BookMyShow Founder: Reality of Concert, Coldplay, Artist, Business Model & India | FO358 Raj Shamani

who. says the band wanted to play in the. world's largest cricket stadium. In the. beginning, it sounded as a bizarre. thought and finally it became the. world's largest concert. We gave an. economic lift of close to 700 crores to. the city of Ahmedabad over two days. It's an expensive show. Our tickets were. not. expensive. reality because there was a bot attack. by secondary ticket sites from all over. the world. Seven departments coming. after you. Do you think there are forces.

who want you to shut. up? Ashi Shim Rojani, founder of book my. show. Movie ticket booking platform. starts economy. leading India leading business. opportunities which are the kind of. artists which India wants to consume. Now there's been a massive resurgence of. independent music something like play. show for the demand. We've had artists. in the past who would say that I want a. bright purple potato wafers and.

sometimes these riders are a trick. because they want you to read. everything. So you say that you're a. cockroach. What do you mean by. that? I'll say we went through the com. bust. We went from 150 people down to. six. We had zero revenues. I said we are. survival even till the end of the world. where the maximum revenue comes from. Our live events business today gives us. about 40% of the revenue and now movies. is down to 60%. Where is the next big. opportunity? air, water, and food. We'll. need all these three things. So, what's. the origin of book my show? Smoking and.

[Music]. drinking. Enjoy the show. Why would I do do something in. Ahmedabad? Because concerts of this size. don't happen there usually. Yeah. And if. you hear it's Mumbai, Delhi, Bangalore,

because there's already like a there's. an urban audience which is ready to pay, ready to commute and there's a ready. market. You guys be doing so many. concerts there already. Yeah. Why. Ahmedabad? That was first. Yeah. Then. second is why Ahmedabad because there's. no alcohol as well. Bombay we were. anyways doing yeah coal play so that was. done we were doing dy partle we. announced two shows. the band wanted to play in the world's. largest cricket stadium it came as a as.

a thought from the band to say why can't. we. play at the Narendra Modi cricket. stadium okay in the beginning it sounded. as a bizarre thought right for various. reasons obviously the band didn't know. nobody. knew You you cited it right. Infrastructure, alcohol, a cricket stadium, right? It's. never been done before. Why Ahmedabad? Will consumers come? Is there a large.

enough population that will come for. that show? Do they understand the music? All of that, right? A thousand. questions. We had a thousand questions. So, there was a lot of people. internally, externally who were like, "No, no, you can't." A thousand reasons. why we. shouldn't. But when somebody tells you. no, it really excites me. It excites me. to no. extent. But.

for charity. You do something right and. it'll be funded. Gujarat tourism there. were. ideas. but stadium not. available then I took it to u the. Gujarat cricket association and BCCI and. uh just like how I got me.

excited I shouldn't be saying it but Mr. Jes supremely. excited. So now I had a partner in. crime. So I went back to the band, the. management, live nation and we said look. it's happening but there are some. changes here are the things. Now we got. into execution mode and I'll tell you. the execution mode was a what should the. pricing be? Who is going to come for the. concert? Will people come? Will it be.

locally from Gujarat? Will they come. from outside? If they come from. outside, uh do we have enough trains? And that time the problem was uh I spoke. to uh we spoke to the railway minister. He's a great guy. Uh Kum Ia was on all. the trains were busy with Kum. Mr. Ashwini Vashnab and his office, his. secretary was very very helpful. Um he. said it's hard but let let's work on it.

Um the challenge was how do you. transport people there because even if. people were to come what's the. infrastructure hotels so Ahmedabad's. infrastructure is really improved right. uh you look at the river banks the roads. access to the stadium access out there's. a metro line that terminates at the. stadium uh so you can transport people. but getting into the city there aren't. enough flights from Bombay from. Bangalore how do people come and when we. sold the tickets there was a lot of. controversy around that as well but I. mean I'm happy to talk about it.

but 75% of the. people mobile. number. 75%. 25% 50% are coming from. Ahmedabadist. 40%.

drive. show that was challenge. The.

second game. indaterial, hydras, forklifts material on the end stage. How. do you protect the pitch? Because stage. it has a runway and it has a B stage and. it has a C stage. B stage sits on top of. the pitch and.

We had a pitch. curator was working for over a. year. and. an translucent light and UV rays.

Forks. damage platform on the pitch and the. substitute. pitches grow lights UV. It will mirror the UV lights of the sun.

and grow. lights roller. It was a whole exercise. It was a different exercise altogether. So there were a lot of twists and turns. Then food and beverage loss because. alcohol will that. substitute. alcohol because Gujarat may. prohibited will they enjoy will they. have the same experience. So what we did. was we there were extra flights. Bombay connections Bombay.

and Bangalore city you can take a train. and we had extra trains which the. railway ministry gave us from. Bombay which could come to the place. then. metrosa timing that people could then. leave the same night because enough. hotel inventory. and finally it became the world's. largest concert over 2 days and like I. said 75% of the population came from. outside of Gujarat and they all came in.

safely. They all went safely. They. didn't miss alcohol. They had the. world's greatest experience. [Music]. live.

stream. There was a national anthem. Everybody stood up. The national colors. were there and it was a celebration. So. it all came together and 26th. January. You can't sell. alcohol. So it all worked out. It's an. expensive show. Our tickets were not. expensive. It's the cheapest anywhere in. the world and we purposely kept it that.

way. We said we want to give the. opportunity to as many. people. Our tickets were the cheapest. anywhere in the world. ground cap. ticket to stand right near the stage. $80. It was the cheapest ticket. But. reality, that's a. different ground tickets and then there. were various.

prices. I can't control that. I'm stand. clear im number mobile number unique. identity transaction ID email address. mobile. number 37,000.

Supreme Court, High Court, policeal.

India law. enforcement company should not exist. because secondary ticket market is not. allowed in India. How can that how can. those two or three companies which are. foreign entities which have their. offices in Estonia are selling tickets. in India in the secondary market which. are illegal by law. Is my job to go and. shut them down? Then why are people. calling you that you did it? This is see this is where people go.

hysteria social. [Music]. med,000 tickets. and math divide Bombay Ahmedabad.

show and third show was 50,000. You. divide that by four, right? If you look at that per. showar can watch it, 36,500 people individuals could buy the. tickets in a country of 1.4 4 billion. people in a city of 20 million. population out of which 35% of the. population was from Maharashtra.

and if you say 25% were from Bombay 10%. was from rest of outside of Bombay 65%. of the people that came to Bombay to. watch the show was from outside of. Bombay. demand. I don't have the ability to do. more than five shows. We had five shows. We sold the tickets. There was a Q. number. What had happened is where the.

only fault was that in the first show. when we opened the queue our systems. crashed and the reason it crashed for 7. minutes because there was a bot attack. There was a bot attacked by secondary. ticket sites from all over the. world and data because we had to prove. it to law enforcement and in the courts. and they saw the data. Millions and. millions of bots had hit our system to. pick up tickets. and waiting room 2. So the bots could.

could hack into that system and. therefore they the bots had taken over. the first show. So what we did was that. we reset the. servers. They had to be reinitialized. into the Q number. That was an error. But it was a genuine error and omission. It was.

not people forget. that% just. think nobody can stop me. I can sell it. on book my show. What we then did we. changed the process your next waiting. room that we called it a waiting room. waiting room. We gave you a randomized.

ticket to token ID randomized tok. ticketing ID we repelled a lot of the. bots because they could not you get a. random ID. So we changed the process and. then from when we reopened the second. show and the third show in Bombay then. the first show in Ahmedabad and second. everything went off smoothly. We had. more than seven departments after us. We. had multiple police. cases. It was relentless. We were going. to department after department after. department after department. We had.

summons against us. We have spent how. many hours and time on giving statements. and summons. interrogation not because I was hiding. behind as a leader in the. company. We proved we open our. databases. We showed everything. But. seven departments coming after you. this. big fiasco. Do you think there are. forces who want you to shut down? No. No. I think this can't be just like. normal people trying to do anybody's. voice. They want actually curate s such.

kind of stuff. Look, the support from. the central government, the support from. the Gujarat government and the support. from the Maharashtra government across. law enforcement across this thing was. phenomenal. They saw the value in this. say we gave an economic lift of close to. 700 crores to the city of Ahmedabad. 700. crores with economic impact over 2 to. three days. Yeah. The honorable home. minister Harangi who did a who con. initialized instituted a I am Ahmedabad.

study came up with this lift that we did. a 700 cr lift to the economy of. Ahmedabad. Why wouldn't anybody want. this? He himself was very proud of the. achievement. He's come up and made. statements and I meant not not the. government officials. exam and maybe the. competitor could do it. No, no, I don't. think I no I I look. till I don't have proof of that. I think. it's just loose dog to blame anybody. I. I it's uncool, right? I don't think that. is the case. I think this was some. overzealious people who did not get a.

ticket. They used uh which is available. to everybody the the might of the law. They went to court. some department thought that they should. investigate because it was so in your. face and the media just hyped it up to. no extent which I think has to be. measured right I think some fault lies. there without you know understanding the. crux of the matter they just hyped it. because it was such a hot potato um.

every department felt it was their moral. duty and. responsibility why is there so much. I think that was the only reason where. it snowballed. You said 700 cr economy. boost for one city. Yes. Over a weekend. Over a weekend. Weekend. Right. How um employment uh hotels, airlines, food, travel, uh. merchandise, uh spends in the city when.

people come. We calculated per person. what was the average spend when they. came into Ahmedabad. not from the. locals. Then there was an expanded view. of the people that were outside the city. but from Gujarat and people that came. from other parts of the country. What. did what was the GST? The GST impact was. 72 crores. The overall impact was about. 650 or close to 700 crores. The direct. impact was about uh 250 crores which was. a direct impact. So we broke it down.

into four or five. We got Ernston Young. to do a a full report. We released uh a. a massive report. How much does some. show like let's say Coldplay cost? The. biggest stadium you did Narendra Modi. Stadium just give me an approximate. cost. You can't give me an exact cost. I. don't remember but I don't think it will. be less than 30 40 crores. Can't be less. than that. Just a setup and then there's. the artist fee. then artist because see. what happens is over there uh you have. permissions, you have security, you have.

local law enforcement, you've got to pay. for local law enforcement because. they're coming from different parts of. the of the state. Um there's cost of. goods sold, there's merchandise, there's. food wastage, um there's security, barricading, infrastructure setup, transport, travel, travel, boarding, lodging, internal transport. Now in the. case of this. show ground cover now there was only. enough material which we own to cover.

one stadium. The second stadium did not. have the material like we needed. drivables and ground cover. So I called. my friends in Israel and some of the. material was lying in Georgia. We did a. trans shshipment of half the material. from Hifa port in Israel. Because of the. situation there they were not using it. They're great friends of mine. Half the. material came from Israel. Half the. material went from Georgia by road and. then it went trans shshipment to Greece. and from Greece it came to Bombay. So.

two shipments have come from there to be. able to do the second show. Material has. come from Southeast Asia on some. materials for the staging and delay. towers. Some of the delay towers we own. So it was a global supply chain which. had to arrive at a certain point get. cleared transported internally. So. therefore the cost went up because see. if it was a show where we could reach in. 4 hours to the next city. Yeah. But we. had to have concurrent setups because if.

we were doing three shows in Bombay and. two shows there there was a concurrent. setup. So Costco in some cases when. you're traveling and you're doing like. in the case of Edin we had uh two stage. So we would do one stage in uh Punea, the second stage was being set up in. Hyderabad. So the Punea stage would then. jump to Chennai and the Hyderabad stage. would then jump to Bangalore and then. that stage would go but then the stage. that we used between Bhutan and Shillong. we could not it could not be a part of. this rig because the time taken to go to.

Bhutan and unrig that stage we could not. make the Delhi show. So normally you. would have two stages what would jump. In this case we had three stages because. Shillong and Bhutan were sharing one. stage because Shillong was the second. last show in the run and Bhutan was the. first show so we could share that stage. So there's too many too many there's. like I said there's no straight answer. What's the what's the technical or an. artist radar for something like Coldplay.

show? What do the demand what do they. ask for? Look, I've known apart from. like lights, shows like is there. something two or three highlights which. makes Coldplay show different? No, look, it is a very immersive experience, right? And there's a lot of love and. connect with the with the fans. I mean, I just. think they're just masters of their art. and they're very passionate about what. they do. Uh whether it's the whole. touring team, the management, the band. itself, they just love what they do. Um.

they love the connection with the fans. The music is phenomenal. It's I think. one of the highest loved and most loved. bands in the country. Every song uh the. fans know there is unlimited demand. there for for for uh an artist like. that. But they're just good people. They're just inherently good people. Uh. I think the Xylo bands create a. beautiful immersive experience. What is. there in Xylo bands? This is RF. technology and what happens is with the. Xylo bands you can control it with the.

music and the light to have a shared. experience. So you can do a flag of the. Indian color, you can have different. colors, you can when people are at a. stadium, you can actually write stuff. based on people's bands. So rather than. putting out your phone and not enjoying. that experience and putting up lights, you don't need to do that. And in fact, there are points in the show where uh I. think Chris tells people that put your. phones in your pocket, put your hands in. the air, right? And then there's um.

there's fireworks and there's pyros and. there's immersive experience to share. that music otherwise you can listen to. music at home, right? And I think that's. why the shows are getting bigger and. bigger and bigger. Whether it's the the. LED screens, whether it's what the band. does for uh for the environment, uh how. how firm and strongly they believe and. stand for it, it connects with a lot of. people and it also inspires the youth,

right? When you're there and uh but is. there something something extra that. you've heard from someone like Coldplay. or Ed or Travis? This is what I need. High look, they're very high demanding. artists. That's the reason that's so. big. High demand. That's why they are. where they are because they want. perfection in everything that they do. Perfection in the sound, the lighting, the rig, the What do they ask extra? No, every artist has writers. M we've. had artists in the past who would say I. want Doritos chips on the right side of. my bed with this ketchup or and.

sometimes these writers are a trick. because they want you to read everything. and some things are just not possible. and you somebody in my artist team goes. and said this is not possible and. they're like it's okay like what like it. could be something really bizarre that I. want to uh bright. purple uh potato wafers the color of the. potato wafer should be bright No, that's. not possible. Maybe it's not possible. So, somebody says that this is not. possible or something is not available. in India if there's an alternative. But.

it's just to check that you've read the. writers, right? The fine print. How much. do they charge? Like what do you think? No, it ranges. Yeah. From how much does. it charge to get like a green day? Look. um for you there will be different cost. I'm sure. No, no, it's not just. different cost. See, Lola Paludza, we. have a very different uh method of. working. We have a artist budget and we. work backward. There is the headline fee. for the artist on day one, day two and. then there is a sub headline then there. is a so we have a it's a format and it.

makes our job harder because paying any. sort of money to get an artist is not. what we do then it's not a business like. I said this is not a passion project. it's a business and therefore for Lula. pludza we have an artist budget which is. purely based on number of tickets brands. that participate costs that are there. and so we have a number so we do this in. partnership ship with C3 who are our. partners. Um and uh Charlie Walker is a. is a great mate of mine and and we work. very hard. It's the third year now in a.

row. Hugely successful. Uh turn the. corner. Uh we're now prepping for 2026. We will now announce at some point the. dates and um eventually the lineup. So it's business. It's it's work where. this franchise has to grow over a period. of time. Same with Bandland. Same with. Sunburn. um sunburns in its 17th year. and so it you have to work backward a. one-off show of a uh of a green day will.

be very different from a multi- tour. within India because the cost gets. deferred right they are deferred over uh. or shared across three markets five. markets if it's a part of a run then the. cost differs give me some number look. cold play green day anyone I don't think. it's fair for me to share uh artist. numbers but I I'll tell you the approx. I'm not the bigger bands I'll tell you. the bigger bands the bigger bands can go. from a million and a half to 8 million. could be the artist fees could be.

anywhere in that range uh then you have. bands which are within. the 150k to a million but the point is. and it it also matters whether they want. to do it whether it's a versus deal. whether are you paying a minimum. guarantee some artists are like pay me a. flat guarantee I don't care some artists. I'll give you a lower guarantee, but you. give me a ref share. You give me a Yeah. So, you give me a spill over, right? So, you do a um uh you do a uh beyond a.

certain amount, you do a share. And. there are some artists who are saying, I. want to play the market, I'll do a B. versus D. You don't pay me anything. Let's co-produce together and Exactly. Exactly. So, as the trust in the market. build, so you know, India was a flat. guarantee market. Mhm. There was no. trust in the market. That is the reason. what I was trying to tell you earlier. We jumped into this business out of. accident and out out of a need and. desperation because the acts were. unwilling to come to India. We had one. act in 10 years like a big act then. nobody would. come and the reason was that there was.

no trust in the market. People were. underdeclaring tickets, not paying. taxes, not sharing the data with the. artists, underdeclaring revenues, short-changing the consumer, health and. safety issues, food and beverage was. short changed. And all the money was. being taken by the promoter by saying, "I don't care about the consumer. I. don't care about the government. I don't. care about the artists. I only care. about myself." And that is the truth. That is why nobody scaled this. All the.

money was being taken home. Basically. was daylight. robbery. Government also in its wisdom. for whatever reason e tax was very high. It was anywhere between 28% to 45%. You. can't do business when the GST was 28%. During the pandemic that's another thing. that I did. I went to the minister of. state for home and the finance minister. at that time and minister of state for. finance. So she put me on to the. minister of state for finance who I know. and I reasoned with him. He was very.

very gracious. He called his GST. department. He saying ash you'll have to. go through the process. We went through. four cycles of submissions and the. government dropped the GST and it was an. advantage which went to the whole. industry. It wasn't for me. I was. obviously a beneficiary but they saw the. wisdom and they dropped the GST from 28%. to 18%. Wow. And zero up to 499. We are. still working with them to say look if. this has to scale we still need. nationalization and it has to be done in. a staggered manner. So I think.

infrastructure, public infrastructure. spending as you've seen there has to be. more infrastructure. It's we still. struggle in India with venues, stadiums, arenas, staging, safety, security, ingress, egress, getting to a stadium, parking, uh metro lines or train. stations going under the stadium or an. arena having enough of them. The biggest. challenge for artists growth, Indian. artist growth has been we don't have. venues which are 50 person rooms, 100.

person room, a 250 person room, going to. 500, then going to an auditorium which. is 1500, then 2,500, an arena of 5,000. to 8,000, arenas of 15,000 to 20,000 and. then stadiums and festival grounds. We. have bars and restaurants where you can. play at a small place and nobody cares. and everybody's doing cover versions or. straight away there's a stadium on open. field. You don't have anything in. between. There's no career path. Any. global artist on the live side went. through this career path globally and.

there was a culture of going out that. was built where you could go and watch. We don't have that. And therefore with. us with festivals that becomes extremely. important for discovery of new music. When you come to Lola and you're seeing. 40 artists, you may come for a a Green. Day or a Sting or Imagine Dragons, you. may come for a Shawn Mendes, but you're. discovering an Aurora, you're. discovering Jonita Gandhi, you're. discovering Niladri Kumar who's one of. the greatest electric satar players and. he did a live set with 5,000 people.

standing to watch him, right? And kids. standing to watch him. And so with 20 25. Indian. artists, the Hanuman Khan set was. phenomenal, right? So many fresh people. who had not seen Hanuman Khind may have. heard his music but not seen his entire. set were there. So I think festivals are. a great way. of. giving Indian artists who are supremely. talent but talented but never got the. big stage or did not.

get a large enough audience for them to. try out or experiment or or get. initialized with their music. Festivals. do that. Tell me the concert start Like. how do. you who. says. like all of this? How do you. decide? We work with other partners as. well. First of all, these tours are.

expensive tour ready market and they are. performing in North America. then. they're doing Europe, then they're doing. Australia, New Zealand, then they're. coming to. Asia. Cycle has to be between October. and May at best. maybe cycle. either you are putting in shows with. South Africa, Middle East or you're. doing something with Southeast Asia, Australia because one.

off one there's no you can't make money. Neither band can make money, neither you. can make money. It's hard multiple. tours. Multiple it has to be multiple. sides. So there's it's a part of a tour, a global tour. So that is number one. Number two, then the artist needs to. connect with his fans. He he or she. needs to believe that India is an. important market. Now here is. where or we we are looking for shows. between October actively between October. and uh May and there's a bunch of things.

that we that goes into the. analysis. Spotify YouTube music what is your um. stats then we look at other uh. professional sites which we subscribe to. then there's an art there's a lot of. science which will tell you this but you. look at trend we have people within our. company which. understand music and our musicians and. our curators. So there's a whole bunch. of people that are constantly analyzing.

what are the pathmaking. trends. Suraj who's Hanuman kind Lola. Pala one and three he also played. Coachella. Dilj did a collab with me. with Ed Shirin he also played Coachella. AP did Lola one he also played for so. we you know are good curators we are. good judge of what we do. Jonita played.

main stage for us. For Ed, we had uh. opening acts from Mali, from Dot, uh. Cayenne, uh Arman obviously. Uh so we. worked with a bunch of Indian artists. and only the glory goes to the western. acts where we did 40 to 50 shows. We did. 900, we sold tickets for 900 shows in. India, Indian. artists, 900 shows in a year. We are constantly looking career. developer and are we doing bigger.

shows what does the artist want come the. first. time low ticket price show many years. later he came back. then but much higher ticket price cut to. March last. year in the round at the turf. club. So bar low ticket price, kazar,

very high ticket price, patch high. ticket price and then we did a show of. eight cities with Ed between when. Coldplay happened just after that. Bhutan then Punakia, Hyderabad, uh Chennai, Bangalore, Shillong, Delhi. and the artist wanted it. Ed wanted to. go deep in the country. He loves the. country and he said, "Yeah, I want to do. an endstage format. You all produce it. and I want to go deep." It was his. aspiration. We analyzed with cities how.

is it going to be easy, hard, what was. possible, what wasn't possible, what. rigs and stages can go, how do we share. rigs between uh northeast and Kolkata. and Shillong and Bhutan because the. borders are closed. How do the trucks go. to those borders? Then from there the. head of the truck, how do customs get. cleared? how will the head of the truck. change because the drivers have to be. different for Bhutan because they know. how to drive on those. So it was a. complicated it was a it was a logistic. even the doing the shows between.

Ahmedabad and um Bombay we had two rigs. and two stages and two coverings but a. lot of the rig was common. How do you. get to move 39 to 40 trucks between. Bombay and Ahmedabad within a very short. period of time? Because Bombay show. Tuesday and next show in Ahmedabad was. Saturday. There wasn't enough time. So. we did two dry runs with GPS tracks with. that much weight. because.

container it moves. faster between Bombay and Ahmedabad. Maharashtra police and Gujarat police. gave me a. corridor between Maharashtra and. Gujarat road. Normally what should take. you but a truck will take. you was taking 36 to 40 hours because.

traffic jam. So they created a blue. corridor for us. Wow. Where we took that. ton of truck and we did a GPS tracking. on alternative routes on how to get. there within 18 hours. And then this. movement happened where Bombay show. Tuesday. So people who came for Saturday. and Sunday would have seen a very. different exit plan than Tuesday because. Tuesday we had to tear down the stage. and tear down the equipment very quickly. work within 4 hours load the trucks and.

move them and get them within 16 to 18. hours to Ahmedabad so that the loading. can happen in Ahmedabad. So it was a. logistical nightmare. So it's quite interesting when you break. down the challenges and problems on how. do you put up the show. So we have to. decide on movement of trucks uh. equipment. cost uh artists pricing their pricing uh. their ability and their need and want to. play uh stats pricing to the end.

consumer in some cases brands is it. acceptable to brands or not. So there's. a lot of math and decisioning that goes. in which goes into a pot and then it's. an art at the end of the day to say but. none of this like in the past which you. would have seen is based on personal. preferences. This is a business. It's not because I like an artist I want. that art. Of course I would love it but. if I like it I'll go somewhere else and. watch the. show. It's not my passion project. It's.

not a party that I'm throwing for myself. to charge people money. It's a business. and it's meant it's meant to be value. accreative to my fans and the customers. and if they see value in it then we'll. do it. If we can make money and there is. this thing we'll do it. It's not. something that I want. All this time. it's been I want this artist because. it's my personal need and preference. That is what was happening till we. jumped into this business. We got into. this business by chance in 2018. Till. then we were just a platform. Mhm. There.

were various reasons why grudgingly we. got into this business in 2018 and then. we've only thought about things. differently and that's why it scaled up. We creating a new industry. It didn't. exist, right? It was a mom and pop. industry because most of the companies. were doing B2B shows. They were doing. launch conferences. They were doing. weddings. We don't do weddings. We don't do launch. conferences. We don't do B2B. Anything. which touches an end consumer point. which is ticketed is what book my show.

does. I'll tell you one of the first. things I heard about you from somebody. and I learned that lesson and it was. really good. I don't even know if you've. said that. Yeah. It's just like somebody. said something about you and I I felt it. was good and I in my head I keep giving. you credit for it. It's a cockroach. theory. Have you said it? Oh, you said. it many times. Perfect. Then so you say. that you're a cockroach. Yeah. What do. you mean by that? Tell me in your words. I love it when I heard it for the first. time. I want everybody to hear it from. you. So you know when when I started when I.

founded book my show along with uh my. co-founders and for the first 10 years. of our journey as book my show's journey. uh by the way the name of the company is. big tree entertainment and that hasn't. changed right in 25 we are in the 26th. year and. so for the first 10 years we were told. India will go the US way all right copy. everything from the US and India will go. the US me. Then came a second wave of.

entrepreneurs and we were told for the. next 10 years or at least what you you. heard is that India will go the China. way. And I kept telling people India. will go the India way, right? There's. there's no other way. Uh you have to be. proud of who you are, who your consumers. are. The moment you try to emulate. what's happening in the US or China or. anywhere else, you're setting yourself. up for failure. Uh you can learn from. some lessons. You can't say that we are. going that way. And in those. conversations the one thing that always. came about is and I find that I find.

certain things about and I was born and. raised in this country. I was born and. raised in Bombay right in a 500 m radius. like I made the big move 10 years ago. 500 m down the road. So it's not like. I'm looking at an outside view or a. western view. But the one thing that. really pisses me off in India it's. disappointing is that we don't celebrate. entrepreneurs for entrepreneurship. We. celebrate celebrities. We celebrate. uh being famous. We celebrate how much.

money do you have, which car you come. and what watch you have. It was in. context to this unicorn question that. kept coming up that are you unicorn? And. then one. day. unicorn unicorn. So I. said I. said have you seen a a horse with a. horn? I said.

animal it's not. real. I said cockroach. So he said what. do you mean by cockroach? So I. said we went through the com bust in 99. uh 2000. We went through the com bust. We went from 150 people down to six. including an office helper and then we. went through the global financial crisis. in 2008. And then the biggest one for us was the.

pandemic. Yeah. Because that was we were. wiped out, right? We had zero revenues, zero anything. And so somebody said, "What do you mean by cockroach?" I said. we are survivors. We'll survive a. nuclear blast. We'll open a microwave. oven and you'll find us there and we'll. survive. We'll be there even till the. end of the world. So in context to this. unicorn question I was said. Then I. think over the years uh somebody caught. on to this right and they said I know.

you're going to say cockroach. Okay. Give us another animal that. you It was like a question for a zoo. So. I said uh we are mongrels. So he's. saying what do you mean by mongrels? I. said look yeah we are very appreciative. if somebody comes and pets you and we. are very gracious when somebody gives. you something but we are survivors. It's. a dog fight out there. It's a doggy dog. world out there. Some days you've got to. run and hide if there's a pack of dogs. and some days it's a street fight. You've got to fight.

So we are. dogs because I think at least me when I. look back in my. journey. entrepreneurs I think majority of us. entrepreneurs are cockroaches. only cockroaches just bang. on. cockroaches from a cockroach you end up. becoming like a vulture or eagle or. whatever you want to so Raj you know one. of The things about while we're on this.

subject of cockroach. I think few lessons to draw from it are. that keep your e ego in check you know. don't think you're bigger. than anything but don't make out to be. more than who you are and what you are. and the moment you keep your ego in. check you tend to learn a lot you. respect consumers you you look at things. around you on what more can you build. what are the other things And I think.

more than survival, I'll tell you if you. contextual contextualize this in in um. the parlance of business or. entrepreneurship, I. think companies that do well over a. period of time are the ones that manage. their down cycle or downturn better. And. that's the uh you know piece about the. survival piece. So, it's not just about. survival for eternity, but it's about. survival and managing that survival in.

the downturn. Look, as a sailor, I keep. saying that that when you've got high. winds, it equalizes all sailors. You. can't tell the difference between skill. because in high wind sailing, it's very. easy. It's the low wind sailing that. makes true sailor. wind, adjusting the sales and doing the. right things because you can't moan and. complain about the sun, the tide, the. wind, anything. All you can do as a. sailor is adjust your sales. And so. again, it's a very inward-looking uh.

theory rather than complaining and. looking outward. So as sailors, you're. always looking inward, number one. And. secondly, it's about lowwind sailing. And that's the analogy with cockroaches. as well that if you can survive or. flourish or get better ahead or get. better during the downturn when the. winds are high and when you have. tailwinds everybody does. well that is easy. What's the origin of. book my. show online like how did it come?

Smoking and. drinking. So I don't. smoke. but. agency on. Netflix was exactly like. madman. So it was a very I used to love.

my job. Um it was very unhealthy. environment to be in constant smoke. around. uh salary and I got the I did the best. as a flunky as a management traininee so. I got a massive raise and I think salary. and I got a massive raise my next year's. salary. was my best friend today my co-founder. he's a he's a brother to me he was uh.

working in um South Africa. He was. actually in Botswana. So we did our MBA. together. He went off. He. said I'll try and uh take a shot at. things there. So um I said I'm coming. over to see you. and I heard a radio commercial trying to. sell rugby tickets online. And this was. an alien concept to me.

ticket. You went to a movie theater. timing that your box office is open from. this time. Then in the afternoon there. was a lunch break and then it would open. again. And there used to be dress. circle. No, there used to be advance and. current counters. I don't know how old. you are. Maybe you don't remember this. You're too young. You look young. So I'm. 51. There was a advance and there used. to be a current counter. So you have to. choose advance current. and within that there were three pigeon.

holes. One used to be uh there's a. railway it used to be uh stall um. balcony and dress circle. So you had to. choose key I'm standing in advance of. current line and then you have to choose. con counter you want to go to which. section and if the guy was sold. out and you used to sit on the steps. waiting for the box office to open up. and more often than none the guy at the. box office was handinand glove with a.

panukhan across all movie theaters in. the country across all stadiums in the. country cricket stadiums everywhere and. the black tickets were being sold sold. at a pawn shop. At the pawn shop. So the. guy saying it's sold out. Mhm. He knows. the demand of the number of people. outside. He's said it's gone and it's. available there. So this was the scene. So for me to listen to this radio. commercial trying to sell rugby tickets. online and. saying you'll get your tickets in. advance stadium 10% food and beverage.

and. merchandise. They are incentivizing you. to buy advanced tickets online. magical. So anyways, I thought through. that and it was in my mind and I kept. mulling over the idea through the trip. So this was under a big tree at Storms. River Valley between Job and Cape. Town, Big Tree Entertainment Private. Limited. That's the name of the company. That's the. genesis. So it has its roots in South.

Africa. We reached a place called Stalin Bosch. which is near Cape Town to youth. host you know it's the wine growing. region of uh of South Africa just say. Nasik. Valley Napa Valley and US to uh it's the. you can go for wine tasting and all wine. tasting I was 24 years.

old but this is something to do. So what. they do for this wine tasting is 10 rand. local South African currency and they. give you five short glasses of wine. different different wine and in some. vineyards it's free to most. people used to take wine they'll smell. it and then they take it through the. pallet and the teeth and then what it. does to the pallet the burst of flavors. and then you spit it out. I come from a country of scarcity. That.

time 99 I'm a Cindi. Anything free in. life is valuable. [Music]. glasses into. five. My head was. spinning. Next morning I woke up at a.

youth host in a bunk. bed. Where was I? In the. meantime. So that's how big tree of book. my show started. It started with smoking. and it ended with drinking and ba I'm. coming back came back without a job. business plan bay and facts she. bact was a one one and a half pager. which was almost like an elevator pitch. to chase capital partners JP Morgan and.

the guy who invested in me bhat ramani. and aniluja. were you from an affluent family I was. from a middle-ass family uh born and. raised in Bombay but I we as kids were. never made to feel middle class in the. sense that. I'm I'm a kid of immigrant parents. Both. my mom and dad came from Pakistan. When. uh the 1947 partition happened, we were. never made to believe or feel we were. secondary to anything. So, so when you.

ask me were we wellto-do, we were in our. heads and in our outlook to life in hard. cash. We were not. Then why do you think. Bat invested in you? your first. investor. You were not even from like a. big shot company or a job. position. Why would somebody give two. crores and that time it was not even.

today I can still think somebody can. raise two crores. It's much easier. today. That. time was an alien concept. Raj, I'll. tell you something. A I think people. have lost their way on uh analysis. paralysis, overanalysis paralysis. Even. I'm an angel investor. I have more than. 30 35 uh investments and you get some. right, you get some wrong. And I think. that's what I guess uh investing was all. about and should be is that you look at. the market opportunity very quickly. You.

should have that it's a science but it's. also an art, right? It's intuition. You. look at a market. opportunity. You look at the idea. And. the more most important thing is you. look at the guy in front of you. You. look him in the eye. You look at the. first handshake. And you look at can you. do business with the guy? Are they going. to go. long? Does he. conviction moral values. integrity? I'm a serial entrepreneur.

I'm on my fifth venture. Why shut. down? Investment. Your job is not to. build something great or something big. Then you should be an investor. Then. your job is to exit. uh. Microsoft look at the big conglomerates. in India Reliance.

Tatas and they keep scaling building and. doing things within that organization. they're not saying I'm. exiting. exit that I'm a fifth time entrepreneur. I'm a seventh time. entrepreneur in some way that's what. you're trying to tell me exactly yeah.

you that means what you're trying to do. is try and maximize that value for. yourself and exit so that you can move. to the next venture. If you have the. conviction on building something and. build within like book my show is. morphed today you may say book my show. started as a movie ticketing platform. today we're not. we then move to a marketplace for. non-mov today we are one of the largest. concert promoters in Asia and producers. today most of our time goes into. hardware into.

infrastructure we will eventually become. a real estate company at some point with. venues and we are a media house in some. sense where advertising has become a. very important part and a content. creation house is the area that we are. moving towards but that's within the. realms of the money that you took from. your early investors creating value and. believing in something right and you. build all of this within that. framework by now I should be on my. seventh venture true you have your own.

views but I think I am also of the same. mindset that you should build something. for a very long term because I also. think in 10 20 30 years framework even. So I'm very young but I've always done. that. I've done even like my all the. businesses that I've done I've done like. four five businesses but all of this is. under one company something that you. also said like I started with something. but then I saw opportunity to make it. bigger but inside the same company. meaningful true inflection.

point. Because. problems. then. magic in this country by the time you. understand boss it's a it's a hard place. to do business but it's also rewarding. because it's transformational it's new.

you're creating a market and that's why. nobody else can do it. Those are your. modes. But if you can create something. in two years, please tell me the magic. portion. You may get an exit. You may. get a lot of money, but that is by. making an idiot out of somebody. That's. no. problem. You're not a strong enough. entrepreneur.

set even with tennis even with sailing. with anything you have to have all skill. set. So you've not created that skill. set. No, I agree with that. I would come. from same mindset which which I'm saying. because I believe in the a lot of guys. may not agree. A lot of people would. won't agree because a lot of people who. I know have also made tons of money. just by doing something for 2 years and. then changing. But is that the correct. barometer is what I'm saying as an. entrepreneur as a look I have a.

different philosophy. There's no wrong. and right answers but I just feel that. you're best suited to be an investor and. there are great and you add value by. doing that as well. You have a great. skill if you can identify seven eight. hits like this which exit and do well. and create shareholder value and you're. a great investor. Warren Buffett does. that for a living. Uh and don't call. yourself an entrepreneur. That's what. you're saying. They call yourself an. investor. Call yourself an entrepreneur. Investor. entrepreneur whatever but. you're not building for the long run I.

mean you tell me today you don't like. those entrepreneurs you wouldn't invest. no I I do not like that's a very harsh. word I just wouldn't invest in somebody. who came like I said if somebody came. and said. company thank you very much I'll watch. you from the sideline I mean it's it's. not something that I know the guy will. scoot uh and I've had a few of those. where I did put money in somebody and. then they were very easy to shut down. they were very quick to shut down like. when it got hard and he said I ran out.

he didn't try something else he didn't. stick with it he didn't put his own. money he said yeah it's not working I'm. shutting down I'm going to do something. else and you said India entrepreneurs. are not celebrated for entrepreneurs. entrepreneurship what do you mean by. that they celebrated they're celebrated. for the value he's 5 billion he's 7. billion he's 10 billion he has a Ferrari. he has a Lamborghini that's his. lifestyle that's the watch that he wears. this is who he's dating. This is where he hangs out and I'm. saying look at it for the work that I.

think some of the finest entrepreneurs. India I've seen uh I mean I don't know. if people give those guys enough credit. but I think are fantastic is make my. trip look at Deep Kalra and Rajesh Mago. conducted themselves phenomenally no. controversy built hard built it over a. period of time took the company public. last five or seven years they were. slammed the stock price was flat it's. now gone up 3x 4x in in the last seven. years isn't they're there right for 25. 27 years I he's somebody who comes top.

of my mind he's somebody also I I I have. a friendship with but I'm seeing guys. like that right you need to where are. they in the news cycle where are they in. in the media you're talking about all. these artists right and you said. something specific which I have to ask. you because it's like elephant in the. room trends yeah you said you keep. analyzing trends what trend do you see. which are the kind of artists which. India wants to consume now And who are. the global giants which you see in. foreseeable future to come in in India. and start playing? Let's start with.

international music, right? Country. music has had a big. resurgence and I think uh while the. numbers are not that big in India yet, but they're getting mainstream. Uh Teddy. Swims is a country music uh star uh or. he's he's got his leanings now. Post Malone, which was a hip-hop artist, has released a country music. album. Uh Taylor Swift's music is. steeped in country music, right? Four. chords, but she's a pop artist, one of.

the biggest in the world. So, I think. there's a big big. uh trend there and it's it flows in. different ways. Uh if you see Shania. Twain's um uh documentary on how she. made it mainstream, etc., I think. hip-hop is huge with the younger. audience like 10, look at our sales for. Travis Scott, right? Gone. In 20. minutes, we sold 110,000 tickets. Um, it's that cohort which is 10 years to 30.

years, that range. It's that cohort. where they listen to that music. I think. in the last 5 years and especially. through the pandemic, there's been a. massive resurgence of independent. musicians. Yeah. People that are making. music, they're writing their expression, they're composing their music, writing. what they feel, what they feel strongly. about. It's not somebody else's version. of it should fit within my film or. whatever. It is my music and I am uh I I. fiercely guard my emotions, my thoughts.

and I'm writing it because I feel like. and you're. seeing that pick up. And there's. platforms like ours where we are doing. so many shows. We have college. festivals. We do about 400 college. festivals a year uh through our business. tribe vibe. So we've got tribe vibe, we've got sunburn, and then we've got. our main BMS live touring business. So there's a big resurgence where. independent musicians can drop a song, they get popular and famous. Uh look at.

Hanuman Kind right big you look. at or it's just look at the amount of. music that's coming out. It's it's. phenomenal. Is there any Indian artists. who you have seen reinventing themselves. as per their audience or is it too new. for us? Look at Djit. Look at uh AP. Uh. I think uh the same kind of music. No, but AP has come up with two new songs. They're very wildly different from his. two new songs. They're very different. Uh if you saw Diljit's earlier work to.

what he came up with, I think Jonita has. come up with a lot. Cayan, a very young. artist, but she's a DJ and she sings. live. Um, uh, Arman, his music is evergreen. and classical. I think, uh, he's he's. he's great. I really like, uh, Dot. She. did a set for us in Bandland, which was. massive, very young artist, but she had. a big. set. She did, uh, you know, she did.

trumpets and and, uh, the saxophone, and. there was a lot of brass on on on stage. I was very impressed. I just met her the. other day and she's got some new. concept. She's she's a thinking artist. There are many thinking artists who. constantly want to push the envelope on. new stuff and then you get inspired to. do stuff with them. You want to make it. better. You want to make it bigger. You. want to introduce them to to other. artists to do collabs. You want to give. them a bigger stage. Um you want to slot. them in the right places so that.

audiences see them. Who's the next. artist after them? So that they get. exposure. And it's that collaboration. that we are constantly working on. Look. at Hanuman kind. I mean, he's been I I. love the guy, right? Yeah. You've. mentioned it 20 times. Why do you like. him? Even Jonita. And I'll And I'll tell. you why specifically. They're. investing on the live touring side. They. put in a lot of money in Lola. Both. these artists, whatever we paid them, we. paid them. They put in more money than. what we paid them. They they put in 2x. more than what we paid them into their.

show. So if you saw those flags, the. design, the stage design, his clothes, the props on the stage, the flags in the. audience, it costs money. There's. ideiation, there's time, effort, energy, and thought that has gone in from the. artist side to be able to say, I want to. put out something out there which will. be big, meaningful, and car and carry me. forward. That's why I respect them. Joe. did the same. She put money out of her.

own pocket to be able to put on that big. show there, right? And I think that's a. lesson for a lot of artists in India to. learn that when they see these global. artists putting in whether it's. Coldplay, whether it's Ed Sher, whether. it's uh uh Green Day, whether it's any. of these global acts today, you're. seeing the success of their large shows. and the they have put in a lot of blood, sweat and tears and money of them out of. their own pocket. Each of these shows. are not cheap. uh somebody's funding.

that show to take it to that level and. then it becomes famous. It's a. multi-million dollar investment. And I'm. so I'm not saying everything has to be a. multi-million dollar. You do it within. your own framework and write and work. hard to do that. But don't think that. it's going to come easy that you put on. a four piece band and go up. You've got. to invest something in it for it to be. it's a show. Yeah. Otherwise, it could. be a studio. You could listen to it in. your car on on the speakers. There has. to be something for the audience which.

is different. Whether it's your stage. design, whether it's the backdrop, whether it's the LEDs or the IMAXs, whether it's your stage coming forward. What are you doing different to be able. to put on a show for your audience which. is reflective of you and your. personality, your album, your song, and. your. music. And it's live, right? And what is. the interactability? What are you doing. by pulling in people? when Billy gave. his guitar to this guy. Yeah. Um my team. tracked him down. He's from.

Jamshedpur. Uh this was not a plant. It. it was real. He's been one of the. biggest punk rock fans since he was. growing up. Um he lives in Jamshedpur. His uh brother lives in Bombay and he. was there with his brother watching the. show. He got pulled up. That guitar is a. custom guitar. Billy has only given that. guitar out once before in his life. And. this was the end of this tour before he. went and they played in Chicago where uh. he could get the custommade guitar made. again. This guitar is $50,000 and he.

just give it to this kid and he said. it's. yours. Now those moments get captured. for life. It's a $50,000 guitar which. was given away. Uh it's not one of your. $1,000 guitar. And so and it's a special. moment and it wasn't a plant. It wasn't. fake. It was organic. There was a kid he. said and the guy played it well by the. way. He's phenomenal. He sent us another. video of him playing another song and I. have that video just outstanding. But. what's your business model today where.

the maximum revenue comes from? The. movie business is almost negligible. Oh, you're talking about the whole business. or festival? The whole business like. book my show as a as an So look, let me. let me try and answer that till about 10. or 10 years ago maybe 15 years 10 to 12. years ago. um 90 plus% of our 95% of our revenue. came from the movies business and it was. 90% of that was concentrated in the top. eight cities. today 50% of our business on the movie.

side comes from the top 26 cities and. 50% of our growth is came coming from. rest of India so we're present in 700. cities and towns so that's a big data. point and and and a change that we're. seeing like I told you about the Brazil. of India Brazil of India and and the. changes that we're seeing. So that's that's one data point. The. other is that our marketplace business. for non-mov events we had about um. 35,000 plus events that were listed on. the platform in the last fiscal and u.

that coupled with our live events. business today gives us about 40% of the. revenue and now movies is down to 60%. I. mean it's not down but as a mix of our. business and then there's the media side. of the business which is highly. profitable which is advertising because. it goes straight to the bottom line. What is advertising? Uh advertising on. the app if you see. So one is sponsors. and brand partners that come in which. goes into the piano of the live side. Yeah. while putting up an event and then. there's advertising that you can come on. the book my show platform uh which we uh.

allow and work with advertisers because. of the high caliber and uh quality of. audience that book my show has. Tell me. what was the toughest part of your life. going through the. pandemic on letting the number of people. that we let go getting the business back. on track not knowing a light at the end. of the tunnel. every time you saw a. light at the end of the tunnel, there. was another train coming towards. you. Um, not being in control of the.

situation because India was shutting. down, opening, shutting down, opening. So, I think that was a very very hard. phase. Uh, it wasn't easy because all. that you've said um it reminds me of a. personal theory that I believe in. It's. called the blind spot. I. believe all human beings, everybody has. blind spots, right? The person who has. lesser blind spots usually tend to win. in life. And by blind spot I mean you. don't know what's going to happen. Maybe.

the weather can be changed the country's. reality can be changed the market the. way it changing people would change the. decision you made money whatever XYZ. things which you don't know as unknown. and know how. And over the years in your. journey of going from zero to now. becoming such a successful story, you. learned certain things which no more are. blind spots. Right. Right. What can be. that blind spot for you which was a. blind spot before and now it is no more. You have learned something and that is. why you're winning. I met a monk uh.

who's a performance coach uh who I. really love. He lives in Chiang Mai. He. made me realize uh things about energy. and energy management and a lot about. myself. So one thing that I have. um figured and I figured very late in my. life that I'm add ADHD dyslexic and. dcalculous. I didn't know this. So I. struggled through life not knowing this. which was great. Right? So I didn't have. this at the back of my head. But what.

I've also discovered through observation. of other people who've given me this. feedback that you have a six sense, right? And I may have probably developed. this since I was born as a kid because. uh I don't have these skills. I don't. have these analytical skills. I I mix. numbers, I mix letters, I mix words, I. replace them. Uh. uh ADHD is no fun. But I didn't know. what it meant till I discovered a lot.

What do you think? Where is the next big. opportunity for someone who is probably. in their 20s, still in one of these. advertising agencies working right now. the way you used to work on a fixed. salary of 20 30 50,000. rupees? Where do you see the next. opportunity? Yeah, look this. country what we did over the last 25. years or what our parents did in the. last 75 years the rate of change is. faster than change itself today. What.

you will see in the next 5 years is what. we saw in our lifetime in the last 25. years and what our parents saw in the. last 75 years. The opportunities are. galore. Whether they are in uh the. nonprofit space, there's 400 million. people that are underserved. That's an. opportunity. There's the whole Brazil of. India. That's an opportunity. There is. this super high spender 5 million base. There's an opportunity. I'm not going to.

be prescriptive of business you should. be in. But tell me where there isn't. opportunity. Look at the public. infrastructure spending. Look at defense. spending. Look at what's going to be in. terms of tech and defense. The only. thing what I would say is don't copy. things from the west to do just basic. consumer stuff. Do something new. Do. something innovative. Build something. meaningful. Create IP. Own IP. Create. platforms. Don't take somebody else's. platform and build on top of that. Like. if somebody's built an AI platform, you.

build an engine on top. Create. something, sell it in one or two years. That's BS. I mean creates something. which comes out of India. Look at. Israel, right? The maximum number of. billion or unicorns that came out of. that country. Air, water and food. What. are you doing? Everybody can talk about. AI. Think about. it. And all 1.4 4 billion and we will.

max out at 1.7 till our population. starts going down. We'll need all these. three things. Yeah. And it's it's getting terrible day. by day. It's hard. It's but you it has. to reverse. You have to reverse the. trend and you have to find innovation. You have to invest money. You have to do. pathbreaking tech to be able to do that. I'm sure somewhere someone has already a. working on it. You need an entire. movement of people to be able to do.

that. Look at look at the agriculture. sector in Israel. It's barren. land but they produce the most amount of. agriculture. All your drip irrigation. everything came from Israel and today we. are using itation. That's why we need it. That's what we. need. Correct. Perfect. All right. Perfect. Thank you so much. It was. pleasure talking to you. That was really. good. I hope we could do this again. sometime next year. 2 years later, we'll. do it and we'll go much deeper on the.

things that we skipped for sure. Hi, how. are you? Very good. Very good. Pleasure. to meet you. Likewise. Yeah. A lot of notes. Little bit of. notes. It is like how are things? Good. Very. good. Exciting times. I didn't know. where the recording was. I think in my. calendar it was opposite Yash. So I know. Adi. I went into Yashaj. Oh shooting. inside the guy sing where is the. shooting is it. a music recording I said no it's a raj.

show I said is a friend I'll call Adi. this that there's a little bit of. confusion till s and she said. come but you know I get out of my home I. go to airport and I see book my show. building right there and I'm always like. one day I'm going to have like building. and have like bra written on it like. figuring out written on it because the. way bookmach show is written To me, it's. like a daily reminder for what you're. doing. Come over to the office anytime. Thank you so much.

And number three. episode one conversation can change.

someone's life. I'll see you next time. Until then, keep figuring out. [Music].