Selects: The First Road Trip | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Hey guys, it's me Josh and for this. week's select I've chosen our episode on. the very first road trip across America. from back in 2023. That episode was from. 2023. The first road trip took place way. before that. Uh and it's one of those. wonderful stories where nothing goes. horribly wrong. The people don't turn. out to be horrible people. It's just a. great story about a couple of guys and a. dog taking a road trip across America at. a time when it was highly unlikely that.

they were going to make it all the way. I'm glad to present you with this one. Enjoy. >> Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeartRadio. >> Hey and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh. and there's Chuck [music] and it's just. the two of us, but we're going to make. it just fine. We're going to make it if. we try, as I like to say sometimes when.

it's just the two [music] of us. And. this is Stuff You Should Know. >> I'm excited about this episode because. this is a really, really. great story that. doesn't have like. I was I kept waiting for something. either bad to happen or someone to be. exposed as awful. Uh and it's just a really fun, feel-good. story. Right? >> go so far as to call it a humdinger. >> It's a humdinger and uh we got to give. huge credit to to uh Ed who helped us.

with this and also. uh. because he helped Ed who helped us, Ken. Burns. >> Yeah. >> Uh Ken Burns has a great documentary. about this topic uh which is the first. cross-country automobile road trip. It's. called Horatio's Drive. >> Mhm. >> Uh it's a wonderful story and you can. find it on PBS. Hopefully if you're a a. streamer you. pay for and subscribe to the PBS app cuz. it's a very worthwhile and great uh. channel to subscribe to. >> Mhm. >> Uh narrated by the great Keith David.

One of the great great voices. >> Just amazing. And such a great actor, too. And everything from They Live to. Men at Work to um There's Something. About Mary. Yeah, he was in Platoon, too. He's like just such a great actor. >> Love that guy. And uh. because our protagonist in this story. uh who we'll introduce you to in a. second is such an affable. seemingly really good guy, they got none. other than Tom Hanks to recreate his. voice for his uh diary letters and stuff.

like that. >> We should also give a hat tip to Dayton. Duncan who's uh interviewed extensively. in that um. that documentary because he wrote a book. on on the drive, I believe. >> I would argue the book. >> Yeah, let's just call it that. The book. On Horatio Nelson Jackson, right? >> Yeah, that's his name. >> Great name. So, we're going to talk a. lot more about him later, but we really. kind of want to like lay the groundwork. bring the context as Flavor Flav would.

put it. >> [clears throat]. >> And just uh kind of give you an idea of. what the the times were like when. Horatio Nelson Jackson decided to become. the first person to travel cross-country. in a car. >> Right. So, 1903, 911 was a joke. You like that one? >> It's okay. >> All right. Just a medium okay on that one. I'll. take [laughter] it. Uh 1903 is when this. happened, but to put this in context.

like you said, uh the the first transcontinental. railroad was built and completed uh or. not built, but completed in 1869. >> Mhm. >> And it was 1876 when you got your first. cross-country train trip that happened. >> Mhm. >> So, this was. uh what? Like 25-ish years roughly after. that, uh and people were still kind of only. traveling. by train because cars were. pretty new, and they were only for.

richies because I believe. uh in the documentary, they said like. the cheapest car you could get would. cost more than the average American made. in a year. >> Mhm. >> So, in the early 1900s, it was rich people who wanted to buy a. super expensive unique toy. >> Mhm. >> that and we'll hammer this home a lot, but that they didn't even know was going. to end up being a real thing. >> Yeah, it could have turned out like the. Segway. >> Totally right.

>> I mean, this is kind of akin to somebody. taking a a. a trek across America on a Segway back. in like 1995. >> Yeah, they they did not know car like a. lot of people thought these cars will. never amount to anything. You're silly, it'll always be trains and horses. >> Right. So, to kind of get across why people thought. it was just going to be nothing but. trains and horses, like that's how the. American infrastructure was built. Like. if you went any any kind of lengthy.

distance, you took a train. If you were moving around locally, you. took a horse, maybe a horse and a buggy. or a horse and carriage or something. like that. >> Stagecoach. >> Drive a home, sure, if you wanted to be. super wild west about it. >> Yeah. >> But there were at the time, say around. 1900, the United States had 2.3 million. miles of roads. >> Sounds like a lot. Pretty impressive. >> 150. miles. were paved. >> Right. >> And all of those were within big cities,

right? So, the the vast vast vast majority of roads. in the United States were rough, rutted, um dusty or muddy or somehow both at the. same time, uh roads that you would not want to walk. over really, let alone ride a car over. >> Yeah, they were in bad shape generally. Uh about 14 million horses in the United. States to about 8,000 cars. And like you said, people traveled. locally. I think the average was like.

people generally didn't go more than 12. miles from their house. And that even. feels like the high end. I don't think. that's an average. I think people. probably didn't go within a a few miles. of their house. >> Yeah. >> Like me and my family unless I'm. traveling. >> At the time, there were and you still. take trains for long-distance travel. sometimes. >> I try to. >> Um at the time also like. you you didn't really steer away from. home because it took you so long to go.

anywhere on horse, right? I think at the. time it was still a two-day journey. basically from New York to Philadelphia. >> By horse? >> Mhm. So this is like a this is a this is. a big deal for for somebody to be like, "No, I'm going to try this." The other. thing was the the roads themselves. weren't mapped. >> Yeah. >> east of the Mississippi there were maps. and guidebooks that you could get pretty. good directions from, right? And it's. it's funny in the um documentary, they. kind of show. >> I love that part.

>> directions were like and one of them was. like, "Turn right at the old stone. horse trough.". >> Yeah. >> Like those were the kind of directions. and because that's what a local would. tell you to do. So somebody had the. bright idea to print those and put them. down in a in book form and transmit that. information that way and it still held. up because there were no road names, there were no route numbers, there was. nothing like that because there was no. reason for anything like that to exist. >> Yeah, and funny enough, that's how I. prefer directions now because.

I'm very directionally challenged and um. famously so. And I also never know the. names of roads. So I I always ask people. like tell me, you know, go to that diner. that you know and take a left and then. go to that car wash and veer right and. that's how I prefer to get directions. >> I. I tend to zone out when people give me. directions that I've asked for. and you can just kind of see it on their. faces. They can [laughter] tell I'm. going to get lost cuz it's just not.

sinking in. >> Well, all all the fun of that is gone. now cuz you just punch it into your app. or whatever, but I'm basically talking. about pre. GPS stuff. >> I remember. I remember. I'm old enough. to remember that. I am also smart enough. to really appreciate ways though, too, you know. >> Do you remember the fun of a road trip. of opening that Rand McNally Atlas. >> Mhm. >> and saying like I think we can go this. way to get to this town or it looks like. this other road we can go around. That. was like and I'm not like oh, things.

were so much better when it was harder, but it was a really had a fun sort of. magical. adventure-some quality to it, I think. >> Yeah, I. spent 5 weeks in van driving around the. western United States doing that. Same. thing. It was very cool and like the. amount of freedom is really hard to get. across of like. >> Yeah. >> not having anywhere you had to be at any. particular time and saying like oh, that. that landmark sounds pretty cool. I'm. going to go see that. It's pretty neat.

>> You know what words you don't hear. anymore? is let's go here instead. >> It's true. >> Everything seems so locked down, you. know. It's like. I don't know. People don't say oh, no, let's just uh. let's decide to go to this town instead. of this town. >> I feel like we've entered the. disgruntled aged old men era of stuff. you should know because [laughter] I it. seems like we do this almost every. episode, dude. >> Yeah, maybe. >> to have to pay more attention to that or. else we're going to lose all the. youngsters and just attract all the. oldsters and who cares?

>> Well, hey youngster, I encourage you to. set out on a road trip with a map and. and enjoy it. >> Okay, there you go. Where did you save it? >> No, I don't think I saved anything. >> So, uh I think we've gotten across that. it would be really hard to drive a car, right? >> Yeah. >> Across the United States at the time. >> Yeah, hard to drive a car, but because. cars were becoming a little more. popular, uh they were trying to get a more. positive publicity going for their cars. and their companies. And so, they said, "Hey, what a great.

way to do this then like kind of sponsor. a cross-country car trip uh trip that'll. get a lot of press.". >> Mhm. >> And so, they tried this with uh John and. Louise Davis. uh from the How do you pronounce that? car. >> Um Duryea? It sounds like something you. contract that you'd be really unhappy. about. >> Okay, the Duryea I I couldn't quite. tell, but yeah, it does sound like a. disease of some sort. >> D U R Y E A. >> Yeah, the Duryea car company gave them. um a national or I'm sorry, they weren't.

a car company. That was the car. The. company was the National Motor Carriage. Company. >> Yeah, known today as the NMCC. >> Oh, really? >> I'm just kidding now. >> No, I thought you were going to say as. >> Porsche. No, I would I would like to think that, but no, I don't think so. >> No, I don't think so, either. Um so, they sponsored this couple. It was in. 1899. It did not work out. Uh they very. famously got beaten to uh they started. from New York and they got beaten to. Syracuse by a one-armed bicyclist who.

gave them a 10-day head start. So, press. it went opposite of how they wanted to. That was sort of they lost track uh or. lost interest very early on in this sort. of doomed thing, and I don't think they. even know if they succeeded in getting. to San Francisco. Well, I think they. know they didn't, but they basically. didn't really cover the story after. that. >> No, they dropped off the map um. after about Chicago. >> They dropped off the GPS. app.

Sorry. >> So, no, it's it's good. It just took me. a second to to for it to sink in. I. thought that was pretty good. >> I'm trying to get our younger listeners. back. >> So, um well, we should make a Tik Tok of. all this then. Isn't that what people. do? >> Sure. >> For now until the US government ban. >> [laughter]. >> That was wonderful. You just saved me. >> Thank you. >> Um so, the it was established though. even though the Davises didn't make it. that like this is actually a really good. way to to to promote a car brand is to. be the first to make it across the.

country. I mean, then everyone will know. that's a good car because it's just so. ridiculous to even think a car could do. that. So, a couple years after the. Davises, I guess 1901, a car maker named. Alexander Winton. um who had a Winton Car Company, handmade cars, beautiful cars. >> Yeah. >> Um he uh he tried it himself, I believe. with his publicist. >> Very smartly. >> [laughter]. >> He and his publicist hit the road. Um. the acid.

>> hit them around Barstow, I think. The bats showed up. >> [laughter]. >> And they ended up getting trapped in a. dune in Nevada. >> Yeah, but you you bring up a a thing. that might be overlooked is they very. smartly started from west to east. >> Mhm. >> because as we mentioned, the west was. untamed land and bad bad bad roads if. there were any at all. So, getting that. hard part over first when the car was. brand spanking new. was really really smart, but what they. didn't count on. was uh. and we'll see what Jackson learned was.

driving through the desert in an old car. like that is not good. Uh sand is not. good for. um getting stuck. It's not or it's great. for getting stuck. >> Sure. >> Uh not good for making good time. Sand. is not good for getting in carburetors. and in oil and gas and you know, it. these engines weren't these big closed. systems like they are today. So, sand no. good. >> But, Winton got this press, right? Like. like it he it helped I think still. publicize this car company regardless.

And again, the fact that no one had done. this, but people were starting to try. it, it kept being a thing. It was going. to be a thing until somebody did it. And. so a couple years after Winton tried, a. guy named Horatio Nelson Jackson, who's. the star of our story, um was hanging out at the University. Club of San Francisco. And apparently a. couple of uh fellow club members were. saying that cars were basically useless. and that they would never really go. anywhere and there's no reason for. anybody to have one. Jackson, by this.

time, had really developed a real love. of cars, had started collecting them. even. >> Yeah. >> And I guess to defend cars' honor, he. slapped down a $50 wager that he could. make it across the United States from. San Francisco to New York in less than. 90 days. 90 days or less, I'm sorry. And. um that was about $1,500 that he threw. down on the table right then. And the. people took it. They accepted his wager. And 4 days later, he set out for New.

York from San Francisco. >> It is madness to think about. that he did this. With that little planning, he didn't. have a car to do it. I mean, he had. cars, but not one to go across country. at the time. >> Mhm. >> Uh. just quickly about Jackson, he was a. doctor who. uh got tuberculosis and quit his. practice. uh kind of at the same time that he. married a very wealthy. uh woman named Bertha Richardson Wells, very new wealthy New England family from.

uh Vermont. >> She uh her family made their money in. celery compounds. >> I tell it was like a a tonic. >> Yeah. >> Basically. So, he as Ed put uh did rich guy things, capital R, capital G. And uh. his wife was super supportive. Like. everyone was on board. She was like, "That's awesome. I'll I'll take a train. to Burlington. I'll meet you over there, honey. You have my blessing. Uh and it. seems like they had a really like. judging from the letters that that of. course it was voiced by Tom Hanks, too,

so you're endeared immediately. But uh judging from the letters, it. seems like they were just a great. couple, a very loving family. Um. he called her Swipes, so no one knows. why that nickname was there, but he. you know, he signed it as Nelson and the. your yours forever, Nelson and my. dearest Swipes. And it was really really. sort of a beautiful story of this. couple. And uh. he knew he had to get a guide to go with. him. And so he picked a great traveling. partner. Uh he was a small engine mechanic in a.

factory named Sewell Crocker who was. about 10 years younger. He was 22 years. old, I think. Um what was Horatio? He. was like 31 or 32? Okay. So this guy could fix cars, he knew. cars, and apparently like they really. liked each other and were which was a. big deal, you know, you've been on road. trips in regular cars. >> Yeah. >> And that's a key factor, but especially. back then with all the troubles they. were going to have, you had to have. someone that you could get along with. >> That's a big one, for sure. So he asked.

Crocker, "Hey, man, what car should we. get for this?" And Crocker said, "Well, you have basically limitless funds. Get. the best. Buy yourself a 1903 Winton touring car.". And let me point something out that I. think is very astute. The reason why. probably Sewell Crocker said get a. Winton was because Winton had already. shown that they were making really good. cars and us so that they were willing to. try to make it across country in one of. them. So uh that's exactly what um Jackson. did, Horatio did. He's the kind of guy.

you call him by his first name cuz he's. got a great first name and he's Tom. Hanks-like affable, right? >> Yeah. >> So um so Horatio bought himself a a. Winton touring car, 1903. Apparently he. paid essentially $100,000 for it. >> And it was used. >> Yeah, it was used. But it was the only. one available. So he just paid whatever. the person wanted for it. And so. in 1903 dollars he paid $3,000. But he.

named it the Vermont because that's. where he and his wife Bertha lived. But. a little bit about this car. there was it was an it was open in every. sense of the word. It was like if you. took a tub. and put wheels on it. and then had a steering wheel sticking. out of it. That that was the car. There. was no windshield, there was no roof, there was no back windshield, there were. no doors, there was no nothing. >> It looked kind of like a. a giant riding lawnmower with like wagon.

wheels. >> Well, it's funny that you bring up. riding lawnmowers Chuck because. the two-cylinder chain-drive engine had. 20 horsepower. And my friend a John Deere X300 series. riding mower has 22 horsepower. >> That's funny. That's really funny. This this thing. topped out at 30 miles per hour. I don't. think the John Deere does that, but. that's probably just cuz it's cutting. grass at the same time. >> But imagine. imagine traveling the country on riding.

lawnmower basically. That's about what. they were doing. But yes, you're right. 30 miles an hour is is substantially. more. That's what it it could do max. In. no way did they average 30 miles an. hour. >> Not even close. It was. someone it was it was red. A really good. looking car. You'll only see black and. whites, but someone on Reddit that's the. picture I sent you. Did a very fun. colorized picture. of Horatio and Crocker and a a third.

party to be named later. and colorized it and it just it looks. awesome. And this car is so cool. looking. >> Yeah, I don't mean to detract from it. It was a cool looking car. But. as far as comfort goes, it was not at. all comfortable. >> No. >> I say we take a break and then set out. on the road trip with these guys, huh? >> Oh, let's do it. [music]. >> [singing].

[singing and music]. [music]. [music]. >> All right. So, as we will see, there. were other car manufacturers planning to. do the same thing at the time. And a couple of them ended up, you know, it ended up sort of being a race against. like a corporation versus.

human. Even though he was driving, you. know, it's not like a car he built. himself. It was a Winton. >> Right. >> But he was doing it himself with this. other guy. He wasn't. >> For fun. >> He wasn't sponsored. It was about the. spirit of adventure. >> Mhm. >> He all these, as you will see, all these. other companies sent like supplies ahead. and they like they had teams of. mechanics. He didn't have anything to. prove. He put this together in 4 days. including buying the car. >> Mhm. >> And that's just.

I really want to get across the spirit. of this whole thing was just this. optimist who was like, let me see if I. can do this crazy thing. >> Yeah. >> So, 2 months after. Horatio and. Sewell set out on their trip, Packard. sent a team out. And like you said, they. were very well outfitted. They had a. mechanic on board. There was gasoline. for them at every stop. Because gasoline was there were no gas. stations. And definitely there were no. gas stations out west. You would go to.

the general store and be like, I'd like. a can of your most dangerous volatile. liquid, [laughter] please. And they. would hand you some gasoline in a can. and you'd buy a few of them to drive. around with. It was incredibly. dangerous, but that's how you didn't run. out of gas. Packard had the advantage of. like every town or every X number of. miles, there was gasoline waiting for. them. So, they essentially had gas. stations that were reserved exclusively. for them. Um Horatio and and Sewell did. not have anything remotely like that.

And so, they got into all sorts of fun. little adventures like the time that. Sewell Crocker had to um bike dozens of. miles on a borrowed bicycle to go to to. and fro to fill up their gas can and. bring it back and then fill it up again. and then bring it back and um it must. have. >> was there. >> Right, exactly. And then it's fun now in. retrospect us talking about it here in. 2023 in the studio. I'm sure it was not. a great day for for Sewell Crocker. >> No, I don't think they were drawing. straws though, you know what I mean? Like.

>> Right. >> the rich 31-year-old with that had TB is. definitely saying, "All right, hit hit. the road on the bike, my friend.". >> We're equals in almost every way. >> But hit the trail on the bike. >> Right. >> All right, so Packard did so 2 months. later like he said and Oldsmobile did. the same thing a month after that, I. believe. >> Mhm. >> Much the same operation, you know, fully. sponsored and like rigged up and. everything. So, they threw out the back seat on this. Winton. >> Mhm. >> I don't think we mentioned this thing.

could go 250 miles with their tank of. fuel which. >> That's. >> was way more than I thought. >> Yeah, for sure. >> I was super impressed. Um so, they. ripped out the back seat which doesn't. look like it was much of one anyway. And packed. you know, cooking kits, tons of rope, something that would. probably be the most valuable thing in. the whole car was. a pulley system, a block and tackle. >> Yeah, for sure. >> They had a Kodak camera, they had.

sleeping bags, they had a shovel and. axe, they had a bunch of guns and. ammunition. cuz they might be hunting for food out. in the middle of nowhere or just maybe. want to murder someone. >> Yeah, or just like shooting out of a. on top cars probably pretty fun when no. one's around. >> They bet that is fun. >> So yeah, the problem is is like they. weren't experts at tying down their. gear. >> Yeah. >> And they would get to like a stop. probably basically every day and find. that something they needed had dropped.

off at some. >> It bounced out. >> some point [laughter] like back on their. trail and that they'd gone too far to go. back to try to to find it. >> It's really funny. >> They lost like cooking utensils, Horatio. lost multiple pairs of his eyeglasses. Um. it's just crazy to me that they weren't. like put a tarp on it and wrap the tarp. up and then put rope on the tarp, you. know? >> Yeah. >> Who knows? But um. they did lose a lot of stuff and luckily. like you said they didn't lose that. block and tackle. It would really come. into into um play multiple times, but.

they they made a really good decision. early on. Number one, they followed um. I can't remember his first name but Mr. Winton's Alexander Winton's example and. started out west. So what they would be. doing is getting the hardest part of the. trip out of the way. first while the car had very few miles. on it, right? >> Yeah, which was a you know, a a nice. little copy but uh then they made a. really really great decision and I think. the decision that.

frankly made them a success in the end. >> Mhm. >> Did I just spoil it? I guess we talked. about what a great story it was. It. wouldn't be great if they conked out in. Michigan. >> True. True. >> But they decided to go at hundreds of. miles through their trip by not just. taking a right and going across the. country but going north up through. Oregon to avoid that Nevada desert. And that my friend, even though there. was some treacherous mountains that they. had to go through, avoiding that desert,

I think, is what ultimately made them. successful. >> Yeah. I mean, hundreds of miles added to. the trip, but it was incredibly smart. because, again, Winton had bottomed out. in that sand, and that sand wasn't going. anywhere. At the very least, there were. wagon trails and stuff up in Oregon, um and they were able to kind of make. their way along these the railroad. tracks that were there. So, there were. railroad right-of-ways, which is the. land cleared on either side of a.

railroad track. And they would drive on those, or if. they had to, drive on the railway. themselves, and they would they would. ride on railroad bridges in a car that. could go 30 mph max. >> Yeah. >> And hope to God that there wasn't a. train that was going to come. And I was. like, man, I'm so glad I watched Stand. by Me a couple days ago. >> about to bring that up. I knew you. watched it. >> It's such a great part of that movie. And then I I was telling you, like, that was a masterpiece. Like, that is.

Rob Reiner's masterpiece, and he's made. some pretty great movies. But, it is. exponentially better than I even. remember it as a kid. >> I'll throw Spinal Tap in there, but I. know you have you still not seen that. >> That's what I'm saying. No, it's great. That's a great movie. I think When Harry. Met Sally is a great movie. Like, there's tons of great movies Rob. Reiner's made. But, I think Stand by Me. might be the best. >> Yeah, it's a great movie. I love the. that scene when he. they put their hands on the rail. >> Yeah. >> And it just gets real quiet, and they're. listening. They're like, do you feel any. vibration at all? And that's probably.

what these guys were doing. >> I'm sure. But, they were doing it. bumping along in their open car. >> Yeah. >> Also, shout out, I don't know if Wil. Wheaton still listens to this. I know he. used to, but, man, all of those kids did a great great, um. job, but he really did a magnificent job. acting in that movie. So, way Way go, Wheaton, if you're listening. >> Great movie. I love it. I'm going to. watch it too now you talking about it in. Vegas. It made me nostalgic for it for. sure. >> All right. >> Um all right, so we are at uh leave time.

which was May 23rd, 1903. >> Mhm. >> That was a Saturday. Apparently it was a. a hot spring in California. And uh it. rained that afternoon and they took off. from San Francisco and very quickly blew. a tire out. >> It was like Romy and Michele. >> Yeah, totally. And uh the the Chronicle uh in San. Francisco wasn't even covering it. basically. The San Francisco Examiner. had a very short little piece about it. about a horseless carriage going from.

sea to sea. But it it would build as you will see uh. with the press as things went along. Uh but it wasn't well covered at first. and this the tire thing. it was an issue. I mean that's car tires. at the time would routinely blow out. Uh. they had a hard time on the trip finding. new tubes. >> Mhm. >> They would stock up on used tubes. whenever they went to a town. It seemed. like they had any kind of tubes. They. would just buy them. >> Right. >> To nail your tubes. [clears throat]. >> Yeah, and it was it was a.

tires were an issue. That would seem. like one of the main issues. >> Yeah, for sure. Um yeah, because I mean. you can imagine there's not people. selling car tires because there were so. few cars and out west they kept. encountering people who had never seen a. car. >> Yeah. >> I saw um mention of that Packard team. that was riding. I think Tom Fetch was. the Packard guy who was driving the car. And they pull into one town uh that. where a murder had just been committed. and so few people had seen a car in that.

town that everybody left the fresh. murder scene including the sheriff to. come look at the car that had just. rolled into town. Like that was like. what it was like out west at the time. So of course you weren't going to find. car tires easily. You had to improvise. any way you could. >> Sure and a and a murdered body out there. back then was a dime a dozen. >> Dime a dozen, yeah. >> It's not going anywhere. >> That's right. >> Let's go check out that new car. >> Yeah, it's not going anywhere. >> So, they're going. east. They're going through some. treacherous terrain. They're going. through the Cascade Mountains.

>> Mhm. >> It's it's fun in the documentary to hear. the the diary or letters home to his. wife. where he was talking about, you know, the roads that are. basically big enough for one car because. I can't remember exactly I said it, but. like because nature has made it that way. basically like it's a cliffside on the. side of a mountain, so. >> Oh, man. >> Luckily, you know, they're having to. share the road with stagecoaches and. horses and stuff like that. Not really. any other cars, probably. >> Mhm. >> But they would it was what you would.

think. They were constantly getting. stuck, constantly blowing tires. They I think. the record was 18 times in a day they. had to use that block and tackle to pull. themselves out of a ditch or a river or. a mud hole. >> That must have been the suckiest day. ever. >> Yeah, and then the maps were an issue, too, right? >> Yeah, they would have to rely on locals. for directions. Some when they could. find locals. A lot of times they just. had to guess. I saw again the Packard team, sorry to. keep bringing them up. I know they're.

not what the story is about, but they. learned to avoid the nicest roads. because out west they usually meant that. it just. dead ended in some rich person's house. >> Mhm. >> And when you could find locals, they. would sometimes just literally misguide. you. There was one that Horatio and. Soule ran across, a woman on horseback. who told them to get to the next town. they should go down this road, and it. dead ended in her family's farm. >> It was her driveway, basically. >> Yeah. They they they came back the way. they went and ran across her again.

They're like, "Why did you do that?" And. she's like, "Oh, my dad and mom and and. husband would have wanted to see a car. They'd never seen a car before." So, she. purposefully sent them the wrong way. down a dead end, miles down a dead end. apparently, too. And I did not hear that. they had gotten angry with her or cross. even. I think they probably just said. like, "Good day to you, madam." and kept. on. >> They should have said, "You don't know. this yet, but one day giving directions. will be very important and this will not. be cool.". >> This is not going to reflect good on. your family, Tina Manson.

>> [laughter]. >> Tina. I just love Tina was so not a name. back then. >> Tina Manson. >> I love it. Great choice. The brakes were kind of what you would. imagine. They weren't great. So, it was. quite thrilling when they would get on. these downhill runs and there wasn't a. lot you could do about it. The clutch. went out a lot. I mean, I would you. know, we talked about our our various. van journeys out west. We were in a. Volkswagen van for mine.

>> Mhm. >> And the mountains killed it. Like we had. to to get a rental. Jeep Cherokee in Nevada. >> Mhm. >> for the whole second half of the trip. because going through the mountains. literally killed his. and it wasn't like. a brand new VW van. It wasn't one of the. old ones, but it was like the Vanagon. >> Mhm. >> But like it drove us from Atlanta to the. mountains just fine. And the mountains. killed it. So, imagine what the. mountains did to the clutch system on. this, you know, lawnmower, basically.

>> Yeah, I have to admit until today I did. not know what a clutch did. I knew that the clutch is the thing you. push in to shift gears. Never understood. why. The reason why you push in is cuz. you actually want to stop the clutch. from working temporarily. >> Yeah. >> What the clutch does is it transmits the. motor power or the motor's torque to the. transmission, which in turn turns the. axle to the the tires, the wheels, right?

That's my understanding of it. And when. you're pressing in the clutch, what. you're really doing is keeping that that. transfer from taking place so that you. can go into another gear, and then you. let the clutch out, and that transfer. begins again. So, yes, the clutch is an. extremely. important instrument. You The car does. not go without it, and apparently Sewell. Crocker had to fix that thing almost as. many times as they used the block and. tackle to pull themselves out of mud. >> Boy, he was worth his weight, what name? >> Oh, boy, yeah, he was. >> Uh they did have one modification they.

made uh. like on on the way there is they added a. a headlamp and acetylene headlamp so. they could drive at night. >> Mhm. >> Cuz they wanted to make up time, you. know, cuz there were times when they. uh. had to go to a town and wait for I think. one of them was like three or four days. where they're waiting, ironically, for a. stagecoach to show up with parts that. they had ordered. There were times when. a stagecoach or a guy on a horse would. pull them out, ironically again.

>> Yeah, and I didn't get the impression. that um that Horatio was trying to prove. that horses were obsolete. >> No, I don't think so at all. >> I think he still saw it as pretty ironic. that he still relied on horses in this. horseless carriage. >> Yeah, I don't think he threw shade. Um. even when blacksmiths would make. repairs, uh. they pointed out in the documentary that. I think it was in one of his letters, he. he said it like the irony wasn't lost on. him, but I don't think he was like, "You're not going to have a job in a few. years, sucker.". >> Right. Right. That's what Segway maker said to people.

on foot. >> Didn't the inventor of the Segway drive. off a cliff on a Segway? >> Oh, that sounds like an urban legend, but maybe maybe one that's just crazy. enough to be true. >> I'll have to look that up. Should we. take a break? >> Yes, we'll look we'll take a break and. look that up. >> All right, we'll be back here with the. truth right after this. >> [singing]. [music]. >> Stop, you should.

know. >> [singing]. [music]. [music]. >> Okay, we're back. And Chuck, it's true. BBC News says it. Yeah. >> Wow. >> Jimi Heselden was 62 when he rode off a. cliff on his company's Segways. >> They killed him, obviously. >> Yes, in West Yorkshire.

>> Oh, that's sad. >> Yeah, oh it is sad for him, but. my god, that's quite a legend. >> It is It's like Fabio getting hit in the. face with a duck on a roller coaster. >> What? >> [snorts]. >> No, you know that. >> No. >> Fabio on a roller coaster. a duck flew across his path and hit him. in the face. >> And killed him? >> No, no, no. >> Oh, okay. >> But it's uh it's one of these pictures. on the internet where you're like, "Oh, that's got to be fake.". And it's and it really happened.

>> Poor Fabio. >> I know. I feel bad for the guy, but it. was also like of all the people. to get for this to happen to, it was. just it it was pretty rich. >> Yeah, I can imagine. What What is he a. jerk? Does he Is he Okay. >> But he's Fabio, and like, you know, that. kind of stuff doesn't happen to Fabio. That stuff happens to me. >> For sure. And me, too. Totally with you. on that. >> Did you look up that picture? >> I'm watching the video right now. [laughter]. I can't not, Chuck. You know, we'll have a an episode.

someday where we just tell each other. internet memes and the other one will. look it up and then react. >> [laughter]. >> and. on on mic, and that's how we'll do it, okay? >> stuff you shouldn't couldn't care less. about will be the name of that new show. >> you really probably shouldn't bother. listening to. >> All right, so let's pick up with the. trip. Uh. it it sounds like we're painting and Ed, I'm glad he pointed this out. It sounds. like we're painting a picture of an. awful time because of all of the delays. and all of the things that happened. They knew what they were in for with.

this. They didn't think it was going to. be a pleasure cruise. It It was also a great fun adventure. Like these guys were having a great. time. They were seeing things that few people. had ever even seen in person before, even by horse at times. >> Mhm. >> And they had no schedule. I mean, they. were trying to beat this 90-day thing. But like I get the feeling he really. just wanted to finish the trip. So, you. know, he had money. They were staying in. hotels. They were staying with people. along the way who opened their homes to. them. >> Mhm. >> They were driving about 2 hours at a. time. And it seemed like they were they.

were having fun at the same time. >> I have that same impression, too, for. sure. And plus, don't forget Sewell. Crocker was making some pretty good. money, too. >> Yeah, what I didn't find that. What was. he getting paid? >> I didn't see either, but we can go ahead. and say um at the end they tallied up. how much Horatio Jackson spent on the. trip. >> Mhm. >> And this included Crocker's pay. It was. about eight grand back in 1903, which is. a 267 grand today.

>> That's a lot of money. >> So, if you think about it, um hotels, food, supplies, gas, >> repairs, >> repairs, that still leaves a pretty. decent amount for Sewell Crocker. And I. hope he got a big chunk of that. >> I hope so, too. >> Chuck, I cannot for the love of life. find the stupid picture of Fabio getting. hit in the face. I found some ABC. report, and it just shows him going into. the the um roller coaster station after. the ride, and his face is all bloody, and he looks really upset, but nothing.

about the actual hit. >> You know, I wonder if I what I saw was a. fake recreation of that, and there is. only a before and an after. >> That would make sense that it looked. Photoshopped, then. I'm sorry. I just had to had to circle. back on that cuz my disappointment was. palpable. >> Oh, boy. Um so, they're making their way. out west, or I'm sorry, back east. And. uh it's funny they say back east, out. west, >> Mhm. >> up north, down south. So, they're back they're heading back.

east, uh and they come to Idaho. >> Mhm. >> When I mentioned a third party in that. photograph, >> Mhm. >> we were holding out for this big. surprise in Caldwell, Idaho. They left. without Jackson's coat, turned back to. go get it, and this guy said, "Here, I have this pitbull named Bud, and he wants to go with you and be your. mascot." And they said, "Hop aboard, Bud." And all of a sudden, they have. this beautiful white pitbull in between.

the two of them. >> Yeah, he's routinely described as a. bulldog, but he he's pretty clearly a. pitbull for sure. >> He's a pity, and he's beautiful, and. like if this story couldn't get any. better, now you have a pitbull in. between you, and they made him doggles. to protect his little eyes, and there's. a. wonderful photo of it in the. documentary. >> Yeah, [snorts] so they were, you know, like you said, they were getting press. as they went from town to town, and they. were like, "Oh my god, a car. There's. people actually trying to use it to. cross the the United States in that.

car." When Bud joined, it people just. went berserk over this whole thing. Um. big in part because he was wearing these. goggles, but also he very quickly. learned how to ride in the car. He would. look ahead. >> He loved it. >> to look for ruts or bumps or whatever, and would like brace himself. Like he's. he just took to it very easily, and. became like this great mascot. Um so, everybody started to really find out. about this when when Bud joined, and I. don't get the impression that Sewell or. Horatio were the least bit jealous.

>> No. Uh he paid him $15, which is $500. >> Mhm. >> today for this dog, and Crocker said, "Hey, adopt, don't shop." And Jackson. said, "What does that mean?". >> Right. >> And he said, "No, don't worry about it. That comes later.". >> Right. >> So, they're getting all this press. thanks to Bud. Uh. they. um make their way through sort of that. toughest stretch of terrain. They're. running out of food. They finally sort. of cross out of the mountains and.

they're like, "All right, that was sort. of it. Like we think this is. um not literally, but this is sort of. downhill from here.". And he in his letters he was saying, "I've I've never felt more confident now. that we're going to make it to New. York." And this is when they were in. like Wyoming. >> Yeah, and then once they got to Omaha, it really got easier. And then after. Omaha, Chicago. And then after Chicago, probably Cleveland or something like. that. Maybe In- Indianapolis in between. Like the. city after city just started to pop up.

and they were getting closer and closer. And there were much better roads. The. railroad right-of-ways were just. beautiful, sitting there for the. picking. And they started to really. Yeah, they started to really make some. pretty good time. >> Yeah, I think uh. How many miles did they top out at the. day? I feel like it was like 70-something, which is not too bad. >> I don't remember, actually. >> I think in the documentary said 70. 70-something miles in a single day like. when they were kind of cruising, which.

that's that's awesome. That's good time. for that car. >> Yeah, that's not bad at all, especially. considering it maxed out at 30 mph. >> Yeah. >> So, that was just like a 2 and 1/2 hour. day for them, I guess. >> Yeah, sure. >> So, but that that really does go to. point out like just how slow they were. going because of things like breaking. down and waiting for parts and just the. the roads being terrible. And I. mentioned Cleveland, too. They actually. when they showed up in Cleveland, that's. where the Winton Motor Carriage Company.

was located. And we didn't say I don't. think that. Winton had by this time heard about the. whole trip and that they were actually. making pretty good headway, right? >> Yeah, so he got he sort of officially. offered to kind of sponsor them from. that point on. and Jackson turned him down. He was. like, "No, I've got Packard and. Oldsmobile behind me. and I I don't want this to become like a. corporate sponsored thing. Like we made it this far, we can make it.

the rest of the way." And they did go by. the factory and they got some fanfare. and I think they helped him out with. fixing this car up and stuff, but. >> free beer koozies? >> Exactly. Refrigerator magnets and they. were on their way. >> Mhm. Yeah, I'm sure they probably fixed. the car up a little bit, but Winton was. talking like. we'll have gas like every 100 miles for. you kind of thing. We'll send a. technician to ride along with you. I'm. sure the idea of adding a third stranger. or a stranger to this mix by this time. was just unthinkable. So yeah, they.

turned him down, but they made it. through Cleveland. They made it all the. way to Buffalo. It wasn't until Buffalo, New York that they had their the worst. wreck that they had. where all three of them uh Sewell, Horatio, and Bud were ejected from the. car cuz they hit something. Um Horatio. only mentions it as a hidden. obstruction. So I'm not sure if he ever. knew what it was, but none of them were. injured and the car was okay, so they. just kept on keeping on. >> So take us home. When did they They. pulled into Manhattan, didn't they?

>> Finally, on July 26th at 4:30 a.m., 63. days, 12 hours, and 30 minutes after. they set out from San Francisco, they. made it to Manhattan, New York and um. Horatio Nelson Jackson won his bet, which by the way he never collected on. >> Oh, I was curious about that. He didn't? >> Nope. >> What a stand-up guy. >> Yeah, or he's like, "I'm never going out. west again. It's too long of a ride.".

>> [laughter]. >> Uh and there to greet him were it was a. throngs of press and journalists, >> Mhm. >> uh people from the Winton Motor Carriage. Company and swipes. the old girl herself right there. >> Yeah, that's so cool. I love that they. had like a great relationship and he had. a great relationship with Sewell and. everybody loved Bud. If you're wondering. what happened to Bud, Bud lived out the. rest of his days on the Jackson farm in. Burlington. >> Right. >> He really got lost and died. >> Right. No, he really did live out his.

days there. >> That's great. Jackson went on to live a. very interesting life after this even. He had a number of businesses that he. ran. He. joined the military in World War I in. his 40s. and apparently became a decorated. veteran. >> Probably collected tobacco baseball. cards at the time. >> Probably so. Uh, so he I think he ran for governor. and lost, governor of Vermont at one. time and lost. I don't know how he lost. I don't know who in the world would vote. for someone else other than this guy.

>> Right. >> Uh, and donated that car. to the Vermont to the Smithsonian, which. and those doggles. Ed has seen this in. person. I don't think I have even though. I've been there, so or maybe I did and I. just didn't know the story at the time. >> Maybe. It seems like you'd be able to. recall a car like that. >> I don't know. I've been to a lot of. museums. So, [snorts and clears throat]. seen a lot of old cars. >> Right. Um, sadly Sewell Crocker, he died. young. He contracted an illness.

and died in 1913. So, he was about 40, no, 30 something, early 30s. >> I think he was 31. >> He'd been sent to. Mexico, I think, to protect some land. during the revolution there. Some and he the stress of it killed him, essentially, is how I saw it. >> Jeez, that's really sad. >> I know, it is. So, that's really the. only big sad thing that happened aside. from Bud getting ejected from the car in. Buffalo, New York. >> Uh, a nice little cherry on top here.

that Ed found, too, was 6 years after. this trip a woman named Alice Ramsey and. three of her friends became the first. woman and women to accomplish the same. thing. >> Mhm. >> Uh they were sponsored by Maxwell. Briscoe uh an automaker and they did the. trip in 59 days in. basically the same or maybe just barely. slightly better conditions than uh. Jackson and uh Crocker did it in. >> Mhm. >> So. uh they they pulled it off and they kind.

of encountered the same issues and they. got a lot of press at the time and and. obviously did a lot to advance you know. the. um shine a light on what women were. capable of doing which was. driving a car through terrible. circumstances for 59 days. >> Right, exactly. Uh also despite being described as. pretty in every single um article that. was written about them at the time. >> Yeah. >> Um so uh. one other thing that was a kind of a.

note about this is that uh 30 years. after um Horatio and Sewell and Bud made. their trip the record was set that stood. for decades. 54 hours. So 2 and 1/2 days. Guy named. Erwin Cannonball Baker. >> Ooh. >> made a famous run from New York to LA. And uh I think about 40 years after that. in the early '70s Car and Driver. magazine editors said this Cannonball. Baker guy he deserves his own his own. place in history.

>> So we're going to commemorate him with a. recreation of his run. We're going to. call it the Cannonball Run. >> That's right. And if you want to learn. more about that we Was that a. two-parter? It was just a one-parter. >> I think it was probably one of our. 15-minute episodes. >> No, that was a good one. >> It was a good one. I'm just saying we. used to do them real short back then. I. can't believe I. didn't talk that much back then that we. could actually record an episode that. was 15 minutes long. >> I think we probably talked for 15. minutes [music] about Burt Reynolds. >> Probably.

Probably, but that was probably the. episode, too. >> [music]. >> Yeah, you're right. >> You got anything else? >> Uh no. >> I don't either, which means it's time. for listener mail. >> Uh I'm going to call this uh short but. sweet Amazon factoid. >> Okay. >> Uh hey guys, about a quarter of the way. into the episode of the moment. Um the. episode reminded me of our trip up the. Amazon to uh I don't know, is it Manaus. or Manaus? M A N A U S. >> I think Manaus. >> Manaus?

>> I think. >> Uh and back on a Viking Ocean Cruise. He. said surprisingly ocean cruise ships can. go that far, about 1,000 miles. Who. knew? Uh on the cruise our Amazon guide. told us that uh what I think is the. greatest bit of trivia I've ever heard. Uh the volume of water leaving the mouth. of the Amazon. >> Mhm. [music]. >> is equal to the volume of water going. over Niagara Falls, Victoria Falls, uh I'm going to do my best with my. pronunciation on this falls in South. America. Uh. Iguazu? Perhaps?

>> Perhaps. Very nice. Our South American. listeners should write in and let us. know. >> Right. So, it is the volume of water. leaving the mouth of the Amazon is equal. to those three giant falls. >> Wow. >> times 12. >> Wow, I was not expecting that extra. little bit of math right there. >> I think that's what makes it amazing. And that's from Rich Pope. >> Thanks, Rich Pope. Great name, too. Really gets it across. Rich Pope. >> Yeah. >> Good to meet you. You know? >> Yeah, agreed. >> Well, it's good to meet you, too, Rich. Pope. And if you want to be like Rich. Pope, you can email us as well. Send it. off to stuffpodcast@iheartradio.com.

[music]. >> Stuff You Should Know is a production of. iHeartRadio. For more podcasts [music]. by iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. listen to your favorite shows. [music]. >> Mhm.