Girl Filmed "Consent Video" After "Doing The Whole Hockey Team" Leads To SA Case Acquitted

Bada bing, bada boom. >> A lot of people who have dated hockey. players have been very active on social. media platforms as of late because of. the 2018 ice hockey hockey Canada essay. scandal where a victim M has accused. five pro ice hockey players of gang. essay at a Hockey Canada gala in a hotel. room. She says that after these players. went to this massive gala hosted by the. organization Hockey Canada, she met them.

at a bar, went back to one of their. hotel rooms, consensually had intimate. relations with one player, and then all. of a sudden there's like 10 to 16. players inside of this cramped hotel. room, and they are gang essaying her. This recently went to trial in 2025. And. if you've listened to part one, which. was the previous episode uploaded on. audio platforms right before this, you. know that the verdict was not in favor. of the victim. But what's interesting is. a lot of people have come out to say. even if the verdict is not in her favor,

we think it's true because here are all. of our experiences dating someone that. plays ice hockey, that dated an ice. hockey prolevel player. And that's not. to say all ice hockey players or all. athletes or all men by any means, but. they are just saying that there is a. very strange environment that is created. by these high testosterone, high. achieving, high entitled pro-level. athletes that do get treated with a. certain celebrity status in the towns. that they grow up in because they are.

the star players of their community. They say it's very interesting. And. along with those stories, a lot of other. women have been coming forward with. their own stories of being essayed by. pro aletes, saying that no one really. believes them. And in fact, people are. saying, "Well, there's no way that you. didn't want it because they're a pro. alete. Everybody wants them." Like, who. would say no at the chance of sleeping. with this prolevel athlete because. they're rich, they're loaded, they're. attractive, they're very competent in. their abilities, they have legions of. fans who would foam at the mouth to have.

an hour with them alone. Of course, you. would say yes. It doesn't even make any. sense. These are the arguments out. there. But perhaps the biggest story. that has been intertwined with this case. was a woman comes forward and states. that years ago she was dating someone. that was part of a team called the Steel. [music] Heads. This was her boyfriend. He had invited her to this movie night. She went thinking that it was just going. to be them, too. But when she gets. there, all of his teammates are there. and she thought, "Okay, it's a little.

uncomfortable, but whatever. It's not a. big deal." In the middle of the movie, they decide that they're going to sneak. away into the bathroom to have. consensual intimate relations. [music]. She did not know that he had left the. bathroom door open, a creek, and all of. the other players, whether they heard, whether they knew beforehand, they start. watching and peeping through the crack. But it starts escalating because they. start coming in and one by one, according to her allegations, they start. essaying her as well. She says that her. mind left her body very similar to what.

the victim M says in the Hockey Canada. case. She felt like she just had to. power through and just get through this. so that she could leave as safely and as. quickly as possible. She does not file. an immediate police report because she. states that some of the people that. allegedly abused her and essayed her, they were [music] underage cuz this is a. junior league. So she felt uncomfortable. saying that she engaged at its core in. this type of action, >> not that she was engaging, but with.

someone who is underage, when she is an. adult, she's saying that this was forced. upon her. >> Mhm. Now, what's interesting is Michael. McCloud, the one that M goes [music] to. the hotel room with, the one that she. initially has consensual relations with, the one that sends that message asking. all of his other teammates if they want. to engage in a threesome quick 209 Mikey. giving them the hotel room that they are. inside of. He was on that very team and. he was 16 years old when this incident. allegedly [music] takes place. But he.

has not been named. But everyone [music]. thinks is there some sort of connection. here. [music]. The trial itself feels like a fraternity.

reunion. That's how a lot of people. describe it. You have a bunch of ice. hockey players that are five accused and. then you've got a bunch of other ice. hockey players that were either in the. room that were either in the hotel or at. the bar that are now being called to the. stand to testify. And I feel like nobody. has any idea what happened that night. Everybody's got a different variation of. the story. They can't even get the core. facts in line. Everyone has a different. variation of events and even the. prosecutors, the defense attorneys. alike, they don't like a lot of the same.

witnesses. So, with that, I'm just going. to run you through everyone's different. timelines and there's a lot of names. None of them are particularly important, but we're going to start with Taylor. Radish. Taylor gets back to the hotel at. 1:00 in the morning. He belines it. straight to his room. I don't know if. it's 207 or 211, but he's right next. door to 209. That's all we know. He's. right next door. He goes home at 1:00. a.m. from the bar and he's facetiming. his girlfriend. There's a knock on the. door. He opens it up and it's Michael. and another player named Boris. I guess.

they invite him to come into Michael's. room next door. So, he goes to room 209. and now it's Michael Taylor Radish and. Boris. And Taylor says, "I just remember. seeing a woman inside the bed. She had. the covers pulled up. I mean, she had it. pulled up all the way to the point where. I couldn't see if she was unclothed or. not. I didn't even talk to her." Wait, he said that Michael knock on his door. >> Yes. >> So he say Michael left his room, but the. Michael story that we heard so far, Michael didn't leave the room. Correct.

>> Mhm. >> Okay, I see. >> So he's like, he came and got me. And. then I see this girl. I'm not talking to. this girl. I don't know this girl. I. have a girlfriend. She's not talking to. me. She's just under the covers up to. her neck. But she seemed completely. normal. She wasn't like, "Oh my gosh, what are you guys doing in here?" It. just seemed normal. He's talking to. Michael and Boris and he says that he. and Boris decide to leave after maybe. like a full 2 minutes inside the room. They didn't see any other players in. there. They just leave. That's really it. from that night, which is convenient.

But Taylor's phone will tell you that he. gets at least two very weird messages. that night. One at 2:10 a.m. into the. team group chat that says, "Who wants to. be in a three-way quick? 209 Mikey.". Then one [music] to his private text. message thread with just Michael. He's. the one that gets the message, "Come to. my room if you want a gummer.". >> At what time? >> Around 2, like 2:12. >> H. So, he's saying that Mike came and. got him, but the messages suggest that, hey, come to my room to get a gummer at.

2:00. >> And he's saying that he went pretty. early on, but the messages are from way. later. He gets to the hotel at 1:00. These messages are coming in at 2. I. mean, the timeline, I guess it could. theoretically make sense. It it's just a. very weird situation. Taylor doesn't. remember when he even saw these text. messages. He just knows that he was in. the room facetiming his girlfriend. When. Michael and Boris come to get him, he. goes to Michael's room, stays all but 2. minutes, sees nothing weird, goes back, and then he does see these weird.

messages, but he doesn't recall seeing. when he saw these messages. Ultimately, he's kind of useless. He just says, "I. don't really have any recollection of. what I saw in that room." They try to. ask him. I mean, was she wearing. clothes? Did you say anything to her? Did you acknowledge her presence? Did. she say anything to you? Like, hi. Taylor responds, "Sitting here today. I. don't remember." Even when he's asked. about what he felt when he realized. there was an investigation into this. matter, he states, "I don't remember how. I felt." To be exact.

>> It's starting to feel like there is some. sort of code of silence. I'm not saying. that these aren't true. I mean, yeah, this could be very well the accurate set. of facts of what happened that night, but it's just a very weird evasive way. of answering questions. Then Boris, the. guy that allegedly came to get Taylor. with Michael, testifies. He says that he. was wasted because it was a championship. celebration, but it was also his. birthday, so it was like double the. opportunity to just get blackout drunk. Anyway, he ends up leaving the bar,

going back to the hotel with Ken Foot. Cal Foot is one of the five accused. He's the one that does the splits. They. get back at 2:23 a.m. So, now we can. assume that Taylor was on the phone with. his girlfriend for about an hour and 30. minutes at the very least before someone. knocks on his door. So, this is. confirmed on CCTV. He gets to the hotel. at 2:23 a.m. Boris says that is as he's. walking back to his own room, he runs. into Michael, who's outside the room, like outside of his own room, Michael's. own room, and he gets invited in. Boris.

walks in. He sees a girl in the bed with. the covers pulled all the way up. And. Michael is just asking Boris, "Do you. want a gummer?" Boris says he just. laughed, but he doesn't respond because. he also has a girlfriend at the time. But he didn't see M reacting in any sort. of strange way. She just seemed normal, which we went over. It's because she. doesn't know what a gummer is. So why. would she have a big reaction? For all. she knows, it could have meant like, "Do. you want a piece of gum? Do you want a. protein bar?". >> Mhm. Then Michael leaves for 2 seconds. to presumably go next door and grab. Taylor to bring him over. Boris stays,

which is not what Taylor testifies. But. nevertheless, Boris is alone with this. girl and she's being very flirty and. playful with him. The crown, the. prosecutors are asking, "What do you. mean playful and flirty?" Like, describe. that. What's that demeanor like? And he. said, "Well, I had bought my own pizza. and I brought the pizza in the room and. I was eating pizza and she was like, "Can I have a pizza?" and he said no. >> And he's like, "Oh, she's flirting with. me.". >> He cannot recall any other conversation. He cannot recall anything else other.

than the fact that he recalls it being. playful and flirty, but all he knows is. that she asked for a slice of pizza, which is the epitome of romance. And. like, you might as well be offering a. threesome at that point. Like, it's just. so strange. He's just like, "Yeah, no, it was flirty.". So now Michael and Taylor get back and. they talk for a few minutes before. Taylor and Boris leave and they both. claim that they stay in their rooms for. the entirety of the night. At one point. Taylor does complain that his roommate. is Brett Howen, who is one of Michael's.

close buddies. And Brett just keeps. going in and out of the room, in and out. of 209, back to their room, back to 209, back to their room, and he was just. screaming at him like, "Can you stop. slamming the door?" And that's it. M, however, states that she was fully. exposed on the bed when the first two. players walked in, which now we can put. together are Taylor and Boris. Like, they walk in and she's saying that she's. fully unclothed on the bed. She's not. covered with the blanket. She said that. she was feeling very shocked to the. point where she retreats to the. bathroom. [music]. But the guys are arguing, "No, she was.

under the covers. We didn't even know if. she was unclothed. We don't even recall. her going to the restroom while we were. in there." Then another ice hockey. player by the name of Tyler Steamberen, he responds and he's the one that did. the winning shot at the championship. when it was down to the 2 minutes. So, he's getting drunk. He's being. celebrated. I'm sure he's bragging to. every single person at Jack's bar. But. he testifies that someone on the team. had gotten a text message about there. being food in Michael's room, which is. the only reason that he went. However, no one can really place this text. message because the only text message.

they can find is, "Hey, do you want a. threesome? Quick 209 Mikey." I don't. know if you're just calling people food. now, >> but he shows up with Dylan Dubet, the. team captain, one of the five accused, and Jake Bean. Jake Bean is not accused, but he's the one that was very active in. the group chat that was like, "No, just. tell them the truth." Which is we. ordered food and then she came and then. like that's not the truth. So, he walks. in and Tyler says, "Once we walked in, there were already players there. Carter. Hart was already there. This is the. goalender. Alex Foreman, this is the one.

that's accused of our word in the. bathroom. and Michael Mloud. So they're. saying all of them were in there already. as well as Sam Steel, Maxim Comtos, Drake Batheson. They're they're not. important, okay? But Tyler sits down at. the desk and then he hears someone say, quote, "Guys, there's a naked girl in. the bathroom." He says, "I was kind of. shocked." And then shortly after she. just came out. She seemed completely. normal. He just watches as she goes over. to the bed sheet on the floor and then. he's like, "She just started pleasuring. herself.".

>> That is crazy. Tyler testifies that he. doesn't remember anyone instructing her. to do that. She just started doing it. He says he wasn't really paying any. attention to what anyone was saying. He. says, "I was just trying to have a. conversation with Jake Bean," which is. [laughter] it's believable, but. unbelievable at the same time. You're. talking about 19 to 20year-old ice. hockey players. I mean, I just can't. imagine if there is a girl unclothed in. this tiny cramped hotel room. Also, I. think the fact that you're saying, "I'm.

just trying to have a conversation with. my friend," is already alarming. Like, I. can't imagine a world in which you would. just be like, "Oh, >> naked girl." Anyway, so what I was. saying about like you would be like, "I. got to go." Or something is happening. Like, you would at least ask questions, you know, like, "Hello, is anyone seeing. what I'm seeing? Cuz this is so crazy. right now. What's happening?". >> Tyler testifies that he watches M give. oral sex to Carter Hart for about 30. seconds. This timeline of how long that. she is allegedly forced legally, I guess.

not, but allegedly forced to perform. oral sex on Carter Hart has been heavily. debated. Some players are saying it was. like 30 seconds. Carter Hart is like it. was like 15 to 30 seconds max a minute. Another player is like I saw it for like. 5 minutes. No one can agree. Tyler. testifies. She said, "Can one of you. guys come over and me?" I feel like she. asked for guys to come over to have sex. with her. I feel like when she asked for. guys to come over to have with her, I. feel like everyone was just kind of in. shock that she had just said that. So,

he's saying, "I'm sitting at the desk. A. naked girl comes out of the bathroom and. she's just self-pleasuring. I don't ask. questions. I'm talking to my buddy Jake. Bean." And then all of a sudden, she's. like performing oral on another teammate. of mine. Again, I'm still talking to. Jake Bean. That happens for like 30. seconds and then she's like, "Can one of. you guys come over and me?" And. that's when we were all just kind of in. shock that she was saying that. Tyler. testifies that his main purpose was just. to find the time to leave. He had a. girlfriend who is his now wife because. it's been 7 years. So, he just wanted to.

get out of there. He says that he was in. there for about 15 minutes before he. leaves with Jake Bean, which happened to. be his roommate. He says that it took 15. minutes because, quote, "I just didn't. want to step over a naked girl." So he's. saying like she's on all fours on the. bed sheet self-pleasuring and so like I. didn't want to like step over her cuz. it's that cramped of a hotel room and. there's already a bunch of hockey. players in there. So I was just waiting. for the moment that the pathway opened. up. Quote, "I was trying to avoid the. situation and when there was a clear. path to leave, that's when we decided to.

leave." Brett Hen is the next to. testify. He is Taylor Radish's roommate. He's also the one that M remembers him. from the bar. like he was hanging out. with Michael a lot and they have like a. thing, right? Not like a thing, not him. and Michael, but they're like friends. They're very close. Brett Hen has major. credibility issues, memory issues. He. was drunk that night. It was 7 years. ago, but he also suffered a very serious. concussion in 2022. That's when he was. playing with the Vegas Golden Knights.

He slammed head first into the boards. He had to be stretchered off the ice. It. was pretty bad. He doesn't recall really. anything. >> So, who's calling them as winners? That's the very frustrating thing. >> Mhm. >> The prosecutors and the prosecutors are. calling them as witnesses because. whatever they had said in their police. statements initially were probably. advantageous to the crown. But now that. they're up on the stand, they don't. remember. They don't remember anything. They don't recall. And like at one. point, the prosecutors even more or less.

alleged that Bred Hen is straight up. lying. >> I see. >> And a lot of people are saying, well, what would be the purpose of them lying? These are players that are not even on. the same team as the rest of the. accused. They used to play on the same. team 7 years ago, but now they all have. their own careers. They're scattered. throughout the NHL. None of them are. even really close buddies anymore. A lot. of them, the last time that they even. spoke to the accused was like back in. 2018 when they were still on the same. team. >> So, it doesn't make sense that they. would be willingly perjuring themselves.

on the stand in an effort to cover for. the five accused. It wouldn't make any. sense. However, the flip side of that is. people are saying it's kind of like I. mean any association you have it. Any. other major sports leagues you probably. have it. The police, the blue wall of. silence. It It's just loyalty. It's not. even about the five accused. It's about. how are your other teammates going to. feel? How are your coaches going to. feel? How's the NHL going to feel? >> Mhm. >> Brett says that he was shocked in the. hotel room because he walks in and he. sees M there. He had seen her at the.

bar. He recognizes her. He's surprised. But he can't remember for the life of. him if she was clothed or not, which is. weird because it's one thing to not. remember what type of clothing she's. wearing, but it's another thing to. remember. If someone is unclothed, it's. shocking. >> Yeah. >> Like you're walking into someone. unclothed and you don't know this. person. You just saw them at a bar. It's. it's a memory that you're probably going. to have for the next 7 years. He. testifies, "At some point, I did see her. unclothed, but I don't know if she was. unclothed when I walked in." He says, "At some points, she was clothed." M.

testifies otherwise. She says that at. times she would try to put on her. clothes, but they would guide her away, but she wasn't like fully clothed. He says that she was just chirping, quote, chirping and trying to egg them. on to have intimate relations with her. He says everyone was shocked at how. aggressive she was being. Brett Hen, there is a text message that he sends. later to a friend of his that is also on. the team, but this is not in the group. chat. He was talking about how it was a. wild night and he says, "Oh yeah, after.

he hit her, like it looked like a pretty. hard hit. I was just got out of there, >> though. That's all he said after he hit. her.". >> It's very vague, but it seems like he is. referencing Dylan Dubet smacking M. really hard and that's how she. testified. He smacked my bottom really. hard and it was very painful and I told. him no. >> So why do you think he left after uh. what's his name? Smacked her. the. prosecutors are arguing because you know. that it's getting bad, >> right? >> Like whatever had been happening up.

until that point, you probably already. have a feeling it's not good. And then. you see that and you're like, okay, maybe I don't want anything to do with. this. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's what what it means, right? >> Yes. And the text message is very It's. not like, bro, she was asking for us to. smack her. She was asking for us to do. her. It was so insane. Like, this girl. is insane. She said it was a fan. It. It's not like that. It's like when he. started smacking her like that, I left. >> Yeah. >> Why would you leave? >> Yep. >> Now in the stand, he says, "I don't even. remember sending that text message." He.

goes on to testify that he could feel. that M was getting embarrassed and. upset, but not because of the lack of. consent, but because a lot of the guys. weren't even paying attention to her. He. says it was just kind of awkward seeing. this stuff, like her asking and begging. us to have intimate relations with her. And then, yeah, it was just. uncomfortable. some crazy stuff to say. like just. >> wow. >> and it's really difficult because I'm. sure there are certain instances and.

very rare occurrences where this happens. but a lot of netizens and a lot of. female netizens are saying like are we. watching some like really bizarre porn. video because no one really behaves like. that outside of the context of maybe. explicit video creations. >> Mhm. Like no one is like I can't even. think of my girlfriends the drunkest. they've ever been behave in such a. certain way. >> It doesn't make any sense. And there's. no evidence to back it up. If there was. some evidence, maybe we could say, you.

know what, maybe that is exactly what. happened. And we don't know, >> but there's no evidence. >> Yeah. >> There's no text messages from that time. between the players saying, "Oh my gosh, she was so crazy. Wasn't that crazy? I've never had a girl asking to bang the. whole team." There's no evidence of her. begging. There's there's two videos of. her consenting. How come they don't take. a video of her begging to have the whole. team do stuff with her? >> Yeah, exactly. I think text messages are. way better proofs from that time. >> Yes. >> Than whatever they're saying today on. the stand and all their text messages is.

very incriminating. >> Even the come quick for the three bay. like anyone want a threesome quick. It's. giving quick because there's a girl in. here. We can try to convince her versus. there's a girl in my room. You're never. going to believe it. boys like she wants. to do with the whole team. >> Mhm. >> It's a very weird message. What do you. mean quick? Like why are you giving the. room number? Why are you telling people. to hurry up? And if a girl is genuinely. begging for the teammates to come so. that they can have intimate relations. collectively, would you not include that.

in the text? Because it's like, guys, this is the most insane thing that's. happening. >> Yep. Yep. At some point, right? >> Yeah. But there's nothing. >> Mhm. >> Right. >> So they I'm so sorry. So they pull text. message from every single one of these. guys. >> Yeah. >> Wow. Okay. Well, a lot of these text. messages were given up by their. attorneys to Hockey Canada. >> I see. Ah, >> yes. >> H okay. >> It's not like all their phones had a. forensic extraction. >> Fascinating.

>> Yeah. So, it's not. >> So, they're selected. >> Yeah, >> seems like it. >> That means these are the best text. messages they can find. >> Yeah. >> Well, they're saying like these are the. only messages relating to the incident. So, >> Right. But. >> yeah, okay. >> Brett had a girlfriend at the time who. is now his wife as well. And the. prosecutors just think this whole thing. is ridiculous. They basically call their. own witness a liar. It's the Crown. submission that Mr. Houdin's memory loss. is a faint memory loss, not a sincere.

one. His memory loss in my submission is. directly related to details that will be. particularly damning for the defendants. who are his former teammates and. friends. Defense attorneys, they argue. differently. They say, "First of all, that is such a reach. It's a stretch to. believe, quote, a man would perjure. himself, as far as I can tell. A group. of men he hasn't even really talked to. in the past 7 years. Like, why would he. lie on the stand to protect these guys. who aren't even his friends?" The. defense also starts taking shots at the. guy. One defense attorney states, "The.

witness is plainly unsophisticated. He. didn't even come to court dressed for. court. He's the one that was in a. hoodie. He is inarticulate, a poor. communicator, careless with words. If. anything, we may all say at the end of. the day, this witness is generally. useless, but he's certainly not helpful. to the defense. >> You know, these Okay, so all these extra. guys, it is also in their best interest. to lie because if they saw something and. they were witnessing it in at the time, that put them at right.

>> I don't think the crown would press. charges, but they would be socially. >> not viable to be pro aletes. I mean, well, I don't know these days, but. >> there would be a scandal. >> Exactly. That's why they're saying, "Oh, no. She's totally asking for it.". >> Yeah, >> that makes sense for them to lie, but. then their details don't add up because. they're lying. >> And I do just want to put a quick. disclaimer out there. I don't even think. that most netizens disagree with the. final verdict. I think people wish it. was different. I don't think anyone is.

saying we need to appeal. Even the. crown, the prosecutors have come out. saying that we're not going to appeal. In fact, the prosecutors came out to. say, "We told M before this, it's going. to be tough to get a conviction. It's. not impossible, but it's been 7 years, and it's not even M's fault. The police. dropped the ball in 2018. They closed. the case in 2019. They didn't do a. thorough investigation. A lot of the. potential evidence that could have been. there is no longer there. There's just. not enough statements from any of the. accused. Like, there's really not much.

that people can go off of. Everybody was. drunk at the time. It's been so many. years that have passed to get a. conviction is going to be really. difficult. M said, "I just want to do it. because I want to stand up for myself. Like even if I don't get a conviction, but the problem that people have is. regardless of the end result of the. verdict, this trial was the most. infuriating thing ever. All the defense. attorneys are asking M, why are you such. a skank?" Like that's basically what. they're asking her for 7 days of. cross-examination. It feels like the.

most backward way of handling a trial. The judge herself is victim shaming. throughout her 91page verdict. All the. defense attorneys are kind of asinine. Like it's just a very shitty situation. And I think people are more upset about. that. I think if the judge had come out. in her verdict and stated this is not. the law. The law is hard. It's hard to. get someone for essay in the letter of. the law. Should we change the law? That's a conversation for another time. However, we as humans, we as the society.

could probably do a lot better at. informing people what consent is because. the thing is it's supposed to be. enthusiastic consent. Consent is not. implied. Consent is like very. enthusiastic. If you ever have to wonder. if someone is consenting, you should. probably confirm. Like you should. probably ask for consent. And so like. that would have been a moment for her to. say they're not guilty because this is. the way the law works. However, these. are things that we could probably work. on. like it could have been a powerful. moment, but instead all she said was, "I.

found the witness unreliable.". >> So, you're just saying that this is a. very, very shitty situation, very poor. investigation, very poor evidence, very. poor witness. There's just no way in the. court of law to make a case. >> Yeah, I will say there is. I don't know. if there's reasonable doubt. I think. that it almost becomes an opinion. >> There's no way to say factually there's. no reasonable doubt. I think it's an. opinion. Like if you have to have. someone film consent videos, I don't.

think there's reasonable doubt. But. that's my opinion. So I don't think. opinions really work in the court of. law. But by the letter of the law, I. don't think a lot of legal experts who. are actually on the side of the victim, they say it would have been very. difficult to secure a conviction. It. actually would have been feasible with a. jury, >> but not with a judge because the judge. has to follow the law and the judge has. to give reasons why. The jury, they. don't have to. As long as it's. unanimous, they don't really have to. say, "Hey, this is why we found you. guilty or not guilty." But the judge, she has to back it up.

>> Wow. >> So, they're saying, "Yes, with the. letter of the law, it would have been. very difficult to secure a conviction to. change the letter of the law." That's a. different conversation. But they're just. saying the way it was handled on all. fronts, even before the verdict came out. with these defense attorneys, everyone, it was just bad. The way that the. defense attorneys were going in on her. was the most intense thing ever. They're. going to accuse her of all sorts of rape. myths. They're going to say that she. liked the attention. They're going to. say that she was asking for it. They're. going to say that drunk M likes to have.

fun. Drunk M likes to do things that. sober M would never do. But one thing. that Brett Howen, the reason that his. testimony was important for a lot of. people was he does state that near the. end as he's leaving, he states that he. heard M quote, weeping. That's the word. he uses. >> Wow. >> Michael also has a timeline that he gave. to the police. He doesn't testify. Only. one of the five testifies. Michael had. told the police back in 2018. He says. after he and M had these intimate. relations, some of the guys come into.

the room. So, we think that he's talking. about Taylor and Boris. He leaves her. with them so he can go downstairs to get. the Uber Eats that he ordered, the food. he ordered. And he when he comes back. up, he sees M giving oral intimate. relations to Carter Hart. He says she. seemed completely fine with it. And. other guys were just kind of hanging out. on the bed. It was kind of a little. different, but we ate the food. We hung. out. We had chicken wings. And after. that, it didn't last too long. The. didn't last too long. And then. we just kind of hung out for a little.

bit. We were really drunk, but we. weren't blackout drunk by any means. It's like we all had our heads on. straight for the most part. Michael says. it was just weird that she kept begging. everyone to have intimate relations with. her, calling them for not doing. it. He says that they were all just. looking at each other like, "This is so. weird. No, you do it. No, I don't want. to do it in front of everyone. You do. it." Michael claims M started getting. upset. Nobody wanted to have intimate. relations with her. And he says I had to. like kind of calm her down and kind of. say, "Are you okay? Like I told her, "We're not going to have sex with you.

because no one wants to have sex in. front of nine other guys. It's not. because you're not hot." He keeps. insinuating that she felt like she was. not hot enough for them to want to have. intimate relations with her. >> Is this crazy to hear as a woman? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> What? >> Yeah. >> Wow. >> Yeah. And like just I think as a woman I. mean she was young 20, right? I've been. 20. I don't recall ever a time being in. a room full of guys that I've never met. before and for the first time, no matter.

how drunk I've been, I don't think there. would be a situation where even a shirt. comes off because I would just feel very. vulnerable. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. >> So, for her to just like be on all. fours, they keep describing like she's. on all fours, self-pleasuring on the. ground, just like begging us and we're. just like we don't want to. That's the. vibe that they're giving. He says, "Later, we're hanging out again and. she's feeling better." And she was then. now like offering to give everyone. So, I got one. Carter Hart got. one. Maybe Dylan Dubet got one. And then.

he says, "Yeah." And then afterwards, she had intimate relations with Alex. Foreman, my roommate, in the bathroom. And then after all the guys leave, they. have intimate relations once more. And. then she ends up leaving. >> She got on the bed naked and said, "Okay, who's going to have sex with me? Like guys are Like none of you. guys would want to have sex with me. >> Do you get the sense that guys are. coming because. they know there's a naked girl in the. room who's.

doing sexual favors for people? I mean like I don't know how guys kept. showing up. >> Alex Foreman also testifies. Well, he. doesn't testify, but he states in his. first police interview. He says that he. had walked into the room. This is his. room that he shares with Michael Mloud. and he sees a woman just sitting on the. bed and there's like a bunch of takeout. boxes around her which is inaccurate. There's no takeout boxes around her. They were showing the judge the CCTV.

video of Michael Mloud picking up the. takeout. >> Mhm. >> It's hardly enough to have takeout boxes. all over her or takeout boxes filling. the It was a very limited amount of. food. Which also begs the question, why. are all the teammates coming to his room. for this so-called food party when. there's barely any food? >> Right? How many bags was it? Or how. many? >> It seems like one little takeout bag. >> I see. >> He says he walks in, there's food all. over the place, like takeout boxes, and. she's fully clothed at the time talking. to the other players. And then. eventually she's like begging everyone.

to have intimate relations. She's. performing oral sex on Carter Hart, Dylind Dubet, and Michael McCloud. And. then ultimately he was like, "You know. what? If no one's going to do it, I'll. do it." Like, I guess whatever. Why not? I don't have a girlfriend at the time. So he's like, "But I don't want to do it. in front of everyone." He claims that M. guides him to the bathroom where they. have intimate relations and then he. takes a shower and she walks back out. into the room. >> I volunteer, but I obviously didn't want. to do it in front of guys. I found that.

very awkward and and weird. So, um we. both walked into the washroom and that's. where we had uh intercourse. >> And what happens after that? After that, um, after giving a little text to to. Mikey, she was, uh, on all fours in the. on the floor of the hotel room saying. like, "Is anyone going to do anything to. me?" And that's at that point she was. playing with herself and saying like, "Is anyone going to bang me? Like, this.

is embarrassing that you have a naked. girl in front of you and a bunch of guys. in the room and no one's going to do. anything." And that's when pretty much. everyone was still um a little iffy of. doing anything in front of the guys cuz. we found it pretty awkward of the. situation. And uh at that point she started to get. like a little bit frustrated saying. like, "Well, I'm going to leave and put. my clothes on if no one's going to do. anything." And stuff like that. And uh. so she was getting pretty frustrated.

about um how no one was doing anything. And I think she kind of took it. personally as in like she's not hot. enough that um none of the guys were. doing anything when really it was just. the guys that had girlfriends and. obviously didn't want to do it in front. of each other. >> Okay. So, she's kind of getting a bit upset. there. >> Yeah. >> Um is it possible that she was upset. because. um.

she feel embarrassed about what was. going on? I think she was embarrassed. that no one did anything to her. Like I. think she was maybe embarrassed that she. thinks she wasn't hot enough and that no. one gave her the attention while she was. sitting there naked, but really it was. just because everyone had girlfriends. and no one found it like not awkward to. do that in front of people. So. >> So the way that these witnesses are. coming in, they're saying she never. seemed like she was non-consenting. She. didn't seem like she was having a bad. time other than Brett Henen sending that.

text message of like I left after. someone hit her on the bottom really. hard and then also the when I was. leaving she was weeping. Other than. those everyone is painting this picture. of like we were just shocked. She just. kept begging us to have intimate. relations so we complied with her. Dylan. Dubet his role in all of this is also. very interesting. He is accused of not. only receiving the oral sex but also for. smacking her on the butt. >> which is that say because she's not. consenting or allegedly right but Dylan.

had told the police previously. I mean. she was coming at us almost. I don't. want to say it like that but I feel like. she was like chirping at us for not. doing anything with her which I thought. was weird. I hadn't seen that before. Dylan says that after Carter Hart. received Oral Dylan's thinking why not? He says, quote, "I might as well." He. says, "He pulls his pants down and. quote, "She came up to me. She gave me. oral, I guess you could say, for. probably, I'd say like 10 seconds. maybe." Then I kind of knew it was a bad.

idea. Which What do you mean you kind of. knew it was a bad idea? What does that. mean? Right. >> And he says, "I didn't want to be a part. of it, so I just kind of stumbled back.". >> A part of what? >> Exactly. So he steps backwards. The oral. sex, according to him, stops at that. point. And Tyler testifies that he did. look up to see Dylan around that point. smack M on the butt. He says it wasn't. hard, but it didn't seem soft either, whatever that means. He says the overall.

mood was playful like foreplay, light. spanking or patting. Nothing abusive by. any means. Dylan Dubet also gives a statement to. the Hockey Canada investigation and he. says that he was very drunk. He does. recall some parts of it, like the. performance of the oral sex. It was very. brief. He wasn't into it. She just kept. begging more people to man up, if you. will, and do it with her. At one point, he does recall that he was holding a. golf club. >> And remember, Em had said that everyone.

was saying, "How many golf balls do you. think we can put inside or like if she. can take the whole club?" But all the. guys are like, "Nobody said anything. like that." Dylan Dubet is like, "I was. holding a golf club because they had a. golf tournament the very next day." So, a lot of the guys brought their golf. clubs and he said he was holding a golf. club just messing around. And she at one. point says, "Are you going to me or. play golf?" He didn't want to have. intimate relations with her. Quote, "I. was off-put. I didn't want to have sex. with her in front of people, so I. slapped her on the bum once or twice.

after she said that." He's arguing that. him smacking her on the butt was a. playful, flirtatious, like she's like, "Are you going to do me?" And he's like, "I'm not going to do you. Smack. Smack. M testifies that's not at all what. happened. She testified it was while she. was performing aura on the floor on. these people. Like she there was no. entertaining factor. Like it was not. funny. Like it was not a joke. It was. not flirtatious. It was not playful. Dylan Dubet states to the authorities. that he believed M wanted to be there.

more than any of the other guys wanted. to be there. She was allegedly saying. things like, "This is embarrassing that. you guys have a naked girl in front of. you and a bunch of guys in the room and. nobody's going to do anything. Like, what's happening?" They said that she. was getting a little frustrated, saying. like, "Well, then I'm going to leave. I'm going to put my clothes on if. nobody's going to do anything." Things. like that. A lot of the guys testified. that it it appeared that she was taking. it personally, as in she's not hot. enough, so none of the guys are doing. anything with her. And after he smacks. her, he says that he doesn't really have.

any other interactions with her. He does. see Alex Foreman go to the bathroom with. her, but he claims like a lot of the. other players, she was the one guiding. him in there. Alex Foreman's defense. attorney does question her on the stand. Um, and I think this is one of the. frustrating things when anybody else. doesn't really remember or recall the. exact sequence of events in the same. order from 2018 during the initial. investigation. Later in 2022, there's an. opened reopened investigation and then. now in 2025 on the stand. If they don't.

recall the exact sequence of events in. the same exact order across seven years, they're not really questioned. However, when M does, it seems like she's just. trying to be very honest. I will say. that she has a very passive tone in a. lot of the ways that she testifies. I. would say that it's not dissimilar to. myself. She would respond in ways like, I don't recall it happening like that, but I guess it could be possible. cuz. she's like, I mean, I guess if you're. telling me that could have happened, I.

guess, but I I don't remember it. happening like that, but also like I was. so drunk and I'm telling you that's why. I couldn't consent because I was so. drunk. And because M states that she. can't recall much of anything from that. bathroom with Alex Foreman from being. intoxicated, Alex defense attorneys are. like, "Well, if you don't remember, let. me tell you what happened." Alex's. attorney suggests during the cross that. inside the bathroom she was touching. Alex everywhere saying that she would. help him get excited, pulling his pants. down, saying that he doesn't have to. wear protection because she's on birth.

control and apologizing that she has. sunburns on her chest from sunbathing. nude. M is asked about all of that, to. which she responds on the stand that. yes, she was on birth control at the. time and she did sunbathe in her. backyard, but again, she doesn't recall. saying any of that. but quote, "I have. no memory of any conversation with him.". But because she doesn't recall and. because the defense attorney presents it. in such a way, a lot of people are led. to believe, okay, maybe this is true.

[laughter]. >> I don't know. What I will say is Alex. Foreman's attorneys are the ones that. I don't want to say are the reason, but. are directly related to why both the. jurors were dismissed. >> So, they seem very aggressive. They seem. like very very aggressive defense. attorneys. And then Carter Hart's. defense attorney, she actually. represents a lot of high-profile accused. of essay. She represented a musician. previously and the victim for that. musician, there was a guilty verdict.

there. She said Megan, this is the. attorney's name, is on the same level as. her abuser. She said, in fact, when she. has nightmares now about being essayed. in that hotel room by this musician, she. has more nightmares about the trial. >> Wow. >> And she says that defense attorney to. her is on the same level as the abuser. She doesn't write her abuser's name. She. doesn't speak the abuser's name out loud. because it brings so much trauma. She. can't say the defense attorney's name. She said it's one thing to do your job. And she's saying it's crazy because like.

I also don't want to bring down a female. attorney of all people, right? And I. think it's someone has to be a defense. attorney. [music] Everyone has the right. to a fair trial. She gets it. She gets. it. When she says this specific. attorney, it's like she was getting joy. from shaming her in any way possible. Like that was the vibe. Like just. straight up cruy laughing at her. >> The crown forced a distressing and. unnecessary trial to the detriment of. Mr. Hart, his codefendants, the.

complainant, and the Canadian public. >> And this is Carter Hart's defense. attorney. Carter Hart does testify. during the trial. He's the only player. He's the goalender. And he states, "You. know, I was pretty excited. I'm 19 years. old. There's a naked girl in the room. that was doing things willingly." I. mean, it was something that I had never. seen before. In fact, out of everyone in. the group chat, he's the one that. responded very quickly. I'm in to the. threesome message. >> H. So he gets to the hotel room and he. sees a girl naked on the bed sheet on.

the floor and she seemed to be enjoying. herself. He says that he took off his. pants and she was helping him. He claims. and he had engaged in oral for 30 60. seconds. He said that uh he wasn't able. to fully maintain the state down there. because he was feeling very. uncomfortable. I mean like all of his. teammates are there. They're watching. it. The whole situation was just weird. So, he stopped it by backing away. And. then that's when she starts complaining. like, "What's wrong with you guys?

There's like a naked girl in the room. with you guys." Carter ends up texting. another player at 3:27 a.m. His name is. Dante. He says, "Get to 209." So, he's. telling another player, "Come to this. room." And he's asked during the trial, "Why did you text another player who's. not in the room? Get to 209." He says, "Well, at that point, she's [music] like. begging for intimate relations." And. Carter knew that Dante didn't have a. girlfriend, so maybe he thought he was. interested. I'm just trying to help her fulfill her. wish. You know, basically, Carter says.

there's no way anything strange was. going in in that room. If he even got. the inkling that it was non-consensual. or something weird was happening, I. can't see why I would have stayed in. that room, is what he says. I would have. said, "Don't do that or stop." Or I. would have just left. You have to. remember a lot of ice hockey fans are. really upset with this case and it's not. just because this case lives in a. vacuum. I think especially a lot of. Canadian nizens. They're going online. and saying, "See, that's the problem. I.

don't believe a single one of these,". they use other terms. I don't believe a. single one of these, the accused, because if you've ever been to an ice. hockey game that is anywhere on the. junior league or like the pro level, you. know how these players are acting. Like. there's no way you can tell me that this. did not happen. >> Right. Right. Right. >> Like this is the culture of ice hockey. They do not respect women. They think. every girl is a quote unquote puck. bunny. >> It's basically like a groupy that's.

willing to do anything for an ice hockey. player. >> That makes sense. Yeah. >> So they're just saying like, "I don't. believe you." Like even if there's no. evidence, I don't believe you. >> I don't believe a single word that. you're saying. Like And also it's very. non-committal. If there was. non-consensual gang essay happening, I. would have said don't do that or stop. It's giving no, you wouldn't have. I. don't think you've ever said those. words. >> Right. Right. >> That's just my personal opinion. He's. asked about the group chat because the. crown is saying that group chat is. weird. You guys are trying to make up.

the story. You guys are trying to get on. the same page about the narrative before. you're questioned by anybody. He says, "No, everyone was just trying to get on. the same page about what they were going. to say about what happened in that room. Does that not mean that you're trying. to? But then he's like, "No, we were. just telling the truth. We were all just. saying everyone should tell the truth.". Basically, >> and the truth is they claim she wanted. it. She was asking for it. M's version. of events is that the players kept. egging each other on, saying things. like, "Someone have sex with this girl.". So, she's saying that she's.

[sighs]. she gets out of the bathroom, they put a. bed sheet down, they're telling her to. self-pleasure herself, and she is very. fearful. She's also very drunk. So. that's exactly what she does. She starts. doing what they tell her to do. She's. self-pleasuring and then she states. there's now just a bunch of private. parts in her face and there are commands. that she hears such as suck it, spit on. it. And so at that point she performs. aura on three different guys. And then. she hears them saying things like, "Someone do this girl." Like someone. have sex with this girl. And she's. testifying like it just felt like that.

was the next step of what I needed to do. in order to get out of this hotel room. safely. That's exactly why she goes into the. bathroom with Alex Foreman. She's like, "Okay, maybe once I do this, everything. will be over." And the defense attorneys. just use any sort of memory gap from M. to prove their point. During the. cross-examination, the defense attorneys. suggest to M that she was probably alone. with Michael for about 10 to 15 minutes. after they had intimate relations prior. to any of the other players coming into.

the room. Which means they're asking. her, "Why did you stay?" which is a. crazy thing to ask, but they're like, "Why didn't you leave? Why didn't you go. put your clothes on? Why did you stay? Unless you were perhaps waiting for the. other players to come into the room.". It's kind of a wild conclusion to make. A lot of people don't really jump out. the bed right after intimate relations. when they're super drunk and get an. Uber. Usually, they're trying to calm. down and relax a little bit before they. get an Uber. It's just very strange. M. disagrees with all of this and she's.

saying, "No, her recollection is clear. on that. First of all, she doesn't even. recall there being like a 10-15 minute. span that she was alone with Michael. after the intimate relations. She said. she's unclosed on the bed. Two guys walk. in. She feels uncomfortable. She goes to. the bathroom and more guys are walking. in. And then the defense attorneys. clarify with her, "Well, why did you go. to the bathroom where your clothes are. and not put your clothes back on? No one. told you to come out of the bathroom. naked and sit on the bed, right? No one. told you to keep your clothes off. No.

one forced you to undress. No one moved. her clothes out of the bathroom and hid. them. Pointing out like why didn't you. put your clothes on? Again, a very I. guess maybe it's a logical question to. ask, but it just feels like another rape. myth is what a lot of survivors are. saying. Like why are we asking all of. these accusatory questions for the. victim when there are so many different. nuances in each specific scenario that. these types of incidents can occur? You. wouldn't be able to comprehend it. M. testifies that after the two guys had.

walked into the room already. So, we're. assuming Taylor and Boris, she was. unclosed on the bed and she started. separating from her body. That's how she. describes it. She did a lot of things. that she doesn't even quite understand. because it felt like her mind was. floating to the top corner of the. ceiling like a CCTV camera view and. she's just watching these things play. out. She feels like she has no control, no choice. It feels like she's just. going through all of the motions that. she thinks that they want in order to. get out of there as quickly as possible.

It's not her doing what she wants to do. It's her doing what she thinks they want. her to do. She says, quote, "I didn't. know these men at all. I don't know how. they would react if I did try to say no. or try to leave. My mind just kind of. shut down and left my body to do what it. thought it needed to do to keep me safe. That's it." She says it was really. confusing to feel herself disassociating. like that. She says, quote, "I could. feel like I was watching my body doing. this and acting like I'm liking it and. doing what they're wanting to see from. me, and it was confusing to know if I.

was liking the attention or not, which. is the next huge point of contention. It. actually is almost a thing where it. feels like if you are accusing anyone of. especially an essay crime, maybe it's. better to lie on the stand." Like that. is how survivors feel because essay is. so nuanced. Even though at the end of. the day you did not consent and most. normal people would agree that you did. not consent. If there is anything where. you try to be too open, too honest about.

the experience of like exactly how you. felt, it's going to be used against you. >> So this one phrase blows up in M's face. M admits that okay, maybe it was. possible that she was flirting with the. guys in the room. I mean, she doesn't. really recall. And this is like a huge. thing. The whole question is, this is. how it goes down. Did you flirt with. them? No. But you just said you don't. remember anything that happened during. that time period. Yeah, I don't. remember, but I don't think that's. something I would do. But how would you.

know because you don't remember? I I. guess it's possible that I could have. flirted with them. So, you think that it. is feasible that maybe you were giving. them certain signals? I mean, yeah, I. guess it's feasible. So, it's just like. this rabbit hole of like you're saying. you don't remember, but like because you. don't remember, now I can say, is this. hypothetically a situation that could. occur? But if you can't remember, you. can't rule it out. >> Yeah, that's a tactic, right? That's a. professional tactic from these lawyers. that. >> Yeah. >> And you have to remember because I mean,

you must. A lot of victims stated that. they hate being on the stand because it. just feels like these defense attorneys. are there to break you. The whole point. is to exhaust you until you start. agreeing with them because you feel like. that's the only way out of the courtroom. and you just want this to be over with. >> Wow. >> I will say that in her initial police. statement, she did say that in the. beginning she was liking the attention. for a little bit, but it does appear. that that is it's vague. It's nuanced. It's not particularly time-sensitive. Like we don't know when she felt that.

way. And even if she felt that way in. the beginning does not mean that she. consents to everything else that. happened that night. So, I don't even. really know why this is a huge point of. discourse in the courtroom. But the. judge, she thought it was. She's saying, "Well, if you like the attention, I. mean, what does that say about you?". That's basically how she's insinuating. it. >> This was like a huge point in the. verdict as well. M testifies that if she. was being assertive, it was just because. she adopted this personality that it. seemed like the players wanted. She just.

wanted to do what they wanted so that. she could get out of there safely. She. didn't feel like she had a choice. She. just wanted to get the hell out of the. hotel room. And so at one point, the. defense attorney gets her to admit that. perhaps she had taken on a porn star. persona. I think what they're trying to. do here, and I don't know, maybe this is. the truth, but it feels like what. they're trying to do is you are saying. that you felt traumatized, but you are. adopting this very sexually aggressive. persona to perhaps protect yourself. But.

these guys who the defense attorneys. love calling boys. But these boys, they. don't know that. They just see this. sexually aggressive persona that you're. putting on. You might be protecting. yourself, but to them that looks like. consent. And as long as to them it looks. like consent, it feels like consent. It. is consent, you know, because that's the. signal that you're giving them. Like. that's the vibe it seems like that. they're trying to aim for. And they keep. throwing everything to drunk M. this. whole persona that she has when she's.

drunk. And the attorney says, you know, in your head, you wanted to be the focus. of the room. Yeah. They start harping. more on that, the attention part. But. what I'm telling you is that these boys. were just having fun amongst themselves. So, a lot of the guys testify that. during the time they did see her, they. did see her begging to have intimate. relations with the teammates, but. they're saying we were just doing our. own thing. Like, I was talking to Jake. Bean. I was talking to Boris. Like, I'm. just talking to the guys. I'm not even. paying attention to the naked girl in. the room. Was she naked? I don't even. remember. Like that's the vibe that.

they're giving. And so the attorneys, they're going with it. They're saying, "These boys were having fun amongst. themselves, separate and apart from your. existence. Do you agree or disagree?". Emma's like, "No." The whole night I was. being objectified. Like they were. telling me what to do. They wanted to. see me do things. Like she's fighting. back. She's like, "No, I'm telling you. right now that's not what was. happening." Like it was very loud. It. was a very chaotic atmosphere, but it. was still centered around her. It's not. like they're all doing their own thing. and she's just in the corner like,

"Someone come. Someone come to me. Like, I want to do things." She says, "If they. wanted to have their own conversations, I'm sure they all had other hotel rooms. that they could have gone to.". >> That's true. >> Yeah. So, she's like, "I don't know what. you guys are talking about." In the. cross- examination, M does agree that. Michael asked her near the end of the. night if she was okay, and she responded. that she was okay because, quote, "What. else was I supposed to say at that. point? like. now like after all that fear and. intoxication now she's going to say you. know what I'm suddenly going to do a 180.

and I'm going to say no I'm not happy. with that and you should have like it. she's like what was I supposed to say. additionally records show that when M's. mom reported the incident to the police. both of them were under the impression. that she had been roofied. >> mom and the daughter. >> yes okay this is a huge other part of. the discourse is. >> there are a lot of netizens. that believe perhaps M did say all of. those things, but she might have not. been ruied, but might have been slipped.

some sort of drug like ecstasy that. makes someone hypersexual. >> So, some people are just saying like the. whole thing is weird. So, like maybe the. person if Okay, let's just talk in a. hypothetical world. I'm not even going. to use the players names because I'm not. saying that this is what happened. This. isn't even a conversation during the. trial, but if someone, maybe not even. one of the players, maybe someone at the. bar had slipped an ecstasy into her, like had drugged her somehow in some. way, shape, or form, she might have had.

a lot of heightened sexual feelings and. then those acted out in a way where. maybe only one or two of the accused or. people at the bar knows that she's under. this drug and everybody else thinks like. it was just crazy. She was just begging. for things. That's what some netizens. feel. I don't know. I Some netizens also. argue back to them saying like that's. not how it works when you're on ecstasy. But then others are saying it really. depends on the person. It's just weird. But they did believe initially that she.

had been drugged. The two of them go to. St. Joseph's Healthc Care about 4 days. after the incident and M tells her mom. like she thinks it makes the most sense. that she had been roofied or something. of that sort. During the cross-. examination, M is asked whether or not. she took a drug test since she's already. at the hospital. And M testifies that. the nurse did suggest a urine toxicology. test, but she says that she was under. the impression that the test wouldn't. even really the test wouldn't really do. anything. She's saying like she was.

under the impression that the test there. would be no point because I mean she. could have taken drugs afterwards, would. have been an argument. like there's no. way to tie it to that specific event. because 4 days had already passed. >> So, there was a lot of like conversation. about that and she's saying that she. ends up not taking the test and I'm. pretty sure why that is not even really. touched upon during the trial because if. this is just a crazy almost a. conspiracy, they wouldn't be able to. bring this up. Speaking of the hospital,

there's a lot of victim shaming in this. incident as well. She does go to the. hospital and the nurse tells her that. they can do a head to toe full physical. examination of logging anything that. could have occurred from this incident. M says that she declined because it's. not like she had any bruises. It wasn't. essay in the way that you might think it. is like someone is being held down. forced and tied up with a rope. So, she's saying there was no physical. injuries like that. So, there's no point. in that. But a lot of the defense.

attorneys are like that's weird that you. didn't take the test. And even for rape. kits, they're incredibly invasive. Rape kits are not like here, spit in a. tube. Like they're invasive. After a. very traumatic experience, you have to. go through a second traumatic. experience. And at that point, most. victims are not even thinking about. pressing charges. Their brain is like, "How do I stay alive? And how do I make. sure that I don't break apart during. this entire trauma?". >> Like, they're not sitting there like, "I. need to log the evidence. I need to.

collect and gather the data." They're. like, "I just need to stay alive." Like, that's pretty much it. A lot of the. words that she uses are again used. against her when this is I think the. reason that people are upset about this. entire trial is not even because they. think the accused are guilty. Some. people are like, "Yeah, I think they're. guilty." But I think the reason that. people are the most heated is the way. everything goes down. The way that. they're like dogging on everything. The. defense attorneys keep pulling up her. initial statement to the police. This is.

days after the alleged incident. And. she's talking about how these guys were. allegedly making comments about sticking. golf balls and golf clubs inside of her. And she to some degree describes it as. they were joking about it, which she. uses the word joking about it. And I'm. like, I can totally see how that happens. because she's still not processing. And. she admits at that point when she is. going to the police to talk about it, it's more so because her mom reported it. and she still hasn't processed it. I'm. sure to some degree her brain is trying.

to downplay everything. >> She said that she felt so much guilt. that she even ended up in the hotel. room. She was like it was a lot of inner. shame that she felt. So as she's talking. to the police, I imagine it could have. been any situation where the detective. is like, "So did they put a golf club. near you? Do they have golf clubs?" And. she's like, "No, I think they were like. joking about it, but I was feeling. scared." like or like they were joking. about it but and then she doesn't. necessarily like. >> because they to them they are joking.

about it like they they sound like. they're making a joke. Hey guys, can we. try this? Like that's what they sound. like, right? >> But there are golf clubs in the room. Like you have to remember he he haha. It. sounds like a joke, but she's with 10. 200 lb 6 foot dudes that she doesn't. know. And there are golf clubs in the. room. At one point, Dylan Dubet does. tell the police that he pretended to hit. her on the butt with a golf club. Like, you know how you like pretend to swing. and stop right before you smack someone? >> Right. Right. Wow.

>> So, I'm sure to her this is genuine. fear, but she tells the police I think. they were like joking about it. And then. later in 2022, she does sue Hockey. Canada. So, four years after the. incident, she sues Hockey Canada. And in. that lawsuit, she states that she was. terrified after these comments were made. about the golf clubs. And now the. defense are like, "Wait, so how did the. joke become scary after 4 years?" You. were just like thinking about the joke. and then suddenly you got scared of the. joke within 4 years because when you. were reporting it to the police in 2018, you said that they were joking about it.

And then in 2022, you said that you were. terrified. >> You said that those comments made you. feel intense fear like how do you how do. you suddenly get scared 4 years after. the event? M says that by the time she. filed the lawsuit against Hockey Canada, she had time to process that fear. The. defense and the judge seem to think that. that is an unbelievable concept. Even. though that is a very well-known thing. that happens to SA survivors. I mean, actually, coming forward within this. amount of time frame is pretty early for. essay survivors to come forward. Some.

people come forward decades later. >> Mhm. >> So, what do you mean? Yeah, she needed. time to process the trauma. Like, that's. how it works. But Michael's defense. attorney straight up states, "It is. inconceivable that it would take years. for you to process fear." So [snorts]. M testifies that nobody necessarily. forced her, held her down, but the way. they would joke about things and joke. about the things that they wanted her to. do, she felt as if they were half jokes. Like they're not really jokes. She. doesn't really have a choice. That's the.

underlying message that she's receiving. from these jokes. She said that at the. time she might have laughed it off. because she thought that was the safest. reaction. So, this is where again I. think people are getting very heated. because people are saying this is things. girls talk about all the time. You can't. outright reject a guy because there have. been instances where you firmly say no, I don't want to go out with you and then. you get killed. >> Mhm. >> And then if you're too passive about. trying to protect their ego in their. rejection, then they think that you're. saying, "Yes, I do want to date you and.

I do want you to do things to me even if. I say no." Like that. It's like there. are so many nuanced ways that everyone. feels like they have to wander this. path. And she said, "Yes, I might have. laughed at some of these comments. because I felt like that was the safest. thing to do, but they're saying there's. no way." The defense attorneys are like, "How can you laugh if it's not funny?" M. testifies that while she was allegedly. being forced into performing oral on a. few of the players, she sees another. player with his pants off doing the. splits, quote, "Right over my face." She.

claims that he placed his private part. right on top of her face. She said that. it felt really gross, very degrading, and it felt like all the players were. making fun of her, like this is all some. sort of joke to them. She does admit. that there could have been a chance that. in that moment in that hotel room, she. laughed it off because she felt like. this was her way of quote coping with. the situation. The biggest part of this. whole split contention because Caloot is. only accused of essay in the sense that. he did the splits on her face, [clears throat] which is essay, but his.

whole conviction relies on this. M. >> And [clears throat] so she's saying he. had his pants off and his private parts. were on my face. I did not consent to. it. Cal Foot's attorneys are saying, "Well, you didn't tell the police this. in 2018. You didn't tell them about the. splits." She explains, "I was really. embarrassed. Like I didn't really even. know how to describe the situation. Like. the whole thing felt gross and degrading. and very difficult to talk about." The. defense attorneys, they hit back and. they say, "But you did tell the police. that all the other guys were shoving.

their private parts in your face, saying, "Suck it and spit on it." But. you don't talk about the splits. And. she's saying her whole argument is, well, no, it's not even just that she. saw his private parts or that they were. on her face. She's saying like it's such. a weird situation. of someone doing the splits on your face. and everyone's laughing. I could see how. it feels embarrassing in the sense of. like it sounds unserious even though.

it's very serious. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, >> but the defense attorneys and later even. the judge are basically asking her like, "What do you mean? You talked about. penises in your face earlier. Why are. you embarrassed about the splits?" M. testifies that he was fully naked when. this happened. All of the guys testify. that he was fully clothed. Some of the. other guys say that because of the way. that she was wedged in between the beds. at one point, they didn't see if he had. his pants on. They could see that he had. his shirt on. Calfoot, the guy doing the.

splits. But they say that in no way was. any of this sexual. Carter Hart testifies it's just like a. pretty cool thing that Caloot was able. to do. And we would be like, "Hey, Footer, do the splits." Like it was just. kind of a thing he did. He's big, tall. dude, super flexible. And everyone was. just laughing. I looked and I saw M and. she was laughing as well. I will say. that previously at Jack's bar, there is. CCTV footage of Caloot doing the splits. on the dance floor and like all the guys. are clearing the way for him to be able. to do the splits. The defense is using. that as see this is not a sexual thing.

for him. Like who is he seducing at the. bar? Like this is just a party trick. This is him being a goofy, silly, funny. 19, 20-year-old. This is not him trying. to essay someone. Others are bringing up. the Junior Hockey Bible. And I'm not. saying any of these guys read the Junior. Hockey Bible that they live by these. terms, but they did use Gummer. Maybe. that could have been a consequence of. other people in the hockey world using. that term and they just adopted it. Or. they maybe might have read the Junior. Hockey Bible, but there's another term.

that reads the teaag. Definition. First, simply remove your pants and carefully. survey the scene. Once this is. established, make sure a camera is in. place to catch you dropping your doggy. nuts onto the victim's forehead. If. possible, deposit them into the. mouth, but if not, the forehead will. suffice. >> Like the split? >> Mhm. Well, I don't know if it's splits, but you're just placing your privates. on. And they literally write the. victim's forehead. >> The victim. They wrote the victim.

>> Wow. >> Some people are saying this is like bro. aet culture. They're probably talking. about other guys in the locker room, which would still constitute as essay if. they don't consent, but. >> they're just saying like this is not. what it's talking about in the Junior. Hockey Bible. I don't really think. that's a great argument to make. Even. the alleged spitting on Em's back, which. she testified to, there is this in the. Junior Hockey Bible that states the. McDonald's surprise meal. This is when. you are doing a creative move while you.

are doing doggy. You say, "I'm going to. reach the destination." You tell the. girl, "I'm going to reach the. destination." But you can't. You don't. You just spit on her back. She will be. tricked into thinking that you reached. the destination on her back, and she. will look back at you, and when she. does, have your fire hose ready and put. out that fire on her face. She will be. so surprised that she will look like. someone who just found a neat toy in a. Mickey D surprise meal bag. Classic. move. But regardless of any of this, the.

crux of the argument is M and the. prosecutors are arguing that she was too. drunk to consent. And the five accused, they knew that. They knew she was too. drunk to consent. So, it didn't really. matter if she didn't say no and fought. back and tried to run away. She was too. intoxicated. M states that even if you. look at the bar footage from the CCTV, she's like, "My eyes are closed. I'm. smiling. It's like a very drunk smile.". The trial spends a good while focusing. on M's shoes. One of the defense.

attorneys even brings in her shoes to. show the judge and to show the courtroom. is like holding up the pair of high. heels. I don't know if maybe I have a. tolerance for high heels. This happened. in the Diddy trial as well where they're. just talking about the heels. >> Why the heels supposed to imply. something? Tenny Gargo just went on a. whole rant about how Jane Doe would wear. high heels like 5 inch high heels. Those. are for when she was like going out. But. then on normal days she would wear like.

3-in high heels. It's just to paint. someone as. >> it's like what are you wearing? Is that. is that what it is or. >> Yeah, it's what are you wearing? And I. think there is almost like an. insinuation because a lot of the jury. there are people with normal jobs and. nobody that has a lot of. high working conditions can probably. wear high heels on a regular basis. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Like if you're wearing. 3 to 5 in heels on a daily basis, it.

could insinuate to the jury we're not in. the same tax bracket or you're living. life a little bit differently, maybe a. little more luxurious than I am because. I got to wear sneakers cuz I'm running. around chasing after things and the kids. and then I am running around at work in. the stock room. Like there's a lot of. subtle insinuations of high heels and. during this trial they keep using the. word stiletto. Do I think this is like. the So Kate red bottoms 120 mm? No, I. don't think so. I think they look like. relatively comfortable heels. If they. were closed toed shoes, I'd probably. wear them to the courthouse. They're.

strappy, but the heel itself is not. particularly skinny or pointed or super. high. I would definitely feel. comfortable wearing that level of heel. to the courthouse. Not even as an. attorney, just like a member of the. press or even to brunch. Like, this is a. very normal heel. It's nothing crazy. But they keep saying, "Look at these. stilettos. They don't look comfortable. Look at how strappy they are." are. they're like, "It must take a very long. time to put these on and take them off.". Like, this seems like you got to be. coordinated to take these shoes off. So,

they're insinuating like when she gets. back to the hotel room and she. eventually takes these shoes off, she's. not so intoxicated that she can't take. them off. >> I see. So, you're saying that they. trying to use this as a piece of. evidence, but you also know what they. are trying to imply by keep bringing up. the pair of stilettos. >> Yes. And they're also saying, "Look at. the CCTV footage. You're walking pretty. steady. And not only are you just. walking steady, you're walking pretty. steady in high heels.

>> Like, that must mean something. And. they're just like throwing it up in the. air dramatically. I mean, if you squint. really hard, they could potentially look. like stripper heels, but that's besides. the point. Like, these are very regular. shoes. If you watch the video of them. leaving the bar, there is a video. She. goes down the stairs fairly quickly. So, Michael Mloud is holding her hand and. he's walking directly in front of her. He is not slowing down for her. Like, he. is I don't know. He looks like he's. walking pretty fast down the stairs. outside the club and she is almost.

touching the wall with her left hand. very briefly. >> Mhm. >> But otherwise, she's not tripping and. falling. She's not getting dragged. But. I also think that's very normal because. I was thinking about it back to like. maybe when I did drink a little more. socially, but. even when I was drunk, I recall going. downstairs is not the most difficult. thing, especially if you have momentum. It's not the most graceful. You're kind. of like clonking down with heels like. clunk clunk clunk down the steps, but. it's not impossible. It doesn't really. indicate how intoxicated somebody is.

She says, "I mean, I feel like I still. had to focus really hard to get up those. stairs. I mean, I know awkwardly. Outwardly it looks fine. I'm not denying. that, but it I was focusing really hard. There is another point of contention. where it's CCTV video of her leaving the. hotel after the incident. It's lobby. footage. She's wearing jeans, her high. heels. She doesn't need support as she. walks out. She doesn't appear to be. walking in a days or fumbling. A lot of. people say that she is walking with a. very confident gate. She's not walking.

out of there appearing shocked, traumatized, or completely unwell. emotionally. She seems like she's about. to go run errands is what people have. been saying about this footage. Others. are saying, "How can you tell?" Others. are saying it doesn't even make any. sense. Like, first of all, her face is. blurred. You can't see her facial. reaction. You can't see if there's tears. streaming down her face. And yes, she is. walking steady and she is walking. normally. But a lot of victims have come. forward to say after an incident like. that, you're kind of, some victims say.

that you're in a state where you are. either trying to deny what just happened. or make sense of what happened. And the. last thing you want to do is make. yourself feel even more vulnerable. So. you're at least trying to walk with a. confident gate or walk out of there as. normally as possible so people don't. stop, people don't look at you because. you don't want attention on you. you. just want to get home so that you can. completely unravel in the privacy of. your own room. They're saying like, "What do you mean? Okay, she's not. crawling on the floor, sobbing, banging.

her fist on the lobby of the hotel. Like, what do you want from her? What do. you want from her?" Is what a lot of. victims are saying. Then they bring up. the bar footage where she tells the. bartender that she was shortch changed. And they're just bringing up all of. this. Now, I will say the bigger points. of contention during this trial that a. lot of people who support M or support. the way that this was a grossly. mishandled case. They will admit that. these are pretty bad. I will say that. Okay. One of them being in 2018 the.

incident takes place. She goes to the. police about it. They close their. investigation in 2019. They say, "We. couldn't find any evidence. Also, we saw. the consent videos. We saw the footage. of you. You didn't look that drunk. And. here's two videos of you saying that you. consented. Hockey Canada does their own. brief investigation. They also close it. because there's no criminal charges and. nobody was really cooperating with. Hockey Canada. Everyone just kept saying. like, "We're not going to talk to you. until we talk to the police." There's no. way to really compel them. This is an. important point later. Hockey Canada. closes it. 2022, she files a civil.

lawsuit against Hockey Canada for $3.5. million. They quickly settle for an. undisclosed amount, probably way less. than what she was demanding in that. lawsuit. But it becomes public and this. is when things start blowing up. Everyone is like, "We knew things were. happening." In fact, they discovered. that Hockey Canada has a sludge fund. where they take a portion of all the. registration fees of all the Junior. League hockey players and they put it. into this fund to cover all insurable.

incidences, any sort of opportunities, things of that nature. That's what they. say. But essentially, a good seven. something million of that fund was just. used to pay off essay victims or those. who have accused players in the league. >> That's crazy. How did we find out about. that? >> It was discovered through an. investigation. >> The bad part of all of this is in her. 2022 lawsuit to Hockey Canada, there are.

a lot of mistakes in the lawsuit. M. claims it's her civil attorneys who had. filed that lawsuit. She didn't really. think that there would be any criminal. charges. She didn't think that anyone. would even hear word of it. In fact, nobody even knew who the players were in. 2022. They were not alerted. Hockey. Canada settled with her so that this. would go away and then eventually it got. leaked by investigative reporters. She's. saying like I didn't think it was that. serious. I I mean she's not saying it in. that sense, but she's saying this was.

just to sue them. I wasn't going to the. police with this document. The police. already told me 2 years ago that they. closed the case. So I'm telling Hockey. Canada because I'm sure there was a lot. of anger and resentment of like you have. this massive organization that oversees. all of these players. They're at a. Hockey Canada gala, an event in a hotel. room that Hockey Canada is paying for. So, I'm sure there was a lot of. resentment and anger perhaps towards the. organization. She sues them and in that. lawsuit, she does falsely name someone.

that was not there, that was not. partaking in these activities. She said. that she thought that he was there, but. even by naming him, she didn't really. think that this was this wasn't supposed. to go public. She's not naming him. publicly. she's not going to the police. with his name and she does regret it. It. was erroneous. She does wish that she. had spent more time going over it. She. wishes that her civil attorneys had. spent more time going over her police. transcripts to understand that maybe. they shouldn't have named him. But she. did not think that this would be public. She was not trying to falsely accuse.

that player of anything. She's just. saying like that really didn't have. anything to do with me. I didn't even. think that this would come out. But this. becomes a huge point of contention. because naturally people are saying, "Well, you did falsely kind of accuse. someone, maybe indirectly, of something. Maybe you're falsely accusing a lot of. other people." It just made her seem. less credible to a lot of netizens. There are other discrepancies in that. lawsuit. She states to Hockey Canada. that after she started talking to.

Michael Mloud, it seemed like she didn't. pay for any of the other drinks that. Michael Mloud and all the other hockey. players were supplying her with alcohol. at the bar and she was just getting more. and more intoxicated to the point where. they should have known that she was too. drunk to consent. They go through the. CCTV footage at the bar and at no point. do the guys buy her any drinks other. than one beer. She had multiple shots, but those shots she paid for herself. So, there is that that a lot of people.

are saying that's a huge discrepancy to. have. And even though it doesn't. necessarily matter in the grand scheme. of consent because it doesn't really. matter who bought the shots as long as. she was too drunk to consent. But I. guess the question being then if she. misremeers that, what else is she. misremembering? as well as she was. saying that a lot of the guys were. putting her hand on their private areas. CCTV footage from the bar shows her only. touching the private areas with her hand. of Michael Mloud and he did not guide.

her hand there. They also make a whole. show. The defense attorneys bring in the. shot glasses that were used in the. Jack's bar to show that the Jagger bombs. that she drank, the shot glasses are not. full 1 oz pores of liquor. They're. actually about half of that. So instead. of drinking, let's say 12 shots, she's only drinking. like half of it. And so they're saying, "So maybe you didn't drink as much. alcohol as you thought." And she's. saying, "I still drink the amount that I. thought in terms of numbers of drinks. Like I still drink a lot in my opinion.".

But the defense attorneys say, "Your. truth changes from 2018 to 2022 and now. to 2025." And they keep using. patronizing language such as, you know, FunM needs more alcohol, right? So. that's why you're paying for more. alcohol for yourself. Fun M likes to. dance. Look at you dancing on the dance. floor. Fun M is outgoing. She's not shy. And they are saying this because at a. lot of points M would say, I don't. remember, but that doesn't sound like. something I would say. And they're. saying, well, that's not that's not you. It was fun. M. It's drunk. M. She's she.

likes to act out on her impulses. Basically saying, admit [music] this. Like you did this cuz you were drunk and. trying to have fun. Then there is the. size potential fear. She is stating that. she was in a room with 10 200 pound pro. aletes. M testifies again, I don't know. these guys. I don't know how they're. going to react if I try to leave or if I. say no. And I will say that judging from. the video of them at the bar, she looks. pretty small. But the defense attorney. states that she keeps trying to make. herself appear smaller so that she can.

exaggerate the size difference. For. example, they asked her, "How much did. you weigh at the time?" And she [music]. says that she estimates about 120 lb. But they're like, "But you went through. the medical records from the hospital. back in June of 2018 and you weighed 138. lbs. So why are you telling me you. weighed 120 lbs?" And they're. insinuating like you went through the. medical records recently cuz to prepare. for the testifying like you go through. all the records. So like you saw that. it's 138 lb. Why are you telling me that.

you weighed 120 lb when you clearly. didn't? >> Bro, what are we arguing here? That's. crazy. What's even crazier though is. that the judge uses this part in her. verdict. >> Saying what? >> Like she is not the most reliable or. credible witness. That she is answering. in a way that seems evasive or. roundabout and not necessarily. straightforward the truth. Because the. truth would be at the time she weighed. 138 lb. The truth is not I estimated at. the time I weighed 120 lb. So with that.

there's this whole argument of like was. she really intimidated by their size? you know, which is kind of crazy. >> because she's. >> Yeah. >> Wow. >> The defense attorneys aren't outright. saying like, "Well, you actually weighed. 20 lbs more than you said, so maybe. you're not scared." Like, they're not. saying it like that, but that's the. message that they're sending out. >> That's exactly what they spend days. doing. Why not [music] leave? That is. the next one. Brett Howen testifies. I. mean, you could tell she didn't want to. leave. She made it look like she wanted.

to, but she didn't want to. She made it look like she wanted to. leave. >> Yeah. >> Oh, so she did look like she wanted to. leave at some point. [music]. >> Exactly. >> That'sing crazy. >> But he's saying but she didn't want to. He says that. >> crazy that he admitted to that. >> Yeah. He says she pretended [music] to. want to leave and then some of the guys. would say things like, "Baby, don't. leave." And then she would allegedly. say, "So you guys want to have sex?" And. then nobody did. So then she would.

pretend to leave again and then they'd. be like, "Baby, don't leave.". >> Wow. >> He alleges that she wouldn't even try to. leave. She would just threaten to leave. and then not leave. The defense also. points out that at no point did the guys. physically stop her from leaving. And. also the bathroom door, which she was. alone in the bathroom multiple times, the bathroom door is closer to the hotel. room door, so she could have just like. ran out of there, but she didn't. M says. she did not think of that. Another thing.

to note though I will say is a lot of. the times victims have come forward to. say you are very scared of making a big. scene out of it because you're already. not understanding what is happening like. your brain is still processing the. trauma and now once you make a scene and. you run like you've been kidnapped by a. serial killer that is at odds with how. the brain is processing the event. So like this is a very normal way that. people respond. Another thing to note, these guys are skating 30 miles per hour.

on the ice. I could hardly think that. anyone in that position, if her. allegations are true, again for legal. purposes, if they're true, then one. would easily assume that these guys who. spend the majority of their time going. 30 mph on ice and slamming into 200lb. hockey players into the barriers, they. would easily reach her before she. reaches a stairwell or an elevator bay. M testifies that it just even at the bar. she was already feeling uncomfortable. Like it was kind of that energy but only. getting intensified as she got to the. hotel room. She says at one point she.

tried to evade Michael by going to the. bathroom and trying to lose him but he. insisted on walking her to the bathroom. There is this huge argument about she. states that she tripped at one point in. front of Michael and he saw her trip. So. I guess the insinuation with the. prosecutors are see he knew she was so. intoxicated. He knew she was super. drunk, but then CCTV footage shows that. she never tripped in front of Michael. And she's saying, "Oh, maybe I. misremembered. I do remember tripping. Maybe it was like inside the bathroom, though." So, she's saying at the bar,

she just already kind of felt a little. like it was hard to think straight. So, she did go to the hotel. And again, she's saying at this point, I'm still. consenting. She's saying when I got to. the hotel, the first time that she has. intimate relations with Michael Mloud, that's not an argument. She's saying she. did consent to that. She is now telling. her truth of how she felt. and she kept. saying like my truth and the attorneys. hated that too. So they keep trying to. point that out as like oh because it's. not the truth. So then she's like well that's how I. remember it right and they're like but. that's not what happened. It's it was.

the whole thing. So then she's saying. well I [music] mean I felt pressured and. I don't think that I was thinking. straight. I just felt really drunk. Like. that is not something that I would. normally do but we decided to go back to. his hotel room and so I did. So she's. not saying that I didn't want to. This. is non-consensual. She's just saying it. was just weird. She's just describing. how she felt in that moment. Then they. have consensual activities and then the. incident starts. So Michael Mloud is. only charged with the essay of the oral.

sex and then also the incident of in the. bathroom at the very end. >> but not the initial time. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> So she's saying like all of that was. consensual. Like no one is debating. that. But the defense submits into. evidence that there is footage of M. talking to a bouncer at the bar. At one. point, she's talking to this bouncer for. like seven minutes, which is a very long. time. Turns out the bouncer was someone. that M knew from high school. So, they're catching up. Okay, first of all, the defense is arguing. It's strange and. suspicious that you never mention this. bouncer. You never mention this bouncer. until you are seeing this CCTV footage.

and people are like, "Why are you. talking to this bouncer?" And that is. the first time in 2022 that you mention, oh yeah, that's a guy that I went to. high school with. The defense argues you. left out the bouncer because it doesn't. fit your narrative. For one, the bouncer. could have been called to testify about. your intoxication levels. The bouncer. would know how drunk you are. They would. remember you because if you call the. bartender, they're not going to remember. you from that many years ago. The. bouncer, he was your friend. He's going. to remember, oh yeah, we ran into each. other at the bar and like I could tell.

that she was this drunk or not this. drunk. The defense argues that's weird. Secondly, it shows that she could have. easily escaped Michael at the bar if she. wanted. She did not feel that. uncomfortable because she could have. easily gone to the bouncer who has. authority in this club and said, "Hey, these guys are making me uncomfortable. and he keeps inviting me to his hotel. room, but I don't want to go." M argues. the reason she didn't mention him after. the fact is because it was embarrassing. and she didn't want to get him involved. in such a private matter. So, it seems. like they're really not that close. And.

also, she's saying I don't know what he. would have provided because I still. chose to go to the hotel. Like I'm not. saying that I was dragged to the hotel. I'm not saying that he made me go to the. hotel. I consented to go to the hotel. So I just didn't think that this was. important. >> Mhm. >> A lot of victims agree saying like. really like this is such a intense. experience and like all you want to do. is like call up all your old high school. buddies and tell them exactly what. happened. Like this is very strange. The. civil attorneys, I think that they. should be the ones under fire for some.

of these discrepancies. M's civil. attorneys when they filed that lawsuit. against Hockey Canada. It is also in. their best interest, the attorneys, to. make it the most strongly worded lawsuit. possible. That does not. become a lie, but it becomes. part of the lawsuit. And they allege. that the guys, the hockey guys were. trying to separate her from her. co-workers. And they're insinuating like. this was kind of a coordinated thing. that they were doing. Like there was a.

lot of effort and. work that was putting into singling her. out, getting her away from her. co-workers, supplying her with alcohol, which we later found out was not the. case, and then getting her to the hotel. room where they all do these things to. her. That's the way that it's worded in. the civil lawsuit. These civil. attorneys, they will take a cut of. whatever Hockey Canada pays out. It is. in their best interest to secure a. settlement. >> Mhm. So maybe it's a little too strongly. worded because at no point does it seem.

like she was forcibly separated or. manipulated into being isolated from her. co-workers. The defense brings up that. her coworker that she Ubered to the bar. with kept texting her and calling her. being like, "Hey, are you okay?" Even. texting her, "Hey, if you ever need like. I can get you from the guys." And she. was like, "No, no, it's fine." But. again, a lot of netizens are arguing, what does that have to do with consent? because again she consented to go to the. hotel with Michael Mloud and have. intimate relations. It just doesn't make. sense. June 20th, 2018. So this is like.

the day after really of the incident. This is a huge conversation of fight, freeze, flight or fawn. So people know. the first three which is when you're in. a shocking situation. Some people have. the impulse to immediately start. fighting. They're like I'm going to. fight to the death. Like I got to fight. back. Some people, they're all about. flight. Like, I just have to get out of. here. I don't care if I look silly, goofy. I'm gonna run away. Like, there. is no way. Or some people just freeze.

But then a lot of people don't really. know the fourth one that a lot of. advocates and a lot of survivors are. trying to tell people, which is fawn. And I feel like this is one that a lot. of girls resonate with, even myself, which is you do the best to keep the. peace, to not escalate the situation, and to get out of there with everyone. being happy. >> except yourself because in your mind. that is the safest route. Fighting, maybe in your mind, subconsciously, you. just know you don't stand a chance.

Fleeing, you feel like that would cause. a bigger ordeal where they would try to. retaliate or harm you even more. Freezing is maybe not what's happening. It's just fawning. You're trying your. best to calm people down. You're trying. your best to deescalate the situation. without outright saying, "Hey, I'm. literally going to punch you in the face. if you keep doing this.". >> Mhm. >> She is fawning a lot and people say that. these messages are evidence of that. Michael finds out that she has gone to. the police with her mom and that Hockey. Canada has been contacted by her mom's. boyfriend. He looks for her Instagram.

and DMs her, "Hi, can we talk?" She. responds, "Hey, yeah, sure. What's up? Can you call me? Text me first, please.". Yeah, I just texted. Busy right now, though. I can't talk on the phone yet. How long? Can I call you around 1:40ish. today? I need to talk right now. Okay, sorry. Give me like 10 minutes. All. right, good. Now, can I call? One sec. And then she changes her mind. Never. mind. I really can't talk right now. I'm. sorry. Did you go to the police after.

Sunday? question mark. Hello. I talked to my mom. about it and she called, I think, but I. I told her not to. I don't want anything. bad to come of it, so I told her to. stop. I'm sorry. Didn't mean for this to. happen. You said you were having fun. I was really drunk. Didn't feel good. about it at all after, but I'm not. trying to get anyone in trouble. I know. I was in the wrong, too. I was okay with. going home with you. It was everyone. else afterwards that I wasn't expecting.

I just felt like I was being made fun of. and taken advantage of. He responds, "I understand that you're. embarrassed about what happened, but you. need to talk to your mom right now and. straighten things out with the police. before this goes too far. This is a. serious matter that she is. misrepresenting and could have. significant implications for a lot of. people, including you." She doesn't. respond and he texts again, "What can. you do to make this go away?" "Yeah, I. understand that. I'm not trying to push. this any further. I'm sorry for any. trouble it might have already caused.". He responds, "Okay, so can you please.

figure out how to make this go away and. contact the police?" Okay. Can you call. me once you've done that, please, and. let me know what's happening? This needs. to be done now before this goes any. further. Please, have you done this? I'm at work. I'll deal with it as soon. as I can. Okay, so you're putting an end. to this, right? Yes. I appreciate that. you're going to put an end to this. I. know this must not be easy for you to. have to call the police and say this was. a mistake. Have you thought about what. you're going to say to them? She doesn't. respond. So, Michael [music] sends,

"Hey, just wondering what's happening.". I told them I'm not going to pursue it. any further and that it was a mistake. You should be good now, so hopefully. nothing more comes of it. Sorry again. for the misunderstanding. I appreciate you for telling the truth. Thank you. All the best. Okay, so this has been dissected five. bajillion times on the internet and by. people and by survivors, by advocates, and also people who just hate M. This is. another thing a lot of discourse is. around the fact of.

>> why. Okay, if anyone hates false. accusers, it's essay victims. Victims hate false. accusers probably more than anybody. else. But I don't know why a lot of men, specifically sportsmen, hater with a. passion. They act like they are about to. get accused tomorrow. and a lot of. victims and a lot of advocates and a lot. of people are fighting back of well. that's not the case because I mean. statistically it's just not something.

that happens as frequently as a lot of. these guys are saying it happens and. additionally I mean when you follow the. rules of enthusiastic consent it's just. not something that happens so this is. you know this is not a cut and dry. situation and if you read these messages. you can see that so first of all a lot. of people are pointing out that. Michael's messages are incredibly. assertive. It comes off as someone where. they know what they want and they're. very aggressive at getting it. And I'm. not saying aggressive in the sense of. like that is how he must have been.

sexually, but he is very firm. He is. texting her non-stop. He's telling her. exactly what he wants her to do. He is. not being shy about it. And she, on the. other hand, seems like she's nervous. In. fact, the police, the detective. testifies that she was going back and. forth like eight times about whether she. wanted to pursue charges or not. Like. she kept changing her mind. >> Wow. >> She kept saying things like, "I want. them to know what they did and like I. don't want this to happen to another. girl." But also at the same time like I. don't want them to get in so much. trouble. Like she was just dealing with.

a lot. And then at some points she does. testify later that she felt like part of. it was her fault. Like she she brought. it upon herself that she even went to. that hotel. But here's what's. interesting about this. Why not in the. DMs did he not just say, "Hey, so you're. actually crazy because you're the one. that begged everyone to have sex with. you and then you went to the police.". >> Yeah. >> No one would have been mad. I feel like. that's anybody's reaction if that's what. happened. That would be my reaction.

That would be anybody's reaction. >> Yeah. >> Like, are you insane? Like, you. literally were begging people and then. now you go to the police and accuse us. Like, that's crazy. You are crazy. Yeah, >> but no, he says, "You said you were. having fun.". She also states, okay, a lot of people. were saying, "I didn't feel good about. it at all after." A lot of people who. support the accused are using this. statement and they're saying, "See, just. because you consent but then feel shitty. and ashamed for what you did afterwards.

does not mean that it was. non-consensual.". I don't know if we can like nitpick. every single word that everybody uses. >> It It's just weird. And she also does. state, "I'm not trying to get anyone in. trouble. I know I was in the wrong, too." So, a lot of people are saying, "See, she knows that it was consensual. She knows she shouldn't have done this. Like, she feels gross about it. afterwards." But a lot of people are. saying it's just her processing the. shame. >> Yeah. >> And again, she texts him. I was okay. with going home with you. It was. everyone else afterwards that I wasn't.

expecting. He does not refute this in. the DM. He does not say, "What do you. mean? I texted them to come in the group. chat because you told me to." which is. what he tells the police. >> Why would he not say that in the DM? She. says, "I wasn't expecting." And then she. says, "I just felt like I was being made. fun of and taken advantage of." Now, a. lot of people who support the accused. say, "Being made fun of while you're. having intimate relations and being. degraded does not mean that it was. non-consensual.".

>> Yeah. Because she's not. >> processing. >> She's not processing. And she's clearly. not the person that will go to him and. say, "Hey, you essay me. You guys essay. me." Yeah, >> she's not going to say that. Look at the. way that she's like avoiding. >> Yeah. >> the topic. >> She's avoiding calling him. She's. avoiding like everything at this point. >> And the fact that he is this sentence is. crazy. This is a serious matter. Your. mother is misrepresenting and could have. significant implications for a lot of. people, guilting her, including you. He. says, including you.

>> That was crazy. Yeah. >> Is Is that not like a threat? >> That's a threat. Yeah. >> Like, what would what would these. serious implications be if she's telling. the truth? He says, "What can you do to make this. go away?" She's apologizing for the. trouble that she's caused. Like it just. again feels like textbook someone who is. fawning. Like someone who's just trying. to avoid and not be confrontational and. just try to make everyone happy because. they believe that is the safest exit out. of this situation. And you might not.

agree with that just on a personal. level. Like I know there are a lot of. people like I'm very non-confrontational. and there has been friction in my life. of people being like well you should. just voice it when you're not. comfortable. I think it's just like a. personality difference and whether you. agree with that's how someone should. live their life does not refute the fact. that this is something that happens. >> Yeah. Yeah. And the fact that you know. most of these people they know exactly. what they're doing. You know they're not. >> M says with all these messages she. testifies she just wanted to avoid the. confrontation as much as possible. Her.

ultimate goal was to keep everybody. happy, which is exactly what happened in. the hotel room because she was very. scared. She was very fearful. She didn't. feel like she could say no. And so she. just did everything to get out of there. And the safest way she thought that was. was to do what they told her to do. Like. once they're satisfied or happy or. content, like she could just leave. because they won't want anything more. from her versus like running away or. fighting. Other netisens are just. saying, think about it like this. anyone. who has ever fawned before or that is.

their typical response in these types of. situations. This is how pushy Michael is. on DMs and this is just Michael. >> Imagine how that dynamic played out with. 10 of them in one room in person drunk. >> Yeah. >> And celebrating and in this very. boisterous mood with all their teammates. like. >> Yes. >> This is just one person in the DMs. >> Yeah. The defense also pulls up other. chat logs. When M is seen in the hotel. CCTV footage leaving, she's on the.

phone. M testified that she had called. her best friend and she was crying for. just emotional support. She says in that. moment she was feeling overwhelming. feelings of shame mainly like. embarrassment. [music]. She wasn't calling her saying like I was. essay because in that moment she just. felt shame. Like that was the. overwhelming feeling which again not. dissimilar to like every other victim's. experience. They're saying like this is. not unique. This is a normal thing. She. cries all the way home in the Uber and. she does acknowledge that as she's.

crying, she is telling her friend like, "I thought this guy was nice. Turns out. he's a douchebag." So, she's saying. these things of why she's crying. Cuz. her friend is like, "You need to tell me. what happened." Instead of saying, "I. was essayed. All these guys came in here. and they all essayed me in a group." She. says, "I went home with this guy. I. thought he was nice at the bar. He. turned out to be a really big jerk." She. mentions feeling intensely guilty for. cheating on her boyfriend. She has a. boyfriend at the time. This will be a. whole thing. She does not mention gang.

essay or essay. M testifies at that. moment it was because she didn't realize. it was essay. I mean she knew it was. something not normal happened but she. couldn't put the word to the experience. And also like I don't know if she wanted. to tell her friend everything. They hang. up. M gets home the next afternoon. Her. best friend texts her and M is just. reassuring her like, "I'm okay, girl. I. think I was just being a little dramatic. earlier, but I'm good. I'm still. processing it, doing my best to try to. be fine." Her best friend responds, "You.

scared me. I'm sorry. I was just feeling. really, really guilty and mad at myself. for letting that happen. I just felt. dirty and used after." The guy was such. a jerk and he had all his friends in the. room and it was just like a really bad. situation. I shouldn't have put myself. in that situation. The defense is just. saying, "You keep telling your friend. it's because you feel ashamed. Do you. feel embarrassed and you feel guilty for. cheating on your boyfriend? M testifies, "Yes, I said that because quote, I. didn't want to admit it was sexual. assault. I didn't want to say those. words because then it would be true. I. didn't want to admit it was as bad as it.

was. I didn't want to think about it.". The next day, M's coworker also texts. her asking her if she got home okay and. then writing, "You were having a blast. with those guys." She responds, "Haha, yeah, they were funny." Crying laughing. emoji. The defense is like, "See, you. loved it. She's testifying. I was. ashamed. I was embarrassed. I just This. is my co-orker. This is not even a. friend. She's like a new friend. I just. started hanging out with her. I'm not. going to tell her my life story and the. worst night of my life over text message.

the next day. She said that I was just. trying my best to make her seem like I. was okay and that I was normal. A few. days later, M tells her best friend that. her mom has gone to the police and she. says, "Pretty sure I was ruied to be. honest and my mom is taking it hella. seriously. contacting the police and it. the group of guys are all high up hockey. players. Go figure. Lmo. She says it's. okay. I was just trying to downplay it. and just forget it. But honestly, I'm. pretty up from it right now. So,

I don't know. >> Wow. >> So, again, it people are saying it's. just very in line with how survivors. are. >> Yeah. >> And again, even survivors are saying, do. they wish the verdict was different? Yes. But do they understand why the. verdict is the way it is? Yes. They're. saying it's notoriously difficult to get. essay convictions. They're not saying. they don't think that she's lying. They. think that she's telling the truth. It's. not the verdict that's the main problem. a lot of survivors feel with this. It's.

the way that she was allowed to be. eviscerated on the stand by the defense. attorneys for 7 days straight. It's the. way that they pulled out every single. shaming, victim shaming, rape myth out. of the textbook that we thought we left. in like 1999. They brought it back out. in the good year of 2025 and whipped. them all out back to back repeatedly. when this is a very normal standard way. that victims process the incident and. then eventually heal. Like this is. insane. And again, even survivors were.

stating online, had the judge just read. the verdict and then said, "For these. reasons, these are the reasons why I am. legally finding the accused not guilty.". She could have even said, "They're not. guilty in the court of law." But I think. this is a bigger conversation for. implied consent. It's a bigger. conversation for what really is. enthusiastic consent. It could have been. a big learning moment for everyone, but. no, she was just like, "She is a liar. I. don't believe her. The judge is like, I.

think she wanted this. Basically, in her. 91page verdict, she pretty much says. everything but that. Even during her testimony, Em is. constantly apologizing when a question. is confusing. When it's literally not. her fault, that is the attorney's fault. that's asking her the confusing. questions. Defense attorneys are. literally paid to ask questions in a way. that is clear so that the witnesses can. understand. So, it's actually their. fault, but she's apologizing. And then. finally, she stands up for herself. At. one point, Alex's attorney is grilling.

her. She starts feeling frustrated and. she says, "I feel like this is also my. time to stand up for myself when I. couldn't do it that night. So, I'd like. to respond to how I'd like to respond if. that's all right with you." I get it. Legally speaking, that's not how it. works when you're testifying on the. stand. And with father Iran, I think. that he is a very fair judge. When the. victims would get flustered on the stand. and would try to explain certain. decisions or ramble about why they felt.

the way they felt, he was very kind in. the way that he would let them at least. finish talking. And if it happened too. repeatedly, he would say, you know, like. we have to. >> you have to answer the question. >> Yeah, we have to just answer the. question. Like I know it's difficult, but I mean have some sympathy, right? The attorney could have easily told her. the same thing, like, "Yes, I understand. that, but this is not the time and place. to do it because this is how it works. You have to answer the questions that I. ask." So, she says, "This is my time to. stand up for myself. Like, I would like.

to respond how I would like to respond. if that's all right." And the attorney. straight up tells the alleged victim, "Well, in fact, it's not all right. You're here to respond to my questions.". >> Man, just like I'm just thinking about. the amount of trauma she's going to have. after this. >> Yeah. And this is again people are. saying another reason that victims are. not going to come forward. Like why do. you think it takes people so long to. come forward and then they get slapped. in the face when they take so long to. come forward when this is all they see. on the news? The defense tries to.

convince her during the. cross-examination that let's be real, she wanted this. However, she was. feeling dirty and used because the guys. were not very nice to her afterwards and. she was expecting thank yous and hugs. and attention. But instead, they kick. her out after all of this. After she is. in the shower with Michael McCloud, the. defense argues Michael just wanted to. get her out so that he could sleep. because he's got a golf tournament. tomorrow. And he keeps asking her when. she's going to leave. The defense argues. that that makes Emoy. He's being very.

disrespectful and rude. And she does in. fact call him a jerk to the police. He. won't walk her to the door. He won't. call her an Uber. In fact, he asks her, "You're sure you don't have STDs? Are. you leaving anytime soon?". which she states that she was taken. aback by those comments. She says she. was taken aback, but the defense. attorneys latch on to that and they're. saying, "You were taken aback because. you were expecting something else. Tell. us what you were expecting. You were. expecting love and adoration and. praise.".

Alex's attorney asks her, "You felt a. bit scorned that neither Michael nor. Alex were really paying too much. attention when you left. You were. expecting them to give you a hug and to. thank you for the night and walk you to. the lobby. and when that didn't happen, you felt hurt. M disagrees. She says, "I. remember feeling that it was odd. I'd. never had an encounter that kind of ends. in that type of way, but I wasn't. scorned about it. I definitely felt. disrespected, but I felt disrespected. the whole night, so I'm not sure why I. thought the end would be any different.".

Another part of the defense that they. fixate on is Brett Hen. The notoriously. unreliable witness testifies that he. recalls near the end that she was quote. weeping and that at one point she kept. saying like, "I'm too sober for this. I'm too sober for this." And then. accidentally she calls Michael the wrong. name. And I guess Michael gets offended. by that. And he asks her straight up. like, "That's not even my name. Why are. you even here by the way?" Which set her. off is the insinuation. Like that hurt. her feelings. She is now a scorned woman. who wants payback and revenge and now.

she regrets everything that happened is. the insinuation because she's been. disrespected. So like the insinuation is she consented. to all of it and then the guys were rude. to her. So now she's like, "You know. what? I take back my consent." But. here's what's weird. He's saying that. she kept saying, "I'm too sober for. this." But then she's like calling. Michael the wrong name. So I'm like, "I. don't know. That doesn't seem too sober. then.". >> And also she's weeping. It just sounds. like so much is happening. Like that is. not normal for you to be saying I'm too. sober, calling people the wrong name,

and then to be crying all in the span of. the time that Brett Howen is like. leaving this room. >> Yeah. >> That seems very emotionally tumultuous. >> And at which point someone should have. been like maybe she is very emotional, very drunk, not in a position to. consent. The defense argues that she had. strong motive to lie because she has a. boyfriend who is now her fiance in 2025. The defense points to M statements from. 2022 in the lawsuit against Hockey. Canada that she says it caused a strain.

to my relationship with my boyfriend. And the defense asked her, "But your. boyfriend wasn't mad at you for cheating. on him." You know, they're saying. because he had sympathy. Like he reacted. to with sympathy, right? Because he saw. you as a victim, I guess. Yeah, which is. true, but I think the the wording, the. way that she's forced to admit it, I. think it insinuates that the motive is. there. Then then the consent videos, the.

judge focused a lot on the consent. videos and people from both sides, people who support M and then people who. support the accused are arguing. separately. People who support M. And. what the prosecutors are saying is it's. just weird. If you have to get a video. of someone consenting, you should really. question if they consented because. that's just not a normal thing to do. >> The people who support the accused are. saying, "Well, these days with all these. false allegations,

okay, with all these false allegations, I mean, I would get a video, too, if I. were a famous hockey player.". The defense argues that M testified that. she doesn't even remember the first. video being recorded. She doesn't know. if someone was recording her, so that. means that she couldn't have been acting. for the camera. And allegedly in this. video, she is seen smiling. M argues, well, actually, like near the end of the. video, you can see me wipe my eye with. the back of my hand. I think that was. when I was crying in the night, which.

would make sense. Like if she's crying. and then they're like, "Wait, we got to. get a video because she's already. crying. So like maybe tomorrow morning. she's going to realize like I would. imagine that that logically kind of. makes sense." And she's saying, "I think. it was near that time that I was crying, so I'm wiping my eyes, but I don't. know." She looks at the video and says, "I don't really look like myself." The. judge does not believe that. The judge. believes it looks like you're smiling, so you're smiling. You didn't know the.

camera was recording, so you're not. acting for the camera, so that means. that you're smiling when this is. happening. Basically, if M tries to bring up the fact that she. believes she was wiping tears from her. eyes, the judge is like, "That is all. speculation, but also smiling equating to consent is. also speculation.". Then the second video where she is. talking about like, "God, you're so. paranoid. Like, yes, I'm okay with. everything. Like, I'm too sober for. this." She says, "At this point, like I.

think my mind was disconnected from my. body." And again, people are saying, "What do you expect her to do?" Because. up until this, she told us straight up. she was in fear and she was fawning and. she was doing whatever it took to get. out of there. And at this point, it. sounds like, "Holy, you're so paranoid.". It almost sounds like again. theoretically speaking in some logical. situation it would make sense if someone. in the room is like wait are you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure you're. consenting? Which again if you have to. ask that's very strange already. I'm not.

saying it's illegal but it's strange. And then to get the video and then she's. saying holy you're so paranoid like I'm. okay. Why would he be paranoid? >> I mean unless he has videos of every. other person that he's ever had intimate. relations with consenting then it's just. weird. And at this point, these guys are. not in the NHL. They're definitely not. as established in their career. And I'm. sure they're heavily career oriented. players. They're very successful in what. they did, but it just doesn't make. sense. I think people are saying even if.

this is a thing that a lot of pro. athletes do, which a lot of people on. Reddit were saying they have had. experiences, it might apply more to. someone in the NBA, in the NFL, in the. NHL, an A-list actor. insert the most. famous singer you know. They might do. that because they have PR training, media training, they have a whole team. of attorneys who have already informed. them of all the necessary ways to. protect themselves and they have this. level of fame that most people cannot. fathom, but these are 19 to 20-year-old.

Junior League players. I don't know if. they've gone through all this process of. like, okay, now that you're making. millions of dollars, you just want to. protect yourself from any sort of. accusations or lawsuits. Mhm. >> It just is weird. It's very weird. Now, the detective testifies that even when. they reopen this case, a lot of people. online were saying, "Why is she just now. coming forward?" Which is already a. crazy thing of like, "Why does it matter. when she comes forward with it?" But. this is not even her coming forward. She. actually came to the police very early.

on, like days after it happened. They. close the investigation in 2019. In. 2022, she sues Hockey Canada. And this. is supposed to be anonymous, but it gets. leaked. They don't know who the. plaintiff is. They don't know who M is, but they they know that something has. happened. The police decide that they're. going to reopen the case and the. detective testifies on the stand. I. mean, I felt pretty bad because it felt. like I got the sense that I was opening. up some wounds that she was trying to. close. I think it was a bit overwhelming. for her, like she wasn't expecting this.

So, it just. >> Yeah, it's. it's frustrating. And another. frustrating part is there are a lot of. statements that are being used against. M. So when she was talking to the police. in 2018 and then later in 2019, her. lawsuit against Hockey Canada in 2022, what she said to the police in 2022, all. of those are being brought up now. The. players, the accused, their interviews, they're very brief interviews. Like they. dropped the ball. The London police did.

not really even go in with a full. investigation. They were just like, "We. saw the consent videos and you didn't. look that drunk, so we think you. consented." They didn't ask hard. questions for any of the accused. Just. nothing. They were just like asking a. few questions of like, "Oh, so she was. inviting people like you guys had food.". It It's just the most bland thing ever. >> You been sending any of those messages? >> No. Like I I I. just told the guys I was getting food. and there's a girl over there. That's. all I said to a few guys. At the same.

time in 2018, Hockey Canada has opened. up their investigation, but they are. talking to the players, but they compel. them to talk. The investigator that's. working on this in Hockey Canada, she's. an attorney. She was hired by them. She's a third party firm. And she. basically tells them, "Hey, Hockey. Canada is not going to work with you. guys unless you guys take this. interview.". >> So, they come in and now they're almost. being forced to take this interview. Whereas the police cannot force them to. take any interview. You can just say, "I'm going to lawyer up. I'm not going. to talk to you." Whereas in this. situation, she's almost forcing them to.

talk. They come in with the assumption. and the agreement that hey, you cannot. record, you cannot audio record this, you can only take notes. So, she does. take a ton of notes and this is not. allowed into evidence because at that. point she already knew that the London. police were going to subpoena her. records, that they were going to get a. warrant for all of her notes. >> And what's the problem with that? They're saying it's highly prejuditial. and it could be considered coercion. because at this point the players were.

cornered into talking to the. investigator, which the police could not. make them do that. The investigator knew. that there would be a potential warrant. out for all of her notes. And so it just. seems like they were being compelled to. do something that could infringe on. their rights. So whereas M, she's got. the police statements, the Hockey Canada. lawsuit, the Hockey Canada. conversations, more police statements, all being compared to her timeline, to. bar footage, to everything, and then her. testimony. There's going to be a lot. more opportunity to find inconsistencies.

because that's just what happens. The. guys, however, have less material that's. allowed into evidence. They've got the. group chats, yeah, they've got the. initial police brief interviews, but all. the Hockey Canada stuff is not allowed. So there's not even that much cross. comparison because that's how they get. you. They impeach you on like, "Well, two years ago you said this and now. you're saying this." They're catching. you in a lie. But even with the limited. information, the guys are still caught. lying. For example, Alex says he never. saw anyone smack M on the butt. Then.

later he says, "You know what? I did see. Dylan Dubet smack her on the butt." Alex. is confronted about that discrepancy and. he just states he was nervous, overwhelmed, and didn't want to throw. Dylan Dubet under the bus, but he wanted. to correct the record that he did see. Dylan Dubet smack her on the butt. So, there's just like lots of discrepancies. and inconsistencies even with the guys. and all of their statements, but it. doesn't matter. And again, even if we're. not disputing the verdict legally. speaking, cuz a lot of people are saying. it's just how difficult it is to convict.

people of essay. The judge did not have. to say like half the stuff that she said. in that verdict. She says, quote, "On. several occasions, the complainant. referred to her evidence as her truth. rather than the truth, which seemingly. blurs the lines between what she. believes to be true and is objectively. true." The judge even uses quote gaps in. quotation marks to talk about M's gaps. in her memory. The judge says, "Another. way that the complainant apparently. filled in gaps in her memory with. assumptions is the manner in which she. answered questions. For example, she.

would say, "I feel that I," as she would. speculate as opposed to remembering or. knowing the answer to the question. This. reflects an uncertainty of her memory. The judge writes, quote, "It was. suggested to M that she remained in the. room because she was expecting the other. men to enter and wanted to participate. in sexual activity with the other men. She denied this suggestion, but it was. not a denial because she didn't say it. or did not recall saying it." M. testified that it doesn't sound like. something I would say.

>> Okay. And that the judge is like that's. not a denial. That's not a no. >> Yeah. >> How a person behaves when they are. clear-headed and sober may not be the. way a person behaves when they are. disinhibited after consuming alcohol. On. the basis of all the evidence, I find as. a fact that the complainant did express. that she wanted to engage in sexual. activity with the men by saying things. like, "Is someone going to me?" and. by self-pleasuring. The judge is. basically saying, "Based on the. evidence, I agree this to be true." What. evidence? The only evidence we actually.

have is that text message that Michael. Mloud sent to the group saying, "Anyone. want a threesome? Quick. 209 Mikey.". There is no evidence other than these. guys testifying or telling the police. that said that she was asking for this. Literally. >> Yeah. And all of their stories don't. even add up. >> Yes. His DMs don't add up. Their group. messages don't add up. Like there is no. evidence. Yeah. >> The judge also touches on the group. chats and she says in his text messages,

Mr. Mloud reminded everyone to tell the. truth and not to make anything up. Mr. Dubet told the group, "Let's not make. her sound too crazy because if she gets. wind of this and then she can get even. more angry and we don't need that, so. just be good with it and be the truth. with it." Which again, people are saying. those are weird group chats. The judge. says, "In my view, the group chat. reflects that the participants were. expressing their honest recollections. about what happened in room 209 and not. concocting a false narrative.". >> This judge, Wow. I mean, >> yeah.

>> M's attorney has come out to say, "We. are very disappointed with her honors. assessment of her honesty and. reliability. M has never really. experienced not being believed like this. before, and it's it was just basically. saying it was tough." The prosecutors. say a successful prosecution is not. measured solely by whether there are. guilty verdicts at the end. But people. are saying this was just not successful. in any way, shape, or form. It just is. bad. On a personal note, it has been my. honor to represent and assist Em.

She is a remarkable person and truly a. hero. Despite her feeling like this was the. hardest thing she's ever had to do, she. chose to persevere and continue with the. process of seeking justice. She knew there were no guarantees for. guilty verdicts. and that even if she decided not to. testify, that decision would have been. accepted. But the five guys, the five.

accused have walked out of the courtroom. probably more smug than they were. walking in because they have just been. acquitted of all the charges and they. were found not guilty. Netzens are. saying that doesn't mean that they're. not guilty, but I guess that's a. personal opinion. Michael Mloud's. attorney states, "Public perception was. shaped by a one-sided narrative from a. civil lawsuit that went unchallenged in. large part because Hockey Canada settled. the claim without first informing or. consulting the players." basically. saying in 2022 had hockey Canada called.

Michael Mloud and all the other players. they would have fought this. They would. not have let Hockey Canada settle. But. because they settled, the public. believed that these guys were in the. wrong. He says that they have vigorously. contested M's allegations and they've. won. There were brief conversations. about Michael Mloud being signed with. the Carolina Hurricanes for the NHL, which means that he would stand to make. on average like $3.5 to4 million a year. That's on average how much that team. pays. But there was so much backlash, a. petition. Karolina Hurricanes backed out.

>> and now he is recently signed with an. Eastern European Vanguard team. He's. still making a lot of money. His. contract is $2.7 million in total, rounding out to be about like $900,000 a. year. One comment reads, "Not guilty is. not innocent. What kind of person treats. a woman that way anyway?" As for Alex. Foreman, the other one that is accused. of full-on essay and Rword, he is now. with the Swiss team. We don't know how. much he makes, but a lot of insiders say. that it's a very comfortable position. Alex's attorney states, "Now the public.

knows that he's innocent of this false. allegation, but only after this case has. erupted into a massively publicized. social cause. Alex's face has appeared. on millions of screens and newspaper. pages. There can be little doubt that an. untold number of people believed he was. guilty simply because he had been. accused of a crime long before any. evidence was presented in court." As for. Dylan Dubet, his previous contract was. with a Bellarusbased team for $600,000 a. year, but I think as of right now, he is. a free agent and he is unsigned. There. are reports of NHL interest, but we'll.

just have to see. Cal Foot, [music] the. one who did the splits, his attorney. states at the start of this trial, Cal. Foot walked into the courthouse an. innocent man, and he walks out today. exactly that. Cal never lost faith that. justice would be done despite the clamor. of external pressures and agendas. outside the courthouse doors. Carter Hart, probably the more popular. of the five accused. He's the one with. the attorney that a separate victim is. just so traumatized by, Megan [music]. Sevard. But, uh, Carter Hart's attorney.

says almost every single feature of the. evidence that the judge identified today. as fatal flaws for the crown has been. known to the prosecutors and to the. police from 2018. Today's outcome was. not just predictable, it was predicted. A lot of comments say she thought she. ate with that one. Um, he has recently. signed, like a few days ago, recently. signed a 2-year, $4 million contract. with the Las Vegas Knights, Golden. [music] Knights. >> Oh, >> people are upset. >> He's in America.

>> Yes. He is the only one that has. resigned with a team inside the NHL. >> And people are rightfully pissed off. He. says, "It's been a long road to get back. to this point, to get back to playing. the game of hockey, a game that I love, and I've been out of the game for a year. and a half now. I've learned a lot. I've. grown a lot. I'm just excited to move. forward." A lot of people have been. saying positive things about Carter. Hart, primarily because he was the only. defendant to testify. >> So, some people think it could be. possible that maybe some of the accused.

in their minds are guilty, some of them. are not. But I will say it also depends. on who's their favorite player seems to. be a huge part of the reasoning and a. lot of people are against any of them. getting signed with the NHL. Saying. things like they shouldn't even be. walking the streets as free men, let. alone taking a spot from another player. Others are commenting or just like hear. me out, I don't know, just don't sign. rapists. Like this is absolutely. abhorrent and everything that is wrong. with sports. And other people are. commenting what's even worse about this. is they're not even the greatest hockey.

players. Like you really don't have to. sign them. >> Like your team is not losing out by not. having this one talented player. Like. there's so many talented players. Like. you get nothing. It's almost like it. doesn't even make sense at this point. It's almost like you're doing this to. spit in people's faces. >> But others firmly disagree saying they. are acquitted. Why are we treating them. like criminals? Why should their whole. lives be ruined when that is exactly how. the justice system works? they were.

proven innocent in the court of law and. people still want to treat them like. they were guilty. Like people are saying. it doesn't make sense. So there's a lot. of debates. Others are commenting like. what's the issue? You guys believe that. there aren't girls who are actually down. for all this stuff. They try to save. themselves and their reputation later by. falsely accusing the guys with the. things that they wanted to do. Like come. on, give me a break. I think there's a. fine line. I think the ones that say. that they should be able to live on with. their lives and their careers and have. an NHL contract, those are people that. are definitely in support of the five. accused, but their argument lies on the.

fact of they were found innocent in the. court of law. Once we start making up. our own rules outside of that, that's. where we get into very slippery slope. territory where now it's just getting. bad. Like they have been acquitted. You. don't have to like them, but they should. be able to live their lives. >> because they were not found guilty. But. then you have the other side of. supporters that are like, "No, that girl. is a liar. She wanted this. She was. asking for it. This was her dream." And. a lot of people are just saying like, "Dude, because a lot of them are guys, just say you want to bang some ice.

hockey bros." Like, you don't have to. put it on women. Like, you can just say. that. A lot of people are also saying. like, "What is it about sports that. brings out guys to defend other guys to. the death? These guys don't know you and. they'll probably make fun of you if they. met you at a bar." Others are just. commenting that consent video is more. like a hostage video. Others are also. commenting that even the judge allowing. those consent videos into the evidence. is just like a dangerous precedent that. she's setting. And ultimately, M's.

attorney states, "When a person summons. the courage to disclose their story, the. worst possible outcome is to feel. disbelieved. It's a gutting experience. that no one deserves. That's why today's. verdict is so devastating. M did. everything in her power to recount her. experience honestly and to the best of. her ability. She agreed to do everything. asked by her by the criminal justice. system and yet it was not enough. And that is where I leave you with. today's case. What are your thoughts? I. think there's four groups of people.

people who support M to the very end and. they say that verdict should have been. different and that these men deserve to. rot in prison and preferably in hell. Then you have a second group that say. legally speaking they can understand why. the verdict happened the way it did. That is not a reflection of M. That is. not a reflection of her credibility but. rather the police, the prosecutors, the. court system, the law. And then you have. some people that are saying at the end. of the day what happened was the guys. have been acquitted so we all need to. move on. And then you've got the other.

end of the spectrum that are like we. need to just like burn women at the. stake just in case they're going to. falsely accuse me. random Joe from. Nebraska of doing something. What are your thoughts? Let me know in. the comments and be safe. I will [music]. see you in the next one.