Admiral Tim Gallaudet - Underwater Alien Base, UFO Psyops and Weather Weapons | SRS #113

[Music]. Tim Galedet, welcome to the show. It's an honor to be here, Sean. Thank. you for inviting me. It's an honor to have you here. Um, so. you kind of came on my radar. I've been. looking around at some of the UAP UFO. stuff and uh I've been hearing a lot. about the water and how they possibly. might be coming out of the water. there's been sightings and so. been looking for somebody to speak on. that and we ran across you. So, thank.

you so much for being here. It's an. honor to have you here as well and uh. man, I am just really excited to pick. your brain on what you know about all. this stuff. So, let's go. But, um everybody starts off with a. introduction here. So, if you don't. mind, Admiral Tim Galedet, American. oceanographer, retired rear admiral in. the United States Navy, formerly worked. on the US Department of Commerce as the.

acting under secretary of commerce for. oceans and atmosphere. Also acting. administrator of the National Oceanic. and Atmospheric Administration, the. NOAA. As of 2024, you're the CEO of. Ocean STL Consulting LLC, host of the. American Blue Economy podcast, prominent. member of the UFO community, on the. board of directors for Forest Blue, honored as a distinguished graduate of.

the University of California, San Diego. You're a research affiliate affiliate. for Harvard's Galileo project. You're on. the board of the Soul Foundation and. Americans for Safe Aerospace. and you later this year have a book. coming out on leadership. There you go. There we go. That's some of the things I'm. Yeah, I'm sure I'm missing a handful of. things. Anything in particular? No, no, it's all good. That's enough. That's enough. All right. Um, well,

couple things we got to crank out first. Everybody that uh comes on the show gets. I've been waiting for this. There you. go. Any guesses? Gummies. Hey. Hey. Good guess. Oh, how about that? There they are. Made in the USA. My youngest daughter, uh, this I'm going. to be her favorite person. Really? Oh, yeah. She loves these. I'll give you some more for the ride. Okay. Okay. Fantastic. Thanks. But, um, but I also have a subscription. account. It's on Patreon. And so one of.

the perks that we give our patrons who. are our top supporters, we give them an. opportunity to ask the current guest. questions. And so there's a couple of. good ones here. This one is from Greg. Are there other. areas that have more common UFO activity. besides the California and Florida. coasts? From what I understand, yes, there are. There's certain places in around the. globe that are hotspots and I don't have.

that all mapped out myself but u it's a. the scientific coalition for UAP studies. SCU they're pretty credible research. organization and and they've done that I. think there's some places in South. America and um where else in in the. Pacific Northwest possibly but there. there are this this is documented and. you could do a Google search and find. them. Interesting. This is from Lester Dodson. What effects do underwater thermal vents. and underwater volcanic activity have on.

ocean temperatures, ocean currents, and. the overall world climate? That's interesting. That's a good. question. I don't think hydrothermal. vents uh are a major factor in changes. in the climate, but they're very. interesting scientifically because they. hold a habitat that is super extreme, high temperatures, very toxic with. metals and minerals, but but organism. have evolved to uh to live and thrive in.

those environments. And it's it's really. interesting regarding this current topic. because of UAP because uh it's basically. we already have aliens in our oceans. when you go to those places. Uh they're. they're uh some of them don't have any. uh uh they're all white because they. don't need any coloration since it's so. dark down there. Giant clams for example. and muscles as well as uh um other types. of tubeworms and just really weird weird. sea life. If you go and look at some. hydrothermal vent imagery or expeditions.

that um I have friends who've done that. Wow. How deep are these? Oh shoot. Well, the first one that was. discovered was off the Mid-Atlantic. ridge, I believe. And my buddy Robert. Ballard, the discoverer of the Titanic. He was one of the ones who found him. He. was working with the French. And I I I. think there might be around 2 miles deep. or so. It varies. It varies. Wow. And then the last question, which. actually uh we had kind of spoken about. before before we started rolling the.

cameras, but I have a lot of Patreons. that excuse me, patrons that are curious. on your thoughts to the UFO. whistleblower series that we did. I. think it was right about a year ago. Right. Right. That that was a really. compelling series. So, I've been in this. UAP topic for a little over about two. years. And uh and I initially. like Michael Herrera the Marine uh where. he saw paramilitary. forces from some agency and that whole.

story originally I would have dismissed. that as can't be our government doesn't. do that. but but the more I'm learning and that's. coming out and I I could talk about some. examples uh I I wouldn't be surprised if. there was credibility to that because uh. for example uh there is a book out there. by a guy named Greg Bishop called. Project Beta. Have you ever heard of it? I haven't. This is a really good book right for. right now. It's a. Project Beta. Project Beta. And it's a and it's the.

subtitle is something like uh the story. of Paul Benowitz and the evolution of. the modern UFO myth. And and what it's. about is a civilian physicist who was on. contract to work at uh uh for for the. Air Force, I believe. And ultimately, he. was he was one of these people who was a. civilian researcher in the UAP in the. New Mexico area where there was that's a. hot spot. and um and the Air Force.

deliberately deceived him and exploited. him and even broke into his house to. make him believe that there was going to. be an imminent alien invasion. And he he. basically nearly went crazy and the Air. Force did that deliberately. And. what? Yeah, for Yes. The book is really good. read too. You can read it like in a day. Uh it's it's all happened. The the main. perpetrator in the Air Force is a guy. named Richard Dodie. He's quite well. known in the UAP circles and that's what. he did. And and I can see that happening.

right now. Uh and we could talk about. this later, but you know this DoD UFO. office called Arrow? Mhm. So they they recently released a report. Real quick, what does Arrow stand for. again? All domain anomaly resolution office. And their report was looking at the. historical. uh kind of story of of the US. government's UAP involvement. Congress. directed them to do this report and they. they basically didn't do their job. It.

was a lot of errors. They missed a lot. And one of the prominent UAP uh. authorities on national security, Chris. Melon, wrote a scathing uh uh expose, if. you will, on all the errors in the. report and how they didn't meet the. congressional mandate. And when you read. that, and you can tell they're they're. obviously obuscating. They are. deliberately not saying what they know. and saying things that are patently. untrue. in this report that Congress. directed and and so Chris wrote a great. article in the the debrief about it and.

all the flaws. And when you put that. together and look at that, you can just. see that is that is active. disinformation. They're not. acknowledging what they know and they're. actually putting out false information. Why do you why are they putting out. false information? So this this this is really uh it makes. sense if you worked in the government at. a high level like me. uh they they uh. the the executive branch uh the National. Security Council with upon direction. from the president and and the.

Department of Defense and the. intelligence community, the Office of. Director of National Intelligence, they. they're the ones who could have the say. uh should we disclose or not? and and. the arrow is just doing their bidding. because those that executive branch. those bodies they set the policy of the. administration. I saw this in my job. under secretary of commerce. The Trump. administration wanted to do certain. things and we did those things. We. actually did a lot of good and I could. talk about that that the press never. gave us credit for but that's how it.

flows and this administration doesn't. want to do that. So Arrow is just the. mouthpiece. It's the policy at the top. level of the executive branch that. directs whether they want to disclose or. not. Now it makes a lot of sense because. uh I mean UFO people want to see it. But. uh if you were Biden, would you want to. tell the American public, hey uh I can't. keep our air airspace safe. It's it's. being um it's being visited by entities. whose intent I don't understand and I. can't control it. Same for our water.

space. Do you think he want to announce. that to the American people on the verge. of the election and say, "I'm not doing. my job. I can't keep you all safe." I. don't think so. Probably not. What But what is the. disinformation piece? Why would they be. Why would the Air Force be planting. disinformation in researchers homes? Well, that was back then. I I I'd be. hardressed to see them do that today, but that's it. They went out of control. Uh they didn't they were basically not. not aligned with the Constitution. Uh.

and they did that because now they don't. say it in the book. Uh the book just. talks about the facts, but it's the same. thing again that's happening today. They. don't want the public to know that there. really is a crash retrieval program and. that we real we we are monitoring UAP in. our airspace and water space and we we. can't control their actions and we don't. fully understand their intentions and. that's that's a dangerous thing to leak. to the public and so they are. deliberately falsifying it and. exploiting people making them appear as.

wackos thus creating a stigma behind the. whole scene which has prevented serious. scientific study and And that that's why. I've joined Galileo, Americans for Save. Aerospace, and the Soul Foundation to. advance the scientific study of the. phenomena. Interesting. So that's a so that the. disinformation is just to discredit. whoever is exactly. getting into the subject. That's right. And it's happening overtly. today. That office is doing it. And and.

you you see it all around uh the media. now. Uh there's just a lot of uh there. are individuals who I will not name who. are who I believe are getting paid but. they every day they get out online and. they're well known in this UAP community. and their number one job is to discredit. these these national authorities these. people like Lou Alzando who who was with. the task force the UAP task force I've. met and trust and know and and he is.

100% who he says he is and what he says. he's seen and knows I have total. confidence in people like him. He he's. getting uh he's he's an active target of. dis of people discrediting him and. others too. Interesting. Interesting. Is there. anybody I should be looking out for? Uh gosh, I I I don't study this like. other people do. Some people are they do. they really uh spend a lot of time on.

this. Um, uh, yeah, I'll ask I'm just not going to. name names because I I don't know. I. don't want to I don't want to do that. Yeah, I understand. I'll ask you offline. Let's get into the Galileo project. Yeah, that sounds fascinating. How did you get. involved in that? Well, again, I had left the government. and so for the background is this. One. of my jobs in the Navy is I was the. superintendent of the US Naval. Observatory in Washington DC. So that.

has it's known for two things. It's the. where the vice president lives. He lives. in the house of the former. superintendent. Um so I didn't get that. house when I came in. The vice president. was there. But but also the uh uh it is. it's this this unit that has been. historically been mapping the stars for. the US for the purpose of navigation. Ships of sh the age of sail are original. ships. the six frigots they navigated. using celestial navigation and uh and.

then and that that's evolved to. modernday star mapping uh which is used. for satellite navigation. So so consider. this if GPS tells you where it is or you. are how does GPS know where it is the. constellation they reference themselves. to the stars in our galaxy that are. relatively fixed because they're so far. away. So you do you do a you create. something called a celestial reference. frame and that is the that is the. coordinate system that satellites.

navigate off of precisely and then. therefore could tell you where you are. So we updated all the star positions. universe was expanding so we'd have to. make new cataloges every so often. That's the observatory. Bottom line is that I got to know a lot. of astrophysicists and I learned a lot. of cosmology and I realized the universe. is so giant. We'd be arrogant to think. that we're the only species that's. evolved to travel between celestial. bodies. And so, you know, we have 100 to. 400 billion stars in the Milky Way.

galaxy and there are over 100 billion. galaxies in the observable universe. That's just crazy. So I I was open to. that and then when I left the government. I decided I'll join Galileo because. Galileo. under Avi Lo at Harvard he is developing. a a network of observatories telescopes. and other sensors to look for UAP in the. in the near-earth atmosphere. And so. he's he's published on several books on.

this topic and I love the way he thinks. he total scientific approach and being. an astronomer and understanding the. scales that I just talked about in terms. of space and time 14 billion year old. universe you have to think okay in this. in in the earth we have evolved we're. pretty new on the scene the earth's been. around for like four billion years and. we've only been as humans on the scene. for not even a million. And so we we.

occupy the sliver of time in the whole. scale of the earth and the universe. And. look how fast we've we've advanced in. technology in the even tinier part of. the last hundred years. You know, I've seen a lot during my time. as a Navy Seal and a CIA contractor, and. I've learned even more hosting this. show. The one thing I can tell you for. sure is that it pays to be prepared. Right now, with our national debt. surging to unfathomable levels, global.

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uh to go way past us and and then maybe. even died off millions of years ago. somewhere else. So, he's on this search. to either find active UAP or or the. remnants of another techn technological. civilization. When you think about those. scales and the fact that okay, there's. life on this earth. So, we know that. life can evolve on a on a planet, it's. just myopic to think why wouldn't it. happen somewhere else in this giant. universe?

Yeah. Yeah. You had mentioned uh just a. minute ago that the universe is. expanding and. I've been watching things on this, but I. how do we know it's expanding? Well, I. won't go into the details here, but uh. astronomers can see it in different. signatures. I believe uh Edwin Hubble, I. think, was the first astronomer to find. evidence of that. And it's it's based on. uh gosh, it's not necessarily the I.

think it's a thing they call red shift. where uh a certain spectrum of. electromagnetic energy in out in the. universe has a feature to it like a. Doppler shift when you know a train's. going by or you're going fast by. something that uh and you hear that. change in frequency. I I believe it's. something like that. Don't quote me. I I. haven't done astronomy for a long time, but um but it astronomers have been able. to prove it conclusively. What do you think it's expanding into,

right? That's exactly it. And where'd it. come from? There's this big bang that. happened 14.6 billion years ago. Nobody. knows what happened before that or what. was what was there? I mean, what does that mean? Does it. mean that. is it creating a wall? Yeah. Like, is there an ant? What's on the other side of it? I don't know exactly. And neither and. that and that's why when you think about. that weirdness. um then then you start re appreciating. that other weirdness could be too.

because again we've only reached our. understanding of modern physics in the. last few last hundred years. What if we. evolve and live and don't kill ourselves. for another thousand or million years? What is the state of technology going to. be like then? And and that's why when we. talk about where are these these things. coming from it it it could be anything. It could be from other dimensions that. we just haven't learned the physics. about or again from another part of the. universe that we say okay we can't. travel that far that fast based on the.

known laws of physics and the speed of. light but but maybe we'll invent the. invent that discover that those physics. sometime in the future. Wow. Wow. man. There's so much to cover here. Exactly. But let's start let's start. with uh a little bit of your Navy. career. So you're an oceanographer in. the Navy. What does an oceanographer do? Right. So uh I joined the Navy uh. because I wanted to be an oceanographer. I it wasn't cuz I wanted to join the. Navy. My my dad had been in and I I.

respected the service of course, but uh. my passion is in the ocean and that's. really why we're here because we'll get. into the UAP and the ocean later, but uh. grew up in Southern California. I love. to swim and surf and uh and so I wanted. to study the ocean and so the Naval. Academy had a great major and they had a. scholarship to this institution called. Scripps Institution of Oceanography and. I wanted to go there and get it. I got. that and I then I started doing that. work in the Navy and what it involves is. basically uh knowing everything about.

the physical ocean and predicting it. waves, currents, how uh the ocean. structure affects acoustic propagation, which is the top consideration in. undersea warfare and and finding and. killing enemy submarines and and vice. versa, not being killed by an enemy. submarine. So, uh that that's what. oceanographers do for the most part. I. worked with your community Navy Navy. special warfare for a time because uh. lot of work with the steal delivered.

vehicles for example or anything like a. special reconnaissance mission from. offshore that the ton of work they do is. dependent upon the ocean wave heights. currents temperature. buddies would hype out on every mission. and I would never want to do that. My my. wife was a Navy diver, you know, and. it's funny because when I was at the. Navy Seal headquarters, I had a good. buddy who was a who had formerly been in. the STV teams and he he knew my wife and. they had these mutual conversations. together and whenever we got uh had.

parties or whatnot because my wife had. been a Navy diver and Bruce had been a. SDV operator and they would always just. talk about hating to be cold now after. all those missions. But anyways, um. yeah, so just just helping operators in. any field, whether it be the surface. Navy, submarine, SEALs, know the ocean. and predict it so they can plan their. missions more effectively. Then you went on, you had you were flag. officer at the Pentagon. Yeah. What were you doing there? Well, I I was the oceanographer of the. Navy. that's the top oceanographer and.

meteorologist and hydrographer advising. the chief of naval operations on. everything uh that my community of. officers did for the Navy. So I was in. charge of six of our oceanographic ships. uh that are all around the world doing. collecting ocean data and um mapping the. seafloor. So this is an interesting. thing. you you see these pictures of the. earth and sometimes you'll see like. Google Earth's o ocean uh features and.

you think the seafloor is all mapped and. and the fact is it's not. We've not even. mapped 25% of the world seafloor to a. modern standard meeting multi-beam sonar. and GPS navigation. That's 75% of the. Earth's seafloor is basically uncharted. territory. And and it's even crazier for. the volume of the ocean. Barely 5% of. the ocean volume has ever been explored. with a remotely operated vehicle. 5%. 5%. Yeah. So like that much volume we.

don't even know what's out there. So uh so I did that for the Navy in the. Pentagon. And as I after I left I I did. that at this US agency which was a US. top ocean agency, the National Oceanic. and Atmospheric Administration. And then. you know I since I've left I'm just. consulting for some companies that do. that kind of work. Ocean tech, weather. tech. Um some other things. Yeah. So. there's another thing about this. underwater feature off SoCal that I want. to dive an ROV on. Uh so uh what.

happened is uh I wanted to get a better. look at it and uh I happen to know this. very famous explorer. His name is Victor. Visco and here's the kind of guy Victor. is private equity investor. He was a. intelligence officer in the Nailo. reserve and uh any but he made a lot of. money uh on his uh in his day job and he. is done the Explorers Club Grand Slam. which involves hiking all the seven. peaks including Everest and skiing to.

the North Pole and the South Pole and. Victor. for him it wasn't enough so he decided. he learned that all the deep ocean. trenches in the world not all of them. have been explored so he hired a. company, bought a ship, built his own. submersible, and financed for the sum of. about $50 million an expedition to dive. in all the five deep trenches. And it's. called the five deeps. None of them that's never happened. So, he built a submersible that could go all. the way down to the Mariana's Trench,

the deepest part of the ocean. They call. it Challenger Deep. And he he's done. that 14 times, which is incredible. He. that only been dove twice before. How deep is it? 35,000 ft. Wow. 10,000 plus meters. Yeah, this is. crazy. And uh and so he he's done some. exploring. What happened is uh I signed. an agreement with him when I was at Noah. uh and he agreed to put our scientists. on his ship and give us the data he. collected because he also had a really. great sonar, a multi-beammetry.

sonar. And so we had that agreement. Well, um, one time after I left the. government, I learned that he was going. to do a test, uh, cruise, if you will, a. shakedown for his ship, cuz he got a new. sonar on it, the the state-of-the-art. And uh I when I learned he was doing it. and I and I knew about this one feature. that I couldn't explain in the on the. seafloor, I rode Victor and I said, "Hey, um this this cruise you're going. to go test your sonar at um I have an.

idea for you and it's going to be an. expedition like no other." And I told. him about what I was doing with UAP and. my you know, my hypothesis on this. feature maybe being the result of some. interaction with a USO in the seabed. And uh I said, "I have some other. coordinates, too." And we gave him some. coordinates of areas like where we knew. the Nimmits had its encounter and the. Omaha had its encounter. Just areas. where UAP had been observed and and USOS. and that maybe there's something on the. seabed there. And I I didn't think he'd.

write me back. I I I was curious. I. thought he might think I'm I was off my. rocker. Well, he wrote me back and just. said, "Send me the coordinates." And he. went and surveyed all around those. areas. Unfortunately, his submersible. wasn't ready and he couldn't get his. eyes on that that target and see it. optically, but he got some high. resolution bethimemetry with the sonar. and and that's what I'm working off of. Well, what did what how long ago did. this happen? Oh, it might have been two. years. But but uh um and that's what's.

interesting about my point too is this. uh that uh here was a guy like him and I. told him about possible UAP activity in. the ocean and he didn't blink. He just. said send me the coordinates. I I have. one other story and it relates to this. the ocean and I guess maybe the. credibility of the topic. So I I uh I. mentioned that I work with the. nationalmies and uh nationalmies of. science, engineering and medicine and.

they have this this body on it called. the ocean studies board and this is the. the hall of fame or the allstars of. ocean science in our nation. And these. are just top tier ocean scientists who. get together and we decide upon topics. of interest for on the ocean and we. agree on studies and help conduct them. and uh you know things like the illegal. fishing issue I talked about ocean. plastics you name it. Well, I went to. them and I I pulled together all my info. about what Congress had done. The DoD is.

doing uh and NASA has a study team and I. recommended that we get together and do. a survey of all the government data sets. that uh ocean data sets and just look. for anomalous activity and see if there. are areas where we know it occurs and. they just haven't been looked at because. remember I mentioned it's not. necessarily the the topic or target of. most ocean research expeditions. So. maybe it's in the data and no one even. thought about calling it out. Well, they. they I I wasn't sure what they'd say,

but and they did not laugh me out of the. room. They actually said, "Wow, that's. interesting, Tim. Maybe you should look. into it, but you probably want to. include all the classified data sources, too." And and we don't do that. The. group that does that is the Naval. Studies Board. Ah, okay. So that was. great because that was familiar. territory for me because I've briefed. the Naval Studies Board multiple times. on different issues, the Naval Studies. Board. And so I went to the chair who. happens to be retired four-star Admiral.

Gary Ruffhead, former chief of naval. operations when I was in the Pentagon as. a one-star and my boss. So I knew him or. pardon me, I was a captain at the time. Um and uh so he was my boss's boss and. I've briefed him before. So I go to him. and I say we we have a Zoom meeting. I. tell him about all this UAP research. that's going on by credible institutions. and the government and he thought Tim. that is something we should be doing. Uh. he and he said not only because if we. have things in our water space that we.

don't know about we should and he said. but also uh this is going to help us. know a lot more about the ocean and I. remember I talked about uh knowing more. about the ocean is going to help us with. China and he said we need to know more. about the ocean for that very reason to. be to be better than them. So two two. purposes he thought we could achieve. with that. So where I am with this is. that uh now I have to that they need. government funding. They need a. government sponsor to say hey Naval. Studies Board do this for us and uh and. we'll pay you this much. And so I I now.

have to go back to the government. unfortunately either the office of naval. intelligence my former command the naval. oceanographic office that I was in. charge of and or uh or Noah and see if. they'll want to do a study. I asked Noah. and they already said, "No, we have too. many other things on our plate." Not. interested. I I don't see the DoD or. Office of Nail Intelligence doing the. same again because of the disclo. non-disclosure policy currently that. exists in the executive branch. But but.

I'm still going to still going to ask. and still going to try. Well, I can't wait to see what you come. up with. We'll see what happens. What was it that I mean, how did you get. involved in this whole UFO UAP thing? Right. Right. So this I've said this. story before, but uh I'll it's worth. going out again. First off, as I. mentioned, I I was a superintendent of. the Naval Observatory, so I understood. how big the universe was, and I was. open-minded to that there could be other. life out outside of the Earth. Uh and. then as a onear, I had actually two.

jobs. I had a Pentagon job and then I. also was an operational commander. So. there's a onestar job in Stenis Space. Center, Mississippi called the commander. of the Navy Meteorology and Oceanography. Command. And that's that's all the folks. that did what I did. So there's enlisted. airraphers that do weather forecasting. on aircraft carriers and shore stations. And there's other folks that again. advise for anti-mary warfare. And so all. these about 3,000 people, civilians and.

and uniformed do things like ocean. mapping, weather forecasting, ocean. forecasting, and and I was in charge of. them all. And so I'm I'm uh in my office. that one day. So I was splitting time. between the Pentagon and DC and this. office in Stenis. And and one day I get. this email on the Navy Secret Network. Cypernet and it's from my my boss's. operation officer. I was reporting to a. four-star admiral, US Fleet Forces.

Command. His operations officer was a. twostar and the email was sent to all. the subordinate commanders. This is at. least 20 flags and SCS's. All the. deputies are copied on it and it the. title of it is urgent safety of flight. issue. all caps. And the body of the. email said, "If any of you know what. these are, tell me ASAP. We are having. numerous near midair collisions, and if. we don't stop it, we're going to have to.

cancel the exercise." And attached to. the video was the now famous leaked go. fast video. You You know it, don't you? Yes. Yeah. Okay. So, UAP F-18 pilots captured. video of this UAP zorching over the. water. There's no flight control. surfaces or propulsion means that are. visible. It's just a little round. sphere. And uh and the pilots are all. going crazy and they other videos have. mentioned how there were multiple ones. out there. And um and I knew right then.

and there that was not ours. Uh we we. don't have technology that like that. I. was read into a lot of SAPs to the best. of my knowledge and we would never do. that in a training range especially. aircraft carrier workups are so. compressed you they have to do all these. things the pilots's got to get certified. they got to land so many times on the. carrier they got to do all these things. and and certify to go deploy so throwing. out advanced technology in a training. range during a a pre-eployment workup.

just doesn't happen. I mean people will. get fired. So, and of course we have. testing ranges to do that. That that's. of course so I knew that was NARS. I. also had been reading all the threat uh. our adversaries capabilities. I knew. nobody else had that. And uh so I knew. right there that was something not ours. Not human off-world whatever. It just. wasn't ours. And I my deputy and I were. both open-minded. He was an SCES. And I. pulled him over and we've talked about. it for a while and uh and we're just. pretty much amazed. But the next day.

that email was wiped from my computer. and my deputies and everybody else. So, uh, okay, it's gone. Wow. Yeah, I I. wanted to save that thing. It was. interesting. And, uh, come to find out, I go to, uh, I go to monthly meetings at. my boss's headquarters in Norfolk. And. we always talk about, you know, staying. up with the training cycle. And safety. issues always came up. And, and this. this was a big safety issue. The ops. officer said so. And so and and then my.

job as the chief meteorologist in the. Navy, another one of my hats was safety. of flight. And uh so we get into the. next monthly meeting and no one brings. this stuff up. No one's talking about it. about a safety issue almost cancelling. this major uh training event. And and. and then and then come to find out one. of the pilots flying during those. missions that that video was from the. USS Theodore Roosevelt's Airwing. Uh it. was Ryan Graves. uh that he's he's. pretty well known now as somebody who's.

come out and he's founded an. organization I'm on the board of called. the Americans for Safe Aerospace and. he's advocating for with draft. legislation out there to uh instill. reporting protocols and uh for pilots in. the FAA, commercial pilots and others by. the FAA uh because currently there and. pretty much the Navy if you come out and. say hey I saw these things it could be a. career killer. Yeah. And I'll just one more point about. that. So I couldn't say anything at the.

time and and by the way, so it was white. from my computer. I had been read in the. SAPS and I knew, oh, okay, this probably. was connected to a SAP that the ops. officer did not know and the. intelligence officer who one of the. intelligence officers probably found. that email and said, oh shoot, and. contacted whoever owned it, which is. probably DIA and uh and they they did. their forensics and took everything off. the system. whoever it was, I don't. know. But I I I had been read into. enough SAPs to know, oh, that probably. happened and that's why I didn't have. it, and that's why no one's talking.

about it. But it bothered me, Sean, because uh and now that I talked with. Ryan, I I realize, holy cow, lots of. these things were in the airspace. They. were interfering with operations and. they were a safety issue. How many? I don't know how many, but but. there were at one of the the gimbal. recording was another one from that. period and you can hear one of the. pilots say there's a whole fleet of them. and and I so I don't know but there. there were a lot and and the pilots were. seeing them all the time and what what.

gets me is that commanders like me once. admirals who are in charge of the. well-being responsible for the. well-being and safety of their people. and their forces they were basically. forced to turn a blind eye because of. some overclassification. issue and allow the make the pilots. mitigate the safety threat on their own. which was is feckless to me. We should. be stepping up as flags, as leaders, and. saying, "All right, you know, we we. let's address this here. Let's talk.

about it at the fourstar meeting and. make sure we don't have to cancel. exercise or see pilots fall out of the. sky uh because of interactions with. these things or avoidance uh maneuvers. that that again." So, there's uh that's. why I'm I've come out and and been an. advocate for what Ryan's doing. Nobody brought up that email. No. No. Well, and that that's the thing. is that we all knew, okay, someone just. touched a sap and they got rid of it and. we can't talk about it. Think about.

that. So, we had we could have had. planes falling out of sky, but we're not. going to talk about it because of this. overclassification. This and that that. that's what's there's a lot of unethical. aspects I think of of this whole UAP uh. system that that exists right now in the. government. Man, that's that's uh I mean that's. that's terrifying. Yeah. That that. that somebody I mean, how high up does. this go? Do you think these people. pulling the strings saying get rid of.

that, take that email out? Well, I don't know. Send out this disinformation. Yeah. Yeah. I I don't know how high it. is, but uh obviously Arrow's last. report, the All Domain Anomaly. Resolution Office in the in the Pentagon. was was so deliberately false that uh um. obviously it's and they had to approve. it. So, it's got to be pretty high at. the SEC defe and I would say certainly. the NSC level. Uh probably probably OD.

and I uh Averil Haynes I'm sure had some. decision to say nope we're not going to. talk about this and same with Jake. Sullivan the NY I'm sure because there's. so many people clamoring it for it right. now and it's getting so much media. visibility so it had to be up at that. level. I don't know about the president. but uh probably the NYSE director. man. Well, so what as a oceanographer. and all the different things that you've. done for the government, for the Navy, uh for the country, why are you focusing.

on underwater stuff? Yeah. Well, first off, we know we see. them in the water, too. Uh we The last. example that I saw was from the USS. Omaha off Southern California. a. well-known video that Jeremy Corbel, one. of the um UAP media types, has gotten. out there and uh so and there's other. examples too. Um classified examples I. can't talk about, but confirmation that. we see these things underwater and uh. and I can I can tell a story about a.

submarine officer who came out to me. too. But so we know they're in the. water. Uh and that's my thing. I've done. a whole career of ocean science and uh. and I I so it's what I know and it's. it's who my network is. So, and now I'm. on two national bodies that uh advise on. ocean research and I I'm trying to get. UAP studies into their research. priorities. One reports to the White. House and one's within the nationalmies.

That's why it's what I know and I know. they're in the water and we're never. going to have a full understanding of. what the nature of UAP unless we look in. the water too. So that's what I can. bring to bear on this whole discussion. How many encounters have we had of UAP. UFO activity in the water? So I don't know. I mean there's a couple. books out on it and most of all of them. I think really lack data. They're mostly. anecdotal with interviews of people. One. of them is by a guy named Preston. Dennit. And it's interesting because.

that he looks at the hotspot phenomena. off Southern California. And then. there's a an older book by a guy named. Carl Feint who has something called I. think it was called UFOs in the water. And he also just compiled a a wide range. of cases just interviewed people and uh. and so there's a lot there's several. hundred in those. And then Richard. Dolan, who's a pretty well-known UAP. researcher, uh he is um he's finished up. finishing up a book and I've seen the.

draft and he's got about 600 cases where. he's looked at all the books and sources. and that go back from the 1700s. Uh so, you know, I think I think there was a. Yeah, he he there's some interesting. cases in that book. Uh but but. ultimately it's a lot less than we've. seen in the atmosphere because the. ocean's not as transparent. But it's but. it's worth looking at again because that. there may be more going on than we've. just than that that amount we've we know. to ex have existed. Let's talk about the.

samariner. Yeah, this is a good story. So as I've. come out, if you will, I've been. speaking out and I I uh I am what I am. I have the scientific background as an. authority on these topics of ocean. science and exploration. Uh people have. looked to me and said, "I bet if I tell. him he's he seems like a straight. shooter, a credible guy, I guess, I. guess." And so some Mariner came to me. and um virtually we had and he just. said, "Hey, I was on a sub in the 80s. I.

could talk to you about what I saw.". Okay. Yeah, let's have a call. I got on. a call with him. He's he was a nuclear. submarine officer now. uh now he's an. engineer uh and uh I think for an energy. company and this guy is like most. nuclear submariners I know he is just. the facts he is by the book uh very much. that way in his personality and the. story he shared me was this he's in the. North Atlantic in the 80s coal war is.

hot uh and um their sub is operating uh. uh I I wouldn't say super deep But it. was very high sea state because of a. storm, 40ft waves. So they were below. that. But even there, they were kind of. rocking. Subs can feel that uh wave. action. And uh and so because it was so. rough, it creates a lot of ambient noise. and and in those conditions, it is. really hard to passively detect uh.

another submarine. So they felt pretty. secure. or they weren't going to be, you. know, detected by a Russian sub and and. they probably weren't going to hear one. either. And uh so there he's on the. watch and all of a sudden. they get a passive hit, a contact that's. moving, you know, off the starboard some. at some range. I don't know the range, but um and then then it then it paused. and then started closing on them. rapidly. And they call that constant. bearing decreasing range. And uh you.

don't want that when you're a ship. driver or a subd driver. I I drove. ships, aircraft carriers. I was a deck. watch officer. You know, that's that's. going to be a collision. And they had uh. that was every feature that a Russian. torpedo would have in terms of the. constant bearing decrease decreasing. range at a very rapid rate. And they. were so convinced he called the captain. the bridge. They set general quarters. and they dived. And it kept on coming. and it kept on coming and they were. hoping to get below some acoustic lens.

or whatever that wouldn't be able to. find them and lose track and it just. kept coming and so they went as deep as. crush depth just above it. Crush depth. is that depth that submarine will uh. implode and and that's a dangerous place. to be on an older sub like this. But. they they were convinced this was a. Russian sub coming at them and then at. some range close. I don't know what it. paused and then slowly took station in.

their on their stern behind them and. trailed them for a while. So they're. getting this passive acoustic hit of. something doing this and then after. minutes maybe it just rapidly departed. the scene and they're they're uh and. they they couldn't there was no. explanation. The Russians didn't have. technology like that. We didn't have. technology like that and uh again to. this day he doesn't know. I want to get. that data. The data is collected and.

archived at John's Hopkins University. and I'm in the process of u reinstating. my clearance and uh I I want to look. into that. Wow. Yeah. Are there a lot of examples like this? So, I don't know, but I have talked to. one other submariner, nuclear submarine. officer, who says that he's not seen. that before, but when you go around the. Navy and talk to other uh sonar techs, they say they do see these quite often.

Really? Yeah. And this guy is very credible. He's actually a reservist and he's his. day job is he works in the Pentagon. All all civilian attracted to nuclear. subs. I don't know. But that this is an. interesting thing and I wrote a paper. about this called beneath the surface. We may learn more about UAP if we look. in the ocean. It's on the soul. foundation's web website. And um I write. about that because we know uh and. there's a book on this that UAPs seem to.

be attracted uh or active around nuclear. sites. Is it is it because that that. submarine had a nuclear reactor and had. nuclear armed missiles or and and what. about the Nimtts and the the Roosevelt. aircraft carriers is because they're. nuclear powered maybe is that attracting. them? I don't know, but it's a very. interesting correlation. What are some of the things that you're. finding under the ocean personally? Oh, well, so this is neat. Uh the.

ocean's so interesting to me still. And. so when I, for example, when I was with. the National Oceanic and Atmospheric. Administration, we've pronounced it. Noah, uh that uh we had a program uh. called the Ocean Exploration and. Research Program with a dedicated ship. and it had a deep diving ROV, remotely. operated vehicle with high high. resolution cameras and other. instruments. And we purposely go look. for things. And every year we found new. species, whether it be deep coral or uh.

new types of fish. And and and get this, this is how much we don't know about the. ocean. In 2020, I think it was, we had a. fisheries biologist go down to. Antarctica and discover a new species of. killer whale that had never been seen. So, this isn't like just some small. weird uh micro. It's there's all sorts. of things we've never seen before. A new species of killer whales. Yeah. Yep. When did Man. Yeah. Have you been to Antarctica? I've not I've been to the Arctic. I've.

been in the Arctic on a sub. So, I've. surfaced. I've I've I've been up there. on the ice camp that they have up there. What's What's up there? The Arctic? Yeah. Well, okay. I was there uh because the. US Navy every two years hosts conducts. an exercise called ice X and it's to. basically train study some of the. dynamics of ice and as well as the. tactics of operating under the ice uh. which we need to refine when you look at. what Russia is doing and um and so but.

there's a lot of things to discover too. again on the seabed new geological. features there are again all sorts of. sea life under the ice too Um, and uh, yeah, I I mean there's we could talk. about a million things about what's in. the ocean. Let's go. Well, shoot. Let's do it. Here's what I here's something I I was. pretty proud of. So, because we don't. know so much about the ocean and uh, here I was in the Trump administration. and I'm with an environmental science.

agency. So, it was kind of a tricky. place to be. Uh, he was not keen on. major funding to uh, science agencies. We had he the White House proposed a lot. of cuts to our budget. Congress always. put the money back in, but we were. looking for good ways to show leadership. and advance the ocean that would appeal. to to his administration. And so, um, one of the things I led was a national. strategy to map and explore the ocean or. the US ocean, which is our exclusive.

economic zone. And the White House. approved it and we put together a plan, a team, and uh, and it uh, it's still. being executed. uh and and so we didn't. even know only about 40% of the seafloor. in the US had been mapped and now we're. getting near 50 and and that why that. matters is first of all submarine. navigation or navigation period ships um. submarines too we had two submarines uh. one was the USS San Francisco in the.

early 2000s and then later the USS. Connecticut in the early 2020s both. collide tied with undersea mountains, seam mounts, sustained major damage, hundreds of millions of dollars. In the. San Francisco case, one sailor was. killed because just 35 knots, boom, he. sustained a head injury. And that's how. much we don't know about the ocean and. why we need to do it. And I I even wrote. an article about the fact that China is. mapping and exploring the ocean heavily.

in the Western Pacific. And if if they. know the ocean better than us, we're. going to have a hard time with them. You. know, think about this. Um, high ground. in uh ground warfare provides a tactical. advantage, right? And uh and and the the. ocean has a high ground too. If you know. the acoustic properties and the seabed. well, then you can use that to your. advantage in not being predicting the. acoustic and optical path of sensors and.

and avoid counter detection and then and. maximize your ability to detect the. adversary. So you need to know the ocean. just like you need to know terrain uh in. your old line of work. And so um and that that's it. So getting. a better feel for what we know, it. matters for national security and it. matters for a lot of cool science. We. have uh some of the the best managed. fisheries in the world in the US, especially in Alaska. And and we need to. understand the nature of the fish, where. they are, they're moving into certain. places. We need to understand what the.

their habitat is like so we know where. where they'll be, and we don't over fish. them. There's all sorts of reasons to. map and explore the ocean. And then. those are just a few. Yeah. Yeah. What are what are some of. the things you've encountered? So, there's some other interesting ocean. things I've seen and done. And uh and a. lot of this is credit I give credit to. my wife Karen who uh was a Navy diver. doing salvage. She was a diving officer. She's recovered aircraft from the floor. of the Mediterranean, the seafloor and.

uh done some hard stuff. So, I she's my. inspiration and uh and she's the reason. actually I even speak up about UAP. I I. had no idea. I had no intention of doing. it and she just said,"Tim, you know, you've done some things. You have a. voice. Why don't you do it? Why don't. you go contact Avi?" And and so I I give. her that credit. But also, because she's. a was a former Navy diver, and we met. getting our our graduate degrees in. oceanography at Scripps, that's just. what we do now as a family. We do ocean.

stuff. And so I I uh I joined her. We we. did a um a week-long cage diving. expedition off Guadalupe Island. Great. white sharks. Oh man. Oh, how was that? It. was amazing. And uh so this is. amazing. Yeah. Well, no, it was there's so much. to say about it, but the neat thing that. I was proud of is it wasn't just some. adventure tourism deal. I actually uh. found the people who do it through my. old agency, Noah. Uh one of the women.

who worked at our fishery science center. in San Diego. She had a nonprofit job. doing uh marine scientific research uh. investigating specifically great white. sharks. And this was part of a 20-year. time series where the scientists had. been photo identifying individuals in. the population uh by the markings on. their on their on the side of their body. where because they're kind of dark on. the top, blue, and then they're light. white on the bottom. And it's like a. zebra. They have a it's it's unique to.

each individual the pattern. uh and so. they had been photo IDing all the. individuals and it's a really important. scientific uh endeavor because the apex. predators in a population if you can. understand their health certain at an. individual level you'll have a very good. indicator of what the entire ecosystem. is doing and so uh so we went down there. we took our GoPro data and they they. downloaded and used our data but it was. also just extraordinary these animals. are as big as buses they of course. they're like weapons with their teeth.

and uh and they're they were. interesting. I remember we had a day. travel from Ensanada and we did three. days of diving and a day travel back. And I remember thinking on the way out, ah, you know, we're going to have three. days in the water. I'm probably going to. get bored after the first day. I'm going. to see the same stuff all the time, no. way. Now, now I know cuz these animals. are coming right up to you and they're. just doing what they do in the wild and. they're they're majestic and beautiful. But now I know why bungee jumpers do.

what they do because I just wanted to. get in the water like constantly and see. those things. They're never. disappointing, man. Yeah, that was a good show. Was that just was that pure pleasure or. were you down there. to study? I I was there again for that that. nonprofit to help with their scientific. study of the animals. Yeah. So that was I had to pay for it, but it. was a contribution to that science. institute. Cool. Um, Marine Conservation Science. International is what they're called. MCSI. Interestingly, and I didn't know.

this back then. I wish I did, but that's. the Guadalupe Island off Baja California. is a hot spot for UAP. All the fishermen around there, they see. them all the time. Yeah. You Google that. and it'll be all you get tons of hits. When I first started this whole. podcasting thing, an online store was. about as far from my mind as you can. get. And now most of you already know. this, but I'm selling Vigilance Elite. gummy bears online. We actually have an.

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off Florida. We've been scuba diving. with Caribbean reef sharks off in the. Bahamas. Um and then just recently. Gopagos Island and Hammerheads. Very cool. Which is great. Yeah. So this is a And. our next trip is to Fiji and the. Republic of Palao to do some diving. And. we were in Palo last and saw some really. magnificent blacktip reef sharks up. close and personal. So that's uh that's. what we do for fun. What are some of the things you've. encountered as an oceanographer that you.

you know? So here you go. When I was. Keep you up at night. Oh, keep me up at night. Uh the nature of the ocean doesn't keep. me up at night. It's it's uh um it's our. adversaries who want to exploit the. ocean uh to our uh to to harm us or our. allies. For example, uh Chinese illegal. fishing is destroying economies all. around the world, especially in Pacific. Island countries. Um, I wouldn't say it.

keeps me up at night, but uh, it is a. big issue that even our DoD, the Navy is. is working to combat with the Coast. Guard. There's a funny thing about that. question, Sean. Uh, so I served in in. the same administration as Secretary. Mattis when he was the Secretary of. Defense. Great guy. Uh, that was one of. the questions he answered early on as. his in his tenure as SEC defe. Someone. said, "What keeps you up at night?" and. he said,

"Nothing keeps me up at night. I keep. other people up at night.". Right on. He's great. He's He's the best. Uh yeah, I I I uh I got to serve with some fine. people in the in the Trump. administration. Uh Secretary Mattis was. one. General John Kelly, the first chief. of staff, or no, he was Homeland. Security chief initially. Great person. there. I had a he was a mentor for a a. month-long course I took at the National. Defense University. Great person and.

there are others too. Well, what are you finding what are you. finding under there UAP wise? UAP- wise in the ocean. Yeah. So again, I only know of the examples. I've just shared and then there's some. classified examples I can't talk about. that but I know of. Um and basically. like you see in the in the atmosphere. you see large craft different shapes um. you see I mean the reports have been uh.

different lighting configurations. sometimes and um and so yes that it's it. seems to be to the variety of the nature. it seems to be as diverse as it is up in. the atmosphere. Um, yeah, I mean that. that's that's what seems to come. through. And again, if you if we if. we've seen so much through the published. literature and then the documented. accounts recently, then you there may be. that just may be the tip of the iceberg.

What do you think these are? Yeah. Right. Are they man-made? I don't know. No. Well, first off, no. I. I don't think I don't know. Uh, that's. why we need to study it. these. organizations I'm with uh supporting. their research. But uh as this topic. gets explored more and more and I I. engage with people that are um that have. been read in or have somehow touched the. programs. Uh we have a very active.

discussion going on daily about about. this very question. What are they? And I. mean there's some possibilities. They. could be from an extraterrestrial. source. Uh again, it's we don't know the. physics on how that could be. Some. people have uh speculated an. interdimensional. origin, which I don't understand either, but again, since we really don't know. all there is about physics, possibly. there's something there. And then uh and. then there's a really interesting theory. I I by and I'll encourage your listeners.

to check it out. There's an article in. the debrief from early this year, 2024, by a guy named Bernardo Castro, and he. it's a it's a really well-written essay. where he speculates that well, all. right, it what's the most likely source? Well, if uh in intergalactic travel is. not possible, then it could be that. these things originated before we. evolved, before before life as we know.

it evolved. So, uh they think there's a. period around 750 million years ago. where due to this the recycling of the. continents, if you will, that there's no. fossil evidence for. And so there's a. period a billion years ago or more that. we just don't have any fossil evidence. of. And and he he he conjectures that. possibly a an advanced technology. civilization evolved. And that's not a. stretch when you think we're an advanced.

technology civilization. I think kind of. and we've evolved. We're here now. So if. you know we can do that uh then go back. even a billion years and perhaps that. could have happened. And when they saw. things getting dicey because there's so. many cataclysms that have happened. You. look at the dinosaurs and the asteroid. that wiped off a large portion of the. earth. There have been other extinction. events. Uh and then and then less. cataclysmic but even severe like the.

like about 12,000 years ago this this. climatic period called the younger. dryest where uh the the earth's. temperature dropped a lot. And you could. see evidence of that in in um in geology. and and the um and so that that was an. event where a large part of the earth's. life uh was ex exterminated. So what. what's h that's a the earth's pretty. hostile. You look at the volcanoes in. Iceland. You look at asteroid impacts of. the past and maybe this advanced.

technology civilization said, you know, we're out of here. we're going to go. create a habitat down deep or maybe on. Mars or in the moon and just uh get get. somewhere more stable and maybe they've. just been able to live and we've not. found evidence of it yet or that these. things are evidence of that. So, so there's so there's it sounds like. there's three discussions going on. within the. um professionals we'll call them. And uh. so one of them is ancient technology/.

civilization, next interdimensional, and the next. extraterrestrial. Yeah, that's how I see it. The. possibilities. Maybe there are more. I. haven't thought of them. So let's let's I'd like to dissect kind. of each one of those, you know, with the. with the ancient civilization stuff. I. mean what. what does that at the end of this I want. to ask where you're leaning towards but. I mean what is that if there if there's.

a civilization. in the earth in the ocean. towards the earth's you know the center. I mean what is what what does that even. look like. well what do you think. right no we we've mapped the surface of. the seabed again not very incompletely. So we don't even know there there are. parts of the is is there underwater. structures uh we don't really know and.

and or or deep below the geology as we. know it again we don't know. So that but. but it's not a stretch to think it's. possible based on the the length this. planet's been in existence. Uh and I. what's unfortunate about this whole. discussion we talked about a little. earlier is uh it's so stigmatized that. few people want to be open-minded and. talk like we are right now of of. entertaining the possibility of an. advanced technology civilization from.

either of those three origins. It it's. it's just not taken seriously. And uh. and I think thank you for having me on. because it is about time we do it. because we do see evidence of them all. the time in the ocean and of course in. the atmosphere. and you know of a Canadian USO. encounter. Oh yeah. This is one of the earlier. ones. It's in the 60s I think early 60s. and there's a great book about it called. Sweep Clear Five and it refers to the.

name of this mine warfare exercise. The. subtitle is NATO's underwater UFO. encounter. And uh it's a very. interesting book because it's written by. uh a researcher who interviewed these. Canadian divers. Now what happened uh is. first off is there was a major UFO event. in Canada, a place called Shag Harbor, Nova Scotia in um gosh the late I think. the late60s. I don't remember the date.

And there's that's all over the web. But. before that, there was another encounter. where UFOs were seen to go into the. water and they uh it happened at I think. it coincided with a NATO exercise and. the ships all got vectorred to go look. for these things. and Canadian divers. were interviewed and claimed to have. seen these two underwater discs and. actual occupants outside the craft.

trying to repair it. So, aliens and uh. and they even they even said they. captured video, but they don't know. where the tapes are. Uh anyways, there's. this book, Sweep Clear Five, is all. about it. It's about the investigation. into that. And uh and that's that's the. first well doumented USO case that I. know about. Wow. Was there any description on what. the what the beings. there there was and I think they were. humanoid. I don't remember the details.

they they weren't human for sure, but. they were humanike. Did they have equipment on? I don't know. It didn't it it it didn't. seem like they did, but but maybe it was. so. uh technical that it didn't appear to be. like equipment. I don't know, man. So, I mean, what do you think if if. if we're on this this we're on this uh. we're going through three discussions. and if it was an advanced civilization.

that's living under the surface of the. earth, whether it's in the ocean or or. somewhere else. I mean, how long I mean, well, here's so many questions. I know. I I I don't know. Uh but I I do. know this and this is why I like the. Galileo project because Avi Lobe. articulates this so well. He he and. modern society doesn't appreciate how. new to the scene we are in terms of uh.

everything our our behavior uh and how. we treat each other and technology and. and so you have to think it's just so. possible that either in this large. universe or in a in a part of the. universe we've not we don't even know. about. Like I said, another dimension uh. that that some advance or several and. actually that's the thing uh Sean is. that uh from what I gather of all these. eyewitness accounts that are out there.

and and knowledge from credible sources. that were in um that know people in. these programs, the the UAP programs, crash retrieval programs, that there are. different types and and I mean in fact. what's very interesting. Just today again I mentioned Chris. Melon. He was a former assist Dazzy. deputy assistant secretary of defense. for intelligence. So he was up there and. he knows what he's talking about and. he's been in this field for some time. He uh he on his Substaff.

page account, whatever you call it. Today, April 23rd, he published an. article and he had a screenshot of a. signal discussion with someone who had. known people in that crash retrieval. program and he said that he was very. credible, didn't want to let his name. out. Uh, but he the person acknowledged. that uh that there was an active crash.

retrieval program and that there was an. Air Force gatekeeper at the SCS level. for it. And um and so there was this. discussion that he published today and. uh and he and he he wrote a nice article. about it basically. And what's so good. about Chris, he doesn't say what he. doesn't know. He he says what he knows. He doesn't speculate and so and he. doesn't reveal sources that don't want. to be revealed. And so he said here's. the discussion we had. Uh this person. was senior in the government and I'm not. going to reveal his name but u he said.

he was aware of these programs. wasn't. read into him but was aware and knew. people who were and so he just putting. that out there again doing it because uh. there's such an active disinformation. campaign that uh that office arrow is a. part of to discredit anybody who brings. forth this information and again that. the highest level the NSC obviously the. ODNI they don't want this information. out now it's it's worth talking about.

that for a little bit um why am I coming. out now with the government is is doing. the best thing and doesn't want the. information out and I so I think they're. wrong on on this case and so do my. colleagues like Chris and Lou Alzando uh. that that at some level we should yes. not let advanced technology come out to. the public because we don't want our. adversaries getting the upper hand of. course not but but the knowledge that. we're being visited and can't secure our. own water space and and airspace and and.

that and that this could be something. more of a global security nature and it. demands thoughtful public policy and and. the public should have a part of that. that fact that we're being visited and. it's something that every nation is. dealing with that that's something I. think is just does not benefit us by. trying to cover up and and in my. personal opinion the Arrow report was. was so uh inartful and flawed and full.

of errors that it makes me wonder are. are we are we that clumsy and. inefficient and ineffective in other. counter intelligence endeavors. I sure. hope not. I hope we're not failing that. badly when we're trying to perform the. same kind of activity regarding Chinese. and Russian intelligence services. How. many I mean are all the are are there a. lot of countries that are digging into. this or are we are we.

there are and uh now I don't know of all. of them but I've had for example I was. just contacted by an Italian researcher. who has like me decided to focus on the. underwater UAP and he's been doing it. for 20 years perhaps and uh and was a a. colleague of this guy Carl Fe uh who. wrote that original book UFOs and the. And so, uh, there's that. Uh, this this. Soul Foundation group has just brought. on a a European on their board. Uh, his.

name is Jonathan Berta. And he's neat. because he's a technology guy. He's an. indust he's he's got his own company. And here's here's how his company got. started. Um, I think they do aerial. drones. And uh I think it was in France. that they were seeing all these UAPs. around their nuclear sites and they. contracted his company to fly drones to. observe them. That's and that's how he. he kind of launched his company and is.

and he's doing quite well. But he's one. of these open-minded people. And so he. brings in an international perspective. to the Soul Foundation in addition to. Peter Scfish who's the other lead and. he's got a humanities background. I. think it's a um socioultural. anthropology and then you have Gary. Nolan who's got a material science and. and biomemed expertise and he brings. that hard science to the soul. foundation. Interesting. Interesting. Back to let's get back to the underwater.

stuff. I just I want to know every I. want to. What else are you seeing? I mean with. with with your current research, what. are you currently working on under. there? Well, I'm not an active. investigator. I I don't have a ship. I. don't have the money to fund an. expedition. Now, there's a couple things. that that I have been involved with. For. example, the Galileo project. Um, and. this isn't too out there, but it's part. of the whole phenomena, if you will, uh,

and field that that is worth pursuing. So, Galileo is look is looking to. discover. u remnants of ancient civilizations, extraterrestrial uh technology. civilizations and or or active ones that. are that are in this in in our world. observing us. So, he's setting up this. strictly outside of Earth. Uh well, kind of. So, he's got. telescopes that are looking at the. near-Earth atmosphere. Okay. And so where wherever they come. from, so it doesn't matter where their.

origin, he just wants to get. scientifically study them better. But. here's something cool. So um he studied. uh the very first known interstellar. object to impact the planet. So it was. in a a catalog of I think asteroids or. objects like that that I forgot who. maintained it, but basically he got some. data, looked at it. It had been. gathered. I think it was collected on on. what appeared to be a meteorite impact.

the earth over papa the ocean off Papa. New Guinea the Bismar sea and uh so he. had data on this and when he looked hard. at the data he realized that this thing. impact its impact was not like others uh. we we know from space force data that. it's got an uh extragalactical no pardon. me an it's outside the stool solar. system it's an interstellar origin just. based on the uh on its trajectory. So if. you're an astronomer and an. astrophysicist, you can do the math and.

determine that based on how how a. meteorite comes in. So we we know this. thing is interstellar in origin one. And. then he looked at how it impacted and uh. and you can again do the math through. the energetics and everything that it. had a a much harder material strength. So it it it disintegrated a lot later. than others at it based on its speed and. all these things. So it was made of. something harder, not the normal iron. type of composite or whatever that the.

normal normal meteorites are made of. So. it impacted from outside the solar. system and it burned up a lot slower. It. was made of something super hard. So. what he did is he launched an. expedition, got it funded and he went. and recovered fragments of that. meteorite. They hit the ocean and then. settled into the sea. And uh what. happens when a mera does that? It burns. up and it it creates these uh sort of. little drop metallic droplets that just. sort of fall into the sky. Heavier ones.

fall first and the other ones sort of. just push along the trajectory and fall. later. And so he went and mapped it all. out. I gave him ocean data and. atmospheric data so he could do a. profile and figure out how far the stuff. drifted in the air and then drifted in. the water based on currents. and he. found him. Uh, interestingly, I was able. to connect him with a group who' done. that before to go search for meteorite. fragments in the ocean. Uh we had done. this in uh Noah had done this with NASA.

in a thing called the National Marine. Sanctuary off the Olympic coast and uh. and and we we basically built a magnetic. sled with some magnets on it and towed. along the water to pick up all the. metallic. particles and and then had to take. basically fine brush and get them all. off, separate them from the mud and then. study them. So Avi did that with his. team and I didn't go out with him and um. but he was able to find material that. was not of earthly origin. So his next.

expedition which he hopes to uh lead in. April 2025 he found the fine stuff. He. thinks why you know it could be it could. be technology right and so maybe some of. the bigger things that didn't burn up. are are out there too. So he wouldn't. know it because he had a a sled that was. designed only for fine particles. But. his next expedition, he's going to take. an ROV with a camera and he's going to. go along the seafloor and look for.

stuff. And he kind of jokes in a lot of. his writings that maybe it'll actually. have a keyboard on it and maybe there's. going to be a button to push. And he he. always asks people, "If you found. something from an extraterrestrial. visitor and a a gadget, like giving a. caveman an iPhone, would you push a. button on it?" And some people say, "No, I wouldn't push the button. No way." And. he he he says, "I'm going to push the. button." Wow. Wow. I can't wait to hear. what uh that develops into. Yeah. So, the the back to the three things.

we're talking about, ancient. civilizations you had mentioned, under. the ocean, and perhaps in the moon. Well, again, this is just speculating of the what is. possible and and that's what Bernardo's. article was titled something about what. is the most likely scenario here on the. origins of UAP and you know those are. those are those are three it could have. they could have originated either from. our solar system or I mean again.

we think other planets are inhabitable. but that's for life as we know it. Uh. certainly there could be other life. forms and I told you about these extreme. they call them extreaphiles organisms on. these hydrothermal vents in the ocean. super deep high pressure and and they're. weird and they're alien looking and. they've evolved to withstand uh the the. pressure and the temperature very high. temperature 100s degrees and uh and. toxic environments. So who's to say that.

life hasn't evolved? I mean, not our. form of life, but somewhere else, either. on a planet here in our solar system or. or elsewhere. Well, what is the what are the theories. with the moon? Well, I don't really there's. there's some chatter out there about. potentially bases on the moon, like. potentially undersea alien bases. I I. have no data on any of that, so I I. don't know. Um I'd love to I'd love to. talk to astronauts who who've been there. or uh but I don't know. But but it's.

worth looking into. I know we're going. to go back to the moon with Artemis. I. would like to see NASA be more. transparent with what maybe it's found. An example here. So when Congress. directed the DoD to start looking at. UAP, they established the arrow. they. NASA, and this is interesting to me, uh, with Bill Nelson, former senator, now. the administrator, uh, they decide to. establish a UAP study team. And, uh,

what they were doing obviously is. Congress was interested and they were. NASA. If Congress is interested in UFOs. and NASA's not doing anything, and this. is how you think when you're in charge. of an agency, you better start doing. something or else they're going to tell. you how to do it. And so, Bill Nelson. decided to stand up a study team and. when they had a press release of their. study and it was it was there was. nothing there there. They talked about.

UAP that need and that that they need to. be studied but they didn't share one uh. one bit of data or one example. All they. did was talk about it. It was it was. embarrassing in my opinion but um but. that that's kind of what's happening now. is the government's trying or the. government is. coming out and saying things but they're. really not being forthright. Now one more thing uh but there is some. sign of interesting activity. Believe it. or not I was just contacted by the.

National Science Foundation and they are. going to host a UAP communications. workshop. No kidding. And they're. inviting really credible people. They. invited me. They invited not that I'm. super credible but I I'm trying. and. other people like uh and I actually. connected them to the these professors. in in religious studies and the. humanities that I know. Diana Pulka, have you heard her? Oh, you you should try to interview her.

She is fantastic. She is a religious. studies professor at NC State and she's. written two books, American Cosmic and. Encounters. You have to read those, Sean. Okay. there. But and what she does like a lot. of researchers, she just interviews. people, but she's found people who have. touched the pro these crash retrieval. programs and they they they wish to re. remain anonymous, but so she gives them.

pseudo names and uh but that that's. that's really enlightening. And so she's. found a NASA engineer who is been a part. of these programs and uh goes through. everything. In fact, the second book, they go to an area of the New Mexico. desert and where crash retrievalss have. happened and they they find materials. and and she goes with uh the one of the. directors of the Soul Foundation, Gary. Nolan. She gave him a pseudo name in his.

book, but he's now come out and. acknowledge that he's that person and. and again, he wants to advance the. scientific study of UAP. He's one of. those people who have studied crash. materials. He's looked at the material. science. He's published a paper on it. And in fact, if you go to the Soul. Foundation website, all of our talks are. online on on YouTube. And he gives a. talk about that paper. And he studied. these materials and basically that he's. proved they're not natural. They all had. to be made with some kind of industrial.

process. And they're not they're not. native of this earth. They they were. they include components that have not. been seen before. Isotope ratios. that. have never been seen before. So that's. that's very interesting. What kind of stuff has he recovered? Is. it is it. the stuff I've seen in his lab are just. sort of metallic fragments. Now of. course out there and what Dave Grush in. the hearing that I was attended uh last. year he of course has claimed that.

there's I think more than just fragments. but uh but I don't know. human bi or nonhuman biologics. That's right. That's right. What does. that even mean? It's. alien. Is that like a skin sample? No, I don't know. Ah, I I don't know. Do you think Grush is. You think that's legit? He's totally legit. Absolutely, 100%. Uh. cuz I know people I don't know him. I've. not met him, but I I know people who do. know him well and work with him and and. I I I kind of know his pedigree. I I.

also worked uh in the Navy as an. oceanographer. I was actually part of a. larger information warfare community. So. I work closely with the office of naval. intelligence and the national geospatial. intelligence agency where he was in fact. I know the last five directors. personally and and have so that I he is. what he says he is 100%. And so yeah I I. I'm sure of everything he's also know. how the government works. So, like for. example, he talks about these SAPs that.

he couldn't get access to, but he knew. people who were and they were telling. him about it, these special access. programs. And um and I've had that. happen to me, too, where uh and this is. like the Wilson memo. Do you know about. that? No, I don't. Okay. I never thought I'd be so. wellversed in UAP lore uh to stump. someone like you. But here we go. Um, the Wilson memo is something I forgot. how it was leaked, but a physicist named.

Eric Davis who was supposedly in the. program, the UAP retrieval program. I I. don't know for sure, but uh he drafted a. memo that got leaked and it was a memo. recording his interview with Admiral. Wilson who had a a top intel job and he. was complaining that he heard about a. UAP retrieval program in this memo and. this is the interview that he. transcribed Dave Davis transcribed and.

he was complaining that he couldn't get. access to it because he didn't have a. need to know and I when I read that it. reminded me of me because here I was a. one star. I I had uh my my people were. working with technology under a certain. SAP and I wanted to learn about that. more so I could better make better. decisions for my people. And I had the. SAP control officer say, "No, no, no, sir. You don't have a need to know." And. I I thought that was BS. Here I am. I'm. I'm responsible for their well-being. I.

got to make sure they have all they. need. if they're using something, this. is totally in my right to uh because I. am responsible for their outcomes and. their well-being to to know what they're. working with. Oh, no. What if what if it. was hazardous to their health? Nope. Nope. You don't need to know, sir. So, that's that's what Brush was talking. about that these people running the. crash retrieval program are they're. leaving Congress in the dark and they're. not letting others with authority and. responsibility know either. And and that.

that gets down to being illegal. I mean, it sounds like a rogue entity. Totally. I mean, who would be running. that? Exa Exactly. That that's not how our. government's supposed to work. It's not. according to the Constitution as I know. it. Is it government? Well, I don't know. I don't know. But. again, the most recent uh uh article. from Chris Melon today, I I believe. there is some Air Force oversight. I've. also heard that there are contractors.

involved, big defense contractors, who. of course have an interest in not. letting that technology get out because. they don't want to have to compete to. use it. They want to have that exclusive. right. So I there's I believe that's. going on. I don't know for sure. Let's go into the interdimensional. stuff. What do you know about that? So I don't know anything. You don't know anything? I I really don't. I mean, this is all. this is all people uh theorizing. Uh I I.

I know there's a lot of math out there. that uh that. uh can characterize. multiple dimensions. String theory is. one of them. And it's funny because Avi. Lo just thinks string theorists are. worthless because he just doesn't he. doesn't think there's no evidence. He. he's about okay, show me the data. If. there are other dimensions, I want to. see the data. And and that's kind of. like Grush. Grush has he said he's not. no one's seen the alien bodies yet or uh.

but um now I have another story if you. want to get into that. Uh there's a. wellknown uh UAP legend out there on um. uh Nixon and Jackie Gleason. Do you know. about that? I don't. Here I am again. I never thought I'd be. such a wealth of UAP uh stories. Okay, so uh. Jackie Gleason was friends with Nixon.

and he was kind of a UFO nut for some. reason. And uh this has just come out, you can Google it, that there's some. legend that uh before Nixon left office. uh he went with Gleon to an Air Force. base in the south uh and he showed him. what was supposed to be a a UFO with. aliens uh like in some warehouse. Aliens. perished in some kind of crash. Now uh. this is the legend, right? Okay. Interestingly, I'm fishing in Key West.

last year and my guide was pretty. interested in this topic and he. connected me to another fisherman who I. had a nice call with and he's he's been. interviewed on this publicly. His name. is uh Mark Croa. And Mark sees has been. seeing UAP in the skies off the keys for. over 10 years. And uh like big lighted. cylindrical type objects that are. clearly not US aircraft. And he's.

actually seen jets from I believe uh one. the the Florida Air Force base down. there sort after these things or. scramble. Uh, so Mark and I talked about. it. He's seen these often. And he shared. with me about this Jackie Gleason thing. because he said when he was a kid, he. worked as a an assistant or janitor. janitor in this clubhouse in Florida. that uh Jackie Gleason used to golf at.

and his wife. and he met his wife after. I think he passed and um and she shared. that story and stated it was 100% legit. that Gleason saw what he saw. It. disturbed him a lot. He didn't eat for a. week. He was so up just upset with his. whole world view had been changed. And. uh but this is this is again hearsay. from a friend. But a fishermen are. really good observers by the way. They. and this guy didn't have any reason to.

uh um like give me a a story. He doesn't. make his money off this. He's So, but. Mark has that knowledge of of that whole. story. Interesting. What do you I mean, there's a lot of. speculation on whether these are. built by, you know, the. military-industrial complex type. companies or are they from foreign. governments? Are they paranormal. activity? I mean, what are your thoughts.

on on all of that? Well, one of the experts on this field. is Jock Valet. He's been researching UAP. for since the 60s. He he's uh he's just. the expert and he's I like his thinking. So, I I don't know. I'm not sure. I'm. still new to this whole field, but I. like his thinking on it. And he gives a. really good talk at the Soul Foundation. uh symposium. He gave one in his own.

line and and he just characterized the. fact that that uh they are real. People. have real experiences and and Diana Poka. does the same thing in her book. encounters. She just chronicles all. these experiences and people are having. a lot of people are having really. strange experiences. They are many craft. there's a paranormal component to it. with either telepathic communication or. other things. And I I mean I don't I. don't dismiss any of it. This is what. Jock says. He says all that can be said.

is there is just a a a massive diversity. in the types of experiences people have. You have a a one camp that call it all. they're just focused on the nuts and. bolts craft and then you have people. that uh are looking at that more. paranormal aspect of it and and that. that's what exists. It's sort of like a. spectrum of experiences and I I don't. dismiss any of it. I to me it's people. are having experiences. They report it.

They're credible people and it and. there's a lot of them. and we thus my goal is to scientifically. study it more and remove the stigma from. it. How are you going to remove the stigma? Shows like yours. This one right here. Getting it out there. And and here's the. here's the reason that I'm I'm out. talking about this. Uh one is more. credible people stepping up will help. remove that stigma and and then and then.

also what's interesting is uh over time. it's going to you'll see a generational. shift in that there are a lot more young. people open to this right now. It's just. they think about it and and they have. more open minds. Interestingly, there's. a parallel here that I've talked about. in some some of my speeches. The Diana. Puka talks in her book or she interviews. a person named Ia Whitley and she's also. one of these researchers that's helping. with the soul foundation effort to study.

UAP and the phenomena and her expertise. is psychology and she has uh made her. living if you will or uh by studying uh. both cockpit psychology if you will and. human factors as well as space capsule. human factors. And so she's advised the. ESA, I believe, and um and and she. noticed that in the 50s, let's say after. World War II, there was a big stigma for.

pilots to report safety issues in the. cockpit because they would fear that if. they couldn't handle something, they. might get a low rating and uh get a poor. performance evaluation. And and and. that, you know, it was the macho thing, the right stuff. No one's going to admit. that they couldn't handle a certain. thing. And uh it was only after a lot of. planes fell out of the sky and pilots. died that that safety measures started. to be studied and uh and and reporting.

for incidents in the cockpit about. safety issues became accepted and and. she she studied this over time and it. took 25 years for that change to occur. which is a professional generation and I. think that's what's happening now. Congress has gotten out. Uh, a lot of. credible scientists have gotten out. People like me, former national. authorities. We're coming out to remove. that stigma to make this a credible. scientific endeavor. Uh, I'm even.

working with a a group to establish a. master's degree program in UAP studies. Uh, so that that's happening. Uh, and. then so so that that I think that's. what's going to remove the stigma and. it's already occurring. What's that going to entail? the. master's degree on UAP studies. Yeah. Well, really, I'd love to see a. physics-based or engineering based one, but that information is not out there. yet in terms of crash retrieval. This. one's going to be a humanities based one.

that looks at uh some of the cultural. and anthropological and societal issues. around UAP, which there are many. I. mean, if we're being visited by other. civilizations with huge technology. powers, uh, what does that mean for. society. and everything else that could be. possible with that? I mean, what do do. you think there's different kinds? Do you think that there is a possibility. that some of these are kind of nuts and.

bolts types crafts and some are. maybe maybe something to do with. consciousness? Maybe something to do. with with. some type of spirituality type stuff. I. mean, what are what are you thinking? I think the answer is yes. Both to both. I do. I do. Think about this. Uh so again, evolution, if we technology-wise.

walk our species forward a thousand, a. million years, my gosh, I mean, what. what will we have? I told you earlier, I. was the last Naval Academy class not to. have a computer. I wrote papers on an. actual typewriter. Now, with one of. these, I can access everything that. humankind has ever discovered. just with a few clicks. Uh so, think about what about that? So. with that in mind um it could be. anything. So think about the evolution. of both technology and uh h the human.

brain and thought. So I accept our. consciousness as what it is. But what. about that evolving too? Think about. that higher a higher a more highly. evolved species will have a more highly. evolved consciousness. We're not a we're not Neanderls anymore. uh we're something we think is higher. and if you and I think that's true walk. that a thousand a million years then.

what are we going to be like. so I I think that's and and Diana. Pasilica does a great job looking into. that consciousness aspect of it because. then you're also bordering or you're. really overlapping with religion now and. that's what she is she's professor of. religious studies and get this she's. terrific she is she has access to the. Vatican archives because of her position. as a professor of religious studies and. she has gone through and looked at all. these this church history and she has in.

her book American cosmic and encounters. and now in recent talks she has uh she's. pretty much. uh deduced that these ascent narratives. that exist in the Bible and the church. history uh have some UAP either. connection or explanation. So Diana in. her book Encounters and then American. Cosmic and then some of her talks later,

she's looked at some of the church's. history and writings from biblical. scholars and she has found that there. are examples for of. apparitions or what they call ascent. narratives that uh um that are indic. indicative of actual UAP. So encounters. So for example, there's this really. famous story of St. Francis of Aisi. I I. believe he's he was the one who cared.

for animals. Uh and a lot of people wear. pendants with his. him featured on that. And uh and and the. story is that he saw an angel and the. angel somehow connected to him and he. received the wounds of Christ uh in his. hands. And um and and there's paintings. out there. There there's one in the Lou. I just saw and it shows the angel and. these beams are shooting down into his. hands and he's having that moment where. he connects with this Jesus Christ and.

uh and maybe his messenger. And so Diana. has gone to the Vatican archives and. read looked up the actual story like not. what you read about in church by in a. sermon but the the Latin text and this. wasn't some like beat beatatific what. did we say beautiful angel. giving his good graces or her great. graces to St. Francis, he's experiencing. horrible wounds. He has pain and he even.

I think dies from them and and he. doesn't describe it as an angel. He. describes it basically as some what. probably is a craft and and this is. radiation or something. So, I I don't. know the exact nature of it, but but she. clearly in in her study of this has. found instances of these visitations. that are of of beings and they're not as. angelic and nice as we'd like to think. they are.

Wow. What I mean, which which way are. you leaning? Do you do you do you lean. more one way than the other? So, again, I I I can just acknowledge. that this is occurring. I I don't know. exactly what it all is. Uh, I'm open to. every I'm open to any possibility and. all of the above if that's really what's. happening. I again I just want I can. speak to only what I know and that and I. and and what data I see and that's why. we need to keep moving forward with with. research and more universities coming on.

board and and studying this. And me at. my level I I want these the nationalmies. who I'm on one of their boards as well. as the White House. I'm on one of their. advisory committees. I want them to. start taking this stuff seriously and. put together the best scientists in the. world to to get at it. When it comes to kind of exploring. underwater stuff and uh coming from. inside the earth, I mean, where do we. start to explore that? Well, this is what I think we should do.

We already have a pretty active. exploration effort nationally with my. former agency Noah and they coordinate. with others. For example, that one. program I mentioned with a dedicated. ship and a with ROV. We also end up uh. funding other groups. Uh my friend. Robert Ballard, Discover of Titanic, he. has his own group called the Ocean. Exploration Trust and his own ship and. and so Noah funds them. they fund a few.

others and then you have universities. doing some of this work too and then you. even have um um people in the private. sector looking for oil and gas. I think. what we need to do is is harness that. ongoing effort nationally and globally. and of exploring our ocean and and. ensuring that UAP these underwater. objects we are are a part of the the. research targets and agenda because. right now uh no one's looking for them.

really no one considers them worthy of. scientific study. So when a ship goes. out, they don't say, "Ah, we're going to. study uh plankton and maybe some. undersea vents and we're going to look. for UAP." They don't do that. Uh in. fact, here's a good example, and it's in. this paper I wrote for the Soul. Foundation. Richard Dolan in his book. that's not yet been published, but I. looked at the draft. He cites a study or. pardon me, a story uh reported in a Navy. log. Uh the USS Mory I think it was 1946.

reported and they were a bathometric. survey ship. They were using sonar to. map the seafloor and u they had. primitive sonar back then. They only had. a echo sounder which is like one beam. looking down. Uh now we have a. multi-beam which is sort of like a fan. and can do a lot more mapping. And they. reported they're they're mapping this. area in the Pacific and they reported a. large object. So what happened is the.

all of a sudden they saw really shallow. death recordings for a long time maybe. even over a football field size probably. and and then um and then it went then it. kind of disappeared and they thought. what the hell is that? Is that is that. some kind of undersea mountain? And they. went back and they did it didn't exist. anymore. Now now you can get reflections. sonar reflections from things like. plankton but not not really hard echoes. So uh that that was an example of them. and they just basically threw the data.

out. So the idea would be let's be open. to that kind of stuff and and by the way. again I know of classified data where. you could see the stuff in imagery. So. we should be using all the things we. have overhead that looks at the ocean. like NASA has satellites that look at. the ocean so does Noah. We should be. taking everything we have ships and and. just I guess opening the aperture to not. just study the earth and the ocean but. to look for UAP too. Interesting. Interesting. And that's that's what I want to do at.

this national level with this thing. called the ocean research advisory panel. that advises the White House on ocean. issues. I'm on it and uh and I want to. get UAV UAP to be a national ocean. research priority and put in directives. like that. So, the way it works here, the White House every year puts a thing. out called something like the the FY. whatever uh R&D priorities memo and and. this year's and the ones when I was in.

the Trump administration, we'd have. artificial intelligence on there. We had. ocean exploration on there and uh and so. um we should I want to get UAP in the. ocean and atmosphere on that letter. Uh. now again it's right now you need an. administration that's gonna buy off on. that kind of policy and right now we're. not seeing those signals. So. interesting interesting. Well let's take. a quick break. Yeah. I want to tell you about this business.

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got a ton of good stuff. Once again, that's layeredupfoods.com. Use the promo code SRS. That gets you. 20% off. You guys are going to love this. stuff. I guarantee it. Join me and my special guest for the. next behindthecenes experience. exclusively available on Vigilance Elite. Patreon. The behind-the-scenes footage. is raw and uncut. This is as close to.

the set as you can possibly get. You can. expect anything from off-topic. conversations, studio tours, the final. moments before the interview starts, and. everything in between. The. behindthe-scenes content is constantly. evolving and we'll continue to bring you. more as we grow. You can gain access for. just $15 a month exclusively at. Vigilance Elite Patreon. All right, Tim, we're back from the. break. We're just having a little.

discussion about what we need to know. about what's in our water space and and. why. And so, let's just pick it up. That. was a pretty interesting conversation. Let's pick it up there. Let's do it. So, this is interesting. Yeah, I I talked about the science and. technology aspect of what we could. discover by looking into UAP more. That's just incredible what we could. find. But then there's this maritime. security aspect. And think about this. Okay, we know we're seeing objects like. the USS Omaha saw an object go in the. water, a UFO. Uh I I told you about.

these other incidents like in Canada. Uh, and then there's other reports and. classified information I know of well of. overhead imagery that have seen these. things. Um, but so if these things are. basically roaming at will in our water. space, uh, what does that say about our. maritime security? So, think about this. Navy submarines, they are incredibly. vigilant in not interacting with the.

bottom when they can. And I told you. about those two collisions and other. submarines and objects. They have these. detailed procedures they call water. space management whenever they're. operating in in a training area and or. an operational area. And they also have. this protocol they call prevention of. mutual interference PMI WSM PMI and and. they are religious about it of course. because this is this will ruin your day. We've had submarine accidents in the. past like the Thresher and the Scorpion.

We don't want to do that. Plus, there. are nuclear reactors on board. We don't. need those things contaminating the. water. All sorts of reasons to do our. due diligence and not having submarines. inadvertently hit something. And uh but. these things and I mentioned that. submariner who I talked about in his. observation, they are roaming at will in. our water space. And uh if if if we. can't don't even know the full extent of. how they're operating in the water. space, how are we going to do against. the Chinese in the Western Pacific,

which is a matter of sooner uh rather. than later. Mhm. In terms of taking Taiwan. Yeah, I think uh that's coming down the. pipe really soon, too. Yeah, absolutely is. I mean, you see. what they're doing. They're they're uh. they're preparing for a long haul. They're doing everything that you would. expect them to do in terms of energy. stockpiling, building coal plants, all. these things that would uh that they. need to be ready for if we impose.

sanctions against them, preventing. energy supply and and other trade issues. like that. They're preparing for it. All. the open source reports show it clearly. I don't know how we would prevent energy. supply. How how would we prevent energy. supply? They've got the lithium mines in. Afghanistan that we've abandoned. They've got lithium mines all over. Mexico. They've got pretty much of. Iranian oil. Iranian oil, Russian coal, but they get. I mean, it seems like they've got that pretty.

much. Uh. they're they're going to do fine. Do you think any uh let's say that does. kick off? You think we're going to see. any of this uh. new technology. become exposed if if that were to kick. off? That's interesting because uh highly. likely. Well, and here's what I some. people say, oh, if if there was that. kind of technology in the hands of the. government or a contractor being UAP. technology, we would have already seen.

it on the battlefield. uh and and I I'd. say that may be partially valid. First. of all, from what I understand, we've. not been very good at reverse. engineering. We tried, but uh this is. just from some sources. Um and the other. aspect is is that um I don't know if we. would have deployed it in what we've. been involved with currently. That's what I was going to bring up. I. don't see. an application. What what would we have deployed it up. against? Yeah. Right. Exactly.

And and how would it have helped? Yeah. No, certainly not in Iraq and. Afghanistan, but China could be a. different thing uh in terms of undersea. capabilities. Uh that that's what's. going to be very interesting. for us or for them undersea capabilities. both because think about this um what if. they have uh reverse engineered. something that we don't know about now. after I left the government I didn't. keep my clearance so I don't know of. anything but they have from the time I. left the Navy in 2014 2017 to now.

they've they have surged they've become. the largest navy in the world That's. That's daunting. Yeah. Yeah. In a very short time. Yeah. I think it would be I mean I think. it would be very interesting. I mean I. hope we don't go there but if World War. II kicks off or a China US Russia type. Yeah. Iran war kicks off. I mean I think we're. going to see some new technologies get.

unveiled. Yeah. Yeah. that that'll be well I know. what's already happening and it's not. necessarily being withheld and that's. drone technology. So there's an. interesting thing and. space, huh? And space. Yeah, exactly. The the. thing that's a field I'm steeped in and. do for my consulting is ocean drone. programs. And that's really advanced in. a huge way. And that's what's. interesting is you asked me earlier, okay, what should be done? Well, we need. to explore more of our ocean. We need to.

consider UAP when we explore it. But uh. and how are we going to do it? Well, we. currently have ships, satellites, and we. have a good amount of drones. A lot of. companies, a lot of uh government. agencies like mine are using different. types of ocean drones to monitor and. measure ocean properties. And and that. is just expanding rapidly. And in fact, I just read about Australia getting a. very large ocean drone uh a UUV. uncrrewed underwater vehicle uh that. they were able to build rapidly and are.

going to be fielding. So that's an area. that's going to proliferate and that. that can be brought to bear in looking. for more undersea UAP and should be. It's uh less expensive. Ship time is. very costly and um the technology is. rapidly advancing. And in fact there's a. I wrote an article in the US Naval. Institute proceedings about this. Uh I. said it was titled something like ocean. drones uh a a revolution in and ocean. robots or something. And um but it's I. kind of chronicled the history of of.

ocean uncrrewed systems. We used some. targets. I think in the 20s surface. vessels that were uncrrewed for aerial. targets and then and then I think in the. 50s University of Washington did the. first uncrrewed underwater vehicle or. autonomous underwater vehicle to go. under the Arctic ice and then it's just. exploded after that. And now right now. and regarding China, the DoD has uh. initiated this program called.

Replicator. And uh some of my companies that I work. for are going after it and they to. prevent Taiwan from being invaded. They. want to flood the Western Pacific with. thousands of what they call a tritable. alldoomain autonomous systems. So basic. and so kinetic things that can. autonomously go and and just saturate. any kind of attempt to uh to invade from.

the ocean. Wow. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. And that that's that that's. interesting. So we that's just caused. all of the industry in the US and. elsewhere to start scaling up big time. in terms of using autonomous systems. And I think these can all be employed. for looking at the ocean too in a way. that will make it again much more less. less opaque as it is and hard to uh. understand. I mean you know going back. to seeing maybe some technologies become.

unveiled. I mean I got a couple of. questions. I didn't even know how to structure. these, but um so I'm just going to fire. them off randomly. But you know, you had. watched you you had mentioned that you. had seen the the UFO whistleblower. series I had. Yeah. What did you think about. the. gentleman that was in Antarctica as a. firefighter that was talking about that. Yeah. nutrino laser? Yeah. Yeah. What do you I mean, you're the perfect.

person to ask about this. Well, unfortunately, I I don't know. I I wasn't tapped in or. read in any involving that. Uh so, I. don't know. I don't have firsthand. knowledge. But here's what I could tell. you is certainly in the last few months. The more I'm learning about what has. been covered up and developed, if you. will, or is uh or both, it I I don't I. don't dismiss anything. Now I'm so I'm.

I'm willing to. take anything at at its face value. really and like your friend Michael. Herrera what he observed uh that uh with. some paramilitary force who from an. agency we don't know and with a UAP and. etc. I don't I I I would have dismissed. that last year but not now. Yeah. The things I'm seeing and the way that. we're just not uh we're not. acknowledging what we're doing. Well, the reason I'm asking about the.

nutrino laser in particular is weather, you know, weather manipulation. We've. we've seen all these things that used to. be kind of conspiracyish. are now kind of hitting the mainstream. things like I mean I remember thinking. it was crazy talk talking about uh. chemtrails from airplanes. Oh yeah. Yeah. You know and people would tell me, "Oh, I think it's hormones being released. I.

it's something to reflect the sunlight. off the earth." Well, I mean now a. couple weeks ago we just saw here in. Tennessee that uh we're banning. chemtrails. Oh, that's right. Absolutely. The state. Um, there was the Hawaii. wildfire stuff, which, you know, I don't. know how true this stuff is either or if. it's if it's complete BS or if it's. real, but it was, you know, there was. this conspiracy that none of the what. was it? None of the blue roofs in Hawaii.

were burnt. Did you hear about this? I did not hear about that. Yep. Yep. And so, and every time one of. these things hits, like the wildfires. thing, that episode uh. about the Antarctica Oh, yeah. laser, it. always gets like these this boost. And. so, the latest the latest one was the. cuz he was saying that these lasers can. cause earthquakes. Oh, okay. I missed that part of it. Wow.

Really? Yeah. He says that these these lasers. can cause earthquakes somehow. And then. the latest one that happened in Taiwan. uh was like the latest boost where it. got brought up again. And I I have. something to say about that earth. earthquakes, not necessarily this laser. Um yeah, what what what's it it there's. two things I I see from my experience in. the government. One, they're covering. stuff up and I get it. certain things we.

don't want adversaries to see, but. either withholding things from Congress. or the public that should not be. withheld, that's wrong. And that's why. I'm speaking out. The other thing I see. too is that sometimes it's not. necessarily purposeful. Their. government's just not necessarily super. competent in in in areas and and the. case with earthquakes. So I work with a. number of real innovative cutting edge. companies and uh one of them uh has. found that if you monitor the ionosphere.

they call it space weather. You monitor. the ionosphere what has been shown and. people have published on this that. before a big earthquake when plates are. starting to buckle it's basically like a. giant semiconductor. you got a lot of. metal and energy and uh it produces in. the ionosphere a super big peak in a. thing called total electron count and. and so the kind of the ionosphere gets. all energized and um. what is the ionosphere?

Oh, it's it's a it's a upper part of the. atmosphere where you don't have. you can't not there's not really air. Um. and so uh and and you see um uh yeah so. you have these this this electromagnetic. field that gets generated and it's you. can see it from space with certain. sensors and you can monitor it and and. and in all these studies before a big. earthquake you see these peaks in the. ionosphere. I I I won't say it looks.

like the Aurora Borealis or Northern. Lights, but it's it's kind of like that. where where it's visible in in data. You're seeing this this before the. earthquake. Before the earthquake. Okay. Before the. earthquake papers have been written. If. anybody's interested, they should Google. earthquake precursor inspire. And. inspire is the acronym of a European. space agency study on this phenomena. So. I I saw this company that I'm working. with called Precursor. And they they. have this capability to with satellites.

and other sensors to monitor this and. potentially produce an earthquake. earthquake early warning capability. Okay, earthquakes cause the amount of. devastation on the order of a world war. Okay, think about the the Tahuku. earthquake and tsunami. So why would we. not look at every possible means to warn. on earthquakes? Oh, so I go to the US. Geological Survey and I say, "Hey, uh,

how about funding some R&D on this or or. or whatever? Let's have a meeting." And. they immediately responded. categorically, "No, our policy is that. earthquakes cannot be predicted." And. and of course, they defined prediction. of having some precision with respect to. time and location and magnitude. And I. kind of wanted I wanted to say, "Wait, wait, wait, wait. Don't sit there and. look at your little narrow criteria. Open your mind and think maybe we can.

provide an early warning service. Hey. public, high ch probability of an. earthquake is not zero today or. something like that. They just refuse to. look at it. And what I mean by that, my. point is is that there are a lot of what. I think are straightforward ways we. should be moving forward in certain. areas and the government is just stuck. in its own little way of doing things. and and this is this is just a case in. point. So, you know, Japan's looking. into it now. We're going after Japan and.

even California. with some of their messed up politics. At least Northern California is looking. at um looking into possibly working with. us and this company to uh um do do some. uh prototyping, if you will. Interesting. And the government just. blew it off. Oh, yeah. We don't want to warn anybody that. earthquake. This is we're all seismologists. We're. we're not going to think outside the. box. Here's the another analogy to that. thinking is um uh so weather. forecasting. When you look at the damage. of a hurricane, also on the order of a.

war, uh it is important that we we. provide good predictions. And we do. actually now we're really good at. weather forecasting. Uh we can days in. advance, multiple days in advance, sometimes even a week, we can have a. very accurate understanding of what a. hurricane's going to do. There's areas. to improve, but still compared to the. last 50 years, we're doing great. Why is. that? Well, we became. multiddisciplinary. We decided to take. ocean observations and learn how they. heat up the atmosphere possibly like the.

Gulf Stream and contribute to things. like hurricane intensification. And then. we also added some components about the. ice. And so we started looking at the. whole Earth as a system rather than just. the weather, the atmosphere, knowing. that's really what what's going on. And. so I've asked the USGS, why don't you. think about the Earth's system and not. just the your your little rocks in the. in the crust, but the whole thing? And. they just refuse to do it. Man, I mean, what do you know about weather. manipulation?

Yeah, that that's that's something I. have studied. They call it. geoengineering and and it's physically. possible and even uh there's some. studies being conducted right now. because you have a lot of people that uh. certainly these alarmists over climate. change which I don't dispute is. occurring but I think a lot of people. are overreacting they uh they're looking. into that like we might need to do it to. keep some of these changes from. occurring. I'm currently not convinced. it can be done, but I don't know if it's. smart. Uh because there's all sorts of.

feedback mechanisms in the atmosphere. and the ocean, the Earth system that uh. can occur. And what if we do a little. bit of that and then things go wild? I I. think I think we need to research the. hell out of that a lot more with models. before we do any type of. experimentation. I mean, isn't UAE currently conducting. some type of weather manipulation right. now? and they just flooded Dubai. That's right. That's right. So, I don't. I have not been able to look at data.

behind that. So, I I don't I only saw. news reports, so I don't know if that. was a cause and effect. There certainly. is a correlation, but um that that's my. kind of point is we ought to be studying. this a lot more so so we could know in. advance if something like that will. happen. Uh and right now, I don't think. we've done enough. Where I'm kind of going with this is do. you think we could see any weather. manipulation type weapons like. Yeah, that that that's been studied. Uh. it has. Oh yeah, what has been studied? Uh oh. The Air Force did this a while.

ago using weather modification as a. weapon, which uh when you look at what a typhoon. can do, uh that that can certainly be an. advantage in the Western Pacific with. Taiwan. uh roll a typhoon into a an. attempted Chinese invasion and that. it'll be just like what happened to. Japan when uh I think it was Kublakhan. tried to invade twice and the kamicazi. the great wind tore through the armada. and uh and took out uh the Mongols. Did.

do you know about that? Man, I don't. Oh, this is my field of study. So, I. don't remember the year, but Japan was. twice threatened with an invasion by the. Mongols. Uh, and I think I thought one. of the cons, I don't remember which one. And both times a typhoon rolled through. the regions. I I think it was near maybe. Okinawa, what I don't know where, but it. wiped them out. And uh and so they that.

they gave a name for that that uh that. typhoon, the phenomena. They called it. the great or the divine wind. That's. what kamicazi means. Divine wind. Wind. Interesting. Yeah. And you know, also there's all. sorts of history if you want to go into. that. The environment and weather. I uh. uh Sir Francis Drake and the Spanish. Armada. Another storm wiped out the. Spanish Armada when they tried to invade. England. Uh and he got very lucky with. that one. And then you go World War II.

We caught the Germans off guard in. Normandy because we had better weather. forecasts. Uh we if you look at weather. kind of goes from west to east and you. want observations upwind and all the. observation networks that we had were in. the US, Canada and and so the the allies. had a good upwind observation network. and the Germans didn't. And what. happened is the Germans saw the forecast. and thought there's no way they're going. to invade today. Uh it's it's too rough.

So actually it was I think Raml was in. charge of that defending force and he. went to Paris to celebrate his wife's. birthday and he wasn't even there. And. what happened is uh Eisenhower had. planned for one day, June, it was might. have been 4th and uh and the weather was. going to be too bad. They called it off. and he wasn't sure when they do it again. because it was about the tides and the. moon and the obstacles and the beach. that the UDS your predecessors had to. remove and and then there was a weather.

window and we realized it would be good. on June 6th, a short time we could do it. and we knew that and the Germans didn't. and we caught them off guard. Wow. big part of the big part of the. invasion successful story. I did not know that. How long ago did we. start looking into weather manipulation? Well, I don't remember the history. exactly, but I know the Air Force did. that after World War II, and I I don't. know too much of the science behind it. because it seems to me that the scale.

would be really large in terms of cost. Uh and and then again there's so much. uncertainty in in in the earth system uh. in terms of predicting it that uh again. I think you just need to research the. hell out of that before you do anything. Yeah. Yeah. Do you do you think that we. have done any of weather manipulation. before? I don't know. I don't know. I I probably. would know too if we had. So I really.

doubt it. in my my last job, I think I. would have known. Okay. You know, another thing that's. that's coming up, and I'm hoping to. get this gentleman on the show as well, is uh these energy weapons. Directed energy weapons. Directed energy weapons. That's that's that's taking off for. sure. Yeah. You know, it sounds Chris uh. Miller, former suck, told me that we. were really close to having kind of the. the dome like Israel has. That's right. And there's another.

gentleman who developed these directed. energy weapons and they're they're. starting to be employed all over the. place. We're putting lasers. We we've. put one a laser on a ship, a destroyer I. believe. Um and yeah, in my mind, we haven't done that fast. enough. Do you think where I'm going with this. is the retrieval program? How are these. things crashing? And do you think that.

maybe we might be. I mean it seems it seems. so here's an interesting thing. maybe a little over I mean. here's what uh I the crash phenomenon is. is interesting because some people think. ah if they're so advanced how do they. mess up and there's a couple ways to. address that one is well maybe. statistically they're maybe coming here. so frequently that and and statistically.

one there might be some kind of uh. component failure or just it's going to. happen the law of of averages if you. will. Um, but that's one way. Another in. Diana's book, Diana Pasila encounters, she interviews this NASA engineer. I. think he was a contractor, so not a. federal employee. And he calls them. donations. that that that um that that possibly.

they're doing this on purpose to help uh. advance our society or something. give. us little uh breadcrumbs, if you will, technology breadcrumbs to uh assist. I. don't know the veracity of that, but but. I just know that's what she puts in her. book. So, that's an interesting aspect. of it. Very interesting. Very. interesting. So, we were talking about a. a underwater terrain feature off the.

coast of California that some may. speculate there may be an underwater UAP. base there. What were you speaking of? Well, so this book I referred to, Preston Denn is the author. It's even in. the title something like USOS and alien. undersea base or something. I I don't. remember the exact title, but uh yeah, so he interviewed all these eyewitnesses. of different types of UAP activity in. SoCal and and this has also appeared in.

a few shows. One of them like UFO. Witness, I believe, with Ben Hansen. where uh and a few others where they. anchored off this feature. It looks like. an undersea messa um in Google Earth and. u and it's about it's it's off of Point. Magoo and um and and in Google Earth the. way it's rendered is it does look a. little bit artificial or man-made and so. they and him and Preston Dennit in his.

book and these these shows they've all. speculated on it. Look at its structure. it can't be natural. And and what the. reality is is is you can go to the US. Geological Surveys data and find it. online and then you can look at the real. feature and it is entirely natural. You. can just it's not as weird as it looks. in Google Earth because Google Earth. does some filtering. Uh and and in fact. there's also some talk uh different. areas around the world. One is in.

Antarctica or off Antarctica in the. southern ocean that have these very. linear features in Google Earth. They. kind of stand out and some people have. thought, "Oh my gosh, that's alien. infrastructure." And uh I just have to. dismiss all that because you just have. to understand the source of the data. In. in Google Earth, for example, they merge. different data sets and so and then they. might filter out the the the resolution. of one feature that might have a higher. resolution and not another. And and for.

example, those linear features are. basically just the fact that most of. that ocean area has been under sampled. There might just be a few soundings in a. wide area, but one ship collected high. resolution data over a track. So they'll. have that in the Google Earth and you'll. see it nice and resolved and then it'll. be kind of smoothed out and so it makes. it look like a man-made feature and it's. just the data. That's it. Yeah. But but the going back to this. undersea alien base uh this is where I.

want to weave in some of this. disinformation. uh and by who the government possibly I. don't know but uh there was a point in. time this year where uh I was having. some public discussions about the the. possibility of again um of usoss. interacting with the seabed and wanting. to then go and do baometric surveys to. search for th those types of. interactions and I I even found a. feature off SoCal that might just be.

that it's I can't explain it It's it's a. it's part of this kind of ridge. underwater ridge that and a section's. been carved out of it as it it appears. and it's been moved horizontally 2. kilometers. It's a big clump of rocks. Normally when you get these things like. landslides in the ocean, they're called. turbidity flows. It's like an avalanche. They just sort of slough off right uh. down the down the uh um the terrain.

feature. But this thing looked like it. was carved out and I took it to some. geologist friends. I don't know how that. happened. And so, uh, I want to get an. ROV on that feature and check it out. And I'm I'm working on that. Uh, but but. then there's this other aspect of the. one that the people I told you I don't. think were actually accurate and calling. this other feature. I think they I think. it's called sycamore null is the name. It was an undersea base and I don't. think it was. Well, weirdly, when I. started talking out about this in Google.

Earth, the feature was filtered out. entirely. This this sycamore and null, now you can't even see it. It's plain as. day in the USGS database. Why would. someone go to Google Earth and have that. feature removed? Who did that? Why? I I. don't know. But but I again the more I. learn about our our government's active. disinformation campaign and and the. story of that guy Paul Benowitz, anything's possible now. Wow. Yeah, I'm with you. Do you have any.

other insight into into government. disinformation? Any other examples? Gosh. Uh there's probably many uh but I. can't think of any right now. I'm sure there are. I'm just curious. I. just want to pick your brain. Yeah. And I I'll be clear again. It's. worth me saying this. I am okay with us. not acknowledging really important. programs for national security. Unagnowledged programs are good for our.

nation. I just think the fact that we're. not letting the public and Congress know. that we are being visited by entities. whose intentions we don't understand and. characteristics and nature we don't. understand. That genie is out of the. bottle. I think you know the Schumer. amendment. This is what was drafted last. year and was almost passed, including. words like technology of unknown origin, non-human intelligence, and um what was the UAP? Uh all of those.

are in that bill multiple times, that. draft. And and the fact that that got. into draft legislation means it's there. There's something there there. And we. know that because I know some of the. people who briefed the Hill and even. though it wasn't passed in the final. NDA, most of that stuff was stripped. out. Uh like I said, it's out there now. We have to reconcile this and really. inform our public to do the right thing. uh for our nation's security. Do you think we've had communications.

with non-human intelligence? I'm sure of it. I'm sure of it. Just. based on all this data and everything. we're talking about there communications. would look like. I don't know. I don't know. But uh I. mean actually uh if you look at Diana. Poka's book again encounters uh this. this one um uh former NASA engineer he. called the crash the crashes that were. retrieved donations that that's a form. of communication right there. Uh yeah.

and and uh so I I don't know the nature. of the communication initially in who. was doing the communicating but I am. pretty sure from what I've seen from my. sources very sure highly that uh that. that's occurred now with with who parts. of the government or just individuals. and actually by the way if you just when. you say we if you mean the US government. yeah but as individuals. there are thousands if not tens of. thousands of eyewitnesses who feel.

they've been communicated to. Mhm. in different way. Are you familiar with Chris Bledsoe? Yeah, I am. What do you think about that? Well, uh I I'm not qualified comment on. any of the validity of what he reports, but he's not alone in what he's. reported. There's many people who have. had encounters. Diana's book, second book is called. Encounters, and it that that's the very. topic. So many people have been. communicated to and and it it's it's. interesting and and I got to say this.

too. Uh if you look at the diversity of. life on this planet, I mean you just got. to dive on a coral reef for goodness. sake. Then why would there not be a. diversity of higher order nonhuman. intelligence in the universe? It just it. just makes a lot of sense. And if that's. the case, like look at look at all of. our different nations that have. different cultures and some get along. and some don't. It's just it's not a stretch to think. there were a a variety of higher order. non-human intelligences with different.

agendas. Some might be malevolent, some. might be benevolent, who knows? Or just. totally neutral. Uh that just is more. and more likely as the phenomena I think. is better understood. Wow. Well, Tim, what what's next for you? I. know you got a book on leadership coming. up. that's going to be released at the end. of the year. I do. I do. Well, thanks for asking. about it. So, from my time in the Navy and and you.

know, you served as a SEAL, I was. blessed to be given some great role. models and leadership and and then I was. given opportunities to lead and um and I. came to this agency, Noah, with that. And and this is a big part of what I do. now. I mentor everybody who asked me to. do it. And I I I I want to bring up that. next generation. People were so good to. me in my career. They carried me along. the way. It's just the right thing to do.

to pay forward uh what was done for me. And and my book is written for that. purpose, to provide my leadership. examples and lessons, if you will, from. what I learned in the Navy and applied. at Noah, a scientific agency. Um and it. was again I told you it was a kind of a. tough time because we always were. getting our budget cut and uh people. wanted uh didn't they wanted some. inspiration and and um thankfully I had. a scientific degree and they like that. and and I just talk about the the.

examples of trying to help people um uh. in tough times when there's uncertainty. and uh and so I I provide a lot of. stories and the best leadership books to. me are um telling stories. I think Bill. McCraven, Admiral McCraven's books are. fantastic. They do that. I don't like. preachy books that are pedantic and kind. of just tell you how to be. I I don't. need to be told how to be. I'm kind of. at the tail end of my career. What I. want to do is just share insights. And. so I have some fun stories to relate. Um.

one of them is like, have you ever heard. of Miranda Cosgrove? I haven't. She was the star of the Nickelodeon show. I Carly and um and so uh she's also at. one point was the highest paid child. actress ever or something. And um and so. I I know of her because my daughter, youngest daughter had watched her show. 24/7 it seemed like uh while she was. growing up and I never really liked the.

show cuz the character was really snotty. and precocious. Uh but um I had the. opportunity to represent my agency at an. event on the hill, a big event. recognizing this thing that we were in. charge of called the Marine Mammal. Protection Act. We were in one of our. jobs was to help protect whales, save. the whales. And uh and so I wanted to. give my go to this event and represent. us in a good way. That was my job to be. the face to be a champion for what we.

did. and and I will go and I I met with. a couple congressmen and then I met with. her and I remember thinking I wasn't. sure I wanted to meet her because her. character is so awful. Uh but it turns. out she's the nicest person ever and she. was very sweet and we got a nice picture. together and in in back of us was a big. picture of a humpback whale and uh and. she signed it and wrote love Miranda. And what's cool is I got this frame. picture and I gave it to my daughter and. now it's still it's still on her. bookshelf. It's like the centerpiece.

So, she didn't give me any respect for. being an admiral or a combat veteran, but now that I was friends with Iic. Carly, I'm I was her hero. Congratulations. Yeah, how about that? But but that. wasn't really a leadership example per. se. I mean, I I was lead trying to. represent us. Um, but there was another. example I might share with you that you. might enjoy just because it's funny. Um, I was in the Navy. I I had a chance to. represent uh the nation basically at a. big conference. This was during the.

Obama administration and I was a. one-star and the ocean the the. conference was called the our ocean. conference and the state department. hosted it. It was downtown and uh and I. got to lead a panel on illegal fishing. I talked about that earlier and what a. problem it was back then in 2016. It's even worse now with China is again. the the main culprit. And uh and so here. was the sequence of events and this was. a big event, foreign ministers, 500. people in the big state department.

auditorium, giant screens, speaker, podium. So the first person to get up. and talk was then Secretary of State. John Kerry. Uh he goes, he talks. Uh the. second person to talk was President. Obama. He gets and talks. Actually, he's. a good speaker. Again, I'm not a fan of. his politics, but he's a very. charismatic speaker. And then the next. person to get up and talk was Leo. DiCaprio, Leonardo. And uh and it's. funny because here he is. He's a great.

actor. And when he got up there and gave. a speech on the ocean conservation work. he was doing, he just read it. I mean, he did. There was no uh emotion that you. know, Obama was just like he is. And. then Leo, this actor, just read it line. by line. It was it was the dest thing I. ever seen. I was so disappointed. So was. my aid actually, but she still got his. autograph. The next person to speak was me. So I. have this lineup I got to follow. Holy. crap. So um so what I did is I got up.

there and and again big screen of me and. I'm in my uniform and everybody's there. listening to me and I I thought, okay, how am I going to keep these people's. attention after those predecessors. speaking? And so I thought of a story. and I I made this fictitious story and I. said, "Okay, everybody, great to be. here. Thank you." Uh, I'm going to tell. you right now, I'm a bit intimidated. having to follow those those allars. Um, so in thinking about my opening remarks,

I decided to ask my wife who was an. oceanographer like me and this is the. Our Oceans Conference. I decided to ask. Karen, uh, okay, what am I going to say. to keep these people's attention? and. she said, "Well, Tim, you know, you. might want to share with them this that. really um based on all your military. service uh and and and by the way, Karen's favorite movie, Titanic, favorite actor, Leonardo DiCaprio." I. said, she said, "Well, why don't you. just point out to everybody that the.

only difference between you and him is. that when you were in the Navy, none of. your ships ever sank.". And everyone kind of got the Titanic. link and they they they not only started. laughing, they gave me a round of. applause, man. That's a good one. So that a lot of a lot of leadership it. Yeah. Well, there you go. You get it. takes a while to sink in, but a lot of. leadership is that kind of thing where. you you kind of have to diffuse the. tension. Um and you have to you have to.

show you have to go big. you kind of. have to go on the big stage and. represent your people and don't be. afraid to do that. Uh and and people. especially in in a big organization, they want to see their leaders step up. and show well, you know, and so I I have. some stories of my trying to do that. I. don't know if that happened. We'll see. It's up to the readers to find out. Well, when does that come out? it comes. out. Uh, well, I'm going to submit it to. a publisher in May and we'll see how. long the editing takes, but I would I. would bet no later than early next year.

And and again, because it was a little. shaky, uh, it's called Holding Fast in. Heavy Seas, Leading America's Top Ocean. Agency in Turbulent Times. We'll see. where it goes. Well, I can't wait to get a copy of. that. And, uh, I just I want to wish her. the best of luck. And when that does. come out, maybe uh we'll reconnect. again. Hey, I I'm up for a part two or three or. what have you. Perfect. Thank you, Sean. Well, Tim, I really appreciate your time. today and coming and and having this.

conversation with us about UAPs and. underwater stuff and and uh always it's. just always fascinating stuff to talk. about and uh and uh I really appreciate. it. Wish you the best of luck. Thank you, Sean. It's great to be here. [Music]. No matter where you're watching Shan. Ryan Show from, if you get anything out.

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