Selects: What's the deal with swing states? | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Hi everybody, it's Chuck and I'm rolling. through the year of co. This is October. 6, 2020 and it's got to be election. season because we're talking about swing. states. Uh, and it's October before the. election in November. Uh, what's the. deal with swing states is the title of. this episode. And I know we did a few. episodes that were uh slightly political. leading up to the election. Uh, and this. is one of them and it was a good one. Um, swing states are weird to me, but um. uh I think we get to the bottom of it. Check it out right now.

Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production [music] of iHeart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh Clark and there's Charles W. Chuck. Bryan over there and Jerry's over there. somewhere, I think, in our office. And. this is stuff you should know. Uh, the. swinging super hip cat edition.

>> Swing states. >> They're the swinging estates of all. >> They like to sleep with each other. >> Uh, based on keys they took out of a. fish ball. >> Uh, should say up front, thank you to. uh, how stuffuffs.com. for this article along with Politico in. PR. >> and I think 538 blog. I got some stuff. from. >> You sound like you're giving an. acceptance speech. >> Yeah. For for best uh election podcast.

episode. >> That's [laughter] right. We are not. going to win. >> Yeah. So, this is on swing states, which. uh are all the rage. Battleground states. these days, >> everybody loves them. >> and have been for a while. But, uh some. of this stuff I thought was even. enlightened me and I thought I kind of. knew most of this stuff. >> Yeah. It's one of those things that I. found um [sighs] that you can make a lot. more difficult than it actually is. At. least just the general concept of swing.

states. But um there's a lot of detail. and info and history to it that makes. the whole thing really interesting. >> So to keep from making the whole thing. uh more difficult than it is, let's just. define swing states at the outset. >> Okay, go ahead. Swing states are states. uh during presidential elections in the. United States here um that are so. closely divided politically that they. could go either way. they could vote uh.

one way or the other and based on a lot. of um you know governmental ins and outs. that we'll go over depending on which. way they they they flip they could make. or break a presidential campaign and. elect the president or deny somebody. else the presidency at the same time. even they can do both. >> That's right. And I'm glad you said that. because more than anything else in this. episode we want to drive or I want to. drive home at least I'm sure you're on. board. >> Okay. Um, a swing state is not just a.

state that is very closely divided. politically among its constituents and. it just could go one way or the other. It is a state where there are people who. there are enough people in that state. who can be persuaded to change who they. vote for. that it can make a state go one way or. the other. >> We're talking down to the thousands or. even hundreds of votes, >> right? And that is why it is so so so so. important that everybody votes.

Everybody votes, but especially if you. live in one of these swing states. because there are, believe it or not, there are people that still haven't made. up their mind in this country, >> which is really surprising in in this. particular election because things have. gotten super partisan and polarized in. America. And they had been going that. way for many many years now. But I mean. it is I don't want to say it's reached. its apex. I hope it's reached its apex. I'm sure it could get way worse. But.

things are real polarized here. So it is. very surprising that there's undecided. voters. And I remember from our election. polling episode, we were saying one of. the reasons that the state polling was. so far off is because there were so many. undecided voters at the end of 2016. That in and of itself is pretty. surprising because the candidates were. so different. Things were so polarized. then. It's even more surprising now that. there's any undecided voters, >> but they're out there. Uh there's not a. ton of them, but there's enough of them. to swing an election and swing a state.

>> Yep. >> Um. Brookings Institution says 75%. uh or more of a presidential candidate. spending occurs in these swing states. >> Mhm. >> And you know, they're they're spending. on ads. A lot of it is ad buys and. social media ad buys. Um you know, robocalling, stuff like that, >> right? But we should go over just, you. know, I know we did one on the electoral. college, but uh just for our friends. across the many ponds, >> we should give kind of a quick overview. of the very odd way that we do things.

here. >> Yeah. Because everybody thinks in the. United States that everybody goes to the. polls and uh during a national election. like the presidential election and. elects the president, that one person. has one vote. And that is definitely. true. Each person does have a vote. But. the thing is we have something called. the electoral college. And rather than. directly elect the president through a. popular vote, we have an indirect way of. electing the president where all those.

people who go to the polls are going to. the polls to cast a ballot whether they. know it or not for the the electors for. each party. So, if you voted for Donald. Trump in 2020, say, what you're voting. for is not necessarily Donald Trump. You're voting for your state's. Republican party electors to go to the. electoral college to cast their vote for. Donald Trump. Hopefully, >> that is the indirect way of electing the. president that we have. And under this.

situation, under this indirect electoral. college setup that we have, you can. actually get elected president without. winning the popular vote. And that's. what happened in 2016. >> It's happened four times. >> Yes. Twice very recently. It happened in. the 2000 election uh where Al Gore, I. think, won uh the popular vote by half a. million votes. happened in 2016 where. Hillary Clinton won the popular vote by. almost three million votes, like 2.9.

million. Then it happened a couple of. times in the I think the 19th century, didn't it? >> Yeah. Four times. Yeah. The other two. were pretty far back. And all four times. um Republican candidates lost the. popular vote and ended up being the uh. winning the election. >> Um and and we'll get into, you know, changes on the horizon as far as that. goes. But to kind of put a pin in the. electoral college, how it specifically. works is um each senator from each. state, which is two senators because. each state has two,

>> uh get a vote and then um for each. representative in the house, uh they get. a vote and everywhere except for Maine. and Nebraska does what's called a winner. take all. So, um, if if everyone in. Georgia or, you know, if Georgia votes. for for, let's say, Joe Biden, then. everybody all the electors would have to. vote for Joe Biden and cast that vote. Uh, in Maine and Nebraska, what they do. is, >> I think they uh, and the goal here, by. the way, is 270 electoral votes if you.

want to win the presidency. But they do. the district system, which is they award. two of those electoral votes to the. statewide popular vote winner and then. they go, I think just uh district by. district, don't they? >> Yeah, they do. And so so um you can win, you know, uh if you win your statewide. election in Maine or in um Nebraska, you. get two electoral votes automatically. and then you get one for each district.

that you won. >> Yes. which is seems a little more fair. >> It does seem a little more fair, but I. saw that um on fairvote.org, they they. said if you do the math, it's actually. way less fair on national level. [laughter] Yeah. Like maybe it works for. Maine and Nebraska, but if all states. did that, you would be able to eke out. an even more imbalance between an. electoral college win and a loss of the. popular vote. I saw somebody put out. that they that there is a path to 270.

electoral votes. So you would win the. presidency while also getting just like. 23% of the popular vote. >> Wow. >> Um the you like to think that that could. never happen, but apparently. mathematically with this setup of the. electoral college, it could happen. And. the the reason why is because one, the. electoral college exists like you said. And then two, because of that winner. take all system to where it doesn't. matter whether you win a state by one.

vote, you get all of the electoral votes. for that one state. And so um in in in. creating swing states, the electoral. college also creates what are called. safe states. And a safe state is where. so many people so reliably vote for the. party that that candidate um uh is. running for. Uh that you can just count on that state. giving like winning their their. electoral votes. And you actually start.

with a base of that that that like um. let's say there's um 170 solid electoral. votes among like 20 states for. Democrats, right? that is what you would. rely on not just on election day but. throughout the campaign. And so you're. not spending much time or money in those. states because those are safe states. You don't need to. It doesn't make any. sense to do that. It makes way more. sense to spend all of your time and. money and attention on those swing. states because those are the ones that.

aren't necessarily safe, but they're. also not necessarily leaning the other. way either. and you could conceivably. put those swing states together to. create that 270 or more electoral votes. which should lead you to the presidency, >> right? But, you know, it's gotten a. little tricky here in recent years. because uh there are a few swing states. that are kind of really solidly swingy. >> Mhm. >> And then there have been a few that were. more swingy or less swingy and you have. to make a decision as a candidate where.

you're going to spend your money and. your time, right? >> And that's where polling comes in. Um, a. lot of people say that perhaps Hillary. Clinton didn't spend enough time in. certain states that ended up flipping to. Donald Trump. >> Um, it's all strategy. Um, I think now. we can uh maybe take a little extended. sidebar here about this whole blue. state, red state thing, which I thought. was very interesting. >> Yeah. >> Because it here in America, we have blue. states and red states. The blue states. are the Democratic leaning states. The.

red states are the Republican leaning. states. Um, if you are sort of in the. mix, maybe a swing state, they might. call you purple in the news. If you hear. that, that's what that means. >> But it didn't always used to be these. colors. Uh, and I got this from NPR. I. found it interesting to know that when. the colors first started being assigned. in the mid 1970s, uh, the, uh, the Democrats were red and. the Republicans were blue. >> Yeah. So supposedly blue was.

traditionally the Republicans um color. because it was the color of the Union. during the Civil War. Um and the Union. was led by Abraham Lincoln who was. Republican. And then also apparently in. Europe the conservative parties are. typically associated with the color. blue. So it made more sense at least at. first to to have Republicans be blue and. Democrats be red. And supposedly that's. where it debuted back in 1976 here in. the United States on NBC because NBC was.

the first network to um have to go full. color. >> Right. >> And so in election night 1976 they said. check out our amazing interactive map. >> Blue states are going to be ones that. Republicans have won. Red states are. going to be ones that Democrats have. won. And um have you did you see a. picture of the map? >> Yeah. It looks like a giant stained glass. window of the United States. It does not. look super flashy or anything now, but. at the time it was like knock your socks. off technologically advanced, I guess.

>> Yeah. But um here's the thing is those. colors weren't locked in like there was. never any, you know, vote about those. colors or anything like that. They just. sort of went that way. >> Um as more and more TV networks went. color, um they went with other colors. and it got a little bit confusing. um. depending on which uh which network you. were watching, you might see different. colors representing different parties. Uh I think always red and blue, but they. were kind of flip-flopped. And it wasn't. until 2000, >> uh and the Washington Post, uh they.

credit Tim Russard, >> um I think the late Tim Russard, he. passed away, didn't he? >> Yeah, unfortunately. Yeah. >> Yeah. They credit Tim Russard with kind. of locking in what we now know as blue. states and red states. blue being for. Democrat, red for Republican. >> during the 2000 election between Gore. and Bush. >> And these colors are important because. it's uh and one of these writers in here. uh what's his name? Bill Bishop. >> Uh he's from Texas. He wrote a book. called The Big Sort. And he kind of.

makes a really good point that it's. become a shortorthhand of not just a. leaning of a state, but sort of a. lifestyle. like you hear things like, you know, it's a really blue. neighborhood or a red community. >> and you kind of know that's shorthand. for a certain thing in this country now. >> Yeah. And part of the problem with with. especially designating entire states as. like red or blue um is that it makes it. seem like there's this homogeneous group. that is that is that that whole state. thinks that way. And that's not.

necessarily true. I mean, there's plenty. of states out there that that are. considered red states, but they were won. by 1 and a half% or 3%. You know, it's. like a very close call, but it went. Republican in the presidential election, so it's a red state. Or like you said, you know, you can you can get it down to. like community level, that kind of. thing. And in doing so, all you're doing. is sewing this division that of. tribalism that exists in the United. States to where it's just so easy to. have this allegiance to blue or red.

They don't even make it donkey or. elephant any longer. It's blue and red. It's one of the most basic things you. can you can sort by, which is colors. Um, and it's a it's a it's a real. problem in that. >> it it somehow. stokes that mentality, that ingroup, outgroup mentality that is so. problematic in the United States right. now and is drowning the the country as. we speak basically. I I hate to say it, but it's absolutely true. >> It really is. And it's especially.

annoying if you have political leanings. like I do and live in a state like. Georgia that is for the past, you know, u 20 plus years been solidly read. And. then, you know, you have, you know, I. used to live in California. I have. plenty of friends in California who. >> say things about, you know, places like. Georgia. >> with such disdain, >> right? >> And just it just bothers me so much. >> Yeah. >> Because it is, you know, these and the. same can be said for people on the other. side of the political spectrum. It's not. exclusive to to me being a liberal in.

Georgia. I'm sure the same frustrations. happen for uh Republicans in. Massachusetts. >> Absolutely. Yeah. No, I'm I'm I'm quite. sure. And the I think it was I don't. know what article that came from. They. they point out that those people are. some of the most diehard partisans. [snorts]. you'll find. You know, people who are. minority in their state. Sure. >> Because they feel like they're really. carrying the flag for their party or. whatever. Um, but yeah, it's it's a real. problem. It all it takes away all nuance. and it also makes people think like,

"Oh, you're you're from a red state. I. can't work with you. My constituents. won't like it if I work with you red. state person rather than you're from. Wisconsin and I'm from California. Let's. figure out how to make this highway bill. make more sense kind of thing, you know. >> Yeah. Emily and I have a lot of. conversations about the lack of nuance. in today's uh world." And it's I think. that's one of the biggest problems we. have going on right now. Nuance has been. lost and everything is carved very much. into red and blue and black and white.

and it's sad. >> And you know what is what another thing. that makes it sad too is it it's not. just like that's just appealing to the. lowest common denominator. It activates. in all people including brilliant. intelligent people who are otherwise. normally level-headed that they still. have that part of their brain stem where. they're like I'm blue, I'm red. Mhm. >> Um I I I I affiliate with that and I. hate the opposite. It's um. >> it is that when you lose nuance, a lot.

of stuff goes out the window with it. >> All right. Well, let's take a break. That was our first soap box of the day. >> I didn't I thought we started out on a. soap box. I thought this whole episode. was going to be on. >> I think pretty even-handed soap boxes, though, right? >> Sure. >> All right. Well, we'll we'll come back. and we'll build another soap box in the. next couple of minutes. We'll be back. right after this. >> [music]. >> Learning stuff is fun with Josh and. some [music].

learning things with Chuck and John. [music]. you should know. Okay. Um, so with we're we're back on. swing states, right? And I think we. should kind of talk about how. >> how they swing or how they have swung or.

swanged. uh recently. Um, because with swing. states like you you kind of get this. idea that they're they're the same all. all the time. That's just not the case, especially not lately. Uh, it seems like. 1992 and 2016 were both watershed years. as far as just completely recoloring the. electoral map. Uh and in 1992, Bill. Clinton did it and in 2016, Donald Trump. did it and it just surprised everybody.

both times. >> Yeah. 92. And if uh you know, if you're. our age or younger, you might not have. been super hip to politics when you were. in high school, let's say, >> or early college. And you may not know. that there was uh what was called a red. wall. uh they didn't call it a red wall. back then, but it was a red wall where. there was um Republicans had a pretty. firm lock on the electoral college uh in. that from 1966 to 1988,

21 states voted Republican every single. election. >> Uh and that included, you might be. surprised to hear, uh California, uh. Illinois, and New Jersey. >> and Virginia. And here's the one that's. gonna really make your heart stop. Vermont. >> Yeah. >> Traditionally Republican voted 21 times. in a row. >> Yeah. >> And that is 191 electoral votes. So, uh, they, the Democrats, had a pretty big. disadvantage going into 1992.

historically, meaning that they had to. win more than 3/4 of the remaining. electoral votes um, for these, you know, quote unquote competitive or up in the. upper grab states. And that's not. counting DC, which Democrats have always. got a lock on. >> Yeah. For the last 14 elections, DC's. always gone Democrat, right? Um so the. the common wisdom was that when George. HW Bush went up for reelection, not only. was he the incumbent president, which. means that you're supposed to be favored.

typically. Um he also had this red wall, which I don't know what they called it, but this lock on the electoral college. And uh it was presumed that he was. probably going to win. And then Bill. Clinton came along and um he flipped. nine states from that red wall. >> Not just the swing states, he flipped. nine of those red wall states um which. was uh 118 electoral votes and ended up. winning 370 to 168 uh for in the.

electoral college votes. >> Somebody bring me a sledgehammer. >> Very [laughter] nice. >> That's basically what he did though. I. mean, it was it was pretty unprecedented. and like you said, just flipped the. political thinking in this country on. its ear. >> and flipped them so hard that. California, Illinois, New Jersey, and. Vermont haven't re haven't voted. Republican since the 1992 election. >> Yeah. Really reshaped the map. >> Yeah. He flipped those Republican lock.

states into Democrat lock states. >> That's right. And now they call it the. blue wall. And they do call it the blue. wall now. >> because blue is firmly enscconced as uh. Democrat. And there are. >> 18 states supposedly among this blue. wall along with uh DC that have voted. Democrat in each of the most recent six. elections from 92 uh to well previously. from 92 to to uh 2012. >> Uh right.

>> And that's when Trump came in and. flipped it on its ear once again. >> Yeah. So he flipped some traditionally. um Democrat strongholds like Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania. Um and he he did. so by first of all energizing voters. that hadn't really been seen at the. polls very much. Um like uh voters. without a higher education diploma. a. lot of rural workers, uh, especially. bluecollar workers who had been lifelong. Democrats, went out and voted for Trump,

um, and ended up taking, I think he. flipped more than just those three. Oh, yeah. Um, he flipped five, Maine and. Minnesota. No, no, no. I'm sorry. He. flipped those three and that's how he. won the electoral college, but he almost. won Maine and he almost won Minnesota, right? And both of them were pretty uh, pretty strong Democratic uh, states. Minnesota hadn't voted for Republican in. like 50 years. Yeah. And he came close. to flipping that. And so here's the.

thing. We're talking about all these. states being flipped because when a. state gets flipped in an election, especially if it's kind of close or. narrowly held rather than flipped, that. state is probably going to be a. battleground or swing state in the next. election. >> Yeah. So, if you're wondering, I mean, we'll list out the swing states and sort. of end that drama right here, but if. you're wondering if you might be in a. swing state, it has to do with quite a. few things. Um, obviously the voting. history there, uh, being predictable.

Um, if, uh, you voted for a long long. time for a specific party, you're. probably not a swing state. um if your. dem uh demographics in in that state are. um traditionally really support the same. candidate, then you're probably not. going to be a swing state. >> Mhm. >> The fact is that most voters in uh most. regions of the country or most regions. of the states in this country, they vote. based on um they have really different.

opinions based on the experience of just. literally the physical place where they. live, >> right? So like uh the rural voters. typically go um GOP or Republican. whereas um people in metropolitan areas, major metropolitan areas frequently go. toward the Democrats and they have. different experiences based on their. geography um and depending on how. balanced that is, how big the metropolis. is, how big the rural area is in a state.

um compared to the whatever metropolis. or capital is there that can make that. state a swing state like North Carolina. is a really good example of that. Yeah, >> there's a lot of um highly educated tech. types, scientific researchers who live. in the research triangle um in North. Carolina, but there's also a ton of. rural voters, too, who are active in. politics, and those two balance each. other out. And so, North Carolina is. very frequently a swing state in. presidential elections because of that.

>> Yeah. And you know, I I want to be. clear, we're not like disparaging people. who don't have college diplomas. Um. there are all kinds of ways to be smart. Uh there are a lot of people with. college diplomas that can't change their. oil on their car uh or, you know, or. build a fence and those those are other. types of smarts and they're all. different ways to be smart. >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm not saying that at all. But I think if you listen to our. election polling episode, uh a divide. between college educated and.

non-oleducated. voters was created in 2016 where it. hadn't been there before. Exactly. And. now that is a major part of American. politics. >> Right. So along with North Carolina this. year and again, you know, this is what. they expect to see. Um it could be. turned on its ear once again and states. could be in the mix that we didn't even. forecast. So, you never know. But right. now, they're saying that North Carolina, uh, Arizona, Florida, always. Florida's. so important. >> Yeah. >> U Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin. Uh,

some people say New Hampshire, some. people say Georgia. >> That's a big one. >> That's a big one. Um, Georgia hasn't. voted for a Democratic presidential. candidate, I think. I mean, has it been. since Clinton? >> Yeah, that's what I would say. >> Since 92. Mhm. >> And uh I think Texas remarkably and. Georgia have both uh drifted left by. four points with each of the last couple. of elections. >> and they're saying that, you know, it. it's going to be very tight in Georgia.

and I don't think anyone is anticipating. that it will flip, >> right? >> But it's purple and in the mix for the. first time in a long time. >> Yeah. which is really saying something. because I mean in Georgia for many years. if you were a Democrat it just did not. matter like you just didn't need to. bother to vote and that's a big problem. with swing states in the electoral. college that we'll talk about. >> and you mean that metaphorically by the. way. >> right exactly but I mean there's this. this whole concept of a wasted vote in a. safe state for the opposition party.

their votes wasted um but we'll talk. about that later but um just like. there's some some surprising states that. are now considered swing states or. battleground states in 2020. There's. also some that have customarily been. swing states that aren't necessarily. And the big standout one for that is. Ohio. Ohio has voted for the president. um correctly or I should say they went. [laughter]. they the the nominee or the candidate.

that that Ohio voted for has been the. president the one who won the. presidential race race in like. >> dozens of of of elections maybe not. dozens but they've been voting correctly. for the president correctly picking the. president I feel like I'm digging So. deeper into a hole here. Anyway, what. that says about Ohio is that wow, Ohio. is like really a thinking group. politically speaking because we have had.

Republican presidents and we have had. Democrat presidents through throughout. the last few decades. And Ohio has, you. know, voted uh differently, you know, just about every time. And that says. that Ohio is a long-standing swing. state. Well, Ohio was flipped in 2016. And there's a lot of political observers. who are like Ohio is now leans. conservative. It's now a red state and. that's a really surprising turn of. events for 2020. >> Yeah, I think Colorado, Ohio, and. Virginia are three of the traditional.

swing states that have been taken off. that list. >> Uh Arizona, and Georgia. I don't think. Texas is officially on the list at all, but I think because Texas has always. been so solidly conservative, for it to. eek towards the Democrats at all just. makes a lot of hay. >> Yeah. >> So, there's a lot more talk about it on. the news and stuff like that, >> right? >> Because there's so much media influence. and I think that. >> uh the liberal media probably thinks. that like, oh, Texas is leaning. Maybe. we can help push them over the edge if.

we talk about it all the time. >> Yeah, probably. >> Um because that's how things work. If. you listen to the polling podcast, uh, and like you mentioned earlier, Minnesota, um, hasn't voted for a. Republican in in about 50 years, and. >> it's crazy. >> They are, you know, they have inched a. little bit, right? >> Yeah. I think Trump just missed. Minnesota and Clinton just barely won. Minnesota by like 3%. And Maine by one. and a half%. So, those two are. definitely in play like they haven't. been in a while.

>> Should we take another break? Let's take. another break and then we're going to. come back and talk about get this swing. states [music]. with Josh and. some [music] sharing. [music]. things with chic. [music].

you should know. [singing and music]. >> So, Chuck, one of the things that we. talked about early on is that um swing. states basically tell campaigns where. they need to concentrate their focus, their money, their candidates time, uh. you know, election stops, that kind of. thing, stumping. Um, and they do that. like that's that's where the vast. majority of the money goes is it's the.

advertising campaigns in these swing. states. Florida is a really good example. of a longstanding swing state that gets. tons and tons of advertising money. Yeah, Florida is such an interesting. state to me because it is it's really. hard to pin down politically. >> and I think it's because I think more so. than almost any other state. except maybe California. >> I feel like there are more versions of. Florida than almost any other state has.

versions of itself. >> Absolutely. >> And it's not I mean Florida's not small. It's not the size of California, but you. know, you think about the Gulf Coast and. then inland from the Gulf Coast. Very. different people. >> Yeah. The people inland wouldn't be. caught dead in Florida. >> Yeah. Uh you think about Miami Beach and. that area and and Key West and Fort. Lauderdale. And then you've got the. interior of like the Tampa Clearwater.

area, which is really different. And. then. >> let's not forget about the most magical. place on earth, Orlando. >> Well, you've got Orlando. And then. you've also got up in the north, you. know, borderline Georgia, you have. places like Jacksonville and St. Augustine and just Florida is has so. many different kinds of places within. its own state. It it doesn't surprise me. that it's really hard to pin down. politically because it's hard to pin. down just sort of culturally, I think. >> Right. And because you have so many. different places that geographically. inform the voters um that are so.

demographically diverse all in one. state, then that of course is going to. be a swing state. And Florida probably. always will be a swing state just for. those reasons. >> Yeah, the retirees are a big um they. always point to retirees in Florida, >> traditional conservatives, but uh. apparently the youngest three. generations uh amount to 54% of. registered voters there now. So. >> that's surprising. >> Yeah. I mean the I guess the the sad way. to say it is is that many of these.

people are dying. >> Yeah. I mean that surely I mean there an. elderly population is going to. eventually die off. Then you got a. younger population going to age into it. But it seems like right now there the. elderly population in Florida has been. losing ground numbers wise while the. younger populations have been gaining. ground. >> That's right. They're coming after. good. for a state because you need all those. young people to work to take care of all. those old people. >> So, um Florida gets a tremendous amount.

of attention, a lot of money, a lot of. um campaign visits, all that stuff. And. because it's a swing state, all swing. states get that kind of stuff um in in. presidential elections. But people in. other states, especially in solid states. that have gone one way for many, many. election cycles, th those people say, "Well, hey, what about us? We want. attention. We want these campaign stops. We have things that are important to us. that we want to talk to you about and. hear from you about. We don't care about.

Florida. We care about uh Idaho. So, come to Idaho and talk to us in Idaho.". And the candidate usually says like, "I. don't even know where Idaho is. Please. leave me alone. I'm trying to pay. attention to Florida and you're being. very distracting right now. >> Yeah. And here's the thing. Like in my. mind, I say who cares if a presidential. candidate comes and talks to people at a. dumb rally? Like. >> Yeah. Really? >> Like does that really matter? But what. they do is, you know, it's not just a. broad sort of let me make a stop there.

It's very pinpointed and calculated like. >> they might be going after a really. specific constituency there like uh. because how close some of these swing. states are uh and they might say you. know what if we can get. uh auto workers to vote for you'll be. set. Or if we can get people that work. on on public roads and infrastructure. flipped our way, then we can win by a.

thousand votes. And so they may make pit. stops in these states to go to the. factory. I mean, that's why they do that. stuff. It's not just to uh you know, I. mean, it's it's all just very calculated. and very specific, >> right? Because the viewer on TV is like, "Hey, I work in a factory and they're in. a factory right now. They must mean that. they really identify with my needs and. wants." Well, true. And that's someone. from another state that also just. happens to work in a factory. But the. people in that state. >> feel like, "Wow, they're here to talk to. the coal miners,

>> right? I can't believe they came to. Michigan." No one ever comes to Michigan. on purpose. [laughter]. >> Hey, we went to Michigan on purpose. >> once. Are we We haven't ragged on Detroit in a. long time. >> No, it's been a while. But that's really. what we're talking about. Michigan is. code for Detroit when you're talking. about not going to Michigan. But it's. just interesting how pinpointed and how. um just like razor sharp and focused and. laser focused campaigns are these days. with talking to very specific groups of. people if they think they can win a.

thousand votes out of a state that that. could make a difference. It can because. again, here's the here's why. A thou lit. literally a thousand votes could make. the president um in in a state because. of that winner take all electoral votes. Whereas if like those states use the. district system like Maine and Nebraska. um you know if you won 51% to 49% you. might get half of the delegates and they. get the other half basically. But the.

fact that it's winner or take all is. that yeah those extra thousand votes. really count in a goodsized state for 10. electoral votes, 20 electoral votes. So. it's definitely worth spending that much. time and focus on one single state. And. a lot of other states resent a lot of. nonsw states resent swing states because. they say basically it's up to Ohio and. Virginia to decide who gets to be. president. the rest of us are going to. go vote as we're expected to because if. you're in a safe state, it doesn't.

matter if you win by a thousand votes or. win by a million votes. You're going to. it's winner take all again too. So, you're not going to pay that much. attention and really you're not in a way. you're not producing the president. That's a little cynical in my opinion. because without that solid safe state, you wouldn't have that foundation that. the president uh the candidate is. building these swing state um electoral. votes off of. Yeah, >> I don't think that's fully accurate, but. there does seem to be like some sour. grapes among safe state people. That.

makes sense to me most of all, Chuck, when you're talking about people who. feel like their vote is wasted because. they're voting for the the party that's. the opposite of how the state. traditionally goes. So if you're a. Georgia voter and you're a Democrat for. the last several elections, you could. very easily feel like your vote was so. wasted, you might not even bother going. to the polls because your vote in the. sense of electoral college, this is a. really good reason to do away with the.

electoral college. As far as the. electoral college is concerned, your. vote didn't count. you you had no reason. to go vote as far as electing the. president goes because it was washed. away and drowned out by all the other. votes that went toward the other. candidate since it's a winner take all. system of of electoral votes that that. your vote didn't matter because they. were always going to win all those. delegates because you were going to get. outvoted. >> Right. But um and and I'm glad you said.

uh president specifically. You should. always vote for the president, of. course, but um there are so many ballot. measures and local um uh local. considerations on the ballot, local. elections that really have such an. impact that you always always always. vote. >> Um but it's almost like. >> it's almost like filling out your census. form in a way. >> It's the only information that we have. of where a state is politically is you. casting your vote. >> Yeah. So, if you cast your vote in. Georgia like I do and uh Donald Trump.

wins Georgia again, it's not a wasted. vote because uh the Democratic party. will look up the numbers and say, "Wow, you know, like they're doing now. Look. how many, you know, Stacy Abrams almost. got elected. The first African-American. female governor in the United States, almost won in Georgia in an election. that uh many people thought was. undermined by the Republican candidate. with voter suppression. And that was a. big deal. So now that's why so much. attention is on Georgia because it's. like you're filling out your little. census thing. You're casting that vote.

and they're saying, "Okay, well. Georgia's in the mix now. We're going to. we're going to campaign in Georgia. more.". >> Plus also, there's another really good. reason to vote in those situations as. well. Um like I'm sure other voters in. Vermont who felt like they were probably. wasting their vote in 1992, but they. went dutifully to the polls and. exercised their real basic important. right as a citizen, their right to vote. Um, and Bill Clinton ended up flipping. the state. Had those people been like, "It's just a waste of vote anyway," and. stayed home, that state wouldn't have.

been flipped. >> And the same goes for Wisconsin or. Michigan for Trump in 2016. Um, so. there's a a lot of good reasons to go. out and vote. uh even if you feel like. your vote is wasted, that's just it's. just too cynical, you know, and I understand especially in. the in the during the coronairus. pandemic, you know, things are. definitely different. But under normal. circumstances, especially the idea of. just staying home and not voting, unless. you're protesting against your party's.

candidate, that's different. But the. idea. >> right in a candidate, >> okay, sure. I mean, just the idea of. getting out to the polls on election day. and participating in government on that. one day every four years even it's. important. It's it's just important in. ways that you can't fully put your. finger on, but you just know it's. important and important enough to just. do it. >> Well, it's a right that people in this. country literally lost their lives to. ensure and it's a right that not. everyone in this country had until.

fairly recently. Yeah. >> Uh, and so it would be a very sort of. privileged I know that word is thrown. around a lot, but it's a it's a truly. privileged frame of mind to think why. bother voting when so many people in. this country, women and people of color, didn't even have the right to vote in. in, you know, within the last like. hundred years, >> right? >> So, it just that's something that. >> that's the only thing that really burns. me up. Vote for whoever you want to vote. for, but if you sit at home and you. don't even vote, then.

just get out. And you know what, Chuck? Yeah. Vote or. die is P Dy [laughter] says. >> Was that P DY? >> Yeah. So, one other thing that really. has grabbed me in the last like several. years is the the idea, you know, when I. was a younger lad, I was like, voting. doesn't even matter. It doesn't count. Everything's controlled by the. Illuminati anyway. >> Yeah. You're anarchist, [laughter]. >> right? So, um the idea that that the. Russians are meddling in our election. and that the the um the the candidates.

take um the the election so seriously. and super PACEs raise so much money to. spend to try to sway people's public. opinions. The idea that that actually. happens in real life to me goes to. support the idea that your votes. actually do count, that voting really. does matter in the United States still. and things are not so thrown off course. and controlled and under the thumb of. people who who um you know are really. pulling the strings and calling the. shots that that actually doesn't exist. That in reality voting matters. And I.

think that the the the threats to voting. that we've seen over the last like. several years um have really kind of. driven that home for me. >> Yeah. And you know what you by the time. this comes out there'll be a couple of. months to go before the election um or. actually maybe one month to go. Check. your voter registration. Make sure you. know where you're going to vote. If. you're voting early, make sure you. understand that. If you're voting uh. absentee or by mail, make sure you fully. understand how that all works. Don't be.

surprised on election day. You don't. want any surprises. You want to make. sure you know exactly how you're going. to vote and that you can ensure that you. can vote. >> Absolutely. Um go to uh usa.gov. to check out voter registration. um and to make sure that you are like to. confirm that you're registered to vote. >> I still check. >> Yeah, I checked uh recently too and then. I tweeted it out on the Stuff You Should. Know podcast um Twitter platform, too. Totally. Um, and we should put a bow on.

this one by talking a little bit about. the National Popular Vote Interstate. Compact. >> You read my mind. >> And this uh the NPVIC, this is uh a. group of states that advocate for a. different plan moving forward. Uh these. are states and people that say, "How can. a candidate win by 3 million votes or. 500,000 votes and not be president? Because that is clearly not the will of. the people. We have a broken system. Let's get rid of this electoral college.

And right now there are Washington, Oregon, California, Colorado, New. Mexico, Vermont, New York, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode. Island, New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland, DC, and Hawaii are all signed up uh in a. past legislation to enter this compact. uh with several more pending. Ohio, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and. Virginia are pending. >> Right. And so what this compact says is. the state signs onto the compact that. says um under normal electoral college.

rules, we um give our electoral votes to. whoever wins the statewide ballot. Instead, we're going to give it to. whoever wins the national vote, the. national popular vote. So even if say um. Joe Biden loses Idaho, if Idaho was. signed on to this and this thing were in. effect, but he won the national popular. vote, Idaho would give its electoral. votes to Biden so that the states are. going to follow the popular vote and. basically go around the electoral.

college by using by using the electoral. college. Yeah, because you can't abolish. it. It would take a constitutional. amendment and ratification by 38 states, I believe, to get rid of the electoral. college. This requires none of that. It's the state signing on to go around. the electoral college by using the. electoral college. And I mean, we should. say too, the electoral college is part. of the framer's vision for the. constitution, but they specifically. added this provision to keep the popular. vote from selecting the president. They.

wanted to keep this elite group of. politicos in charge of who actually. picked the president. And that's they. created the electoral college to get in. the way of the popular vote. Yeah, it's. interesting. >> It really is. So, that's swing states, eh? >> That's swing states. If you want to know. more about swing states, start reading. up on swing states. Start reading up on. politics. It's pretty interesting stuff. And like we said earlier, go vote. Just. vote. Uh, and since I said that,

everybody, it's time for listener mail. Uh, this is from McKenna Bridge, and. this is in defense of baby carrots. Uh, just like Chuck, the thought of baby. carrots disgusted me in the past, conjuring up uh conjuring up images of. towering piles of food waste that I. imagined were the byproduct of these. smooth little suckers. But we got it all. wrong, my friend. While the baby carrot. is, of course, a very manicured and. aesthetically pleasing version of the. real carrot pulled straight from the. soil, their invention basically changed. the entire carrot industry forever. Uh,

and there was a guy named uh, Mike. Yurrosk. >> who decided to smooth carrots down uh, in the 1980s into these little. aerodynamic bite-sized cylinders and. they were called baby carrots. Uh, he. figured carrots were ugly and uh, too. plentiful to profit from as farmers. So, they had a long growing season and the. people just weren't buying them. So Mike. uh usuric I'm sorry Yurrosk introduces.

the baby carrot and boom carrot sales. absolutely skyrocketed [music]. and even today's ba uh baby carrots. frequently top the list for the largest. share of supermarket sales. >> Wow. >> Uh asking about the peels guys. Well. they are just about the perfect. byproduct for making carrot juice. Uh. baby carrots are tasty, convenient, and. turns out a wonderful invention. The. more you know, right? Anyway, I'm not. completely caught up on your podcast, so. maybe someone is beating me to the. punch, but I didn't want to chance y'all. making fools of yourself the next time.

baby uh Baby Carrots comes up. I think. you guys are great. [clears throat] Keep. up the amazing work. You're a loyal. listener. And Baby Carrot Convert, uh. McKenna Bridge, and I even looked it up, too. And I think I saw that it was a a. myth that they are bleached. >> But it sounds like something I would buy. into. >> It sounds like something I'd buy into, too. >> Yeah. big carrot or I'm sorry, small. carrot. >> Yeah, carrots are bleached. The. Illuminati really runs things. >> So, you know that I haven't fully vetted. all that, but that's what McKenna. [music] Bridge says is that they really.

turned around carrots as a whole and. that they do use those uh shavings. >> That's really. >> for carrot juice is what she says. >> Well, McKenna, that was really great. stuff. Thank you for trying to keep us. from making fools of ourselves again. >> It's not going to work. >> No, [clears throat] it won't stick. Uh, if you want to get in touch with us like. McKenna did, you can send us an email to. stuffodcast@ iheartradio.com. Stuff you should know is a production of.

iHeart Radio. For more podcasts, [music]. iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. listen to your favorite shows.