😜PEDDOLLA KABURLUU | Jr. GVK ON FAMILY LEGACY & BUSINESS SECRETS | FT. GV. KESHAV REDDY | EP - 123

How are you? Checker. check. >> Done. So let's welcome the youngest. billionaire in Hyderabad. Let's unveil those things which are not. out about your family, your legacy or. your grandparents story. 2015. Oh yeah. There were three people and. first meeting I said these guys are. going to do something. Ani said $3. million 500k.

500k so $4 million round today now. they're valued at 3.5 billion over 100x. belief has changed a little bit. companies are getting built faster and. are dying faster and with AI it. accelerates more you can't bet on things. for long anymore. how much of is it true we took a. decision Bangalore airport first so we. Okay. [laughter].

You speak a lot about. he's probably going to be the most. profound human in this century. >> You also met Sam, right? >> I didn't find him so impressive in. person. Was. >> Yeah, I met him many times. >> Third generation curse. >> Yeah. >> Third generation is born with a silver. spoon. So, they don't see hardships. They don't know how to build. >> They generally destroy it. they destroy. it. That didn't happen because I always. believed in one line. Feet to the. ground, eyes to the sky. So be humble.

but be ambitious. Team should be such effective and. strong. You learn how to run business when you. learn how to collect money. Exactly what. you were telling. [laughter]. Actually manifestation works. I don't. know how it works but it works. Guest. what's the name.

companies grow in tech like this. one thing which I got very much excited. [music] was your journey life changing. first I'll try everything before I join. you talk about how do we purchase. airports how do we sell airports right. it's interesting it's insane not so easy. for a common man like me to go inside or. aim at the You're saying you're a common. man now, >> bro. [laughter] Seriously.

[laughter]. Bro, hi. >> Hello. >> So, let's welcome the youngest. billionaire in Hyderabad. Cool. [laughter] Cool. Billionaire. Yeah. Coolest billionaire. >> So, how are you, bro? >> Good. Good. >> How do I call you? Junior GV. [laughter]. I always had the same initials like my.

grandfather. >> Oh, no. Was it on purpose? Actually in 1992 law was born. >> the company was up it had a different. but 1991 GVK was found so there was some. correlation. >> okayrishna. yeah that's. an jun [laughter]. so let's talk about your grandparents.

>> how often do you meet M. and both my tatas are very very like. amazing personalities. Exactly. actually. one fine day what happened I don't. remember the movie's name.

break I realized there's someone who's. sitting beside me. it's. [laughter]. Yeah, please please go ahead. >> No. So n um every Sunday. >> since I've been born. >> I have gone to first authentic. every Sunday. >> Every Sunday since I've been born if I'm. in Hyderabad I'm there. >> Okay. >> All my friends know Sunday afternoon.

[laughter]. lunch. Right. Right. Right. Right. So. there are no videos where you. [laughter].

[laughter]. almost I think. weddings. Parents, it's the parents wish parents. desire. >> Right. Right. Hyderabad. 10,000 people.

opposite airport. [laughter]. actually wedding emotion like memories. >> and uh I I have so many fun memories. with my friends, my cousins, my family. members. M. >> and that is what remembers like what. people remember how you made them feel. >> and how you had fun or like what what. memories that you had my like my uh Vina.

is my wife's Nanama was very old Apuru. >> and she at that point of time came for. the wedding she was over 90. >> oh. >> close to late '9s actually now she's no. more. >> Apuru and she came for the wedding and. then she gave her a very thin gold chain. >> I that is like ingrained in my memory or. like when my uh when my Tata you'll see. videos of Subran Tata dancing with Ranir. Singh. >> oh. >> and.

post like it's not part of the post. sange. >> and Ranir first to actual big big event. was for my sister's wedding. 2011. >> and bajara so Shah Rukhan was the Shah. Rukhan and Priyanka Chopra came as the. main event speakers dancers. there was an additional two people. because the you know was set up. everything. >> oh we'll send two more people and you.

know in events Ranir Singh and Anushka. Sharma. >> Apuru they were just first first uh. movie. >> so they were actually the the dancers in. between so after five six years Ranir. was the main person in so he's a great. guy amazing guy. >> crazy crazy I used to. the stars and actors come and dance at. the events and all. In fact, [laughter].

there's a there was a meme I guess he's. the only actor who who goes to an event. and makes the guests the outsiders main. >> but he see the most people came for uh. for like my sisters or my wedding. because of my parents. >> right. >> my parents knew them from before. >> and then obviously you are request some. of them to dance and this so. >> crazy. starting. >> [laughter]. >> Google search.

we'll talk something something else. which is important I mean interesting. video about Goa's house tour [laughter]. kind of. see when first of all you have to see to. believe that house. >> it is amazing beautiful home so atan uh. and only it can only be my mother and my. father who go see something they love it.

and then they take it to the next level. So while I I I don't think you know my. father is very very creative. >> if you see. and airports airports are actually very. like. like very simple structures. >> Mumbai I guess right you have a museum. >> museum he made if you see the pillars in. Bombay it's a peacock. >> it's a white peacocks and what he said. is thousand peacocks in the sky that was. a concept there is no wall It's just.

thousand or they're actually 27 pillars. of peacocks and then each of those shape. is the logo of Mumbai airport. >> which was designed by Mumbai T2. >> in Mumbai and then in Navi Mumbai he had. designed new Mumbai. So he had got the. world's most innovative futuristic. designer Zahad to design a lotus. Oh, >> in Bangalore airport he has uh designed.

a garden terminal first of its kind in. the world. >> Mhm. >> He just loves design. He is like one of. the he will go down in history as the. most like the airports man of India. crazy. >> All three terminals which he designed he. loves. And obviously my Tata loves. gardens, greenery and they just. learn. crazy. [laughter].

>> [laughter]. >> and I also read about this Mumbai you. have a museum that's one of its kind. it's the largest public showing of art. in the world 10,000 pieces. >> all curated for the terminal. >> crazy.

>> so it each one has a story from a region. in India. artist. your legacy will be in Mumbai. while just did what they felt was. representative. Crazy. >> So, >> and what about this Goa's house. auada? >> Okay, >> it is a palace only. And uh there was. this man actually from Bombay man. >> He went in the 70s and built this house. >> gual. He took.

>> and he built it after a European Italian. uh sort of a style. >> and you have to see to believe how. beautifully he did it. >> and '90s actually used to throw really. big parties. >> there's only because the CRZ rules after. late 80s you can't build anything on. water that's why Goa has all temporary. structures. >> oh. >> so this was before that it was built. before that. So it's actually built as.

on the water and fort gua fortada. jail is now a museum for auada the. church. >> act. whole couple hundred acres. >> it's a beautiful location. okay. >> in 2021 he passed away no children no. spouse so when it went for auction then. my parents went and visited Everybody in. India saw that house. You ask anybody,

they've gone to that househ. because there are no children. >> So but when my parents went and saw it, they said this is it. So [laughter]. rest is history. Now it's like uh you. have to take you. It's beautiful. whenever whenever you are free. next [laughter]. but definitely we'll have to go there. Google.

[laughter]. but yeah as you rightly said wedding. whatever the events which are larger. than what it is. and that is what people think about even. when we were what you looking after the. content. there's a. I was talking to many other people who. are in this eos startup e everyone has a. very good clean image about you. [laughter]. I thought there's a lot to talk about.

this man why are only these out let's do. that [laughter]. but yeah. let's let's unveil those things which. are not out okay about your family your. legacy or your your grandparents story. father. So, right. grandfather was the first generation,

right? >> They were villagers uh in agriculture. Where are you from? >> From Nelor. Okay. >> Nel there's a small town or outside it. called. So, >> oh nice. >> And farmland. All the older generation used to go. Nice. Nice. Okay. My um so they were two. people there were two uh we actually. have a book called the Gapati book. Oh. okay. >> Which actually takes all the six seven. generations with names with photos with. tree.

>> Yeah I have a tree. >> You have a. you. actually first generation seven kids. Seven kids have five six kids each. So. Tata, my subra tata and my mother's. mother, >> myama are in that family. Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. Oh, nice. >> So, my parents are second cousins to. each other. >> I didn't know this. Okay.

Okay. So, so actually first second. generation. they were in construction EPC contracts. Telu EPC contracts are very good at. >> that's just in our nature somehow. [laughter] So, so uh yeah they came from. uh went to Chennai a lot of them then. they came to Hyderabad. So u so I think. agriculture contracts cont.

everywhere you there. was coming [laughter]. he was asking me. so. I was telling him. and there are uh airports that you have. built. Okay.

Let's talk about all those. Was GVK Mall. a PR thing or a profitable business? How. did that start? And let's also talk. about all all those businesses. So um so. I think '90s. '7s. contracts. before 90s 80s low wood manufacturing. business better. >> uh called nopan industries. >> okay. >> and so. and then after that got into hotels.

>> I don't know if you. then Taj was holiday and then hotels. next to power projects first 91 built. first independent power project private. power project in India in Jagur Padu in. uh in Andhra Pradesh. >> right. >> and uh that was the first plant that was. the first in 1991. private plan road then after that in.

airports after that and then. actually. As far as I know, but what is this article? I was reading. that GVK has bought complete Taj. Hospital. But how far is it true? >> No, it's basically their joint venture. Okay. >> So my aunt runs it. So Taj is a operator. most places and asset owner.

That's normally how it is. Except in. Mumbai and Delhi where they own their. own hotels. There's always a there's. asset owner then there's an operator. >> Right now it is we who own the property. That's right. Land hotels and. everything. mall.

My aunt hotels. [laughter]. exactly 30 years. >> So city. exactly 25. Oh nice. >> And but mall mall is a good business. Mall is a very good business. and first. few years 2005. and. very.

okay. used to be there actually. [clears throat]. Okay. Okay. And we should also talk. about your dad. >> Yeah. >> What is it like working with your dad?

>> See, my my dad is actually one of the. most inspiring people. And he's in work. and in person life. He's like the best. father for me, my sister, my wife, and. my brother-in-law. And then he's in. work. He's super inspiring. and he's. like um he's 62 running on 13 in his. mind in you know he he he loves new age. technologies and he he like loves. building new businesses. >> he's realized that actually many very.

few entrepreneurs can build many. businesses in many different industries. >> right. >> and I think he or my have proven that. you can do it. >> many ways in uh in India you'll see that. you know very few family business people. are able to do that they stick to one. thing and stick go very deep into it. action pattern first generation second. generation. >> and he was also recognized as India's. top 25 young entrepreneurs he was. recognized. 2007 low I think. >> crazy. >> world economic forum he was US law no um.

he was a commencement speaker in. University of Michigan in his business. school. >> he was in Purdue University. commencement speaker so that was a very. very big achievement and then apart from. that I think he's anybody you meet he. has um right discipline right positive. attitude and uh he's he's like a super. inspiring to work with.

so [laughter]. I was shocked today in the morning I was. reading this facts. he has done his PhD in philosophy Crazy. [laughter]. [laughter]. How about Vina? How how is of course her. support is needed everywhere. So we. should talk about her. >> Yeah. No, Vina is an amazing person. I. think you get to know her. She's very. funny. Uh very very open. She'll be a.

perfect fit. [laughter]. No, but she's an amazing person and she. >> if she loves somebody, she's there for. that person no matter what and every all. of us. >> Is she not in your business also? >> She actually started she's working in. one of the business. It's a fertility. business. >> that I've read. So she started. >> equal early days she helped me a little. bit then she's uh started working with. in one of the businesses that have been.

started in the family companies. >> Okay. >> And she loves it. I mean she had this. you should chat with her about it. She's. very passionate about it and very. missionoriented about it. I'm very. excited you know when when somebody has. a you know passion and that aligns with. their work no it's like something else. everything else is secondary then. >> so it's always nice to see that. Yeah. and for her especially. >> let's talk about you now. me me journey one thing which I got very. much excited was your Mckenzie journey.

>> see generally. there's a there is a lot of toughest. process to get into that. >> how was that experience. >> Mckenzie is one of the top tier. consulting firms globally. >> and. Tesla. >> M. >> summer internships. doing Mckenzie summer internship is like. the the best you can get. M.

India is the land of opportunities or. Asia all my internships most of my work. throughout my career I've always been in. India. >> and. I came to Bombay. >> Bombay and. there was. I went there first and they put me on a. project in Indonesia and Singapore. >> Okay. Okay. >> So, I was based out of the Southeast. Asia office. >> Mhm. >> And uh.

>> you cracked it here but went there. >> Yeah. Yeah, that's right. >> And actually Mckenzil, it's amazing what they teach you. It's. literally like they put the smartest. people they find in a room. >> Okay. >> And they solve problems. It's like it's. you know and and I think I've learned. learnings from everywhere. project. There was one person from the. US Navy. >> and American guy. >> and uh we were talking about discipline.

and very interesting story. >> Okay. >> He said discipline and work ethic is. showing up at the right time at the. right place with the right material with. the right people. >> That's it. 80% of your work is done. >> Right? And I thought that was simple%. most relevant [laughter]. and. projects are I mean the world has.

changed. most. because. >> you feel so seeing. firms. >> correct All three AI can do instantly. validation. >> stamp mckenzie. approved. everything is AI so what is correct. what's not there so it will evolve.

I will make your entire firm native. [laughter]. it's inevitable. >> it's inevitable M. So how was that. experience? Almost 3 to four months. >> 3 to four months summer internship 3 to. 4 months. Um I realized after that. experience I never want to hire. consultants. Oh, [laughter] because.

fivestar hotel. >> too much expense. >> client. >> and actually that family business. thought [laughter]. [gasps]. consultants I I think in very niche. spaces where intelligence they're very. good. >> right. >> but general knowledge they're not the. best And uh that's my that's my take.

>> Got it. Everyone can be best there. >> Makes sense. [laughter]. I get so much excited. experience is something which is. interesting. They're life changing. They're life changing. Actually, when. internships are so underrated cuz once. you you go, you're young, you're excited. to learn. because.

in the business. I'll try everything. >> before I join. So I did six internships. Yeah, I've seen I haven't seen one in. private equity, one in consulting, one. in mining, one in government of India, >> one in our farmer business and one in. our airports business. >> What was this? Government of India sir. >> I work in planning commission of India. planning commission of India. >> All the chief ministers have to go and. the uh the chairman of planning.

commission used to be the prime minister. >> and uh they used to go there submit. their fiveyear budget planning. Oh okay. >> So members board members. So I worked. for one of the board members for two. three months. Actually you realize you. learn so much. >> very smart people in the government. >> They are way smarter than everybody. else. >> Right. >> And uh they determine the future of the. country. >> Very true. >> And that that small board or committee. >> Yeah. >> decides everything.

>> Correct. I always used to wonder there are few. certain rooms or certain closed doors. [clears throat]. >> Uh it's not so easy for a common man. like me to go inside or a moment. >> you saying you're a common man bro. seriously. [laughter]. No. So of course having network is. different having access to that uh. discussions is different. So when when I. just think about it. example AI if it is called as a. disruption.

I I always stay curious. actually. prime minister is par excellence he's. kept such a stable country for so many. years. and panic stability all the nationwide. leaders.

they're all going towards development in. the right direction you look at any. country in the world is state of chaos. >> from every leader to the people there I. mean who would have thought you know. this war would lead to so many things in. Dubai for example. >> now let's talk about something which is. interesting or a bit deeper and. >> have you heard about this third. generation curse. >> Yeah. >> So, how's the pressure.

uh financial crisis or business. [laughter] because. so whatever you do will actually hit the. tree completely. Of course it's not a. very very huge thing that. but still whatever you're doing. >> it gives you that. So all your life how. was that pressure? You're 30 plus right. now if I can quote [laughter] that. So. >> I I'm very happy with my age. >> No no [laughter] I'm I'm just kidding.

So what do you think about this. pressure? So n actually in China I always had um I. always was grateful for the platform I. had. >> and I always thrived in that opportunity. from I was like head boy in school I was. this and I never felt it as a. responsibility or a burden I actually. think it's a great opportunity. >> and the third generation curse is real. >> it's a absolutely real so you have to. >> what do you mean by that.

>> it means that by the time the first. generation actually builds the the. wealth health, the company, whatever it. is. The second generation grow with that. and they scale it up a lot. The third. generation is uh you know born with a. silver spoon. So they don't see. hardships. They don't know how to build. They don't generally destroy it. >> They destroy it cuz then they're you. know they're not value creators. >> No no no. >> And I think that curse only happens when. you actually have no motivation. >> and you have nothing to look forward to. or to achieve or earn. Oh,

>> and I think I've always been very humble. that way because of my mother. >> and very ambitious because of my father. So I never had that curse. >> Mom will strict and. >> mom is not strict but she's very larger. than life. >> Yeah. >> Very uh she's done I think thousand. ribbon cutings in the country. >> Oh yeah. She's. heard about it. Yeah. Yeah. >> But yeah, she's uh she's the type of. person who's very humble and very um. very approachable by anybody from. anywhere. And I think for me that that.

third generation course didn't happen. because I myself was very hungry to. prove myself and I've consistently been. if you've known me from when I was 15. I've been the same person. >> So what what more what else can I do and. that hunger and excitement keeps keeps. um keeps you going. >> Oh I get it. and uh. >> and how much see uh the opportunity or. maybe the. exposure. >> when I keep saying. whenever we had a discussion we have a. discussion I keep saying family finance.

business. so collection so I I I used to go with. my uncle my father's brother. >> and collection so naturally we have to. collect money to pull the money and then. give it to the whoever. the auction. Correct.

So the kind of exposure I used to get. there is different. Absolutely. The same. way. exposure is different allgether. Sundays. the problems that you discuss are huge. >> technically maybe not for you but. huge. >> what were those best learnings or best u. I wonder times that you spent in your. family which turned you. >> maybe.

see when I joined the business, infrastructure business by looks amazing. >> but actually very challenging. >> and um I joined business 2014 I. graduated up. >> and I joined. >> you mean infrastructure this includes. even airports and all. >> yeah everything uh and generally. airports, roads, power plants, infrastructure business. >> uh and uh I joined the business a very. tough time. >> very very challenging time a lot of. infra companies have gone through huge.

issues over the years and Um and we. actually like I joined in a very very. tough challenging moment. So I think a. lot of my learnings also came from that. >> that you know it's you have to work hard. and there's so many challenging times. and you have to solve one problem at. once. >> right. >> and I think um I'm very proud actually. that my father grandfather have steered. so well they're one of the very few. infra company promoters who sold big. businesses to settle uh banks and.

everything and I think they're uh they. have such a good reputation because of. that and Uh and I think. >> what do you mean by that? >> Generally I think when a lot of infra. companies grew with a lot of debt. >> correct. >> and then we actually start exiting. infrastructure because we wanted to. close off the debts of that business and. there were many other businesses that we. built. So the idea was um you know we'll. grow but these are businesses which are. very challenging to run. So I think we. said okay we don't want to be in certain. businesses and we'll build now if for. example our farmer business is the.

second largest in India in farmer. research already. >> or there are other businesses in real. estate in malls and other businesses. that we built now obviously with AI so. many new businesses are getting built. >> so I think the learnings are actually. when you're going through tough periods. of time you realize what is really. important and uh when things are good. you don't learn. >> so I think that is uh that is very. important in in your own journey and. career. M. if you just one fine morning you wake up.

and say 100 crores is the fund now I. need to invest in the startups. >> let's help the startups who are going to. build the best best things who are not. going to get affected by by these things. what are those five sectors you would. invest. >> uh you know when we started. I've been investing since 2015. >> and I have the list of startups also. >> you have all the list [laughter] of. startups. >> you know when you actually meet founders. and you meet people. and then.

second is actually space. building. one of the first investments 2015. [clears throat]. Oh yeah. There were three people Ravi, Rau and. very expensive. [laughter]. RKSV securities. Oh, okay. RKSVL.

We used to co-invest. Yeah, she's been on the show also. Ah, she's amazing. She's very very dynamic. and amazing like a mentor to me. Correct. >> So, Vani said um she was investing. >> up to uh I think $3 million. >> uh at $15 million valuation and they. were they were number 20th in the list. of brokerages in India. >> Okay.

>> First meeting I said these guys are. going to do something big. Plat the. space is big. Their vision was big. They. came back from America. They worked in a. company which was very big called. interactive brokers and they came in an. article. You should find their article. >> Okay. >> They uh you know in trading trading. volume. >> because you allow traders they built it. for traders. >> Right. Right. >> Uh and they themselves were traders. So. they had lacks of crows of trading on.

the platform. They will scale the right people right. market. Timing was not correct. 2015. they really became big. and today now they're top five in. brokerages valued at three and a half. billion and uh they're very close. friends of mine we continue to invest in. the company Tiger Global Cheru Danta. >> so you haven't exited now. >> no no continue to hold you know 15.

million. yeah. 500km Matt. 500. So $4 million round. >> Oh, only three of you. >> Yeah. Three of us. >> and it's one of I mean it was like over. 100x right. >> if you see the trajectory of companies. know first of all you shouldn't leave. early you should stay the full ride. >> right. >> and if you believe in the people. >> right. >> and uh I have so much faith and trust in. these guys building we not even touching.

the surface 100 million demat accounts. in India with 1.4 4 billion people are. just starting you look in China it's. like half a billion accounts so the. world in India know next 10 years people. will not recognize this country. >> ah you put Hyderabad so many people come. to Hyderabad now they're like I can't. imagine what's happen. people are shocked shocked.

years back. [laughter]. 10 years back in my first job I used to. travel on a bike 18 to 20 minutes. but that's what yeah absolutely see this. I mean that's a whole topic Hyderabad is. I love Hyderabad I love Bombay but.

Hyderabad is the number one city to live. In India, >> everyone says that. >> everyone it's the most I think uh ranked. five or six years in a row as the most. livable city. Very true. >> In pollution, we are the lowest relative. lowest. >> in traffic. We are relatively good at. building infrastructure. >> In quality of living, in cost of living, in aesthetically everything is thanks to. all the politicians, >> the main politicians who are parties. things are going well. last 15 years like compared to Bangalore.

>> simple example. >> and say now that we have. investments. >> uh generally when you're investing. because you led that family office you. were the one who leading the ground. was one of the startups that also this. is at least 10 years back 10 to 11 years. back how was your thought process back. Then. how was how was how were you thinking.

back then and generally I've seen many. investors pitch I was proxy for certain. startups even I I. couple of times raised my startups. startup. >> I know certain investors who talk about. exit first. >> so how was your thought process back. then the first startup when you've led. the round to 30 plus startup. conversation. >> how are you thinking right now. >> I I think the so there there are two. deals of companies that I believed in.

very very. >> okay. >> like very very seriously. One was um. when Alibaba investment by SoftBank. >> that was around that same 1999. era. >> uh and then that was they bought one/ird. of the company for around $20 million so. about $60 million valuation only. At the. similar time two years before that um. Naspers Naspers uh invested in Tencent. >> okay. >> Tencent which has.

>> both those companies took 15 to 20 years. to mature. >> Nasper's investment and Alibaba's. investment when these companies IPOed. anywhere in last 5 to 10 years were. worth 80 billion and 150 billion. respectively. >> So companies grow in tech like this. >> Yeah. So you your your subscriber base. would have grown like this. >> Absolutely. >> You know if someone met you somewhere in. between.

I'll tell you something. >> and that is that is my thesis on tech. >> for sure. [snorts]. September [laughter] 923. like message. [laughter]. >> I'm very proud of you. Oh, thank you. very much. So, I generally send a. screenshot of my channel also. >> This is my uh channel. These are the. because I don't want them to click a. link and then go to channel. Let them.

just watch the numbers on it. >> Correct. >> Two lakh subscribers, three subscrib. >> and. couple of guests, they'll not respond. because of some some reason. All of a. sudden when I get a message back after 2. years later [laughter]. then I see. it was two lakhs when I sent the. message. [laughter] So just just imagine. years.

it has multiple reasons for it. Absolutely you told absolutely. [laughter]. no. channel. uh November 2023 I 22 or 23 22. 22. >> 22 amazing amazing trajectory I'm very. proud of you Akadi now you're everywhere. which is amazing [laughter] we're two. and a half years late on my part. >> no I still remember you told uh I'm. building something interesting let's.

take some more time and. I've never done podcast before. >> this is my first podcast [laughter] see. no that's Okay. Because you think English first. No, that's what it happens. >> You know, I grew up uh with Telu as a. primary. But college, high school, you I. didn't learn Telu. I learned Hindi and. then French and then Spanish, second. language, third language. So.

[laughter] okay. So let's also talk about those people. who are in your business. who have. invested in your business maybe equal. >> Yeah. >> Kunal Sha and Niko there. >> How was it that previously you invested. in credit and now [laughter] invested in. your startup? >> Kunal is uh is something else if you. ever spend time with him. >> That's what.

[laughter]. actually. I lived in Bombay for many years seven. eight years. used to run free church. >> Mhm. This was when you were managing. airport business up and uh I knew Kunal. from those days and he has he's a very. different person. >> He has a he thinks about he's a he's a. psychology major by the way. >> Mhm. >> He never did engineering. >> And he always thinks about what are the. incentives of a person.

>> Interesting. >> So everything he thinks are in those. patterns and lines. So even free charge. he used to pay you something for. charging recharging your phone like it's. very psychological thing. Oh, no. >> Even cred is a form of that. You see the. the one page that he sent everybody for. when he's raising a seed round. >> white paper just why people care or will. care about credit score. >> or credit score. >> and he's like a very interesting fellow. that way. uh one of the leading thinkers.

>> he thinks a lot. >> right. >> uh and um and then he basically I think. you know at that time we invested in in. cred and then um when I was starting. equal he was like yeah sure and he's a. WhatsApp investor he's invested in over. hundreds of companies in India. >> right. >> he has a model he people who he thinks. are in smart who he looks up to and. people he has a fixed amount he invests. in everything so that's his model. >> right. >> nickel on the other side is a uh is.

again a visionary thinker and he like. he's building so many things of large. interest. I'm very fond of both of them. him and his brother. >> and they're good friends also. >> and uh Bini of course has built one of. India's largest flipkart. >> and uh Bini actually was um is in that. phase where he's building a lot of. things as well. So all three I look up. to and I think they're you know there. are other people also angels are people. who look up to friends and. >> you want people in your journey like. that you know. >> how do you how do you guys discuss.

progress of the business I'm talking. about equal sure. >> so generally when you deal with. investors though you know them. personally. >> but you keep having those professional. discussions. discuss. >> see tech is very different than uh. traditional businesses. >> right uh tech reviews their whole. business model grows. You have to be so. quick in what you build. >> So I send a quarterly newsletter with. basically everything you need to know. >> Okay. >> And uh that is the way I command I see. everyone around they ask what's.

happening. >> and how we can partner do more. So see. you you asked me a question about. correct investors or. >> not one investor has asked me for an. exit. >> Oh no. >> Yeah. Because our right the people who. want to make this India's largest tech. company. >> you want those people in your right in. your journey and it is a journey the fun. of building every day and compounding. and building something bigger so how are. you thinking right now. see.

how do you validate the valuation. whether it is right or not because. there's no thumb rule Yeah. How do you validate 2015. thought process? Tech is very very risky. >> It's hit or miss. >> Absolutely. >> The chance of success is so low that in.

your mind you should be ready for nine. companies going to zero and one becoming. a super winner. >> Right. And if you see actually all these. funds are like that one, two are. winners, two three return money, rest. are don't even return money. >> So. investing is a state of mind actually. >> Yeah. >> If you go in with that exit for that. type of investments tech is completely. wrong for you. You have to think about. okay. market will be become bigger, he will.

become bigger and then the whole you. have to run with the ride. M. >> so Apuru I think I had these two. companies or ideas of how you know how. you should invest. >> in terms of yeah case studies and. long-term nature. >> and even today I believe in that these. companies will take long and they will. grow very significant uh over duration. as you keep compounding the right. behavior business grows right way and. everything in that in that sense. >> live example 15 million. what's the estimated.

>> it was 15 million round three and a half. billion and this is before they do a. next round or list stuff like that. >> So see these are tech companies are like. that but we have many companies which. have shut down also. >> That's. >> so you should never go in that mentality. but thesis slightly changed. >> Mhm. >> Um that you believe. >> tech Yeah. My belief has changed a. little bit. >> Uh I think companies. are getting built faster. >> and are dying faster. >> and with AI it accelerates both.

>> Yeah. Yeah. So there's a very. interesting article that uh companies. will become single person you know. unicorns. >> but also they'll get challenged so fast. that you can't you can't bet on things. for long anymore. >> right right. >> and that is what is happening so you. have to build um digital businesses. that's my current thesis. >> got it. >> building an Uber is very tough. >> getting riders getting the vehicles.

>> software is easy. >> but actually getting the network is very. hard. >> So my thesis actually put digital. businesses are the ones which will. thrive. >> What do you think would be the next bet. that you would want to invest in or. maybe support? >> See I think equal AI platform build. >> AI assistant. Yeah, >> we grew from zero users in in this new. product in um October we launch October. 2nd. We always launch on some important. day for India business.

I don't know why somehow. [laughter]. >> So. we closed from zero customers. We went. to 75,000. >> users on our call assistant by Jan end. >> This is B2C. >> B2C. >> B2B already B2B anyway only B2C. Yeah. So Jan and 75,000 monthly active users. >> then we grew to 383,000. then we grew to 850,000 in March.

>> So the trajectory is like this and it. continue like that. So all products once. it click there. >> that's all. >> that's crazy first it's very much. exciting. >> uh the kind of uh merger. one. >> one money account. >> you've taken it completely. >> yeah so we merged the company so. basically how how did it start what is. the business idea. >> so the business idea was uh data in.

India people share on WhatsApp. >> and they share and for you want to get a. job You want to get a loan, you want to. get healthare services, you want. insurance very informal. >> and government of India built India. stack with UPI payments right. >> account aggregator financial data diger. personal documents so platform that. enables easy sharing between customer. and a business. >> so we moved into um you know KYC went.

into data sharing regulatory licenses. >> then we said Okay. And AI assistant. and for for you know for India. >> because we realize data is being shared. for purpose. You know we have over 500. customers enterprise businesses who are. customers on our B2B business. >> example. >> like uh SBI or everything right all the. large banks NBFC's Airtel all these. businesses and when we realized that you. know there is huge opportunity actually.

started the company up for B2C only we. realized problem was in the B2B layer. cuz knew if you wanted to get a loan you. would share it in anyway and the person. giving you the loan would upload it. anyway so we wanted to build the. merchant access, business access. >> And then now we building the customer. layer. So in 2 3 years you won't. recognize the company. It'll be an it'll. be an AI assistant, an AI platform, an. app that you use for everything in your. life. >> Crazy B2B because we we never understand. the scale because it's happening behind.

us. >> Yeah. company HDFC I have the list of. the startups I mean brands which are. working with you. >> platform. knowingly and knowingly basic. equal. >> every transaction or if I ask you we are. being touched or maybe equally is. touching us [laughter]. in the process of these transactions or. something. Yeah, I think see where you. use us is uh in financial services.

especially loan. income documents. >> uh brokerage account broker open new. account they for limits to increase. >> insurance. uh PFM personal finance app or you're. checking your money. >> in uh places of um anything with other. assets you want to share for some loan. or for something all these places touch. financial data sharing which you'll. touches. >> So one of the largest in uh account. aggregator. >> there are three or four large players we.

are if not we are the largest actually. right. >> so that you know India scale. >> is the most exciting thing. >> you know you messaged me up. >> about the ink talk about scale I don't. know if you remember that video. >> and it's I still believe in that. >> that you know we don't we have seen in. our lifetime maybe 50,000 people in one. place max you go to a stadium, you go. for a match, you go for so and so.

>> maybe political rally if you went to. maybe 500,000 people you seen. >> You've not seen more than that in scale. We are 1.4 billion people. >> It's insane to think about how many. people are in this country and the scale. and the opportunity. So I'm a huge. believer in love of scale and India. >> visible. [laughter]. [gasps]. >> Nice. Nice. So uh what the story about. this one money and Danindu we had to. acquire acquire acquire. >> Yeah it was a acquisition and a merger.

>> basically uh we realized financial data. business law. So this was acquired by. equal so um uh you know financial data. business law uh regulatory license are. very important. >> and that's why actually we have um three. deputy governors of RBI on different. boards of ours uh and because they give. us all the right governance the right. guidance. >> and um when we were when we were we had. started with personal data sharing. between business customers everything is. consented my business consented customer. is sharing for some purpose and then we.

enable the right way to share And uh. then you know we went into health we. went into employment use cases financial. law you have to have a regulatory. license. >> So to enter with a regulatory license we. we felt it is a very logical business. for us to enter. So, how about this B2C? I've seen a video of an influencer. phone. How can he install? That's. amazing, man. May May first week.

after. maybe three weeks. Okay. Yeah, that's. right. Um so what we're building is we. think that callam. but Indians also like talking on the. phone for everything for every. transaction. So basically we said okay we want to. solve that painoint we want to be a call. assistant. >> So phone call is the unknown call. The.

assistant picks up on your behalf, speaks like you, gets the context, then. tells you if it's important, then you. can pick up. >> Oh, >> so it's a very smart call assistant. But. then because that we are able to do for. you. We have now known contacts also. I'll pick up. Other than your mother, father, siblings, spouse, kids, lot of. work colleagues, people who come home, you'll send assistant address for. details. So adant it can do we feed the.

information before. >> it learns from whatever you say. >> and then and then we'll do messages. it'll help uh manage for you it'll do. tasks for you you know when you get a. call about a loan. >> when you say yeah I'm interested it'll. help you actually get the best loan. >> and then and then uh so you'll see all. of that coming this year it will be the. one layer that you talk to for. everything in your native language today. all level languages which are the. primary languages in India it's able to. handle at high skill when when you say.

then you can pick up. >> like how much time does it take and uh. how does the process go if I'm getting. an unknown call now. >> correct. >> what happens. >> so the assistant picks it up. >> okay. >> automatically picks it up in Android in. iOS you have to send to assistant. >> okay. >> uh and then uh because iOS the way it's. built out. >> and uh the assistant says hey this is. assistant. >> uh tell me uh why you calling and then. whichever language and we'll converse. And then we'll take the takeaway. If. it's important, we'll connect a call to. you. >> Oh,

>> based on what you like. You can put your. status. You can decide when you want. calls to come to you, when you don't. want it. And that's just the starting. Everything that you want in your life, you will have a expert agent for you. doing everything for you. >> So your personal AI for everything you. want. >> Oh, assistant answer. >> Okay. If it is making sense that then. it'll send it to me, right? One one. straight question. I'm just talking about the chat or maybe.

basic. two to three days for open I mean chat. GP to launch it example correct. option C is giving it another 3 days or. one week. back to back back to back so how far. will equal stay in the in the in the. game as a top player. everything is possible Absolutely. >> How do you think you are different and. how how strong can you stay when the.

competitors are in the in the game? >> Absolutely. See, I think there are two. reasons why uh I told you that things. life of companies will be shorter. >> Oh no. >> And that's why you are saying exactly. everybody is building the same thing. faster. >> Every 6 months our competitive advantage. will evolve and change. >> and we have to keep changing it. Today. it may be we are for smaller advantage. after that it could be network density. lot of people are using us. >> thereby people are using us more and.

more apart from that we have um tens of. millions of people who use our consented. rails for data sharing. >> right. >> so that becomes a a way where it says. vamsi has an account oh hey you want a. loan it'll help you. >> do better. >> so I think that can be a mode. >> and then over time we're building for. bharat Right. >> I think that will make us succeed. We're. building with hyperfocus. If you think. of all the AI assistants that you're. talking about, they build for global. scale. They don't think about each.

region anymore cuz the the world of AI. is actually a global platform, >> right? >> And we are building for absolute. Indiaentric and I think that will make. us succeed. >> All the best for it. [laughter]. >> No, I think we will succeed. I think. we're hit a. >> I'm sure because I know you personally. We we thought was gapati. I've been. talking to your team also. I know about. you and your leadership. So I'm sure. about it in this scale. eight lakhs recent numbers eight lakhs. plus B2C if they're involved into I mean. using your application that Android.

launch iOS launch iOS will be super hit. >> because a call assistant. >> right. >> iOS people are the ones who have more. disposable income they want these. services they're busier in their life. while actually more important. >> so while they it'll a super hit and now. I was thinking from the other side. [laughter].

crazy. >> AI costs are crazy unless people bring. it down at scale to lower cost India. everybody and everyone won't be able to. use it. >> you'll hit the pay wall very quickly. >> use please pay and that's That's. actually. >> and now it's almost token system tokens. Yeah, I can understand. Huh? >> See also one insight that we have is. that uh over a billion people in India. have never used AI.

I've never. >> and even now I mean when you search on. Google and it says hey it's an AI I. don't count that. >> somebody has to intend to go on to let's. say Gemini or Chad GBT or claude and. then actually ask something. >> Um over a billion people have never used. AI because. >> they don't know where to start. >> True. It is actually quite intimidating. India law people can't are more used to. conversing speaking in multiple. languages. >> Writing reading and writing is not.

typically very they're not very used to. it. >> So actually my insight in that voice. will become the biggest medium for an AI. assistant. So wherein voice. conversational AI assistant any language. anything you want you can just ask and. it'll get it done for you. That is what. will succeed. So building building for. India there are a lot of different. nuances you're. >> correct. Correct. So where do you look. at yourself about equal in the next 5. years. >> I think we'll be u one of the leaders in.

AI in India doing everything for you in. your day-to-day life. >> We'll probably becoming um a platform. that you you want to get the cheapest. iPhone or you want to go buy a car or. you want to get some insurance or you. want to speak to somebody about. something. Today when you're buying. something it's very interesting people. will call me you'll call your baba. you'll call your uncle you'll call shop. friend you know something you always. call people you always find out before. you make a purchase. >> and we want to be that person for you.

>> right. >> when you're thinking about. customercentric. >> the kind of uh lack of exposure. I I'll just be corrected also. example in general I I get a chance to. go out and meet a shopkeeper in general. >> I can't even imagine after coming to. your house also. [laughter].

so you lose those uh what do you call. tiniest patterns to understand Indian. psychology. so was it not difficult for you to. understand Indian market. >> not really Actually you have uh you've. come to my office. It's Oh, you haven't. come yet. You should come to supposed to. come. >> It's a it's an open office. Anybody can. talk to me. I sit with everybody. >> You don't have a cabin, right? >> No, I don't have a cabin. I have a. cabin. >> And see the idea is if you're humble.

enough to learn to be. >> mistaken and to be corrected and to. learn through that. >> Um my insight is you can build any. company. M. >> anybody with any level of dedication, hard work and like will you ask me one. thing why would you invest in founders. >> you know the biggest reason I invest in. people or founders in people actually is. what they have to lose. >> like you have to see their motivations.

many people if they don't have what they. you know their motivations are so clear. they want to prove it to somebody they. have something to lose they won't have a. house to live in. >> they uh you know have some past baggage. that they want to just make sure that. they want to clear every person has a. story a very deep story and if you get. to that story and they tell you the. reason why they're doing what they're. doing. >> um they'll move mountains those people. >> and I love I love those people people. who are trying to prove someone wrong.

who's trying to beat something you know. you have to have a purpose. >> otherwise you get bored and you don't. there's no motivation. >> no I get it reality. sentimental. thought process change. India is is in such state where every. 100 kilometers taste and preferences. changes a lot. So.

maybe your grandfather might have had. different insights altogether. Your. father might have had different insights. together. Absolutely. Maybe. access less of access to the outside. world. So I think correct because if you tell. me what the price of onions or circle I. won't know and I'll be very bad. There's. one funny video you should see of Bill. Gates trying to guess how much grocery. is on Ellen, >> right? >> It shows how much I he is very.

successful in every ride, but he had was. so wrong on all the. >> No, that is where people like me learn. business. I'm a good negotiator. >> Oh, that's [laughter] great. >> See, because I actually believe in. value. >> I don't believe in price. >> There's a big difference in that. M. >> you you will pay a lot of money for. something if you see the value in it. >> M. >> and if you if something is overpriced.

even at a low lower price I won't pay. for it. >> That's that's just my mentality. And I. think my my mother's my grandfather's. mother is like that. >> She is like knows numbers to the tip. She's the smartest person in my family. She's the one who ran a lot of the Taj. hotels and. >> uh she will tell you my Nanama. >> uh I learned a lot from her. I'm very. similar to her in that sense. >> Yeah. She sits on many boards. She's. regarded as one of the most uh inspiring. woman leaders.

>> publicly company boards. Yeah. >> Is GBK family group betting more on AI. with technological advancements? I've. not I've not seen anything recently. Sure. >> So, uh family office or like a holding. company has incubated a lot of. companies. 2022 10 companies incubate. Oh, nice structure segment segment. generally in many many different. businesses. >> Okay. and AIO we've done about three. companies which would include equities.

family capital. >> and um and then we'll basically every. year we start two new businesses. >> and that's the idea and these are like. >> new age or old age or like uh. traditional businesses with a new age. twist I think inside. AI and software will take over how old. businesses are run. >> It disrupts the models completely.

>> of distribution, operations, execution. So you have to rethink and the people. who are rethinking them will be ones. with an advantage. >> So that is like a very important. It can. be customer experience also. It can be. like new product innovation. It can be. um you know algorithms that are. predicting things better. You know there. are different ways. >> right. >> software was disrupting the last 10. years software has been disrupting many. business AI is disrupting software also.

and all other businesses. >> Now if you put uh you know physical AI. like humanoids. and robots it disrupts the whole. business models. >> cuz they work more efficiently for. longer hours for different uh ways. But. of course I am concerned I think with we. have a large population who need to have. work and purpose and job. So. >> I'm a big proponent of finding that. balance. >> Nice. And here I wanted to talk about.

the importance of founding team. >> both legacy business startups bigger. scale ideas founders team or founding. team or found co-founders the importance. of those. >> uh few people. >> if we need to talk about see. the people that you my my nana always. says that the people you start anything. with a business they have to be the. right people. >> right. >> and we spoke about how many businesses. is how do you run so many businesses.

with the right people leaders? You have to have cultural alignment. You. have to be principally on the same page. You know, you have to finish each. person's sentence should know that this. is. this is our goal. >> and this is where we want to get to. And. at the same time, you have to have. immense trust of the person. >> If you don't trust each other, the. number one reason startups fail is. because co-founders fight. >> Very true. And then I think the second.

is like funding is not there. But in. it's such a critical thing to find the. right business partner, co-founder, whatever you call it, founding team that. it's like wildly understated. It's like. marriage. [laughter] actually there 14, 15, 16. hours a day. So very important decisions that is life. has a set scale but business has a huge. scale [laughter] goal is different all.

together. alignment. >> it's a different marriage all together. >> yeah I agree. >> that's a relation yeah somewhere. >> very important relationship. >> yeah [laughter]. I I read about something interesting uh. >> exit relation uh closure relation for. some a business sir. >> if it's not working the relation is. broken it's not just a money relation. that you have lost but it's also your. baby something which is lost from you. [laughter] that's very tough I can. imagine.

very important. >> what are those patterns that you. observed. issues. not just with founders also the founding. team. >> absolutely absolutely. >> incentive is different no see business. founders the kind of incentive they get. >> and the founding team they get is. different salaries incentives. >> so what is that pattern you observed uh. which is not that kind of. We are not so incentivized. What was the pattern that you have.

observed? >> I my pattern I've observed is that. founders founding team mission is most. important. >> Yeah. >> If you're not aligned on mission where. you want to go. >> and the direction of where you want to. take this business then a lot of it. fails through. M. >> second is I think building companies is. a team sport. >> Oh yeah. >> You know you we all see founders in the. front as they have built it but there. are so many people behind it who are the.

real building blocks. >> So that being able to and I think most. of the businesses that I've been. involved with it's always the team. >> right. >> that they have done amazing work. So I. think that is like founding team. that they get the right they get the. seat in the front. >> for putting their time for sweat for you. know prioritizing opportunity cost. that is the most important second I. think third is. >> if you're able to and if you're lucky.

enough to find people. >> who are absolute alignment I have many. people in the business that I run. including equal that I start a sentence, they'll finish. >> It I can't tell you it's like then. delegation means like 10 steps behind Ed. in that thing in whatever they doing. >> cuz I know that broadly I'm on the same. page for sure and they're going to do. what I would have wanted to do. Then you. can expand your sphere of uh influence. >> and that's such a difficult thing to do.

>> It's delegation is one part. >> This is like absolute trusted. delegation. >> Yeah. And uh when that happens you know. it leads to immense outcomes. You see. the relationship with many leaders. >> that Steve Jobs had with Johnny IV in. design what he had with uh you know Tim. Cook in execution supply chain. operations. >> that led him to do innovation. >> Yeah. >> And you see many companies which have a. lot of turmoil they will not last.

>> You need like. >> unless you're Elon Musk. >> the other companies won't last. So, >> you speak a lot about Lam Mosque. >> I think he's uh he's like um he's. probably going to be the most uh uh. profound human in in this century. And. so four hours. next level. question.

he'll think. he'll think he runs all the. probabilities in his mind and then. answers and whatever he says is so. profound. >> It's like crazy. And I I I think when I. met him in person I thought he's like. more superhuman than ever before. I mean. he came from like six things in work. which are like critical. Then he went. put his kids to sleep. >> Then he came for the podcast at 10:45. p.m. >> and he stayed on till 2:30 4 hours.

>> non-stop. >> He didn't stop in in no breaks. >> Okay. >> And uh I don't know how he's like he's. so in the zone and everything he talks. was like most people wouldn't have. understood half that podcast. [laughter]. because of how ahead he was in his. thinking and I think see he's building. human face interface I mean human chip. interface he's building a electric car. company which is like profound he's. building a social media company he's.

building um you know electric car. company he's building the world's. largest satellite system. >> he's building a large defense company. he's building. >> I mean just each of these are like. massive opportunities but so difficult. to build. >> So I mean I really look up to him. I. think he's the for any entrepreneur. I. think he's number one. >> Of course. You also met uh Sam Elman, right? >> Another celebrated name now right now. >> Yeah. >> How was your how was that experience?

>> I don't think he was as impressive. >> Oh no. >> See because he didn't. >> Yeah. No, see he's built an you know. Elon claims and Elon Sam alman have this. whole thing. Elon named the company. OpenAI. He gave its founding $50 million. as a foundation. >> Uh he claims to be one of the founders. actually. >> Uh Sam Alman is a great leader but for. not for a $800 billion company. I didn't. find him so impressive in person. >> Oh. >> um the company has done amazing. I mean.

built wildly like without Chad Gibb the. whole era did not start. >> Um. >> that's what we all know right? Even now. [laughter]. but I mean I can't compare them. I mean. that's like so different in my mind. So how do you think that with your. limited thought process. Sam Alman. proper office with like 10 15 people.

>> Elon Law one time in uh in the he's so. frugal Elon Musk office there's no. office. >> I heard. a tables between the manufacturing plant. and units it's he's frugal absolutely. frugal it shows in product design it. shows and everything. >> makes sense. >> So, >> and uh what do you think it uh worked. for Chad GPT or maybe Samwin's team? >> He had an amazing he has an amazing. team.

>> I've met a lot of people in the team. >> Yeah, very good team. >> and they see they built a world-class. product. I mean we use a lot of their. APIs and we see a lot of good work. they're doing. So, >> and they're cutting edge. I mean I would. say the AI race is now come down in the. in the US era between Google Gemini. products uh chat GPT and Anthropic. Anthropic obviously leading in. enterprise. >> and Gemini is giving all of them a tough.

fight. So also I mean uh with your. experience for the last 3 four 3 four. years that you've uh been building equal. [clears throat]. >> mour. you've been working on data or. exclusively using data accessing data. >> what is that something which is. surprising or strange for you last two. three years. pattern.

surprising. So data and that's how we structure it. actually is it's consented but it's data. blind. >> Uh patterns. now we believe that now 100 billion. times is sharing data in India. >> So 70 1.4 billion people we believe are. sharing data about 100 billion times. So. about 70 times a year some healthcare. document, financial document, KYC. document.

>> So the scale of the problem is so large. and that opportunity thereby is so large. and it's completely unorganized. >> So like I think organizing that is an. opportunity. >> India has the most structured data. >> I think the government of India has done. amazing job. India India stack though. there is no country in the world which. has such a large population that is. completely digitized with iris scan. fingerprint I mean Aadhaar. >> Aadhaar is a massively successful story.

>> for such thin city. >> are there. >> now everything is linked to that also so. I think that's a great success story up. of course. >> uh that's like I I love going in US. China. 1. because oh it went from here to here. instantly because in the US it t this. system is called American clearing house. a. >> that takes t plus 2 days. >> t plus 1 t plus2 yeah. >> huh it could real time from bank account.

to bank account. >> it's like people can't believe how it's. possible also. >> right [laughter]. >> and how is it worth working with nicl. kamat or the brothers. >> no I I think Nitan is an amazing leader. is a great. >> uh he has a has a way to bring great. people together. Both of them super. humble. >> for being so successful. >> Five six years in Shabbad also. >> and every time and they're I think the.

what I like is they bring the American. success aura. >> that they're not they're not doing this. for money. They're doing this for a for. a cause for a purpose and is super. humble, super mission oriented. >> Everything is mission. >> oriented programs that they conduct. I. mean found WTF fund. intentions climate all the things. they're doing. the kind of startups that are actually. backing up.

>> 150 plus startups if I'm not wrong. >> Yeah, it must be. >> that's crazy. And that with the shortest. span. and they started doing all kinds of. other new businesses. >> Very interesting. I was reading. something Amazon Jeff. team. should be such effective and strong that. and they should be very strong to build. such kind of huge embers. Yeah,

>> even you mentioned something similar to. this uh small teams and high performance. something like that. >> How far is it possible? First of all, >> see I think u. when when Jeff Bezos said it, he said it. because he didn't want bureaucracy. He. didn't want large teams building any. product. >> and um you know small teams are usually. most high performing uh because you know. the the loss of. communication. And that is by nature.

>> world of. >> teams are getting reorganized because. people who don't know how to code build. entire products now because the cost of. software has come down to zero. >> right. >> so building something has become. commodity. >> sou teams now how we are reorganizing. also in our AI teams it's small high. performing teams of two three people and. they'll come with a mission or a goal.

and that's it. It should be that way. Earlier teams used to be product design, tech, QA, support, attuned. >> and it used to go through the cycle but. building shipping products has become so. fast. >> that. we have to reorganize every team like. that now and I think. traditional companies are going to be. different because you know we have. different shop.

physical stores manufacturing experience. different uh pure software will be very. different. >> very very different I mean the pace of. innovation uh and the way things are. going now whether it is uh very. opportunistic but also scary. >> so generally any any startup or any uh. legacy business startup business hiring. makes a lot of difference. >> what did you observe maybe a key factors.

hiring call an grandfather. What is that you have learned? >> You know if you think about it. in the Telugu people. >> in United Andhra Pradesh and Telangana. my Tata would have been one of the top. five successful business leaders. >> in all the 10 plus businesses that he. would have built. I'm sure. Yeah. >> And it is not humanly possible to build. so many businesses if you haven't got. the right people for each of the.

businesses. >> And I think that is the secret sauce in. at least my tatas, my dad's and even I'm. trying to inculcate a lot of that. >> in success because you get the right. people, >> you give them the right amount of. accountability and also responsibility. and they will do wonders. M. >> it is time and again proven in every one. of our businesses that that's the right. way to build many things and they have. to be culturally aligned to you. They.

have to think like you they have to be. exactly. >> yeah they have to have a value system. >> Is it not tough family business. board of directors. they are deciding on certain things or. maybe they are making the bigger. decisions. >> How does it feel? I think see there's a. balance balance some key decisions. family will take. >> lot of key decisions a professional. management will take. >> and that's the right mix. >> because if you're trying to do. everything you won't be able to build.

more than one thing at one time cuz we. are just humanly impossible that. >> that is where delegation comes. >> delegation. >> micromanagement. if you see like there are so many. examples of um our farmer business GVK. bio which is now called arrogen lifesty. It grew from 2001 when my father started. it very very professionally and then my. uh DS bra who's our co-founder can join. in 2004. >> it grew professionally completely. professionally. >> even today we have a group C MD CEO we.

have three CEOs of the businesses and we. are only on the board and only get. involved with capital allocation key. hires. >> you're a part of the board yeah I've. been on the board for 5 years now. >> and um you know So you have to know. where we want to get involved where. there's value occurs where you're. building value and I think if you know. that model no uh my my dad or my uncle. doesn't have an office in GBK bio region. >> they don't have an office room. >> that's how professionally run it is the.

number one in corporate governance in. pharma companies in India. >> it is ESG number one. >> in India it is great place to work seven. times in a year in a row uh and see you. you have to build value that way. >> Corporate governance in business is very. important. Same model GBK starts. >> 2001 law you call 108 ambulance service. and it was started by some other person. and then my tata took over after that.

>> Um it grew from one state to 20 states. in India. We cover now um over a billion. people in India. Absolute scaled out. We. have uh 18,000 ambulances, 75,000. employees. >> and it is scaled because there's a good. there's good leadership team. It's a. nonprofit and good leadership, good. team. So each of these businesses all. nonprofits. >> have to have good leaders to build out. and we had that in every single business.

>> is managing it, right? >> Yeah. Tata loves uh you know he's in. he's in that phase in his life where he. wants to give back a lot and he built um. there's two three years ago he got very. a few years ago he got very passionate. about animal ambulances. >> okay. >> cuz um people get hurt let's say that. I'm not well. >> animals can't say anything. >> so actually now we are um the top. ambulance uh service for animals we have. 2,500 ambulances in India. >> only for animals.

>> only for animals. >> oh. >> and that's growing very fast and that. was just with an idea four five years. ago and then the government supported it. and then we scaled out. >> and by the way these 18,000 ambulances. are in 15,000 zip codes in India so. think about rostering people. >> uh repairs maintenance oil like for fuel. >> it's it's like an insane operation so. weather but all this can happen with. good people. >> no how much of is it I mean.

How much has been spent by GVK? >> See, it's a private public partnership. So, they uh they give it out on PPP for. us to operate. >> and the assets are given by the. government. >> and the people, team, innovation, technology, all of that is run by us. >> and so that's the right. >> that's the biggest thing. >> No, it's both actually. I mean, without. the assets, this won't run without this, that. >> that's a one time thing at least, right? Running it on every day. >> Yeah. Yeah. See because I think that.

that's a great example. Uh Harvard. Business Review wrote an article saying. this is um one of the most impactful. organizations in the world. They have. saved close to 10 million lives today. >> Wow. >> 10 million. And it is like think about. scale. How many people are naming their. children GVK em. >> Wow. >> I mean you should see the scale. There. are millions of cases of animal bites or. like snake bites or pregnancies. You. know how many pregnancies.

>> in a year that happen in these. ambulances because in rural India. there's no healthcare that is good. >> So you have to rely on someone like. this. M. >> so the kind of impact and scale we also. have um you know 102 which is for women. care woman health line. >> um you have 104 you have basically uh. suicide line we manage we manage so many. different services pan India in UP in. Gujarat in Hana in Karnataka AP. Telangana I mean there are lot of places.

we do different different programs like. that for India. >> the other day I was talking to someone. I still remember actually half an hour 8. minutes pan like in states certain. states in 8 minutes ambulance comes to. you. >> and they do it they're more efficient. than a lot of the quick commerce. companies. >> it's crazy cuz it's it's only delivery. there. >> it is go pick up take to hospital. immediately and you take them to the.

fastest closest hospital to save the. life it's called the golden hour. >> 60 minutes slow if you can get them. emergency. It will save the person's life and. that's most important. That's their KPI. >> We had to call 108 and within 20 25. minutes and that highway. it was tough for us to make them. understand but yeah that's that's a. biggest game changer. It's all impact. good good cause.

>> and when you are working along with such. kind of powerhouses around you. >> so. does not feel I don't belong to this. maybe I don't deserve this like did you. anytime feel intimidated or. I feel like it's a learning opportunity. every single thing you can learn. something. >> um and that gives you so much like uh. subconscious strength [snorts]. You know when you when you're young you.

don't realize it but when you notice you. know I see with my kids. >> correct. >> they see me they learn through my. actions they learn through the way I. conduct myself or behave. >> and I I did the same I used to walk like. my Tata my dad I used to look like them. I used to dress like them subconsciously. I am like them only. >> that's why the GVK junior name really. stuck [laughter]. it's not a positive positive topic. with that ease I've got with you.

So, So that way generally do you have such. kind of discussions at your home or. over you? >> See I think every family has their own.

way of doing it. >> Uh my family got a different way of. doing it but generally a lot of clarity. >> Okay. clarity. I think. always. So I think that has always led. I know what businesses that I will work. in. >> which I will build and then continue to. build. So those are the only ones I'll. be involved with. >> and apart from that I think there's I.

have a simple rule actually I read a. book long. >> said. >> you want you'd rather be a Brahma. >> okay. >> you want to be a value creator in every. role that you do. >> and it's actually a very simple rule if. you can add value and create value in. every role that you do the pie will. become bigger whatever value will become. larger I think that simple rule I follow. as uh in any role that I'm putting. >> It's not just for business also. It's. it's even for a job also.

>> Yeah. Absolutely. >> Absolutely. And that's like you know. that is like the golden rule I feel you. know it's it's very simply put but. that's a golden rule. Succession yes and. no. I mean like that's not the end state. >> you know. Nobody nobody should wait for. a succession for feeling like they've. achieved something. >> Oh for sure. you know they should want. to take that to the next level. >> and they should build and that building. that I am I'm always the first person to. work reaching work since I was my first.

role in the company. >> in 2014. >> I heard this me you started at 7:00 at 7. 7:30 at the office. >> yeah and and at 7:45 8 I'm in office but. that's been since I was 21. >> I'm 33 but people will think. it's [laughter] Not true. >> For years, that's my tendency. >> And that's I I like doing that. I like. going early. I like getting my calendar. ready. I like getting my email, Slack,

work done. Then when people come, I'm. I'm there. And for getting stuff done. and. >> actually in a funny way, I like people. not coming cuz then I can finish. [laughter] discussions. You lose that 2 three hour window. >> When you told that creating value is. important. >> Yeah. As long as you're creating value. at any place you are, you are never. replaceable. >> Definitely that product is not. replaceable so easily at least.

>> Yeah, agree. uh I think those. fundamental rules and things you learn. from you know people successful people. around you and you you I think the the. best thing is in your formative years. just you're starting out you know first. job [clears throat] first. >> learning and absorbing all that most. people are not successful in their first. business. >> or second usually it's the third. >> me I start it's my fourth company as a. founder I started two when I was in.

Michigan. >> I started one year in MIT. My own. companies. >> This is the fourth company. >> The Indian brand. >> when I was in uh high school and it was. in early college. No. Michigan. >> Yeah. 20. 19 years old. Nice. You sold it right. Yeah. He scaled it up and exited that. >> It was a retail company a part of. shopper stop. They had one company. >> Clothing company. Clothing company. A. small brand. And I don't even know if.

they still run it. >> Okay. Okay. >> So, uh, >> how much was the ticket size? Am I. >> It wasn't a big See, most of these are. never big outcomes. Only the big ones. will come on the first page. >> But the learnings. >> of building how to distribute a product, how to sell a product, how to market a. product. >> Those learnings still help me today, >> right? >> You know, those are those building. blocks that suddenly look like, wow, you. learned everything so fast. >> So, every small learning, right? It. compounds.

>> Makes sense. And uh in some interview or. some interaction you mentioned uh. initially you were confused between uh. delegation direction. you mentioned something am I right. >> at that point of time. >> I was much younger. >> and I at that point of time I always. felt that you tell somebody to do. something or you delegate it's when you. just start work color you think that. doing everything is the best. >> and everything you.

micromanagement but very quickly you. understand that if you get smart people. delegation is way better. >> you can do 10 times more amount of. things. So I think that was if I. remember that was the thought I took. took me few years to get to [laughter]. learn that. I always uh. I keep believing in such one statement.

[laughter]. cannot not expand its uh uh time outside. time and space. different. >> because I've been traveling with your. thoughts and all for a few days. I'm not sure whether you're feeling it. or not. >> but what it takes to just come out of.

all that personal time. So what do you do personally to actually. come out of all that? >> I think for me. hectic little bit of a workaholic. weekend I try to slow it down. >> and at least. >> What do you mean by that? >> I try not to use my phone when I'm at. home. >> Mhm. which is I think helps me be sane.

on a Sunday for example. >> and spend time with family with my kids. My kids are in very cute age. >> Oh, I've seen them now. >> Yeah, they're adorable. >> What was interesting is. father. not allow kids to get into those rooms. or. but it was very cute. Your kid was. coming and you you gave that attention. to him. naturally he needs.

and we had to spend good time there. >> It was nice. >> No, and then that age where they learn, they see everything and I actually I. didn't imagine how much I love being a. father. >> and uh it's it's. >> Oh, we should talk about parenting also. then. >> Yeah, we should. And um so I think that. I I really enjoy and for me I think. spending time with the kids is one big. stress buster for sure. >> And I meditate every day. I think I. learned that about. >> uh when I was in MIT 20 20 2019.

>> uh transcendental meditation gives me a. lot of. >> transcendental. >> me meditation so coincidentally this. person is Deepak Chopra's sister-in-law. who lives in Boston and she does this. just to share that knowledge. >> okay. >> and uh one of my friend uh me and my. wife we went to learn from her and she. it's very simple you just let thoughts. come go and uh you know you feel at. peace and.

happiness because you're like you you. wait you know. fast life you just take a moment and. just consume everything and you know. there's so much power in that. whatever I think subconsciously always. happens interesting okay. >> and it's like. no actually. thoughts. >> you should let it pass and that's the. only thing and then actually you feel. like very calm after it and.

scientifically your brain actually comes. down your neural network comes down you. feel at peace there's like very strong. science behind this. >> and for me I think the one thing which. has happened is a lot of um coincidences. happen. >> and I think something is going to happen. I think about someone or some thought. and I'll get a phone call about it. >> Oh, >> it's like manifesting. >> It's absolute manifestation. But in this. case, you should not force anything. >> You should let it come and go. And.

anyway, things you're manifesting are in. your mind. It's like the energy system. No, the subconscious energy system is so. strong. >> That's what you know, God is about. That's all about you know, we we went to. big big big bucks of. >> Okay. Uh he was chairman. Yeah, >> Tata was the chairman two times. My. Amama was a board member a couple of. times. uh. I always wear a namapati.

wati. >> and uh big big believer like my parents. and grandparents everyone and I you know. head priest family priest. actually he was a PhD in biomedical. engineering. >> okay. >> now I mean same family. so that it's all about energy. What do we do in tirupati? We conserve. the energy. >> through pujas, through chanting, through.

all these things. And everything in life. is about that. When you walk in to the. corridor in. um the energy wavelength is so high you. forget what you're thinking. >> Have you ever felt that? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And this is scientifically proven. And. so it's like um after that actually they. he said that you should never ask for. anything. >> You shouldn't ask. shouldn't ask for. anything. So my my nana 50th birthday. many of us. >> my dad's 62 now.

>> so 12 years I never asked for anything. you only ask for two things. >> okay. >> you I mean you don't you pray for two. things you say you want moka which is a. very Hindu belief and um you know you. want knowledge. >> so these are the only two things you. hope for and everything comes with that. >> this interesting uh transcendental. meditation. >> meditation. >> okay. >> I kind of took you from meditation to. devotion of course but both are the same. in my mind both are energy both are.

>> and he spoke about how the deity arrived. at this in the seven hills. >> and it was just found there and it's. like it's amazing I when you think about. these stories and how uh devotion comes. in different forms and uh there is a. higher being there is a higher. power that makes everything happen so. seamlessly. Topic wise also they create a lot of.

calm. [laughter]. Do you also believe. negative energy, positive energy? Do you discuss do you have that. [laughter]. fire? removing the energy. >> Uh. my mother is very particular. So every. day the kids take. Yeah.

>> So basically. I thought like. it's just a thought that's it's an. exchange of energy between two two. people. positive energy but I keep listening to. a lot and with our journey. every year every now and then with every. project we keep changing.

>> face of life. aspirations of that year or that phase. >> So how are you placed right now in your. in your career professionally majorly. correct actually manifestation. many years ago. >> Okay. And then five year plans. personally. >> Oh nice. >> And where I want to be in achieve and. it's crazy actually I look at it once a. month. >> and then you have to like plan how.

things are going. Many things will go. >> look at it once a month and. >> you write it down. >> and then once a month you look at it. >> and then you you put a positive if it's. happening. You put a negative if it's. not happening. You put a positive. negative if it's somewhat happening. >> Nice. And that kind of guides. >> new year goals, >> new year girls, >> but they're broken down into smaller. tasks. So like almost a task project. level. >> and um I think 10 years from now I know. where I want to be. >> You know, I want I want to be seen as a.

leading entrepreneur for India building. innovative technologies doing some. massive scale in hundreds of millions of. people using what I built. >> Right. So we all started that. [laughter]. >> That's true. >> Definitely. It's insane. You know, uh. one and a half month back when we first. discussed about. first. it was all. but when I was looking at the numbers. one month. So in the meantime when I was looking at.

the socials and all people influencers. talking about the brand. >> [laughter]. >> No next level. >> No, no, no. I I I want to join I want to. spread word also. >> Yeah. Interesting. But definitely it is very much. important. So actually.

manifestation it works. M. >> I don't know how it works but it works. It's form the form factor of energy in. some way what you really deeply believe. in it happens in some way. >> and actually in Indian [clears throat]. principles n life flow I always believed. in one line um feet to the ground eyes. to the sky so be humble but be ambitious. >> that's been a guiding principle. >> right. >> uh and I read one book once that. actually if you read your principles.

every day. >> they become part of you. >> so there are different ways to do it and. different Uh definitely makes sense. When you keep reading or when you keep. reminding about your goals, that's how it it wakes you up. It's not it's not a logic thing. [laughter] We've seen.

sense. My hunch is. already manifest. You think about it subconsciously. >> That's you're indirectly doing it. >> That's true. Actually, what's the name? >> Manifestation. Yeah. [laughter] This. name is that did that. So, it's Yeah.

Yeah, [laughter]. we have a 500 number. This includes even English speaking. guests. Maybe we might go at least 300. because it is reachable. Which are very tough to crack.

Wow. So we never knew that we could crack. [laughter] See the importance of. manifestation. Value of manifestation. [laughter]. Let's talk about the importance of. calendar management. >> Oh, it's too important. >> Too important. >> It it my personal life is on my. calendar. My work life is on my. calendar. My to-do list is on my. calendar. My events are on my calendar.

Everything has to be there. If it's on. my calendar, I'll show up or I'll get. done. >> It's as simple as that. You only have. certain amount of time in your. dayto-day. >> So, if you have more things to do than. the time allocated, you won't be able. And if you read. >> it's not. >> it's not possible unless you you you. give it to somebody to do. >> but there's so many ways actually to be. effective as a leader. >> Elon Musk actually has 5 minute 10. minute 15 minute blocks in calendars. >> Okay. >> I've been able to go to 30. I tried 20. It was tough because when you get into a.

meeting it ends before you start. literally. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> You can go to 15 also but you have to be. in standing meetings. >> You have to say okay what is it? What is. the decision? and so and so but there's. like that's a way to be really really. effective I've realized and following up. in India or anywhere in the world. getting work done is half following up. >> so the first thing I do in the morning. first first thing is set up my calendar. for the day everyone in my teams know. now he'll set up his calendar and. they'll say okay and I I move things. around and make it very effective now. >> how much of is it possible.

completion rates are low. >> because what happens is meetings during. the day You'll have meetings. >> and then you'll have tasks out of the. meeting. >> but at least you prioritize things. >> I've seen people going into like. prioritizing in the day which is like uh. takes a lot of time to set up a. [laughter] calendar. >> Yeah. I like it when you say completion. maybe. >> completion is low. I think if someone. tells you that they do everything in the. day, they're probably bluffing. [laughter].

>> Basically, most critical things, >> critical but not important. >> And that four diagram, not critical, not. important, you should not do. >> and then uh important but not critical, you should do it in a form factor. somebody does it at some point. >> Correct. Correct. Correct. So what is. see let's make it a bit general.

>> but people who look at you like a this. guy is a silver spoon guy. What is that one overthinking segment. that people think about you. if you can talk about. >> a wedding photos and I'm not that person. fat wedding that you've done man. [laughter]. >> but first thing you google ads.

>> and I I my association in my own life. when you write your own autobiography. it'll probably come as the 25th thing in. [laughter] my auto. >> I can understand the pain. >> and but I mean it's uh it's it's. >> it feels weird. >> It's not my number one thing or five or. 10. So. >> I know what you're doing. >> Yeah. Absolutely. >> Things out there are. >> different. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean I want to be. you know we live in such short period of. time. Unfortunately most of us will not.

be remembered. >> The world is in millions of years. >> That's a good statement. >> Yeah. and and um you want to be known. for people when you're alive with people. around you that you've done something. good. You've impacted humanity in a way. >> and I think that if you've done that. you've achieved and people are there for. you. You've you've loved people. genuinely. >> I'm actually a very positive person. >> So negativity doesn't even break into me. usually. You can tell.

>> and actually extra positive. So problem. so you'll think that you are so. obsessively that sometimes [laughter]. you don't know where to stop. So your. team Sai was mentioning. >> how is it possible in a businessman I. mean that too running a family I mean. involving into a family business like. fund. >> dealing with so many startups that. you've invested in. >> is it so easy to control your cool or is.

it just a. >> I don't get angry much very little zero. I would say. >> I think see what are you going to. achieve if you get angry. >> especially in work. >> even in personal life you won't achieve. anything if you get angry but in work. though like if you get angry you're just. creating a negative environment. >> you know I had huh I had one boss I. think one of the best things I did was. when family business law if you work for. your family directly in AMH go I had. professional CEOs I used to and that.

actually my dad said first to I worked. for three bosses. >> okay. >> uh within your group in the yeah within. the group but they are professionally. run bosses. >> I learned all the leadership styles and. I'm now have a version of it for myself. But one of my bosses uh his name is. Karthik Gajendraan. He is a Sri Lankan. very very accomplished. >> Mhm. >> And his way of getting work done. He's a. sweet man. >> Okay. >> But he was in charge of building.

terminal 2. >> He and he would very sweetly scold you. >> Example, >> he'll say uh I didn't expect this out of. you. [laughter]. And he makes you feel like. [laughter]. >> you feel bad. again, you know, he'll feel [laughter]. but he was so effective. So that only. tells me that you don't need to scream. >> Yeah. >> And then there was another boss who had. was uh super rockstar and like work.

diligence, quality of work, hard work, 24/7 anytime, anything. And that work. ethic has come off to me. M. >> and then I had one more boss. >> who was not a good boss at all. >> Okay. >> But I learned what not I [laughter]. don't what I don't want to be. >> Yeah. That's a very big lesson. >> You know people say they work for their. boss. They don't work for the company. It's so true. >> It's very true. >> It's very very true. >> People don't change the company. They. change the boss.

But that was changing the company is not. the first thing. Absolutely. That's very. true. That's very very true. >> And uh it might be weird for you to. answer this question. >> General employees [snorts] or teammates. talk a lot about their leaders or their. bosses. >> Let let's come the other way. >> What do you think that you're doing. right for your team? >> As a leader, >> what are those five things that you are. good at? I think the f the first thing. is I give a lot of freedom and a lot of.

authority and I I mean even before that. I hire very smart hardworking people. >> A question also. >> there are only two things I care about. actually. I don't care about what you've. done in the past. I don't care about. your accolades. I don't care much about. the resume. >> Are you very hardworking? >> And are you smart? If you can do that, you can build in any. business, any vertical, any role. And. that is like such a fundamental rule for. me now.

>> I I I mean I'll hire people who came out. of college, didn't go to college, but. who are super hardworking. >> And in the world of a I'm telling you, you know, inquisitiveness, creativity, and hard work. Only three things that. will succeed. Well, >> if you have a past resume in a long. resume, I actually don't like hiring. older people. >> Really? Because especially in AI, >> what is the average age now? >> Average age in AI must be 24. >> Oh, >> 24. And I like hiring younger because. you're not you don't have the bias. >> among those 140 people. Huh?

>> Not 140. I'm talking about the 30 people. in our AI team. >> AI team. Okay. >> Uh that's much younger. M. >> and see the thing is that when I think. people are fond of working with me. because one is of course hire very smart. people. >> right. >> I don't compromise on that um I I think. give a lot of freedom authority. responsibility. >> that's what's needed. >> and and small companies know. >> I give lot more freedom than the person. can even handle but they'll figure it. out. >> if they have the three qualities they'll. figure it out right. >> you know if they don't have the.

qualities they won't be able to figure. it out. >> and then the third I think is you have. to be very transparent with your team. >> about your visions about the good and. the bad. >> because if the minute you look like. somebody's hiding know people are very. smart. >> people are extremely smart you will you. you think you're smart people think. they're very smart. we're all wrong these are three like. fundamental rules I think that have. worked well for and I have an amazing. team. >> I think the team does everything so I.

think that is the success story of at. least. when equal becomes the largest AI. company in India, you'll come back and. say the reason is [laughter]. >> no I'm sure the second point also the. what you mentioned freedom and authority. they also say it's foolishness to hire. smart people and tell them what to do. Yeah, absolutely. >> Leaves things to them only then they. make wonders. And the last one, everyone. relates to it.

Any day if you're just acting uh to show. something about you. months, one month. [laughter] So yeah, the years are the the the walls have. years. Yeah. >> So, even if you're alone in the room, the walls have yours. They'll know. Everyone will find out.

[laughter]. >> No, I must be careful. [laughter]. Yeah. And uh Mumbai airport 15 2015. You. were there? >> No. No. 2005. >> 2005. I mean, you were vice president. from. >> Oh, no. I'm saying we we won the bid to. uh operate own operate Mumbai 2005. I. joined 2014. >> Terminal 2 was built by you right? >> Yeah. Yeah. So how it works is the.

entire asset is given to a company and. we operate that company business. everything the your aero non-eronautical. the all the terminals uh general. aviation terminal everything. So what's. interesting you were the vice president. of nonerautical business right. um. real estate I mean real estate business. >> you have in some ways airport business. is basically four businesses. >> you have aeronautical where flights take.

off and you make revenue second is. non-eronautical where anything in the. terminal duty fee retail lounges car. parking ATMs advertising all of that is. called non-erero then you have real. estate Right? Because large most of them. are in centers of cities and then fourth. is cargo. >> Okay. >> So I used to run that non-eronautical. revenue. >> So when you go inside a terminal you say. oh this advertising or you see some shop. or you see dutyree right. >> all of those concessionists I used to. know about it. So. >> and aeronautical how do how do airports.

make money and is it every flight. how does it happen? >> Yeah how it works is actually it's a. regulated business. >> Okay. So there's a regulator called ERA. >> So what they do is they talk take all. your uh capital expenditure. >> and then there's. >> all your capital expenditure. >> for the terminal for airside for. everything that you're spending. They. have to approve it. >> but after approval then they give you a. fixed rate of return and then they. divide it into five year tariff period. >> Oh.

>> and that tariff period shows up in your. ticket as UDF user development fee. >> As a when you're flying there'll be a. lot of things. >> Oh no no no. So there'll be UDF, there'll be CUS charges, there'll be so. and so security charges. It goes that's. how they make money. >> It's not you who fix the rate. >> No, no, no. It's not us that fix it. The. government of India actually the. regulator fix it because it's correct. It's the right balancing act and uh. there's obviously landing charges. So. every aircraft based on the size of the. flight. So like let's say A380 will be.

more expensive. >> A small turborop will be smaller, lesser. So based on that there is a. pricing. >> So how much you can charge. Okay. >> And then the fuel and so essentially. it's all regulated as a business. >> Interesting. In nonerotical businesses. this includes shops whatever it is I. heard. >> So how does that model work? >> So it's basically a minimum guarantee of. the rent or revenue share whichever is.

higher. >> or Okay. Okay. Okay. >> Whichever is higher. >> Mhm. Interesting. So that is the model. >> Okay. Got it. So how was that. experience? >> Amazing. Actually that is uh I think one. you know pivotal moment in my life. >> You learn how to run business danda when. you learn how to collect money. Exactly. what you were telling me. >> Okay. [laughter]. >> Because in collections is the hardest. thing no in any business. So I used to. have a boss Sapu.

>> who uh we used to you know he taught me. a lot on how to collect money because. you used to have a a chaiwala who used. to pay us rent and duty free operator. used to pay as well and the scale is. like hundreds of crows and you know a. few lakhs a year. >> but you learn to deal with people you. learn to deal with their you know. business models for sure. So you learn. how you know and we had 400. concessionals. that we used to manage. >> So it is not like 10 20 people. >> small big. >> small big everybody. So you learn like.

what is their incentive model how they. think how is their business doing. [snorts] So I think that experience has. changed cuz when I came back from. college I thought. I was so wrong. Nothing ever happens. when you say go get this done. It never. happens. >> Right. No, I understand how much process. are set. Money movement is tough. [laughter]. [laughter]. with time even I real at a smaller scale.

but anywhere money is money. can make a lot of differences between. [laughter]. >> but yeah u if you don't mind journey. with Mumbai airport as a vice president. >> ended up and maybe it got connected to. another controversy. >> there are a lot stories crisis headines. How did you take that phase and how much. of it is true and there was something. see I I heard articles to such extent.

where GVK. so how much of is it true and uh what. should you talk about this. >> see I think um our journey was 2015 16. we were exiting infrastructure. businesses. >> and we took a decision family took a. decision and then u Bangalore airport. first. >> so we used to own Bangalore. Okay. So 2010 we invested and acquired. majority.

[laughter]. 2017. and uh we did that to pay back lenders. because debt was becoming very big. I'm. sorry to cut you. when airports got privatized. in 2005 four five Delhi and Bangalore. were the first two to get privatized. >> and in that there was every single. conglomerate in India bid for both the. airports. >> Oh.

>> the crazy thing was two south Indian. Telugu people won them. >> Delhi GMR won. >> Yeah. >> Bombay GVK won. >> Crazy. And both were infra companies and. we had both uh family business had lot. of challenges. >> initially at that time. >> Uh and. >> what was the key reason for you to win. that bit idea on that? >> It's no so technical evaluation is first. after technical there's a um there's a. revenue share evaluation. >> So revenue share GMR had highest in. Delhi we had highest in Bombay. >> Okay. Yeah. Simple actually.

>> And um so that you pay the government. Uh I get it. >> Yeah. So then um so when we actually uh. started exiting in 2015 16 Bangalore. airport we sold so when you enter. >> so in Bangalore there was already LNT. >> there was Seammens and there was Zurich. airports so we acquired stake from them. >> so we didn't the bid was already done. before they won the bid and they started. building it they built it also. >> it's officially possible. >> absolutely so the government what it.

does is it moves the asset into a. long-term lease 30 plus 30 shares into. an SPV special purpose vehicle and you. own shares in that vehicle. >> Got it. >> End of the day all these assets are. owned by the government of India by. airports authority of India. >> They are long-term leased to a company. that's all. So um. >> you just run the show till that lease. period. >> Yeah, that's correct. >> And uh so so in when the um when we were. we started exiting assets Bangalore we. sold first and Bombay we were actually. signed with a very large global uh.

sovereign wealth fund in 2020 to sell. M. >> and it's in the news you can read about. that also. >> and what happened is at that point of. time uh covid hit and there was like all. revenues in airports and airlines all go. down right. >> and at that point of time even uh uh. Adani wanted to enter the business so we. actually exited to them instead of the. global fund. >> but I think see for us u that was a very. good outcome for the what we wanted we. wanted to pay back lenders.

>> and we wanted to you know kind of exit. the business fully. Infra I'm saying and that was the. direction. >> and um I think uh you know news will. always say stories and whatever they. want. The reason why I asked you and. exit process airport exit shares of that. company. >> that's it right. >> that's how it works. >> okay it's almost like a startup that. >> I mean everything you break down to. simple sounds the same. >> that's a process yeah. >> according to you after after this long.

journey. these are the cost of privilege. because because you belong to such. family. be honest Please [laughter]. a lot of costs of privilege also. >> You are first seen as an idiot. You're. seen as a rich brat. You're seen as. you're you're you're perceived by that. as a baseline. If you have wedding. videos like that, it that's like when. you met me, you must have thought. [laughter].

of privilege. I don't It doesn't bother me. M. >> I it doesn't it doesn't I don't waste. time uh it it doesn't come into my mind. even if it comes it goes very quickly. M. >> I think that your mind is so powerful if. you just latch on to that. Now. >> you can't let go of those things. >> You have to learn to just focus on. things that you want outcome. Actually. there are costs of that also. Then.

you'll you can't you're narrow-minded in. what you want to do. >> So but that's most successful people are. do one thing very well actually one. business very well. They do one thing. well. There are only very few outliers. that do many businesses or many things. well. So you rather do one thing very. well or one business very well or one uh. you know either if it's a profession. like podcasting or any profession you'd. rather do that one thing very well. >> and then that will kind of open up many.

doors. >> correct and how was your childhood I'm. very interesting interested to know that. like how much was it media training how. much was it [laughter]. [gasps]. >> I don't have so much media training. >> no in general I'm asking childhood at. >> my childhood was amazing. >> Were you a calm guy even even then? >> I was I was a naughty brat. [laughter]. I was a naughty kid and then my I had an. amazing positive safe. >> childhood. >> and uh I had a sister I used to be we.

>> safe childhood as. >> like I had a very safe environment like. very positive protected. >> yeah a lot of cousins who are very close. my best friends are all my cousins. >> my uncle aunts we had a very big family. so always together. >> and I used to be known as my akasa I. used to always be with my sister. whatever she says I'll do you actually. now my my daughter s two years. >> two years Yeah. >> Uh so between my daughter Sia and Kish. is like that only. See I will listen to. Krish whatever he says. >> So it's it's very cute actually. Now.

that uh you know I used to be like that. My my mother has always been my idol. My. dad also. >> and I think as you grow up now you know. we have our own family Vina and me. >> It's amazing. Shina is an amazing mother. and growing kids is like a amazing like. I want to give the same childhood to my. kids. >> right. >> That's a present in today's world. >> Absolutely. We should talk about. parenting also. What what did you learn. from your parents or what did what did. you decide this is how my parenting. should be there? >> I want to be present. Ah I want to be. present. >> in my busy schedule. I will be present.

for the important things they remember. I go for every single birthday on. weekends. >> with for my with my children. >> Okay. >> I'm usually the only father nowadays. Usually nannies and. >> but I love going cuz remember see I. remember that I was there. Nana was. there. He took us for the birthday party. >> and these are you know birthday parties. Oh, nice. Okay. Other kids birthday. parties. >> That's good. Interesting. [laughter].

And see, you know, these small things. matter. They just your time. >> They want your uninterrupted time. >> Yeah. >> And then I think you want a very. protected environment. They want to. feel, you know, when you grow up and you. have like today mental health issues are. like very very widely rampant with. software, technology, social media, AI, >> um addiction that comes with that that.

if you don't have a very safe childhood, a very positive childhood, it shows up. in many ways throughout your life. >> So I think the gift of a good childhood. is so underrated. That's what I want to. give my kids. Mina and me actually want. to give that. >> And how was your childhood with your I. mean journey with your father? Anim. [laughter]. was very busy building businesses as I. was always with my mom and my larger.

family. >> and uh I was always. >> you're missing your father in a issue. >> Le not so much but he was always there. for the big things. Okay. Always present. for the big things. He wouldn't look in. like like school or grades he wouldn't. care about but he would. >> just every every pivotal moment in life. he was there and he gave the right. advice. >> he he's more like a friend actually. >> even today if you see I keep getting. because he's very fit. >> people think we're brothers [laughter]. >> nija it's like.

>> 60sh. >> yeah you should see my dad he's a. marathon runner he's he's much fitter. than me [laughter]. >> and even after after his injury. He he had two big injuries and he still. ran after that. >> That's discipline. That my tatas is. discipline. He has. >> crazy. >> So that that is a belief of execution. >> And last time when I was when we were. talking. you were mentioning there are very few. people that you look up to and Mkeshi.

was I is one of one of their money. >> Correct. >> If we can talk about him. >> See he's built India law building. businesses is challenging right? He's. built massive businesses and he's such. yeah I met him many times and he's very. close with. >> uh no Akash Anisha okay. >> but they're actually he's amazing leader. amazing father. >> amazing family person and amazing leader. >> so I look up to him in India Indian. context he's one of the most successful.

entrepreneurs and leaders and he knows. he meets you he knows everything. >> and he is so focused when you meet him. and you know that. really look up to him. >> cuz building see building one business. in one industry and then replicating. that in many industries is very. difficult in this country. >> and uh he's shown that it's possible. >> at massive scale. >> so you also got to know that you're very. close with allin and yash allin is fine. logically he's from Hyderabad.

I love both of them they're amazing. people and I like actually I've realized. I love humble actors. >> okay. >> real I feel normal. They're nice. They're fun to hang out with. Uh both. have very good fun personalities. >> I think that's what I enjoy. And I think. with them I vibe a lot. >> And uh Bunny obviously is like very. funny, really a fun guy. And same with. Yasha. I think Yashi met through a. common friend. And then uh but he's been. an amazing guy. Like you just you can. chill with him. He talks about. creativity, about movies, about the.

craft, about how deeply involved he is. M. >> um and he's doing it for really building. like making Canada movies big and for. like that longer vision. He has a. purpose very very evident when you sit. with him you'll understand. >> doesn't do it for fame or for smaller. things. >> right. >> so. >> so how often do you meet friends school. friends college friends. >> I think with the usual craziness of kids. and works and.

>> family but I yeah one two times a month. we catch up for sure and. [laughter]. This is uh this is good. Now I'm putting. you in my category, not [laughter] like. the others. Got it. Nice. Nice. But how was it for you? How was the. conversation? This is the first time, right? >> Yeah. >> After a long time, you have accepted to.

just give a media appearance, I guess. >> I really I think u you I'm very proud of. what all you've done. >> and amazing level of influence that. you've created. It's an amazing first. time podcast. very natural. [laughter]. I keep saying this. grill. [laughter].

with time I I I realized that I'm. enjoying conversations. It's like deeperations. person selfish question [laughter]. even in this podcast I'm sure. it feels so yeah and the influence topic. [laughter]. what do what do you think of this.

creator economy or content creation as a. phase in Indian. because almost all these giants who who. used bet a lot on uh news as a media. >> of rupees pump. advertisement cost so that they'll be. aligned to the brands. >> but now we are also seeing those brands. I've been getting a couple of proposals. where political parties brands they want.

alignments. channel. which is making decent numbers. viewership. if the if the biggest of the biggest. brands and uh political parties are uh. what do you call requesting for an offer. and. >> I can imagine the scale. >> what in your view is the content. industry how are you looking at it. >> I think people don't realize the level. of influence the creator economy has. >> it is wild.

everybody who has contributed to it. >> but it is created category of influence. >> Yeah. >> Today you open Instagram, you listen to. a creator. You shopping, you listen to a. creator. You're thinking about anything. of interest, you think about a creator. >> Other forms of media. have diminished. Nobody sees them. Nobody takes them seriously anymore. I'm. telling the creator economy is so. influential.

I think nobody has really understood the. depth of the level of influence. M. >> so I'm I mean we use creator economy. partner with creat economy it is wild I. think people just don't understand it. and I'm so excited this is going to grow. 10fold in the next 10 years because you. look at the number of people you serve. in the country. >> you take like in your own case how many. Telugu people are there in the world. that is your probable TAM that you can. go. >> correct correct. >> and it is very large because we have a.

large population who consumes a lot of. content. and actually purchases based on views, perception. And today what happens is. creators are very trustworthy. >> They're they I listen to creators as. much as I listen to other forms of. media. And I think that that is a. transformational change. I think you. think you're at the right time at the. right place in that way. >> Oh, thank you. [laughter]. Where did we divert?

[laughter] Just kidding. But yeah, thank you. It was it was great. talking to you and I never thought you'd. be so free in front of the camera. But I'm happy. I mean uh. industry. who will talk about how do we purchase. airports? How do we sell airports? [laughter]. It's interesting. It's insane. Uh but we. should again sit absolutely very soon. again.

regular user. That's the goal. No, no. All the [laughter] very best for. your uh Thank you very much, bro. Thank. you. Thanks for Thank you so much.