Selects: Iran-Contra Affair: Shady in the 80s, Part 1 | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Hey guys, it's me Josh and for this. week's select I've chosen our 2019. episode on the Iran Contra affair. We. called it shady in the8s for two good. reasons. One, it took place in the 80s. And two, it was probably the shadyiest. thing the US government has ever done. And that's really saying something. Anyway, if you like your stuff you. should know episodes eyepopping, then. prepare for this one.

Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeart Radio. [music]. >> Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh Clark. There's [music] Charles W. Chuck Bryant. There's Jerry over there. eating uh with Chopstick. As a matter of. fact, >> you know, when Jerry pulls out the. chopsticks, >> it's time to record. >> That's right. >> Yep. She's got she's got Facebook open. and she's sitting there with her. chopstick. So, it's we're recording now. >> Jerry's been fork free since 83.

>> Speaking of 83, >> your shirt, >> I guess it's kind of 83ish. >> Looks very Thomas Magnum. >> It does, Chuck. It does. Not just the. shirt, the whole outfit. Look at the. jeans, the shoes. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> You got the Ferrari out back. >> Thank you for noticing, [laughter] man. I look like a chubby Thomas Magnum. It's. funny because uh I just finished. Stranger Things 3 and um [snorts] saw. that there was a Have you seen it yet?

Are you into that? >> No, I I I like the first season. I never. really got back into it after that. No, no offense to anybody. >> Sure. Uh the the main uh the sheriff guy. >> Yeah. >> Hopper wears a shirt kind of like that. through most of the season. >> Is that right? And so someone did a cut. of a like a Magnum [clears throat] PI. intro and had him running around and. shooting things and jumping into cars. all set to the Magnum thing. >> Very cool. >> And it really fits. All you got to do is. throw that song. >> with a guy with a shirt like that and. it's Magnum.

>> Yep. >> Of course, he has the mustache, too. >> Well, I'm a mustacheless chubby Magnum. >> You should wear a mustache. That'd look. interesting. >> I don't know. I do solve a lot of. mysteries, though. >> Nothing can change a look like. mustaches. Oh, dude. Especially. >> instantaneously, >> right? Especially a fake mustache. because you just put it on and bam, you're done. >> That's right. >> So, uh I tried I'm going to go back to. the 83 segue. >> Yeah. We're here, right? We're right in. the middle of the 80s. >> Yeah. Like I This was super 80s. This is. as 80s as it gets.

>> Iron Contra affair. That's what we're. talking about. Some people call it Iran. Gate. I poo poo that name. >> Iron Contra. >> Sure. Um I remember this going on at the. time. Me too. >> I remember watching Oliver North. testify. >> Me too. >> And my sister was like, "He's so dreamy. Look at how much poise he has.". >> Oh, he had his dress greens on all those. medals. >> Had his boy scout three fingers up like. swearing. I really think he did do that. [laughter]. >> Um, but even as an adult, like.

everything I knew about Iran Contra, like until researching this, it was just. the glossiest version. Well, I mean I I. was like 10 and 11, so you were like. seven and eight. >> Sure. Sure. But I mean like still over. time as you age, you're like, "Oh, that's what was going on." Or, "Oh, I. understand that." Even as an adult, my. conception of it was not very thorough. at all. And as I dug into I'm like, "This is one of the shadiest things. America's ever done.". >> Ever.

>> Yeah. And it was really great to do. this. And like now I know it. Now I have. a full understanding of what happened. and if it ever comes up at a party, >> right? >> And people are like, "What was that all. about anyway?" I'm be like, "Well, >> please sit down for an hour.". >> And I'll just pull up my smartphone and. play our episode. >> Right. [laughter]. Actually, maybe an hour and a half. We'll see how this goes. >> Yeah. By the way, everyone, this is a. two-parter. >> Yeah. Buckle up. >> And so, uh, this is part one. I figured. we'd start with the beginning. >> I think that's a really good idea. That.

reminds me of my friend in college. watched the movie. >> uh oh, which one was it? Weekend. Shortcuts. It was a movie that was on. two video cassettes. >> What? >> It was so long, you know, they had to. split them up. >> Was it Magnolia? >> A bridge too far. >> I can't remember. My friend in college, very very famously among our friends, watched the second tape first and then. watched the first tape second and didn't. really put it together. She was just. like, I thought it was a little. confusing.

So, it was accidental. >> Oh, yeah. And then she was like, uh, and. then she showed up in the in the second. part and I was like, she's already dead. >> She was kind of country. >> This is kind of funny. >> This movie is one of them anacronisms. >> Yeah. >> Well, this is not an anacronism because. we're going to be normal, smart, sane. people and start at the beginning. >> That's right. >> And there's really no better place to. start than the election of Ronald Reagan. in 1980. Ronald Reagan, if you weren't. familiar with him already, when he was. president, he had already been governor.

of California, but even before that, he. had a pretty extensive career in. Hollywood. >> Yeah. >> And while he was a pretty big star in. Hollywood, at least B+ list, if not. A-list actor. >> Yeah. I mean, he was a medium-sized. star. >> Sure. But definitely way more famous as. president than he ever was as a movie. star. >> Sure. Um he learned to detest communism. >> Yeah. >> And at the time communism was a really. big thing in Hollywood. Like it was very.

fashionable. Um especially among the. intellectuals of Hollywood. >> Yeah. >> And he learned to hate it. So much so. that by the time he got to be president, he had this idea that there was it was. impossible for capitalist democracy. >> and communism to coexist even peacefully. on Earth. You couldn't have both. You. had to have one or the other. And by. God, Ronald Reagan was going to see to. it that the one that we had was a. capitalist democracy. >> Yeah. He wanted to stamp out communism.

wherever it reared its head. Uh, and it. was rearing its head close to home, which we'll see here in a second, but. all over the world. >> Oh, yeah. For sure. He It was called the. Reagan. >> Yeah. Bits and pieces of it were, >> right? And he came up with the Reagan. doctrine. And the Reagan doctrine was um. we will aid any any opposition to. communism wherever it [clears throat]. sprouts. Like if you're if you're. fighting against a communist revolution, we'll support your country. If you're a.

rebel fighting against a leftist. communist um uh government, we'll help. you overthrow them. That's the Reagan. doctrine. >> Yeah. Via uh money, via arms, via. training, >> via covert operations that we carried. out ourselves. Yeah. >> There were all kinds of ways that we. could and did uh help stem the flow of. communism. >> Yep. So there was, as you were saying, there was a place pretty close to home. where communism had sprouted up. And. that was Nicaragua down in Central. America. And in Central America in the.

30s, the Sandinista government uh had. taken power and had held on to power. well into the 70s and by this time the. early 80s. And it drove Ronald Reagan. nuts that there was a communist power. right there that was being supported by. the Soviet Union through Cuba. ostensibly. I I've never gotten the. impression that this was ever. conclusively proven. They definitely got. support from Cuba, but whether it was. the Soviet Union who was really calling. the shots in Nicar Nicaragua or not, I I.

don't know. >> Yeah. And I think, you know, to go even. further back and draw the lines a little. even more clearer. The Sandinistans were. named for Austo Sandino, who led the. nationalist rebellion against what? the. US occupation of Central America. >> Oh, that's where it started. Huh. >> That's where it all started. And from. 19, you know, the US occupied, this is. all part of the banana wars, >> right? >> So, we occupied Nicaragua from 1912 to. 1933.

>> Uh, for a lot of reasons, but one was. like, hey, no one's going to build a. canal here unless it's us, >> right? >> That was sort of one of the main. reasons. And, uh, that all ceased in. 1933 with Roosevelt's good neighbor. policy, >> which is basically like we're going to. pull out of Nicaragua. >> Oh, really? Yeah. >> Okay. So, >> but we we had our fingers all over. Central America, >> right, >> for many many many years. And that's why. when people. >> forget or choose not to remember when. people flee horrible situations in.

Central America to come to the United. States now, >> like kind of where all these horrible. situations started years and years ago, right? >> Because of things that we did, >> right? Well, when when Reagan became. president, um intervening in Nicaragua, Nic Man, I'm gonna have a hard. [laughter] time if I can't say. Nicaragua. Um it intervening in. Nicaragua became like a a. like first and foremost priority for. him. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Almost immediately they started um. funding the Contras. The Contra rebels.

are the the groups who were fighting. against the Saninista government. They. were right-wing groups. Um and they were. funding them. They were training them. like you were saying and they were doing. all this secretly. There was an. operation called Operation Black Eagle. >> Man, that one. >> that was something else. >> Yeah. >> So, we were already funding them and and. at the time Congress was on board. Congress was on board, especially at. first because the Republicans controlled. the House. >> Well, you know how when somebody comes. in and just steamrolls over the other. party, usually in a presidential.

election? >> Yeah. >> Very frequently there's in the midterms, the congressional midterms, there's like. a backlash against that. >> Yeah. like a house flip. >> Believe it or not, that happened to. Ronald Reagan in 1982. >> Yeah. >> And the House did flip. They flipped. over to the Democrats and um that. Democratcontrolled House combined with a. Newsweek cover story that came out kind. of turned the tide against um Reagan's. policy on helping out in Nicaragua. >> Yeah. There was a CIA director named.

William Casey who was um he was kind of. telling Congress what they needed to. hear here and there. Uh you have in here. vague briefings that that was probably. um a generous way to say it. Sometimes. Casey would send another guy though. named Dwayne Dwey Clarage. >> And this is where things really went. south because Clarage did not present. well to Congress. Um, and anytime. Congress feels like they're being. subverted or ignored or like kept out of.

the loop or like not able to offer their. checks and balances on the executive. branch, they really get mad. >> They do. >> Like we're seeing that today. This is. like history just repeats itself over. and over again. >> Exactly. Yeah. And and in this. particular case, the the place where um. where the the administration, the Reagan. administration and Congress just started. butting heads over Nicaragua, it was. Dwayne Clarage. Yeah. >> You know, he just that's how poor a job. he did. But in his defense, he was.

coming from a place where he was a CIA. man through and through. >> And this is less than 10 years after. Congress had just basically rooted out. the CIA, held public hearings. Yeah. That's when like the um MK Ultra came. out and the fact that they've been. dosing um unsuspecting Americans with. LSD. >> Yeah. So, in his defense, he was mad. because they uncovered all the awful. things that he'd been doing. >> Right. Right. Right. True compassion, Chuck. [laughter]. That's true compassion. So, um so. Congress is starting to to get a little.

unhappy with this. And there was one. congress uh man in particular named Ed. Edward Boland I believe. >> and he was from Massachusetts and he. said hey I just read about this cover. story in Newsweek. It has a a title. America's secret war colon Nicaragua. >> Mhm. >> Seems like they should have flip-flopped. that. You know Nicaragua colon America's. secret war. >> I think they both had the same end goal. >> It's fine. Right. >> But he was like wait why am I reading.

about this in a magazine? Yes. >> And I'm a member of Congress, >> right? Um because at this time like. Congress is like, "Well, okay, we think. we're just kind of funding things. We're. maybe helping out a little bit." This. Newsweek magazine was like, "No, no, no. It's way more than that." Yeah. Like. there is way more American involvement. down in Nicaragua than than you've been. led to believe, Congress. like actual. covert CIA ops like uh blowing up. bridges and blowing up buildings. >> and uh you know direct sabotur type ops.

>> Yeah. Not just here's some arms. >> and then you know you you close this one. eye but leave this eye open when you're. shooting. There was way more involved. than that. So. >> or we could just do the shooting. >> basically. Here just let me do it. So, Congress uh in the guise of Edward Bolan. said, "Nope, we're not doing that." And. they passed the Bolan amendment, which. basically said if if uh you cannot use. CIA funds or defart defense department.

funds to aid the Contras in Nicaragua, it's done. Good night. And Congress went. to sleep. >> And so that should have been the that's. the end of it, right? Because Congress. passed a uh. >> what was it? A law? No. Passed an. amendment. >> An act. >> An act. >> Yeah. And so everyone just stopped, right? >> That's how it works. >> All right. What's part two going to be. about? >> We're just going to sit here quietly. [gasps]. >> So, um, this did not stop anything. Uh, here's what happened in 1983. The CIA, uh, had this one operation where they.

went into the commercial shipping. harbors of Nicaragua. Oh, boy. >> I know. It's It's contagious. >> I said it right in my head all morning. Nicaragua. >> There you go. >> Uh, and they put mines there. You know, I was about to say land mines, but they. were sea mines. >> Yeah. Mines. >> Floating mines. >> Right. >> And uh the idea here was we're going to. plant these mines that we're going to. whip up our own press releases for the. Contras. >> where they take credit for it. Like we. don't even trust them to write a good. press release,

>> right? The CIA wrote the press release. for them. >> So where the Contras are saying that. they did it and uh the overall effect. it's going to have is they're not going. to be able to ship arms via the seapport. at least into Nicaragua. Plus, it also. makes the Contras look way more. together. >> Sure. >> And with it than they actually were, >> right? Like, all we need to do is give. them some money and they got it covered. >> Right. So, the CIA does this and and. they're thinking, okay, so um m or. shipping in the Nicaraguan harbors is. going to stop. It does not stop. >> No. >> Um as a matter of fact, there there were.

there was damage. So, they used little. firecracker mines which make a big blast. and a lot of water everywhere, but if. it's a big ship, it's not going to hurt. the ship. Well, it sunk a lot of small. fishing vessels, right? But it also. damaged ships from the Netherlands, Great Britain, oops, Japan, and the. USSR, commercial ships. So, um, the Wall. Street Journal broke this story and. said, "Hey, you guys, Congress, you. remember how you passed this amendment. saying there could be no CIA involvement. in in Nicaragua? Well, they mined the.

harbor of the sovereign nation and it. blew up a bunch of other other countries. ships." in Congress once again. It's. like, man, you keep doing secret things. behind our back, right? >> That really makes us mad, >> right? >> Should we take a break? >> All right, let's take a break. [music]. >> Stuff you should know. >> Josh and [music] Chuck. >> Stuff you should know. Stuff you should. know.

[music]. Okay, let's keep going. So, what does. Congress do? They're like, "All right, >> they're mad. >> We passed one Bowling Amendment, which I. don't think we said, Chuck. That first. bowling amendment was passed 411 to. zero.". >> Yeah. >> Unanimously saying, "Do not mess around. in Nicaragua anymore.". >> That's when you know Congress is mad,

>> right? when they unanimously agree on. something and then then the Wall Street. Journal breaks the story about the. harbor mining long after the Bolan. amendment was passed. >> and now Congress is even madder, >> right? So they passed two more. amendments, Boland amendments, >> right? >> Uh because there were loopholes. basically that allowed, you know, the. the US to sort of do these things. semi-legally. So it was like, well, here's a loophole. So it wasn't really. fully illegal that we did this stuff. >> Yeah. That's like the Reagan. administration's way.

All right, they closed these loopholes. and uh now this was like it was pretty. ironclad. I don't know about ironclad, but it it was pretty tight amendment. wise. >> At the very least, Congress walked away. thinking it's done. It's settled. We. made ourselves quite clear, >> right? >> Ronald Reagan signed these into law. >> Yeah. He didn't he didn't uh veto them. >> No, he accepted these things. I think he. even said like, "Yeah, this is a good. idea. Great way to go, Congress." And. signed it. Um, I'm not gonna do a Reagan.

impression, but um, so Congress thought. that the matter was settled, but it. wasn't settled. Like, this is how laser. focused Reagan was on on overthrowing. the Saninista government down in. Nicaragua. >> He just took a CIA operation. >> and took it even further underground. than it had been before. Basically, he. was like, "Okay, if you guys are going. to outlaw this stuff, um, we're just. going to have to get even more illegal.".

>> Yeah. So, there were a couple of. factions here at work. One was this. continued operation underground, deep, deep underground now. >> And then there was Reagan's public, like. he still wanted to get real money from. Congress, right? >> So, he didn't have to do this stuff, right? >> So, he kept up this public PR campaign. beating this drum about communism at our. doorstep. Uh he said that the uh the. Contras were the moral equals of our. founding fathers. >> That's a big one to pull out. >> Like that's a direct quote of our.

founding fathers. >> Yeah. >> Um and started in with the and again you. see this stuff kind of repeating itself. The campaign of fear uh where he. basically said unless we do something. tough here then there will be a tidal. wave of feet people. >> I don't even know what that means but. that's that just seems super offensive. >> Swarming into our country. He meant, you. know, refugees, >> feet people. >> seeking a safe haven. >> It was one word even. I think. >> one word. It's funny cuz I looked up. feet people and that's a company that.

like I think makes shoelaces. >> and they're like, "Yes, say it again. [laughter] Say.com.". [gasps]. Uh, so this is all going on and on the. on the on the download all the. operations are going on and on the. public facing side Reagan's just. continuing this PR push, >> right? basically saying like, "Congress, look at these heartless old, you know, gas bags, turning off the funding to. these founding father, moral equivalent. to our founding fathers. Go vote these. guys out of office and vote in some. people who will turn the funding back.

on.". >> Yeah. Yeah. And while the Contras may. have been fighting uh communism, they were doing so through means that. the founding fathers probably would not. have approved of like murder and torture. and rape and m mutilation, >> kidnapping and not, you know, I mean, it. wasn't so widespread that it was like. that's all they were doing, but they. would resort to those tactics, >> right? >> Uh and that's not founding father stuff. >> No, it's definitely not not as far as. I've ever learned. >> No, I don't think so. And I mean it's. had a few hundred couple hundred years.

to come out. Yeah. And it still hasn't. So yeah, >> I read some of the stuff too like some. of the um affidavit were like just. brutal. >> Oh yeah, dude. The the the war down in. Nicaragua, the civil war. Yeah. >> That the US basically fermented and. supported. Um it went on for a decade. Like it was it went on into the '9s. And. it was like not just like countrymen. against countrymen, like civilians were. getting murdered by the scores. Yeah. >> And just they would get kidnapped and.

tortured and killed and like it was a. really brutal time in Nicaragua. And the. the Reagan administration's right in the. middle of this like providing as much. aid as they can to one side. >> Yeah. And it it was uh one of the big. problems was the the Contras. >> back then were a bunch of different. factions and they didn't answer to a. single leader. Right. >> And the one thing I got out of the. affidavit uh one of which this woman. described them taking her children and. her finding their mutilated bodies the. next day. Good God. >> It was brutal. Um, one of the leaders.

said that there's there's no. disciplinary system at all within the. Contra uh groups. So like Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. Like there there's no. accountability. So you could do anything. you wanted and there's no discipline set. up, right? >> So it was just. >> they were fractured and no one, you. know, was talking to each other and it. was just a big mess. >> Right. But Reagan was doing his best to. to paint everything in black and white. Right. >> Contra's good. Saninista is bad. So, anything the Contra did was good and.

stuff that couldn't be painted as good. would just be denied or glossed over, not reported on. >> That's right. >> So, uh while while Reagan's out running. around trying to drum up public support. for the Contras and thus congressional. aid being turned back on. >> and also saying don't do drugs, >> he uh yeah, that was a big one. >> Even though we're shipping a lot of. drugs back and forth, >> it's awfully rich now that you know all. that stuff, you know. Yeah. Um he's also. secretly supporting them going in. flagrant violation of what Congress has. said. >> that that America can do. Um he tells.

his people he wants the Contra movement. to be kept alive body and soul is how he. put it. >> Which and he basically said do it. This. is what history has told us is that. Reagan basically said keep the Contra. movement alive body and soul. I'm going. to go work on Congress. I'm putting my. hands over my ears from now on. Whether. that's true or not, >> we will probably never know, >> right? Because it's all been as far as. the history books is concerned. Yeah, that was that's what happened,

>> right? So, uh here's what they did. They. said the CIA has a bad rep um for a lot. of reasons and Congress is not super. friendly with them. >> Well, they expressly forbade the CIA. from operating there, >> right? So, he said, "Here's what we're. going to do. Um we're going to use the. National Security Council. >> and the the CIA chief, William Casey, he's around. he's going to just like. advise here and there and William Casey. was like, "Oh, no. I really got to be. involved because this is really good. stuff.". >> They're like, "No, no, no. We're talking. like officially here." He's like, "Oh, yeah. Okay.

>> Exactly.". >> So, at first, uh, National Security. Adviser, Robert Mcfarlane, and then he. was succeeded by John Po Dexter. >> Very important you remember that name. >> Um, and then Casey's still there, like. you said, doing his thing on the down. low unofficially, >> right? I think even in some cases kind. of stepping on toes or whatever. He was. like a an additional boss. >> to the to the main guy, >> the guy everybody's heard of, the guy. whose mind or whose name jumps to mind. when you hear about this Lieutenant.

Colonel Oliver North. >> Olly North. And in in in retrospect, especially if you went if you lived. through the Iran Contra hearings and. you're familiar with Olly North, like. you would guess that when Olly North was. tapped to head up this extraordinarily. difficult secret operation. >> to go against Congress and keep the. Contra movement alive and kicking. >> that Ali North was a a a bad a covert. operator to the ninth degree. Right.

That is not at all correct. >> No. Career Marine, uh, very highly. decorated Marine, uh, served in Vietnam, won Silver Stars and Purple Hearts, >> uh, devout Catholic, >> and by all accounts, a stand-up guy, and. >> to many, many Americans, he is a a still. like a top-notch American hero. >> Sure. Well, he was like the president of. the NRA until, I think, recently. >> Yeah. I think there's some scandal that. just happened where there was it came.

out that he like tried to depose Wayne. Laierre or something like that. >> I don't know. >> I don't either. But but even beyond. that, like even beyond whether he's a. stand-up guy or not as far as, you know, patriotism is concerned. >> Sure. >> Just job experience, he had like none. >> Yeah. >> He had no experience whatsoever as far. as I could ever tell in covert. operations. >> He did a pretty good job for a while. >> He did an amazing job. He was basically. the. the White House's operations and intel.

arm of the [clears throat] shadyiest. stuff it was doing. Stuff that was so. shady the CIA was even kept in the dark. about it. That's how shady the stuff. Olly North was doing. And he had no. exper he's learning as he went. Yeah. Just making it up as he went along. And. he really did do a pretty good job of it. if you look at it from that that angle. >> just as far as like getting getting her. done, >> right? So, um, what they basically decided was, "All right, if we can't get the real. taxpayer money and like official funds, >> we'll just go and raise funds on the.

side in secret, um, through business. people that, you know, we can have these. big parties and dinners and say, "Hey, listen. Communism is knocking at our. door. This wouldn't be good for America. It wouldn't be good for your company.". >> Right? >> And why don't you give us some money? Uh, open up the checkbook. >> Right? >> Reagan's here. You want a photo? >> Yeah. Sometimes he would show up to. these secret fundraisers. >> and uh it was a it was it really worked. like they raised a ton of money from the. business elite of America to stop the.

Sandinistans in Nicaragua. >> So they actually, forget this, they. founded they had two private citizens. found a nonprofit, the National. Endowment for the Preservation of. Liberty. Its sole purpose was to get. these fund these illicit funds to send. to the Contras, >> which means that the people who are. donating to the president's illegal. secret proxy war could write their. donations off on their taxes. >> That's right. >> It's just mindboggling, hilarious in.

some senses. >> Yeah. But they were uh not the most. standup nonprofit because as you point. out they raised $6.3 million through. that organization uh during 8586 about. $3.3 million made it to the Contras and. uh so that means a 52% program expense. rate. >> That's pretty bad. >> Yeah, >> that's not good at all. >> No. $3 million it took supposedly to run. to run that uh nonprofit. >> Those fundraising breakfasts for a year. >> Yeah, pretty bad.

>> Good omelettes though. So, um, yeah. Oh, yeah. The best. Top notch. >> Yeah. So, from this this idea like, okay, this is this is probably kind of. legal. We're just fundraising, >> right? >> We're not giving any American taxpayer. funds. We're just getting other people. to donate, private citizens. Saudi. Arabia was a big one. >> And it was all to stop communism. So, like I think their intentions were that. >> Oh, definitely. >> Theirs were. >> Yeah. And but there was this definite. end justifies the means kind of thing. And and really, isn't the president.

really the most powerful person in the. world? >> Can Congress really tell the president. what to do as far as foreign policy. goes? Nah, >> that was kind of the idea, I think. >> So, Saudi Arabia donated a bunch of. money. There's all these private. citizens donating money. Um, and here's. the thing. The Contress found themselves. flush with cash. >> Yeah. Many millions of dollars. >> Over just two years, Saudi Arabia alone. donated 32 million to the Contress. Yeah. This is a couple of loosely.

affiliated factions fighting in two. spots of Nicaragua that suddenly have 30. plus million dollars at their disposal. >> Yeah. >> The problem is they don't have the. contacts in the international arms trade. >> to buy arms with this money. They had a. bunch of money and they're like, "Who. wants this?" Right? >> And they were getting crickets and. >> got some bombs, >> right? You know, the the cartoonish. black kind, the round ones that are. shiny. >> Take 15 of those. This is before. Craigslist, too, >> right? So, their only uh.

their only avenue was to go back to the. Americans and Oliver North. And uh he. began working with a guy named Richard. Secord. He was a retired forced retired, we'll get into that in a minute, >> Air Force Major General. >> and he had a lot of experience. Um, there was this group of dudes in the. 1970s and 80s that were uh former CIA or. current CIA, former CIA, former and. current American military who were all.

had their fingers in the illegal arms. trade, >> right? So, exactly what you can imagine. a a Hollywood writer would come up with. >> Yeah. >> This is the real life version of it. >> Yeah, for sure. >> So, they would they would um you could. farm out assassinations to them. Mhm. >> They could rustle up mercenaries. They. could um carry out sabotage operations. They could find whatever gun, bomb, anything you need. >> You want some money laundered? Done. >> Right. Anything that is extraordinarily.

illegal and deals in death, like these. guys could get their hands on. >> You want some poison? Done. >> Sure. A a bomb disguised as a briefcase. We got it, buddy. And they would Here's. the other thing, too. They were an. illegal black market arms ring, but they. were also even more illegal in that they. would sell to whoever. Whether you were. an enemy or a friend to America, it. didn't matter. These guys were operating. well above any sort of national loyalty. or anything like that. >> Yeah. This was about making money. >> Sure. >> Like many millions of dollars. Yeah,

you're right. So, especially a guy like. Seord, he wasn't. >> he was in it to make dough. >> Definitely. whereas an Ali North was. seemingly in it to stop the you know. communism. >> right so that's that's an important. point but the fact that they that they. contract with CCORD to kind of swoop in. and help um hook the Contras up with. arms means that the Reagan. administration is contracting with this. extraordinarily illegal black market. arms ring. >> yeah one of which uh they took down some.

of these dudes over the years one of. them uh one of the founders of this. group was a CIA op named Edwin Wilson. >> He uh was sentenced he served 22 years, 12 of which were in solitary. confinement, but was sentenced to 52. years for illegally arming Libya with. 10,000 machine guns and 20 tons of C4, >> right? >> That he hid in barrels of mud and flew. on a chartered jet to Libya, >> right, himself. >> It's like Hollywood stuff. >> I know. It really is like this really.

happened. >> It's crazy. >> And it wasn't just Libya. this guy was. funding or um outfitting Mar Kaddafi. >> Oh yeah. >> Edi Amin was another customer like. whoever if you need to keep a strangle. hold on power in your country we're the. people to help you do that. >> Yeah. And when I teased earlier about. Richard Secord. >> being uh forced into retirement that was. due to his connection with uh with Edwin. Wilson. >> Right. >> So he was forced to retire from the Air. Force. They couldn't pin anything on him. but there was enough of a connection. there where he had to step down.

>> Yeah. They're like, "You can do this the. hard way or the easy way. We're going to. give you the option." And he took the. easy way. >> And then he went on to make a lot of. money, >> right? He was like, "Oh, okay. Well, I'll just do the the arms dealing thing. full-time now, >> right?". >> And he he did. So, when they brought him. in, at first, Cord was basically acting. as like a a very LZair intermediary. He. was basically the guy who on behalf of. Olly North was like, "Yeah, I can. introduce the Contras to my friends in. the arms ring.". >> Yeah. Um. >> in Canada of all places. >> Yeah. He introduced the conscious to.

some Canadian arms dealers. So now the. setup was this. >> The friendliest armed arms dealers, >> right? [laughter] They're like, "Oh, these bullets will really put a hole in. somebody, eh?". >> Yeah. Oh, sorry. I meant to include. rocket launchers on that order. Sorry. Sorry. >> Um, that was pretty good. So, uh, Cord. was just there to make some. introductions, make sure things went. smoothly. Um, and then the it was up to. the Contras to use these funds that were. coming in from other people and to buy. weapons from the Canadians. Easy peasy,

right? You'd think, okay, that's fine. That's done. It still has like a slight. veneer of arms length legality as far as. America's concerned. >> Yeah. And we should mention, too, that. he to do this, he he set up a shell. company, uh, the Stanford Technology. Trading Group. >> with an Iranian-American businessman. named Albert Hakee. uh who knew how to get around certain. official procedures and stuff like that. He's another guy who could get things. done. >> Yeah. >> So he set up Swiss bank accounts, untraceable accounts because that's what.

you do, >> right? >> To run the funds through. And this. became known as the Enterprise. >> Yeah. There Stanford Technology Trading. Company or or uh group, sorry, >> trading group, aka the Enterprise. >> Yeah. That was like everybody called it. that because they're like, "This sounds. way cooler, the Enterprise.". Right. >> All right. But like you were alluding. to, you'd think it would have been going. great, but the Contras in the North, who. was the the FDN, they were the largest. by far, the largest group. >> They were the better organized from what.

I understand. >> Yeah, they were doing a pretty good job. But in the south, uh, they were not. doing a very good job. >> No. Somehow they were like, "We don't. have the arms and equipment." They're. like, "What are you talking about? You. have the same amount of money. You have. the same contacts." Yeah. >> Just buy the weapons. And they're like, "I don't know.". So Ali North is like, "Okay, all right. Here's what we're going to do." He. called the leaders of the FDN and the. FSLN to Miami to meet with them. And he. said, "Here's here's how it's going to. be from now on.". >> Yeah. >> Any veneer of legality is going out the.

window. From now on, I'd like you to. meet your new boss, Richard Cord. >> Yeah. Not only is he going to make sure. you have arms, he's going to take the. funneled money himself, buy the arms. himself, and then he's going to have it. kicked out of a plane over your camps. >> Right? >> So now America is directly involved in. supporting and arming and training the. Contrabels in the north and the south of. Nicaragua. And if there was any, again,

if there's any kind of legality, it's. totally gone at this point. >> Yeah. And in the meantime, uh, Secord. and Aake were marking up their stuff as. much as like 300%. >> Dude, they made a lot of money off of. this. >> Yeah, they made a ton. >> But they put it they put a lot back into. the enterprise. I mean, they took this. job very seriously. Oh, yeah. It was a. company. If you are if you were Olly. North, you were quite happy with the. work you were getting from Richard. Secord and Albert Hakeim because the. shipments went out on time. They got.

everything they needed. They had so much. money, they had it left over, but they. were also investing it into the. enterprise. They bought um planes, they. rented air strips, they hired employees, they contracted with other like um. airlines like a CIA front. Um I can't. remember the name of it right now, but. they were they were doing the work for. sure. >> Great healthcare. >> Yeah. The best benefits. [laughter]. All of the uh all of the Contras had. really nice teeth. Yeah. After Richard. Seord took over. >> work from home. Y. >> uh All right, so let's take another.

break here. and we'll come back and uh. bring it home for part one with a little. bit about the propaganda machine that. was set up. [music]. >> Stuff you should know. and [music]. >> stuff you should know. stuff you should. know. [music].

[music]. >> All right, Chuck. So, things are in full. swing. America is unknowingly. totally hooking up the Contras now. Basically running this proxy war that. the Contras are fighting against the. Saninista government, >> right? Um, the enterprise is working. full. >> boore. >> And I if it if it couldn't get any more. illegal, if you thought it couldn't get. any more illegal, prepared to just be. knocked right over. >> Yeah. So, here on the home front, um, it.

was decided that there needed to be a. pretty massive and dense um, propaganda. campaign. And it's we're not talking. about Reagan just going on the news. talking about communism being at our. doorstep. M we're talking about a real. deal propaganda campaign. Uh and they. even set up an office, the office of. public diplomacy for Latin America and. the Caribbean that was [snorts] founded. and managed by a Cuban American named. Otto Reich. >> Okay. >> Uh and this was all exposed later on by.

the Miami Herald uh by the reporting of. a guy named Alfonso Chardy. >> Yeah. I just want to interject here real. quick. So do you remember when we've. done you know historic stuff in the past. and I'm like go read the contemporary. articles. There was some really good. reporting going on because the story was. so huge and multiaceted. >> Oh yeah. I mean Newsweek broke it before. Congress knew. >> Yeah. Right. >> The Washington Post broke it. >> Yeah. >> And. >> Wall Street Journal. >> Yeah. Wall Street Journal. And then the. Miami Herald. >> Yeah. LA Times did a lot of really good.

>> going on like in Miami's backyard. >> But it was back when it wasn't like, oh, think piece, think piece, think piece. Actual article. Think piece. Think. piece. You know, it was like real. reporting. And even then, it still did. wasn't up to snuff in the end. But there. were actual journalists like actually. paying attention and writing about this. stuff and informing the public about it. >> And this is when you and I were kids. And I think like maybe even the seeds of. us cuz we both kind of had desires to be. real deal journalists. Sure. In our. lives at one point. >> Yeah. >> Look at us now. >> Speaking of.

>> What a joke. >> RIP Mad Magazine. >> Oh yeah. >> What a shame. >> Yeah. They tried that reboot. Didn't. work. >> Yeah. It's tough. >> It is. It's It's tough biz these days. >> Yeah. And I got friends that worked for. him, too. Like on this recent. reiteration. >> Oh, really? >> Yeah. Or iteration, I guess. >> Well, I know one of their illustrators. is a stuff You Should Know fan from. years back. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> It's very sad to see it go. >> Yeah. >> So, uh, it is very 80s reference, though. It was. It really wasn't off.

track. >> So, um, all right. This is going on. They they set up this office run by Otto. uh Reich. >> And this whole thing was designed and. orchestrated by the CIA. But here's the. deal. The CIA wasn't supposed to be. doing this. They were barred from doing. this. >> Yeah. There was a long-standing like. prohibition on the CIA from operating in. the US. Basically like we know who you. are and we know you're so good. You. can't use that stuff on us. You can only.

use it overseas. It's fine if you go. overthrow other countries. >> on your mind tricks. >> Yeah. Use those on other groups, but you. can't use them here in the States. And. actually Reagan himself also had his own. executive order explicitly banning the. CIA from, let's see, um doing any. activity that was intended to influence. United States political processes, public opinion, or media. >> This is Reagan's executive order 12333. And the he at least his administration.

was like, "Forget about that. We'll just. get around that.". >> Yeah. And who was this? Um it says here. that they the CIA's uh like biggest. foremost psychological warfare expert, right? >> Retired from the agency officially and. then was hired as a consultant, I guess, to this office of public diplomacy. Was. that Otto Reich or was that someone. else? >> I don't know. >> Oh, well that's the whole point, >> right? Yeah. But that was how that's why. I was saying earlier like Reagan that's. the Reagan administration way just like.

here's the letter of the law well let's. change this letter in our sentence and. now we're following the letter of the. law. >> right. >> you know and that's what they did so the. the CIA's psychological warfare guy. retired came on as a consultant and said. oh here's what you do you need to. basically start setting up some sting. operations because the the point of this. is to I can't remember who said this but. to paint or to glue black hats on the. Saninistas and white hats on the Contras. in the public mind.

>> Right. So when you say uh sting. operations, we mean literally the United. States and Oliver North smuggling. cocaine into Nicaragua, >> right? >> Photographing Sanden officials with this. shipment, >> right? >> And then smuggling the cocaine back to. the United States. >> Back to Florida. >> Back to Florida. >> They're like, "We told you we'd bring it. back. Chill, man. >> Unbelievable. >> Give us our driver's licenses back. >> So, this photo was published. This is. during the middle of uh the Just Say No.

movement. Um championed by Nancy Reagan. >> Yeah. >> So, it all it all fit on the surface, but what was going on behind the scenes. is just unconscionable. >> It It is unconscionable. >> Unconcable. >> It was both. [laughter]. But the So, the But this gave Reagan. this photograph that got published all. over the place. >> Oh, yeah. And he's like, "Look what's. going on. Look what these guys are. doing. These are They're bringing this. stuff into America, killing our kids. >> Exactly. Right. So, these are the people.

that were fighting or the Contras are. fighting. How can you keep the funding. turned off for the Contra Congress? You. jerks. >> And that was the only evidence, too. >> Yeah. Yeah, the DE somehow came out and. said, "By the way, I don't know if. anybody cares or not, but we have no. evidence whatsoever that this Saninistan. official has ever engaged in drug. trafficking aside from this photograph.". >> But this was a a followup probably weeks. after the big splash of the original. photograph came out. So, that was one. sting operation. Yeah.

>> There's another one that involved Manuel. Noriega, the dictator of Panama. >> Yeah. who actually was selling drugs to. America's youth. >> Yeah. But he was also a friend of the. CIA. >> Exactly. So much so that he was a CIA. operative for a very long time. >> Yeah. I don't know about a friend, but. he was at least an asset, >> right? Yeah. >> So um this seeing operation was they. were going to through Panama have Panama. arrange for a shipment of arms to be. seized in um Honduras.

>> El Salvador. >> El Salvador. Yeah. on its way to. Honduras or maybe just in El Salvador. Ostensibly arms from Nicaragua. >> Yeah. Basically saying you're arming. Salvadorans, you're arming Hondurans. >> You're exporting your revolution. This. is exactly the kind of thing that Ronald. Reagan has been saying we need to. contain. We need to pluck this sprout of. communism out from Nicaragua because. they're trying to spread out of the. region. Totally made up, complete sting. operation. And it didn't even work. because Manuel Noriega was like, "I.

didn't like that New York Times piece. you guys just uh published about me. I'm. gonna keep this shipment of arms for. myself.". >> Yeah. But I love it. First he was like, "I can do that.". >> Oh, yeah. [laughter]. >> He's like, "Sure, send me the arms." And. then we were like, "Oh, okay.". >> There would be a a a I think it's from. the Iran Contra investigation. The. description of Manuel Noriega was that. he ran a narcoleptocracy. That was the the government that he ran. >> He was about. >> Let's break down that word. [laughter].

>> He was as shady as they come. >> That just means drugs, thievery. >> Yeah. Exactly. [laughter]. >> Yeah. >> So, um this is what's going on in the. United States in the in the mid80s. >> Yeah. And here's the deal. If you were a. reporter at the time and you were. reporting on this stuff, >> uh the NSC didn't like that very much. So, they would meet with editors and. reporters themselves, right? and be. like, "Hey, can you like can you report. on the Sanden that they're really not. good people? Like, can you help us out a. little bit?". >> Right.

>> Well, but here's the thing. If you. didn't uh play ball, >> then didn't they cook up some story that. they would uh that they would send like. Sandinist sex workers there to the like. pleasure the reporters? That was the the. rumor was that if if you were a. journalist who reported favorably on the. Saninista government, the reason you. reported favorably on him was because. the Sanita government was furnishing you. with sex workers, >> right? That was that was directly from. the Office of Public Diplomacy, >> right? >> And I read the thing about it and they. said the the guy was like, "And we're. not just talking women either, right?

>> If they were gay men, then they would we. would send gay sex workers.". >> Right? So totally discredit them. It's. like a complete page right out of the. Edward Bernay's playbook. It's. orchestrated by the CIA's foremost. expert on psychological warfare. And. this was the state of America in the the. mid 80s. But that was just one dimension. of this whole thing. And I say this is. the end of part one. What do you think? >> I think that's great. >> And uh we're going to make this a. cliffhanger.

>> That's right. And as uh per tradition, we are not going to do a listener mail, but uh instead we'll do a call, which we. rarely do. Um, a little just a little. marketing call. Everyone, if you like. stuff, you should know, right? [music]. >> We've been doing this so long. We're so. bad at this, yet we've managed to grow. anyway. >> It's crazy. >> Tell a friend. Share an episode with a. friend. >> now that they don't have to. You don't. have to explain what a podcast is, >> right? >> It's a lot cleaner now. >> Maybe start with a good one like. ballpoint pens or something. >> Yeah. Tell a friend about the show. Leave a nice review uh or just any kind.

of review at all. >> on uh iTunes. That would help us out. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's how classy Chuck and. I are. He even corrected himself from. good review to just any review. >> Whatever you want to leave, we're not. going to try to influence you. No. >> Like the Reagan White House. >> That's right. Uh so yeah, we'd really. appreciate it. Spread a little love. Try. and turn one person on to our podcast. this week and that really helps us out. >> Nice, Chuck. >> How about that? >> That sounds like a good pyramid. >> We like to do this once every five or. six years. >> Well, thank you for joining us this. week. If you want to get in touch with.

us, you can go on to stuff you should. know.com and check out our social links. You can also send us an email to. stuffodcast@ iheartradio.com. >> Stuff you should know is a production of. iHeart Radio. For [music] more podcasts, iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. listen to your favorite shows.