Selects: How Disgust Works | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

how did. everybody yeah I think you know where. this is headed it's our episode on. disgust uh this is this was a Josh pick. way back in the day this is March. 2019 and I thought initially well what. in the world are we going to talk about. with disgust I don't not sure I get this. one Josh but he knew as he always does. that there was something more to it than.

meets the eye and uh he was right so. check it out and learn all about disgust. right here right. now welcome to stuff you should know a. production of iHeart. [Music]. Radio you and welcome to the podcast I'm. Josh Clark and there's Charles W Chu. Brian over there and um there's Jerry.

and this is. disgust on stuff you should know about. disgust you got to say it like that I'm. excited about this one Chuck and you. want to know why I have no idea I think. you do if you stopped and really thought. about that's fine that's fine but if you. stopped and thought about it you would. say yes I know exactly why Josh and it. is as follows colon. quotes uh because this is one of those. things that science hasn't fully. explained which means there a lot of.

interesting theories which means we just. get to like talk smack the whole. time it's interesting this is one of. those where I was reading it and I was I. mean it was sort of interesting but then. I was like why would anyone even study. this uh I I that's I mean that's a good. question that's a good question I think. one of the reasons that I'm fascinated. by it and then I'm sure one of the. reasons these I mean to to dedicate your. career to studying disgust it is kind of. a bizarre idea but but one of the main.

researchers in the study of disgust is a. guy named Paul Rosen he's kind of like. The Godfather maybe even the father of. the field yeah like four people than. that family sure but he's been doing it. longer than anybody so he's the he's the. papy um as they say in the Hills uh he. said that to him disgust is the thing. the emotion the experience that makes. humans human that that it is disgust.

that separates us from the other animals. that we share the animal kingdom with so. much so that we actually may use disgust. to separate ourselves from the rest of. the animals okay that is pretty. fascinating and it's worth exploring too. because I think it says a lot about us. as as humans and as animals yeah so. that's why that's the answer to your. question how about that all right no I I. get why somebody would want to study I. guess I'm talking about allocating funds. to study it oh gotcha it just seems like.

a strange thing to sink money into well. I mean if the humanities are going to. sink money into anything what makes us. the most human would be that make it it. makes sense according to one guy. right I love it let's talk about gross. things okay so we're going to so so this. this whole idea of studying it of. studying disgust is actually pretty new. um Rosen didn't really start until like. the 70s and it wasn't until the 9s that.

it really got it really picked up um. which we'll kind of get into but prior. to that it was basically just. philosophers who who were talking about. disgust right yes I think uh and I'm not. sure about studying but at least as far. as uh I think it seems to me like it was. more of a like where's the boundary as. far as what can we write about and what. can we talk about and what can we. perform right and still sell books and. tickets right like we want we want. people to to be tantalized at the. thought of of being grossed out or.

disgusted but not actually be disgusted. it is a fine line that's walked you know. no of course and it's subjective it is. but the other thing about disgust that's. pretty interesting is it also appears to. be Universal it's like it's a universal. reaction but what disgusts people is not. Universal it's culturally bound I guess. right maybe personal too sure I think. totally personal so the the over time. like as you know discuss kind of moved. out of the realm philosophers and into.

science um there were a couple people. who kind of made contributions early on. in the field one was Charles Darwin he. wrote A Treatise on it and his big thing. was that disgust was um related to taste. which is true to an extent but that was. Darwin's big thing and then later on. there was a guy a psychoanalyst named. andris. angal and Andre Angel basically said. that um no no no disgust is not really.

related to taste it's the it comes from. the idea or the thought of putting. something horrific into the mouth which. again kind of makes sense to a certain. extent but then when Rosen and friends. came along it really started to take off. and they actually managed to kind of. categorize disgust into a few categories. which is what you do when you categorize. things yeah there's uh the first one is. core disgust and that's what you think. of if you like you know if poop or I.

mean everyone has their own triggers MH. but if like vomit or feces or like a. like int Trails or something like that's. cord disgust that's an encounter with. some sort of like physical contaminant. that makes you you know make that face. right and that face specifically that's. another Universal thing too apparently. the face is it's called the gape which. is your mouth is open your tongue may or. may not be sticking out your nose is.

wrinkled and your upper lip is is raised. interesting I don't do that with my. mouth open though so you just kind of do. the the nose Wrinkle in the upper lip I. guess like this but uh I don't open my. mouth so that's why I sort of like I. don't know when it comes to stuff like. this I'm a little when they make these. sweeping statements like everyone makes. this face it's like well everyone may. make a variation of a. face of a like kind of a there's like a. universal.

set of of characteristics to the face. that you could choose from that would. fall into disgust like that well I don't. know if you choose anything but maybe. your natural reaction but like I don't. open my mouth and when I read that like. everyone opens their mouth like no. that's not true so um that I think one. of the reasons why there is like this. idea of it being Universal is because. evolutionary psychology as we'll see has. said like yes this is our realm we've. got this we're going to explain this one. and two fully explain it it basically.

has to be Universal so I think that's. another thing about the point where the. study of disgust is right now like. there's a lot of good ideas some of. which have kind of been shown to be. probably true thanks to the Wonder. machine but it's still it's not fully. explained and so there are some ideas. and descriptions that make it seem kind. of wacky too right yeah for sure um that. second kind of discuss getting back to. that was uh animal nature discust which. is apparently these are things that.

anything that reminds us that we're. really animals and that that could there. could be a wide range of things there. from like some people think people. eating with their hands is disgusting. and I think that would qualify under. animal nature because like you're eating. like an animal let's say um sex uh and. we'll get into that more later but. apparently there's a baseline discussed. for sex which uh I'm not so sure about. that one either. uh and then.

hygiene uh is another one poor hygiene. is the animal nature disgust yeah and. another one is the like like you said. entrails something that's called the um. the uh body envelope the ideal body. envelope being violated whether it's. like there's a deformity or there is. like some sort of um like open wound or. something like that they think that this. whole animal nature thing that all these. things remind us that we are animal and.

that disgust can be triggered by um that. reminder that we are that we are in fact. animals which is kind of weird but we'll. get into explanations for that later I. can't wait that's right and the final. one is moral disgust which uh and this. is one where you know you you can be. disgusted with someone's Behavior or uh. you know disgusted with like something a. politician does or discusted with racism. uh or bigotry something like that right.

and that one makes like the least amount. of sense if you think about it like okay. the first two were just kind of like all. right we're like it's animal related we. might have issues with being animals so. we're we're kind of disgusted by. ourselves at the thought that we're. animals maybe it's a bit more of a. stretch than that core disgust like core. disgust makes the most sense out of all. of them. agreed uh yeah and I don't even think. that the moral disgust I think that's a. different type of thing altogether so. that that people have proposed that that.

like they're like some people have said. well English speakers are just misusing. the word disgust they're actually. talking right well they've done they've. done studies of people in the Wonder. machine that shows that the the region. of the brain the anterior insula that's. usually um that usually lights up when. you're shown a picture of like dog poop. and said you're going to eat this you. know your your anterior insula lights up. that same region lights up when people. are disgusted with um other people.

morally yeah like remember the ultimatum. game I don't remember it used to come up. all the time back in the day in our. episodes oh yeah but so if somebody was. given a really really low offer a take. it or leave it offer that was so low and. so unfair that the person said I I'm. just leaving it I actually don't want. this free money because I find it. insulting that same part of the brain. that that is triggered by um like feal. disgust is also triggered um which.

supports the idea that there actually is. a moral Dimension to discuss and that we. experience it in the same way yeah. that's interesting it is interesting but. it is like the it's the most tenuous of. those three I think so the way this all. started out there there are a bunch of. theories but uh it makes sense that it. might have uh been sort of an offshoot. of distaste which is you know your body. is conditioned thanks to you know EV. solution to if you eat something that's.

bitter or rotten like your instinct your. taste instinct is to throw it out and. get rid of it uh and it's a defense. mechanism to save your life and so the. idea is that discuss developed out of. that and that it's just simply an. evolutionary trait uh that could have. you know saved Tuk tok's life you know. however many years ago yeah and the. there's there's evidence apparently that. this this dis taste which is basically.

is in an involuntary reaction is like. dropping something that's hot like you. don't stop and think like wow this. cooking pan is about five well the on. 550 Dees Fahrenheit and then you drop it. I should probably drop it like you just. drop the pan this taste is the same. exact thing and they've actually seen it. elsewhere in the animal kingdom um so. we've probably experienced this taste. since before we were humans and it's. just spitting something out that doesn't. seem right in a in a a. um an effort to I guess keep the body.

from becoming polluted with disease. right and they think that. distaste somehow became a behavior that. was laid over this ex or I'm sorry. disgusted has was a a behavior that. became laid over this existing structure. of distaste yeah and that's interesting. to me because that means that it it. becomes all of a sudden it's not like. you have to eat poop to be disgusted. right like the mere sight of grou now. can discuss somebody yes uh and that.

just happened over time I think so that. is why Rosen says this is like disgust. is the defining characteristic of. humanity because they suspect that other. animals at the very least almost all. other animals don't have the cognitive. capacity to use their imagination to. imagine themselves eating poop and see. and and being disgusted by it as a. result. right so that's why they say disgust.

separates humans from from animals. because it requires imagination to go. from an involuntary reaction of spitting. out food to not even getting to the. point where the food is in your mouth. you can imagine that you would have that. reaction and experience the emotion of. disgust so you don't have to go through. that process that actually very. dangerous process of eating something. rotten to figure out that you shouldn't. be eating it you can imagine it. beforehand and that's the function that. disgust at least core disgust provides.

Humanity it advances us we don't have to. learn through trial and error over and. over again not to eat rotting meat we. just know on some very basic level that. that is a disgusting thing to do and we. have a reaction to it all you want to. take a break y all right everyone we're. going to be right back right after this. with more. [Music]. discussed. [Music]. go.

so I I think we should go back to Tuk. Tuk um and just like how this actually. may have worked back in the day uh let's. say Tuk Tuk and his buddy mchm are. strolling along the tundra you know. Chuck after 11 years I am surprised that. we have a new character and I'm very. pleased that's great yeah well don't get. used to him cuz mckm is he's about to. die oh poor mckm so Tuk Tuk and mchm are.

walking along the tundra um they find a. an old dead Antelope and mckm is like. well this doesn't smell great but I tell. you what I'm going to eat this thing. because I don't have this genetic trait. because my mom ate this stuff uh and. it's fine and Tuk tu's like I don't know. my friend it looks and smells gross um I. do have this genetic trait so I'm going. to pass on that so mm's like you're a.

sucker I'm going to Chow Down on this. rotten antalope and then mchm gets sick. and dies before mmok can have any babies. and then if this happens thousands and. tens of thousands of times over a huge. population you can see how over time it. would be like any uh physical. evolutionary trait uh that might evolve. over time and all of a sudden Tuk Tuck's. family is thriving today in the United. States all healthy descendants of Tuk. Tuk and mchm is long gone right and and.

because tukk was able to pass along his. genes of being disgusted by rotten meat. and mckm died before he could pass his. genes of not being disgusted along so. nature or natural selection or Evolution. selected for for Tuk Tuk right right and. Tuk Tuk was a prolific lover as we all. know and I I imagine mock moach in his. dying words gasping I regret never. having seen the ocean yeah probably.

so it's a good mock mock everyone. doesn't know but it's true that was a. great question so Chuck um that's the. that's the evolutionary psychology basis. for explaining how discust came along. and was passed along right and it makes. sense on a very basic level but it. starts to get less and less sensible as. you've already pointed out as we start. to add more and more inputs of disussed. right like yes it makes sense that.

either somehow the idea of not eating. meat was passed along either genetically. or even you could say Tuk Tuk went back. to the hunter gather tribe and said hey. let me tell you what happened a mock. mock it was crazy he ate some rancid. analou which I guess we all kind of. thought was okay up to this point but. let me tell you steer clear of the. rancid Antelope you don't want to have. anything to do that cuz it just killed. Mock moach and everyone trusting Tuk Tuk. and not just assuming that he hit mchm.

with a rock or something out in the. wilderness and left him to die that he. actually did die from eating analou this. became passed along this is another way. it could have happened and that this. like ancient knowledge we just lost um. where the ancient knowledge came from. that was actually Tuk Tuk seeing mock. moach die and instead it just became. something that um we came to think of as. like instinct over time you just don't. eat rancid meat but really what it is. rather than being passed along. genetically it was a um I guess a meme.

an idea that was passed along generation. to generation and it became so ingrain. that we just confuse it for genes or. Instinct as well which is another. explanation of it but both of them have. like an evolutionary component to it for. sure yeah and then over time that even. changes to where um like it's not like. humans like let's talk about a human. body then like a dead a dead human body. a corpse let me get my poking. stick well you probably wouldn't poke it.

because your evolutionary instinct is to. probably just stay away from that body. well that's what the stick is for and. it's not just because like well it may. be partially because a dead body just. might creep someone out but there's also. an evolutionary basis to avoid that body. uh get it out of the house uh and bury. it because it's may have been diseased. uh and they've even done studies there. was a study in 2004 in biology letters. just the the greatest teen science mag.

out there Tiger Beat and biological. sciences uh so biology letters said that. they did a study where they found the. images of objects that held what was. called a potential disease threat were. rated as more disgusting so this is just. the idea that um again because of. evolution we are uh have trained. ourselves to avoid somebody who looks. sick okay now we get to to another big. in the armor if you ask me where.

did we get the idea that a body caused. disease and that you could become. polluted by some weird magical. transference of this disease by handling. or coming in close contact with the body. like pre germ Theory pre- germ Theory. germ theory is very new it's about 150. years old almost on the nose we're. talking about people's aversion to dead. bodies and corpses for eons before that. hundreds of years if not thousands of. thousands of years right well maybe even.

more like what if. like I mean what if someone just. going like back in the day were people. like oh that's great come here and give. me give me some sugar right or were. people always sort of repuls by that. yeah I I don't know and we we don't we. don't know we can't say we can only go. as far back as any like historical. references we can find but you can make. a pretty good case that an aversion to. to something like that or a dead body. goes back much further than germ Theory.

yeah so you you come to that question. where did we get this idea where did we. get this understanding on a very basic. fundamental level that corpses are to be. avoided so much so that we are disgusted. by them and even if you're not disgusted. like I want a WR if I see a dead body in. person which you may be surprised I. think a lot of people would be very. surprised that if they actually did see. a dead body they would be they they. would probably rich depends on you know. what's going on the state it's in yeah.

if it's eviscerated or something like. that or the smell I think also too um. but the the the idea that that there's. something that is keeping you from. avoiding it whether it's the creeps. whether it's disgust whether it's some. form of aversion that is that is acting. to put distance between you and the. polluting entity this dead body um where. did that come from before germ Theory. that's my big question. I haven't seen answered anywhere it's.

where did we get that again was it. somebody handled the dead body and like. became directly sick from it so. obviously that even like Tuk Tuk could. say yes the dead body caused this so we. should steer clear of hanging out around. dead bodies or um was there some sort of. awareness on on a very basic level that. that we haven't figured out how to. explain yet that it that kept. generations and generations of humans. relatively healthy before the Advent of.

germ Theory and our understanding of it. it is a bit of a mind experiment it is. like uh the this perhaps the very sound. of someone very ill and Hawking up you. know fim sounds gross right but like. like you say though before germ Theory. before they knew that that would make. that was sickness or that made someone. sick maybe people are like oh come in. here he and do that in my face I love. that sound right but it just doesn't.

seem likely it's like ASMR to me I don't. know man it's very hard to wrap your. head around and also if you remember in. our great stink episode prior right. prior to germ Theory there was miasma. Theory which was the smell of something. directly polluted you and made you sick. it wasn't like associated with it but. even that it's like so okay what what. made you think that the smell what makes. you think that a dead body which in and. of itself isn't giving off any actual. signal. that it will make you sick if if it's.

decayed enough and you like interact. with it what about that made us. associate sickness a transference of. sickness that transference is it's an. invisible magical transference of. pollution from the dead body to you the. person who's handling the dead body that. is that is significant and remarkable. that we came up with that that's what I. think is is just so fascinating about. all this yeah and I think this thing. about the contingencies plays in too. because uh and it's funny I have to.

admit when I read this the word. contingencies in my head I I was adding. a letter or something and I kept saying. in my head. as content Genesis and I was like what. is that conting Genesis and finally I. saw contingencies correctly I was like. man am I drunk like what's going on so. anyway there are conting. geneses that's like fous I had that same.

uh experience with fous when I yeah what. did you think it said or sounded like. facus or something like that oh and I. kept sounding it out and then finally I. was like oh that's factious yeah but you. were probably like 12 I and not a. professional broadcaster yeah I think. you had something in your eye that was. all so these contingencies um in. humans at any time there there are many. contingencies at work within us.

competing against each other so if you. go back to Tuk Tuk and mchm moach um. mmok uh died but let's say he did feel. some disgust but it wasn't like but he. was also hungry so that's the competing. conting. Genesis and his desire to eat or not. desire his need to eat right overcame. his low-level disgust of like well it's. not doesn't taste great but I I have.

this other contingency that says I have. to eat so I'm going to eat this thing. and he doesn't die right then it's a. little more complicated it is more. complicated and if you step back and. think about it evolutionarily it would. make way more sense for us to not. maintain a sense of disgust and be able. to eat like rancid meat and then instead. learn like like basically develop a gut. biome that will will kill any any. bacteria Decay that could make us sick.

so that we we could have like that many. more things that are available for us to. eat when we're hard up that makes way. more sense through natural selection and. evolution than learning to not eat. something you know I think that's sort. of the thing too though like the the. winning contingency is the ultimately. going to be the one that it makes you. more fit for you know replication right. right so you. replication yeah for. self selfing so the the but yes so if.

you have more available food that you. can gain energy from in the environment. that would make more sense to adapt to. that rather than to adapt an aversion to. a potential food source right so that's. one question and then you can also kind. of um lay that right over sex as well. too right so this this explanation of. why we might be averse why we have. competing contingencies for sex right. like you want to be attracted to your.

mate because you're a person you you. find attractive is probably going to be. um a good match for you reproductive. wise right especially if they smell good. right and then yes and then if if you if. you are trying to reproduce with. somebody you're disgusted by they might. not be a good match reproductive W was. evolutionarily it makes sense that's a. that's a that's a mental gymnastics.

right there to me it makes more sense to. just say here's an example of evolution. screwing us up of natural selection. screwing us up we developed an ability. to feel disgusted by sex because it. reminds us that we're animals and so. we're missing out on sex or at least. deriving pleasure from sex because we we. are possibly disgusted by the act of sex. if we step back and think about it in. the right way right you see what I'm. saying sure so there's a lot of holes. here which is why I mean I've got both.

of my six shooters I'm about to start. shooting them in the air out of. Glee because it's been a while since we. had an episode like this yeah another. thing that I found interesting too from. this was the uh the just the the Mir. reaction apparently most people open. their mouths I keep mine shut but. regardless uh we all have the disgust. reaction I guess if you don't then. you're probably a a serial killer like. if you saw someone yeah like open up and. smoke like rotten meat and literally. just kept this Stone Face we're like.

that smells really bad like they they're. clearly sociopaths right and that's what. Rosen was saying that's why disgust is. the it's it's the defining human. characteristic because that person would. seem nonhuman in that sense they'd be a. robot kind of yeah but so if people make. this face like that is the cue like you. don't even need to smell the milk if I. walk in the kitchen m M and Emily pours. some milk and it uh well I was going to.

say I see it Clump out of the the thing. but that wouldn't count like if I see. Emily just smell the milk she makes her. disgust face I I don't need to smell it. no but why is it that there is a 100%. chance that Emily or anyone else is. smelling yes who will say oh smell this. yeah I never do no that's okay thanks. for the warning with the wrinkled nose. and raised upper lip I know but when. you're married it's like no seriously I. smell it like you have to smell it right. no I don't want to smell it I've. suffered um so that becomes like all of.

a sudden a uh something that like bonds. communities together and cultures. together even right but which is which. is another okay so this then we get to. the explanation uh or the moral. explanation of disgust of how seeing. somebody involve in cheating or some. sort of unfairness or racism or just. something some really antisocial um uh. violating Behavior yeah that you you.

experience disgust at the very least. people say use the word disgust I'm. disgusted by face I mean maybe it is the. same thing so that's that's I mean. that's what that one Wonder machine. study said and the other the other way. that they backed it up there's a really. interesting article by Rosen uh Jonathan. height who actually was a contributor in. our super stuff guide to happiness if. you remember and then um a guy named um. oh mcau what is Clark mcau they're kind.

of like this big three Triad in in the. study of disgust they're known as the. only three there's a couple others but. yeah kind of but they uh in this paper. they basically say okay so you get the. Wonder machine evidence suggesting that. our actual brain the part of our brain. responsible for experiencing disgust is. lighting up when somebody gives us an. unfair offer of money that's one thing. but also they go around the world. and say that in Japan in Spain in.

Portugal um all over the world whatever. that Society or or languages cultures. word is for disgust they routinely use. it to describe things like the. experience of seeing somebody hold poop. up to their mouth and the experience of. being treated unfairly or seeing. somebody racist so it's not just people. in English misusing an English word. discust which means actually bad taste. in older Middle English um it's it is.

there is some sort of moral component to. discust it seems like well even the word. distasteful like is rooted in the word. taste and that's that's a similar thing. too like Behavior can be distasteful and. uh rotten analoge can be dis tasteful. exactly y uh especially if he's a real. jerk right um the other interesting. thing about uh the work that Jonathan ha. did was this tying it to political. ideolog uh IDE. ideology geez what is wrong with me.

today uh I thought that was super. interesting because they did research. and they found that people who are more. sensitive to. disgust and tend to be more socially. conservative and that can be exploited. so when you go to a a major news outlet. that may be conservative MH that is why. you were more likely to see photos of uh. unwashed or sick immigrants approaching. the Border mhm and not like pictures of.

like the handsomest most fit immigrant. approaching the Border because that. will at least according to this study. they they have a higher uh powerful more. powerful emotion of disgust right it's. it's hijacking your ability to. experience moral disgust uh because. apparently it's really really easy to. come up and poke to push a person a. person's disgust buttons and from from. what the study says is that this happens.

a lot way more than we're cognizant of. and that if we can make ourselves. cognizant of it we could actually defend. against it a little more yeah I mean. they're not going to Fox News isn't. going to put uh the guy that looks like. you said it you said it they're not. going to put the guy that looks like. Antonio Banderas in the Immigrant. Caravan hello as their FR you. okay as their front page uh lead photo. you know it's going to be the person. that's on in the on the stretcher that's. sick and dying right and that's going to.

cause this reaction of disgust. like they CGI flies like flying around. the person can't you see Antonio. Banderas walking up in the video and. going this wall is too. sexy um and then the other interesting. thing about that that whole study that. he was doing that hate was doing was. they also found that people make harsher. judgments when they exposed to a. disgusting stimulus so uh and it usually.

was a smell like the smell of of a of a. 2d booty a shot. duck um and if you smell this uh. flatulence you would react more harshly. toward like a photo of something right. now that might disgust you just a little. bit I want to know the methodology of. this study pretty badly like did they. was it was one of those things where. they just kind of suddenly the the area. between you and the researcher fied with. the fart smell well where do you get the.

fart smell is there a synthetic or I. think there is you probably like at some. novel joke shop they picked up like a. spinning bow tie while they got the the. canned fart too right they're like thank. you uh here's your $10 and uh have a. good day and they shake their hand. there's a buzzer right exactly so um but. I mean like is this so where they they. were talking about something like you. know how what kind of a prison sentence. would you oh excuse me what kind of a. prison sentence would you give to. somebody and like this this fart smell. just kind of comes up but like they're. just not talking about it I would guess.

that's how you would have to do it right. dude I had a stranger asked me the other. night if I. farted oh yeah had you no I was at the. Fleetwood Mac concert standing in the. beer line and this guy in front of me. turned around with his wife and fully. just said did you fart and I went nope. and I was like I would tell you if I did. did he look to his wife and go did you. fart no but then we got to talking and I. was like guys I hate to tell you I said. I don't even smell anything so I think. you're looking in the wrong direction.

and then he felt like I was a little. drunk so I didn't care I was playing. along but then he felt like really bad. and was over apologetic I was like dude. if you're going to ask someone if they. farted don't then turn around and be. weirdly ashamed of that right get all. weepy just own it so um yeah does the. guy not know the whole He Who smelted. delted idium I don't know maybe it was. the first date and that was the deal. maybe he did yeah he really played it. off well it sounds. F all right should we take a break I.

think we should all right I'm going to. go fart in the hallway we'll be right. back thank you for that Chuck we'll be. right. [Music]. back all right it's back Chuck is back. now everything's fine in here and um we. are still talking about disgust let me. let's let's let's. um just kind of go over this real quick. one more time.

okay so we started out with this this. mechanism of distaste M um where we like. involuntarily spit something out that's. gross that occurs elsewhere in the. animal kingdom and then over time we. figured out how to create a new um. adaptation a new behavior that is. overlaid over that same brain circuitry. where we spit something out and we call. call that disgust and it was it. originally started out as an aversion to.

things like poop and vomit and and that. kind of stuff and then that evolved even. further because at some point we said. we're better than animals and I don't. like to be reminded of an animal and I. guess that desire to not be reminded of. an animal developed so much that it. became overlaid over that disgust. emotion that had been that had hijacked. the distaste emotion and then at some. point finally it reached moral um the. moral structure and that hijacked the.

animal and the core and the distaste to. where now just the idea of somebody. behaving in a certain way can disgust us. and the whole thing that really kind of. changed and made it human was the the um. addition of um Imagination and symbolism. to these ideas so that we didn't even. have to taste or smell or see anything. anymore just thinking about this kind of. stuff could disgust us and that's where. we're at in disgust research and that's.

where we're at in the podcast too. frankly. wow that's a nice recap thank you all. right so uh culturally you know it. depends on where you are in the world. and what you might be disgusted by so. while while it is universal it's not. like every single thing is universal um. people uh eat things in some parts of. the world that other parts of the world. might think are disgusting mhm um and. that again is a thing that basically. says uh I'm I'm a part of this family.

I'm a part of this culture I'm a part of. this group um the fact that like I'll. eat eyeballs right out right out of a. fish right out of a fish's head to scoop. it out and eat it right um I might think. that's disgusting but that's not like a. necessarily like tabos are not the same. uh in cultures all over the world yeah. whether it's food apparently they think. maybe even you know well can cannibal. ISM obviously some cultures don't view. incest as um as taboo as as other.

cultures do so some of the things that. we would think would be universally. disgusting aren't universally disgusting. and the whole idea of food too shows. that you can um learn to not find. something disgusting or never find it. disgusting at all because you were just. raised in a culture that eats this food. and values it but to somebody else from. outside of the culture when they see. that food they are disgusted by it so. yeah there's a lot of lack of. universality in disgust that we might. assume would be there that actually.

isn't yeah I mean vegetarianism and. veganism is a perfect example uh someone. can eat meat uh until until they're in. their mid 20s and then all of a sudden. switch to veganism and a year later the. mere sight of meat might discuss them. whereas the year before they were. chowing down on it which I would guess. that's just like you restructuring your. brain circuitry basically right yeah I. think so probably I mean that would make. sense but so something that never. disgusted you before can become. genuinely disgusting or the other way.

around uhhuh I imagine well yeah I mean. you can learn to eat other cultures. foods that you were disgusted by. previously and I know people vegan that. eat meat now right right yeah yeah yeah. you can also learn to eat broccoli over. time broccoli is good it's it's not. though it really is roast it in the oven. delish okay I will give you that roasted. broccoli is okay but if it's Steam or. just like floppy in any way sh or form. I've had bad experiences with it over.

over the years it sounds like someone's. overcooking your broccoli not anymore. but yes I think um mom and dad used to. used to overcook it quite a bit Yeah I. go for Al Dente when it comes to most. the vegetables yeah but roasted roasted. is good mushy is a is a food quality. that kind of disgusts me MH so uh food. preparation is important like I know. we're just kind of kidding about the. broccoli but like let's say um an. eggplant or a squash M if you cook that.

thing till it's really mushy uh it's. it's really gross to me but I will. totally eat an eggplant if it's nice and. firm yeah yeah I mean yeah texture is. enormous with it it also affects taste. too which doesn't make any sense except. for like it's part of the experience of. it right yeah but true disgust happens. for me I think it's not just like I. don't I don't prefer that like mushy. food really really grosses me out well. there's something that that um that Ed.

actually Hit Upon early on in this is. that like disgust is it goes around our. conscious thought right yeah like you're. not like hm this this broccoli is is not. to my preference it is way too floppy. and mushy and I'd be I prefer to not. have it in my mouth anymore so blah and. you spit it out and it just falls back. onto your plate instead you put it in. your mouth especially if you're not. expecting it to be mushy and you start. chewing it like you expect it to be good. your reaction without even thinking is.

going to be spit it out probably and you. might you might not actually spit it out. but that will be your first reaction and. you might have to stop yourself like. bring your napkin up to your mouth or. whatever and that's one of the things. that like really kind of is a a Hallmark. characteristic of disgust when it is. experienced it goes around our intellect. and our our um conscious thought it's a. a a basic reaction yeah and it can also. get out of hand as far as the uh if the. idea is that at its root we're trying to.

avoid disease and dying MH um we've all. heard of of cases phobias really that. developed um in pathologies out of fear. of uh germs or dirt or cleanliness um. anyone who's ever seen the great uh. movie Safe by Todd Haynes um that was a. movie about that where this woman sort. of slowly unwinds and uh eventually ends. up in a in a like a. a community where everyone is obsessed. with this kind of compulsive cleanliness.

who's the woman it's uh Julian Moore I. haven't seen that yet is it pretty good. it was it was great I mean it was it's a. long time ago so it's like in the early. 90s I think okay like some of her. earlier work right but that's just an. example of how um how that can happen. and how it can get out of hand until. basically you have a compulsive disorder. that may have started out of a legit. environmental like disgust reaction to. disease right yeah that well that's what.

they think is the basis of of possibly. all of it that has to do with disgust or. a a like a drive to to feel clean or to. get rid of germs or to be afraid of. germs that kind of thing that it's it's. your um your the being indoctrinated. into disgust went a little too far and. your brain your brain's disgust reaction. just became too powerful and now it has. this kind of crippling effect on your. life. yeah but it can also like It's oddly. there are things that have nothing to do.

with disease and dying that have been. kind of labeled as disgusting and Ed. points out acne as one of them that. might trigger a disgust reaction in some. people and it's really completely. harmless it is but it it's playing upon. in an inadvertent way our predisposition. to be grossed out by things like disease. yeah a sore a pox a p it has nothing to. do that it just kind of resembles it in. the exact same way people find slugs and.

snails disgusting uh and they suggest. that it's because they look like they're. covered in mucus even though it's not. actually mucus it reminds us of mucus so. we're disgusted at the thought of. touching one of those things same thing. they're not disease carriers but they. remind us of it that's the key because. disgust Works hand inand with human. imagination I got Emily one of those. poppet Pals have you seen those no what. is it you know how she's pretty obsessed. with with zit popping mhm and she. doesn't watch she's not one of those. people who watches the stuff on YouTube.

yeah but it's just like a personal thing. but they I saw it on Shark Tank there's. this thing now it looks it's about the. size of a bar of soap okay but it's made. out of uh silicon it's kind of a squishy. rubber rectangular bar yeah and you. squirt this like uh I don't know what. it's made of it's It's almost like. Crisco or something um I think it's. plant-based and you fill it up with that. and the top of it is covered with all. these little dimple holes and you pop. them. and it comes it comes snaking out just. like like the best pimple you've ever.

seen that's amaz so I kept like trying. to imagine that like this was going on. the person's face now I see it's like. just a basically like here keep busy. with this and leave my face alone yeah. you just like whatever you set it in. your lap and just pop away that's really. awesome man yeah it's it was really. satisfying for her too I thought she. might be like n this is not the same but. she was obsessed with it for that's. awesome a couple of days that's is there. any great human thing that Shark Tank. hasn't give given us I don't know I. can't I can't think of one um Yumi has a.

thing for cauliflower ear and she'll. sometimes watch videos of cauliflower. ear being drained and it's like I can't. hang man it'll she ever date a wrestler. no not not that I know of but she missed. her chance I guess right she better have. missed her chance by she comes in and. she finds you like on the carpet rolling. your ear on the. floor is that how wrestlers get it I. think they get it from like a TR to the. ear like a punch of the ear like a. impact of the ear and then like it it.

swells up and then it turns into like. scar tissue or like just infected. edema well which is why they wear the. ear covers yes well that and to look. cool this too look kind of cool somehow. um so it off it offsets the. singlet it which is the least cool thing. you can wear it's pretty uncool I have. to say sorry wrestlers but the entire. rest of the world thinks that the. singlets look uncool it's not just us oh. boy so let's talk about the um disgust.

scale real quick you have that yeah you. know I didn't even look at this cuz I. thought it might be fun if you just went. through a few of those with me oh okay. well this is a great idea Chuck let's. make it into a game still innovating. after 11 years I'm so proud of us so. John Paul Rosen and John height and a. couple of other people came up with the. sorry Clark mcau and Clark mccaulay I'm. just going to say the third person they. came up with a disgust scale. okay yes so Chuck between zero and four.

zero being strongly disagree and four. being strongly agree meaning it's very. untrue or very true about you okay. please indicate how much you agree with. each of the following statements or how. true it is about you between zero and. what three four okay four zero strongly. disagree it's very untrue about you four. is strongly agree very true about you. you might be willing sorry I might be. willing to try eating monkey meet under. some circumstances strongly disagree. four that's a zero okay zero okay it.

would bother me to be in a science class. and to see a human hand preserved in a. jar uh obviously that would not bother. me because when I saw the human head in. in a bucket very famously yeah my. reaction was huh there's the human head. okay whereas the person with me was. really disgusted right yeah and I think. understandably so um I love that story. okay here's another one I never let any.

part of my body touch the toilet seat in. public restrooms agree or disagree. untrue or true uh I'm just going to. ditch the numbers because it's confusing. me uh okay I don't that doesn't really. bother me that much I know that probably. really disgust you uh no well yeah I. just have to go to another place oh see. when when I do that I don't mind man I. know that's gross probably but whatever. uh okay here's one more um from this one. then we're we're going to do another set. you ready. okay um I would rather eat a piece of.

fruit than a piece of. paper well yeah I'd rather eat a piece. of fruit okay okay I think that's just. like a baseline one that they use maybe. so so then between zero and four R these. not disgusting at all or extremely. disgusting just say one of those two. okay you see maggots on a piece of meat. in an outdoor garbage pale uh very. disgusting you I agree your friend's pet. cat dies and you have to pick up the. dead body with your bare hands um not.

disgusted just sad okay I mean I've done. that with all of my animals that have. passed I took care of the bodies right I. think this leaves out that it was hit by. a car and is now part of the road. basically oh yeah that's medium. disgusting and sad okay yeah well yeah. sad you're about to drink a glass of. milk when you smell it as spoiled and. then in parenthesis weirdly enough it. says because Emily just jammed it under. your nose and said smell this that's. weird. um yeah the smell of turned food grosses.

me out a lot okay uh while you're. walking through a tunnel under a. railroad track you smell. urine yeah I've been to New York enough. times it's not that big of a deal it. still gets me man I think smelling urine. is worse than smelling poop for some. reason oh really yeah oh interesting. okay two more you see a man with his. intestines exposed after an. accident yeah that's pretty high up. there yeah yeah I think so too and then. last Chuck you see someone put ketchup.

on vanilla ice cream and eat. it yeah that's gross okay although it's. interesting though when I thought about. the the B's. entrails like I don't love it but I can. watch like a. surgery MH it's not my favorite thing. but I'm not like fully disgusted but if. it's an accident I think that it so it. might be a contextual thing as well so. one of the things that I experience when. I see like some something in surgery and. I think yeah context definitely has a.

lot to do with it in that case too but. if I see like a surgery like remember. there used to be that TV network that. was nothing but surgery you remember. remember uhuh it was in like the late. 80s early 90s I think um but uh to see. that I'll get like faint right like and. it's not necessarily the sight of blood. it's like the sight of viscera I get a. little fate and it never made sense to. me might miror neurons huh I think. definitely is part of it too but I think. also part of the disgust reaction is is. that your heart rate and blood pressure.

lower which would explain why you start. to feel faint like I don't feel queasy. or nauseated or like I'm going to wret I. feel like I need to sit down for a. second which is I guess is still part of. the discust reaction it just isn't the. the the the um nausea version of it the. but still revulsion but a weird fainty. version so in the med school sitcom that. we star in when they pull the sheet back. you start saying I don't feel too good. guys and we're like yeah you're so funny. and then all of a sudden you hit the. deck uhhuh I think the way I would play.

it is even more straightforward where I. my eyes just go up in the back of my. head and I fall. backward in response to the Sheep being. pulled it's a good move I can't wait for. that movie to come out yeah uh you got. anything else I don't think so I'd be. surprised if you did we've gone on for a. good six seven minutes Beyond when we. should have. stopped I think I like that game uh. aspect of that one that was fun oh your. by the way uh indicates that you do. experience disgust from time to.

time I'm not a serial killer no no uh. and I don't know if you guys heard or. not but Jerry also gave her answers as. well that's right uh if you want to know. more about disgust you can just go look. at some weird stuff on the internet it's. out there for you uh and since I said. that it's time for listener. mail I'm going to call this uh one of. the many dyslexia. emails we got those are really rolling. in from people who uh have overcome.

dyslexia and adults living with dyslexia. y um so this one is from uh from a. fellow at lanon named Audrey short she. says this hey guys I have dyslexia and I. was so happy to hear you talking about. my learning disability I was diagnosed. when I was about 10 uh and went to the. shank school in Atlanta which uh is. specifically for children with dyslexia. actually sent in a following follow-up. email just to clarify that um we learned.

how to read and write using a technique. called or at Gillingham when I left. after the fourth grade I could actually. read more importantly I loved to read. and devoured every book I could get my. hands on while I graduated top of my. class I had to work twice as hard as my. classmates to keep up with the required. readings and homework uh my peers seemed. to think that my extra time I receed for. exams was the reason I did so well not. the countless hours and late nights I. spent um learning the material while.

this bullying did affect me did not. discourage me from pursuing education at. College uh I attended Miami University. in Ohio uh graduating this may with a. 3.99 GPA biochemistry and physics wow uh. I plan to attend a PhD program at. Harvard or UC Berkeley uh I'm not saying. this to brag but to tell other children. with dyslexia to keep trying I know so. many students are afraid to ask for. extra time or accommodations because. they don't want to be bullied or stand.

out I'm proud of my dyslexia because uh. it is force me to learn how to stand up. for my student rights I've made it to. where I am today by utilizing the tools. given to me like extra time and I want. to encourage all people with learning. disabilities to seek help because you. are intelligent and your unique. perspective just might change your field. entirely nice that was Audrey Audrey. short great Emil man Audrey that is. great email so that kind of replaces. that whole like look this famous person. made it you can just tell people let me.

tell you about Audrey short yeah agreed. okay way to go Audrey that's fantastic. congratulations early on um graduating. with a 3.99 man that's impressive uh and. good luck in grad school too uh if you. want to get in touch with us like Audrey. did you can go on to stuff you should. know.com and uh check out the Social. Links there you can also send us an. email send it off to stuff podcast at. howstuffworks.com. stuff you should know is a production of.

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