Bonnie and Clyde | STUFF YOU SHOULD KNOW

[music]. >> Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a. production of iHeartRadio. >> [music]. >> Hey, and welcome to the podcast. [music]. I'm Josh, and there's Chuck, and Jerry's. here, too. Machine Gun Jerry Rowland. And this is Stuff You Should Know. uh about Bonnie and Clyde, a true crime. edition, but also a folk hero edition. >> That's right. >> Uh. and it's given [music] me an opportunity. to get that Bonnie and Clyde song stuck.

in my head all day, which is great, cuz. I like that. >> heard that song. >> Bonnie and Clyde, Bonnie and Clyde. >> I think you're just making that up. >> No, it's for real. I think it was Serge. Gainsbourg, but I know the uh. Luna version. >> Mhm. I came across that a mention of. that, so yeah, it was Serge Gainsbourg. and um Brigitte Bardot. >> Yeah, but uh Luna covered it, and. speaking of uh Luna leader Dean. Wareham's brother, Anthony, is a.

listener, so hello, Anthony. >> Wow, we finally got to Anthony. >> [laughter]. >> I tried to buy Dean's guitar off of uh. Instagram a few weeks ago. >> How'd it go? >> Well, he put his guitar up, and it's the. one that's on the cover of the his book, Black Postcards, and he's huge in the. studio and on tour, and I was like, huh, so then let me just see how much he. wants. And uh he said I missed it by a. day, so. >> That stinks. Well, maybe Anthony can. pull some strings for you. >> Yeah, like steal a guitar from Dean, and. just send it my way.

>> Yeah, and w- if Anthony did that, he'd. be a lot like Clyde Barrow or Bonnie. Parker. >> Yeah, man, these guys like to steal. stuff. >> So, yeah, I Did you see the PBS. documentary the American Experience. documentary on them? >> No, just the movie. >> good. It's worth watching. I haven't. seen the movie, so you put the two of us. together, we have a full comprehension, right? >> That's how it works. >> [clears throat]. >> Um but they they kind of uh. I they basically got across that they. stole or Clyde stole just literally as a.

way of life. He stole cars to get around. He stole. money to buy food with. Like he that's just how he lived and. they make the point and I think Olivia. Olivia helps us with this. I think she. kind of makes the point too like these. were the options that were open to them. especially Clyde because he was raised. dirt poor during the depression. And. like a lot of people were poor during. the depression. So if you were dirt poor. during the depression you were really. really poor and that's the life that.

that Clyde Barrow was born into. >> Yeah, for sure. And you know, not to excuse crime but. that was just his background and not to. you know, they've been glorified over. the years but kind of reading through. this it was like oh man, they like just. would murder people at will again. usually to get out of a scrape. But still just like killing people left. and right just you know, to not get. caught. >> Yeah, particularly cops and there's some. disputes over there's a pair of. patrolmen that were killed and it's it's.

disputed whether Bonnie was one of the. gunmen or not. There's some other crimes. that they. have had attributed to them. that may or may not have like been there. doing but they are definitely there's a. the. path behind them was littered with dead. cops that they definitely murdered. Yeah. They were known to like if a cop. came up to him even if they had no idea. who they were and were trying to help. they just open fire and kill the guy.

Like that was definitely their MO. Typically with cops though and I don't. this isn't like justified but this was. also the era where the cops would just. open fire on you too. There wasn't like. a put your hands up kind of stuff. It. was like you're an outlaw I'm going to. start shooting at you first ask. questions later. >> Yeah, not like these days where cops and. ice never just kill people. >> Right. >> [snorts]. >> Bad joke. >> Yeah. >> All right. Well, and you know, it. I maybe I'll make this point later, too,

but and again, it doesn't justify it, but after. Clyde's prison stint early on, like he. was to me, like clearly killing people. so he would never ever have to go back. to prison. >> Right. >> You know. >> Yeah, and you can kind of get that after. you hear about his his time in prison. and then how much he hated it. >> Yeah. So, let's get going and talk about. Clyde first. I know it's Bonnie and. Clyde, but we're going Clyde and Bonnie. initially. Uh. Uh he was born in Texas in 1909 in.

Telico, and you know, when he was a kid, he. I don't think this necessarily means he. was set for a life of crime. So, a lot. of kids play gangster, play outlaw, and. that's but that's what he did. >> Mhm. >> Uh and in the '20s, they moved to a. very, very, very poor neighborhood in. West Dallas, and were homeless as a family for a. while. And his brother, Buck Barrow, and Clyde. started, you know, early on, like. stealing food, like you mentioned, stealing turkeys, and then that. graduated to.

robbery and car theft and stuff like. that, to the point where he was. eventually arrested for the first time. when he was 17 for car theft. >> Yeah, this was not him boosting a car, which was basically how he got every. other car. He actually went and rented a. car. >> And this is Clyde. >> a girlfriend and then didn't take it. back. >> Yeah, that's stealing, though, you know. >> It No, it it definitely is. Theft by. taking, I think. But But I think also. you can implicate the car rental place. for renting a car to a 17-year-old.

>> Yeah, I I was also, quite frankly, surprised to learn that they had car. rental services in 1926. >> Yeah. Although it was probably just some dude. in town who'd let you take his car for. 10 bucks or something. >> But you got to be 13. >> Right. So, yeah, that was his first brush with. the law, and that was certainly far from. his last. And that's Clyde. His middle. name was Chestnut, by the way, which I. thought was pretty cool. >> Very cute. >> Bonnie's middle name was Elizabeth. Her. name was Bonnie Elizabeth Parker. She was born into different.

circumstances than Clyde. Um her mom was. a seamstress, her dad was a bricklayer. Um but she was she was born in Rowena, Texas, and after her father died, the. family had very little means of. supporting themselves. And her mom uh. was I think her mom's name was Emma. She. was basically left to raise three very. little kids on her own. And so they. ended up in the same area roughly where. Clyde and his family were. Um basically.

I saw it put that they were both from. the same side of the tracks. Despite. Bonnie's mom raising her and her. siblings to be um respectable and and up. to feel that they were above their. circumstances rather than, you know, part of their circumstances. >> For sure. Um so, you know, this was the. early 1900s, so uh a lot of times you. would find kids dropping out of school. or getting married at very young ages, and that's what happened with Bonnie. At 15, she married a guy named Roy. Thornton, who was a criminal.

Um so, that kind of gave her a taste of. that lifestyle. Uh they weren't together too long. I. think about 4 years, uh even though they. never officially legally got divorced. And finally hooked up with Clyde in. 1930, uh when he was 20 and she was 19. And it wasn't long after they got. together that uh Clyde went to prison. for car theft and burglary. Again, just. sort of doing the same. um. fairly low-stakes crimes at the time. Um.

and she she got him out of jail. She. smuggled in a gun and like uh helped him. escape basically with two other inmates. Uh they were all three recaptured. though, and that's when he got his kind. of really tough stint in prison. >> Yeah, they sentenced him to 14 years. hard labor on the Eastham Prison Farm, which was a notorious farm in the Texas. penal system where you would just get. beaten for no reason by the guards who. were just completely. beyond the law.

And he was also he had been taken, remember he's still pretty young at this. time. He was basically [clears throat]. claimed by another inmate who raped him. repeatedly. and beat him repeatedly, and he. essentially was like, "This is my life. now for at least the next 14 years.". And there was a a. he finally was was tired enough of it. that he. smuggled a gla- a galvanized pipe into. the cells with him, and he walked to the. showers knowing that this guy was going. to follow him. And the guy did, and.

Clyde suddenly turns on him and beat him. over the head until he was dead with the. the lead pipe. And I think one thing that really kind. of gets across. like how Clyde was, he was kind of a. likable person throughout his life, but. especially at this time. Um another inmate who already had a life. sentence, he was never getting out. He. took the blame so that Clyde wouldn't. basically ruin his future for. killing the man who'd been raping him. >> Yeah, I mean.

hey. It's pretty stand-up thing to do for a. guy in prison. >> It's it totally is. It's like, "I. donated a kidney to a stranger." What. >> Oh yeah, well, I took a murder rap. >> So a kid wouldn't who [snorts] who is. doling out his own justice wouldn't ruin. his life. >> Yeah, so you know, that's what I was. referencing when it you know, it seems. that Clyde did everything including. killing cops that he could to stay out. of jail again. >> Mhm. >> Uh again, not excusing the killing of. police. Uh just going to kind of lay. down the reality of being. assaulted in prison like that.

>> I think you're you're explaining his. mindset. That's legitimate. >> Yeah, okay. So. uh one of the other things, I don't. think Clyde was ever accused of being. like the smartest guy in the world. Um because at one point he cut off two. of his toes to avoid the hard labor part. of the hard labor uh prison. And less. than a week later he was freed. um when his mother petitioned for. parole. So, uh didn't time that one out. quite right. >> No, he was also I guess not known as the.

luckiest guy around, too. >> Yeah. >> He spent So, he spent less than 2 years. in prison, but in that time he um. changed like fundamentally. Before, like. you said, fairly light stuff, boosting. cars, stealing truck loads of turkeys, that kind of stuff. Um but there was another guy that he um. was in the prison with who said that. before his very eyes he saw Clyde change. from a schoolboy to a rattlesnake. And. even Bonnie later on in in a poem that. she wrote, she used to write poetry, um.

she mentioned that that Clyde was uh. basically a victim of unfair. institutionalization, basically. That. that's what that's why he was the way he. was. >> I got to say, every time you say boosted. a car, it makes you sound super street. >> I sound like a a '50s greaser in the. '70s. >> Yeah. Instead of stealing a car. Like. I'm not cool enough to say boosted a. car. >> I guess you could say stealing, yeah. I. was going to say I don't know any other. way to put it, but I mean, I guess it's.

just cuz I'm from the streets, you know? >> I was about to say. You're like, "Oh, wait, there's a word for boosting a. car?". >> What is steal? >> Uh yeah, they don't teach that on the. street, so I don't blame you. Uh so, Clyde uh was released, like we. said, when his mother petitioned for. that release, and he went right back to. robbing um. you know, gas stations, convenience. stores, stuff like that. Uh he had his. first sort of partner in crime, his name. was Ralph Fults. And Bonnie uh was.

kind of joined up with them as the the. first version of the Barrow gang. um just the three of them even though. like, you know, parents on both sides. were. like, Bonnie, you can't join up with. this criminal gang. Like, please don't. do it. And she's like, I love my man. >> Yeah, she said I like the bad boys for. sure. >> Yeah. >> But you know, one of the reasons why we. still know about Bonnie and Clyde or not. just because they became celebrities, but also because they were just totally.

in love with one another. I mean, like. basically every single outlaw romance or. love story that you've ever seen. um in the movies or on TV is in one way. or another based on Bonnie and Clyde. >> Oh, yeah. >> That's my theory, yeah. >> [laughter]. >> I should probably say. this is not, you know, something from an. academic journal I read, but. >> The white paper as Emily would say. >> Yeah, exactly, [laughter] right. It's. it's something I'm working on. >> Emily says. >> Boy, Emily's got one for everything,

doesn't. >> yeah, when I like, you know, when she'll. just sort of make a claim or something, I'll and not to challenge her, I'll just. be like, are you sure about that or. something? And she'll be like, well, I. don't have a white paper on it. >> [laughter]. >> Like, all right, I know that's the time. to back off. >> Thank you, Emily. >> Uh so, in April of '32, uh and you know, we should point out this is over just a. couple of years that all of their. shenanigans took place. >> Yeah. >> So, we're going to be spitting out dates. kind of fast and furious, but in April. of speaking of boosting cars, uh in April of '32, did you get that.

one? >> Mhm. >> Fast and Furious? >> Oh, oh. Did they boost cars? I thought. they they were. extensive, lengthy scenes of them. negotiating at car dealerships. Actually, for their purchases. >> I think I only [laughter] saw. You got to sell me this car. It's about. family. Uh I only know that line about family as. a reference cuz I've only seen one of. that I think I saw that very first. movie. >> Did you? >> I'm not familiar with the Fast and the. Furious verse, but were they even car.

thieves? I think they were, right? >> I probably. I mean, they were definitely. I get the impression that they were on. the wrong side of the law, the right. side of justice. >> [laughter]. >> Man, that's the logline. Did you you. didn't see any of those? >> No. >> Not even the first one? >> No. >> You you say that like you haven't seen. garbage movies before. >> But, it's also the the highest-grossing. movie franchise in the world ever. >> It's cuz there's 37 of them. >> That has something to do with it. It's. definitely part of it, but also people.

apparently like car movies. >> They do. They're supposed to be good. Uh all right. So, back to after pointing. out my dumb pun, April of '32, Bonnie and Ralph Fults, who was the guy. who he initially hooked up with in the. gang, they were arrested uh trying to. rob a hardware store, and she got out, and was never indicted at least, and. Ralph was convicted, and while she was. sort of being investigated for. indictment, uh Clyde and his other boys. are still out there. again, robbing banks, robbing stores,

gas stations, all pretty and this is one. reason they got away with it for so long. is they never did like these huge. things. They were kind of in small. towns, robbing, you know, kind of. backwater grocery stores and stuff. >> That's key. >> Uh but, it was at one of these um. robberies where the first murder happens. when a store owner, and one of the only. non-cops, a guy named John Butcher, was. killed. >> Yeah. And it's also not whether it was. Clyde that did it. I don't think anyone. thinks it was Bonnie. I'm not Oh, yeah,

she was in jail, I think, like you said, at the time. Definitely wasn't her. Um. there was he was with an associate named. Raymond Hamilton, and Raymond Hamilton. and Floyd Hamilton would kind of come in. and out of the Barrow gang. And. I got the impression that like Clyde was. definitely one of the more stand-up. gangsters of the people in his gang that. he ran with some shady shady dudes that. were way more murderous than him and. that it was just basically him being.

pragmatic. Like he just had a a small. pool of people who he knew could help. him rob a store at any given time. So he. had to kind of hang out with these shady. people. I get the impression he. otherwise wouldn't have necessarily. >> Yeah, I sort of do, too. Uh um. >> [clears throat]. >> Yeah, so that was in April of the first. murder. The second murder. was in August of that year when Clyde. and Raymond. and another, you know, guy that they was. sort of in and out of the gang, um. killed an undersheriff, I guess, which.

is sort of like a deputy named Eugene. Moore in Stringtown, Oklahoma. And then went back to Dallas around. Christmas and. uh Clyde uh talked to a kid, basically, a 16-year-old named W.D. Jones into. joining up with the gang. And on. Christmas Day, which was the next day, they killed another guy named Doyle. Johnson while stealing his car. And. Clyde was like, "All right, kid, like. you got to stay with us now. Uh otherwise like they're going to get. you for this murder.".

>> Yeah. Um and W.D. being 16 at the time was. like, "Oh god, I have no choice. I have. to turn to a life of crime now. I'm in. too deep.". Um as Phil Collins would later say. >> Very nice. >> Um so he did. He stuck around and he and. um Bonnie and Clyde were essentially the. first cohesive Bonnie and Clyde gang. >> Yeah. >> Cuz they stuck together for quite a. while, actually. Did a lot of stuff. Like everything we're talking about. here, every significant thing, which is.

usually um the murder of a cop, there in between those, there's. handfuls and handfuls of robberies and, you know, shootouts and stuff like that. that they engaged in. They were on the. run and on the move and under the gun. every. >> moment up the start to their death over. the course of this two something years. Um they were just constantly in action. Even when they took a vacation, as we'll. see in Joplin, Missouri, they ended up. in a shootout.

>> Yeah, there was a lot of a lot of gun. play. Uh I mean, that was at Christmas when. the second murder happened. Uh in. January, there was another murder, and this was a. just a. sort of an unlucky circumstance when. they walked into an ambush, but it. wasn't for them. It was for a different. target. And but it was an ambush. nonetheless. So, they killed the deputy. sheriff named Malcolm Davis. >> Mhm. >> And for the next couple of months, basically early '33 through the spring, it was Missoura, Arkansas, Oklahoma,

stealing, boosting cars. How do I does. that sound right? >> Yeah. >> Boosting cars. Um and you know, the it was if you've. ever seen the very famous photos uh. that looks like, "Hey, this looks sort. of like a photo shoot of these. criminals.". >> Mhm. >> That's kind of exactly what it was. It. was during this time that WD took these. photos of them, uh these very famous. photos. Um one of which I I'm sure you. saw this one online. Um somebody did a. really good job colorizing the one where.

he's kind of uh lifted Bonnie up and um. like. colorized and retouched to where it. looks like a modern photo. There's like. a lot of clarity. >> Mhm. >> Uh. cuz otherwise they're sort of grainy. black and white. But yeah, you get your. with this color photo, you get a really. good look at like who they were. And. they they, you know, Faye Dunaway and. Warren Beatty played them for a reason. Like they were both like pretty. attractive people. >> Yeah, and um I didn't know this, but. Bonnie was a really dinkums. Like she.

was under 5. >> She was under 5 ft tall and weighed 85. lb. >> That's a dinkums? >> Yeah, that's a dinkums. >> Never heard of that. >> Um I guess it's my it's mine. >> Oh, okay. I like that. >> white papered. >> [laughter]. >> It's on archive right now. >> Well, you means a small version. Do you. say come here little dinkums? Is that. where it comes from? >> Yeah, it drives her crazy. >> [laughter]. >> She's like, "Put me down.". >> All right. Yeah, she was a dinkums. That's why he was just sort of holding. her up with one arm, I guess.

>> Yeah, and also it would come in handy. later when she injures her leg. >> Right. >> Cuz she had to be carried quite a bit. But, um, so around this time the those. photos, like you said, they'll they'll. come back in again. Um, but around this. time, um, I guess in March, this is January. when they started shooting at the cops. again. Yeah, December and January. >> Started shooting at the cops again? >> Right. So, this is this is March and um, when Clyde's brother Buck shows up. And. Buck had been in prison, too. Remember,

he basically taught his little brother. Clyde how to be a criminal. Um, but not a murderous criminal. Clyde. learned that on his own, remember? >> Yeah. >> And Buck's wife Blanche came along. So, now they had a two-couple gang with the. fifth wheel and WD. >> WD. >> Buck and Bonnie and Clyde and poor. little WD, who again is like 16, maybe. 17 by now. And after like this. at least a year of just constant crime, they're like, "Let's take a a vacation.

in Joplin, Missouri.". Missoura, right? That's how they say it. >> Yeah. >> Um, and I they were there for 13 days. before the cops got called on them. because they were basically being noisy. drunks, um, in in a neighborhood and the neighbors. were like, "I these are probably. bootleggers cuz this is this is, you. know, um, I guess it's after prohibition, shortly. after prohibition, but still um, these. bootleg operations were so successful. I'm sure they just didn't go away.

immediately.". >> Yeah, they're like, "Whoever's at this. Airbnb is really. dragging the neighborhood down.". >> Yeah, I think that's exactly right. >> So, they did call the cops and another. gunfight, you know, this the cops come. up and like you said this is just a time. where people are just opening fire all. over the place. And they killed two cops, Harry McGinnis. and Wes Harryman, and the gang got out. of there. >> Mhm. >> And uh WD, his his nickname was Little. Forty, he was shot in the side and. recovered. >> Mhm. >> And they somehow with those old cars in.

the 1930s uh drove about 600 mi. overnight to Shamrock, Texas. That's a long drive. >> Yeah, because Clyde was a professional. getaway driver. He was He was really. good at stealing cars and he was really. good at driving. cars fast. >> Yeah. Should we take a break? >> Yes, I think that's a great idea, Chuck. >> All right, we'll be right back with more. on B and C. >> [music].

>> All right, so we're back with Bonnie and. Clyde. Um they are starting to get a. little bit of press at this point and. the newspapers show up at the um hideout.

in Joplin, Missouri at the Airbnb. Uh once they found out what was going. on, uh they found, you know, guns, they. found this poem that Bonnie had written. Uh. which we'll get to in a second a little. more detail. Uh they found that. undeveloped film. So, you can imagine. they developed that film of these like. soon-to-be infamous photos of Bonnie. with a cigar and all this stuff. And it was front-page stuff and like. everybody was all of a sudden like. really uh kind of captured by the allure.

of these gangsters. >> Yeah, because not only are they like. doing. you know, news newspaper article worthy. crimes, getting away getting away from. the cops, killing cops. Now there's. photos that they can run alongside of. them. So, everybody starts getting in on. the act, not just the press, but also. true crime magazines, newsreels. Like. they became famous overnight. Like they. were already local legends in Texas. After those photos started getting.

published on the wire, that was that was. when they just really became icons. >> Yeah, I mean attractive young lovers, they're having a good time cuz in these. photos they're like goofing off and. having fun. >> Right. >> So, obviously just something that's. going to capture the public's attention. They published that poem that you. referenced earlier. This was called The. Story of Suicide Sal. >> Mhm. >> And I read the poem, I'm sure you did. too. >> Mhm. >> She wrote this in jail when she was. briefly in jail in 1932. And.

you know, it's an okay poem. It's not. the greatest thing in the world, but. when I was reading it, I was like, I. wonder if anyone's ever put this to. song. I was like, surely someone has. And I went online, I was like, oh yep, there it is. And I went and played it. and I was listening to it and it was. this woman. and it was like a country sort of. version. I was like, wait a minute. I. was like, this. does I bet this is not real. And I. looked of course it was freaking AI. from like February of this year. >> Oh my god. >> Like all completely fake. And I was just. it left a really nasty taste in my.

mouth. >> I'm sure. And well it should, man. >> Yeah. >> You got duped by AI. Somebody said, AI, make a song out of. this Bonnie Parker poem. >> Yeah. >> in the in the. in the the style of Juice Newton. >> Yeah. It was more like I don't know, I can't. think of a country singer right now. >> Like new country stuff? Like country. pop? >> Yeah, I mean it wasn't poppy. It sounded. country, but the the way the woman's the. fake woman's voice I don't even want to.

call her a woman, the computer voice. >> Mhm. >> uh was just super sort of modern. Nashville polished. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, I hope AI when they take over. don't come back and and punish us for. saying things derogatory things like. we've said about them over the years. >> Remember Yeah, remember the guy on the. train in Canada. that I overheard talking about AI? It was on the ride from uh. >> Yeah. >> uh Ottawa to Toronto. >> Yeah, but I don't remember what he said. >> He said he's talking about AI, he's. like, "Some people don't like it, some.

people do like it." He's like, "I mean, I can't wait for AI to get here.". Like it was coming to dinner. I was. like, "Bro, it is here, my friend.". >> [laughter]. >> Right. >> Yeah, sweet sweet Canada. >> off the train more often. >> Yeah. He I'll tell you what, he knew a. lot about NHL hockey though. >> I'll bet. Just like basically every Canadian does. >> Yeah. >> Um one thing about that poem, too, um so. in it she uses a bunch of like slang. like like underworld slang basically. >> Yeah. >> But it's it's still a serviceable poem,

especially for a 22-year-old. >> Sure. >> who dropped out of school at 15. And I. think that that's like a really good. back of the envelope sketch of Bonnie's. personality. She was. >> Yeah. >> very bright, she excelled in school, but. she dropped out at 15, and she was. fascinated with the underworld and like. um outlaw stuff. So much so that she. started living that life because she. found a guy who was living in that that. life, and she decided to to be with him, you know? >> Yeah. >> was that's her basically encapsulated.

>> Yeah, I totally agree. Um so there the public again is. enthralled at this point. Um they're in. like the true detective mysteries. magazines and stuff like that. >> Mhm. >> Um. the 19 you mentioned. that Clyde loved cars and like loved to. boost them. and also drive them. >> Mhm. >> And he loved Fords and he wrote a letter. in 1934 supposedly the I don't think. they verified it was from him but it. certainly sounds like it was to me. Uh wrote a letter to Henry Ford. And he.

said part of the letter says, "While I. still have got breath in my lungs, I. will tell you what a dandy car you. make.". "I have drove Fords exclusively when I. could get away with one." Uh "For. sustained speed and freedom from. trouble, the Ford has got every other. car skinned." There's your ad. >> Mhm. >> "And even if my business hasn't been. strictly legal.". "It don't hurt anything to tell you what. a fine car you got in the V8.". And judging from you know, we later got. poems from Clyde as well and there are a.

lot of misspellings and stuff and I said. he wasn't you know, the the brightest. bulb because of his upbringing of. course. >> Mhm. >> Uh but it sounds sounds to me pretty. legit. >> Yeah. Yeah, I think at least Henry Ford was. like it's legit enough to have his. secretary craft a thank you letter to. send back. >> pretty funny. >> Yeah. Um and you said that that like they were. you know, they they become popularizing. true crime magazines. Um in part as like folk heroes like I. said at the outset and one of the. reasons why is they're they're.

committing these crimes at the height of. the depression or the depth of the. depression. >> Yeah. >> And people were rooting for people who. did things like rob banks because the. banks were the villains at the time. They were foreclosing on like hard. working honest people. >> Yeah. >> And so if you robbed a bank, you kind of. automatically became a folk hero. And. people like Bonnie and Clyde so much. that those true crime magazines. basically attributed scores of bank. robberies to them that they never did. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Apparently they were popular enough that.

banks would if they got robbed, they'd. be like, "Yeah, Bonnie and Clyde just. robbed us.". Be just to have that brush with. celebrity even if it wasn't them. >> Yeah, I mean get it in the paper. >> Mhm. >> Uh for sure. They also you know, they. did kill a lot of cops but they also let. a lot go by way of kind of taking them. with them, which is technically. kidnapping. Uh sometimes cops, sometimes civilians. that would they would kidnap and then. just drop them off in the middle of. nowhere, basically. Uh so they didn't. have to kill them, which uh you know,

that was a better choice, I guess. Uh and they were also like. you know, this is a time where you get. away with crime a lot easier and come. and go is a lot easier just cuz of. communications and the way things. worked. And they would, you know, they'd. go home and like visit their families. and stuff and not get caught. Like they. didn't have their families' homes staked. out at this point. >> No, but they were also really safe about. it. They were very smart. Like they did. write a message in a Coke bottle and. just throw it out of the car as they. were driving past at their mom's house.

or whatever. Like they were they were. smart. They assumed that the phones were. tapped and all that stuff. But if you're. an outlaw that is are well-known around. those parts, to show up at home is still. pretty pretty risky. >> Oh, for sure. >> So uh after Joplin, after the little. vacay in Joplin that ended on a uh. shootout with the cops and the death of. two cops, um they kept moving. They got. back on the road and uh they were in a. car wreck actually at one point. Um.

I like a couple months later. And they. like it was a bad crash. The Clyde was. going really fast. They rolled the car. and Bonnie got third-degree burns on her. leg. I saw from one account that she was. burned because the car caught on fire. Another account said that it was acid. from the battery. Either way, she had. third-degree [clears throat] burns down. to her bones and no options about going. and getting actual medical treatment. So. she had she was in a lot of pain and and. limped and hopped and was carried in.

some cases uh for the rest of her life. >> What? Does it surprise me that cars had. batteries then? >> I think that was actually very new and. that was one of the reasons Clyde was. able to steal so many cars is because. you could hotwire them now. >> Uh, okay. >> Mhm, I think that was super new. >> All right, which is probably why leaked. all over Bonnie. >> Yeah, I guess. >> They didn't have the the caps. >> No, they were like, "Just don't tip it. over. Don't roll your car over, and.

everything should be fine.". >> All right, so good driver except when. he's crashing cars. Uh, later they robbed I think it was. that was in June of '33. They robbed a. store in Alma, Texas. Another gunfight. with two cops, and they killed another. cop, Marshall Henry D. Humphrey. Escaped again. Uh, in July they were. not at that Airbnb, but they went to a. different one in Missouri. Another guest house, and the owner and I. never had heard of this, but it makes.

sense. If you Apparently back then if. you would back a car in, they called. that like gangster style cuz you want to. get out of there quick. >> Mhm. >> And that was sort of a just a red flag, so he noticed that they backed their car. in. The other thing he noticed to me, a. bigger tell, is they taped newspapers. over the windows. >> Right. >> And they paid for their meals with. coins, and it turns out some vending. machines nearby had been robbed. So, this was all just like the guy was like, "Well, maybe I should call the cops.". So, >> Yeah. >> uh, they did. The cops came out. Guess what happened? Another gunfight.

Guess what happened? They escaped again, but this time Buck Barrow, his brother, was wounded pretty badly, and Blanche. was too. Blanche got shards of glass in. her eyes. Um, I'm I'm guessing temporarily blinding. her considering the jobs she had later. in life. >> She was blinded in at least one eye, so. I don't know if it was permanent or not. either. I didn't see that anywhere. >> Yeah. >> So, they actually made it they escaped. from this gunfight with the cops, um, in. Missouri, and they made it all the way.

to Iowa, and they found like a park and. were hanging laying low in this park, um, trying to keep Buck alive and I. guess tending to Blanche as well. And. again, they backed their car in gangster. style and that caught people's. attention. They also left the car. running when they went to town to buy. supplies. >> gangster. >> For sure. Either that or you just got. places to be, you know, but I guess. people were jumpy back then. >> Yeah.

>> The cops showed up at the park. Somebody. followed them or said these people are. staying at the park right now. 50 cops. show up. Another gunfight happens. This. is like a day or so I think after the. first one and Blanche and Buck Buck gets. hit again. And he's like, I can't make it any. further. You guys go on. Blanche stays. with Buck and they both get arrested. Bonnie, Clyde and WD make their make. their escape and they actually get away. WD finally says like, that's enough for. me. I'm done. He did the whole blackjack.

dealers like I'm out thing and he went. home to Texas. >> Yeah, so he goes home to Texas while. Buck is arrested. I think five days. later he dies. So big brother is now. gone, Blanche's husband. And. when WD goes home, he's arrested in. pretty short order. I think in November. And he told the cops like, yeah, I was. in the Barrow gang, but he said he was forced into it and. because of that fact and because he was. a kid, they were fairly lenient on him.

They sentenced him to six years in. prison. >> Yeah. So yeah, I think WD kind of got the. least of it out of anybody because also. at this time like there are other people. that they're kind of coming up against. doing some crimes with here there. They're going in and out of prison. >> Yeah. >> Pretty pretty frequently and as a matter. of fact to because he was short-handed, he actually Clyde staged a prison break. I remember the the old Eastham a farm.

>> Yeah. >> That had learned to hate and it had. changed Clyde essentially, right? Well, he had people on the inside. and he and a guy named Jimmy Mullins. busted these guys out. They busted out. Henry Methvin, Joe Palmer, guy named. Hilton Bybee, and Raymond Hamilton. Remember him from. >> Yeah. >> section. He had been captured and and. sent to prison and so they busted him. out because Clyde needed more help. because now W.D. was gone and so was.

Buck. >> Yes, and killed two guards in the. process here, so that's two more down. >> Mhm. >> Uh, I mean the bodies are stacking up at. this point. >> Well, one of those guards, um, I think. may have been purposely killed because. he was known as such a brutal guard. He. would leave his post just to go beat. inmates. >> Yeah. >> So, it's probably not coincidence that. he was one of the two that were killed. during this. >> Like get one on the way out. >> Mhm. >> All right, so the gang is still on the. run and it feels like.

it feels like the noose is tightening a. little bit. Like the original gang is. now had is is partly died and been in. prison, so it's been splintered. >> Yeah. >> But they're soldiering on with new. people and in April of '34, Bonnie, Clyde, and Henry Methvin were in and he. was one of the guys they, you know, boosted from prison, yeah? >> Mhm. >> Can you say that, too? >> Yeah, you can boost somebody from. prison, sure. >> Okay. Uh, what about when you just give. somebody a boost like an emotional. support? Where does that fit in? >> Um, that is.

I see. I guess that would be Clarking. somebody some support. >> Yeah, Clark Clark made some good. feelings. >> Yeah. >> Uh, so, uh, where was I? Henry Methvin, they all went to Grapevine, Texas at. this point. Um, a couple of highway. cops, highway patrolmen, saw thought. they were stranded motorists and stopped. to help them out. >> Mhm. >> And they killed them. So, two more cops. dead and then 5 days after that they. killed another cop in Oklahoma and. kidnapped a police chief. So, things are. getting really pretty uh.

intense at this point. >> Yeah. I mean, three cops in 2 days, I think. >> Yeah. >> That's or three cops in Yeah, 3 days, something like that. That's crazy. Um. so, this was like Yeah, you kind of get the. impression that things are starting to. move really, really fast at this point, right? Uh Raymond Hamilton, he was. recaptured uh I think by uh like a month. or so after, but he'd already been. involved in the murders of these cops.

and like a bunch of other robberies and. stuff. So, remember he had been busted. out. So, when he was recaptured, not. only was he being resentenced for. escaping prison, but also for all the. crimes, including murder, that he. committed in the short like month or two. that he was out. Yeah. Um he was. sentenced to the Texas State Pen in. Huntsville and placed on death row. there. >> Yeah. >> He also escaped there, too, but he was. recaptured again. Do you know how hard. it's got to be to escape from death row? >> Uh how hard?

>> Really hard. >> Okay. >> But, he had already actually split ways. with Bonnie and Clyde when they finally. recaptured him and sent him to. Huntsville um and they had had a falling. out. >> Yeah, they ended up uh sending a letter. to Hamilton. uh in prison saying like, you know, you. stole from us and you're a coward. Uh. so, yeah, it was a pretty bad breakup. >> It was. There was no love lost.

>> Should we break up this episode? >> Oh, good good call. >> All right. We'll be back to finish up on. Bonnie and Clyde right after this. >> [music]. >> Learning stuff with Joshua. and Chuck.

>> Okay, Chuck. So, you had said a little. while ago that um the one of the reasons. they were able to be so successful is. because they were. There was a There were a handful of. reasons. One, they typically kept their. um targets pretty small. They were small. towns, often mom-and-pop groceries, um. maybe like a gas station, something like. that. Every once in a while, a bank. But, remember like all of their crimes. were exaggerated, so they were. supposedly two of the greatest bank. robbers that ever lived, even though.

they'd only done a couple of banks. So, by making their takes pretty small, I. think the biggest take was like 1,800, which is less than 50 grand today. That. was far and away the biggest take. Sometimes they'd make enough money just. to buy some groceries or something like. that. Um. they they kept themselves small. They. made themselves small targets. What made. them huge targets. uh was killing cops. You know, like that. definitely catches the attention of. other cops. And there was another Texas. outlaw named Willis Newton who said, "Killing that first cop, Eugene Moore,

was their was their true undoing." And. then all the cops after that just made. them even bigger targets. But, one of. the other reasons they were able to. still get away. even after killing all those cops is. because those cops in the different. jurisdictions were not coordinating in. any way. >> No, I mean that didn't happen back then. It's not like they were being stubborn. That was just not a thing that had. really come along yet. Uh like working interstate with one. another or even intercounty, probably. >> Yeah. >> Uh the FBI wasn't quite a thing yet. The.

Bureau of Investigation was. And all. they could They They did start. investigating them. They um I guess the. BI. uh in December of '32 and did get a. warrant in May of '33, but it was only. over interstate moving of the stolen. cars. But, they did get involved with. the local cops and start sort of. providing um information, providing. support to like the the local cops and. the state agencies uh as you know, part. of the eventual dragnet. Uh and it seems like the cops in Texas.

and Louisiana are the ones who really. sort of uh got together finally to zero. in on them and focus on these guys. And. when the Texas Rangers come on the. scene, that means things are really. serious. And that's what happened after. that uh. that second prison break. Uh the Texas. Rangers got together. Uh this guy came. out of retirement, Captain Frank uh not. Hammer, but Hamer, I guess. He probably. He probably called himself the Hammer. And he was like, "I'm coming out of. retirement to get these guys." And had a.

posse of six Rangers. And he's like, "I've killed 53 dudes in my law. enforcement career." So, it was really. on at this point. >> It was. Um he coordinated with the guy. named Henderson Jordan, who is sheriff. in a parish in Louisiana, Bienville. Parish. And the reason he's significant is. because Henry Methvin, remember he was. one of the guys that got busted out with. Raymond Hamilton and some of the other. guys and joined the gang. Methvin was. now a part of the gang. Um he lived, his.

family lived in Bienville Parish. And. supposedly Henderson Jordan, the. sheriff, had been approached by. Methvin's family, who were alarmed that. he was. wanted by the cops and with Bonnie and. Clyde, these notorious outlaws. And they. look, we can get our son to cooperate. He was basically Daryl in Red Dawn. essentially. >> Yeah. >> Right? It's That's Daryl's dad's car. It's the mayor's car. Um so, that his family is like, "We'll. get him to cooperate, but you got to. give him clemency. And but we'll get you.

Bonnie and Clyde if you make sure our. boy doesn't doesn't get the chair for. all this stuff." And so, Frank Hamer and. Henderson Jordan are like, "Let's make. this happen." This was ultimately the. downfall. Trusting Henry Methvin was was. what brought them to their end. >> You know, I'm still mad at Daryl after. all these years. >> I know. >> The second you said Daryl from Red Dawn, I was just like, "Ugh, >> [snorts]. >> that guy.". >> They picked like a perfect actor for it. That guy really suited that part of.

>> Yeah, he was one of the bad soches in. The Outsiders, too. >> Oh, I didn't know that. >> So, that fits. >> Did you know that S.E. Hinton was a. teenage girl when she wrote The. Outsiders? >> I had no idea. >> It's crazy. >> Uh so, they. uh they kind of figured out their um. their route, basically, and that Bonnie. and Clyde were driving a lot to that. Methvin home in Louisiana on Highway. 154. So, in May of 1934, they were like, "All. right, we really need to get this done.". And this is where the famous ambush.

happens. Um there, you know, are. different like kind of disputing. accounts of exactly how it went down, >> Mhm. >> uh but it seems like they got um. Methvin's dad's car out on the road and. parked it there with a wheel removed. Um. so, they would be like, "Oh, that's your. dad's car. Like, it looks like he needs. help." So, they would pull over. They had those six Texas Rangers. They. had automatic rifles. And as soon as. that Bonnie and Clyde car showed up, they just started firing. They were. like, "We've seen enough of these guys'.

work. >> Mhm. >> to not let them open the doors, not try. and arrest them or whatever, cuz they're. going to be shooting at us.". So, they just basically shot the crud. out of this car. And uh. to great effect. I mean, they they. murdered the crud out of them. >> They did. They got them. >> Yeah, Bonnie was shot 26 times. Clyde. was shot 17 times. Uh further research. um says that it may have been as many as. 50 times. >> Mhm. >> Um they were kids, you know? They were. 23 and 24 years old. And it was it was.

pretty gruesome. And uh the people in. the press went wild over this ambush. >> Yeah, they the car with the bodies. inside. Um. >> That's crazy. >> Yeah, to well, they also laid in wait. and executed them without giving them. any chance to to give themselves up. So, at this point, basically anything's on. the table, right? >> Yeah. >> So, they towed the death car. um and I I guess it essentially. immediately became like a tourist. attraction. Um they sent them both back to Dallas.

for for burial and both of the funeral. homes where they were they each in a. different funeral home because. um. Bonnie's mom. Emma was like, "You. In death, they can't have anything to do. with one another. I couldn't talk her. out of being with him while she was. alive, but I'm calling the shots now. that she's dead and I don't want her. anywhere near him.". >> Yeah. >> Both of their funerals were thronged. with onlookers, but even before that, um. while their bodies were just basically. hanging out in the public, um. all these basically souvenir seekers.

were trying to like cut off their body. parts and stuff, right? >> Oh, yeah. Just like looting what they. could to get a piece of the car or maybe. to get a like a blood-soaked. handkerchief or something like that. And. yeah, supposedly some guy tried to cut. off Clyde's ear. Uh their their death photos are, you. know, you can look those up if you have. a strong stomach. They're pretty nasty. Uh and their funerals attracted like. thousands of people to come and and see. the burials of Bonnie and Clyde. Um after they died, there was sort of a.

lot that went on. Uh there was a book. initially from Bonnie's mother and. Clyde's sister. They got together and. wrote a book called Fugitives {colon}. uh the story of Clyde Barrow and Bonnie. Parker. Uh they started publishing more poems. from Bonnie and Clyde. One from Bonnie. called The Trails' End or The Story of. Bonnie and Clyde. And then. uh another one that that I mentioned. earlier that Clyde had written sort of. as response. And in both of them,

they're kind of still talking about like. hey we didn't do all these crimes we're. not as bad as everyone makes us out to. be that kind of thing. >> Right. >> Uh and in key though in one of these. Bonnie had requested at least in the. poem someday they'll go down together. they meaning them and they'll bury them. side by side so that that seemed like. that would have been her wish that she. did not get. >> No because her mom said heck no. I I. read his nephew and her niece maybe. great niece have been like trying to.

trying to draw up support to to bury. them rebury them together but it hasn't. gotten anywhere. >> Yeah. Um so as you know I said a lot. happened basically what happened from. this point forward is the cops were like. it's not good enough just to get like. Bonnie and Clyde like we got them but we. need to just dragnet the whole operation. and so all of their friends and family. that were ever uh aiding and abetting or. anything like that were rounded up. I. think Dallas police got 20 friends and.

family. Uh everybody was found guilty and you. know not very long prison sentences I. think the max was like a couple of. years. But um. they they wanted to get everyone who. ever touched part of this gang and put. them away. >> Yeah and I mean. two years for just basically being. friends with Bonnie and Clyde that's a. lot you know. Um Raymond Hamilton. >> Aiding and abetting is like. >> Yeah we were just friends. >> Right right. >> Like they might have stayed at my house. and I might have given them food and. hid them from the cops but.

>> ammunition and stuff that's what friends. do. Um. uh Raymond Hamilton and Joe Palmer they. were both executed in Huntsville. at the prison in Huntsville on May 10th. 1935 and Henry Methvin he was so there. was this I said there was a disputed. murder of one of the patrolmen that. farmer who supposedly witnessed this. said that he saw Bonnie like go over and. execute the cop at point-blank range. blowing his head off with a shotgun and. making some grizzly, tasteless remark. about it. She supposedly wasn't even.

>> about to head out or something? >> That would have been good. No, something. like, "Look at there, his head bounced. like a rubber ball." or something like. that. Right? So, the kind of thing where. you're like, "Wow, she's really. despicable." And of course, every. everybody printed it cuz this farmer. said he saw it. >> Right. >> What the what historians now believe is. that it was actually Henry Methvin who. actually did the killing, and the reason. why he wasn't implicated was because his. family's plan to bring in Bonnie and. Clyde was already in motion. So, now the.

authorities had to cover up his murder. of a cop before he could turn in Bonnie. and Clyde. So, that it was attributed to. her and almost certainly wasn't her. >> Yeah. Methvin was eventually paroled in. '42 and died 6 years after that. Uh and. the story is he was hit by a train. He. was either drunk and got hit by a train. or maybe he was shoved into a train and. murdered. Uh but no one was ever tapped for that. Uh as far as Blanche, uh she was Buck's,

you know, there's um Clyde's. sister-in-law. And Buck's wife, who was. uh blinded in one eye, she served 6. years, was paroled in '39, and wrote her book uh My Life with. Bonnie and Clyde, no colons. >> Mhm. >> And went back to Dallas and, you know, lived a life there, worked as a taxi. dispatcher and a beautician, cared for. her dad, got married again. Um the death car. uh. eventually you know, it would end up at. Buffalo Bill's Resort and Casino in. Primm, Nevada. I think that's where it. is now.

>> Mhm. >> But for a while, it was, you know, a lot. of this stuff, like the the guns and the. cars, like everyone wanted a piece of. this. I think everyone knew it was going. to be worth a lot of money. So, uh. various family members had to sue. various institutions to get this stuff. back. And in the case of the guns, Clyde's mom was like, "I want those guns. back because. uh. Clyde had never uh been convicted of the. murders. Like he was just shot in cold. blood. >> Mhm. >> So I want those guns back and I think. the car.

like the original car owner, Ruth. Warren, was like, "Hey, that was my car. to begin with.". >> Yeah. >> The cops can't keep that thing. So she. sued to get it back and got it back. >> Yeah, and before it ended up at the. Primm Valley Casino Resort, it was a. traveling amusement at like circuses and. carnivals and state fairs and stuff. >> That's right. >> I don't know entirely that we would just. know and everybody would be walking. around knowing that there was such a. couple as Bonnie and Clyde were it not.

for that 1967 movie. starring Faye Dunaway and Warren Beatty. Um. I never saw the movie, so it's not like. I my understanding of them comes. directly from it, but all the people it. informed, I think it it brought them. back up into the popular culture again. and they never. >> Sure. left since then. >> It's a good movie. The great Arthur Penn was the director. who had another Stuff You Should Know. connection in that he directed. The Miracle Worker as well. Oh, okay.

Yeah, that's He's basically a friend of. the podcast then. Yeah, two Stuff You. Should Know movies. Good movie though, but it was. the year after the Hays Code ended, you. know, the movie codes that tried to rein. in sex and violence. And so there was a. lot of sex and violence in this movie. and glamorization of crime and stuff. like that and that that ambush scene is. like a sort of a legendary film scene. because it's it's it shows it all and. it's pretty gory. [clears throat]. Um but it was a it was a big big movie. and I think a lot of gangster movies. kind of started coming around in its.

wake because it was so popular. >> Yeah, it was huge in the UK apparently. Um and it set the stage for other bloody. movies to come, everything from The Wild. Bunch two years later to Pulp Fiction, which was originally written by Eleanor. Roosevelt. Um to basically every violent. movie you've ever seen. Um, Bonnie and. Clyde essentially set the stage for. that. >> That's right. I tell you what, if I'm. ever near Primm, Nevada, I'm going to go over to Buffalo Bill's. Resort & Casino to to check that car.

out. >> Uh, >> I'd like to see that. >> And his death shirt, too. >> Yeah, they got a shirt. >> Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, it's full of. holes. >> Yeah, and and not in a bad plot sort of. way. >> [laughter]. >> Boy, you're full of little zingers. today, aren't you? That little shorty. for WD or Lil' 40? >> Oh, yeah, did you catch that one? >> Yeah, that was a good one. Uh, you got any other little zingers? >> I got no other zingers. >> Okay, well, then that means this is the.

end of the road for Bonnie and Clyde as. far as Stuff You Should Know goes, and I. think that means it's time for listener. mail. >> That's right, and we did not plan this. everyone, but here's the listener mail. Hey guys, I want to share a moment from. the Eleanor Roosevelt episode that gets. a gold star for Josh. I have a long. history of Josh-like moments where I. will add in an absurd, impossible fact. when talking to my wife, such as a local. construction [music] site being a dining. with your pets restaurant or coming or a.

lava fields in the California desert. being a huge disposal site for used. asphalt. [music]. And my wife over 25 years of marriage. has become very canny about my {quote}. facts, [music]. and it's very difficult to fool her. anymore. However, when Josh said in her. writings Eleanor Roosevelt wrote an. initial treatment that became the script. of Pulp Fiction, I saw my wife process that fact for. about 10 seconds with narrow eyes and. complete confusion followed by a loud. no. So, thank you Josh for that magic. moment, and thank you [music] both for. all you do. Very long-time listener. I. started listening when there were only.

about 100 back episodes. So, 100. episodes in. And that is from Sam and. Lisa. >> Nice, [music] thanks Sam. And yeah, that. wasn't planned. How What a coincidence, huh? >> As soon as you said it, I was like, oh. boy, Josh's going to be so excited.". >> Uh and I am. And I was. And I still will. be probably for hours after this. Uh Sam and Lisa, right? >> That's right. >> Thanks, Sam and Lisa. Thanks for the. email. Thanks for listening to us for so. long, too. And if you want to be like. Sam and Lisa and send us an email, you. can do that, too. There's nothing.

stopping you except no access to the. internet. If you have access to the. internet, you can send us that email to. stuffpodcast@iheartradio.com. [music]. >> Stuff You Should Know is a production of. iHeartRadio. >> [music]. >> For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple. Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your. favorite [music] shows.