The ART Of Creating Opportunities For SUCCESS ft. Sahil Bloom | FO 75 - Raj Shamani

when I got married a friend asked me the. day before how did you know that. Elizabeth my wife was the one and that. was what I said I said I'm so happy. doing absolutely nothing with this woman. I mean I have so many friends who have. gone through these relationships where. it was all reliant on doing the fun. stuff on doing the trips undoing the. fancy dinners out on doing the events. and the cool photos and all that stuff. and as soon as you got them into a. setting where there was none of that the. relationship fell apart the biggest.

problem is. that men and women are not same you may. win the argument but if you lose the. friend was it really worth it. your Mentor is Tim Cook was or is or I. don't know so was you were you in his. team what was it how was it no I have a. very funny story of how Tim and I met. um. so flashback to 2014 I just started my.

first job out of college so I played. baseball at Stanford University in. California I just took a job working in. financing yeah sweet yeah. I was very lucky to get in I don't know. how they let me into school there when I. took my first job and my job was going. to be working. 80 to 90 100 hours a week really really. tough first job I was going to work. really hard and so I knew if I wanted to. continue my fitness I was going to have.

to go to the gym early in the morning. and what that meant was that I had to. show up at the gym at 4 45 every single. morning okay because I wanted to get to. the office by 6 30 so I'd work out 4 45. to 6 and then go to the go to the office. so I get to the gym near my office and. there's five people that show up every. single day at that same time only five. people and so you know you're in the gym. with the same people every single day so. you chat with them you get to know them. after about six months of chatting with. the same group of people I talked to.

this one man and uh someone came over to. me after and said do you know who that. is. I said no I don't he said that's Tim. Cook the CEO of Apple and I just said oh. because I had no idea who he was. for six months and I'd been talking to. him probably sounding like an idiot. and only on that day did I discover that. this was the CEO of one of the biggest. companies in the world them so after. that I was chatting with him the next. time I talked about this article that I. had read about him in and I guessed his.

email address later in the day and sent. it to him I said this was the article. that I mentioned to you he responded and. was very kind and so I just thought. I always have this phrase closed mouths. don't get fed if you don't ask you will. never get and so I figured why not be. bold so I replied to him and said I. would love to pick your brain I'd love. to learn from you I don't want a job I'm. not looking for anything but I would. love to learn from you and your career. experience will you get a coffee with me. he said yes and it started what has.

become an incredible Mentor relationship. for me in my life I've never worked with. him I don't think I could because I. imagine he's a tough boss but he's been. an amazing influence in my life and he's. been someone who has supported me. enormously in what I do today and helped. me think through these changes that I've. made in my life from working in finance. to working as a you know kind of. entrepreneur and Creator and just been. an incredible relationship that came out. of a purely lucky circumstance of the.

fact that I happen to be at the gym at. the same time as this person. them okay I have more questions to it. but first I want to say guys start going. to gym at 4 45. that is that is not. necessarily the lesson but what is the. lesson to that is this idea of luck. surface area. where you can create luck luck is not. all lucky I expanded my luck surface. area by doing something like that. because the type of people that show up.

to the gym at 4 45 are generally High. performing disciplined people and the. the other people out of the five it was. like the founder of one of the biggest. investment funds in the world I mean it. was a very high performing group that I. happened to then connect with because I. was there. interesting because yeah like why would. a normal person wake up at 4am and go to. the gym like it's just you have to be a. psychopath. and I'm a night owl damn please like I.

just hope that. some other founder they work out at like. 9 pm well I think Founders tend to go in. one of two ways right there's either the. crazy morning people like Tim is or. there's the night owls that are up. working until three four in the morning. like you so I'm sure you're not gonna be. out of line you'll find someone but yeah. and you know I also feel I the luck. surface area. I feel luck is created I mean obviously. there is one part which is which is. given but you can definitely create your.

luck by doing little things things like. this that you you can be at the right. place with the right people or you can. surround yourself in the right City or I. don't know just just I like there are so. many different combinations which you. can make in order to just create your. luck and be there at the right time. there are four types of luck okay the. first type is blind luck that's what you. reference the things you're just given. God where you're born who you're born to. the circumstances of your life you. cannot control them blind luck okay the.

second type is luck from motion that's. when you're going around hustling when. you're young and you're creating. connections meeting people you just. create so many collisions that luck. might strike as a result of that the. third type is luck from awareness which. means you get so good at spotting. opportunities for luck because you're so. knowledgeable about a given space that. you can see luck coming from a mile away. and the fourth type is luck from. uniqueness which is your hobbies your.

interests that you have so much deep. knowledge on you become the expert that. everyone is seeking out for specific. types of opportunities so the type of. person who has been a nerd about. artificial intelligence for the last 10. years is now being sought out by all. these companies that are building in the. space and that's lucky but not really. yeah yeah oh wow I think they're the. fifth kind of luck which is combination. of all four that is what worked for me. to know.

that's the best kind that's the best. kind like I really feel that I was. blessed to be born in a family where my. parents just supported me through my. throughout my career they never asked me. to do anything apart from things which I. love that is one the second is I really. hustled my way out I went out everywhere. and I'm a big believer of networking and. creating your own luck by being at the. right places the right thing doing right. thing stuff right like that's the second. and what was the third one I forgot the. name awareness you're spotting luck now. now you're seeing it yeah you are doing.

that for sure now oh awareness like. okay I wanna so podcasting for me was. the awareness luck I knew that if I can. pick brains of the best people in the. country. it not only gives me an opportunity to. learn from them it gives me an. opportunity to be in the same room with. them. and that itself is going to give me so. much opportunity and so much luck like I. mean if you're sitting with the top 100. startup Founders in the country and in a.

year you're hanging out with them there. is some kind of luck with your creating. so that's the awareness Lord and then. the fourth is because I was I was. speaking and I was learning. communication since last 10 years. probably this is working out for me and. now everybody's coming and talking to us. so all four together is the fifth well. you followed the path because that's how. these four types of luck tend to play. out right where you're born you can't. control when you're young it's mostly. blind luck but then as you start to grow. in your life and in your career you.

start the motion you start creating. motion as you did you were hustling. creating that energy then you go to the. next stage and you start being aware of. all the opportunities that are there. that's only once you've developed that. knowledge and experience and then the. uniqueness is the same because it just. takes years and you're just getting. started on all of those by the way. you've just started to scratch the. surface of feeling that luck you're 26. years old yeah I've got a lot of luck. left I'm excited I'm excited for you I'm. 32 and I feel like the old one in the. room all the good gods in the in the.

world please please give me all the love. well you will the benefit for all of us. is you will give back a lot along the. way of having that lucky set of. circumstances a lot of people get lucky. and they just take it all for themselves. they bring it inside they're not. creating value in exchange and that's a. shame you're going to create a lot of. value for other people to help them on. their curve Yeah by putting out this. content I think you know the way you.

brought up and the way your career. trajectory has been. it also defines the what what kind of. person you're going to become so I feel. I am wherever I am because few people. helped me okay and that's why I feel. it's my responsibility to help others. right because I wouldn't be here if some. person wouldn't have taken a chance on. me and given me some opportunity like if. it's just I mean I'm so grateful whether. because when I started let's say just. talk about podcasting forget the world.

when I started podcasting my podcast was. so small there was nobody. like I had like 50 000 followers. something other on YouTube and I started. a podcast video podcasting and I reached. out to people. and someone who doesn't go to a podcast. uh under million followers. he said yes and then the next person. said yes and the next person and then. recently we're getting people who are. saying no to Forbes and times and.

they're saying yes to us and I'm like. you know so they are helping us so it's. become like responsibility that I need. to help others so it helping and giving. back it depends a lot on how your career. has been chilled so that's just Sir. Isaac Newton once said. if I have seen further it was because I. stood on the shoulders of giants. and that's how you feel that's certainly. how I feel that we have been able to. achieve certain things because we stood. on the shoulders of some giant who was. willing to put us on their shoulders and.

as a result your responsibility your. duty is to be that giant for others in. the future wow and that's the greatest. calling in life is to be able to do that. for other people now to give it back. yeah that's so it's such a simple idea. but it's so powerful I really liked it I. want to be a shoulder. it's the great it's the greatest joy you. can have is when someone in a few years. says this about you on a podcast the.

exact thing you just said about those. other people you're going to be. listening to someone that you mentored. and they're going to say this about you. they're gonna say I'm only here because. Raj helped me yeah what an amazing. feeling what what better value could you. create and there's no money to that they. might not pay you for that but. unbelievable sense of fulfillment oh. comes from that that it does it does I. just want to take the name of the guy. because he said it because I really feel. that he should or uh he should find this. out nikhil kamath have you heard of him.

he runs one of the biggest startups in. the country zeroda it's quite trapped. you know the story right bootstrap two. brothers so nikhil helped me out in the. beginning he said yes when I was like. nobody knew me back then and then he'd. not only just came on my podcast built a. relation with me okay we did an audio. one and then I shamelessly asked him. again was like hey you know what. the audio doesn't cut out for me do you. want to do a video and he was kind. enough to call me at his place we did it. and then he connected me five other.

people as well right who does that he's. he's a goddamn billionaire like he. doesn't have time for people like me but. he helped me at that time and just just. a kind soul I feel the exact same way. Tim is one of those people for me. that have helped me. when they had absolutely no reason to do. that they've believed in me when they. had no reason to believe in me at the. time and there have been a few people in. my life who have done that who have. believed in me when there was absolutely. no reason to.

and I've never let a single one of them. down and I don't intend to start hmm. of course you should not and you will. not you you're also getting started what. are you saying I'm the old man in the. room next to you I'm excited by the neck. I mean I'm I think I'm six years older. than you and I'm so excited about what. the next six years of your life looks. like because I think about my years from. 26 to 32 and you're just if you're 26. you are just starting to feel the. compounding that occurs in your career.

you're just starting to see those. networks start to connect and the. circle's starting to connect and the. knowledge starting to combat it's the. most amazing time like this next 15. years is just unbelievable. wow if this is the start damn okay yeah. this is this is I'm getting Goosebumps. right now because I can't I'm excited. I don't even want to play like all. humble and stuff because I can. play yeah I'm excited okay coming back.

to the Tim Cook part yeah. what do you first is what do you think. why do you think he accepted to your. thing like why do you think he believed. in you at that time it's very important. for all the young people who are. watching this because I want them to. know that there must be some skill which. you must have had there must be. something in you. like apart from the fact that you you're. from Stanford and you look sure are you. in the gym every time I think the first. thing and the most important thing was. that subtle fact that for six months we.

had interacted without me knowing who he. was the reason that's important is. because I never had any sort of. pretenses to our relationship I never. had any sort of need or ask I wasn't. coming to him pitching a startup I. wasn't asking for a job because I didn't. know who he was so it was pure genuine. interest of just talking to another. human being and people in high positions. people liked him people like your. mentors they are constantly hit with.

people asking them for something. everyone who comes into their life wants. something from them there's always a. transaction and when you can be the. opposite of that when you can seek. people out just for their knowledge just. to learn from them to absorb by osmosis. being around someone like that it stands. out and their minds when you can be. genuine like that so that I think is. probably the most important thing okay I. told Tim later I didn't know who you. were for the first six months and we. kind of had a laugh about it but it.

definitely came across that I was. genuine and I wasn't looking for. something from him in the way that. everyone else does. the other thing I would say is there is. a. discipline and a certain mentality that. comes across. when I was taking the actions on a daily. basis that I was I was showing up at the. gym every single morning at that time. you know certain things about a person. that does that yeah you know that I'm. the type of person that when when I say.

I'm gonna do something I'm gonna do it. and that tells you a lot about someone. you have these subtle signals that. you're sending out into the world on a. daily basis through your actions and. whether you know what they are or not. other people are observing them certain. things you do in whatever way are. sending signals about who you are as a. person and your identity so be very. thoughtful about what signals you want. to be sending the world. Fair very fair that's but okay here's a.

question on the first thing which you. said like just being around people to. learn and you know. just to just to be around them for. to absorb knowledge right I'm sure Tim. Cook or any one of the big shots. they would find at least hundreds of. people every day who would say this. thing to them that I only want to be. around you because of the knowledge I. only want to be around you because I. want to learn from you right. what do you think how do they identify.

who to give time to and who not to the. second thing which is like somebody who. shows up every day kind of stuff I think. that's certainly part of it the signals. and it had been six months before I made. any sort of ask it had been a long time. so I didn't just show up at the gym at. 5am one morning see Tim Cook walk up to. him and say will you be my mentor will. you get coffee I'd like to learn from. you because he has to your point. thousands of people that probably ask. him that exact thing or would do that it. had been so long of building a genuine.

relationship with someone we had become. friends we were friends I didn't know. his name he didn't know my name but we. were friends and that speaks volumes. because then at that point we had had a. relationship there was a basis for it. that wasn't just a transaction that I. was coming in to try to have. and with people in those positions it's. just it's hard for them to find real. friends to find real relationships with. people that don't want something from. them and to this day I don't know that. I've ever asked him a single question. about Apple.

I've spent tons of time with him over. the years I've never asked him a single. question about things going on at Apple. or what you know what's going on what's. Happening partially because I'm so. sensitive to the fact that I don't want. him to think that I'm looking for. something from him I want to learn he. has access to the smartest people in the. world I want to know how they think how. it was his relationship with so and so. someone that I'm interested in learning. from how does he think about goals how. does he think about building how does he. think about growth at his age in his.

life what gives him the energy to wake. up every morning and show up at the gym. when he's a billionaire he's a. billionaire but he's showing up at the. gym at 4 45 in the morning why why would. you possibly do that those are the. things that I wanted to learn true now. that that makes sense that was going to. be my next question I wanted to ask like. because you've spent so much time with. him what do you think is really. outstanding about him. there are a few things that stand out in. my mind about Tim Cook the first one is.

the most insane sickening work ethic. that you'll ever find in a human being. and the fact that he's showing up at the. gym at 4 45 in the morning every day. as a billionaire. as the CEO of the largest company in the. world is insane yeah he's showing up. he's getting to the office before every. single Junior employee. that works for him. and you just know if you're working with. someone like that that you are not going. to outwork the CEO of your company that.

is unbelievable unprecedented he works. at that age and at that age to have done. it his whole career. the second one is he is incredibly. principled. he has a core set of values and. principles. I don't know if he has them written down. or if they're just so firmly ingrained. in his mind that he operates by and he. sticks to them and anything that he. looks at any challenging decision he's. viewing through the lens of those set of. principles and values and a lot of us.

strive for that. but we don't have such a clear picture. of what they are so it can be. challenging and that has always pushed. me learning that about him has always. pushed me to try to Define what those. values are in my life that I want to. live by because it provides such Clarity. in chaos when you're able to do that. when you're able to look in a moment of. craziness where there's noise all around. you and just know just narrow the field. of vision to that one thing he is. incredible with that so the CEO of Apple.

Tim Cook okay what was the best thing. you learned from him what did he teach. you the best specific to you. because you say that you have learned a. lot from him right he's a CEO of Apple I. mean that the gazillion things to learn. from him yeah what have you learned the. most interesting thing I learned from. Tim Cook the most interesting story. is related to how he found himself at. Apple. and it's a lesson for all of us around.

following our passions and pursuing. things that we have genuine excitement. about so Tim was prior to Apple at. compact which was a small computer. company that you might remember maybe. you're too young I know I know and prior. to that he had been at IBM and he was on. the fast track to be an executive at. this big company. incredible career everyone's patting you. on the back you know he was in there. like executive acceleration program and.

he decided to leave that cushy gig to. take a role. I believe as CEO at compact this tiny. computer startup and he did it because. he had the energy he was so excited. about jumping to that role. six months after joining Compaq. Steve Jobs was looking for someone to. run all their supply chain to run their. operations at Apple and was looking. through the stack of resumes that the. recruiters had given him and saw Tim's. resume. and he saw that he had been at IBM which.

Steve kind of looked down on this big. company slow moving Etc but then he saw. oh he left and went to Compaq a small. startup dangerous move risky move this. guy actually has something to him he. thought. and that was what led to him hiring Tim. that was what drove him to the top of. Steve Jobs's list and bringing him in. and now the rest is history as Tim is. CEO and it all sparked from that small. decision to follow his energy to go to. compact to leave the cushy gig when Tim.

told me that story I was so blown away. by it and it coincided with my own. Journey with thinking about my own life. was I going to continue to pursue this. cushy path or should I jump and do this. thing that didn't really make sense to. anyone but me. and what he said about it when he told. me this story was that things have a way. of working out when you follow your. energy he never could have predicted. that he never could have predicted that. going to compact would have led to Steve. Jobs taking his resume so seriously.

because of that move that he had made he. just did it because that was where his. energy was leading him and what an. incredible case study of that. wow. wow this is this is your uh the fourth. one. the fourth luck right he was he was. doing things and then somebody spotted. that exactly it's. while I never thought of it this way I. thought he must be some exceptionally. crazy man who Steve Jobs must have.

hunted the way he hunts everyone it's so. crazy no and I think Steve would have. viewed him very differently if his. resume had just said IBM he never would. have gotten the job yeah yeah it was. because of that small switch and it's so. funny it's like you know Steve Jobs has. that famous commencement speech that he. gave at Stanford University and in it he. talked about connecting the dots yeah. and how you have to have faith that the. dots will connect in your life you can't. connect them looking forward you can. only connect them in reverse and for Tim. that's such a true case of the dots.

connecting you couldn't have possibly. known that going to compact was going to. lead to this but in hindsight you can. look at it and say that it did and I had. a very interesting uh insight about. Apple and we can move to the next part. after this because there's something. it's totally unrelated but I was reading. that Steve Jobs maybe you've worked with. like you know Tim Cook personally so. probably you would understand help give. me some light. so I read an article I think it was by. Alan or somebody which said that Steve.

Jobs never prepared for his succession. have you read it oh you read it like. where he so he built a design team. separately and a supply team separately. he and he was the only one who was the. connector between both of them and he. never made a succession so nobody knew. who's gonna be the right person like. whether it's gonna be Johnny Ivey or the. that's going to be Tim Cooks who's gonna. be the next person so what do you have. to say about it do you think that the. the creativity has gone lost in apple.

because there's no one who can. combine those two things because Tim. Cooks is an excellent Supply guy like. he's an excellent operations person he's. not a design person so what are your. views on that yeah. first off I think Steve Jobs is a once. in a generation multi-generation talent. and I think Tim would be the first to. say that he has so much admiration and. his first thing when he became CEO in. every interview you read is him. acknowledging I am not Steve Jobs true.

nor am I going to attempt to be Steve. Jobs because no one can replicate Steve. he was one of a kind. but if Tim has one enormous strength. it's that he knows what he's exceptional. at and he knows what he's not. and he's willing to he doesn't have the. ego. about those things that he's not he's. willing to Outsource those to people who. are exceptional at them to give them the. opportunity. to be exceptional at those things and. that is what is allowed Apple to what.

now 5 10x in value since Tim took over. it's that they've been able to continue. to achieve on the supply chain side and. continue to be extraordinary at that. because Tim is so unbelievable on that. side and he's given an armed people with. the responsibility to do those other. things to make the advancements from a. design standpoint from a product. standpoint have they launched you know. their next iPhone which is what everyone. complains about they haven't had another. massive product release like that no but.

a billion people have Apple products. around the world a billion people have. iPhones. true I mean when I walk around the. street in India and I see someone with. an iPhone we are connected in some. incredible way. just through this technology and that is. such an unbelievable thing to me I think. it's hard to it's almost hard to. comprehend the scale of that and the. connection that it has there's two. companies known as apple and Facebook. there's two billion daily active users. unbelievable how it's connected people. so I think.

on the succession question in particular. I just think. he picked a perfect person in the end. because he was someone who knew his. strengths and knew his weaknesses and. didn't have an ego about his weaknesses. so many of us have ego about our. weaknesses I do yeah I'm terrible about. it I I have things that I know I'm bad. at and yet I insist on trying to do them. and that makes no sense what we should. all do is figure out what we're great at. and focus all our energy on those and. figure out what we're bad at and find. people who are great at those things.

and how do you find them okay that's do. you know anything about like what kind. of questions did Steve Job ask now to. Tim Cooks while hiring him crazy I don't. know uh that's a good question I don't. know what senior executive recruiting. looks like actually it's you know. because I I know my own recruiting. experience when I've gone to jobs and. it's like you know they're getting to. know you and they're asking you. technical questions but what do you ask. to a perspective Co you know it's like. it's a very different process in general. I don't have any insight into that.

unfortunately. um but it is interesting I mean you see. someone's track record at that point you. see what they've done they have you know. to the point earlier on evidence you can. actually look at their evidence what how. did things improve under you at these. prior experiences that you've had and. and how do you envision things improving. for us yeah show them you know the. inside gory details of your business and. say what would you do what are the areas. you would improve. so difficult right it's so difficult. it's imagine that imagine looking at.

Apple like supply chain and having to. come in and criticize Steve Jobs and say. hey this isn't good enough here's what I. would do to make it better I mean that. takes guts. that's insane I mean today like I think. about someone doing that to Elon Musk. you know like go come into Tesla and. tell me where my supply chain is screwed. up and you get to sit in a room with. Elon Musk and tell him why he sucks at. supply chain okay. man that'd be scary yeah that'd be.

so the person that makes it through that. Gauntlet pretty impressive and who. actually proves that he has a point not. just who actually executes yeah executes. wow talking about Elon Musk right we. were wanting to talk about it. huh. have you read about the guy have you. understood like how does he operate like. what is there in him okay there are so. many things which fascinates me about. him. the first is how could he build like the.

biggest the most valued automobiles. company without marketing like what is. that I want to know that like I'm I'm in. the business of building brands I'm. doing I'm starting a new like whole. company about it at. I just stand there like what do you. think what's the reason how could he. build that. product first. it was a cult he built a cult and a. community around a product in an. unbelievable way and the way they. started Tesla. was sort of Genius in that they built.

the Halo product first they built this. expensive beautiful Roadster the Tesla. Roadster that was the first car it was. this really sporty incredible high. performance and from there they've gone. from the top and slowly moved to more. mass-market cars and what that did was. it kind of flipped the traditional auto. market on its head rather than just. producing the cheap car and then having. one maybe that's really expensive they. started at the top so it created this. Allure aspiration about Tesla I lived in.

California the whole time those cars. were coming out in the early days when. you'd see a roadster man look at that. car unbelievable and then they released. the model S and it was sporty but it was. a little more accessible you started. seeing more of them on the road it was. still a hundred twenty thousand dollars. expensive expensive car and so they were. really nice and you saw them and they. built from the top down this incredible. Allure this incredible aspirational. brand. that was so different in the Auto.

industry it had never existed in that. way from the from the top down. to you you feel that. starting from the top building the most. premium product and making people want. that worked out really well for them it. worked out really well but hindsight's. 2020 would it work for everybody I don't. know he did something very very unique. and I'm speaking as a I I have two. Teslas uh so so I'm I'm a huge fan of. course they're unbelievable the.

self-driving is incredible I'm a huge. huge fan of the cars. um. but it was truly special what they did I. mean they've spent zero dollars on. marketing and when you compare that to. all of these car players who have spent. just billions upon billions of dollars. on Advertising. they've been able to scale into a. massive car company without doing any of. that exactly and revolutionize how. everyone thinks about electric vehicles. electric vehicles were not really sexy. sexy or really a thing until Tesla yeah.

and now every car company is having to. create that and that is a tremendous. positive for our world and for the. environment so people that hate on Elon. Musk he gets a lot of which some of. it is deserved he's crazy sometimes. he has done a lot of good yeah in that. way in normalizing electric vehicles too. true and I drove Tesla for the first. time in LA uh recently I think this. April last April and so in U.S there's a.

lane system okay in India usually people. don't they don't know the notice. there's no Lane system right and like. you. whenever you see space you just go there. right like that's that's the way to. drive with you. and so in Tesla there's an option the. moment your your wheel is on like on a. different Lanes line it just shows you. red red the car Buzz is right I'm sure. you've experience it. and while I'm driving I just start. driving.

every time I'm trying to like just go. right and it just started buzzing it's. like what happened what's happening I. for 15 minutes I thought someone's gonna. bump into me that's why it's buzzing. around and then later I got to know okay. like if my wheel also steps on someone. else's Lane the car is auto correcting. me I was like what the hell I just it. was so difficult for 15 minutes for me. to drive and the second thing was. I didn't know okay so I took that on the. car and rent and then I didn't know that.

you have to like turn like you have to. open the car from the side right there. and for 15 minutes I'm in the middle of. the street like okay. and I think it was so difficult like I. didn't know how to turn off the car and. I was like but there's no turn off just. get out you just get out get out yeah I. mean I I'm in India right now obviously. and my wife is back home in New York and. she needed something out of my car and. she didn't have my key and from here I.

opened up my app and unlocked the car. sitting in my driveway in New York and. she got into it that's just so cool yeah. but what car can do that it's. unbelievable it's crazy I mean it makes. sense it's just the internet and it's. wired in and but what an amazing like. these simple things that they've done. that have just changed how you could. think about a car working are incredible. yeah true so that's wow I'm sure Elon. must be happy about this conversation. well if he's listening I'm a fan of the. cars.

okay but what do you think you said like. and then so let's talk about Elon Musk. doing hundreds of things okay what I've. seen I've heard a story that where Elon. says that go for such bold things that. the world thinks it's crazy. that that's the best filter for you to. hire people because. when you say crazy things like I want to. build I wanna spaceships like I want to. build spaceships or I want to go to.

model sorry yeah so I want to go to Mars. and try to do everything there and want. to build build civilization there right. I want to do that when you say that. ninety percent of the people are gonna. feel that you're crazy you're just dumb. you're stupid right I don't know the. money has got into your head you're. doing stupid things but the 10 who feels. that oh there's possibility these are. the people you can hire do you believe. in this yes for what he's trying to do. on a consistent basis across all of his. companies whether you look at Tesla.

whether you look at SpaceX neuraling. Solar City I mean neuralink is like you. know robotic brain I mean it's insane. um I think so you're you're basically. trying to weed out people that aren't. big enough crazy enough thinkers that. don't necessarily Believe in Your Vision. which most people won't and I think part. of his strategy has always been. over promise to the Moon you know to the. to Mars I suppose in this case like.

create this massive aspiration because. if you undershoot that by a little bit. it's still an incredible advancement but. if you shoot for something that sounds. reasonable and then maybe you don't hit. it what benefit did that create for. other people you know he has been saying. these unbelievable massive numbers for. Tesla over the years that they've. consistently missed and yet because of. those because of all the talk because of. the press that gets done off of all of. that the whole industry has had to. change and now the same thing is. happening with Mars with SpaceX he you.

know talks about colonizing Mars and. going to Mars will they do that in our. lifetimes I don't know but because he's. talked about it so much because he's. taken steps with SpaceX to build these. rockets that are reusable the entire. space economy has changed and. revolutionized as a result of it it's. changed the entire industry and so I. think it's all part of his strategy that. you throw these enormous crazy sounding. goals out there it recruits incredible. people that want to go after those kind. of things and if you miss it's still an.

amazing outcome. do you think we like young entrepreneurs. should do that. it depends what you're working on oh. we'll promise like whatever you're. working on just just go. just just over promise like throw these. number of things out and then start. working backwards. I've often said that I want to impact A. Billion Lives during the course of my. life that sounds ridiculous that's an. insane ridiculous number no that's not. achievable you can do that I think so.

yeah I think so I think it sounds crazy. to a lot of people that hear it but I do. say things from time to time that my. wife will look at me and be like what. you want to do you know I'm writing a. book right now and I keep saying like. you know I want to sell I want to sell. 100 000 copies week one and like you. know the top the number one New York. Times bestseller normally sells like 30. 000 copies in the first week I was like. I'm gonna sell a hundred thousand copies. the first week and she's like there's no. real precedent for that like you know. Prince Harry maybe can do that but like. who are you how are you going to do that.

and I'm just like I'm gonna manifest it. I don't know I don't know I'm gonna do. it but if I keep saying that in my mind. and even if I go up short and I do 50. 000 that's a great outcome yeah so I. think there's levels to it I'm not going. around saying that I'm gonna go send us. to Mars I'm not you know necessarily. working on anything that's that. ambitious or incredible for Humanity. um but I do think that having these. enormous dreams and starting to build. and show evidence that you can go and. accomplish that. is healthy I mean I think I I'm a big.

believer in manifesting these outcomes. that you want to create so am I and just. being able to see it in your own mind. before anyone else can that's Elon. musk's biggest trait that has allowed. him to be successful is that he. believes before anyone else could. possibly believe that thing can happen I. think he genuinely believes that it is. possible he just fills people. normal people like you and me he fills. us with so much so many promises that we.

all subconsciously want him to win and. that's one of the biggest reasons he. also has this amazing. and unique rationality to the things. that he's doing that is so confusing. from the outside looking in if you don't. dissect it so I'm going to break it down. when you talk about going to Mars that's. crazy that sounds ridiculous that. doesn't make any sense that can't. possibly work. but break it down his View. is that the value of that happening of.

making it to Mars and doing that. colonizing it is so astronomical for. Humanity completely changes the course. of humanity that even if there's only a. one percent chance that it works the. expected value the percentage chance. times the total value if you do it is. enormous yeah and so he's willing to. take the bet because it makes sense to. do there's this famous interaction he. had with Charlie Munger the famous. investor Warren Buffett's partner where. at some lunch Charlie Munger basically.

gave a monologue of all of the reasons. that Tesla would fail he sat and told. everyone at the table with Elon Musk. sitting there all the reasons Tesla. would fail and Elon Musk famously. replied you know yes I actually agree. with all of those reasons I think. they're all correct and you're probably. right but it's still worth doing because. the outcome if it works is so huge for. Humanity that it's still worth trying. it's still important that we try AI so I. think he has this very fascinating.

rationality. where the probability of success times. the unique value that will be created if. they succeed. is what he really thinks about yeah. that's what that's what I meant that uh. D if he wins the reward is going to be. so big for everybody every individual. that the masses want him to win that's a. huge that's a that's a brilliant Point. you're making that he get he has a. unique ability to get people on his side. yeah because he wants him to win yeah.

think of it like no matter even the. things he does for fun. people want him to win like buying. Twitter yeah. what's your take on that he bought. Twitter for fun yeah. um. too early to say there's clearly been a. bunch of changes to Twitter since he. came in I would say not all of them have. been good okay uh but things are. happening at Twitter which is a positive. relative to the Past they're rolling out. new features there's things that they're.

making changes around and I'm all for. that uh you were telling me something. about the AI okay I have a very I I'm. I'm confused when it comes to AI. because I feel it might kill content. creators it might kill creators. it's or it might help them I just don't. know for to me right now it looks more. towards the dark side I really feel that. creators are dead because I mean if. somebody can somebody can write for you.

in some if somebody can think on behalf. of you if somebody can come up with. better content than you then what's the. point that they in fact there are going. to be times when I think it's already. happening that they can speak also right. so so what are we going to do we're dead. like the companies are just gonna use it. for their specific agendas so he hears. the conversation I was having with one. of my friends that. so all the fintech startups are going to. have the finance channels they'll be. using these AI tools to build the.

finance channel so Finance creators dead. right Banks and business ecosystems will. have business creators your let's say. Shopify and everything will have money. online money making kind of creators. right everybody will have their own set. of creators and the companies will build. it they'll have their teams running it. and then you're done. I think you're misunderestimating the. human desire to interact with humans. okay I think that's what people are. missing here when they're predicting the.

apocalypse for creators is that. I don't want to consume content from. computers I don't want a future that. looks like Terminator with Arnold. Schwarzenegger and the like big robots. running around running my world I want. to connect with a personality and so. when I follow someone and the. relationship that you're building with. your audience is based on your. personality your face a real person. face-to-face interaction that they feel. they can connect with on some level. Beyond just the content and so I've.

always thought from the early days of my. own Creator experience I need to be. building a community I need to be. building a true connection person to. person with this audience that I'm. building because if not if it's just. based on the information that I'm giving. then yes yeah AI will replace the. information it can already do that but. if it's based on a human connection on a. feeling of cultural connection on a. feeling of social connection that goes.

much deeper than just the information. you're giving so but okay here's the. thing right so if you look at content. creators right now there are two types. of creators one is relationship based. creators one is topic based creators. okay so topic based creators are. essentially only being followed for the. next topic they're going to bring in the. world right and there are many like that. many okay information based creators I. think uh I don't know most of the people. we talked about right now they all were. in the same category and then there is.

relationship-based Creator which are. essentially your vloggers your funny. content creators they who make you fall. in love with their personality so you. mean to say that the one side of. creators the topic based creators are. gonna die I think it's a very. challenging future if you are a purely. topic based Creator I used to be a. purely topic based Creator so I'm. talking to myself here as well I used to. simple I mean I started my entire. Creator career was just writing about. topics it was writing about business or. Finance explaining these things mental.

models Frameworks and what I realized. maybe about a year ago was that that. might go away and the reason I realized. it was because I created a market sort. of with these Twitter threads originally. that a bunch of people came into they. saw it working for me and then there. were a hundred people creating the exact. same thing I was doing and so I looked. it I looked at it that way I didn't. think about AI I just basically those. people that were doing that copying me. were AI to me I was like that that was. the AI coming after me and so what I.

realized was I have to build a. relationship with my audience and that. means communicating with them engaging. with them responding to things they send. me being really personal doing things. that don't scale to use the to use the. Paul Graham phrase and that was when I. started sharing more photos of my family. of myself of my own journey of my own. struggle being more vulnerable doing the. things that start to build that. connection because otherwise the AI is. is coming and it's coming for you all. right the last part of the conversation.

relationship which. has um. recently I've gotten into it a lot. because I. I've realized that. relationship you know you get better. with relationship and you grow. when you actively work on it when you. work on yourself and that's how you grow. the relationship right so it has been. now a really. an area of Interest which I never looked. on and that's why I've been doing this.

content of relationship right and. because I've been in. and. knowingly or unknowingly I've always. been a person who who's who loves like. long-term commitment who's been there so. you would see me I'm such a mama's boy. I'm such a like dad's boy I'm such a. great like I'll always be there for my. brother I'll be there with my girlfriend. like you know everything I'm just like. always there so unknowingly I was there. but now knowingly consciously I'm making. constant efforts to make sure that I'm a. better person now and if I have anger.

issues how to solve that what triggers. that there's so many things so I wanted. your take on relationship. what do you think like what makes a. great relationship. so much of life. that we perceive from the outside. looking in. is the Glamorous stuff when we see. people's lives on Instagram and on these. social media channels what we see is the. gorgeous vacations the perfect photo. shoots all the trips all the events all.

of these amazing things that's very very. little of life the vast majority of life. is doing nothing. it's literally just moments doing. nothing boring. when you find a person who you are happy. doing nothing with. that is your person. when I got married a friend asked me the. day before how did you know that. Elizabeth my wife was the one and that.

was what I said I said I'm so happy. doing absolutely nothing with this woman. and that is life life isn't about those. fancy vacations and the honeymoons and. the Glamorous trips and all those things. it is sitting on the couch and relaxing. with the person and doing nothing and. when you're happy doing that. that's a beautiful beautiful thing that. you cannot take lightly have you said it. somewhere I've heard this before. I may have tweeted it no I think you've. said it on Ali abdullah's podcast have.

you. because I've heard it hurt you saying. something maybe I've said it on Ali. abdalls or maybe like Harry stabbings. something I saw you I might have said. that yeah it just gives me it's stuck in. my mind yeah it's. because it just gives me that feeling. that I've heard it and now it's making. more sense and. dude it's true because there are only. few people you can do nothing around. like nothing you can do nothing around. them and you still be okay I mean I have.

so many friends who have gone through. these relationships where it was all. reliant on doing the fun stuff I'm doing. the trips undoing the fancy dinners out. on doing the events and the cool photos. and all that stuff and as soon as you. got them into a setting where there was. none of that the relationship fell apart. because it wasn't based on something. real it was based on this extrinsic. world of glamor and that's not what life. is that's really not what life is. especially not after you have a kid.

after you have a kid most of your life. becomes that kid and basically doing. nothing cleaning up after them playing. with them walking all of those things so. you have to love doing nothing with this. person. wow I mean it's part of the whole. imperfection of what love and. relationships really are we have this we. all grew up with movies and you know the. Disney movies and all these things that. painted this perfect picture of. relationships and of love and the. handsome charming Prince and the. beautiful princess getting married and.

coming together and that's not reality. it's just not we are all deeply deeply. flawed in our own ways we all have. tremendous amounts of baggage. pain suffering things from our past. personality flaws weird eccentricities. we all have these. and so it's finding someone who will. perfectly love. your imperfections. that is what is impactful that is what. makes the difference.

okay there are two things about it okay. the relationship. right there's one thing that you need to. be with someone who who like with whom. everything's happy everything's great. everything's just. you know that person just brings you a. sense of comfort a sense of life in you. okay. and then there's other thing that if you. want to be with anyone it's not a garden. it's not like Wonderland you'll have to.

go to sacrifices adjustments compromises. you have to do a lot of that as well so. do you feel that. when you compromise in the relationship. isn't it compromising with the core. principle of yourself that you'll never. want to compromise in life. it's a amazing question you ask because. I've thought about this recently very. recently that. falling in love and having a great. relationship. is all about giving up your.

innate selfishness that you've developed. your entire life our entire childhood. and our entire upbringing our early. career years we are 100 selfish whether. we believe it or not because we're. looking out for ourselves we're trying. to find our way in the world we're. trying to figure out our routines grow. learn do all these things it's all for. ourself for the most part yeah. and in order to build a meaningful. relationship you have to give up that. selfishness because you have to make.

those compromises because you have to. find someone who you're willing. to give up that selfishness for I'm. extremely routine oriented I'm obsessed. with my routines I'm like the annoying. person that does their exact same wake. up time the perfect routine all of that. okay my wife is the only person I've. ever met my whole life who I'm willing. to give up my routines for who I'm. willing to when she says oh stay in bed. so you can talk to Roman our son that I.

do it no one else in the world if they. said that to me I would say shut up no. I'm not doing that but for my wife I'm. willing to do that because it's so. important to our relationship and to who. we are for me to make those changes to. give up that selfishness. and so I think it's a great question to. ask yourself is are you willing to give. up your natural selfishness for this. person are you willing to let them in in. that way. I saw something you did recently that I. loved that I want to ask you about. it was a it was a clip of you talking. about.

um your girlfriend I think you know was. came home and was venting about. something she was upset and someone had. been mean or there was something that. had happened at work and I've run into. this exact same situation with my wife. where. she'll come home from work and be you. know annoyed about what so-and-so did. and some project didn't go well whatever. it was and my disposition which I think. is yours is to be a fixer yeah I'm like. okay I'm gonna fix this I'm smart I'm. analyzing the situation I'm going to. give you the answer that you need like.

hey you could have looked at it this way. or here's how the problem might have. been solved a little bit better and she. would get so mad at me and what you said. in your video which I loved was that. they don't want you to fix it that's not. what they're looking for in this. situation they just want to know that. someone is there with them yep and so I. think about that so often that sometimes. the most powerful thing you can do in. life is just say I'm with you yeah. because that's what they need yeah. that's absolutely what what we also need. right that you know I was having this.

conversation I think two days ago with. someone that. the biggest problem is. that men and women are not same. right and the biggest problem is that we. think that they're same you know that's. just so different it's we. women are very feeling oriented emotions. already men are very fixing oriented. they're Solutions oriented they want to. fix everything they want a solution they.

won't find Solutions everything okay and. what happened in these two mindsets the. the moment you're trying to find. Solutions and if sometimes you go all in. and you want to solve that problem. and sometimes when and when you know. that there's no solution over it you. just completely ignore it you pick it up. ignore it let it be whereas women okay. they're very feeling oriented so they. will feel everything whether there's. solution for it or no they would still. want to feel that thing with you. so when you are trying to solve a same.

thing together the one person wants to. feel it and the other person wants. illusion so you always have to just. think about it that okay if there's a. problem of her I need to treat it the. way she wants me to treat it and it's. the problem of him I should treat it the. way he needs to be treated and not the. other way around and the problem is. where we feel that okay you know we. treat other person the way we feel like. we need to be treated and that's wrong. and that's what I think the world just.

needs to change that we're not same and. and it's not about men and women it can. be opposites as well can men can be The. Feelers as well and the women can be. solution oriented I'm just saying that. in my relationship it's different so you. just need to feel that. the way they are you need to solve their. problem like that not the Way You Are. yeah you need to give them what they. need it's like the there was that famous. book of the The Love Languages. yeah you need to know what your. partner's Love Languages and you know I.

it's taken me years to understand this. with my wife and to be able to. internalize it and I've known for years. what hers is it's touch you know she. needs to just be hugged basically and. like that's what she wants she needs. more affection in that way I don't. experience love that way so it's weird. for me but I need to do that because. that's what she needs and yes when I. need a certain type of love she needs to. know that and be able to give it to me. in that way. and being able to do that I mean over. the long run those tiny little things.

add up. I saw I think it was Mel Robbins. recently talk about this she said. people are quiet quitting on. relationships. slowly letting a relationship atrophy. it's not the big fight the big breakup. the big thing it's those tiny Nicks it's. death by Thousand Cuts by not doing the. thing that your partner needs in one. little way it could be as small as not. putting the dish where you know your. partner likes you to put the dish away. and you do that over and over again and.

every single time you do that it's a. tiny sign of disrespect and you don't. think it's a big deal but she does. and you're slowly chipping away You're. slowly quitting on that relationship wow. I thought it was really powerful this is. powerful this makes this makes so much. sense you know in fact you know what the. bigger problem is the bigger problem is. sometimes you know. that. this is. this is how your partner needs to be. loved or this is what your this is what. is important for your partner.

and you still don't do it because if. because that's not important for you. right so just knowing that you know I I. think. to make a great relationship work. you need to work you it just doesn't. fall into place it's not like movies or. like the way fairy tales and the Disney. stuff is coming up you need to work you. need to work on yourself you need to. work on your communication you need to. work on your partner you need to work on. understanding love language you need to.

work on every goddamn thing daily you. need to work on your feelings. right it's a lot of work so when you're. ready to work on something more than. just yourself that is the time you can. actually get in a relationship if you. feel that hey someone else is going to. come into your life and then just help. you get better with your work I think. it's wrong expectation setting of your. of your relationships you can never let. your own stubbornness your own ego.

be more important. than what you're trying to build with. this person. and it's so easy to let that happen. because you want to win some fight. you've decided like I am someone that. wins fights like I win arguments. and if that's what you care about the. relationship's never going to work. because no fight is worth ruining a. relationship over it's okay to fight. it's okay if you get into fights I've. seen you talk about this before that's. okay you can fight. but you shouldn't let wanting to win a.

fight get in the way of your. relationship I I spoke to. a bunch of 80 and 90 year olds for my. birthday asking them what advice they. would give to their younger self. and one of the people that I talked to. said you may win the argument but if you. lose the friend was it really worth it. and I thought it was so powerful because. we get in this like hype cycle of like. oh I'm gonna win this argument we get. all pumped up and it's probably more. with men than women you know we're like.

alpha male I'm gonna win this argument. this is gonna be great but if you lose a. friend or if you lose a relationship. what the hell was the point yeah what. was the point of that argument. you know. I feed with me specifically I'll talk. about like a subtle problem yo okay. which I think now overcoming over the. time and it is. that I never wanted to lose a friend or. I never want to lose a partner and not. even want to win fight okay but.

sometimes I feel that hey I was right. and I'm right and because I'm right then. other person should listen to me. you know and that used to make things so. ugly. and I think I'm still recovering that. where I feel like oh this is not my. fault at all right so now so earlier. like this used to be the Baseline and I. would just it's like that's it done you. can't understand my point of view you're. you're wrong you're bullshitting let's. just not talk okay so and I would do.

that. but now what I do is. even though let's say I know that the. other wasn't wrong in my head let's say. I am right I would say okay great. perfect let's talk about it tomorrow. let's talk about 10 days later but the. other person let's say wants to fix it. right here right now. I would be someone who would accept it I. would let it flow I would I would lie. about that okay I get your point and. it's okay let it be and then five days. later when the state of anger has gone.

down then I would address this and be. like hey you know what that day you said. this I don't agree to it let's fix it so. that has helped me you know strengthen. my relationship so much that. you don't have to be honest every time. on spot. like you can just. sometimes you cannot say anything you. can choose not to say anything. stick it in you I just hold it for the. right time to say it in so that you can.

solve it rather than make it more ugly. because the way you are not ready to. accept the truth the other person is. also not right to accept the truth. yeah wanting to be right. and feeling you are right is a dangerous. thing yeah I feel that often and it has. led to many fights that could have been. avoided there was an amazing article in. the Atlantic this magazine I don't know. if we have it in India but in the states. um that basically was an author saying. that he got a divorce because he. wouldn't put his cup in the sink.

and that was the headline of the article. and so I clicked in and I was reading it. and it was all about how he would refuse. to put his cup in the sink he would. leave it on the on the table right next. to the sink and it bothered his wife and. she would say something and his rational. mind would say no you're you're. absolutely wrong about this thing it's. so stupid I do so much for this family. I'm earning all this money I do so many. big things and you're gonna get mad at. me about this cup that I leave here. you're wrong.

and what his point was in the article is. that it's not about the cup. he might be correct rationally it's. stupid it doesn't matter relative to him. earning money and relative to him being. a good father it's not about the cup. though. it's about what it meant and what it. represented to his wife what it. represented to his wife was that he. didn't care enough about her to just do. the tiny little action of putting it in. the sink which to her was just so easy. and simple and so every time he did that. he rationalized it in his mind as it's.

stupid but for her it was a subtle sign. of disrespect that chipped away and. chipped away and chipped away at their. relationship until they broke dude this. is so powerful this is. wow. it's not about the cup. it's about what it means to the other. person. and so what are those cups in your. relationship and in your life think. about them. and try to understand and empathize with.

what does that cup mean to the other. person. because it doesn't matter what it means. to you. it really doesn't. wow this is highlight for me today's. episode dude this is so good. I'll send you the article we can put it. in the show notes it's a brilliant. article yeah it is it's it's crazy. because. you know feeling that you're right with. his. wanting to prove that you're right it's. just these are like two different things. they're dangerous.

I I don't have I don't have words for it. because it is showing me so many like. Memories right now in my head about my. relationship with my brother my. relationship with my mom my relationship. with my girlfriend my relationship oh my. god dude it's sick it's everywhere yeah. I love it I love how I stand what do you. think are the top three principles which. every young person should follow in. their lives. it's a great question I would say the. first one. would be integrity.

you have to operate with high integrity. in everything you do yeah because your. career and your life is so long. and one black mark against that when you. start when you just allow it to slip a. little bit snowballs into something so. much bigger it's a very very slippery. slope true and and you know. once you if it once you do something. like once you allow something slippery. to happen and if nobody notices it.

becomes a habit it becomes so much. easier to do with them exactly the next. time and the next time and the next time. and you don't realize it until it. becomes so big and just just. just this freaky art look at every. single one of the worst frauds in. history all of them started with a tiny. little. Act. a tiny little slippery slope that got. started Bernie Madoff one of the biggest. frauds in history billions and billions. and billions of dollars it started with.

a tiny loss on a bad day that he covered. up. and then what the next time it's a. little bit easier because you've already. done it to cover that next one up and to. say oh no I'll work my way out of this. don't worry we'll continue to do better. it'll it'll be fine every time it gets a. little bit easier to take that negative. action in the direction. and it's the same thing with everything. is connected in your life so when you. take actions that are positive in the in. the direction of the person you want to.

be every single one of those makes it a. little bit easier for you to take the. next action that's positive but it goes. both ways hmm so if you're taking a. negative a if you're not doing the thing. you said you were going to do it gets a. little bit easier to not do it the next. time yeah. so you get to decide which course and. the beauty of it is. all you need to care about is the next. decision. because if you just start and you make. one positive decision it starts sending. you in that direction then you make. another one then you make another one.

you start stacking compounding those. positive decisions. me too I'm thinking in fact I feel. taking positive steps. every time you take one it gets. difficult and then difficult and then. difficult but when it's negative it gets. easier easier and easier it just works. out of it because so there was a I don't. know I heard it in a Bollywood movie or. something somewhere where somebody says. that. when you do something negative.

it feels great instantly when you do. something positive it feels great in the. long run it doesn't feel great instantly. so you need to decide like in Long Run. even when you like you know in long run. you want to feel great or do you want to. feel bad like that's the and it it. just you know just clarifies everything. in your life because. if you think that you're waking up every. day and doing anything because you want.

to have a great life 10 years from now. because everybody's working in hope that. tomorrow is going to be better right. then why are you doing negative things. because 10 years car like the end point. of the 10 years is gonna. not be really great it's not gonna be. something which you wanted so just just. work on something positive because if. you are thinking of 10 years then think. of just doing the positive stuff. long-term thinking is one of the most. powerful mindsets you can have as a.

human being Naval ravacant once said you. always should seek to play long-term. games with long-term people and it's. always stuck in my mind as being so so. true because the people that play. long-term games and are able to delay. gratification are the people who win the. people that aren't looking for that. short-term dopamine hit from scrolling. social media or from doing the stupid. thing they shouldn't be doing the people. that are willing to delay that. gratification to play that long-term. game will always win is Stanford I think.

it was at Stanford there was the. marshmallow experiment okay where they. gave a bunch of children a marshmallow. and then they left the room and they. said don't eat this marshmallow we're. going to come back and you can eat it. when we come back but you can't eat it. now and they left and they watched the. kids that were sitting there with the. marshmallows in front of them some kids. couldn't resist and just ate the. marshmallows this you know this sugary. treat right in front of him some kids. listened and delayed the gratification. and what they did was the people came. back and then said okay now you can eat.

it they tracked these kids for years. into the future the kids who delayed. eating the marshmallow are dramatically. more successful as adults than the kids. who ate it right away unbelievable yeah. yeah it plays out over the course of. your life the ability to delay that. gratification is so impactful in your. life. and. I don't think it's difficult also. delay gratification is not that. difficult it depends on who you are I.

think for some people it can be really. it may not be for you because you're. naturally wired in a certain way to be. able to do it if your wiring is not. built that way or if you have spent the. last 15 years doing the short-term thing. and not delaying gratification it may be. hard to flip the switch the way to do it. though is to Pat yourself on the back. for the tiny wins give yourself a little. gratification yeah because if it's not. going to be there like you know give an. example say I'm. 300 pounds.

I'm I'm overweight. and I want to start working out and I go. to the gym the first day for 20 30. minutes it's miserable terrible I feel. awful really really difficult there's no. short-term benefit from that I didn't I. feel awful I'm sore the next morning I. don't want to get out of bed but if I. look in the mirror and I say wow you did. that you went to the gym you did the. thing you said you were going to do I. give myself a little win to feel good. about it feel even for five seconds to. feel good about what I did now I'm more.

likely to go do it again yeah and so. even though the actual gratification of. Being Fit and being in shape and being. healthy is maybe a year away of doing. that every day or maybe six months away. I'm giving myself a little bit. and it makes me more likely to stay the. course to be able to navigate it. I feel you should also just like for the. fun sake the moment you go work out. right after you work out watch yourself. naked in front of a mirror because even.

though like people say that you don't. see results in day one I disagree you. see slight change on day one itself. because there's like a small pump which. you can see it right even though your. body is not changed significantly but. you could see it so and especially when. you're working out in the morning so. delayed gratification I mean obviously. it works out and you can pat yourself in. the back and you can see but I feel. every time you do something good you. something positive it's gonna benefit. you in the long run. it benefits you in short run as well and.

just I mean with working out working out. will change your life in every area. getting into shape training your body. physically on a daily basis moving your. body physically will change everything. in your life because when you work out. you're much less likely to eat unhealthy. as well because you don't want to ruin. that effort that you just put in you. just put in all this good effort so. people tend to eat healthier once they. start working out people tend to sleep. better when they're working out sleep. impacts your focus the next day when. you're working it all is this virtuous.

cycle that all starts with just moving. your body every single day if you can. just commit to moving your body for 30. minutes every single day in some way it. doesn't even have to be going to the gym. walking. go walk up some stairs run up and down. the street whatever it might be anything. it will change your life. well I'm getting dead you look great. no it has been so I used to work out a. lot about I think three years ago two. years three years ago and then I had. like a very bad injury on my shoulder.

and I that was like very bad like I. couldn't lift and then there was this I. got scared that I'll never be able to. gonna lift again because my doctor said. that I need to undergo a surgery and the. surgery will put me on bed for six. months and you know if it's so scary. that I was like let it be I don't want. to lift again I'm not doing it but then. now that it's healed now that I can lift. again obviously I can't do like extreme. weights but I can I can do enough that. that allow me to get back in shape again.

so now there's just a fear. um I think that that fears taught me for. two since like that stopped me for two. years but I'm getting back so it has. been I think this is. this is second month where I'm not. skipped my gym amazing and that's I feel. great and if not Jim I go play tennis. yeah like something some or the other. thing I need to do it and I've I I. started with three days a week now I do. five days a week and I'm think I'm good. and slowly I'll I'll go there with Trend.

and if I got today only just I just. uploaded a story that hey I'm looking. for a strength coach oh yeah. okay first was Integrity for you yeah. second was what was the other principle. work ethic okay has to be I there is. this movement. of. working smart is more important than. working hard if you are young there is. no replacement for working hard I just. don't believe it and the reason I say. that is not because I'm some hustle.

culture bro trying to Peddle hard work. and work 100 hour weeks it's literally. because early in your career early in. your life you have to explore the range. of opportunities that exist in order to. know which are the good ones the only. way to do that is through time you have. to work hard you have to say yes to. Opportunities take on enough things. stumble enough screw up enough be. embarrassed enough to learn what the. good ones are and then once you've done.

that now you can start to work smart can. start to find leverage can start to. exploit the best opportunities that. exist but without that first phase your. view is so narrow that you might be. working smart but on the wrong thing. yeah you might climb up this one. mountain get to the top of it and. realize you climbed the wrong one you. get to the top and you look around and. say. I climbed the wrong mountain now what do. I do I have to go all the way back down. and that's a terrible place to be you.

don't want to do that I almost did that. it's not good. why do you say that you did that. I spent the first seven years of my. career working in a traditional Finance. role that was the wrong Mountain for me. I wasn't cut out for it I didn't want to. do it but the money was great yeah and. so I said this is this is what success. looks like sahil you just should be. making more and more money every year. this is success and I was overweight and. I was stressed and I wasn't present with.

my family I barely got to see my parents. I didn't see my friends because I was. working so much it was robbing me of all. of these other areas of my life because. it wasn't suited for who I was as a. person. and it was because I hadn't explored. broadly enough early in my life I hadn't. I had just gone into the one thing and. thought that was going to be my life. that was going to be my career. and fortunately. something happened a shock to the system. with covid and the lockdowns that led to. me having the opportunity.

to re-evaluate and to think more broadly. and ultimately led to the decision to. quit my job to start this New Journey. that I'm on to move back closer to home. to be closer to my parents it's. benefited my relationship with my wife. unbelievably being more present being. more real giving my energy not just my. time to her. Everything Has Changed when you find the. right Mountain that you want to climb. and that you can only find when you're. working really hard on 10 different. things and then then you find out like.

when you explore 10 things because you. have to see it you have to see the. entire map I don't know if you ever. played video games as a kid but there. were like those video games where you. were you know in the you had the tiny. Circle and everything is black on the. map and you have to go explore to open. up the map to be able to see what's. there imagine you're that character and. you just decide oh I'm just gonna build. my city in this tiny dot that I can. currently see imagine thinking that that. is going to be the best DOT where you. can build your city you don't know you.

have no idea if that's a good place or a. terrible place so you need to go do the. hard work to explore to open up your map. to then figure out where should I be. building. interesting the but you know work ethic. is usually. so when we talk about work ethic you you. talk about that. showing up. every day at the same place at the same. time you know doing the same thing. having the right kind of uh timetable.

schedule all of these things do you feel. that is work ethic or just I feel it's. more related to discipline it's more. related to doing the things you say. you're going to do yeah I don't think it. necessarily has to be working 80 hundred. hours either I think what it relates to. is that you say you're going to do. something and you show up and you do it. yeah no matter what it is and when. someone asks you to do something you do. it and you do a good job on it yeah yeah.

you don't just go through the motions. there's a lot of young people out there. who just go through the mode they they. think that having a job is their right. that someone owes them this that they. should be the CEO the first day and that. it's it's more of an American culture. thing than an Indian culture I have. generally found that in India the youth. population is unbelievably energetic. they want to grow they're so focused. just on the future because the future of. India is so bright yeah all of these.

young people that are getting access to. the internet that want to learn. in America there is a culture with the. younger generation right now that they. deserve this job that this is something. yeah you owe me this job and oh I should. actually be making more money than this. and that is going to change rather. painfully. that's going to change yeah that's. that's true I also believe in the same. thing that you should. he should do what needs to be done and I. would put it in a better words it's.

your action should map the ambition. which comes out of your mouth. and that is one of the biggest problems. right you know your your action should. map that because most of the people have. wild Ambitions they say Wilder things. and they feel that all of a sudden they. deserve it because everybody because. they look at some some other hero on the. internet and they feel that oh he's he. or she is the same age he or she comes. from the same background and I should. get to the same thing I have the same.

background of the same education. everything and then they don't see that. okay that person has been putting ours. every day learning every day doing. things every day and you're not. the way I would say it is. you can't expect people to just believe. you you need to generate evidence. and that's what you should be focused on. is just generating evidence if you. believe you are something that's great I. believe is the first the first step in. all of this you have to believe that you.

are capable of being the CEO that you. can be the leader of this team that you. can do those amazing things that you. want to do but it's your responsibility. to generate evidence to prove it to. everyone else. nice nice I like that I love you have. like lines for everything. it's fun like it's it just generate. evidence that's just it is increase your. lock surface area four types of luck I'm. a Frameworks guy yeah yeah. this is what I love reading about.

thinking about I mean this is um. I have typically thought about how I. create the things that I put out into. the world I don't have any answers I. don't know a single answer for you like. if you come to me and you say how do I. how do I succeed how do I do this how do. I do that I can't give you the answers I. can give you the questions you should be. asking I can give you the structure and. the Frameworks of how to think about. going about it and then it's up to you. to take that mold it in your own way and.

figure out what that looks like nice. nice anyone that's trying to sell you. answers well anyone that's trying to. sell you answers I just don't believe in. because it's not one size fits all me. telling you how I succeeded how does. that help you it's very different you're. doing a totally different thing than me. my map is not going to fit your reality. Integrity second was work ethic was the. third one oh geez now you're testing me. what would be another one you would add. to the list the principal one yeah hmm.

now you've really spun the game I know. no well I'm struggling to come up with a. third on the spot the principal right I. think. you know uh. I feed one I would say more than. principle I think this should be a. practice which people should follow in. their life that is. observing not judging you know it's just. something which is very powerful I've. started noticing in my life I feel every. successful person I've met a very good.

observers they just and they don't judge. so whether good or bad you should you. should see things as they are and just. observe what happened when somebody did. something. I love that one another way to say it. for me would be. listen much more than you speak hmm is. that kind of another layer of that and I. think the smartest and best people in. the world. the most successful people in the world. that I know. are all incredible listeners.

and they're not seeking to be the. loudest voice in the room they're not. seeking to have all the answers they ask. the best questions and then they have a. bias for Action that allows them to act. upon what they learn When You observe. when you listen and then you have a bias. for Action to go and do things the the. results are unbelievable the most. successful people in the world that's it. that's the formula if you wanted to have. one ask great questions and then act. what do you think makes.

a great. podcast or a great newsletter person. what do you think what why is Lex. Friedman Lex Friedman or for example Mr. Beast Mr Beast but why are great. creators great at what they do what do. you think like is there a similar. pattern in every one of them I think. there's an unbelievable consistency and. durability to what they do. when you look at any of them they've. been doing it for years Mr Beast how.

many videos has he put out over the. course of his creator career to get to. where he is today now he has 80 million. people watching his videos every single. one that he puts out but it wasn't like. that when he was starting he was just. creating every single day and he is. maniacal about understanding the. algorithm about thumbnails about titles. I mean like truly Next Level mad. scientists about how he thinks about. those things. and that stands out everywhere the best.

interviewers Tim Ferriss I love his. podcast he's an incredible interviewer. spends hours with an interview coach. he has the interview coach review the. transcripts and the videos of his. interviews and that person criticizes. him and says here's where you should. have gone deeper here's where you could. have stayed at the surface I mean he. takes it like he's a professional. athlete that's how he tried he trains to. be an interviewer and the best creators. are doing that in whatever domain it is. them you have to train in the same way.

that a professional athlete does because. this is your sport if you want to be one. of the best podcasters in the world this. is your sport. the last two questions which is on the. more on the cardio side I wanted to just. make a chart like what's the one. framework which a lot of young. entrepreneurs watching this should. follow in order to build their career. trajectory I'm sure you must have read. like hundreds of Frameworks it's a. generic question which I want you to. understand. stop comparing yourself to others.

full stop. it is everyone's tendency. to base your own happiness on how you. compare to those around you. and it is the most dangerous game you. can play Early in your career it leads. to you creating these unbelievably. unnecessary timelines on which you're. supposed to achieve Things based on how. other people have. and all it does is make you feel unhappy. about where you are today the only thing.

that matters is the comparison of. yourself today versus yourself yesterday. and if that is a happy comparison. then that's great. but I have when I think about my own. career in my own life most of my. unhappiness has come from my comparing. myself to other people I didn't get. Forbes 30 under 30. I'm congratulating. you on getting it I was so mad for so. many years about the fact that I didn't. get that because I thought that that was. what it meant to be successful that I. got Forbes 30 under 30 and I didn't get.

it over and over and over again I didn't. get it and it made me really unhappy I. saw friends posting on LinkedIn about. raising 200 million dollars for their. startup or valued at a billion dollars. or I got into Harvard Business School or. I got this fancy job at Google and I. wasn't getting any of those things and. every time I saw it I felt upset and I. felt upset about where I was in. comparison to them. and I think about how much time I wasted. and I think about how much energy I. wasted doing that and it was just stupid.

it was just and then I see. people out there that are following that. same path as me and I just want to say I. just want to shake those people out of. it just as best as you can stop. comparing yourself to others stop. following other people's timelines. stop scrolling social media in a way. where you're following people who are. making you feel bad about yourself most. people scroll social media and all. they're seeing are things that are. making them want to be someone else be.

somewhere else be with someone else all. of these negative things that's not. healthy don't follow those people follow. people who inspire you to be better than. you are today who inspire you to grow to. learn to expand your mind don't follow. the people that make you feel bad that. you don't have their life you don't need. that. that's that has been the root cause of. my unhappiness for the longest time. and I still struggle with it today it's.

it's basic thing to say but it's so. difficult to follow it's sort of and I. still struggle with it the last question. of the day which I feel I had to ask you. is I think everybody's asked you this. which one is your favorite mental model. till date. [Laughter]. Exile Bloom is a man of mental models. and Frameworks on Twitter on internet. like the world knows you from you know I. want to compliment you on one thing.

there's one thing which uh one of the. nitin karma the nikhil Kama that I tell. you his elder brother Nathan kamath he. told me this that you know. focus on becoming an influencer who. influences the influencers you know and. that's super powerful because he said if. you become a person who's influencing. 100 people who have 100 million reach. you are the most powerful person on the. earth instead of you directly reaching. out to 100 million right so I think with. you that's the case you really really.

have an impact on the top one percent of. the people because people who can. consume your content. are not someone who is getting started. they they have already had to because. you can't in order for your content to. make sense they need to be doing. something they need to be some kind of. achiever they need to be some they need. to have some kind of work ethic they. need to have some kind of. some kind of hunger to become better. right so everybody who's following you I.

think. they're already an influencer in some or. the other way and that have done. beautifully so kudos to you on that. my favorite mental model. I I would have to come back to Occam's. razor okay that was my simple simple is. beautiful. you know this whole idea that the. simplest explanation is often the best. one and the reason I say that that's my. favorite is because it is the. Foundation of everything that I do which. is trying to simplify the complex I want.

to take these things that are previously. exclusive or challenging to understand. and distill them into something that. anyone can engage with and learn from. and if one mental model applies to. everything that I do it's that one so. that would have to be my favorite just. because it's at the room so what is the. whole model can you explain it to the. audience who are watching it yeah. Occam's razor is this idea that when. you're faced with a whole ton of. potential hypotheses about something.

the simplest one the one that requires. the fewest assumptions to be true is. often the best one and so the whole idea. when you generalize it is just that. simple is beautiful. Simplicity is the ultimate. sophistication if you will the famous. quote. and I think it's true and we're all. looking for beautiful Simplicity. Elegance that cuts through all the. complexity and noise of life and so when. you can provide that when you can create. content that does that. it's a really really powerful thing.

because if I go right. ten thousand word newsletter super. complicated dense how many people are. going to read that and be impacted by it. but if I can go distill those same ideas. into something that's 500 Words simple. language like a second grader could read. it. now how many people can I impact with. that how many people will be able to. digest that and have it impact their. life it's so much more powerful 100. times more powerful. and so I think it's really true. Simplicity is the ultimate.

sophistication. do do you read to learn how to make. things simple are you a reader like. you're I read a lot you read a lot yeah. I read constantly even top three books. like you've read when breath becomes air. is probably the most impactful book I've. ever read okay um it's about a it's a. true story written by a Stanford. neurosurgeon who gets diagnosed with. terminal cancer and during the last year. of his life he writes this book. wrestling with the meaning and purpose. of life.

extremely extremely impactful. The Alchemist is another book that I. read every single year. manifesting I mean this is stuff that. we've been talking about incredible. incredible and then if I were to pick a. third book I'm going to pick one that's. a little different that I haven't talked. about in the past which is Barbarian. days it's called Barbarian days a. surfing Life and it is the most random. book you will ever hear any business. person mention because it has nothing to. do with business it's about surfing and. it's a true story it's written by this.

guy who goes off and Journeys the world. surfing at different exclusive spots but. it is such a powerful metaphors for life. contained in it of riding the waves of. Life of having this mentality of a. surfer of being able to ride a wave. knowing that that wave is going to end. and having that faith that there are. always going to be more waves in the. future. interesting thank you so much for being. here sahil I hope you enjoyed as much as. we did I got so much juice out of you.

you're an incredible interviewer this. was a blast and I'm so happy that we. were able to do it in person yes I'm so. glad we did it in person thanks a lot. for doing this brother thank you. [Music].

thank you.