Ruby Franke “Shares Bed” With Evil Woman/Marriage Counselor To Get Rid of Demons

[Music]. bada bing badao they say that Spirits. all have something that they want and. ever since jod hilderbrand moved into. the Frankie household just weird things. have been happening people are hearing. footsteps inside of the walls that's. what it sounds like it's hard to explain. but it sounds as if someone is inside of. the wall just walking around through the. walls the Frankies obviously didn't. check inside the wall but it's starting. to freak some of them out whatever it is.

it feels like jod brought it into the. house with her whatever these Spirits. are and now she's sitting on the. bathroom floor while the dad Kevin. Frankie is shoving a camera in her face. documenting this allegedly torturous. situation while Kevin's wife Ruby is. sitting next to this middle-aged jod. hilderbrand holding her so that jod. doesn't accidentally harm herself this. happens maybe once a day maybe a few. times a day it's like another being just.

enters jod hilderbrand's body and starts. controlling her movements and it's so. easy to tell because immediately jod. hilderbrand's eyes get pinched closed. and she starts Breathing heavily she. looks like she's in pain she looks. perhaps even constipated today she's on. the floor with her hands fisted into. balls and she's slamming it down onto. her. [Music]. chest Ruby is gently L trying to stop.

her but nothing's really working by this. point they've tried everything I mean. Kevin was known as the resident Exorcist. for a minute trying to cleanse jod of. whatever evil spirits are following her. around he says I would place my hands on. her head and then I would command the. demons to depart and then I would state. every name of Jesus Christ that I could. possibly think of and those evil spirits. were very reactive to those names it. became very clear the minute he would. start saying those names jod would.

thrash and hiss and will and growl at. people it was like she was being hurt. every time Kevin said one of those names. what is it that the spirits even want it. doesn't make sense why jod. hilderbrand jod lays there her eyebrows. are crunched up in pain and this new. voice comes out and it comes out like a. deep aggressive voice She's. Mine what did she just say She's Mine.

She's Mine she knows I own. her she. knows I own. her these are all recorded yeah who is. she that jod hilderbrand is talking. about what does she want to do with her. perhaps she's talking about Ruby Frankie. maybe she wants Ruby Frankie to be hers. and maybe she's going to do everything. in her power to make sure that she is.

hers this is the case of Ruby Frankie. and jod hilderbrand the therapist and. the YouTuber that were arrested for. child abuse for holding two kids captive. in the basement and torturing them. [Music].

we would like to thank today's sponsors. who have made it possible for rotten. mango to directly support a Survivor. Jesse hilderbrand who endured abuse at. the hands of their aunt jod hilderbrand. their information will be in the show. notes if you'd like to share your. support as well this episode's. Partnerships have also made it possible. to support rot mingo's growing team and. we would like to thank you guys for your. continued support as always full show. notes are available at Rotten mango. podcast.com to today's case involves.

some very well-known names in the family. vlogging World Ruby and Kevin Frankie. plus their six children best known as. their channel name eight passengers all. the minors in today's case have been. protected and will simply be referred to. as either boy girl or just their first. initial we will be using the names of. the two eldest children Sherry and Chad. they are of legal age they've publicly. spoken out about ruby and jod and. additionally Sherry recently published a. book that I read and like I said you. need to get 10 copies of this because no.

coverage of any news station any. documentary even compares to the truly. visceral way it's like such a vulnerable. way that Sherry is able to convey her. feelings about everything that's. happened and she does it without I mean. there's so many points where it's very. depressing to read but ultimately the. amount that she's shown to have grown. from this is inspiring and incredible. it's one of those books that I think we. will all be thinking about 2 days after. reading it 2 weeks 2 months and even 2.

years down the line also I believe she. narrated the book herself so if you're. more into audio books that would be a. great way to listen as for Content. warnings there are descriptions of food. restriction child abuse CSA religious. abuse therapy abuse as well as just. overall abuse and torture in general now. side note there is going to be a lot of. conversation about the LDS church in. these episodes Ruby and jod were devout. members of the LDS church or at least. they claim or they thought they were but. they should not be used as presentations.

of what the faith means or how it should. be practiced we are also not here to. discuss the LDS church or faith as a. whole I personally don't have much. experience but like with any religion. there's going to be bad people that do. bad things and sometimes if the. establishment protects them I do think. that there should be consequences for. all those parties involved as well with. that being said this was originally. supposed to be a three-part series but. with the addition of Ruby's personal. journals detailing the torture Kevin. claims that he did not know the kid kids. were being abused as well as just all.

the online conspiracies discourse. there's another woman that a lot of. people want to be arrested in connection. with jod and Ruby this is like the Three. Musketeers and people online are saying. you've only arrested two of the Three. Musketeers so there's a lot of discourse. there now this is going to be part two. of the now four part series please go. watch part one if you haven't already. and that's in depth onto Ruby Frankie's. YouTube career the channel8 passengers. how they go from making millions of. dollars to just being cancelled for.

suspected child neglect and all of the. video proof that Ruby Frankie is a. pretty horrible mom in this part we will. be going over jod hilderbrand and how. she likes to force divorces as a. so-called marriage counselor and how she. likes to ruin people's lives in part. three we go over the T house that is her. $5 million mansion in the middle of. nowhere and in part four we will go over. all of the online conspiracies as well. as the the prison calls how passionate. netizens have been that something needs.

to happen to both Kevin Frankie and Pam. there's a woman named Pam so with that. being said let's get started do you. think that you can pinpoint when exactly. you made the worst decision of your life. because marriage counseling is ruining. Adam Paul steed's entire life including. his marriage not even in the oh the. marriage counselor is bias and she keeps. siding with my wife that a lot of. husbands like to argue it is so much. worse than that marriage counseling will.

Kickstart a chain of events that has. Adam kicked out of college hundreds of. thousands of dollars in debt hated by. every single person he knows and in jail. he's holding his little daughter in his. arms when the officers arrive this is a. protective order we're going to have to. take your child the little girl starts. screaming Daddy no Daddy no and the. authorities they more or less just rip. her from Adam's arms he has no clue what. the hell is happening right now in. exchange for his child being taken from.

him Adam is now branded the most evil. person in the entire Campus of BYU in. Utah how old is Adam and he's in his. early 20s he's a college student okay. and the kid is one oh wow yeah now if. you see him on campus it's like seeing. Satan himself just walking casually. through the corridors he's evil you know. he's got like a 500 page Honor Code file. in his name which okay side note BYU is. religious Institution so while a lot of.

Institutions they have honor code. offices they're typically for placing. the academic Integrity of students. whereas biu you could basically start a. file for your roommate if you caught. them watching thirst traps or if you. catch them secretly drinking coffee. because BYU is sponsored by the LDS. church the honor code includes. behavioral standards established by the. church like caffeine intake there's not. a single drop of tea or coffee that. you're going to find on the entire. campus yeah so what do you drink and. energy drink no you can't even drink.

energy drinks they love um soda yeah. that's like soda shops are a big thing. in Utah like sugar just sugar eyes yeah. just straight sugar I think yeah okay. now Adam's file is now 500 pages long. the notes on his file are dated there. are detailed notes of phone. conversations between the Honor Code. office and witnesses that are calling in. to explain Adam is too predatory to be. left in this University which is a very. old statement to make I mean they're.

saying that the longer that he's a. student here the more people are in. active danger Adam and his wife let's. call her Mary that's not her real name. she's also a student at the university. the two of them they have a one-year-old. daughter and another baby on the way and. Mary is actually the one that starts the. honor code file in her husband's name. Adam she walks in one day and she. reports that Adam her husband is. delusional he is controlling he has. violent tendencies she tells the on her. Cod office said she's concerned about.

her husband taking baths with their. young daughter she says it's because. he's a victim of sexual abuse when he. was a kid he does not have a healthy. understanding of boundaries again this. is what she's saying and one time he. asked that I take the baby out of the. tub they're taking a bath together I. take the baby out of the tub and he was. trying to hide his erection that's what. Mary is claiming she said from then on. she had to be in the bathroom at any. given time that Adam was alone with any. of the kids and Mary is just scared of. him now and it's not even just Mary that.

Adam is scaring Mary claims that she has. this marriage counselor a therapist and. Adam is threatening the therapist too. like they're both terrified of Adam. naturally the Honor Code office they. want to talk to the therapist and she's. an open book she tells them well listen. Adam and Mary came in for marriage. counseling and it was very clear from. the get-go I mean due to Adam's. behaviors it was just going to go. downhill the file reads the therapist. advis and explained that Mary wanted.

marriage help at first the story was a. common theme of a wife struggling to. understand her husband's problems with. self-pleasure and poor consumption. however the therapist quickly became. alarmed because Mary had been convinced. that by Adam that whatever Adam was. doing was not anything wrong that this. is just the way that men. behave the therapist states she believes. Adam is manic and with the encouragement. of therapy Mary has been trying to set. boundaries and be more assertive with. herself in the relationship and Mary had. quote began to waken up to what was.

acceptable behavior and how confused she. had been and how off track Adam has been. the therapist is explaining to the honor. code officer I mean Adam is masterful at. keeping Mary in this constant state of. confusion the notes continue the. therapist explained that Mary felt too. threatened to comprehend or connect with. the seriousness of some situations but. once Mary started putting in boundaries. Adam did not like that and that's. putting it mildly the therapist States.

he's psychologically unstable he has an. intense delusional fixation on me the. therapist and he keeps saying that I'm. the. Antichrist which sounds alarming right. and he's violent the therapist strongly. asserts that she's just scared that the. two of them have kids at home one. example that the therapist gives to the. Honor Code office is that Adam held. their infant daughter over the third. floor balcony and he was just giggling. he was like oh holding you over the. Third floor balcony haha he thought it.

was a funny joke the therapist claims. she would not be surprised if he does. anything drastic to Mary or the kids so. that they don't leave him he is just so. extremely manipulative pathological. narcissistic and. dangerous the therapist explains that. out of all of her years treating. thousands honestly yeah thousands of. married couples I've never been. terrified of a client until Adam there. was this one instance where they were. both in my office and I was so. physically threatened by him I had to.

position myself between him and the door. so that I could make a hasty Escape if I. needed to this was the first time in all. the years that I've been a therapist. that I've ever had to do that she goes. on to allege that not only has Adam ped. essayed his own wife but also their. one-year-old daughter she states. confidently with her whole chest Adam is. the most dangerous person that I have. ever met in my life he is very clearly a. predator.

that therapist's name is jod. hilderbrand when Adam first looks into. Jodie his potential new marriage. therapist he does like a quick Google. search on her just to see what's going. on she is one of the most recommended. therapists in the wasach front of the. Mormon church from for like the past 20. years honestly wow her website sounds. good it says my style is compassionate. yet direct and clear of what is. necessary to fully change and Champion. any addictive or self-destructive.

Behavior whether it be ravenous. addictions feelings of inadequacy. conflicts in relationships intimacy. problems Communications and breakdowns. and frankly block anything that prevents. having and creating peace and. joy at the bottom of her website the. banner reads what you do is not who you. are I don't even know what that means. her resume on paper seems great. Bachelor's in English graduate work in. educational psychology earned a master's. degree then she worked at Lodge which is.

a nationally known drug and alcohol. treatment center which is frequently. visited by celebrities it's expensive it. can range from $330,000 to $100,000 to. get treated for one month one month and. jod would not stop talking about it she. claims that she treated Paris Hilton not. for drugs but for bad behavior at the oh. the school that the camp if you will. that Paris Hilton was sent to that was. terrible but she was there working there. yeah that's what she claims now Adam did. think that it was a little strange how.

little she cared to protect clients. information but maybe it's because Paris. Hilton's personal life has been all over. the Tabloid since forever so it's not. actually breaking any patient protection. laws it is weird though and Adam did. think it was weird besides it's it's. fine because Adam and Mary they're going. in for marriage counseling they've been. married for 2 years when they're. recommended by a church Bishop to go see. jod the church Bishop is like oh that's. a good one Adam says jod was very. curious itic right off the bat Mary's.

instantly obsessed she's really happy. that she's working on herself and Adam. was just excited for his wife because he. thinks maybe jod is a good fit she's. firm but she seems very wise in a fun. way she doesn't mind laughing and making. jokes so that the message gets delivered. I mean for a church recommended. therapist she doesn't seem like she. takes herself too seriously at least in. the beginning as for Adam's relationship. and marriage itself there's just a lot. to work through just a lot they're. trying to balance being new parents.

while also being college students they. have a one-year-old Mary is pregnant. with their second they're both students. at BYU they're both Mormon but for. Adam's wife she's not even just. religious it's not oh church on Sundays. her dad has a very high standing in the. church so there is pressure for them to. be the best LDS church members out there. which naturally is not the. healthiest Adam says that whenever he. Googled something if he even saw for. like 20 seconds okay maybe he Googled it. maybe he Googled a naked woman's picture. for 2 seconds and if he looked at it for.

2 seconds and he had a quick lustful. thought about it he would call his wife. and apologize profusely like you would. think that he met another woman at Motel. 6 he's saying I feel terrible what I did. was terrible this is terrible it. probably doesn't help that Adam's entire. start to their marriage is just rough. all of Mary's family members hate Adam. they were against this marriage to begin. with from the. get-go Adam was one of the biggest.

whistleblowers of the LDS church and. it's not that he turned against the. faith he's like a devout LDS member even. at that point he was assaulted by a. higher up in the LDS church when he was. a child he was one of the first few. victims to Kickstart a decade long chain. of almost 93,000 victims who have come. forward with essay claims against the. Boy Scouts of America wait. 93,000 victims have come out against the. Boy Scouts of.

America now um it gets very complicated. cuz you're like what does the Boy Scouts. have to do with the LDS church he was. Adam was one of the first people to try. and get some justice so quick context. the LDS church was the largest sponsor. of the Boy Scouts of America scouting. was considered a big part of the youth. development in the church so about one. out of every five Boy Scouts were of the. LDS Faith they were essentially sent by. the church as part of their church youth. activities now there are LDS higher ups. that also hold significant positions in.

the Boy Scouts executive board if you. are an eagle scout in the Boy Scouts. which is like the top 5% ranking it is a. badge of honor at church so they're two. separate organizations but not really. they're very merged together MH Adam. Paul Steed grew up in the LDS church in. fact his dad works as a seminary teacher. for the church they're very serious when. he's 14 he goes to a Boy Scouts camp in. Idaho where he is essayed by a scout. leader but who also happens to be an LDS.

church leader named Brad Stowell after. the essay at the camp he tries to report. it to the Boy Scouts leadership they. don't care Adam straight up calls the. police himself he's like come get this. guy he's very brave he's 14 now he. admits Brad Stowell admits and confesses. to not just Adam but 24 boys and he. pleads guilty he receives a dainty. little 150-day jail sentence that's. about a week per boy that he abused. about a week that's it what kind of jail. sentence is that but how did he get away.

with essaying so many boys Adam and his. father they go to the church hups to. report the abuse because he's also a. higher up Church leader Brad the abuser. I mean he's not just a scout leader he's. heavily involved in the LDS church he. has a leadership position so according. to Adam when he brings this to the. church to report it the church does. practically everything to shut Adam up. which why why because apparently years. prior to essaying Adam Brad confessed to. essaying a six-year-old boy his LDS. Bishop Church leader sent him to quote.

counseling and then later stated you are. cured and allowed him to keep working. with children I think with any massive. organization at least I think religion. is beautiful but sometimes it can. provide ways for people that should not. be around children to be around children. and that's going to happen anywhere in. any religion and I think in this. situation the chain of command they all. should be punished I don't think that. this is representative hopefully of the. LDS church as a whole but this whole. chain of command the whoever his Bishop.

was that was like you are cured is crazy. as well mhm no it's alleged that even. after he was quote cured there were more. reports more warning signs that people. have reported hey this Brad guy is. really creepy but the Boy Scouts and the. church they ignore it they even cover it. up so when Adam and his dad they try to. get Justice from the church because how. do you let him still be around children. the church turns around and allegedly. pushes the family out they fight Adam's. dad from the church as a seminar teacher.

and they're just pushing this issue too. much they don't like it they feel like. if other victims come and seek help it's. just going to start getting messy. allegedly and Adam this little boy. instead of getting the support that he. needs he starts getting treated like a. money hungry liar like he is just out. here to get money from this church that. has about a billion doll I think they're. worth like a billion dollars a church. yeah Adam and his dad do not get give up. there's a lot of respect honestly for.

the two of them now in the LDS community. and just everywhere else Adam and his. dad not only fight tooth and nail for. justice and they help other victims come. forward they fight to get laws passed so. this gives an extension of the statute. of limitations for sa victims in the. state of Idaho prior if a child was. essayed they would have to report the. abuse before their 23rd birthday Adams. advocating his dad is advocating they. get a law passed in Idaho that you can. report it at any point in your life now. there's no statute of.

limitations which the LDS church. allegedly really hated really hated just. curious why would you not like that no. accusations just thoughts just kind of. weird mhm now even though Adam is a. victim of the abuser that belonged to. the LDS church it appears nobody cared. to help him nobody wanted to do anything. the backlash to telling the truth. demanding Justice trying to get other. victims to get help this is I mean his. entire family has to relocate from Idaho. to Utah because was that bad they were.

shunned that is where Adam meets his. future wife Mary at BYU they get married. they have two kids now and everyone is. telling his wife even before the. marriage that Adam is a terrible person. I mean he did all of these weird Shady. things to try and make. money the alleged Church leader that. tried to suppress Adam president hilum. he ran the whole Boise Idaho Temple he. was in a leadership position he also was. heavily involved with the leadership of. the Boy Scouts he did everything.

allegedly to cover up the abuse. coincidentally hilum is very close. friends with Mary's parents who are also. very high up in the church so they're. doing everything to try and prevent. these two from getting married when Adam. heard that his fiance's family hated him. he said I was depressed for a couple of. days and then I remember just being like. triggered because I was a victim of. child abuse and I just remember thinking. I'm not I mean I don't have problems I'm. not like that I'm a good person and I. remember some terrible moment I went.

online and I looked at Sports. Illustrated Swimsuit Edition and then I. called my bishop and I went into this. repentance process I called my wife I. told her I wasn't worthy to get. married but nevertheless the two get. married they have a 1-year-old and now. she's pregnant with their second child. and their lives are about to get harder. so they need guidance it is natural to. seek help it's admirable to seek help. they get referred to jod hilderbrand and. that's when everything starts falling. apart at first the changes are really. small but Adam does notice it so jod.

likely knew Adam's history like this. whole thing and she's involved with all. these leaders right yes and she wasn't. as involved with all these higher-ups. but it's alleged that she saw Mary as a. way to get even more influence in the. LDS church. m i see Adam says his wife would just. confront him all the time just out of. nowhere confronting him with abstract. things like very vague accusations. you're self-denial about your own.

addiction what does that even mean Adam. says I just have a million questions I. mean it doesn't even make sense what. addiction are we I was never diagnosed. with any sort of addiction nor was I. actively struggling with one sure he has. PTSD from the abuse he suffered as a. child but what the hell is his wife on. about but jod starts telling them that. everyone has an addiction every single. person has an addiction whether it's. food or reading the book of Mormon too. much yeah you can do that apparently. every single person has an addiction.

she's explaining to these marriage. counseling classes that Adam and his. wife are a part of that every action. that you have comes from addiction it's. rooted in addiction most of the time you. don't even know that it is the cause of. every action that you take are you. jealous about your friend doing. something it's an addiction that's. causing the jealousy are you gaining a. few pounds on vacation because the food. is delicious no it's actually an. addiction it may not be obvious at first. but that's what Jody's here for right to.

get to the bottom of your addiction for. example jod would teach if you have to. spend time not thinking about something. like a picture of a naked person the. fact that you have to not think about. that proves that you're an addict in. other words all this resistance of white. knuckling not to think about the. magazine on the aisle of the grocery. store the fact that you have to not. think about it means you're a addict. which by the way she's talking about. like Playboy magazine she's not even.

talking about Hustler magazine another. huge belief that jod teaches her married. couples is from the beginning jod tells. every single married couple. relationships have to die so that it can. be reborn again it's like a resurrection. how do you do that separation it's the. concept of only if your relationship. dies only then can it be reborn it kind. of makes sense Adam says because of the. worship of Christ and his resurrection. in the LDS faith in theory this whole.

theory of relationships dying is almost. too perfect but Adam soon realizes quote. if the relationship or marriage didn't. die on its own jod would kill the. relationship in any sociopathic way. alive after a few weeks of being in a. big group setting with a bunch of. married couples and Jodie now it's time. to graduate to The Next Step split the. couples up husbands Go off into the. men's Counseling Group wives Go off into. the women's Counseling group and that's. where things just start going off the. rails Bonk. Adam is placed in a group setting with.

other husbands jod is leading it these. other husbands week after week are just. confessing in the man's group they're. just confessing to the most heinous. predatory crimes they're confessing to. having thoughts about ESS child abuse in. Adam is traumatized he's a victim of CSA. he does not feel safe in this group but. jod does not care she tells him actually. you're on the same level as these people. he's like no I'm not I don't have. predatory thoughts these people are. predators because they're confessing to. these predatory thoughts I'm a victim of. CSA I feel triggered when I'm in this.

group she's like no you're in denial. you're just as bad I'm going to help you. see the. truth this escalates until 3 weeks after. giving birth Adam's wife is. understandably in a very sensitive State. she's vulnerable Adam says jod starts. digging her claws just deeper she starts. helping Adam's wife identify how she's. the victim Mary was likely very confused. like what do you mean I'm the victim. it's the oh sweetie. you just don't know it yet that's what.

jod saying jod would tell Mary that she. had been conditioned by Adam to believe. that a husband who looks at a naked. picture here and there is normal it's. not normal it's basically the same level. as cheating or domestic violence if not. worse so of course you cannot trust him. around your kids she's trying to tell. Mary it's the same as if Adam killed. someone you know would you forgive him. and just hope that he doesn't kill. someone else or maybe doesn't kill you. or your. baby ad is so taking a back to be. treated like a predator I mean he had to.

uproot his whole life after being. victimized as a child and he's still. trying to work through the trauma and. his own wife is treating him like a. perpetrator Mary eventually tells Adam. it's yourx addiction you just don't see. it side note Adam has only seen about 2. hours of corn in his entire life but his. wife is acting like he is an addict of. these videos Mary tells Adam that he was. never a victim of child essay the wife. is telling him that never happened to.

you you're in denial because you have an. addiction you made up that story because. you have an. addiction by this point Adam is trying. to convince his wife that's crazy like. that's crazy I'm not an addict. especially not for and she knows that he. would never lie about what happened to. him so in this desperate attempt to try. and save his marriage Adam agrees to his. wife's conditions on how to save their. relationship which is they need to break. the relationship so it can be.

resurrected remember jod instructs them. that they cannot talk to each other they. can only talk to each other in a group. setting and they need to break the. relationship in order to rebuild it Adam. suggests getting a second opinion. because what kind of crazy therapist. even suggests that as a marriage. therapist but jod tells him see that's. your addiction speaking the addiction. knows that you are solving your. addiction by coming to me of course the. addiction doesn't want you to keep going. to me addiction is a parasite and it. wants to keep being.

fed Mary rejects his idea she's like no. I'm going with Jody now again this is. just from Adam's perspective Mary has. not said her side of the story but it. seems like there are I mean he's got. files of evidence he was on a big. podcast called Mormon stories where. they've been really covering the jod. hildbrand Ruby Frankie case that 5H hour. long interview with Mormon stories with. Adam has been taken down due to a cord. order so it's a it's a little why how so.

what's going on uh it there are. speculations that Mary did not like. being spoken about but um Mormon stories. when Adam went on there he gave every. single file that he had police reports. the 500 page Honor Code office file he. gave lawyer statements every court order. he gave everything he gave jod. hilderbrand's uh therapy notes that he. subpoena he gave everything so it's.

still alleged but I just just putting. that out there now Mary allegedly. rejects this idea from this point. forward she says we're not going to. really live together like we're going to. live together in the same apartment cuz. we have two kids together but we're not. going to speak unless jod is present she. even goes as far to allegedly give Adam. a letter that says as of today I am no. longer willing to take upon me the. responsibilities that come with being. your spouse I set the folling in. boundaries in order to protect myself. from expectations that are not being met. in this relationship I will no longer do.

these things for you as a wife cooking. cleaning laundry dishes picking up stuff. after you reminding you of any of your. responsibilities or appointments. assisting you and your school work. spending family time sharing intimacy. sharing a bed engaging in any kind of. physical touch beyond the social. acceptable boundaries of friends I Will. consent to share our apartment as living. space I will consider to have my. responsibility to take care of myself. and our two children and I will not. consider it my duty to inform you of my. daily activities or.

plans they have no physical emotional. mental or even verbal contact for weeks. and then one day out of the blue. allegedly Mary the wife asks Adam to. give their baby a bath so he goes gives. the baby a bath and he says quote she. totally walks into the bathroom in Herre. like I just remember thinking oh my God. she's finally listened to me we're going. to get back to our normal life and stuff. and she starts teasing me and acting. like she was going to hop in the tub. with me and I'm holding our baby our. one-year-old and I was like hey you got. to get the baby out of the tub and I'm. laughing thinking it's funny she leaves.

with the baby she comes back into the. bathroom looks at me she looks at my. private parts and then she looks at me. in disgust and just turns her back and. walks. away that is wild what is going on that. is the alleged Honor Code reporting of. he had M an ER in the bathtub but even. if it's true then this whole thing is. like a setup it's ENT TR. is if yeah but even why does that even.

is that even necessary to you know I. don't know it's weird this bathroom. incident the motives behind it become. even clearer later but Mary his wife is. turning into a little soldier for jod is. what it appears to be Adam doesn't even. recognize her anymore for example Adam. and his wife had this trip plan to go to. Yellowstone they're bringing some. friends there one couple from Brazil. they just had a baby the couple from. Brazil and they don't have much money. cuz they're exchange students on top of. all all of this so Adam really wants to. do something special for the Brazilian.

couple and he's like we're going to go. on this trip and I'm going to help you. guys pay for it like I will pay for all. the food on the trip it's a big moment. for Adam to be able to finally do. something like this and to I don't know. do something special for his friends but. when they get to Yellowstone Adam. promised his wife that they were going. to stay within an entire budget for the. entire trip now I believe most of the. money that they were spending was Adams. he did get settlement money from the Boy. Scouts of America but it wasn't a lot. it's not like he's rolling in it and he.

also does not spend lavishly at this. point he's hundreds of thousand dollars. in debt because of jod at this point so. at this point today oh today okay but at. this point when they're in Yellowstone. he has a little bit of money and he. doesn't spend it lavishly and this is. one of the times that he just wants to. spend money on his friends like this is. a good reason to spend money they. realize when they get to Yellowstone. that all the food prices are. astronomical there because it's a. tourist Zone everyone is hiking up the. prices of all the food. Adam says it's fine but Mary starts.

freaking out telling him that he is. violating the boundaries of their. relationship because he wants to feed. his friends he says I remember driving. like 4 hours around Yellowstone trying. to find a grocery store that was cheap. enough so that we could feed my friends. and her baby and her baby was crying and. finally I got so upset I said I can't. listen I have to do this and my wife was. screaming at me I went into the grocery. store and and I bought a bunch of food. to feed all of us with and her newborn.

baby that was crying I mean they were. just. humiliated Adam is like I don't know who. this woman is but it's not my wife Mary. and I'm going to get my wife back but. three phone calls is what ruins. everything the first call to the police. happens after a big fight between Adam. and Mary Mary is on the phone with the. police frantically telling them that her. husband is physically. abusive okay ma'am what's going on what. happened he violated. the boundaries of the relationship of. the marriage what did he do he left his.

backpack on the couch a few things I. mean one the police were just like mouth. and gape shocked secondly I think this. goes to show how far off the deep end. jod has Mary because to confidently call. the police and say that this is a. transgression that is an act of domestic. violence if not comparable like you. cannot be in a place where your brain is. functioning normally mhm that's how bad. things are she genuinely believes the. cops are going to handcuff Adam log in.

his little backpack into evidence it. doesn't even make sense the next day. Mary calls the police again on Adam this. time she allegedly states that he. physically abused her by pushing against. her which is very interesting wording. like did he push you what do you mean he. pushed against you she states yeah well. I was standing here by the door and they. ask were you blocking him from being. able to leave the apartment well yeah. did he hurt you. no the police leave because Adam has.

been incredibly patient during all of. this but he finally decides okay that. was the second time I'm not going to do. this anymore like you got to stop. calling the police on me you're publicly. humiliating me I mean not even if the. police do anything a lot of people are. just going to assume that he's violent. and abusive and that the police are just. being incompetent so Adam decides he's. just going to get his life back and that. means sleeping on his own bed for once. he had been sleeping on the couch he. says I paid for the house I paid for the. apartment so I went into my bedroom and. I slept on my bed I said to my wife if.

you don't want to sleep next to me you. don't have to but I'm not going to sleep. on the floor or the couch anymore he was. just tired of being treated like this. subhuman being Adam's wife calls the. police and states that Adam attempted to. essay her that night what did he do she. says well she felt like he might essay. her the police don't do anything because. again it's not a threat he didn't say it. he didn't try it all he did was sleep in. his own bed that he has every right to. and she was just having a feeling when.

this does not work the way that Mary an. allegedly Jodie likely intended Mary. just disappears with their two kids for. a little bit now again this is alleged. at this point I think like any video you. have to come up with your own. conclusions do your own research listen. to Adam sher's story and Mary has not. publicly spoken out about it so it's but. you get it now Adam's one-year-old baby. 3- week old baby his wife they're just. gone so after a few days he files a.

police report because he thought they'd. been kidnapped and Adam says he went and. talked to jod about what was happening. and how heartbroken he was and what's. going on with the kids and Mary and he. says I just remember being in this. agonizing pain feeling it intensely and. I remember looking over at Jodie and she. was smiling her cheeks were. blushing so at this point he's not. resentful of jod yet right does he think. something is wrong with jod as well or. he it's like a mixture of he knows that. Jodie is telling her a lot of things.

clearly that aren't making sense but at. this point he's kind of confused more. than. anything he doesn't know what's going on. behind the scenes between jod and Mary. but it's just confusing so from there. Adam's wife starts reporting Adam for. actually trying to abuse her and the. kids likely just making up insane. stories that jod is feeding her she gets. a protective order against Adam and. lures him to meet up with her afterwards. so he gets served this temporary. protective order and then she's like hey. come meet up with me because I like you.

like maybe we can work this out but he. will be in bigger trouble right he goes. and she reports him for breaking the. protective order she's also going to the. BYU Honor Code office to report him for. violent and predatory behavior so not. only is Adam facing expulsion from. college he's facing a likely divorce and. 20 years in prison for breaking his. protective order he's trying to tell his. church leader you have to help my family. I mean you have to to read through these. files because none of this is true like.

this protective order is not true I. don't know what's going on to which the. bishop just responds a woman doesn't. just run away from her husband unless. there's. something Adam is just looking at him. shocked like what are you talking about. you know me the bishop is just staring. at Adam do I know you what are you. talking about like you think I'm like. physically violent or I'm sexually. abusing her he says the bishop Smiles. the fact that you just said that makes. me know that you're guilty of those.

things it is like every single person in. Adam's life had just decided to turn him. into the devil he starts looking online. trying to figure out what Jody's problem. is why is she suddenly on this war path. to kind of destroy his entire life and. reviews for jod hilderbrand the negative. ones read she reminds me of an abuser in. abusive relationship she isolates her. clients by setting up unrealistic. expectations so they believe all their. friends and family are toxic leaving. them to only depend on her and her quote. support phone calls it makes me sad to.

think about how many relationships she. has poorly hurt another she's not worthy. to be trusted with your marriage or. relationships my wife went to her. counseling in classes and the main. result was that Miss H debrand. brainwashed my wife that I had an. addiction when I did not my wife was so. certain that I was hiding something as a. result of This Woman's lies that we had. to go to an honest counselor to help. dispel the dishonesty that jod hbr had. told my wife do not go to this woman go. to a specialist who respects both. members of the marriage and does not. spread so-called empowering lies and.

another I have a very different history. with Jody than most I'm a pretty. well-known therapist and I trained under. jod hilderbrand for a year as I trained. under her I saw her tear apart families. and destroy relationships I believe she. is truly evil and I don't say that. lightly I have done so much therapy for. people coming out of her quote cult who. were traumatized by her therapy I don't. have an axe to grind but I am tired of. people getting getting hurt by her work. I'm reluctant to speak out against.

colleagues and other therapists however. I wouldn't mind somehow some way helping. people see how dangerous this woman is. but nobody is willing to listen to Adam. or anybody else that has said anything. negative about jod Adam was referred to. jod by the Bishop from the church jod. works as a therapist for this massive. company called LifeStar which side note. the bishop the church Bishop that. recommends Adam to Jodie The Bishop's. brother own owns that chapter of LIF. star which is already a massive conflict.

of interest it just adds to all the foul. characters in this case cuz the sick. part is Adam gets money from the. settlement from his abuse case for. things like therapy and the bishop knows. that and it's like he's thinking well. why not give that money to my brother by. going to his business where they employ. a bunch of therapists and it's not cheap. or affordable it's like $500 a week per. person and that's not even. individualized therapy that's to join a. men group with a bunch of other husbands. and then you have personal sessions that.

you have to pay for that's one to two. additional sessions per week between. Adam and his wife Mary I mean they're. spending thousands of dollars per month. to work with jod LifeStar itself has its. own controversies it's known for being a. network of LDS therapists and some have. said if you go to LifeStar and you've. ever seen like a naked body depicted on. any sort of media God forbid that you've. ever watched explicit videos you're an. addict and you're going to need to enter. a lengthy 12-step program many.

therapists in the network also believe. that if you ever self-pleasure you are. technically cheating on your partner and. this is a grave instance of infidelity. and you need to join a support group. there have also been accusations against. LifeStar that they will if you have. health insurance they will diagnose you. with an actual dsm5 recognized diagnosis. because Point addiction is not one I. know that a lot of people do struggle. with it but point addiction is. technically not one so they'll diagnose.

you with other things in the dsm5 so. that your insurance will pay for it. allegedly that is the accusation that. has been levied upon them multiple times. by internet users which side note I. think it's fine if someone believes it's. not in their beliefs to take part in. self-pleasure or consumption of explicit. materials I think we should respect. everybody's Choice especially um well. only if they're adults right but to. actively go around shaming everyone. condemning them to the deepest darkest. depths of hell for doing it I I think.

causes more harm and for Adam it was. kind of like that there was this. NeverEnding idea that self-pleasure is. one of the greatest evils in the world. like right up there with. murder he says you know there was a lot. of guilt and shame behind. self-pleasuring and explicit material in. the church I mean I had a lot of guilt. and shame as a kid growing up I. discovered self-pleasuring a few weeks. before I met Brad and just on my own. quietly from then on I just always. believed that God had sent this pedo.

into my life to punish me because I was. sick so like that's how ingrained and. how damaging it is that it made him. believe that he deserved to be a victim. of essay as punishment and now he's. recommended by the church to jod and. she's telling him that he was never. abused that he's the addict here the bad. one and now he has to show up to court. to refute accusations against him about. the whole bathtub incident he thinks the. whole thing is crazy I mean Mary walked. in with lere he wanted her to put the. baby to sleep so that they can have.

consensual adult time and she accuses. him of CSA of his own child he is a. victim of CSA he walks into court and. the worst conflict of interest is. sitting right there right next to Mary. there's jod hilderbrand the therapist. but also Elder halam the higher up in. the LDS church that when Adam was 14 he. tried to allegedly shut Adam up for the. abuse that he suffered. then later he tried to prevent Adam from.

marrying Mary he's just sitting right. there right next to jod hilderbrandt. which you know what with all disrespect. we hate Elder halam and unfortunately if. you want to send him a non-threatening. but scathing message of of how his soul. will burn in the depths of Hell For the. Rest of Eternity he's dead fortunately. he's probably there burning why is he. there they just all kind of linked up. and exactly Adam is facing four felony. charges each is a third degree for.

violation of a protective order domestic. violence enhancement and Adam States. these are all the lies he has to now. spend. $250,000 go through all this trauma. fighting all these allegations just to. plead guilty to an attempt to break a. protective order which is a misdemeanor. he had to pay a fine no jail time he did. spend like a few days in jail because. they briefly arrested him right when he. broke the protective order but he. technically pled guilty which means. everyone in Utah and the church being. said he's this crazy abuser that was. never abused as a kid just creating.

chaos wherever he goes but later they. will find evidence that some really dark. things were happening between Mary and. Jodie they allegedly found evidence that. they were trying to manufacture evidence. on Mary and Adam's child to accuse Adam. of essay so remember the incident in the. bathroom they were trying to enhance. that with evidence allegedly what did. they find like text messages um. obviously these are not available to the. public just descriptions of it make it. seem like there is evidence that shows.

Jodie and Mary trying to get the. daughter to pose in a way and to say. like Daddy did this to me training her. if you will. allegedly Mary and her attorneys use. Adam's psych evaluation that showed how. bad the abuse he endured in childhood. was they use those documents to now and. try and take his children away from him. so as side note they also just go around. showing his documents to everyone just.

with extensive details of the trauma he. endured just letting everyone read it. like it's book club and Adam says the. worst part is they used it against him. to say that he's not fit to be a dad he. says think about it a victim comes. forward tells the truth about the hell. and the trauma maybe he's a decent. person but this is really traumatic and. they use it to punish me try and take. the kids away he says they kept arguing. that because I was a victim of sexual. abuse I wasn't able to be a safe parent. they Twisted it into something heinous. to just stab him with now an additional.

side note Mary at one point accuses Adam. of being gay which in itself is. obviously not offensive but Adam has. essay Trauma from when he was a child. and it's likely that he has a very. complicated relationship or did have a. complicated relationship with his. sexuality because he was abused by a. monster who happened to be male and. being from a faith that typically. condemns gay relationships it's likely. further complicated things for Adam as a. victim there was just no bar too low no. bar in hell too low for jod and Adam's.

now ex-wife Mary to just Target Adam. emails between jod and Mary were. uncovered in Adam's fight to exonerate. himself from the accusations so the two. Mary and her therapist jod are writing. to each other about the contract that. Mar is going to give Adam they're going. back and forth of like oh you should say. we're living together but technically. separate this is crazy mhm Mary emails. jod I wrote up this contract yesterday. afternoon after our meeting it's still. work in progress I'm open for any. suggestions thanks Jody responds this.

looks good the more specific you can be. the better but this looks good as a. starting point I will share this with. him this evening if you would like they. later add stipulations that Adam cannot. withhold funds from his wife and that he. is not allowed to see any other. therapist outside of. jod a squirrel might seem like an. unlikely Financial role model but. consider this they bury thousands of nut. and seeds every single year and the ones. that I forgotten about they grow into.

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now side notes since we're here [ __ ] the. honor code at BYU I'm sorry I'm not. sorry Adam had a few friends targeted by. the BYU Honor Code office just because. they were friends with Adam allegedly. one female friend was called in because. Mary reported her for adultery with Adam. since their divorce had not finalized. yet she was asked about extensive okay. so this female friend of Adams is also a. surviv of CSA MH the honor Cod office. asked her for hours grilled her about.

the essay that happened to her during. her. childhood we don't even know how they. knew about it she never told the Honor. Code office that so maybe they got. church records Church Files about it. which is crazy she was interrogated over. her past trauma then she was accused of. having an adulterous affair with Adam to. which she adamantly denied what they. called in Mary Adam's wife and she. confirms no I know they're they're. adulterers okay they're having an affair. to which point the Honor Code office is. trying to ask like do you know what. adultery is right like it's when people.

do it like they're having physical. relationships Mary just responds oh well. then maybe they didn't have an affair. maybe it was just spiritual and. emotional the next friend targeted by. the Honor Code office is Seth one of. Adam's best friends now by this point it. feels like anyone who is friendly with. Adam is going to suffer to truly to try. and alienate him is what I think Adam. was sharing custody over the kids not. legally but I think it was more so. agreed upon and Seth came with him to. see Mary Mary grabs allegedly a giant.

shell the size of a cinder block and. throws it at Adam he quickly Dodges. because he's holding their baby in his. arms and Seth wrote a statement about it. to the Honor Code office saying hey. you're how everyone is reporting Adam. well guess what Mary just tried to kill. him maybe not that dramatically but you. get the point they turn around and the. honor code starts question questioning. him if he's a sex addict also Seth is a.

chef he cooks with wine sometimes as one. does they accused him of hiding an. alcohol problem and being addicted to. they told Seth if he keeps hanging. around Adam they will kick him out of. the. University they go after like five of. Adam's friends for again the sole reason. that Adam is around them and also at one. point the BYU police sent by the honor. Cod office came and grilled interrogated. Adam for about 2 hours asking incredibly. intense questions about the abuse he. suffered when he was 14 what does that. have to do with anything but it was.

traumatizing he said I felt so filthy. and gross after that it seems like the. Honor Code office did not realize that. Adam could subpoena their records which. he does Adam says he will never forget. the day that he was accused of essay of. his own child he says how I couldn't. even breathe I mean I had a panic attack. in the parking lot afterwards so there's. a clear conflict of interest everywhere. here he subpoena is the BYU Honor Code. files on him which jod clearly breaks.

patient confidentiality by talking to. them about Adam but not only that she. has nothing to back up any accusations. suspicions or statements that she has. uttered about Adam he subpoenas her. therapy case notes and the case notes. about Adam whom jod hilderbrandt has. reported for being this sexual predator. one of the most dangerous people that. she's ever met that he's are wording not. only his wife but his one-year-old. daughter he's so sick and twisted and so. great at manipulation that he is an. active danger to the public you would.

think jod has two novel length spiral. notebooks on him detailing his sick. perversions but when he gets her notes. it's like this long it's one page not. even Adam is in here for marriage. counseling has some issues that he wants. to work on AKA staring 20 seconds too. long at a picture of an unclothed woman. on the internet that's about it so these. are be being used in court yeah cuz he's. like I mean this is not a good therapist. like she this is crazy she's leving all.

these accusations against me and these. are her notes on me like I've told her. nothing she wasn't even Adam's personal. therapist he was part of group sessions. but he never really sat with her. one-onone wow so he's like suddenly. you're just coming out accusing me of. like the world's most heinous crimes out. of the gate for no reason at all there. are also logs of emails between jod and. Mary where they collude on how to take. Adam down allegedly there are emails of. jod coaching Mary on how to talk to.

authorities to make Adam look worse it's. not even just like say this but she's. all present things as an inquiry not an. anger when you present things to. authorities she's coaching her on her. tone her delivery she writes give the. authorities the right thinking because. they're not going to come up with those. thoughts themselves it's difficult when. you begin to see what is really going on. to be patient with those who don't be. direct and act inquisitive not angry or. defensive make them think that they came.

up with the idea. themselves Mary would email back those. suckers they totally fell for. It ultimately Adam would not get custody. of his kids although he's in their lives. now neens theorize it's mainly because. Mary and jod are no longer in each. other's lives and Mary allegedly wants. to focus on dating rather than her kids. so it's just better for Adam to take. care of the kids I guess allegedly from. her perspective so he is in the kids. lives but he doesn't have custody as of.

right now he was also placed in jail for. 7 days for breaking that restraining. order he was kicked out of University he. was hundreds of thousands of dollars in. debt from legal fees his reputation has. been ruined he has much more extensive. PTSD than before before his entire life. was derailed by jod hilderbrand I mean. the magnitude of courage and empathy. that Adam has is pretty a inspiring even. when talking about this incident on the. S taken down podcast by Mormon stories. he never really blames his wife he.

expresses a lot of pain and betrayal. from her but he actually shows a lot of. understanding for her he believes that. jod told his wife about all these. unhinged deviant crimes that Adam was. allegedly committing which he wasn't. which Adam has denied all of them to his. wife but she just thought he was lying. Adam says jod would just have everybody. just chopping off all the arms of. support in their life until there was no. one left to support you except for jod H. debrand Adam says jod H debrandt is like.

Ted Bundy she is completely pathological. and that lady is going straight to. Hell he's not suing jod or going after. her no he he hopefully he will but he. thought about going after BYU they. admitted him back into the school but he. didn't have time or money to hire. babysitters or time for anything at that. point he was also too traumatized to go. back to BYU he thought about suing BYU.

he asked how would the settlement be. paid he also attorney he asked the. assistant dean of BYU I believe and she. said it would be paid using T. tis which is uh offerings from the. church and those are supposed to be used. to help people that need it and he said. then he didn't want to. sue so he says Jody is going Straight to. Hell and there's a Road to Hell actually. it's called hell hole Pass road yeah.

hellhole Pass Road that's the road name. it's dry it's hot it's like hell the. road runs through the Beaver Dam. mountains on both sides of the road you. just see mountains dry red rock. mountains and desert scrub bushes the. road is gravel it's completely uneven. and there's usually not a lot of cars. going up and down the road I mean one. does not choose to drive up and down. hellhole Road for fun. except for jod H prand she likes to. bring her niece to hellhole Pass Road.

her 14-year-old niece and make them run. up and down run up and down the road. until I tell you to stop I don't care. that it's 100° in Utah you have no shade. no water just run run for your sins or. you'll go to. hell licensed therapist jod hilderbrand. has taken on the courageous task of. helping her 14-year-old niece Jesse who. goes by they them pronounce by the way. this is before Adam Paul Steed they were. also interviewed by Mormon stories how.

old is jod at the time she was much. younger not jod the niece n oh they were. 14 when they first got taken in by Jody. what about today today they're probably. fully adults right okay now jod is. itching for a big project and Jesse is. her biggest one yet Jesse is probably. one of the biggest Sinners that jod has. ever laid eyes on what is the grave sin. that they committed being to Mormon. Jesse now adult tells Mormon stories. podcast during an interview C I was very.

I've always been a very curious person. and always um I think very challenging. in that way so both of their parents are. super religious in the LDS faith and. obviously very well connected Jodie is. Jesse hilderbrand's Aunt Jesse's father. is Jody's brother who also happens to be. an attorney so Jesse's father is jod. hilderbrand's brother and Jesse's father. is an attorney they say that they had a. very typical strict conservative LDS.

faith-filled upbringing they say this is. a talking about Jesse's mom my mom is. very docile sweet obedient very. efficient housewife I mean everything. was always very clean and very organized. and very efficient I think I was kind of. a wrecking ball to them always asking. why about everything no answer was good. enough and it wasn't coming from a place. of disrespect it was genuinely I didn't. understand and I was very curious about. things and in Jesse's mind this is true. the LDS faith is true The Book of Mormon.

is true their entire family are devout. LDS church members their logic is true. and they're thinking I just need to find. all of the supporting evidence to back. it up now I know a few people like that. as well like they grew up in super. religious you can't watch Marvel movies. because they're not rooted in faith and. they're just certain people that grow up. like that but still want to know but why. it's not that they're trying to be mean. it's it's not that they're like I don't. believe in this it's just they want to. know why for everything I feel like.

you're kind of like that you always ask. why for a lot of things and it's not. that they're challenging anything their. brain just functions in a way where they. want to know the reasoning behind every. single thing that's done every tradition. there must be a reason for it so Jesse. says asking questions especially maybe. higher esoteric unanswerable questions. or questions that point out skeletons. why weren't black people allowed to have. priesthood why weren't they allowed to. be at the church for the longest time. what about sexism what about race those.

types of questions you don't ask you. don't talk about it so this podcast also. are they dedicated to are they Mormon. stories um I believe the host I don't. think they're ex Mormons I think they've. been excommunicated but still hold a. degree of faith I think that they just. don't like the established religious. aspect so they um they interview a lot. of EX Mormons or current Mormons and. talk about their experience with maybe.

things that have been happening in the. church that you're not technically. supposed to talk about I see yeah. they're a great resource I think now. it's not like Jesse is challenging their. parents for the sake of trying to prove. them wrong or rebelling against the. religion in a snarky teenager kind of. way Jesse says by the time I was 16 I. had read the book of Mormon six times I. believed it so in my head this is true. my logic was just backwards I started. with the belie. or I was like okay this is true so I. will find the evidence to support it.

instead of following the evidence to the. eventual truth but also I was a total. nerd and then you know the ADHD you know. they say that they have ADHD and they. say this was a hyperfixation and then. the layer of wanting familial acceptance. It's very powerful I was emotional I was. strong willed I questioned everything. and neither one of my parents I think. knew what to do with that they were not. prepared because of the culture of the. church Jesse also likes to experiment. with their clothes and makeup which. makes everyone in their family freak out. like as if they had just brought home a. two-headed seal and said this is my new.

best friend yeah Jesse gets ambushed at. a family gathering they're all gathered. at Jesse's grandparents home so this is. Jody's parents' home MH and jod happens. to be there because jod is Jesse's Aunt. this is Jesse's father's father's home. when everyone leaves including Jesse's. parents Jesse didn't even know that. their parents had left Jesse was down in. the basement they just left them yeah. it's just Jodie and their. grandparents it was jod and my.

grandparents telling me that my family. had left and I wasn't going with them. and that my life was about to change. pretty. dramatically um I still remember that. moment as just it's completely. galvanized itself onto into onto my soul. it was a you know in movies when they do. the like they zoom in and pull out at. the same time it was like that's that. really wild kind of effect that's how it.

felt and. um yeah everything everything changed in. that moment and they sit them down and. explain that their life is going to. change Forever Jesse will not be going. home Jesse will be going with Jodie and. jod is going to fix. them because Jesse asked too many. questions that they can't answer yes and. Jesse like. to wear strong eyeliner and not super. feminine modest clothing and how do they.

fix Jesse by making them sleep out on. the balcony in the middle of winter this. is January in Utah nighttime. temperatures are anywhere between 8 to. 30° sometimes it can be in the rural. areas dropped to 0 de all Jesse would. get to sleep on the balcony every single. night would be this flimsy $5 sleeping. bag from Walmart the risk of hypothermia. is significant but jod does not care she. even lies to Jesse's parents telling. them that Jesse was given this high-end. Subzero type of sleeping bag this just.

feels extreme why are we putting a. 14-year-old through this jod would tell. Jesse that this is the start of getting. Jesse to confess to their sins and. addictions jod is saying Jesse you are. in. denial you have not come to terms with. how evil you are yet Jesse has ADHD and. at the time when they were 14 it was. undiagnosed jod would sit there watching. Jesse if Jesse moves their hand back and. forth or if they tap their feet Jody.

would snap look at you look at you. you're tapping your foot because your. body is so full of Shame so much shame. is in there and it has nowhere to go in. that little body so it comes out like. this by you tapping your foot this is. all the shame just itching to leave like. I said if you are angry if you are. depressed if you are anything it's all a. result of Shame Shame is the cause shame. is the result of Sin Sin causes Shame. Shame causes mental health issues your. body and spirit are full of Shame what I.

doing for you is to make you physically. so uncomfortable that it forces the sin. out just remember a lot of this verbiage. because it comes up in the next episode. this comes up when jod is torturing Ruby. Frankie's kids I have to make you so. physically uncomfortable that it forces. the sin out eventually jod moves Jesse. in from sleeping out on the snow on the. balcony to this little bunker of a room. in the closet in Jody's office maybe. it's a little bigger than a closet but. no windows it just has like a table and.

chair shoved inside and there to sleep. on the floor this is going to be Jesse's. life from now on the how long is was. that already like oh I think they were. with jod for. years wow they tried running away. multiple times it wasn't until the third. time that they were able to successfully. break away and even then there were. instances where they were brought in by. family members to do these events and. jod would be there and they would be. terrified like they were terrified that. this would be another way to facilitate.

them going back with. jod what's Jesse's emotion towards this. whole incident so much trauma I mean. the they're very eloquent in the. interview with Mormon stories they're. able to articulate exactly what they. felt in the moment that makes you feel. like you were there with them but at the. same time it's pretty clear that they're. still working through a lot of the. trauma and not in like a they're. breaking down which that would not be. like a shameful thing or anything like.

that but in the sense of they state that. over and over like it has impacted every. aspect of their lives so this is going. to be Jesse's life from now on that's. just the inside of this room jod tells. Jesse along the lines of you're no. longer going to school you're not going. home to your parents as your therapist. it is my duty to fix you you're going to. live and work here full-time but the. first rule rule number one you are not. allowed to leave the this room all you. can do every single day is write your. sins out on a piece of paper and every.

day you will tell me what you have. written because I need to get the sin. out of you Jesse doesn't even know what. other sins to come clean about Jesse has. told jod a few things the reasons for. them being taken to jod one of them. included that they had kissed a girl. before which is like a huge thing I. guess so it's not like Jesse is UN. cooperating which even then this is sick. and cruel Jesse just doesn't know what. else to write down so Jesse is sitting. there trying to think and they're trying. to think back to every single Living.

Action that they have ever done in their. entire lives I mean maybe once while. drinking from a public water fountain. they accidentally pressed 2 seconds too. long like they're thinking that hard. like is there anything that I've done. that I'm preventing the evil from coming. out of my body just see sitting there. writing down one time I lied to my best. friend Scotty like just the stupidest. things these are the types of things and. at the end of the day jod walks in. snatches the paper out of their hands. reads it out loud and makes Jesse get on. their hands and knees beg beg for.

forgiveness while I read all of your. sins back to you when she's done reading. the piece of paper out loud she looks at. Jesse who is still on their knees no. that's not it this isn't it there is. more and I need to know there's more I. know you've had multiple. OBS Jesse did not Jesse did not Jesse. would even say later in the interview. I'm I mean Jodie would rationalize and. validate these types of behaviors. through dreams and Visions like she.

would have dreams that God came to her. and told her that I had abortions and so. no matter what I said I was a liar she. was convinced that every word that came. out of my mouth was a lie that gave her. rationale to put duct tape on my mouth. that's why I was always duct taped. everywhere Jesse went she had duct tape. on her mouth because every word I said. was a. lie that's crazy which is like the most. unhinged accusation so first of all. Jesse has never had intimate relations. that could result in pregnancy at that.

age they didn't even really know or. understand how it works also Jesse likes. girls and that's what Jesse told Jody so. Jesse's like how would I what are you. talking about I mean they've known for a. while now there's just no way that they. got pregnant let alone terminated. multiple pregnancies also jod accuses. Jesse of terminating like I think it was. like 14 pregnancies it was a lot it was. just a lot even though jod knows that. Jesse is gay Jesse says I was struggling. with my relationship with my father I. was struggling with self-hatred I knew I.

was gay I knew I was queer that was a. huge part of my internalized shame. eventually Jesse learns that the only. way to even get jod to calm down is to. just make up things and this is going to. become really important in part four the. final part of this episode because Ruby. starts accusing her own children of. doing some heinous. things Jodie forces you to just make up. sins. like the craziest sin that you can think. of you have to say it out loud or else.

she's probably going to torture you it's. like no matter what they did jod just. wanted Jesse to be the devil there was. no way around it you could not prove. that Jesse was not the devil to jod they. say Jody was convinced that I was a drug. addict that I was a sex addict she was. convinced that I had multiple. terminations she was convinced of so. many beliefs never allowed privacy I was. never allowed privacy when using the. bathroom I had 7 minutes to shower 2. minutes to use the toilet with the door. open I wasn't allowed tampons because. she was convinced that I was an addict. and I was self-pleasuring with them I.

was never allowed to have the bathroom. door closed because she was convinced. that I was constantly self-pleasuring in. there she was convinced that I was. addicted to explicit material I mean I. never seen po at that point in my life I. didn't even know that people with my. anatomy could. self-pleasure this is Jody's manual on. complete destruction of a human being. how to take a human and break them in. every aspect physical mental. emotional the physical is likely the. easier part for Jesse and that's saying.

a lot because it's just torture plain. and simple jod would make Jesse run up. and down hellhole Pass road for hours. the concept being quote for the reason. of making me so physically uncomfortable. that I would confess to sins I mean if. you also made me run up and down a road. for hours in the sweltering heat I would. confess to anything I'd be like okay I. just need a cup of water you're right I. have reincarnated did as the spawn of. Satan I would say whatever you wanted me. to say there was one time Jesse says.

that they finally stood up and said no. I'm not doing that Jesse says that was. the day that I walked away and I was. like No And I turned around and she. punched me in the back and knocked me. down and jod she's not tall but she's. sturdy she's a Powerhouse of a woman. very strong then she ended up going. inside I stayed outside I went to a. neighbor's house the neighbor didn't. know what to do jod found me came and. again the neighbor was like I don't want. to tell her but I have to because you're. a my and she has power of attorney she's. your guardian and I can't lie to her. that's how Jesse gets sent.

back mentally it's confusing though. Jesse says they ran away three times. only to end right back up at Jody's. house and the punishment for running. away would be to be blindfolded tied up. by their arms and legs roughly thrown. into the back of a car Jesse had no clue. where they were being taken they're. driving for like an hour before finally. they hear the car shut off they're in. the. mountains Jesse will be forced run up. and down the mountains as repentance for. running away the worst part is it gets. to the point where the torture and the.

life is so bad that once they're done. running up and down the mountain jod. would start showering Jesse with praise. I knew you could do it I knew you could. repent and my niece is still in there. Jesse says after attempting to run away. three times hating life wanting to be in. jail rather than with Jodie but once. they hear that little bit of Praise. mentally your brain is so starved so Des. desperate it gives you a high like you. want to work harder for praise from.

Jodie they say in the other part that. type of abuse that I don't think is. talked about as much is that 90% of the. time you're evil and horrible and wrong. and the abuse is almost unbearable but. then there are moments where you're. rewarded and you're now the best thing. in the world and so after these 6 hours. of running up and down the mountain the. reward that jod gave me of acceptance of. you did it you did the thing it creates. this cycle which I think is already the. foundation and the prerequisites of this. is instilled in the Mormon Church of.

having to earn. love but that has affected my my life. forever for the rest of my life. of if I try a little harder if I do a. little bit more maybe they'll love me. maybe they'll accept me maybe they'll. whatever um in this case it was really. extreme where the abuse was so extreme. but then if you if you would bear it. then you would get these moments of of.

immense reward from her and it's just. such a. psychological. [ __ ] and the I mean I was I was. scared of myself people were scared of. me my family I mean. so it's like this very sick cycle of. abuse but emotionally Jesse says they.

thought about jumping from the balcony. to break their legs because they felt. like that would be less painful than the. torture even going to jail if they're so. bad just call the police they would ask. jod just like let them arrest me please. if I'm that bad let them arrest me Jesse. says I would rather be in jail and the. isolation was the worst part jod would. tell everyone that Jesse is a nightmare. a terrifying nightmare jod told family. members the reason that she has Jesse. sleep on the balcony is because quote. I'm scared I'm scared Jesse is going to. murder me in my sleep you don't know.

she's going around saying you don't know. what I'm dealing with I have to do this. with for my own protection the worst. part is Jesse believed. it they believed maybe she's right maybe. I just don't see it cuz I'm young and. I'm not connected to God I guess but. like why am I so evil why is everyone so. scared of me what about Jesse's parents. believed it that they're evil Jesse does. Jesse have resentment towards the. parents or yes I believe right now Jesse.

is no longer in communication with their. parents um I think even some of their. siblings had reactions of like Get over. yourself when Jesse spoke about the. trauma that happened when they were with. Jody Jesse says again I believed all of. this I trusted these people I trusted. the church the isolation got really bad. it's like jod is just practicing on. Jesse before she evolves into trying to. throw Adam Paul Steed into prison to. isolate him Jesse constantly had duct.

tape on their mouth and they were told. because you're a liar every single word. you say is a lie you need to be. physically reminded that everything you. say is a lie sometimes jod would make. them go to family functions with duct. tape on their mouth so people are seeing. this Jesse says everyone around me my. cousins my parents everyone was. terrified of me I wasn't allowed to. speak to anyone I wasn't allowed to. speak to my parents which it's not even. the fact that they had duct tape on. their mouths and can't physically talk. it's the fact that nobody thought this. was.

crazy and I'm sure if if you have duct. tape on your mouth and your family. members are acting scared of you it. almost makes you feel like some sort of. animal yeah it doesn't make you feel. human anymore it's so bizarre I mean it. gets to the point where jod is convinced. that Jesse is contagious rubbing off. evil onto everyone around them if Jesse. is in the kitchen because jod is making. them do something for her if Jody's kids. jod has two kids Jodie's got two kids oh. yeah they're no longer on speaking terms. with her they're adults by the time that.

she gets arrested but more on that later. but if they go into the room these are. Jesse's own cousins if they want to use. the kitchen they would have to report to. their mother that Jesse is in the. kitchen and then jod screams at Jesse to. get the hell out of the kitchen and. Jesse would be forced to stand on the. perimeter of the kitchen with duct tape. on their mouth just waiting for them to. be. done jod would stare at them and say see. no one loves you you're a manipulator. and you destroy people's lives.

constantly you destroyed your parents. lives you're destroying your own life. and you're trying to destroy mine for. trying to help you jod would tell Jesse. no one actually cares about you and you. just manipulate them into caring nobody. believed Jesse not even their own. parents Jesse says she destroyed my. credibility I mean I was an angry. teenager and now she made me into this. emotional angry teenager that she had. told people that I destroyed my family's. life that I destroyed my Dad's life and.

that every person I come in contact with. I destroy so she sets up the premise and. then when I come forward and I try to. tell people what's happening what she's. doing to me she can be like oh see. Jesse's trying to destroy my life that's. what they do it's all just it adds up so. she's so good at protecting these. loopholes and discrediting. people eventually Jesse manages to run. away without getting caught they go. straight to the police station where. they lie about their age and get taken. to a shelter for those without homes. they say that was rough too it was. traumatizing but it was still better.

than being with. jod now a big question everybody has. though is why the hell is jod. hilderbrand so goddamn angry like it. doesn't make sense why is she so upset. with every why is she so angry why is. she such a vile person maybe this Jesse. remembers one very interesting. conversation they had with Jodie because. Jodie makes it her entire life mission. to make sure that Jesse is not gay. but they State she did say something to. me when I was living with her that was. very strange because I've known I was.

queer since I was seven and I was. experimenting with girls and friends. since I was seven or eight she knew. about it and that it was very bad it was. very very evil but then she said. something to me she had this friend her. name's Bev she said something to the. effect of yes being gay is evil and. pleasures of the Flesh and yada yada but. if I were to have relationships with my. friends if we were to it would be. different because there's a deep emot. connection there and that's different we. were sitting in someone's living room. and she said this and I was just like.

what yeah that's called being gay like. what do you think gay relationships are. like they have deep emotional. connections Jesse was taken back by. Jody's comment of saying that oh if I. were to have a relation with another. woman it's fine it's because we have. this connection yes and Jesse is like. that's literally called being gay so. Jesse believes that jod is gay as well. yes now there's a lot of quizzes online. with names like am I gay quiz they're. all like fun goofy they ask what's your.

favorite Beyonce song what you order at. the bar it's goofy it's playful don't. take it too seriously but to therapist. jod hilderbrand it's not funny it's not. funny this is not cute as the world's. worst life coach jod will give advice to. viewers who submit their life worries to. Jodie in one particular clip she's. responding to a viewer who states that. she's going through her 13-year-old. daughter's phone comes across her search. history where she's talking about taking. a quiz it's called the Mi gay quiz jod.

explains there is no such thing as Mi. gay and so because we all have the gift. of choice there is no such thing as am I. gay because. that takes Choice away it says I am. something period the end like I didn't. have choice in it it just is and so that. on its face is a lie it's not the truth. it's a distortion. so here's the core principle that this. mom needs to understand so mom the truth.

is is that your daughter is a daughter. of God period the M she's not um I am. bad or I am fat or I am um unloved or I. am gay all those things are lies all of. them which is like the collection of. words she uses there is also unhinged. all these things are lies all of them. it's a choice I know that people get. crucified when you say that to the world. but that is the truth being gay is a.

choice it's about protecting her you are. a mother your job is to protect your. young if there was a lion coming at your. young you would stand in between and you. put the baby behind you and you would. defend that child with everything you. have well that's what's coming at you it. is worse than a lion it is here to Snuff. out the life of your child and kill her. spiritually what is being gay so. lesbians you heard it here first your. aura is stronger than a. lion yeah jod continues I heard a song.

the other day called we'll convert your. children we'll convert your children and. it was a song about. homosexuality and how they're coming for. your children it was the most evil thing. I've heard which side note the entire. song is tongue and cheek they're talking. they're singing about converting your. children that phrase because it has. always been and still to this day is. used against the lgbtq community the. only people that I've seen take that. song Seriously are both homophobic and.

DSE up here that's it in another video. jod sarcastically says. lgbtq and I think there's an I now plus. plus okay it's another of these. movements that are going on in our world. that is divisive I mean I work with. three people every day and not every day. but probably once a week somebody says a. word like cisgender was the last word I. learned like what in the heck is that. it's just a madeup word that someone.

plays meaning on because of what. happened with Adam Paul Steed jod. actually does get her therapy license. suspended briefly that's the only. negative thing that comes out to what. she's done to Adam ruin his life. completely shatter and disassemble his. entire family and ret traumatize him she. just gets her therapy license suspended. on probation for like 18 months so she. starts this New Life as a life coaching. business everything gets more extreme in.

her beliefs the coaching business is. called connections and she preaches. about living in truth and it's it's a. lot more extreme than when she was a. therapist because when you're in therapy. you are still governed by certain. guidelines but as a life coach there's. no governance oh so she got suspended. and now she's a life coach which a. counselor she can do whatever the hell. she wants though they call themselves. mental fitness trainers they say like. how you would need a fitness trainer for. your body your physical body you need.

one for your mental state and it's all. about living in the truth with a capital. T living in truth and not Distortion. means having impeccable honesty rigorous. personal responsibility and humility. which I mean those are like really vague. words I feel like you could apply that. to anything yeah whereas living in. Distortion means you are addicted to. something that something could be as. serious as drug drugs and alcohol but it. could also be Hobbies entertainment. receiving compliments you could be. addicted to that you could be addicted.

to mirrors you could be addicted to. driving driving going on drives I don't. know. if I don't know where that came from you. are also living in Distortion when you. know that you are not enough which by. the way jod hilderbrand has a memoir. that she titled you are not not enough. and everyone's like I keep reading it as. you are not enough which like yes Jody. you are not. they also say that you are living in. Distortion when you are living in lust. which includes being sex attracted to.

your own. spouse that's living and lost so these. principles get built upon through the. years and they actually do get worse as. they develop if jod was not against. drugs I would think that she developed. her ideas while super high on some. random couch and elbow deep into a. Pringles can because her ideas of Truth. and Distortion these cannot be sober. thoughts I'm like doesn't even make. sense we can only assume that the idea. of formulating a coherent thought is too.

big of an obstacle course for jod. because it doesn't make sense the. principles are truth is always loving. Distortion is never loving control is. never loving so remember if you really. want to love someone you'll reflect. truth to them if you love someone you. can be yourself around them and you. don't have to tiptoe around what you're. saying when you love someone you hold. boundaries with them and your boundaries. won't offend them anyone who is offended. by a boundary is in Distortion anyone. who's offended by a boundary is someone. who is being selfish and wants what they. want so with these principles of honest.

responsible and humble you will have. calmness permission peace and a. willingness to hold boundaries for you. and your child who needs a labotomy when. you have jod hilderbrand's great. teachings I think fortune cookies make. more sense and are less big than her. so-called teachings she would also hit. couples with the Jesus said having the. thought is the same as actually doing it. so if you think about your hot coworker. you actually did your hot coworker. one therapist who was training under jod. says she was excellent in exploiting.

Mormon anxiety being pure being sinless. being perfect but connections was more. than just therapy it was a whole. community that she created a whole. platform of people drinking her Kool-Aid. it was like a church within a church and. jod was the prophet that person also. didn't like the way that jod would treat. clients entirely differently according. to their status he says a client would. come in who was wellknown and had a lot. of money and she would say to me we. really got to take care of this one and. I thought that's odd so this was when. jod was a therapist and he would say.

like we're therapists we're trained not. to care about if that person has money I. think she was just salivating she was. salivating about money and power like. that excited her what can I do with a. client with a lot of money influence and. a lot of power jod was a businesswoman I. mean she really has a lot of addictions. huh yeah yeah she knew how to hit on a. pain point and the biggest pain point. for people in order to turn a profit. Jesse says this is the crazy thinking. about it now but I used to do her. billing so Jesse is Jody's niece.

remember and they say I used to do her. billing she would force me to do it like. free labor Jody's billing for the. therapy session Jesse says I did her. billing and she bills the LDS church so. every client essentially I would say the. vast majority of her clients were from. Bishop recommendations just based off. the billing that I would do so the host. of Mormon stories mentions in the Mormon. church if somebody can't afford a. therapist sometimes tithes and offerings. might be used by the bishop who. recommends his Ward members to jod he.

will then foot the bill from the church. offerings pay Jodie she's making money. off the church allegedly right but they. pay the bill now here's the problem with. that one Jodie is gaining a lot of. wealth and success from the church. itself and two a lot of victims have. come forward to state that another. Insidious way that jod ruins people's. lives is once your Bishop pays for your. therapy they are entitled to All Therapy. notes what like there's no such thing.

like you usually have to sign things. that say my Bishop can also know what I. talk about in therapy so it's this jod. will alienate you from your Bishop. accuse you of doing some heinous things. allegedly is the allegation against jod. I mean multiple allegations against jod. even when Jesse's physical state started. changing because of the physical torture. that their aunt was putting them through. I mean a lot of people at the church. could see them in this mental and. emotional anguish people start going to. the bishop about them and the bishop. then turns to jod gives jod a full.

rundown like these are what people are. saying about Jesse Jesse says Bishop. went to jod told her gave her the names. of the people what they said the reason. why these people thought anything was. wrong with me and according to jod it. was because I was emotionally. manipulating them into thinking that. that I would go to church wear a long. face and manipulate them into feeling. sorry for me jod would facilitate. meetings with the bishop and with Jesse. to tell them no tell them Jesse nothing.

is wrong right Jody's great which is. already highly unethical okay side note. already unethical if you are a therapist. every single therapist at least the ones. that should be licensed anyway they say. if their family member a niece a cousin. a cousin five times removed doesn't. matter they would never be their. therapist they would recommend someone. that's it you do not become the. therapist for your niece and not only. that but you don't have them move in. with you and since you know jod is in. competition for the worst person alive.

and just bring the gold home jod would. facilitate meetings with herself Jesse. and Jesse's bishop and the church leader. the bishop would tell Jesse you're like. a. horse you got to be broken in Jesse says. we drove to all the people's homes all. the church members that were concerned. for me and jod sat me in the car she. told me exactly what I was going to tell. these people and I would go in and. apologize to them for manipulating them. into thinking that jod was doing. something wrong to me when she was. actually saving My. Life Jesse says also Jody hates men she.

hates men she thinks all men are pretty. much vast majority of men are evil. including church leaders she thought. church leaders were idiots and she had. the answer and that she understood it. she thought she was fighting tooth and. nail on the front lines of Satan but. somehow there are still people that. believe jod is the all- knowing Oracle. to the truth one review reads Jody's. one-on-one calls and the group classes. have been life-changing for our family.

years of false beliefs were surfaced in. weeks what years of therapy failed to do. I will say anyone who believes Jody's. tactics are questionable are simply not. ready to take responsibility for their. choices five stars for jod hilderbrand. review left by Ruby. Frankie 18-year-old Ruby is not looking. for a degree which seems counter into. intive because she is a student at Utah. State University but where else are you. supposed to find the love of your life. who is going to be athletic handsome.

smell good comfortable to talk to. well-groomed not skinny 5 Ines taller. than Ruby doesn't have anger issues is. not Snappy is not snoody is good with. music and teaching whereas khakis in. colar shirts Eagle Scout is good with. siblings likes yard work prays daily. reads Scriptures Daily wants six kids. willing to help kids with homework and. is crazy about me that is her list of. what she's looking for in her future. husband and she's looking right now 18. years old in college looking for a. husband how how do we know that her she.

oh her prequisites she has a whole graph. of it labeled and detailed on a poster. board that's hung in the back of her. closet when she starts dating she's. going to go in and start writing the. boys names across and then coloring in. the boxes so if you're 5 in taller. she'll color in that box and then at the. end she's going to see who has the most. colored boxes and and that's her future. husband what yeah she's like efficient. with her dating that is crazy mhm yeah.

the boy that she's going to marry is. going to check off the most and one of. the contenders is Kevin Frankie it's not. the most romantic meeting but that's. fine she did not write love at first. sight type of Romance movie meeting on. her chart Ruby and Kevin Frankie they. bump into each other at a hot dog stand. on campus and instantly he's a good. Contender he's laidback Ruby likes that. she wants someone to join her in life. not run her life not lead her in life.

she wants to she wants to drive the car. which also side note a lot of nzen have. been asking eight passengers then who is. driving and then a lot of netz comment. jod interestingly Kevin is just as. interested in Ruby as she is in him. maybe more so he was heartbroken when he. realized that while watching a movie. with Ruby under the blanket he was. holding her hand oh when he looks under. there is another guy dating Ruby on the. other side also holding her hand what.

he's so pissed about it but he becomes. determined and I don't know how he knew. about Ruby's little graph of dating in. the back of her closet I don't know if. he stumbles upon it by accident but once. he finds it he's ready he jots down. every single thing on that list and this. is the new Kevin Frankie this is who he. will be from this day forward he says I. went home and I studied hard I studied. that list harder than I did my. schoolwork I think I was very insecure. with who I was I was willing to change. to become somebody that somebody else.

would appreciate and love and it works. after 2 weeks of dating this is like 2. weeks after meeting each other they get. engaged and within two months of being. engaged they get married and at just 21. years old Ruby gives birth to their very. first child New York Times bestselling. author Sherry yeah get her book one down. five more to go six kids total and Ruby. Frankie is the type of mother who needs. a scapegoat she would be a perfect Mom. right had it not been for this kid.

everything would have been perfect had. it not been for this one a lot of. narcissistic parents always find a. scapegoat in the family and it's usually. a kid every other kid is good every. other kid is well behaved in their eyes. except this kid if something goes wrong. it's this kid does the kiss shift yes. the kid um it seems like in the. beginning it is Chad and then once a lot. of the older children move out once Chad. and Shay move out and Kevin moves out. it'll be the youngest.

too Chad is the eldest son the second. born and in part one we go over Ruby. taking away his phone his bedroom his. bedroom door even sending him to a. troubled teen Wilderness Camp for over a. month it seems like this was all done at. the recommendation of Jodie which Ruby. meets jod through a friend who is. telling Ruby listen if anyone can quote. fix Chad which by the way Chad and I. don't think think any of the Frankie. kids needed any sort of fixing they just. needed a mother who loved them and did. not Vlog all of their worst moments and.

put them online 5 days a week but she. says if anyone can quote fix Chad it's. going to be Jodie now the first Zoom. meeting between Chad he remembers for. some reason his parents were so nervous. Chad thought it was Goofy he's like I'm. just going to get through this Zoom. meeting with this Jodie lady and I'm. going to be done with it they hop on. Zoom jod says Chad it's really good to. see you are you ready to start living an. honest and responsible and humble. lifestyle Chad says absolutely let's get. started I'm so ready to live a. responsible life you're lying.

Chad Chad said he went silent because. he's never had a therapist or whatever. call him out so directly in front of his. parents like you're you're lying about. that it was just very aggressive Chad. looks over and he just knew that his mom. is hooked from that moment forward jod. is not taking Chad's [ __ ] is this. like in the middle of their YouTube. Journey like they're already famous and. already famous so do you think jod. coming in already like oh I want these.

people as it seems like I want to latch. on to this them because they're famous. and famous Rich influence everything is. perfect I see yeah now after the zoom. call jod reaches out to the Frankies and. she tells them look your son Chad he. needs an outcome he needs an outcome for. the way that he showed up to that. meeting he's running cir CES around you. guys immediately they just start taking. away everything his phone Xbox no. friends anastasi Wilderness Camp he.

doesn't get a bedroom eventually they. take away football which was that was. honestly Chad's he was really good at. football really good that he wanted to. get a scholarship and just get out of. there Chad says my mom was trying. everything in her power to fix me but I. never felt like she was doing it for me. it always felt like she was doing it for. herself at one point my mom got kind of. teary eyed and she said Chad this is. your last chance jod and I found a. military camp in Virginia and we are. just waiting for one more time of you. acting up and if that happens we're. going to send you there until you're 18.

Chad says I don't know I think I really. just sense something in my mom that. realized that she's not going to let jod. go this is just how it's going to be. this is how it's going to be from now on. and I just decided to start. listening Ruby's thought is if this is. going so well with Chad why not Kevin. maybe Kevin Frankie Ruby's husband can. benefit from some counseling Kevin. Frankie works at a as a professor at BYU. in the civil engineering department with. a focus on geotechnical engineering. meaning he teaches how soil and rocks.

and earth materials interact with. structures and buildings and. infrastructure it's a lot of work. pertaining to the soil so they're really. well vered in fundamentally soil. mechanics and just how rocks behave so. how certain soils respond to static and. dynamic loads how an earthquake can have. the interactions between the. infrastructure and the soil specifically. in that region and how they can learn to. make the infrastructure better for the. future it's a lot of smart stuff it's.

indisputable that Kevin Frankie is. academically very intelligent but in. terms of teaching some would argue he's. not very good his Rate My Professor. rating is 30% would take again with a. solid 2.2 out of five one review on Rate. My Professor says he's very rude and. mean he spoke down a students in a very. condescending disrespectful manner I. truly did not have a great experience in. this class it wasn't an insanely hard. class I take school work very seriously. and have never had issues with a. professor before Professor Frankie hard.

professors are one thing but downright. rude dismissive and arrogant is another. save yourself the misery if you can and. take something else with someone else. another just reads weird dude. interestingly enough another reads. unable to get in contact outside of. class he's very controlling and you can. only have the same views that he has or. you will be looked down upon caused me. so much stress that I dropped out which. we talked about this briefly in part one. but Kevin does not appear to be involed. in his family life one would assume that. perhaps he was using all his energy at. work but a lot of the students say he.

was impossible to get in contact with. outside of class so if he's not working. he's not with his family what is he. doing another rating reads Professor. Frankie was rude from day one he does. not respect his students at all he was. always in a bad mood and made class. miserable he would make horrible. homophobic remarks and make us students. feel incompetent his classroom felt. hostile and like a prison I hate it. there Kevin says. he started taking connections classes. with Ruby group sessions actually the. first time he went was a full seminar.

like you know a whole Workshop it's like. one of those hotel conference rooms that. you book out Jody's hosting it Jody's up. on the stage and the whole Workshop is. love versus lust Jody would say love is. giving it's honest lust is about taking. it's about greed it's about control and. you can lust over anything if a man says. he doesn't lust he's lying many of them. are lusting whether they they're lusting. SE they're being selfish so we have a. huge pop okay that's what Jody's saying. Kevin leans in looks over at his wife.

Ruby he's about to roll his eyes when he. looks and sees that Ruby and every other. person in this entire hotel conference. room is laser focused they're like on. the edge of their seats he whispers to. Ruby this feels like a cult like a. man-hating club Kevin says the. experience was very confusing you know. this is a bunch of man-hating women that. are just looking for excuses to tear. down their husbands and I mean that's. what it felt like to me in there but. it's confusing because there were a lot. of people that I respected a lot of.

people that were on that stage with. microphones in hand giving testimonials. of how great this was and how it changed. their lives and their. marriage the seminar does come at a very. vulnerable time he says to be honest we. were pretty lost and Ruby believed this. was the road map back to the place that. we both wanted to go so after the. seminar she sat me down and she said I'm. concerned about our marriage and I'd. like to invite you to join a connection. men's. group which is a group of men that meet. up on Zoom every week with jod so she. can berate them about how they're. ruining their lives if they ever Place.

their eyeballs on a nude photo of a. woman in the beginning at least Kevin. and Ruby get sucked in he says we both. felt like there was purpose again even. the kids felt the change Ruby was. happier she never shouted anymore we. were really happy like a happy family. again clearly very quickly Kevin gets. very into connections there are clips of. Kevin Frankie giving advice to other. parents in the connections groups he's. sitting there right next to Ruby saying. things like there's so many culturalism. today that are just being promoted and.

celebrated and taught from the highest. Towers in every part of the land that. it's my job to make kids happy it's my. job to give my kids a magical childhood. it's my job to make my children smile. and laugh and it's my job to make my. children successful. no Sher remembers in her book yeah. that's exactly what ruby does Ruby does. not have time or patience for a child. that wants to be happy or is even sick. so now Kevin's like buying into all of. this he's like discipline discipline.

it's not my job to make sure that my. children are emotionally stable in the. beginning Ruby and Kevin are the stars. of the new group sessions that jod is. hosting they become the teachers pets if. you will and everyone would do well to. learn from them many victims have come. forward to say that jod is very. meticulous about how she tortures people. in these group counseling sessions you. could be in a group setting with all. these husbands but if you you ever admit. that you have been self-pleasuring they. will pair you up with an accountability. buddy this is a non-mental health.

professional that you have to text three. times a day at the very least anytime. you want to self-pleasure or do anything. that you shouldn't be doing even if you. just briefly thought about it for 2. seconds you have to tell your. accountability buddy they take a full. log they're like an accountant Excel. spreadsheet this and then there's these. confessional meetings where you meet up. with your wife and Jodie and you have to. confess everything to her and if you. maybe don't mention one thing on that. list the accountability buddy will rat. you out and then everyone in the group. pressures the wife to punish the. offending spouse in some way other.

victims who have come forward state that. jod encourages the wife to punish. husbands by kicking them out of the. bedroom no hugging no kissing no talking. no nothing no intimacy or even personal. connection for months at a time all for. the unforgivable crime of. self-pleasure does jod have a husband. she did briefly an ex-husband for 2. years and it was apparent a very messy. divorce now jod would use that where the. husband is now going through months of. isolation and it's almost like she's.

waiting for the husband to self-pleasure. again and have a relapse that's when she. pushes the wife to kick him fully out of. the house and start initiating a. divorce aside from that the group. sessions are just group bullying. sessions Kevin says if jod piles on. somebody they all pile on if jod Praises. somebody they all praise and so it. really felt like a pack of dogs and jod. was the alpha and whoever whoever she. sticks the dogs on they would go whoever. she prays you know the dogs would just. lick them up and down and that's just.

how these groups went the revenue from. these group counseling sessions alone is. estimated to be on the conservative side. have brought in jod about $330,000 a. month now Kevin would start helping to. lead these sessions yeah he was very. involved at this point he would talk. about how he was addicted to all sorts. of things Sports his phone work and how. he always just made his wife feel like. she had to hold the house down and it. was this whole conversation he's like. leading and teaching and it seems like.

the only one in the entire Frankie. household that's really concerned that's. not a full-fledged child that's getting. concerned about this is Sherry she's. very suspicious of Jodie something about. Jodie is cold not maternal but in the. worst way possible it's like the absence. of any maternal energy Sher starts. looking into who exactly jod hilderbrand. is and she seems like a grifter honestly. like a conoman on her website there's. packages that you can purchase. leadership training 6E program 1 person. 800 team leadership program 5,000.

company leadership training 15,000 jod. learns the reason that jod switched from. therapy to full-blown counseling and. life coaching is because yes there's. more money but also she's on probation. her license was. suspended at this point Adam Paul ste's. story was not fully out so it just was. like jod was disclosing patient. information to the honor code at BYU it. wasn't uh the level that we know today. mhm even the way jod responds to.

criticism is alarming in one video jod. demands people leave her better reviews. she starts ranting it's confusing to me. it's like you guys like what you're. getting from us and we're saying hey can. you please help can you please take 5. minutes and hit a button and go give us. a five star review please I I don't. understand why you won't do it there is. a link underneath every every single. video I think we've had five people from. the last time I asked which is probably. a month ago five out of almost 9,000.

five people to give us a review that's. five and we've had probably 50 to 75. people give us one star reviews so we. started with a five and in 3 months. we're down to like a two there is a link. underneath every single video that says. give us a review click it and give us a. festar review please I don't understand. why you won't do. it even if you put all of this to the. side Sherry is noticing how extreme. things are getting in the house jod. would say extreme things like it's. extreme but it has to be because we're. surgically removing the sin we're.

surgically removing the sin from your. souls May 2021 jod calls Ruby freaking. out she's wailing and sobbing into the. phone this is jod the life coach. extraordinaire crying to her client she. tells Ruby that it's happening it's time. the second coming doomsday The. Apocalypse the shadow figures are coming. for her they're haunting her they just. surround her at at night all around the. bed jod knows Satan is behind this he. has it out for her he's the one sending. them we talked about this in part one. but Ruby and Kevin were prepared for.

doomsday The Second Coming Kevin says. because we were in that state of mind. where we were ready for something big to. happen we were expecting it we just. weren't expecting this so to them this. sounds incredibly rational levelheaded. yes of course Satan daddy is sending you. demons at night so they go to Jody's. house to be with her while she goes. through these demonic possessions to. give her support So for months the. Church Bishop would come to help jod I. guess with exorcisms but nothing's. working Bishop even suggests maybe the.

demons are attached to your $5 million. house maybe you got to leave which means. maybe jod can stay with you Ruby live. with you and the rest of the Frankie. kids until she's better move into the. Frankie household Kevin says I was like. oh hell no I don't want this in my house. but I was beaten over the head with it. that's really insensitive she's done so. much to help our family you're being. selfish she needs it come on and it. won't be for long and so I relented and. I was like okay actually this could be. kind of fun let's make it fun and she. needs a vacation so we'll just do all of.

this and it turned into um the moment. she showed up at my house which was just. the weirdest crap started happening he. wa so the church leader told jod to live. with Frankie well it was more so I don't. know how to help you maybe the demons. are in your house I got to go oh so Ruby. just took her in yeah Jody and Ruby were. like oh let's go to Ruby's house. H okay now Kevin says out of nowhere the. lights would turn on and off it sounds. like people were walking inside the. walls you could feel there's Spirits.

floating around Kevin says he hated it. that it was weird but he probably didn't. hate it as much as Sherry hated it she. just remembers her Mom calling her you. have a couple of hours to take whatever. you need out of your room and Jody's. moving in you're moving out in 2 weeks. already to go to college so I figured. you only have to deal with it for 2. weeks so it should be. fine Sher says it was fine but I thought. it was weird that a therapist would move. in with her patient but it gets worse. Sherry writes in her journal at the time.

the House of Spirits feel weird with jod. here something's going on between her. and my parents that we don't know about. and the whole thing is super secretive. I'm trying to spend as much time out of. the house as I can this is the desert. house no this is the Frankie house oh. the desert house is not Frankie house no. that's Jody's house oh yeah. this is like their family home that. they've been vlogging in okay now jod is. still suffering from her demonic. possessions her transes both Ruby and.

Kevin are trying to help her through it. but eventually jod starts responding. best to Ruby Ruby even volunteers to. stay in Jody's room overnight which is. her daughter Sherry's room to comfort. Jodie cuz the demon Spirits get more. active at night they start sleeping in. the same. bed Ruby tells Kevin you know what I'm. just going to start sleeping in there. and if I need you I'll come down and get. you and maybe if I'm in the room with. jod these things will leave her alone. Kevin says I'm like oh that's kind of.

weird that is when they started sleeping. in the same bed Kevin says that's also. when quote Ruby started having like. transes and stuff I would say it was. probably around that time that she. believed she was going to heaven and. seeing God and Jesus talking with them. they would stay locked in that room for. four to 5 hours and then they would come. out all on Cloud9 and Ruby would say. things like she just had this amazing. Vision we're all bringing all this stuff. into the world we're doing God's. work yeah Kevin says I don't know the.

extent to which their interactions went. but it was much more than a friendship. much more than a Sisterhood it was. uncomfortably intimate Sherry says I. never remembered her being that. sympathetic towards me when I was having. similar issues AKA nightmares as a kid. but I guess this was different with. Jodie also Sherry says Ruby and jod. would stay upstairs all day and they. would rarely leave the house unless they. were going to Dairy Queen their diets. were a cardiologist nightmare just sugar. and ranch dressing so after moving out.

for college there's this very strange. incident where Sherry has to go back. home to get a few things from her room. she says I pushed the door to my bedroom. and I looked around confused the room. was bathed in the soft glow of candles. the air was Heavy with the scent of. lavender and vanilla wafting from the. massage oils in the dresser I quickly. grabbed what I needed and got the hell. out of there feeling like I just walked. into someone else's honeymoon suite the. only thing missing was Rose Petals on. the bed that is crazy Sherry says the.

whole thing was made weirder by the fact. that that night Sherry's sleeping on the. couch she can't fall asleep it's like. 5:00 a.m. she hear something and she. writes in her book quote I cracked one. eye open just in time to see Ruby. tiptoeing out of my room her hair messy. her cheeks flushed and her robe hastily. tied heading back to the bedroom she. shared with my dad a strange smile on. her face she looked mischievous what the. hell was going on why was Ruby sneaking.

around in the middle of the night like a. teenager trying not to get caught by her. parents were they really doing candlelit. massages in my bedroom how could all of. this be happening with all of us in the. house she continues it was equal parts. fascinating and horrific two women who. preached quote truth while living lies. who condemned queerness very publicly in. their connections videos while embodying. it privately in my room on my bed most. likely later Sherry will find notes in. Ruby's computer detailing how frustrated.

Ruby was about having to cater to Jody's. needs for physical affection without. getting anything in return which is a. lot going on but at the time all Sherry. is most concerned about is her family's. safety Sherry starts Googling is my. family in a. cult this is where I leave you with part. two and stay tuned for part three and. part four so part three we're going to. go over if people could have seen more.

warning signs cuz up until the day of. the arrest they're still posting podcast. episodes like 30 Minute Podcast episodes. and some of what they're teaching kind. of lines up to what they're journaling. about the torture that was taking place. and then in part four we go through the. arrests stay tuned let me know in the. comments what are your thoughts stay. safe and I will see you in the next one. [Music].