I Watched Diddy’s Lawyers Question Cassie For 12 Hours - This Is EVERYTHING That Happened

[Music]. Bada bing, bada boom. I think every. single person I know in existence on a. personal level taken it upon themselves. to send me anything that is related to. Shan Combmes. The amount of AI generated. Tik Toks that my parents send me asking. me if I'm safe, if I'm going to be okay. in the next 2 months. It's getting out. of control. But an interesting series of. Tik Toks have actually been circulating. in the Rotten Mango group chats. In. short, it is always somebody very. passionate in front of a camera,

seemingly very frustrated because nobody. else thinks the way that they think. One. person says, "Why the hell didn't Cassie. leave?" Like, you guys need to stop. acting like we have this invisible line. in the sand. Like, we're not allowed to. ask, "Why didn't you leave?" She's. putting up with the [ __ ] because she. thinks the good [ __ ] outweighs the. [ __ ] Y'all are going to stop making. people acting like they're crazy for. pointing that out. At the end of the day. though, at what point are we saying. you're a willing participant or not?

Like, we can't ask common sense. questions. Another person on TikTok. compares her to Glain Maxwell, the. counterpart of Jeffrey Epstein. No, bro. She's got favorite escorts. She's. picking out different escorts. And come. to find out, she's been cheating on her. husband throughout this. No, bro. Cassy's husband is finding out that he's. getting cheated on in the most. diabolical ways in the courtroom that. he's walking out. Side note, that is. factually incorrect. That is not why he. walked out. And y'all are acting like.

this is grape. She was a willing. participant. I can't stand how we are. framing Cassie as this super victim when. she's picking out the escorts that she. wants. She's one of the most freaked out. people in Hollywood. And y'all think. that women just aren't on that. You hear. a woman being part of stuff like this. and you think, "Oh, there's no way she. could have wanted that." Actually, bro, yeah, she's a ring leader. We saw the. text messages. She's setting this [ __ ]. up. That's so nasty, bro. Everybody up. there freaked out. And the women, too.

Another one is focused on Cassie's. husband, Alex Fine. With one Tik Tok. saying, "She cheats on you and he takes. you back. Y'all work this [ __ ] out." And. then years later down the line, you have. to find out how and exactly what way she. was cheating on you. You find out not. only was she cheating on you with one. dude, she was getting double quadruple. teamed. And not to mention, she had an. affair with the man that she said abused. her. And then women on TikTok are going. to gaslight you for taking on her. [ __ ] That is why women don't get.

the respect that they beg for in society. because they don't tell the truth under. any circumstances unless it benefits. them. The comments under that read, "1. billion women versus accountability.". Another reads, "Cassie got away, got. married, and still went back to Diddy, and women are going to keep moving the. goalpost for her actions." Another says, "If your girl is praising Alex Fine and. saying things like, "Every woman needs. Alex Fine," you got to run. I will say. many of the comments in these videos and.

the videos themselves are misquing or. miscontextualizing statements and/or. questions from the cross-examination. against Cassie Ventura. Here is a full. recap on the 12-hour long. cross-examination of Cassie Ventura. [Music].

We would like to thank today's sponsors. who have made it possible for Rotten. Mingo to support the Joyful Heart. Foundation. They are working to. transform society's response to SADVCA. and support survivors healings. This. episode's partnerships have also made it. possible to support Rotten Mingo's. growing team. We'd also like to thank. you guys for your continued support as. we work on our mission to be worthy. advocates. As always, full show notes. are available at. rottenodcast.com. A few disclaimers. before we get started. Regarding. content, there are themes of DV essay.

and sex trafficking. Please watch with. caution. Many of the quotes and. statements included have been shortened. and condensed for brevity or rearranged. because I mean if you look at the. transcripts for Cassie's. cross-examination, I think it's almost. 1,000 pages. Okay. No, I want to say. it's like a good 600 pages. It's a thick. stack and they keep jumping back and. forth. The timeline was so confusing. The way that it's absorbed in court in. real time was like certain times text. messages would be brought up and I'm.

like, I don't even know when this text. message is from. We had to rego through. all the transcript and our notes and the. exhibits to be like, oh, this is when. it's from. So, we've kind of rearranged. it in a way that makes a lot more sense. And this week's testimony was impossible. to shrink into a standalone episode. So, if you haven't already watched the first. part of Cassie's direct, that's like her. direct testimony. So, go check that out. And speaking of the legality of things, Shawn Combmes is presumed innocent until. proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Everything up until this point, everything that he's been charged with.

are alleged crimes until a verdict is. reached, which at this time of the. episode, it has yet to occur. Any. descriptions and observations regarding. Mr. Combmes, his legal team, the court, andor the public during the trial were. personally noted by myself or my two. other researchers who were present in. the courtroom. None of us three should. be used as like a definitive source to. determine how you feel about someone's. innocence or guilt. So, with that being. said, let's get started. I saw a comment. on the last episode, well, like a few. episodes back that said Sean Combmes's. defense team is like all of the Avengers.

except now they're working for Thanos. They're representing Thanos. So, there's. typically three sketch artists in the. courtroom and they've been kind of. bickering. They've been fighting a. little bit. We have observed some. things. We're not going to talk about it. because we love the sketch artists, but. two of them are now sitting on the very. first row of the right side, which we. are in the back of the right side. And. one of them is sitting on the very first. row of the left side. So, practically. right behind Shawn Combmes. And the one. on the left side, I just see her. grinding a piece of white chalk into the.

sketch. And I'm like, she's ferocious. about it. I look over and it's just. three floating orbits of white hair. heads. in varying degrees of white. You. got Brian Steel who's got almost a. nearly full head of white hair. You've. got Sean Combmes. You've got Mark. Agnifilo and she's just grinding in the. white chalk, making their heads even. whiter than I think they are in real. life. And then on the other side, you. have one of the sketch artists. She's.

like a legend in the courthouse, but. she's drawing Cassie with a tissue in. her right hand. Cassie is clearly in. distress. She's stopping and the judge. is looking at her as she's crying. It is. propped up against the wooden railing. right in front of her. So, usually you. don't see too much unless you kind of. crank your neck. They like to keep it a. little bit slanted, but I think she's. trying to get a good overview because. she has it propped up that I can see the. sketch pretty clearly. Mhm. Cuz I'm. sitting behind Alex fine directly behind.

him. It's directly in his line of sight. If he were to look up, he will see. Cassie, his wife, crying on the stand. And if he looks down, he will see a. giant sketch of her crying. I think that. the cross-examination of Cassie Ventura. is, if you can even believe it, more. emotional than her direct testimony. Before Cassie enters the courtroom, the. energy is very interesting. There are. these like five windows on the side of. the courtroom that are massive. And the.

second one near the front, the curtains. are clipped closed with like a giant. binder clip. The courthouse, I think, spends all of their money pumping the. AC. It's like -10 degrees in there. Cassie even mentioned that she might be. a little bit chilly. The judge is always. asking people if they're chilly. Everybody's cold and the freaking. curtain is binder clipped. Why don't. they bring it up? They do. Um, they say. it's a I talked to Officer RZ, who. basically controls the courtroom, and he. said it's either going to be snowing or. it's going to be so hot everyone's going. to be sweating. Like there's no I think.

it's very hard to control. I see. Sean. Combmes walks into the courtroom. He's. wearing this sandy colored sweater with. a collared shirt. He looks anxious, but. not in the bad way. Like that's the best. way we can describe him. This is like. before the cross has happened. The. direct lasted 2 days. It's happened. And. now we're heading into the cross. examination. So this means that. Combmes's defense team are going to be. grilling, poking holes into Cassie's. story. I'm going to go into like what. all the steps mean in a second, but he. looks like something is going to happen.

He looks almost anticipatory instead of. like it's anxious because you're. anticipating something. Side note, he is. also not allowed to belt for obvious. reasons and his pants are always. dangerously close to just like giving. the press a sight of something that we. did not ask for. And you can just tell. it's going to be a big day because in. walks Karen Agnif, Mark Agnel's wife, also Luigi Manion's representation. council, and she brings her mom, her. elderly mother, Karen's mom. Yeah. Who.

Sean blows kisses at. Wow. And someone. around me comments, "It's a family. affair." But I'm like, "No, Karen, I. love you. Please just give us updates on. Luigi." Now, there's a little back and. forth between the government and the. defense team, which I think is just so. fascinating the way that they talk. So, long story short, not to over complicate. things, the defense wants to use. something that the government does not. want to be used during the cross-. examination, but they didn't even show. the government all of these exhibits. until yesterday. So, to to that, the.

judge is asking, "So, how would you ever. be in a position to establish good. cause? You would have brought that to. the court's attention in any of the 15. or so hearings that we had in this court. and then I would have addressed them, right? Aka, why are you upset after you. turned in your homework late? Mark. Agniflo is not phased. He pleads his. case, but the way that we can best. describe him is a giant teddy bear. talking. Does that mean that he's a good. person? I'm not even trying to say that.

I know teddy bear is like associated. with like good and kind. I don't know. anything about him personally, but he's. the energy of a giant teddy bear who. yeps. He likes to say things like, "I. know your honor has given this a lot of. thought as you always do. I'm just. trying to sort of give your honor a. different way of looking at the letter. and the understandings." Like he see. sounds very harmless. He's so disarming. If he were a cop, I would confess to. crimes I didn't commit. M he's he gives. me like if I'm lost in a supermarket and.

I need someone's phone, he'd be the. first person I talk to. Wow. But the. judge is not swayed by his backpack with. 10,000 zippers and his slightly. charismatic way of talking. And he is. also reminiscent of a passionate. filibuster. That's exactly how the RM. team knows him. We call him the. filibuster. Seriously, he's Mr. Filibuster. Sometimes when I see his. name pop up on the transcripts, I'm. like, I remember that moment in court. I'm like, let's just fit through 10. pages because he just likes to yap. So, they're arguing back and forth about.

these exhibits not being turned in on. time and prosecutor Comey chimes in and. every time she talks, like I said, I. don't think I want to be on the. receiving end of whatever she's saying. I forgive Mr. Agnif for probably. thinking about a different conversation. We have talked about a lot of messages. over the course of the last few weeks, but in the last context of this. particular meet, there were no. discussions of those text messages. Basically, the defense wants a text. thread admitted during Cassie's cross. The government is like, "No, we don't. want that admitted, and you were.

supposed to tell that a long time ago. You were supposed to tell us if you. wanted it." The judge is like, "Children, calm down. I made my ruling.". It seems like maybe people don't. understand. Not only is there no basis. to admit these specific messages, but. maybe we're not on the same page. There. is no issue here, as far as I can tell, because the actual examination of the. witness is not being impaired. Am I. wrong about that? So, the judge, he's. getting snappy with it. He's not having. it anymore. I feel like his patience is. running thin. There are some whispers. that the defense is, I don't want to.

call them dirty moves, but it seems like. they're very strategic in the late. timing of submitting exhibits and. they're wordy, trying to do things a. little bit slick. So, that text threat. is not approved. Yeah. Well, they are. redacting parts of it. Mhm. And as. they're having this very intense back. and forth, there's members of both sides. of the legal teams pushing giant, they. look like shopping carts, which is. filled to the brim with papers and. binders and files. This is going to be a.

very intense day. When the jurors walk. in, and we haven't seen this since it. feels like 3 months ago, but it was like. a week and a half ago. Um, we haven't. seen this since the very first day of. jury selection. When the jurors walk in. and Sean Combmes is nodding, his body is. fully turned towards them. And near his. hip height, he has both of his hands. near his waist and he's slowly rubbing. his hands back and forth. Like when. you're cold, you know how you rub them. together to generate heat, but much. slower. And he's slightly swaying his. body. Even his kids seem a lot more.

involved today. The daughters are gone. They're back in California. They. actually only came for two days. The. three sons are still here as well as the. mother. So Justin Combmes, Christian. Combmes, and Quincy, and Janice Combmes, Shawn Combmes's mother. They're all. dressed a lot more casually in their. normal attire. And it just feels like. they've got something up their sleeves. And maybe they do because prosecutor. Slavic even tells the judge, basically, the deadline for submitting these. documents, these exhibits a month a was. a month ago. The defense only submitted.

four exhibits a month ago. Okay. Mhm. We. probably should have raised this with. the court. However, last night, right. before the cross- examination this. morning, they dumped 400 exhibits on the. government. Some of these exhibits were. incredibly long. They were documents, proposed exhibits of 100, 200 pages. Many of these documents were internally. duplicative, like aka just the same. portions of the same emails or text. threads overlapping with government. exhibits, but they have to go through. all of them because they have to. This. sort of dump of 400 enormous duplicative.

documents. This is high in efficiency. The government submits there really. needs to be a solution so this doesn't. continue happening throughout the course. of this trial. Wow. Yeah. So that is. definitely a strategy. Yeah. Comey even. adds in, the government has produced. hundreds of marked exhibits on our. exhibit deadline. And as we have marked. additional exhibits, we have been in. real time been producing them to the. defense throughout the trial. Our goal. is to not have this trial by ambush. And. our goal is to not waste the juror's. time in the middle of the witness's.

cross-examination. The judge is looking. at the defense like that's a fair point, but the defense is arguing through Tenny. Garagos that this is not a trial by. ambush. They're arguing it's the. defendant's right that the government. cannot prepare her on potential exhibits. while she's on direct examination. It's. not trial by ambush. The these are all. documents that they've seen. They have. them in their possession for 8 months. before we got them. So, in terms of. fairness argument, it's a fairness for. the defendant. in terms of the. government, we have gave them everything.

that they didn't have by our deadline. They keep going back and forth. The. judge finally asks prosecutor Comey, you've heard what they have to say. What. do you want? She stands up into the mic. I want their exhibits, your honor, and I. think they've already marked them and I. would like them now. So, I want their. exhibits now, please. Very firm. And. then the defense does something. interesting. And again, I don't know if. this is a strategy, but they say, "Oh, yeah, our parallegal brought copies.". and they just have a giant cart full of. binders for their exhibits. And Comey is.

immediately like, "We will also ask for. an electronic copy." To which the judge. agrees, we are in the 21st century, so. let's try to make that happen. Which one. could imagine it could be the defense. trying to make it harder for the. prosecutors, but Tenny Garagos jokes, we. are. I do work with Mr. Agnif, but we. are in the 21st century. And he admits, I'm a little behind. It's very interesting the way that. they're doing this. I see though. I see. what you mean. The it does seem like. every single action is calculated with.

the intention of like delay or just. complicate things, make it hard for. them. Just everything is part of. strategy. Exactly. And the way that Mark. Agno is able to talk to the judge is so. fascinating because this was a. conversation that's been coming up over. and over again. And even the judge says, "Let me take a step back. Mr. Agnif, I. thought you were going to take this off. my plate." Those were the words Agnif. told him a few days ago. and he says, "I. think taking it off your plate, your. honor, is going to be a dayby-day. process, and I'm going to continue to.

try and take it off your plate as the. morning goes on. I am on an aspirational. basis.". What he says, I aspire to take it off. your plate. Basically, two days ago, he. was like, "I'm going to take it off your. plate, your honor. Don't even worry. about it." And then today, he said, "Day. by day on an aspirational basis, you. know." Yeah. And what's Judge's like. reaction over these type of talks? Just. like what the hell is like you guys are. wasting my time. Like this is literally.

his children arguing back and forth. That's why you say he's his patience. running thin. Oh yeah. He he went from I. think he's still fair. I think he has. way more patience. I was even talking to. some of um the people that work in the. court and they were like he's actually. one of the most fair judges. Like a lot. of judges won't even let both sides even. plead their case like this. They'd be. like, "Hey, shut up. I'm going to. lunch." Mhm. So, he's very fair. However, he went from being like very, you know, in a good mood to now he's. like Logan Roy from Succession and all.

of his kids are arguing and he it looks. like he thinks they're all dumb. I don't. think he thinks that, but is the feeling. when a witness is called into a. courtroom, you have the direct. examination. You're setting the stage. Now, Cassie Ventura is the government's. witness. So, the government leads the. direct testimony. Then after that you. have the cross-examination. The defense. or the other party will question and the. whole part of the cross-examination is. to effectively discredit the witness, poke holes in their story, pick out any.

lies that they can see and undermine any. of their allegations. And then you have. the redirect where the prosecutor will. come up and try to repair any. credibility or add context to anything. that was not perceived well during the. cross. Then there's the. recross-examination, which is to. challenge new information provided in. the redirect. So, a lot of people say. that sometimes the cross-examination of. a very important witness in a criminal. case is the most important thing, one of.

the most important things. And there's. so many rules that some people abide by. Some people say the number one rule is. that don't ask a question you don't know. the answer to in a cross- examination. Some people say no, the number one rule. is you're going to make mistakes. cross-examining. So, keep it short. The. shorter the time, the less mistakes. Proving two points is better than. proving three. Proving one point is. better than proving two. Always keep it. condensed. Everybody has different. opinions. Attorney Anna Esto is the one.

doing the cross-examination of Cassie. Ventura. She has a reputation for being. a top white collar criminal defense. attorney, usually representing clients. accused of financial fraud, insurance. fraud, tax fraud, moneyaundering, narcotics, and weapons offenses. She. does this thing when she's talking, when. she asks questions. This is our first. time really hearing from her. She will. pause, let the silence linger, and it. feels like she's constructing her. sentences in real time. Like there's an. invisible word document in front of her. that we cannot see, and she's like. deleting words, replacing words. Cassie.

walks in. The first two days of her. direct testimony, she was wearing. sweater dresses with um a coat. The. first day was no coat. The second day. was a coat. the third day and the fourth. day, she shows up in blazers for the. cross- examination. And it was just so. interesting to see her very distinct. shift in her clothing. She shows up with. her blazer and Esto takes the podium. She's got very interesting body. language. Now her arms are tightly.

crossed, like very tightly crossed. I. can see her shoulder blades peeping. through her blazer in the back or her. arms are flexed forward in front of her. Just straight flex. There's no give in. her elbow and she's like gripping her. pen tightly. Good morning, Miss Ventura. Good morning. You and Shawn were in love. for 11 years, right? That's her first. question. Yeah. During that time, you. loved him. I did. Yes. And you believe. that he loved you as well? Yes. Sean, that's the name that you used the past. two days in the courtroom, right? Yes,

that's the name his mother gave him. Okay. She's like trying to humanize him. We all have government names. And that's. a part of what made your relationship. with him special is that you knew the. real Sean, right? I believe I knew a. real version. Yeah. This part is so. strange to me. I I thought it was odd. And you always knew how special you were. to him, right? No, I don't think I. always knew. You sometimes knew. Sometimes is fair. You frequently knew. Sometimes you wanted to keep Shaun's. trust. Yeah. And you earned that trust.

I don't know. But I wanted to earn it. You did earn it. I did earn it. Yeah. It's just very weird. I think it's like. I think it's weird because these cross-. examinations always feel like some sort. of power play. I feel like the first few. I don't know, maybe even 10 minutes. It. feels like trying to establish dominance. is the feeling. And maybe I'm looking. too much into it, but it's like they're. trying to control the conversation and. put the witness in a specific mode of. answering. So, like even this I'm like I.

don't really know what it did for the. jurors. I don't think it proved anything. in like the defense opening statement. like earning his trust. I don't think. that has anything to do with. racketeering. Mhm. So, to make him. happy, you told him that you wanted to. do freakoffs, right? No, there there's a. lot more to that. I'm sure we'll get. there. In front of Anna Esto is a stack. a binder with all these papers and it. seems like every page has a different. post-it sticking out of it. It looks. like a highly annotated at least two. books of the Acatar series. It's like a.

thick binder. And the whole time Kenny. is just passing more Post-its. These. defense attorneys are keeping the. Post-it company in business. The amount. of Post-its after the cross-. examination, I want to say it's like 3. in high. Wo. So, there are a lot of text. messages brought into evidence from the. defense, and they start off a bit more. normal and get more intense as they're. released in one text message thread. And. this is all to establish that Cassie, I. mean, more or less wanted it is what the. defense is trying to argue. That she was.

not coerced into these freakoffs. In one. text thread, Combmes texts Cassie. It. makes me so happy that you would fly to. Atlanta just to see me. I'm truly a. lucky man. Love you. Missing you. Can't. wait to hold you. Esto as Cassie read. her messages out loud in the courtroom. I'm a very lucky woman. Smiley face. I'm. a very lucky woman. I miss you so much. I'd fly wherever you needed me whenever. I love you, Cass. I think being in that. courtroom, one thing that Esto did that. I felt was more impactful than. prosecutor Johnson is she got herself.

and Cassie to read the messages out loud. like a text thread. So, Esteeo would. read Comb's messages, Cassie would read. Cassy's. Now, Prosecutor Johnson did. too, but a lot of the times it wasn't. super cleancut. It was always like then. he responds and then what do you say. afterwards? So there was a lot of break. in the flow. I think this format is. doing a lot more impact for the jurors. and they're just rapidly going through. these exhibits of text messages and. these jurors, at least in the beginning.

of the cross- examination, they're. locked in. I saw one of the jurors flip. a page in his notebook and he's already. used like half of his notebook that he. was given. And they're just rapidly. going through these text messages, just. normal conversations, maybe trying to. establish that it was a normal. relationship, I guess, is what they're. trying to do. One message, Combmes texts. Cassie, I love you so much it makes me. cry. Another one, Combs text Cassie, did. you miss me a lot? You didn't even. respond to my message. Then another one, Cassie texts Combmes. Going to sleep now.

so it can be tomorrow faster and you can. be home. I love you. Love you, my baby. Smiley face. I love you so much it. consumes my life. How did that happen? Cassie responds, I don't know. I wonder. the same thing for myself all the time. Like, who was I before we decided to be. get to be together? I never knew it. could be like this. How do you have me. this way? Lol. What do you mean? I'm so. happy that we fell in love. We are so in. love. We don't do anything else. That's. not true. But you're going to have to. work so hard. Four times as hard as me,

which takes a lot of time. Another one. from Combs to Cassie. I miss you. already. Me, too. When do you want to. freak off? Lol. Lol. I'm just going up. to change and put my ring on. I just. picked it up. I'm always ready to freak. off. Lol. Combmes at this point is. leaning in. His body is a lot more. towards Estavo and the jurors this time. When this message is read, he [ __ ] his. head to the left because anytime a. message is read where she's initiating. or responding well to a freakoff, he's. like doing some sort of motion. He's.

always kind of pivoting towards the. jurors. He's cocking his head. They. continue reading these text messages. You tell me the day. You choose. That's. Sean. It can be whenever. Name the. night. I feel like the weekend, like a. Friday night, would be the best because. we'd want time to recover for work for. the work week, right? This upcoming. weekend, the 8th is the only one I have. until the 28th. I'm on it. Lol. Okay, but if you can't, we can always do it. during the week. You know, it doesn't. matter to me. Esta looks at Cassie. When. you say we know that doesn't matter to.

me, you're saying that you understand. that Mr. Combmes knows that you don't. mind whether or not it's on a weekend or. during the week, right? That's what it. says. Okay. And then Mr. Comb says, "Friday it is. I wish we could get Jules. here." Cassie reads her message. Lol. Maybe we could. We don't know him that. well, though. You want to call him and. feel him out? Yeah, I could do that. Call him now, please. Now, those are a. little bit more on the tame side. There. are some messages that have the internet. in a bit of a tail spin. They're not.

read out in court, but the exhibits are. displayed right on the screen for. everyone to see. So, they're admitted. into evidence. August 7th, 2009. Cassie. says that the two of them are texting. about planning a freakoff. Cassie texts. Combmes. Me, too. I just want it to be. uncontrollable. I can't wait to watch. you. I want you to get real hot. She. responds, I can't wait to stare at some. big black. In another message, Combmes. texts Cassie. I'm so horny, I can't. concentrate. She responds back, "So, what do you want to do? I'm going to.

Dwayne Reed to grab candles and then. going home to pack us a bag. If you want. any regular clothes, by the way, or just. sweats, then I can go check in. set the. room up. I'll eat, take my vitamins, lol, and get ready before I LV the. house. Leave the house. Just want to. know what you're thinking. It's crazy. because as these text messages are being. revealed in court. I think it's like you. sit there and you're like logically. thinking and you go, "Yeah, no, it makes. sense. This is exactly what Cassie said. in her direct testimony." And this has. been her stance since even she filed her.

civil lawsuit. It's like the whole. grooming thing. They met when she was. super young, impressionable. He's got. the power. She wanted to make him happy. She clearly did not want to participate. in these things, but she didn't know. what else to do. And that's kind of what. you get in the text messages. But I. think in that courtroom, the impact as. they're being read out was very intense. A lot of the jurors were scribbling. notes, especially when the more. explicit, vulgar messages came up. I I. don't personally think that the vulgar. messages are evidence of anything, but.

it it had such a strong shock value in. that moment. Yeah, that it was just it's. hard to not feel when it feels like the. whole room feels shock cuz there's like. a collective energy that everybody has. And this is why I think direct and cross. is so important because I think when you. go online, everyone is like, "Oh, the. whole direct testimony was so sad and. it's like one emotion." But then when. you're in that courtroom for the. entirety of the 15 hours that the direct. testimony is, there's so many waves of. emotions. And even if you're sad, if the.

prosecutor is asking maybe not the right. questions, it's very easy to see that. jurors are falling asleep next and then. people get sad and then people fall. asleep. It's like the weirdest thing. Now, one text from 2009, Sean texts. Cassie, "I'm so horny." Estao asks her, "And you received that message and in. response, what do you say?" "Oh my god, I was about to text you the same thing.". Sean responds, "How are you feeling? Talk to me. You're supposed to be. seducing me all day. Lol. I'm sorry. I'm.

nervous. I feel like I want to [ __ ]. Another text thread that is exchanged. between Cassie and Combmes a few days. before the Intercontinental Hotel. incident. So, this is them preparing for. a freakoff in the Intercontinental. What? Cassie messages Combmes. I want to. spend time with my baby. Okay. Well, let. me know either way so I can plan my. night. Love you so much. You look so. sexy today. Hello. Well, hit me when you. have time. Thank you, baby. I love you. so much and you look so sexy today. So, what are you planning to do so I can. plan the rest of my night? Baby, I want.

to fo so bad, but I don't want to [ __ ]. myself up. What am I to do? After the. messages are read out loud, Esto lets it. sink in for a second. So, at this point, this is the fifth text message to him. suggesting that you guys get together, right? Sure. Yeah. And after he was. asking you multiple times what you. wanted to do, it was up to you, right? Yeah. And he again says, "What would you. want to do?" Right. And then you say, "I. don't want you thinking I don't want. to." Right. So after this, she's like, "I don't want you to think that I don't.

want to fo." Yeah. As in you don't want. him to think that you don't want to have. a freak off. Correct. Because he's been. asking me over and over again after you. have asked him over and over again. Yeah. I guess it's just like, you know, when you're with somebody, you know how. they speak and you know what they mean. when they text certain things. It's it's. like that. Est mentions that Shawn texts. back. Thanks babe. I love you. You look. beautiful. Proud of you. Have a great. day. And then no response. What are you. doing? I just got out of a spiritual. therapy session. What are your plans.

with the messages up? Esto says, "Because at this point, he's asking you. what you want to do." Right? Because at. this point, you've proposed a number of. things. You've proposed a freakoff. You've proposed going out with your. girlfriends. You've proposed just being. you. I'm assuming that means staying in, right? This is the message at the top. where you say, "Baby, I want to FO so. bad, but I don't want to [ __ ] myself up. What am I to do?" Right? Yep. And this. is the one that you were asked about in. your direct testimony, right? Yes. And. this is the one when you were asked why.

you sent this message, right? You said. you were doing damage control because. you didn't want him to ruin your movie. premiere. Cuz you remember after the. Intercontinental Hotel incident, she's. got a movie premiere where she had to. put a lot of makeup on. And that's the. same one where she's like asked about, "Oh, how was your chemistry with your. co-star?". And she's like, "He's a friend. He's a. friend. He's a great friend." Then that. Terrence had great hygiene cuz it's. kiss. You guys kiss. Terrence was cool. Terrence is fine. Out there for the. ladies. Like Terrence is fine. How was. he playing his love interest? I mean, you guys definitely were believable as,

you know, a couple of sorts. I don't. want to give too much away. No, you. know, we're friends at the end of the. day and that is very awkward when you're. just friends with somebody and you're. not in love, but um we're comfortable. with each other. So, it was cool and it. was easy and he's just been such a per. uh supportive person in the whole making. of this situation. So, and at that. point, Mr. Combmes has sent you a number. of loving messages, right? Right. And. he's participated in a promotional event. for your movie, right? A lunchon. I. think he just came. But yeah, he came.

That went smoothly, right? Sure. And it. was supportive of whatever decision you. wanted to make in terms of how you two. spend your time together, right? Yeah. And then he says, "So, what would you. want to do?" And that's when you say, "We can have fun. I don't want you. thinking I don't want to." Right. Yeah. to which they read the next text of. Shawn writing, "I think if we start at 7. or 8 and end at 4:00 at the latest, take. a Xanax and or ambient and go to sleep, we'll be okay. And you rest tomorrow and. all day Sunday, you'll be good and drink.

a lot of water, we'll be good, but we. won't have hours to be caught in a. matrix if we do it. I want you to call. Garen." So Garen is from Cowboys for. Angels that arranges a lot of the. escorts and see what he What did he say? Yeah. I want you to call Garrett. Okay. And see what he has so it can really be. a turn on, but if we're going to do. something sooner the better. Can you. elaborate, Miss Ventura, on the term. matrix? Um, it says, "But we won't have. hours to get caught in the matrix." So, matrix, I said, is like the high and. being too high where we wouldn't be. doing anything sexual, anything would be.

happening cuz we would just be too high. Like, there would be no performance. So, it would be a big deal for you to get. very high before such an important night. in your life, right? Yeah. Your premiere. was a big night, right? And if you were. to enter a matrix or take too many. drugs, it might impact your ability to. participate in the promotion for the. movie, right? Correct. And you. understood that he knew that and. recognized that, right? I guess she's. trying to prove he gave you so many outs. and you didn't take anything is what. she's trying to establish to the jury. When I say the defense is trying to. establish, I'm not saying that's a fact.

I'm saying this is their point that. they're trying to make. Later, the text. messages show that Combmes is asking a. ton of questions and Cassie is not. responding. He says, "Chill with your. friends. I'm going to check you later. I. tried." Wait. Yeah. He's like texting. about the night and she's not. responding. He's like, "Okay, well, why. aren't you talking to me about Garen, I. guess?" And then he's like, "Chill with. your friends. I'll check you later." I. tried. Like, I tried. Honestly, feels. kind of passive aggressive. To which. Cassie responds, "I said, let's have. fun. You're tripping and reaching and.

that's not cool. This is a big moment. for me and it feels like it's spoiled. now cuz it's like now he's just getting. upset." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Comb says, "Call Garen. Can you do that and go get. your stuff right? Where where do you. want to stay? Can you see who Garen has? Hello. Yo, I hate when we're in the. middle of texting and you just stop. She. responds, I'm waiting for him to hit me. back. He didn't answer. Are you headed. home? Where you at? Can we do it at your. house? Hello. Talk to you later. Going. to go into this meeting. Carrie is here. We can't do it at my house. About to. head home now. I got Intercontinental.

Did you call Garen? Hit me back. Is. Garen the one at the. Intercontinental Hotel? No, it was. Jules. So Garen is the one that is just. sending people. Oh, I'm imagining that. he's going to be either a government. witness or he's going to be subpoenaed. Wow. Okay. Now, Cassie sends a picture. of people Garen has for them that are. discreet. That's the word used. Combmes. doesn't respond to it. She texts, "You. hate when I stop responding, but now. that's what you're doing. Can we get the. other guys? You really want to bring. another random into our situation?".

Estee points out that the two of them go. back and forth discussing which guys to. invite. So, this is like the beginning. that one Tik Tocker that's like she's. choosing and picking her escorts. the. way it happens. It's It's more so she's. not like picking and choosing. She's not. like, "Ooh, that one looks hot. That one. looks great." It's more like, "I don't. I've never met these people. I'm not. really comfortable. Like, this person. gives me weird vibes. If I have to. choose, I'd rather choose Jules who I. feel safer with." That's kind of been. her whole energy throughout the entire.

testimony. That's That's what they were. referring to. Yeah. Wow. cuz I was like. flip we're I'm telling you if you see. the state of the desk over there like my. researchers and I are flipping through. transcript pages like this doesn't even. make sense. Mhm. Cassie is being a bit. stressed about this stranger coming and. she just doesn't want a random I'll be. right over there. Let's just start the. energy fresh is what Cassie says. I had. such a great day and I intend on keeping. it that way. Estao looks over the.

podium. When you say you were intending. on keeping it that way, that included. participation in this freakoff that. you're planning, right? So, she's saying. you intend on keeping a good day. A. freakoff is a good day. Another message. Cassie sends Reed, I'm not in a. combative place. I've just been people. pleasing all day and I just need relaxed. fun. By saying you just need relaxed. fun, you're referring to the anticipated. freakoff, right? Not necessarily. I felt. like for me it was more about the high. and hanging out with Shawn. Eventually, she sends another text of like, "No. crazy [ __ ] She doesn't want crazy [ __ ].

because her energy is good. She wants to. keep it a good day. She's got a movie. premiere, so she just writes, "No crazy. shit." To which Combmes responds, "All. good. You just don't hear how you be. talking." So, this goes back to her. direct where she talks about how he. loves saying things like, "Watch your. face. Watch your words." Yeah. Yeah. In. another text thread, it's Combmes. texting Cassie. You know, we have to. have a proper fo without no K. Ket, I. need to get it out of my head. I hate. Ketam. So, you let me know when. Please.

don't be mad and think that's all I want. to do. It's just the K. A successful FO. is when we remember and don't be fending. to do it the right way again. I won't. bring it up again until you're in that. mood and I'll fly Dave in. Cassie. responds, "I'm fine. Just trying to get. my life back organized." Yeah, I know, right? I'm sorry. I feel like it's my. fault that we rush back into [ __ ] I'm. praying on us. Love is so hard. sometimes. We both got to get back on. track or we'll never get [ __ ] done. I. want you to know that I realize what's. going on. We're at a great place. Let's. give things time to breathe in a. positive light. I need to get the songs.

for Epic. Send me all the songs that you. have on a flash drive when you're ready. I'll send Dave to get so I can get that. done. And I'm coming up with a. management solution. Anything else you. want me to work on? Please send. I'm. going to my therapist today. Love you so. much. Always will. They're trying to. argue. Some of the same text messages. are being used where Cassie in the. direct is like, "Yeah, I didn't want to. I was just scared. So, this was my. reaction." In the cross, they're. basically saying, "Look, you want to. look at this. like you guys are having. in-depth conversations about the. freakoffs. In another message that was.

brought up, um Cassie had texted Combmes. that she wants to talk to him about. something and he's like, "Is it going to. stress me out? Do you remember that. text?" He's like, "What is it about?". Freak off. It can wait. It's not a big. deal. Now you don't want to do it. anymore. I already know. You're so. predictable. Really? Okay, since I'm. That's definitely what it is. We'll. leave it at that. Since I'm so. predictable, have a good night. Sean. Combmes say freak off. You don't want to. do it anymore. You are so predictable. Meaning Shan's like, "Okay, you've done. this a thousand times. You don't want to.

do the freak coff anymore. I can already. see it." The fact that he already knew. what was coming is very interesting. Yeah, that's okay. But the defense is. like, she says, "Okay, I mean, I'll. leave it at that. Good night." He says, "Whatever, baby. I'm not going to play. no games with you, and you ain't going. to keep shutting me down." Esta looks at. Cassie. You testified on direct that you. were going to tell him that you didn't. want to do freakoffs anymore, but you. didn't tell him that because you didn't. want him to be upset, right? I saw his. reaction and yeah, and I will say I was. getting very lost in the timelines that. were jumping around. So I felt like they.

were slightly rearranging timelines in a. way that made the most sense for the. defense. That was the feeling I got. because we would jump from like 2008 to. 2018 to 2012 and there would just be. like one line of like this message is. from this date. Oh. So, we actually go. on to the next defense exhibit, which is. from one day before the previous. messages, and it reads, "From Shawn to. Cassie." And baby, we really need to do. some soularching this time. We got to. figure out a plan and get us back on. point. Think about it. Definitely. What.

do you feel about where we're at? What. do you feel about us? I think it's more. than missing you. I'm talking about us. I know I'm the happiest when I can feel. your love. And I haven't felt it lately. because I know that you don't really. want to be around me. I know that I need. to work on being nicer, less moody, and. more like your woman. I just think that. things haven't been able to turn around. because we haven't given it any time to. breathe. We just get keep getting pushed. backwards. I believe that our love has. no bounds. I'm 150% sure that you're the.

man that I want to be with and I want to. be that woman for you, too. Yeah, that's. probably, you know, you don't know how. much it is to be Ruth you. I think he. means with you. You're insecure and you. don't know what it takes to take care of. me. I over so much but like I think he's. trying to say I still love you. I don't. know. His texting is like kind of the. most insane thing ever. I just know that. I love you and I'm trying. So it sounds. like they're on the phone briefly before.

Cassie texts back. Freak off with a. girl. Like she just texts him back. So. it's freak out with the girl. That's it. Yeah. What makes you want to do that? Esta is trying to establish that the day. before she was asking for a freak off. with the girl and then the next day she. states in her direct that she was going. to tell him that she no longer wants to. do foss period. So she's trying to. establish it's a little bit weird and. then she just keeps moving on. Now. Cassie at one point she does get. frustrated during the cross testimony. because she's like am I allowed to like. say something? And then they're like no.

just like answer the questions because. she's not allowed to. She doesn't really. have time to be able to explain much. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, anytime a new text. message thread is shown, it's it just. seems like a good chunk of the times. Combmes will literally physically lift. his butt up out of his chair so that he. can sit at the edge of his seat, lean. onto the table, put his glasses on, and. read the text from the evidence screen. So, it sounds like they from like their. 10 years of text messages, which I don't. even know how much text is there, they.

will cherrypick. very brief conversations that sounded. like Cassie wanted to freak off. Yes. Is. that correct? Yes. And it got to the. point where I forgot what day this was. I think it was like yesterday. We were. texting and I think we were like like. half arguing, half joking about. something that was so dumb because I'm. so sleepd deprived. And I remember. thinking like, "Oh, that's so. interesting because if you were to take. anybody's full relationship of text. message records, even though we're half.

joking, you could totally take. everything out of context." Yeah. Yeah. So, it's very interesting. It was just a. weird, oh, this is so weird type of. moment. His energy while he's reading. the evidence screen reminds me of well. first he's looking at the evidence. screen but his demeanor is very casual. It's fascinating. He looks like the best. way I can describe it is it's like a. he's staring at a menu when it's too. dark in a restaurant. He's just like. squinting looking at the evidence. screen, but it's a very casual demeanor.

I don't know how to describe that even. better. You know when two people are also having. a heated discussion. This is his energy. throughout the cross-examination. Two. people are having a very heated. discussion and you're trying to say your. piece but they're like sh wait your turn. and you just have to wait like you're 5. years old but you have so much to say. That is the energy of Shawn Combmes. during the cross- examination or like. when you know the answer to a question. but you have been a smartass for the. entirety of the day so the teacher does. not want to call on you but you're like. trying to sit up taller so that they'll.

call on you. That's the energy Shawn. Combmes has. This is vastly worlds of a. difference from the past two days that. Cassie has been direct testifying. Even. during the cross-examination on the. first two witnesses, the security guard, the male escort, I mean, albeit there. were much, much less critical. cross-examinations. Other than Combmes. looking at Donaldson with the eyes of. what I felt like was like, "Hello, what. are we paying you for?" He was not. nearly as involved this time. He seems, dare I say, excited, butt off the chair. He's very.

expressive. Even his kids, there will be. short moments where the judge is on. sidebar with the attorneys. Sidebar, they play the white noise machine. You're not allowed to talk. The judge is. still on the bench. Like Officer Viz. will, he's kind, but he's fair. He'll be. like, "Hey, you. No talking, right?" The. kids, they're like smiling. They're. giggling like the teacher just stepped. out of the room. And then eventually. Sean Combmes will look back at his three. sons and they're smiling and nodding at. each other. And I know a lot of you guys. said that I do not have the faculties to.

interpret those nods, but this one was. very interesting. Other points of the. cross- examination, Combmes is sitting. in between. So this is very interesting. So I thought he was going to be on a. full like female table, femaleled table. Mhm. He's actually back to most of the. original seating. So it's Tenny Garagos. who's constantly passing postits to. Esto. Then you have Mark Agnif who's. sitting right next to Shawn. Then right. next to him is Brian Steel. and then. Alexander Shapiro. No, Mark Agnil and.

Shawn are sitting like two guys in a. boardroom watching an intern give a. presentation. I don't know who the. intern is in this scenario. I don't. think it's Esto. Maybe it's more Cassie. Maybe no one. It's just like that's the. best way I can describe the energy. It's. like they're leaned back in that. boardroom. CEO demeanor and they look slightly. amused. Like they're not laughing or. smirking, but they don't look that tense. or stressed. So, they go back and forth. between these vibes. Meanwhile, Brian.

still looks very stressed. He looks like. he's being held hostage. He looks like. he misses Young Thug. There is this very. awkward moment during a recess where. everyone walks back in and Cassy's. husband walks in and appears that So, my. researcher and I both collected, him and. Shawn Combmes make prolonged eye. contact. Wait, Alex Fine and Shawn. Combmes make prolonged eye contact. I. would even consider it glaring. And so. much is said through that look. Nothing. great. But immediately after Brian Steel.

and Mark Agnif start comforting Shawn. Combmes like he just saw the boogeyman. And my researcher way like like patting. his back like talking to almost like. they're giving him a pep talk. They're. both leaned in to the sides of his face. like it's okay. Like that's the vibe. I. don't know if they said it's okay but. that's the vibe. Huh. So they saw the. exchange of the look. Okay. And they're. both like comforting him like he just. saw the boogeyman. That's the feeling. Like they're really comforting him. I've. never seen them comfort him like this. They'll hug. They'll like tap each other. on the back, but this was like calming.

someone down, comforting. I don't know. It was weird. It was weird. Now, there. were moments where I think the defense. were trying to prove a lot of points, but it really depends on how the jurors. are receiving this information. It's. hard to say because I do think there is. a small discrepancy between what the. internet thinks and maybe what the. jurors think. The jurors, a lot of them. have poker face, but there will be times. where I feel like they are not.

responding the way the internet is. responding, okay, to some things that. are said, such as I think a lot of the. text messages did not um sit well with. some of the jurors is the feeling I got. I don't I really have no way to prove. it. It's just like a intuitive feeling. that my researchers and I felt. It would. be like moments where a vulgar text. message would be shown. It would not be. read out, but then you would see like a. juror look at the screen and then kind.

of eyebrows raised and start writing in. their notebook. So, it's like I Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's a small thing, but. collectively over time, oh, what's. happening? Right. Esto asks Cassie, "It. was very different relationship from any. other relationship that you've had. before." Right. It was exciting. It was. much different. Is passionate. There was. passion. Yes. And it opened up your. world tremendously, right? Cassie gets. quiet. She kind of [ __ ] her head to the. side. She purses her lips like, "Wait,

what does that even. mean?" There's not really a yes or no. answer to that one for me. Did it open. up your world in a different way? Yeah, I'll say that. The defense pulls up an. exhibit, a text message from October. 14th, 2007. Esto mentions, "Can you read. from this or would you prefer if I read. it?" You can read it. I can read it. It's just it's kind of making me giggle. because it's from 2007. I know we're. taking you back. You can do it, though.

Esto starts reading Cassie's message out. loud. We've only really had one week of. each other just together, and I can say. that it's been the best and worst. I've. never felt so loved, safe, and empowered. since we've come together. When I'm with. you, I feel like I'm your woman and no. one else's. I feel protected when I'm in. your arms and so comfortable that I can. sleep and not worry about anything. You. are one of the sweetest, most sincere. people I've met in a long time. And I. cannot express enough how grateful I am. that you've chosen to be a part of my. life. I don't want to rush things, but I.

can't help but sit with you and dream up. a beautiful future together. Who knew. I'd fall so fast? You make me feel like. I can do anything, and that's real. On. the other hand, you're constantly weary. of me. I'm sneaky. I never seem to make. the right decisions to you. I'm a. spoiled brat. I'm dramatic, disrespectful, and some reason you don't. trust me. It always goes back to, well, maybe Carrie would have been the better. one to go after since I've witnessed. you. More than once, you realizing that. she's way better fitting for you than I. am. Carrie Morgan being Cassie's best. friend of 17 years that she no longer. talks to that was also subpoenaed to be.

on the stand. Wait, she's saying maybe. Carrie is a better fit for you? Yeah, because she's saying I've witnessed you. more than once realizing that she's way. better fit for you than I am. It's hard. for me to handle that as I feel like. I've given so much of myself in this. short time, but whatever. I can take it. I'm guessing there will always be. something negative. I don't know. I. really don't. I'm hurt that you think. that I'm a malicious person. The dinner. I went to last night was definitely bad. timing, but it had been planned before. all the drama things had to be handled. Just like how you have to handle your. business. I never step on your toes when.

it comes to handling yours. I'm about to. get on this plane and I'm sad, mad, frustrated, and hurt that you just don't. feel like I'm the right one. I really do. love you and I hope to just be able to. learn what it is you want in a woman and. give it to you. You're very important. and I hope you know that. Cass, there's a lot in this message, right, Miss Ventura? There sure is. Yeah. Cassie says, "Reading this feels. like I don't know, just like reading it. like a journal entry. This message. suggests that you are hoping to have. more of a relationship with Mr. Combmes,

right?" Yeah. You're dreaming up a. beautiful future together, right? Uh-huh. Esto then brings up the fact. that Cassie was dating another producer. prior to dating Combmes, which the. sentiment being, okay, the defense is. trying to perhaps inconspicuously try to. make the jurors feel like Cassie is. someone who dates with opportunity. So, you just said that prior to your. relationship with Mr. Combmes, you were. in a relationship with Mr. Leslie, right? Mhm. And how much older than you. was, Mr. Leslie? I believe 10 years. older. When did you start dating him?

When I was 19, 18, 19. And it was. relatively serious. Yeah. In fact, I. think you had the tattoo of his initials. on your body, right? Uh-huh. So, because. you spent 3 years with Mr. Leslie, when. you started dating Mr. Combmes, it was. not the first time you had been dating. an older man, right? Second, baya. In another message, Estao is. trying to prove that Cassie loves. freakoffs with Cassie texting combs, "I. miss you," and then sending a very. explicit message and I miss our love.

sessions in the afternoon. And when. you're referring to love sessions in the. afternoon, you're referring to. freakoffs, right? I don't know in this. message, but they keep reading the. messages. At the bottom, Mr. Combmes. says, "You up? Want to have some freak. fun in the afternoon? Smiley face. Are. you horny or sleepy? We can sleep or. make love today. You respond, "I'm both. Lol. I thought we were going to lay up. and spend time, but you want to just. come here so we can talk in person. I. was thinking I wasn't going to see you. until tomorrow. I had stuff planned for. the day, but I'm good to cancel." Cassie.

says she doesn't remember this. conversation at all. But continuing on, another thread where Cassie texts. Combmes. I'm just going to lay by the. pool for some fun if it's cool. Wish we. could have effed before you left. My. period is over. Sad face. Esto continues. on that page. Mr. Combmes is not. initiating the freakoff conversation, right? No, not in that one. Later, Cassie mentions that sometimes if she. had a big event coming up, like her. movie premiere, she would offer a. freakoff as pre-damage.

control. He would just have made it. miserable for me. I never really had. like the chance to or opportunity to. enjoy the things that I'd worked really. hard on. So, I just felt like I was just. trying to play a balancing act a bit. Estabo starts relatively grilling. Cassie. And it wasn't only sex that you. were doing in the hotel, right? Having. in the hotel, right? You were also. listening to music, hanging out. True. In fact, I believe part of the reason. you wanted to participate in the. freakoffs was to have your time with. him, right? Yeah. And it was a special.

time that you cherished, right? Right. I think in proving the fact that Cassie. wanted the frees, which is what the. defense is saying in the opening. statements, that's the fact that they're. trying to prove to the jurors. I would. say I think emotionally the explicit. messages probably have the most impact. on the jurors. And then a lot of these. other side messages, it's like you could. really go either way depending on the. juror cuz I mean in the direct, they.

also brought up a lot of text messages. where she's initiating freakoffs. So, it. really just like depends on I guess the. juror because it doesn't matter what we. think. It matters what the 12 jurors. think. A big point of contention that. was mentioned in the defense opening. statement as well was the fact that the. freakoff videos that the government got. possession of, they received through. Cassie's computers and her electronics, not Shawn Combmes's, insinuating that. she had the power, that she was the one. in the control. She did not fear. blackmail because she was in possession. of said blackmail. Cassie texts Combmes.

I just deleted our little video off this. camera. It was so dope. He says, "I'mma. do it again." Estee looks at Cassie. Does that suggest to you that he was. referring to taking another video with. you? I would think so. I just don't know. what we're talking about exactly. I will. say in court, it just feels like they're. constantly showing her 5 million things. to refresh her memory that we're not. allowed to. see. So, the jurors don't see it either. They're not entered as evidence. So why.

are they showing them text messages? Yeah, they're just showing Cassie a. bunch of things. She has to sit there. and read through a bunch of things and. then they're like, "Do you remember that. day? It was just not well prepared is. the feeling." I don't know. She's going. through text messages, not in any sort. of chronological order. At one point, she's confused about the timeline. She's. getting very frustrated with this. timeline because they just keep grilling. her on questions and she's like, "I. don't even know when this is from. I. don't even know what we're talking. about. Yeah. Estabo continues about the. videos. Do you think that is a strategy.

or no? I think so because when she does. say like I don't remember this. I do. think that some jurors could perceive it. as she doesn't remember it because it. doesn't look good for her. Oh, I see. Was the feeling that I got from just. observing the jurors. I don't know. I. can't read minds. It was the feeling. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds like she's. trying to maybe potentially evading. this. Yeah. Like I don't know why I sent. that, you know, but it's like to me I. don't know if it's like the previous.

biases that we have, but it's like I'm. like I I genuinely she she's flipping. through so many papers. I would be. confused as well. Yeah. But Esto. continues about the videos and going. back to the videos. You testified on. direct about deleting videos that were. in your possession, right? Yes. And by. recording them on your devices, it gave. you the capability of deleting them, right? If I saw them. Yes. And at a. certain point in your relationship, you. insisted on recording them on your. device so that you could delete them, right? No. Would you want to record them. on your device so you could delete them?

I didn't want them to be recorded at. all. If they were going to be recorded, you'd prefer they would be on your. device. I don't know. Est also points. out a text thread of them talking about. an FO for later that night, which Comb's. text asking, can we kiss tonight a lot? To which Cassie responds, "Yes." which. goes back to her direct. She said she. hated kissing during um uh freakoffs. He. says, "What are you doing? Where are you. at?" "At hustler about to check out. Trying to find something to impress you.

Lol. You great. Go to hotel." "Okay, how. long you think you're going to be?" To. which Esto asks Cassie. And in this. exchange, so far you have not said no, right? Correct. The next important part. of the text is brought up. Esto is. asking Cassie what she responds next and. she says I left the iPad. Should I go. get it? Esto asks, "When you say you. left the iPad, that meant you previously. had possession of the iPad and had left. it wherever you left it." Yeah, I just. don't know whose iPad it was. So, it had.

been in your possession, right? Yes. Combmes appears to love this line of. questioning because he's like boopping. He's like nodding his head along to it. And you told him that you left the iPad. because you knew that he would want it. for the freakoff, right? Yes. And it was. anticipated that that iPad would be used. for some sort of recording for the. freakoff, right? In 2017. Yes. And you. asked him if you should go get it, right? I did. And he says, "Yeah, fuck.". Right.

Yes. They read the next message where. Cassie says, "Okay, I will run there. Sorry, I had it hidden, so I forgot to. grab it." In the same text message. exchange from 2017, Combmes asks Cassie. if she wants pizza. To which she. responds, "Almost there. I'm good, I. think. Maybe a slice. I'm too excited.". Estee questions her. That's referring to. the freak off that you were about to. attend. Correct. In my mind, I probably. would have been excited to see him and. have fun with him. But the words you. texted him were, "I'm so excited, right?" I'm too excited. I'm too.

excited. Excuse me. And this was after a. discussion about negotiating supplies. and logistics for a freakoff. Correct. Yes. Thank. you. So, they're trying to prove she had. access to the blackmail material that. she was supposedly very scared of. They're trying to argue that she. initiated and never said no to the. freakoffs. And now they're trying to. bring in jealousy, which was a huge part. of their defense opening statement. They. were saying even a lot of the violence. and the toxic relationship between Shawn.

Combmes and a lot of his um they say. like girlfriends and romantic partners. prosecutors say victims right is through. drug usage and. jealousy. So much jealousy. Okay. So. like the materials right like let's say. she has it on her device which is fine. that that still doesn't mean that she. wants this to be out there. So, let's. say if someone else say, "Hey, I'm going. to spread this video." That's still. blackmail, right? I think the defense is. trying to argue that he couldn't even do.

that because she has possession of the. iPad. No, but he say he has it, too. He. has text her that, "Hey, I'm going to. send those videos." So, he did say that. he will spread the video, but I don't. know. That's just what they're arguing. Okay. Yeah. I I am trying to keep like. give you the flow of what happened in. the courtroom, right? Right. Um I think. the point they're saying, "Oh, you have. the video, so it's not that he wants to. blackmail." Right. But to me, it's like. that that doesn't correlate to being. black male just because I have this.

video. Yeah. But also, I think another. thing to even if I have this video and I. let's say I share with you as a. boyfriend or girlfriend, still I can be. blackmailed, right? Yes. And. additionally, I think it's very. pertinent to consider the idea that a. lot of celebrities, even like Jennifer. Lawrence for example, her iCloud was. hacked. So I think there is a strong. level of paranoia that even if you think. that you have the only copy of something. I. mean I think you could easily be black,

especially at that level where he. presumably has a lot of power. I just. don't know. Well, I think as a woman, it's kind of hard to see Esteeo's points. with certain things cuz it's kind of. like like I get that this is what the. defense is going for, but also as a. woman, it's like I think a lot I think a. lot of women in the gallery of the. courtroom likely felt the same way is. the whispers in the hallways. I felt. it's like, yeah, legally, we don't. really know because we're not attorneys. The jurors have different perceptions,

but as a woman, it's like so many people. could relate to those feelings of. anxiety. Yeah. This episode is sponsored by Acorns. The. best piece of money advice I ever. received was time in the market beats. timing the market. But where do you even. start? That is where Acorns comes in. Acorns is a financial wellness app that. makes it easy to start saving and. investing for your future. You don't. need to be rich. Acorns lets you get. started with the spare money you've got.

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endorsement compensation provides. incentive to positively promote Acorns. Tier 4 compensation provided. Investing. involves risks. Acorns Advisors LLC and. SEC registered investment adviser. View. important disclosures at. acorns.com/rotten. [Music]. Now they bring in jealousy and she is. asked, "What would trigger Shawn. Combmes's incestant calling from your. perspective?" It could just be anything. from not telling him where I was, many.

things, just angry with me about. anything. Why do you think that he was. concerned when he didn't know where you. were? I think because he would assume I. was cheating, but I don't know. So the. defense brought up again jealousy, insatiable jealousy, and they say it. goes both ways. They enter another. exhibit that shows a text message where. Cassie texts Shawn Combmes. Amazing. I. love you so much. It made me feel like I. can't wait until we don't care anymore. What did you mean until we don't care. anymore? Honestly, I don't know. I. haven't seen this message in a while, but we definitely were not open about.

our relationship at the beginning part. Yeah. Does it suggest that you're. looking forward to becoming public with. your relationship? That I can agree. with. Yeah. They show another text. message that reads and they have Cassie. read it. So, you hung up. It's like I. need to have something written out to. say to you with no breathing room or. you'll get mad at me and hang up. I. haven't talked to you at all. I know you. can take three minutes out of your day. to talk to me and you don't even try. You're in too much of a rush to get me. off the phone. That's not being in a. relationship with somebody that you love.

and are in love with. I'm really hurt by. the way you deal with me. I don't need. your money. I need some attention. I'm. thankful, but I can pay for these things. myself. Another one from July 2nd, 2013. By this point, they have been together. for a good amount of time. So, this is. like later. A lot of the messages are. from like 2007, 2008, so 2013. She texts. him, "As much as you think that you're. Bruce Willis." Now, side note, Bruce. Willis has a very healthy relationship. with his ex, Demi Moore, whilst raising. their kids together, even though they.

both have new partners. She's like, "You. think you're Bruce Willis? You aren't. He's married, and before he was married, the family as a whole went on trips. together. So, she's saying he's married. the new love of his life. And even like. before that, the family went on trips. together as a whole. Or just him and his. woman. Eddie Murphy and Paige took his. kids away on their own. He didn't go. with his ex because that's not who he's. in love with. I've been at the edge of. tears this whole week. I don't think. that you sympathize with my feelings. I. understand you feeling like you need to. protect your children. But after a.

while, it's like for what? They've never. known you and Kim to be together unless. there's something I just don't know. about. They were babies when we started. dating. If Chance can go away with her. dad and not her mom. So Chance is the. daughter of Sarah Chapman and. Sean. I think the other kids can too. The more time that goes by, the harder. it is to understand I'm here. I'm ready. to be that woman and I'm in a constant. fight because you won't ever allow it. This isn't what I want. I can't be that.

woman this way. I'm bracing myself for. pictures that are going to break my. heart. That's where my head is at. So. Cassie explains that she's frustrated. because a lot of the holidays she. couldn't spend it with Shawn. Kim Porter. and the family would all go off, but a. lot of the times it's not even like. Sarah Chapman would come is her. argument. Like I you keep saying that. it's because the kids need Kim Porter, but they never thought you guys were. like in a happy marriage. So she's just. saying like you're making excuses and. I'm getting upset. Mhm. Estelle looks up.

at her. Miss Ventura, you were upset. that you weren't integrated into Mr. Combs his family life, right? Yep. That. you didn't get a chance to form a. relationship with his children. Correct. Correct. You'd been together with him. for years at this point, right? Almost 7. years here. When you would see photos of. him in Kim Porter, that would be. extremely hurtful, right? Not always. If. you saw them on social media when he was. on vacation with Kim and his kids. together, that was a little. heartbreaking, right? It could be. You. just didn't want to be a part of his. sexual fantasy, right? Because you know.

there's this point of I feel like I'm. just for. freakoffs, right? Mr. Combmes texts. back, "Man, I'm going to spend time with. my kids. I'm sorry you feel that way. I. won't let no pictures be taken." She. responds, "Well, I hope that you enjoy. the kids. I don't trust that after the. type of sexual relationship you've had. with me, you had with her and have in. the recent past. Today I texted you that. I wish we could have eoed before you. left." By the way, I think this part is. just sad, but all good. That was what I.

didn't get to say. I'm done venting. Thank you for hearing me out somewhat. Hope you don't shut your phone down like. you said you were going to. That would. really break my heart. I won't. And you. still have no response to what I said. about an. FO. I think this has been interpreted. some different ways. Some netizens feel. like it's her initiating an FO and like. using it as her own power play. A lot of. other netizens think this is just really. sad. It's clear that she knows that's. what he wants to use her for. And in.

these moments where she's expressing. sadness, she pulls back so quickly. She. doesn't even double down. She's like, "By the way, if you're interested, you. know, so some it's been interpreted. differently depending on who the person. is." Another text message chain reads, "Come starts off by first saying, "The. things I want to do for you and to you. I want to be nasty for you. I want to do. what you want me to do. I want to make. you finish more than you've ever. finished. I want you to feel safe to let. go. The pause is in the courtroom. Can.

you begin reading your response, Miss. Ventura? We'll take it one line at a. time. When when was this text from. remember? Probably like 2012, I want to. say. Okay. Can you begin reading line by. line? I like that. I want it and I want. to give you the same. I just think that. I have to trust you beyond just being. sexual. Do you know what I mean? In. order for me to be more open with the. things we do in bed, I need to feel. safe, like home, like this is my. husband, and this is the only man that.

will ever see this aggressive sexual. side of me. Um, I will say that Esther. Veo does a like relatively good job at. incorporating pauses. Again, sometimes. it's to craft her next question. Other. times it feels like it's intentionally. done to let some of these messages sit. with the jurors. Now, Esteeo asks, "Does. this reflect a communication between you. and Mr. Combmes that you want him to be. the only one that he's doing these. things with?" withdrawn. She withdraws. her own question. And then she asks, "It reflects that.

your acceptance of doing freakoffs with. him is that it's like home. This is my. husband and this is the only man that. will ever have this aggressive sexual. side of me, right? Am I reading that. correctly?" Prosecutor Johnson leans in. Objection sustained, which means. rephrase your question or move on. Sustained means that's not a good. question. Overruled means you can reask. that question and it should be answered. Esto has Cassie read the rest of the. message while she reads it to the court.

The last time was a mistake, but since. has made me feel a little dirty and. grimy as opposed to sensual and. spontaneous. That's the only reason why. I go back and forth in my mind with. wanting and not wanting to do it. When. we used to freak off when we were so in. love, there were no questions asked. It. felt right. Like it literally made sense. for the next step of our sex life. together. I get nervous that I'm. becoming the girlfriend that you get. your fantasies off with and that's that. I don't get the other part anymore at. least. When you sent that message, were.

you afraid that Mr. Combmes was only. seeing you for this in this way and that. you were only fulfilling that part of. his life? Again, I don't like remember. this message specifically, but at the. end of it, it sounds like that. Yeah. Like I was worried about that. And that. your hesitancy was that you were afraid. that you would just become the. girlfriend to get his fantasies off. with, right? That you wouldn't be his. true full girlfriend. That's a way to. look at it, I guess. Yeah. You say that. you go back and forth in your mind with. wanting and not wanting to do it, right? Yep. And you say that's the only reason.

why I go back and forth in my mind, right? That's what it says in the. message. Yes. Because at the time you. were afraid that you were being treated. as someone who could just get his. fantasies off with, right? That was a. concern. So they're trying to establish. that the only reason she didn't want to. do freak offs was because she's. concerned that's that's all she's good. for. So that's the point that the. defense is trying to make. And you were. still not public in your relationship. with him, right? Correct. And so it was. a fear that you would never be his. public girlfriend, right? I guess that.

was something that was thought about. It. wasn't a huge fear. It was kind of an. understanding we had more so. Esto even. brings up that Combmes once left a. freakoff in a hotel room with Cassie to. go see Kim Porter in another room. Were. you jealous of Miss Porter? I had some. jealousy of Miss Porter. Yeah. There. were periods during the holidays when. you learned that Mr. Combmes was. spending time with Miss Porter. I always. knew that every holiday. And did that. upset you? It did. Yeah. And do you. recall a time in April 2014 when you. learned of someone named Gina? Um, Gina.

is an ex-girlfriend of Shawn Combmes. This is around the time that he was. dating Young Miami publicly and there. was a lot of back and forth between the. two of them where Gina would Snapchat or. Instagram story Shawn Combmes in her. house and then Young Miami was making. fun of the fact that maybe Shawn Combmes. is paying her rent, but she still has. carpet in her house. And there was a lot. of like little drama. But I think the. biggest takeaway was Gina at one point. did go onto a podcast to allege that. Shawn Combmes was incredibly violent.

with her and that he would he forced her. to terminate pregnancies as well. He was. like mentally, emotionally, and. physically abusing me and uh you mind. telling me what happened with that. pregnancy? He was like, "You're going to. get an abortion, right?" And then he. offered me 50,000 to get rid of it, but. I turned it down. So Gina does come up a. lot in this. When Gina comes up, the way. that Combmes is sitting is like a. teacher's pet. Like I want to answer the. question, like pick me vibes. Yes. Cassie says she found out through social.

media. And what was your reaction to. that? I was really upset. Cassie says. that Shawn just denied it to some. extent. And in fact, he did not break it. off with Gina as you were led to. believe, right? Yeah. And did that upset. you at the time? Yeah, it did. Cassie. admits, "Yeah, it led to arguments. between the two of them." Were there. many women that you saw on social media. who claimed to have relationships with. Mr. Combmes? Not many, like a lot, but. not crazy. But you reacted when you saw. on social media that Mr. Combmes was.

with some other female, right? Yes. Mainly Gina. Was Gina the main problem. in your relationship? I would say so. Was Mr. Combmes consist consistently. denying his relationship to Gina with. you? For the most part. And how did that. make you feel? Not great. She says she. finally drew the line when she saw a. video of Combmes at a music conference, literally trying to hide Gina off to the. side. And she does somewhat cooporate. this in a podcast that has now since. been deleted. Gina said in a podcast she. went to I believe it was French.

Montana's birthday party where Sean. comes allegedly had her sitting behind. like a poster board. Do you remember. that? That said like happy birthday or. No, I think it was Meek Mill. It's. either Meek Mill or French Montana. I. think it's Meek Mill. Yes. And then she. like leaned over while Sean Combmes was. bent over. I'm sorry. forgive me. This. was like months ago, okay? And I think. she had said like, "Happy birthday, Meek." And then she said that she was. physically assaulted in the car that. night. He like grabbed my hair and like. cussed me out. And then when we got to. the hotel, it got even worse. He took.

one of my heels and tried to throw it at. me. And then he like mushed my face and. like really hard and made my nose bleed. To which Esto says, "And he was telling. you that you were if not the number one. girlfriend because of Kim Porter, the. number two, right? Uh-huh. October 13th, 2012. Combmes text. Cassie. You ready for tonight? Yes. I. just got to get stuff. You got all you. need, man. You had all day. All day. It's always something. One day. Wait,

what? So, it seems like he's getting. agitated that she still needs to pick up. supplies for the freakoff. Oh, yeah. I. don't know why this was shown cuz I was. like I don't think I don't think he's. making the point that you wanted to. make. Yeah. I'm sure there's like a. legal point that they're trying to make, but there were certain points where I'm. like, the point was not made. I feel. like it went the other way. A few months. later, Cones text Cassie. I said, "Answer the question. What am I doing? What am I doing disrespectful in the. picture?" So, clearly Cassie is upset. about some sort of picture. And he said, "What am I doing that's disrespectful?

You're making me look like a sidepiece, and that is not what I thought I was, and you won't come to [ __ ] We've. We'll all have a great time because for. 2013, I'm not on any okey bull. It is. what it is. I am who I am to you and I'm. clear. We'll have a good time no matter. what. I'm having a ball. I'll be happy. with you no matter what. I'll treat you. as a king no matter what. Esto asks. Cassie. You're concerned that you're. looking like a side piece. What do you. mean by that? Not a main girlfriend. And. that upset you, right? Apparently. So, because you wanted to be the main.

girlfriend, right? I thought I was. I. just don't know what we're even talking. about though. He's talking about a. picture. I don't know what the picture. is. Estabo ignores her. You testified on. direct that you were insanely jealous, right? I did say that. Yeah. Side note, this is what was said during direct. Cassie says more or less there was a lot. of cheating in the relationship. She. says there were times she saw other. guys, he saw other women, and she said, "I was insanely jealous, but also super. young. Didn't get it at all, but I was. definitely Yeah. young and jealous.". When you say that you didn't get it, what didn't you get? So, this is.

prosecutor Johnson during the direct. I. didn't get that he was him. As he would. say, I'm Puff. Puff Daddy. And Puff. Daddy has many women where you know he. likes the company of women and yeah I. had to just really learn that over time. despite what he would tell us tell me. just between us. Esto continues you were. insanely jealous right? Sure but I. wasn't I expressed that can I speak? Of. course I expressed insanely jealous is. who I was then and it didn't pertain to. every situation but I was definitely.

jealous of certain situations that he. was in. So, it seemed hypocritical to. you that he would date other women but. simultaneously expect you to only be in. a sexual relationship with him, right? Yeah. Jurors seem locked in for the text. message portions of the. cross-examination. Other parts, they. look like they're falling asleep. So, I'm just going to run you through a few. lines of questioning. And I think a lot. of it has to do with the fact that both. the direct and the cross, they just keep. jumping around too much. They keep. repeating the same question. And I get.

the point. They repeat the same question maybe in. the direct because they're trying to. pull more emotion or information out of. Cassie. Same as the cross. However, I. think like when you ask multiple times, were you scared of the violence in the. relationship? The first time Cassie. responds, it's like a very emotional. moment. You sit with it. And then if you. ask her five more times, I think it's. human nature. Like each time you hear. similar phrasing of the words, the. impact lessens. And that's like one. thing that I was reading from attorneys.

who were talking about doing directs and. cross because they were like you want. that emotion to be fresh. Like the more. you hear the more sensitized you get to. it. So I mean the cross as well it was. jumping all over the place. One line of. questioning I think is trying to. establish that Cassie is not scared and. that she had ample opportunity to leave. with Esto asking even though you were in. a relationship with each other you. weren't together all the time right? No. In fact, you often had long breaks from. each other when you didn't see each. other, right? Yeah. And he sometimes.

would have to travel for long periods of. time when he was doing something for. work, right? Yep. They also tried to. argue that she's a very strong, capable, independent woman, which was said. controversially in the defense opening. statement with Esto asking questions. like, "At the time, you were very. successful 21-year-old, right? I was. trying." Yeah. They tried to prove a. point by asking which celebrity showed. up to her 21st birthday party. Cassie. kind of looks confused like, "What does. that even have to do anything with. success?" She's like, "Sean was there. He brought Dallas Austin. He brought.

Britney Spears. I think those were the. two people that stand out to me." How is. it that a 21-year-old is able to attract. such celebrities to her birthday party. in Vegas? That was all him. Yeah, I. didn't even know them. What. accomplishments had you already achieved. by the time you were 21? Cassie says she. had a pretty good first successful. album. She's like, "It did well. I think. we have a plaque." You had a very. popular song that were wellknown at the. time. Yeah. And people wanted to know. you and get to know you. Yeah. And. you've been modeling for some time. Yes.

And you're very beautiful and. charming. Like that was a really random. And she says, "Thank you." And everyone. in the courtroom starts really awkwardly. laughing. It's just awkward. I don't. know if she was trying to get her to say. yes to make her seem like, "Oh yeah, I'm. so pretty. Thank you." You know, but. Cassie felt awkward. She said, "Thank. you." And everyone's laughing because it. was just like a very um I think it's an. odd moment where the tension of it all, everybody was holding on to tension and. then they just like released it in this.

giggle. I don't think anyone thought it. was funny. It was just uncomfortable. Yeah, it was like really weird. What was. your financial situation as a. 21-year-old having a successful album. out? Cassie explains it's mainly her. modeling money that she saved up at this. point. Were you able to have an. apartment in Manhattan? Yeah, my own. place. And pay for your own clothes and. goods. Yeah, another key point the. defense brings up. Whether you think. it's a point that was made or not is up. to you, but they bring up that Cassie. testified in direct that she saw Combmes. hold her friend over the balcony before.

he threw her onto the patio furniture. They show text messages to Cassie, not. to us, between Cassie and Christina. Corm, the chief of staff for Shawn. Combmes. Didn't you tell Miss Cororm. that you just learned about Mr. Combmes's activities on the balcony? You. told Miss Cororm that you learned after. the fact that Mr. Comb supposedly. dangled Miss Bangalon's feet off the. balcony, right? No, you didn't tell Miss. Cororm that. I'm not sure what you're. asking me. It's kind of confusing. Did. you tell Miss Cororm that you had just. learned something crazy? I saw that I.

did text that. I don't know if that's. what I'm referring to because a lot of. crazy things happened. Isn't it true. that you learned about this incident on. the balcony after the fact? I saw what I. saw. So, I I don't know. That line of. questioning kind of ends there. They. also try to highlight that Cassie did. have relationships outside of combs. Cassie disagrees, stating that it occurs. when they were on bricks, but Esto asks. her, "What would trigger his incessant. calling from your perspective?" From my. perspective, what would trigger it? Could be anything from not telling him. where I was, many things, just just.

being angry with me about anything. Why. did you think he was concerned when he. didn't know where you were? I think. because he thought he would assume that. I was cheating, but I don't know. Mr. Combmes also developed suspicions that. you were not faithful to him. Correct. Correct. What was his reaction like when. he developed those suspicions? It was a. little scary. Yeah. So, they start. bringing up Kid Cuddy. Um, they start. bringing up the fact that he learned. about that connection during a freakoff. where he went through her phone and then.

he tried to attack her. She ran away. She got to a hotel. Then she decided. that she was going to go talk to Shawn. Combmes at his house. He kicked her in. the back. She went back to the hotel. The whole hotel room was trashed. She. and Scott Muscati, which is Kid Cuddy, they went to Connecticut to be with her. family. This is around Christmas time. And then eventually she breaks up with. him because she felt like this was a. dangerous situation. By New Year's, she's back with Shawn Combmes. Did you. feel justified in cheating on him with. Mr. Muscui because of Mr. Combmes's. infidelities? I could have possibly. I.

don't know. To your knowledge, this was. particularly offensive to Mr. Combmes. because of Kid Cuy's stature in the. industry, right? To my knowledge. Yeah, because from his perspective, he was. cheating on you with people who weren't. celebrities, right? In 2011, I don't. think so. And because you understood. that Mr. Combmes put you in the studio. with Kid Cuddy. Yes. You would. frequently have text arguments about. cheating and he would bring up Kid Cuddy. all the time, right? Yeah. He would. always throw it back in your face, right? He brought it up quite a bit. So,

the main point that was argued here is. that um Combmes was the one that. introduced her to Kid Cuddy. I think. that the defense here is trying to. establish a pattern of cheating from. both sides. Um, I think it also probably. connects to the fact that Shawn Combmes. had hired Alex Fine as her personal. trainer and then they ended up getting. married. Again, I think every single. person is going to have a different. reaction to this. That's the point that. the defense is trying to establish from. the court's perspective. Like being in. the courtroom, that was the perspective.

They also bring up the fact that she was. in South Africa filming a movie called. Honey 3 and that's when she started. dating Michael B. Jordan and that she. had another brief relationship with. someone who was an NBA star. She doesn't. know if he still is. Yeah. Esto brings. up another celebrity. He found out that. you were dancing with another person in. the entertainment industry and was upset. and took your phone. Right. I honestly. don't know. Do you remember the occasion. when he suspected of you dancing with. Chris Brown? I do. Which, side note, weird connection. Mark Geros was Chris.

Bound's attorney during the incident. with Rihanna and he is technically a. long-term attorney for Shawn Combmes. So, just like random attorney. connection. I do, but I was not. He. thought you were, right? I don't know. Defense exhibit 1303A is received into. evidence. Estao leans towards the. podium. I'll read Mr. Combmes's message. Can I not get a chance to make things. right? It seems like you're blaming. everything on me. It's like you have.

anger to me. I haven't taken care of. you. Cassie responds, "I'm not running. around telling our business, but my. family knows because I need their. support right now. You took care of me. materialistically, not where I needed. it. I have lived in this bubble by. myself for too long. I'm too dope. You. may not be happy, but maybe it's because. you surround yourself with people that. always take from you. I don't need you. taking care of Kim, Sarah, and Gina. I. needed to love you and put me first. I. just don't trust anymore." The last shot. put the nail in the coffin. I promised. myself I wouldn't be with you anymore if. you did that to me again. You lied to.

me. When I think to Burning Man a year. ago, all the things I found out that you. paid for and continued happening, I just. love myself more. I'm not blaming you. Maybe I didn't try, but you wanted me to. be a machine and forgive you every time. And she never went away. When you're. talking about the last shot put in the. nail in the coffin that she never went. away, you're talking about Gina, right? I would think so. Combmes is slowly. nodding his head during the line of. questioning. Now, Cassie was really. collected for like her 12-hour.

cross-examination. There are parts where. she would be waiting and awkwardly kind. of smiling at Esto. She seemed very. genuine, like she wasn't like throwing. daggers at Esto. When it was quiet, she. would just kind of awkwardly sit there. and smile. At one point, Esto asks her. if a personal assistant ever came into. the hotel room during a freakoff. Cassie. is like, "To my knowledge, they set up. and helped clean up after freakoffs. I. don't know if they ever came in during. You would remember if an employee came. into the room while you were in the. middle of a session with an escort, right? Maybe. I don't know. I was high. as well. I just I had my privacy invaded.

quite a bit while I was in that. relationship. So, I can imagine. So, a. lot of people, especially after seeing. Don Rashard's cross, a lot of people. think that Cassie held her own during. the cross examination regardless of like. what nizens I guess feel about her. Um, yeah, she was very good at answering. questions genuinely and not getting. bulldozed. Mhm. Later, Cassie mentions. that she's not a huge going out type of. person. You've never been a huge going. out person. No. No. Personally liked it.

No, but you did a lot of it. I did. In. fact, you were paid handsomely for it, right? Yes. And you spent a lot of time. in clubs. Yeah. Too much. There's. another ridiculous incident where Estee. is just reading off messages. Mr. Combmes says, "Can you make it? I think. it'll be good to go with Will tonight.". Rube can take you. You say, "How are. you? I love you." Mr. Combmes says, "I'm. missing you, Miss Belt." And you have a. frowny face. And you say, "Stering at. our pictures from the plane. I miss. you." Mr. Combmes says, "I love you. Good morning to my queen. Have the. greatest day at work and get a lot of.

work done." You say, "Good. Good. morning, my king. You mean everything to. me with extra ease and O's." And. Johnson, prosecutor Johnson stands up. Your honor, is there a question coming? Esto pauses because you cannot make. statements. You must ask questions. during a cross- examination. She says, "Am I reading this accurately, Miss. Ventura? I'm just waiting to find out. what you want me to answer." Am I. reading this accurately? I believe so. You're just reading it. And then you. respond, "I will have the greatest day. of my life until you're back home,

right?" Yeah, I can see that Cassie's. cousin was in the row in front of us. though her whole um her attorneys and. then you had Alex Fine, her brother and. her cousin. I could see her face pretty. clearly and I wrote this down. We. observed that whenever Cassie had these. slightly smarter responses to Esteeo, her cousin would smile up at her. Like. most of the time she was not smiling. There was one time where she was sitting. down and we made awkward eye contact and. she smiled. But they they were like not.

interacting with the press. like they. were very focused on like not even. looking at us, right? But um she was. like smiling at Cassie with all these. smart moments. It was like a very. interesting smile. It I don't know, but. it gave me one of those moments of like. stand your ground smile. Yeah, that's. what it felt like to us. Esto's cross is. interesting. Um I will describe some of. the body language. I think that I think. that she had a really hard job in the.

defense team because I think whoever is. cross-examining Cassie, first of all, they knew it had to be a woman. obviously, but whoever is doing it, they. can't come off too aggressive. They. can't come off too hostile. This is. victim number one of the entire case. They have to be gentle. They have to. discredit her all while being polite, not being aggressive at the same time. I. think it's very tricky. I think that so. far out of everything we've seen from. the defense, this is probably the. hardest position one of them has been.

put in thus far. Probably there will be. more opportunities for harder positions, but I will describe some of the body. language. Um, Estee the whole time has. her arms crossed and then she keeps like. getting postit from Tenny Garagos. She. keeps looking at Mark Agnil. She keeps. looking at Tenny while Cassie's. answering the question. She does this. thing where she will physically lean. over the podium and like listen to Mark. whisper to her the next question and. she'll do it with her arms crossed. It's. like this really weird demeanor. It's.

like when you're doing a group project. and you were not there for most of the. project and the teacher, the professor. is like, "So, who did the group. project?" And you lean over and they. whisper and you go, "So, we did." That. was the energy. And it was not just. perceived by me. Because later at a. sidebar, the judge tells Esto, "One. thing I'd like to avoid. I know you're. almost done. Sometimes a question is. asked and then you're kind of going and. looking at the rest of the members of. the defense." I think it's disruptive in. terms of you have asked a question, so. you should listen to the answer. And the. jury is seeing it. I don't want that to.

be an element of this case, Mark. Yeah, it was weird. Like she like. physically just leaned over and then. would come back. So, the judge is saying. that you should you need to pay. attention to the answers. Yes. And I. think that's why the cross was so. confusing and kept jumping around. because it didn't feel like she's going. based off of the answers that Cassie is. giving. It's like she has a list of. questions and she's just like checking. it off. And I do think the prosecutor. was doing the same thing. Johnson was.

doing similar things with Cassie, but it. just both of them it was and it was so. long. And I think the part that really. bothered me is like yes, you have to. establish your foundation. You have to. tell the jurors everything, right? But. now it's like you put such a pregnant. Cassie on the stand for so long. And I. swear to goodness, from my opinion, half. the time for the direct and the cross, it looked like the jurors were falling. asleep. So I'm like, why are you putting.

this girl through all of this just to go. in circles and the jurors don't even. care? Or at least it looks like they. don't even care. Got it. Mark tries to. take the fall for it. He tells the. judge, "It's probably our fault. I'll. try to keep up. I'll try to uh keep it.". And then he pauses because the judge. interrupts. Miss Esto is in charge. I'm sorry, judge. Now, there were brief. arguments on whether or not the still. images of freakoffs would be shown to. the press and public in open court, aka. not posted online, like sealed.

government, like exhibits that are. sealed, so you can't request them, not. shared with media organizations, but. displayed on the public screen that the. members of the press and public can see. I actually have a sick. feeling the RMT members and I were. talking about it. There were some. members of the public in the line. outside the courthouse where it felt. like they came specifically in hopes of. seeing something. That was like the kind. of conversations we heard over overheard. some. It was just really gross. There. was one representative that I believe.

was a spokesperson for major media. outlets that stated it should be. viewable in open court stating that the. evidence should not be sealed or that. they should pull certain reporters, some. members of the press like vetted. members, some representatives that can. see the videos so that they can present. a description to them to the public. The. argument being that these videos must. have some persuasive and evidentiary. value that the public should have the. right to know about. Now, as a certified. member of the press since two full. minutes ago, I think these people are.

insane. I'm sorry. That's crazy to me. The fact that these like major. publications are arguing that through a. spokesperson, I get that justice needs. to be served and the argument being that. it probably has some evidentiary value. Yeah. But also just like no, Cassie is. already explaining and giving. descriptions. I don't know why providing. pictures to any members of any select. group of press, no matter how reputable. the publisher, the the network, it just. feels unnecessarily cruel for the sake.

of quote journalism. The spokesperson. argues the New York Times and the Wash. Post and the Wall Street Journal are not. interested in reporting anything. salacious. They want to be able, however, to report that this was shown. to the jury and here in a very discreet. and appropriate and mature way is what. they show. There's no different than any. other trial, your honor. So, we do. strongly, strongly object to the total. sealing of the exhibits. We think they. should be shown to the press and the. public. We're not asking for copies. We. do understand the serious privacy.

concerns. We ask the court to try and. craft something that not only has the. privacy concerns considered, but the. very strong First Amendment access right. considered as well. To which the. prosecutor at Comey, she later states to. the judge, "The core of the objection is. that this was blackmail material that. was used to victimize these women, used. to convince them to do more or coers. them to do more of these acts, and. showing them to anyone more than. absolutely necessary, would feed into. that victimization, would revictimize. them and would unnecessarily humiliate.

them. We have now heard vivid. testimonies about how humiliating one. victim found all these incidents to be. And in our view, in our victim's. council's view, it is absolutely. unnecessary and unwarranted to show them. to anyone outside of the jury and the. parties, which the judge thankfully. agrees. Yeah, I don't know what that. like really irked me. I was like fuming. in the courtroom. I was like, I know I'm. not supposed to make reactions, but I. want to stand up. Which Okay, during. another break without the presence of. the jurors or Cassie, the judge asks. Esteeo how much longer she needs. Mark.

Agno stands up and he says, "I was told. that I would be the one to fall on the. sword. I think that's my role at this. trial. I think we're definitely going to. finish this week. I think it's going to. be all day tomorrow. We're going to do. everything that we can." The judge is. not happy because for months they have. been talking about how Cassie needs to. be off the stand by the end of the week. Finish, cross, redirect, everything by. Friday. No questions asked. You. recognize that is the exact opposite of. what I was told yesterday in this. courtroom? Does he sound upset about.

this? Yeah. He's not like He's like, "You do recognize that this is the exact. opposite of what I told you in this. courtroom, like what I was told. yesterday in this courtroom." And he's. looking at them like, "Explain yourself. right now." So, they're saying, "We need. more time." Yeah. And Mark is like, "Yes, that's why there's a sword that I. must fall on. It's a lot of material to. go through. It's the most important. witness in this case. We're trying to do. it very quickly." The judge is like, "This was the subject of discussion for. I don't even think it's weeks. I think. it's months that this witness needed to. be off the stand by the end of the week. So what happened? I never understood.

that. I understood. The government asks. our direct took less than 2 days, probably a day and a half. And we would. ask that the court exercise its. discretion under rule 611, aka avoid. wasting time and make procedures. effective for determining the truth. Under rule 611 to limit the cross-. examination to the length of the direct. Mark says, "One thing I want to point. out is the government chose to call two. witnesses before this witness, which. took up a great deal of time. So, I. don't know that this artificial dead. deadline of the end of the week, end of.

day, Friday, should be held against us. They chose not to call her first. That. wasn't our choice. So, we are going to. do everything we can, but it's a. critically important witness. Prosecutor. Comey pops up. As he knows and as we. told defense council, the first two. witnesses had scheduling issues and. we're not going to be able to testify. otherwise. The judge is not moved by the. defense. It was the understanding of. everyone that this witness would be off. the stand by the end of the week. direct. took a day and a half, so the defense. will have a day and a half. He also. notes, "Miss Esto, you have a witness.

who is being responsive to your. questions, the questions you're asking. This is not the kind of witness that is. fighting you on every single question. that you're asking." Mark Agnilo says, "Now it's in now it's starting to feel a. little strategic on the government's. part to kind of pen us in to only having. a day and a half or 2 days for cross. It's not uncommon for cross to be 3 4. hours longer or shorter than one. estimates." The judge snaps a bit. In. what universe did you not understand. that this was important given that it. was in the numerous filings and. discussed amongst the parties several. times? When was this taking place? Uh in.

the middle like the jurors and the. witness would be gone and just like an. open court. They have these discussions. like a midday break type of thing. Yeah. They'll have like a few breaks and then. they'll have lunch but then even for. lunch they'll send the jury they'll send. the witness out and then they'll. continue talking you know and then. afterwards they have a few more breaks. Yeah. Wasn't there like speculations on. why they're doing this? Like delay this. uh cross because Cassie is extremely. pregnant. Yeah. Yeah. So, there's like a.

lot of speculations that the defense is. pulling out some really dirty cards. There were speculations that they were. trying to delay the beginning of the. trial so that Cassie wouldn't be. pregnant during her testifying, which. was later semiconirmed to some netizens. with the defense trying to argue that. they didn't want Cassie to walk in front. of the jurors pregnant. M. So there's. like a lot of reasons, but you know, it's very interesting because the judge, like I said, what I've heard about the. judge is that he's so fair. One attorney.

that I did unrelated to this case, I. heard in the hallways, they said that. judge is sharp. He's too sharp. Personally, I like my judges a little. dumb. Like, this judge is very sharp. So, there's that. Yeah. Mark Agnif. continues, "This is a critical witness. in a case that involves a life sentence. So, the schedule is important, but Mr. Combmes's right to cross-examine this. witness fully and fairly is quite. important. Thankfully, the defense does. start speeding things up and Cassie is. off the stand by Friday. But it's very. interesting. The judge even says, "I. thought it was pretty clear that if.

issues are to be raised before the jury. comes in, they need to be raised with. the court in advance and I've been very. lenient. There have been letters that. have come in at 3:00 a.m. I've come in. early so I can make sure that I have a. handle on the issues before we get here. because the jury has been so prompt.". even later or earlier in that day when. the jurors come in for the first time in. the morning. He apologizes every time. Welcome back members of the jury. I'm. only five minutes late today. So his. like tone of voice, he's so. compassionate with jurors and witnesses. You were here early as usual. So I.

apologize for our lateness, but we are. making a couple minutes of progress. We. will keep working on it on our end. Like. just so nice. During the direct, so this. is with the prosecutors. Cassie explains. that she had started freaking out at one. moment in the timeline because she was. texting Shawn. I need you to call me. ASAP. Sean's responding, "I called. pickup. When did he say he saw it? How. long ago? Ask him what did the room look. like, etc. Girl, you need to act like. you need to get this info." So, Cassie's. explaining, "I was in Atlantic City. hosting a party with new management.

company. While we were out, somebody. that I was working with mentioned that. they had seen a truly explicit video of. me, and immediately my thoughts went to. a freakoff video. So I reached out to. Sean Combmes is texting her. You got to. tell him this is your life and this is. serious. Ask him who kid bring it up. So. that's a DJ. Did he say hey look I got. this video with Cassie. The natural. question Sujin would have asked is how. did he get the footage and what is he. planning on doing with it? You got to. tell him this is your life and this is. serious. Wait. So Cassie called Sean. saying that hey somebody mentioned a. tape. Sean was like call him ask him.

this is my life. Do something right now. Oh, but like he's saying you tell him. this is your life. Like you got to do. something about this. But he's like. putting pressure on her for sure. Now. Esto brings that moment back up. You. said on your direct that you had learned. from Suzan that there was potentially a. recording of you out there, right? Sujen. is part of the new management company. Oh, okay. Okay. I think Yeah. And you. were concerned about it because you. thought it may have been one of the Free. Cop videos, correct? And you at some. point were with Sujan and you asked him.

about the video, right? Yes. And you. suggested on your direct that Mr. Combmes was encouraging you to get to. the bottom of it with Sujan. Correct. Yes. Which later it's revealed that. Cassie even asked Shawn if they should. take Sugjan. hostage. They play an audio clip. A. recording that Cassie took herself. A. lot of people were shocked by the audio. clip. Um, I think in the courtroom there. was definitely a heavier impact because, you know, when you're sitting there all. day just listening and then you see like. some random bubbles of text messages.

here and there and it's like 7 hours in. and then all of a sudden you hear an. audio clip, it's going to be a lot more. memorable. It's going to feel like a lot. heavier of an emphasis because it's. like, wo, what's happening right now? But can you set the scene for us in. terms of what's going on in this audio. recording? Where are you? I believe. we're in Atlantic City. just hosted a. set of parties the night before and you. reviewed this audio recording this. morning before taking the stand. I did. Yes. In the recording, you hear Suja. asking Cassie to come to one of his. events. He offers to pay her. Cassie.

says, "You don't have to pay me for me. to come. What I need to talk to you. about is the video of me." Sujan reveals. that he has it. And Cassie sounds. genuinely heartbroken. She says, "You. have it? Why wouldn't you show me?" And. then she's like, "I would have shown you. if I had a video of you." Wait, what do. you mean you have it late? He's Okay. To. me, it sounds like he's either drunk or. high. He's not cooperating. He's just.

like, "Haha." Like, honestly, it was. frustrating to hear cuz it's like, and. she sounds like she's getting. progressively more anxious. She sounds. heart hurt, heartbroken. Like, what do. you mean you have it? And then now. you're not showing me. And then he's. just like, "Haha, yeah, because I never. want to see it again." And she's like, "No, you have to show me." And he's. like, "No." Later she expresses, "No, I. will kill you. I will cut you. I will. bury you in the [ __ ] dirt. I will. kill you and he will kill you again and. I'm going to kill you because you're. [ __ ] with me in my life right now.

I'm going to you and it's not I'm going. to kill you and it's not going to be me. There's not going to be blood on my. hands." It was not um I see some people. describing it as menacing in a tone that. we've never heard Cassie before. I don't. necessarily think so. It was not like. this dark sinister, hey, look at me. I'm. going toinging kill you. Like, no. But. the thing is that it's not like she's. trying to kill him for like she's saying. that, hey, give me like he has this. material of hers, like blackmail. material. No, but he won't. It's not.

even that he won't give it to her. It's. like she's talking to a wall. Like. they're not communicating. Like he's. not. He's like, I have it. Nah. Like. it's like imagine you're talking to. someone, the world is about to blow up. and they're like, "Hi.". She's just like, "I'm going to [ __ ]. kill you." Like, "I'm going to kill you. I'm going to bury you." That's her tone. That's the tone that she uses. Yeah. A. lot of people went online to describe it. as menacing, as a voice we've never. heard before. I think it was shocking in.

the moment. There was impact. I just. felt it was a very desperate response. considering the. circumstances. I think it was one of. those moments where it's like, okay, god. forbid a woman try to protect herself. from having explicit videos of her. circulating like it just was kind of. like, wait, what do you want women to. do? You just want us to like lay down. and get shot and take it? I'm so. confused. Very nicely, politely ask, can. you please show me this video, please?

Could I pretty please have it? and if. you don't say yes, I'll just go back and. cry in the corner. Like, it was just. weird. I don't think anything she said. was particularly vile or scary. Like, she didn't honestly context and like. situational awareness. Like, if people. were in that situation, I think people. would have said bigger things, worse. things. Yeah. But they try to use this. to ask Cassie and try to establish the. idea that Combmes also didn't want the. freakoff videos leaked as much as Cassie.

did. Have you ever witnessed Mr. Combmes. expressing concern about these videos. being released? Yes. And Mr. Combmes. always supported you in not wanting. these videos to come out and prevented. these videos from coming out? Yes. And. but this is the part where they. confirmed there was an escort that you. met Mr. named Mr. Jonathan OD a few. times, right? Yeah. Do you know who I'm. referring to? Yeah. At some point, you. understood that he'd taken a video, a. secret video of you and Mr. Combmes, that he had at a freakoff, right? I. thought he did. Yeah. When you found out. about that, you spent some amount of.

time, several months, trying to make. sure that it went away, right? I did. not. Mr. Combmes did. Yeah. You. understood that Mr. Combmes spent a. great deal of time and money to make. sure that video went away, right? I. didn't know any of the details. Were you. aware that he spent a significant amount. of money to make sure that that video. did not get released? Cuz remember there. is an agreement circulating that. Jonathan OD received $5 million in. exchange for signing an NDA. Cassie says. no. So she was not aware. And you were. very concerned about the situation with. Mr. OD, right? Yeah. He seemed like a.

volatile personality, right? I don't. know about volatile. I just didn't trust. it. He was threatening to release a sex. video of you, right? I don't know that. he actually did that. I don't I'm sorry. You don't know if he threatened to. release a video? I don't remember. You. just remember learning that he had a. video. I was in the room with him and I. saw the phone up and so I told Shawn. about it right after. Mr. Combmes is a. celebrity as we've already established. Right. Yes. And these would have been. embarrassing to him and had they been. released, right? Yes. In another text. message, the defense shows Cassie.

texting Combmes. You're whack for lying. to me about [ __ ] coming to the house. I tried to just leave it, but you're. [ __ ] with me now. You aren't here, and all you've done is stress my nerves. You're really bringing up Sujan. You're. crazy. He's a grown man. I was trying to. keep it cool. He hit me when I got home. that he fell asleep. I don't know what. you want to do anymore. I want to do. whatever I can, but you just keep. putting me down. I'm over here dealing. with this on my own. I really hope you. didn't get drunk and embarrass me, but. I'm sure you did. Always great to hear. [ __ ] telling me [ __ ] I don't want to.

hear or know. So, Cassie sent this text. message to Shawn Combmes a few days. after the Suja incident. Again, I I'm. not really sure why the defense brought. it up because I'm like, if anything, it. just showed Cassie saying like, I'm. dealing with this all on my own. Adding. to probably her feelings of desperation, adding to the fact that, yeah, she did. with words threaten to kill someone, but. I mean, situational awareness, having. some context, this text message just. kind of bolsters. Yeah. And again, like. the the attorney was saying that it.

would be embarrassing for Shawn Combmes. to have this video out. Meanwhile, he. didn't do anything about this. He's like. partying. Yeah. Versus Cassie is the one. like desperately trying to do something. about it, right? Yeah. So, I'm not. entirely like I think there was a point. they were trying to make, but clearly it. didn't get made well enough. I I'm sure. they asked a few questions afterwards. about that text message, but like the. point did not point. Mhm. One text. message thread from June 2017 reads, "From Cassie to Combmes, the game starts.

at 10 p.m. No texting after this. Create. a character that you will be that is. nothing like who you really are. And so. will I. Different name, different. occupation, different style of dress, different background story. We cannot. break character until 8 a.m. When you. see me, I am no one you have ever met. before. I'm not Cassie, and you're not. Sean, Puff, Diddy, Mr. C, etc. Lol. Example, pilot, doctor, author, professor, or whatever you decide. We do. not know each other. Then it goes on. with this game. So, the whole purpose of. this game, Cassie explains, is that she.

just wanted to rekindle the romance. I. think the defense is trying to. establish, they're trying to say that. maybe this is her proposing something. else to rekindle their relationship and. it seems like they're trying to connect. it with freakoffs as like they're a very. experimental couple is I think the vibe. that they're trying to set. There's. another text message thread that's. entered into evidence from 2012. Sean. text Cassie, "What do you want to do. tonight?" I don't know. What are the. options? Am I meeting you in the. Hamptons or will we be in the city? In. city? Whatever your heart desires. Well,

I get in kind of late. We can just go to. bed. You'll probably be tired. I doubt. that. I'm going to sleep on the plane. Lol. So, what do you want to do, woman? And no, I'm not asking you to fo. I want. to know what you want to do. Get. something to eat, smoke, take a walk. He. says that there's a party tonight. I'm. as also, but the way and please sleep on. the plane. Smiley face. And it looks. like I have off tomorrow and I need some. Valium, which there's a pack in my top. drawer. She doesn't respond. He texts. hello. This part I think it's.

intriguing. Cassie likes to eat, smoke, take a walk. I feel like Sean is always. texting her that he's Yeah. Like all the. text messages. I feel like there I have. not seen many text messages where. there's a lot of depth in their. conversations or at least both ways. She. tells them where the pills are and she. just briefly says, "Let's go out and. have some carefree fun. We will play it. by ear. When are you on your period? What's fun?" I'm skipping it. Just. taking it as it comes. Are you on it. now? No. Good. Are you.

Yes. How what you be thinking about when. you're Cassie responds, I think about. the way you're on top of me and the way. you look at me and talk to me like that. I love looking up at you and hearing you. moan. He responds, you like it when I. moan. I'm a moan more for you. Just for. you. I love it. Lol. That's what I. really think about. I love the way you. talk to me when you're on top. She does. not mention, I love jumping into a. gallon of baby oil in hotel rooms with. strangers. She mentions her relationship. with Mr. Combmes, which she again said. in the direct. One of my favorite times. is when we effed and then we made love.

after. I also liked it when we made love. before and then you know it was just in. the next room. Then he came in and I. blindfolded you. She responds, "Yeah, I. liked those times. I love it when we. make love after. The last time was so. good." I get the point that the defense. is trying to make, but also I don't get. the point that the defense is trying to. make with these specific text messages. He even texts Cassie, "So, what do you. want to do, woman? I'm not asking you to. fo again." And it sounds like he knows. that anytime he asks, maybe she has like. a I don't really want to type of. reaction. Yeah. Mhm. But the defense.

focuses on skipping the period. You tell. him that you're skipping your period, right? Yes. And you're telling him that. so you can plan a freakoff, right? I. don't know exactly what I was thinking. then, but probably. Yeah. Later messages. show Sean asking Cassie, "I want you to. tell me a new fantasy of how you want it. next time. Would Dave turn you on?" "I. don't know. I haven't even had time to. think about it. I've been trying to. think about you with a girl to get into. that and I think I'm starting to. fantasize about that which again just I. think they're trying to prove that she's. very promiscuous and loves these.

fantasies but it was just kind of. depressing like she's saying I'm trying. to get into that. I think I'm starting. to fantasize about that in another. thread that was entered in as a defense. exhibit. So the defense is like yeah. this one Cassie text Combmes how's the. party? I'm on board. I tip the cleaning. ladies hope you don't mind. Hello, I. need your D. Dying. I feel like I'm. trapped. Est asks her. This was after a. freakoff. And when we go to the next. page at the bottom, you say, "I love. you. Had so much fun with you. I'm so. happy. Thank you." In another message.

from much later, so in 2017, Cassie. text, "Please don't play victim if you. can go to our last messages." And then. you say, "That's all you wanted and. that's why I was upset." I love our FOs. We both want it. Esto asks Cassie, "And. that's how you felt at the time that you. love freakoffs when you were both into. it." Correct. I would say that loving. freakoffs were just words at this point. Well, those were words that you said to. Mr. Combmes. Correct. Those are texts. Yes. In this text message, Mr. Combmes. says to you, "I want to freak off right. now." How do you respond? Lol. Me, too.

Well, I want to have fun with you. That's you telling Mr. Combmes that you. want to have a freakoff right now. Correct. That is me agreeing to it in. the first message, and the second one is. me establishing I want to have fun with. him. Mr. Combmes texts you, "Let me know. if you want to have a light night. Jules. is available, FYI. Jules is an escort. If not into that, no problem. We can. just do our own thing, me and you. Just. want to know for hotel purposes. Love. you. Cassie responds, "Love you." Which. I guess the point that Esta is trying to.

make here is that Cassie had a choice to. the freakoffs because she asks her by. him saying, "Jules is available, that. suggests to you that he wants to have a. freakoff." Correct. Correct. And he. says, "If you're not into that, no. problem." That's what it says. Yeah. And. that was an invitation for you to. respond yes or no. Right. I suppose so. And the response you gave was, "Love. you." Right. Right. There was no yes or. no. They read more of the messages. Comb. text. You didn't give me an answer. In. response, Cassie says, "I love you, pop. pop." In another thread, they bring up a. text message from Sean. I want us to.

have one of our nights. I found this new. store. Dope. We'll drink a lot of water. Don't overdo, but have us some freaky. fun. Do I have your permission to set. up? Cassie responds, "Yeah, but I'm. ovulating." This part it feels like I. don't know. Some netizens felt like it. kind of proves Cassie is always trying. to avoid freakoffs. He responds to her. ovulation comment with that's good. We'll be extra careful and anyone else. if you're not super. WTF? Of course I am. Then in another. message, Comb says, "Same Paige. Let's.

get some outfits, shoes, go to sex club, maybe a sex club with your wig." Cassie. responds, "Okay, we sure about tonight. because I'm making plans, so I need to. know. No stress." Which, yes, the words. on the text sound like, "Yeah, just let. me know." But I guess Cassie is saying. like it wasn't like that. She testified. in the direct that she hated the clubs. And he says, "You sure? I need to know. No stress." He texts, "Didn't hear from. you, so just put some plans in motion. If you're not sure, please let me stop. Surprise package coming out of state. Just let me know if I'm headed in the. wrong direction so I can cancel." She.

responds, "I told you I was getting my. lashes and brows done at 8:00. I just. finished." Cool. Read and answer my. text. The defense opening statement. Tenny Garagos brings up that Combmes did. indeed have a bad temper that was quote. when he drank or did the wrong drugs he. got violent aka he's violent because. mainly of the amount of substance abuse. She continues violent outburst often. fueled by alcohol, jealousy and drugs. might have warranted domestic violence. charges but not sex trafficking and. racketeering counts. With Esto repeating.

questions and circling back and bringing. more questions about drugs, you would. say that he was an addict, right? What. substances was he addicted to? to which. yes, I think Cassy's attorney should. have and did prep Cassie on how to. respond to the questions in the honest. way, but I do think that she's like fed. up. Cassie's not having it. There were. points in your relationship when he was. heavily dependent on opioids, right? We. both were. There were points. You said. that when he's taking drugs, he's not. doing well. Is that what you said? I was. saying from my perspective, like my. mind, if I'm taking drugs, I'm not doing. well. Like, I'm just trying to follow.

you right now. Your questions. My. question is confusing. That's okay. When. Mr. Combmes was using more drugs. Was. his mood worse? I can't specify. There. was a lot of drug use. You witnessed a. lot of drug use by Mr. Combmes, right? We both participated. Yes. You said. before that you witnessed him withdraw. from opioids, right? Based on those. experiences, how did his mood change. during the withdrawal? I haven't thought. about it in a while. I'm also not a. doctor. Your serotonin levels are. definitely messed up after you party and. take certain pills. So, coming off of. them, yeah, you'd be pretty irritated. And part of the appeal of freakoffs was.

going to be doing drugs, right? part of. it at the time. There are different. reasons for me. The freakoffs were also. a time to do drugs in a safe confined. space in a hotel room, right? Yeah. So, someone like Mr. Combmes who is a. celebrity and well-known, it's an. opportunity for him to take drugs and. experiment and not be seen by anyone, right? Yeah. And did you ever call each. other get high partners? We did. Now, Cassie mentions that she always felt. like Combmes wanted her to do drugs with. him, but if she ever did drugs with. anybody else, he would get explosively. angry. The defense is trying to bring up.

that Combmes tried to get Cassie off. drugs. At one point, he encourages her. go to her to go to rehab and Esto even. asked to your knowledge, did he tell. drug dealers in the LA area or have. communicated to drug dealers in the LA. area that they were not to deal drugs to. you? Cassie says yes. Now, side note, in. the event of trying to establish that. Combmes is like, I don't know, maybe. this really good guy that's trying to. get Cassie, his beloved girlfriend, off. of drugs, to me, I'm like, that's crazy. To reach out to drug dealers and tell. them specifically, do not sell drugs to.

my girlfriend is kind of crazy behavior. Like, that is controlling behavior. So. like I do feel like a lot of and then I. have seen whispers in the courtroom. where it's like it was weird because. like the point proven bypassed and then. like a stronger different point was made. with that one because it's just like. that just proves how controlling he was. It doesn't come off like oh he's such a. good caring boyfriend which it felt like. that's what the defense was trying to. do. So it was just very confusing. You.

previously told the government that you. believe that Mr. Combmes was blackout. for the Intercontinental event. Isn't. that right? I believe he was. intoxicated. Yeah. You believed he was. blackout, right? Everybody's definition. of blackout is different. You use the. word blackout. Sure. They bring up a. text message that Cassie sends Combmes. after the Intercontinental Hotel. incident. When you get [ __ ] up in the. wrong way, you always want to show me. that you have the power and you knock me. around. I'm not a rag doll. I'm. someone's child. When you say when you. geted up in the wrong way, you meant.

that he took too many drugs, right? I. meant that he was out of control. because of the amount of drugs that he. had taken, right? And alcohol. He often. combined drugs with alcohol, right? Yes, we both did. Do you remember when Mr. Combmes overdosed in February 2012? Now, Cassie says something that has the. internet kind of in a tail spin. Was. that around the time Whitney Houston. died? Yes. So, there are speculations. that there was this massive party and. perhaps they all used the same like. Hollywood drug dealers and there's just.

some connections there. I don't want to. get too deep into it without perhaps it. becoming more pertinent to the case, but. um he had apparently overdosed and he. went to a hospital. Other points argued. by Esto include asking he was suggesting. going to marriage counseling, couples. counseling, correct? Maybe. I don't. remember. Shortly after you started. dating your now husband, right? Yeah. It. just seems like they're trying to prove. that Combmes tried to make the. relationship work. And a major point of. contention for the defense is the rword.

allegation from August of 2018 with Esto. asking, "Do you recall meeting with. agents and prosecutors on November 30th, 2023?" I could have. I don't remember. the exact date. This would be the. meeting shortly after the lawsuit that. you filed. Do you recall that meeting? Yes. Is your testimony that you told the. government that he was acting strangely. at the dinner? I don't really remember. that word. I don't remember that word. That's okay. In fact, do you remember. that you told them that he seemed. anxious? I don't remember saying that.

They pull up the original government. report that we do not get to see, but um. Esto says, "Does this refresh your. recollection as to whether or not you. told the government agents that Mr. Combmes was acting anxious and strangely. that evening?" It does sort of. And you. told them that you thought this behavior. might be attributed to his bipolar. disorder, right? You told prosecutors. that you did not think that Mr. Combmes. was in his right mind because he didn't. respond when you told him to stop. Is. that correct? Then they bring up a. message that Combmes sent to Cassie, which is August 21st, 2018. That reads,

"From Cassie to Combmes, hit me when you. can, heart emoji." And then he responds, "I know I look bad to you. I could tell. I didn't turn you on yesterday. I fell. off, but I'm about to get my [ __ ]. together." Estee states that in the. April 2025 meeting with prosecutors, Cassie told them that the alleged rword. incident happened August of 2018. You. saw Mr. Combmes the day before this. message, right? I think so. I'm not. sure. So, the insinuation being that the. text messages were sent around the time. of the alleged rword. They bring up.

other texts from September 12th, 2018. where Cassie texts him, "Landed safe. How's yoga treating you? I'm assuming. now it's safe to date. Let me know.". Good morning. I'm confused. Safe to. date? What are you talking about? Side. note, it's revealed that he was having a. romantic relationship with his yoga. partner, allegedly, and he texts Cassie. back. What does yoga have to do with me? Hit me back, please, babe. Nothing. I. hear you're dating. I didn't know. I'm. on the beach walking with my dad right. now. I'm not dating. Dating who? I'm not. dating, baby. I'm not dating, lol. And. no dates, no dinners, nothing. Nobody.

Okay. Who do you think I'm dating? I. don't think I should even be bringing. this up to you. Let's just leave it. alone. All right. I actually need to. stop even caring. Do you want to start. dating? If you want, if you are, let's. just talk about it. Esto tries to. establish to the jury that Shawn was. open to Cassie moving on and wanted to. have a conversation if she was ready to. date. At the end of the page, you wrote, "If you're in LA next week, maybe we can. talk." I'm just trying to take care of. myself now. So, Estee was confirming. with Miss Ventura. Then, another text.

message from September 26th, 2018. So, this would be a month after the alleged. rword. I don't want to have a. conversation where you break up with me. again. This is Shawn to Cassie. I need. you to love me. I need to love you. I do. love you. I would just prefer not being. one of your girlfriends anymore. I need. to hold you. Let's get up tomorrow. night. I'll do studio from like 6:30. until 9:00 9:30. Can I hold you or are. you just going to break up with me some. more? We already did that. Is that a. yes? Can I hold you? We can embrace. LOL. Lol. Good to know that you still.

have a sense of humor. I can't wait to. see you, Cassie. I can't wait to see. you, too. Yay. I wasn't trying to upset. you. I promise I'm not being mean. I'm. embracing my sanity. People have access. and just showing up to the house really. has me [ __ ] up. Had me [ __ ] up. We. don't even have to talk about it. That's. just not what I need right now. Right? If I can't know where you live, that's. too far for me. If you want to be away. from me like that, we don't have to deal. with each other on any level. That's too. far for me. Live your life. Whatever you. need will be done as promised. That's. too far. I don't know what to say. I'm.

choosing my sanity over everything. Today would be the first time we're. seeing each other in person in a long. time. I'm so peaceful right now. I want. to keep it. I'm finally sleeping well. and gained weight. I don't think you. understand how those two small things. have made the hugest difference. Estao. looks at Cassie. And you don't say. anything to the effect of, "The last. time we saw each other, you ripped me, right?" Right. In fact, you're saying. that you want to keep the peace, right? Yep. And he responds, "I respect your. sanity. It's best we keep it moving. I'm. not a stalker. No beef. I'm clearer than.

ever. I don't want to link. Focus on you. and your sanity. I'm good. Love.". Combmes is like reading the messages so. intently. Like he's never seen this. before. I'm like, "Sir, you sent these.". Like he's like really reading it. like. he looks like he looks like he's about. to kiss the evidence screen. So, this is. clearly a very important moment. And you. said you were really looking forward to. that hug, but Okay. Right. Right. And. you wanted to hug him at that point, right? Yep. So, the defense argues that.

September 27th, 2018, Cassie sees. Combmes and we don't know what they. showed to refresh Cassie's recollection, but Esteeo says, "And when you saw him. that night, did you have sexual activity. with him?" I did. So Cassie did mention. during her direct that she was rworded. August and then she did have another. encounter with him where she did. consent. And that night when you were. having intercourse with him, did you. receive a FaceTime call? I did. And did. you answer that call? No. Did you. recognize the caller ID to be your now. husband? So at this point, she and Alex.

Fine were dating. I did. And Mr. Combmes. noticed this call, right? Yep. And he. noticed the name that was or the alias. that was popping up on your phone, right? Yep. And this was in the middle. of your evening with Mr. Combmes, correct? During which you were having. intercourse, right? Yeah. Was it. actually in the middle of intercourse. that you received this call? We were. together. I don't know if it's actually. in the middle of intercourse that I. received the call. And your now husband. didn't know that you were with Mr.

Combmes at the time. Correct. I don't. know what he knew at that point. I don't. know. You were seeing him at the time, right? Yes. At the time that you had. this evening with Mr. Combmes. Yes. After this incident, your now husband. learned about your evening with Mr. Combmes, right? At a point, but I don't. know. You didn't answer his FaceTime. call that evening, right? I did not. Did. he find out after that evening that you. didn't answer his FaceTime call because. you were with Mr. Combmes? Objection. You told your now husband. that Mr. Combmes rworded you, didn't.

you? I did that evening, right? That. evening in September. No, that wasn't. the evening when I was rwarded. Your. husband punched a wall at a certain. point, right? He did. When he learned. that you were still having intercourse. with Mr. Combmes, right? When you. informed him that Mr. Combmes areed you, correct? Yes. I think I don't remember. exactly when that was. Your husband. learned of your sexual intercourse with. Mr. Combmes. Right. Right. And you told.

him that Mr. Combmes rworded you. Right. Right. And when your husband learned. about it, he punched a wall, right? I. believe so. The point I think that the. defense is trying to establish, whether. you agree with it or not, the their. defense is that she was seeing Alex. Fine. She was dating him and then she. had this evening with Shan Combmes in. September of 2018. Alex Fine facetimed. her. Clearly, he's finding out that.

maybe she's not where she said she was. going to be or something of that sort. She goes back to him and he's trying to. ask her like, "Where were you?" And. they're almost insinuating that she. comes up with this rword story in that. moment to kind. of deescalate perhaps a big relationship. fight with this new boyfriend of hers. is kind of what they're insinuating with. this line of questioning. Or at least. that's what we got from it. Esto brings.

up other text messages from October 5th, 2018. So now this is 2 months after the. alleged rword. Combmes texts, I'mma just. fall back. You call me when you need me. Cassie responds, "To be honest, I'm not. sure how to even handle things to get my. life to a comfortable place. I know that. you don't want to hurt me anymore. I. miss you. I feel so lost without you. I'm heartbroken. I don't trust anymore. I'm sad." You don't see him for a number. of weeks, correct? A month after this is. November 15th, 2018, Kim Porter passes.

away unexpectedly. Isn't that right? Yes, it is. And you went to a memorial. service for Mr. Por Miss Porter. Correct. Another message is entered into. evidence sent from Cassie to Combmes on. November 19th, 2018 after Kim Porter's. memorial service. I didn't just leave. you. I said goodbye a few times. I want. to be there for you, but needed to get. to Grandma. My flight was delayed, so. I'm taking off now. I need to be real. with you. I know how crazy and painful. this all is, and you want my support, but you've compared me to Gina the other. day and the babysitter whom he's.

allegedly sleeping with at the time. And. there's last night and you posted that. Kim was your soulmate. What was the 11. years all about? 11 consistent years. I. know you're going through a lot, but. that hurt my feelings. I love you, but. I'm going to my family right now. I'll. probably make it Saturday with my dad. I'll hit KK Christina Cororum, the chief. of staff. Hit me if you need me. Love. you. So, Estee and what they've been. arguing since the defense opening. statement is that Cassie did not leave. Shawn Combmes because she realized that.

he was abusive and that he rworded her. They're trying to argue that her final. straw in leaving was that he called Kim. Porter his soulmate online. He let you. go, right? You never saw him again after. that, right? I didn't see him again. I. don't know about letting me go. That's. different. You never saw him again. Yeah. And you got married? I did. To the. love of your life. Correct. And over the. years, has Mr. Combmes reached out to. you? Yes. So, they start reading text. messages from Combmes to Cassie, checking on you, seeing how you're.

doing. Hope you're well, sending you. love and light. Hope you're well. Congratulations, Cass. I'm truly happy. for you. You're going to make a. beautiful mother. God bless. This one, Cassie does respond. Thank you. God. bless. Sending you love and light. Hope. all is well. I had a dream about you. last night. Shaking my head. What a. difference a year makes. Really happy. for you. Have a blessed day. Just. sending love. Later, he sends another. one. Congratulations. I'm really happy. for you. I know you're so happy. You. deserve it. Love. Then March 2020, he. texts, "Miss my best friend. Hope you. are well. Frankie is so beautiful. Love.

miss you too and thank you. Hope you're. taking care of yourself and the family. as well. Thank you so much for. responding. It really means a lot more. than you know. I'm so happy for you. The. kids are good. Mom is good. I hope your. family is well also. I miss you guys. Sending you nothing but love and light. always. Please know I'm always here if. you need me. Cassie responds, "I've been. reflecting a lot, like a lot. The turns. of life are so crazy, but I'm happy. everyone is good. Please send my love to. them and if I can express anything, take. care of you. I'm trying. Just had. another operation. This is going to be.

my last. Lol. Not entirely sure what. that is referring to. Has definitely. been rough without your friendship. I. pray for a day that I can sit down with. you and let you know all the things I've. reflected on. You were there for me. throughout everything. You were my ride. or die. I've got nothing but love for. you always. My heart is filled with joy. to know that you don't hate me. And I. hope you're taking care of you also. I. thank God for the time that we had. together and you're one of the greatest. women in the world. Don't ever forget. that. love. Sorry, I needed a second to gather. my thoughts. The things you said blew my. mind a bit. First, I don't hate you. I.

never have. I wouldn't be at this. beautiful point in my life without. having been with you. I definitely think. of the day to sit down and just talk. because I know that we need closure, understanding. What do you mean when you. said, Estee was asking Cassie, "What do. you mean when you said the things he. said blew your mind a bit?" I think. those were honestly probably all the. things I wanted to hear for a long time. that I never did. Just being recognized. as the greatest woman in the world, right? Not that part, just the message. in general was it was nice and it was.

what you had been craving for a long. time to hear from him right before this. I don't think I was craving it then. You. wanted a relationship previously. Yeah. In in in the relationship I was craving. it because he shaped you in many ways. after 11 years, right? Yeah, that's. fair. Can you go to the bottom message, please? Mr. Combmes says, "Tears of joy. I don't even know what to say, but I'll. always love you and one day I hope you. can forgive me. I pray for the day we. can have closure, but most important. talk. We're honestly lucky to be alive.

We went hard. God was really watching. over us. You deserve the world. I'm. happy you found someone that loves you. the way you deserve to be loved and. respected. Please let me know when is a. good time to get together and I'll make. myself available. Tell moms and pops I. said hi. Please know I send this message. with all respect for your marriage. Be. well and never forget who you are. Love. She responds, "We are honestly lucky to. be alive." The defense tries to point. out the timeline of the lawsuit. They. state that it was filed November 2023, the month before Cassie and her husband.

moved into her parents house in. Connecticut with their kids. You moved. into your parents house in Connecticut. because of financial issues. Is that. right? No, we were just moving to the. East Coast and transitioning in my. parents home. Your husband is a physical. trainer. Is that right? He was at the. time. He was. And your financial. situation in October of 2023 was limited. to the income your husband has as a. physical trainer and whatever income you. were able to make at the time. Correct. Correct. Esto goes on to ask if you. could categorize her parents house as. modest compared to the mansion scene in.

the government exhibits, which is like a. crazy statement. I assume that her. parents house is modest, but like I. think she really just wanted her to. confirm it's modest. Cassie mentions. that she was preparing for tour in 20. for January 2025. As soon as you agreed. to settle your lawsuit against Mr. Combmes in November 2024, you canled. this tour, right? I did. As soon as you. saw that you were going to get $20. million, you canled the tour because you. didn't need it anymore, right? That. wasn't the reason why.

There is this one part that I do think I. would imagine if I were on the jury, which I'm not obviously, but if I were. on the jury, this probably would have. alienated me from the defense. Um, she. Esto brings up, and I think that from. what I could hear and gather, it irked a. lot of people the wrong way, this part. Esto says, "Your lawsuit in November. 2023 that you testified about on direct, was that the first time that the term. freak off ever became public?" Right. As. far as you know, so far as I know.

Right. Besides the participants, I guess. from your perspective, what happened to. Mr. Combmes's career after your lawsuit? Objection, your honor. Overruled. From. your perspective, what happened to Mr. Combmes's career after your. lawsuit? That's a lot. Fair to say that. his career was ruined based on your. understanding when your lawsuit was. publicized in November 2023. You. understood that his career was ruined at. that point, right? I could understand. that. Yeah. I guess it's like regardless.

of the charges that Combmes is facing. right now, I think that hotel video. alone, I don't know if people really. care for his career. Like no one cares. for the longevity of his career after. seeing the hotel video footage. Now, obviously, we cannot make judgment on. the charges that he's on trial for right. now. However, just that people are like, why does Cassie need to care about his. career after that hotel video? That. hotel video alone should probably end. someone's career. So they just didn't. like it was a lot of people felt like. it's giving but the rworder or the.

abuser is a young man with a bright. future ahead of him and you ruined that. right? It's like yeah but what about my. life? That was the feeling. They also. bring up that after the Intercontinental. Hotel footage aired she points out. Cassie wrote domestic violence is the. issue. So she released a very simple. Instagram statement remember after that. footage and in that statement she writes. domestic violence is the issue. Yes, you. wrote domestic violence is the issue. There was more than that, but yeah. So,

the point that they're trying to make, okay, if I'm being so honest, both me. and our researchers wrote, "What's the. point?" It just felt like it might have. been better if they didn't even include. this because it's like, I mean, for that. footage, yeah, domestic violence is a. huge issue. I guess they were trying to. point out you didn't write sex. trafficking as the issue, but it would. just felt like uh like it just was I. imagine if again we were on the jury, I. would have been like this is very. alienating for me because that's crazy.

Yeah. And there is this part where it's. kind of confusing. Esta is trying to say. at that point in the timeline. It's it's. unclear if she's saying at that point in. the timeline or right now, but she says, "And you still don't hate him now, right?" And Cassie says, "I don't hate. him. and Comb shakes his head side to. side. In fact, you still have love for. him. I have love for the past and what. it. was. The defense closes their. cross-examination with the text message. Want to freak off one last time tonight?

This is what Combmes text Cassie in. 2012. They break up in. 2018. Want to freak off one last time. tonight? What? You can't read? Cassie. responds, I don't want to freak off for. a last time. I want it to be the first. time for the rest of our lives. Anna. Esto says, "I have no further. questions." And she walks off the. podium. Prosecutor Johnson does the. redirect. She pulls up more messages. from that exact text start in which. Cassie texts later. And you know what, Prosecutor Johnson, I felt like this was.

her redemption arc because her direct, a. lot of people were struggling with her. direct. I heard cuz I I do try to listen. to like what people in the public are. saying about because there's like. overflow rooms anyway. I try to listen. and see what people thought because. sometimes you go online and you have a. very different reaction from a lot of. people in the courtroom because you're. getting snippets of headlines and random. excerpts from the court day and then the. people that were actually in the. courtroom you're getting like 8 hours of. information. sometimes there's a. discrepancy and a lot of people said.

that with prosecutor Johnson's initial. direct it just didn't like they felt. frustrated because this is an emotional. testimony and yes you don't want to. retraumatize the victims but there were. a lot of points where it just felt like. she didn't let Cassie talk. like she just kept moving on to the next. question next question when the jurors. are like we we want to know what she. would have said further because there'd. be these moments where she's collecting. her thoughts, like wiping away a tear.

and then it we're already moving on when. it's like, wait, I feel like she was. trying to say something after that, like. after she collects herself. Yeah. Now, this she comes in and she seems a little. bit upset about the cross. Okay. Cuz she. a lot of jurors are furiously taking. notes when Johnson comes in for the. redirect. Even Combmes is taking notes. on his pad on his lap. Her voice feels. animated compared to the past 12 hours. with Anna Esto, which Yeah. You say, "I want to see you, but I'm. emotional right now. I can't do one last.

time. I'd rather not at all." So, that's. context to the question, the text. message thread that the cross just ended. with. Throughout your relationship with. Shawn, were there periods where Shawn. was kind and loving? Yeah. Did those. periods ever last? No. What are some of. the ways Shawn's mood affected you? I. mean, they affected my whole life, my. career, how I felt about myself, my. self-worth. Yeah. Throughout your entire. 11-year relationship with Shawn, who did. you want to have sex with? I wanted it. to be with him, just him. Was there. anyone else you wanted to have intimate. relations with? Not at the time.

Prosecutor Johnson also shows that in. one of the texts that Cassie is. expressing wanting to do freakoffs, Combmes had texted her, "You're supposed. to be seducing me all day." During. freakoffs, how often was your career. discussed? A lot. Why didn't you get to. do many of the things you wanted to do. for work? Because I had a whole other. job. What was that whole other job? It's. basically a sex worker. Motion to. strike. So, the judge does grant the motion to. strike, which means jurors should. disregard the last answer, which I think. is nearly impossible to do as a human,

but don't get me started on that. The. prosecutors also point out that in other. messages, it seems like Comb's request. freakoffs. Meanwhile, Cassie is sending. messages like, "I can book a show for us. to go see tomorrow night. We can be like. Old Times and take our Central Park. walk, smoke, drink some wine, just veg. out. Sorry if I seem a little out of it. They put our oldest dog to sleep today.". Instead, they do a freakoff. Do you have. any doubt that Combmes Rword did you? No. And a few weeks after that, in. August of 2018, did you have consensual.

activities with Sean? Yes. And you said. the settlement was not the reason you. canled the tour. Correct. Why did you. cancel the tour? After filing my. lawsuit, I was just overwhelmed and I. didn't couldn't continue doing that. At. that point, it was quite overwhelming. addressing the past in the way that I. chose to. I didn't want to be away from. my kids at the time. Do you plan to file. any more lawsuits? No. Do you expect to. get any money out of testifying at this. trial? No. How much money did Shawn pay. you to settle the lawsuit? $20 million. Would you give that money back if that.

meant you never had to have. freakoffs? She starts, this is probably. the most emotional part of her. testimony. I'd give that money back if. it means I never had to do freakoffs. If. I never had to have freakoffs, I would. have agency and autonomy and I wouldn't. have to work so hard to get it. back. And this is like my researchers. and I saw the same thing. A member of. the defense team looks over at another.

member of the defense team and basically. rolls their. eyes. And I'm like, I get it. You don't. think that that happened. Do you think. that she consented? But it was kind of. sad to. see. It was just like really, wow, what. is happening right now? Combmes is. frozen as a statue. Do you remember when. defense council asked you yesterday if. freakoffs were a special time that you. cherished? Yeah. How would you describe. the experience of an escort urinating in.

your mouth while you were on the floor? Objection. Sustained. So, they got to. move on. How many times did Shawn insist. you have a freakoff when you still had a. UTI? All the time. Frequently. And did. Shawn beat you during freakoffs? Yes. Once or more than once? More than once. How did you feel during the freakoffs. when Shawn beat you? Worthless? Just. like dirt? Like I didn't matter to him. Like I was nothing. Like absolutely. nothing. What concerns did you have, if. any, about saying no to freakoffs? I was.

worried for my safety. I was worried for. my career. But I was also in love with. him. So, I worried that he wouldn't want. to be with me anymore. No further. questions at this. time. Esteeo is back on the podium and. she proceeds to go through and readress. a lot of the things, but nothing new is. said until she asks, "You stated on the. redirect that you did not have any. additional lawsuits other than your suit. against Mr. Combmes." Right. Right. You. have recently received a settlement from. the Intercontinental Hotel, didn't you? No. So, at this point, I was kind of.

confused of like, oh, maybe Esteeo got. incorrect information, right? You did. not. I haven't received a settlement. from the Intercontinental. Did you make. a demand on the. Intercontinental? I did. Did you receive. anything in response to that demand? No, I haven't. Do you anticipate receiving. some settlement in that case of matter? I do. How much do you expect to receive? I don't know the exact number. Can you. provide an estimate? I think it would be. 10 million.

maybe. And you reach the end of the. settlement discussions with the. Intercontinental. I have. So you expect. to receive 10 million from the. Intercontinental. Yes. Then Esto has Cassie read the same. message from earlier. This is going to. be the last thing I ask you to read, which is her saying, "I need to gather. my thoughts. This is after the breakup. The things you said blew my mind a bit. First, I don't hate you. I never have. I. wouldn't be at this beautiful point of. my life without having been with you. I. definitely think of the same day to sit. down and just talk because I know we.

need closure and. understanding. Okay, this is where I. think there was a huge discrepancy. between the internet and the courtroom. I think the internet it I'm like no, it. makes sense. Like I would also sue the. Intercontinental Hotel. Are you kidding? Like your security guard came up. They. took videos. He he look at my shiny. shoes. They saw me with a black eye in. the hotel. Like it's in the footage. And. then one of them was allegedly paid off. to delete the footage. Yeah. I think.

it's so valid. Yeah. Yeah. Sue them for. more money, right? I think though the way it was revealed. in court in the. recross like you could it was like a mic. drop moment and like the energy shifted. in the courtroom and it felt like. something that Cassie was trying to hide. even though I don't think that's the. case but the way that it was brought up. made it feel like that in that moment. I. do think that some of these big numbers.

also don't sit well with the jurors is. just what I've noticed. You know, this. is a very large amount of life-changing. money. Do we think she should sue for. more? Probably a good chunk of us. probably think, "Yeah, she should sue. for a lot more." Right. A lot of people. were upset with the prosecutors about. this because why did they not address it. in the direct? So, you're saying like. when this was the question was dropped, the jurors had a like energy shift or. had a reaction courtroom. Everyone like.

public press, everyone. It was like a. Oh, got it. Oh, but then it's like. afterwards you get out and you're like, "Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, duh." Right. But. in that moment, it was like, "Yeah, yeah." So, like it almost like this this. should have been brought up way earlier. Yes. Okay. So, that's why a lot of. people are upset. It's not the fact that. she sued them and got $10 million. It's. the fact that it was revealed by the. defense attorneys in the recross. If.

prosecutor Johnson had brought it up in. the direct and Cassie had time to. explain, it's so easy for people to. connect the dots of like, "Oh, yeah, duh. We saw that footage. That was. crazy." Yeah. But instead, the defense. brought it up. They took everybody off. guard. They took Cassie off guard and it. made it seem like a dirty secret, even. though technically it probably is not. In the redirect, Johnson just asks if. she has any more pending lawsuits and or. if she's expecting any financial benefit.

depending on the outcome of the trial. Those are all answered no. Esto just has. one last question for her recross and. it's you just reached the settlement. with the Intercontinental last week, right? I don't know if it was last week, but in the past month before your. testimony today, right? Yeah. Esto grabs. her binder and she says, "Thank you.". and she walks off the podium and she. looks very. upset. After that, um, the witness is.

off the stand. Cassie is walked away out. of the courtroom with her husband, attorneys, brother, and cousin following. after her. And after that, uh, Sean. Combmes does prayer hands and hugs Anna. Esto. I think that there were a lot of moments. where people in that courtroom, from. what I could tell and from what I. overheard some of the members of the. public saying, they felt very frustrated. with how the direct occurred with. Cassie. They felt like it just did not.

do her justice. And then with the cross, the revealing of certain information. just really didn't do her justice and. she didn't have that time to explain in. the direct. And a lot of people felt. like it's not like the direct was short. Some jurors were seen allegedly falling. asleep. We think they looked like they. were very sleepy and very zoned out and. not engaged during the direct. So, there's clearly very slow moments where. we just kept circling back. We kept. rambling about things and we I maybe. legally it's like they're establishing. the foundation, but it just as someone.

who probably resonates with a juror. because I'm not an attorney. It just. felt like a lot of yapping, but nothing. was being said. And like the fact that. you have Cassie on the stand to be. ret-raumatized through all of this, it's. like it felt lengthy for no reason. And. yet we didn't even address the. intercontinental. We didn't address a. lot of these things that if she had been. given the time to explain her side of. the story, it probably would have been. good. And um a lot of people think.

that's why the internet is having the. reaction it's having because certain. things she was not able to address in. her direct at all. Mhm. Outside the. federal courthouse, Doug Wter, the. attorney for Cassie and Alex Fine give a. statement. Cassie and her husband's. statement. Cassie says through her. attorney, "This week has been incredibly. challenging yet profoundly empowering. and healing for me. I hope that my. testimony has provided strength and a. voice to fellow survivors, encouraging. others who have faced similar struggles. to speak out and begin their healing. process. For me, as I continue to heal,

I find that I can recall more. And with. each memory, I am reminded that I will. never forget. I wish to extend my thanks. to my family and advocates for their. steadfast support and I'm thankful for. the kindness and encouragement I've. received. I'm relieved to close this. chapter of my life as I shift my focus. to the conclusion of my pregnancy. I. kindly request privacy for myself and my. growing. family. Cassie's husband, Alex, also. made a statement through their attorney. Over the past 5 days, the world has.

gotten to witness the strength and. bravery of my wife freeing herself of. her past. There has been speculation. online surrounding how it must feel for. me to sit there and listen to my wife's. testimony. I have felt so many things. sitting there. I felt tremendous pride. and overwhelming love for Cass. I felt. profound anger that she has been. subjected to sitting in front of a. person who tried to break her. So to him. and all of those who helped him along. the way, please know this. You did not. You did not break her spirit nor her. smile that lights up every room. You did.

not break the soul of a mother who gives. the best hugs and plays the silliest. games with our little girls. You did not. break the woman who has made me a better. man. I did not save Cassie, as some have. said. To say that is an insult to the. years of painful work that my wife has. done to save herself. Cassie saved. Cassie. She alone broke free from abuse, coercion, violence, and threats. She did. the work of fighting the demons that. only a demon himself could have done to. her. All I have done is love her as she.

has loved me. Her life is now surrounded. by love, laughter, and our family. This. horrific chapter is forever put behind. us, and we will not be making additional. statements. We appreciate all the love. and support we have received, and we ask. that you respect our privacy as we. welcome our son into a world that is now. safer because of his. mom. And that is the final part of. Cassie's testimony. But it's not really. over because they bring in Cassy's best. friend. They bring in Don Rashard who.

testifies about some of the abuse that. she saw Cassie go through. They bring in. Cassy's mother. And they also, we have a. pretty good inkling of like another. thing that the defense is probably going. to try to bring in because of a line of. questioning during the cross. But that. is where I leave you with today's. episode. What are your thoughts? Let me. know in the comments and I will see you. in the next one. [Music].