Joe Rogan Experience #2206 - Chamath Palihapitiya

Joe Rogan podcast check it out The Joe. Rogan Experience Train by day Joe Rogan. podcast by night all. day F would do it live is like that that. will live in. infamy it is the best clip because he's. like a totally different person well. it's what he really is but he really is. exact yeah it's like the Ellen thing you. know it's. like I mean he really did lose his [ __ ]. there oh like weirdly you know it was it.

like I got the Christian Bale one cuz. like he's in character he intense scene. some guy's [ __ ] around in the. background like God damn it stop [ __ ]. around I get that like he's in this he's. in this frenzy of this intense scene but. what is [ __ ] what is Bill. doing Republican talking points on Fox. News and he that was a different when he. was current affair it's when he's doing. like gossip and stuff oh that's right he. was a gossip he was like an.

Entertainment Tonight typee guy Inside. Edition one of those deals was that's. what it's called Edition yeah and. [ __ ] those things they never go away. it's um it's so such a weird environment. the the left and right there's no like. Centrist news source on television. there's no like uh this is probably. what's going on news source it's always. one or the other and it's like you're. living in a bipolar person's brain you. know I think like part of what's.

happened is we used to have news and you. could make a good living in news and you. know journalists were really sort of the. top of the social hierarchy in some way. shape or form because they were this. check and balance and then somewhere. along the way this business model. focused people on clicks and nobody told. the rest of the world that the. underlying incentives were going to. change and so that's where you find. yourself where there's very little news.

I think there's a lot of opinion and. then the problem with opinion is that. feeds the outrage machine and that's the. you know the click ometer the click. ometer doesn't go high when you're like. hey guys I studied this equation initi. show. right there's a 50% chance of this 50%. nobody cares about that it's either like. it's totally totally bad or it's totally. totally good because it just it amps. people up and that's that's a real. bummer because I think like you you.

don't know what to think anymore well. it's also a completely novel new thing. that we weren't prepared for so before. there was social media and online news. no one was prepared for the world of the. algorithm no one was prepared for being. like literally everything that freaks. you out is what you will be shown. because that shows that you're engaging. and that's how it's set up for it which. is just so contr to the rest of history.

I mean it was always it bleeds it leads. in the news because they wanted people. they wanted to win ratings news but they. only had so much control and it was only. on for an hour exactly and now it's just. this 247 anxiety Fest it's omnipresent. and it's basically made to want you know. to to convince you that you need more of. that thing yeah and the it's like a bad. diet you know like the first few shots. of it first few bites of it tastes. amazing but you know if if you eat the.

full toffee cake every day for the next. 3 you know 65 days and then for the next. year I mean you're going to get diabetes. you're get heart. disease so the version of that is like. your brain just gets totally fried and. then the bigger problem is and when. you're presented with maybe it's not. even the truth but an opinion that you. should consider you get totally shut out. of it and that's like the real problem. you build these antibodies in your body. where this other version that says take.

a step back and reconsider it's not. allowed right and you know then if you. said to yourself well how do you even. start where do you go you know like if. you're a friend of mine um works at uh. Facebook and he showed me threads we. were playing poker last week and he. showed me threads and what's incredible. is like threads and X are like the exact. Polar Opposites in some ways and he was. showing me in the context of like how. the outrage machine on threads works and.

the way it works is like and this woman. wrote this article about it but what. they'll do is they'll post something. that says 2 plus 2 equals 5 just that. that kind of thing and you'll get like a. million views and then it'll first start. with like you know folks that are like. trying to gently nudge this person. actually you know I want you to. reconsider 2 plus two actually equals. four you know and then it builds and it. builds and it builds and this that so. there's this like this weird version of.

how people react to like information and. it tends to be um kid gloves and then. people just lose their mind at some. point so it's kind of like and then over. here I think on X what you find is. there's a lot more structural data but. then it can easily get lost in the noise. because there's just a few things that. just constantly consume you know what. the algorithms want to amplify and what. is important in the moment and I think. that finding a way to like probably. blend the two is probably what is the. best in in the sense that there's.

probably some stuff over here that. doesn't make it over here and there's. probably a lot of stuff over here that. doesn't make it over here a little bit. of that diet for everybody probably goes. a long way is there heavy content. moderation on threads is there I don't. know I don't use it I don't either I. don't have it I just saw it in that. moment but when he described how. the the engagement farming works it just. SED sounded kind of like. ludicrously you know so the the explain. to people that 2+ 2 equals 5 if youst.

that is a bizarre thing that was going. around where they were talking about how. math is racist exactly basically that's. where it gets to m is racist which. is oh. no if math is racist we have a real. problem because that means everything's. racist because everything's math you. know we had this thing in um I don't. know if you saw this in the Bay Area in. Co the city of San Francisco you know. brought together their Board of.

Education or whatever and they're and. they eliminated a bunch of AP classes. including like a bunch of AP math. classes and part of it was because of. this reason because they felt it was. exclusionary and I think what it misses. is that there's all this other stuff you. could do to kind of like even the. starting line for folks but if you rip. out things like AP. math like take take a step back like an.

8 billion people in the world what are. the odds that there's only literally one. Steve. Jobs or literally only one Elon Musk. meaning capable of that kind of. execution I suspect that there's maybe. two and so like part of the human exp. like part of our social responsibility. as adults is how do you make it so that. that second Steve Jobs can find a path. to to do stuff right and I'm not saying.

AP math is the answer but I'm saying. there are people that I remember when I. was growing up I wasn't particularly. good at anything in. school um but there were a few subjects. which I was just like wow like the. little time I spent in school I was like. I felt a little safe you know I could. connect it built up a little bit of my. self-confidence and I didn't feel so. marginal I'm sure there's a lot of kids. like that for some very small subset. maybe that's what that kind of class is. it pushes them to a boundary that they.

didn't know was possible you're teaching. them stuff that's really cool so I. understand what the intent is but then. the byproduct is there's a small group. of folks that get shut out and then that. person that could. be that Steve Jobs like person that Elon. Musk like. person is held a little bit back and I. think that that hurts all of us so you. got to find a way where we're doing just. a little bit better this episode is. brought to you by the farmer's dog dogs.

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there's talk I think they're doing that. in New York is that where they're doing. that find find out if that's the case. there there some where there's this hot. controversy about eliminating the. eliminating the concept of gifted. classes but the reality is there's some. people that are going to find regular. classes particularly mathematics and. some other things they're going to find. them a little too easy they they're more. advanced they're more advanced students. and those students should have some sort. of an option to Excel and it should be. inspiring maybe intimidating but also.

inspiring to everybody else I mean. that's part of the reason why kids go to. school together to come look how hard. she works she works so much harder than. me look how much she's getting ahead. [ __ ] I got to work harder and it really. does work that way that's how human. beings in in cooperation that's how they. grow together and I and I think that it. used to be the case that if you went to. in high. school you would be really cool with. people that were going to like. specific high schools to get really good.

at something remember like that show on. TV Fame yes right and so well that was. more about the Performing Arts right but. that was amazing it's like you know if. you knew a kid that was going to one of. those schools what you'd say is wow you. are incredibly talented in this one. specific thing go push the boundary of. that and see what happens I think we owe. it to ourselves to say that yes right. there's 330 million Americans in the. United United States don't you think.

that if we created a bunch of different. ways for people to figure out what. they're super good at things are better. not worse like what is the answer do we. think do you think things take a huge. step. back you know you have more Joe Rogan. you have more Kevin Harts you know you. have you have more great actors you have. more great directors but you also have. more Engineers you have more scientists. you have more doctors and you created a. way for them to just go deep in. something where their curiosity took.

them that's okay what's wrong with that. idea just nothing wrong it sounds. optimal it sounds pretty reasonable it. sounds great it's just a matter of. resources and then also like completely. revamping how you teach kids yeah that. this is my gripe with this whole ADHD. thing I you know I've talked to many. people who have varying opinions on. whether or not that's an actual. condition or whether or not there's a. lot of people that have a lot of energy. and you're sitting in a class it's very. boring and they don't want to pay.

attention to it so instead you drug them. and you you give them medication that is. essentially speed and lets them. hyperfocus on things and now all of a. sudden little little Timmy's locked on. you know it was really just the. medication that he needed and I think. for a lot of those kids if they found. something that was really interesting to. them you know maybe they're really bored. with this but they're really excited by. biology maybe there's something that. like resonates with their particular. personality and what what what excites.

them and you know they could find a. pathway and instead we have this very. rigid system that wants to get children. accustomed to the idea of sitting still. for an hour at a time over and over and. over again throughout the day being. subjected to people who you know aren't. necessarily that motivated or getting. paid that well well let's we're going to. probably talk about AI today but let's. just touch on this just in this one. second for. we are going to create computers that.

are able to do a lot of the rot thinking. for. us what that means is I. think the way that humans differentiate. ourselves is that we're going to have to. have judgment and taste right those are. those are very defining psychological. characteristics in my opinion but what. that means is if you go back to like how. school is taught what you said is very. limiting for what the world is going to.

look like in 30 years you know in 30. years where you have a PhD assistant. that's in your pocket that can literally. do all of the memorization spellchecking. grammar all of the fact recall for you. teaching that today is probably not. going to be as important as interpreting. it like how do you teach kids to learn. to think not to memorize and regurgitate. so we have to flip I think this. education system we have to try to.

figure out a different way to solve this. problem because like you can't set a. children in this generation of our. kids to go and have to compete with a. computer that's crazy it's crazy that. thing can make a Drake song in three. minutes CRA the computer is going to win. yeah so what can't the computer do is I. think maybe a reasonable question and I. think the computer in a lot of. cases can't express judgment it'll learn.

but today it's not going to be able to. the same way that humans can it's going. to have different taste right so the way. that we interpret things the same way. that you motivate people like all the. psychology all these things that are. sort of like these softer skills that. allowed humans to cooperate and like. work together that stuff becomes more. important when you have a fleet of. robots and so if you go all the way back. to. school today. the school system is unfortunately in a.

kind of a a a pretty tough Loop like. look teachers I think are like going to. become the most you know the top three. or four important people in. society and the reason is because they. are going to be tasked with teaching. your kids and my kids how to think not. to memorize don't tell me what happened. in the War of 1812 I don't like you can. just you know use a search engine or use.

a chat GPT and find out the answer but. why did it happen What were the. motivations if it happens again what. would you do differently or the same and. those kinds of reasoning and judgment. things I think we're still far ahead of. those computers so the teachers have to. teach that which means you have to pay. them more you have to put them in a. position to do that job better and then. back to what you said you know in my. I've I've lived this example of ADHD in. my family I have five kids one of the. kids was diagnosed with. it and unfortunately what happens is the.

system a little bit closes in on you so. on the one side they give you a lot of. benefits I guess I I put it in quotes. because you get these emails that say if. they want extra time if they want this. if they want you know um they'll give. you a computer for example to take notes. so that you don't. handwrite so those feel like AIDS to. help you right um but then on the other. side you know one person was very. adamant like hey you want to.

medicate and my ex-wife and I were just. like under no circumstances are we. medicating our child that was a personal. decision that we made with the. information that we had knowing that. specific kid and all kids are different. so I don't want to. generalize and then the crazy thing Joe. what we did was we took the iPad out of. the kid's. hand and we said you know in we had. these very strict device. rules and then Co turned everything. upside down and you're just surviving.

you're Sheltering in place you five kids. running around they're not really being. you know taught um by the schools the. schools won't convene the kids um and so. what do you do you just hand them the. device everything was through the device. the little class they got through the. device the way that they would talk to. their friends through the device so it. reintroduced itself in a way that we. couldn't control and then we saw this. slippage and then what we did was we.

just drew a bright red line and we said. we're taking it out of your hands no. more video. games no more iPad we're going to dose. it in very small doses and he had an. entire turnaround but then here's what. happened um I took my eye off the ball a. little bit this summer because it was. like he had a great year he reset his. self-confidence was coming back I was. like man this is amazing and then I do. the thing that you know a lot of people. would do I here you can have an hour ah. yeah it's fine you know talk to your.

friends you know and then it started. again and then again now we just had to. reset so at least in our example what we. have found and I'm not it may not apply. to everybody but for us him. not being bathed in this thing um had a. huge effect playing basketball outside. you know rough housing with his brothers. you know uh having to talk to his. friends having to talk to us watching. movies. you know or we would just sit around.

because by the. way what I noticed was like my kids had. a hard time watching. movies or listening to songs on Spotify. for the full duration they'd get to the. hook and they'd be like for next and. they'd be like you know they'd watch. like eight minutes next and I was like. what are you guys doing like this is. like enjoy the. full they couldn't even sit there for 3. and a half minutes so what at least you. know my son was learning was right to.

just chill a little bit be there be able. to watch the show and these these shows. move at a glacial Pace relative to what. they're used to if they're if they're. playing a video game or Tik Tok or Tik. Tok yeah um yeah because Tik Tok they're. like this boom boom boom. boom and it's helped it's not a cure but. it just goes back to what you're saying. which is. like if you give parents option.

and I heard this crazy stat I don't know. if this is. true if you take your devices away from. a kid the kid will feel isolated from. their other students the critical mass I. don't know if this is true or not but. it's what I was told so I'll go with it. was that if you get a third of the. parents so like in in a class of 20 if. you get a third of the parents to agree. as well no devices the kid feels zero. social isolation. because it becomes normative it's like.

it's normal yeah you got a flip phone. yeah and you're texting like this to. your parents or your calling you know um. and I don't know it it may be worth. trying there was a crazy thing I don't. know Jim if you can find this but there. was a crazy thing eaten College which is. like the most elite if you will private. school in the UK it's kind of where like. all the prime ministers of the United. Kingdom have matriculated through Eaton. College it's like high school fancy High.

School uh they sent a memo to the. parents for the incoming class and the. Headmaster said when you get on campus. with your child we're going to give you. like what is basically a noia flip phone. you are going to take the SIM card out. of this kid's iPhone or Android you're. going to stick it in this thing and this. is how they're going to communicate with. you and communicate amongst each other. while they're on campus at e wow. mandatory mandatory I was I thought this.

was incredible I don't know what the. impact is but that's that takes a lot of. courage and I thought that's amazing. well it's it's great because then if. they're communicating they're only. communicating they're not sharing things. or Snapchatting each other back and. forth and The Addictive qualities of. these phones which is if you think about. the course of human evolution and you. think of how we adapted to Agriculture.

and civilization and we essentially. became softer and less muscular and less. aggressive like that took a long time a. long time that was a long time this. thing is hitting us so quickly and one. of the bizarre things is it creates a. disconnection even though you're being. connected to people consistently and. constantly through social media there's. a disconnection between human beings. and normal behavior and learning through.

interaction with each other social cues. all the different things that we rely on. to learn how to be a friend and to learn. how to be better at talking to each. other I have um a rule with my with my. oldest who's. 15 he'll call me he'll call. me or even when I call him huh.

it's like this like uh it's like a grunt. greeting right they don't know how to. talk. anymore and I'm like. hello and so I went through this thing. where like I would just hang up and I'm. like you know beep hang up and then he. would call me back. huh and then finally I said I just I. just want you to have these building.

blocks they may sound really stupid to. you right now but looking people in the. eye being able to have a normal. conversation and be patient in that. conversation is going to be really. valuable for you people will really be. connected to you you may not feel that. and you may think this is like lame and. stupid what I'm telling you but I was. like just try to just try to do it and. then what's so funny is like. I I would tell this story about like you.

know our kids go to like um you know. very well-meaning private school right. and uh I I almost think like sometimes. like again we're not teaching. necessarily kids to think for themselves. we're asking them to memorize a bunch of. things and one of the things that I. worry that we've taught our kids to. memorize are like the fake greetings and. salutations so on the one end you have. what's really visceral which is uh and. then on the other hand you know.

sometimes you'll see these kids and. they'll get introduced somebody hello. how are you it's great to meet you and. I'm like man this is the most this is. the fakest thing I've ever seen so. you're at these two ends of the. spectrum and and I would make fun of my. kids sometimes because like you know. they would say thank you but they would. say like thank you like the queen they'd. be like thank you and I'm like what what. are you doing who taught you that and. you were taught at school to say thank. you like that. hey you could just say thank you right.

thanks I appreciate that just look. somebody in the eye thank you but what. concerns me is as this Tech gets more. and more invasive in terms of how human. beings particularly children interface. with it and as it gets I mean we're. really we would just be guessing as to. what comes out of AI and to what what. kind of world we're even looking at in. 20 years it seems like it's having a. profound effect on the behavior of human. beings particularly young human beings. and they developmental how old are you.

I'm 48 I'm 57 so when I grew up there. was Zero of this and I got this slow. trickle through adulthood of from when I. was a child the VHS tapes and answering. machines for the big Tech yeah you had. the rotary phone yes exactly we went. through the whole cycle of it which is. really interesting yeah so you get you. get to see this profound change in. people and and what's doing to kids and. you got to wonder like what is that. doing to the species and is that going.

to be normal is it going to be normal to. be emotionally disconnected and like. very bizarre in our personto person. interface I think that I think that when. Technologies get going you have this. little burst like it's like this these. Cambrian moments you get these little. bursts which are overwhelmingly positive. like I don't know what your reaction was. but my reaction when I. first saw the iPhone I was I was blown.

away and I think like the first four or. five years was entirely. positive um because it was just so novel. like you took this big computer and we. effectively shrunk it to this little. computer made it half to a third of the. cost and lo and behold Supply demand. just the number of computers tripled and. quadrupled and quintupled and so many. more people were able to be a part of. that economic ccle all positive then you.

get a little dip and the little dip is. when I think we lose a little bit of the. ambition of that first moment and we get. caught up in the economics of the. current moment and what I mean by that. is you know the last five or 10 years I. think why you feel this viscerally is we. haven't had a big leap forward from the. iPhone of really 20145 and I'm not. picking on the iPhone I'm just like a. mobile device MH so what if you had over. the last 10 years you've had an enormous.

amount of money get created by an. enormous number of. apps and the problem is that they are in. a culdesac and so they'll just iterate. in this one way that they understand. because the money is really good quite. honestly and the incentives of the. capital markets will tell you to just. keep doing. that but then I think what happens is. something shocks us out of it and then. we get the second wave so so if you go. all the way back to look at like the PC.

the first moment of the PC in the 70s. and the early ' 80s was incredible you. had these people that you know were able. to take it and do all kinds of really. interesting things it was it was. pure then you had sort of like the '90s. and the early 2000s and what was it it. was duopolistic at best Microsoft and. Intel and what they were able to do was. extract a huge tax by putting all of. these things on folks as desks and it. was still mostly positive but it was.

somewhat limited because most of the. spoils went to these two companies and. all the other companies basically got a. little bit run over and then it took the. doj to step in in 2000 and try to course. correct that on behalf of everybody. basically and then what happened was the. internet just exploded and the internet. blew the doors wide open and all of a. sudden if you had a PC you weren't you. didn't have these Gatekeepers. it actually didn't even matter whether.

you were running on Intel anymore you. just needed a browser so you didn't need. Microsoft Windows right and you didn't. need. intel and then just the internet just. explodes so we have a positive moment. followed by you know call it 10 or 15. years of. basically economic extraction and then. we have value I think today it's like. we've invented something really. powerful we've had had 10 or 15 years. that were largely.

economic and again I think you know this. is like the problem I'm going to sound. like every other you know nerd from. Central Casting from Silicon Valley. telling you this but I do think that. there's a a version of this AI thing. which blows the doors wide open again. and I think we owe it to ourselves to. figure out how to make that more than. more likely than not likely well it. seems it's inevitable right ai's. emergence and it's where it goes from. here on is inevitable it's going to. happen and we should probably try to.

steer it at least in a way that benefits. everybody and I agree with you there is. a world I could see where AI changes. everything and um one of the things that. makes me most hopeful is a much better. form of translation so that we'll be. able to understand each other better. it's a giant part of the problem in the. world that's you know the Tower of Babel. so we really can't communicate with each. other very well so we really don't know. what the problems are in these. particular areas or why how people feel.

about us how we feel empath yeah it's. it's yeah we can't it's very easy to not. empathize with someone where you can't. even you don't even know what their. letters are have you been in a like a. situation where you have a translator. with the thing in your ear no empathy. zero because the problem is you you you. the person there is giving it to you in. a certain tone because it's first person. oh I've had that with with my interview. Fighters I've had translators yeah but. like when you're here it's very hard to. feel empathy for this person CU it's.

this person that you're focused on. because you're trying to catch it so. right you hear the words I think. somewhat of the meaning is a little bit. lost and then you go back to this person. and you say something and they're in the. same problem that you are so I agree. with that the translation thing is is. cool I think that there are there's so. like there's just so there's going to be. some negative areas and I think that. there's going to be a lot of pressure on. certain jobs and we got to figure that. out so it's not all roses but some areas.

if you imagine them I'll give you a. couple if you want are just bananas I. think okay okay so I'll I'll go from the. most likely to like the craziest okay. okay so most likely today do you know if. um if you know somebody that's had. breast. cancer if they go into a doctor a. hospital a random Hospital in America. and the doctor says we need to do a a. lumpectomy meaning we need to take some. Mass out of your breast to take the. cancer.

out what do you think the error rate. today is across all hospitals in. America it's about 30% wow and in. Regional hospitals so places that are. poor right or places that are in. far-flung parts of the United States it. can be upwards of. 40% this is not the doctor's fault okay. the the problem is that you're forcing. him or her to look with their eyes. eyes into tissue and try to figure out.

well where is the border where the. cancer. stops so for every 10 surgeries what. that means are a week later so imagine. this you get a breast cancer surgery. they take it out they send it to the. pathologist the path pathologist takes. between s and 11 days so you're kind of. waiting seven of the calls come back. clean margins you're great now go to the. next step three of the calls I'm sorry. there's still cancer inside your body.

three so these women now go back for the. next surgery but the problem is one of. those women will get another call that. says I'm sorry there's still. cancer and so what is that that's a. computer vision problem right that's not. a that's not necessarily a um a problem. that can't not be solved literally today. we have models we have. tissue samples of women of all ages of.

all Races right so you have all of the. different boundary conditions you'd need. to basically get to a 0% error rate and. what's amazing is that is now working. its way through the FDA so call it. within the next two years there'll be an. AI. assistant that sits inside of an. operating room the surgeon will take out. what they think is appropriate they'll. put it into this machine and it'll. literally I'm going to simplify but. it'll flash red or green you got all the.

cancer. out you need to take out a little bit. more just right over. here and now you get it out and now all. of a sudden instead of a 30% error rate. you have a 0% error rate that's amazing. that's today because you have this. computer that's able to help you and all. we need is the will and the data that. says okay we want to do this just show. me that it works. and show me what the alternative would.

be if we didn't do it and the. alternative turns out to be pretty. brutal 14 surgeries for every 10 surgery. like I mean that's like that's not what. the most advanced nation in the world. should be doing right okay so if you do. it for breast cancer the reason why. breast cancer is where folks are. focusing is because it gets so much. attention and it's like prime time but. it's not just breast cancer lung cancer. pancreatic cancer stomach cancer colon.

cancer if you look at any kind of. tumor so if you're at the stage where. you're like we need to get this thing. this foreign growing thing out of our. body we should all have the ability to. just do that with 0% error and it will. be possible in the next couple of years. because of AI okay so that's kind of. like a that's cool and it's. coming I think between years two and. years five. you're going to see this crazy explosion.

in materials and this is going to sound. maybe dumb but it's I think it's one of. the coolest things if you look at the. periodic table of elements um what's. amazing is like we keep. adding so there's like 118 elements we. actually just theoretically forecasted. there's going to be 119th so we created. a little box it's going to be it's like. it's theoretical but it's going to show. up and they forecasted that there's. going to be.

142 okay so the periodic table of. elements quote unquote grows but when. you look at the lived world. today we live in this very narrow. expression of all of those things we use. the same few materials over and over and. over again but if you had to solve a. really complicated. problem don't you think the answer could. theoretically be in this meaning if you. took I'm going to make it up. selenium and then doped it with titanium.

1% but if you doped it with Boron. 14% all of these things are possible. it's like stronger than this strongest. thing in the world and wow and it's. lighter than anything so now you can. make rockets with it and send it all the. way up with less ener like it's all. possible so why haven't we figured it. out because the amount of energy and the. amount of computers we need to solve. those problems which are Super. complicated haven't been available to. us I think that is this next phase of AI.

so what you said which is we're going to. have these PhD level robots and agents. in the next two to five years we're. going to come up with all kinds of. materials you know you'll have a frying. pan that's like nonstick but doesn't. have to heat up like all you know. whatever you want from like the most. benign to the most incredible stuff. we'll just. re-engineer what's on. Earth that's going to be crazy it's. going to be incredible we we all benefit. from that the kinds of jobs that that.

creates we don't even know what job. class that is to work with selenium and. bore I'm I'm again I'm making up these. elements please don't so the point is. that there's so that's like in the in. the middle phase so our physical lived. world is going to totally transform. imagine a building that's made of a. material that bends can just go like. this and nothing changes to it why would. that be important well if you want to. protect yourself from you know the crazy.

unpredictability of climate in the areas. where it's susceptible to that maybe you. need you can construct these things much. cheaper well earthquakes earthquakes you. could construct more of them imagine in. San Francisco you could build buildings. that solve the housing crisis but do it. in a way that was cheaper because the. materials are totally different and you. could just prove that these things are. bulletproof so instead of spending a. billion dollars to build a building. because you got to go you know hundreds. of feet into the Earth you know the. Earth you just go 50 ft and it just.

figures it out so that's like so that's. possible and I think there will be. people that use these AI models to go. and solve those. things and then after that I think you. get into the world of it's not just. robots that are in a computer but it's. like a physical robot and those physical. robots are going to do things that today. will make so much sense in hindsight so. an example I was thinking about this. this weekend imagine if you had a bunch.

of. Optimus like Tesla robot and they were. the beat. cops they were the highway patrol okay. now what happens there well first you. don't put humans in the. way I suspect then the reaction of those. robots could be marketly different now. those robots would be controlled. remotely right so the people that are. remote. now can be a very different archetype.

right instead of the physical. requirements of policing you now add. this other layer which is the. psychological elements and the judgment. and so my my point is that if you had. robots that were able to do the the. dangerous work for. humans I think it allows humans to do. again judgment you know those areas of. judgment which are very gray and fuzzy. it'll take a long time for computers to. be able to replace us to do that I I I. really do think so I think the biggest. thing that.

we have done as a disservice to what is. coming. is some folks have tried to say that AI. is the end all and B all and I think the. better way to think about this is that. you know how like you used to have to. get your spelling right in an email and. now you just don't think about it cuz. like Gmail just fixes it mhm it up. levels us right you used to have to. remember the details of like some crazy. Theory random detail fact now you can.

just Google it so you can leave your. mind to focus on other things right the. creativity to to write your next you. know to write your next set to to think. about the next interview to think about. your business because you're occupying. less time with the perfunctory stuff I. think these models do are doing that and. they're going to get complemented with. physical models meaning physical robots. and they're going to do a lot of work.

for us that we have not done um or today. that we do very precariously you know. like should a robot go in and save you. from a fire I think it can probably do a. pretty good job they'll have multiple. sensors they'll have Vision they'll be. able to understand exactly what's going. on if something is falling they'll just. be able to put their hand up and just. like stop you know what I mean like if. they encounter any person of any body. weight it's no problem pick that person. up transport. them again it it allows humans to focus.

on the things that we're really really. differentiated at um I do think it. creates complications but you know we. have to figure those out um so that's. like a kind of like a short medium long. term well I see what you're saying in. the final example as the rosy scenario. that's the best case option right that. it gives people the freedom to be more. creative and to pursue different things. and I think there's always going to be a.

market for handmade things people like. things they like they like they like an. acoustic performance they like stuff. where it's like very human and very real. but there's a lot of people that just. want a job and these people maybe just. aren't inclined towards creativity and. maybe they're very simple people who. just want a job and they just want to. work those are the people that I worry. about I worry about them as well and I.

think that like I don't I I didn't live. in The Agrarian economy nor in the. industrial revolution so I don't know. how we solve this problem but we have. seen that problem two. times and each time we found a way and. this goes back to sort of like news and. politics and like just working together. but in each of those moments we found a. way to make things substantively for all. people like I saw this crazy stat in.

1800 do you know how many people lived. in extreme poverty how many. 80% whoa you know where we are today sub. 10% single. digits and it's a straight line that. goes like this and that was through an. agrarian Revolution it was through the. Industrial Revolution so it is possible. for humans to cooperate to solve these. problems I don't know what the answer is. but I do think you are right that it. will put a lot of pressure on a lot of. people but that's why we got to just.

figure this out what are your thoughts. on universal basic income as a Band-Aid. to sort of mitigate that. transition I'm pretty sympathetic to. that idea um I grew up on. welfare so what I can tell you is that. there are a lot of people. who are trying their best and for. whatever set of boundary conditions. can't figure it out I agree I grew up on. welfare as well yeah yeah and so if I.

didn't have that safety. net you know my my parents's struggles I. think would have gotten even worse than. what they were right um so I'm a. Believer in that social safety net I. think it's really important best case. scenario right because your parents work. their way out of it my parents work. their way out of it but some people are. just content to just get a check and. this is the issue I think that a lot of. people have is that people will become.

entitled and just want to collect a. check and if it's a substantial portion. of our country like if Universal basic. income if if AI eliminates let's just. say a crazy number like 70% of the. manual labor jobs truck drivers. construction workers all that stuff gets. eliminated that's a lot of people. without a purpose and one of the things. that a a good day's work and earning. your pay it makes people feel. self-sufficient it makes people feel. valuable and it gives them a sense of.

purpose you know they could look at the. thing that they did maybe build a. building or something like that and. drive their kids by hey we we built that. building right there oh wow it's it's. it's a part of their identity and if. they just get a check and then what what. do they do just play video games all day. that's the worst case scenario is that. people just get locked into this world. of computers and online and just receive. checks and have the bare necessities to. survive. and are content with that and then don't. contribute at all.

the the jobs that like let's let's put. it this way if if we were sitting here. in 1924 whatever 100 years ago you know. right in the midst of the turn of the. Industrial. Revolution we would have seen a lot of. folks that worked on. farms and we would have wondered well. where are those jobs going to come. from.

and I think that now when you look back. it was like not obvious but you could. see where the the new job classes came. from it's like all of these industries. that were possible because we built a. factory and a factory turned out to be a. substrate and then you built all these. different kinds of businesses which. created different kinds of jobs on top. of. it I would hope that if we do this right. this next leap is like that where we are.

in a period where it's hard to know with. certainty what this job class goes to. over here but I think you have a. responsibility to go and figure it out. and talk it out and play it out because. the past would tell you that we have a. really good humans when they're. unimpeded have a really good ability to. invent these things so so I don't know. maybe what it is is by you know.

2035 there's a billion people that have. traveled to. Mars and you're building an entire. planet from the ground up there'll be. all sorts of work to do there and boy. what kind of people are going to go. first there I think that there'll be a. lot of people that are frustrated with. what's happening here yeah sure just. like the people that got on the Pinta. the Santa Maria and. made their way across it all starts with. like a group of people that are just.

like I'm I'm fed up with this yeah but. to to want to go to a place that doesn't. even have an atmosphere that's capable. of sustaining human life and to try to. figure and you can only go back every. couple of years like those people are. going to be psychos you're going to have. a completely psycho I it's Australia on. meth you know it's like the worst case. scenario of the the the cast outs of. societ sorry like just just like what. you say is it's so true but like if you.

think about what that decision looked. like 400 years ago when that first group. of prisoners were put on a boat and sent. to Australia right that's probably what. it felt like yeah most people on the. mainland when they were like chaa were. probably thinking man this is insane. right um so it'll always look like that. it'll be easier to rationalize it in. hindsight but I do think that there will. be a lot of people that want to go when. it's possible to go.

and like look you know we're in this. studio we could be anywhere we could be. in Salt Lake City right we could be in. Rome right we could be in Perth you. don't know it's all the same especially. today so you could be on Mars you could. you wouldn't know yeah you know that. could be the future is you know. instantaneous. communication with people on other. planets just like you talk to people in. New Zealand today so that's an amazing.

example of an innovation in Material. Science that we have been experimenting. with for years so basically at the core. of what you just said is a semiconductor. problem it's a doping. problem is it silicon germanium is it is. it silicon germanium with a something. else and the problem Joe is to answer. what you just said is a tractable. problem that has been bounded by energy.

and. computers and we're at a point where. we're almost at infinite. energy and at a point we're almost at. like what I say is very specific which. is we're at the point where right in the. distance is the marginal cost of energy. is basically zero the marginal cost. meaning to generate the next kilowatt is. going to cost like sub a penny even with. today's stuff you don't need nuclear you. don't need any of that stuff we're just. on this trend line right now and because.

of AI we're at the point where to get an. answer to a question super complicated. is going to be. basically zero the cost of that when you. put those two things together what you. just said we will be in a position to. answer the world will be able to say oh. Joe you want instantaneous communication. between here and Mars we need to harden. these communication chips we're going to. build it with this stuff which we. simulated on a computer we made it it. works it's shipping we're done now that.

will still take 5 and 10 years to do but. my point is all these things that sound. crazy are not they're actually not that. crazy these things are like. achievable technical. Milestones it everything will boil down. to a technical question that I think we. can answer you want a hoverboard we. could probably figure it out well then. also with Quantum Computing and one of. things about AI that's been talked about. is this massive need for energy and so.

they're going at least it's been. proposed to develop nuclear sites. specifically to power AI which is wild. yeah I'm I have to. be you got to dance around. this no I'll tell I'll tell I'll tell. you what I. think okay well. maybe before I give you my opinion can. we I'll tell you the facts.

okay. um today it costs about 4 cents a. kilowatt hour just don't forget the. units just remember the 4 cents concept. 20 years ago it cost like six or seven. cents if you go and get solar panels on. your roof basically cost nothing in fact. you can probably make money so it cost. you like negative 1 cent because you can. sell the energy in many parts of America. Amer back to the. grid but if you look inside the energy.

Market the cost has been compounding and. you would say well how does this make. sense if the generation cost keeps. falling why is my end user costs keep. going up this is like that doesn't make. any sense and when you look. inside we have a. regulatory burden in America. that says to the utilities of which. there are like less than 2,000 in.

America we're giving you a monopoly. effectively in this area of Austin you. can provide all the energy now Texas is. different but I'm just using it as an. example but in. return I'm going to allow you to. increase prices but I'm going to demand. that you improve the. infrastructure every few years you got. to upgrade the grid you got to put money. into this money into that over the next. 10 years we got to put a trillion. dollars America collectively into.

improving the current. grid which I think will not be enough. because it is aging and most importantly. it's. insecure meaning folks can penetrate. that folks can hack it folks can do all. kinds of stuff so and then it fails in. critical moments I think that you know. in Austin you had like a whole bunch of. like really crazy outages in the last. couple of years people Di like this is. in 2024 that's like totally.

unacceptable. so I think as like people decide that. they want. resilience you're going to see 110. million power. plants which is every homeowner in the. United States everybody's going to. generate their own energy everybody's. going to store their energy in a power. wall this stuff is going to. become I mean AB abolutely dirt cheap. and it'll just be the way that energy is.

generated so you you have this but this. is not the whole solution because you. still need the big guys to show. up when you look inside of like the big. guys so like now you're talking about. these 2,000 utilities that need to spend. trillions of. dollars they can do a lot of stuff right. now to make enough. energy to make things work but when you. look at. nuclear I would just say that there are. two different kinds of nuclear there's.

the old and the new the old stuff I. agree with you it's just money and you. can get it turned back on it's a. specific isotope of uranium you can deal. with it everybody knows in that. world how to manage that. safely but then what you have are like. these next Generation things and this is. where I get a little stuck and I'm not. smart enough to know all of it but I'm. close enough to be slightly ticked off. by it is there's a materials and a. technical problem with these things and.

what I mean back to. materials some of these NextGen. reactors need a material that will take. you like 50 years in the united in in. America in the world to like Harvest an. ounce the only place where you can. really get it is the moon in sufficient. quantity are you really going to what I. mean that's how it's going to work like. you're going to go to the Moon to Har. going to go to the Moon you're going to. harness this material then you know. schlep it all the way all the way back. to some place in Illinois to make some I.

find that hard to believe what is the. material I I I can I can find it it's in. an email that one of my folks sent me. but it's like it's a. certain form of reactor that uses a very. rare material to create the plasmonic. energy that can generate all of this. stuff and it's just very hard to find on. Earth so I kind of scratched my head. what's the benefit of this particular. type of reactor enormous energy so like.

you know a solar cell gets this much. energy you know a nuclear reactor does. this and like this other thing does that. and it's super clean and so my point is. like these nextg reactors I think have. some pretty profound technical problems. that haven't been figured out I applaud. the. people that are going after it but I. think it's important to not oversell. that cuz it's super hard and there's. still still some profound technical. challenges that haven't been solved yet.

you know we just got past what's called. like you know positive net energy. meaning you know let's just like you put. I'm making up a number you know 100. units of energy. in and at least you try to get out like. 100.1 and we're kind of there so that's. where we are on these nextg reactors the. old generation of reactor I'm a total. believer in and we should be building. these things as fast as possible so that.

we have an infinite amount of energy by. the way if you have Infinite Energy you. know the most important thing I think. that happens is you have a massive peace. dividend there's like the the odds of. the United States going to war when we. have Infinite Energy approaches zero but. isn't the. problem with introducing this to other. countries and I I believe it was in. where they introduced nuclear power. plants then they realize very quickly.

they could figure out how to make. nuclear weapons from that yes when you. when the when the uranium degrades it. can be used in weapons grade uranium and. the real problem would be if that is not. a small handful of countries that have. nuclear weapons but the entire world it. could get very. sketchy I think you're you're. touching what I think objectively to. me is the the single biggest threat. facing all of us. today.

um. um I escaped a civil war so I've I've. I've had a lived experience of um how. destructive War can be the the. collateral damage of war is terrible. where were you in Sri Lanka and you know. it was uh I was part of the ethnic. majority singes Buddhist but you know we. were they were fighting Hindu Tamil.

minority and it was a 20-year Civil War. it flipped the whole country upside down. from an incredible place with 99%. literacy to just a you know a struggling. developing third world country and so we. move to Canada um we stay in. Canada um you know my parents do. whatever they could they really and they. got run over by that war they went from. a solidly middle class life to my father.

you know had a ton of you know just. alcoholism and didn't really work and my. mother went from being a nurse to being. a housekeeper and it was. disfunctional it really crippled I think. their dreams for themselves and so you. know they breathed that into their kids. fine but that can't be the solution. where hundreds of millions or billions. of people have to deal with that risk. and I am objectively afraid that we have.

lost the script a little bit I think. that folks don't really understand how. destructive War can be but also that. there are not enough people objectively. afraid of this and that's what sends my. Spidey senses up and says hold on a. second when everybody is telling you. that this is off the table and not. possible shouldn't just look at like the. world around and ask are we sure that. that's true and I come and I think to.

myself wow we are you know the biggest. risk of my. lifetime and I think the only thing that. that is probably near this is maybe at. some point in the Cold War I don't know. because I was so young definitely you. know Bay of. Pigs but it required JFK to draw a hard. Line in the Sand and say absolutely not. so will we be that fortunate this time.

around are we going to find a way to. eliminate that existential risk this is. why like my my current sort of like vein. of political philosophy is mostly that. which. is like you know the Democrats and the. Republicans there's just so much. fighting over so many small Stakes. issues in the sense. that some of these issues matter more or. less in different points but that there. is one issue above all which where if. you get it wrong nothing matters and.

that is nuclear war. and you have two and a half nuclear. Powers now that are out and. about extending and projecting their. power into the world Russia China and. Iran that wasn't what it was like 10. years ago that wasn't what it was like. 25 years ago it wasn't even what it was. like four years. ago and I just don't think enough people.

take a step back and say hold on a. second if this thing. escalates all this stuff that you and I. just talked about won't. matter whether you know our kids are on. Aderall or not or the iPad don't give. them so much fortnite or you know. Material Science or you know Optimus and. going it's all off the table because we. will be destroying. ourselves and and I just think that. that's tragic we have an enormous. responsibility right now for the village.

Elders of the world to tell people guys. we are sleepwalking into something that. you can't walk back from one of the. strangest things about us is the kind of. wisdom that's necessary to sort of see. the future and prognosticate and see. where this could go especially based on. the the the history of human beings and. how many times things have like you were. talking about Sri Lanka but there's many. examples all over the world of. civilizations that were thriving that.

were pounded into dust and because every. day is similar for us we have this. inability to look forward and to see. make that leap and see the potential for. disaster that all these things have and. this this is what freaks me out about. when people talk openly about you know. we have to win with Russia versus. Ukraine what are you talking about like. what what is winning yeah what does that. mean like this sounds insane and then.

applauding the long range attacks into. Russia now like and Es this escalation. oh you know they're they're attacking. Russia now they'll show them like what. are you in a movie like are you are you. do you think that this always ends up. with the good guys winning cuz that's. not the case in human history right at. all and not only that there is no good. guy if people start launching nukes. everybody's a bad guy yeah and. everybody's [ __ ] yeah and that's on. the table it's on when you see long. range Israel bombing campaigns in the.

Lebanon and you see what's going on with. Ukraine and Russia like who knows who. knows how this escalates who knows what. the retaliatory response is who knows. what the response to the response is. well I think I think I let me add to. this by saying we know what the response. will be not it will not be measured it. will not be calm it will not be hey. let's get get on the phone and talk. about it right like the thing is there. was a long period of time where you know.

America was the leading moral actor in. the world right and I think that we. spoke from a place of wisdom but also. like earned. respect but we forget that at the end of. the Cold War it's not that we vanquished. the USSR as much as they imploded from. within right it was just an economic. Calamity they just couldn't AFF to keep. up with us and the reason was we had. these two edges right we had a.

technological. Edge and we had a um an economic Edge. and when you put those two things. together it created a lot of abundance. now we can talk about how some of that. is not equal which I also agree with but. it allowed America to be sort of. effectively for a long period of time. the top dog. the honest reality is that's not where. we are today we are one of two or three.

and the problem with that is that you. can't look back in history and try to. live your life like what it was like in. the good old days you know we're not the. high school football star. anymore so we need to live in a more. modest way in a more reliable and. consistent way with neighbors that have. also for themselves done well and just. realize that they have their own. incentives and when you tell them to do. something they're not always going to.

listen so if we don't understand that. and find a way to deescalate these. things what you said is going to happen. something is going to be one step too. far a reaction a reaction a reaction and. then eventually somebody will. overreact and that is all just so. totally avoidable. and I and I it just frustrates me that. we objectively don't understand that we.

sweep it under the carpet and we talk. about all the other things and I. understand that some of those things all. of those things let's say matter at but. at some point in time nothing matters. because if you don't get this right. nothing. matters and I think we have to find a. way of finding people that draw a bright. red line and say this is the line I will. never cross under any. circumstance and I think America needs.

to do that first because it's what gives. everybody else the ability to exit stage. left and be okay with it the other. problem that America clearly has is that. there are there there's an. enormous portion of what controls the. government whether you want to call it. the military-industrial complex or. military contractors there's so much. money to be made in pushing that line. line pushing it to the brink of. Destruction but not past maintaining a.

constant state of War but not an. apocalypse and that as long as there's. Financial incentives to keep escalating. and you're you're still getting money. and there still signing off on hundreds. of billions of dollars to to funnel this. and it's all going through these. military contractors and bringing over. weapons and gear and all and the the. windfall is huge the amount of money is. huge and they do not want to shut that. off for the sake of humanity especially. if someone can rationalize you you get.

this diffusion of responsibility where. there's a whole bunch of people together. and they're all talking about it. everyone's kind of on the same page and. you have shareholders that you have to. represent like the whole thing is. bananas so I think you just said the key. thing this may be super. naive but I think part of the most. salvageable feature of the military. industrial complex is that these are. for-profit largely public. companies that have.

shareholders and I think that if you. nudge. them to making. things that are equally economically. valuable or more ideally more they. probably would do that what what would. be an example of that other than weapons. manufacturing like what would be equally. economically viable so part of when you. look at the. the the primes the five big kind of like.

folks that that's you know get all of. the economic activity from the uh. Department of Defense what they act is. as an organizing principle for a bunch. of Subs underneath effectively they're. like a general contractor and then you. know they have a bunch of. subcontractors um there's a bunch of. stuff that's happening in these. things that you can reorient if you had. an economy that could support it so for. example when you build a drone okay what.

you also are building a subcomponent a. critical and very valued subcomponent. all the navigation all the. communications all of it has to be. encrypted you can't hack it you can't do. any of that. stuff there is a broad set of commercial. applications for that that are equal to. and greater than just the the profit. margin of selling the Drone but they. don't really explore those markets if. for for example we are multiplanetary. I'll just go back to that.

example I will bet. you those same organizations will make. two or three times as much money by. being able to redirect that same. technology into those systems that you. just described hey I need an entire. Communications infrastructure that goes. from Earth to the Moon to Mars we need. to be able to triangulate we need. internet access across all these end. points we need to be real time from the. GetGo there's just an enormous amount of.

economic value to do that so again we. have these very siloed parts of the. economy that are limited by what we know. and what we know is part of what you. just said which is we built these things. and then some people convince others to. use the things that we. built and I think instead of saying like. there's like some crazy. nefarious plot to always go to war. instead if we say if if you make the. thing and you could sell it to a. different market and make more money. would these people do it or are they.

hellbent on War I think it's more that. they would just do it as long as there's. not still a business for war so then it. reduces. War to a very different kind of business. I think. it's. smaller I think it's more kind of drone. oriented I'm not saying that war will. not will go away I'm not there's no. Utopia where War goes away but I which. is a crazy thing to say really.

unfortunately I think that we're always. going to be fighting for some resource. so the last 30 or 40 years all these. forever Wars we were fighting over. energy effectively this is my one bright. spot that I think about with AI as well. it's like everyone's terrified of the. open border situation and criminals. coming across the border and wouldn't. the solution be not have a Place Like A. desperate third world country where. people are trying to escape on foot with.

their families if we were living next. door to another United States and you. could just travel freely back and forth. between the two of them because it. really didn't matter right both of them. are equally safe both of them have equal. economic Prosperity both of them are you. know equally democratically governed no. problem yeah just go over there go over. here I mean kind of used to be like that. with Canada you know with Canada you. used to go over there where the driver's. license used to be able to go back and. forth between the United States I mean I. think the first time I went to Canada I. did not have a passport I had a driver's.

license and uh it was kind of the same. sort of deal it just accepted oh that. place is cool we're cool we're next to. each other if the whole world was like. that it'd be incredible right it would. be incredible and I think AI makes that. possible I think so too I think it it. makes that possible and we're going to. have to deal with a few very. uncomfortable factors one of them being. the illegal drug trade and another being. the consequences of prohibition and. forcing people.

into of drugs yes which is I'm I'm not. comfortable with that but I I feel like. the only way to disempower illegal drug. manufacturing is to have legal drug. manufacturing that's regulated the only. way to stop fenel overdoses is to have. cocaine become legal but the problem. with that is you're going to get a bunch. of people that are addicted to cocaine. can I ask you a question I'm don't do. drugs so I don't understand but what's. the step before it like what causes you.

to want to do Fentanyl they don't do. feny on purpose okay they started. because of a prescription no most. fentanyl overdoses is fentanyl that's. cut into other drugs particularly party. drugs like Molly and ecstasy cocaine. even heroin things along those lines. where people think that they're getting. a pure thing but they're getting it from. the cartel and it's laced with this yeah. it's it's cheap and it's very small. amounts of feny do incredible damage.

like the amount of feny that can kill. you is like the head of a nail it's very. small have you seen it in relationship. to a penny I saw I've seen a picture of. it it's crazy so the the problem is if. you have a drug and you've cut it with a. bunch of other things because you want. to sell as much of it as possible you. add a bunch of things into it and to. increase the potency they add Fentanyl. and because that it's all done illegally. it's unregulated so a lot of people die. and the numbers in the United States I. think there upwards of 100,000 people.

can you is there something to do to. motivate folks to not do the party drugs. well I think you're going to have to. have a massive education campaign and. people are going to have to understand. it the same way they understand. cigarettes like cigarette smoking in. young people is down quite a bit from. the 80s right and I think that's because. of people understanding the consequences. of it but you're always going to have. people that want to smoke cigarettes. and my belief is that they should be. able to smoke cigarettes I don't I don't. think you should do Aderall all day but.

if you get a prescription you can do it. but at least in my mind you're getting. Aderall from a pharmacy and that. Pharmacy is going to give you actual. Aderall and not some fenel lace thing. that's going to kill you and you you. have no idea you think you're taking the. same thing you've always taken and then. one day you're dead and that's the case. with a lot of people today especially. with party drugs I don't think you. should do heroin I don't think you. should do cocain I don't think you. should [ __ ] your life up and I know too. many people have [ __ ] their life up.

but I also don't think that I should be. able to to tell you what you can do. especially when there's all these drugs. that are readily available particularly. alcohol which is one of the most. destructive drugs to your health to. relationships and families to societies. how many alcoholics how many drunk. driving accidents how many drunk people. murdered other people there's just. horrible consequences of alcohol but. completely support alcohol being legal. we but we have learned how to consume.

alcohol as a culture about what about. what happened in Oregon you know like. Oregon when they passed they legalized. it and now they well. first they were already off the rails. okay this is not like. legalizing drugs in a very it's not like. legalizing drug in San Francisco in the. year 2000 it's it's a completely. different scenario so you have these. people that are really they're. accustomed to tents and subsidizing drug.

addicts and they're they're accustomed. to this very bizarre breakdown of Civil. Society where you're seeing open air. drug markets and everyone's fine with it. and it's somehow or another kind and. compassionate to allow this to take. place everywhere and that's what you. have in Portland right Portland is. probably one of the most liberal cities. that we have one of the most leftist. cities that we have so for Oregon to do. it that way I think it's a like an an.

awesome libertarian notion to say you. know what we. shouldn't make any of these things a. crime these are personal choices and you. can make good personal choices or bad. ones we'll have everything but the. problem is the fabric of society the the. the encouragement of discipline and of. hard work and of accomplishment had been. eroded to the point where accomplishment. meant that there was something wrong. with you like if you were a person that. was Eat the Rich tax the rich if you a. person that had accomplished something.

great it wasn't because of some. extraordinary effort you put in even if. it was it was you did something to [ __ ]. over other people that's the only way. you get rich in this world and it's is. bizarre and permeated Portland so when. you introduce free heroin to that like. you're gonna get more problems it's just. and you're subsidizing people for living. on the streets which they do I mean I I. watched this interview where they were. talking to these people in the Pacific. Northwest where they moved there. specifically so they could be homeless.

because they knew that they get money. and they there's no incentive to get out. of those tents there's no incentive. there's free food and free drugs and. they give you money and they're like. okay right so that didn't fail because. of the actual drug policy but more of. the other social policies I think have. you ever heard of Dr craw har no he's a. professor at is he at um. Colombia I believe he's at Colombia Carl. Hart was a. straight chemist like a guy studying.

chemistry and studying these substance. Colombia um and he was a clinical. researcher and along the way he started. realizing that our our understanding of. these drugs and the pros and cons of. them had been flavored by Propaganda. heavily uh particularly the sweeping Act. of 197 that made almost everything. illegal which was really to Target civil. rights groups and anti-war people and so.

this was during the nixit administration. they made a bunch of things that were. psychedelics MK Ultra is that when that. happened well MK Ultra was actually. before that was when they were. experimenting with people okay. particularly with with LSD so when they. started doing this they they made. everything illegal and now the only way. you can get any of these things is. through illegal sources so getting them. through the cartels so if we don't have. the ability to legalize things and the.

problem with legalization there's a lot. it's there's no good answer here so to. keep things illegal you're going to have. feny overdoses I know people have lost. their children I know people have lost. their brothers and sisters to this it's. a horrible thing that. happens you're also going to get heroin. overdoses if it's legal so Jesus Christ. like and you're going to get more people. that try it because it's legal but it's. just like prohibition during the 1920s. or the 1930s rather when when they had.

that what they did was they enabled the. mob and they enabled organized crime and. that was the rise of Al Capone and that. was the rise of the Moonshiners and you. essentially you always had a demand and. the people that were willing to supply. that demand were criminals and they were. criminals in this country we're. empowering criminals that are. essentially running Mexico which is. bizarre you know I know during the. latest election how many assassinations. were there was it 37 or 35 during their.

latest elections in Mexico in Mexico. there was at least 35 assassinations wow. are there are there European countries. that do this well Portugal Portugal has. decriminalized everything and they saw a. massive decrease in HIV a m massive. decrease in drug addiction and all sorts. of other things I don't know what the. long-term study is on that oh 37 37 37. assassinated candidates I mean you have. to play ball with the cartel over there.

you know just like you had to play ball. with the mob in the 1930s you have to. play ball they have the guns and they're. really mean and they'll do whatever the. [ __ ] they want to the 2021 midterms when. 36 candidates were killed oh my God geez. oh my God geez yeah it's wild down there. that is a direct result of having. trillions of dollars being made by. selling illegal drugs and made most of.

them to sell to America I'm sure they. sell them to other places as well and. it's all fenel or is it all is it like. all kinds of things no I don't think. there's a lot of money in that the the. real money's in like meth meth cocaine. um they have a problem with illegal. marijuana that's grown in the United. States on National Forest land because. what happened is especially in. California my friend John nor he wrote a. book called The Hidden war and he was a. fish and game officer and you know.

basically wanted to be the guy that like. checks your fishing license like great. job you're out in the outdoors and uh. one one day one day the beginning of a. movie it is the beginning of a movie I'm. sure they're probably doing a movie on. it but in one day they find this Creek. that is dried up and they think that. perhaps oh they diverted the water. someone's diverted the water they. thought it was a farmer that had done. something inappropriate or whatever so. they follow the Creek up and they find. this illegal grow up that's run by the. cartel and this is the and then then. then they become a Tactical Unit and.

they have Belgian malamis and. bulletproof vests and machine guns the. whole thing's crazy and they getting. shootouts with the cartel in National. Forest land oh my God because it's a a. misdemeanor to grow pot illegally in a. state where pot is legal so California. has legal marijuana you could go to any. store anywhere use credit cards it's. open free market if you follow the rules. you can open up a a store but if you. don't follow the rules you can sell it.

illegally and it's just a misdemeanor I. I I wanted to learn about marijuana uh. the market but you can't process the. money I think right in some states like. I know in Colorado it was a real problem. and in Colorado they had to do. everything in cash it's like Breaking. Bad like bricks of cash and all they. were using mercenaries they're they're. essentially using you know military. contractors to run the money back and. forth to the bank cuz you had to bring. the bank money in bulk right so you youd. have a million dollars in an armored car.

and a bunch of guys like tailing the car. and in front of the car and they're. driving it to the bank and everyone. knows there's a million dollars in that. car so who you have to like really be. fortified and so it was very sketchy for. a lot of people I don't know what the. current condition Colorado is now I. don't know if you're still if they still. have to do it that way a couple of. companies I just I remember the reason I. know this is like a guy came and pitched. me on some business and he was like the.

the software for all that and uh you. know I think the company went public and. I just realized it just went sideways. because like nobody wanted to touch it. because they didn't want to build rails. for that economy yeah which didn't make. much sense seeing as to me at least just. because if the laws say it's legal then. it should all be treated equally but. then the problem I think I remember them. telling me was that federally it's still. great. yeah it's great and they're trying to. diminish that they're the latest steps. during the B Administration is to change.

it to a schedule three and that's up for. that's a proposal that's going that. would that would help but really it. should be just like alcohol it should be. something that you have to be 21 years. old to buy should have to have an ID and. we should educate people how to use it. responsibly and we should also pay. attention to whoever the [ __ ] is growing. it and make sure you're not going wacky. you know like there's there's people. that are boness that are out of their. mind pod heads that are just 24/7. hitting bongs and they're making stuff. that'll put you on Mars like without.

Elon Musk I remember. the the problem that somebody raised I. read this in an article was you need to. make it more than what it like more. legal than it is today so that you can. get folks to put like some version of a. nutritional label on the thing and show. intensity right because the intensity is. not regulated right well they do. regulate it in California if you go to. to good places in California let's say. this is 39% THC which is very high this. is 37 this is you know but then there's.

also the problem with one thing that. marijuana seems to do to some people. that alcohol doesn't necessarily some. people have a propensity for alcoholism. and it seems to be genetic um but. there's a thing that happens with. marijuana where people who have a. tendency towards. schizophrenia marijuana can push them. over the edge and Alex Baron wrote a. great book about this called tell your. kids and um I I've personally witnessed. people who have lost their Marbles and I.

think it's people that have this. propensity because one of the things. that I think is beneficial about. marijuana in particular and this is some. of one of the things that freaks people. out is the paranoia right paranoia is I. feel I feel like what it is is a hyper. awareness and I think it it pushes down. all these boundaries that you've set up. all these walls and all these blind ERS. so that you you see the world for what. it really is and a lot of people it. freaks out but what I think it does is.

It ultimately makes you more. compassionate and Kinder and nicer and. you realize like in the moment or. afterward afterwards afterwards it's I. think it's a tool for recognizing things. that you are conveniently ignoring and. you know my friend Eddie told me about. this once he was saying if you're having. a bad time and you smoke marijuana. you're going to have a worst time cuz. you're already freaking out you're. already freaking out about something you. know if you're going through a horrible. breakup and you get high oh no one loves.

me you know but if you're having a great. time with your friends you'll probably. just laugh and be silly right because. you're not freaking out about something. you probably you're in a good place. mentally which we should all strive to. be in a good place I uh I have this. weird. psychosomatic guard that developed my. father was an alcoholic and I didn't. drink at all uh in my teens in my 20s. and mostly in my 30s and then in my. mid-30s I started drinking wine and I.

love wine and I and I think I can handle. it and I I really enjoy it I love it I. do too but I cannot drink hard alcohol. the minute that it touches my lips I get. severe. hiccups I mean like debilitatingly bad. hiccups really any kind of alcohol you. think it's psychosomatic I think it's. completely psychosomatic cuz it makes no. logical sense but if the tequila touches. lip I just start hiccuping like crazy. and it's like this weird protective. thing that I think my brain has. developed because my dad used to drink.

some stuff that would like you know make. you. blind like. moonshine it was like 150% proof the guy. would just chug it I mean it was well I. think there's there are whiskey. connoisseurs and there are I mean there. are there is like Scotch like old scotch. does have a fantastic taste it's got an. interesting sort of an acquired taste. but there's real wine connoisseurs like. wine is a different animal the flavor of.

wine is spectacular it's the most. delicious of all alcohols without being. sweet I completely agree with you yeah. it's a different thing like the people. that say they're tequila connoisseurs. like shut up it all tastes like [ __ ]. some of it just tastes less like [ __ ]. the great tequila tastes less shitty Al. it's it's alcohol and it's like then. there's some flavor around the alcohol. yeah I drink a glass of wine with a. steak and it's like oh Wine's [ __ ]. great I totally agree with and it puts. you in a a like a calm it relaxes me you.

don't like want to go drive [ __ ] wild. and get crazy and get in a fight when. you're drinking wine exactly and the the. amazing thing about wine is you can go. on these Journeys where like when I. first started to buy wine I did what. every knucklehead does which is like oh. if it's expensive it must be good right. and you start down that road and it's. just so dumb because the amount of money. that I spent. on stuff that was marginal but it had a. good label and it had a good pedigree. and then when you discover and you learn.

like I remember like my wife's Italian. so we spent a lot of time in Italy in. the summer with our kids and when we. were there you find these incredible. Italian white chardonay okay in the. summer I'm just going to be honest with. you there is nothing better to drink in. the world it's better than water if you. were like cold it's cold it's refreshing. it's got a great bouquet but these. bottles are 40 50 60 80 maybe. maximum1 Max and then you'll spend.

$1,000 on some stupid white burgundy. from France and it tastes like half of. it you know the other great example of. this is like Chateau. Petrus and you know I don't want to get. in trouble with the shatow Petrus guys. but I'll just be honest those bottles. cost you know two three four five 6,000. you see some in restaurants 19,000 I've. never bought one I've tasted it once. because in Vegas I had a host and once. he gave me a a thing he says Jam you can. use this for you know like your dinner.

and I'm like well is there a cap you. know and he's like this time no cap and. first I was like God I must have lost a. lot of. money when they say when they say No Cap. $9,000 so then I said [ __ ] it I'm just. going to try this so I I went to. Caesar's and it was like or $5,000 I. mean I would never buy this in a norm. but I got it cuz it was. free Joe's okay all this buildup in my.

mind this is oh my God this is going to. be ethereal it's going to be Ambrosia it. was not Ambrosia yeah whereas you can. find these other ones that are made by. you know folks that just put their. entire lives into it you taste the whole. story I just think it's incredible but. it's a weird status thing the expensive. wine it's it's just like Cuban cigars. it's really dumb yeah it's a weird thing. the real skill is being able to know. price. value and when you know it it's so.

satisfying because it's like oh this is. just delicious and then when your. friends enjoy it they're like oh my God. this is delicious and I'm like yeah. that's 80 bucks yeah but how and I'm. like well it's very hard to find so then. the the skill is like it's funny I'll. tell you this is how bad wine has gotten. for me meaning like I love the story I. love the people I want to support the so. I I went I register for a um an alcohol. license at the ABC in California really.

because I was tired and frustrated of. trying to buy retail because you have to. go through folks that have their own. point of view and I was like well if we. just become you know we as in like me. and a friend of mine and so we set up a. thing we set up a little see I went I I. filed the paperwork um uh and it's. called like you know. CJ wine LLC you know my friend me and. Joshua and uh we're able to negotiate.

directly with the wineries oh and we're. able to get it from wholesalers in. Europe or in South Africa or in. Australia and it just allows us to buy a. bottle try it if we really like it. Thursday nights at my house is always. poker we serve it to our friends they. like it then we can buy a couple cases I. can share with my friends and you know. you get it at wholesale it's a great. great little hack is there a limitation. like is there a certain specific amount. that you have to buy I look like I look. like a retail store could be Amazon you.

know and so retail store could just buy. a few bottles they could buy a case they. could buy a few bottles from that's a. little bit harder you so you have to. have a more personal relationship but. then the really good stuff you can buy a. few cases and then you know pass them on. to your friends and I don't know it's. it's it's I think Wine's incredible and. with food incredible but when I hear. people that are going to open up their. own wine label I'm like oh good lord. like how much do you know about wine. like oh I'm going to start a wine.

business like what I went to a couple of. these Wineries and I just asked them. just out of like like just explain to me. how you got there and all I could think. of was man this is way too complicated. but these folks it's like animal. husbandry they're breeding this Vine. with this Vine but then they're going to. take you know cleave off this little bit. so it's it's like bre it's a breeding. program over 10 and 20 and 30 years and. it's like this is really complicated oh.

yeah they do weird stuff like they'll. splice avocado trees with uh with um. what what is that nut pistachios so. they'll take avocado trees and they. splice them with pistachios to make the. tree more sturdy you can take two. different species of tree and if you cut. them sideways and splice them together. they'll grow a friend of mine started a. company that's making like potato Poes. and he makes like these ginormous. potatoes like this it's an incredible. thing because like you the yield is.

through the roof and like you know his. his I think vision is I'll be able to. feed the world in a cheaper and more. abundant way but it's all this. engineering he hacked the chromosome of. the potato oh my God that's incredible. and and like it generates a huge potato. and it generates a seed I didn't know. this but potatoes don't have seeds in. order to plant more potatoes you chop up. the potato into like quarters or eights. and you stick the potato into the soil.

oh he's playing God and so he's like no. this is dumb I'm going to make a huge. potato and I'm going to have the potato. have a seed then I'll just take the seed. and I'll plant it at the ground so when. you usually do it do you have to have. that potato and they have to soak it so. a sprout comes out of it and then plant. it is that what they do I don't know but. I mean cuz I've seen that before yeah I. don't I've always wondered like how are. they doing that I don't know but he's. like going after potatoes and then he. wants to go after fruit like I'm a I. love fruit but fruit is like tilts me.

because like every time I go to the. store sometimes like you'll get like. their seasons were like you know like. white nectarines and white peaches maybe. like one of the most incredible fruits. ever created but if you get it in a bad. season it's just like unedible yeah. they're dull they're dull they're. terrible mangoes are the same I love. mangoes and when you see like these. mangoes in the summertime like I I don't. know where Europe gets their mangoes but. this is probably one of the best. features of Europe like they have these. mangoes that are just like this well. they're organic too they're just they're.

just incredible well they still have. real Tomatoes like you have to search. for real Tomatoes here like if you want. an heirloom tomato that's an actual. tomato the tomatoes that we have are. just these freaks you know I um have you. ever worn um glucose monitor glucose. monitor no haven't I um I wore one for. 90 days and my wife when she was younger. well she runs a Pharma company so she. has. a proclivity for science obviously and.

she's she she thinks about a lot of this. stuff scientifically but she also broke. her back when she was 11 so she's very. sensitive to inflammation so she's. hacked a lot of food so that she can. minimize inflammation I wore this thing. and I. was totally Blown Away the things that I. thought were healthy for me my body was. like this is radioactive like what stuff. so like the way that I ate rice or. quinoa I would have like a small amount.

of rice or I would have brown rice or. I'd have black rice or I'd have quinoa. because I was like oh it's more. protein it didn't really matter it had. the same my body reacted with this. massive sugar Spike the minute I cooked. it off put it in the fridge waited 24. hours and ate it the next. day no glycemic load whatsoever same. with potato. potatoes I found that pasta if I made it. more El Dente than what I was used to no. glycemic load and like the problem.

that's frustrating al dante meaning less. cooked less cooked um has a totally. different reaction in my body than if I. make it soft and smooshy huh so I've. trained my body to have like really you. know alente pasta and I see that the. glycemic load is much lower I think just. the point is like like. the food supply in the United. States I think it's the most precarious. it's ever been it's brutally hard to.

figure this out I mean how is everybody. supposed to get a glucose monitor and. then figure out what little things you. know trigger insulin spikes well that's. not possible and then even if you do. find out are how do you get it in a. cheap affordable way and I mean no. wonder like everybody's you know really. struggling with this have you ever worn. a glucose monitor when you were in. Italy no I wore it here I'd like to know. because there's a difference that the.

way my body I can tell you how my body. feels if if I take a picture like I mean. I try to work out and I take pretty. detailed like what's my BMI what's my. muscle mass what's my fat percentage and. I always take those readings right. before I go and when I look. afterwards and I don't do anything when. I'm there I'm you know I swim in the in. the sea when I can like when I'm on. vacation or whatever I walk a lot but. nothing else no weights no.

nothing. um my muscle mass stays the. same my fat percentage goes. down um I look. healthier and I feel really. great and all I do is I just eat what's. in front of me I don't think about. quantities whatever but when I'm back in. the United States so I get to be there. call it 6 weeks a year right but when. I'm back in the United States I have to.

go back on lockdown because like a lot. of people you know I had this thing like. if you look at a picture of me in Sri. Lanka look like old Dave. Chappelle I was like this I was just a. total stick. figure within one year of being in North. America in this case in Canada you look. at the school pictures I was. fat couldn't expl just a difference in. the food system and my parents were.

making the same things because they. wanted to have that comfort of what they. were used. to. so I don't know if it was the food. supply or not but you know it has to be. it has to be it has to be everybody says. the same thing and then my whole family. has struggled with it you know so I I I. think that there's something and then. when I go now to Italy as a different. reference example it's like it's the. best shape of my life feel completely. different even when you eat things like. pizza over there you don't feel like you.

ate a brick if I I've eaten pizza here. and I love it but when I'm over I'm like. oh what did you do what did you do like. you ate a brick but over there it's just. food it tastes great the pasta doesn't. bother you nothing bothers you it's just. whatever they're doing and it's there's. many things there one of them they're. not using enriched flour and another. thing is they have heirloom flour so it. hasn't been maximized to for the the. most amount of gluten I'm curious to see. what Bobby does if Trump wins and this. will make America healthy again I don't.

exactly know what his plans are yeah um. what's possible like how much can you. really affect with regulation how much. can you really bring to light and what. what are we going to learn about our. food system I mean even Canada if you. could one of the things about the. hearings that they just had was they. were comparing Lucky Charms that they. sell in the United States that are very. brightly colored versus Lucky Charms. they sell in Canada. completely different looking product. because Canada in Canada it's illegal to. use those dyes right that we use.

ubiquitously right and those dies are. terrible for you we know they're. terrible for you in Canada knows they're. terrible for you which is why they're. illegal up there the food tastes the. same it still sucks it's still bad for. you it's still covered in sugar but at. least doesn't have that [ __ ] poison. that just makes it blue totally or red. and it is it's impossible like to teach. my kids healthy eating habits as a. result of this the food in in the United. States it's just it's everywhere and. it's beating into you that you this is a. cheap way of getting caloric intake.

right and it is full of just all these. stuff you can't pronounce it's garbage. yeah it's it's all garbage and it's so. it's so common and then if you're in a. what what they would call Food desert if. you're in a place that only has fast. food like my God like you're odds of. being metabolically healthy if you're. poor and you're living in a place that's. a food desert it's impossible it's. [ __ ] it's impossible you're [ __ ]. it's too hard and it's also very. expensive which is even crazier it's so. expensive to eat well and to eat like. clean and make sure that you don't have.

any additives and garbage in your food. do you remember um in like the '90s and. 2000s where what we were told was fat. was bad yeah and like you would see. sugar-free and and I would just buy it. oh yeah sugar-free is great oh like. sugar-free I'm doing the healthy thing. here this is great margarine margarine. or then I would see fat-free I'll be. like oh I'll do that yeah and it turned. out all this stuff was just well it's. not even it's such a small amount of.

people that affected that that's what's. so terrifying it was a small amount of. people who bribed these scientists to. falsified data so that they could blame. all these coronary heart uh artery. diseases and heart diseases on saturated. fat when it was really sugar that was. causing all these problems and we had a. very very dysfunctional understanding of. Health for the longest time the food. pyramid was all [ __ ] up the bottom of. the food pyramid was all bread and carbs.

you know it's ter it's so nuts and just. made a bunch of like really sloppy. humans and you could see it in the. beaches the photos from the 1960s versus. looking at people in the 2000s have you. had Casey and c means on they're coming. on yeah they're coming on yeah uh they. have an incredible story should I say it. or we can just sure they they have this. incredible story that they tell about. what happened and what they say is in. the 8S when you had these mergers one of.

the mega mergers that happened was um. tobacco company with food company there. was two of them and a lot of the. scientists started to focus some of. their energy on taking that skill I'll. just put that in quotes of making. something very addictive and transposing. it to food right it's like okay if I'm. at RJR and I'm used to making cigarettes. how I think about structurally building. up something that wants you to eat more. but now instead of smoking instead of a. cigarette it's a Twinkie or whatever and.

a lot of the food science that we have. in America is built on the back of a. bunch of these Mega mergers where you. had these scientists go and build super. quote unquote addictive food yeah you. know and that was a failure of the I. mean obviously it was a failure of the. capital markets but it was a failure of. Public Health well it's it's a failure. of our Reg regulatory process it's it's. a failure of. our exposing the public to this and.

making sure that whatever this is is. labeled the same way cigarettes are. because if you want to buy cigarettes. you can buy them today but it's going to. have a big warning that tells you this. can kill you totally and arguably sugar. is probably as difficult to kick as. nicotine is and there's a lot of other. problems I um I smoked when I was. younger I found it much easier to stop. smoking than it was for me to uh cut out. sugar wow cutting out sugar is basically.

impossible it's very hard you encounter. it everywhere I have a friend who has. diabetes and he got di type 2 diabetes. and he's thin my friend Duncan and one. of the things he found out is when he. stopped it was all just eating too much. sugar when he stopped eating sugar he's. like oh my God I have so much energy. like this is what I'm supposed to feel. like he had thought that was just life. like he's in his 40s now he's stting. yeah I need a nap and he didn't realize.

he was poisoning himself yeah and that's. what most people are doing most people. out there that are drinking regular soda. and they're eating candy and you're. eating burgers with sugar in the bun and. [ __ ] and bread and french fries. cooked in seed oils you're just poison. yourself you you should fact check this. cuz I may get the number wrong but there. was um something that came out very. recently about the percentage of the US. Food Stamp system that goes to uh soda.

yeah and it was like 10% of the total. budget or something nutty like that it's. like some ginormous amount of money is. just basically giving folks sugar water. yeah and you wonder why now the solution. is just to give everybody on the back. end of it OIC it's also like let's be. real that's not food okay sh it's you. put in your mouth but you can't buy. cigarettes with food stamps right so if. you buy you can't buy cigarettes and. food stamps why should you be able to. buy something that's really bad for you.

I mean what would change if we said food. stamps we're going to actually increase. the amount that you get but we're going. to regulate what you can buy and you. have to buy all the things from the. outside of the store I don't even think. you have to regulate it like think of. what has happened because of companies. like Uber Eats and door Dash as an. example what have they done and I'll. tell you why I think this is important. those guys have gone out and Cloud. kitchens there's three companies they. have bought up every single kind of.

Warehouse in every part of every city. and suburb in America and what they put. in there are these things that they call. ghost kitchens so that when you launch. the app and a lot of the times when you. get a drink from Starbucks it's not. coming from the actual Starbucks down. the street it's coming from a ghost. kitchen why because they centralize all. the orders and it creates an economy of. scale why am I telling you this I think. that there is a way for food stamps to.

sit on top of that infrastructure and. just deliver food but the problem is. people especially people that don't know. or care want that sugar. water well you know like there the the. choices are I I understand yeah you're. gonna have people that choose that Big. Mac because it is delicious yeah and I. think that they are delicious and once a. year I have a Big Mac um but I think if. you're going to tie it to something like. a government.

subsidy at least the government should. have a conversation with themselves that. says well we can ship them all of this. healthy food and you know change a bunch. of boundary conditions in these folks'. lives. like I I've seen it I know what it's. like to be overweight it sucks your. self-confidence is negative one. the way I dressed the way I felt it just. took an enormous amount of work to. overcome it and you're still left with. it then there's the physical pains then.

there's the internal issues that you. create for yourself this is not a win. and so I get it that the hamburger. tastes good but this is where the. government I think has a responsibility. to say look we're going to spend. hundreds of billions of dollars a year. so let's spend it in a smart way we're. not going to give you pop and soda. anymore. and we're going to start. introducing some fruit some vegetables. some Fiber like why can't you do that. that's like a very reasonable thing to.

do especially if on the same hand the. other hand of the government is going to. go and negotiate insulin prices and. Metformin prices and and. gp1s right that that is the issue do see. what Bobby Kennedy was talking about. with uh these gp1s he was uh comparing. the amount of money spent on G gp1s and. what you could give every obese American. that you could give them free healthy. food and a gym membership for 10% I. think I think what Bobby said is the.

cost of GP 1's current course and speed. would be $3. trillion a year isn't that amazing just. something that controls your. appetite and and for 300 billion you can. give everybody food by the way you can. use this ghost kitchen infrastructure to. give the food in a prepped way right so. you can even make life super simple for. them. the idea that you would spend three like. we don't have three trillion to spend. but we have a responsibility to make. sure that people don't kill themselves. with food but now there's an industry.

that's making $3 trillion do by giving. people these glp ones and the problem is. just like every other industry once it. starts making money it does not want to. stop and by the way I think that they. should be allowed to make money but what. I'm saying is in a free market every. actor is allowed to act rationally and. actually what you want is everybody to. have their own incentives and to Act. Naturally that's when you get the best.

outcome because if you're acting with. some Shadow agenda you're not going to. necessarily do the right thing so my. point is in this. example the government's job in this. narrow example is to get the best. healthare outcome because if they're. doing any form of long-term. planning it's pretty obvious like we are. hurdling to a brick wall on this. healthare issue with respect to People's. Health you don't have a solution yeah. the only solution cannot be to medicate.

and then triple and. quadruple the budget deficit that we. already don't have a path to pay down. right well the only other thing that I. could think is if there was some sort of. a. way that would be. effective at establishing discipline. other than just promoting it like. I could conceive of especially when. you're dealing with something like. neuralink or some sort of a new way of. programming the Mind where it just.

changes whatever the behavior pattern is. that accepts these Foods as. choices like lobotomize your your. appetite that would be a very dystopian. Place sketchy to [ __ ] be an early. adopter if you want this subsidy you. need to get this brain imp would not be. a good that would be bad that's worst. case scenario best case scenario is you. just have like a national scale.

promotion of health and wellness and. abandonment of this body positivity. nonsense and fat doctors and and people. that telling you that every weight is a. healthy weight and all food is food and. to think otherwise is discriminatory. which you're hearing from people and by. the way that stuff is funded and that's. what people need to know that that. nonsense is actually funded they pay. people to be influencers and they're. getting paid by these food companies to. say these nonsense things that are.

scientifically factually incorrect. they're not true it is there it is not. healthy in any way shape or form to be. obese and when they tell you that it's. Health you can be metabolically healthy. and still have fat it's okay it's not. okay it's not okay that's just not true. and is that fat shaming I don't you can. call it whatever the [ __ ] you want but. it doesn't change what it does to the. human body and it doesn't make someone. better if you don't make them feel bad. about being robustly unhealthy well it's.

a it's it's an enormous disservice to. folks. if we don't expose an alternative. path okay we're spending this much money. we spent so much money in all kinds of. random stuff like just a simple example. that we saw this past week $50 billion. spent between um rural broadband and. Chargers we have no rural broadband and. we have three. Chargers no that's the this is the this.

is the data that's 50 billion. so okay that's not the 300 billion that. explain that what you mean by that so um. there was. um so in Congress when they come. together to pass these bills sometimes. what happens is there's a lot of horse. trading right and you get What's called. the Christmas tree bill which is like. everybody gets to hang something off the. Christmas tree and the crazy part of the. United States is these little bubles now. are 10 billion year 50 billion there.

whatever. so we we passed a few years ago um. something that was meant to get rural. Broadband into thousands of people's. homes and initially it was given to. SpaceX and starlink. specifically and then I think it was. pulled back and they said you know what. there's a better quote unquote better. way to do. it and there's other folks that decided.

that the better option would just be to. like lay fiber now I'm just going. to this is not a judgment I'm just going. to show you something um the the thing. is like if you were like in Kansas from. here okay between here and Kansas is. like a big distance right it's like. this when you're in orbit is just here. right it's just infinitely shorter. distance so just at a practical level. solving that problem technically is way.

better through satellites fine they make. I think what was the right decision they. unmake it and so they say we're going to. go and figure out a way to lay fiber. whatever they've laid zero fiber so. there's these thousands of people that. were promised Broadband that you can get. for basically a th000 or 100 bucks a. month or less now and instead they're. spending upwards of thousands and. thousands per home and haven't delivered. any isn't it isn't it like $42 billion.

that's 42 yeah and then the other. example was A7 billion program to. install EV Chargers 7 billion and. they've managed to install. three so all I'm saying is if you add. the two together that 50 billion that's. one sixth of what Bobby Kennedy was. talking about in terms of giving people. organic food so maybe we can't give. everybody organic food but you can get. tens of millions of people right start. with the 40 million people that's on. snap you can get maybe 10 million of.

those people get them organic food right. away so there's all of this waste yeah. all we got to do is just like focus a. little bit take some of these dollars. that are just like falling into the seat. cushions it seems like and just. reallocate it somewhat intelligently. into the things that really matter it. seems worse than falling into the seat I. if it's 42 billion people and none of. them have received internet access. that's really2 42 billion nobody's got. that U I should say I used the uh.

starlink mini this past week in Utah in. the mountains it's amazing it's amazing. it's the size of this book it's amazing. it's crazy it literally fits in a small. laptop case my friend couldn't believe. that was it I was like this is it I got. do is plug it in I got a very early one. and I used to carry it around in a um. laundry B. it was. incredible and then when you see what. they've done in a couple of years from. this thing that was a little bit bulky.

it is so beautiful and simple and you. know you you've seen it you just plug it. in and it auto starts to rotate figures. out where it is the app comes up it. shows you this you know speed and then. you're just going and I've used it in. all kinds of situations like where you. know I'm traveling I bring it with me. it's never failed and then I think man. this is like it's a hundred bucks it's. less than a 100 bucks it's crazy and. then you know in a year or two you'll be. able to run your cell phone over this.

thing yeah this is crazy yeah in a year. or two it'll probably be straight to. your cell phone and you won't need that. dish anymore but right now the dish is a. small iPad and you just sit it down in a. field and we plugged a cord to it and by. you don't even have to have a cord it is. a battery that comes with it so how much. do you think it really takes to give. every American just. a starlink dish pretty [ __ ] cheap. it's very cheap it well it wouldn't be. 42 billion I can guarantee you and by. the way the cost the cost of that would.

basically fall through the floor if you. put it in an order for 50 million of. these units right you know right SpaceX. would make them for like eight bucks. right you know what I mean like and it's. fast internet too which is even crazier. yeah yeah there's all of this stuff. that we should do we just need a few. folks. I don't know that can either course. correct or just can shine a light on it. I mean it's like it's like this thing. where I'm like so.

optimistic married to enormous fear and. like you know just like a. little I I kind of go back and forth. between these well let let me paint the. ultimate dystopian. solution the ultimate dyst part of our. problem is we have we have corruption we. have what you were talking about with. deals sort of like you know the Border. wall deal had money in it for Ukraine. like there's all these weird deals there. bills that don't make any sense like how. did you add all this why is this 2,000.

Pages how many people signed it actually. read it AI government AI government. solves all those problems AI government. is not corrupt AI government just works. literally for the people and instead of. having all these state representatives. and all these [ __ ] artists that. pretend to be working on their truck and. they don't know what the [ __ ] they're. doing they're just doing it for an ad. you don't have any of that anymore now. everything's governed with AI the. problem is who's controlling the AI and. is there some sort of an ultimate. regulatory body that makes sure the AI.

isn't biased or tainted I think there's. a step before that which is a lot more. palatable I think the thing with I. thought about your. version and the problem that you state. is the key problem which is how is this. model trained right who got their hands. on that core stuff the weights and the. values of that who who decides right and. at some point there's going to be there. or not there going there is already. today in AI models a level of human. override it's just a natural facet of.

how these things are there's a way to. reinforce the learning based on what you. say and what I say it's a key part of. how an AI model becomes smart it starts. off as. primordial and then Joe and jamaath and. all these other people are clicking and. saying yes that's a good answer bad. answer ask this question all this stuff. who are those people so right and it. could be gamed as well right like you. could organize I think that's Gil we. haven't figured out we haven't seen it. yet but it will be when the incentives.

are that high and we've seen distortions. like like the the Gemini AI that was. they were asked to make Nazi soldiers. they made these multi-racial na Nazi. soldiers and that kind of stuff where. it's just like who are the founding. fathers and it's all here's a black guy. like here's a Chinese lady like okay we. get it you're not racist this is you're. you're being crazy well you're. distorting the past exactly when you're. talk specifically history I me one of. them was like a a Native American woman.

was a Nazi Soldier it's like this is so. nuts right so that that is a problem is. in that AI is not clean right it it is. it's got the greasy Fingerprints of. modern civilization on it and all of our. bizarre ideologies but there's a step. before it that I think can create a much. better government so it's possible today. for example to. understand have you ever done a. renovation on your house yes okay so you. make. plans you go and you know your architect.

probably pays an expediter to stand in. line in in city hall there's a person. that goes and reviews that plan they. give you a bunch of handwritten markups. based on their understanding of the. building code you can't use this lead. pipe you need to use aluminum this. window's too small all this stuff you. come back you revise you go do this two. or three times on average to do a. renovation and then they issue your. permits now an AI can actually just. ingest all the.

rules knows exactly what's allowed and. what's not allowed and they can take. your picture and instantly tell you Joe. fix these 19 things you fix those things. you go to the city you can show that it. maps to all the rules so you can. streamline government you can also point. out where they're making decisions that. don't map to what the rules say that I. think is going to be a really important. First Step because it allows us to see. where maybe this administrative state. has grown unwieldy where you got to.

knock some of this stuff back and clean. up some of the Cru because there's rules. on top of rules and one conflicts with. the other I bet you there are things on. the books today that are like that 100%. there we have no way of knowing right. you know but I do think an AI can tell. you these things and say just pick which. one it's a or it's B and I I think that. that starts to cut back a lot of the the. difficulty in just making progress right. you know you know one of the things that.

um I thought was extraordinary that Elon. was getting pushed back on was his idea. of making the government more efficient. and that auditing the the various. programs and finding out how to make. them more efficient and a lot of people. really freaked out about that and their. main freak out the the main argument. from intelligent people that I saw was. uh what are you going to do you're going. to fire all these people that are in. charge of government I don't think. that's the answer for ineffective.

government is to let the same people do. the same thing because otherwise you. have to fire them that sounds insane. right and to say that the government as. as efficient as is humanly possible or. even close to it No One Believes that no. no rational person believes that. everyone believes in bureaucracy. everyone believes there's a lot of. nonsense going going on everyone. believes that like look at the. difference between what Elon has been. able to accomplish with SpaceX versus.

what NASA has been doing recently look. at the difference between what they're. able to accomplish with starlink versus. this $42 billion program that yielded. zero results look at the difference. between all these different things that. are done in the private sector when. there's competitive Marketplace. strategies like you have to figure out a. way to get better and more efficient and. you can't afford to have a bunch of. people in your company that are doing. nothing and that are creating red tape. and creating Bureau making things harder. to progress that's bad for the business.

that's the argument for letting private. companies take over things by the way I. think that what and just to build on. what you're saying people jump to this. conclusion that like government. shouldn't exist it's not some anarchic. thing where like government's actually. very important they. create incentives and then those of us. in Private Industry go out and try to. meet those incentives or take advantage. of them that's very normal okay and a.

well-functioning government creates very. good incentives an incredible example of. this is in the. 1950s do you know what the GDP of. Singapore was no it was the same as the. GDP of. Jamaica and you fast forward 70 years. and you understand what good governance. looks like we actually were talking. about Singapore yesterday how. extraordinarily efficient their um. recycling program is it's unbelievable.

yeah I mean it's really amazing what. what they do like like they really. recycle they recycle how we think we're. recycling they really do they really. separate the plastic they break it up. they use it to make Power they use it to. make Road materials they make building. materials out of it they reuse. everything well they were thrust into a. spit of land. with no natural resources they had to. become incredibly well-educated and. industrious and so you know Lewan Yu was.

able to create the right incentives for. government to do a good job they pay. their civil servants incredibly well but. then also for Private Industry to show. up and do the rest and it works. incredibly you can do that in the United. States the thing that we would benefit a. lot from is if we could just point out. all the ways in which like there's. either too many laws or laws are. conflicting you can at least have a. conversation about batting those back.

and the second is if you if you look. inside of um private Equity there is one. thing that they do which I think the. government would hugely benefit from and. it's called zerob based. budgeting and this is an incredibly. powerful but boring idea what private. Equity does when they buy a company. some of them the best ones they'll look. at next year's budget and if they say. what should the budget be well guess. what's going to happen Joe and your.

company everybody runs and says I need X. for this y for that Z for this and you. have this budget that's just ginormous. instead what some of the best private. Equity folks do is say we're starting. with. zero next year's budget is zero we're. spending nothing now let's build it back. up meticulously block by block. so somebody comes in okay what is it. exactly that you want to do I want to. build an interface that. allows they start saying something no.

okay what do you want to do I want to. upgrade the factory so that we can make. a more high Y okay done you're in how. much do you need okay one by one by one. and if you go and you do that inside the. government what you probably would find. is that same group of people would. probably enjoy their job a lot more. they'd actually be their hands would be. on the controls in a much more directed. way we'd spend a lot less because a lot. of this stuff probably just goes by the.

wayside and we don't even know you know. and people would just be more able to go. and work you could do what you wanted to. do I could do what I wanted to do Elon. could do what he wants to do there was a. thing I tweeted it out. today he cannot get. the FAA to give him a flight permit for. Starship five and. six so they're waiting on dry docks.

right they're slow rolling the approval. right he's it takes it it takes him less. time to build these Starships now than. it does to get govern approval that's. what he. said meanwhile the FCC which is a sister. organization to the. FAA fast-tracked the sale of 220 radi. stations in part to some folks that were. foreign. entities right before an election that. touched like 160 million.

Americans when you look at that you. would say how can some. folks cut through all the red tape and. get an answer quickly how can other. folks be waiting around for something. that just seems so obvious and so. exceptional for. America and there's no good answer. I I don't I don't know what the answer. is I don't think any of us know no and. then there's these folks that are stuck. in. space meanwhile there's these two people.

stuck in space yeah and and Jamie said. they were supposed to be there for how. long eight. hours yeah they were supposed to be. there for eight hours it supposed to be. quick it was supposed to be quick and. they've been there for months they're. going to be there till February that's. so. insane they're going to be there till. how terrifying must that be I mean I for. maybe you and me eight days eight days. they were supposed to be there for eight. days I think I think I would freak out.

100% I think they would too how do you. not well I I read this article where. they interviewed them now this could be. the party line I don't know but they're. like this is great it's my natural place. I'm happy oh good lord um I can't. believe that's real I had a friend of. mine who that's what they say them to. themselves to keep from going crazy well. yeah a friend of mine went to space um. the founder of cir G laberte and uh he. brought a super high Google talks about. like it's already over but it's still.

going on no it's still going on say it. until February 21st yeah February yet. yeah we're stuck in space like it ended. up spending months more more. AI wow yeah it could be way more it. could be way way more that's weird that. AI That's Another flaw with AI right. that it would read it like that wonder. what the incentive is for AI to L you. about that how does AI not know it's not. 2025. yet we're stuck in space until February.

of. 2025 that's just a straight up error. that's a weird error though it is a. weird error um but these poor people you. know and so my friend that was up there. said it was incredible he has this funny. story where he was a smoker still is a. smoker but this was like 20 years ago so. he was going up on like a soyuz rocket. and he shows up I guess in Siberia is. where they do the launches and uh he was.

really stressed out because he had to. stop smoking and he had to stop drinking. and all this stuff and he shows up in. the cosmonauts are smoking oh no they're. like oh it's totally fine don't worry so. they smoke in space no no no I'm saying. on the ground while they were training. oh boy so they go up he does eight days. he comes back down um he took these. incredible highes pictures of like all. the parts of the earth he said it was. the most incredible thing but you know. when you get back he's like I was ready. to get back did you see this latest. report there's like real controversy.

about some finding that the James web. telescope has discovered and there. there's some talk of some large object. moving towards us that's course. correcting yeah this is the the weird. part about it and there's all these. meetings and so all the the Kookie UAP. people are all over it saying disclosure. is eminent there's there's a Mothership. headed towards. us so it gets fun I don't know what they. mean by course correcting what does that.

mean and how how do they know it wasn't. impacted with something else that. diverted it it could have been that it. could have just been the gravitational. fields it just an orbital path path but. they're not telling anybody there's. something going on do you think they. would tell people like imagine if there. was a a giant chunk of Steel of iron. rather that's headed towards us that's a. great question I think the question is. what would we do if we knew do we have. the capability of moving that.

thing would the FCC wait five months to. give Elon I think you'd probably spend. send as many but see the I mean it's all. a physics problem at that point right. it's also a problem of breaking it up. exactly if it breaks up then you have. smaller pieces that are hitting. everywhere instead of one large chunk by. the way isn't isn't this like the. perfect reason why being multiplanetary. just makes a lot of sense sure like in. any like for example would you get on an. airplane if they said Hey Joe this is. the best airplane in the world it's the.

most incredible it's the most luxurious. it has the best weather you can surf you. can but there's only one navigation. system and if it goes. out you never do that right would you. ever get on that airplane no so you know. I think we owe it to ourselves to have. some redundancy yeah but ultimately I. always wonder you know like the universe. sort of has these patterns that Force. Innovation and constantly move towards. further and further complexity and if.

you were going to have intelligent life. that existed on a planet what better. incentive to get this intelligent life. to spread to other parts of the planet. than to make that planet volatile make. super volcanoes earthquakes solar flares. all sorts of different possibility. asteroid impacts all all sorts of. different possibilities that motivate. this thing to spread but to say like. this is fragile yeah and it's not. forever so create some redundancy I.

mean I was raised Buddhist I'm not that. religious in that way but I'm kind of. weirdly spiritual in this other way. which is I do think the universe is. basically it's littered with. answers you just got to go and find out. what the right questions are so to your. point like are all these natural. phenomena on Earth you know the question. is okay if that's the answer well the.

question is like do we want to be a. single planet species or do we want to. be do we want to have some built-in. redundancy and you know maybe a hundred. years from now that builds on top of. what happens in the next five we'll have. discovered all kinds of different. planets that's that's an amazing thing. unquestionably unquestionably and we. also know that there's planets in our. immediate vicinity that used to be able. to Harbor life like Mars we know that. Mars was covered in water and Mars had a.

sustainable atmosphere so we know that. this is not just a dream that this is. possible that what we're experiencing. here on Earth is temporary and if we get. hit by something big what we know Earth. was hit by a planet in its formation. there was Earth One in Earth too the. formation of the Moon the primary theory. is that we were hit by another planet. and that's why we such a large Moon. that's a quarter the size know quarter. the size of Earth it's like keeping our. atmosphere stable and keeping our it's a.

wild Shooting Gallery out there I me it. really is and especially our our. particular solar system has a massive. asteroid bu there's like 900,000 near. Earth objects and but isn't that so like. inspiring like this idea of like. discovering all these other questions. that we don't know yet to even ask ask. right that is a life well lived yes you. know that's the the most promising. aspect to a hyper intelligent AI in my.

in my opinion that it'll be able to. solve problems that are inescapable to. us and also offer us like real hard data. about how big of a problem this is and. when this needs to be solved by and then. come up with actionable Solutions yeah. and that that seems to be something. that might Escape us as biological. entities with limited Minds especially. we're not working together and you could. get AI to have the accumulated power.

mind power of everyone you know 10x the. the mental model is if an alien showed. up today would humans by and large drop. all of. their internal issues and cooperate. together perhaps perhaps I I would I. would hope that the answer would be yes. it would have to be something that. showed such overwhelming superiority. that it shut down all of our military.

systems and did so openly to the point. where we're like we're really helpless. against this thing well so I think that. one way to think about AI is that it is. a supernatural system in some ways so if. we can just find a way to cooperate and. harness this and see the bigger. picture I think we'll all be better off. like again like killing each. other is just so barbarically.

unnecessary it doesn't solve anything. all it does is just makes more anger it. creates more hatred because the what's. left over is not. positive and I think that we need to be. reminded of that somehow without. actually living the. experience yes my hope is that one of. the things that comes out of AI and the. advancement of society through this is.

the allocation of resources much more. evenly and that we use AI as I was. saying before the best way to keep. people from entering into this country. is to make all the other places as good. as this country good as this country. that's then you solve all the problems. for everybody and you you don't have. this one place where you can go to get a. job or you go over there and you get. murdered well so that I think that you. know why are a lot of people coming to. America a a lot of the reasons some are.

clearly political persecution but a lot. of the other reasons are economic to. your point and so if you can create. economic. abundance generally in the world that's. I think what people want most people. want as you said before a good job they. want to come in and feel like they can. point to something say I made that I I. feel proud of that they want to. hopefully get married have some kids. have fun with them teach them what they. were all about and you know then are.

Swan SW swans song and we all kind of I. don't know get reborn or not isn't it. interesting that the idea of people not. getting together in groups and killing. people they don't know that's. Utopia that like that is some sort of. ridiculous Pie in the Sky vision of the. possibility of the future of humanity. where that's common in small groups like. even in cities I mean there's individual. murders and there's crimes in cities but.

cities aren't attacking other cities and. killing everybody right so there's. something bizarre about Nations and. there's something bizarre about the the. uneven application of resources and. possibilities and and you know. your you're you're you're you're. economic hopes your your dreams your. aspirations being achievable pretty much. everywhere if if we did that I think.

that might be the way that we solve most. violence or the most horrific. nonsensical violence so and you have. this data point I said this before but. the most important thing that has. happened is that in the last four five. years is we have severely. curtailed the likelihood of War. in the nominal sense I think Trump was. able to basically draw a hard Red Line. in the send on that. stuff and the underlying reason was.

because we had enough economic abundance. where the incentives to go to war. fell we had just a complete Rebirth of. domestic hydrocarbons in America whether. you agree with it or not my point is it. is quite clearly correlated in the data. as we were able to produce more stuff so. economic abundance. we had less need to go and fight with. external. parties so I do think you're right like. this reduces it down to we need to find.

ways of allocating this abundance more. broadly to more countries meanwhile that. one crazy thing that you can't unwind. and go back from you can just never go. there and you just have to make sure. nobody believes that that is. Justified because in a nuclear event I. think that that's not what happens. clearly I saw this brilliant discussion. that you had where you were explaining.

that Trump is the wrong. messenger but many of the things that he. did actually were very positive right. and I think that is a it's a very. difficult thing to describe it's a very. difficult thing to express to people. because any we're so polarized and. particularly with a character like Trump. that's so polarizing it's very difficult. to attribute anything to him that is.

positive especially if you're a. progressive or if you're on the left or. if you've been a lifelong Democrat or if. you're involved in Tech or if totally I. mean it's this. bizarre denial of basic reality the the. reality of what what can you see based. on what what was put in place what. actions were taken what were the net. benefits When um I've always been a. liberal and I think I should Define what.

liberalism used to mean it used to mean. absolutely no war and it used to mean. free. speech and it used to mean uh you know. supportive a government that was. supportive of Private Industry try your. best go out there we'll look out for you. come back to us if things go Haywire. that's an an incredible view of the. world. and I think what happened was when I was.

given a. choice I would vote Democrat or I would. support Democrats because I thought that. that's what they stood. for and I didn't really understand Trump. and so what happened was I got too. caught up in the. messenger and I didn't focus enough on. the message. and I didn't even realize that I didn't. realize it in 2016 but I don't I don't. think many people. did and then in 2020 I got lost in.

it but probably by 21 or. 22 I started to see all this data and I. said hold on I am not being a. responsible adult the way that I Define. responsibility I am not looking at this. data from first principles and I need to. do it and when I. did what I saw was a bunch of. decisions that turned out to be pretty. smart the problem is that because he's.

the vessel he turns off so many people. with his. delivery and I think this is a moment. where the stakes are so high you have to. try to figure out what the message is. versus what the messenger is saying or. look to somebody else that can tell you. the message in a way that maybe will. allow you to actually listen to it that. could be JD Vance it could be Elon Musk. it could be RFK there's all kind tulsy. gabard there's all kinds of surrogates.

now because I think that they have. realized that there's a lot of value in. these. messages we need to have multiple. Messengers yes so that folks don't get. tilted and go upside down so that the. minute the one person walks in the room. and I had to challenge myself to go. through that process and at the end of. it I'm like wow he's the only Mainline. candidate here that will not go to war. and just on that. point it's like very unique times.

creates strange bedfellows it's sort of. like one thing that kind of like always. like pops out of me like why are they. working together why are they. cooperating I always think like what's. going on here and when I saw him and. Bobby align you know Bobby is a very. balanced view of Donald Trump. here's the good here's the bad even now. even with everything that's on the line. for Bobby and Bobby's agenda he's quite. honest about Donald Trump's.

um positives and. negatives but they both get. along and one of the things and probably. the most important thing where they were. sounding the drum from day one is UN. under under no circumstance will the. United States go to war I just just. think we should observe that people. should have an opinion on that he's so. polarizing that he there's been two. attempted assassinations on him and no.

one's Neo in The Matrix he's like. dodging these bullets for now you know. yeah but listen no one can dodge forever. but the thing is it's like no one seems. to care that the rhetoric is ramped up. so hard and has been so distorted the. other thing that people need to I think. think about is. the domestic policy agenda of both the. Democrats and the Republicans are within. error bars and what I mean by that is. when push comes to shove they both.

whether it's kamla Harris or Donald. Trump they have to work through a very. sclerotic. Congress which means that very little. will ultimately get done if you just. look at the track record of all these. past presidents you typically get one. piece of landmark legislation passed in. your first two. years and it all just gets Unwound it's. happened from Clinton onwards you know. bush had one bite at the Apple Obama had.

one bite at the Apple Trump had one bite. at the Apple Biden had one bite at the. Apple. so the American political system has a. really incredible way of like insulating. itself so if people would just take a. step back and look at that a lot of the. policy agenda agendas that both of them. espouse are going to be very hard to get. done there'll be one thing you know. maybe they both do something on you know. domestic.

taxation maybe they both do something on. the. border but the likelihood based on the. past is that they'll get one of these. things done and then not much will be. done this is why I think folks then need. to think about okay what are. the super presidential Powers then where. they can act. alone one area where they can act alone. is they can issue executive. orders and that can direct the behavior.

of governmental. agencies okay so people should decide. what they think about that do you want a. muscular American bureaucracy do you. want a more slim down one do you want. one that has you know bigger Ambitions. more teeth do you want one that. um is zero Bas budgeted they're pretty. Stark on those. things and then foreign. policy I think you know one Camp is much.

more. in the view that you know we are the. world's policeman and there's a. responsibility that comes with that and. one says we got a lot of problems at. home we're not getting pulled into. something. abroad and I think people need to decide. about that but other than those two. threshold issues my honest opinion is. that there's you know we're we're we're. we're in error bars between the two of. them one will cut taxes by this much one. will increase taxes by that.

much but there is real decisions that. have been made during the B. Administration about the border that are. affecting people or lack thereof well I. think it's a decision I don't think it's. a lack thereof especially the flying. people in and the utilization of an app. to fly people in. that seems insane like the the whole. thing seems insane and I I don't know. what the motivation is I've talked to. people that know a lot about the. construction business and they believe. the motivation is cheap labor they think.

that's a part of it and that a lot of. the problem is in in many Industries the. lack of cheap labor and people that are. willing to do jobs it's one of the. things that I've heard you know there's. a lot of criticism about all the. Haitians that have moved to Springfield. Ohio but one of the positive things that. I've heard from people that live there. is that these people are hard workers. and they're willing to do jobs that the. the other people weren't willing to take. on so you you have pros and cons but you. have this incentivized effort to move.

people into this country illegally which. will undoubtedly bring in people that. you don't want here gang members cartel. members terrorists terrorists that's. real and we've documented that and. there's people that have been arrested. that were trying to come in that were. terrorists and there's people that have. gotten through for sure I think that if. I give both of them the benefit of the. doubt I think both of them will have to. act on the. border um I think that Donald Trump has. had a clearer view of this issue for. much far longer I think that um kamla. has had to shift her position to make.

herself more palatable to. centrists um but I do think that both of. them will probably have to act because I. don't think what's happening today is. sustainable I don't think it is either. but the the fear and elon's talked about. this the real fear is that they're. bringing these people in give them a. clear path to citizenship which will. allow them to vote and then you've. essentially bought their vote so if the. Democrats bring them in incentivise them. to become Democrats and vote and give.

them money which they clearly are doing. they're giving them EBD cards and. they're giving them housing and they're. giving things that they're not getting. giving to Veterans and poor people in. this country that seems to be an. incentive to get these people to want to. be here and also to appreciate the. people that gave him that opportunity. which is you would essentially in swing. states which is Ohio it's one of them. you if you can get a lot of people in. there and you've given them a better. life because of your policies those. people if you give them the opportunity.

to vote they're going especially if. they're like limited low in information. voters they're going to vote for the. party that got them to. America I mean I yeah I have I don't. know whether it's. a conspiracy per se meaning but I I do. agree with the outcome. meaning I remember very. vividly. um we my parents took out the whole.

family three of us myself and my two. sisters to Niagara Falls and then we. crossed the border to. Buffalo and we applied for Refugee. status in America as. well um we didn't get it we were. rejected um and when we went. back we got a tribunal hearing in Ottawa. where where I grew up and I remember. that it was in front of this Magistrate. Judge the person comes in with the robes. and the hair and everything and you sit. there and they hear they got the wigs up.

there all of it yeah and. then the wigs and then U they sit there. and they hear your case out and my. father had to defend our whole. family here's you know what our life was. like here's what we did and I remember. just crying. from the minute it started that's all I. did the whole time uh it seared in my. mind because like you know your life is. right there it's it's like a crucible. moment for your whole family if they're.

like I don't buy it off you go we go. back and I don't know what would have. happened fortunately obviously it worked. out and then you know you go through the. process I became a Canadian citizen then. I moved to the United States to get on a. Visa then I become an American citizen I. have an enormous. loyalty to this country and so when I. think about like Americans not getting. what they deserve before other folks it.

really does touch me in a play it like I. get very agitated about that idea it's. not that those folks shouldn't be taken. care of in some way shape or form. because I was one of those people that. needed a little bit of a safety net. right we needed welfare we needed the. you know the places to go in to get the. free clothes and all that stuff. but you have to sort of take care of all. of the people that are putting in the. effort and the time to be here and.

followed the rules and stood in line. like when I came to the United States. man I came on a TN. Visa it's every year you had to get it. renewed you had to show up and if the. person that was looking at you said jam. out you're gone. Joe then I had to transfer to an H1B. Visa. my company had to show that there wasn't. an American that could do this. job and we then we were able to show. that so I've lived this experience of an.

immigrant following the. rules and just methodically and. patiently waiting and hoping and the. anxiety that comes with that because it. comes with tremendous anxiety if you ask. people that were on h-1bs in America. there was a website I don't even know if. it exists anymore but we would check. what you know because when you apply for. a green card you get an application date. and man I would sweat that website every. other week hey did they update that and.

it would be like four years in the past. and I'm like I'm never going to get my. green card my Visa is going to expire. I'm G to have to move back to. Canada but I still play by the. rules so I just think it's important to. recognize that there are a lot of folks. that play by the rules that are. immigrants to this country there a lot. of people that were born here that have. been playing by the rules and I think we. owe it to them to do the right thing for. them as. well and then try to do the right thing. for some folks that are coming across.

the border because they probably are. some of them legitimately are escaping. some really bad stuff quite a lot of. them I'm sure and I'm sure most of those. people are people that just want a. better opportunity and that's a great. thing and that's a great thing but you. have to take care of all the people here. especially the veterans and then. especially these people that have been. struggling in these inner cities that. have dealt with the redlining and all. the Jim Crow laws that have set them. back for decades and decades and has. never been corrected there's never been.

any effort to take these places that. have been economically [ __ ] since the. beginning of the 20th century and. correct it and instead you're dumping. all this money into people that have. illegally come here that to me is where. it starts looking like a conspiracy I. think that as long as people can explain. what they're doing for these other folks. that you just. mentioned I think for a lot of people. for 50% of the population that leans red.

on this topic you could at least explain. to them right the problem is that there. is no explanation there is. $150,000 you know home credit that Gavin. news was about to give I think he vetoed. it I could be wrong um was wildly. unpopular but that bill somehow gets to. his desk. and is there a bill that says we should. have better food for the food deserts. did that bill get passed so there's. clearly a way for you know state.

legislatur to do what's right on behalf. of the folks in their. state so if we just had a little bit. more. balance and then if we were able to. shine a light on those. things a lot of the people that live. here that. contribute would feel better. about where things were going and. wouldn't feel like the whole thing is. just rigged right well that's one of the. things that people are so excited about. with this Trump Union with tulsy Gabbert. and Robert Kennedy is that you're having.

these movements that seem to be almost. impossible to achieve outside of an of. an outsider like the make America. healthy again concept like what are you. talking about you're going to go up. against these companies that have been. donating to these political parties. forever and have allowed them to have. these regulations that are allowing them. to have these dyes in food that's. illegal in our neighboring Canada like. how what this is a no one's done that.

before right so that's very exciting. okay so but again messenger message. messenger message just take a step back. though and if you were just the average. Joe. citizen I think an important thing to. just notice is. why are all these totally different. people acting as a. team I just think it's an interesting. thought question for I'm not I don't.

have an answer and I'm not going to. plant an answer but just ask yourself. like why are all of these. people cooperating and I. think the 2024. election is a lot about. the traditional Ro to. governance and a very radical. reimagining of. government and I think that's what. effectively will get decided the. traditional approach says we're going to.

create robust policies we're going to. work sort of top- down you know this. muscular foreign policy muscular. domestic policy the government's going. to play a large part of the. economy and we're going to try to write. some. wrongs the radical reimagining. says we're going to go back to a. more founding notion of this country. we're going to have a very light. governmental. infrastructure we are going to cut back.

a bunch of the. rules and we're going to take a little. bit of a step back on foreign policy so. that we don't end up in a situation we. can't uh pull back. from in that lens it's very different in. the lens of actual policy I honest think. that it's pretty much six of one half a. dozen to the other but in that first. lens they're they're really markedly. different choices and you know we'll see. um well the the lens that you're.

describing the the thing that distorts. everyone's vision is Donald Trump as a. human being that's the thing it's and. it's also the media's depiction of him. which has been grossly distorted and and. I think that you know I met him and. spent time with. him um I've also had lunch with. Kamala um she was very kind very nice. person Donald Trump very funny very. kind very. polite like he talks to.

you and I just was like wow this is like. totally and exactly what you said I was. like I was expecting something totally. different. um and I think though that the part at. the core part of what where the media. goes crazy I think I'm I'm. guessing is that there's a part of him. as well that's like an Entertainer I. mean he's better than he's as good as. any. comedian yeah he's on point he's got s.

like he's got rhythm he knows how to. lend he so there's a thing that he's. doing when he's on stage which for the. audience I think is no different than. going to a show or a Revival or. something you're seeing a star. right but then if you're looking at him. as Donald Trump the person I think the. media really gets out of they get tilted. well not only that they've distorted who. he is whatever flaws Donald Trump has.

are nothing in comparison to the media's. depictions of him and everybody's got. flaws um his I think are um his exist. and are well described but I do think. that they um I think there's like a. couple of good examples you know one. example that bothered. me was the Charlottesville press. conference um when I first heard the. media depiction of it I was really upset.

because of what I thought he said right. it turned out he didn't say it exactly. in fact not only did he not say it he. said the exact opposite right and then I. was really frustrated and a little bit. angry because I thought he was never. lying to me the filter was lying to me. right and I'm not. paying for those people to lie to me I'm. paying for them to actually give me the. transcript of it so that I can decide. for myself I think that's part of a. responsibility of being a coent adult.

and the only repercussions of them lying. is a lack of trust that people have for. them now and so then they make their own. bed you know they dig their own grave a. little bit because it's the I think the. trust in the mainstream media is the. lowest it's ever been I think way more. people trust you you know way more. people trust us to tell a version of. what we think is happening. because you're you're not going to lie. and you're like interested in just. showing the clips and then just debating.

what did he mean what did he say why did. he say this why did he say that um by. the way the same goes for kamla because. now you know the the domestic political. Machinery is going to try to. characterize her as well cherry pick. comments she says so my point is I think. we have to suspend this right but it's. not balanced like particularly like look. at the debate where they fact check Che. checked Trump multiple times but they. didn't fact check her by the way did you. I I read this is this a is this true or.

not but the the co-host was her sorority. sister yes that is true. yes I mean well not not just that but. there's the affidavit by the person from. ABC that sh said she was aware of the. questions and that she was told that. there were certain things going to be. off topic or off uh off limits like her. record as a DA and also some other. person that she's attached to that's. involved in something shady and then on. top of it there was things that she said.

that were absolutely untrue one of them. the most the one of the grossest ones. was she saying that we don't have any. troops deployed in combat zones have you. ever seen that one where the the troops. in the combat z comat z are going what. the [ __ ] are we doing here and then Dan. khaw see if you can find Dan caw's Post. on Instagram he he's seal with one eye. yeah yeah I mean that's a guy who. understands the consequences of War. right clearly paid the price personally. for serving but on his Instagram he laid.

out how many troops are in active combat. zones it's tens of thousands right in. multiple combat zones of American. citizens I mean look I was I was trying. to be charitable when I said that like I. I think that there's like I'm going to. assume that both. people are smart they believe what they. believe they're both trying to do what. they think is right they both want to. win okay let's take that off the table. for a. second the filters that then try to give.

them that message will try to pervert. that truth for their own best interest. and I think what they have decided the. mainstream media is their best interests. are better served through one IE comma. and less well served through another I.E. Donald Trump yes so if there's ever been. a moment where it's time for all of us. to show up and be a you know a. grownup try to get the source material. try to think about things from first.

principles I'm telling you it is the. most consequential election of our. lifetime and the simplest reason why is. that the president decides to hit the. button on the nuclear. football so just imagine for one second. irrespective of what your politics. is who do you want to hold that. thing what do you want them to do under.

even the most excruciating pressure in. the. world and I think what we want to find. is someone at least in that very narrow. moment will be a JFK like. decision I will block everybody else out. it is entirely about my desire and wish. for how I want America to be known and. I'm going to protect my children and my. grandchildren you cannot touch the. button you can't get close to the.

button I think we're a lot closer than. people. think I think we are too thank you very. much for being here man that was really. fun I really enjoyed it thanks I know. you're very busy so I really appreciate. your time it was a real honor it was an. honor for me as well thank you thank you. all right bye everybody. [Music]. [Applause]. [Music].