Selects: Special Effects: A Short History | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

hey everybody it's Josh for this week's. select I've chosen our episode on. special effects from September 2019 it's. just a nice Straight Ahead sysk app from. Chuck the grabster and me if you're into. movies this is going to be a good one. for you so. [Music]. enjoy welcome to stuff you should know a. production of iHeart Radio. [Music].

hey and welcome to the podcast I'm Josh. Clark there's Charles W Chuck Bryant. wearing his Stone tumble Pilot's hat and. there's Jerry over there she's not. wearing any hat she's got really cool. hair it's not Stone Temple Pilots it is. too I've seen the Stone Temple Pilots. hats before and that's what it is. STP because I bought two hats at. AutoZone yesterday oh I have a Champion. spark plug hat yeah they have good hats. they really do I was getting a battery. and I was like I want these two hats it. was a good year Ohio goodye hat nice.

which is where Emily's from sure so I. wanted that and then I saw this STP hat. Stone Temple Pilot but I would get a. Champion spark plug hat too those are. that's that's great okay I'll let you. borrow mine anytime you want just got to. give it back I don't know if I've ever. seen you in a baseball cap uh it's a. weird Jam is it not what you want to see. I've seen you in shorts like twice in 12. years I keep the legs covered and I. think one of them was when you came over. to borrow my lawn mower I remember that.

yeah like N9 years ago sure I've got to. mow the lawn sometimes now things have. changed you can buy a lawn mower yeah. yeah uh that's where we're at now we can. afford lawnmowers I can wear shorts too. I actually have one of those plug-in. lawnmowers I have a battery powered lawn. more do you look at us stupid liberal. hippies Well mine's mine's battery. powered too but you have to plug it in. to charge it oh yeah yeah what what kind. do you have I have the green one yeah I. think they're all green no there's a. blue one oh I've got the green one too. the Sun Jo no but I have a sjo pressure.

washer do you really is it battery. operated no you plug that in I was going. to say I'll bet it just goes like. Tinkles out water but they do make uh. plug-in lawn mowers like it's not a. battery you just like have a cord that. you walk around and run over with your. lawm Mar I guess they're called. electric sure but yeah I got the battery. one cuz I have so little grass now and. we may be done period with grass oh yeah. that's right you're Zer escaping well. we're definitely doing the front but the. back.

it just got smaller and smaller and I my. last lawn more broke so I was paying a. guy to come cut it I was like why am I. paying this guy to cut to do a seven. minute Mo there's just that one blade of. GL grass that sees the lawn more coming. like mother yeah but then I went and got. the battery because lawnmowers are. terrible for the environment yeah that's. why I got it they're one of the worst. polls too yeah we're both also aware. that we are charging our battery powered. lawnmowers with coal fired power yes I. we understand that I'm just talking.

about exhaust fums I don't even need one. I live in a condo but I'm so. dissatisfied with the landscapers that. take care of the condo that I bought yes. I bought a lawn mower just to do the. little patch out in front of our. building so poor Momo doesn't get long. grass against her junk when she's. pottying this is a great way to start. this episode so we're talking special. effects obviously this has been lawn. talk we're talking special effects Chuck. yes movie special effects which uh boy I.

mean we could do 10 parts on this this. is yeah kind of a big summation because. movie special effects can be everything. from the movie that you walk out of. saying oh that movie had no special. effects when in fact it did yeah wrong. yeah just tiny little things that you. may not even notice MH to things that. are almost whole cloth special effects. like Sky Captain and the World of. Tomorrow yeah or Sin City yeah I like. both of those yes did you know Sin City. every single bit of the set was CGI yeah.

and that Sky Captain did it first yeah. year before huh yep every bit of that. was it was a green screen movie I never. saw it was it good uh it was interesting. like the look of it was amazing and very. much ahead of its time like real art. deco right yeah for sure I call it black. and white but it wasn't it was just this. really washed out M color yeah but it. looked awesome and was not bad nice I'll. have to check it out and I think the. dudes that made that kind of quit making. movies after that it's a very unique. story have you ever seen this has.

nothing to do with anything but have you. seen the changeling George George C. Scott sure oh my god did you just see. that yes and I have to tell you I don't. think I've ever gotten chills more. frequently from a movie than I did with. that one great genuinely it's a. genuinely scary ghost story yeah like it. is wonderful yeah I'm Miss George Scott. too yeah he's a good actor and I I don't. remember who the um the the female lead.

was in there but she was great too it's. been a while I haven't seen it in many. many years so anyway special effects. let's try this. again we're going to get derailed like. every five seconds uh effects are. divided and this is by the grabster he. helped us out with this Ed's a big movie. guy and horror movie sci-fi guy sure so. he probably enjoyed writing this one up. uh they're divided into three General. categories and this all has to do with. where the effect is happening right uh. it can be practic.

which is in front of the camera and that. means it's a physical thing that's. happening I think that's what most. people think of when they think special. effects you think sure okay by most. people I mean. me uh in camera effects that happen. inside the camera MH and then. post-production effects and many times. you're using one or all three of these. right right so with like practical. effects that's things like um like. makeup and Prosthetics like uh Ed uses. the example of David Lynch is the.

Elephant Man like the the prosthetic. makeup that was used to turn John Hurt. or John. herd which one uh hurt into Joseph. Merrick yes um that's a special effect. an explosion on set that's a special. effect a um a blood packet to make it. look like somebody just got shot in the. chest a squib that's a special effect. all three of those are practical effects. they're actually happening in the. physical world in front of you on set.

being captured on film that's a. practical special effect yeah and the. other one I wanted to mention there that. you might not think of is stuff like if. there is a uh a fire like a fireplace in. a scene and then you flip the camera. around to show the people and you see. that fire shimmering on the wall that's. a practical effect too little things. like that but it's lighting it's a. lighting effect yeah or it's a fire like. you know those aren't real fires yeah I. mean it's real fire somebody should put. that out but it's it's not like someone.

lights a bunch of wood they put fake. wood and they have these uh fire bars. mhm that it's like what you have under. your grill basically right or they hide. those and then that's your fire sure. because it has to look perfect you can't. just chance somebody not being able to. start a fire or looking wonky that's why. movie fires look perfect yeah because. they're fake they are kind of dreamy. they're so good so in camera effects is. just basically messing with the way the. film is being produced inside the camera.

what not what's going on in reality that. the film is capturing but how the film. is actually capturing this stuff yeah. slow motion is a special effect in. camera special effect yeah or fast. motion too which is 10 times more. hilarious than fast motion if you ask me. like where would the monsters be without. fast motion yeah you know or Benny Hill. for God's sakes sure that lived and. breathed on fast motion yeah he did um. what else can you do there you can we'll. see this some some of the early special.

effects like. stopping the film changing something. starting it again right like Bewitched. appearing out of nowhere yeah that's a. special in camera special effect yeah. one thing that struck me about all this. from researching this is how the the. basis the foundation for special effects. was laid immediately upon like Mo Motion. Pictures being like created yeah like. the the whole industry not even the. industry before the industry existed but. basically after the invention of Motion.

Pictures and that it stayed virtually. the same until the. 90s uh yeah people refined it and got. better at it and techniques got more um. the same general crafts were used very. much so which is why craft service is. called craft service oh yeah because. each department is their own craft oh I. didn't know that and they're there to. serve them pizza rolls yeah man for. whatever you can put on some weight. filming something I'll tell you that for. oh my my God so uh stop motion animation.

that is an in camera effect you're. moving a little clay figure or whatever. a doll or a King Kong a raisin one a. California Raisin one frame at a time 24. frames per second can you imagine didn't. you do that with your brother with GI. Joe I did and then years later I did a. little Star Wars thing when I got a high. eight video camera and um spent like 3. days working on something that ended up. being 9 seconds long and I said I'm done. what's funny you're going to get a cease.

and deist lat from lucasfilm After. talking about this in the podcast I. might uh and then we have post-. production effects and that is uh I. think that's what a lot of people think. of as special effects these days really. because that's all the CGI stuff that. you will see is all happens in post. production okay all right yes these days. I gotta like almost all special effects. happens in post these days right well no. they still combine some of the old. crafts as well but yeah surely a lot of. it is CGI I mean computers can do some. amazing stuff they can I mean stuff that.

used to take months to do a computer can. do in hours now and do it a million. times better yeah so um depending on. your taste I should say that's right so. those are the big three practical in. camera and post- production and um like. I was saying like the the basis of. special effects was. founded like in the 19th century and. there were just some people who uh had.

kind of followed in a tradition of still. photography still photographers by that. time had already figured out some cool. stuff that you could do messing around. with cameras something like double. exposure where you take a picture of one. thing and then take a picture of another. thing with the previously exposed film. and all of a sudden it looks like. there's a ghost looming behind you. that's right stuff like that so out of. the gate when Motion Pictures were um be. started to become a little widespread. and people could afford them and try. messing around with them they had a. basis of of trickery to begin with but.

there's a lot of stuff you can do with. motion picture cameras that you can't do. with still photo cameras and they. figured this out right away yeah that. first guy uh who's credited as the first. special effect is Alfred Clark and in uh. they don't have the year exactly right. it's either 93 that's 1893 yeah or. 1895 uh he made a short film called the. execution of Mary Queen of Scots and he. did that little stop trick like I was. saying shoot something you stop the.

camera you replace it or you remove. something and then you start the camera. and in real time when you go to play it. back it's seamless right and in his case. did you look at it did you watch I. didn't see that one it's uh he uses a. stop trick with Mary getting beheaded. and right when the axe is going to fall. you know he switches her out for a dummy. then starts the camera back up and he. chops the dummy's head off right and. it's it looks pretty good like you can't. there's no big weird jump he did for.

1893 he did a really good job yeah and. the key to that is just making sure that. no one touches the camera or even. breathes on it don't move and then. getting the dummy in the same position. as the the actor yeah and in fact as. we'll talk about later with Matt. paintings it's so crucial that the. camera not moov that one technique was. they used to bury the camera tripod like. a couple of feet into the earth makes. sense just to make sure like no dumb Dum. PA bumps into it.

me so um Alfred Clark is credited with. the first special effect but a guy named. George. M did I get it m we should go ask Casey. Pegram oh yeah he would know I think. it's uh. millier oh nice I think you just nailed. it George. millier at any rate this guy is known as. the father of special effects yeah he. was uh very early on doing stuff that no.

one else was doing you know granted. there were very few people working in. this field at the time none of the five. people did but he was an Illusionist and. he said oh man I can really do some. amazing tricks with this camera and he. really put it to good use from a very. early um like I mean turn of the last. century yeah he actually stumbled upon. that little stop trick by accident M uh. when he was shooting a street traffic. scene in Paris in 1896 the camera jams. while I think a bus was coming across.

frame he's like mad fixes the camera can. we say that sure all right we don't have. any french people listening to yeah. that's. true uh starts the camera back up and of. course there's different things. happening and then when he went back to. look at it it's he kind of just stumbled. upon this weird little substitution. splice that became part of film making. yeah because by the time the the camera. had started up again the bus was. replaced by a hearse so it looked like. when he went back and watched it the bus.

suddenly transformed into a hearse and. he said wait till they get a load of. Bewitched 70 something years from now. yeah so um or no I guess what was that. in the 50s uh 60s 60s all right so you. may not recognize George meler oh I got. it that time I think so name uh but you. probably have heard of his work like a. trip to the moon yeah what's very widely. sight is like one of the first actual. movies I think it was in the 20. something minute range but it about some.

explorers in the Victorian era getting. in a rocket and traveling to the moon. and the rocket lands in the man in the. moon's eye everybody's seen that I don't. care who you are if you say you haven't. you have yeah um this was the guy who. made that and this is a very early movie. it was from 1902 but he was doing all. sorts of amazing stuff he was using. extensive costuming masks um all sorts. of in camera techniques he was painting. on film frame. yeah and this is 1902 and like I was.

saying this stuff was refined but was. the basis of special effects for the. next Century to come should we take a. quick break I think so all right let's. take a quick break and we will talk a. little bit about uh the mat technique. right after this I'm actually pretty. psyched about this. [Music].

all right Chuck as I said I'm very. psyched about the. mat yeah so this isn't uh this is a. little confusing the way it's laid out. here okay um because what what Ed's. talking about here with Norman Dawn. is called Original negative matte.

painting okay um if you hear of a matte. painting that is a uh piece of glass. where you have and I'm going to talk. about the most common way you might see. it employed is you take a a big piece of. glass and you paint like a cityscape on. it right like really realistic yeah and. then you put that in a scene and shoot. it so it's uh instead of having someone. in front of a city and this is pre- blue. screen and green screen Tech technology.

you would just put Kurt Russell and. Escape from New York in a field and. there's a matte painting of New York. City behind him right and it looks great. and James Cameron painted that in Escape. From New York he was a map painter oh I. didn't know that that was like his first. job it's neat like if you um if you even. if you do know what Chuck's talking. about go to the internet and just look. up like great mat paintings it's amazing. there's a lot of really wonderful ones. one you've seen before ones you haven't. but basically anytime you've seen a. movie. pre.

1993 maybe. 1990 um where somebody walks into this. enormous place or this amazingly. elaborate future city or something like. that what you're actually looking at is. an expertly painted painting that has. been messed with in post- production or. using an in camera technique to make it. look like it's alive or actually you. know bustling or energetic or there but. it's really a it's a painting it's a. painting that some amazing human being. painted by hand yeah and we should point.

out they still do this today they just. do it digitally and digital mat painters. are super talented as well sure um but. it's kind of neat to think about that. old craft and James Cameron and painting. a piece of glass yeah uh and sticking. that behind Kurt Russell and I mean it. was used in everything like I If for my. money matte painting is the single most. um important and widespread special. effect. ever may be hard to argue that thank you.

like it it was in Mary Poppins when Mary. Poppins is coming into the city of. London that's a mat painting when. Superman walks into the um uh where's. the what's the name of the place where. he's from like the Crystal Cave where um. Fortress of. Solitude yeah is that where he talks. with um with Marlon Brando his dad uh. yeah I think so okay um that's a mat. painting and I think the Fortress of. Solitude are the remnants of Krypton. okay and Boy Superman people are so mad. at me right now that's are there.

Superman people still I thought. everybody was on the Marvel train no. people love. Superman really the comics oh. okay cuz I was going to say I mean. you've seen what they've done as. Superman lately right and Batman yeah so. uh that's the matap painting and what. that is it's called set extension so. that basically means you're just sort of. extending the real life Set uh to make. something uh bigger and more opulent. gotcha um or maybe not more opulent just. bigger and more right but here's the. thing relying on that mat painter and.

having the glass there and glass can. break and it can you know on set with. lighting can be weird so that's all can. get a little hinky so that's why this. technique called Original negative mat. painting was developed by Norman Dawn. okay and that is when nowadays they'll. use what's called a mat box which is um. literally a like black I don't think. it's cardboard these days but whatever. they make it out of a cardboard thing. thing that you put over the lens to.

block out whatever you want to block out. uh back in the day they would paint. cardboard and hold it in front of the. lens or they would actually paint the. lens and what you're essentially doing. is um painting away it was early green. screen you're painting away what you. don't want in the frame or what you want. in the future and then uh adding that. later on right and because it's black or. because it's covered there's light is. not hitting that part of the film that. part of the film the actual film strip.

itself that you're you're recording on. to or filming on to that's unexposed all. that gets exposed is the part of the. lens or the camera that is not covered. that has say your actor like doing the. hery jerky dance right right and so what. you do after that is you take that film. that has your actor doing the Herky. jerky Dance Project it onto a screen so. you see where the actor is yes and on. this screen you literally paint the back. background that you want then you film.

the whole thing a second time and now. you have your actor in The set that you. originally wanted right the only. difference there uh which is something. that wasn't quite right here is they. don't like project it they just develop. a few frames of it okay and project it. like a slide I gotta so it's not like. the camera the film is moving through on. the wall right right because in the. article here it says and then you just. stop it and what happens if you do that. is the the bulb burns the film okay so.

you can't just stop a movie projector. you produce like a slide of and project. that yeah and then you paint in the. castle or the the mountain or the. whatever you want and then you go back. and expose it again yep pretty neat you. just open your trench coat there you go. and the uh big innovator with the. original negative mat painting was. Norman. Dawn and he really like really led the. way but I mean again most of the stuff. that that does this now is done by.

computers in post but this is like the. links people were going to to make. movies at the time and you watch them. today and you're like God that looks. terrible but if you stop and think about. the effort that they were going to they. inventing this yeah it's just. mindboggling that they managed to get it. you know to this point yeah Norman Dawn. tried to patent that technique as well. uh but they said no you did not invent. this you popularized it and you can't. Pat something that you made super. popular yep there's some other stuff too.

there's like rear projection and front. projection which is basically like. projecting the background a moving. background onto a screen behind the. actors yeah um basically you know all. those hokey driving scenes where the. person like the cars being rocked or. whatever the road behind them that's. front or rear projection yeah the and um. people still will use that as omage like. in Pulp Fiction uh very famously Bruce. Willis uh or I guess not yeah when Bruce. Willis gets in the cab after the fight. yeah and it if it looks oldfashioned.

that's cuz uh QT used rear screen. projection for that yeah and there's. also a technique that's not in here that. I just remembered so I'm actually having. to look up what it's called uh um when. you're in a car scene right but you're. not doing a rear screen projection okay. so what happens here is you're you're. sitting in a car in a still car on the. set but they're not projecting anything. behind you okay what you've got is uh. two people shaking the car out a frame. they grips uh yeah usually a grip but.

I've I've shaken cars and trains before. it's like cuz I'm just a body on the set. oh I got you like get in there and shake. that thing in fact one job I was on that. was a fake subway train and the. Hydraulics broke early on and they were. like bring out the Pas you're going to. shake this train for 12 hours so like. you got rhythm get in there yeah oh we. couldn't have too much Rhythm because we. got uh yelled at for that because it. looked too rhythmic gotcha so we're like. I don't know what I don't know how to do. this who are you working for oh it was. just a commercial director got that said.

that our our movement of the train. looked too rhythmic and not believable. right so anyway this Fruit of the Looms. commercial is totally unbelievable uh. you sit in the car you're acting like. you're driving there's someone else. shaking the car there might be someone. else off camera like flashing a a light. uh through the car like you're going by. a street light or a headlight goes. across their face and there may be fake. rain in the background and this is. sometimes like six seven eight people uh. working in concert to make it look like.

you're driving at night in the rain or. something like that right so there's not. like an obvious background trees a road. or whatever but maybe there's headlights. coming up behind you it's just dark yeah. but they're people with a spotlight yeah. it's really really cool oldfashioned but. people still use that stuff yeah and I. wish I could remember the full name of. that technique the uh the shake and. shimmy it's I'm gonna be so mad later on. what this called the shakeing shimmy. okay that's right um so you talked about.

green screen and that's actually super. old too there's a really convoluted. explanation about how originally green. screen employed sodium vapor lights yeah. which would actually mess with the. yellow exposure on pan chromatic film MH. and my brain I started bleeding out of. my ear I cannot tell you how many times. I read descriptions about this and I. can't quite get it so suffice to say. that that was one technique for green.

screen what really kind of changed the. industry is when they figured out that. again if you if you if you film in Black. the um the film is not going to be. exposed so anything you go and reexpose. it to it will cover over that stuff so. like it's transparent so for example in. The Invisible Man from I think 1930 1933. yeah Claude Reigns wore black bodysuit. mhm and the background was black it was.

a black screen like a black green. screen and but he wore clothes and. everything and bandages and sunglasses I. think he smoked a cigarette or whatever. but when he took the bandages off when. he took his sunglasses and clothes off. there was nothing there it was a black. bodysuit and a black um background so. when they filmed the background later on. all you could see was the background and. the clothes and the bandages it looked. like there was nothing there because as.

far as the film was concerned when they. were filming it there wasn't anything. there so the film wasn't exposed in. those sections on each frame that's. right and that's called the Williams. process and a key part of the Williams. process is the optical printer and that. is a projector that actually prints an. image directly onto the film that runs. through the camera while that printer. and Camera are synced up yes so this is. to me the optical printer is the second. most widespread and useful special. effect technique in the history of film.

you just waved your hand I did so I. suddenly had an ascot and a beret on uh. yeah hard to argue that too but uh all. this stuff was just precursor to what. was blue screen early on uh chroma key. blue and then later became chromy green. right I'm not sure why they made the. switch actually I don't either other. than maybe the green less prevalent or. less use I think so proba maybe the blue. was um cuz you know what you don't want. anything close to that color right will. disappear against the Green Screen.

anyone who's ever done the weather on. the newscast can tell you that yeah. there have been there are blooper reels. of weather people disappearing when they. wear like a green jacket or something. right it looks like the weather's going. on through their body same thing so so I. want to say one more thing about Optical. printers or another little bit about it. sure so what you have is a projector. projecting a film on to a screen and you. you have a camera recording what's being. projected right that's right that's the. optical printer and you could do all.

sorts of stuff with that so let's say. you have a shot where you have one mat. in the foreground and live actor and. then another mat in the background that. has a bunch of different people in it or. something like that or storm troopers. three okay so you got three different. elements to that shot what you would do. is using the same film film each thing. so you go film that like the uh the. actor the liveaction actor you've got. that on the film and you project that. and you take film where you're filming.

the mat and you project that and film. that this I just totally have screwed. this up oh my God this is just like um. oh what was sun no it's worse than that. was it um false false. positives do you remember that time. where I was like I took a pretty simple. thing and just completely walked the dog. with it yeah okay well I just did that. again everyone I want you to go look up. Optical printers read a little bit about. him and then you'll say oh Josh is right.

yeah this tough stuff it is essentially. you're filming a projection and you can. do that multiple times with the same. film and it adds up to where you have. the shot you wanted where it makes it. look like all these things that you. filmed three separate times are all. happening together in one space yes you. are marrying separate images together. onto a single piece of film right you. couldn't do that with before Optical. printers which is a projector in a cam. camera working together that's right.

okay I think I need a nap uh we should. mention briefly motion controlled. cameras uh this is a system that. allows it it's basically taking the the. person out of the equation there is not. a person pushing a dolly there is not a. person moving the camera it is a machine. that is programmed to move a camera. through space uh very very precisely and. exactly the same every single time yeah. so you can do the exact same motion over. and over again over and over and a lot.

of times you'll if you're on a TV. commercial as boring as that is you will. see stuff like this for like a food. shoot uh because food shoots are. notoriously tricky because everything's. super close up and has to be perfect and. you can't be off a little bit with the. camera because a lot of times you'll Sub. in stuff later and post and that's the. whole reason for emotion control is to. replicate moves with exact Precision so. um I was reading about Industrial light. and Magic using this to really great.

effect with the first Star Wars which is. episode 4 right the new hope that's the. first one. right right I'm not confirming or. denying anything I'm just going to let. that stand episode four is the first. Star Wars movie that ever came out. correct the Star Wars and New Hope is. the first episode okay that I ever saw. in a movie theater because it's the. first one that ever came out anyway when. they were making this you know is it a. star destroyer. the big the big daddy ships okay oh man.

we're going to get murdered um. everything all of the ships in Star Wars. were models fairly small models actually. they weren't wer the biggest okay I. think it was episode 4 I'm almost. positive so um those models were not. moving in these shots in these enormous. like huge panoramic shots where like. there's um Tie fighters flying around. shooting everything and um X-Wing. Fighters shooting the Tie fighters none. of those model were moving what happened.

was they figured out how to use motion. control cameras so that the the camera. would go through the shot and around the. model and make it look like the model. was moving and plus it was moving the. shot through space right right the thing. is is let's say you have five different. ships MH you film those five ships. separately but those five ships are all. going to be in the same shot so you have. to film that same shot the exact same. way five different times and then run it.

through an optical printer so that you. can get all of them all five shots onto. the same strip of film but that's one of. the one of the ways that motion um. motion control cameras were really put. to good use and it was extremely. groundbreaking because not one of those. ships were moving in reality when they. were filming Star Wars can you name five. star war ships TIE fighter mhm X-Wing. Fighter mhm you already said one you're. right Tie Fighter 2 uhhuh uh the deuce.

is what the people in the no call it. sure um the uh uh you already said Star. Destroyer you should use so Star. Destroyer was right yeah there's a star. destroyer oh okay you made a face like I. just was just totally off um you can. make the case that Endor was a ship even. though it was a. planet uh there was the uh the the. forest speeder uhhuh the um the uh Pod. racer uh. yeah and um Dr Zas that's right he's the.

final ship. yeah uh do you know how many people boy. their calf muscles just popped right out. of the backs of their legs oy fry is. like hyperventilating somewhere in the. office and she doesn't know why so as I. said earlier it's it's usually a com. combination of these different. techniques to create one overall special. effect using these different crafts. and uh a great example is Jurassic Park.

in the um in the scene with the bossa. Raptors in the kitchen that great great. sequence uh when it was playing cat and. mouse with those children yeah there. were uh puppets there were actors in. costumes there were animatronic Raptor. heads and there were full CGI Raptors. and you throw the all in a hat mix it. all up and it comes out to be like a. really believable looking scene yeah it. comes out as an. Oscar yeah I'm sure they won Oscars.

right they had to of I don't know but. there's just no way it was. groundbreaking I remember being just Gob. smacked in the movie theater yeah when I. first saw those dinosaurs walking across. the screen and that was 1993 I believe. for the first Jurassic Park right. Jurassic Park A New Hope the first one. that came out so um but that was 5 years. after the first Oscar had been awarded. Ed for special effects as far as I know.

oh really I believe that the abyss was. the first one to win an Oscar for. special effects maybe or there no no I'm. sorry I'm way off way off um the abyss. was the first movie to win a special. effect for a CGI effect okay remember. the water sure um still looks pretty. good it looks amazing this is 1987 we're. talking about wow was that when that. came out yeah I was surprised to see. that too cuz I I thought it was yeah. it's a good movie yeah really like that.

movie how do you not like Ed. Harris you don't like Ed har what did. you not like Ed Harris no I like I like. him as an actor I think a lot of people. might have problems with Ed Harris as a. person he's notoriously kantankerous I I. I've never heard that I believe it sure. he looks like he could yell somebody. down doesn't he sure but he also keeps a. cool head when he's an actor as a 70s or. 60s NASA guy hey I love it Harris all. right let's take another break okay and. we're going to come back and talk a.

little bit about Star Wars Episode. whatever right after this. [Music].

okay we're back and we should talk uh we. should mention the garbage mat real. quick okay because that is uh that is a. big deal a lot of times you have wire. work or you have um you have things. hanging from wires it doesn't have to be. a person it can be like a model plane or. a TIE fighter or whatever true you got. to get rid of those wires unless you're. at wood you can't have fish in line no. you're supposed to not but yes or if. you're Charlie throne in Mad Max Fury.

Road you got to get rid of that arm mhm. or if you're in force Gump you got to. get rid of Lieutenant Dan's legs man. that was amazing that was the first time. anybody's ever done really something. like that throughout yeah I had my. problems with that movie for sure and. one of them is I think he way over he. was like a kid in a candy store and way. overdid the like and now Forest is in. the White House and using archival. footage and sticking forest in it yeah. that whole like half hour dialogue he. has with Peter Cushing's.

ghost it was. uncanny uh but I get it I get why these. filmmakers get excited these really. technical Wizards when they get a new. technique and they just hammer it you. know the guy from industrial Light and. Magic when they made the first Star Wars. call it what you will um his name was I. think John dyra and this motion. controlled camera assembly that they. created was called dlex mhm it was super. groundbreaking and they really did.

amazing stuff with it well he's like a. legend in this industry now and I saw an. interview with him recently and he was. like I'm so tired of seeing just whole. cities leveled and like just the most. amazing stuff you can possibly think of. being done just because we can do it. right he he he put it really really well. I think it's an embarrassment of riches. yeah you know totally like it can be. done so it's being done everybody's. doing it it's it's just you know like. and it makes it less amazing not.

necessarily cuz it looks bad it just. keeps looking better and better every. time yeah like if you if you look at. Charlie Theron's um prosthetic arm or. missing arm compared with Lieutenant. Dan's missing legs looks radically. different it does so it's getting better. there's just too much of it I think is. the point just to be just to be all Ed. heresy on this no I have long predicted. a return to practical effects really and. it's starting to happen a little bit. more and more yeah I could see starting. with Indie filmmakers yeah for sure.

which is funny because finally computer. generated effects have trickled down. enough yeah like you or I could just. walk out of the studio and probably get. on any one of those Maxs out there and. use stuff that 10 15 years ago would. cost. $500,000 to set up a rig like that yeah. and that's how some young filmmakers. have gotten noticed is by making these. um short films with like zero money on. their computer that get a lot of action.

on YouTube because it looks so amazing. and the studio will be like sign that. person up yeah I can't remember the. guy's name but uh that's happened a. couple of times in recent years to Ed. Harris uh we should talk about a few of. the groundbreaking people over the years. oh yes um we'll go through these a. little quicker than what we have in. front of us I think but no we should. mention Lon Cheney sure uh one of the. original um super super stars of film in. the silent era the man of a thousand.

faces he was uh he was very talented. doing his own makeup and changing his. face um that's why he's called the man. of a thousand faces right he's like. here's. 997 what about Willis O'Brien he was one. of the pioneers of stop motion. photography again if you're a California. racing fan you have a lot to thank. Willis O'Brien for yeah he also this. dude the stuff he did I mean if you look. back he did King Kong the 1933 King Kong.

yeah and if you look back at this you're. like this is this is cool but if you. research what was done to create this. you're just blown away by it yeah again. many processes coming together um to. create that 1933 version of King Kong. and that fight looks good still I mean. it doesn't look realistic but consider. the year it looks awesome it does and. it's about three three and a half. minutes long King Kong fighting the. Tyrannosaurus rack. um but it took seven weeks to film yeah.

because there's 24 frames shot per. second in a film that's right and for. every frame they moved the models a. little bit here or there yeah so that's. why it took seven weeks just for that. fight scene I think it was 55 weeks for. all of the stop motion photography that. was done in that movie yeah that's. impressive it it really is impressive. especially when you realize the trouble. they went to when you go back back and. watch it like this is pretty nuts yeah. Ray uh Harry Howen continued the work of.

Willis O'Brien and very famously in like. the 50s and 60s with movies like Jason. and the Argonauts and Clash of the. Titans remember Medusa sure scary lady. yeah that had to be toward the end of. his career I guess cuz that was in the. 80s yeah I think like 81 maybe remember. the minitar 2 man that was cool movie. that was a big movie for me as a kid. yeah and I was like when La law came. along I was like I know that guy that's. right there's the Titans. guy uh we we should shout out uh Millis.

Patrick this is a very interesting story. she was one of the only well first and. only women working in special effects. back in the day right and she created. the very famous mask of the Gilman from. Creature from the Black Lagoon in the. mid 1950s and was unceremoniously fired. not just fired stricken from the credits. yeah this guy named Bud Westmore he. assisted her and then basically had her. fired rather than give her the credit.

for the mask which he would take credit. for CU I think he was the supervisor in. charge of effects or costume or. something oh I thought I guess he. assisted her but he was her boss yeah. okay but it like she very clearly on her. own came up with the Gilman for the. Creature from the and this has only come. out in the last like few years they've. kind of dug up the original stuff and uh. yeah sexism just basically pushed her. out of the industry all together yeah. very sad she's starting to get her du. now though which is good yeah that is.

very good um there's Dick Smith is. amazing he created the squib oh really. yeah he's a he's a very famous makeup. artist he's really good at making people. look aged yeah he made a 47-year-old. Marlon Brando look uh much older than. the Godfather oh yeah yeah he was he was. a year younger than me BR crazy I never. thought about that wow he really is good. he also did death become which is one of. the alltime great movies oh yeah for.

sure and The Exorcist yep and scanners. and if you ever seen ghost story from. 1981 oh yeah yeah very scary movie the. old dudes he did uh he did that what. else uh very famously aged Dustin. Hoffman and little big man MH by many. many years sure and then in the last. like 253 years uh Rick Baker and Stan. Winston Stan Winston's he's M got my. vote yeah I mean these two guys were. both just.

uh creative leaders in the industry and. um Trailblazers in the industry and as. Ed says in here like mentored a. generation of special effects uh. employees employees creators artists. sure all three of those work Lord gig. workers uh Rick Baker American Werewolf. in London in 1981 which still holds up M. uh the Thriller video in 1983 Star Wars. Moss Eisley Cantina he made all those.

yeah did you know that about the MZ. Eisley Cantina sure I didn't know that. he was sing almost single-handedly. responsible for all of them and then. Stan Winston you got to talk about. movies like the thing and predator and. Terminator M and they both have set up. you know foundations and schools and. things like that Stan Winston also did. the uh makeup for what I think is maybe. the best slash film of all time Friday. the 13th Part Two yeah two is when Jason. comes along right yes it's Jason before.

he got his mask he gets his mask in. three I think the Friday 13th franchis. is as good as it gets for horror movies. I dropped off at a certain point did you. see all those no no I still haven't seen. all of them but even just putting like. the first five or six up yeah um I think. it's like watching them again as an. adult I'm like these are really good. slasher films like even better than I. remember for being a kid yeah um and the. reason Stan Winston filled in for Friday. the 13th Part Two is because the guy who. did Friday the 13th the first one Tom.

savini was unavailable he was off doing. Creep Show I believe but Tom savini is. another Legend I think they're redoing. Creep Show are they M oh okay I'd watch. that different stories oh even better I. think if I'm not mistaken nice but yeah. savini is well known for uh being sort. of The Godfather of Gore yeah he did. Maniac did you ever see that yeah that. was an off The. Rocker movie and then then these days. there are companies um ilm and and WETA.

ilm industrial Light Magic is Lucas's. company and they're cool because they. invented this stuff because Lucas needed. stuff to be done that couldn't be done. right and he was like go figure out how. to do it and they did they really did. and then WETA is Peter Jackson's company. oh okay and he's the one that has really. pioneered the map the motion capture. techniques mhm where a person's wearing. like a suit and the suit has a bunch of. different kind of like almost pingpong.

balls all over it yeah at like joints. and crucial places where the body moves. and the actor stunt person or dancer. whoever wearing the suit goes through. the motions and then uh they're just. going through the motions sure and that. that those motions that what's captured. is fed into a computer and the computer. generates a character doing all those. same motions creating the performance. but it's a computer generated character. yeah I don't think he was the first but. the the gollum character in those Lord. of the Rings movies um was really one of.

the first really terrific looking fully. CGI character yeah I found from what I. could tell the First full CGI character. ever in a movie you want to guess you'll. never guess well I mean it's touted as. Indiana Jones in the Last Crusade wrong. really mhm what is it going to be it's. another Spielberg movie okay it's Young. Sherlock Holmes do you remember the. Stained Glass Knight that comes to life. and tries to slash one of them with his.

sword uhhuh First full CGI character in. a movie well. why I don't know but that's what I could. find and that one's from. 1985 well it it says maybe there's uh. it's in the nitpicky language because in. the Last Crusade when Walter Donovan's. face melts and turns to dust when he. drinks from The Chalice that's in that's. in Raiders of the Lost Arc isn't it Oh. no you're right you're right I'm sorry. okay yeah it says here it was the first.

ever digital composite of a full screen. liveaction. image there's something in the language. there was full screen or something this. was the got this was a the first CGI but. it wasn't the first CGI image this is. the first moving CGI image the first CGI. image was in looker remember that movie. I totally saw looker yeah that was a big. HBO movie for me for sure same here it. was looker runaway uhhuh crawl runaway.

it's Tom celic yeah and Jean Simmons is. the bad guy that's right I saw croll a. lot too yeah oh yeah uh looker had. Albert finny right if I remember. correctly Albert finny and Susan day. yeah Susan day and it was written by. Michael kryon I think that was the first. full body 3D human but it did not move. it was static yeah and the very first uh. computer generated effects period funny. enough Were Us used to replicate. computer screens so whenever you would.

see a computer screen in like Westworld. or aliens or star wars and they were. like what is the computer going to look. like you know not now uh that that was. the first time they used computer. generated Imaging was to yeah make a. fake computer screen and the First full. CGI scene ever done was in the wrath of. KH which I believe came out in 1982 but. there's a Genesis like Earth being you. know like Cooling and turning into the. Earth and there's this amazing shots.

around it that's all CGI and that was. the first one and Tron oh yeah I thought. for sure Tron would have been among the. first apparently most of that was. animated by humans not computers that's. right the um like all the glowing lines. all that stuff animated which makes it. nuts that they were able to create that. yeah uh the now the big thing is this. daging technique that they're getting. better and better yeah they really are. yeah so the new um Scorsese pick the. Irishman I think dages and it and has.

taken a long time to get out because the. daging didn't look good enough for. scorsi so theyve deaged daero and then I. saw this new Ang Lee movie Gemini man. where Will Smith of now he plays an. assassin and he has to go kill his. younger self. Looper uh yeah sort of like Looper I. guess but this Gemini man script has. been in development for like 25 years. with with various people attached but. they could never do it because the. technology was there yeah it's finally.

here but here's the thing I didn't know. like I've seen this trailer and I'm like. man that daging looks great they didn't. deage him it is a fully CGI Will Smith. Oh and it looks that realistic the. younger version is yeah wow cuz I was. like man they're getting so good at the. daging wow that's amazing so he moaed. his whole performance motion captured. and they just used fresh prins uh photos. man they just basically deep faked them. sort of Prince photo have you seen the. bill hater deep fake that's going around. now it's pretty cool.

yeah because he goes from hater to Tom. Cruz to Seth. Rogan back to Tom Cruz it's like kind of. all over the place it's really creepy. it's really well done uh and then you. know like we said they use CGI for so. many movies little mistakes that can be. corrected little things that it's just. much cheaper to add digitally later on. right it could be a movie that like I. said looks like it has no CGI whatsoever. and it's cheaper to put a plate of food. in the background digitally than cook.

the food right and put it on set right. which is that's a bad example uh or you. can color grade a movie you completely. change like the movie Oh Brother Where. Art Thou has that yellow Hue for. everything yeah all that stuff is green. you know they're in the Deep South in. the summertime right and they used to. have to like film it at some weird. exposure and then project it at another. exposure with some filter and then. record the whole thing on an optical. negative yeah now they can just do it. all with a computer easy peasy it's.

great you got anything else I'm kind of. looking around but this is like one eth. of this topic yeah hopefully it made you. appreciate movies more yeah you. specifically me I'm just kidding I know. you love the movies sure uh if you want. to know more about movies go listen to. Chuck's podcast movie Crush you'll love. it hey thanks uh and since I said movie. Crush it's time for a listener man. uh and actually since you said movie.

Crush we're about to release an episode. on The Matrix oh yeah hadn't seen that. movie it's been 20 years since it came. out you've never seen The Matrix no I. hadn't seen it in a long time but I. didn't realize this is the 20- year. anniversary watched it last night still. totally holds up really looks great fun. yeah well acted by most of the cast. members who didn't act well oh you know. K who always gets picked on I love that. guy I no Kung. Fu he's perfect in that role though yeah.

he's great I can't imagine anybody else. in it'd be too just too serious I think. like imagine Tom Cruz in that in the. Matrix yeah you're right he adds a. little like something light doesn't he. yeah it makes it a little more every man. almost a little more believable in a. weird way I think so do you seen those. John Wick. movies uh I've seen some of it it's just. like a little too video gamey for me but. I mean it's fine I I respect that people. people like it. sure here we go okay this is about 3D uh.

3D it's about solar panels got I got. movies on 3D got the well they are in 3D. I guess okay I got movies on the brain. hey guys uh being a roofer my entire. life I never thought I'd have much input. until now it's my time to shine uh one. thing that wasn't mentioned in the solar. panel episode is that people really need. to consider the age of their existing. roof before installing solar panels oh. that's a good point uh a new residential. single roof should last about 30 years. but if the roof isn't Nearly New I would. not suggest installing solar panels and.

definitely don't install it if the roof. the roof the roof is on fire once the. panels are installed roof repairs or. replacement is very difficult and much. more expensive if the life of the roof. ends before the solar panels die you can. easily add 50 to 75% or more to the cost. of the re-roofing due to the added labor. cost to remove and reinstall the panels. what a nightmare yeah I didn't think. about that so you should align it. ideally with your new roof sure uh I do.

mostly Commercial Roofing can't tell you. the number of customers who I talk to. had solar panels on an old roof and are. now paying through the nose for repairs. or replacement a reputable solar panel. Specialists should have this roof. conversation with a potential customer. before installing the panels but I'm. afraid it doesn't always happen uh or. customers underestimate the added. re-roofing cost once they're installed. man this is a great PSA it is thanks. again for what you guys do I'm in my. truck a lot driving to different job. sites and it's always easier on Tuesday.

through Thursday when I have a new stuff. you should know and that is from Owen uh. cig great name first and last yep love. the name Owen Stephen King's kids name. one of them yeah Owen King thanks a lot. Owen we appreciate that big time that. was a great email I would have never. thought about that and he didn't even. send his business in to be plugged so. just Google his name and Roofing and if. he happens to live near you use him.

that's how dedicated this guy is he. sounds honest uh well if you want to be. a cool person like Owen you can get in. touch with us you can go on to Stuy. should know.com and check out our Social. Links you can also send us an email to. stuff podcast iheartradio.com. stuff you should know is a production of. iHeart radio for more podcasts my heart. radio visit the iHeart Radio app Apple. podcasts or wherever you listen to your. favorite shows. [Music].