Night of the Grizzlies | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

welcome to stuff you should know a. production of iHeart. [Music]. Radio hey everybody and welcome to the. podcast I'm Josh Clark and there's. Charles W Chuck Bryant Jerry's here too. and this is stuff you should know let's. go oh you like that one I did and also. like this title that Livia gave this one. yes it's very fun can I read it sure the. night that transformed bare human.

relations it's pretty straightforward. and says everything you need to say yeah. it's actually uh sadly very accurate. yeah and yet despite it being that. straightforward there's a pretty uh. interesting story hidden am amid those. letters sounds like a cross word clue it. does I feel like we should tell that. story now or else really what are we. doing here. Chuck uh all right well I think this is. one of those uh unfortunately we can't.

just sort of play out as a teaser to. reveal what happens I think we kind of. need to say what actually happened and. then tell that story yeah um all right. did you want to tease this thing out no. okay I'm just being difficult because. what we're talking about is is a very. sad night uh August of. 1967 when two young women two. 19-year-old women were killed uh by two. and here's the the kicker two different. bears in two different places in the.

same National Park um if it was one bear. that just went crazy or something and. they were all camping together that. would be obviously tragic but not like. hey we need to really look at what's. going on here and that's what happened. because it was two bears in two places. yeah and the reason why it was such a. kicker is because in the 57 years. leading up to that that Glacier National. Park was a national park only three. other people had ever been killed by. grizzly bears and then all of a sudden.

it it went from three people in 57 years. to two women in two separate incidents. in one night that is crazy and it really. did kick off this a national. conversation about should grizzly bears. stay alive as a species because we like. living in National Parks do we have the. right to do that kind of thing um it's a. pretty interesting story it's got a lot. of facets to it and I feel like we. should talk a little bit about grizzly. bears first because I didn't realize. that they were just a subspecies of.

brown bear although that makes a lot of. sense yeah Grizzlies are brown bears uh. they are generally darker than brown. bears in Coloring they're generally. smaller uh they can be you know a couple. hundred pounds up to about 600 but they. uh and it's interesting here because I. think it depends on where you live and. who you ask like usually uh brown bears. are called brown bears when they're more. Coastal uh like the ones you see like. grabbing that salmon out of the river. you would call a brown bear I thought.

that was a. Grizzly whereas if you live inland and. you're a bear a brown bear you're called. a Grizzly but then I also saw people. talking about Coastal Grizzlies so it. may be one of those names has just sort. of uh been tacked onto a lot of kind of. brown bears yeah I think it's just you. know it's confusing yeah but they're. brown bears yeah they're brown bears. which makes them you know and they're a. relatively small brown bear there's a. type of brown bear called a Kodiak that. gets up to 10 ft tall when it's standing.

on its um hind legs no thank you. Grizzlies are not nearly that big but. they're still big enough I mean the the. males can get up to about 600 lb and. there used to be a lot more of them than. there are today uh the early 19th. century I think um I think around the. time of Lewis and Clark there was an. estimated 50,000 to 100,000 grizzly. bears they went all the way from Canada. down to Mexico they were in every what's. now States along the west all the way.

over to the Great Plains there was a ton. of them and then as we started to move. out there we meaning white American. settlers and col yeah. colonists um part of what that whole. Westward Expansion included was not just. wiping out Native Americans it was also. wiping out large carnivores too yeah. like when they talk about taming the. West that's what they mean it's like. let's go out there and kill things right. uh and they did this for a few reasons. sometimes it was because they had uh.

cattle that they wanted to take care of. or you know occasionally if they thought. they were In Harm's Way they might kill. a bear but a lot of it was just that. sort of uh I was about to say human. nature but really man's uh nature at. least some men not me or you to want to. kill big beautiful animals uh because. they're big and beautiful and you know I. guess could be considered dangerous yeah. you got to keep an eye on those people. cuz they can very quick become real like.

most dangerous game types right that's. right so by the time 1967 rolls around. when the two uh 19-year-old women who. died lost their lives uh and I'll just. go ahead and say their names are Julie. hel hel helgason man and Michelle Coons. um by the time they died in August of. 1967 grizzly bears um had been wiped out. so thoroughly that they had a territory. that was about 2% of what it had once.

been mostly they were in National Parks. because those were protected areas and. um there was something like under a. thousand of them in the entire. continental United States yeah that's uh. 2% is great when you're talking milk. it's not great when you're talking about. animal populations did you write that. one down I didn't it just came to me. when very nice uh here's the weird thing. though is and it seems rather. counterintuitive uh there were there. were more even though there were fewer. Bears there were more encounters with.

these bears for this very reason and as. we'll see this is what uh part of what. led to this this huge mess um and it's. really hard to if you if you're our age. uh and maybe obviously younger you don't. realize that national parks weren't. always these places where they really. were smart about everything they did. right because at the time um they would. do some crazy things in National Parks. they would try and get Bears around they. would leave food out uh they would there.

was one story here that Olivia found. where and a luckily a park ranger kind. of stopped this in the ACT but these. parents brought a bear over with some. food with a candy bar and then tried to. put their 18-month-old on this Bear's. back to take a picture yeah there's a. story in that same article about a guy. who was trying to lure a bear into his. car to get a photo of it behind the. wheel yeah um just people interacting. with again 600 lb grizzly bears they can. just take your head clean clean off if. they want to but that's the thing uh.

they are really unpredictable and for. the most part they're vegetarians I. think plants make up something like 90%. of their diets and a lot of times. they're I don't want to say docel but. the the the 18-month-old baby survived. and so did the mom and so did the dad if. that bear had acted any differently they. wouldn't have survived so I saw that. their um personalities can best be. summed up as unpredictable but at the. time in the' 60s that is not the. impression people had of Bears um they.

were kind of considered a lot more. gentle there was a a park ranger um who. was quoted by Jack olssen who will meet. in a little while who said that on a. scale of uh a danger scale where a. butterfly is a zero and a rattlesnake is. a 10 the Grizzlies of Glacier Park would. have to rate somewhere between zero and. one that is entirely wrong he really. should have said they rate between a. zero and a 10 and you have no idea which. what what it's going to be be uh at any.

given moment if you encounter a bear. yeah and you know like a lot of large uh. animals like this uh when there is a uh. you know their accident so I'm going to. call it an accidental killing uh because. Bears weren't like ooh human let me go. eat them like you said they're mostly. vegetarian and even when they ate stuff. that was nonvegetarian it wasn't like oh. boy let me go Chow Down on that person. it was let me go Chow Down on that. person's steak by the fire or the fish. that they're cooking or something like. that and so when there is an accident.

it's it's usually one of a couple of. things it's either the sort of familiar. scenario of where you stumble upon a. bear and scare them or they may have. their cubs around it might be a mama. with some Cubs or it is that bear that's. like wait a minute that's my food you're. eating that fish out of that River I. want it so let's go yeah apparently they. defend their food like it's it's je like. with the most jealous violence that they. need to like that is their food even if. it's your food food yeah exactly cuz.

that bear thinks it's their food because. it's their territory uh and the other. thing that um liia was Keen to point out. which is like it it sounds sort of funny. at first but it really is is a thing. that you need to pay attention to is the. Yogi Bear cartoon was a big thing and. Yogi and Boo Boo as these sort of. friendly Bears going after the piik AIC. basket that came about because that's. what it was like it wasn't like someone. said I got this crazy idea let's take. these ferocious animals and make them.

Hannah Barbara and let's let's make them. into a a lovable cartoon character it. was like no that's when you went to. these national parks like you said. people are luring Bears around they're. like ooh take my pick AIC basket if I. can take a picture a pick a pick pick a. picture pick aure I'm trying to make. that into a funny pick AIC thing anyway. that's how things work so that's why. they made that cartoon and that was just. sort of what was going on like they. literally at Glacier at one oh I'm sorry.

this was at Yellowstone but they were. doing similar things in Glacier at. Yellowstone they put bleachers up around. the open air dumps so people could show. up and watch the Bear show which was. Bears wandering in to eat yeah so a lot. of people rightfully lay a lot of the. blame for the deaths in 1967 at the feet. of the administrators of national parks. at the time because they were using the. Bears as entertainment and at the very. least even if they weren't in some of. the Parks they were not instructing the.

public on how to interact with bears and. just how dangerous bears were and that. was a huge problem because like you said. people were treating them like they were. just these docel gentle animals that. wouldn't do them any harm and then the. other Factor um that uh kind of gets. overlooked is that this is right after. the national highway system had really. been developed and people were hitting. the road so these national parks were. suddenly just swamped with tourists for. the first time in their history so. people were there were far fewer bears. but there were a lot more people all up.

in the Bears grills than there ever had. been in human history yeah and leading. up to this specific incident we'll you. know we'll detail a little bit more of. this uh after I guess we'll take a break. here in a couple of minutes but uh at. Glacier there were sort of in the days. leading up there were a lot of alarming. incidences where bears were becoming way. more uh aggressive or if you're watching. a cartoon way more friendly than they. had been uh there were fires that came. through the park the summer of ' 67 so.

that shrank their habitat some and kind. of squeezed them into a smaller area and. there was one bear in particular that uh. had a uh had been reported a few. different times I went back I'm sure you. did too and read uh this great original. Sports Illustrated article um who was it. that wrote that Jack Olen yeah Jack. olssen is kind of the standard account. of this uh horrific event but this bear. it was an emaciated female who is. underweight uh had been reported a a lot. going up to people being very Brazen and.

you know not like typically when you see. a bear if you ever watch these outdoor. shows you start yelling at the bear like. get out of here or clanking a pot and. the bear usually is going to leave uh. bears are scared and they don't want to. be around people but this bear was not. taking any orders and not doing any of. the things that a bear would usually do. it would just come into a camp and start. eating and not leave until they wanted. to leave this this skinny lady bear. right so we have in the Western National.

Park system uh a situation where Bears. have become acclimated to humans they're. totally fine with being really close to. humans kind of not scared of us and then. also they had um become habituated on. human food and garbage and they they now. Associated humans with food and they. were no longer scared of humans there. were a huge population of bears in the. western parks with lots of humans coming. to see them all right well let that.

sounds like a very natural place to stop. thanks and never come. back but we do we have to tell this this. bad story so we'll be back right after. [Music]. this. [Music].

all right so uh we're going to take this. one uh horrible incident at a time uh. and we're going to start with the story. of uh who you mentioned earlier Julie uh. heg helgason man that is really hard for. some reason it is I want to say a. different word but it's uh it was Julie. helgason uh she was from Minnesota and. she was 19 years old yeah um along with. her friend that we're going to meet who. also lost her life Michelle Coons they.

were both working summer jobs at Glacier. uh I imagine in the late 60s at Glacier. it was uh it was probably pretty great I. mean glacier's an amazing place even. today uh but back then I imagine it was. a pretty awesome summer job to have yeah. so I think uh Julie was working in the. laundry facility and Michelle was. working in a gift shop and that that. makes the whole thing even more bizarre. to me because they knew each other um. they both set out on separate hikes on. the afternoon of Saturday August 12th.

1967 and they knew each other well. enough that um Julie and her crew. invited Michelle or no vice versa. Michelle and her crew of five other. friends and a dog named squirt um. invited Julie and her friend I I'm. getting boyfriend Vibes Roy dukit uh to. to join them but U Michelle and her. group were going somewhere uh I think. they were going to Trout Lake and um. Julie and Roy had been to Trout Lake the.

weekend before so they wanted to go on a. different hike to Granite Park Chalet. and they all set out and these were. these were experienced hikers they knew. what they were doing and they were off. to have a good um weekend overnight. camping trip out in the woods in the. back country is what they call it but. the back country is another word for. wild territory that's right uh I imagine. they you know we say they knew each. other imagine it was a pretty tight-knit. group uh back then there were many many. more employees now at these national. parks and there were back then uh and.

you know these they were the same age. and they were teens working this like. amazing summer job so we're talking. about helgason and ducat at this point. they hitchhiked uh to this and if you've. ever driven down this road it's amazing. it's called the going to the Sun Road uh. it's the main roadway through well it is. but it's really great well it's really. not because you don't actually go to the. sun I guess be going toward the Sun Road. would be what it should be called uh but. they went to uh spend the night at the. Chalet uh initially but the Chalet was.

full and so back in the days where when. you could be surprised by something like. that and and when they got there they. they saw it was full and they said all. right well we'll just go camp about 500. yards away we'll go camp in the woods. sort of the immediate back country and. they ate dinner they watch the sunset. off that road and they I take it they. didn't have tents cuz they thought they. were going to beat the Chalet so they. just beded down in their sleeping bags. on the ground outside I've seen sleeping. bag oh FYI that's why I took it to.

possibly be her boyfriend but um they. could have zipped them together that old. move there's there's one thing that um. yeah I guess so I forgot you could do. that um there's one thing we should say. about the Chalet Granite Park Chalet. that they hiked to and were camping near. that was the site of a um a purposeful. feeding area that the managers of the. Chalet were throwing out food scraps to. attract the Bears for the entertainment. of their guests and just four days. before this uh some Rangers had visited.

Granite Park sh they saw what they were. doing and were like you can't do that. stop doing that and the managers were. like sure sure we'll definitely stop. doing that so these guys are open air. camping about five football fields away. from that very Chalet that's right uh so. after they're in their bags at night uh. just after midnight uh a bear arrived. grizzly bear to their camping spot and. you know some of this stuff has uh has. come out later in different form whether. it was interviews with survivors after.

the fact or that Sports Illustrated. story or them writing about it years. later uh and they' tried to piece it you. know together as best they can but I did. see some of the details kind of varied. here and there among the accounts but. what we do know is that uh dukot said. later on that Julie had seen the bear. and woke him up and said hey there's a. bear here um and from what I read in. Sports Illustrated it was about 10 ft. away but it was definitely a bear and so. she's like played Dead uh the bear did.

not fall for that and began mauling. Dukat uh got to his arms his legs and. his back and then left him alone and. then dragged uh poor Julie helgason off. yeah and so ducat ran and um there were. other people camping nearby and you know. the Chalet was five football fields away. but there was probably help there so. they were screaming they were using. their flashlights to to flash SOS and. they managed to get the attention of. some people um who called for a. helicopter um and they came and got.

ducat and he said well don't forget. Julie she's out there somewhere. apparently a ranger who would have been. in charge of sending out the search. party um waited about two hours before. he finally said okay let's go out and. find her because he was concerned about. putting other people's lives in danger. additional lives in danger searching for. her because we might run into that bear. um and that I don't know if that caused. her death I mean the bear caused her. death but that might have helped seal. her fate two hours yeah that was two.

hours they finally found her this. happened just after midnight remember. and they finally found her and got her. to the Chalet at 3:45 a.m. and she died. at 4:12 a.m. um she had puncture wounds. to her throat and lungs um but she. probably had died largely of blood loss. and had entered shock um and that was it. so I don't you can't really say yes she. she definitely would survived but. perhaps her her chances of survival.

would have been higher had they gone out. and searched for and found her a couple. hours earlier yeah I think for sure my. initial reaction was to be you know like. what the heck with this Ranger but again. this is 1967 it was a different time. they didn't have the resources they do. now they didn't I'm sure now if there's. any kind of be situation they a they. know exactly what to do and exactly how. to handle it and B they have uh I would. imagine they have all kinds of. tranquilizers or just more guns and.

stuff to deal with this kind of thing. that they didn't have back then I mean. it sound like if they would have gone. after this bear it might have been one. park ranger who maybe had a pistol maybe. didn't and then a bunch of other people. with you know baseball bats or something. like they they weren't prepared so I. tried not to judge too harshly yeah that. this guy said hey let's wait because. they they had never encountered. something like this before and I think. rightfully so like people don't usually. make decisions out of cowardice it's.

normally there's some other line of. thinking that in hindsight proved to be. a bad decision agreed um so that was the. unfortunate death of Julie helgason um. she was very terribly mauled um and died. of of blood loss and wounds to her lungs. and throat um Michelle Coons um just. hours later essentially around the same. time that Julie helgason was dying in a. makeshift uh operating room at the the. Chalet a bear was wandering up to.

Michelle and her um her groups sleeping. bags that they had set up around um a. campfire in a beach because that same. bear had already visited them all the. way back at 8:00 pm and caused them to. split yeah yeah that bear came up um. this bear came back a few times it. was it was a very one of those things. again in hindsight you you you're like. they should have gotten out of there but. you know we'll kind of detail all the.

reasons why um they had gone fishing. they you know they set up by this great. lake uh not Capital Great Lake but this. amazing Lake all right uh they went. fishing um there the one of the guys. that was with them was just 16 years old. like these were were kids you know and. he caught one fish he caught a rainbow. trout uh augmented that meal with some. hot dogs uh grilled it up and that. Grizzly like you said at 8:00 p.m. came. wandering around and they took off uh. they watch this bear from a short.

distance um eat that food and then grab. one of their backpacks and take it away. and this is a point where like they. could have gotten the heck out of there. but they were like it's getting dark we. don't know what to do this bear left it. got our food so it's probably fine now. right uh and also if we're going to get. out of here we got to go through this. berry bush field that are you know. that's tall ber or bears love those. berries so there you know that bear may. be there there may maybe more bears so. let's go down here to the beach area.

let's build a huge fire uh to try and. help keep the bear away and they built a. log barricade between that fire and. their old campsite and then line their. sleeping bags up around this campfire uh. but very key here they did bring some. food they brought uh some cookies and. some Chee itss to that camp new campsite. so is that the idea that that that was. what attracted the bear back again the. food yeah the the cheit I mean it was. food and they after food so okay we.

should also say one other thing as they. were before they even reached trout lake. in the afternoon when they were on their. hike to it they passed some other hikers. who said that they had been recently. chased up a tree by a Grizzly around. that area were like nuts to that we're. going to keep going and that that same. bear um they believe also turned out. actually they not even they didn't. believe it like it was the that same. Troublesome bear had been chasing Girl. Scouts around and had had been a problem.

all summer because it was underfed and. emaciated and apparently that's a a. really good um way for a bear to start. acting and behaving very oddly and. aggressively is when it's underfed. that's right so this same bear uh that. has been overly uh aggressive toward. everybody it meets it seems like came. back again after the 8:00 visit came. back at 3:00 a.m. in the middle of the. night uh one of them wakes up sees said. that fire is has basically died out and.

he jumped up I think it's the guy who. caught the trout uh jumped up to go. start rebuilding this fire again really. quickly and apparently set those cookies. down on that log barrier that they had. between it and uh the old campsite M so. now it's 3:00 a.m. they all decide uh. the bear uh takes these cookies and goes. away and they all decide listen we're. going to stay awake for the rest of the. night because now we're out here in the. middle of the night we're genuinely. stuck like we can't just hike off in the.

darkness and so they decideed to all. stay awake together so man I would have. been quite scared by this time this is. the second time the bear visited right. yeah 8:00 p.m. 3 a.m. constantly just. taking this food and then now we get. back to 4:30 a.m. when the bear Returns. the final time and this time it just. goes straight up aggressive I don't know. if it was cuz they ran out of food and. the bear didn't like the fact that they. didn't have have any more food or what. but it bit one of the guy's sleeping.

bags it clotted his sweatshirt so now we. get back to 4:30 a.m. when that bear. returns a final time and I don't know if. it was because they had run out of food. and the bear didn't like that very much. but it became more aggressive than the. other times and it actually started. attacking the the kids in this camping. group uh one of them uh had it sleeping. bag bitten which if a bear's attacking. you and it bites your sleeping bag. that's kind of a best case scenario sure. Claw at his sweatshirt um and I think.

there were there was other bare. Encounters in this this event right yeah. so that was Paul D um he starts. screaming he runs away and climbs a tree. this bear is chasing him he runs away. and he climbs a tree this kid's 16 so. he's up this tree in a matter of seconds. uh apparently he did get all cut up and. stuff though cuz he didn't have his. shirt on and he was you know climbing. like a person scared of a bear sure so. he gets up in this tree and from up in. this tree he looks down and this bear is. sort of circling below him his friends.

are at the camp they have obviously. woken up at this point and they see the. bear circling the tree so they use that. as their opportunity to get away they. grab that dog first of all squirt and. yeah they grabbed squirt squirt when. this thing first started happening uh. the um they grabbed it and put it inside. the sleeping bag and literally like had. their hand over this dog's poor dog's. mouth like to try and play dead but so. they finally uh get away as as well they. run away while this bear is circling the.

tree below Paul Dunn and except for one. person and that was Michelle Coons um. she they hear they're literally you know. 30 40 feet away from this bear and their. friend and they hear her screaming uh. they're like you know get out of there. get out of there they hear her yell I. can't he's got the zipper they hear her. yell uh he's ripping my arm he's got my. arm my arm is gone uh and then they. finally hear her yell oh my God I'm dead.

and this bear carries her off in the. sleeping bag still right right in front. of them yeah so they are um they have no. trouble staying awake for the rest of. the night at this point um they a couple. hours later the sun came up and um after. it did and they saw that the bear was. gone they took off for help. right yeah there was a um you know in. these Parks I'm sure they still have. stuff like this had what's called. seasonal Rangers that were maybe just.

there for the summer and there was a guy. named Bert gildart and he said at 630 in. the morning uh he was at West Glacier at. this point in his little apartment uh he. got a knock from another Ranger named. Norm Hagen and gildart was the one who. knew about that previous uh killing. earlier in the night and I'm not sure. how but somehow he managed to go back to. sleep and he's the one that like got the. emergency responders there Hagen shows. up and says that there's a young woman. who is mauled at Trout Lake Lake and he. was like no no no you're confused this. was over at the Chalet and then as you.

know this Hagen guy keeps going it Dawns. on him like my God what has happened. this has happened twice in a matter of. hours yeah so uh he very quickly uh got. himself over to Trout Lake I I read that. he essentially ran four miles um at from. the trail head to the lake and uh there. was another Ranger already there named. Leonard Landa and two other men arrived. by helicopter and they formed a little. search party and very quickly Leonard.

Landa um discovered Michelle Coon's body. and you had said earlier that like like. grizzly bears generally don't see humans. as prey or as food yeah and one of the. things that makes them so unpredictable. is they'll do that sometimes sometimes. they do see us as prey in food like. sometimes they'll attack one one person. in a party see them as food and then. attack the other people to defend that. first first person that they see is food. and that seemed to be the case also with.

Michelle Coons because when um her body. was discovered the bear had had begun. eating it and another dead giveaway. usually is that the bear will um eat. some and then go essentially bury the. body under some like dirt and twigs and. stuff like that and then sit around and. protect it and I I don't know if I don't. think they found the bear around her. body they just found her body but but. she had been essentially partially eaten. man uh all right I feel like we should.

take another break uh that is the the. sad story of what happened that night. and we're going to talk a little bit. about the aftermath of what happened. right after. [Music]. this.

[Music]. okay so that was a big deal um not just. in Glacier that stuff made it out very. quickly and one of the first responses. among Park officials was we need to go. find these bears that did this and not. only that we might have a problem with. any bear that eats human food so Gilder. and Landa um formed a like a basically a. death squad looking for Bears especially. the one who killed Michelle Coons um and.

they had they they were basically. instructed to shoot any bear that didn't. run away from him and the first day they. they didn't find any bears they stayed. overnight at a patrol cabin at a place. called Aro Lake and when gildert went. out to use the bathroom the next morning. he saw a bear and he called for land to. bring out the rifles and land did and as. they were standing there giving the bear. a chance right cuz none of these people. wanted to kill bears there wasn't like. Vengeance necessarily and even if there.

was I think I think actually that's not. true I think gildert had a sense of. Vengeance and then eventually kind of. had a change of heart but some of the. other Rangers were not happy about this. job of killing bears and even if they. they however they felt about it the you. were supposed to still kind of give the. bear a chance if the bear took a step. toward you that was a dead bear if it. ran away from you that bear could live. to to you know be examined another day. this bear started coming toward them so.

they they had to kill it that's right. and uh this was the bear uh this bear. was 17 years old uh the bear was under. 300 lb uh and I know he said their range. can be a couple hundred and up but I get. the idea that this was a larger bear. that was under 300 lb and and like. clearly uh underfed and emaciated uh. they opened this bear's stomach uh Jaws. movie style and found some uh a big ball. of blonde hair undigested inside the.

bear uh and also found this which and. this is this is all it's a tragedy for. these humans it's a tragedy for these. Bears because they had been you know fed. human trash for so long and were used to. people it's not their fault uh but they. found glass embedded in the mullers of. this bear so this bear had been eating. glass uh food that was probably in glass. from trash and uh made it difficult for. this bear to eat probably uh probably. made the bear very uh uncomfortable and.

grumpy and that probably all contributed. to what happened to Michelle Coons yeah. I think it's really important to. remember that none of this was the. Bear's fault the Bears were acting like. bears and they were being essentially. mistreated by humans in the park park um. administrators by allowing them to get. habituated to human food because it it. was it was destined this was destined to. happen essentially the way that people. were behaving in the Parks um so they. had the they had definitively the bear.

that killed Michelle Coons I mean they. didn't test the hair or anything like. that but it was just her yeah um they. were still looking for Julie helgeson's. bear uh and they they actually never. definitively identified it but another. Ranger named Dave Shay who was um among. a group of four who shot a bear and her. Cubs that were feeding at the um Chalet. garbage pit um he was convinced that. that was the one that killed helgason.

because that bear had blood on her claws. and I don't believe Julie helgason had. any feeding done to her so it's not like. that could have been an innocent bear. that just came along was like oh I'm. going to have a bite of this but didn't. kill her it was almost certainly the. bear that killed her and even if it. wasn't their an orgy of grizzly bear. death fell over Glacier and Yellowstone. and the other national parks that had. grizzly bears um in the ensuing weeks. months and years after the night of the.

Grizzlies absolutely um like you said. the media got hold of this and all of of. course all of a sudden everyone's got an. opinion everyone thinks that they know. exactly why this happened uh some people. are like well there was there were. thunderstorms and lightning nearby uh. that could have agitated them uh the. idea that bears are attracted to. minstral blood was brought up um I think. they now say that that's may be true. with polar bears only well they've never. experimented with they experimented with.

polar bears polar bears showed a. preference for that and like seal blood. or something and then they've never. experimented like that with Grizzlies. but somebody did like a a once over of. grizzly attacks and didn't find any. pattern necessarily so we don't know. experimentally but we do know. anecdotally that's probably not true. right but at any rate that doesn't keep. the media from reporting something like. this sure uh and then it showing up in. Anchor Man is a joke years later uh but. you know it was it was coincidence uh. there was never any like link between.

these two it was just a really bad. coincidence a horrific uh example of bad. human luck that night between these two. young women um Jack Olsson wrote that. story uh the Sports Illustrated story. which is really fun read in three parts. and three separate issues that you also. get the benefit of uh the ads of 1967 in. the magazine which are always fun I'm. sorry this is 1969 when it finally came. out right the Summer of Love right. that's right one of them uh this was. when everything started to change um.

people started uh there was a biologist. named uh Gardner moment who said you. know what um we should and it's. interesting that this was a biologist. but this guy came out and was like hey. you know what we need to finish what our. forefathers started and we need to make. them extinct in the United States uh and. not only that but the common rat and the. fire ant uh some kinds of sharks that. sey fly this guy was like let's wipe out. any that's bothers humans or is a.

Potential Threat to humans if a. biologist can be a hack Gardner moment. was a hack biologist agreed that's just. a terrible idea and it's not like that. was just like the the Zeitgeist um. people arguing at like Gardner moment. introduced it to the Zeitgeist or at. least kind of stoked any um existing. feelings in the public and so now all of. a sudden there is like a push to like. get rid of grizzly bears because they. wouldn't behave around the humans had. invaded their their. areas yeah um luckily that didn't happen.

right I think there were more people or. I don't know about more but there were. people beating the drum on the other. side of like no this is not something we. should do and they want out yeah real. biologists Grizzly biologists they're. known as the father of grizzly bi. fathers of grizzly biology they were. twin brothers Frank and John craige head. and they um became the philos shaffle of. the um the movement to eradicate bears. they just almost single-handedly got in. the way of that and managed to swing.

public sentiment back toward. conservation um and it was a. real that was a real accomplishment. because when um Jack Olsen wrote night. of the Grizzlies which by the way the it. was called the grizzly bear murder case. in Sports Illustrated right oh wow I'm. glad they switched it um when he wrote. the the the actual book in. 1969 he was a uh um a disinterested. Observer he was a reporter but he he. concluded like that was the fate of the.

Grizzlies they they were goners like the. the the public had turned against them. so much that it was all but already done. so the the Craig Head Brothers managing. to turn public sentiment like that was a. big deal and they did it by saying like. there's just a few Common Sense things. we need to do and if we do them you're. going to basically get rid of human bear. interactions or or deaths by grizzly. bear yeah and they they actually had. research they weren't just saying you. know this is what we think they had a.

full decade of human uh Grizzly. interaction and they could point to. actual stuff and say no no no this is. what we have found and they cited This. research uh and this this is a great. quote I think it was John uh that said. you know getting rid of all these Bears. he said would be as tragic as the. leveling of Yellowstone Canyon because. somebody fatally fell from its Brink. like you don't go knocking down the. mountain because someone fell off of it. and you don't go killing all the. Grizzlies because they killed somebody. Jack kowak said you can't fall off a.

mountain did he really yeah it was in. the Dharma bums I read that one it's. been a while so the the common sense. stuff that they pointed out were like. keep humans out of some parts of the. park it's like sorry this is bear. territory just leave it to the Bears. don't go back there it's too dangerous. for you step one at least um another is. just like actually monitor bears like. start tracking the Bears in the in the. park. know them get to know who they are and. then also like when they're moving.

around you should probably have a good. idea of where they are and and when and. who's around them and um basically just. teach the public that Yogi Bear is. fictitious not a real bear he lives in. jelly Stone you're in Yellowstone big. difference right and if they if they do. that but also teach the public like yes. they're a risk you're at greater risk. out boating on one of the Lakes but they. are still so treat them as such they're. a wild animal but yes go see them and.

take in their Majesty but from afar um. you like that would definitely reduce. encounters and thus the chances of of. bears killing humans yeah and if you've. been to a national park uh at all in the. last um well since this really then what. you see are bear prooof garbage cans I. actually bought these for my Camp I have. bear prooof stuff at my Camp uh bear. prooof garbage cans um you're going to. see uh where your cooking area should. not be where you sleep uh you're going.

to see these uh cables strung between. trees uh or you're encouraged and they. teach you how to do it yourself so you. hang up your food high off the ground. suspended between trees at night uh you. can't just Loop it over a branch because. they'll climb up that tree you got to. suspend it it's a pain in the butt but. you got to do it and you know this stuff. now you can't go to a national park or. go back country camping without seeing. signs and uh just knowing everything. that we know now has all been in place. literally because of this night uh that. all came out of this uh that you.

shouldn't have food around your Camp you. cannot entice Bears don't get that candy. bar near your windshield like this is. not how we should be treating Bears yeah. and I think also a general idea that. your bad behavior might not result in. your death but you're increasing the. chances that it could kill someone else. so there was a collective responsibility. that was put upon visitors to the park. too and I think that was super helpful. um yeah like we said there was a there. was. a the this change over wasn't just.

without fault apparently Yellowstone was. just they just shut down the garbage. dumps like they were like no more. garbage for Bears smart I mean that's. that what you would do in response to. something like the night of the. Grizzlies but the craige head Brothers. had said like don't do that like like. yes shut them down but do it gradually. and start supplementing their food that. you're taking away from them with actual. food of theirs like elk or something. like that and they didn't do that and as.

a result the the Bears were now made. more appearances at campgrounds looking. for food because the dumps have been. shut down and it it ended up in more. bare deaths and the death of a camper in. 1972 yeah I mean it's basically saying. it's basically like having a food store. for a wild animal that they know is. always open and then they just shut that. food store down all of a sudden the bear. doesn't know that they're going to keep. coming back there they're going to be. confused it will take them a long time.

to learn that there's not food there and. to go elsewhere which is why the Craig. Head said to do it gradually it you know. makes sense but just rash decisions were. made um like you said in 72 another. camper was killed uh this was an illegal. campsite I think um and you know had. left their food out so that's what. happened uh they still killed a lot of. bears I think 189 Bears uh were killed. between 6. 73 uh and by 1975 between those killings.

and then the lack of food there were. only 136 Grizzlies left in Yellowstone. uh prompting them to be placed on the. endangered species list and covered by. The Endangered Species Act Right uh. they've made a a very nice uh recovery. um such I believe they have six recovery. zones starting in the early '90s uh one. of which was in Glacier and one around. Yellowstone where they uh you know we're. trying to have reintroduced these bears. and now they are up to uh a couple of.

thousand I think in the US yeah yeah I. think nearly 2,000 yeah I mean such that. there are people now that are saying. like hey we should let people hunt bear. again in the US yeah yeah which is a. great idea do it of course we should. really get that instinct of of um. killing a large trophy animal for. bragging rights back as soon as we. possibly can that's sarcasm yeah and. there so that didn't do away like it's. not the end of um bear killings among.

humans like it does happen actually 2023. has seen four different deaths from. three different bear attacks uh just. this year alone in I think national. parks in the United States that's pretty. significant because it is really really. rare despite you know um events like. that um the National Park Service. estimates that if you visit a national. park you have a one and two .7 million. visits chance of um being injured not.

killed injured by a bear but if you stay. in the developed areas like the roads. and everything don't go into Back. Country um you have a one in. 39.6 million chance of being injured by. a bear but it cuts both ways because if. you do go Backcountry camping overnight. you have a one in. 54,000 overnight visits chance of being. injured by a bear so it really depends. on where you go and what you do and if. you put yourself out there in bare. country you you have to come prepared.

yeah I've done a I mean you know we got. my little black bears at my camp that. I've caught on my Camp cam sure uh but. these are the you know the little guys. in Georgia and they've no one has. literally ever been killed by a bear in. Georgia but I've I've done a lot of. camping and back country camping out. west over the years and I never saw a. bear um you know it's uh if you're if. you're smart it doesn't mean it can't. happen but like you said the chances are. very remote but you got to be smart you. got to do the right thing with your food. and your trash be good Steward of the.

land back in the late 60s it was I think. at one point uh Olivia said that they. were started to clean up a little bit. then and they they got three helicopters. worth of trash just out of this one area. of Glacier uh people this is the time. when people would just go back country. camping not everyone probably and just. leave their stuff um another Anchor Man. reference yeah and just leave their. garbage and it's uh. thankfully we've come a long way uh. since then and even though that still.

happens I guarantee you every time. there's a bear incident in the United. States it is highly scrutinized and. studied and they're still trying to. learn from it yep uh you got anything. else I got nothing else all right well. if you want to know more about bear. attacks go familiarize yourself. especially if you're going to a national. park and since I said that it's time for. a listener. [Music]. mail I'm going to call this one Hammond. the clock remember we talked about the. laurren ham end episode he made those. clocks oh yeah the tickless clock Yeah.

Tim and Sarah have one and it's. beautiful uh Hey guys listening to the. laurren Hammond episode and head right. in my wife's parents owned a deli in. Brooklyn and had a Hammond electric. clock hanging up for many years and when. they passed on the clock came to our. possession not in the greatest shape I. was able to clean it up and discover. that it also had uh low voltage light. bulbs on the inside it took some time to. find them but uh I got that working too. uh my wife never knew that the face lit. up all those years that's super cool.

yeah it is uh during my online searches. for bulbs I had read about the. uniqueness of the Hamond electric clock. one thing he did differently from all. the other electric clock manufacturers. at that time was his clock requires a. restart when the power goes out and. comes back on uh the other people's. clocks start right back up automatically. and hmon designed it way on purpose and. I agree 100% with the design decision we. know exactly what time the power went. out uh than think about it even if the. clock automatically restarts after a. power outage you still have to adjust.

the time anyway uh the man really did. have an analytical mind and thought of. just about everything and I think I. agree Tim that is from Tim and Sarah. nice Tim and Sarah thank you very much. that was a great email I guess they send. a picture of the clock all lit up uh. they sent a picture later because I was. like why didn't you send a picture oh I. want to see it did they send it to both. of us uh I'm not sure but if not I'll. forward it to you that's very kind of. you uh and that was that Sarah and. sarahah and Tim yes thank you guys again.

and if you want to be like Tim and Sarah. you can send us an email too send it off. to stuff podcast at iheartradio.com. stuff you should know is a production of. iHeart radio for more podcasts my heart. radio visit the iHeart Radio app Apple. podcasts or wherever you listen to your. favorite. [Music]. shows.