to. the kids. Um the bones were distributed all over. um in this kind of one site at the base. of the cliff because it was um. there was a a wash, I think, on either. side of the cliff. Yeah. So, over the. course of all these years, 15 years um. the rains and the ensuing torrents of. water would have essentially spread the.

bones out. Um. I don't know that that would have. done anything just to the kids' bones. I. don't know. Maybe they were so light. that they got carried away and spread. and dispersed even further. I'm not. sure, but it is sad that they never. found the kids' remains, too. Yeah, and I just can't imagine anything. more terrifying than uh. being with your family like that and. slowly dying of of. sunstroke and dehydration and uh. malnutrition is just over the course of. who knows how many days, you know? It's.

brutal. Yeah, the thing that gets me is. that I like thinking of what it must. have been like for Egbert to to climb. some ridge and be able to see for dozens. of miles and see that there was no. perimeter fence anywhere. And for it to. just hit you then, and then you have to. walk back and. I guess tell your tell your girlfriend. like. yeah, we're in trouble. Uh we salute. you, Tom Mahood, for uh picking this. case up and and bringing about some sort.

of resolution. Uh obviously they feel. awful for his uh ex-wife back in. Germany, you know, that her son was. taken from her and on this fun sort of. bonding trip and never came home. It was. just just a very sad story. >> It is. Um yeah, and I mean, that's. that's as close to solved as it gets, and it seems pretty solved. >> Yeah. Agreed. Uh well, since we don't have. anything more to say about the Death. Valley Germans except rest in peace, all. four of you, I think it's time for. listener mail.

Uh this is about The Far Side. We did an. episode on Gary Larson's great cartoon, The Far Side, and got a lot of great. feedback. It's clearly a beloved. uh. cartoon that um we heard from a lot of. people that just really enjoyed our. tribute. Um hey guys, uh The Far Side. was also a huge part of my comedy. experience in my middle school to high. school years. Been happy to share it. with my son, who's 11, who laughs out. loud or sometimes says, "I don't get. this one." Uh your podcast made me think. about how polarizing the humor of The. Far Side can be, and sometimes you just. don't get it or don't really like it. Uh.

my mom always thought it was such a dumb. comic, but would see me laughing on and. on reading The Far Side galleries. Uh. one day she had the paper first and. really [music] liked the Far Side from. that day and laughed out loud and said, "Oh, Pete, you're going to love [music]. this one." And it was Grandma Worm. telling the little worms how Grandpa got. the axe and made them. you know, chopped up into little worms. And I said, "Eh, it's okay." Uh. >> [music]. >> but she was insistent, "Don't you get. it?". And I said, "Ma, I get it. He cut.

himself into more worms." My mom was so. mad about my reaction that she couldn't. talk to me for a couple of hours. But I think that's what's so brilliant. about Gary Larson. Any single cartoon. could be the funniest thing ever to a. particular person and not so much to. another even if they love it. Uh thanks. so much for the show, guys, and the. countless hours that you've given to. entertain me and my family. And that is. from Pete. And hello to Pete and your. family and your 11-year-old son. >> Yeah, hello, Pete. Um thank you for. that. Yeah, we got a lot of people. sending their favorite um Far Sides.

Yeah, it was fun. Yep. Um thanks. everybody who wrote in about The Far. Side, and if you haven't listened to. that episode yet, strongly recommend. It's a good one. Uh and if you want to be like Pete and. send us a good email like he did, you. can send it off to. stuffpodcast@iheartradio.com. Stuff You Should Know is a production of. iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from. iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen. to your favorite shows.