SYSK’s Summer Movie Playlist: Josh and Chuck's List of Horror Movies that Changed the Genre

Hi there friends. Welcome back to the. playlist. This episode is our list of. horror movies that changed the genre. It's from back in 2017 and it's as. timely today as it was back then. Horror. is probably my favorite genre of all. films. And I hope you guys like it too, even if you're not into horror movies. And even if you're not into horror. movies, I hope you guys will like this. episode, too. It's just that. interesting. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know from.

how stuffuffs.com. Hey, and welcome into the podcast. I'm. Josh Clark, Charles W. Chuck Bryant. Howdy. His middle name is Wayne. My. middle name is Malcolm. There we have. it. I always forget about that. Malcolm. Yeah, Wayne. Named after Wayne Coin, right? Uh, no. Oh, John Wayne and you were named after. Malcolm in the Middle. That's right.

Frankie Munis is my name'sake. I hope he's okay. Early Brian Cranston, too. I used to love that show. Oh, it's. a great show. I watched it um like. within the last couple months. I was. cleaning the house and put it on Netflix. and still great. Yeah. Yeah. It really. is a good show. So, you clean your. house, you put on your VR goggles and. just queue up Malcolm in the middle. Yeah. No, I just You walk around and. bump into things and Right. Exactly. But.

I I put on like a huge feather duster. suit. Yeah. So, you're just cleaning and. bumping into things. That's right. That's how I do it. Wow. Yeah. It works. kind of well. Someone's going to take. that idea. Yeah. Like the shark native. Yeah. But. they should just they should sell that. suit with a purple drink. [Laughter]. I think you just get one spot on the. floor really really clean.

Uh what are you going to title this one. by the way because this was your pick. and we title our own shows episodes. Some horror films that change the genre. All right. And you should add this aka. How could you guys forget blank? Yeah. Yeah. We should say like this. First of. all, this is a Grabster article. So, it's Grabster's list. Sure. And he knows. what he's talking about. If you look at. some of the entries, some don't even. have source tags. Whoa. He's just like,

I just know. He should grabster. But we. even took his list and carved some out. and put some in. Sure. So, this is How. about this? This is Josh and Chuck's. idea of some horror films that changed. the genre featuring the mind of the. grabster. Yes. In other words, it is not. a complete list of every horror film. that changed the genre. Yes. Because I. would argue that Well, and actually, I.

see Grabster put Texas Chainsaw Massacre. in there. He said that if this were a. top 15 list, that would be in there. So. would Alien. Yeah, he has that. Alien uh. Ringu and the US remake Ring. And I. would lobby for uh well, Psycho didn't. make it onto his list, which but we're. going to put that in. And uh there was. one more. Oh, even though I didn't. really think it was that great. Uh the. movie Saw I think kind of changed horror. films. And that's what this list is. Not best.

horror films, but things that kind of. changed the game. Yeah, it seems like. Saw kind of kicked off that that uh. torture porn. Yeah, didn't it? I can't. remember if it was that or hostile. One. of the two. What a It was definitely one. of the two for a subg genre. Well, it's. pretty accurate actually. It is. But. most of these are are movies that either. uh were the first of its kind and maybe. did start a subg genre or movies that.

were so popular that they just, you. know, kind of rewrote how people view. horror movies. Mhm. Uh some of them. because of marketing, some because they. were really good movies, some because of. box office, but all of these I don't. think anyone could argue did not change. the genre. How about that? Sure. Yeah, I. think that's well put, dude. Uh, and. before we get started, speaking of. horror, I want to give a plug to Whoa. my friend Toby's movie that's coming.

out. He's a producer. Yeah. On a movie. coming out called The Ghost Story. Yeah. Toby uh when we met Toby, well, you knew. Toby before me, of course, cuz he's your. friend. And I know him through Yumi. So, really, he's Yumi's friend. But he was. he was small time doing short films and. stuff. Mhm. And since that time, and. this has been within the last like since. we've been doing this podcast. Yeah. He's now big time. Yeah. They did Pete's. Dragon. Yeah. Um and then Yeah, they.

have this this they did Ain't Them Body. Saints was I think the one that they. kind of broke out with, which I love. that movie. And then this one um is. definitely kind of falls into that same. look and mood and feel, which uh it's. called A Ghost Story, and I think it. comes out in July. And I think it's. labeled a drama rather than horror or. even supernatural or thriller. Um, but. the reason I tie it into horror is. because A24 is releasing it and A24 is.

killing it with horror movies lately. Yeah, that's a good uh that's a good. outfit. They did The Witch. They did the. Black Coat's Daughter. Have you seen. that? Uh, no. It's on Amazon Prime. It's. on Amazon Prime right now. Nodded and. gave a thumbs up, dude. It's one of the. best horror movies I've seen in a while. I think The Witch is probably my. favorite right now. Yeah. Black Code's. Daughter is a close second. And then. last night, I saw It Comes at Night in. the theater. Uhhuh. And It Comes at. Night.

actually upset my stomach. The ending. did. It was It was that rough. Yeah. I think we're we've we're at a. place with horror movies that we haven't. been in a long time. Like a really. genuine good spot. Yeah. Like the whole. torture porn sort of era is over and the. found footage thing is so played. Oh. man. But I think we like with movies. like The Witch, I think we've really. like there are some really creative uh.

uh It Follows. Did you see that one? Yeah. like some just really creative. ways of bringing scares that I haven't. seen before. Get Out. That was amazing. You see Get Out, man. I still haven't. seen it. You're going to love it. I I'm. I'm envious of you. It's really It's. great movie, Chuck. You're going to love. it. Well, I don't get to the movies much. anymore. And the only time I could was a. couple of weeks ago and I elected to see. Wonder Woman. Yeah, not a bad choice. So, long way of saying congratulations. to Toby and his new film. Well, that's. funny. We also need to congratulate Toby.

too because Toby just got married. Toby. and Enell are now married. So. congratulations to them as well. So is. this is this new movie with uh his uh. directing partner David Lowry. Yeah. Yeah. And Rooney Mara, man, they got a. good thing going. Yeah, they they. definitely do. So it's going to be good. I'm looking forward to it. Awesome. Okay, so let's get started. Thanks for. for indulging that. Thank you everybody. So, the first the first movie on our. list is what's widely considered the.

first horror movie, and it's a 1920. movie out of Germany that um basically. was the first film that undertook what's. the artistic movement known as German. expressionism. Yeah. It's called The. Cabinet of Dr. Caligari. Yeah. I mean, some say, like you said, it was the first horror movie. Some say. it was the first cult film. Um, it uh well just you may not be able to.

get through the whole thing if you're. not into silent movies, but you should. ceue up a little bit of it and watch a. little bit of it. Um, because it's. hugely impactful. Um, and still to this. day like very disconcerting to look at. because of it how um. ominous and weird it looked. Yeah. Just. physically looked. Yeah. Like the sets. that they built are obviously um. constructed, manufactured. They were not. in any way, shape or form going for.

realism. They were going for surrealism. for sure. Yeah. And so like the. staircases are at crazy weird curves and. angles and um like everything from the. house the house's rooftops to the blades. of grass are super pointy and sharp and. and the shadows that they employed were. just perfect. You've never seen a better. use of shadows than this. They didn't. get in the way. They just created this. mood and it was the first movie to. really kind of do that to just take to.

use the camera for something other than. capturing realism. Uh, and it it it for. that reason it's considered the first. horror movie because that that's such a. standard part of horror, whether large. like in large part like in a Tim Burton. movie or in small part, you know, where. you're um you're using small spaces to. create claustrophobia. The idea of using. the set to mess with the viewer's mind, I think, is is born in Dr. Caligar's.

cabinet. Yeah. It's almost like they. they took a child and gave them. construction paper and said cut out. scary things, right? Uh and then like uh. like that movie, The Baba Duke. I think. the actual book within The Baba Duke was. hugely inspired by this. Uh the actual. movie itself um the plot is about a a. sideshow operator, a hypnotist who um. has a patient that he takes around to. these sideshows with a sleep disorder. supposedly he's been asleep his entire.

life and he uses this patient to commit. murder, right? He's like a sleepwalker. Yeah. Somnulist. So that in itself is a pretty. frightening plot and to think about that. being cooked up in 1920 uh when there. were really not such things that you. think of as horror movies is pretty. impressive. Mhm. Um, and then some of. like the deeper critiques I've seen of. it was like the the explanation for why. the filmmakers chose like these weird. odd angles to kind of depict insanity or.

that kind of thing. Yeah. Um, was rooted. in World War I. The horrors of World War. I had just been seen and revealed and. recently taken place and it upended. Europe in general and especially Germany. as well. Um, and that the idea is that they they. might not have had this idea. They might. not have had this desire, this drive to. create this this weird set and in fact.

this weird movie had World War I not. happened. Yeah. This uh there's this. writer Jeff Saparito who um kind of put. it this way about German expressionism. because I wasn't exactly sure how to. define it. Uh but you're kind of right. on the money. He said Germany was uh. largely isolated from the rest of the. world following uh World War I. So. expressionism therefore became confined. to the country refers to a number of. creative movements from World War I. through the 1920s. Uh expressionist. works examine the uh current and future. state of the culture through bold and.

artistic creations of creativity and. often explored topics of madness, betrayal and other intellectual. concepts. And nothing encapsulates these. ideas more than the cabinet of Dr. Caligotti. That's basically what I said. Yeah. You did you read that or were you. just uh that I don't know if I read that. that one or not. It sounded kind of. familiar. Yeah. No, just say you came up. with it. Um so there the the idea of the. the set just creating like a creepy tone. and texture to everything. Um.

that was Dr. Caligari. That's how it. changed the genre. Yeah. Yeah. Tim. Burton say thank you. Yeah. you um have. you seen Coraline? No, but I know it. It's a they they did. that to very good effect. You know, I. think Hodman does a voice in that, doesn't he? He does. He does the dad. He. did a spectacular job because you. actually forget it's Hajman while you're. watching it. That's impossible. All. right, Chuck, moving on. That was 1920. We're going to fast forward all the way.

to what? 1960? 1963. If you're talking. about Blood Feast. Well, I wasn't, but. let's. uh Simon uh Simon Abrams of Roger. Eert.com says this. Bloodfast is a. terrible film. Mhm. And a historically. important one, too. Yep. And I think. that's sort of the deal with Blood. Feast. It is not good by any accounts. Did you watch any of it? Yeah, sure. It's not good. No, it's not good. It's. terrible. Uh it was written on basis on.

a 14-page outline. Didn't even have a. script. It's got the same cloying. technicolor of like a early Hawaii 50. episode. Yeah, for sure. Uh directed by. Hershel Gordon Lewis and producer David. F. Friedman. And uh basically the idea. was this. These guys did not see films. as art. They saw them as a business and. thought you were foolish if you thought. it was anything else. So they sat. around, they brainstormed movies that. they thought no one else would make.

Yeah. because they started out making. like porkiesesque type movies. Yeah. And. they were they were doing fine with. that, but apparently they were. successful enough with it that there. started to be imitators and the market. was crowded. So they said, "Where can we. go make movies that no one else is going. to make?" Yeah. Cuz we want to shock. people essentially. So couple of ideas. they had that did not make the list was. con man evangelist and Nazi torture. which uh which were later made. Exactly.

And they finally said, "You know what? No one's really done yet is hardcore. gore." Yep. Like everyone always cuts. away when the knife comes. And you're. like, "What if we showed the the. grossest goriest stuff imaginable on. screen?" Yeah. And even still, they. didn't show so like one of the f the. first murder, a woman stabbed through. the eye and then the murderer hacked her. legs off with a machete, right? And they. didn't show the knife penetrate the eye.

They didn't show the machete making. contact with the skin. But what they did. in Blood Feast and what made Blood Feast. the first of its kind was they would. show the what came after that. They. would show the brains on the ground. They would show the endtrails like on. the knife. Um they would show the leg. being, you know, that had been. dismembered being put into a bag and. like the wound that was left by it. Yeah. like that. This was to No one had. ever done anything like that on film.

before. No. And and it paid off. They um. depending on who you ask, the the budget. was uh anywhere from like 20 to 30 grand. and it made between 7 and $30 million. Uh like I said, depending on where you. get your info, but by all accounts, it. was a huge financial success. Yeah. Uh. compared to what they paid to make it. Yeah. And they they shot it in um I. think it was six days or something down. in Miami. Yeah. Um based on a 14page.

outline that wasn't even a script, it. was an outline. Basically, it was like. murderer goes and kills this girl. Yeah. Next girl, murderer comes in, kills. girl, cuts off leg, that kind of thing, right? Yeah. I mean, if it matters, the. movie is about a serial killer caterer. Yeah. That's it. There's your plot right. there. Yep. Um but the the it was just. such a a revolutionary movie that the. sensors at the time there wasn't such a. thing as the MPAA hadn't been formed. yet. Um and there was basically no one.

except for local sensors overseeing. movies. Yeah. So you know you you could. be playing in one town um to all. audiences and then the next town over it. could be banned. But the sensors had. never seen anything like it and they. didn't know what to do with it. So yeah, it it it was hugely successful. commercially too. Yeah. And uh another. big impact it had was it inspired a. generation of special effects, but. basically um let's be honest, young boys.

who were doing this on their own Super. Eight films, right? And said, "Wait, uh. I can get a job doing this." Yep. So, including Tom Cevini, I think, was. inspired by it, wasn't he? Or was he. inspired by Yeah, I think he was. inspired by Blood Feast. Oh, wow. Um, and then we should also give a a mention. to the Grand Gun. Is that how you think. it's pronounced? Sure. Granuin. Sure. Uh, it was a theater in Paris, I. believe. From the late 19th century on.

to, I think, 1962. So, the year before. Blood Feast came out, it had closed up, but it used to do this stuff on stage. It was like a gorefest. Um, and there was lots of like blood and. sex and and like depraved themes in the. plays that were put on at this theater. People loved it. They were crazy for it. Um, and the this was kind of like the. Grand Go tradition put onto film for the.

first time. And who for that? You want. to take a break? Yeah, let's do it. [Music]. [Music].

All right, Charles, we're back. So, 1960. or 1968? Uh, I've got 1968 in front of my face. Okay. Uh, and that could be no other. movie than Night of the Living Dead. classic George Romero film. Uh Romero. was a TV director making TV commercials. Commercial director rather. He was also. making short films for Mr. Rogers. Neighborhood at the time. Yeah. And he. was he was young. Yeah. I don't I don't.

know how old he was, but he was pretty. young guy still. 196 I think when he. made shot of the Living Dead, he was. like 26 or 27. Wow. So, uh yeah, by any. standard, that's still pretty young. unless you're 23. So he I he had um he. and his buddies were like, "Let's make a. horror movie, but let's not make a. stupid horror movie. Let's make one with. like an actual plot that explores like. deep themes to like a good movie. Let's. let's make the first good horror movie.".

Well, yeah. So, and we'll delve into. that a little more, but that that was. definitely a different thing at the. time. And the other different thing was. that all the horror movies up to that. point, uh they were called the Universal. Monsters from Universal Studios. You. know, all the the kind of the classic. Frankenstein and Dracula and Creature. from the Black Lagoon and the Werewolf. and uh that was where that was. mainstream horror. And George Romero. comes along and says, "Um, how about. zombies?" And everyone said, "What in.

the world's a zombie?" And he said, "Well, let me define that for every. future generation of movie and TV goers. and lovers." Yeah. And there had been. zombie movies before, but they had been. things like like Dr. Caligari's cabinet, somebody who was under the control of. something someone else or something like. that. There was a hypnotist or this was. like the the first time what we think of. as zombies were ever introduced. Like. flesh-eating ghouls who were dead and.

come back to life. Yeah. Just what you. think of as a zombie. This guy started. that genre. like you said. Yeah, they uh. shot it outside and in Pittsburgh uh on. about $115,000. budget. Not bad. Ended up grossing 12. million domestic. Not bad. And I think. close to 20 worldwide. And um was. eventually selected by the Library of. Congress for preservation in the. National Film Registry. It's a good.

movie. It it's a very good movie. Uh. they shot it in black and white to save. on cost even though color was the. standard by that point. And uh black and. white is also a little more forgiving. for rudimentary special effects. And uh. one of the revolutionary things he did. was uh cast a black actor as the lead. and for no other reason than hey this. guy Dwayne Jones is really good. Exactly. right. Like he didn't go back and go, "Oh, well, you know, our our hero is. black, so we need to make the the whole.

thing a meditation on race and have him. confront racism." It it was just here's. the script and then the guy playing the. lead just happens to be black, right? And he was the best guy in the auditions. and you know in 1968 this didn't really. happen. You didn't just cast a black guy. as a lead actor for no with no like. ulterior motive basically. Right. So I. read this review from the from the time. from 1969 the year after it came out. a. young Roger Eert went and watched it and.

wrote a review and he wrote um a a. pretty pretty interesting review which. is basically it was about the reaction. of the audience and he went to a. Saturday matinea that was populated. almost entirely by 10 11 year olds. Oh. wow. and they were used to seeing the. creature from the Black Lagoon or. Frankenstein or um you know just just. movies that any kid could handle and. could enjoy watching and you know fun.

scary kind of stuff. Yeah. And he said. that's how the that that was how the. crowd reacted for the first half of the. movie. But then about the point where. and here's here comes spoilers. everybody. If you haven't seen Night of. the Living Dead, just hit yourself in. the knee with a hammer. Um, you the the. the the teenage couple go to get gas and. when their car blows up and is engulfed. in flames, they die. They're burned to. death. He said, "Right about that time,

the tone, the mood of the theater. changed and there was no like gleeful. screaming anymore. kids were starting to. like not move and were afraid to like. move in their seats and some were. quietly crying to themselves and from. that the whole the whole point on it. just got worse and worse for these. little kids watching this movie. So it. was a huge uh. impact on horror movies. A it uh like. you said earlier, it was kind of the. first one to really sort of delve into.

other issues like if if you look up like. significance of Night of the Living Dead. or um meaning of Night of the Living. Dead or something like that. There are. scores of articles that have been. written over the years of how it was a. metaphor for the Vietnam War or an. allegory about distrust of authority or. the collapse of traditional family. And. I think Romero said like I didn't. necessarily mean all these things, but. you can certainly find it in the movie. That is art. Like one of the great.

revelations of my adult life is that the. artist, the writer, the songwriter, the. um the author rarely intends to imbue as. much meaning into their work as people. take from it. That that's part of art as. interpretation. Isn't that neat? Yeah. Like you don't if. you're a writer, if you're a young. writer right now who's just sitting. there racking your brain for how to. insert metaphor and and meaning into. this, just write your story and people.

are going to find it for themselves. Yeah, agreed. I wish somebody had told. me that when I was younger. I had. teachers that said stuff like that. Oh, I didn't. like good college uh. professors in English that would when. students would argue like I think he. means this he would say like you know he. may or she may not have meant anything. right I had that's the revelation I had. teachers that would just go wrong. uh the other thing about Night of the. Living Dead is it spawned um obviously. the the zombie genre and uh sequels Dawn.

of the Dead, Day of the Dead, Return of. the Living Dead, uh The Walking Dead. remakes like shout out shout out Steven. Yun. Yeah, right. Why not? I'm still. into The Walking Dead. You Yeah, we. talked about this. Yes. Yes. Okay. Steven Yun listens. Uh anyway, zombies are I think still hot. and we can so hot. We We owe that all to.

Mr. Romero, master of the genre. Yep. Chuck, one more thing too that that. Night of Living Dead did that they. weren't the first, but very famously. Romero did was kill off his hero. senselessly and shockingly. Yeah. At the. end. Good point. Thanks, man. Okay, so. let's move on. Like I said, 1973. Yes. Day after Christmas. If you've ever. been uh in Washington DC at the end of M. Street, you might have noticed a very uh.

during the daytime ordinary set of. stairs. At night time, maybe they look. creepy to you because those are the. exorcist stairs. Yeah, I'm trying to. conjure the music in my head, but all. I'm coming up with is the Unsolved. Mysteries music. It's not quite right. So close, but it's not it. I'm so. unsatisfied right now. So, The Exorcist. was uh based on a book by William Peter. Blatty who uh wrote this uh in 1971 and.

then in 73 the movie was made. Uh and. there's I think I referenced not too. long ago a great Mark Marin interview. with um. William Friedken. Mhm. Where he talks. about the audition process for Linda. Blair. So, you should go listen to that. because it was pretty insightful. But um. The Exorcist really kind of changed the. game. um in that it was a it spawned a. bit of a subgenre of um demonic movies.

Sure. That were like religiousbased. Yeah. Even though I guess Rosemary's. Baby was before that, but The Exorcist. was such a mega hit and it was nominated. for best picture, the first horror movie. to be nominated um. for for that. So, it was just like it. was a big deal. It was It sold six. million tickets in about two months. Yeah. It's amazing. This is a horror. movie, right? And it came out of. nowhere. Um, apparently the effect it.

had on audiences was extremely. pronounced. There was a woman in Boston. who had to be carried from the theater. And she goes, "It cost me $4, but I only. lasted 20 minutes.". So word like that's the stories of that. got around and and people wanted to see. you know this movie can't be that scary. and they went and they were like oh my. god that movie is that scary. Yeah and. it holds up too. I mean um special. effects are they'd never quite hold up. but it's still a very creepy movie. Um,

very famously, uh, Linda Blair played. the the little girl who was possessed by. a demon and, uh, the the the the heavy. hitters were called in, right, to. exercise this demon, including, um, a. Max Van Seed, who was only 44 when he. played this guy in his easily in his. 70s. Yeah. Was he Benjamin Button? Well, no, they they made him up. Wow. They did. a great job. Yeah. Which I don't see why.

they felt the need to do that. I know. they um God, who else did they almost. cast? Oh, uh Brando. They almost cast. Brando, but that would have been a. colossal mistake. Well, Freriedin said, "You know what? As soon as you do that, it's a Marlon Brando movie." Yeah. And I. think he said picture. A Brando picture. Sure. That's what they said. Uh and he. didn't want it to be a Brando picture. He wanted to be The Exorcist. Um, so the. the you said it was based on a book from. two years before by William Peter. Blatty. He he apparently was known as a.

a comedy writer and he wanted to do. something different. He said, "Hey, wouldn't it be funny if the little. girl's head spun around and she puked. green bile?" Wait, what will you hear. what I have her do with a crucifix? Hey, so um, he actually wrote the book. because he wanted to scare America back. to church. That was his aim with the. book. it may have worked. He he believed. that there was real evil going on in the. world and that part of it was because of. a a loss of faith or a loss of religion,

I guess. And that's what he wanted to do. with it. Um, and when the movie came. out, there was a huge push back from. religious authorities. Like Billy Graham. said he believed the movie itself was. possessed by a demon. I'm not sure how. that would happen, but that was like a. huge thing at the time. Um, and a lot of. a lot of other um, religious. establishment types were like, "Don't go. see that movie. It's evil." But there. were some who who were part of part of.

religion, major organized religion, who. kind of saw through it and said, "No, no, this is it's good that we're talking. about this that there we're telling. people, you know, or people are seeing. that there there's such a thing as like. good versus evil literally combating on. earth, you know, and people are talking. about this and thinking about it." And. so in that sense, The Exorcist like. really kind of went to bat for organized. religion. Oh, interesting. I saw another. um criticism of it though that that said.

one of the themes of the movie that the. book hadn't really intended, but the. movie picked up on and expounded on was. intergenerational conflict. That that it. was Reagan, the child, represented the. younger generation who was at war with. the establishment. and that it even goes. um so far as to where her mother, the. actress, the movie that she's working on. is about a campus takeover by young. radicals. Huh. So that that's kind of a.

theme that was apparently part of the. subtext, but was a major part of it in. the movie at least. Interesting. Yeah, I. thought so too because apparently I mean. you think of intergenerational conflict. now. Apparently in the late 60s and. early 70s it was sharper than it. probably ever has been before or since. Yeah. Mhm. The only other thing I got is. that the uh the green stuff that she. projectiles was uh Anderson's pea soup.

and a little bit of oatmeal texture. Anderson's pea soup. I bet you can't get. that anymore. Chuck, let's do Jaws and. then we'll take a break. I love talking. about Jaws. Yeah, I mean Jaws is on, you. know, I did my top favorite movies list. uh at one point on our website and I. listed Jaws as my favorite movie. Favorite of all time. Yeah, I mean that. list changes, but it's Jaws is always in. my top five. I can watch it anytime it's. on. Uh it is one of the I've I've often.

said it's a perfect movie. Um, and what. I mean by that is there's just not a. misstep. Like the casting was perfect, the acting was great, the script was. great, it played out just perfectly. throughout the film. Um, he like. Spielberg was just a master storyteller. with that movie. You were talking about. how young George Romero was in Night of. the Living Dead. Spielberg was 26 when. he made Jaws. He was 13 years old,

right? He uh and he was apparently scared to. death when he finished filming. Uh the. schedule had been for 55 days. It went. to 159. Yeah. His he had I think been. allotted $4 million. He ended up. spending $12 million on it. Um yeah, largely because a shooting on water is. notoriously difficult and b uh the shark. mechanical shark they use was uh. legendarily. um.

wonky and how it or not wonky but wanky. wonky. It didn't work. No, it rarely worked. So. they spent a lot of time and burnt a lot. of uh hours trying to get this shark to. do its thing. and uh so much so that it. didn't even make that many appearances. in the movie. I think they even kind of. scaled it back and that ended up being. better for the movie because you didn't. get as much shark. I looked up the um. the urban legend about the shark being. named after Spielberg's lawyer, Bruce,

and apparently it's true. Oh, really? Yeah. Bruce Rener was the name of. Spielberg's lawyer and that was the. nickname for the mechanical shark on the. set was Bruce. That's pretty funny. So. with Jaws, right, we're we're talking. about horror movies that changed the. genre. Jaws not only changed the horror. genre, it changed movie making to this. day. Yeah. In in multiple ways, multiple. massive ways. It it changed the entire.

film industry almost single-handedly. Yeah. It was uh at the time there was a. uh there was no such thing. You take it. for granted now, but there was no such. thing as a quote unquote summer release. No. A lot of theaters closed down. because AC wasn't in every theater and. people didn't want to sit around in a. hot movie theater for two hours. Yeah. A. summer release or a a tentpole film or a. blockbuster feature like Jaws was the.

first one of all those. What at the time. when Jaws came out, they used to um. release a movie on maybe one, two. screens in say New York or LA for a week. and then it'd make its way to, you know, Atlanta, Minneapolis, Chicago for a few. weeks and then eventually it'd make it. to your small town six, eight weeks. later. Yeah, that was how movies were. released. Not Jaws. Jaws was released on. 435 screens across the country, which.

was huge. which is part of the part of. the um summer blockbuster release. playbook now. Yeah. And it was also the. first movie to to spend lots and lots of. money on marketing. Um and so I think. the studios are like, "Wait a minute, you spend some dough on marketing, you. release this thing wide, you can make a. ton of money in the first month that a. movie's out." Mhm. And you're kind of. set. Like after that, it's anything else. is gravy. Yeah. And that's after the.

first like week or two probably. Yeah, it was. Yeah. The whole the whole point. of Blockbuster now is to get that. opening weekend to make all your money. back in the opening weekend and then. everything else is gravy on top of it, right? Jaws was it didn't make its I. don't know, maybe it did make its money. back in the first weekend because it it. hit a hund00 million in like 78 days or. something incredible like that because. it was the first movie to hit $100. million and it did it in just a couple. months even. Yeah, it eventually went on. to make uh to about $260 million.

domestically. Uh which is I mean that's. a great take now. Yeah. You know, much. less uh the mid1 1970s. Sure. For a $12. million spin, for sure. My only beef. here is that I would not consider Jaws a. horror movie. Yeah. I think it's an adventure film. Yeah, I guess you're right. With a scary. antagonist. Yeah. But um it's amazing. how much I quote that movie in my. daytoday life. Yeah. A sha shark.

That's a great that's a classic. All right, let's take a break. I'm going. to meditate on that line and we'll talk. about uh a few other scary movies, including one that was originally titled. Scary Movie. [Music].

[Music]. Okay, moving on to Halloween. Halloween, Chuck. 1978, I believe. Halloween. Yes. John. Carpenter. Uh, the youngish John. Carpenter. Mhm. Who originally titled. this movie The Babysitter Murders. No. Little on the nose. Yeah. But pretty.

terrifying title. I guess. Uh, young. Jamie Lee Curtis, her very first movie. Was it really? Yeah. Well, she went on. to become known as the Scream Queen for. all the horror movies she was in. Totally. And this was uh shot in 20 days. in uh South Pasadena as the Midwest. And. um it was it's credited as being. birthing the slasher genre. Yeah, it did. So, there were slasher. films before it. The Town That Dreaded.

Sundown. good movie. It's like based on. a true crime story actually in Texas. One called Black Christmas, the Grabster. Sites from 1974. Haven't heard of that. one, but the idea of um. of a faceless almost a like non-entity. entity coming at you uh and relentlessly. stalking you, being impervious to harm. as the Gripster puts it. um and just.

coming at you again and again trying to. kill you. That that was that was all. established by Halloween and it was done. like to to great effect as well. Yeah. And it holds up. It's still scary. Uh. Michael Myers of course was the killer. Um the the music that John Carpenter. score I mean he he scores most of his. movies himself but um very iconic uh. basic thing. I think he only took a. couple of days to come up with it, but. like the Michael Myers character and the.

mask are so iconic. The music is so. iconic. You know about the mask, right, Shatner? Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead. I went. and checked that one out, too, to verify. that it was true. And it definitely is. true that the Michael Myers mask is. actually a Captain Kirk Star Trek mask. painted white. Yep. That is history. Yep. in the in the script uh when it. came to the mask, it just said uh pale. neutral features of a man. Yeah. Which.

makes the whole thing even creepier. because he's a implacid or a uh is that. the right word? I don't know. He's just. it's just almost like a just an. emotionless killer. Oh yeah. It it made. the fact that he was merciless, ruthless, pitiles, and and arbitrarily. killing people almost um all the more. pronounced because his expression never. changes. Well, to me, the two things. that were creepiest about Halloween was. the expression never changed because of. that mask and he did not run like Oh,

yeah. He would just walk and you still. got the feeling like you can't outrun. this guy even though he's walking. That. was another creepy part about it. it. follows was the walking aspect of it. Oh. yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. In the same. way that like 28 Days Later was freaky. in that it took zombies and made them. run. Yeah. Or I remember when I saw uh. Friday the 13th, I'm sorry, uh Nightmare. on Elm Street for the first time and. Freddy Krueger was running around, I was.

like, that's not what scary dudes do. Yeah, scary dudes don't trot. No, they. they walk very creepily toward you and. still somehow gain speed on you even. though you're running full speed. Well, Freddy scared me to death the first time. I saw that movie. Yeah. No, first one. was a pretty good one. But Halloween. established the like you said, it. established the slasher genre and. everything about slasher films still. today all rooted in in Halloween, John. Carpenters's tropes. Yeah. And again, like you said, there were a couple of. other slasher films before, but none of.

them grossed close to 50 million bucks. Wow. Is that how much Halloween made? Yeah. 47 million domestic at about a. $300,000 budget. So, it uh you know, it's sort of like with The Exorcist, like there were other movies that sort. of did this thing before, but when you. have a huge hit that does it is when it. sort of redefineses the genre because it. makes money. Yeah. And that's all that. matters. Everybody Everyone starts. paying attention after that. All right. What's next? What's next, my friend, is. a movie that came out when I don't know.

Were you still in college? Uh, no. You. must have just been out then. I was out. a few years. Okay. Well, regardless, around our college era, this movie came. out because up to this point, everything's come out either when we. were little or before we were born. This. one was right in our wheelhouse. It was. The Blair Witch Project, which came out. in 1998. Yeah. And uh one of the big. things that um Blair Witch Project did, well two things really. It established. the found footage uh genre or subg genre.

that is so overplayed now. Mhm. Uh and. the viral marketing campaign and that's. how I came upon it. I remember very. specifically uh being in the apartment. of Scott Epelo who you know. Sure. He. shot our TV show. one of my oldest. friends and I was sitting in his. apartment on Claremont Avenue uh in. Decar and I happened upon this and this. was pref Facebook. I don't even know how. I found it, you know, before things were. being shared around, right? And I. happened upon this website, the very.

first Blair Witch Project website, and I. was like, "Dude, come over here and. check this out. This is the scariest. thing I've ever seen." Yeah. And I. remember the the the website set it up. as if it was real. And that this found. footage thing, it's so overdone now, it's hard to go back in time and. remember when it was fresh. But I. remember looking at it and being like, did this happen? Did they really find. this footage of this murder in the. woods? Like, I got to see this. That was. the rumor that this was actually real,

man. And this was, like you said, I. mean, this is before the found footage. genre. So, people were being exposed to. this concept for the first time and were. kind of falling for it. I mean, first of. all, you're you're either in college or. you're just recently out of college, so. you're maybe slightly more gullible than. you are 10 years on. You're ready to. believe it. You want to believe, right? So, yeah, the idea that this was actual. found footage, it just made it all the. more enjoyable and people were buying. into it. Then I think the other part of. it too was that the filmmakers partly.

because they didn't have the budget for. actual effects left a lot of the the the. scariest parts to your imagination. Yeah. Nor did they have the talent to. make a good narrative film. I guess I mean they worked on a 64page. script which I was surprised that it was. that that big but they shot it for eight. days and originally they were going to. make it like a documentary about the. found footage right and then one of them.

had a flash of of perspective and was. like wait wait wait wait let's just. release it like it's found footage and. that was that the rest was history. Yeah. and I'm poking fun that was not very. nice at all. um Eduardo Sanchez and. Daniel uh Merrick or Merrick the. co-directors. they they should be credited with a. truly ingenious. uh campaign and invention that well they. weren't the first to come up with found. footage right there were some films. before um I've never known how to.

pronounce it Mondo Kane or Mondo Kaine I. think Kane it's from 1962 and it was. supposedly a documentary about um like. some some like weird tribal rituals. I. think there's hedge shrinking maybe. involved and it purported to be like. real footage. Yeah. Same with Cannibal. Holocaust, which if you've never seen. Cannibal Holocaust, go out and watch it. right now. It's very disturbing. Um and. it's so disturbing that the director of.

the movie was charged with murder. because they believed that the the. actual murders depicted they were so. realistic. They thought that it was a. snuff film basically, but it was. supposed to be a documentary as well. So, there was an idea of like found. footage or documentary style horror. movies that had come before, but nothing. like the Blair Witch where it was just. straight up these people. We found their. their old camera and this is what was on. it. Well, and they were smart enough to.

kind of dig up an old thing that never. went huge, you know? And they're like, "Hey, man." Like these other movies, they never really hit it big. And they. It was a timing thing. They they uh I. mean, hats off for them, to them. Yeah. Good for them, and to them. Nice going, dudes. All right, Chuck. Scream. Yeah, Scream. I I teased that it was. originally titled Scary Movie. I'm glad. it wasn't because Scary Movie is. awesome. I don't know what Scary Movie.

ever would have been called. Maybe it. would have never been made. Or maybe. they would have called that Scream. Oh, yeah. I guess so. So, uh, Scream was a. very big deal when it came out. Uh, the. writer Kevin Williamson. Um, and this is. still the highest growing slasher film. of all time. Basically, Scream one is. It was huge. I got Nev Campbell's. haircut as a result of it. Like, it was. a big big pop culture watermark. It was. And one of the big things about it, aside from the boatloads of money that. it made, uh, was it spawned a subgenre. called metahor, which is, um, even.

though it had been done by no less than. its own director, Wes Craven. Yeah. With. West Craven's New Nightmare, uh, two. years before Scream, it wasn't nearly as. popular. But metahor is this idea, if. you've ever seen Scream, you know. they're constantly just referencing. horror movies like this is where you. know you don't go out and make out in. the car because that's where you get. killed and then they would do that and. get killed, right? Although I don't. think that specific thing happened. Like.

don't go back in the house. Yeah. Like. all the tropes of horror movies are. addressed in the movie and they're. talking about them as the horror movie. tropes. Yes. Yeah. Exactly. Metahor. Yeah. And there were plenty of other. things that came along. Meta metahor um. examples like have you seen Tucker and. Dale versus Evil? Uh no. It's a good Oh, check it out, man. All right. That's a. good movie. Um Zombie Land. Yeah, I did. see that. Uh where he's rattling off all.

of the things that you need to to know. to survive a zombie apocalypse that he. learned from zombie movies, right? And. then Cabin in the Woods. Did you see. that one? H great movie. It was a great. movie. I thought it was really good. I. mean, from beginning to end, it was a. great movie. Did you like Scream? Yeah, love Scream. I liked all the Screams. I. only saw the first two. The second one, I think, might have been even better. than the first. Uh, maybe to me. And that the second one was. shot Emily worked on that. It was shot. here in at Agnes Scott College.

partially. Oh, is that right? Yeah. Huh. I'll have to go back and watch it. knowing that now I'll be like, "Oh, I've. driven past that place.". Uh, so I got a few tidbits. Uh, like I. said, initial title was scary movie. Um, number two, the Weinstein Brothers. initially offered it to George Romero. and Sam Ramy. Um, what else do I have. here? Drew Barrymore was originally. supposed to play Sydney, the lead. character, and then she said, "No, how. about if I just play that girl at the.

beginning, which kind of was a big thing. because you see Drew Mary uh Barrymore. and it was a big shock when she died in. the first scene, right? You know, you. can't kill off your heroine right away.". Yeah. And like I remember I remember. that first scene really really scaring. me when I saw it the first time in the. theater. Yeah, it is. is a scary, gruesome, gory part. Yeah. Very well. played. Uh and then before he went to um. Nev Campbell, he went out to Alicia Wit, Britney Murphy, and Reese Witherspoon.

And then Nev Campbell Camp. That was. your first choice, right? Uh and then. the mask, the iconic uh Scream mask. apparently was an off-the-shelf mask. Wow. That made that company's. money. Yeah. And the Weinstein didn't. like it. They were like, I I hate that. mask. Everything else is fine. Huh. But. Wes Craven said, "No, it's got to be. that mask." Don't be stupid, Bob. All right, we going to finish up with. our own edition here. Finally, 1960.

Yes. Psycho. I can't believe this wasn't on. the list. I think Ed kept this off the list to toy. with somebody he doesn't like. specifically. That's the only. explanation. Yeah, because Psycho. changed everything. Yeah, it really did. I mean, it was the You could say that it. was one of the first slasher flicks. It. was a early psychological thriller. Yeah. Um, it was based on the real life.

story of Ed Gene. Yeah. I mean, it. doesn't exactly mirror Egg Gene's life, but the idea of um being obsessed with. your mother so much that you will commit. murder uh is definitely rooted in. Egene's story. Yeah. Um if you're not. familiar with Egene, he not only he was. a I don't even know if he was a serial. killer. I think he only I think he. murdered one maybe two people, but more.

than anything, he was a grave robber. But he likes to um dress up in people's. skin, women's skin, and pretend he was. his own mother, which man, that's a lot. of years on the couch working that one. out. Yeah. Or you can just die at the. hands of cops. One of the two. Um and he. also inspired Leatherface from Texas. Chainsaw Massacre. Yeah. And and Buffalo. Bill, of course. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Silence. of the Lambs. Yeah. One guy inspired all. those all those guys. So, I found this. article uh Psycho:en the horror movie.

that changed the genre by uh Owen uh. Glyberman or is it Glyberman? Gleber. Gleberman. I think he wrote for. legendary critic wrote for EW for years. and years and now writes for Variety. Oh, he does. Yeah. But he uh he put it. best. He said, um, well, you know, the iconic shower. scene, first of all, is hugely important. because it was, uh, Hitchcock really. kind of ripped up the script. Not. literally, but the horror movie script.

when he kills off Janet Lee halfway. through the movie. It was You just. didn't do that at the time. No. And came. out of nowhere. And we've seen that come. up later on, like at the end of Night of. the Living Dead or Drew Barrymore and. Scream. Hitchcock was the first one to. do that. Yeah. And uh Gleberman puts it. uh this way. He said uh he was also. slicing through years, decades, centuries even, of audience expectation. that the hero or heroine of a fictional. work would be shielded and protected or.

would at least die usually at the end in. a way that made some sort of moral. dramatic sense, right? Uh in Psycho, the. murder made no sense at all. Right. And. he really kind of hits it on the head. there. It was like if if you've never. seen Psycho or heard of it, the movie's. just going along about this woman who. like steals some money from her work and. she's kind of on the lamb and checks. into this hotel and you don't even know. it's a horror movie. You're thinking. it's a a movie about a lady who steals. money and is trying to get away from.

getting caught, right? And then just out. of nowhere, she's hacked up in a shower. And at the time audiences and still if. you haven't seen it, it's shocking, but. audiences were just like they didn't. know what they'd seen. Right. Exactly. So you not not only is is the hero no. longer safe, that means maybe you're not. either. Yeah. So it has it had a really. huge unsettling effect. And then Owen. Gberman points out that Hitchcock was so. smart that he even he he even made a nod.

to the the type of pat expected horror. that the audience was used to in the. house that he used for Psycho, the Bates. house. Yeah. There was this huge. rambling Victorian mansion on a hill and. there was lots of taxiderermy and uh it. was like over overdecorated and just. creepy. But up to that point like that. was horror. That was what a horror movie. looked like and felt like. And this was.

this was kind of Hitchcock's homage to. that. But at the same time he was also. putting the heel of his shoe on it as. well. Yeah. And that house was I mean. almost a character in itself. Like if. you've ever seen the recreation of it at. uh in in Los Angeles, I think it's a. Universal. Did you see it? Oh, yeah. I. never did. The closest I came was um I. think uh when Different Strokes went. there. That's the closest you got to it. Yeah. Uh yeah, man. If you've ever seen.

this thing in person, like it's it sends. a chill up your back just seeing this. thing in like a sunny Los Angeles day. still. That's awesome. It's such an. iconic house. It's like, oh man. Uh. there it is. That's where Norman Bates. lives. He's the most disturbed human of. all time. Right. Uh so in the movie, of. course, there was the the mother. character who is sort of uh referenced. throughout the movie. And it is not. until the end that you realize that. there is no mother. Mother's dead, right? There's just Norman Bates and all.

his rage and hang-ups. Yeah. So all the. monster movies about giant ants and or. the creature from the black lagoon or. monsters, things that were an other that. a normal person had to do battle with, that was gone. Yeah. Now the monster had. been on screen the whole time and you. had noticed it. And now what do you. think about your neighbor who has seem a. little weird from time to time before? Could he be a murderer who thinks he's. his mother? Who knows? Yeah. This is.

what Hitchcock did to everybody back in. 1960. And you almost get like I think. Owen Lieberman points it out. Yeah, he. does. At the beginning he basically says. like um we probably didn't see Psycho. If you're reading this, you're probably. too young to have seen Psycho in 1960. and we should all feel sad that we. didn't because it so changed everything. that we can't do anything but take it. for granted now. and everything that's. come since then has been trying to. regain that shock and horror that it.

instilled in audiences and and thus far. no one's actually been able to do it. Yeah. And the other thing I remember. when I saw it when I was younger, I. think I saw this when I was like 14ish. Um and I think it had this impact on. just about everyone. I don't think I. took a shower for a month. I was straight up bathtub, curtain open, doors open, windows open. Making your. mom watch, she's keeping watch. No, that. would have been full circle back to.

psychology. Oh, yeah. I guess so. Yeah. You didn't even want to have anything to. do with your mom. No, man. Like it it. changed the shower curtain industry for. a while after that. Yeah, I'll bet. Very. good movie. And the um there were a. couple of Hitchcock movies in the last. few years. uh two different ones uh one. with Anthony Hopkins and one with Toby. Jones. that were both really good and one was. about the years that he was making. Psycho. The other was about the years. when he was making The Birds and they.

were both really really good movies and. you should check those out too. You. should repeat that. We just got a a rare. introjection from Null. So go ahead and. say it again Josh in case it didn't come. through. So, Null just said that um the. director of the Black Coat's daughter is. Anthony Perkins, who played Norman Bates. in Psycho's son. Wow. He also did. another movie now that Null says that. Thanks, Null. Um it's called The Pretty. Little Thing That Lives in the House, which was another horror movie, a ghost. story. I think that was his first one,

and I think that might be on Netflix. That it's great. It's a really great. movie, too. Man, this has got me fired. up to see some horror movies. It's a. renaissance of horror. Yeah. It's tough. though because Emily doesn't really dig. it. So, I have to just find alone time. to do this. You got to watch it in the. bathroom. All right. Well, if you want to know. more about horror movies, go watch. horror movies. Go forth. Uh, and let us. know what we missed for God's sake. Yeah. If you want to check out. Grabster's list, type in horror movies.

on the search bar at houseofworks.com. and it'll bring up this fine fine list. that you'll disagree with. And um since. I said disagree, it's time for listener. mail. Uh this is from Eric and I'm going to. call it what he called it, Schoolhouse. Rock nostalgia theory. All right, I. think he's pretty right on. This just. came in. Actually, this is a hot take. Uh hey guys, in the Schoolhouse Rock. episode, Josh made the statement that. Gen Xers are most nostalgic generation. and attribute it to the success of. Schoolhouse Rock. I'm going to offer my.

own theory. I propose that Gen X is. nostalgic mostly for pop culture because. of the prolifer uh that word of child. targeted advertisements and marketing in. the 70s and ' 80s. Huh. Maybe certainly. something we've talked about. Um this. theory's got legs. While our little. impressionable brains were developing, we were being taught by those who were. steering pop culture to long for and. find fulfillment in the toys and other. products our cartoons were pushing on. us. Now, as adults, those messages are. still deep in our psyche, and we can't. shake the idea that we still really need.

those Star Wars action figures to be. happy. Not because the toys and the. shows were so great, but because we had. been tricked into believing we need. them. I have nothing scientific to back. this up. Just a hunch. Yeah. What you. mean? There hasn't been a study from. MIT, right, on Star Wars toys? I'm kind of surprised by that as well. I. thought you were being facitious at. first and then it just took a turn. Yeah, I don't know which way's up at. this point. Yeah, nothing scientific to. back this up, but I'd love to hear what.

you all think. See if anyone out there. is uh any respectable and informed. input. Love what you guys do. Love you, Eric. That is from Eric Leuen. And Eric, uh I think that's super valid. Yeah, I. do too, Eric. I think you've really hit. upon something here. And that's all I. have to say about it. If you have a. great theory, fan theory, real life. theory, whatever, we want to hear them. there. Especially if it's interesting, you can tweet to us at sysk podcast or. joshm clark. You can post it on Facebook.

at Charles. Wchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchchuck. Bbryant or stuff you should know. You. can send us an email the stuff podcast. at housestuffworks.com. As always, join. us at our home on the web stuff.com. For more on this and thousands of other. topics, visit housestuffworks.com. [Music].