Plant-Based Diets | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeart. [Music]. Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's. here, too. And this is a good. oldfashioned root and tootin down home. episode of Stuff You Should Know. Technical difficulties. Please stand by. Yeah, we we're a good 20 minutes late, Chuck. Man, because of Well, I was about. to say me. It's not my fault. No, it's.

not your fault. It's the um computer's. fault. Not. even. But who cares about computers? This is I mean this is probably. literally the opposite of computers. because we're talking about plants. Yeah. Yeah. Um I was going to ask you. old school Chuck. Mhm. Have you ever. eaten a plant? I love living things so I do not kill. plants and eat. So, are you a. breitarian?

That's what they are, right? Yeah. Where. you just don't eat? Uh, no. Of course I eat plants. Uh, I, you know, Emily, I would argue, has a. plant-based diet. Um, now that I know. that a plant-based diet doesn't mean. that you're vegan or vegetarian. And it. just and you know as as you'll see. depending on the percentage of the. website you look at uh a lot of people. say like you know it really depends on. how much you eat and a certain. percentage like maybe 80% of your diet. is plant-based and that's easily Emily.

she eats vegetables constantly. She always has like a radish in her. hand. No, but just her meals, like her. meals, she'll cook like we try to eat. the same stuff, but I don't want to sit. down and eat Brussels sprouts, broccoli, and cauliflower for dinner. That's a. plant-based diet for sure. Yeah. But. she'll throw some chicken in there and. some fish. So, she's sort of pescatarian. plus. Mhm. Maybe. Yeah. Pescaultarian. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of terms for.

all this stuff. I didn't know about a. third of these, probably. Yeah. They all. seem to fall under the umbrella term, like you said, a plant-based diet. So, like a vegan diet is a plant-based diet, but not all plant-based diets are like. vegan diets. That kind of setup. I had. never heard of lacto vegetarian, which. basically means throw out all the rest, but I'll eat dairy. Yeah, understandable. There's also. oovearian. These are terrible names, by. the way. Yeah, that means that you um. include eggs in your vegan diet. Yeah,

not oval. That would make even more. sense, I think. No, it means that you. include om in your diet. Yeah. Um but I. should say it's not a vegan diet at all. Like you can't have any kind of um. animal products. Nope. In a vegan diet. Not just like meat or dairy or eggs, but. like vegan won't eat honey. Yeah. We. talked about fig wasps recently. They. won't eat figs for that reason. Uh, I. think some vegans I I found a lot of. support behind vegans saying like a.

processed wasp part in a thing is fine. Okay. I'll bet there's some that still. won't. Oh, sure. Um, and then there's. also lactoovo. vegetarian. You're a vegetarian but you. eat eggs and dairy. There's lactoovo. bacon. vegetarian. And then there's what you. said Emily was pescatarian which is. generally I mean you're you're. essentially just you know you're eating. more vegetables than the average person.

at this point if you're a pescatarian. I. think that's right. Uh no comment on. what that does to your butt. Uh what if you just eat seafood? No. If. you eat nothing but broccoli and. cauliflower all day long. Oh yeah. Not. just your butt but like the well-being. of people around you too. Yeah. But it's. it's very good for you. She's a much. healthier human than I am. Nice. Well, not not the part that you're not as. healthy, but I'm glad that she is. Yeah, of course. Uh, one thing we should point.

out early on is that uh there's a sort. of exhaustive look at how much meat. people eat around the world at a certain. point or kind of peppered throughout. Mhm. And just for comps purposes in the. United States, uh, we average per capita. meat consumption, uh, between 123 to. 150ish kilograms, depending on where. you're looking. So, just kind of put. that in your in the back in your back. pocket when we start talking about other. countries. Yeah. And that that really.

kind of came home to me when I converted. it to quarter pounders. Yeah. What's. that? Or in Europe, Royale with cheese. That's 1332 quarter pounders a year. That means you're eating almost four. quarter pounders worth of meat a day. every year at 151.4 kg. Man, if only you. could do that and live, right? That's. called heaven, my friend. Uh so clearly. with those kind of numbers that the US. is a meatbased culture. Uh I mean plenty.

of people here do not take part in that. kind of thing obviously but as you'll. see many cultures around the world um. historically have plant-based diets and. still have plant-based diets. Depending. on who you ask they might say there's. about two billion meat-based eaters in. the world and about four billion. plant-based eaters. Yeah. So I mean. that's not too bad. They're really. holding things up because I mean if. you're if actually that's more than. that's the majority the m you're saying.

the majority of the world is plant-based. diet. I'm saying two billion and four. billion. I'm not I'm not weighing in on. percentages. Okay. Yeah. We we'll go around the world. in a minute, but let's go through. history for a little bit first. Okay. Because plant-based diets, especially in. the West, they're kind of like a new. thing. Maybe they came out of the New. Age movement in the 70s and 80s. No. Um, this is really old stuff. In fact, you. can make a really good case that. plant-based diets, especially like a.

flexitarian version, is essentially the. default diet of humans. Yeah. I mean, it's in some cases or actually in a lot. of cases, especially historically. speaking, and still in some places. today, it's sort of the deacto diet. because that's what you have and um you. may not have the kind of money to like. go get really good meat or something. like that. So if you look back through. time and you go back to say like Ireland. in the 19th century uh before the potato. famine, they were eating tons of.

potatoes. There were a lot of poor. people in Ireland that were like, "Hey, we can grow potatoes. They have some. vitamins and minerals. Maybe we can milk. a cow and eat a little uh pickled. herring." But other than that, we're. eating lots and lots of potatoes. Yeah, for sure. This is before the famine when. a potato blight came. Um, and when the. Irish immigrants really started to come. on mass to the United States in the, uh, 19th century, um, they were quite. surprised at the abundance and.

availability and cheapness of meat in. the United States. And that apparently. dates back to colonial times where. colonists in uh, well, what would become. the United States were eating more meat. than the average person back in England. like they were eating essentially the. same amount of meat as elites back in. the UK. And that's a the long-standing. thing where meat consumption throughout. history in most places is associated.

with a higher status an elite status. You're wealthier because it's always. been harder to come by. Well, the. colonies had a lot more land so they. could grow a lot more livestock and then. hence eat a lot more meat. Yeah. Had a. lot more land. Asterist. You're right. Well, yeah. Everyone knows what we mean. by that. Uh, yeah. And you know, there's. uh who helped us with the original. version of this? Was it Libya? No, Laura. All right. The claw. Dr. Claw. Dr. Claw. Uh, she dug up a a graph.

basically about how Italians eat. And. prior to uh well, not that long ago, they ate what you would call the. Mediterranean diet now. And they just. called it what we eat because that's. what's around here, right? The diet. Yeah, exactly. Fruit, vegetables, olive. oil, uh legumes, fish, cereals, not a. ton of dairy or meat. Um but they after. I believe after World War II, they. started eating um a lot more meat. Um.

before that, it was basically a. plant-based diet. Uh because as you'll. see once again, no, no, no, Chuck. They're eating lots of fish. Plant-based. diet is we're talking about meat here. uh their fish get a pass, I guess, as. far as plant-based diet goes. It does. not mean vegetarian or vegan, right? And. Italy followed the same trajectory that. um most nations do. Once they reach a. certain point of prosperity, meat. consumption just starts going through. the roof. Um whereas before in history, elites like individual groups of people.

who are well off could afford meat, when. an entire nation becomes welloff enough, they start buying meat, meat consumption. just goes up. So after the war, Italy. followed that. And it you'll see like. throughout throughout the world, the. more um prosperous a nation, the higher. their meat consumption almost almost to. a country. Yeah. Which, you know, a. cynic might say, well, if every every. nation was prosperous, everyone would. just eat tons of meat. Uh and it sounds.

cynical, but like the data sort of says. what you just said, right? you know um. if you look at the US in the 19th. century uh they were roundly encouraging. to people eat lots and lots of meat. Uh. there was a kala outbreak in 1832 and. the US government said eat more meat and. drink more alcohol and lay off the. fruits and vegetables. uh obviously. because of chalera, but there was also. just this idea in America early on um.

that like you know we're we're wellfed. and we're well bred because we eat red. meat and and we grow them big here in. the States. We're not sitting around. eating rice and grains and potatoes. Yeah. And that um that diet has just. spread throughout the world. But again, it doesn't necessarily seem to mean. because people are emulating the United. States. It just seems like the United. States was following a trajectory that. other countries are now, right? Yeah. And hey, what a great time to set up.

where countries are now because remember. those numbers I told you about the. United States. We're going to walk you. around the world, everybody. Not in the. wayback machine. Uh what do we call this. when we're just currently the go far. machine? Yeah, the go far and wide. machine. Mhm. It still has that um new. imaginary machine smell in it. Nice modern day jump in the go far and.

wide machine and come with us. Uh at. first to Africa uh if you look at. continentwide the stat is about 65 gram. I'm sorry 65 kg of meat per capita. Uh I. I wonder about that number because if. you break it down for per country, South. Africa uh they eat about 65.2 kg. compared to let's say the dem uh. Democratic Republic of Congo at just. over 4 kg. Mhm. Who's who's eating more.

red meat in Africa than South Africa to. make that average 65? I don't know. One. thing that I I recognized from. researching this is that there are so. many stats that are so different and. estimates that are just so different and. don't understand why it's so hard to. track something like meat consumption. Like we've got that so commoditized that. I mean I don't understand how we can't. track it even for the United States. You. you rattled off three different.

estimates for how much meat the United. States eats. So, who knows, Chuck? Who. really knows whether any of these. numbers are correct or not? Well, it's. No one's ever asked me how much meat I. eat. I could skew that. Have you? Oh, I. get that all the time. Usually because I. have like a big chunk of like steak in. my teeth. No, no, no. I mean like an. official study like I I don't know how I. know. I'm just kidding. Do any of that. stuff. It's It's sort of like weird. black magic to me. But we do know uh. that generally speaking uh West African.

nations eat a little more meat. It's a. little more meat heavy than East African. nations. Um, but even in West Africa, that's again, I mean, if the average per. capita was 65 kilograms, that's like. less than half the United States per. capita, right? Yeah. The I I'm guessing. from what I could tell, the United. States leads the world in meat. consumption, I'm sure. Um, most other. countries, depending on where they are, are going to eat a lot less. But again, like you said, Africa is not some single.

monolith. It has a bunch of different. variation. Asia is the same way. On the. whole, Asia eats far less meat compared. to one another. Some eat more, some eat. less. And you get all sorts of weird. little statistical blips that come up. from that. Yeah. If you uh if you look. at the top 10 countries around the world. with the highest rates of vegetarianism, um India and Taiwan are on there. So, two of the top 10 are in Asia. Um, Japan. and China, they aren't on the list of. top 10 percentage.

vegetarian-wise, but they eat a lot less. meat than the US at an average per. capita consumption under 75 kg. Yeah. And Taiwan's a good example, too. It has. a very high percentage of um, vegetarians, but it also has a really. high per capita meat consumption, too. So, it's just basically wacky over. there. Yeah. And what uh this was. another. um like if you look at Bangladesh, Bhutan, Nepal, Minamar, Cambodia,

Indonesia, and Vietnam, they're all. under 20 kg and Thailand is at like 25. and Laos at 30. So, uh I mean that's way. less than the 75 average in Japan and. China. Yeah, I would guess Thailand and. I'm not sure about Laos, but I would. guess Thailand is. um wealthier than probably Myammar or. Indonesia. I don't know about Vietnam, but I think a lot of it also has to do.

with the religious um like what. religions are predominant there too. Yeah. which we'll get in well actually. we should take a break before we do that. but we'll talk about India real quick. because uh they have the highest. proportion of vegetarians in the world. um close to 40% 38% 39% are vegetarian. in India um for you know obvious reasons. uh and 6.6 six kilograms of meat per. capita compared to as many as 150 for. the US. Yeah, exactly. That's very low.

It is very low. All right, we promised. talk of religion because who doesn't. love that? Uh but this is religion as it. relates to diet because depending on. your religion, uh there may be a lot of. you know rules and restrictions on what. they they say you should eat because of. a bunch of reasons. It can uh sometimes. it shows like uh purity, sometimes it's. like no, it shows how dedicated and. faithful you are. Uh sometimes it's like. hey you good at following rules. Uh.

don't eat this on this day and let's see. how you do with that. Uh but for. whatever reason there are plenty of. religions that um have rules sort of. surrounding uh meat for sure. Yeah. Some. of the most famous ones are kosher. That's a big one where you have to. actually separate certain kinds of food. like you separate meat, you separate. dairy. There's also like restrictions. and guidelines on how animals are. slaughtered. So, it's not particularly. vegetarian by nature. Keeping kosher is.

um but it makes you so much more mindful. that a lot of people just eventually end. up being vegetarian just by following a. kosher diet. Um there's also halal is. very similar. It has all sorts of. permissions and bans and stuff like that. on what animals can be eaten, but it's. different in that like there's no. shellfish allowed or birds of prey, but. you can eat rabbits. Um, but they're. they're both similarish in that there. you really have to pay attention to what.

you're eating if you are a genuine. adherent of this religious diet that's. being prescribed to you. Yeah. And if. you're wondering like, well, how does. that affect the rate of vegetarianism in. Israel? uh they are second behind India. Uh that's not the only factor of course. but uh I think the the highest p. percentage of veganism is in Israel too. which is uh yeah that I don't know why. that surprised me but it did. Okay good. noted. Um there's I think so this is another.

thing too like a lot of people just end. up being default vegetarians because of. their religious diet. Um, and another. good example is the Ethiopian Orthodox. Christian Church, which we talked about. in our Holly Salassi episode. I think. they have 200 days a year that are. considered fast days where you just. can't eat meat. Um, but you can eat. plants. So, I mean, for all intents and. purposes, you're at least the majority. of the year a vegetarian if you're um,

Eastern Ethiopian Orthodox. I wonder if. 165 days a year they just party down on. some steak. probably. Uh what? Seventh day. Adventist. Uh it's not a requirement to. be a vegetarian, but they're like it's. not a bad way to live. They kind of. endorse it. Yeah. Remember they grew out. of that whole um uh William Keith and. John Kellogg um movement of the 19th. century. Yeah. uh they endorse um the. movement generally, but about 36% end up.

uh lactoovo vegetarians and then 16% I'm. sorry, an additional 16% eat plant-based. diet uh with maybe a little fish, maybe. a little bit of meat. Yeah. Um Buddhism. is very connected to vegetarianism uh. like a straightforward religious decree. like um uh like kosher. Instead, it's. linked to nonviolence, right? So, if. your your religion forbids violence, you.

can't really cut the head off of a. chicken and eat it very easily. Um, people still do in Buddhist countries, but it's much more or it's much less. common and frequent. And in fact, apparently in Japan from 675 to 1872, um, meat was essentially banned in that. country um because of the influence of. Buddhism and Confucianism. You got to. wait on that chicken to die of natural. causes. You're just following around. like a a buzzard. He's not looking so.

good. He He looks a little peeking. Uh. Hindu is I love that word, by the way. Good. I'm glad I used it. I heard that. word last night on the TV show The Pit. And I realized I just don't use it much. You know what I like that's similar is. peckish. I like peckish as well. Yeah, me too. Maybe our our musical duo should. be Pit and Peckish. Oh my god, that is. that you just won the band name contest, Chuck, for all time. But everyone would. be like, "Who's peek and who's peckish?". Like, I think Josh is peek and Chuck is.

peckish. It wouldn't matter. We could. both be. It would it would depend on our. mood on any given day. Or perhaps we are. both peaked and peckish. Yeah. At all. times. We're always hungry and we're. always not looking so good. uh Hinduism at almost 80% uh eats a a. plant-based diet but they again it's not. required it's just like hey why don't. you do this that kind of thing heavily. suggested maybe yeah it's also um I mean.

especially since the uh Hindu. nationalist ruling party took over the. Baratia Janata party BJP they um have. been enforcing like really strict rules. that are Hindu in nature. against eating meat. So much so that. people have been beaten. Uh pe I think. one person at least has been lynched for. eating meat or being associated with the. meat trade specifically beef because. cows are considered sacred in Hinduism.

Um and also similarly in India. vegetarianism is linked to social. status. Yeah. uh in in in basically. complete contradiction of what it's like. in say the west where you know eating. meat has long been associated with being. an elite or having high status. Vegetarianism is in India apparently. All right, flip-flopped it. I love it. Yeah. And if you're like, "Wow, 80% of. Hindus are vegetarian. It's pretty.

impressive." Prepare for this. Janes. These are the people who are so against. hurting or killing anything that they. have little hand dust brooms that they. carry with them to dust off seats before. they sit down so they don't actually. accidentally kill a bud. 92% of them and. 59% of seikhs in India are all. vegetarians. And I guess 8% of uh Janes. are bad janes I guess. So, I mean, like, how would you show up to like the Jane.

meeting and and show your face? Yeah. Or. show up to a Jane party with a rack of. ribs, right? That's probably not It's. probably frowned upon, I would say. I. would think so. Uh, all right. So, if. And of course I'm kidding. No, no. offense to any James out there. No, of. course not. I'm sure they'd show up and. be like natural causes and everybody. would be like, heck yeah. Uh, so if you're going to eat a. plant-based diet, it can look like a it. can look many different ways depending.

on what you're into. Um, we found some. information from Harvard Health and. obviously one thing that you're going to. do is eat lots of veggies like Emily. does. Uh, they say like, hey, fill half. your plate up with veggies and vary the. color. Don't eat just like a bunch of. green veggies. Like eat veggies of all. all stripes and colors. Get you some. anthrocyanins, why don't you? Yeah. also. um the way so these are like if you want. to start to get into vegetarianism, these are some easy ways to kind of. slide into it. Another one is um.

changing the way that you think about. meat. Rather than it being the center or. the star of the meal, just kind of put. it to the side. Like it doesn't. necessarily have to be, you know, a. thumbsiz piece of steak, but I mean, if. it more, you know, kind of evenly. resembled the the grain or the greens on. your plate, that would make that would. make a lot more sense. Yeah. I'll have. the cream spinach, side of broccoli, and. a thumb of steak. Right. It's funny. So,

I used thumb. So, have you ever heard. that thing about um a portion of meat. being no bigger than the palm of your. hand for like that's the healthy way to. eat meat? Yes. Uh I don't think I've. heard that but that okay I I could see. that. So, not just that if you cup your. hands that's your serving of fruit and. vegetables and then your thumb is your. measure of fats like a nut butter or. something like that. Okay. There's a. name for all this. It's called the. Zimbabwe hand jive. I I I can I've done.

that dance, but I did not know that was. a eating uh scale. Well, so this guy in. 1993, Dr. Kazim uh Mauji, came up with. this this way of doing it and it's been. widely adopted, but I had no idea that's. what it was called. It's a great name. Um what I do, we host a lot of uh. especially in the spring and summertime. uh of people um when we go to the lake. and just at our house here we have we. throw dinner parties. We just do a lot.

of that kind of stuff. Mhm. Uh and aside. from being exhausting, one thing I'm. just kidding. It's actually a lot of. fun. But um one thing I do and this goes. along with like how you think about meat. and how much meat you have is I don't um. cook up like you know 20 chicken breast. if there's 20 people there. Uh I cook up. uh a bunch of you know whatever kind of. cut of chicken and or steak. Sometimes. I'll do a couple of meats and I will. just I will slice it all up on a big.

platter. Mhm. Uh and then you can just. get a portion of something rather than. saying like here's a gigantic chicken. breast on your plate that you now feel. responsible for, right? And it see. people seem to really like that, you. know, like maybe I'll have a little bit. of this and a little bit of that and. then the rest is our our veggie sides. Nice. Yeah. So that's a tip from Chucky. Yeah. You should just set up a carving. station and ask to see each person's. thumb size. Yeah, that'd save you a. bunch of money. Totally. Um, so, uh,

let's see what else. Oh, another good. one is to, uh, choose different fats, avocados, olive oil, stuff like that. And then, um, just cook at least one. vegetarian meal per week. Um, dip your. toe in the pool. Yeah. And if you start. doing these kind of things, it's. actually really easy to find yourself. down the road like just doing it without. thinking about it. And more and more. meals throughout the week become. vegetarian. um because we'll talk in a. minute about why people do this, but a.

lot of people stop eating as much meat. for health reasons or because they want. to lose weight. Um and if if you just. kind of start, like you said, dip your. toe in like this, it just becomes kind. of second nature over time. Yeah, you. can get used to something like that. Uh. and I think what you'll find if you if. you think you need meat because it like. it's more filling, um that's just not. true. you you get plenty full eating all. that other stuff. Uh so, you know, you. can give it a whirl. I I I do that stuff. every now and then. Um whole grains at.

breakfast is is great. Uh this is. basically again what Emily does. A lot. of oatmeal, uh buckwheat, barley, quinoa. Um eat like a horse, but not as. much as a horse. No. Um, this is a big. one for me, Chuck, is uh eating fruit. for dessert because I don't ever eat. something and um like a meal of any kind. and and not think like, "Okay, now I. have to have something sweet." Oh, really? I I just can't not do it. My. brain just is wired that way. I am too.

Yeah. Okay. So, if you just eat like an. apple or some strawberries or something. like that, it just shortcircuits that. It does it for you. Yeah. I I have just. retrained my brain to where I don't seek. that. And it's not like I was eating. dessert every night. Like the only time. I literally have dessert, like a. dessert, is kind of either if a bunch of. people are out to eat and it's an. occasion or maybe on vacation or. something like that. Um but it's not. like even eating out in a restaurant. We. we never eat dessert like that. But um I.

have found just one square of dark. chocolate um scratches that itch in a. nice way. That always feels like a. punishment to me. Why? Because it's just. one. Just one. And it's dark chocolate. Oh, you don't like dark chocolate? It's. fine, but it's not going to short. circuit that dessert. I You know what? I. used to not be into dark chocolate, but. I love it now. Yeah. Good. I'm glad. I'm. glad to hear that. I'm going to cut the. legs out from under you in a little. while then. But I don't do that every.

night. But I'll still, you know, when I. want that, when I find myself like, God, I got to have the sweet thing the night. I'll do one square, sprinkle a couple of. little dabs of sea salt on top, and that. that does it for me. My god, why don't. you live in Brooklyn? I know. Uh cuz I. don't have a mayonnaise store. Um. greens, too, obviously, like leafy. vegetables, salads, uh just eat as much. stuff like I I love a salad. Um Emily. make, you know, she grows that stuff and. prepares fresh salads, makes her own. salad dressing. Uh she's gotten more.

into cooking. She never used to do stuff. like that at all, but she's um uh that I. found myself eating a lot more salad. these days, right? Uh and then the last. one is after you do all these things, eat more vegetables, uh eat a vegetarian. meal once a week, eat a salad for. dinner. Um the this is actually the key. to the whole thing, go to bed really. early so that your normal breakfast will. come much more quickly. I don't eat. breakfast, but yeah, that was a joke, by the way. I know. I.

get it. Okay. Well, thanks for the laugh. support. Um, you want to take a break. and then come back and talk about why. people become vegetarian or vegan? Sure. Okay. Well, we'll be right back again. [Music]. Learning stuff with Joshua and. Charles. Stuff you should know. [Music].

Okay, Chuck, I think I promised before. we left that we'd talk about why people. become vegetarian. I already said health. reasons, which we'll get into more in a. little while. Um, but a lot of people.

just do it because it's just healthier. Like, if you want to eat healthier, most. people don't like double or triple down. on fried chicken. like you instead start. turning to plants, you know, like people. just start eating more plants and it's. almost intuitive. I don't think it even. has anything to do with the nutritionist. set in the United States convincing. people like plants are healthy. I just. feel like we just intuitively know that. that is healthier than eating like a.

steak or again fried chicken, which I. feel like there's a place for fried. chicken. I'm not knocking that. No. I I. mean, as you know, it's my favorite. food, and I just, you know, I I heard. you. I got to got to pick and choose. with that stuff, but it it's not uh. removed from my life, thank goodness. Um, but you're going to get lots of uh. vitamins and minerals and fiber and. antioxidants in your veggies. Uh if you. eat legumes, if you eat, if you're a. vegetarian, you probably eat lots of. legumes and chickpeas and limema beans.

and stuff like that. Soy, uh you're. going to get lots of uh protein, uh. amino acids, lots of fiber and. antioxidants there. And also no. cholesterol, which is, you know, I have. cholesterol problems genetically. speaking. So, uh and a lot of people do. So, that's a good way to get your. cholesterol down. Yeah. And there's a. lot of variety in just legumes alone. like rather than do you want the chicken. or the fish, there's something like. 20,000 species of legumes. And I didn't. know this. I ran across this Chuck.

There's a category of food called. neglected and underutilized legumes. The. saddest legume. They even have an. acronym for nuls, right? And there's. apparently a ton of legumes that are. found around the world that are known to. like local cuisine that are just waiting. to be adopted to kind of make the the. plant-based diet even more varied. Yeah. I mean, I I there's 20,000. I probably. have had five. Yeah. Actually, maybe.

more, but I don't know. I know. No, I. know what you mean. Yeah. I just had and. I So, one of the one of the ones um I. found was the Bombara groundnut. You. would make a trillion dollars if instead. of a mayonnaise operation, you opened a. bombara groundnut operation in Brooklyn. Yeah, for sure. I mean, you would make. so much cash, dude, overnight. People. just like saying groundnut. Yeah, but. that bombara really sells the ground nut. if you ask me. Yeah, for sure. Um, obviously, you know, we've mentioned the.

concerns with red meat. Uh but with beef. and pork uh people have been you know. calling for years for less of that in. your diet and you know health. practitioners and doctors uh because. obviously you know heart attack, stroke, cancer, all the things that can lead uh. lead you in that direction once you eat. too much red meat. Yeah. And the medical. consensus consensus is and remains so um. that eating red meat, too much red meat. is bad for you. like it just leads to.

all sorts of negative health outcomes. like stroke and heart attack, heart. disease, things like that. Um the. problem is despite that consensus, studies still come out fairly regularly. that question that idea that say no it's. not necessarily true and they usually. get shouted down. Um but it's enough. that it makes you like some people. question that. I feel like because the. medical consensus is that for now, it's. probably okay to kind of follow that. philosophy that less meat is healthier.

than more meat. Yeah, for sure. Uh, another big big reason is animal welfare. and just maybe your your moral values as. a human. uh that is a a lot of people. switch over to vegetarianism or veganism. because the modern factory farming. system in the United States is is a. horror show and and everybody knows. this. Some people uh some people do it. anyway. Um but it's a big reason, you.

know, like vegans are like, "No, all all. animals um have a right to life and a. right to freedom and we're not doing it. right here in the United States, so I'm. not going to take part in it." Yeah. Um, that's a whole subcategory of veganism. called ethical vegans. And I think that. they could shoulder their own episode. because the whole philosophy behind it. and like the way that they live their. lives, it's really interesting. Um, and. something I ran across that they counter. is the idea of um, carnism eating meat.

um, not being normal and we just take it. for normal. And they um, uh, they. question that. They're like, "Who said. that eating meat is normal?" Um, and. that that's like why people why people. like me can feel bad when I pass like a. a truck full of cows on their way to the. slaughter on the highway and then still. go eat like a cheeseburger that same. day. Um, that we just kind of have this. idea that carnism is normal and vegans. are like, "No, that's not true." So, I.

found that fascinating. I kind of wanted. to get into it a little more. Yeah, for. sure. Uh, I'm not going to tell that. story. Uh mindful eating is another one. which is uh I mean exactly what it. sounds like. Um just instead of like. falling into a pattern and I just I'll. just eat that because that's what I've. always eaten. Uh or you know grab that. thing that's quick and brainless to put. in my mouth. Grab it by the horns. Yeah. to really just have a heightened. awareness of what you're eating, what's.

going in your body, and every impact. from your health to to what it means to. the world and to that animal. Um, just. being more mindful is another reason. that people will go to a plant-based. diet. Yeah. I think that's how people. get to that from like religious mandated. diets. Yeah. Uh, and we'll we'll put. environmentalism in its own category. because there's a a whole section on. that, but that's another reason. Okay. Let's pick up health outcomes. Let's. dive into that a little more. Um, so, uh, one of the things that people figure.

out pretty quickly when they become. vegans in particular is that you can get. really unhealthy really quick just. eating food that qualifies as vegan. food. There's a ton of processed vegan. food out there. A lot of times, a lot of. sweetener, including just sugar, is. added. um and just basically eating. packaged food or even French fries. Um. as long as they're cooked in vegetable. oil, those are vegan and everyone knows. that French fries aren't really good for. you. So there is like a whole um kind of.

blind alley that you have to watch out. for when you get into veganism. Yeah. Uh. I'm not a vegan, but it's I I can still. say, you know, word of caution if you go. that route that um you have to be more. active in in meal planning and because. what you really want to do is eat whole. foods and eat real foods. So if you're. like, I'm going to go vegan and and just. sort of buy this the ultrarocessed stuff.

that is technically vegan, you're not. doing yourself any health favors. uh I. mean you know you're still doing uh and. you know as far as your moral values are. concerned you're doing right by that but. uh you want good outcomes all the way. around so just lean toward whole foods. and the Mediterranean diet which again. uh people around the Mediterranean just. call it eating um that has roundly been. um shown over the years to be kind of. the one of the ideal diets that you can. lean toward. I would say the ideal diet.

I mean, as far as health outcomes go, like I can't imagine how much this diet. has been studied and um result after. result shows that like some kinds of. cancers, diabetes, cognitive decline, cardiovascular disease, um like these. things are all lower in people who eat. like a Mediterranean diet. Like that's. just what they eat than people who. don't, especially regular meat eaters. Yeah, for sure. Uh, as far as the. indivi, you know, we'll kind of go.

through a little bit about like who's. deficient in what depending on what you. eat. Um, if you're looking at protein. and saturated fat, uh, you're going to. have obviously if you're a meat eater, you're going to have the highest intake. among anyone and the lowest is going to. be among vegans. That's just makes a lot. of sense. Uh, if you're a vegetarian or. a fish eater, you're going to be. somewhere in the middle. And vegetarians. are uh more likely than meat or fish. eaters to have uh as a result inadequate. protein intake. And vegans even more.

likely to have inadequate protein intake. I think more than vegetarians. Yeah, that's a long-standing chestnut in like. the um I guess I don't want to say. bodybuilding community. Just people who. work out like hardcore that you can't. possibly be ripped as a vegan. And um. our stuff you should know listener Doyle. Wolf Gang Von Frankenstein, the. guitarist for the Misfits, he is just. vegan to the core and he is totally. ripped and in fact he has his own.

protein powder called Vegan Monster. Protein. Um where you can get ripped. yourself if you want to and still be a. vegan. I think Ripped Vegan is that's. got to already be a band name. Oh, I. would Yeah, maybe that's his sideband. His folk sideband. ripped vegan. Uh you might have a uh vitamin B12. deficiency if you are a vegan because. plants don't have B12. Um I think 52% of.

vegans are B12 deficient. Uh 7% of. vegetarians and if you're a meat eater, you have a less than 1% chance of being. B12 deficient. And that's a big deal. too. I mean like that is a well-known. problem for vegans and vegetarians. because uh B12 is used for red blood. cell production, cell wall production, nerve function, DNA production, and it's. just not in plants. It's in meat, it's. in fish, it's in dairy. So, you really. have to pay attention to that and and. basically take B12 supplements all the.

time to make sure you don't become. deficient because it's not good. Yeah, for sure. Um, here's one thing though, and this is something that was. controlled for BMI. Even if you were. vegetarian or vegan, you have a kind of. a remarkably uh a remarkable statistical. uh risk or higher risk, I guess, of of. getting bone fracture than meat eater. Uh, and especially when it comes to your. hips, the risk of hip fracture, uh, with. vegetarians, you have a 25% higher risk. of fracturing your, uh, your hip as a.

vegetarian, uh, controlling for BMI. again. and vegans 131% higher chance of. hip fracture. Yeah. I So part of it is. that B12 deficiency because B12 helps um. produce bone and so bone density, but I. also wondered if vegans typically get. less protein and therefore have less. muscle mass on average. Obviously you. can get ripped as a vegan, but not. everyone does. if you're more. susceptible to falling, like you can. lose your balance more easily because.

you have slightly less muscle mass than. a meat eater. And then with with less. bone density, if you do fall, you're. more likely to break a bone. Just my I. wonder. Yeah. Yeah, I did mention. cancer. You know, I think we often talk. about like heart attack and stroke and. stuff like that uh by eating too much. red meat. Um, but cancer is another. factor that I sort of briefly mentioned, but if you're a vegetarian or a vegan, uh, you have a 10 to 18% lower risk of. cancer than meat eaters, uh, although,

um, all cause all cause mortality. That's a another good band name. And. that's three band names. Mhm. All Cause. mortality. This is peckid peckish and. peek. Uh, all calls. See, I I that can't. be our band name because I can't even. say it at the end of the show. all dash. cause mortality was not different uh. which is surprising between uh. vegetarians and meateers and vegans. Yeah. Another thing that surprised me is. that vegetarians have a 20% higher risk.

of having a hemorrhagic stroke. Uh there. so we should say all of this data came. from a 2021. um analysis of this British cohort of. 65,000 Brits that have been followed. around since the '9s. So they managed to. look at 20,000 vegetarians. So this is a. pretty robust study and they found that. they have a 20% higher um risk of. stroke. They couldn't they couldn't. determine that for vegans. I think they.

only had like 200 in this cohort, but. for for stroke at least, they weren't. able to figure out how how that affects. vegans. You would assume that it would. be even an even higher percentage for. vegans, but a hemorrhagic hemorrhagic. stroke is where blood vessels in your. brain start bleeding. Again, that would. make sense because B12 helps um fortify. cell walls. Yeah. And um I would think. the lack of red blood cell production. would have something to do with that. too. So I think what we're trying to say.

the upshot is it's not just like a slam. dunk that you're going to be healthier. or your your lifetime health outcomes. are automatically going to be better. Um. but it still I mean it's just if if your. overall or sorry if your all-c cause. mortality is going to be the same then I. don't know. I I think that kind of makes. an argument to eat whichever makes you. feel best. Yeah. H that's just a weird. stat. Yeah. The all dash cause. Um yeah,

I don't know. I can't explain it. Maybe. someone will have some more information. on that. Uh but earlier we did promise. an entire section on the environmental. impact of eating animals because that is. uh that is yet another reason and you. know obviously people have all kinds of. reasons and it's usually a combination. of all these things but we we're. learning just it's become plainly. obvious more and more this isn't the. kind of thing I think that especially in. America people like to look at a lot in. the past but it seems like in the last. like 15 years or so people are sounding.

the alarm like, hey, besides ethical. concerns and health and all that other. stuff, like raising animals is to eat is. kind of a uh or the the way we do it is. a disaster for the environment. Yeah. So, there's a lot of misleading stats. out there that compare the amount of. kilogram kilograms of greenhouse gas. emissions compared to the kilograms. produced of something, right? That. doesn't make any sense because a.

kilogram of broccoli is a lot less um as. far as food being spread among people. than a kilogram 2.2 pounds of beef. Right. You can feed way more people with. 2.2 pounds of beef than you can with 2.2. pounds of broccoli. So other people one. and a half people. Exactly. At best. Yeah. Um but so some people have said, "Well, let's just alter it a little bit. So we'll measure the kilograms of. greenhouse gas emissions for every. thousand calories produced. And so that.

makes it a lot more apples to apples. comparison. Yeah. But even still, when. you alter it like that, the numbers. essentially come out the the same, which. is that meat production has a much. larger carbon footprint than almost any. kind of plant production. Although there. are some surprises like for example your. beloved dark chocolate has a larger. carbon footprint than producing poultry. or pork. Chuck, how do you feel about. your dark chocolate with salt on top of. it? Now I didn't kill that chocolate. Uh.

I you know coffee and chocolate are are. two pretty notorious uh you know um. environmental disasters as well on the. on the non-meat side. For sure. For. sure. The reason why apparently is. demand um there's so much demand for. chocolate that uh the deforestation that. results to create more fields for cocoa. production. Um that that just is what's. giving it such a huge footprint. And I. think coffee is relatively the same.

Um overall though I found a 2019 study. from sustainability the journal and they. basically said 30 vegetarians have 33%. lower greenhouse gas emissions based on. their diet than a vegan or than meat and. a vegan diet has 53% lower greenhouse. gas emissions. It's just that's just how. it goes. Yeah. Uh and and if you're like. well I like eating some meat. Um, the. biggest offenders there are beef, lamb,

and mutton. I thought that was weird. Uh, beef produces 60 kilograms of. greenhouse gas emissions uh per. kilogram. And a kilogram of poultry is. only six uh and but you compare that to. a kilogram of just some some English. peas, that's under one kilogram of. greenhouse gas emissions produced. So, you might think that as far as water. consumption goes, the plants would far. outpace uh like a meat diet because you. got a water vegetables. Uh but.

generally, there are just a few. plant-based foods that have a bigger. water footprint than beef. Yeah, beef is. just the worst offender of all. Um but. livestock, raising livestock in general, apparently 15 to one quarter of all the. water used by humans goes to raising. livestock, which is nuts. But the reason. why is because not only do you need. water to keep that head of cattle alive. until you decide to kill it, um you also. need water to grow the grain that you.

feed that head of cattle. So they're. just consuming all over the place, especially as far as water is concerned. Yeah. And just so you know, there are. like zero um sort of vegetables that. outpace beef. The the the two that do. outpace beef that I was referring to are. chocolate and almonds. Yeah. And who considers an almond a. vegetable? Come on, give it up. Uh, and. I think as far as lamb and mutton go, the two other biggest defenders in the. meat category, um, only cashews, pistachios, and hazelnuts, uh, consume.

more water to produce than lamb and. mutton. Hazelnuts are so great. Far and. away the best nut, you think? Not the. ground nut. I haven't had one yet. Well, peanuts apparently are a ground nut. I. have not had the Bombara ground nut yet, so I should wait and reserve judgment. Yeah, peanuts. They grow underground, right? Yep. They're a ground nut. I can. just see Jimmy Carter holding a big uh. thing of peanuts and roots with dirt. falling off of them. RIP and God bless. that man. That's right. Uh the US.

maintains about 9 billion 9 billion. livestock uh to get the meat that it. needs or or wants, I guess, is the. better way to say it. Uh, and if that. grain went to uh, humans, it'd be enough. for 840 million people that have. plant-based diets. Yes. And there was. another um thing that I came across that. I was kind of surprised by that totally. makes sense is if we on mass as a as a. species, humans essentially abandoned.

livestock production, beef production or. meat production in favor of a. plant-based diet just basically. globally. the chance of communicable. diseases developing would drop. drastically because 75% of emerging. communicable diseases are zunotic, which. means humans get them from animals and. we make our closest contact with animals. through the livestock industry. Yeah. And at petting zoos. Yeah. I mean, as as.

long as it wasn't grown in a lab, you. can kiss communicable diseases goodbye. Yeah. Uh the other uh environmental. disaster of raising livestock and and. this is more and more lately is the. habitat uh destruction to raise all. these animals. Um you're talking about. extinction of um plant and animal. species and thousands more being. threatened in the in the uh years. upcoming because of habitat destruction. Uh and it's also true for some kinds of. agriculture. You know, we've talked. about palm oil cultivation being a big.

problem for for a lot of stuff, specifically uh orangutang populations. or at least by example. Uh but beef once. again is the biggest factor. Uh they. drive 40 beef drives 41% of tropical. deforestation globally. Uh whereas uh. palm oil and soy, which are two sort of. offenders on the other side, are only. 18% combined. That's all just 18% of. deforestation. Yeah. But I I mean the. one takeaway here is is beef uh beef.

bad. It's what's for dinner and what. ruined the planet. Yeah. I mean it's. it's the it's far and away leading the. way in all all the bad categories, you. know. It really does. Um so yeah, I mean. this is we've just kind of touched the. surface, especially on the environmental. impact. There's a lot to dig into there. if that interested you. Um but I I feel. like we gave some good reasons for. people to adopt a plant-based diet. I. don't know if I'm going to fully, but. I'd like to think it's I'm kind of.

partway there already. Yeah, I eat more. vegetables now. I eat way less red meat. than I used to. Yeah. Um for just like. all the reasons that we talked about. Yeah. I've cut my four quarter pounders. with cheese every day in half and I eat. both halves. Uh, since Chuck kind of laughed at my. last joke, I think everybody that means. we should probably slog along to. listener mail. That was a real laugh. That was an Oh, Josh laugh. Yeah, I know. I love those,

too. All right. Uh, this uh this from a. smithy uh because because of us, actually. Oh, yeah. I saw this one. Uh, hey guys. I've always had a bit of an. interest in metalworking, and as of. about 5 years ago, I've had an interest. in your show. Uh, I'd say your show has. been the longest running podcast of my. life, actually. Uh, I remember listening. to your episode about blacksmithing four. years ago, and that kind of set off the. domino effect of me getting really into. blacksmithing as a hobby. I'm definitely. one of those that liked to collect. hobbies with most passing in about 6.

months, and I never pick it up again. But not true with blacksmithing. I've. stuck with it since your episode came. out, and I'd like to say I've come a. long way with it. I've attached a few. pictures of my work, which is very good, by the way. Mhm. uh starting with early. works and all the way to the two I. completed about a week ago. Uh I thought. you might be interested in seeing how. your show kicked off one of my favorite. hobbies I've ever had. So, thanks for. that. And that is from uh Tate Avent. Uh. and you can find Tate. Just look up. Tater Makes. T A I T E R M A K E S. And.

check out Tate's work. Well, thanks a. lot, Tate. That is awesome. Congratulations on your awesome hobby. and getting so good at it. And uh we. really appreciate you letting us know. that we had some sort of small tiny. impact on you. We love hearing that kind. of thing. If you want to be like Tate. and let us know that we had some small. tiny impact on you, please send it via. email to stuffodcast@. [Music]. iheartradio.com. Stuff you should know. is a production of iheartradio. For more.

podcasts iHeart Radio, visit the. iheartradio app, Apple podcasts, or. wherever you listen to your favorite. shows. [Music].