Girl With Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID) Kills Her Abuser

[Music]. bada bing badao there is a man laying. unconscious in his living room he's. knocked out face first onto the carpet. he's not dead at least not yet Alyssa. and Vanessa are standing over him Alyssa. believes this is what this man deserves. this is the only way they have to kill. him or else there really is no other. option here she reaches for the zip ties. she nudges his ankles together and. starts zip tying them three times across. three separate zip ties Vanessa on the.

other hand she does not want to do this. she's screaming in her head non-stop. stop stop this just needs to stop this. is taking things way too far when Alyssa. has a moment where she is no longer in. control it's like a brief second Vanessa. goes grabs a pair of scissors and cuts. the man's zip ties off his ankles. essentially freeing him Alyssa is. screaming no she rushes to grab more zip. ties continues zip tiing his legs his. arms together all the while Vanessa all.

she can do is just helplessly watch. what's happening she watches as Alyssa. grabs a knife and plunges it into the. man's neck stabbing him so deeply that. she nearly decapitates him it's over now. they're going to be safe Alyssa drops. the knife there's blood dripping down. her arms and her hands the police would. later report the victim the man dead on. the living room floor to be Harald sasco. and the killer to not be Vanessa to not.

be Alysa but a single 19-year-old. teenage girl named Sarah mlin this is. the story of Sarah mlin and how she. violently murdered a man and was. diagnosed with did and a lot of people. believe that she should be free. [Music].

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episode's Partnerships have also made it. possible to support rotten Mango's. growing team and we would like to thank. our listeners for your continued support. as we work on our mission to be worthy. Advocates as always full show notes are. available at Rotten mango podcast.com. now a couple of very important. disclaimers before we start into today's. case there are mentions of CSA essay. grooming RW and self- exits so please. take care of yourself and watch at your. own discretion one more clear disclaimer. I want to provide very clear is. disassociative identity disorder AKA did.

is mentioned throughout this case. however this episode is in no way a. representation of the entire did. Community nor is it our objective to. speak over people with a similar or that. diagnosis we did our best to consult and. research only peer-reviewed research by. medical professionals and we pulled. research from the did Community for. their unique perspectives it's also just. like any other mental illness depression. anxiety to give you examples people with. did are not inherently violent or.

dangerous in any way solely based off of. a diagnosis I would really hope that by. this point we all know that anybody has. the capacity to be a terrible human. being and from what I can tell just. anecdotally typically those who struggle. with their mental health whether that be. depression or did or anything else are. much more vulnerable to becoming victims. rather than perpetrators a few small. things to note statements and letters. have been condensed for time and this is. a case where a lot of interpersonal. relationships are very important but.

because the interpersonal relationships. are not heavily documented or recorded. we really only have one version of. events for that Sarah's Sarah does have. an incentive to lie or alter the truth. considering she was on trial for murder. so use your best judgment on whether or. not you believe she's trustworthy I'm. not here to sway you one way or another. like with any case I have no skin in the. game I will say though that when I was. first researching this case I watched a. snapped episode on this case from oxygen.

and I thought I knew the story then we. filed a Freedom of Information Act to. get court documents which were only. partially approved because of an appeal. and I have to say that they were so. revealing it's about 1,500 pages that we. combed through of transcripts documents. and I did not see most of the. information mentioned at all in the. snapped episode and I believe that. episode came out a little biased because. of that so hopefully this will feel a. little bit more like a comprehensive. Deep dive so with that being said let's.

get started Dr Hutchinson was called by. a criminal defense attorney he told her. he's got a very puzzling case a. 19-year-old girl in prison for a brutal. heinous Murder She nearly decapitated. her victim can you please evaluate her. for us Dr Hutchinson is a psychologist. she works with offenders pretty often. and she has experience with the trial. process and obviously her Intrigue is. peaked what do you mean this is a. puzzling case Dr Hinson agrees to a. meeting she goes to meet with the.

patient the inmate the defendant. literally about to go on trial for. murder 19-year-old Sarah mlin the first. meeting lasted a little over an hour and. Dr Hutchinson walks back out the defense. attorney Sarah's attorney walks up to. her what do you what do you think I mean. the doctor's got it now Sarah is by far. one of the most unusual people that she. has ever interviewed she says initially. she appears to be this sort of sweet.

typical 20-year-old Midwest kid who is. kind of lost in the world then we. started talking about the actual murder. and all of a sudden there was just a. lack of distance it's almost as if she. wasn't describing what she was. describing to the point where after that. first meeting Dr h on the drive home she. kept shaking her head and kept saying to. herself what in the world was that she. said I have never really witnessed. anything quite like that Dr H likely. could not put her finger on it the very.

first interraction which I don't think. anybody expected her to things like this. take time but to Dr H it did not feel. like Sarah is just this cold-hearted. ruthless killer that can talk about a. violent murder in a blunt sort of way. that's not the feeling she's getting. it's not oh she's so detached from the. crime she doesn't care she has no. remorse it's not that regardless Dr H is. so intrigued she wants to be a part of. this case she starts going to build. rapport with Sarah meeting with her. getting to know her analy ing her the.

first few things that really stuck out. to the doctor the first being sometimes. when Sarah describes certain situations. or memories that she herself was a part. of she uses language that typically. wouldn't be used for example if I'm. standing in the living room and then I. walk to the kitchen to grab water I. would say oh I felt really thirsty when. I was standing in the living room so I. walked over to the kitchen and I grabbed. a glass of water that's what happened. but Sarah and this is obviously an. example would say something along the. lines of we were in the the living room.

then I watched myself go to the kitchen. to grab water H interesting it's almost. like she's narrating her. actions noted Dr H also noted that Sarah. has these unexplainable gaps in her. memory she does not remember random. chunks of her day her week most of her. childhood she has no memory of it not oh. I don't remember anything particularly. that stands out nothing spectacular. happened would just straight up no. memories random blank in the day that.

are unexplainable she would be sitting. in her bedroom and then all of a sudden. she would be in the kitchen she doesn't. know what happened in between that time. span Dr H goes to pull records from 2012. this would be 2 years before she's. talking to Sarah oh this happened 2014. yes and she pulls records from 2012. Sarah's medical records before Sarah. committed any sort of crimes and she. finds that even 2 years ago Sarah had. attempted self- exit she was forced to. report to a psychologist on a daily.

basis for a week and she keeps. mentioning even 2 years ago that she has. gaps in her memory there's time in her. day that she just can't fill the. psychologist from 2 years ago writes in. her notes patient reports gaps in memory. on almost daily basis losses of time. that she does not know what happened. during those. incidents interesting noted another. interesting observation Sarah would be. talking to Dr H about the events and. every now and then so naturally that. Sarah herself doesn't even see seem to. notice it almost just comes out of her.

mouth so smoothly but Dr H would note it. down Sarah would use we and US pronouns. when referring to herself now she does. identify with she her pronouns which. side note this is not like matter of her. identifying with different pronouns it. it was just a little bit different from. that Dr H noted something is interesting. here mhm then another observation this. one is harder to ignore sometimes Dr H. would come in to talk to Sarah and would. just feel like a completely different.

person each time most of the time Sarah. according to Dr H her detailed notes. appears quiet softspoken apologetic. often tearful and horrified at what's. happened what she's done and deeply. terrified and scared and every person. has a very specific tonality body. language even the way you use your face. muscles is very unique to your. personality so side note the way your. face looks is yes based on your face. structure the way that bones are set but.

there's also face muscle usage that's. only part of it the other part is. actually your personality so if this is. your face this is your bone structure. but you have a completely different. personality than I do we might look. different right because when you're. anxious you hold tension in certain. areas that make maybe your jaw more. prominent maybe your lower lips come. down because you're pulling down at them. maybe there's a little bit more tension. in certain areas of your cheeks so the. way that your personality is can reflect. on your face face wow sometimes her face.

would just look slightly different and. people have a baseline pitch they have a. baseline body posture they have Baseline. hand gestures that they use when they're. speaking obviously there's subtle. differences depending on environment or. stress levels but the minute that Dr H. believes she has a grasp on Sarah's. mannerisms she would come to see Sarah. and everything feels different it's like. a completely different person Sarah. would go from being quiet softspoken to. being incredibly assertive definitive.

clear sharp spoken Unapologetic there's. not a single tear no crying whatsoever. and almost kind of. Snappy Dr H has been a psychologist for. a very long time probably longer than. we've been alive she knows this is not a. matter of a good day versus a bad day or. getting more comfortable or even like a. mood swing which is very typical things. that people go through or or like. someone pretending to yeah be someone. this is this is something else the. doctor said then I think it was one time.

I arrived and there was again what felt. like a completely different person that. met me and I just asked who are you she. responded I'm Alysa thank you for coming. to talk to me is there a reason you're. here today yes there have been some. fights in the jail and I had to come out. because Vanessa can't handle that so I'm. here Dr Hutchinson remembers saying. there are really a few more important. things I would want to talk to Vanessa. about about today is it possible that I.

talk to Vanessa no it's not safe I'm. staying later Dr Hutchinson would ask. about Sarah if she could please speak to. Sarah the name on her patient chart she. was informed that Sarah was dead Sarah. had died at 16 years. old did disassociative identity disorder. a quick disclaimer before we get into. this episode like I said we try to get. GA as much peer reviewed research as.

possible from the medical community as. well as listen to the did community and. go on forums and try to pull from actual. personal experience rather than people. who think they know what they're talking. about right and I will say that what we. gathered is did might be the most poorly. represented psychological disorder in. mainstream media so we tried our best to. separate that from all of our research. we also know that did can present itself. very differently person to person so. this should not be taken as a. generalization of did as a whole so. please if there is anything you felt was.

not exactly explained correctly or. honestly even more insight that you have. on this topic I would be very grateful. if you could leave that in the comments. did disassociative identity disorder can. Loosely be defined as a disruption in. one's identity by the existence of two. or more distinct identity States in an. individual which okay when I'm reading. that definition I'm like yes it makes. sense but I think this definition. explains a lot more to me in terms of. understanding someone without did.

typically experiences a very stable. singular sense of identity the identity. evolves over time through experience. obviously and of course we all have mood. changes periods of sadness and. personality Evolution but overall there. is this underlying feeling of being the. same person that evolves and over time. adapts I mean don't get me wrong I would. think that I'm not the same Stephanie. from 10 years ago but it's because I've. evolved that Stephanie from 10 years ago. when from point to point B which is.

where I'm today but it's still Stephanie. it's just changed it's not a fixed. identity that I have but it's moving and. developing and it's just one singular. identity going through motions whereas. people with did describe their. perception of self as a bit different. and there's not one way but some people. have described it as seeing their. identity as multiple identities not. limited to one and it's not just oh. today I'm happy so this is my identity. just compl completely different. identities it's like two souls in one.

body is the feeling others have. described it as multiple identities. coexisting in a vessel like one body. that has to be shared so for someone. like me who does not have did think of. this analogy I'm driving a bus there is. nobody else on this bus I'm the only. driver of this bus the whole time I'm. driving I have a very clear memory of. everything that's happened while I was. driving this bus obviously the boring. bits where I space out on the highway. it's not going to be strong In My Memory. but there's very big moments where I'm.

like oh yeah I saw that while I was. driving down the highway oh yes and I. was listening to this song while I was. driving down the highway but someone. with did has a very different bus. driving experience they might only. remember half of the drive they might. have this feeling that they don't. remember anything prior to suddenly I. was sitting in the bus driver's seat and. driving the bus but they don't know how. they got on the bus or sometimes they. experience driving the bus from the. outside almost like they can see. themselves driving ding the bus but they. don't actually feel what it's like to.

drive the bus wow also another good way. to describe it is someone without did is. you look in the mirror that's how you. perceive yourself someone with did Might. perceive themsel almost like a CCTV. camera from the outside not staring into. the mirror but watching their body stare. into the mirror H okay that's because. someone with did there is more than one. identity on that bus did is categorized. in and characterized by the dsm5 by.

having the presence of two or more. separate identities or altars there is. not one singular identity there's not. one singular driver of the bus there are. multiple different altars that drive. that bus now there might be one or two. altars that drive most of the time some. altars barely ever drive or other altars. are fighting to try to drive but they. never get the chance to but there's a. lot of people on that bus and they all. feel like completely different. identities like think of a full bus of.

different people because they are so. what does that mean I'm driving a bus. alone I see my hands on the wheel I am. in control of the bus non-stop I have. the AC blowing in my hair I see the red. lights these are my personal experiences. I remember the whole bus drive someone. with did Might experience that for 25%. of the bus drive the other 75% they feel. like they've been sharing the seat. helping the driver drive the bus or. sometimes they feel like they're in the. back of the bus not paying attention to. who's driving the bus or they're. watching from the front seat trying to.

give backseat driving instructions to. the driver and they're getting. frustrated because it's like why aren't. you listening to me or they can see. themselves driving the bus but almost. from the view of a CCTV camera and these. identities and altars make up a system. now side note they are referred to. altars that make up a system I think. prior maybe decades ago they were called. personalities that doesn't apply because. I think people without did was like I. also have different personalities when. I'm at work that's not what we're.

talking about so instead of having One. Singular identity there's many separate. identities that make up a system each. identity has a distinct personal history. self-image and has completely separate. responses to certain situations they can. even have different handwriting. psychologists say it's actually pretty. common for different altars within a. system to have drastically different. likes of Music food preferences. political views even the way that they. use that body they say is different and.

I think that maybe if you don't know. anyone with did some psychiatrists were. saying you might have a tendency to be. like wait that doesn't make sense right. but when you see someone switch between. altars you see their tone their body. language the way they use their face. also. changes yeah I don't want to get it too. complicated but just know that there are. multiple altars that make up a system. and when we say fronting when we are. talking about me talking about the case.

not as someone with did I don't want to. act like I'm representing that Community. but when it's referred to as fronting is. that alar is in control of the body and. sometimes the other altars have no idea. what's happened when that altar is in. control some sometimes they do sometimes. they do that's called co-consciousness. sometimes they can actually have like. inner monologue between the different. altars and they can fill each other in. or they have systems where a lot of. people with did have specific apps where. they write down hey this is what I did. as this Altar and then the next altar.

that comes to front they can see what's. happened so far so they're they're not. completely out of the loop but that is. why recurrent Amnesia is typically a big. diagnostic point that psychologists tend. to focus on in terms of diagnosing. someone with did there may be random. Slots of missing time or at least that's. what it feels like giant gaps in memory. chunks of childhood times just missing. from your memory or you see pictures of. your wedding and you know you were there. you see it in the picture you're there.

that's you obviously you're getting. married but you have zero memory of your. wedding or you might be watching a video. eating a bowl of cereal and then. suddenly in the blink of an eye you look. up and you're in bed reading a book and. you have no idea what just happened it. does seem like there are people out. there in this world that either don't. take did seriously or think that it. cannot be real which is obviously very. ignorant and yes there have been. instances of people faking did typically. for social media Fame but there's also. people faking terminal illness for. social media Fame that does not make.

terminal endless fake if you take brain. scans of people with did you'll see that. often times they even have blood flow. patterns that are different from people. who do not have did one study showed. that people with did also tended to have. a smaller hippocampus which is the part. of your brain that helps you form. memories and it's not like oh the. smaller your hippocampus the more likely. you are to get did it seems more like. after the fact and you'll see why so we. kind of know what did is but how does.

did develop it's generally agreed upon. in the scientific community that did is. typically formed during childhood as a. protective mechanism against trauma I. think Dr Mike Lloyd puts it a lot better. than I do but he says and this is a. paraphrase every single one of us has a. different tolerance for trauma or life. stress so visualize it think of it as a. glass cup your resilience to tra trauma. is an empty glass cup and all of us are.

going to have differ sized cups some. people are naturally more resilient than. others typically when you're younger. your cup is going to be very small as. you get older your cup grows or at least. it should as an example so if you're an. adult with a great well-adjusted life. and support system you likely have a. great deal of resilience and you've got. a big empty glass cup now think of. trauma as a jug of water so every time. someone experiences trauma you splash. some water in there it goes into the. glass cup and if you have a fairly empty.

cup one splash of water is going to do. nothing it's just going to be a sip of. water sitting at the bottom of your cup. it's not going to be good you want to. get it out but you have so much room in. that cup to learn how to cope manage. grow you have space in that cup to think. and process the trauma you can actually. pour the trauma water out because you've. put it in the cup experienced it. processed it and now you're done with it. it's no longer taking up all your brain. space that's for a healthy adult when. you're a child every amount of trauma.

every Splash feels like it's going to. overwhelm the cup because you probably. just have a shot glass the cup is so. small children do not have strong coping. mechanisms to deal with trauma even if. there is room in that tiny little shot. glass likely the child does not know how. to manage that water that goes in but. that's why you have parents or adults in. your life they will take your shot glass. and actually pour it into their cup they. take your trauma out of them they see. trauma they take it out they try to. lighten constantly drain the child's.

trauma cup but what if that child does. not have an adult or anyone in their. life that can take away their trauma or. the trauma it's not just a little splash. it's a giant Splash or sometimes it's a. constant trickling of water that never. ends like an open faucet just constantly. pouring more water it doesn't matter if. someone once in a while tries to dump. the glass there's just new water coming. in whether it's parental neglect. physical or sexual ual violence High. stressors that the child has it is.

non-stop now nobody's taking any water. out eventually that cup is going to. overflow where does overflowing trauma. go it doesn't just disappear our brains. don't work like that where it's like oh. you know what I can't handle the trauma. so it's just not there anymore it's. still there it just does not evaporate. so what is that child's incredibly. powerful desperate but also very. resilient brain do they create new. glasses to hold the trauma additional. vessels to hold hold more trauma altars.

think of the cup as new altars sometimes. those new glasses are clear and people. can see they themselves can see perhaps. therapists can even see how much water. and Trauma is in some of those glasses. other times the new glasses that they. have are paper you can't even see what's. in there they themselves can't even see. what's in there or how much is in there. and as the child grows or as more trauma. takes place they might have more glasses. that are required to contain the trauma.

so that's why you'll see that with. people with did even later down the road. they might have new altars emerge and. it's usually because they need more. glasses wow and those glasses make up a. system multiple identities in one body. and side note with altars it does seem. common that there are specific altars. that are usually made out of paper the. ones that you cannot see through and. they hold most of the trauma. so that's why the did Community said.

you'll actually see a lot of people with. did say that doesn't make sense because. I've never experienced childhood trauma. and then they start reflecting they. start going through therapy and they. realize oh actually this happened to me. and there are witnesses from my. childhood that are like yeah that's. crazy because that did happen to you wow. and they just didn't realize it so they. have trauma holding altars so it's all. like your brain just trying to protect. you yes and that's where the. disassociative also comes in it does.

feel like it didn't happen to me it's. almost like you're protecting yourself. like I can't handle this emotion so it. didn't happen to me but I can't just get. rid of the trauma yeah so I'm just. looking for a different way to cope it. is called a disorder but a lot of. psychologists say it's more like a. protective mechanism that develops in. the brain another thing to note is that. did is not something that needs to be. healed a lot of people will say oh you. need to learn to reintegrate yourself as. an adult go back to one identity but. that's not really necessary that would.

imply that someone with d is broken. which that's not the case I think every. person on the planet can use some. healing but you get it and this part is. important but when talking to someone. with did from what we've researched it. is preferred that we use the pronouns of. the fronting altar someone who is part. of a system of altars said if you're. talking about me as in me the person sat. in front of you talking to you then it's. me one person and I identify as and then. they would give their pronouns so we. will stay with how Sarah's doctors refer.

to her which is Sarah and the pronouns. she uses are she her now side note most. of the time people with did will refer. to themselves as we instead of I which. is why I wanted to make sure that. there's no confusion about the pronouns. and one more thing to note just because. there are different identities working. in a system that has completely. different likes and dislikes it is. nothing like the movie Split which is. about a homicidal person who happens to. have did and that's like the whole punch. line right people would ID do not have. bad evil altars that are trying to front.

and commit heinous crimes altars have. different personalities but the reason. that a new altar comes about is. generally for protection it's never like. oh I just have like a serial killer. altar that is crazy that's that is. unhinged that is movie that is crazy. usually altars are created again to. protect someone so sure there can be bad. people with did and there's also bad. people who don't have did just. statistically speaking people with did.

are no more likely to commit crimes than. the general population and 70% of people. with did have attempted self- exit at. one point in their lives they're likely. to be victims of crime more than. anything yeah because they're. traumatized when they were young yeah. and even in today's case there is a lot. more Nuance so just follow me there. Sarah has a habit well she did she had a. habit of stealing her dad's Keys before.

he went to work this is when she's a kid. Sarah's dad was almost always running. late because of Sarah which is kind of. cute at first but over time it's just. very inconvenient it's part of the daily. routine where are my keys hurry go find. Daddy's Keys Daddy's going to get fired. but now that Sarah's older both of. Sarah's parents they're divorced and she. no longer lives in the family home but. they just think of that moment when. they're asked what do you remember most. about Sarah's childhood they would both.

respond oh she used to do this thing. where she would hide her dad's Keys. she's like daddy's little girl they. would smile and it's like this cute. little memory one of the happiest. memories they have as a kid and Sarah. must have loved her dad that is the. messaging she loved him so much she. never wanted him to leave the house so. both mom and dad is sharing this story. saying how much Sarah loved her dad to. Sarah's psychologist oh okay and Sarah. psychologist is like okay that's very.

interesting because I feel like Sarah. has a lot of complex feelings about her. parents and Sarah clearly remembers. things very differently as a child Sarah. actually had a lot of interesting habits. she didn't like wearing shoes she likes. to play outside and most unique and. potentially alarming one is she had this. habit where she would run outside to. play with her friends and she would come. back home and everyone is like what are. you doing where did the rest of your. clothes go she would just come back home. and nothing but her. underwear what and nobody looked into it.

they just thought Sarah's such a tomboy. she doesn't like wayar clothes she not. even Elementary School maybe like four. or five and she really really really. hated their nextdoor neighbor hated him. but that's not really news I think. everyone in the neighborhood hated this. guy despised this guy he's old he's. crabby he has dementia and he would do. this thing where he would just shoot. squirrels with BB guns sometimes the BB.

gun pellets would Ricochet off and hit. other things sometimes he would hit. neighbors cars parked on the street. while he's attempting to hit a squirrel. with a BB gun which I imagine is. happening frequently considering his age. and deteriorating eyesight he's hitting. random things in people he is overall. probably the worst neighbor of the year. nobody even knows why He's torturing. squirrels in the neighborhood he's not. exactly the type of person you can ask. that question to you feel like you're. next he's going to shoot you next. they keep an eye out for him and he.

keeps an eye out for little Sarah. allegedly he would make Sarah watch him. shoot a squirrel with a BB gun walk over. grab that squirrel still half alive and. skin the squirrel alive using a. knife then he would kill the squirrel in. front of her face just after literally. ripping and peeling its skin off in. front of this I don't know 5-year-old. girl he would would scream at her if you. try to run or if you look away this is.

going to be you next if you tell anybody. anything this is going to be you and. when he's done killing a squirrel in. front of her he would hold Sarah down. shove the mutilated squirrel in her face. and molest her it's stated that he. essayed her orally and digitally and. then he fully essayed her by inserting. gardening tools into her the very first. time it happened Sarah runs all the way. home screaming yelling she slams open. the front door she doesn't even know how.

to describe what happened to her I. believe she was young to the point where. she knows this is bad painful evil. terrifying but I don't think that she. can put it into words like I don't think. she understands her body like that even. or what this action is she has no idea. she just knows she hated it she runs. inside and her mom is on the phone and. she screams at her loud daughter you're. making too much fuss go to your room. maybe it was Sarah's Choice to take off. her clothes while playing outside maybe. it wasn't but had someone just looked.

into it they would have realized that. the demented neighbor doc that's what. they called him is more than just. demented later Sarah's psychologist. would ask when did the neighbor assault. you at night in the mornings before. school after Sarah. responded anytime my dad wasn't home so. that's why she hid his keys gosh in. hopes that he would stay home. Sarah's psychologist firmly believes.

this is the childhood trauma that. Sarah's brain could not handle and. protected her by creating new. altars wow police are called to do a. welfare check on a 19-year-old girl. named Sarah mlin they show up at the. house in question that she's apparently. staying at it's not her mom's house it's. not her dad's house it's not even a. relative's house it's just a small. little Suburban House in Kansas the. police initially tried knocking on the. front door nothing they try the back. door nothing it's a little unclear if.

this was their second welfare check or. if this there was some reason that they. felt that they needed to break into the. house I'm sure they've got a list of. reasons but the police forc their way. into the home through the door through. the kitchen they kick it in and they. step right into the house and they're. like we were right the whole place is. rans sacked if you were to go into the. bedrooms you would see dressers or. rummage through bed sheets are ripped. off the bed pictures are ripped out of. the picture frames but two things would. stand out the most on the wall written.

in Big Red Letters is a word like. imagine just spray painting inside the. house it's weird and right underneath. that is a dead man laying in a pool of. his own blood zip ties around his wrist. zip ties around his ankle curiously. there are cut zip ties next to him and a. pair of scissors next to his foot so it. seems like someone zip tied him and then. cut it and then rezip tied him for. whatever reason the police look at the. man then they look at the words on the. wall and they realize that the words on.

the wall were written using this man's. blood and the words read and it's kind. of hard f r e e d o m Freedom the most. popular item at CC's pizzas it's a pizza. chain it's not actually a pizza it's. their cinnamon rolls it's also not the. most popular pizza chain in the world. but it is or at least it was one of the. only places in the entire town that. would hire 15-year-olds and give them a.

part-time job after school and on top of. that the owner Harold sasco so he's the. owner of three cce's Pizza franchises. he's not like the owner of the C's Pizza. franchise company he just owns three. locations and he would hire 15-year-olds. and he's really cool Harold is. interesting people say he's a cool boss. he lets the high schoolers call him Hal. and instead of talking to them like. they're. irresponsible incapable incompetent. 15-year-olds which is usually how these. kids feel like adults talk to them he.

talks to them like they're his age like. they're also adults he'll even randomly. talk to them or teach them about. business and the struggles of running a. franchisee location he kind of feels. more like a like a business Mentor than. a boss and Harold could just see from a. mile away that Sarah mlin is hurting. she's got scars on her arms on her. wrists that are in various stages of. healing she just seems lonely she. doesn't have anyone she's also a little. awkward she was homeschooled as a kid.

which side note her homeschooling. curriculum was just so questionable. apparently her daily routine was to read. classic literature novels and then watch. the movie but regardless Sarah was. homeschooled and it resulted in her not. really knowing how to make friends she. was awkward even when she does. eventually go back to public school it. was just a little too late usually Sarah. keeps to herself keeps away from people. and people keep away from her except for. Harold he just feels like she needs help.

and he wants to help her does she work. for him or yeah oh so she's one of the. employees and he's her boss and he's. also 33 years older than her so. technically old enough to be her dad and. he tells her I can help you get on your. feet I can see that you're really. struggling and when you're ready I can. help you get your life together I can. help you learn how to run a business. kind of like a dad or a mentor like a. father figure you can even move in with. me Harold has been divorced four five.

times right now he lives alone he's got. a spare room she could use it's. completely up to her how old is she at. this point. 17 okay and he's 33 years older so he's. 50. yes he was going to show me how to run. businesses so I can eventually run a. business of my own it I really looked at. him as a mentor like I looked up to him. like none of my family. had businesses or anything like that. like I just admired that and I wanted to.

learn from that she does not know that. her new Mentor Harold has downloaded. hundreds of videos of violent explicit. content onto his phone and visits. x-rated websites that feature children. teens and beastiality at least 20 times. he visited a website that feature men. fondling or having intimate relations. with women that appear to be asleep. Sarah did not know this at the time. instead she had his name saved on her. phone pH under the contact Dad but dads.

don't really do drugs with their. daughters do they according to Sarah. right after moving in Harold was. supplying her and giving her. unrestricted access to whatever drug she. wanted weed vodka cocaine ecstasy which. there seems to be other witnesses that. have stated Harold was buying drugs. mainly weed and black market. prescription painkillers allegedly they. said he talked about it they never saw. it happen but he talked about it but if. it's true that he is buying drugs and. giving it to Sarah it defeats the whole. purpose of her moving in to begin with.

because he said it was to make sure that. she got clean and worked on her future. Sarah said after moving in with Harold. she might have actually started doing. more drugs this is according to Sarah. she said she was drinking almost on a. nightly basis she's having seven shots. of vodka at a time seven drinks at a. time she would smoke weed almost every. single day and a few times a week she. would take super strong prescription. painkillers which yeah from the outside. we're confused we're alarmed but Sarah. she's 17 she's having what she thinks at.

the time is a really good good time 1. month into Sarah's move into Harold's. house Sarah shows up with a whole brand. new nose she got a nose job Sarah's. sister Ashley is kind of confused maybe. because a nose job is like $6,000 how on. Earth did you pay for it but she also. knows that Sarah has complained about. how she hates her nose how ugly it made. her feel and how ashamed she was of it. and Sarah tells her sister well Harold. told me that if I feel insecure he can.

help me not feel insecure I'm going to. pay him back though he's he's just. fronting me the money that's crazy Sarah. feels really lucky I mean not only that. this sweet man is paying for her very. expensive nose job I mean obviously. she's going to pay him back it's more. like a loan but he really didn't even. have to do that for her Who loans. someone $6,000 so casually I don't think. many people would do that for Sarah even. just the fact that he thought out of it. and offered it to her she said it felt.

like wow I finally have an adult that. sees what I really need and will help me. it's not a free ride but somebody is. really helping me and they care about me. it's that type of feeling 6,000 is a lot. of money for a 17-year-old it probably. feels like $6 million you know what I. mean like it's like. un you know you can't even fathom that. amount of money and that must mean like. the world for her to receive that but. also think about that later because.

imagine someone tells you you need to. pay me $6,000 at 17 yeah yeah I would. not even I would be so overwhelmed she. probably feels like she owes him life. yeah exactly I think Sarah's so happy. with this new found parental figure that. she trusts she doesn't even see what. people see from the outside which is no. this is definitely a little bit strange. I don't even think most parents would. give their 17-year-old a nose job. Sarah's older sister Ashley allegedly. starts picking up on it just a little. bit Ashley knows that her sister Sarah.

is moving in with her boss Harold she. thinks yeah it's weird it's strange but. maybe it's for the best the two of them. Sarah and Ashley they never really grew. up with strong parental figures maybe. this is what Sarah needs but there are. weird things like the fact that ever. since Sarah moved in with Harold she's. had her nose job but also butt. implants not that Ashley is judging or. anything but but it just doesn't sound. like her sister Ashley was under the.

impression that both of them never. wanted to get body augmentation. surgeries and also she's so young and. Sarah can't stop talking about the end. of the world political Annihilation. through War like she's becoming a. doomsday prepper I mean there are some. really unstable nuclear power plants. right now and they're on the cusp of. exploding um okay it would be in. everyone's best interest to look for. Bunker locations places in places like. uh Utah Montana are good they're far. away enough from any of the blast sites. that it should feel safe enough oh yeah.

I mean I have a friend in Utah they say. it's nice is the older older sister or. younger sister older sister okay Sarah. and Ashley would be out grabbing coffee. or food and Sarah would just keep going. on and on about how they need to make GO. bags filled with dry food that's going. to keep them safe and alive for a few. days they're buying survival knives her. and heral survival skills are going to. be more important now than ever because. think about it sure you can do things on. the computer but what if computers are. shut down how are you going to get food. if there's no grocery stores could I get.

a name for the order Sarah would turn. Vanessa as thinking okay whoa this is a. little strange Sarah just called herself. Vanessa but maybe she doesn't like. giving her real name to strangers so. you're saying the sister this is the. sister's first time hearing Vanessa yes. and she thought it was a little odd and. then sometimes she stated that Harold. would even call Sarah. Vanessa but it was just weird she didn't. ask ask about it she didn't think too. much into it but it was just odd she.

thought it was like just a fake name. yeah regardless before Ashley can ask. about it Sarah would go on another. tangent about volcanoes another new. found Obsession since she moved in with. Harold so yeah things are a little bit. strange but as long as Sarah has someone. and somewhere to make her feel safe. which she never had in her childhood. Maybe Ashley can support it Sarah grew. up in this really dysfunctional family I. mean obviously so did Ashley she's got. Ashley then it's Sarah and then they. have three younger brothers all of whom.

were adopted which apparently according. to Sarah Sarah's mom would have these. phases in her life implying that her mom. went through an adoption phase where she. either thought that's what she wanted to. do or thought it was cool or something I. don't know it's just something that she. would tell her psychologist later their. mom adopts three boys and according to. Sarah when they were no longer cute her. mom just decides the phase is over. decides she doesn't really want to be a. mom anymore leaving both Ashley and. Sarah responsible for the care of the. boys and it's obviously not easy one of.

the brothers has fetal alcohol syndrome. and two of the other brothers both have. add the girls are left to raise their. three brothers and all they remember. growing up about their mom is she was. always on the phone her phone is glued. to the side of her face talking to her. friends she just always seemed to be way. more concerned with the opinion of her. friends and what they think about their. children than her actual children she. wasn't really maternal either if the. kids had a problem or wanted Comfort or.

support or something she was either a. not there to provide it or B usually her. method of support was along the lines of. hey suck it up stop whining life is hard. okay the world is Harsh so go to your. room which fine maybe dad is better. Sarah's dad is described by Sarah as uh. being quote very emotional she said he's. very depressed and has a very weak. personality that lets both of his wives. control him she also thinks that he has.

an alcohol problem he would constantly. be out till 5:00 in the morning the. girls would be up all night wondering if. he's going to be okay if he's in trouble. if he's even alive if he's abandoning. them but they can't go talk to their mom. about it since she's on the phone and. sent them to their rooms they both. always felt like their parents only ever. did what was most convenient for them. they did not care about their kids then. they divorced Sarah's only 15 when it. happened it's rough there's non-stop. fighting in the house both parents get. new partners and the kids feel even more.

abandoned at one point Sarah's mom would. put the boys to bed then leave to spend. the rest of the night at her new. partner's place just leaving the kids so. it's safe to say that there really were. no strong parental figures in their life. no sort of guidance they could sneak out. skip school get high it didn't seem like. anybody cared or anything which is maybe. why Ashley thought yeah Harold is weird. but maybe he could be good for Sarah. when Ashley meets Harold he seems nice. enough he talks about how he's Christian.

and Sarah told her that he was going to. teach her how to start a business help. her through school which is super sweet. and everything seems super normal except. Harold mentions to Ashley that her. daughter Ashley has a daughter so this. is Sarah's niece Sarah's very young. niece is more than welcome to stay at. his house if Ashley ever needs to get. away and get some time. alone Ashley thinks the offer is quote. weird and a little creepy but she tries. to brush it off he's probably just.

saying that nobody actually wants to. babysit right she's trying to be. supportive of her sister and her journey. but there's a few things that you really. cannot explain away one time Ashley's. hanging out with Sarah Harold is out of. town in Florida Sarah gets a text. message from Harold and it's something. about how sunburnt is getting on. vacation which is normally enough but. this is the picture that he sends it. looks like a bathroom mirror selfie he. is very sunburned he looks like a cooked. red Lobster and you can't see any. intimate areas he's shirtless but you.

can also tell that he's not wearing. pants and he's not wearing underwear so. it's like a top be chest selfie yes but. he's showing enough of the waistband. area that it's implied he's not wearing. anything so he took that photo naked yes. which it's cropped like I said you can't. see his Parts but it's just a very odd. thing to send someone that you call your. stepdaughter if I receive this picture. from my father or a stepfather if I had. one I would genuinely be terrified I. would ask did you mean to send this to.

somebody else because I need to throw my. phone away now this doesn't make any. this is not a normal fatherdaughter. relationship photo it just rubs Ashley. the wrong way enough so that the next. time Ashley visits Sarah at the house. she makes sure to be a little bit more. observant and she notices two things. from her perspective it seems that her. sister is high on cocaine and Harold is. looking at her sister in a very creepy. way Ashley is so tired that night but. she refuses to fall asleep because.

something in her gut is telling her to. stay awake be alert and keep an eye out. on her sister which is exactly what she. ends up doing but what about all the. other nights that she's not there she. can't stay awake and sleep over every. night she's got kids she has obligation. she has a job after that incident Ashley. goes to their mom and tells her look we. got to do something about Sarah Sarah's. not in a good situation right now she. needs help but their mom would more or. less tell her sh we can pray for. her she didn't ask for any more. specifics on like hey what's happening. to Sarah is she okay who is she with.

didn't really ask much it's unclear if. Sarah picked up on all these weird. little instances or not I would imagine. not and by the time she finally did pick. up on something it'd be too late one day. Sarah is sitting on the couch with. Harold and she's got him in her phone. contacts his dad and he tells her I have. feelings for you I want to go on a date. with you which is the last thing Sarah. would ever ever want she genuinely sees. him as a dad she tries to reject him as.

nicely as she can but she's confused. that he would even ask such a thing or. even feel such a thing because he had. confessed to me something that he was in. love with me or something one time and I. just quickly shut it down and said I. really do you know see you as a father. and like a mentor and a friend and I. did uh and it. just I I was very just crushed the first. time that happened and I just felt.

completely helpless at that point but. ever since that conversation things. start changing around this house the. energy is just different the dynamic is. Shifting when Sarah is sitting there. watching TV he would come up behind her. sit really close to her put his arms. around her and she could see or feel. that he's getting an erection and it's. starting to make her feel super. uncomfortable wait so she's still 17 or. so this happen when she's 18 now but she. moved in when she was 17 okay now one.

time she woke up with him lying in bed. next to her without his shirt on they. sleep in separate rooms so what is going. on right now and just to emphasize once. more in the eyes of the law any unproven. interactions between Sarah and Harold. are from Sarah's conversations with her. psychologist it is at the end of the day. her version of events but there are some. witnesses we'll get into later within a. few weeks of asking Sarah on that date. though and being rejected Sarah sees. Harold as her dad and hopes maybe things.

will go back to normal clearly that's. not the case according to Sarah Harold. does something no person should ever do. let alone a father no father should ever. do this to their daughter according to. Sarah he starts essaying her he. threatens to kick her out of the house. if she does not comply she said that she. felt she had no choice the thought the. action it disgusted her but what can she. do she tried to tell him they're like. father and daughter this isn't normal. and he allegedly responded this is just. what people do when they're drunk so she.

quote I would get as drunk as I could. and I would just lay there she stated. she tried to tell him no but refusing. consent does not feel like an option he. would just quote act like he didn't hear. me she stated that one time he kept. assaying her while she was pleading no. the whole time or if Sarah starts. squirming to get away he would quote. like when I would move my arm he would. just hold my arms according to Sarah. this is just the start he would essay. her multiple times a week for months.

after that and each time it happened. Sarah would be mad at herself for. thinking it was going to be any. different this time she said he was my. hope that the world wasn't just like the. people of my family and that maybe there. were good people in the world and now. that's gone why would he be different. from all the other people that essayed. Sarah what just because he's 33 years. older than her and said he was going to. be her father figure. it is alleged that pretty much every. male interaction Sarah had in her life.

on a deeper level had negative. horrendous outcomes Sarah's very first. boyfriend she's thinking this is going. to be like the TV shows where they find. comfort and love in each other and then. one day he tries to get intimate and she. tells him she's not ready considering. all of the trauma that she likely had as. a kid she just doesn't want to do this. and he responds by beating her later at. 16 Sarah starts doing drugs and drinking. alcohol and she's visiting this guy's. house and they're not really friends. he's 20 she's 16 he's drunk and he's.

trying to get her to agree to have. intimate relations and again she says no. Then why would you come over he pushes. her onto the wood coffee table so. roughly that it breaks he does not care. he puts all of his body weight on top of. her lays on her grabs his cigarette that. he was smoking and starts pressing it. into her arm burning her skin then he. drags her by the hair into his room and. proceeds to essay her while he tells her. that if she tells anybody he's going to. find her and he's going to kill her do.

we know who he is no and initially she. didn't tell anyone she didn't tell. anybody and nobody questioned why she. came home with bruises and scars on her. arm it's not until months later Sarah. finally tells her mom a little bit about. what happened with the 20-year-old and. her mom is quiet at first and she just. responds I don't want you to tell anyone. else but according to Sarah her mom went. ahead and just told everybody else for. her just about told every family friend. every family member that they have and.

would allegedly her mom would half joke. that Sarah's a [ __ ] now Sarah seemingly. does not know how to digest all this. additional trauma including her alleged. childhood abuse and I say alleged. because I mean I I don't like to. question victim stories but we do have. to factor in that she does have. incentive to lie but you get it I I just. can't imagine someone making this up and. maybe I have a naive perspective on the. world it just and there are medical. records that do state things she's. having traumatic nightmares where she's.

holding a knife and killing a faceless. man she attempts self- exit multiple. times around this time she's. hospitalized for over a week for that. and they just prescribe her. anti-depressants side note one of. Sarah's therapists at the time straight. up told Sarah's parents we cannot help. Sarah we are not qualified she is beyond. our scope of expertise you need to find. someone else this is like younger right. before she even meets. Harold wow and I don't think her parents.

took it that way the way they were. supposed to I don't think they digested. that information and went home thinking. we really need to help our daughter they. were just like okay then we just won't. find her a therapist if they can't. help all she had are her meds and the. meds are okay but drinking is better she. starts skipping school drinking. apparently she would start her day with. multiple shots of vodka and her coffee. at 15 she's doing drugs just about. anything that can help her forget all of. the trauma and abuse and sometimes.

forgetting includes doing so much. ecstasy or cocaine that you genuinely. feel nothing she said no matter how bad. my day was at least I could do a lot of. drugs and all the negative stuff would. just fade. away she said when I was drinking I. wasn't depressed but clearly it's not. working she's not coping with all of. this trauma well at 16 she even starts. watching very violent graphic explicit. videos. specifically videos involving women that. are being brutally humiliated as key.

points and this is going to be a theme. throughout the rest of the episode this. is uh what a lot of psychologists. suspect is her behavior she feels so. powerless and she starts doing actions. she believes her perpetrators would do. because she believes they are the ones. with power yeah cuz later she's going to. start skinning. animals yeah I mean you can always. almost pinpoint how it happened at this. point you know she's like look look at.

the conditions look at all these like. you know and again I know that there are. people out there that believe that not. did is fake but Sarah is faking did I. think it's very hard to do first of all. if we take that out of the equation it. just psychologically makes a lot of. sense a lot of experts are like this. just this it's not farfetched it doesn't. feel like someone made it up yeah even. without did just look at what happened. to someone imagine that type of trauma. to anybody like what you know how do you.

respond at that age Sarah would later. state for 10 months the essays would. continue to escalate in Harold's house. she states she would be essayed by. Harold over a hundred times she said it. was just so gradual that I feel like it. wasn't until I was really far into. things that I started to question almost. like to a point where I didn't feel like. I could do a lot about it thinking back. she said he was always controlling right. when she moves in he tells her I just. want to let you know that this is still. my house I have the right to search for. all of your things Sarah thinks yeah I.

mean no big deal of course it's his. house he has the right to not want. certain things in his house he would go. through her things then she's. immediately given access to as much weed. and alcohol as she wants the only. condition being she always has to do it. in the house and he would be there. controlling and taking advantage of the. situation little by little he starts. taking over her life he would tell her. she can't have her phone in her room at. night when she goes to sleep because. technology should not be in rooms well. not in her room and.

immediately like I was given access to. Weed and Alcohol like as much as I. wanted but even that like had relations. like I had to use it in the. house um and he would be there a lot. he's getting full control and slowly. starts demanding more and more from. Sarah is how she puts it she claims he. essayed her multiple times a week for 10. months but sometimes it's not just the. essay that's messing with her ability to.

cope it's the words Sarah doesn't really. know how to handle those she said it was. nonstop he would follow her around and. tell her men aren't going to find you. attractive because your breasts aren't. big enough and your butt's not big. enough Sarah starts feeling less. confident in herself which is saying a. lot because she said at that point her. self-esteem was practically non-existent. already and she was already embarrassed. by when she was younger you know how she. was burned with the cigarettes she was. so embarrassed by how round the scars. were it looked in her mind she thought.

someone would see it from a mile away. and think she was raped and someone. burned cigarettes on her because it's. it's not a natural scar pattern it's so. round so she would actually take a sharp. instrument and alter the scar to make it. look natural like a normal scar it's. alleged that she would lie and tell. people that she fell off a horse and. that's how the scar came about and now. Harold is basically telling her trying. to convince her to get a boob job or. butt implants a BBL this is worse than a.

BBL BBL is a fat transfer which is very. painful and it's dangerous but butt. implants I heard are miserable you're. literally sticking foreign objects into. your but Ox area and he's telling her. maybe if you have that people are going. to focus on that and not anything else. AKA like those cigarette scarves Sarah. does not want either of these she tries. to convince him I'm way too young for. breast augmentation surgery somehow. Harold agrees but he still wants her to. get the butt implants and Sarah feels.

like she has no choice she's cut off. from her family she's got nowhere to go. no money he keeps telling her that she. can't leave or else something bad is. going to happen to her he won't stop. talking about the butt implants and she. feels like fine if I get it he's going. to stop talking about it and essentially. he's making her feel completely. undesirable a burden destined for. homelessness and all the scary things. that come with being a woman without a. home Sarah later said I think more than. anything he made me feel like he owned. me to him him I was just a toy like his. personal Barbie doll that's what he. tried to make me by this point that.

Sarah had moved in she's isolated she. now has a nose job and butt implants. she's essayed by Harold on a weekly. basis allegedly and before she can try. and manage to cope he's degrading her. he's kicking down her self-esteem. telling her that she's ugly and that. she's going to die alone unless she does. everything he says she is completely. helpless and on top of that we add on. another layer this reminds me a little. bit about the Sarah Lauren College code. case Harold starts writing up list of. all the money that Sarah owes him money.

for rent $6,000 for the nose job $10,000. for butt implants which side note we're. not even going into the psychology of. forced body. modification we tried looking into. peer-reviewed medical studies about the. psychology of what that could do to. someone's psyche and there's not a lot. of information the closest we could get. was branding on sex trafficking. survivors who get U brands or tattoos by. the. traffickers it would be a little bit. similar to that to force modifications.

on your body that you don't want and now. he's charging her $10,000 for it he's. charging her gas bills Netflix is on her. list of debt the streaming service she's. almost $20,000 in debt to Harold she's. 19 $20,000 at 19 and he's holding it. over her head threatening to sue her if. she doesn't do as he says she's working. at Bed Bath and Beyond she has sporadic. hours does not really get the best pay. her last paycheck from Bed Bath and. Beyond was just.

$265 which is deposited into an account. that only Harold has access to and when. Harold gets drunk he would allegedly. throw Sarah down and Essay her Sarah. said it was always when he was drunk. after Sarah's butt implants she is in so. much pain physically and mentally she's. laying on the couch she doesn't feel. like this is her body she has a loss of. body autonomy and I think visually it's. very scarring to see her body in a way. that she does not like and does not want. all she wants to do is lay on the couch. get high off of prescription pain meds.

and she just Spends months laying there. depressed she said all she could do was. drink smoke marijuana and think about. how much she hates herself and how much. she hates everybody and how much she. hates Harold and how much honestly she. hates being essed which she claimed. happened even while she's depressed on. the couch while she's laying there she. said she started having these very. strange symptoms stomach distress daily. headaches and this bizarre tingling. sensation in her fingertips and she. thought it was so strange because her.

fingers wouldn't stop tingling and she. starts feeling like wait am I being. poisoned right now I feel like I'm being. poisoned either Harold is poisoning my. food or this house is poisoned otherwise. there's no reason for me to feel this. weird which means Harold must be trying. to kill her right so she has to kill him. first before he kills her or at least. that's what Sarah thought sometimes. sometimes she wouldn't have this thought. Sarah starts feeling very confused at. how much her state would just change and.

go through the motions every day and it. doesn't feel like depression she's had. depression clearly right she tried to. self- exit she's been in the hospital. for that but this is different she. starts Googling rapid fire why am I. different than anybody else why do I see. things like this why am I always. different at night than when I am in the. morning Sarah wouldn't know until later. that she is diagnosed with did at this. point of living with Harold she just. knew that she had random gaps throughout. her day or she remembered doing things. but very vaguely sometimes she could see.

herself doing things like she's watching. from a bird's eye view it's registering. in her brain that that is me doing it. but it doesn't feel like it that is how. her psychologist explains her altars now. her altars are she has four that we know. of that her psychologist knows of and. this is her psychologist explaining. Vanessa is very depressed anxious and. described as very weak has a lot of dark. thoughts about wanting to to self- exit. very very suicidal she is described to.

have the energy of a skinny miniature. Greyhound nervous anxious breakable. she's immature maybe 17 years old she's. the more compassionate altar but it does. appear that the compassion comes out of. fear more than anything she's the one. that is fronting most of the time this. is Sarah's State most of the time wow. Alyssa is the protector Alyssa came. about to protect Vanessa. Alyssa drinks a lot she never panics. she's very strong very witty people.

really like her she's confident but not. reliable she is boiling with rage she. has so much anger but she doesn't want. to let that anger go because she deep. down believes that's where her strength. comes from is this anger she mainly. fronts when the body is numb so that. might be why Sarah was Googling why am I. different at night it seems that Alyssa. fronts more at night because she's. drinking. she's getting more of that rage is. coming in MH she seems to have taken the.

protector role and put it upon herself. she feels like she has to be this way. she told the psychologist that she. doesn't want to be the angry one she. doesn't want to be the aggressive one or. constantly Vigilant about protecting. them but she feels like she needs to. because if not her then who the others. are just going to let themselves get. abused non-stop Alyssa would later say I. didn't want this I didn't want this. poultry life we had to be all I would. ever have and then when the world was. going to be ended and that would all be. there is side note it does appear that. she genuinely does think that the world.

is coming to an end and the idea that. this is their life before the world ends. is so painful and sad and depressing for. her and that's still that's an idea. that's forced upon them from the abuse. and heral the end of the world yeah I. mean I don't know if it was forced but. it does seem like she never had those. conversations with anybody in her life. until she moved in with Harold she did. not seem to care about the end of the. world until then Alyssa also has very. very strong feelings about men she said. that she would never kill a dog horse or.

a woman but men are a disease on this. Earth they think with their bodies so. they are not human they are animals. Alyssa hated everything about men and. felt Harold was worse than a pig more. offensive than a pig and again I I'm not. trying to defend Alyssa I don't think. that Alyssa is sitting here just like. waking up hating men it's clearly her. trauma and this is her protection it's. stated that she needs to hate men. because it makes her feel in control of. not letting more men into her life. because if you hate something you're not.

going to try to let it into your life. the other altars consist that we know of. of Mila and no name however as Sarah's. doctor she was not allowed to talk to. them much we have very limited. information about them we just know that. Mila is a bit tiny bit more confident. than Vanessa but she's very feminine and. quite young I'm not sure if she's. considered a little which is a type of. altar I don't know if it's type but. categorization of Altar and typically it.

embodies a childhood version of the. person very young her role is. interestingly though young but almost. kind of like a mother figure to. Vanessa younger more feminine but that. is how much Vanessa is weak in their. system that everyone needs to protect. Vanessa Mila is the most like Sarah. before her reoccurring trauma she's very. nice and content with the world not too. angry she likes people she thinks all.

people are pretty good and she's very. feminine Dr Hutchinson described Mila as. being very polite now no name is the. trauma carrier the memories of the essay. from the creepy old neighbor only come. about when no name is fronting no name. yes literally no name no name this is. the only altar in the system that. carries memories before Middle School. the other altars will tell Dr H I don't. remember anything before Middle School. wow no name is described by the others.

as just a body doesn't really have. inside emotion just kind of. functions which is very enlightening. considering no name is the trauma. carrier and Sarah Sarah is dead she died. at 16 years old when she was essayed by. the 20-year-old so it seems that Sarah. was likely part of the system I don't. even think they knew it was a system at. the time I think I don't know if they. could categorically say that but when. she was burned by the cigarettes they.

said that is when Sarah died Sarah's. doctor would later State Vanessa was. very afraid anytime I talked to Vanessa. she was always crying now Alyssa never. cried Milo was extremely softspoken and. like to quote Bible verses which Alyssa. was very angry about Alyssa said Mila. has always been reading parts of the. Bible like you should cut off the part. of you that offends you and she thinks. that she can just cut me out like how. does she think that she's going to cut. me out Alyssa is very protective she's. the protector of the system now I will.

say this is the part of did that I think. the jury and a lot of people couldn't. understand about this case right and. please correct me if I'm wrong but did. your alars it's very hard to control. who's fronting it's typically a. psychological response to triggers and. triggers could be something big or. something so unnoticeable to other. people that are not part of the system. and anytime Sarah mlin talks about the. crime that she commits she's very cold.

very blunt almost to the point of. sounding like Cassandra. Borge yeah yeah yeah people believe that. that is Alyssa fronting and she presents. herself when she needs to be in a. situation where she needs to protect the. system and she's very a little bit more. emotionless right and it doesn't deliver. well at all no it does not Sarah's. doctor would later explain Sarah system. has a bunch of walls and sometimes those. walls are permeable like Alyssa and. Vanessa can talk back and forth but some.

of them are like concrete bricks and. this part never talks to this part and. when I work with clients or when I have. worked with Sarah is that when I talked. to the waldof altars they had no idea. what the other altars have said and if I. asked them about hey they said this they. would have no recollection of that I. didn't hear you talking to them and I. didn't know that would be their. response the way Sarah describes what is. going on in her brain to her doctor is I. feel like I'm a puppet with no master. there was only one rule the entire. system was forced to follow the rule was.

don't let anyone know nobody was allowed. to know that Sarah had a system which. means nobody knows there is what is. described as inner conflict taking place. Vanessa and Alysa have a conflict at. hand Vanessa has decided the only way to. escape this life and this abuse is to. either kill Herold or to self- exit. vanessa wants to self exit soon Alyssa. realizes that is what Vanessa is. planning and she's not going to let that. happen this is how Sarah's doctor.

explains it Alyssa was angry she would. later tell her doctor that had Vanessa. been smarter none of this would have. happened Alyssa told the psychologist. Vanessa's weak she would lay there like. a dead dog and she let him touch us and. talk her into that stupid butt surgery. Sarah's doctor believes Alyssa was. forced to protect them or let Vanessa. self exit because she could not handle. the abuse from Harold around this time. time a cooworker from Cece's Pizza had. come over to SAR and Harold's house and. he's friends with Harold I believe he's.

also young too so just giving you an. idea some people say he was a mentor to. the youth other people say he's hanging. out with a lot of young people and it's. weird yeah no like yeah there's no P. anything to signal that he actually. cares about youth future or anything. like this is not his interest or motive. or reason at all and I would just say. that if I knew someone who was 50 years. old and genuinely cared about helping. the youth and they see a young.

17-year-old girl I think the smartest. best decision most of these men would. make these good men in my opinion would. be to tell a woman of age or look for a. shelter cuz I think it's just not a. comfortable setup to have a 17-year-old. girl living with a 50-year-old man that. is not her relative or dad because even. even relatives and dads abuse their. daughters yeah it's proven I mean just. like from the get-go the why the way he. brought her in it was Zero ounce of. actually wanting to help this yes.

because there are lots of witnesses who. do state they saw Sarah do drugs in. front of Harold and if Harold wanted to. get her clean which is the whole point. that he wanted her to move in it doesn't. make sense right now he knows that the. two of them are living together he's. also heard that they've been sexually. involved this guy that works at CC's. pizzas but he's just over to hang out he. walks over to the dining room and. there's this box sitting on the table. it's a c cardboard box is closed and. every now and then the box would start. shaking the box would start moving.

shuffling he's like what is going on in. that box Sarah walks over opens up the. box inside there's a little fluffy. rabbit oh what are you guys going to. clean it and cook it he watches Sarah. bring the box over to the kitchen sink. he can see her taking the rabbit out. placing it into the deep sink but he's. behind her at this point so he can't. really see what she's doing to the. rabbit but he hears high pitched Yelps. coming from the rabbit and Sarah's body. is like an. autopilot just nothing behind the eyes. she kills the rabbit proceeds to.

disembowel it skin it alive and him this. is all so confusing why is she doing. this can't she buy rabbit meat somewhere. else if she wants to eat rabbit not only. that you know how hunters will hunt down. wild rabbits and that's you know every. person finds it questionable to a degree. whatever degree this rabbit was not that. this rabbit was a cute little fluffy. white one that you would have as a pet. in fact Sarah bought this rabbit from a. pet store to slaughter and eat how.

strange she did this with both a rabbit. and a Geral from the pet store later. Sarah would State at the time she. believed it was a normal survival skill. practice she was practicing for the end. of the world it's not like she was just. torturing animals she was eating them. for food what's the difference between. that and hunting she said it made her. feel really really in control at first. the rabbit was almost like a test she. tried to justify it oh I have to kill. and eat the rabbit to test my survival. skill skills but it started scratching. this itch inside of her I will say. there's a very strong correlation.

between her mental state and her killing. animals she states that one day after a. really stressful day at work she walks. into the pet store trying to buy a toy. for her dog she's got a labrador named. Oliver but she's passing the guinea pig. cages and she remembered someone talking. about how in South America they eat. guinea pigs so she stops in front of the. cages watching them sleep in their. little Barn hay barns she just has this. urge I want to kill it and I want to eat. it she would go on YouTube and watch. videos on how to kill skin and Slaughter.

rabbits the video in particular she. watched over 14 times was of a man using. scissors to skin a rabbit and ultimately. package it for human consumption oddly. after watching this video she then. watches a Tupac video within 2 to 3. minutes so I don't know those who knew. Sarah said none of this makes sense. Sarah has always been an animal girl she. grew up with a rescue horse named Black. Beauty who was so badly neglected Ed and. abused by his previous owners to the. point that Sarah could not even ride him.

which is kind of the purpose that she. got a horse to begin with and she would. take these writing lessons and she did. not care she babied that horse until his. very last breath and when he was gone. everyone in Sarah's life remembered her. just being absolutely devastated she had. this yellow lab growing up aptly named. Shadow because it was literally Sarah's. Shadow technically Shadow was supposed. to be the family dog but ended up just. following Sarah around everywhere when. shadow passed away she was a wreck and. she always told her family I don't even. want a house when I grow up I just want.

to travel around and help animals. because there's animals everywhere that. need help but now she's skinning pet. rabbits and eating them she's also. punching walls and breaking glass she. would later say somewhere down the line. her sadness turned into anger disgust. and pure hatred and she's not scared. anymore she just feels rage to this part. she does not tell anyone about but Sarah. said at this point she starts having. these crazy visual hallucinations of. killing herself her parents and Harold. she's hearing all these voices in her. head and every time she sees people. walking around they're walking around.

faceless and bloody every single person. she runs into walking past saying hello. to at work she would picture them dead. what they would look like and then her. Visions would come back years ago when. Sarah was essayed and burned with a. cigarette for a while afterwards she. started having these Visions where she. would find unknown men and slash their. necks with a knife or Cho them up with. an axe and those Visions were back but. this time that unknown man was now. Harold sasco January 11th 2014 Sarah. logs onto her computer and asks Google.

why do I feel so differently from. everyone else she then texts her sister. I'm starting to realize I don't want the. life everyone expects of me I don't want. the American dream the house or the car. I don't want to be tied down to a job or. debt I want real freedom and I know how. to get it but it means giving up a lot. it's like do I want what my friends and. family think is right or do I take a. risk of being happy and not trapped. anymore I feel like a caged animal right. now it's making me crazy and on edge. then a text comes in to Sarah's phone.

not a response from Ashley but a text. from Harold it reads hey good morning. thank you for last night it was good we. never got to talk about Sunday I. apologize for trying to sleep with you. tonight before we get going can we talk. please and thank you wait um um I. apologize for trying to sleep with you. like trying to essay her yes is what. Sarah says now people who believe that. Harold is is innocent he's innocent in. the eyes of the law of course he's a. victim in the eyes of the law people.

that believe that he did not essay her. believe that maybe he she's of age he. was drunk he tried but then. stopped because she said. no so the text message is in is. interpreted in two vastly different ways. now initially the plan was to attack. Harold in his sleep but she starts. worrying what if he wakes up there's no. way she can over EMP power him there's. got to be a better way then ding she. gets another message Harold wants her to. put some beers in the fridge for tonight.

when he gets home beers in the fridge. according to Sarah he would always essay. her when he's drunk there's no more time. left either she does it now or she's. going to get ESS is what she says right. now have you heard of Ambien it's a. prescription sleep medication and it is. very strong it's considered a sedative. hypnotic medication that should really. only be used in the short term because. serious side effects can lead to. sleepwalking sleep driving memory loss. hallucination severe allergic reactions. and sometimes even death Harold had.

ambient in his bathroom Sarah knows this. she sneaks into his room before he gets. home and goes into the bathroom pulls. out a bottle of ambient and she starts. grinding up a handful of pills using one. of those glass figurines on top of the. dresser she puts the powder into a piece. of paper folds It Up Like Cocaine I. guess hides it in the kitchen under a. box of green tea on top of the microwave. then she just Waits waits for ad him to. get home he starts drinking one beer she. waits until he's what 5 six beers in. because she would assume that the.

crushed up ambient has a very specific. taste probably bitter she doesn't want. him to taste it and feel suspicious or. stop drinking the beer so the six beer. he's like can you get me another one she. dumps it in to the beer can and watches. him gulp it down and eventually he gets. up from the couch to walk over to his. speaker system to fix it halfway there. collapses Falls onto the ground face. down onto the floor Sarah's home she. walks to her car grabs a stack of zip. ties brings them back in and then walks.

into her room to grab a hunting knife. she stands over his limp body for a. second then she starts tying his legs. together three around his ankles locking. them together and as she's about to zip. tie his wrist he makes some sort of. moaning sound some people say this is so. important moaning could be that he's. unconscious but also could trigger yeah. yeah yeah it could be a trauma Sarah. later tells her doctor that something in. that moaning sound all of this up until. this point was Alyssa but when Harold.

moans Vanessa steps back into control. screams no grabs a pair of scissors and. cuts the ties off of Harold's ankles to. release him to let him go but Alyssa. does not want this Alyssa would later. tell the doctor I was not going to let. her do that she gains control and re. ties his hands and his ankles takes the. knife before Vanessa can do anything. about it she reaches her hand down to. feel for an artery she needs to find the. vulnerable spot on the neck and when she. finds what she's looking for she takes. both of her hands and plunges the knife.

straight into his throat pulling from. one side to another like truly slicing. she practically saws his head off she. plunges the knife so deep into his neck. the knife blade hits the carpet she just. starts pulling through his neck muscles. like sideways out so instead of pulling. up to bring the knife out she pulls. sideways to go through his neck through. his neck muscles arteries veins his pipe. even his esophagus she had to use both. hands to get it out and she's standing. there now with blood dripping down her.

arms and the original plan that she had. was to dismember Harold she had an axe. in her trunk but I don't know she said. when she's done it felt like being in a. cage and having the door swing open she. said in that moment it felt like she was. standing in the Sun for the first time. she didn't need to do anything more so. she grabs a towel drenched in his blood. and writes f r e e d o m.

Freedom then she goes to wash off the. blood from her hands and the first thing. she does which is very questionable is. she grabs her Samsung tablet brings it. into the bathroom where she proceeds to. put on some music and start showering. when she's done she gets out dries her. hair straightens her hair and then. gathers up all the things she wants to. take with her jewelry guns money. everything she's got to bring it all. truly everything she even prints a file. off of Harold's computer of a tattoo. idea that she had saved a rib cage.

tattoo with the quote beware the pool at. the bottom of our hearts in its black. icy depths dwell strange and twisted. creatures it's best not to. disturb wow so again a lot of people say. everything even the quote that she. resonates a lot with is reminiscent of. what people with did that might not know. they have did might feel now I'm not. saying people without did can't resonate. but knowing that it feels kind of like I. feel like there's something or someone. else inside of me is the feeling she's.

taking the clothes out of her closet. taking a picture of her and Ashley out. of the picture frame then she loads up. Harold's car and she brings her dog. Oliver and she just starts skipping town. oh she does leave one thing though she. leaves her phone on the kitchen counter. because she knew that she could be. traced through it she first goes to. Texas almost all the way down to Mexico. then she decides you know what let's do. Florida now side note she's selling. jewelry along the way to get cash she's. living out of the car never checking. into hotels and at one point she gives.

away her beloved Oliver to a local. vet yeah she does get that rib cage. tattoo starts making it to Florida and. she will be arrested 11 Days Later by. the National Park Service in the. Everglades National Park in Florida the. police had been called to do a welfare. check on Sarah broke into Harold's house. found him dead and at one point they. thought that Sarah had been kidnapped. but they were like M nothing's adding up. all of our stuff is gone it seems like. she's the perpetrator and finally 11. days later Sarah is arrested they were.

still questioning if Sarah had been. truly just a perpetrator or a victim or. kidnapped and then a perpet they didn't. know in the car though they found knives. an axe two handguns nine boxes of. ammunition a taser multiple knives a. stack of murder mystery books a machete. a large supply of bottled water military. food rations a fishing pole and other. camping and survival supplies as well as. over $2,000 in cash and weed Sarah was. immediately placed into custody and is. brought into an interrogation room now. we only have 3 minutes of that footage. that is publicly released we did file an.

foia and I received no footage in that. just transcripts and court documents but. Sarah is sitting cross-legged at the. table across two interrogators she. almost has the energy of Cassandra Borge. that we recently talked about not in the. sense that she's oh she's so heartless. but she's so blunt there's no emotion. they ask her Sarah how long have you had. planed to kill Hal. um it was sort of just in like the last. week where um well not just in the last.

week it's like um last 5 days I really. thought about it you said the last 5. days before you actually did kill him. okay tell me what you about the thinking. and the planning that you did I just you. know like I said I just wanted something. different and I was stupid um I just. thought about it and how I would do it. and that's how I did it so did would you. say that you started making preparations. about 5 days before well I had. everything that I needed so I didn't. have to like go out and I just sort of. did it almost the exact same way I. killed the rabbit when I ate it I mean I. did I I cut his throat too so you.

decided to do it like you did the rabbit. and the way you did it push push the. knife through and push out yeah as. opposed to slicing right is there a. reason that you chose that method is. that a reason is that I mean I don't. know that's I just thought that he would. bleed out faster that way and I wouldn't. have to be as strong to really um like. slice his neck and she motions a slicing. motion one of the ter Gators actually. gets up and puts his head down on the. table facing Sarah and forces her to. motion how she stabbed Harold in the.

neck it's visually a lot I will say then. uh I went and I took a shower okay and. uh got ready oh I uh brought my um. tablet in the bathroom too okay for. music okay while you were showering and. where was that tablet before you brought. it into the shower in my room okay uh. backing up there a little bit we talked. about what you said when you wrote. freedom on the wall when did the did. that happen immediately after. immediately after cutting his throat yes. I guess okay so after you cut the throat.

how did how did you uh how did you do. that uh well I had a towel and that's. kind of what I used to put the the blood. up there on the wall and then I rode in. it with with my finger Sarah would later. say that she was asked why why did you. write freedom on the wall and she said I. guess because that's what it felt like. Sarah said she also didn't like her job. she owed money she hated her life she. felt trapped and she was curious she. said she was curious about killing.

someone and in the interrogation she. does later compare herself to Jeffrey. dmer which is not really something that. you would ever want to do in a police. interrogation but later her psychologist. asks her about it cuz she's like I read. the transcripts why did you tell the. police that you felt like Jeffrey dmer. and she explained Jeffrey dmer responded. to betrayal and don't like the. necrophilia and I didn't have any. interest in cannibalism but I felt his. understanding of betrayal was similar to. me. now there are three groups of people one. group of people that believe that Harold. is purely a victim and what he did or.

didn't do does not matter and Sarah is. the ultimate perpetrator then you have. another group of people that believe. Sarah shouldn't have done what she did. but she essentially killed from a. buildup of trauma and almost as a. mechanism of self-defense that she is a. victim and a perpetrator and that haral. is also a victim and a perpetrator then. you have another group of people that. just hates the both of them they think. that both of them are just evil for. whatever reason those who believe Harold. was completely innocent of any. wrongdoing and brutally and viciously. murdered by someone he was trying to. help said some that knew Harold said.

this right Harold's ex-girlfriend said. he told her that he was just trying to. get Sarah away from drugs and away from. friends who were in gangs he was always. involved with his employees he wanted to. have a mentoring program for the Youth. he has a good heart a good soul and he. cared about helping a lot of people. Harold's brother said from what I know. of Harold there's no question that his. purpose with Sarah was to be a father. figure to her my honest opinion was the. defense was just grasping at straws and. making up stories it's also argued that.

Sarah was diagnosed with did after she. was arrested and after she allegedly. confessed to killing Harold out of. curiosity the group that fully supports. just Harold and believes Sarah should be. locked up for the rest of her life they. State her interrogation is a confession. police even noticed scars on her arm and. they asked her about it the cigarette. Burns and she said she fell off a horse. so the people who don't believe Sarah. they said see she's just making up lies. with her psychologist to get out of this. after the fact but she straight up told. the police it was from a fall off of a.

horse in that moment when the police are. asking her and questioning her about. murder wouldn't she try to build. sympathy then unless she didn't have. time to think about a. lie I don't know about that okay I will. say I don't know if this argument in. particular is a good argument because if. truly infected is a scar from an essay. and she is that embarrassed of it and. that ashamed of it to the point that she. took a knife to alter it to look more. normal I think this would be her default. lie especially to two men sitting in. front of her yeah exactly without.

thinking like yeah she's not going to. open open up right now and tell you. exactly how this happened in front of. again two men so a lot of female victims. have a harder time opening up to male. interrogators or male psychologists for. that very reason but there are. statements from people around Sarah that. said she made a lot of comments about. zerial Killers she once told her sister. Ashley that she did think about killing. someone and the thought had crossed her. mind but other people argue that's. nothing new she literally admits to. hallucinating and killing Faceless Men. she also told interrogators that she.

wanted to prolong the murder as long as. possible for maximum enjoyment basically. but I don't know how much of that is. accurate because she looked for the. artery to kill him instantly almost yeah. there was no signs of torture Harold had. no defensive wounds so he wasn't. fighting back there was no prolonged. aggression Sarah also does seem to have. an inclination towards violence a. cooworker at Bed Bath and Beyond. reported that Sarah would talk about how. she and her friends would take drugs and. have a fight club in the basement she.

thought it was fascinating and it made. her realized that watching people get. beaten up to a pulp was interesting and. maybe she wanted to watch people die she. also went on tangents on how good she. was of a hunter and how she liked to. kill and clean animals there's also a. lot of evidence that Sarah thoroughly. planned the murder I don't think that's. ever really debated by both sides but. without a shadow of doubt it was very. thoroughly planned Sarah even told her. doctor later that for a couple of days. before the actual Murder She had already. reached a conclusion that she was going. to kill Harold and she stopped seeing.

red the doctor describes Sarah's state. in that point as an incredible sense of. calm when the anxiety drops off because. she's got a plan she was looking up. things buold tranquilizer Wilderness. areas rope bondage techniques how to get. a passport in Lawrence Kansas and even. vulnerable neck spots another argument. made against Sarah is why a knife when. Sarah was arrested she was found with. two guns on her shooting someone is. remote easy and quick she would have. done that while he was asleep or she. could have she wouldn't have even had to. touch him or while she's crushing up.

ambian to slip in his beer she could. have just crushed up the entire bottle. and tried to kill him through a fatal. dose of the drugs but no that wouldn't. accomplish what Sarah wanted they argued. Sarah wanted blood and Vengeance she. wanted to slice into him touch Harold. while she killed him which is why she. chose the knife because it's intimate. it's bloody it's violent it's painful. additionally Sarah continues to do a lot. of strange things after the murder she. takes bed sheets off of Harold's bed and. takes them with her right I don't know. if it was Harold's bed or her bed but. she would later tell the investigators.

why took the bed sheets because they. were. expensive they argue that this is not a. snap decision she called into work. stating that her dad died so nobody. would be alarmed when she doesn't show. up to work she crushed up ambient she. was clever enough to put them in his. beer like fifth beer so that he wouldn't. taste it she found zip ties she didn't. have any difficulty locating her. survival knife in her bedroom she went. through a rehearsal several months. earlier with with a rabbit and a guinea. pig wait wait wait so hold up Sarah used. to work for him yes how come she stopped.

working there and went to Bed Bath and. Beyond I think he didn't want to pay her. so there was a whole thing in the court. transcripts about how he was paying her. less than everybody else cuz he was like. you owe me money. wow so I mean it was heavily planned. Harold's older brother would say that. Harold might have problems and issues he. believed but he still believed Sarah. should spend the rest of her life in. prison Harold's daughter who is just a. few years younger than Sarah said Sarah.

had taken away far more than just a. father she wrote you took away. Irreplaceable happiness a normal life. and years of my life that were now. filled with anger and incredible sadness. now of course one of the biggest debates. in this case is whether or not Sarah. actually does have did I will say I. think it's very difficult to fake having. did on a clinical scale sure maybe you. could do it on social media in an. attempt to go viral but I think the did. Community would immediately clock you. regardless that you're faking it but to. fake it during a murder trial where. there are psychologists from both sides.

where some of them it might even be. beneficial for them to even to a degree. perhaps prove that you don't have did I. mean it's very difficult to fake did is. really hard to fake but there are claims. and allegations that Sarah is Faking It. the prosecutor stated that psychological. evaluations at Larned State Hospital a. neutral Hospital between the two found. that Sarah did not meet the criteria for. did. now another argument against that though. is did is heavily. misdiagnosed not saying that everybody.

gets did every like you get a diagnosis. you get the opposite people actually do. not get did diagnosis really easily they. get uh major depression disorder they. get bipolar disorder they get. schizophrenia yeah yeah so it I mean so. how does the diagnose affect the. sentencing because that was what the. defense put their whole argument on. during the trial see they plad not. guilty by reason of insanity okay but. did does not make you insane but they.

need to prove that she has did and then. they need to prove that she was in a. state of psychosis so they need to do. one and two got it that was their game. plan they don't technically need to. prove that she has did as long as they. can prove that she was in a state of. psychosis but still yeah now Sarah did. mention Vanessa in her police interview. stating that Vanessa was a name that. Harold had come up with because they. were going to run away together Sarah. was going to be Vanessa and Harold would. be Scott so people are like see Vanessa. is in her altar Vanessa is an alias a.

doctor on the prosecutor's side so. technically against Sarah went on to the. stand and he said I think certainly it's. a possibility that she has did I don't. know that I could confirm it but I. respect Dr Hutchinson and she spent a. great number of hours with Sarah I. certainly think at this juncture Sarah. believes she has the disorder he. basically argued even if she had did it. was not to the level where she was. having psychosis. but then you have a group of people. including a lot of advocates for. domestic violence in essay they do not.

condone what she did they said murder is. bad nobody canones that however they. don't think that she's this crazed evil. killer that just wants to kill Harold. for curiosity some also argue that. Sarah's bizarre sudden interest in. harming animals is linked to her essay. as a child it it's her taking control. the rage and wanting to feel that sense. of control go hand in hand her. psychologist believes that the. foundation for her subsequent obsession. for dead animals knives and everything. is then those in support of Sarah argue. that everything she did even after the.

fact seems like someone that's not. really planning to get away with it. writing freedom on the wall yeah that. that's not someone who's let me make it. look like a home invasion gone wrong. yeah yeah she also makes one last call. to her sister and Grandma to say goodbye. before leaving her phone but she doesn't. actually say goodbye she just makes it. appear that she's doing all right she. just wanted to hear their voices it. seems she gives her dog away to a vet. knowing that she cannot take care of her. dog anymore and uh gets a tattoo with a. very dark quote it does seem like. someone who is trying to start over yeah.

yeah yeah and you know we cover so many. of these cases you you kind of always. see how how people react after math. right some people they flee they they go. off with their new boyfriend they live. in the house with their dead. grandparents and spend the money yeah. the the in the motive you can always. kind of pinpoint but for her it truly. feel like she fell free and she would. because people later ask why Florida cuz. remember she was talking about Utah and. Montana are the furthest away from.

nuclear power plants or where she felt. was safe she said she just wanted to see. the ocean she didn't really have a plan. she said she just wanted to see the. ocean now again that's not to justify or. excuse what she did and obviously we. could all just be naive but that's the. argument that freedom on the wall that. should hold a lot more weight that's. that's a huge thing we've never seen. that before but the most important. evidence for the group is most. conversations about Herold allegedly. grooming Sarah were not allowed in the. trial. why the judge is very questionable.

decision questioned by a lot of people. but the judge stated any character flaws. that Harold might have had will not be. discussed in front of the jury the judge. stated that Harold was not on trial. Sarah was so his visiting of websites. that may or may not contain videos of. children teens and beastiality was. happened yes but they were not allowed. in court they were not admissible as. evidence which side note this is less of.

an interesting observation but as I was. going through like the 1500 pages of. court documents and transcripts there. were multiple times where the prosecutor. and the judge so these are people who do. not like Sarah they want to put Sarah in. jail for a very long time they would. call Harold the. defendant and then they would go I mean. sorry the victim and then they would. call Sarah the victim and then say I. mean sorry the defendant Sarah M so even. them for a second they keep getting. confused it seems I mean it could just. be a slip of the tongue maybe they say.

those words too often I don't think that. insinuates guilt or innocence I just. thought it was interesting now this is. where I think the evidence against. Harold starts ramping up acquaintances. of Herold allegedly reported that he. would tell them that it was quote. amazing to have an. 18-year-old this is again someone he. brought into his house at. 17 as a 50s something year old to help. her in the eyes of the law maybe it's. not illegal if she was 18 and it was. consensual but still it's morally and.

ethically incredibly questionable. especially if she moved in at 17 yeah. yeah yeah that changes the whole motive. and reason now another witness and this. is absolutely personal opinion rather. than a testament to anyone's character. but just to give you a full picture a. former manager that had worked with. Harold said that when they found out. Harold had been murdered he went home to. his wife and said I wonder which one of. those girls' dads went over and killed. him. because he believed Harold was. constantly having not inappropriate. relations but something weird was going.

on insinuating that Harold was known to. either try to groom or groom girls that. would infuriate their dads obviously. that's not what happened but it is. interesting that that's the first thing. he would think of a different. ex-girlfriend of Harold said he was a. very sick person the jury should have. heard how messed up he was and that this. was the environment Sarah was part of. I'm an adult woman with five children. high functioning and he weighed me down. just just listening to him is exhausting. but probably the most worrisome. testimony that was not allowed in court. was the day after Harold's body was.

found a single mom of two twin girls. underage 16 she goes to the police and. the mom does let the detectives know. that Harold the man they just found dead. she believes he was in the process of. grooming her twin girls that even just a. few days before he was killed she had. been talking to the girl school guidance. counselor about filing a no contact. order against him wow the detectives are. like okay what happened she stated that. they were all family friends but he just. kept referring to the twins as his. daughters and kept saying call me dad. and it just made her so uncomfortable.

like you're not their dad it's crossing. a line you're crossing a boundary and I. don't like it but he wouldn't listen he. would also tell the twins if they ever. wanted to run away from their mom they. were more than welcome to come live with. him he would take care of them feed them. give them jobs so that they would have. spending money the Only Rule he had and. he told the twins allegedly was quote my. drugs are our drugs and your drugs are. our drugs he was supplying them with. drugs and recently gave them an envelope. full of weed and he kept telling the. twins that he was going to buy them a. car for their 16th birthday so much so.

that she ended up having to buy her. girls a car for their 16th birthday when. she wasn't planning on it because she. didn't want Harold to do it and it just. it was putting her in a tricky situation. he would also buy them other expensive. gifts as long as they promis not to tell. their mom about it and just a few days. before Harold's death the twins went out. with him to Best Buy to buy $400. speakers for their new car that they. weren't allowed to tell their mom about. it until after he was dead yeah I mean. what kind of father figure a good father. figure does this now a data dump was.

processed on two of Harold's phones and. that's when they found out that he was. visiting websites that had inappropriate. if not fully explicit illegal videos. featuring children teens and beastiality. he had actually downloaded more than 300. videos from that website I don't know if. those videos he downloaded in particular. were illegal or not and on more than 20. occasions he visited websites that. featured men fondling or having intimate. relations with women who appeared to be. sleeping none of that was allowed in. court none of that also Harold would go. around telling everybody that Sarah was.

his stepdaughter and people thought that. was weird if he was someone that was. such a good figurehead in the community. that was a mentor to the youth why. couldn't he just tell people the truth. of yeah she's not doing well I've taken. her in she doesn't have a support system. why lie that it's your stepdaughter that. makes it seem like you're hiding. something like you you know it's weird. you know people are going to have. questions right those in support of. Sarah also say okay fine if Sarah truly. is sick and twisted in the head and she. just wants to kill out of curiosity. because she likes herial killers and.

she's sick and nasty why kill Harold if. he's so good to her why wouldn't she. just have killed someone else and then. come home to Harold to have free drugs. and a free place to stay why would she. bite the hand that feeds her and then. why write freedom on the wall it's. obviously a very emotional crime so she. didn't she did this emotionally yeah I. will say that most people do believe. that Sarah has did it doesn't seem like. the symptoms spawned out of no where. when Sarah was 14 years old one of. Sarah's closest friends she came forward. later she said she stopped hanging out. with Sarah she told her mom that she was.

scared and she doesn't know how to. describe it but it just felt like there. was a different person inside of Sarah's. body was like very unsettling she said. she said Sarah would just like randomly. start talking about violent things and. it didn't seem like Sarah was saying it. at least the Sarah she knew so they. stopped hanging out at 14 that Sarah. that she saw at 14 the new Sarah the one. that was talking about violent things. that was the one she saw in the. interrogation video later when she saw. it Sarah's doctor would tell the jury.

during the trial certainly nothing in. this report should be taken as excusing. the conduct of Sarah Mr sasco did not. deserve the death he received the. purpose of this report has been to lay. out the puzzle pieces that can identify. the controlling factors to the severe. mental illness that she suffers from. Sarah psychologist believes Alyssa's. actions of killing Harold are. reminiscent of a mother that would want. to kill a person who essayed her. daughter AKA Vanessa it's very impulsive. crazy but usually mothers have emotional. maturity and the ability to stop.

themselves but Alyssa did not have that. Sarah psychologist also noted that. Alyssa and Vanessa had very different. ways of describing the crime Vanessa. said it's like a fog and I remember. intense moments after the crime when I. sat down and looked at him I don't know. when I actually did it I kind of. remember myself from above it stated. like she was watching herself do it from. above like a CCTV camera during the. actual crime she felt nothing no. emotions Alyssa on the other hand was. very blunt she told the doctor for once. in my pathetic life I found strength and.

I took control now pain feels tolerable. Because deep inside this weak little. girl is a powerful woman who lets no one. use her now with all of this Sarah pled. not guilty by reason of insanity her. psychologist diagnosed her with high. levels of depression anxiety and alcohol. substance abuse her psychological. profile reads as follows likely to be. generally pessimistic and dysphoric has. a potential to act out her anger in. impulsive ways self-destructive and. spending sex and substance abuse rapid. mood swings she often feels her behavior.

is out of her control is likely to. self-mutilate and act out self- exit. plans limited social skills has. difficulty interpreting the nuances of. social relationships in relationships. she likely takes a very passive. submissive role and very uncomfortable. around people sensitivity in these. interactions leads to her holding. grudges against others ironically. difficulties in relationships are major. source of stress for her she would also. be diagnosed with disassociative. identity disorder major depression. recurrent moderate PTSD alcohol and.

marijuana dependence in remission. subsequent to incarceration her clinical. symptoms include weekly episodes of. Amnesia daily episodes of losing time. unable to remember her home address deep. personalization not recognizing self in. Mirror feeling like an observer of self. on a daily basis rather than feeling. oneself feeling detached from body. feeling more than one person at a time. perception that someone else is talking. for themselves speech is not under. personal control episodes of feeling. like someone else has taken over.

different smoking and drinking habits. for different parts of self. derealization feeling like self or. things are not real that friends and. relatives seem unknown not knowing what. is real and unreal identity confusion an. internal struggle about who they are. that is usually triggered by stress. identity alteration feeling or being. told that they were acting in different. ways that they do not recall Sarah was. found guilty she was sentenced to a hard. 50 sentence meaning she would have to. serve at least 50 years before the.

chance of perole so she could. technically be there for the rest of her. life she will be 70 years old by then. Harold's brother stated I feel sorry for. the family Harold's daughter will hurt. the most she lost her dad through the. years it's going to get worse and worse. and then it's going to fade away but I. honestly think that it'll do nobody good. if Sarah gets released before those 50. years I want 50 years he also stated. that he believed his brother Harold was. just being overly generous and thought. he could fix Sarah Sarah and her team. have appealed the sentence and took a.

deal where she would get her parole. reduced cut in half so meaning instead. of doing 50 years mandatory she would. just have to do 25 but here's the thing. that's the chance of parole that doesn't. mean she's going to get parole and. likely she's not because she committed a. pretty violent first-degree murder so. it's not like her sentence was cut in. half but now she's lost her chance to. appeal ever again again the jury foran. who was on Sarah's trial said that it. was frustrating that they weren't given. options they either had to say she's.

insane or she's guilty they didn't have. a self-defense angle to consider H the. jury Foreman said if her attorney. presented a self-defense angle I could. see a non-guilty verdict play out I. couldn't tell you it would have changed. the verdict then but in today's age I'm. sure it would really yeah so the jury I. think they all sympathized with Sarah. but it's the fact that they could not. say that she didn't know what she was. doing because she was not in a mental. state she was mentally going through a.

lot but she knew she was doing it was. first degree it was premeditated it was. planned wow the jury Foreman also stated. that they had no idea that them finding. her guilty would result in a hard 50. sentence he said we wanted relaxed. sentencing instead of straight. incarceration Behind Bars we wanted some. sort of mental treatment for her wow. in retrospect he hopes Sarah could have. been given a new trial so a lot of. Advocates have come together in support.

of Sarah and they believe what she did. is bad and nobody deserves murder but. they're trying to get clemency for her. which is like a pardon so you write to. the state Governor she can't get an. appeal she can't get a new trial but. they can write to the governor and say. hey can you commute her sentence can you. show Mercy can you release her can you. pardon her can you do something which. none of this is even in the snapped. episode but Megan stook the executive. director for the Willow Domestic. Violence Center wrote long letters to. the state Governor asking that I mean. how saw a vulnerable teen already.

suffering so many forms of abuse and. violence as a young woman Hal recognized. her vulnerability and prayed on it he. moved her into his home telling her he'd. be a father and take care of her he paid. for plastic surgeries in order to make. her into his perfect girl and bragged to. his friends about how amazing it was to. be with a young woman Hal created list. of debts Sarah could never repay and. threatened her with homelessness and. financial Strife if she left he. controlled her movements her medications. her mind a former business associate of. Herold wrote to the state Governor.

shortly after Mr sas's death I realized. the media was portraying him as a kindly. businessman who opened his home to a. troubled teenager I called Sarah's. attorney to provide a different. perspective on Mr sas's character. stating that he is not a good person in. their opinion and they stated that they. do not condone what Sarah did but my. heart goes out to her each and every day. a former inmate from prison who shared a. cell with Sarah wrote a letter to the. state Governor and it reads I want. people to know that Sarah has the purest. heart of anyone I've ever known a lot of. women in prison they regret their crime.

but they also brag about it Sarah was. never like that she was very sorry for. what she did she was not proud at all. she didn't share much or go into much. depth about the crime but she did say. that a man made her do things that. sexually she did not want to do that he. abused her physically mentally and. sexually and she wanted out but she. didn't think there was a way out I just. wish people would stop and think about. what he must have done for her her for. her to have that much hatred that much. anger that much fear in her heart she. was a young woman barely he was much. older I remember laying in my bunk at.

night listening to her cry in her sleep. sobbing she'd be thrashing and screaming. no no no stop stop and she'd be moaning. not like in the movies when someone is. dying more like a petrified shuttering. terrified animal she'd be kicking and. jerking and at first I tried to wake her. up but she wouldn't wake up that went on. night after night and I finally gave up. because there was nothing I could do I. will say Sarah is the one person in my. whole prison experience who had the most.

positive impact on my life and for that. I will forever be indebted to her this. inmate is now free Sharon Sullivan a. professor and expert on human. trafficking said Sarah's brain wasn't. fully developed she was trapped she. didn't know there were options she said. I can't even imagine having to deal with. that at 18 years old with so little. experience of the world and this is. someone who's supposed to love her. called her his daughter how creepy is. that Dave Ranny a retired reporter wrote. Mr sas's actions contributed to his. death he was well aware of Miss mlin.

sexual traumas her battles with. depression her unexplained mysterious. mood changes and her homicidal thoughts. yet he continued to provide her with. ready access to alcohol and drugs he. continued to rape her it is reasonable. to ask whether Miss mlin would have. killed Mr sasco if he had not been. raping her two three four times a week. for almost a year I believe the answer. is no in Miss mclin's case the state was. allowed to portray her as a crazy killer. her attorney was not allowed to portray. Mr sasco as a sexual predator that is an. injustice Sarah's mom is rebuilding her.

relationship with Sarah in prison the. saddest part of all of this is Sarah had. told her mom the first feeling that she. had when she went to prison was at least. it kind of feels safe she would write. letters to God trying to process her. shame Sarah is very remorseful for her. crime and she works with a program. called pooches and PS that helps train. dogs for people with physical or visual. impairments basically she helps train. service dogs she said I will say that. these dogs healed me in a way that I. didn't even know I needed healing.

they're just amazing Sarah said she. requested non-stop to get her butt. implants removed she said when I first. got incarcerated I asked them to remove. them and that in itself was traumatic. because I had to go to the doctor the. prison doctor and just how it was. handled I felt like everyone was just. curious I remember one nurse waiting and. called another nurse into the room and. they both touched me and they did all of. that just to tell me no they're not. going to remove it and then later. recently I just asked again and I don't.

know it stated in prison that Alyssa and. the other altars did have some internal. arguments at first that were very. intense they were mad at Alyssa I just. really hope nobody compares this to the. movie Split because I think even. internally Sarah felt like look what. Alyssa got us into and it took a lot of. therapy and a lot of mental help to. realize that even though in that moment. it wasn't self-defense a lot of. psychologists see what Sarah did as.

self-defense because do you guys know. what battered woman syndrome is is when. a husband typically beats a wife so much. the wife will typically kill them in. their sleep and the self-defense is. there but in the eyes of the law they're. like well he was asleep he wasn't trying. to kill you so you can't kill him. they're saying this is a version of that. they're saying that this was. self-defense. now I think the system has come to. realize that but remember the journalist. I was talking about earlier which one. the retired journalist that was.

advocating for Sarah's clemency okay. they would have an interview with her. her first prison interview and he just. wants to ask the public how is it that. she can be tried and convicted without a. jury being fully aware of what's going. on in that house how is that not an. injustice the question isn't whether she. killed him it's why and if you don't. know the answer to that just ask anyone. who counsels women who finds themselves. caught up in abusive relationships they. can tell you Sarah said if she could sit. down with the governor right now she.

would say I'm not that young girl who. found herself in a situation of. hopelessness and that she had no idea. how to deal. with um that I have dedicated every day. since my incarceration to better. myself not only for myself but for my. family and the. community and that I will continue to. make sure that everything that happen.

wasn't just for nothing and I want to. continue to give back and help other. young girls who just feel so hopeless. like as for mental healthwise it is. stated that Sarah is doing great the. altar of Sarah has returned there have. been conversations that she's been fully. integrated which I know some people. don't like that term because again you. need a singular identity but mental. health professionals believe Sarah is. she has other altars still Alyssa and.

Vanessa are still there but she said. it's more like I don't feel alone. anymore less of there's a lot of. turmoil mental health professionals. believe Sarah is very capable of living. and maintaining a crime-free and. productive life but her potential. release date as of right now is February. 1st. 2039 but that's if she makes parole. which she could very well be. denied wow when I watched the snapped. episode I definitely went into the court.

documents feeling very strongly one way. when I read some of the Court docu the. transcripts until I got to the part. where the judge is declining all of. these things to be ad admitted into. evidence I mean it's it feels like the. story is much deeper than I ever thought. it would be what are your thoughts do. you think that she's paid her time do. you think she needs more time do you. think that she shouldn't have paid this. time in this way I mean I don't think. she ever wanted to be free I think that.

they just wanted her to get mental. treatment versus prison what are your. thoughts or do you think that this is. just a big Injustice to Herald after the. fact what are your thoughts please let. me know in the comments and please stay. safe and I'll see you in the next one. bye.