Luis Chaparro - Inside Cartel Drug Operations | SRS #012

so you've seen thousands thousands of  dead bodies that have been murdered. the fentanyl like the proper  powder like fentanyline powder. the precursors to cook it come  from china or from germany. so you you just totally immerse yourself into the  narco culture to gain their trust to experience.

it so you understand it better orbas brought  someone from china to to teach him how to compete. i don't know if you um heard  about the killing of two. employees of the u.s  consulate in sioux earthquakes.

so these are all hitmen coming in yeah yeah. because i know if i killed that guy  a couple of guys that got into me. there's going to be more coming. so you're saying that the dea is  trading weapons for kingpins or phones.

and you grab a kingpin it was just part of that. horizontal structure it was not the boss  you didn't caught the head of the snake. ladies and gentlemen welcome back to the  sean ryan show this is episode zero one two.

and it's all about cartels the dea and fentanyl  thank you for everyone that showed up to the live. conference about the blackwater episode it was a  great chat we had on patreon and for you patrons. out there you are the ones that make it  possible to bring these stories to light. so thank you if you can't support us on patreon  please go to the link below click the itunes tab.

and leave us a review all we're looking for  is one word let's get on to the cartel stuff. in episode zero one two we've brought to you an  investigative cartel journalist that was kidnapped. he also witnessed an arms deal go down between the  dea and the sonola cartel he's also embedded with. fentanyl chemists in mexico and discusses with  us how the chinese are sending chemists to mexico.

to train the cartels to produce the most potent  fentanyl in the world and how it's smuggled into. the united states of america ladies and gentlemen  please welcome my next guest luis chaparro.

luis chaparro yeah did i say that  right yes that's perfect welcome to the. sean ryan show thank you for having me man i  mean um i told you i've been binge watching. your channel and now i'm here and it's  like wow this is this is where it happens. second interview in the new studio and this  is an amazing studio man you have here right. i really love it thank you it's amazing  so you're an investigative reporter.

and you do a lot of stuff with drug trafficking  narcos and immigration yeah and uh we met. on a zoom call uh you shot an email in  and and uh said you wanted to be on the. show and we get a lot of those emails and nine  times out of ten we nix them right off the bat. but uh you sent a couple of articles we picked  through them and i was like [ __ ] you know. let's see what this guy's all about  so and we had just wrapped up a.

episode with my friend ed calderon yeah which  is what uh drew you and the channel exactly. and i think we were all a little skeptical on  you know what's going to make you different than. ed yeah because you know ed we had just done  that it's very knowledgeable on all these topics. and uh so we jumped on a zoom call first words out  of your mouth after i think my wife asked you that. is what's going to make you any different than ed  you said well we just did a deal between the dea.

and the sonola cartel and uh i jumped in  immediately and said [ __ ] it you're on let's set. a date and uh so here we are and um we're going  to talk about a whole bunch of stuff we're going. to talk about arms trafficking your dea deal and  you did a tour of a fentanyl lab yeah and um then. we'll get into the documentary that you made and  produced uh and eventually wound up on show time.

yes so which i watched this morning it was  it was a good uh good duck thank you so but. kind of getting a little backstory on here just  a little bit here how did you kind of get into. investigative journalism when it comes to  you know cartels well i grew up in juarez. i was born in inside juarez right at the border  of mexico right across el paso texas i have the.

dual citizenship so growing up at the border you  are immediately immersed into that crazy world of. cartels and all that stuff it's been happening  in mexico forever so i remember reading some um. magazines my dad used to read but that is a  lawyer but he used to be a teacher back then. and he would like read a lot and i will read  about cartels i will read about organizations.

about drug trafficking and it was like it blew  my mind that that world existed in the same world. i was living in at the same time that culture  is always around you when you're living a place. like ciudad juarez i was in um you know in  a private school in primary school uh it was. like a fancy school where most of a you know like  businessman and business owner put their kids and.

the rumor that some of the narcos including  carrillo fuentes el senor de los cielos um. he had a couple of kids there on that same  school so i was like you know that the whole. my whole life has been around that stuff so i  wanted i knew when i was in um secondary school. i knew that i wanted to write i just i just wanted  like to learn you know i can't i couldn't wait to. go into college and say like okay i'm gonna  learn some skills to actually start writing.

and i'm gonna i'm gonna end up writing for the  magazines my dad used to read you know and i. did one of those magazines is processor magazine  and i and i had two covers one of them actually. talking about the cia a cia operation in mexico  and and the other one talking about how the dea. was not really looking for narcos in  mexico but looking for you know like.

gold medals to to hang under their neck and  so when i i went to college i didn't study. journalism instead of like mass media which  was like a broader thing i honestly thought. like i just need a paper you know because  i was already working at a local newspaper. i went and knocked on the door trying to get a job  as um to deliver the newspaper i was like that way. i'm gonna be the first one reading the news of my  city and i can maybe find around how journalism.

works in a newsroom so i went there they told  me like all right wait wait on that chair and. then all of a sudden the editor of the newspaper  came down upstairs so like you're here for the. editor right like and i'm like yes i'm exactly  that guy and that was completely [ __ ] yeah and. he set me up on a computer gave me a couple  of articles like a list of news headlines and. a thing we call domi which was like the like like  a like a like a small version of a newspaper page.

um and told me that's that's you today and i'm  like all right what the [ __ ] am i gonna do. with all of this you know i had no clue but i  started asking and the friends around started. helping me out like on how to decide on which  um article was gonna be on on the front which. picture i was super i was like 19 years old back  then and and i was like [ __ ] it i learned quick. i stay there then they noticed that okay so you  weren't here for that job right i'm like no but i.

i have uh six months now working here and  delivering so what the what the hell you know. and he's like all right um do you have a permit  to work in the u.s and i'm like yeah i'm a u.s. citizen also that's perfect let's move you  to the u.s newsroom so they brought me into a. paso newsroom and it was like a small newsroom so  every time a journalist reporter didn't show up i. was covering for that i was like me i'll write  it even if it's you know like a crash around.

the corner whatever i'll write it um so i started  like working my way up there but always having an. ear out and uh and uh my eyes open to see what's  going on in the cartel world and all that stuff. and i remember my first if you could call it  investigation which was kind of like shitty you. know but uh my first story about that was how some  of the cartels since you at juarez were what were.

trying to recruit kids on a metroflog social  network social media which metro vlog was huge. back then in mexico there was no facebook or  twitter it was just like metroflog what year was. that i think it was 2007 2007 something like that  2007. how old are you i'm 34. i'm about to turn. 35. okay so i started i started like somewhat  young you know like writing about this stuff. my editor saw my pitch and it was like this seems  like you know like a conspiracy theory unless you.

bring me some proof so i brought him a lot of  proof a lot of links between this metroflux. user his this and that and he killed this and  that and he's like holy [ __ ] you have a story. there man yeah let's uh let's let's run it and  it was the front page of the of the newspaper. so it was it was like i liked that feeling but  at the same time it made me because i was too. young until naive until you know like too into  it i made some mistakes i started writing about.

how corrupt the mexican police were and how were  they dealing information between the military. federals local police narcos even the d.a was  involved in that [ __ ] so i started writing about. this woman who was a police officer and she was  like trafficking information because she was like. good looking so she was like literally [ __ ]  everybody and trafficking information around um.

and that was uh my editor said like okay  we're gonna run that on the front page. but we're not gonna put your name into it and i'm  like why not man it's my story i mean you sure. and it's like you're sure i obviously didn't  understand what that meant yeah sorry protection. exactly and so we did and i got kidnapped by the  local police into the juarez you got kidnapped by. a local yeah by local officers and uh it was like  it was when i knew that i was into deep [ __ ] and.

it was not a game you know i was i left my  girlfriend at her house was driving back to. i still live with my parents driving back to my  parents house in the middle of the night and i. got stopped by uh first like a traffic police and  i'm like wow i'm not even you know doing anything. but i guess he's mistaking so he told me like hey  you just run that red line on a huge street and. i'm like i i did not man i mean i'm watching the  red light and he's like no you did can i see your.

your license yeah grab my license kind of laughed  um said something on the radio like codes and then. gave me back my last and said like ah you're good  to go and i'm like all right that was where kept. driving and right in front of that like two police  pickup trucks just like crossed my my my way. they started knocking with their guns in  my windows like get the [ __ ] down get. the [ __ ] down and i'm like all right and  i thought again i think they're mistaking. everybody's nervous because it's like the water  the wire and juarez between cartels was just.

starting and i'm like i think they're mistaking  they're nervous because of everything that's going. on in the city so i grabbed my badge like from  the news paper and put it like behind my shirt. um and it's like uh we got this is like we got the  journalist yeah it's him all right bye and then it. like started like sending codes and now like oh  [ __ ] and i'm like dude you can take everything. like take my car if you want money i have some  money i can go to the atm get some money and.

just leave me alone and they're like no no you're  just [ __ ] up you you know what you did and you. [ __ ] up real good this time and i'm like i have  no clue man i'm i'm cool and so they tie my hands. and feet put me in the back of the truck or the  pickup truck they put their feet like on top of me. you know in my chest and they started driving off  and someone else took my car um and it was like 11. 00 pm like in the middle of the night we went to  a deserted parking lot and then they stopped there.

and then they asked me to run and i'm like  i'm not gonna run cause i know what's gonna. happen i'm gonna run you're gonna shoot me  and then you're gonna say it was a confusion. or i had a gun or you thought i watched this  and that or some [ __ ] like that so i was like. i'm not running man and i knew for that source  that the local police and the federal police. were fighting between each other because one  was supporting one cartel and the other one was.

had a deal with another one so i saw a convoy of  federales driving by and i started jumping to see. i i told him like i was cold because he was in  the middle of the winter so i started jumping and. saying like um and they're like what the [ __ ]  are you doing i'm like i'm trying to get some heat. max i'm i'm i'm freezing and they're like that  they just like kick me and they're like hey get. in the [ __ ] floor i know what you're doing and  then the other guy was like watch out the fox they. that was the code for the federal like fox watch  it with the fox and then the federalist convoy.

just left just passed by and i was like [ __ ]  um and i remember they i got my knees inside like. if you if you're gonna do this then just [ __ ] do  it and i was thinking like if my colleagues at the. newspaper investigate this they're gonna find  out i was executed and i wasn't you know doing. something else because i was on my knees and i was  like that's how my god am i gonna get on my knees. um at the end i i don't remember like being  screaming or yelling but they say that i was i was.

like stop [ __ ] yelling stuff and i'm like i'm  not yelling and i'm just asking you for a favor. like you you're in no position to ask for  anything and and i'm like i can bring you. money i can bring some money um and just give  me two hours and then we'll play um you know cat. and mouse again she said no but one of them was  like what if we and then start like talking codes.

but i could understand that what if we actually  get some money from out of him and then we end up. catching him again and just killing him and uh and  i said yes yes yes yes yes do that let's do that. let's do that and then the other lady started  fighting each other and then the commanders are. like all right get up go to an atm and i'm like  there's your wallet and i'm like all right and. i'm like just give me your word that you're gonna  shoot me in the back while i'm walking and it's.

like you don't you're in no position to ask me for  any so if you want to go go if you're not don't go. and i'm like okay i'll go and i started walking  and i felt like [ __ ] this is it that they're. gonna [ __ ] shoot me off the back um i hit a  main street went to an atm i had two cards on me. um because i they're following you no  no one was following me i could just. run or and leave but they had my address my car  plates all of my documentation and i was like.

of course they're gonna try and look for me at my  house you know or my family or something like that. yeah so i went tried to play it cool got 12  000 pesos which is nothing 600 bucks that's. that was the limit of both of my cards that that i  called withdraw um got back and said like counter. is 12 000 pesos and it's like i'm gonna trust you  um get in your car make sure you're not missing.

anything and i'm like i don't even care he's like  no please make sure you're not missing anything. because this is not a robbery this is not why  we want to you know say that we're braving you. please look into your car look into  your wallet you have everything. yes all right you have two hours we're going  to be looking for you again so that same night. i crossed the border and stayed in el paso for  a good while for like nine nine months i think.

without being able to actually get back into  juarez that was like traumatic you know i was. like oh [ __ ] i can't i can't see my city  from here but i can't cross i can't get back. and i have a sword and i had a source back then  a guy who was with me in um secondary school and. we were like good friends and then he went off to  the other side of the coin you know he wouldn't. look on the bad side and he would like tell me  how the whole cartel works and like a lot of.

stuff we will talk about a lot of stuff and uh he  called me on my we used to have like these nextil. radios i don't know if you remember those like  they were like very popular in mexico back then. so he rang my radio and i was like hey what's  up man it's like hey what are you doing i'm like. nothing working and it's like where are you when  i'm in el paso and it's like i learned that you. can't get back to juarez what happened and i'm  like i didn't tell anyone anyone i i talked to.

the owner of the newsroom of the of the paper  and i told him like i don't want anything like. the police and he was like no i need to call  the mayor obviously that juarez to give you. protection and this and that i'm like please  don't just don't tell anyone anyone please. and then he's like all right i won't i  won't do anything i won't say anything. what you're going to do is you're going to file  a complaint with human rights just so you have. uh preceding you know like a background in  character a record yeah in case something.

happens and i'm like all right i'll do that and  i did that but didn't tell anyone just my family. and um and so i was like hmm how did the guy this  this guy found out and he was like anyways i don't. know why you don't want to tell me we're friends  and everything but um be uh be looking out in the. news like you're gonna be surprised and i'm like  all right so i can watch the news for the next. days and one of those days in the same spot they  closed my road uh that those police officers were.

shot killed right there really and uh so i  stopped communication with that guy i was like. dude that's not i mean we're not friends because  of that you know like that i'm completely. different than that i'm older than that i'm not  in the business of having people killed yeah i'm. actually in the other side of the coin you know  trying to make people um skip their lives and um.

so yeah it was pretty damn hardcore and so i  had a chance there to get out we keep writing. and i was like okay i need to  step up i need to be more careful. that's why you study some of this [  __ ] that's when you go to college. and that's why you learn but but right  there was just starting the ugliest. part of the history of juarez  where the killings were it was the.

most violent city in the world you know yeah they  killed five friends of mine like it was like hell. and i was just in the bridge of that so so i  had to cover all that war writing for most uh. international organizations about what was going  on in ciudad juarez at the same time figuring out. how to protect myself like how to have a protocol  uh security protocols and other stuff other stuff. we know now in mexico it's just like basic stuff  in journalism you know like safety protocols and.

all that stuff but back then we weren't used to  that so i learned how to work in that in that. you know in that time where was your family at  uh at the time you were kidnapped in mexico or in. mexico yeah my family was in mexico but they live  in a in a gated community with uh security guards. and you know like it's like it's like a it's  like a bubble in in juarez where most of the the. business owners like the biggest insurance  in the city or in the state they leave their.

politicians all kind of people yeah so they're  very well protected so they still have to leave. though right they have to leave their their bubble  yeah they go to work exactly it's gonna work. i told them i told them like um this might  be dangerous to you you might be in danger. too because on my id is that address you know  they were like should you be safe we'll be good. and i'm like all right that's i mean they're  like that they're just weird and um so yeah i.

left to el paso my sister left to opacity too and  both of my parents uh stayed in juarez they did. wow i wasn't expecting that yeah it was not  expecting that yeah man that so they basically. that's how i started i mean i started learning  the bad way you know and um but uh it helped a lot. um i've been doing this for 12 years  now and um so so yeah i learned a lot. well how long was it bef uh after you  got kidnapped before you started going.

back like nine months that's it just nine  months yeah because when when that guy. asked me to watch the news and i saw those guys  were dead yeah it was like a mixed feeling you. know because it was like i don't want to be a part  of that i don't want to feel the responsibility. for those lives but at the same time it's like i  i feel like i can't go back now you know like i. they got rid of those guys so i can't  i can actually go back to my city.

and i started like i didn't like went all the way  back i started like going for a couple of hours. getting back and then going a couple of more  hours then getting back yeah and then i was like. all right um i feel good to get back to leaving  southwest you didn't uh you didn't feel like. that was coming from higher to kidnap you and  and eventually kill you you didn't think that. was coming from higher you think that may have  been just those two cops or no it definitely.

def i definitely could tell that it was coming  from higher um but uh but not that high i think. it was coming from specifically that girl so  she was like a commander okay uh and because i. i had her phone number so and i had access to  some of her text messages so i um i think i. i stepped up too deep you know i i think that's  not what investigative journalism is i just went.

too deep because i thought that was journalism  but it wasn't but that didn't stop you because. now you're yeah exciting all kinds of stuff but so  how long was it after you got kidnapped before you. started kind of doing these stories again where  you were embedded and and things started getting. a little dicey so the whole hell broke loose into  that juarez we had like 13 murders a day reported.

plus those unreported um and i started working  for like two jobs and college so i was i bought. a motorcycle so i can actually made it on time to  college and then to the newsroom in el paso and at. the same time i had to cover for um fa which has  it's like an international news based out of spain. and they will ask me to go to every  single murder scene to report on that. so i will be driving all over town you know like  um sometimes i will report for el diario in el.

paso remotely i will like write a big like like  a feature story but be reporting like certain. 10 words a day into that and that was very  basic but i learned a lot because i wasn't. really investigating i was just like covering  like a red what we call the retinol the no taroka. um they kill five cops here they kill 15  kids here they kill when it was like that.

but you get your brain thinking and connecting  the dots and it's like oh this murder might be. connected to that stuff and to this and to  that investigation and you start thinking. and i started like coming out with some  proper features you know on investigation and. um and again i think that that was like too  raw of journalism it wasn't like proper stuff.

but it was like the beginning of trying to put  together stuff and trying to explain what's. going on but it was hard for me to at the time  because i was into the leaving that city to see. the bigger picture like this is something else  then curtails killing each other you know um but. that was my main question all through that's been  my main question all through these years man like. like still so today what the hell is going  on in mexico what is really happening. yeah how does this world really works because i  don't believe in the thing that it's a turf water.

between cartels you know so they were asking you  to go and basically cover every single murder that. happened in juarez and they were doing did you  just say they were doing 13 13 murders a day how. long were you doing that for uh three years three  years yeah so you've seen thousands thousands of. dead bodies that have been murdered yeah so my  question is what is it all cartel and cartel.

crime or what is what is the motive uh to kill  somebody down there when it's if if it's just a. a regular person who's not involved in the cartel  why are they getting murdered by the cartel. there's a there's a lot of uh you know like the  drug uh business involves a lot of people not only. you know dealers or cartel members it involves  lawyers it involves business owners it involves.

journalists it involves a set of people so  sometimes when you see like oh [ __ ] the girl to. kill this woman and she used to be a teacher i'm  not saying she was into the business directly but. sometimes they will try to extort her because  they needed more money to get more weapons. so it was like okay she's driving a nice car let's  try to extort her and they they will show up ask. for money she will call the police she will get  killed because of the police was working with the.

cartel so sometimes it's like that there's  been confusions like i don't know if you. heard about the killing of two employees  of the u.s consulate in ciudad juarez. a man and his wife with a young girl  in the back and i i had access to. recording that the d.a was doing on those guys  the d.a was doing surveillance on that group of.

the cartel the juarez cartel they were listening  to recordings they were like taping the phones. and radios uh and i got access to that and i and  i learned how they work and it's shitty you know. they don't have a system they'll just say like  okay so the hit is dark-haired male in white suv. that's it and they have people all over the city  so that guy started receiving a bunch of rings.

from his people it's like okay so  i got black-haired male with woman. white suv right here it's like all right um okay  go for it five minutes later it's like hey i have. one suv dark haired man with a child uh oh [  __ ] we have another one ah scope for the two. of them so they just kill anybody that fits the  description yeah they're not you know they're just. yeah just a blanket yeah after like everybody four  or five rings on different people so it's like.

okay i have some other info he has it's called  the el paso they called it in in codeword parque. so they don't say el paso so it has plates from el  parque so it's like oh okay so it's not my target. this has like mexican plates all right bye and  so they narrow it down to el paso plates which is. half of the city of juarez you know and um so well  texas plates and um so yeah i learned that they.

don't there's a lot of people innocent that are  just killed just to because they put a description. exactly what about uh what about just regular  crime you know that's non-cartel related. how much of that is just regular crime  it's um usually regular crime is not using. firearms like they're not using they're using  like if they use a firearm it will be like a. small firearm you know like it's not even  gonna be like a nine millimeter um nine is.

definitely cartel related um 223 cartel related  all that stuff it's car slope related um okay. the other guys they sometimes they don't  even they don't even kill you because they. want to mug you you know because they know  they're gonna get some hit and they know. that if they got arrested they're gonna put some  other charges on them like a lot you know gonna. be like organized crime and this guy had like two  kills of heroin and this and that and that and he.

was just like a regular [ __ ] mugger that was  trying to get your phone so okay so yeah that's. um now the the local um drug business like the  street selling that's that's huge that's a huge. business in juarez since the 90s um and and that's  why you have a bunch of sellers getting killed. getting murdered getting threats i'm getting  getting crazy just last night i saw a video of. two women uh being tortured and and killed and in  a place called quote milk a few hours from juarez.

and everyone is like the teachers why were  the murderer but in the video i saw they were. interrogating them i was like who do you work for  and they're like this guy and what are you doing. we're selling and who are you selling to  i was selling in this spot so it's like. damn man sometimes like people you don't even  think about are into some [ __ ] you know somehow.

well then you started getting so you started  reporting all these murders and then and then. it sounds like that wasn't really enough  for you so you wanted to get more into. the investigation investigative  uh type stories and that can be. hard to bust into so i'm kind of curious you know  how it is that you started developing sources. and assets and informants or whatever you call  them in the journalism world you know and from.

what i've found is once it can be real hard to get  in but once you find one that opens the door for. everybody yeah and so i'm just curious to see you  know how you kind of developed your first asset. or what do you call them do you call them sources  sources how did you develop your first source. well my first source was actually this friend  i was talking about it was we were in secondary.

school and we grew up together we lived nearby we  just hang out together and then he started going. into that world and started writing i remember one  time we were drinking at my place and we were like. super smashed and i told him like you know that  there's gonna be a time where or worlds are gonna. meet not in the best way right and he's like  yeah and he i remember he gave him gave me a.

hug and it's like you're still gonna be my friend  no matter what man like you're gonna be my friend. sometimes i guess i'm gonna have to stop talking  to you and sometimes i guess you're gonna step on. my toes but um i'll keep doing my job and you keep  you doing yours so we started like splitting but. see but even then um he will introduce me to other  guy you know like you were like hey man come over. and i'm all right i would show up in a house  with armed people and you know i was like okay. so this is this is a place he wants to show  me um and then he introduces me to one of the.

bosses you know like hey this is that and this  is my cousin um his journalist and he's like. making like um making like jokes about me  reporting is like just don't report this. [ __ ] okay and i'm like no man like honestly i'm  here just like a you know like a regular person um. most of those guys you get them either by  drinking doing drugs or partying the party.

is where you make months in that world if you  don't party you're never gonna get access to. any of that [ __ ] you um and you're gonna look  like something else you know i'm gonna like so. why is he doing what is he doing here what  does he want he see a d a because everybody. in mexico thinks like everybody's [ __ ] d.a and  that's like that's why you did so yeah the party. it was what make the bun so i have my tall  party sometimes my wife she knows what i do.

she doesn't really know any details of what  i'm doing until my story is published and even. then she doesn't really know the details or the  backstories um but at the beginning she was like. it's [ __ ] 3 a.m man and you're not  answering yeah well i'm like you're. gonna have to trust me in this one because  i'm not you know doing something else than. working and having a blast with these guys  yeah and sometimes i will get home like.

super wasted high on code you know like stuff like  that and but that's why we'll open doors you know. that's not what will open the doors do you enjoy  it i mean it's a good time no yeah i mean don't. get me wrong it's like party sweaty you know  sometimes it's just too much sometimes it's it. becomes a place where you start having like a bad  trip sort of you know like when you are drunk and. all fussy and confused and and you're like what  the [ __ ] am i doing here like these people.

they i don't relate to these people at all yeah  what they're talking what they're saying um. i don't know i just can't find uh commonplace  between us where are you guys partying are you. part what are you most most most of the time is  houses yeah most of the time is particular houses. like houses they have um sometimes bars but not  really because very private yeah very private yeah. sometimes it's just like a small party sometimes  it's just like a you know like not even like.

an overnight or whatever a couple of beers  having fun shots or whatever and then they'll. be like okay that's it i'm good and because  they see that you are um into that they feel. comfortable with you and it's it's harder for a  mexican journalist to get access into a mexican. you know like criminal organization because when  they see if you are from somewhere else they will.

say like okay i like this guy because if i can  confirm it's not d.a or whatever it's cool that. he's here that he's interesting and interested  in this and he's gonna go report whatever. but um they feel they can trust it him more  because he's not we're going to be working. with a local police or with another cartel or  that kind of [ __ ] what is the what is the uh. what's the motivation to have an investigative  journalist at the party with the cartels that. you're saying that you know they trust you  i mean why the [ __ ] would a cartel trust.

an investigative journalist i guess  i guess because it's not i have never. done something or written about something they  don't know i'm gonna write you know i'm i'm. full disclaimer if i'm there partying with them  i'm they're partying with them um learning i'm. i'm finding my way through to get access and trust  of them but um but i'm not going to report on that.

i'm not going to say anything i hear in that  party i'm not going to report on that i'm not. going to write on that i'm not going to say any  anything because i know that's going to cost me. you know and um and they know that i think they  can feel that i'm transparent and that i'm like. i'm not here to snitch on you man i'm i'm here  to actually party with you to get to know you. to ask some questions for me for myself to  to know what's going to be my next steps. and then when i want to write a story when i need  something then i will reach out full transparency.

however like i'm writing a story about this do  you feel comfortable sharing something with me. and i will say like not at all man i cannot give  you an interview and i'm like i mean wonder what. circumstances will you feel comfortable giving me  an interview and it's like no face no name no this. no that and then i'll i'll work that you know  it's a negotiation it's like amen um okay i'm.

not gonna put your name your face i really need  to write that you are part of that organization. in this place is that doable and it's like i don't  know man so we started like talking about that. and then sometimes i they say yes sometimes they  say no not at all and when they say no it's a no. rather it loses story i guess my question is what  is the motivation for them of what do they get out. of it why would they even want anything in the  news at all uh it's still information to you.

at all it's different in the italian organizations  and that's that's an interesting side of it um the. juarez cartel super hermetic like they they don't  share anything it's super hard to break inside the. juarez cartel because they don't feel motivated  at all to talk to say anything they just don't. give a [ __ ] they they actually go the other way  they're like no man you have to have solid sources. inside they have to trust you a lot and even then  i found that most of them will just like talk.

broadly on stuff you know uh but they almost  have like this pr office they really want to. be out there they want to be out yeah yeah yeah  what is it for recruiting or i think it's just to. to make a point to make a point with like  we're still on top we're still on top of the. game so it's it's to flex spread fear to the other  cartels into the to the public in general general.

mexican population yeah it's just like  a flexing move you know like we're still. we're still the bad guys here um and whenever  i ask uh for access there i have a great source. in sinaloa that i really trust and he  really trusts me and we're friends and. and he helps me a lot like a lot every time i ask  him for crazy [ __ ] man like i've asked him for. crazy stuff and it's like hey man can you help me  out with this he knows that when his phone rings.

i think it rolls his eyes  like oh my god he comes again. because i push and i push hard cause that's my job  you know i'm not gonna take just like no we can do. that all right bye man sorry it's like how can we  do this how can i tell this story man how can you. help me out i need this profile specifically  i need to find a person that talks to me.

and that knows about this why how can we do that  and when it's like no no no no no i was like okay. what if i show up there we just have a drink and  talk talk it over but in person not over the phone. not over a signal or telegram or whatever just  right there and then we go from there and ninety. percent of the time it works ninety percent of  time is like all right let's go let's talk to him. say what it says um to be honest like also some  some of them ask for money some some of them uh.

they try to get some money out of that out of that  how much money well not that much but it depends. it depends on the access depends on the days  it depends on the person thousands yeah no 100. now thousands of dollars thousands of dollars  they they would ask for for money sometimes. it's not even for them but it's like to pay the  employees you know okay um of course this is like. i'm telling you this is full disclaimer i'm very  transparent what i do most of the times i try not.

to i try not to because it's not ethical and it  can not be real what they're telling you if their. motivation is money but sometimes i've worked  like that i've worked like that when i see when. i see that what i need basically is b-roll you  know yeah i don't need info i need v-ro i need a. bunch of imagery of guns or training of these and  that and you want video assets for your stories. yeah and i need like to be real you know yeah  not like fake guns or whatever like to be real.

so you you just totally immerse yourself into the  narco culture to gain their trust to experience it. so you understand it better how long are you when  you do immerse yourself what's what would you say. what's the longest you've immersed yourself  down there within uh some of these cartels. before coming up and going back home  and checking in with the wife and kid. not too long i try to i try to have like a tight  a safety protocol you know so i don't tell my wife.

when i'm going or what i'm doing like specifics  but she knows that i constantly ring and she's. my like it's crazy because i do that protocol  with some friends with some journalists and with. associations of general super tech journals in  mexico you know when i'm when i know i'm going to. be into deep i ring on them and say like emman can  we start like a protocol uh they're like yeah so.

the protocol is like bring me every two hours or  half an hour um or if you're gonna be out all day. just in one part of the day before midnight you're  gonna have to bring me back and say like okay i'm. back at the hotel i'm safe and i'm like okay but  my safety net is my wife because she can feel. the threat or the danger before hand you know  she um she knows that when i'm not feeling. comfortable i tend to call her a lot not not  text her not what's up i tend to call her a lot.

like a lot color in the night in the morning when  i have breakfast and she feels that she feels like. okay this guy is not feeling good about what he's  doing right now he's might be in danger yeah um. so she knows that i could be in danger so she  tries to ring more often so you're checking in. at least at least once a day yes yeah yeah  i am i've never i've never been more than.

more than one day like i've had uh i have the case  like the scenario where it's like okay we're gonna. go into that place no cell phones this and that  but i try also to negotiate my side you know like. not to go full on it's like yeah whatever you say  it's like no man no no phones it's a no go for me. are they are they frisking you are they  searching you before i just had one time. just not wanting to trust you that much yeah  i just had one time with a guy in sonora.

that um that he uh searched me uh he grabbed my  phone he blight funded me well the beginning his. his employee uh put like a thing on my eyes but he  thought it was too disrespectful it was like no no. no dude that's disrespectful for the journalist  here just let's do this um grab your hands put. your hand your head down all the road just look  down that's it um even then i could know where.

where i was because i sort of like you know i knew  that we crossed like a train track i've heard um. a checkpoint a police checkpoint i  could count the street lights passing. then i dirt road so i sort of know where  i was at the time um i didn't like that. uh i didn't really like that at all like i was  like no man i'm not gonna do this [ __ ] again.

because we were there and then he had it was  incredible man he was and the the story is in. uh netflix it's a show called dope and if you see  the mexico side of that series i they didn't do. any of the using the all the mexican side you  will see a scene where we arrive at a house. uh there's this narco and it says like so this  is my stash house and i was like all right um. that small house right there this is like an  old man with a tecate you know like drinking.

and he's like yeah and i'm like but there's  nothing man what the [ __ ] is this and he's. like nah i'm not that stupid man hey guys can you  open up the stash so it was like they started like. putting dirt out with a shovel and then we'll  have a carpet and then behind a carpet you will. have a door like a like a um iron door  that will open that and there was like a. stairs and it was like an underground stash  house packed with it was weed and poppy and.

but it was like floor to roof you know like full  of that stuff and they had their all of their. accounting and inventory everything everything  like and yeah so it was under the house under the. house but you can you couldn't tell because it  was like a small house in the middle of nowhere. and it was like dirt just like that we were like  actually stepping into like on top of that so we. went out we went down there we filmed everything  we filmed an interview and all that stuff.

and then we went up again and then he received  a call on his radio um someone telling him. that one of the security rings  was breached by um convoy of. federalist and he's like okay so my fifth ring  got compromised let's wait here give me your id. i'll keep all of your ids if something  happens if they break into the second ring.

it's on you guys and i'm like okay i mean it's not  going to be on us man we're not even we don't have. cell phones um it's i mean no there's no way and  it's like i don't care what you say man if they. breach second ring it's gonna be in you and i'm  like all right so it was like a tense because it's. like okay they breached into the fourth ring and  then they reached the third ring and i was like. [ __ ] [ __ ] [ __ ] [ __ ] [ __ ] and they um  they stopped at burritos place to eat burritos.

and they're like all right that's good for  you all right there you go man let's go. give these guys an extra burrito exactly. yes man it was it was intense so you're really  embedded with these guys yeah well let's take. a quick break and uh when we come back i want  to get into some of these uh arms trafficking. deals that uh you were a part of and and were  able to report on yeah sure cool for sure man.

so. all right so we're gonna get into some arms  trafficking stuff and um before i do we had.

a good conversation at breakfast today about you  know i cannot believe that you don't carry a gun. and i couldn't believe it when you told me um when  we were talking earlier today about some of the. stuff that you've been doing and that you've been  involved with and who you're embedding with then. we get in the studio here and we start recording  and tell me you've been kidnapped yeah and uh so. that blows my mind that that you're not carrying  um into each zone but before we kind of get into.

the arms trafficking stuff i'm really curious  without the if i wanted to go down to mexico how. hard would it be for me to illegally acquire  some type of a firearm it will definitely be. easier than to acquire like a legal arm it's  not that hard man like mexico is flooded.

with with guns like they're all over um it's  very easy just you need like to know someone. and you can get one many of the cartels now what  they're doing is they are renting like you know. like uh firearms you don't even have to buy it  that will take you into a warehouse and you're a. hitman and but you don't own a gun um so you go to  that warehouse and say like hey how much for this.

gun two hours or two days and it's like it's gonna  be i don't know two thousand pesos four thousand. pesos twelve thousand pesos you rent it you  rent it you rent the weapon yes and then you go. do the job get back and deliver back the gun to  that same warehouse have you seen these warehouses. yes i've seen those warehouses uh what is the  selection like well like what do they have yeah. um all kinds of [ __ ] they have a bunch of  nine millimeters a bunch of shitty revolvers.

you know like these old revolvers they have a  case uh they have uh what the mexican military. uses which is the 223 i don't know what kind of  rifle is but the bullet is at 223. it's time so. probably some type of an m4 or ar yeah exactly  something like that it's like something long. um they have like that kind of stuff those guys  who rent those kind of guns the it's like all. guns you know like they're like sort of uh sort of  like manipulated in some way they're not like new.

pristine state guns yeah it's like ugly ugly  weaponry uh and that i guess it's like the. second life they give to guns they used uh  in like bigger scales of the cartel you know. yeah well when you go in these warehouses is  it all organized is everything on the wall. or is it hey look at the trunk of my  car and uh there's just a whole bunch of. no i mean um the warehouse i've i've been into  there are in juarez downtown juarez imagine.

downtown juarez imagine this city border city of  1.4 million uh people living there not a beautiful. not a beautiful city kind of a shitty one imagine  a market in downtown crowded a lot of people. um you know like a regular market selling fruits  selling a lot of [ __ ] medicine and a lot of. stuff people screaming people yelling cars going  into you know like smart ups small ollies and in.

between all that it's a store a regular store  selling sneakers um counterfeit you know like. fake nike sneakers fake whatever with  a man outside sound like hey come get. some sneakers 20 bucks for the pair whatever  but if you arrive there with the right guy. he'll be like hey man he's with me all right  and then you just go to the back of that. um store uh and there's a warehouse which is  around like about this big it's not like a huge.

warehouse not small and you have guns all over  the gun is like laying there um you know like just. in the wall like right there on the floor an ugly  table uh he can't find sometimes the you know. like the gun he's looking for he's like i know i  have an ak like an uak around here so he's like. rummaging around and then he finds like the  ek is like oh yeah here it is can't find the.

charger though i'm just looking for the charger  um all duct taped you know because it's not. properly working or fitting um yeah it's one of  those places and i'm like wow and uh you're like. so you sell these guns and it's like nah we  actually rent them and while i was there in. the middle of the day like 2 p.m a guy showed  in and he's like hey man hey you just need two. guns like hangouts whatever you have but for now  now i knitted now and it's like did you talk to.

whatever yeah yeah yeah i talked to him and yeah  all right it's gonna be this and that i already. paid that guy let me give him a call hey man the  guy this guy here blah blah yeah it's a good he. paid all right see you there you go so these are  all hitmen coming in yeah yeah low-level hitmen. they're not like you know there's like also  some hit men that are like very well prepared. most of them working for um law enforcement in  mexico okay do these guys um do they have any.

rituals or traditions they  do before they're going ahead. like when i was a i used to live in  columbia i used to live in medellin. and they have a church that they would go and  all the assassins would go pray at that specific. church before they would go on a hit and uh  is it like that in mexico too do they get it. right yeah no i mean in mexico it depends like  sinaloa it's jesus malverde is huge um he's the.

saint of drug traffickers he's a legend and  um and they go and sometimes they will have. to like on their houses they will have like  a small um altar for jesus where they drop. cigarettes booze um drugs offerings um  there is a there is a huge jesus malverde. altar in the middle of the of a road where  they go also and offer stuff for him uh many.

of them that was kind of new in 2010 we started  watching new santa muerte churches in juarez. and i went to all of them you know i'm curious  like that so i was like what the hell this is a. [ __ ] santa muerte full on church um so i was  interested into what was going on in there um.

and it's crazy man it's uh doesn't make sense  it's i mean not disrespectful but uh but it's. just like too mixed with catholicism they will  pray some of the parts of the holy father father. and in the middle of that they  will say something like santa. wow that's that seems like [ __ ] you know but  um but many of them believe in the santa muerte.

and it started developing in 2010 in juarez  because the northern the north of mexico that was. not a tradition in the north of mexico there was  a tradition in the center and south of mexico for. centuries uh but when the militaries and  the federalists started arriving in the city. they brought with them some of their culture so  they started like setting up you know churches. and all that stuff does that translate to  saying of the dead yes the santa muerte is the. holy death okay and it's this um is this um  skeleton dressed as the holy mary you know.

like with a thing yeah but it's a skeleton and  it has the um hoes it's called yeah i don't know. what it's called i know what you're saying though  yeah the the sickle exactly yeah spanish is called. right um so so yeah it's uh it's interesting  like so so they some of them have those.

rituals um i can tell that most of them when they  pray or have a santa muerte they are related to. law enforcement most of the time not all of them  because i watched some stash houses where they. are like not law enforcement related sicarios and  they will have a small santa muarte on the corner. so so and i know that sinaloa is huge  for jesus malverde a us artist uh.

i i took him to sinaloa to take some pictures  of of the narco culture and all that stuff. and he uh it's called charles kraft and he makes  ceramic art amazing and he gave me a bust of jesus. malverde on ceramic like this big and i have it  in my in my living room right there what is that. the the what are you saying it's like it's like  a figure of jesus malverde made out of uh ceramic.

you know it's a painter like very beautifully  um he was uh that was like his thanks to me you. know like he was like thank you for taking me  to sinaloa to make some crazy ass pictures on. the aquaculture and i'm gonna give you this so i  have it in my on my living room on my tv room you. know it's like right there on top of everything  and um and i love it but sometimes where people. shows up on my place and it's like oh wow why  do you have a jesus malverde on your clinic and. i'm like it's a work of art it's just the first of  ten you know there's only ten in the world and it.

has a value like it um it's worth something but it  has also like a value to me um inside that culture. that's cool it's interesting yeah well let's  get into some of these arms deals yeah so. i was um by the time we were we talked about  the um like a sum call remember right after that. i traveled to sinaloa to meet with some arms  traffickers well i traveled to sinaloa and then.

to mexicali because the route is the u.s border  towns like um calexico el paso uh tijuana well. san diego and then south either tijuana mexicali  or juarez and then down to sinaloa durango sonora. and so i met with these guys i explained  them that i wanted to understand. how was the arms still flowing south still after  fast and furious still after a tight gun control.

in mexico um still after all of that the border  closed um how how you managed to actually still. bring up bring in like huge guns i showed  you some pictures on what they look and i. was like what what the hell is this one it's like  that cigarette grenade launcher right that is a.

m203 grenade launcher that fires a 40 millimeter  basically explosive it's like how does these guys. get a hold of some [ __ ] like that you know yeah  it's like heavy weaponry they have and they just. show me the the basic you know so so i went to  sinaloa they took me to this place a proper house. where they have some of um you know like gold  um nine millimeters gold ak-47 they used a lot.

these call this stuff called draco which is like  a short um ak like i don't know if you know i. don't know i mean they call it draco down down in  mexico yeah i mean here they would just call it. an ak right it's like a short version of the big  ak they have a bunch of them some of them like. um all golden you know very flashy stuff uh and  i i follow the the road to the us so in the us.

in places like california or like texas they will  just buy a gun with a permit someone like me or. like you and um that guy is clean he has his own  guns but he's selling um other guns to the cartels. cartel members what he needs is just like a report  of the guns he's sold so he can show atf like. sold these guns because i have a permit to sell  guns out of my own home out of my own place um.

what they do with that i just don't give a [ __ ]  so i don't know if the atf actually tracks those. buyers or not but these guys are like and i know  for a fact that many of those guns are ending up. in mexico really so they how they traffic  stuff is they disassemble the guns and they. put small parts inside like old refrigerators  a stove you know an old living room or whatever.

and then they were like oh just moving back  to juarez from el paso and i'm gonna pay my my. taxes for the for my stuff to get into mexico so  they will pay that go in and then they have like. these workshops where they're putting everything  together again i went to one of those in mexicali. i think one of the videos i shared is one of those  places you will see like a table with a bunch of. guns those are the guns that are ready to go there  are like a sample back again and then from there.

they go to sinaloa like by plane by  truck sometimes even by sea when they. are in the in baja california they travel through  the mar de cortes all the way to the sinaloa. coast and um that's that's where the where for  they told me that's where the heavy weaponry is. going through like why does it go there so i think  it's easier to navigate the sea than to actually. uh you know like ride okay so they go there and  then it's dispersed exactly okay yeah yeah yeah.

they go they most of them go to sinaloa and  then from there they they end up living in la. in central america places like honduras guatemala  um they trade that for drugs or for you know like. when when they don't have a payment for a big load  of coke they will say like okay we'll give you. guns you give us the code and we'll take it north  and sell it so sometimes it's like a trade um.

those guns are [ __ ] everywhere man it's uh it's  really it's really confusing to see that many guns. and that easy access in mexico a place where it's  impossible to get a proper firearm like myself i i. mean to me to get a hold of a firearm in mexico  it will be super hard i will have to be in a. hunting club or go through a lot of [ __ ]  bureaucracy to actually get approved for a permit.

to carry and i wouldn't be able to carry  a nine millimeter or a rifle you know like. would be just like a shitty gun i guess yeah um so  yeah it's kind of it's kind of it's kind of weird. it's gonna i mean in the u.s i could have a gun i  don't even know how to use one so i need to learn. how would people i mean do you think. do you think mexican citizens would want access  to be able to protect themselves it's been a.

debate like a recent debate and it's always in in  people's opinion you know like it's very divided. so split um half of the people say like we don't  need guns what we need is for corruption to end. because without corruption you will have a state  of law and those people getting illegal weapons. will stop many of those guys believe that the  responsibility is in mexico half in the us the.

other half it's like your um your freedom to get  guns is hurting us you know some of the other guys. are like we should be more like the us where you  can access guns where you can actually fight back. you know where where i can protect my family with  a gun of those guys because if they get to you. i'm still not sure where i stand to be honest  on that that matter because i'm very i'm very um.

i'm very in the both worlds you know like i i can  get one in in el paso which is like texas is the. the gun culture is like very open but at  the same time i know what they do you know. i know what they mean for mexico and i've seen my  friends killed by those guns and all that stuff so. so i'm still i'm i still don't know where  i stand on the fence exactly because um. on one side i said like oh yeah yes i mean of  course on what i'm doing because of what i'm.

doing especially i should have one you know to  protect my family because i never know when a. [ __ ] is going to come up and when i'm going to  have to fight back but at the same time it's like. do i want to engage in a shootout do i want to  engage into that because i know if i kill that. guy or a couple of guys that got into me there's  gonna be more coming you know there's gonna be. more coming they're gonna get mad they're gonna  get angrier they're gonna go like again so so i.

i don't know you know when i think about my family  how to protect them i feel that the best way to. protect him is sometimes not talk a lot about what  i do a lot of details of what i see what i hear of. my cell phone my wife see she gets sketchy because  i'm always like you know protecting my cell phone. of course she believes that it's it's another  another girl i can see that that could become. an issue especially when you're partying with  the cartel but yeah yeah and sometimes she.

believes like the worst for her yeah she believes  like these [ __ ] clacking to another girl yeah. but most of the time don't get me wrong  most of the time it's not like that most. of the time is um i don't want her to see  some pictures i don't want her to see some. messages um i wanted to see who is sending  me messages because i don't feel comfortable. with her knowing who i'm talking with when you  know the other is living in el paso um the other.

is trying to get the heat out when i'm covering  like a interesting story like a hardcore story. not going straight home and take my kid out  in the same car and drive around you know like. just like i'm gonna be away for a couple  of days until i feel the heat is out. i try to reach back to my sources after the  story is out and so like hey we're good are. we cool is everything good do you think something  shady there's been two times where things haven't.

been cool at all where i reach back and the wife  of my source will answer is like they kill him. i'm like oh [ __ ] and i feel like you know  like [ __ ] i feel like [ __ ] i feel like. it's my responsibility i feel like his life is in  my hands and and um yeah those times are like oh. my [ __ ] god because at the same time i'm i'm  feeling responsibility for that and at the same. time i'm feeling fear for my own life like if they  got to him are they mad at me too yeah are they.

angry at me too so those kind of stuff are the  ones that gets you up at night you know like that. like you stay all night thinking like should i be  uh doing something or would that be overreacting. you know i don't want to have my family all  nervous all the time yeah but at the same time i. need to protect them so sometimes i fall yeah how  did these deals go down these arms deals that you.

what was your role there they why did they  let you witness because the they all go down. because i i wanted that there is a lot  of stuff in the news that just repeats. keeps repeating you know like talking  points and people keeps repeating. the us this is the us fault and the narcos are  getting guns and the narcos are getting just. like big weapons and he's like okay yeah yeah  but what does that mean like how do they get the.

guns and who and why and are cartels inside the  u.s are cartels properly buying guns in the u.s. or it's just like a regular one trying to make  some bugs and they don't see the harm in selling. those guns to a cartel i wanted to understand  that i wanted to really get close to that. and to understand what's what was on and what  i found out is like in general cartels are not. um a structure like you know like a vertical  structure they're more like a horizontal uh.

structure now you don't have a big bus and then uh  you know like another sort of like chief and then. like a bunch of scarios and then like a bunch of  whatever it's all horizontal right now that's why. a lot of the law enforcement don't get you  know that's why some of their operations don't. get don't get the the results they  are expecting when you grab a kingpin.

he was just part of that horizontal structure it  was not the boss you didn't cut the head of the. snake she just got up chunk yeah and the snake  can grow a tail again and so it works like that. and the arms deals are exactly like that there  was once where the big boss will call his people. in the us or whatever and so like i need guns all  right let's buy guns there you go boss your guns.

all right you're still on a payroll  you're still getting the same money. but right now it's like i need guns we're getting  out of guns what do we do when it's like okay i. have a plug in the u.s i have a cousin that he's a  u.s citizen he can get a gun for us we're several. all right try it out and he's like yeah but  he wants to he's gonna he's gonna buy i don't. know an ak for 500 bucks but he's gonna sell  it to us um triple the the price for 15k 15.

100. sorry and um i need someone will say yes all  right yeah just give that just bring it back and. that will you know like one guy is like okay and  what's my commission for crossing it over okay you. get 300 bucks and then the guy who takes it all  the way to sinaloa like how much for transporting. this to sinaloa 300 bucks all right there you  go and then you know so it's a it's a horizontal. chain it's not a big structure so everybody's  making money out of that everybody's making money.

uh out of the gun deal you know and that's that's  that's interesting that's interesting because. because when you say something like the u.s has  responsibility well the u.s just made 500 bucks. on that someone else made another 500 and someone  else made 300 and someone else made another 300. for that gun to reach the hand of the guy who's  going to kill a bunch of people yeah so most of. my money is still saying in mexico you know yeah  and it's not entering like a legal uh economy.

so i correct me if i'm wrong but i think what  you're saying is it's not one major deal that's. happening it's onesies and twosies and just  thousands and thousands of people that are. making that are making 300 500 a small amount  of a nominal amount of money you know for one. one well exactly yeah i um i talked to a guy in  juarez also and he's like i found that if i if i.

if i travel to the us to like dallas to a gun show. they would sell guns to me like that and i  would just take him back into mexico before um. fast and furious and all that stuff it was like  more you know easy to travel back into mexico yeah. without being searched uh so it's like i found  that i would just like travel back to chihuahua. it's like nine hours from juarez to  dallas nine hours back and then four.

hours to chihuahua and i will make a thousand  bucks for one gun every weekend so he's like. i might bring three and he's three thousand bucks  on one weekend and the next week and again the. next week and again and he's wicked again and he  made a good living out of that you know like 3. 000 bucks in mexico can be like every weekend can  be like something to to start something you know.

i guess that's another reason why maybe you know  securing the border a little bit more might be. beneficial for both countries exactly the thing  is uh the thing is when you secure the border. on the mexican side like right now they're  changing the mexican irs which is called sat. those were the guys in charge of customs they're  so corrupted man like they're one of the most. corrupted organizations like government  organizations in mexico so they were like. okay we're gonna change that to the military the  military is not it's not that corrupt but it's.

known for stepping on human rights you know so so  i don't know if that's gonna work i don't know if. that's gonna work actually um i think corruption  in general needs to change because corruption is. what it's killing us in mexico you know it's not  it's not the us it's not this and that it's not. open or close borders i think what's killing us  is corruption that's what is keeping us safe on.

this side of the border your corruption levels are  there but at higher levels like higher officials. it's going to be hard for you to get out of a  ticket giving 20 bucks to a traffic police officer. you know it's not there's no way you can give  them 20 bucks for that guy to leave you alone. but mexico you can you can get away with that  you know and that's that's exactly what is. killing us corruption is is inside the whole  city it's a system it's not corruption it's.

not inside the system corruption is a system on  itself you know so and that's what is killing. us like you can put all of the military  out of the streets all the deas you want. close all the borders you want but as long as  the corruption is still a system operating in. mexico there's going to be a way for people to  benefit from legal or illegal activities yeah. well let's move into the dea deal of course i'm  dying to hear about this well you know the sinaloa.

cartel has been one of the biggest cartels in  mexico for a good while you know it started with. a sinaloa federation federacion de sinaloa where  the juarez cartel leader was the beltran levas. and all the stuff and even since then they've been  trying to cut deals or they've been cutting deals. with the d.a they i guess the dea is eager to  keep arresting kingpins and busting drug loads.

that they break deals with them but these mexican  articles at the same time they are so naive that. they think that they're going to actually  benefit from that now that they're going to. leave off of that of that deal um el vicentillo is. the son of el mayo zambada which allegedly  is the leader of the sinaloa cartel right now.

after they arrested el chapo the only one who  there is only one picture of him and no one. knows where the [ __ ] he is is el mayo zambada  so supposedly he's the boss of the sinaloa cartel. although you and i know they don't work like that  anymore but he's somewhat like a figure you know. like a respected figure he's been hiding forever  there's only one picture of him taken by this. mexican magazine processo because of the director  of that magazine interviewed him a while ago um.

elvis entities son and he tried in 2000 they don't  really say when but it's between 2010 and 2012. he tried to break a deal with the dea in  mexico city he got in touch with the d.a. and he's like all right this is my proposal i'm  gonna give you guys intel on the other cartels.

so you can arrest like all older but you let me  work uh freely and the dsl yeah let's do that man. all right sounds good all right deal deal  all right bye-bye they left and as soon. as he left he got arrested and exproved  into the u.s so he's he's recently free. he walked out recently because he snitched on his  own that on zambada he called him from prison he.

uh he broke a deal with the d.a with the u.s  government to snitch on the whole scenario. that's what that's what god of chapel arrested  like that guy snitching on the whole organization. he's free obviously the us recommended him not  to go back to mexico no one know where he is. of course i don't think it's a good idea for him  to go back to mexico um but he might be operating. again he might be back at it again somehow  with his dad or not who knows the thing is.

i learned that these deals have been going on  still with the sinaloa cartel with some other. members with some other people and now the jalisco  navajo which is the ruthless cartel growing up and. is huge his financial reach is three times more  than the sinaloa cartel is huge wow now they're. trying to break a deal with the d.a now they're  meeting the agents now they are saying like we.

can get you el mayo we can get you this and that  from sinaloa cartel uh if you let us walk free. and i don't know i'm not sure i can't confirm  for a fact but for what they say the jalisco. it's working they said like the deal is working  man the deal is ongoing that's how we're getting. [ __ ] tons of firearms like we've never seen  before they just recently posted a video on social.

and it's a full army they have tanks they have  this kind of like rhinos like armored vehicles. yeah they have like rocket launchers  they have rpgs they have like. so you're saying that the dea is trading weapons  for kingpins for kingfield yeah and not only.

that i also know that they're being well not  specifically d.a but it is in the middle of that. the u.s government has been giving out um green  cards to some of them some of the cartel members. some of the people who is on the record  killing more than 20 30 40 people in mexico. and they're giving out green cards in the middle  of of a moment where there are a lot of people. from latin america trying to desperately enter  the u.s and they're stuck in places like juarez.

the u.s is giving out green cards to narcos in  exchange for something so shitty as a statement. in court where it's all fixed that they say like  the exact same thing do you know that guy yes can. you point where the narco whatever it is is that  guy was he the leader of the organization he was. he did he asked you to you know traffic drugs yeah  he did all right there you have crinkle for you.

your wife your kids and some money wow  it's like dude that's unfair that's so. that's a policy that is not only unfair  but it's also unethical you know on mexico. have you uh personally witnessed any of that yes i  personally witnessed that yes uh on a court uh in. el paso on one of them allegedly um leaders of the  juarez cartel i personally saw that i personally.

spoke with a lawyer who showed me the deals the  u.s government was breaking on that case and who. these people were on the organization of juarez i  even saw the record of statements they did and at. the beginning they said like this is not that guy  and then he's like i was like no this is yeah it. is that guy like they did the wrong statement and  someone told them like that's the wrong statement.

you need to say that's the guy okay sorry yeah  this is the guy and they're getting green cards. wow it's it's crazy man it's crazy how  they operating or honestly it's not. it's not news why the us is having a  backlash you know on a bunch of people from. mexico central america south america arriving  at the border desperate asking for help it's.

it's backlash of some of those  policies where you protect narcos. you know for your own good for your benefit um did  this protect a lot of people do you think there. may be some things that you might be missing as  far as what the government's doing to these guys. maybe they give them a green  card but maybe they're also. turning them into an informant you know  keeping them going still running them. when it's an asset could be continuing to get  information out even though they're in the us.

cool b man could be because i mean there's  another story i i published in 2000 2013 i think. on the guy who delivered el chapo was a  doctor he didn't had any relationship with the. with uh cartels he just happened to live in  the u.s juarez and had a neighbor who was. the right arm in the state for el chapo  he got into some kind of fight with him. he threatened his wife and his kids so he decided  to snitch on him on an international bridge.

he arrived at an international bridge it's  like hey i know a guy who works very high up. in the sinaloa organization so they were like  yeah whatever just get the [ __ ] out you know. and then he called 9-1-1 and  he like tried hard he went to. the mexican um government military no one will  believe him and then he said he arrived to the.

u.s consulate in juarez saying that he  had a bomb on him so they grabbed him. took him in and it was like no i don't have a  bomb so they search them and like read like his. background and whatever she's like then what  the [ __ ] are you doing here it's like i have. some information that i want to tell you and so  he started like sharing like this guy dusties. and that and he's like the right armies he's in  charge quality stuff and all that [ __ ] so they. arrested that guy um they went for him in a hotel  in juarez when he arrived with his wife like he.

just like stepped out of his car and someone right  behind him is like hey let's go get up and he's. like oh [ __ ] i don't know if this is cartel or  government so it just went up like the car and i. know that because of the a source in the interval  describing the whole operation to get that guy. and um and he's like he didn't put any resistance  just got up the van and then he asked like who is. this and it's like it's the u.s government it's  like oh my god yes thank god so they took him.

they took this doctor into the u.s and gave him  protection another identity an s visa which it's. a piece of four stage basically uh but then they  told him like do you have any more information. no you're gonna share with us and he's like no man  i'm not inside the cartels and it's like okay if. you don't have more information we're gonna revoke  your s visa because that's only for these purposes. and you're going to go back to mexico so he was  like super desperate that's where he called me.

that's where he's like dude i'm desperate um i  gave this all information to those guys and i. don't know what to do and i wanted to reach out to  the media so i started started following his story. and in the middle of that story he managed to  find or to get the phone number of a woman who was. without chapel at all times um and he's like  this is her phone number uh i'm handing it.

to the va the d.a knows where she is where el  chapo is and that's how el chapo got arrested. the first time you got arrested um even then  they still threatened this guy to send him back. to mexico they're like okay what else and he's  like i just gave you a chapel man like this was. your operation it was not a mexican operation and  he was like all right but what else do you have. to keep your ass visa you know so if i felt like  he was disposable like he was totally disposable.

like i'm an informant i'm giving out you know like  good information they should just leave me alone. but they didn't and i know he's hiding still  from the dea from the narcos inside the us. interesting yeah i mean. you can't blame him yeah if he's got information  it's gonna save lives yeah you know and uh we. just went through you know that some mexicans  are pissed off because arms are being tracked.

traffic down there you know from the us well  now you have a guy who has a ton of information. and you know yeah yeah and that foundation  could save a lot of lives exactly and i. feel that my responsibility and all that is  to shed light into how stuff really works. not talking points not blaming governments yeah  not blaming whatever policy this is what it is.

it's like this is how it works information exactly  this is how it works yeah it's not a structure. it's not an evil plan from the u.s like flew  mexico with [ __ ] guns and they kill each other. yeah this is how it's going on there's people  making money out of it especially during the. pandemic you know yeah i appreciate that everybody  has to put a spin on [ __ ] these days and yeah. you know you can't just present information  anymore but you're still doing it that's. that's awesome but yeah a lot of stuff going on  down there man that's um trying to i'm trying to.

find the ties that ties us you know the u.s and  mexico i live at the border i'm a border kid um. so i live i i report in spanish write in english  i meet people like you i interview people like. you in english and report in spanish back and  forth all the time back and forth all the time. and i received the heat from both sides i received  the heat from mexico because i write in english.

and they said like oh you'll [ __ ] sell  out and i receive the heat from the u.s. because i report and write spanish it's like  oh you're [ __ ] mexican you're just like. stalking [ __ ] about the us in mexico and  i received the heat from trump supporters. and from biden supporters i received the  heat from mexican president amlo supporters. and the opposition i received the heat from  everybody because i'm not in the business of. putting out my opinion you know in the business  of showing things as they are and some things.

are good about trump some things are bad about  trump sometimes some things are good about biden. some teams are things are bought about biden um  it's just the way things are you know like because. because i'm not trying to put the nice light  on any president or in any government trying. to to tell it how it is and not put my  voice in it just say like i went there. talk to these people and this is how it works  yeah if that's it i appreciate that i really do.

but um do you have anything else you want  to talk about when it comes to the arms deal. i think i think that's that's pretty  much pretty much it man perfect. let's take another break and then let's  get into some drugs let's do it all right. let's get into some fentanyl yeah.

so.

all right so we kind of went through some of  the arms trafficking and some of the deals. that you were part of not a part of were able to  report on and uh big correction there it's like.

i have the atf stand outside the doorway just like  no no no it's like you're on the record but um. but you also uh recently went and you're  able to report on and actually go into. a lab that was making fentanyl so  where was that we got some great videos. uh that you gave us that we're gonna put in here  so uh while we're talking about this you'll be.

seeing photographs and videos of the actual lab  but go ahead and and let's hear what you got so. so was fentanyl it started like ramping in the  u.s you know like being like a proper issue i. i also wanted to know where to where does this  start you know like where where is it being made. and how and who's making it uh i reached out  to one of my sources in sinaloa of course.

like this guy who always like comes through and uh  and i asked him if i could be on on a fentony live. and he told me it was kind of hard because the  fentanyl labs now they're not set up as before. before they will they will like rent or  buy a warehouse and establish uh ongoing. lab but because of the busts the  mexican government has been busting. um labs they are making like these small laughs  on the go in the middle of nowhere and they work.

quick overnight take everything destroy the rest  and leave and they're gone and they're done so. i told him like i know it sounds like um like a  letter to santa claus but i wanted to ask you if. we can actually follow the whole process like if  you find that someone's gonna be cooking i want to. know i want to be there for the preparation  like how they set up you know for for that.

and it's like you're asking for too much  because it's not like obviously they don't. share they don't announce like okay we're  going to set up a [ __ ] fentanyl lab you know. so it's like so it's going to be hard and  i'm like okay i'm just going to go down to. and wait there for your signal you know so i did  kulekhan is a beautiful city man you you really. have to go there it's a nice city um nice weather  nice people nice places to eat great seafood so i.

spent a couple of days just eating seafood having  beers and walking and swimming at the hotel pool. until i got the signal from this guy that said  like all right i'm picking you up the hotel. and we're driving off to the outskirts of kuliakan  in the middle of nowhere and i'm like okay i'll.

follow follow your lead he knows me and he knows  that i don't go without like a safety protocol. so i just jumped in um and we started like  driving taking off and i asked him like can. i start recording from now and um he said no no  no no because the um the road might be um you. know like someone kind of knows where we are or  where we had it so no road at all i'm like okay. i was with uh with a film crew for vice  world news so there was a cameraman a host.

and i told the cameraman like just don't  because he's a white um almost reddish. british guy he doesn't look like he belongs to an  accident no super tall and i was like just undress. uh dangerously you know just don't  do anything stupid exactly like if. you dress uh i don't know like hipster e yeah  then you're good you know if you dress like a.

skateboarder you're good whatever just  don't dress in a dangerous way i guess. he didn't understand what adventures  why it was because he was full on the. khaki cargo pants like these black tactical  boots sort of like short boots not the long boobs. glasses you know like these kind of like  dark glasses um a green uh military cap.

and a backpack no like dude really  you all did yourself today like. you don't even dress like that  on a regular basis you know yeah. and i'm like all right so let's go uh  let's hope that's not gonna be an issue. and he was like super rewarded about that he's  like do you really feel that i just can't jump. out and just don't go and i'm like no man you  have to go you're the camera operator so let's go. um we went there uh we arrived into like a very  small town like dirt roads and everything and.

from there we met another guy another couple of  guys grabbed a pickup truck put us in the back and. started like driving off in the middle of nowhere  in the middle of nowhere so it was like really. in the middle of the woods and then from there  we met on other guys on motorcycles and they. started driving the motorcycles into the woods  and we started walking until they found a place. where they have um taken out like a lot of trees  and they started setting up a laugh right there.

um some of the stuff it's in the pictures i i  send you like this huge um i don't know like. the rails or something like that yeah um a lot of  um precursors a lot of chemicals a lot of like a. stove like a man-made stove uh and a um like a  smart roof you know like um like a tent and um. and i obviously we obviously had masks on like not  like the regular face mask like proper gas masks.

those guys didn't have anything like anything and  there was like an old guy and it's like okay he's. the kook or boss brought someone from china to  to teach him how to cook this [ __ ] and i'm like. wow that's interesting and it's like how many  people knows that and it's like just like a couple. just like two guys in the organization can't know  how to properly cook and i'm like okay and then i.

started like talking to him he's like very quiet  he didn't really want to talk he was like too. shy with the camera was the man from china on in  the lab or he had come in and taught a group of. people how to do this apparently he just uh uh  teach that guy and that guy showed another guy. and then apparently what goes on is like they  had to show or to teach another two guys in case.

they die there's another two guys but just like  pairs of two um keep learning about how to cook. but it was just once where these chinese came  and showed this guy how to properly cook fentanyl. and the the fentanyl like the proper powder like  fentanyline powder the precursors to cook it. come from china or from germany and they really  take care of that [ __ ] like if that was cold.

they bring them in and box with one arm  guy and it's always looking at that bag. and it's always like okay that's too much  don't don't waste it put it back lock it in. and that guy's always like taking care of that  self like the the precursors fentanyl is possibly. the most addictive drug on the planet yes exactly  it's an opioid an opioid um and it's it's it's. it's a pandemic in the u.s now because it's uh  it's really hurting bad like not only their people.

you know like drug addicts or people in straight  but also moms that's working people regular people. it's killing a lot of people because a lot of  drugs are being laced with fentanyl and those guys. it's that's what amazed me while they were  cooking what they were like setting up i was. asking like how do you move from one business  to another how do you move from cooking heroin.

to lace it with fentanyl how do you move from  that to pure fentanyl how do you move from that. to math you were like dealing with marijuana  not long ago and one of those guys was like. telling me like if it was like a proper  established business you know it's like. our clients in the us they tell us they  started like they started telling us. that their heroine we were giving them wasn't  strong enough so we had some small drops of.

fentanyl into that and they liked it but a year  went by and they're like it's not strong enough. so we added some more and now we're adding like  a lot so like this co kill a huge animal you know. and they they're liking it they're liking it  we're getting good feedback from our users. and like you have like a feedback system on how to  make drugs how like do you like someone calls you.

or your boss or whatever is like no no like the  the street vendors um when they're selling they're. like ah you know what it's not selling good  because my client says that there's a stronger. heroine around the corner with the old guys so we  need to bring this one stronger so he says the guy. he buys from and that guy from the guy he buys  from and he goes all the way back to that cougar.

interesting to the cook and so yeah it's like i  just received the orders like put one fentanyl. into that heroin it's not strong enough now  and he does i always wondered i thought it was. a little counterproductive to make the drug  so strong because so many people are dying but. now i understand if it's a media feedback from  the users to the cookers exactly yeah because it. wouldn't make sense like that's what i understand  that like okay so these guys yeah because what.

am i saying for these guys to be killing their  clients in the u.s you know um it wouldn't make. sense like for them to be actually like yeah just  have like super strong so they [ __ ] die or not. overdose they know that and they talk about that  and so like we don't use this [ __ ] that we don't. use any of this [ __ ] it's that's [ __ ] strong  those guys are crazy like you guys are cooking it. you guys are crazy yeah and it's like yeah but  we don't use that like those guys are asking.

for stronger [ __ ] every time more and more and  i'm like but they're dying and it's like i know. but that's what they want if they want to kill  themselves that's on them i'm getting paid to cook. and i'm like wow that's that was revealing  you know that was like really something like. how they actually see the issue because we think  we tend to think that these guys are like the bad. guys you know like putting fentanyl and cooking  and they're like yeah they're gonna die in the u.s.

they're actually like wow that's strong i don't  know if they should be using this [ __ ] you know. um and they so they lace a bunch of stuff um  chloride or i don't know like the bunch of stuff. they put into that mix and then they start you  know like just mixing it but you get the fumes and. they're like strong [ __ ] fumes i i was wearing  one of those masks and i mean it was it was.

awful it was bad like you could feel it you could  still smell it you could still feel you know the. the trees around the area were all that like  around that specific area they were all like. from the from the fumes yeah like specific  specific circle all that like all [ __ ] brown. that nose [ __ ] i thought that was just  the environment when i was looking at them. only around that you walk like a couple of feet  from there and it's green again like green leaves.

healthy trees wow but it's that strong it's not  crazy and that's for a couple of patches only. how much how much fentanyl does a couple of  batches look like is it is it well what they. were cooking there they used the bag of the  precursor to make fentanyl was a bag like that.

um fill up to the middle and they  used like a corner of that you know. the rest was a lot of other [ __ ]  with heroin and i don't know what. and then they make this this paste um when they  cook it like they cook the whole um like a broth. and then they leave it to dry and then  when it's dry it's like a it's like a paste. like a brownish paste they told  me that the quantity they used um.

into that of the precursors were worth like  200 bucks 300 bucks something like that. and what it was in the back by for when it was  dry in mexico it was like 20 grand in the us. it was like 100 120 200 grand so he's like we have  a lot of money here i'm like [ __ ] and i was like. so what if the government comes like right now so  that would just like burn everything and just grab.

the gold you know just this this is the worth the  precursor and this [ __ ] let's go everything else. just like burn it um they took me to another  place around all burned out and i was like. did they yeah like someone told us like hey the  military is on its way so i had to burn everything. grab the [ __ ] and go and we were gonna make  the double like twice the batch with either but. we only managed to do one before they came so  that's where we're cooking this second batch to.

make for that and i'm like okay and  then from here what's what's next. it's like from here uh the bus shows up apparently  the bus is was the brother of the of the old cook. um and he's like yeah my brother is like  very intelligent man not like me i'm only. a cook and i love marijuana i love to harvest  marijuana i have a beautiful beautiful um crop.

of beautiful weed man good quality all natural  i want to show he was like so proud of his. wheat crop but um he didn't like working  into that but i was paying the bills you know. and he felt like he was supporting his brother  he's like my brother came out with this idea. like okay we can cook this [ __ ] i can find the  proper um a proper supplier in china i'm gonna. bring it you gotta cook it i'm gonna export it  and we're gonna make [ __ ] tons of money and i.

was like is he and he's like yeah he's making  [ __ ] tons of money like because he doesn't. take it all the way to the us what he does is  he sells it to someone he doesn't even know. but uh there's a trans uh transport in the  middle who just he just pays that like okay. um i'm gonna send this quantity of fentanyl to  the u.s all right it's gonna be two thousand grand. and he takes um requests from everybody so  he carries a um cessna or a car it depends.

with a lot of drugs from different knuckles you  know just like have this math that's why they. were like putting a name on the on the back oh  [ __ ] so he's delivering to all the cartels. it's a delivery guy he's like okay yeah i'm  taking from sinaloa to the border that's. not the cook though that's no the transfer just  teaches cooks and then he gets everything ready. his brother arrives takes the batch already in  bricks to the cook coming to the delivery guy um.

all it it's like okay it's like six bricks of this  [ __ ] under my name off you go there's your money. and he's like okay i have a trip to mexicali who  else is gonna send me [ __ ] uh and then another. guy jumps in i have like some math i have some  coke have some wheat there you go so these cooks. do they have direct ties to the cartels or is it  direct tie to the transporter who has direct ties.

to the car that's exactly what i was telling you  before on the on the how the structure works now. this guy represents a cartel but it's like a  brand you know it's like if you open up a shop of. nike tennis sneaker shoes here you're not  necessarily part of the night corporation you know. you have a store selling that brand so these guys  are representing a brand but not a cartel it's a.

franchise it's a franchise so these guys are like  okay i got the protection from the cartel they. are allowing me to cook here they are giving me  some assets um and i am delivering drugs for them. you know only my my job is to cook and to send so  that's an ex that's a that's an extremely small. operation yes so how are they making connections  with the chinese to come over and teach them how.

to cook if it's such a small organizational  outfit that's where the big organization comes. in you know like the big bosses are like the big  people inside they facilitated exactly like this. guy the brother of the cook he knew a guy from  the citadel cartel higher up dealing with money. laundering like higher operations you know like  um arms trafficking it was uh trafficking chinese. into mexico with fake mexican ids and that  was the deal like okay you give me precursors.

i'll bring your i'll smuggle your people into  my country you know so they're bringing chinese. with precursors into mexico and it's wow it's a  whole [ __ ] operation man so he knew that guy. and he's like hey man my brother can cook i can  like you know operate that part of the business. and um i'll just be selling you the batches  what do you think and he's like yeah that's. a good idea all right i'm gonna bring out a  cook from china who knows how to cool that.

[ __ ] it's gonna show you uh and you and you  start and start telling me that those batches. and it's like yeah let's set it up so they set up  that coop that kitchen how many of these little. if you have an estimation that'd be great if  not that's fine too but yeah these little labs. do there are like like i guess like only in the  outskirts of kuliakan you can count them by the.

hundreds every day every day like how many by  the hundreds by the hundreds like a hundred so. i have two hundred three hundred blacks working at  the same time wow and then disappearing and then. the next day popping up somewhere different  and then disappearing and then popping out. somewhere different they're cooking this every  day every single day how long does it take them um. we arrived there around 11 in the morning or  so and we left by six ish pm before sunset so.

around like six seven hours to cook like a batch  that worth 200 k in the us so like that so every. six hours they're like again they're producing  a hundred thousand dollars worth of fentanyl. and um the cook was telling me that the another  set of cooks recently died is like they die like.

if they don't if they don't because he  wasn't talking he wasn't like he was like. super quiet but then someone offered him  uh coke and then he started like talking. who actually was like cranking  when we were like editing the video. um the the vice crew and i was like just  laughing like all through the night because he. transformed you know he was like super quiet  super not you know shy and then he goes like. so then yeah you have to use this  [ __ ] because it's like oh my god.

yeah it's like started like talking and um  a lot and so he started talking about his. brother about his crops but all this stuff  and about how most of the kooks don't last. more than two months they keep dying every two  months so that he has to teach someone else. and then you know why are they dying  because of the future the poison. yeah like the he's like that's why i use coke  to to to balance the effects of the fentanyl.

that doesn't sound um you know right or wrong  i think you got it wrong man i don't think the. cocaine is going to help out that you're getting  more chemicals into your body and they end up all. like cold and you know affected by the fentanyl  they end up and they drink a lot drink it's like. you gotta you gotta keep hydrated man that's why  we get a bunch of beers and um bottles of tequila. they had don julia right there it's like drinking  the julian burst and the fumes and the coat is.

like wow man you really end up with jordan like  super intoxicated from here damn two month like. life expectancy exactly yeah and um surrounded  by a couple of armed people that are just there. sitting bored talking drinking you know like uh  and when they're over they just like scored the. [ __ ] yeah where it has to go dude what kind of  drugs are the are they they're lacing what kind of.

drugs with fentanyl and can you get just straight  fentanyl yes they're doing straight fentanyl like. peels and that kind of [ __ ] uh and they're  lacing uh heroin and meth with fentanyl that's. coke not coke not for what i saw there not what i  learned there they i don't know i mean they might. be doing but when i was there it was only a batch  of heroin a batch of meth to to take into the u.s. it was it was an interesting it was  very interesting to learn how to.

how does that works you know how unstructured the  organizations are another guy in mexicali at the. border we met we followed the route so we met  with the guy in charge of the stash house where. that drug was gonna be stashed before jumping into  the u.s you followed the product we felt the stash. uh-huh and then i mean not not like that specific  product you just followed a product no we we knew.

where where that was going to be stashed so we  arrived there two days later okay so we went there. to the stash house and talked to that guy so like  okay so what's the next process of this of this. drug and it's like right now what i'm doing is  putting everything into ziplocks uh vacuum sealed. and then i watch them with um uh detergent you  know to like this suave dell it's called in mexico.

just for it so it smells like roses and the  dogs wouldn't smell it and when he's all washed. up i'm gonna put it in um in a  car that it's gonna arrive here. and all right so and then in the middle of the  interview and everything uh a couple like a man. and a woman like nicely dressed in a nice  car showed up to that [ __ ] stats house. and they were like very curious like who are these  guys with cameras here and it was like oh it's.

a it's an interview they're reporters from the  us and they were like can we stay here a little. and they were like having fun watching us  taking us pictures and then they went into. our room and then they left and i was like  who's this people it's like oh they are the. launcher launderers they came here to deliver  some stacks of bugs we count them with a machine. stash them and they left and i'm like oh wow  that's interesting too and i'm like all right so.

and then what you do so it's like okay we're gonna  wait wait for the car it's like okay is that like. uh part of the cartel car someone she's like no no  the borders are closed for most mexican residents. so we're exclusively using us citizens like the  people who is out of work we started recruiting. them recruiting them in the us like hey you want  to make like 500 bucks to a thousand you know an.

afternoon and um some of they say yes all right  okay so just show up in mexicali and um we'll. um we'll you know like have a load on your car  you're not we're not going to tell you where it is. and then you're going to deliver that leave the  cars leave the keys of your car in the parking. lot we're going to take it we're going to get  back you're good to go so that afternoon a woman. arrived a woman speaking perfect english she was  from california in a mercedes all mercedes-benz.

and she was like yeah i've been doing this for a  good while and i'm like why she's like i have five. kids um my mother's job because of the pandemic  and someone offered me this job so yeah i make two. or three trips a day wow and i'm like wow that's  interesting and how come they don't i don't know.

they don't stop you at the border and she's like  cause i uh even even the days i don't carry loads. i still cross because my story is i work in  mexico and i live in the u.s so so she's made. a cover story sticks to it it's just created an  entire pattern of life yeah exactly um and so. we followed her they put the stuff in her  car we followed her and she got secondary.

she got what secondary oh she was like a secondary  um inspection when they send you to these. booths and they put like x-rays and dogs and  the cbp officers the customs are like looking. all over your car they didn't find anything  nothing nothing that was like we thought like oh. [ __ ] they got her and no we met her at  a motel on the other side and we're like.

what the [ __ ] you just got secondary she  was like yeah honestly i thought i was like. dawn but he didn't find anything and now wow wow  that's [ __ ] crazy it was like are you afraid. she's like yeah every time is the last time every  time i do this is the last time i'm gonna do it. and uh but i can't stop because it's good money  and i don't have any other source of income. so i don't know if that when the pandemic  restrictions are lifted i don't know if she.

actually caught a proper job and got out of that  wow hopefully what would happen to you guys if. you were at that fentanyl lab and  i don't think anything because um. we're not we're not carrying anything with us  we're not being part of the operation the business. we're just filming there um i guess what will  happen is they might be interested in talking.

to us to see if we can snitch say something  locations names but um other than that um. i don't think there's uh there's anything they  could actually do to us you know um when we. had to take a flight from rally well i had to take  a flight from from la i ditched all my clothes. into the trash bin because it smelled so strong  of i don't know ugly like super [ __ ] strong.

so i put everything on the trash and uh i was like  yeah i'm ready to fly back again home you know. because this these things and i'm tired and it was  like intense you know it was like you have to be. on top of your mind all the time like on  top of everything on top of a production. and also on top of the safety of yourself and  everybody else and your on your crew you know. because one guy was from brazil the other guy  was from colombia the other guy was from the uk.

when we crossed the border the officer was  like what is this like a [ __ ] u.n car. oh [ __ ] yeah yeah this was it  was like a mexican and brazilian. a guy from the uk and a colombian in the  same car is like what the [ __ ] is this. damn that's interesting yeah that's extremely  interesting it was it was very interesting. it was a it was a nice access it was an  interesting access um into how does that work.

works you know yeah and and what it's doing  to killing some lives in the u.s many lives. and getting some people alive like that  girl like providing for her family for kids. it's what is all this going to be made into  it's a documentary which is already in vice. world news um i'll show you the link what's it  called it's called camera it's called something.

like it's a short documentary called how the us  know how mexican cartels are using u.s citizens. to smuggle drugs or something like very new you  know it's like a it's like a report you know. not like a proper full-on documentary it's like  a 10 10 15 minutes piece okay for password news. yeah i'd love to watch it i love it yeah  i'll definitely send you the link and um. it's interesting we embed it with the mexican  police because we know that mexicali is huge for.

um labs they denied everything they said like  no there is actually no labs here man like uh. this is one of the cleanest city in terms of lab  operations we obviously didn't say like we just. been into one yeah um it's like oh really no [ __  ] it's like yeah and this is like he kept talking. and talking and like so then what are we doing  because we discussed like you were gonna go into a. an operative and we kind of begged you it's  like yeah we have an alternative um permanent. apprentice going through the city to find you know  stuff and i was like okay so we spent four hours.

finding people with a small wheat cigarette it's  like stop right there you look suspicious and they. were like and i was like okay so these guys are  just putting up a show for the cameras yeah we're. gonna cut all that out because this is [ __ ] you  know so yeah yeah wow it was it was interesting. too to be in that place very interesting  let's take another quick break let's do it.

thank you.

my louise i kind of want to wrap this interview up  but you've taken part in quite a few documentaries.

and and um i kind of want to what what are  those documentaries i want to link them below. so people can kind of see your work and what  you've been involved in so definitely so um i've. been working for some documentaries in vice world  news i'll show you the links so you can put them. up there mostly like reportings on 10 15 minute  pieces like many docks yeah i like mini ducks.

on on the beats i cover um for cnn i did  like some some interesting stuff with a. smuggler with a human smuggler he allowed us to  follow him all through from his safe house to. the border while until he put people together  and why is he doing it how much he's charging. also i've been doing some more like blowing  version documentaries like the one um on showtime. it's called ready for war on deported veterans  who end up working for cartels in mexico and um.

and some serious like dope in netflix the  mexican part of that series i've helped. produce that um i'm the middle of uh production  for two short documentaries for vice as well. one on weaponized drones in mexico the cartels are  weaponizing drones and the other one about how the. mexican drug traffickers specifically the  sinaloa cartel is using mexican indigenous.

people to run drugs across the border and um long  desert stretches wow that's a lot of stuff here. what would be one that you're probably most  do you have one that you are most proud of um. i mean it depends because every time i i jump into  a new project uh that's one that i'm most excited.

about so right now the indigenous  issue i'm very very excited about. that one because it's been a story that i've  been hearing and covering for a while now. i just did a story on that a written story talking  to some of them talking reviewing court documents. under arrest talking to some of the bad guys and  some of the good guys and what's going on with. these indigenous people and why are they running  drugs and how climate change is a big part of it.

um and so that becoming a shared documentary i'm  really excited about that one to me interesting. how can people find you um i'm very active in  twitter and on instagram um in twitter you can. find me as luis l u i s koreaki k u r i k y i'll  show you my handle so you can like post it here. because might be difficult to remember louis  kuriaki in instagram i'm the same luis guriyaki.

i go by that name on my on most of my social  just i thought at the beginning i thought it was. safety wise sir you know like i thought that  if you look for luis chaparro social media. it's going to be harder to to find me unless you  know my handle which is louis kuriaki you know. and yeah i'm very active on both of them most  of the time when i'm out i record short clips. of what i'm reporting of what i'm doing  when i'm not compromising a location.

and then i upload stories on my instagram  afterwards when i'm back into a safe place home or. else and i started like so you can know what i'm  working um during dance and have some behind the. scenes on going to continuing labs arm trafficking  stuff and also on my instagram all my pictures i i. they're not like pictures of me or selfies or you  know food it's pictures of my work pictures of our.

people um cartels um drucking kingpins um pictures  that i most of them might take them or i find them. through a source like the wedding of el chapo  you know so that kind of stuff you can find my. instagram and and on my twitter you can find all  of my stories uh every time i publish a news story. it's um it's on twitter perfect i'll be following  you and uh i just want to let you know you know.

if you ever have anything new yeah you're always  welcome here we'd love to get you back on and and. uh see what you got going on and if you ever need  anybody down there even if it's just a sound guy. i can hold a boom pole like nobody's business so  i'd love to get down there and take part in that. that'll be amazing man that'll be that'll be great  that'll be an honor and i'm and i'm very happy to. be here because i watch your show i learn a lot  on your show and and so i really wanted to to be.

here and share my small part of the world that  i know you know which is the Mexican cartels. well i really appreciate it thank you and it's  been it's been a real pleasure to host you so. thank you be safe down there and uh best of  luck to you thank you we will see you around. thanks a lot and um and yeah and hopefully  people your your people will um will learn. about this guy i'm gonna interview soon and it's  gonna be around there they will all right cheers.

you.