SYSK Gets Weird Playlist: What's the deal with blue people? | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Hey everybody, winding it down with a. couple of more here from me at least uh. with the stuff you should know gets. weird playlist. Have you ever seen the. blue people? There's a thing where uh. I'm not going to spoil it, but let's. just say there's a thing that happens. where people's skin can turn blue. And. this is the episode called What's the. Deal with Blue People? And no, not David. Cross and Arrested Development or the. Blue Man Group. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a.

production of iHeart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh Clark and there's Charles W. Chuck. Bryan over there. And uh Jerry was just. here. She said, "Peace out, suckers.". And this is stuff you should know. Of. course, >> it was nice of her to log on to say. goodbye, >> right? No, we're just kidding, Jerry. She's. been busy lately. >> Yeah, >> that happens.

>> It totally happens in this busy go- go. world of 2021, almost 2022. The double. deuce. >> This year has just flown by. >> It really has. I think mercifully cuz. this is going to be part of the lost. years when we look back, you know. >> Yeah. It felt like 2020 took 18 years, >> right? And somehow 2021 has just like. been in a snap. >> Yeah. >> I don't know what's going on. >> I don't think anyone does anymore,

Chuck. So don't don't feel bad. >> Uh can we shout out the uh people and. sources that helped us along for this. one? >> Mhm. >> Uh well, our buddy Dave Ruse wrote an. article for uh How Stuff Works. >> Uh and I found a great article from. Wired. I I forgot how much I love Wired. That's from Mallerie Picket. and BBC. News, ABC News, NPR Morning Edish, which. is always a fun listen. Uh, National. Library of Medicine here in the US. And.

then, as always, I feel like it makes. appearance in every episode. Jamaica. Hospital.org. >> That's right. >> Surprisingly helpful. Yeah. Or maybe not. surprisingly. >> Uh, I wonder is it Jamaica Queens or. Jamaica Jamaica? >> Oh, you know what? I was thinking. Jamaica. Jamaica. Maybe Jamaica Queens. >> Yeah. Should I Jamaica scene? Jamaica. Queens. >> My neighbor across the street neighbor. has uh from is from Jamaica the country. >> And I feel like a heel now cuz I was. like, "Hey, that hospital website's.

great, Pat.". >> She's like, "What are you talking. about?". >> Yeah. She's like, "Okay, great. Glad you. like some random hospital website.". >> Oh, boy. So, uh, we're talking today. You went and found some medical stuff. That's why you went to look at. jamaicaos.org, Oregon, I'm guessing. because we're talking about a really. interesting condition and actually a few. kinds of conditions that have something. uh unusual in common and that is that.

the people who suffer from these. conditions have blue skin. Blue skin. You heard it here first, everybody. Even. though this really first started hitting. the presses in 2008. >> Yeah. I mean, you didn't hear it here. first. This I mean this is all over the. internet. Uh, but we were talking about. not the blue man group, >> but the blue people group of Kentucky. Uh, it's a family. The is I guess it's. pronounced fugate. >> Mhm. >> It's not fugate. >> No, that's Italian. He was from France.

>> Well, that's that's a spoiler. >> Oh, is it? I'm sorry. I take it back, everyone. it, you know, it's not a spoiler, but. for some reason when I saw that the. original uh Martin Fugate was from. France, from uh I'm not sure what part. of France, but I was like, huh, that's. surprising. I was like, I don't know why. it would be. Uh yeah, he could have come. from anywhere in the world and he would. have been like a completely overlookable. person. I think totally lost a history.

had it not been for the rare um rare. genetic mutation that he happened to. carry with him. And even that wouldn't. have gotten him into the history books, Chuck. Even that wouldn't have. Instead, it took Martin Fugate to happen upon. against all odds to have found a wife. who he was not related to, who was a. total stranger from a totally different. country who also happened to have that. same rare genetic mutation. And when the.

two get together, kapow, blue kids start. popping out. >> That's right. Uh, he came over from. France to Kentucky to the Blue Hills of. Kentucky, ironically. >> Oh, wow. I hadn't thought about that. in. uh 1820. And like I said, he was from. France and he was an orphan, so he. didn't know a lot about his his family. as far as uh whether or not any of them. were blue, I guess. >> No. Or if so, he wasn't he wasn't piping. up about it. >> Yeah. Maybe he just kept it quiet. Uh. but he did marry a a red-headed American.

named Elizabeth Smith, >> and they headed on over to Troublesome. Creek near Hazard County in Kentucky and. set up a homestead there. Mhm. >> And it is a I mean the one of the. doctors that uh from one of these. articles said you know it's maybe one in. a 100,000. chance that you even have this genetic. mutation. >> right. >> and he said but you know once you start. I guess there's no other way to say it. once you start inbreeding. >> Mhm. >> which uh can happen in the 1800s in the.

ruralness of Kentucky. He said that can. go down all the way to like one in eight. chance. And that's exactly what. happened. >> Yeah, I was surprised it was even one. and eight, but there's some little fluke. of genetics that um that you have to. that when you're talking about. probability and genetics, it's a little. more difficult than you know half and. half straight math. Yeah. Um so. apparently Martin himself possibly had. like a little bit of blue to him.

>> Um his wife Elizabeth had no blue to. her. um she apparently had very very. pale skin and and bright red hair. But. when um the two got together and those. two genetic mutations donated um their. mutations to that specific gene, they. the kids that they had were like um. irresistibly blue. Like there was no. confusing. It's not like, "Yeah, Martin's kind of blue. Have you ever. noticed? Maybe he needs to to breathe. more deeply." This was like straight up.

blue kids. I've even seen them described. as dark blue. Not even a bluish hue or. tint or tinge. Dark blue skinned. children. >> Yeah. Four of seven were blue. Uh and. it's funny you said that she was not the. the mother was not blue tinted. But I imagine like before they knew. about genetics and inbreeding, >> if he would if she would have been a. little blue, that might have been a. reason to get together. >> You know what I mean? No, I don't.

Explain. >> Well, blue man happens to meet blue. woman and they're like, geez, there's. another one like me. >> and you know, we've been sort of, you. know, sort of embarrassing and maybe. we're cast out a little bit. >> So, let's hitch our wagons together cuz. there's probably nothing wrong with us. having kids, right? Because medical. science hadn't known that at that point, >> right? It's a story as old as time, Chuck. >> But it was uh it was just complete. happenstance, though.

Right. Yeah. So, um and I wonder also. like it was significant to me that they. pointed out that his wife Elizabeth. Smith um Fugate's skin was almost. translucent. It was so pale because I. wonder if she donated that to her. children. Um which allowed the blue to. really shine through even more. >> Oh, maybe. >> it's possible. >> Like the ultimate recipe for blessess. >> Exactly. Um, and they actually became. known as this blue family and they were. not particularly proud of their blue.

skin. Uh, I think they were a little. freaked out about it. I think that their. neighbors may not have particularly. treated them well. And so they already. lived in like a pretty isolated part of. Appalachia. Um, but they took pains to. actually isolate themselves even. further. And one of the one of the. consequences of that was something you. touched upon that that meant that um. their son married their aunt and cousins. married cousins even if they were way. too close to be marrying. And so one of. the one of the products of these this.

inner marriage was an entire small. regional population of blue families or. families who had blue children or blue. family members because these neighbor. families were still blood relatives of. the fugates who initially settled this. area and just started reproducing. through imbreeding. >> That's right. Uh and the condition that. they had is not a skin condition at all. It's actually a blood disorder like you. mentioned and it's called.

medmaglobanmia. Is that pretty good? >> Wow. You're So it's not meth. >> No. >> Okay. Oh, I'm glad you said it first. then. >> I I actually took great pains today to. look up between this and the other. episode we're recording. >> Oh, yeah. >> Pronunciations. >> Yeah. >> And when you look at medemoglobinia, that is 17 letters of of it's a mouthful. of letters. >> Yeah. Pure hell. And this is really one. of those that I looked at over and over.

and just could not get it right in my. head until I, you know, went and looked. it up on the internet and I was like, "Oh, it's not so hard.". >> All right, let me try. Let me try. Medmagloanmia. >> I think it's more of a T than a D. >> Uh, okay. What about a B? >> You want me to try that one next? >> This is like the worst acting audition. ever. M mativ another one. >> What's my motivation here? >> Uh to get through this episode. >> Okay, fair enough.

>> Uh so we're going to touch a little bit. on melanin throughout this episode, but. you remember melanin from our uh I think. pretty good episode on sunscreen and. suntans, >> right? Uh and this is uh you know. special cells in the body in the skin. make melanin and they are melanin is. responsible for coloring your skin and. there are all kinds of different u. melanin disorders whether you have too. much or too little uh whether you can. you know it'll make your skin lighter or. darker or whether or not it happens in.

patches uh I had a friend in Los Angeles. with vitiligo. >> which I have a friend too. >> oh you do. >> which you know leads to uh patches of. light skin on the body. Isn't that what. Michael Jackson claimed to have had too? >> Yes. >> Was that verified? >> I don't know. >> I don't know either. >> I really don't know cuz I think. >> I just remember there was a big stink. when that came out. Everyone was like, "Yeah, right." the well the the reason. why it was like really it's you got. vitiligo because it's usually um patches.

like the melanocytes the melanin. producing cells just kind of poop out or. crap out in an area and it it leaves. like patches without pigment not your. entire face um without pigment but who. knows. >> well I think his I think what he said. was that he bleached his skin to match. the light patches was his reasoning. >> oh well that's fairly reasonable you. know if you're self-conscious about. vitiligo and you have a ton of money, you could do something like that.

>> Who knows? >> Who knows? >> Should we talk about skin color or. should we take an awkward Michael. Jackson break? >> Uh, I think we just did. But the the. point is this that I think you're. making, Chuck, is that changes in like. your skin color typically have to do. with a lack of or an overp production of. melanin. Right. And that right what. we're talking about uh mimmoglobanemia. right. >> y. >> is actually a blood disorder. It's has. nothing to do with the skin. It just.

shines through that super translucent. skin that we have. >> Right. So what's going on here in the. body? >> Yeah. Okay. So you know. >> are you surprised I'm asking you to do. this? >> I I'm a little surprised. I thought we. maybe tag team this one but okay. Okay. So, uh, you have like a a a pinkish hue. to you typically, um, being being. Caucasian, um, because you're there's. not a ton of melanin that's blocking the.

blood supply underneath in your tissues. It's kind of shining through and your. blood is red. And the reason it's red, Chuck, is because. >> But the reason why blood is red, well, remember in school they teach you that. your blood is blue until you get cut and. then it hits the air. >> Yeah, that's not true. >> And then it turns red. That's what you. hear on the playground in elementary. school. >> from dumb kids. >> But that is not true. And I bet you. anything kids are still spreading that. mistruth on the playgrounds. >> Yep. Yeah. It's got some staying power.

for sure as far as as far as rumors go. >> And you know what? My dad will sue your. dad for all the money he's got. >> Did you guys threaten lawsuits? >> Sure. We were very ligious. >> Kids did though. It was very funny. >> We were like uh we were like little. Puritans in in Salem Town. >> That's right. Uh so blood is red. That. was the question, right? >> Uh yeah. Yeah. Why is blood red? >> Right. Because uh and I know we've. talked about this before, but it's.

because our red blood cells have. hemoglobin. It's a protein. >> and it gets its red color from something. called heem. It's a a compound that has. an iron atom in there and that iron atom. is the key. That's what binds with. oxygen. >> and allows red blood cells to get oxygen. all over the body and that's sort of. what makes us tick. >> Yeah, it definitely is. I mean that. oxygen is super important. So, we want. to have super redri uh hemoglobin blood, right? Our bodies also produce something.

else called uh matimoglobins I guess is. how you would pronounce it. That is not. how I've been pronouncing it in my head. But these machimmoglobins are basically. the same thing as hemoglobins, but they. have a different kind of iron attached. to them. The iron they have is like. there's really no other way to put it. Well, actually there's plenty of other. ways to put it, but one way you could. put it is that it's rusted. It's. oxidized iron, which means that it's. missing an electron that it would need. to bind to oxygen, which means it's.

useless for transporting oxygen through. the blood. So, if you have a bunch of. metmoglobin built up in your blood, your. blood can reasonably turn blue. You also. may have some problems breathing um. because you don't have any oxygen in. your blood. Although that's not true. I'm sorry. you would be able to breathe. breathe perfectly fine, but it wouldn't. clear up necessarily the lack of oxygen. in your blood because it's on a a blood. level um rather than something to do. with your lungs. >> Yeah, that was my one question because.

doctor after doctor has confirmed that. mativloia. doesn't present any health issues. >> Yeah. >> But how can that be possible that your. blood has is having trouble carrying. oxygen through your body and it doesn't. matter? I had a really hard time with. that too. And the best I could come up. with as far as an answer, which is not. definitive, but the best I could come up. with is that there is a. >> there's a threshold where your blood. will turn blue, where you have enough. metimmoglobins in there that it's blue,

>> but not so there's not so many. metimoglobins that you're actually. having trouble with your oxygen in your. body. So, it can turn blue long before. you actually like suffer from the. effects of low oxygen. Um, does that. make sense? >> Yeah, I guess that makes sense. And. isn't the threshold to turn your skin. blue like a really low percentage even? >> Like 1% of metimoglobins. If your blood. is 1% metmoglobin, you can start to turn. blue, right? So, it doesn't take very.

much, which means that you have 99% of. of the global the globins in your blood. are are um hemoglobin, which means. you're still able to to get all the. oxygen you need. You just have maybe a. little less than somebody else. That's. my best guess from what I saw. Um and I. I think at this point in our. understanding of mimmoglobanemia, it's as good as anybody's. >> Well, that sounds like a perfect place. for a break. >> Okay. And uh we'll be right back to talk. a little bit more about this and other.

interesting blood conditions right after. this. So Chuck, we were talking about. matimagloanmia. Um, and the reason I like like I think. one of us said earlier that the body.

naturally produces these things um these. mimmoglobins. Um, but we also produce an enzyme that. can convert excess metimmoglobins into. hemoglobin and it's got a doozy of a. name which I just love. May I take this. one? Yes, >> this enzyme is called reduced. nicotinomide addinine ducleotide. cytochrome B5 reductase. One of the. great alltime nickname. >> sparky.

>> It has no nickname. You have to say the. entire thing every time. And so this enzyme reduced nicotinamine. addinine ducleotide cytochrome B5. reductase is actually capable of. converting the iron from its um feric. state in mi metmoglobins into its. ferrris state which is capable of. binding with oxygen like the kind that's. found in hemoglobin. So for all intents. and purposes reduced nicotinomide. addinine ducleotide cytochrome B5.

reductase is capable of converting. metimmoglobins into hemoglobin and most. of us are able to do that. But if you're. like a fugate and you have that rare. genetic condition where both parents. donated that mutation to you and you. develop machmoglobanemia. but there's some reduced amount of. reduced nicotenomide addine ducleotide. cytochrome B5 reductase which means that. that metimoglobins that you naturally. produce are able to build up and.

accumulate in your blood and when they. do that and they they they start to turn. blue that's how you cross that 1%. threshold. old. >> That's right. And this is one of the uh. rare times where you can actually have a. genetic condition that's uh pretty. easily solved. And in this case, it's. just a pill. >> Uh and the guy who figured this out uh. has sort of an interesting story in his. own right. His name is Madison Kowen or. Kawine. >> Kowen. >> I'm going with Cowine. >> Cowine.

>> Cowine. Cowen. I'm going with Cowine. C-. A W E I N Cowen. >> Although I like cow wine. That doesn't. sound like it'd be tasty, but I'll bet. it gives you a pretty good buzz. >> Uh he was the or uh he was the grandson. of a a pretty famous at the time poet. out of Kentucky. Uh and Madison was the. third of of the Madison's. And this is. just a side note, um very sad and. interesting. His wife was poisoned and.

murdered by poison. Oh, no. >> In the 1960s and no one was ever caught. and charged with a crime and it it kind. of remains one of Kucky's um you know. sort of biggest cold cases. >> Wow. I did not see that one coming. >> Yeah. He and his wife and this other. couple were out drinking all night. supposedly like just got sloshed. >> at at a Yeah. at a country club. Um he. Madison didn't even make it home. I. think he stayed the night there, but the. other man uh the the man from the other.

couple drove his wife home. Um. apparently just dropped they had another. night cap and she woke up dead. Well, didn't wake up dead. She died. >> Mhm. >> And they thought it was just, you know, alcohol or some natural cause, but then. they found these two like little needle. pricks in her. >> Wow. >> Where they think she was uh I guess. given a shot to pass out and then. poisoned. And I can't remember the. poison. of some sort of like acid or. something. >> Wow. >> But yeah, really really interesting.

Neither here nor there as far as this. goes, but that's the sad story of of Dr. Madison uh Cow Wine's wife. >> Was he a suspect? Cuz I would have. suspected him. >> I don't think so because he wasn't even. there. That's the first thing I thought. But apparently it was pretty verified. that he slept it off. >> at the country club. I guess. >> crazy because Yeah. Well, I mean, one of. the things that he became famous for, if. not the thing he became famous for, was. injecting people with with some fairly. weird stuff. >> I know. Isn't that weird?

>> Yeah, it is weird. >> You're not buying it. >> Nah, I don't want to like casters on. somebody. I don't know enough about the. story, but that it's that's just very. odd, especially. >> like judging from this 90 story. >> Right. Exactly. I I can conclusively. solve this case. I've seen enough law. and order to know that the husband. almost always did it. >> Oh, well, that is probably true, but uh. probably not in this case. But, uh at. any rate, he was a a hematologist at U. at University of Kentucky.

>> and he heard about these people. throughout the world and really wanted. to kind of get to the bottom of this. when a couple of them uh well, I don't. think these were Fugates, but Patrick. and Rachel Richie uh I guess you know it. happened in some other family. I know. the Combmes is. >> We knew a Combmes from Kentucky. We We. had a friend that we worked with for a. little while. >> Oh, really? >> He was never He never struck me as blue. Yeah, >> he never struck you as blue. >> But I wonder if he is related to the. Combmes. >> Oh, who knows? >> Which would make him by some somehow a.

Fugate because again these these. families in the Fuggate area were all if. you went back far enough fugates. >> Right. Exactly. All right. So these. people walk into his office and what. happened? So here here's the thing. Like. they didn't walk into his office. He. went and found them. I read an article. about him and he became maybe a little. obsessed with finding these people. Wanted to know what the heck was going. on. So he actually went out in the woods. and would wait for them and and every. once in a while would see one and he'd.

chase them telling them to stop and of. course they would run off. So he figured. out another way to do it. He moved to. Hazard County near Troublesome Creek and. he started asking around at clinics like. had anybody ever treated a blue patient. and he finally struck gold um blue gold. when he spoke to one nurse at a clinic. that said, "Yeah, this this one woman. came in with blue skin and she was. really self-conscious about her skin. She came to the back door was really. just kind of meek and embarrassed." Um. but uh yeah, we've treated a blue person. before. So, uh, Cowane B b b b b b b b b.

b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b b. b b b b b b b b b b b basically hung. around this clinic until more blue. people came in and that this is where he. met the the Richie siblings. >> Yeah. So, he started to dig into their. family a little bit. Uh it became pretty. obvious to him that it was a genetic. disorder and he started digging around. other stories around the the North. America and found an Inuit population in. Alaska who had uh who had the same. condition. I'm just going to call it. this condition now. >> Okay. I think we said it enough or at.

least I have. >> Yeah. >> And he said, "Well, you know, these. people were uh interbreeding a lot. because they were very remote as well.". And so he said, "I think we understand. the problem here. How do we fix it?". Yeah. I don't know if he where he he got. this idea, but he used something called. methylene blue, which was already like. in wide use. It's used to stain tissue. because it affects some cells. differently than others. Um, it was a.

malarial treatment which malaria can. actually produce uh mimoglobanemia. I'm suddenly having trouble saying it. because we haven't been practicing. lately. Um and and what it does is it. goes in and it interacts with the um. reduced nicotinomide adanine ducleotide. cytochrome B5 reductase and basically. gives it a boost and helps convert all. of that excess um metimoglobins into.

hemoglobins in patients with. metimoglobin anemia. And so I don't know. where he got the idea, but he tried it. and apparently injected the Richie kids. with it and they they stopped being blue. like almost on the spot. >> Yeah. Like minutes later they returned. to a to a you know a standard color. >> Mhm. >> And. I I mean they were overjoyed. Like could. you imagine being like this your whole. life getting a shot and looking in the.

mirror a few minutes later and you're. like oh my gosh it's like it's it's. gone. It's actually really sweet because. they were very self-conscious. The whole. family I mean this family like retreated. to the woods to to like people didn't. know where they lived and they lived. like 5 miles away from them and knew. that there was this blue family. Still. had no idea where they lived. It was. like that's how far they were treated. from society because they were that. self-conscious. So yeah, I'm sure it was. a pretty joyous occasion for them. >> There's going to be a movie about this. at some point, right? >> I can't believe there's not. There was a. very famous interview with Kawwinne in a.

a magazine called Science 82 and there's. also a really famous painting that. somebody did and it was just kind of. lost of history who did it and I read. this article I can't remember what it. was on but this person tracked down um. the the artist the initial artist and. got to see like the original because. it's been scanned so many times it's. really lost a step but um the original. is apparently really something to see. Should we say the quote that uh Cohane. had in that science 82 article? >> Totally. >> He said he said when they walked into.

the office, he said they were bluer than. hell. >> Very Kentucky. >> Yeah, totally. >> All right. So, over time, uh, Fugates. started moving away like some of the. younger population of the family got out. of Hazard County. And it's so hard not. to make Dukes of Hazard jokes. I've been. just sidesteping the whole time. >> You've been doing really great. Thank. you. Uh, but they started to move away. over time and basically, you know, that's going to stop the inner breeding. and that's going to make fewer and fewer.

blue babies. >> And as of 2012, I think some were still. blue, but not today. >> Yeah. I think now that there's a. treatment, an easy treatment because you. they don't even have to be injected. anymore. Like if you're blue and you. don't want to be blue, you just take a. methylene blue pill once a day and it. goes in. Apparently, once you excrete it. out the methylene blue, you go back to. being blue. So, you have to take it. daily. But I'll bet there's members of. that family now, and I'm just guessing.

here, but um that are proudly blue now. that they know that they don't have to. be blue. Some of them, I'll bet make a. choice to be blue as kind of like a like. a pride in their family heritage. I'm. guessing here. Well, the thing I saw. that there was one in that was the one. in 2012 that was still blue. >> like by choice, >> I think. So, yeah, it just didn't take. the pill. >> Gotcha. Wow, that's neat. >> But, uh but not today anymore. So, this. is uh not the only way you can get. bluish or any, you know, I guess silvery.

skin is another is another thing that. comes into play here with this next uh. disorder. And this is one called. Argeria. And some people are bluish, some people. are silver. If you've looked up, you. know, blue people or silver people. online, you've no doubt seen uh Paul. Carrison. >> They called him Papa Smurf, and he is. all over the internet as one of the more. famous cases of Ageria. >> Yeah. And he uh was he kind of emerged.

as I don't know if a cautionary tale is. right because that was not his purpose. Um. >> Mhm. But he he als he he he whether he. meant to or not he served as a. cautionary tale about taking colloidial. silver because that is what turned him. blue. And it didn't just turn his skin. blue it turned his mucous membranes. blue. So if he like flashed his teeth. his gums were blue. The inside of his. mouth was blue. The inside of his nose. was blue. He was blue. Bluer than hell.

as cowane would probably put it. >> That's right. Um, and he he did it. because he saw an article about how um, silver ions basically restored some cut. flower back to life again. And he. thought, well, that that'd be really. something to to to see what it can do on. a human body. >> I want to be a fresh daisy, >> right? And he wasn't the only person at. experimenting at the time. Like. apparently for a while it was a. over-the-counter drug and we've been. using silver for a very long time. But.

he was um somebody who used it every. single day. He was drinking like a 10. drink of colloidal silver. He figured. out how to basically make his own. colloidal silver uh potion. And he also. rubbed it on his face too. And so in. very short order he started to turn blue. because that is definitely a consequence. of using uh silver too much of. overexposure to silver. >> That's right. Uh and this can happen if. you work in like a silver mine or. something, >> right? like it can be one of the side. effects of mining in silver.

>> mines. I also saw that in the old time. um not even that old but just. pre-digital photography processing. photograph processing you could actually. um yeah you know the 80s. >> Yeah. >> Um you could actually develop argeria be. from exposure to the the silver dust. that was used to expose um photographic. plates. I think prior to the 80s. I I. don't know when they stopped using that. >> I don't either. I spent a lot of times. in dark rooms as a kid because of my.

dad. >> Uh because. I'd go in there, turn on that red light. and sit there and think about what. you've done. >> No, my dad was an amateur photographer. Well, I guess in my profession, he sold. stuff, but. >> Oh, nice. >> He he did his own uh developing and um I. I learned how to do it and did it some. through high school and then kind of. quit doing it. It was a lot of fun. though. Dark rooms are uh very like. peaceful places. >> Is that right? >> Yeah. just, you know, they're dark. obviously. Sure. >> And you're in there for a long period of.

time and it's just very nice. Usually by. yourself, but unless you're in a teen uh. romance movie and then, you know, the. cute girls in there with you. >> I Well, I always associate them with the. the murderer finally coming into focus. and they happen to be standing right. next to the the photographer is. developing it. So, to me, dark rooms are. very tense, scary places. >> Like as it as the as the photo paper. like comes into focus. Oh, very tense. >> This shows the calls coming from inside. the dark room. >> That's right. Um, where were we? Okay,

so what causes this is an excess of. silver ions in your body. >> Right. >> And when they're exposed to light, they. react by forming dark deposits on the. skin. >> that end up looking silverish. And the. bad news about this is once you've got. it, it's there. You can't take a pill. and get rid of it. >> No, it's irreversible. But we don't have. a way to remove excess silver from the. tissues in the human body. And that's. all it is. It's just it builds up. Normally the body can excrete, you know,

small amounts of silver that we're. exposed to from like, you know, touching. silver or um snorting silver, that kind. of stuff. Um. >> what. >> you know uh like we pee it out, we poop. it out and we get rid of it. But if we. overcome that threshold and our silver. ingestion um exceeds our ability to. excrete it, it starts to build up in the. tissue. And so if you're drinking your. own 10 colloidal silver um homebrew. every single day, you're going to.

overwhelm your body's ability to excrete. silver very quickly and it's going to. build up and build up and build up and. pretty soon you're going to be blue or. silver blue. >> That's right. Uh, and if you look up. images of uh, Kerasan, you're probably. also going to find pictures of Stan. Jones, a libertarian politician in. Montana who around Y2K said, "You know. what? I think things are going to go. south and we're not going to have any. antibiotics. So, I'm going to uh, start. making my own again colloidal silver. solution.". >> Yeah.

>> And drink that stuff. And then there was. a teacher in Brooklyn too named Rosemary. Jacobs who uh very sadly I think got um. nasal drops with silver when she was a. kid and she was sort of not sort of she. was very silver for life. >> Yes she was. So these people again have. proved to be cautionary tales to most. people who are like oh that's what. happens if you take too much silver. I'm. not going to take colloidal silver. supplements over the counter or um. anything like that. I'm just going to. steer clear of silver alto together.

because one of the problems is there's. not a lot of peer-reviewed evidence if. any that suggests that silver has any. beneficial effect when taken internally, right? It is actually anti. antimicrobial. It's pretty clever to um. use silver like in the pre-scientific. days, but there's nothing that says like. yes, if you drink a colloidal silver. home brerew, it's going to have any. effect on your on your life or your. health. And in fact, it it might.

actually turn you blue. Despite this, people still take colloidal silver um. pretty frequently. Apparently, Alex. Jones touts it, Gwyneith Paltro touts. it, Dr. Oz touts it and that's, you. know, if it's not actually harming you, there doesn't seem to be any any harm. from it aside from potentially. irreversibly turning blue. But there's a. larger harm that I saw, Chuck, to. society in general. And that silver is a. a antimicrobial of last resort that is.

um they're figuring out how to use it. against um mic antibiotic resistant bugs. like MRSA. that that silver will get in. there and even kill MRSA, but that. silver resistance may be developed in. bugs by all these people taking. colloidal silver supplements and. drinking colloidal silver um you know, homebrews and stuff like that that it's. actually creating silver resistant. microbes which is not a good thing for.

anybody. >> All right. Well, let's take our second. break. Good. Yes. And we'll talk a. little bit more about colloidal silver. right after this. All right. So you mentioned earlier that.

uh kind of in passing that colloidal. silver had been used pre um you know. mainstream medical science coming on. board. >> and it's really true and they were kind. of on to something in that like you said. there were there are some antimicrobial. properties. So people like Ply the. Elder, uh Cyrus the Great, they both. touted the use of silver. Uh monks in. the middle ages use silver nitrate um to. treat ulcers and burns and it was used a. lot. It's it's kind of in a way before.

we had real antibiotics one of the first. antibiotics. >> Yes. Um again externally it messes up. microbes and we're not exactly sure even. still today what the mechanism is. The. guesses are that it somehow penetrates. the the membrane of the of bacteria and. prevents it from replicating properly. um or it it it has it does like some. one-two punches on enzymes that the the. microbes need to to survive. Um but that.

it it will leave your human skin cells. alone. It just attacks microbes weirdly, bacteria specifically. Um so yeah, it. was like a a early antibiotic and it. actually kept um stayed in use for a. long time. Now nowadays you'll find it. in like wound dressings. Sometimes. sutures will be coated in silver. Um. replacement joints, artificial joints. will have some sort of silver component. to it to to protect um against. infection. Um but we were using them.

internally for a really long time up. until the 60s even. I think babies got. like silver eye drops uh when they were. born, which I had not heard of until, you know, yesterday. >> I had neither. Yeah. Silver nitrate uh. to prevent eye infections. Uh but then. they found out it can actually cause eye. damage and burn the skin. So they really. worked on um just sort of uh what's the. word I'm looking for? When you make. something less potent by mixing it with.

water, >> dilute it. >> Diluting it. >> Mhm. >> Right on the tip of my tongue. >> You did it. >> No, you did it. So they learned how to. dilute it. But the problem with diluting. it in a formula is. it wasn't an exact science. It's like. they didn't know exactly how much silver. was still going to be active. >> And so, you know, you couldn't really. use it as a medicine anymore because it. was either too weak to do anything or it. was so much that you risk turning blue. So, eventually they just scrapped it as.

a medicine and said, I think in 1999 the. FDA said, "This isn't a medicine. You. can't advertise it as such." So, they. said, "All right, we'll just say it's a. supplement," right? >> And just move it to the shelf, you know, four feet away. >> And the FDA said, "Whatever. And that's what happened. And you can. still get this stuff. That's where, you. know, that's why Gwyneth Paltro uses it. >> Yeah. So, and I mean, like, again, it's. one of those things where it's like, yes, it makes sense. Silver has. antimicrobial properties. There's. probably some microbes in your body you. don't want. Um, so take some silver and.

see if it works. But again, there's just. not any peer-reviewed evidence that. backs this up. That's not necessarily to. say that it doesn't work. Just because. there isn't peer-reviewed evidence that. backs it up doesn't also necessarily. mean in the same breath that there's. plenty of peer-reviewed evidence that. says it doesn't work. I'm not suggesting. anybody take the stuff. I'm just saying. there's not peer-reviewed evidence to. back up that it actually does anything. And if you do take it again, you risk. permanently, irreversibly turning blue.

>> Yeah. Yeah. And and I should point out I. don't know anything about Gwyneth. Paltro's current usage, but this uh her. appearance on Dr. Oz in 2013 uh was when. she touted it. She she may have given it. up. Who knows? >> Who knows? Um Paul Kerous never gave it. up though, Chuck. He died in uh. 2013 as well. Same year that Gwynneth. Paltro outered herself as a silver user. Um, and Paul Kerousan, uh, he apparently.

used colloidal silver, that homebrew he. made up until the end. Like he never. stopped, even though he apparently. retreated from the public eye because he. was tired of being treated like a freak. or a weirdo. Um, and had some rough. years toward the end, apparently after. he went public, but he still kept up. with the colloidal silver, although that. doesn't seem to have been linked to his. death. He was also a really heavy smoker. for many years and he suffered a heart. attack and a stroke. >> Yeah. I mean, I guess his point was.

probably, well, I'm already blue. >> Yeah. >> Like, why stop now? >> Can't get much bluer. So, uh, what else. you got? >> Well, I just thought we'd wind it up. with this little uh kind of sidebar. Uh. I can't this doesn't really have. anything to do with being blue or. silver, but I thought it was an. interesting find that uh they basically. determine uh there's something called. repigmenting that has happened to people. uh to go uh their skin both darker and. lighter that has nothing to do and it's.

funny this article kept calling it. intermarriage. Um what they mean is you. know or. >> yeah what they mean is having sex and. having babies. uh of two different skin. colors, but they keep calling it inner. marriage, which I guess is uh you know, very sweet. >> It's just such a lovely way to put it. >> It is. Uh but they know that. repigmenting happens regardless of uh. intermarriage. But what they found. recently is that this has happened a lot. faster than anyone thought. And we're.

talking about 100 generations uh or as. little as a 100 generations, which is a. long time, but over the course of human. history, it's not that long. It's. potentially. Yeah, it's not that long. Usually a generation is chocked up at. about 20 years. So, we're talking as. little as 2,000 years. >> that groups that were once lily white. went back to being dark and groups that. were dark can turn into a lily white. population. >> And that it's it's it it's just. basically more evidence that race is.

strictly a social construct. Skin color. has nothing to do with anything but the. amount of melanin that our genes tell. our bodies to produce which is triggered. by the amount of UV exposure that we. have over something like 100. generations, >> right? And so if your family lineage. moves from a place uh that has lots of. UV near the equator to a place that. doesn't have much daylight or vice. versa, your body is going to adapt and. melanin uh production is going to change.

>> and over time your entire family's skin. color can change. >> Yeah. Because we actually need UV, right? But we just need a certain amount. of it. If you have too much, you can get. skin cancer. Apparently it can uh have. reproductive issues. If you get too. little, it can also have issues on your. bone because we use UV to produce. vitamin D, which we use for for strong. bones, bone density. So, our bodies have. figured out how to kind of adjust. depending on that UV exposure by. producing or slowing down melanin.

production. That's it. >> Pretty amazing. >> Pretty neat. But it is surprising that. it's. >> Well, actually, it's not that surprising. that it can happen over a hundred. generations or or 2,000 years because. the body is very responsive to its. environment. We adapt very easily. So. that's not particularly surprising, although it is neat. >> Yeah. I mean, it surprised the. scientists. I think they just thought it. it that was quicker than they. anticipated. >> So if you're a racist, just stop and. think that somewhere down your family. line there is a white person or a black.

person. Haha. >> Or in the future. >> Yeah, that's true. >> That's right. So take that. >> Uh you got anything else? >> I have nothing else. >> All right. Well, if you want to know. more about blue people or colloidal. silver or pigmentation, go start reading. up on it on the internet. Uh, and thanks. again to all the great sites that you. found in putting this really good. episode together, Chuck. And since I. complimented Chuck's episode, putting. together skills, it's time for listener. mail.

>> I'm going to call this uh one of the. many thanks we got for the M, not NRA, but the the Mr. N episode, >> right? Uh this is one I think for both. of us like we were super stoked to do. and like in retrospect very proud of you. know. >> we're stoked. >> We were super stoked. Not just stoked. >> Brah. >> stoked. Plus there's no way to say. stoked without sounding like the a bro. >> No. No way at all. >> That stinks too cuz I'm not a bro. But I.

do like saying stoked. >> That's fine. Just say stoked. Be loud. and proud like the last remaining blue. fugate. So this is from Mark and it was. a really long one that I'm going to just. sort of summarize the first part. Uh is. that Mark works in healthcare. information technology and had a rough. go of it over the past couple of years. like so many people um working alone and. uh listening to our show which he said. helped quite a bit uh losing some close. friends to co. >> man. >> and uh seeing all this up close and.

personal. So Mark had a tough time. So. he says this uh after working for almost. 2 years uh on the co 19 problem the last. thing I wanted to hear was your podcast. about Mr. Na vaccines. >> understood. >> Uh when I saw the topic pop up on my. player took a deep breath and decided to. listen anyway. I knew almost everything. you shared on the podcast but became. enthralled in the recap of this amazing. story. Uh to my surprise, I was again. brought to tears with a recognition uh.

one that you two share of these. brilliant helpers who use their gifts. for the benefit of all humanity. At the. risk of making you blush, uh you two are. part of those helpers. You presented. this Mr. Na episode with a childlike. curiosity and relatable simplicity that. anyone with doubts on taking the vaccine. would reconsider. Uh I can't believe. that I have to say this, but facts help. and fact sharers are helpers. Uh, I. might also add that letting go of any. biases to let your curiosity curiosity. take hold is heroic. Uh, and that is.

from Mark. And boy, I I'm going to read. that one another hundred times today. >> Yeah, just print it out and fold it up. and keep it under your pillow. >> Yes. Thank you, Mark. He wanted his uh. last name to be with help, but. appreciate the work you've done, Mark, and hang in there. >> Yeah, same same to you, Mark. And um. that was very high praise. Thank you. very much for it. Means a lot to hear. something like that. Um, one other thing. though, Chuck, that that Mark reminded. me of that people with Matimoglobanmia. actually can blush blue.

>> Oh, so they get bluer. >> Yeah. Isn't that neat? >> I guess that makes sense. >> Thanks for that, too, Mark. Even though. you had no idea you're setting us up for. it, you did. So, you're just basically a. an allgether great person. >> If you want to be a great person like. Mark and write in to let us know. whatever you want to let us know, we. want to hear from you. You can wrap it. up and spank it on that bottom until. it's blue in the face and send it off to. Stuffpodcast at iheartradio.com.

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