Eleanor Roosevelt: Best First Lady | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm. Josh and there's Chuck and Jerry's here, too. And this is Stuff You Should Know, the Great Women in History edition. >> That's right. Uh, one of the greatest. >> Sure, she's up there. Francis Perkins. still gets my vote, though. >> Oh, yeah.

Yeah, Elanor Roosevelt is amazing. It's just that learning about her makes. your head spin. Like you could do a 10-. part series on her easy. >> Yeah, at some point you just got to, you. know, do the stuff you should know. thing, >> right? And condense 10 parts into 45. minutes. >> That's right. >> So, um I think I just let the cat out of. the bag, Chuck. We're talking today. about Elellanena Roosevelt and she is. the longest serving first lady. She was.

called the first lady of the world as a. matter of fact by Harry Truman. Uh Mayor. LaGuardia in New York called her. America's number one volunteer. And she. was almost universally liked. Even if. you couldn't stand her politics, she was. just so eloquent and graceful and kind. and generous and all the great things. that you like you couldn't help but like. her pretty much. It seems like only a. few members of her family are the ones. that she ever had a real beef with.

>> Yeah, for sure. And you know, family's. going to family, >> right? Never trust family. >> That's right. >> So, let's let's talk about her family to. start. She was born in 1884. I believe. her full name was Anna Elellanor. Roosevelt, but everybody calls her. Elellanar. And her father was Elliot. Roosevelt, who was Teddy Roosevelt's. younger brother. And so, yes, she wasn't. just married as a Roosevelt. She was. born a Roosevelt, too. Isn't that. surprising? >> Uh, that she married her cousin. That is.

surprising to probably a lot of people. >> Yeah, fifth cousin. Not a lot of genetic. um issues there, but yeah, I mean, I. thought she was she became a Roosevelt. after marriage. She was born a. Roosevelt, buddy. There's your trivia. question for this one. >> Yeah, for sure. Uh she didn't have her. parents around for long. And while she. did, it was not the best scene. Uh. apparently she her mother was a pretty. distant person. >> Uh not the greatest mom, and her dad was. a a pretty tough alcoholic. But um they.

died not to you know they died when she. was a child basically. Uh her mom Anna. died in 1892 of dtheria and her father. Elliot um died after he jumped out of a. window uh because of alcoholic uh. tremors basically delirium trimming. So. it was a pretty rough go for her uh. until she went to live with her. grandmother uh where she had lived with. her brothers Elliot Jr. who uh actually.

he didn't live that long either, >> but her brother Hall did and apparently. she doted on him quite a bit. >> Yeah. I mean, what a what a great. sister. Like they're they're both. orphans and so she's going to take on. the role of like being his mother figure. essentially and taking good care of him. So I think that's pretty neat and that. shows a lot about who she was because. this is starting about age 10. Um and. when she went and lived with her. grandmother, she was educated at home as. very very wealthy people uh did at the.

time. And um and when she was 15, she. was sent to England uh and that's where. she her first brush maybe even really. her only brush with education uh went. She was there for like three years. before her grandmother called her back. and said, "That's enough. Let's do some. debutant stuff. Come back and get fitted. for a big frilly dress.". >> That's right. uh and that was in 1902. and she wasn't um you know she didn't. take to even though she was born into in. wealth and kind of into that scene.

obviously as a Roosevelt um she didn't. feel like she really fit in in that. elite sort of uh sort of scene there. So. >> uh early on she started volunteering and. she thought well a good way to sort of. rid myself or at least distance myself a. bit from that life uh would be to kind. of you know see what the the common. folks are up to and help them out. and. she started out uh doing that at a. pretty young age. Um initially at the. Rivington Street Settlement House there. on the Lower East Side where she um she.

was a dance teacher and she taught. classes to uh young immigrants and then. also finally joining the National. Consumers League uh which was basically. an organization that tried to improve, you know, down in the garment district. what the what the workers were dealing. with, >> right? trying to get workers death from. 100% down to something like 80%. You. know, >> yeah. >> So, she met her cousin, her fifth cousin. who she married, Franklin Delano. Roosevelt, when they were both very. young. Um, I think uh they were at like.

a family gathering or something like. that and he was giving her piggyback. rides. Uh, not teenage piggyback rides, like these were little kid piggyback. rides. And then they um I guess didn't. keep in touch much. But then when she. was 18 and got called back for the whole. debutant thing, um they met again and. they were just like, "I like you. I like. you too. Maybe we should get married. Maybe we should. We're fifth cousins. I. think that's okay. Let's do it." That. was the conversation.

>> What's a teenage piggyback? >> It's a piggyback ride given by. teenagers. It's much different than like. a little kid piggyback ride. >> Can you explain the difference? I've. never heard of this. >> Um I think the guy giving the girl. usually is how it goes. Piggyback ride. The piggyback ride um is hoping that. that will somehow turn into something. much more than just a piggyback ride. Even if it's just someday. >> Oh, wow. All right. I never heard of.

this. >> That's a teenage piggyback ride. >> Wow. I missed out. I was I grew up a. Baptist kid, though, so I wasn't aware. >> Well, I mean, all of this was just. completely me making this up as I went. along. I don't think it's an actual. thing. >> I gota All right. So, they decided to. get married. That happened in 1905. Uh. they had kind of a longish engagement. for uh the time. And apparently um Sarah. Roosevelt, Franklin's mom, kind of. didn't insist on that, but she didn't. love Elellanar. So, I think it kind of. dragged out a bit.

>> Yeah. >> But they did get married, and boy was. Sarah a part of their life. Like, talk. about an intrusive mother-in-law. Um. Sarah and her son were very very tight. Um she did not want to uh kind of. completely give him up. So she. accomplished this by uh gifting them a. brownstone. uh that she had built for them. And she. had a matching brownstone built that. were connected by sliding doors. So. essentially um you know it was kind of.

like one big place when she wanted it to. be. >> right. And she kept this control not. just by adoring her son, which she. genuinely did, or being adored by him, which he genuinely did. Um, she also. kept everybody in the family on a pretty. short leash by um controlling the the. family's finances. She was the one who. was in charge of the family money. So, she could threaten to cut you off if you. didn't do what she wanted. She could. reward you for doing what she wanted. Um. she and then she I I just can't really.

wrap my head around how overbearing. Sarah FDR's mom was. It's just. mindboggling to me because not just. controlling the finances and building a. brownstone. It gets worse as a matter of. fact. And yet Eleanor really wanted her. approval. She loved FDR. She wanted FDR. to be happy. And at the same time she's. like you have to be kidding me about. this. Um, still she managed to become. pretty close with her mother-in-law. against all odds.

>> Yeah, Bill Collins said. >> That's right. So, uh, that was another. pretty rough situation. Uh, not too long. into their marriage. About nine years. in, Ellaner found out that her husband. had been having a affair, like a. yearslong affair with her secretary, uh, Lucy Mercer. And this all came out and. you know there were love letters found. and uh they thought about getting. divorced but um you know depending on. who who you read uh they stayed together.

um probably because he wanted to. continue his career in politics and that. would not look very good. >> Um other people say that his mom Sarah. had a threat to stop the flow of money. >> um kind of Arthur style. So that might. be a reason too. But at any rate, they. decided to stay together to fight uh. despite this infidelity, which I'm sure. was a huge disappointment. >> for sure. I think that hit her hard. Um. and if FDR had any, you know, second. thoughts about staying together, three.

years later, um he was stricken with. polio, which he probably contracted as a. younger child, but it caught up with him. at age 39. And he was partially paralyzed and had. to be had to recover. And he never fully. recovered full range of motion. and um. power um and he just happened to be. married to the perfect person to help. him through that. So I think that that. really kind of helped reinforce the. bonds that they had and also helped. reinforce the character of the.

relationship where um he had one mom, he. got another one, he also had a wife, he. also had a very smart, savvy advisor. So. he had like everything except maybe. the love of his life in Ellaner and he. was like this is good. I can deal with. this. >> Yeah. I mean she definitely stepped in. and not only cared for him but acted uh. almost as a co-president like certainly. more so than any other first lady uh. that we had ever seen. And we're going.

to go through you know a lot of her. first lady first. But you know when he. couldn't get out there for any reason. she was out there for him and would. report back uh to him. And I think. everyone kind of understood and um you. know viewed her with a lot of respect it. seems like for the most part. >> Yeah. Um I think a lot of people were. also like especially when she was first. lady, hey um overstep your bounds much. but she just plugged. One thing that. you'll see about her um is that she was. a very self-conscious person. uh she had.

kind of low self-esteem in a lot of ways. and yet she was willing to plow through. it and she was also willing to plow. through the disapproval of her social. peers um her uh friends sometimes the. general public uh and just kind of. follow her moral compass essentially. where it led her to great effect. I mean. when you put all of it together she's. one of the most revered women in. American history. >> Yeah, for sure. Um she had a lot of. kids. Uh she gave birth to six kids but.

in a 10-year period between 1906 and. 1916. uh with Anna Ellaner James um Frank Jr. sadly passed away but she would they. would get another shot at another Frank. Jr. as we'll see. >> uh because she then had Elliot then. another Frank Jr. and then John and you. know she was a mom who wasn't like as. close to her kids as she wanted to be or. thought she wanted to be. Um Sarah again. was sort of always there and always.

stepping in as um grandmother plus to. the point where she would say things to. the kids like I'm your real mother. Um. she just bore you uh your mom Ellanar. So you know again Sarah's kind of there. throwing a wrench into things including. like not separating but at least. creating some sort of a divide between. Ellanar and her children. >> Yeah. And I think her children kind of. didn't feel very close to her and maybe. even disliked her for their childhood.

years. Um, and it wasn't until they got. older in um before they started to get. close with their mother. And I'm. imagining that that probably coincided. with Sarah's death when she was finally. out of the picture. >> Yeah, that's a pretty good uh bet. Um. yeah, but it was during I guess sort of. the beginning of the childbearing decade. >> when she became a political wife for the. first time when Franklin was elected to. New York State Senate. And that's when.

she really kind of, you know, jumped in. there. She got really active and. >> uh acted as, you know, a host, you know, to um dinners and of course stuff like. that. Um she would sit in on meetings. when she was allowed to. um when FDR uh. when they had to move to DC when she was. appointed or I guess he was appointed. Woodro Wilson's assistant secretary of. the Navy. >> um that's when she found herself in the. middle of like sort of the DC politics. for the first time and she really took. to it. It seems like. >> she did at first she was basically.

following like the traditional political. wife um handbook, right? But then uh as. uh FDR's political career kind of rose. and rose and rose, she started to become. more and more involved in a much less. traditional sense, like much more. pioneering sense. Um for example, she. helped him write speeches, she helped. him strategize, especially when he ran. for vice president in 1920. Um and she. became much more of a collaborator than.

the average political wife at the time. Like this is when it became clear to. FDR, if it wasn't already, that she was. invaluable. In the same way that um. inflammable still means flammable, >> right? >> This means that she was super valuable. >> Yeah, for sure. Uh and they kind of. lived all over depending on what his job. was politically because he was governor. of New York at for a while in 1928. And. so, you know, they certainly their home. was New York. Uh went in New York. I.

think they lived on the Upper East Side. and she also, as we'll see, would later. have a place uh in like near Washington. Square Park, but they also obviously. lived in DC when they needed to and Hyde. Park, New York. Um but you know, she she. liked uh she liked New York City. >> Yeah. I mean, who doesn't? Especially. now that the Knicks won. >> God, >> we're gonna That just dated this. episode, huh? >> Yeah, that's right. So, something I. didn't know about Elellanar um that is.

at first tough to swallow until you stop. and kind of think about how much that. means she changed her views. Uh early on. again she was just kind of following the. standard handbook of her um social class. or social circle to the people around. her including her mother-in-law. So, um. she from her early letter she was a. prolific letter writer throughout her. life from her early letters like she. didn't know anything about politics. She. wasn't paying attention to that kind of. stuff. She didn't care about it. Um she.

was just doing the society thing. Uh. apparently she adopted her mother-in-law. um her mother-in-law's anti-semitism. She didn't think very highly of her um. black servants. Um like she was not a. great person at that point. And a lot of. it from everything I've seen people are. like she was straight up a product of. her culture. Yeah. Right. >> Seems to be. >> Yeah. And so the idea that she went from.

anti-semitism to um to lobbying for um. America opening its doors to uh Jewish. people who were fleeing the Holocaust um. from disparaging her black servants to. tirelessly working for civil rights for. black Americans. Um, and also just kind. of showing disdain for the suffrage. movement, becoming a champion for. women's rights. It really kind of shows. like she didn't go from a neutral place. to these amazing heights. She came from.

the the bottom and then got to neutral. and then got to those heights. And it's. pretty impressive how much she changed. And I mean, just how willing she was to. change her views because a lot of people. aren't. >> Oh, for sure. Absolutely. Is that a good time for a. break? I think so. Sure. >> All right. We're going to come back and. continue with I bet you're never going. to guess. Elellanena Roosevelt.

Learning stuff with Joshua. Stuff you should know. All right, so we're back. We talked a. little bit about her early volunteerism.

Uh that kind of stopped for a while when. she became a political wife, but she. always had that uh volunteer Jones, I. guess. So, uh once she had more. opportunity, she she turned that into. more volunteerism. Uh she was a. volunteer for the Red Cross in DC during. World War I. Um in 1918 when she went to. Europe with her husband, she tooured war. hospitals in the battlefield. And it. feels like all this sort of inspired her. to really kind of get busy and put her.

um her time where her uh heart was. >> uh because she volunteered as a. translator. She spoke uh French as well. as English. So um she was volunteered as. a translator at a lot of different. events. uh one of which was the. international conference of working. women at the Paris Peace Conference. >> Yeah. Um in addition to volunteering, she also became an activist. She like. was very very active with um uh. organizations that promoted women's. rights. Get she finally kind of got on.

board with the suffrage movement. Um she. became uh part of the League of Women. Voters. And one of the things about her. that you'll notice is she'll join an. organization and then you like blink a. couple times and now she's like vice. president of it or something like that. She was a really great asset to your. organization if she showed up because. that meant she really believed in what. you were doing and she wanted to help. >> Yeah. like the my read from all of this. is like, you know, certainly being uh a.

prominent political wife had something. to do with it, but it wasn't just that. because that didn't happen to. everybody's. uh wife at the time in politics. So, she. she clearly just. >> showed the stuff, you know, that people, you know, had clear leadership. qualities. >> For sure. Definitely. Oh, she was also. asked too by the DNC, the Democratic. National Convention, to um basically. chair a committee on women's issues to. help them come up with whatever plank in. their platform they were going to have. for for women's suffrage. And they were.

like, great, thanks Doll. And took her. ideas and shut the door and the um all. male committee deliberated on it without. her in the room. >> Yeah. So, she definitely faced stuff. like that obviously at the time, which. really stinks because she had a lot of. great ideas. >> for sure. Um, another great idea, too. I. thought this was super cool. She. co-founded a furniture factory that was. a nonprofit furniture factory. I have. the impression it was a collective,

Chuck, which we've talked about before. It's called Valkill Industries, and they. made um colonial furniture reproductions. in Peter. >> Yeah, it's kind of nice. Sure. What else. did she do? >> Uh she joined the Women's Trade Union. League. Uh this is kind of part of her. advocating uh for labor. Uh that's when. that came into the picture. Um you know, working conditions for women and. children at the time, of course, because. kids were working. >> uh and you know, capacities that they.

don't work now, if at all. >> It's always fun to talk to kids who have. teenagers about, you know, uh them. getting jobs and stuff. I feel like. that's happening a lot uh here and. there, but not like when we were kids, which was basically still child labor. >> For sure. It really was. >> Whenever I tell like my teenage uh my. friends teenage kids that I was like a. bus boy when I was 13, they're all just. like, "Are you serious?". >> Yeah. >> It's like Yeah. Like every one of my. friends worked as well. It was weird. >> Yeah, it it kind of is weird in.

retrospect. I had like a paper route. when I was 10 or something like that. >> Never had a paper route. I was always. jealous of those. Man, the smell of a. stack of newspapers at like 4 in the. morning. >> Yeah, >> it is a it's a specific experience and. it can be really great or it can be like. what am I doing with my life? >> What uh do you get paid per paper? Is. that the deal? >> I don't remember. I was 10. I'm not even. sure I was directly paid. >> Okay. >> I don't remember. I don't remember being. 30some. >> Was your dad just funneling uh funneling.

money to coffers? I'm like, Dave, when. did you start smoking cigars? >> Exactly. These look like good ones, too. >> So, uh, all the stuff we've been talking. about, this was just the 1920s. She. hadn't even become first lady yet. And. when FDR was elected in 1932, um, like we said, she became a first. lady of a lot of different firsts, some. of which have never been replicated. since, you know. >> Oh, yeah. I mean, she's definitely uh I. think not many people would argue that.

she wasn't the most active first lady of. all time, probably. >> Um she was the first first lady to hold. a press conference or multiple press. conferences and apparently only allowed. uh women reporters to attend her press. conferences. >> Yeah, >> it's kind of cool. Uh she was the first. to write a daily newspaper column and to. host a radio show. uh she's the first. lady to travel to an active war zone and. just really sort of um open the door on. what the whole title of first lady could.

be. Not necessarily had to be because as. we've seen over the years there's been. um. let's just say lots of different kinds. of first ladies. >> for sure. Yeah. Some more active than. others having different interests when. they were active. >> Um she just basically did it all. And. and again, this was the kind of thing. that made her a target. Like, what are. you doing? You're a first lady. You're. not supposed to be this active. I mean, one of the things that she did that. really made her a target, Chuck, was um. she was she became assistant director of.

civilian defense uh in World War II. >> Yeah. And then later director even. >> Yeah. Okay. And that's a public office, right? She's the first first lady ever. She's the only first lady to uh have. held public office while her husband was. in office as president, right? And. people were like, "What do what is. this?" Like, "I I don't know how I feel. about this." And some people were like, "This is um they accused her of. cronyism. They accused her of frivolous.

spending. And it actually was so bad. that she stepped down after a year. because she didn't want to keep drawing. like negative attention to the work the. civilian defense agency was doing.". Totally, man. I mean, that's the worst. She's trying to do good work. She's. getting disparaged and she has to quit. making a difference and doing the thing. she loves to to make that thing better. >> Yeah. I mean, just because her husband. had political enemies, you know? I mean, that's and that's just politics, I. guess, you know.

>> Yeah, for sure. Uh she her code name for. Secret Service was Rover. Um, and the, you know, everyone's best guess is. because she was always all over the. place. She was traveling. I think there. was another nickname that she had, uh, which was Elellanar everywhere. >> because starting very early in her. career, um, she would hit the road. She. was very famous for, uh, driving a blue. roadster, uh, saying, "Secret service, I'll smell you later." And hit the road. And I think between 1923 and 1940, she.

traveled over 300,000 miles. >> Yeah. and visited in person every state. except South Dakota. Uh just traveling. all over the place like checking on. projects that were going on, talking to. everyday Americans. Um just, you know, kind of hitting the beat as as someone. checking on the health of America. >> Yeah. And reporting back to FDR. Like. >> she wouldn't keep it a secret. >> No, it wasn't like a media blitz or like. a a charm charm offensive. That's what. I'm thinking of. like she definitely.

taking this information back to use for. strategizing, for adjusting policy, all. that stuff. Like it was really. important. The first year she was first. lady alone, she traveled 40,000 miles in. her Buick. And um she also, little known. fact, was the first person to popularize. those mud flaps with Yuseimity Sam on. them that said back off. >> Back off. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. I think she created Yuseimity Sam. In fact, >> probably. I hadn't read that, but you're. probably right.

>> Uh it was also in one of these road. trips that she uh well, we we can't say. with absolute 100% certainty, but it's. pretty well uh known that she had a love. affair with a woman. Uh it was a road. trip in 1933 to New England and Quebec. um shortly after FDR was inaugurated the. first time and there was an AP. journalist named uh Lorena Hickok or. Hick who was a very uh you know just. sort of a woman doing her own thing at.

the time. Um, she would like chomp on. cigars and she was kind of kind of tough. talking and she wore bright scarves and. loved like uh like big dinners and rich. foods and was a very kind of well-known. high paid AP reporter and they met when. uh Hick was covering FDR's gubanatorial. campaign in 1928 and then she was. assigned to cover Elellaner and it it. sounds like she covered Ellaner. >> for sure. Uh they they they went. everywhere together as a matter of fact.

Um, and historians at first were like, "No, no." And then they're now kind of like, "Well, maybe." And most of them are. like, "Yes, they probably did become. lovers." Um, and that's just kind of. supported by some of the stuff that they. wrote to one another in letters. And. again, like you said, they were never. caught in flagrante delicado. Um, and. you know, no one Danny DeVito didn't. snap a picture with one of those big. flash bulbs or anything like that, but.

you know, if you interpret some of this. stuff like any sensible person, it. definitely does seem like their letters. do suggest that yes, they they. definitely had a romantic relationship. >> Yeah. And, you know, uh. I mean, should we read a selection? >> I think that that yes, I think that will. help everybody make up their own mind. >> Yeah. It's not salacious or anything. It's like they were they were having an. affair. Good for them. Uh except for you. know the the cheating part, but uh you.

know FDR did the same thing. So. >> uh we're not going to hold her to a. different standard than her husband, right? >> Yeah. Well put. I was going to say even. Steven. >> Uh here's a selection from Hick to. Elellaner. I've been trying today to. bring back your face and the feeling of. that soft spot just northeast of the. corner of your mouth against my lips. So, I mean, come on. They were having an. affair, >> right? Exactly. Um, even if they. discovered or Hick discovered that that.

soft um spot on the northeast corner. while they were both eating a shared. piece of spaghetti, that still suggests. that they had a romantic relationship. >> Yeah. I mean, we know what was going on. in Lady in the right? >> Right. So, it none of this matters. this, if anything to me, this says like, oh, she's kind of open-minded because. she does not seem to have been a. straightup lesbian. She is, as we'll. see, um, considered to have probably had. an affair with a very close male. companion, too, at some point. So, I.

think she was just like, I'm into you. I. love you. I don't care who you are. Let's get it on. >> Yeah. Like Marvin Kay said, >> Yeah. >> Uh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, her. husband had an affair kind of what, seven, eight years after they got. married for for at least four years, and. the only reason it stopped is cuz he got. caught. So, it. >> cuz his mother told him to stop. >> Yeah. His mom told him to stop. So, it. seems like it may have been one of those. marriages where they had a lot of um.

love for each other, but probably stayed. together because of uh his role and and. all the good that she was able to do. So, you know, it was at a time where. people just didn't get divorced over. that stuff. They they had affairs, you. know. >> Right. Right. So, back to those road. trips, right? Remember she's like doing. recon as well as um having trrists with. Hick. >> Yeah. >> One of the places that she went was. through um Scotsrun, West Virginia on. one of these trips. I think it was.

actually that New England trip, which. it's news to me that West Virginia is. New England, but hey, who's to judge? and she came across the um the basically. these coal miners, the whole town of. Scots Run, West Virginia was coal miners. and they were all out of work. This is. the depression. And she was so moved by. just how impoverished and how hard their. life was that she came up with this idea. to basically have the federal government. foot the bill for building towns that. were out of the box great and you would.

move impover say impoverished coal. miners into them and basically give them. a head start at a really great good life. that they could take over and make for. themselves in a close-knit community. that they built together. >> Yeah. Uh there were there was supposed. to be like a hundred of these planned. communities all across the United. States. >> Uh but the first one was that one uh in. West Virginia, Arthurdale, about 25. miles south of Scott's Run. Um it was. called Elellaner's Little Village at.

times, but she was really active in this. uh building of the first one. Like every. home had to have which was a big luxury. at the time, like modern appliances and. electricity, especially in rural West. Virginia at the time. >> Yeah. And the rent was based on what. people could afford, which was about 20. bucks a month. And like people made fun. of these projects sometimes that she was. involved in. Uh this one in particular. Um but you know, it it worked out pretty. well. Like Arthur Dale became a very. like kind of thriving community and.

there are still people like from that. first community that live there today. >> Yeah, for sure. And um the US government. was like, "Okay, we're not going to. oversee Arthurdale anymore." in 1947, but Elellaner kept visiting until 1960, I think, was her last visit, two years. before her death. And all told, she. visited Arthurdale 33 different times, long after she was no longer first lady. Um, from 1935 to 1944, she attended. every single high school graduation of.

Arthur Dale's well, high school. >> Yeah. And I think FDR. went to one and is still the only. president to actually give actually give. a commencement speech at a high school. graduation. >> Yeah, pretty cool. >> Yeah, she um helped those graduates like. find jobs. Um like she really took an. interest. She apparently used to buy. Christmas presents and bring them to the. kids at Arthurdale. Like it was a she. was really involved in this. It wasn't. like a good idea. She helped it get. going and then forgot about it, moved on.

to something else. Like she really. cared. Yeah, for sure. >> Uh, what do you say about a break? >> All right. I mean, we never need them. We just have to do it. But we're going. to do it now because we're supposed to. >> They make us. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Well, we're going to do that then. Learning stuff.

Stuff you should know. Okay, Chuck, we're back. Um, and one of. the things that you may know about. Eleanor Roosevelt, if you're, you know, somewhat familiar with her and her. life's work, she became virulently.

anti-racist. Um, she was a champion of the civil. rights movement long before there was a. civil rights movement, decades before. it. uh she helped kind of get civil. rights. um recognized I think among white. America and in a lot of quarters that. meant that people started to hate her. especially in the south and like I said. before like she didn't let that slow her. down she just kind of kept at it. >> Yeah. She joined the NAACP in 1934.

>> Uh she was a very very much a lobbyist. for anti-ynching legislation. Um she was. a very early proponent um kind of. sounding the horn against segregation. Uh she quit uh in 1939 the Daughters of. the American Revolution because they. said um we're not going to let this uh. black performer Marian Anderson perform. at Constitution Hall in Washington DC. So she was like all right so long. suckers. I'm out of here.

>> And then later um helped organize a. concert for her on the steps of the. Lincoln Memorial. >> Yeah. It was a free public concert on. Easter Sunday of 1939 and 75,000 people. showed up. It's considered one of the. key moments in the early civil rights. struggle. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Uh she also um this is such a great. anecdote about her. She attended a. meeting this uh Southern Conference for. Human Welfare in Birmingham, Alabama.

with Mary Mloud Batoon who is a a famous. black educator. And because this was in. Birmingham, they weren't allowed to sit. together. It was like local law that. black people had to sit on one side of. the main aisle, white people had to sit. on the other side of the main aisle. This does not sit very well with Mrs. Roosevelt. >> No. So, she has very much like uh like. she probably could have insisted she sit. on the other side, but I think it made. even more of a statement that she said, "You know what? Then, put my chair right. in the middle of the aisle and that's.

where I'm going to sit.". >> Yeah. Pretty cool. Oh, and then one other thing that she. did in World War II too, Chuck, um was. that she visited a Japanese American. internment camp. Remember, I think we. did an episode on that alone. >> Long time ago. >> Yeah. And she came out of this. internment camp and was like, "We should. not be doing this. We need to shut these. down." Which is ironic or courageous or. something because the internment camps. existed by executive order that her.

husband had issued. Yeah. >> You know. >> Yeah. >> And we did shut him down and some people. credit her lobbying for it for um. helping get that started sooner than. later. >> Yeah. She was like, "But you know what? He cheated on me early on in our. marriage, so I don't owe him anything.". >> Right. >> I don't have to do everything me, >> right? >> Uh she was a prolific writer. You said a. prol a prolific letter writer. Uh but. kind of just writer writer. Uh she was. um writing a newspaper column beginning. in 1935 called My Day. Mhm. And she did.

that 5 days a week. Uh in 1941 she did a. monthly advice column for Lady's Home. Journal called If You Ask Me. And then. she also just wrote all kinds of op-eds. and she wrote memoirs. She wrote an. autobiography. She wrote non-fiction. books. Like she just wrote and wrote and. wrote. It was one of her great passions. and she was good at it. >> Yeah. She also wrote a treatment for. what eventually became the script for um. Pulp Fiction that Tarantino made in.

1994. >> It's fantastic. >> Isn't that something? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um she was also not shy of um going on. to TV, appearing on the radio. I think. like you said, she hosted radio programs. um with one with her one of her. daughters, one with a son. >> Yeah. So cute. >> Yeah, it is super cute. Especially. considering that they weren't close when. those the kids were younger. I think. that's just heartwarming. Um, she had a. couple of shows on NBC. These are like. public information or public um, what's.

the word I'm looking for? >> Uh, for the good of the public. Is that. kind of. >> Yeah, we'll just call it that. Yes. >> Um, she had a couple of those shows on. NBC. She had another one, I think it was. on PBS, um, Prospects of Mankind, where. she interviewed like activists, intellectuals. She basically shine shone. a light on these, you know, things that. were going on in the US and around the. world that people weren't really paying. attention to. And again, just remind. yourself when she's doing all this. stuff, she is pretty self-conscious. She.

didn't consider herself photogenic. She. didn't like her own voice. And yet. she'll go on any um media op that you. can offer her with a big enough audience. to um to basically tell people about the. stuff that she feels passionate about. That's really that's dedication. >> Boy, could you imagine if she was around. during the uh podcast era, she would. have been on everything. >> for sure. Look out uh who's number one right now?

Look out Kelsey brothers. Elellanena. Roosevelt's here. There's a Kelsey. Oh, the Travis Kelce. >> Mhm. >> Oh, okay. Good. Good for those guys. >> Sure. >> I don't even know. I don't I used to. look at the podcast rankings a lot early. on and then I stopped at a certain point. many many many years ago and I don't. think I've looked one time since then. So, I have no idea who's out there and. crushing it. >> I used to look at them so much, Chuck, that I would go change countries for the.

iTunes thing and see what where we were. in other countries as well. Hey, Australia's always been our guys. They. We were number one in Australia for a a. while. >> And Canada's always loved us, too. >> Yeah. That's why we toured Australia and. uh Canada. >> Yeah. Step it up, rest of the world. >> We don't go to where people don't like. us. Why would you do that? >> Why would everybody come just to boo? Uh. so while she was uh doing all this, you. know, volunteerism and and like lending. her time to everybody under the sun, uh.

she also made some very good friends. with uh women who uh were were probably. in the gay community would be my guess. And I think this is where her sort of uh. her advocacy for um for gender rights. and stuff like that would come into play. is just her exposure to these people. So, um, through the League of Women. Voters, she met, uh, co-founder, a woman. named Esther, uh, Everett Lee and her. partner, Elizabeth Fischer Reed, uh, who. would be her financial adviser later on,

but they were like a a great trio and. they were really really close. Uh, really good friends. Um, eventually they. would rent uh that that when I said she. lived near Washington Square Park, they. would rent apartments um, right on top. of one another. and you know uh a lot of. other women. She became partners with. Marian and Dickerman and Nancy Cook and. that's who she founded that Valkill. Industries with the furniture business. >> She became friends with them and they. were partners. >> Yeah.

>> Oh yeah. I guess she became partners. with them too. >> Yeah. >> She became partners with those partners. >> That's right. And I think uh like after. uh like one of the cottages that Valkill. built that she I think she ended up even. moving into one of those as a residence. Eventually she did, but first um Marian. Dickerman and Nancy Cook did. I think. they lived there for like three decades, too. >> Yeah. >> And then finally she was like, "I need. the place. Beat it.". >> Yeah. Scram. >> So yeah, these I mean it's just a plain.

fact that another uh expression of how. open her mind was is that a lot of her. friends were gay women. Um again, this. is the 30s, 40s, 50s, >> at most the early 60s. people did not. talk about this kind of stuff and um I'm. sure a lot of people avoided gay people. and she just was it was again I think. she judged people on generally a case-by. case basis. >> Yeah, for sure. Um you know you. mentioned early on she probably had.

other affairs. I know that her bodyguard. Earl Miller is someone that they. everyone is and like historians kind of. suspect that she had an affair with. uh. including her son, one of her sons, um. was pretty much like, "Yeah, I think. Earl Miller uh had an affair with her. They were super tight." And I think he. was the one that gave her the uh I don't. think we mentioned insisted that she. carry a pistol with her uh on these car. road trips since she is Secret Service. >> Yeah. And she used it to great effect, too. Like if you weren't doing what she.

wanted you to, you know, like um passing. an anti-ynching law, she would just pull. her gun out and just set it on the desk. just let it sit there, make its own. statement. >> Well, she was not popular with racists. because she received death threats a lot. um because of her promotion of racial. equality. And in the 1950s, apparently. the clan had a $25,000 bounty on her. head. >> For sure. Um, one other thing too about. Earl Miller is that he was actually.

credited as the one who gave her her. self-esteem and and her uh courage to. face the media and just basically be a. public figure despite how, >> you know, um, debilitating her fear of. that stuff was. >> Yeah. Pretty cool. >> Yeah. So, um, FDR passed away, let's. see, 17 years before she did. Uh, he. died in 1945. This is when she moved to Valkill. College Cottage. >> Yeah. >> And um she was like, "I'm not I'm done.

with politics." And everybody's like, "No, come back. Be in politics." She. said, "No, I'm done. I'm just going to. go be a private citizen." And it turns. out that President Harry Truman a few. months after FDR died and Ellaner said. she was just becoming a civilian again, said, "No, I need you to go to the UN. They're doing some pretty neat stuff. there. uh go see what's going on and uh. just become part of the American. delegation to the to the United Nations. >> Yeah. So she she answered the call and. from 1945 to 1952 she held that position.

at the UN. Um all of her colleagues were. men uh obviously at the time and they. were uh dismissive of her and they said. you know let's put her on committee 3. like they don't do much. uh it's like. humanitarian issues, but uh how wrong. they were because committee 3 turned out. to be pretty important uh and somewhat. controversial when they were uh tasked. with determining whether post-war. refugees had to go back home. They had.

to be like made uh to be go back home. And she said no. She was like, I'm going. to take this up with the general. assembly. And she convinced them to vote. against forced repatriation. >> Yeah. um those male colleagues who. forced her on to committee three um. because they thought it wasn't going to. amount to much, they kept the committee. for planning the future for men wearing. hats everywhere, >> right? >> Uh for themselves like this is this has. got legs. >> Yeah. >> Even more to the point, aside from.

getting repatriation off the table, she. helped author the UN Declaration of. Human Rights. >> Yeah. one of the most important documents even. though toothless but still one of the. most important documents humanity has. ever come together and created which is. pretty great. >> Yeah. And you know you said toothless. that was the one things that really. upset her was that they did this great. thing and then she was upset that there. was there were no teeth and that they. didn't do anything to really make sure. it was enforced.

>> Right. And I'm not sure what they could. do. I think now the international um. criminal court is capable of doing. stuff, but I think even they're semi-. toothless depending on how big and tough. the country is, you know. >> Yeah, good point. >> Um so yeah, she passed away in 1962. She. was in the hospital. She was not feeling. very well and she checked herself out. and said, "I want to die in at home.". And she went and died in uh I think. Greenwich Village. Is that correct?

uh upper east side by that point. >> Same thing. >> Uh she was 78. She had, you know, it was. heart failure. It was uh tuberculosis. It was alastic anemia. She was in rough. shape at that point. Um but, you know, she got to uh die in her home like she. wished. And she left a legacy behind. that. Um I mean, good luck. Who came. right after her? Like, good luck filling. those shoes as a first lady. >> Uh my Truman. >> Yeah. I don't know. Maybe my Eisenhower.

maybe Eisenhower. >> I think some some maybe. >> Yeah. Um, one other thing, Chuck, that. she was the first at, and technically. she made FDR the first, she lobbied for. him to include a woman in his cabinet, specifically our beloved Francis. Perkins, who was made secretary of labor. under FDR, the first woman cabinet. member ever. >> That's right. And we talked about that. in our Francis Perkins episode, and I. highly recommend that. That was a good. one. That's Josh's uh I think favorite.

modern woman. >> Well, I mean, Yumi is my favorite modern. woman, but you I get your point. >> Yeah. >> Um and Mary Tyler Moore, don't forget. her. >> Oh, sure. We need to do an episode on. her. And let's do one on Yumi, too. Why. not? >> All right. I'm sure Yumi would love. that. We'll sit down and interview her. for 20 30 hours and see what we come up. with. Okay. Uh well, while we go. interview Yi for 20 to 30 hours, I think. uh we should insert listener mail here. first.

That's right. This is from Alex. Hey. guys, uh this is from a selects episode. about the fairness doctrine. Uh during. the episode, you mentioned that the. owner of WJIM TV built a TV studio with. a pool uh in case he needed to convert. it to a motel as a fallback business. And guys, that building is still a TV. studio under the call signs WLNS, a. local CBS affiliate, and they kept that. pool. Uh, he sent a a video, in fact, of. meteorologist uh Katie Nicolo giving a.

weather report from the pool, I guess, semi-reently. And he said, "I passed. this TV station countless times. Always. wonder why it looks so swanky, and now. it makes total sense that I know it was. built like a 1950s motel.". >> Mhm. >> Thanks for the show, guys. Always fun. when an episode hits close to home. >> Yeah. Who is that? That's Alex. >> Thanks a lot, Alex. That was a great. one. I've always been fascinated by that. TV station with the pool, too. So, yep. Thanks for calling it out. >> Uh, if you want to be like Alex and say, "Hey, I know just what you guys are. talking about cuz I live by this thing.

Let me tell you about it." Well, you can. tell us about it via email. Send it off. to stuff at iiheartradio.com. >> Stuff You Should Know is a production of. iHeart Radio. For more podcasts from. iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio. app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. listen to your favorite shows.