SYSK Gets Weird Playlist: What was the Philadelphia Experiment? | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

[music]. Hi there friends. It's Josh. Finally, I'm here and I'm presenting first our. episode on the Philadelphia experiment. Uh it's a bizarre conspiracy theory that. in 1943 the USS Eldridge, which is a. real destroyer from the real US Navy, suddenly disappeared from port and. instantaneously reappeared miles away. and that when [music] it did reappear, things weren't quite right with it. I'll.

leave it to past me and Chuck to give. the details in this fascinating episode. [music]. >> Welcome to Stuff You Should Know from. how stuffuffs.com. [music]. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck. Bryant. And this is a special edition of. Stuff You Should Know because Jerry has. transmorgriified into guest producer. Null. Yeah.

>> Which is requires quite a bit of. alchemy. >> It does, >> you know, >> and a little bit of alcohol. >> Yeah. And some uh and like a magnificent. brown bearded chiaet. >> Nice. [laughter] There's a woodchuck. waving from there. Looking good. No. >> Yeah. Jerry's gone on a top secret. mission. Can't talk about it. That's. [music] what makes it top secret. >> You're talking about it right now, >> but she's coming back at some point. Don't worry. >> Yeah. >> So, she's not left us forever.

>> No, this is a stint by guest producer. null. We'll have to make a suite out of. it. >> Yeah. Uh null produced shows you should. know. >> Summer of Sam Death Sweet. Null stint. >> Nol stint. [laughter]. That sounds gross. >> Uh how you doing, man? >> I'm great. I'm so used to reading ads. these days that like I just panicked. [music] like I lost my place and then I. was like, "Oh yeah, it's the actual. podcast. I can just ramble and stall as. long as I need to.". >> Yeah.

>> You remember this from your being a kid? Was this in your wheelhouse? The. Philadelphia Experiment? >> The movie was. >> Watched it last night. >> Sure. Oh, did you really? >> Yes. >> Wow. >> It is basically I mean the plot makes. sense, but it's like a 15minute plot. >> Yeah. They managed a lot of chasing in. Yeah. >> to really draw it out. >> They really gussy. Yeah. They drew it. out. >> But the idea behind it, especially when, let's see, 1984, I was eight. >> Yeah. >> And I was This was about the time where. I'm like, I'm going to Duke University.

to study parasychology when I get older. >> When you were eight? >> Yeah. >> I didn't even know what college was when. I was eight. >> Definitely. That was in my wheelhouse. >> Really? >> Yeah. Wow. >> Um, so this was like right up my alley. Yeah. Now that I watch it as a child, I'm like, man, I was an idiot when I was. eight. >> Yeah. >> But it was pretty cool. The the special. effects are like 80s rific. >> Oh, yes. They do not hold up. >> No. But I mean, if you're a fan of Tron, >> you're going to Or video drum. >> Yeah. >> You're going to love this movie.

>> Uh starring the great Michael Pere. >> Yes. And um RoboCop's partner. >> Yeah. Nancy Allen. Uh. >> was she Who is What else was she in. famously? She was in a bunch of 80s. movies. She was big back then. >> What was her big one, though? Or was she. always like co-starring the female lead? >> I think. Yeah. I don't think she was. ever like the lead in a movie. >> They didn't make movies with female. leads in the 80s. >> I can't remember in this context. Are we. allowed to say female or should it be. the girl lead? It's a female lead.

>> They didn't they didn't make leads with. uh women uh as the lead in the 80s. They're all just there to prop up the. dudes, >> right? >> Which is still working girl. That was in. the 80s. >> Good point. >> Nine to five. >> Three ladies. >> All right, I'll take it back. >> Okay. >> Few and far between. What? I'm I'm. trying to lobby for gender equality in. Hollywood. >> Yeah. And Well, you should. >> And you're like, "No, look at 9 to5.". >> No, I'm just saying [laughter] it's I. mean, there were some. >> Yeah. Yeah, you're right. >> But yeah, you I I agree with you. I.

don't mean to argue. You're right. It's. few. They were few and far between. >> That's what you call a trap. >> What about Barbarella? >> Yeah, that was what '7s or was it 60s? I. think the 60s. >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> Jane Fonda. >> Well, just like the makers of the. Philadelphia experiment, you and I know. how to draw out a 15-minute plot. [laughter]. >> Hey, also I wanted to point out Michael. Pereé. disappeared in Eddie and the Cruisers. >> Oh, is that was he in that? >> He was Eddie. >> Was the Was that based on Bruce.

Springsteen or something like that? >> No. >> Was it based on any real life band? >> No. >> I mean, it it echoed he was he was. Springsteenesque, >> right? But it wasn't like, you know, I. think they were just I think the writer. was like, "Who do I like?" I like. Springsteen. >> Yeah. >> So, let's get John Cafrey to sing like. Springsteen. >> Mhm. >> And put Michael Pereé to lip sync. >> Wow. That's a. >> Eddie. >> That's. That's 80s rific, too. >> And I saw John Caferty in concert in the. 80s. That's how.

>> What else is he in? >> No, he was the band. He was the real. band. John Caferty and the Beaver Brown. band. >> Okay. >> They sang those songs for real. And I. saw them in concert at Six Flags. >> Wow. >> How about that? >> And they've now become the Zack Brown. Band. >> That's right. >> Right. >> Who looks like Null. >> Full circle. >> Full circle. We just did it. >> Can we be done now? >> Yep. So, the Philadelphia experiment, I. guess, was right up Michael Pere's um. alley because it echoed real life, too. >> In a way.

>> In a way. >> Sure. Uh the makers went back and read a. couple of books that purported to be. non-fiction accounts of this incredible. experiment carried out by the the Navy. >> So incredible. >> And we should probably let's let's. describe the experiment to begin with, right? >> Uh experiments, we should say. >> Yeah, that's true. Uh this article gets. it wrong. >> Yeah. >> On how stuff works. >> Yeah. There were two separate things. uh. both involving the uh a destroyer ship. called the USS Eldridge recently.

commissioned. Uh summer of 1943 is when. it began. >> July I think. >> and what supposedly happened was that. there was um this ship and there was a. big secret Navy experiment. >> that whose what's aim was to make this. ship disappear. >> Yeah. not just to like radar or. something like that, but if there was a. guy with a periscope, he would look. right past the ship because it had been. made invisible. >> Essentially invisible. >> And then the story goes that that was.

successful. It was a successful. experiment that was carried out. >> Yeah. It disappeared in full view in. broad daylight. >> Uhhuh. >> Uh and from the was it the Philadelphia. shipyard? >> Yep. >> And then reappeared. Uh there was a big. glow. >> Yes. Yes. >> And then it reappeared and all the the. sailors aboard. >> were in bad shape. >> So did that take place in July or was. that. >> that took place in July? >> Okay. Well, okay. Then it happened again. in October when you did the second. experiment. >> Yeah. Then they retried the experiment.

Supposedly the ship disappeared and. popped up in Virginia, >> Norfolk, Virginia, >> and then then reappeared 10 minutes. prior. So it timeraveled back 10 minutes in. Philh to Philadelphia again. >> Right. And again, the sailors were in bad. shape. >> Even by teleportation standards, that's. impossible. [laughter]. >> Yeah. >> You know what I mean? >> Yeah. And supposedly these uh the. shipmen were um uh seammen were were. some were caught like in the middle of.

the ship, right? >> And crazed and crazy, >> right? So basically the implication is. is that they had been some sort of or in. some fashion molecularly disintegrated. Yes. Along with the ship. >> and then when it was brought back. together the coordinates were maybe off. slightly, >> right? >> Maybe the ship and the people were where. they were 10 minutes earlier, >> right? >> And things just went a little haywire. >> Like oh my upper half's on the Leo deck. and my lower half's on the uh what were.

the other decks on the left? the the uh. man, that's the only deck I know. The. party deck. >> The tango deck. >> Sure. The tango deck. >> Yeah. Uh and the the um and I'm still. alive. >> And I've also gone mad cuz my brain. didn't configure back correctly either. >> Yes. And this was all possible thanks to. um Albert Einstein working with the. Navy. Yep. >> And teaching them all his little tricks. on how you can make ships disappear in. time travel. Specifically, the theory is.

that um or the rumor, the conjecture, the conspiracy theory is that um Albert. Einstein figured out the unified field. theory. >> which is not true. He did not. >> basically the theory of everything. No, it frustrated him for his whole life. Um. there's this idea in physics that. [snorts]. there's possibly one explanation for the. behavior of everything in the universe. >> Yeah. Right now, we've got a pretty good. theory. I think the theory of special.

relativity ties in three of the. fundamental forces in the universe. Yeah. But gravity is this outlier that. can't be tied in through physics. formulas. >> And they think that there's some way of. understanding things to where everything. ties together. And as I think Mitioaku. famously put it, um he said that what. what they're searching for with a. unified field theory is with an a. formula an inch long. Yeah. You'll be. able to read God's mind,

>> man. >> So the idea is that that Einstein came. up with this unified field theory. Yeah. Again, not true. And that it was used to. understand how to teleport things. So. they used this understanding to carry. out an experiment with a bunch of Navy. seaman on a destroyer. Yeah. In broad. daylight. >> because you could you can imagine the. advantage to be able to make your ship. invisible. >> Not only that, if you could figure out. how to teleport it. >> like you're you're done, dude. No more. war because you would win them all.

Yeah. >> And the rest of the world would just. cower at your invisible feet. >> Yeah. You'd just suddenly pop up behind. your enemy, put him in a full Nelson and. be like, you give, you give. And you'd. be like, I give. And that's it. You just. let them go and be like, "That's right.". And you teleport out of there. >> You see how easily that could happen? Nazi. >> unified field theory. >> All right. So, the Philadelphia. experiment [clears throat] never. happened like that at least. >> What? >> We'll go ahead and not give any credence. to the conspiracy theorists out there. Although, we'll probably get a couple of.

people that email in. >> Oh, man. This is this is like a nucleus. of conspiracy theory. It ties in UFOs. Sure. >> Ties in theoretical physics. >> Yeah. The US government, of course. >> Yep. Ginormous cover up. Um, it it ties. in all these different things. And it's. really really interesting. If you go. read this stuff, it's it's it's to me. it's more interesting than just just UFO. conspiracy theory or just government. cover up conspiracy theory. It's like a. clearing house of conspiracy theories.

all tied up into one package on this. secret experiment that if you listen to. the Navy's official line, never took. place. There never was a Philadelphia. experiment, right? >> There never was. It was also known as. Project Rainbow. There was never a. Project Rainbow. No. >> Um, it just didn't happen. The whole. thing was made up out of whole cloth. apparently by a guy named Carlos M. Aende. >> Yeah. And there were there was a couple. of hinky details. We'll go over why this. thing has survived uh a little bit.

later, but there are a few hinky. details, not that make it believable, but that just have fueled the fire over. the years. Yeah. And let's let's take a. break right here, Chuck, cuz I'm getting. a little over excited. >> Okay. Just put this under your tongue. You'll be fine. >> Okay. [music]. [music]. [music]. [singing].

>> All right. Wake up, buddy. [laughter]. Huh? What? We're back. >> Oh, okay. >> How much time has passed in your mind? >> Millions of years. >> No, it's only been about three hours. >> Oh, okay. >> Do you feel rested? >> I do feel very refreshed. >> Good. Well, we can continue. So, uh, you. teased a man named uh, well, he had some. different names. Carl M. Allen or under. his pseudonym Carlos Miguel uh, Alende.

Yeah. [laughter]. He's like, "Hey, let me throw a de on. the end. I'll sound mysterious. >> Yeah. An OS [laughter]. and a DE. >> So, uh, in 1956, uh, I was going to get in the wayback. machine, but, I don't think we should. even bother for this. >> No, this actually proves there is no way. back machine. >> That's right. So in 1956 in real time uh. Alende sent um a letter and he would go. on to send about 50 more letters to an.

author named Morris Jessup who wrote a. book a year earlier called The Case for. the UFO. >> Yes. Which you can find on the podcast. page for this episode. >> Yeah. And he's a he was an author. He's. like a legit dude that wrote a bunch of. books. I mean. >> well if he's legit. [laughter] I don't. mean legit as in uh like he proved any. science behind UFOs, right? But he was a. he he authored books for real. >> Yes. >> He wasn't printing man he wasn't just. publishing manifestos online. >> And he was a um a conspiratorallyminded.

investigator. >> Yeah. >> But if you read like his writing, it was. just nothing but conjecture. >> Sure. >> Nothing. There was nothing in it but. conjecture presented as fact. >> Yeah. And he even says like these are. there are three basic proven facts about. this and then here's some more facts and. it's like [laughter] no these aren't. facts at all but it's really fascinating. stuff. >> Maybe he doesn't know what facts are. >> Maybe so. >> Uh so he got these letters and um in. these letters. >> uh at first there were some attacks on.

him and from uh from Allen saying you. don't know what you're talking about. man. You're getting this unified field. theory all wrong. And I know because. Einstein spent several weeks with me. teaching me this stuff himself. >> Yeah. And not only that, >> so it's like cuckoo pot writes crackpot, >> right? And he he was saying like I can. prove that that unified field theory has. been mastered by describing this. experiment that took place in. Philadelphia in 1943 concerning one US.

destroyer called the USS Eldridge. >> Yes. And he said, "I know this because I. was there, buddy. I was on a ship in. that harbor and there were other ships. in the harbor. That seems to be the only. part that's true. >> Yeah. I mean, this is a place where. ships were being outfitted. Yeah. Like. throughout the summer and fall. Yeah. >> It was the war. >> That's right. So, he claimed that he was. on one of these ships. He said, "I. witnessed this uh in person. I saw this. green glow. I saw this thing disappear.".

Not only that, he could see he could see. the the field that was created by this. this um experiment. Yeah. The green and. he stuck his arm into it. He was that. close. >> Stuff of movies, right? >> Stuff of 1980s bee movies. >> Yeah. Uh so he sends these letters and. >> he sends like 50 of them. >> Yeah. And Jessup said, "Uh, you know. what? Let me investigate this a little. bit because I'm a crackpot, too. I I get. where you're coming from.". >> Yeah. So, let me just check into this.

[laughter]. >> This is right up my alley. >> Yeah, thank you for these. Uh, let me. look into this a little bit. And he. basically gave up because the dude could. produce he asked him for some evidence. >> or names, >> anything. And he had nothing. >> He didn't. He just said, "Here's the. story and it's fact." And he goes, "Um, Carlos Aende," who by then I think had. dropped the pseudonym, right, to Carl. Allen. >> Who knows? He might have called himself. Big Bird at that point. So he was and he. was a very disturbed man. >> Yeah, I'm joking. But yeah, he he had.

mental problems. >> He did. Um but if you if you research. him and you research even skeptics of. the Philadelphia experiment, like the. stuff he was coming up with was really. interesting stuff. >> Yeah, he was good a good writer, >> but he was a huge confabulator as well. >> Sure. >> So um he's saying all this is as fact. and he uh he he's saying I don't know. what the dates were. I don't know the. people's names or anything like that, but perhaps if I were put under. narcohypnosis, I would remember all this.

stuff. So, you got any drugs? Yeah. >> And about this time, Jessup said, "I'm. done with this." Right. He had actually. moved on because apparently the. government had directly addressed UFO. rumors and no, Jessup didn't do that. I'm sorry. Another guy did. Okay. um who. is interested in researching um Aende. >> But I'm sure Jessup was like, I got to. get back to my serious work. investigating UFOs. >> He did. >> Yeah. >> But then something truly bizarre. happened. And this did happen. He got a.

a knock on his door and two researchers. from the Office of Naval Research, who. would have been carrying out experiments. like this. Yeah. >> Said theory. Sure. >> Hey, have you ever heard of a guy named. Carlos Aende? And you probably could. have picked uh MK Jessup off the floor, >> I would imagine. So, because Yeah. He. was like, "It's all true.". >> Yeah. Exactly. And he said, "Come in. Come in. Please have some tea. Have some. opiates.". >> Uh it was 1957 at this point. And they.

said, "You know what? We got a package a. year ago." Um and it had a copy of your. book, my friend, on the UFOs. >> And it was um. >> case for UFOs. >> Yeah. It was annotated. very heavily. >> by three people. >> Well, by by three. sets of ink and three types of. handwriting, which were all clearly uh. from Carl Allen. >> Well, they were to MK Jessup, who. corresponded with Carl Allen for well. over 50 letters, right?

>> Yeah. He said, "I'm not fooled. This guy. Jimmy Jeem I. >> who may have been an alien. >> It's it's Carl Allen and Mr. A and Mr. B. are both Carl Allen. They're they're all. Carl Allen. But regardless of whether. they were all one dude, the the. annotations had fascinated these two. Navy researchers enough that they. supposedly, as far as the Office of. Naval Research officially says, they. took it upon themselves and paid out of. their own pockets and I guess took. vacation time to go find uh MK Jessup.

Yeah, I haven't found I saw a bunch of. conflicting reports on that whether or. not and this is what conspiracy. theorists will point to that. >> either it was official business or they. did it on their own. >> Either way, they say that that means. something. >> and I've heard it explained away is. >> it was just something on their list that. they eventually had to get to. >> That seems like a terrible explanation. I think this adds like a real wrinkle to. the story, whether purposefully or it's.

just something that can't be very easily. explained away. Maybe it is. It was just. these guys were really interested in. this. Maybe they were into UFO stuff or. whatever. Maybe it doesn't matter. The. fact that those two guys showed up gives. this thing legs for miles. >> Sure. >> You know, and it's just awesome that. that happened because that has kept this. thing alive in part. >> Yeah. And the box came to them marked. happy Easter, which I always thought was. kind of funny. [laughter]. And uh it had weird punctuation and. capitalizations, all the marks of a.

madman, >> right? Um but again, like the stuff he. was saying was. it was it was curiosity arousing in. these guys. And they actually took um. and again supposedly paid for out of. their own pocket the um annotated. version of the case for UFOs and. published it with the annotations. Uh. they had a a contractor, a military. contractor called Vero Technologies, I. think, and um had them publish it, which. is weird, especially if they were doing.

it out of their own pocket, but. >> it was only 127 copies. I imagine it. didn't cost that much. >> I saw 25 even and they were like spiral. bound, so it wasn't anything fancy. >> I read a lot of this and it's um it's. you know, >> it's like. >> it's really out there. >> Yeah. >> You know, >> sure. But I imagine if you're a UFO. enthusiast, it might interest you. >> I mean, if you read um Morris Jessup's. stuff, it's out there, too. >> Well, I imagine reading that with the. annotation from this other dude.

>> Yeah, I was going to say I get the. impression that Carlos Aende stuff was. even more out there. >> Yeah, you can get online. It's on uh. there's PDFs of it if you want to. >> Oh, of the Veraro one. Oh, yeah. >> But supposedly there's a lot of forge. copies as well. >> Oh, really? >> In circulation. Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't know. This seemed real. Um, why would someone take the time to. forge a copy of a crackpot manifesto? >> That's a question we should all be. asking ourselves. >> So, um, Jessup's story, uh, ends just a.

couple of years later. He was, uh, down. on his luck and he got injured really. badly in a car accident, had a bad. breakup with his wife, and he killed. himself. He he put a hose from his uh. car exhaust into his window. >> And uh this is one of the other reasons. that conspiracy theory anytime there's a. suicide. >> Yeah. >> and there's the government involved, it's pretty easy to say he didn't kill. himself, the government killed him, >> right? It's made all the more spec. suspicious though because um supposedly.

he that was the day that he was to meet. a friend. Yeah. >> Who he had said he had told, "I've made. a breakthrough in the Philadelphia. experiment case." Yeah. And then all of. a sudden he turns up dead of a suicide. >> Yeah. >> So well I mean that and the onr guys. showing up at his door definitely has. kept this thing alive. >> It has. Uh um supposedly his friends. came out and said no he was deeply. depressed and he had talked of suicide. in the months before he committed. suicide. >> Yeah. >> But then I'm sure conspiracy theorists.

say they paid them off man. >> Yeah. Those people said uh you can let. my family go now. Navy I did what you. said. And the uh Eldridge um had a. pretty uh well it didn't go on to like. great things. It was uh sold to Greece. or transferred to Greece, renamed the HS. Leon um used in exercises and then sold. for scrap metal in the 1990s. >> Yep. >> So, no big deal with the boat, right? >> No bigs. >> So, uh we'll take another little break. here and we'll come back and we'll talk.

about what really happened in the. Philadelphia shipyard that day. >> [music]. >> Stop. No. [music]. >> All right. What really happened, Josh?

>> Nothing. [laughter]. That's supposedly what really happened. apparently on that day in the naval. shipyard. Uh I guess either July or. October, but July I think is the one. that people typically if they just think. it was a one day thing rather than two. separate experiments, it's usually July. that they point to, which they did in. this article, too. >> Yeah. >> On that particular day, um the USS. Eldridge wasn't even in Philadelphia. >> Yeah. This is the part I don't. understand. >> It was in Brooklyn. >> Yeah. >> So here's the thing. This is that that.

revelation came out in 1999. We'll get. to that in a minute. Prior to this, there is a researcher. He's an. astrophysicist and eupfologist named. Jacqu Jacques F. Valle. And he was. actually the inspiration for the uh. eupfologist Frenchman character in Close. Encounters of the Third Kind. >> Yeah. >> And he was also like a venture. capitalist. He's a pretty sharp dude. He. just had some unusual interests, right? >> Yes. But one of the things that he. dedicated himself to was disproving the.

Philadelphia experiment, proving that it. was a hoax. He was a skeptic, right? >> Yes. >> In some manner, he was a skeptic. >> Yeah. >> So, he wrote a paper and um in the paper. he invited people to uh to reach out to. him if they had further information. about the Philadelphia experiment. And. as a result, allegedly, he was contacted. in 1994 by a guy named uh Edward Dugjan. or Dudgeon. Let's say Dudgeon. It's a. little little more pleasant than Doojan. >> I bet his friend called him the dungeon.

>> Yeah, I'll bet. >> You know. >> Yeah, >> that's what I would have called him. >> Yeah. >> So, yeah, he responded. The paper was. called Anatomy of a Hoax: The. Philadelphia Experiment 50 years later. in the Journal of Scientific. Exploration. and uh Dudgeon got in touch. and said, "You know what? I was in the. Navy from 42 to 45. I was on that boat. and uh I can explain what happened.". >> Yeah. >> Which is pretty exciting. >> Well, he was he was on the Angstrom, which was there at the same time. >> Oh, I thought he was on the actual boat.

No, >> no, he was an electrician on the. Angstrom, but he said he was fully aware. of all of the electrical components on. the Angstrom and on the Eldridge. >> Yeah, cuz they all party together. >> Sure. Exactly. That would that actually. comes comes up later. Um, so he he was. saying he he basically had a pat and. completely sensible and reasonable. answer for every single part of the. Philadelphia experiment. For example, part of the Philadelphia experiment. legend is that a brawl broke out in a.

bar following the experiment and two of. the sailors on board the Eldridge. suddenly disappeared. They vanished. >> Yes. Well, um, Duden Dudgeon says, "I. was one of those guys. I actually faked. my age on my enlistment page paper. So, I was underage and shouldn't have been. in the bar." And the bar the the. bartender um took pity on me and another. underage dude and shoot us out the back. door and then pretended that she'd never. seen us. >> So, they disappeared.

>> They disappeared. Exactly. >> Out the back door. >> Another one he says, um, well, he. explains the whole thing basically, right? He says there was no experiment. like that but they were doing something. that might have seemed freaky to the. uninitiated and that was deossing the. the ships. >> Yeah. At the time Germany and I guess. everyone else really in the Navy in the. navies around the world uh they had. magnetic uh mines sea mines which would. uh find your boat and you know go that's. metal. Let me go stick on that thing and.

blow up. >> Yeah. And torpedoes that were magnetic. seeking too. >> Yeah. And they thought, you know what? Let's come up with a way to make our. ship holes and our metal parts um. non-magnetic to these to these uh. obstacles, >> right? Which is an established um. project, I guess, or an established. what's the word I'm looking for? >> Process. >> Sure. >> So, I was close with project. >> Yeah, it was a real thing. >> Yeah. It's called deossing. Uh, and it. basically either changes or um gets rid.

of the magnetism of a of something that. was formerly magnetic like the ship's. hole. >> It does not make it invisible to radar. or otherwise. >> but it probably looks pretty weird, right? So they wrapped the ships in. hundreds and hundreds of meters of cable. um and then ran a really high voltage. electrical charge through it. And. supposedly this would demagnetize the. ships which really came in handy because. at the time um just outside of um.

America's coastal waters was called the. graveyard of the Atlantic. Yeah. Because. German Ubot were running the show out. there at this time. >> Yeah. And as we learned in our uh the. Nazis invade Florida, >> they sometimes were parked right off the. coast. >> Exactly. So they were taking out our. destroyers and our cruisers and our. battleships. So this was a this was a. big deal to be able to do that kind of. thing. Although it and it was classified. stuff. It wasn't experimentation in. anything that hadn't been proven before. It was like, yeah, we're we're just.

demagnetizing our battleships. >> Yeah. They could have had a big sign up. said degossing at work. Stand back. >> Yeah. >> It was no big super secret thing. >> Right. But if you're a Nazi, don't read. this sign. >> Right. >> Um the other thing that Dudgeon. addressed was the the concept that the. Eldridge disappeared from the. Philadelphia shipyard, reappeared in Norfolk, and then. reappeared back in Philadelphia. Well, that happened, but it just went there.

and then came back, >> right? But it it didn't happen in like. five minutes or 10 minutes or 30. seconds. No. >> But again, he points out like if you. weren't really if you were just casually. paying attention, you might have seen. the uh the Eldridge in Philadelphia that. night and then noticed it was missing. late at night and then noticed it was. back in the morning. >> Yeah. Which would seem impossible. because that was supposedly a two-day. trip. >> Yeah. Two days. including there and. back. Round trip was two days up the up.

the coast, but apparently the Navy had a. canal that they used um I think the. Delaware Ches Peak Canal that only the. military could use and they could make. that round trip in six hours. >> Yeah. So, in other words, it's easily. explainable that it just simply uh I. keep want to say sailed, but it's not. sailing. >> I think they still call it that, >> do they? Set sail. Yeah. Ship out. >> Yeah. It shipped out and shipped back. >> Right. in a regular amount of time, right? >> And it just became part of the lore.

>> Yeah. And I mean, you can even tack on a. few hours there. Apparently, Norfolk was. when they where they outfitted it with. with their explosives. >> And apparently they could load a. battleship in 4 hours. >> Yeah. >> So, even taking that into account, it's. still 10 hours. If it shipped out at 11. p.m., which is what uh Dunin says, right? Dunin, >> I think he went with Dudgeon. >> Yeah. Um he uh he says that it shipped. out at 11. It'd still be back by 9:00. am.

>> Yeah. >> So again, if you're just casually paying. attention, what seems pretty mysterious. really took on legs over time. It's. basically like a game of telephone, like. any conspiracy theory. >> Sure. >> Maybe there's a kernel of truth. It got. exaggerated by some drunken sailors and. then bam, it it gets shrunk down to 10. seconds through a teleportation. experiment. Well, and these sailors, the. drunken sailors supposedly could have. been overheard saying things like, you. know, they're going to make our ship. disappear. They're going to make us. invisible. When in fact, what they were. saying is they're going to make it more.

or less invisible to these mines. >> Got all twisted around. It wasn't. literally invisible. >> Yeah. And so there were apparently tons. of um merchant seammen around the area. as well. >> Yes. So again, this would have been. classified stuff. If there had been. loose lips, which sink ships, >> they do. >> Um, and somebody had said like, "We're going. to make it invisible." Like you said, they would have picked up on that. Maybe. they were the ones who were um just.

casually paying attention to the to the. Eldridge here or there, and it just. seemed to disappear and reappear. >> Yeah. Um, and there's this guy named uh, Robert Gorman, and he um, in a 1980 Fate. magazine article wrote about tracking. down Carlos Aende. He was from the same. hometown as him. And turned out that he. would already knew the guy's father. He. just didn't realize that he was Carlos. Aendai's father or Carl Allen's father. >> You're old man Allen's son.

>> Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. Um and he. managed to interview the family and get. a pretty good picture of the guy. Um but. one of the things that he found was Carl. Allen's merchant seaman papers. >> Yeah. >> So it's entirely possible he was there. around the time or if he wasn't there at. the time um he may have been he may have. known somebody who was there at the. time. >> I could totally see him have been there. and that's probably how he got the idea. to cook it up. >> Right. Okay. >> I believe all that. >> Yeah. And again, all of this lands.

squarely on the desk of Carl Allen. because no one no one talked about the. Philadelphia experiment. It was never. those words were never put together. until he his first letter to Morris. Jessup. Right. So it appears to have. been totally fabricated by him. >> Yeah. And um after the movie came out, people started coming out of the. woodwork. >> This guy, >> including a dude named Alfred uh Bale. Have you been to his website? >> Uh oh yeah. He's he's something else. He.

made a a video uh called uh the. Philadelphia experiment part one. crossroads of history. And he claims. that he was a physicist on board the. Eldridge. Uh and he was a part of the. team. And not only that, he says he. timeraveled uh in 1943 all the way to. 1983. >> during the experiment to tell his story. That sounds extremely close to the plot. of the Philadelphia experiment movie. >> Yeah. And and sure,

>> except it was a little different. In the. movie, he travels from 1943 to 1984. >> Um we we shouldn't mock this guy. It's a. fascinating website. >> Yeah. >> But he puts himself squarely at the the. um the center of the Philadelphia. experiment. And he also says that he was. part of the Montalk project. >> Yeah. which they're sort of tied. together somehow. You should do one on. that at some point. >> Debunking things. >> This guy, this guy wrote a book where he.

just basically made this stuff up out of. whole cloth. >> Yeah. >> He says that the book whether you take. it as science fact or science fiction, you're in for a really great story. Um. even though it's it's basically loaded. with soft facts. This is the author in. the preface, right? Yeah. But basically, it's this extension that like the the. Philadelphia experiment was wildly. successful and from that we learned all. sorts of things like getting in touch. with extraterrestrials, being able to. teleport everywhere, um just doing all. sorts of really interesting things. Basically, anything you can possibly.

think of that a conspiracy theorist. would enjoy, it's crammed into this book. and it's it's given um a bit of. gravitas by associating it with the. Philadelphia experiment, [laughter] you. know. >> Yeah, >> in some quarters, man. >> In some quarters, >> that that definitely gives some. gravitas. >> Uh this green glow has been explained. away by most people as uh maybe an. electrical storm or St. Elmo's fire. Mhm. >> Um and it was just, you know, maybe just.

another part of this story that people. took and ran with it. Or maybe it was. nothing at all. >> Uh yes. Um it also could have been the. Office of Naval Research put out a fact. sheet on what they understand about the. Philadelphia experiment and they said, um it's possible another origin or the. origin of that specifically was. experiments with the USS Timberman later. on after the war in the 50s. Yeah. where. they tried to use a small generator that. was higher power than the generator that. was currently on board and it actually.

caused coronal discharge a glow. >> Yeah. >> Um and they said that no one was. injured, no one was imshed into the. ship. >> No, >> it was just a glow was created which is. what you'd expect from a very strong. electrical field. Right. >> Yeah. So they think possibly that. combined with um the degossing stuff. they were doing during World War II came. together um and helped this legend take. off. But what they say also though and. what was supported by this um reunion of.

USS Eldridge sailors in 1999 is that. even the guy who debunked and. discredited everything that Carlos Aende. said um Dudgeon. he he was full of it too apparently. >> because the USS Eldridge wasn't in. Philadelphia then it was in Brooklyn. >> Yeah. They got together in Atlantic City. and I read an article on this meeting. and they they had a good laugh and said. that one of him uh even has something. about it on his license plate just so.

people like ask him about it and a few. of them said they would pull people's. legs and say like oh no I disappeared. and my hand was caught in the ship and. then they would say no none of that. happened. >> but uh they said that that was in. Brooklyn and the ship's log uh confirms. that. >> So um apparently it wasn't even in that. shipyard that day at all. >> Right. So that's that's the only part. where I'm like, "Well, wait a minute. How could they completely invent that it. was even in the shipyard? Why wouldn't. they just use a ship that was there?".

>> Because this guy, >> they would give it a little more. credence if there was at least a ship. there. >> But that's what I'm saying. Like um Carl. Allen, he made he said all this. He was. the one who just came up with it from. the beginning. >> Yeah. But it I don't know. It just seems. a little weird that he he didn't care at. all about making it believable by. picking a boat that was actually there. >> Well, that's what I'm saying. He may. have been there at the time. He may have. known that the Eldridge was there and. just fudged the date because he couldn't. remember because this is like 12 years. later, 12 or 13 years after the fact.

>> You know what I mean? >> Bad memory, >> right? So maybe he just got the date. wrong and the thing really did happen. and then the ONR would be like, "Oh, that experiment." Yeah. Oh yeah, we. teleported a battleship. you just got. the date wrong. >> So, we've mentioned quite a few things. here that why this thing has lived on. through the years. Um, there uh that. Jacques Valet theorizes that, you know, anytime you have like a movie made about. it. >> or any kind of imagery, whether it's a. photo of the Loch Ness monster.

>> to uh a photo of the Montalk monster, people are going to have something. physical to point to and say, "Look, they made this movie." And that's when. people started coming out of the. woodwork was after the movie saying, "Oh. yeah, I was there. I remember that now. Michael Parade just reminded me of this. thing that happened.". >> He also his my favorite thing on his. website is that um he met the person. that he later realized was the actor. Mark Hamill in Hawaii in 1956. But Mark. Hamill would have been five at the time.

>> Well, did he say he was a little nice. little kid? >> I don't think he was a kid. [laughter]. >> He said he was a full grown adult. Interesting. Uh what else? The um the fact that it's. the the federal government of course and. the and the military, you know, people. are going to run with that stuff, >> which I mean that's the military's. fault. I remember. >> Well, yeah, sure. They did secret. experiments. Still do. >> tons of them. Back in 1993, some stuff. got declassified and it really opened. people's eyes to the fact that the. government and the military experimented.

on un uninformed and unwitting subjects, not just in the in its um ranks, but. also in the general public. Yeah. >> So, yeah, it's totally the idea that the. military would do this um with its own. people on board. >> Yeah, that's believable. >> Probably the most believable part of the. whole thing. Agreed. Uh, and also just. um, throw Albert Einstein in there, throw in uh, secret scientific theories.

that haven't been proven and it's just. uh, ripe for the picking. Yeah. When it. comes to conspiracies. >> Yeah. >> And the suicide, of course, like we mentioned earlier, >> that definitely doesn't help. >> It did not help the case any. >> But, um, this is one that I I had a hard. time finding people that still believe. this. >> Uh, yeah. I think a lot of people like. it aren't aware of it even. >> except for the movie. >> You know what else helped it get legs? There was a book in 1979. and it was called um the Philadelphia.

experiment colon project invisibility. and it was reprinted in in excerpts in. papers around the country as as fact or. non-fiction. >> in 1979. >> does not help. >> doesn't help things. You know, >> I personally with all conspiracy. theories, I just I I enjoy reading this. stuff. I think it's fun and funny and uh. interesting. I don't there aren't any. that I really believe in, >> but um I do think it's funny when people.

get all up on their hackles and write in. >> that, you know, making fun of this stuff. and it's, you know, you don't know, could be real. >> Well, that's the other thing, man. I'm. I'm glad you brought this up because. there like the just being like, "No, this is not possible." Well, that's. stupid. Stop thinking stuff like that. It's like, no, this is at the very least. people using their imaginations in a. exercising it in ways that I don't. typically do. >> Sure. >> And so, it is nice to come kind of visit. it and check it out and and read it, you.

know. >> Yeah. Although, I claim to have seen a. ghost. So, what do I know? >> Exactly. Although, I have to say. probably the best excuse against this, there are two things that just say just. on its face, this isn't right. One, this. happened 70 years ago, and if the. military successfully transported a. battleship, we would know about. teleportation by by now. >> Yeah. They'd be doing it all over the. place. >> Exactly. The second thing was a quote. from Robert Gorman, the guy who tracked. down Carl Allen in that 1980 Fate. magazine article. He wrote, "If we are.

to believe Carl Allen, our naval. hierarchy abandoned sanity and. historical president by conducting an. experiment of enormous importance in. broad daylight using a badly needed. destroyer escort vessel.". >> Yeah, >> I think that kind of sums it up nicely. >> Agreed. >> But go forth and read about the. Philadelphia experiment because it is. interesting stuff. >> Watch the movie. >> Why not? Is it on Netflix? >> No, it's on YouTube. I thought you. watched it on the YouTube.

>> Yeah. >> I can't believe you made it through it. >> I did. I'm telling you. Like I mean I. was working too. I had two like windows. open. But. >> okay, there you go. >> But it was fine. >> Yeah, >> it was fine. >> It's as believable as Tron. That's. Josh's review. >> Uh let's see. If you want to know more. about the Philadelphia experiment, you. don't have anything else, right? >> No, sir. >> Uh you can type those words into the. search bar at How Stuff Works. And since. Chuck [music] said Tron, it's time for.

listener mail. >> I'm going to call this uh email from a. up andcoming podcaster in Georgia. Bulldog. >> Nice. >> Hey guys, my name is Bailey. I'm a. junior mass media arts [music] and. theater student at good old UG. Go dogs. wolfwolf. Uh my professional identity. aside, I'm also a longtime [music]. listener and lover of you guys. I. listened to my first episode on the bus. home from seventh grade. >> That's so.

wow. >> I'm pretty sure it was episode on. brainwashing. So, she's in college now. Uh I mainly listen to y'all as I'm. working on my on-ampus job uh bus. driving. Did you ever take the buses in. Athens? [music] The student bus. >> I was so crippled with social anxiety. that if I couldn't find a [music]. parking space, I would just skip class. cuz I didn't want to get on the bus. >> [laughter]. >> You had social anxiety. >> Really? >> Like didn't want to get to know anyone. or you just. >> I just couldn't bear being around peers. at that age. >> Really? Yeah. Interesting.

>> Uh it the buses were always a little. scary cuz it was like here's a 40 foot. long bus full of students and it's. driven by 19-year-old. >> a student. Yeah. Yeah. Well, >> it was scary for me for different. reasons, but I can imagine it was scary. for that reason, too. >> Yeah. I took him a few times. I mainly. want um. Okay, where was I? Bus driving. So, my. passengers have the honor of listening. to you as well. Oh, I guess she plays it. out loud. That's nice. >> That is nice. That's the party bus right. there, >> I guess. So, the other day I was.

driving, I realized it's my destiny to. produce [music] and host a podcast on. campus. Uh we don't really have anything. like that, so I'm excited about it. My. idea is to have me and another host be. constants on the show and every week. bring in [music] a different UG. professor or Athens professional or. general awesome person to talk about the. one thing in their field that fascinates. them the most for about 30 minutes. Uh. it would include informal conversation. between the three of us about a topic. highly inspired by y'all's witty banter.

>> Nice. Uh anyway, because you guys are my. muses, I would want to uh wanted to ask. if you had any advice for a baby bulldog. podcaster. Uh as an MMA major, I feel. like I have the [music] basic knowledge. and resources for the technical side, but as far as what makes a good episode, I'm feeling pretty shaky. Uh what is. your environment like? How much do you. prepare for the actual script? Do you. have a specific formula for every. episode? I'm fascinated. And that is. Bailey Johnson. Uh. you got any advice?

I will give you the same advice I would. give anybody starting out in podcasting. Bailey, get good mics. It's worth the. expenditure. >> Make it sound good. >> And. >> they probably have them on campus, I'm. imagining. >> Yeah. I mean, yeah, if you can finagle. your way into a studio with good mics. >> Yeah, do it. >> Oh, yeah. Do whatever you need to do to. get that done. Uh, and then release on a. reliable schedule. That are those are. the two keys to to begin with. I mean, like, as long as you're releasing on a. reliable schedule, people will come to.

[music] appreciate what you're doing. >> Yeah. And uh my advice uh as far as. scripting goes is, you know, we've said. this a billion times on different. interviews, but we don't script stuff. out and we don't go over stuff with each. other. We just do our own research and. try and have as natural a conversation. as possible, which I think has helped. our show out. That's not to say that you. need to do that. No. >> But I think being relatable and [music]. um conversational helps uh rather than.

feeling like you're being read a script. >> Uh I don't know a lot of people that. would be as into that. So my advice. would be try to make it conversational. Um you know, maybe go over it with uh. whoever your co-host is some at first. She's a theater major, right? >> Yeah. You should be pretty good at this. stuff already. >> So yeah, I'm sure she's good at ad. livinging. probably finds comfort in the. idea of a script. I don't think there's. anything wrong with starting out trying. that, but if it doesn't feel right or. you're not getting good feedback about. it, then try try something else. >> Yeah. My my I guess I would say maybe.

try [music] like instead of a script, try like an outline. >> um that you share with each other. >> The poor man script. >> Yeah. So, you've got a little road map. ahead of you. And uh we kind of just. we've been doing this for so long, we. don't need that. >> We don't need it now. But um we have our. own road map that we share via our brain. [music] waves. >> Yes. Road map to the White House. >> It's just not written down. >> 2016. [music]. >> So those are our points of advice. Um we. don't have a specific formula. We just.

try to talk [music] about things that we. find interesting. >> That's I think that's a key too, man. >> Yeah. Be into what your own topic is cuz. that'll show for sure. >> Yeah. Although we've also found [music]. that like just about everything is. interesting if you dig hard enough. Everything has a story. >> Yeah. >> So, if something's like really boring. you, maybe abandon it, but you can also. try digging harder. >> Agreed. [music]. >> So, uh, [clears throat] good luck, Bailey. Send us a link when that's up. and we'll, uh, plug it for you. And, um, >> and since you're doing an interview. show, your goal should be with each.

interview to make that person cry. [laughter]. >> You know what, Bailey? I'll I'll even be. on your show if you want. >> Whoa. Woo. Nice Chuck. >> Yeah, I'll do that. If you get it up and. running and you need somebody, I'd be. happy to sit in. >> That is so nice. >> Why not? >> Why not? I will too if you want. >> I don't know if I'll go to Athens. >> Uh, yeah. >> Not that I don't like to, but might just. be easier to do it on the phone. >> Okay, we'll see. Bailey, he's laid it. out there for you. Get in touch.

>> Uh, all right, Bailey. Good luck. Uh, class of 17. That's crazy. >> Yep. Who started listening in seventh. grade? >> Goodness me. Uh, if you want to get in. touch with Chuck or I, uh, Chuck or me. Yeah, Chuck or me. Yeah. Uh, you can. tweet to us at sysk podcast. You can. join us on facebook.com/stuffyou. should know. You can send us an email to. stuffodcast@houseuffworks.com. And as always, [music] join us at our. home on the web stuffyou know.com.

For more on this and thousands of other. topics, visit housestuffworks.com. [music].