Selects: Why Do Great Flood Myths Seem To Be Universal? | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Hey everybody, it's Josh and I have one. word to describe this week's select from. 2021 on why there are so many myths. about a great flood. founding cultures around the world. [music] And that word is fascinating. But I'll add a few more words, I guess. This is one of those good old-fashioned. Stuff You Should Know episodes where we. find out that a thing that everyone just. kind of takes for granted actually has a. lot more to it than it seems. And I love. those episodes. And I love this episode,

which is why I picked it. I hope you. love it, too. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production [music] of iHeart Radio. >> [music]. >> Ahoy and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh and there's Chuck and we're the. captains of this here ship called Stuff. You Should Know. And that's all there is to it. Although.

I do think we need to allow for the fact. that Jerry is rear admirable. And by that, of course, I mean. >> [laughter]. >> rear admiral. And by that, of course, I. mean it's going to be a long episode. Uh. has there ever been a cutsey TV show. called The Admirable Admiral? Uh no, that sounds great. I think there. was one The Simpsons did one called. Admiral Baby. Uh all right, well, that counts. Yeah. I. don't know if the baby was particularly. admirable, though. Could have been like.

a terrible person. Uh so, I have a cold, so I just want to apologize up front. Uh. just a head cold, but I'm a little. stuffy, so I'm sorry if uh. if it's coming across as untoward. I'm very proud of you for pushing. through, Chuck, cuz a lesser podcasters. would not They They They might They. might just be like, I can't. I I have a. cold. People don't want to hear that. And you say, "The heck with that. I'm. going forward with it." Remember back in. the day you had like a 3-month cold that. one year. Every year. Every year for a.

little while. I used to get so sick. Yeah, I know it was terrible, but we've. gotten much better, haven't we? Yeah, I. think uh I don't know. Maybe quitting. smoking had something to do with that. Maybe. Just a touch. You don't get colds like. that anymore. No, I really don't. So, yet another reason to quit smoking. everybody who's out there on the fence. That's right. Uh so, we're talking today. the reason I said that we're captains. because I was making a play on a story. that it seems like every single person. Chuck knows about. At the very least I. can say with almost 100% confidence that.

everyone that you and I have ever met, seen in passing, talked to, um or been. in the same like country with probably. has heard of the story of Noah and the. flood where Noah was told to go ahead. and build a a boat because the the earth. was going to flood and everybody was. going to be killed. And by the way, grab. some animals, put them on board so that. you and your wife and then the animals. can all repopulate your respective. species once the flood subsides, right?

It's a classic story. Everybody loves. it. We we we read it out loud just about. every Saturday at dinner time, and it's. just a great story, right? Everybody. knows the story. But it turns out, Chuck, that um there's this idea that. that actually happened. That that there. and it's long been an idea that the that. what the Noah story is talking about. happened in actuality, that there was a. point in time where the entire world.

flooded, and there's been a lot of. scholarly research into this and into. how that's even possible. Yeah, and you know, I guess if we're. talking about. this particular because you know, we've. we've found after digging around and. getting Ed to help us with this research. that there are flood myths in. not every culture, [clears throat] but. a lot of cultures over the years. And. we'll get into that, you know, in lots. of detail, but as far as actual Noah's. actual flood from the Old Testament, um.

there was a gentleman in 1872. named George Smith, who was a hobbyist. of all things Assyrian, and an amateur sort of uh historical. sleuth, but um. a well-educated one nonetheless, because. he could do things like read cuneiform. tablets. >> Mhm. And he was doing that one day on uh. I don't know if it was an actual lunch. break, or if that's just apocryphal, but. supposedly on a lunch break, went to a. museum, was reading cuneiform, and came. across a story.

uh the Epic of Gilgamesh, and read this, quote, "Build a boat. Abandon wealth and seek survival. Spurn. poverty, save life. Take on board all. living things' seed, animals. The boat you will build, her dimensions. shall be equal. Her length and breadth. shall be the same." Uh doesn't say. anything about cubits, but it's. inferred. >> Right. Uh cover her with a roof cover. her with a roof like the ocean below, and he will send you a rain of plenty.". And George Smith said, "Hey, this is.

strikingly familiar as the. Christian/Jewish Old Testament Noah's. flood story, but this is several hundred. years previous." Yeah, and instead of. um God telling Noah, or an angel telling. Noah, it's the god Enlil who's telling a. guy named Utnapishtim. to build this boat. Noah's nowhere to be. heard. And for what reason? What do you mean? Well, I mean, wasn't this one of the. ones where like Earth is being punished,

basically? Oh, yeah. So, um the reason. that that uh Enlil gave to Utnapishtim. was because the humans were too noisy, and the gods were sick of humans, so. they were going to flood the Earth and. kill off all humans. Whereas in the. Bible, it was because humans had become. too wicked to to live. I think noisy and. wicked are the same thing back then. >> I guess so. And it makes you wonder like. did somebody misread the word and and. they're like noisy? Okay. And just. barreled on. They're like my lunch break. is almost over. So George Smith just was.

like noisy. It's they said noisy. But. the uh there was also the idea of saving. animals and there was also the idea that. afterward uh birds were sent out to find. dry land just as in Noah's story. Right. And so uh you just kind of say whoops. because um the Epic of Gilgamesh. predates the Old Testament by at least. several hundred years depending on what. part you're talking about. And um. so you might say okay, so the Noah story. is adapted from this. But that doesn't.

mean that it undermines the veracity. They don't undermine the veracity of one. another. In fact, if you stop and think. about it, the fact that one of the first. things that was ever written down. after the invention of writing, cuneiform was the first written system. humans ever devised. >> Yeah. And that the first literary work. ever created, the Epic of Gilgamesh, contained this flood story. Um it kind of suggests that something.

actually may have happened. Like it was. a really important story that has stuck. around for thousands and thousands of. years. The Epic of Gilgamesh was written. 3,400 years ago. Um. that that it suggests that there might. be some some kernel of truth to it. Yeah, and over the years a lot of people. have tried to. um prove whether scientifically or. otherwise that the the Noah's flood.

really did take place. Uh Bible. literalists, is that what is that what. we call them? I think so. Okay. Bible. literalists, um Bible historians because that would. uh that would go a long way uh in. Christianity if you could say, "Hey, the. Bible is an actual historical document. This stuff is really true.". And in the 18th and 19th century, there. was something called uh diluvialism. Diluvial meaning like relating to a. great flood. But that was a big shaper.

of actual geology was basically saying, "Hey, this physical literally the. physical world that we're living in came. about after this flood what kind of. reset things." And then the the real. geological record came along once. science got serious and they proved that. was not the case. And that kind of went. the way of the dodo around, you know, the mid-1800s. Yeah, they kind of did it. backwards. They said the the Noah flood. shaped the world as we see it. Go find. proof. And when they found proof, they were. like, "It's not really adding up." Yeah.

So, there's no evidence that there was a. global flood that inundated the world. And in fact, the geological record that. these geologists the early ones and you. know, up to modern-day ones have been. putting together. supports the exact opposite of that. That Earth wasn't created in a deluge. It was created over incredibly [snorts]. long distances of time very very slowly. layer by layer, right? >> [clears throat]. >> That's right. But people still say, "Okay, well, why.

number one, why have we been telling. this flood story for so long?" And then. also, why is it like you said, the the. idea of of flood myths seems almost. universal. Doesn't that like still. strongly suggest that there was. even if the Bible doesn't quite have it. right. And by the way, Noah's story also. shows up in the Quran, too. So, it's in. the Jewish Bible, the Old Testament, and. the Quran. And then there's the Epic of. Gilgamesh story. Like, why is this. important story still around? Doesn't it. still support the idea that something.

happened? Why would there be universal. flood myths from cultures that had never. even heard of Christianity before? And. there've been like some attempts to. explain that that I think are much more. satisfying than the idea that we're just. missing all of the evidence for a great. worldwide deluge that happened back in. antiquity. Yeah, and there were, you know, that. it's more than just those. There were. Chinese flood myths, there were. uh. flood myths in Southern Canada and the. British Isles. Uh so, there was one study that picked.

out 50 cultures and they all had their. own flood myths. and that that was related to some kind. of punishment. So, they started looking, like you said, of like why why is this. happening? And there's a bunch of reasons and they. all kind of make sense to me, if if I'm. being honest. Um one of them is that. there there was a flood in these. cultures, but it wasn't a global flood, but if you're. you know, if if all you know is a. certain area and you never get to leave. that area.

and it wipes out everything you know, then the story that you pass along. orally. um through the years would sound like. one that wiped out everything. Yeah, and. and like the the whole idea is is that. this flood actually did happen way far. back to one. group and then that group eventually. kind of spread out and carried that. flood myth with them. And so, to those of us today, historians, anthropologists, looking at.

like all of these groups that are spread. out all over the world, all sharing. basically the same story, it would make. it seem like a flood had impacted all of. these groups that were that far spread. out. So, it must have been a really big. flood, but this explanation says, "No, the flood was actually really localized. It was the group that it happened to. that eventually spread out." That's one. explanation. It makes a lot of sense. And one of the. the groups that are usually. kind of pinpointed as the this flood. happening to are the. Proto-Indo-Europeans,

who were known to have been around the. the I think the Caucasus mountains to. start and then just spread out as far as. the British Isles um. basically all over Europe northwest east. south um and that all of our languages. like English Germanic um just a whole. slew of languages developed out of this. group. Yeah, and some more support for this is. the fact that there aren't flood myths. in sub-Saharan African cultures and. these were groups that when they left.

Africa they didn't come back so they. would not have taken back with them uh. a flood myth from Proto-Indo-Europeans. >> Mhm. So it would all kind of make sense. Yeah, exactly. There's another kind of. related one too that um. that says that. there were floods just not a flood. That. flooding is actually really common so it. happened to a lot of different groups so. it would make sense that all these. different cultures would have flood.

myths. Sure. And again if you're if you. live in your. uh riverside village and you don't get. to travel very far from there and. everything you know of gets destroyed. again it could be you know lend support. to the idea that it gets translated as a. worldwide flood and if everyone's having. these localized floods which which. happened you know there's always been. floods. then uh. not necessarily the 40 days and 40. nights variety. but when things are passed around orally. and then they get rewritten things get.

kind of mixed up. Yeah, and it's our bad. those of us alive today who are. mistaking or. laying our interpretation of the world. word world onto like these cultures use. of the word world. They're saying their world which is much. smaller than it is to those of us today. When we think the world we think the. whole globe you know. Yeah, and speaking of laying your things. on other cultures. uh the third one is Christian. missionaries. Uh, and there's evidence of this.

happening. They would go and tell the. story of Noah's great flood. Uh, especially, you know, when colonization. was happening, too. And between. missionaries and colonization, all these. other cultures picked up on that. original biblical flood tale. Uh, or I. don't know if we should call it a flood. myth or or flood tale at this point. What should we call it? I I think most. people call it flood myths or diluvian. myths. Okay. Diluvian myth. That sounds. a little more academic. >> Mhm. Uh, so yeah, so Christian missionaries.

did this and I think this is. >> [clears throat]. >> um, also evidence in the fact that uh, the South Pacific didn't really have one. until uh, 1814 when they came into. contact with with Christian missionaries. and then all of a sudden they had the. Maori flood myth. Yeah, so they actually. had a flood myth before, but apparently. it was more tsunami-based and then after. contact with Christianity, it became. much more like a deluge and it just bore. some striking resemblances to the Noah. flood myth of Christianity. And.

apparently that happened all over the. South Pacific as well where um, these. cultures will have their own kind of. flood myth, but it's always based on. tsunamis, but then the Christians come. and go and all of a sudden it's a deluge. where the water rose after like, you. know, 40 days and 40 nights of rain and. stuff. So, that creates a lot of. headaches for anthropologists, but it. also at the same time explains why a. universal flood myth or a flood myth. would seem universal to those of us. around today and why they seem to bear. such a striking resemblance to one.

another, you know? Indeed. I think we should take a break. >> Mhm. And uh, I'm going to go blow my nose. Okay. And then we'll come back and talk. about geo-mythology right after this. >> [music]. [music].

[music]. >> So check, that was nice of you to blow. your nose at the break rather than. during. >> [laughter]. >> recording, even though I still had to. hear it. It was thick. >> Uh. you know what's funny? I was listening. to uh. I don't know why I just thought of this, but I was listening to uh Paul F. Tompkins. Stay at Homekins podcast he does with. his wife Janie the other day, and he was. talking about sneezing on stage, and that that had happened to him once.

>> Mhm. in his career, and Paul is someone. who spent lots and lots and lots of time. on stages. >> Mhm. And I wonder if there's something to. that. of the body. withholding things like sneezes, cuz. I've never seen anyone sneeze on stage. I've never sneezed on stage. Yeah. Isn't that weird? Yeah, I'm sure it's. related to adrenaline and fight or. flight. That's what I was thinking. I. mean, there's got to be something to. that. >> Yeah. Like your body's like, I don't. have time to waste all that energy on. sneezing. We got to get out of here. We.

got to put on a great show. It would be. really weird to think about it if like, I don't know, Barry Manilow in Vegas was. talking about setting up Mandy before he. sings it and just lets out a big sneeze. Yeah. Well, thank you for setting me up. to reminisce yet again about the time. that you me and I saw Barry Manilow. front row center in Vegas. >> You would have been sneezed on with that. big snot. >> Yes, we actually would have been covered. in his his sneeze. Uh all right, so we promised talk of. geomithology. Here's the idea. Since science uh really.

got its act together, there've been a. couple of different ways to look at. things like flood myths as either. um this is a a a story about our. cultural values, and there there's a lot. of religious metaphor involved, or this. was an actual historical event and. geo-mythology came along to kind of say. hey man it can kind of be both like. there could have been a real flood and. it also. took on metaphor and took on cultural.

values and was used as a as a story of I. can't think of the word I'm trying to. think of to teach you a lesson. What's. that called? >> Fable? Yeah, like a fable. Mhm. So this. kind of this field has emerged since. I believe the 60s and actually it was I. was reading about this field of. geo-mythology is like still really. trying to establish itself in the. [snorts] field of geology and most most. geo-mythologists are trained geologists. That's where you start out. Do you play.

D&D? Probably, but they they also are like, you know, they have to really defend. what they're doing against their fellow. geologists because they're they're. basically saying all of these myths, all. of these legends, all of this so these. these folk traditions. they actually contain eyewitness. accounts of natural disasters, of weird. events in Earth, of early finds of. fossils and yeah, they've they've en-.

cloaked them in the language of. mythology and the terminology of. mythology and monsters and weirdness and. all this stuff that makes it just seem. completely. um legendary to us today, but um that's. how these pre-scientific and often. pre-literate. cultures um passed along really valuable. information and like we've been kind of. foolish to just discount them as as all. nothing but legend as if there's no fact. whatsoever in there. And so they're. saying don't throw the baby out with the. bathwater. >> Exactly. And so that's what.

geo-mythology is doing. They're saying, "Wait a minute. Wait a minute. If you. just look at this the right way, we are. covered up in historical accounts just. waiting for us to unravel if we learn. how to to. read these correctly and then also. correlate. with actual like known geological events. that we've discovered through science. Yeah, like hey, you see that story that. uh seems completely crazy about a demon. god who lives in a mountain and gets.

angry and spouts uh uh. fire from its top. Mhm. Like that's a. volcano, bros. And like just because it sounds crazy, does it mean we shouldn't look at the. fact that an actual volcano eruption. might have happened then? And let's kind. of marry these two things and let's just. all get along. Right. And so like that. that that legend about the volcano with. the angry god that sometimes spews like. scary stuff forth and if you ever hear. the mountain starting to to make. rumbles, it means the god is waking up.

and you should run. Like um that's that. is a way for a culture that is aware. that this mountain's actually a volcano. and that volcano can sit dormant for. generations at a stretch. So those there. will be people born in the future who. aren't aware that that's a volcano and. this is the way that the culture passes. down over deep time this really. important information. If the volcano. ever makes a sound, run cuz you don't. want the fiery breath of that god that's. trapped inside. It makes. >> Yeah, I I love this stuff. Like.

before science came along, >> [clears throat]. >> all humans did from the moment they they. could sort of form thoughts was try and. explain what was going on around them. from rain and thunder to volcanoes and. floods and I don't know. I think it's. super interesting. It's almost like. these proto early warning systems. >> Right. Like nuclear They just didn't. really know how to explain the science. of it. Exactly. Like nuclear semiotics. Remember we did an episode on that on. how to tell people 10,000 years in the. future about steering clear of nuclear.

waste, right? It's the same exact. principle. It's just Chuck somewhere. along the way we later generations. became arrogant and just completely. discounted any of that of those. pre-scientific traditions because they. didn't appear scientific, but it is. exactly like what you're saying. It was. the way that they made sense of actual. stuff and so there's plenty of stuff to. learn from those those accounts and. those tales and those myths and legends. We just have to basically kind of.

eat a little bit of crow and go back and. be like, well, we've been ignoring this. to our own detriment. Yeah, and it's. like you said earlier, it's it's it's a. tough uh road to hoe though for. scientists these days if they take this. on because. you know, you have mixed results when. you go back and you look at these tales. Some of them may just be folk tales and. legends. and some may have kernels of truth, some. may have a little more truth. So, there's a lot to sort of parse through. as a geologist these days if you're as.

you're if you're working as or with a. geo mythologist. Right. Um and so. when when you are laying this out and. trying to figure out, okay, what what is. this myth describing? You know, again, you're a trained geologist if you're a. geo mythologist, but you're also working. with um people from other scientific. fields um as far as trying to uncover um. the the the fact, the kernel of truth. behind these flood myths, you would be. working with um paleohydrology.

or paleobathymetry, which is the study. of ancient sea levels, like where they. were at in in the past. And um so you're. going to take like the the findings from. these fields and then say, okay, let me. see if I can correlate it with a myth or. you find a myth and you say, okay, let. me see if I can correlate it with. paleobathymetry or paleohydrology. findings. Um and they've actually turned up some. really interesting stuff so far. Yeah, there was uh in 2016, there was a study.

that tied together one of the Chinese. flood myths from about 4,000 years ago. Basically, that there was a great flood. wiped out China. It lasted for a couple. of decades, and then this great man came. along who had become emperor, Emperor Yu, and tamed the water. >> Mhm. So, geologists went back and they. said, "All right, there's an ancient landslide. around that same time that dammed up a. river, and a lake filled up behind it in. about 6 months or so, and then that.

flooded that river got flooded, broke. through the dam, and there was this huge. flood. And they have found sediment that. sort of tracks along these lines. Then. they found that Emperor Yu actually. it turns out he may not have been, you. know, magically tamed the water. He just. had a knack for early engineering in. that he dredged the waters, and it. cleared up the river's flow. Things. returned to normal, and he became. emperor. But back then, it gets, you. know, told as a tale of this, you know,

great soon-to-be emperor that tames the. waters when he was just good at what he. was doing. Right. But they I mean, they. found like evidence, geological evidence. that backs all of this up, that this. whole series of events, the earthquake. that triggered the landslide, the. landslide, the dam, the lake filling up. in 6 months, the lake breaking and. flooding, that all this happened within. a single year. That is definitely the. kind of thing that your culture is going. to make note of and pass down over the. years that this kind of thing can. happen. And then not only that, this. great person came along and freed us.

from the the burden of these flood. waters that apparently stuck around for. 20 years. That's right. >> It's pretty cool. There's another one. that is just beyond thrilling, if you. ask me, that a lot of people say this is. probably this is possibly, and I think. that's a that's a big reasons a lot of. like mainstream geologists have problems. with geo-mythology. is we we can't really see a course to. getting to the point where we're saying, "This is the one. This is this flood.

that we have evidence of is what gave. rise to the Epic of Gilgamesh and Noah's. story.". But, you can say there's a really good. chance that this this is the one. This. fits the bill. And this one does kind of. stick out like that. That's right. This one uh in the '90s it. became fairly popular. that basically said there was a. oceanographer named William Ryan and. another guy named Walter Pitman. Uh they were I think in the early 2000s. and they said that rising sea levels at. one point caused the Mediterranean to.

burst through uh the Bosphorus Strait. about 7,000 years ago. And this was a. like a legit serious flood that I'm sure. seemed like a flood like a global type. of thing. Uh it created a waterfall a. volume 200 times that of Niagara Falls. and I think enough water in one day. that could have flooded Manhattan by. 3,000 ft. Yeah. That's quite That's a. flood. quite a bit. They also determined. that the um the Mediterranean Sea moved.

inland. The coast moved inland by about. a mile a day. Can you imagine seeing that happen. before your eyes? Like you're just you'd. almost lose your mind. Again, that would. make a a really great story that you. would pass along and and and explain it. in whatever terms you could, but there. would have been coastal settlements. along the Bosphorus uh Strait on either. side on the Mediterranean side and also. on the the Black Sea side that all this. water poured into. And it would have. just completely wiped those settlements.

out. So, the people who did survive. would have been like, "Something really. bad happened here." And this is how. we're going to make sense of it. And the. timing of it was just right. Um it. happened probably about 7,000 years ago. And as we'll see, there's a lot of stuff. that happened around 7,000 7,500 years. ago around the world because the end of. that uh last glacial period started and. the sea levels rose and and all sorts of. crazy stuff happened as a result. But.

that's a that's one that people point to. is like that may be the the flood that. gave rise to the Gilgamesh and Noah. stories. No pun intended. Gave rise? I think so. >> It really was unintended. Yeah. Uh another one about 7,500 years ago was. the creation of the Persian Gulf. Kind of a similar kind of thing during. the last ice age that what is now the. Persian Gulf used to not be. It used to. be a very nice river valley. uh near the Fertile Crescent where.

people lived. And the thing here though. that I don't quite get is that they. haven't. they haven't found any evidence of of. things underwater there, right? No, they haven't. They they they reason. why they think this happened, Chuck, is. because all of a sudden on the shores of. the Gulf as we know it today, some like. really well-established settlements with. decorative pottery and well-built stone. houses and all sorts of other things,

domesticated animals, just sprang up. basically overnight. So they were. relocated essentially. Yeah, that's. really the only explanation. It went. from hunting settlements, hunting camps. to all of a sudden these people are like. an advanced society. So the. the best explanation is that their. original settlement is down there. beneath the Persian Gulf. We just. haven't found it yet. What about. Doggerland? So Doggerland is another. similar story. They both share what's. called aquaterra by the way, which is a. coin or a term that was coined in the.

'90s to describe these lands that were. exposed for 150,000. years that humans were kind of. developing and forming societies and. then were lost just 7,000, 7,500 years. ago when the sea levels rose again. So, Doggerland and the idea of the Gulf. being a an underwater now submerged. settlement, Doggerland's like that but. instead of in the Persian Gulf, it's. been in the North Sea. It was a patch of.

land that connected the British Isles to. Scandinavia before until about 8,500. years ago. Right. And here they have actually found. submerged traces of settlements under. the sea, unlike the one in the Persian Gulf. Right. And they actually think that it's. possible some some people are saying no, it's probably just you know, slow steady. sea level rise that that flooded. Doggerland. But they there was a. massive landslide in I think Norway.

called the Storegga event. that happened 8,500 years ago and and. probably generated a massive tsunami. and it could have been big enough to. have submerged Doggerland permanently. after that. Apparently, that's how big. that underwater landslide was. Yeah. I. was about to say underwater. You got to. point that out. Yeah. But there's a flood story from Brittany. around that area that says that a king's. daughter.

was possessed by a demon and opened like. the their their country's floodgates and. the they were flooded, you know, catastrophically. So, it's like, you. know, are they talking about this event. that happened 8,500 years ago that this. is survived as this legend until today? That's right. And yet another. right here in the. well, in now the USA but in the 1980s. and 90s they investigated flood myths of. the indigenous peoples in the Pacific. Northwest and they found out that their.

flood myths. this was a little more recent. This was. around 1700 AD but the idea is that. there was a like magnitude nine. earthquake that caused a tsunami. unleashing these big waves from. basically sort of. Vancouver Island all the way down to. Northern California. Yeah, it was the. Hoh and the Quileute people who had this. legend of Thunderbird and whale getting. in a fight. And what's what's.

interesting is I mean there's all sorts. of geological evidence. Apparently. there's still trees that are just not. where. they're they're just not growing back. They were wiped clean from the tsunami. But the they there's a Japanese temple a. Buddhist temple that marked the date. January 6th, 1700 because the tsunami. wave made it all the way to Japan and. they noted it. So by basically cross. correlating that Japanese. noting of the date with the Hoh and the. Quileutes um.

story about thunder Thunderbird and. whale they've said this is this story is. about this particular event which is. pretty awesome. And then sometimes it's just uh. a culture like pre-science again making. sense out of finding weird things. Mhm. Uh like the Zuni people in the Southwest. of the United States. uh obviously not back then they they saw. these. you know, ancient marine animals and. seashells in the fossils that they were. finding. and they said, "Well, this is part of.

our. creation story. There there was a great. flood and that's how this stuff got. here." Yeah, here in the desert. Which. is I mean that's how a pre-scientific. culture would make sense of that kind of. thing. Pretty cool. >> Absolutely. So I say we take one more. break and we're going to take talk about. the other aspect of these myths the. mythology part of it, right? Right after. this. >> [music].

[music]. [music]. [music]. >> Okay, so if you take um a myth and you. strip the mythology off and you just. look at the kernel of historicity. and try to figure out, you know, what. event it's actually describing, um you.

don't want to just forget the myth part. You want to go back and also look at the. myth part, too, because that reveals a. lot about humans uh and who we are and. how how we think spread out even across. cultures throughout the world. Um and. there's a lot of. similarities that pop up from um from. examining geo-mythology, uh especially with flood myths, even. when you set aside the idea or I should. say even when you um account for the. idea of missionaries spreading the Noah.

flood, too. So, yeah, you know, one of. the things that's uh interesting to look. at is how these things are how these. myths are similar. Mhm. And one way that. a lot of these flood myths are similar. is that uh and we've already seen a. little bit in what we've talked about is. often times it's a man and a woman, uh. usually a man and a wife, who are. charged with um gathering up the. animals, with repopulating the earth. afterward, uh saving the species, essentially. Um. there's usually a warning um whether.

it's Noah's flood myth or all the others. where uh you know, someone comes along. and says, you know, you better get your. act together, Earth, or tell everybody. on Earth, you know, you were the. messenger, to get their act together or. else I will rain down rain upon you. Right. Yeah. Um there's also sometimes a. um a warning, I guess. One of the. warnings, Chuck, that came through, I. think we said earlier that the Chinese.

have like at least four flood myths. Um. and one of the warnings that that uh. came through was to this brother and. sister who freed a thunder god um from. their father's I guess chicken coop or. whatever. He their father had captured. him. And so the the thunder god said, "Hey, thanks a lot, kids. By the way, the things are about to get serious. around here. You might want to build a. boat." Act- Yeah, I think they they. built a boat. Um but they're one of. those interesting stories where you said.

usually it's a man and wife who end up. having to repopulate the earth. That put. these two kids in the position of having. to repopulate. And um that was a taboo. Incest is a a basically the universal. taboo, one of um and that was the same. in ancient China as well. So, in. different versions of the story, either. the brother and sister basically got a. pass. this time. Another version is that um the brother. had to go through a huge series of. physical challenges and couldn't and.

that somehow the earth became populated. anyway. And the third version is that. they just made everybody out of clay. that they made themselves. All right. Okay. Um but the the if you start really kind. of looking at floods, there's like. especially the purpose of the flood. That's the thing. Like it's very rare. that the flood happens in a flood myth. just for fun. Like there's almost always. a reason. Like humans want there to be a. reason. So, we've come up with different.

reasons over the um over the years. And. one of them is um basically the. apocalypse that that humanity is being. wiped out, usually as as punishment uh. and that it we deserve to survive and we. would have to survive or else we. wouldn't be around to be passing the. story along. So, somebody had to. survive. So, that's where those people. who repopulate the earth come from, but. the rest of us we got wiped out because. we displeased the gods. That's right.

Uh another one is that we started out as. an ocean. and nothing but ocean. So, this is just. a reset to that return to our original. state here on planet Earth. And there. are a lot of cultures around the world. that basically thought that we started. out as an ocean. from ancient Egypt, Norse, I think in. Japan as well. And basically, you know, it's either. returns us to. a state of water or an island above an. ocean. Yeah, and that's I mean, that's.

so closely related to the apocalyptic. one, too. It's just that's. we just happen to be returning to how. things were before, which is also. related to another kind of theme as a. reason for the flood, which is. purification. Like, yes, you're being. punished and yes, you're returning to. this primordial state, but the ultimate. reason that say like God or the gods. have is to purify things, to get to rid. the world of evil and just keep the good. and start over with just the good.

basically. That's another big one, too. And they're all kind of, you know, pretty tightly wound up together. Yeah, then there's just angry gods and. it might not have anything to do with. you. doing anything wrong as a culture or. getting your act together. It's just. that the gods were angry, so they they. kicked open the top of that mountain and. it became a volcano and sorry, TS for. you guys. >> Yeah, just happens. But that's still interesting that people. That's a rationalization even in itself,

though, isn't it? It's just kind of. like, sometimes that happens even if you. didn't do anything wrong. I don't think. so. So, the there's another one, too, that Emperor Yu myth is a good example. of industriousness, people working. together, people controlling things. Where the Earth has done something. crazy, maybe the gods were responsible, but humans managed to overcome it either. in the the the form of like a a savior. like Emperor Yu. There's one in Bhutan.

I believe there's a legend about Guru. Rinpoche. in the Tsangpo Valley. He shows up and. basically drains a lake exposing all. this fertile farmland where a village. was then settled. Or the. and I apologize for this. I genuinely. could not find a pronunciation for it, Chuck. I really tried. But the Goong gani ji Aboriginal people. g u n g g a n y j i. They have one where.

the tsunami keeps coming and coming and. the sea levels are rising and rising. So. the people are organizing get together. and start rolling boulders down into the. sea and it actually prevents the sea. levels from rising any further. So I. think that's probably my favorite one. The industriousness and control ones. It's good stuff. And then people. have gotten a little weird over the. years with trying to explain these away. There was a Hungarian psychoanalyst. named Géza Róheim. in the 1930s that said, "No, the reason.

why we have all these flood myths. is because they're just from people's. dreams and people in ancient times drank. a lot of water and peed a lot at night. and so they dreamt about floods and told. stories about floods. Or maybe it is. the gods urinate on urinating on people. Mhm. Like literally which and there are. myths that literally talk about that. That floods are result of gods peeing on. Earth. But I don't know about expanding that to.

like all the cultural flood myths all. over the world for all time. Right. And. there's others that explain it as like. men's jealousy of not being able to give. birth and that it's a reference to the. bursting of the amniotic sac or. something like that. Um, I feel like. when when psychoanalysis gets involved, especially in this day and age, it's. kind of like that was a. nice try, everybody. Let's just move on to geo mythology. instead, you know? >> so. That's where I'm putting my money,

Chuck. Geo mythology, it's fantastic. stuff. Uh, and also I should say I want to give. a shout out to one of our past episodes, was there a real Atlantis? We were doing. geo mythology without even realizing it. That's right. Uh, if you want to know more about geo. mythology and flood myths, then just. start searching the internet cuz there's. a lot of interesting stuff out there. about it. And since I said that, it's. time for listener mail. This is a shout out to the uh one of the. winners of the Stuff You Should Know 5K.

Uh, this is something that the Stuff You. Should Know Army. puts together uh every year now in a. in a virtual way right now, uh but our buddy Aaron Mizzell is one of. the people who works on this. Mhm. Um, they're looking to do this again next. year cuz here's the deal is they sent me. this stuff afterward. Right. And I was. like, well, we need to get this before. So, I'm going to go ahead and say it. now, and then we'll see if we can remind. people, but people voted to have this. happen in late September, early October.

Uh, so 2022. is when it's hopefully going to happen. Again, uh no official registration, no. entry fee. Uh, there's an event page, I. guess, at the Stuff You Should Know Army. Facebook site. And um. I think people had two weekends to. participate this year, and they had bike. riders this year. So, regarding you. know, regardless of what your status is. an athlete is, they're finding ways for. you to get involved, which is really. cool. Yeah. So, this is from uh Amanda.

though, writing in to say that I'm a. winner, baby. Uh, you guys are the best. Been. listening for years, and I was happy to. participate in the virtual [music] Stuff. You Should Know 5K this year. It was a. cool event that brought some really nice. people uh together at our little corner. of the internet. I'm not a particularly. good or fast runner, but I get out there. and I did the dang thing and that's what. counts. The other participants [music] in the 5K. radiate that spirit and are so. encouraging of each other. Don't ask me. how, but somehow I achieved fastest 5K. for a woman in this event. What a cool.

feeling. So today I listened to Venus flytraps on. the way home. and came across a package addressed to. Stuff You Should Know 5K champ [music]. Amanda Thompson and just about cried and. got a hand-crafted. by Stuff You Should Know Army member. metal rack. for her efforts and it's really great. That's pretty great. She has to buy the. her her own medal though. I don't think so. >> [laughter]. >> That's fantastic, man. Congratulations,

Amanda. [music] That's wonderful news. and congratulations to everybody who. participated and finished or even just. started or even thought about doing it. Maybe you'll do it next year. Who knows? [laughter] That's right. Congratulations. to everyone. >> Yeah. And again, that is a very cool. thing that Stuff You Should Know fans do. and it makes us love you guys even more. You got anything else? No, just be on the lookout next late. summer fall for news on the Army. Facebook page. >> Yeah, somebody please remind us ahead of. time so we can tell everybody else.

And if you want to remind us of. something, we would love to be reminded. because that probably means we forgot. and you can put that reminder in the. form of an email which you can send to. stuffpodcast@iheartradio.com. Stuff You Should Know is a production of. iHeart Radio. >> [music]. >> For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple. Podcasts or wherever you listen to your. favorite [music] shows.