Joe Rogan Experience #2012 - Gad Saad

Joe Rogan podcast check it out The Joe. Rogan Experience Train by day Joe Rogan. podcast by night all. day how are you sir oh my God I'm. excited to see you good to see you it's. always great to see you I think this is. the ninth time I appear so am I entering. kind of Hall of Fame status yeah there's. like after five anybody with more than. five that should be like the top line on. my CV forget about all the other Bullit.

[ __ ] nine times on Joe Rogan we've had. some fun conversations yeah before we. start today July 25th is the release of. my latest book right here's a copy for. you sir thank you very. much the sad truth about happiness eight. secrets for leading the good life boom. all right please read it will you'll. enjoy it lot of did you do the audio. book you I swear to God the number one. thing I was worried that you were going. to ask me was that and you lead off with. that uh so here's what happen an actor.

does it so he has a beautiful. voice I. insisted I said Joe Rogan berated me on. his show for maybe 15 minutes listen to. him they pitched it to the audio. publisher the audio publisher said sorry. we do in-house narration so I think for. the next book I'll put it as part of the. contract yeah it has to be there's silly. they're silly especially in you're a. public figure like there's hours and. hours and hours hours and hours and.

hours of you talking indeed now when. people want to hear your words they want. to hear them through your mouth and it's. personal stories yes it makes no sense. I'm sold I believe me I fought the fight. crazy but it's such a it's such a silly. fight to have when someone's a. professional public speaker yeah like. yourself like doesn't make any sense. with a very velvety voice velvety smooth. and you know who's closer to the subject. matter right indeed.

you know the truth behind the words like. you're going to say these things if. you're talking about especially like. real life experiences you're saying them. as you I lead off by the way in in first. chapter to talk about sort of. existential happiness about how I came. very close to being aborted in Lebanon I. don't want somebody else to be telling. that story right right right right of. course your story is wild yeah you know. um what I find about people like. yourself that have been through.

um like like a really scary thing really. scary like genuinely scary like scary. threats threats of your life war zone. stuff folks like yourself have so much. less patience for nonsense exactly and. that's why I sometimes can appear. erasable when I go after because. sometimes people will say you know when. I meet you you seem so much nicer and. warmer than how you are on social media. but I'm not trying to be mean on social.

media it's that I'm pissed off at the. [ __ ] and so it comes across as. though you know I'm contener and. combative but I'm just really fighting. hopefully the good fight the real. problem with social media is the problem. with human beings it's Tribal group. think yeah and it it overwhelms these. groups of people that you associate with. and then narratives get formed and you. can't stray outside those narratives you. can't even look at objective reality you. can't look at data you can't look at it.

just becomes so crazy the ideology and. the adherence to that ideology trumps. everything trumps the truth it trumps. you're you're willing as long as the. politicians on your side to ignore. craziness corruption horrible [ __ ] you. ignore all of it perfect example of that. I hate to say that I'm I've seen his. feed Meathead from All in the Family Rob. Riner have you ever gone to his I've. read a couple of tweets and I'm like I'm. out.

I love his work too much I know I know. it's hard to then like his work when he. he is so. overwhelmingly obsessed with with Trump. Stephen King is another guy who yeah uh. fits that description something happens. to Old liberals with a ton of. money it's like something happens to. those old creative types yeah it just. you know it doesn't make sense it. doesn't make sense that you're arguing.

with people online about it all day long. if you're Rob rer or if you're Stephen. King like putting you know nasty tweets. out it's like come on so I actually I I. wrote maybe it was Shameless plugging of. my book but I I responded to Rob R I. said let me send you a copy of my book. man there's so much that you have to be. happy about stop being mired endlessly. in vitrio I mean that's all he does I. mean imagine this guy how many things. he's got to be grateful about he's a. creative guy a talented guy and he.

spends all day obsessing on issues that. ultimately he's got no control over well. people viewed Trump as an existential. threat to the the the very fundamentals. of the country they they thought that he. was going to come in and he was going to. represent corruption on a level that. we've never seen before but the problem. with doing that and saying that is that. it opens the door to examining all the. other corruption like how much is there.

like how much what do who's how much. money you guys making how where's this. money coming from there's so much. corruption that's readily available that. once you start opening the door to. calling someone a monster then everyone. gets to look at you and go hey but what. about you guys like what are you doing. what what about what about drone. bombings look at let's talk about some. real problems what about the fenel. crisis like what about you know what. about the the the borders where like. criminals are coming through like how. many are being sent back what's the.

numbers yeah what's the numbers I mean a. lot of them are good people that just. want to find a better way to live and. good for them and I would do it I would. do it too if I could sneak across into. America and be assimilated I would. [ __ ] do it why wouldn't you if if you. got a bad roll of the dice and you're. living in somewhere that's less. favorable and you get the opportunity to. just all you have to do is get across. the river and they let you in but how. many of those people shouldn't be here. how many of those people are dangerous. how many what's the number it's not zero. What's the number well I could tell you. that uh we've talked about this in the.

past when we talked about people who. come from certain cultures where there's. rampant anti-Semitism right and so if. you let people that are coming from. cultures where when they're pulled. somewhere between 90 to 99% of them will. exhibit rampant Jew hatred it doesn't. take much of a uh social sociologist or. you know survey analyst to recognize. that out of all those people that are. coming in you're going to have an. increase of Jew hatred yesterday I was. out with friends um here in Austin and.

so one of them asked me have you have. you seen an uptake on uh you know Jew. hatred are you exposed to more I say. it's it's it's endless it's I mean it's. usually on social media do you think. it's ramped up or do you think now that. Elon has uh taken over Twitter and. allowed much more free spee hard for me. to tell I don't I really don't know but. it there is kind of a normalized now. many of them are behind Anonymous. accounts of course but there is kind of. a a Cavalier normal ization of just say.

so for example I think someone had. retweeted you know promotional thing. about my book and someone said you know. why are you promoting the Jew you're. like my God this this guy could be your. your son's teacher he could be your the. grosser at the store you know what I I. have a real concern with that and I also. have a real concern with vested entities. like organizations that would want. people to be at each other's throats. stirring up things with fake social.

media posts cuz this is a real problem. that's happening in the world right now. right you know um someone um tweeted a. bunch of different examples uh of where. dozens and dozens of accounts are saying. the same inflammatory things with the. exact same wordage exact and they're all. like you know they have numbers and. letters and their accounts like just. random accounts and you know you go to. their page it looks kind of real they. have a photo there's like them with a.

flag it's like and you go through it you. but you get this sense like oh you're. you're a bot like you're not even a real. person like so you you're an agent of. you're stirring up [ __ ] so there's a. certain aspect of our culture I don't. know what the percentage is but there's. a certain aspect of the conversations. online that are being flavored by fake. accounts that are designed to get people. upset with each other yeah it's like. Psych ological Warfare on a level that.

no one anticipated and no one's prepared. for because when you have the two things. we already discussed like this adherence. to the ideology no matter what no matter. what like there's no you can't. objectively logically defend any of the. things that are in in opposition of it. and then you have this so are you I I. noticed I mean obviously we follow each. other on Twitter you almost never I mean. short of the recent thing you did with.

the Peter Hotes you almost never weigh. in on anything is has was that sort of a. conscious thing for you to step back. yeah well with that one it was like okay. this is crazy you're you're you're. you're saying that he he was he made. some crazy tweet about Neo fascist Leen. yeah I saw that like what are you. talking about like with Robert Kennedy. Jr with me I'm like this is dangerous. like what you're saying is totally. untrue you know it's untrue and you're. willing to just say.

because like the the more you can. discredit someone who's in opposition to. some of your ideas the the more you can. somehow or another in your weird game of. checkers you're playing like Elevate. yourself but you don't think people know. what you're doing like that's like the. the most clear Neo fascist like what the. [ __ ] are you saying did you feel more. angry at the fact that you had already. had a conversation with him and so you. there was some kind of personal. connection between you two I mean I. understand he's not your best friend for. sure I've had him on at least was he on.

twice tce twice I've had him on twice I. was very nice to him yeah even in. disagreement with him like in issues of. Health I was very nice to. him but you can't just say stuff like. that and you know it's like I just. wanted to say like have a debate with. the guy yeah like have a debate with the. guy so what ended up happening I think. it got up to like2 million he's not. going to do it he won't do it you know I. don't think he wants to do it you know. and this there's the idea that like. Robert Kennedy would be too silver Tong.

like come on cuz he's a lawyer you know. he's really good arguing stuff like like. if you you either have facts or you. don't have facts right and if you're. scared to debate the facts I have to go. what are these facts what's bothering. you like what do you worry that he might. bring up I mean what are we saying it it. could be the case so for example I've. been often asked why don't you debate. creationists about Evolution and I take. the position there of Richard Dawkins. which is it's not that I'm too hoty to. debate anyone is that there's almost no. chance that I could present any evidence.

that would cause you to alter your. position so it's really a losing. proposition so could it be that Peter. Hotes is coming from that perspective it. could but you know what I would say to. that even in your case it is. preposterous for someone to to not. believe that at least there's a process. of evolution at at this stage of it's. it's kind of crazy to because there's. like there's evidence of things that are. happening where things are adapting to. their environment right now that we. we've tracked yeah exactly like you know.

there's a little antelope in the Congo. that swims underwater and eats fish is. that right yeah it's called a dier I. think it's called a diyer d i k r I. think that's how you say it but this. little animal evolved uh lived on. grasslands and the grasslands became. rainforest and when the grasslands these. little like prairie animals are trapped. inside the Congo there's an amazing BBC. documentary about it but they've got. like these things are evolving yeah like. they're figur out a swim but believe me.

having spent 30 years trying to convince. some of my academic colleagues about the. value of evolution and studying human. behavior they'll go la la la I don't. want to hear it right with human. behavior and especially with you know oh. there certain narratives so this one is. just swimming in the water but these. [ __ ] can go underwater they can. the the Dyers that they were talking. about in the Congo they can swim under. water for like a 100 yards why do I feel. that the crocodile is about to hit it. and second now cuz we've seen too many.

of those videos that that is arguably. one of the. scariest. scenarios the scariest the [ __ ]. scariest start I have to pause something. happened with my video feed right now oh. it's some doing mixing your two things. really Strangely I need to do we got a. reboot not a reboot I just got to figure. out what happened oh okay but we got. everything else no yeah it's so it's. just yeah when I cut to your camera it's. blending them together and people only. listening to audio this is a special. segment of the podcast that's only just. for you there you go cuz the video's.

[ __ ] should we stop talking I mean you. can keep talking it's just that the. video looks weird so I don't want to be. a distraction all right well let's fix. it we'll pause we'll be right back we're. back all right uh technical difficulties. I just want to close the parenthesis on. something that happened from last show. oh incredible story you ready yeah. that's actually speaks about connecting. with people so last show you had asked. me or not you had asked me we were. talking about who would be some guests. that we'd really want to have on our. respective shows and you probably don't.

remember what my two celebrities were do. you by any chance I don't remember Clint. Eastwood and first I appreciate his. politics I I've been watching him since. I was a kid in Lebanon uh number two was. Bert bakarak who's I don't do you. remember who that is I remember the name. Bert Barak is the uh music composer. who's basically written songs for. everybody uh he was featured in one of. the Austin Powers movie oh where he the. guy says ladies and gentlemen Bert Bak.

you know anyways uh after our chat aired. I go on my Instagram I have a personal. DM private DM from what looks like the. account of Bert bakarak who's you know. arguably the biggest musical you know. composer in the United States so I'm. extremely excited it turns out it was. his son who said oh your your clip with. Joe Rogan uh was passed on to me uh and.

I think I would it would be great for. I'd love for my dad to come on your show. oh and now cut to the punchline it never. ended up happening he recently passed. away so perhaps he wasn't I mean he was. like 94 95 but just the fact that you. and I are having a conversation someone. else pick it up and then my word can my. world can intersect with Bert bakarak. whom there no conceivable place where.

his word and world and mine would ever. connect that's the beauty of Life wow. that is the beauty of life that's. awesome isn't that amazing yeah you are. a connector sir I try to be Clen would. be an interesting guy to talk to like. the guy still works you know he's like. 93 years old he's still out there making. movies still enjoys it I remember in. Lebanon when I I you know I only learned. English in and when I moved to to Canada. when I was 11 and I I got all the.

communication I needed to get even. though there wasn't much dialogue in the. Spaghetti Westerns I would look at him. and I would say that's that's the man. you know and so he's remember Every. Which Way but Loose of course he hung. around with an rangit. tag so that's a bit later right a. [ __ ] movie that's in the 70s right I. I believe so yeah yeah yeah I believe it. was the 70s yeah he played a bare. knuckle boxer that's right who traveled. around with anag tank that's right I. think that sounds like 77 7 but I'm. talking in the' 60s I'm talking you know.

65 67 68 when I'm you know four 5 years. old and I'm watching this guy in in in. Lebanon wow that's the power of you know. the male archetype it's it's incredible. that is still Every Which Way belose. right I'm not conflating two movies. right that's the movie that where he was. the bare knuckle boxer isn't it I think. that sounds right yeah yeah and I and I. think at the time his his love interest. in the in that movie the hell was that. was that Jesus Jamie you got a wrong tab.

open up son start the trailer D how. about taking in a new movie okay what. you mind guess trailer is and I don't. know why there's nothing on it oh you. can't see the video I don't know yet oh. what is happening. okay yeah but it's weird oh there is it. that's the one well I guess so I don't. know what that voice is over it it seems. like someone was oh I said 77 it's 78. there you go yeah yeah is this a dumbass. movie.

those movies are great though I love. movies from that era like ridiculous. like like uh smoking the Bandit I mean. come on man Jackie gleon you got B. Reynolds Sally Fields come on man that. that's a fun movie yeah Jackie gleon. plays a a cop it's. hilarious yeah yeah uh what's your. favorite movie of all time if you have. to pick one I really don't think I have. one but you know what I watched recently. I rewatched is um 2001 Space Odyssey I.

forgot how good that was that movie is. amazing it's not just amazing it's. amazing visually and it's from 1968 yeah. it's amazing the the special effects are. so good like all through it like even. the Apes in the beginning you know the. scene where they're evolving yeah when. they encounter the monolith the [ __ ]. special effects on the Apes is pretty. goddamn good for. 1968 my my all-time favorite the. original 12 Angry Men I first saw and.

actually it speaks to what we talked. about earlier about how you can get. someone to change their mind when. they're in a tribal mindset because I. watched the the movie for the first time. in a first semester I was an MBA student. and I was taking a uh organizational. behavior class where the professor. assigned us that movie to watch it to. demonstrate group dynamics because for. those of you who don't have you seen it. Joe I don't think I have or you need to. rented tonight so basically it it's uh.

Henry Fonda that's it that's the. one okay I think I have but it was a. long long time ago so let me tell you. the premise uh 12 guys get together in a. room they're trying to discuss whether a. guy should be put to death uh you know. found guilty they take a a poll 11 say. he's absolutely guilty let's go home one. guy Henry Fonda says hey let's let's sit. and talk about it the rest of the movie. is how he gets each of the 11 other guys.

to flip their positions and so that's. why I had watched it in that NBA course. because it demonstrates how you know. there are techniques you can use to try. to persuade people of course today you. could almost never do it I can never. convince Rob Riner of anything but you. know h i mean I wouldn't necessarily say. that I think some people are just like. really deeply cemented in their belief. systems right and I mean maybe they can. relax it's still it's still you're a. human being if you're being and you're. willing to look at objective truth you.

can realize that like there's some other. things a foot there's like there's a. tribal aspect to all of our ideological. um problems that makes objective. reasoning a giant problem it it just. like it gets in the way of everything. because people are so tribally committed. right now and that they're tribally. committed to this idea that the other. side is the end of the world if they. take power yeah and there's all these. different things that are bounced back. around these these societal issues that.

keep getting bounced back around where. you go like what what why aren't these. resolved like the roie Wade one and now. they're talking about uh gay marriage. like doing the same thing with gay. marriage like why do you want to do this. are you doing this because you just want. people to squabble about [ __ ] because. that's what it seems like because that's. the only reason why you would have have. like Supreme Court conversations about. gay marriage in 2023 like why would who. the [ __ ] why what like what you we've.

already had that debate we're God we. passed that we passed that so that's. still if people even want to bring It Up. For Debate like Is that real or is this. one of those things that keeps us. culturally squabbling and it keeps. people like. ideologically connected to one group and. opposed with all their vitory all the. other group the other the group they're. monsters they're evil the ruin of. society yeah and this this [ __ ].

bipolar aspect to our society is just. it's Fe it's fed by social media it's. fed by these fake accounts it's fed by. you know soulless commentators the the. saddest part is when that tribalism. comes into your own family so so here's. an incredible story uh I I've appeared. on tuer Carlson I mean his old show uh. several times on television but his long. form uh podcast that he used to do uh he. had invited us to us meaning my my.

family and I to Florida to do his show. he was super gracious super warm with. everybody with our kid with my kids and. so on and so I put out a tweet just. thanking him for his Hospitality hey. Tucker it was so nice to meet you thank. you for giving me the opportunity to. chat blah blah blah a cousin of mine Joe. who went through the Lebanese civil war. with me and who was my best friend. growing up in Lebanon so you would think. that if there's ever a relationship ship. that's cemented in the trials and.

tribulations of our childhood it would. be that relationship so he puts out a. tweet and he says something I mean I. don't remember exactly although I quoted. in the book on happiness uh because I'm. basically arguing don't don't live your. life like my cousin uh he puts out a. tweet saying something like have you no. shame right so he decides to publicly. shame me for being associated or. agreeing to go on Tucker Carlson's show. that shows you what tribalism can do to. the human mind it takes something as.

difficult as what we went through. through the Lebanese Civil War and it. erases it because he can't believe that. I could do something as grotesque as to. talk to Tucker. Carlson yeah there and if you asked him. for examples specific examples of why. Tucker Carlson is so horrible that's. where it would get interesting yeah cuz. some people might be able to say some. things they found disagreeable but most. people are just sticking to a narrative. yeah there's just this narrative that he. is Carnet he is a transphobe or whatever.

it is he's a he's a Putin sto yeah he's. a Putin stoe there's all these different. things but they they want to ignore all. evidence that he's a lovely guy like and. he really is by all accounts by all. accounts all the people that I know that. have had interactions with him so he's a. very lovely guy including my friend. Steve renella he had him on a podcast. and these people that you know they had. these ideas of who he was before he came. on his podcast and these like they all. came away like I really like him he's a.

really nice guy yeah even if you don't. agree with his politics he seems like a. really nice guy gracious down to earth. uh what what I love you know how you you. you often say if you want to know. whether the date that you're out with is. a good person see how she he or she. treats the server at the restaurant sure. so the way he interacted with my. children right he he he was focused on. them he was at so how are you doing how. are you en right so he's he's taking his. time he's not acting h and I'm this big. star he is focused on my children I.

thought that was really lovely that's. what I was trying to convey in that. tweet but to my cousin that was beyond. the. pale yeah it's unfortunate it's. unfortunate that someone would turn on. you like that yeah it's just so foolish. it's so foolish because it's first of. all that should be something that you. would have a conversation with somebody. about like if I care about someone and. they're they're talking to someone that. I find egregious. you know I think you would have a.

conversation with you call them up and. go hey man just this is what I think. like you tell me what you think yeah I. want to know what you think but there's. certain like narratives that you can't. like anything on Fox News is the Hitler. it's the Hitler it's the evil it's the. I'll be I'll be on the Hitler Channel. tomorrow when I go to Greg Gutfeld yeah. it's like I mean I think they're trying. to reform that in some sort of a way and. I think uh Fox News is getting a lot of. push back from people on the right that.

are very concerned with you know some of. the decisions they're making they're. they're kind of going down the same path. that a lot of these other corporations. have gone down do you have a sense of. what happened with the do you have any. uhuh I don't know so I don't know what. happened with Tucker Carlson I don't. know why he got fired I know as much as. the average person who reads. Reddit I know some conspiracies I know I. know he was uh the he was like he's kind.

of wild fella when you think about like. what he was doing on a a major. television show implicating the CIA in. the assassination assassination of jnf. Kennedy yeah and he's saying it with. like utmost certainty yeah right it's. like so you think that the reason of. firing him was that they he they thought. that he didn't adhere to some. journalistic ethic or rigger or. something like that I don't know that. could be the case I don't know yeah um I. would think that when you have a network.

that's run by advertising you know I. mean that's what you do for income yeah. you know um I would imagine there's a. lot of pressure by those people those. advertisers to uh eliminate threats to. their their business right so if you got. some wild dude on Fox News who's uh. saying a bunch of [ __ ] about whatever it. is whether it's uh the why we in Ukraine. whether it's uh why you mandating. vaccines whether it's uh what this.

having that kind of stuff on regular. television it's a big problem to anybody. that's selling advertisement that's in. those businesses apparently Budweiser. didn't learn that. lesson well see the difference between. Budweiser and pharmaceutical drug. companies is that Budweiser is not. prescribed right it's not recommended by. your doctor right you don't get you. don't go to CVS to pick it up it's uh. different and so this is like something.

that you can't really um you can't. really criticize a brand and like say. yeah we don't we don't buy fizer around. these parts anymore like it doesn't that. doesn't work it's not going to work you. can do that with Budweiser though and. you can do that with like that's. probably going to happen with some other. stuff too like people are upset at the. country music channel you know because. they the Jason Al de song try that in a. small town. the level of outrage like now I'm not.

saying that that's the greatest song in. the world's ever known you know but the. level of outrage coming from people that. are upset about that song is so strange. when there. are hundreds of rap songs out there yeah. that are infinitely worse and also. enjoyable misogynistic qualfying. violence the whole thing and no no. complaints at all yeah yeah yeah uh. we're not even talking about old stuff.

there's new stuff too there's there's. there's hip-hop there's Wild Rock songs. there's a lot of wild [ __ ] and to be. focusing on that one and it it's the. racial aspect of it it was crazy because. like the real antifa problems that were. happening during the BLM I think there. was a lot of white people doing that. wasn't it it was a lot of like lost. liberal whites who are very angry who. decided to take up this movement and. smash things. so like the racial aspect of it there's.

nothing racial about the lyrics or how. about the Tracy Al did you see the Tracy. Alman uh controversy no I did not so she. she wrote in the I don't know if you. remember I think it was 1988 she had. this iconic song Fast Car yes uh oh. right right and then this uh I guess. he's a country music Chapman Chapman. that's om man oh that's she's an actress. right she's a comedian Tracy Chapman. thank yeah and then this this uh singer. asked for her permission I guess to to.

do a cover and so on and then people. came out that you know the white guy is. assuring this yeah well but that's. always going to happen you're always. going to have a certain amount of people. to say that yeah it doesn't mean it's. real it's it also and apparently she's. happy that he's doing it well no kidding. I mean everybody's good and it's a great. song I mean it's really good as he. didn't even changed the gender like when. he sang it yeah yeah yeah you know yeah. I can become a checkout girl he says. checkout girl right yeah yeah yeah yeah.

so what else is up what's I think we. were going to talk about uh uh what my. impression of some of the prices in. Austin oh yeah you were telling me that. an espresso was $8 so yeah so yes. yesterday I went out with actually I was. at my at the hotel and uh two friends. came by to one of whom I think has been. on your show Michael malice yeah I love. that dude yeah he's lovely and the other. the other guy is a professor at UT. Austin who's really Richard Lowry who's. really fighting he's very much of a. academic honey badger fighting against.

all the woke stuff and so we were just. hanging out uh one of one of the guys. ordered a Diet Coke and two of us. ordered a two espressos uh the bill came. it was uh with the tip. $28 and I'm thinking this is like Oprah. money like who who can who can you know. afford these prices you you tell me. what's what's going on in Austin I have. no idea I didn't go to that place but I. mean in general the real estate.

everything is completely doubled tripled. it's it's going I mean I understand that. it's because it's a hot place yeah but. espresso shouldn't be eight bucks right. what should espresso cost well in. Montreal it'll be four or five is normal. what's noral Montreal would be maybe for. an espresso so it's a short espresso. single espresso 350 which it's hard for. people to believe but when I was growing. up there was no Starbucks right people. did not they did not like coffee like. they like coffee now they are the.

greatest drug dealers the world's ever. known they they're slinging that sweet. caffeine all over this country and. that's what it is it's the best drug. dealing operation the world's ever known. because it's a super mild productive. drug that everybody enjoys feels like a. warm hug my. friend the the requisite drug. conversations coming up here we go on a. 30 minute conversation drug this is like. a good drug like caffeine is like. there's whatever effects you get from. coffee they're so minimal there's even.

like links to like good health benefits. from it yeah I think there's worri. people used to worry about dehydration. but I don't think they worry about that. as much anymore when it comes to. drinking coffee they used to think that. if you drank a lot of coffee you would. get dehydrated but there's a certain. amount of hydration you're actually. getting from drinking coffee too so it's. like kind of complicated because it is. kind of a diuretic but it also like. you're also drinking it so that here. perfect segue into one of the chapters. of the book I talk about everything in. moderation which of course Aristotle.

already talked about the golden mean you. know if a soldier is too cowardly it's. not good if he's too Reckless he's going. to die and so like most things The Sweet. Spot is in the middle and so in that. chapter I go through a bewildering. number of phenomena all of which adhere. to that inverted you too little not good. too much is not good and and the ideal. point is in the middle exercise. intensity inverted you alcohol. consumption inverted you coffee. consumption inverted you fish.

consumption inverted you and so I. thought that was a really cool chapter. to cover because it's arguably the most. universal law that we can find so many. things adhere to that inverted you and I. think we had discussed this last time. that I was on the show the ancient. Greeks were already aware of it I mean. Aristotle in his Niko Maan ethics talks. exact I mean he doesn't call it the. inverted you he calls it the golden mean. and so to our earlier conversation the. last time I was here in in going through.

the research for this book The amount of. insights I found from senica epicus. Aristotle Marcus aurelus was just. breathtaking it was unbelievable yeah I. um I just got back from Greece is that. right yeah I was in Greece for two weeks. and uh I saw the parthan on and we went. to elsis uh went to dallos went to a. bunch of different Islands it was really. interesting man yeah we we checked out a.

bunch of ruins and uh it's just. so it's so hard to even wrap your head. around what was going on there 2,000. plus years ago yeah indeed I I did five. Islands so maybe we can compare notes I. did Corfu CIT noxos Santorini and the. fifth one I'm leaving to the end I asked. the captain take us at the time I was. traveling with a buddy of mine after. school this is is 1990 I said take us to. an island that's completely void of.

tourists and so he dropped us off on an. island volcanic island called fig. gandras and we spent I think maybe two. days there not a single tourist just. hanging out with the locals they didn't. speak a word of French or English and it. was just magical wow where where did you. go which is did go to we went to a bunch. of them I can't remember all the names. mikos all right but that that is that's. that's tons of tourists right that was. there was a lot of people there we went. to uh. oh my God I'm not going to remember a.

bunch of weird ones but it was really it. was really fun and it was relaxing but. the most mindblowing thing was seeing. the Parthenon and seeing uh ulses and. walking around there yeah we just came. back from Portugal we did 16 days in. Portugal first time ever uh and it's. elus I'm saying elsis it's elus okay. yeah well uh really enjoyed uh Portugal. with the exception apologies to all of. my Portuguese listeners and fans not a.

very attractive language you don't like. that language I don't like that it do. you hear it coming out of Brazil it. sounds amazing Brazilian Portuguese is. nicer than Portuguese Portuguese oh no I. I'm I'm I'm stealing here some I think. there was a a comedian who said this but. who who said something that like uh. Portuguese is akin to someone having a. Perpetual stroke in the way that you. know F wow right there's kind of a. twisting of the mouth that appears. unnatural uh and I can see that because.

I found it uh it wasn't the most. Pleasant so now I'm going to get hate. mail from Portuguese yeah they're going. to be very mad at you cuz Brazilian. Portuguese is beautiful it's got a it's. got a flow it's got a flow it's a like. there's like a dancing Italian you know. it's a universally loved language French. has spoken in France now I'm going to. upset the next group of people Quebec. French is an affront to human dignity. what yes sir I'm I said it what yes it's. horrifying I can't believe what you're.

saying now listen to this my wife is. able to switch her French depending on. whom she's speaking with so if she's. speaking with someone who speaks. International French she'll speak an a. regular manner not Parisian French but. like an international French I speak an. international French because we're from. Lebanon when she speaks to a quebecer. she turns into a complete quebecer and. often times I say how did you just do. that that sounds so inauthentic she was. well know because if I speak in the. regular French then I it'll come across.

as hottie but that to me is so strange. because that would be like I speak with. an Oxford accent with one person and. then I turn into the southern draw with. the other person depending on who that. doesn't sound that there's a falsity to. that there's a good argument there's a. good AR argument that there's a falsity. to that yeah but there's also a good. argument that like there's like a. cultural agreed upon way of communic. communicating you know like if you. started talking like there for thou like.

you started talking like that today. people would go what are you doing man. right we don't talk like that anymore do. do you think I have an accent in English. you don't have an accent you have um a. very distinct way of talking okay so you. couldn't say oh you're American or. Canadian it's you well you have this. there's that like your your words are. very clear but there's like there's. something going on right yeah it's clear. there's something going on there right.

but that's an a fascinating thing about. a person that's able to speak multiple. languages it's like you're you're. speaking English but you're speaking. English perfectly with like a little bit. of a Twist to it right which is I guess. an accent so I guess the answer is yes. my arguably my only regret as a parent. so far may it be the only one that I. ever experienced has been that we. haven't passed on our linguistic. Heritage we meaning my wife and I to our. children so I speak you know Arabic is. my mother tongue French English and.

Hebrew my wife speaks Armenian and so. between the two of us we've got five. languages and yet our children only. speak French and English and the reason. for that is because if I were to speak. to them in Arabic or Hebrew my mother um. my wife would be locked out and if she. speaks to them in Armenian I would be. locked out and so we ended up just. agreeing on the two the two languages. that we both speak but now both both. both our children are telling us that. they regret because when they see me.

meeting someone who's Arabic and we we. break out the beautiful Arabic at least. my son has been saying you know Daddy. you should only speak to me in in Arabic. but now it feels as if it's a vocabulary. lesson right so I'm telling him here's. how you say he goes no but just speak to. me right but that's easy to do when. you're you know one year old when you're. 11 12 13 it's it feels false to start. speaking to you in Arabic when you don't. speak a word of AR you know yeah but. that's a great way for him to learn yeah.

indeed wouldn't it be yeah of course cuz. he'd have to keep up he'd have to keep. up yeah that's what they say like if you. really want to learn a language really. want to learn it move to a place oh. absolutely I mean one of the things that. I regret the most is that I haven't been. able to return ever to Lebanon because. if I were to go to on a visiting. professorship to say American University. of Beirut for a year they're going to. come back Flawless Arabic speakers and. especially I mean now my daughter is 14. he's 11 so sort of entering that period. where they're pretty much soon not going.

to be able to ever speak it like a. native speaker there's something magical. that happens around puberty where if you. learn a language after that period you. can never speak it without an accent. really yeah it really is and no one. exactly knows what what causes that. mechanism but so for example I learned. English at 11 and that's that was the. Genesis for why I asked you do I have an. accent because I would expect that the. time at which I learned it I snuck in.

just before that period had I learned it. when I was 13 14 15 I could have spoken. it you know perfectly but you would have. detected a much stronger accent that's. interesting yeah that's a strange thing. about human development and and just the. sounds that we all agree upon that equal. the words well there there are tons of. sounds in Arabic let's see if you can do. them you ready first time ever on on The. Joe Rogan expence TR okay so for example. my last name everybody all Americans.

will say sad you just extend the a but. the proper way to say it it's God s s. right it's like Arnold like if Arnold. was gonna say it sort of like exactly or. for example can you say not. there's and they're coming from. different parts from my throat. what those are all the so if I say if I. say the Arabic people are going to laugh. at. this that means you're [ __ ] okay it's.

a. okay that means you're you're an ass. okay you're an idiot say it again in the. second one yeah second. one but see you're saying. it's. okay first time ever are we breaking new. ground oh yeah for sure I've never even. tried to say these words yeah yeah it's. uh you know it's Arabic. earlier I I I I said some uh derogatory.

things about Portuguese and about French. Canadian so let me be fair and say not. Arabic Hebrew which is also you know one. of from my Heritage is a violently ugly. language on the other hand Arabic as. spoken by the Lebanese and I'm not. saying this because I'm Lebanese because. you know Arabic comes in many different. dialects right there's Iraqi Arabic. there is North African Arabic there's. Egyptian Arabic the Lebanese Arabic is. really the the Italian of Arabic.

dialects get ready for some comments and. I'll come in your way isn't it weird how. when uh they have horror movies when. whenever someone's like calling a demon. they always have to do it in an old. language meaning like what it's always. in Latin or something oh right okay. they're always reading from some book. they're not supposed to be reading from. what does it. say and like and then the demons come. like to say the magic old words that. people don't understand there's probably.

some weird you're psychologist you. understand that [ __ ] that's interesting. what's going on there yeah wof you're. putting me on the well it's always right. it's always like a dead language or an. old language because of that there so. because it's an extinct language it's. somehow calling demons it's calling. demons that exist in another world I I. think it's as simple as that what a dumb. concept that the way to call demons is. like by saying a word like making a. noise with your mouth it's the perfect. say candy man in front of the in front.

of the mirror three times scariest movie. of all times as we were talking earlier. about our favorite movie Halloween first. one Jam Lee Curtis till till today I. would probably have a heart see what. scares me about horror movies is not the. supernatural stuff it's the being. startled you see what I mean where he he. comes and and you right so often times. when I'm watching a horror movie I will. block my ears because it's that sudden. sound that really scares me I think if I.

had to pick a alltime scariest. movie I think I would say the first. alien love that movie the first alien. movie that is a scary movie it's very. different than all the other Alien. movies cuz in all the other Alien movies. the aliens are kind of out in the open. and and you shoot a bunch of them. they're coming from all over the place. it's way unrealistic by the way way we. can get into that have you seen the. documentary of the making of alien I. have is that amazing it's amazing yeah.

that uh HR how do you say his name guer. HR G the artist that designed it oh my. God unb what a unique Vision unreal like. the the Str his art was so strange and. that creature that he created was. [ __ ] amazing it was literally like. the ultimate. terrifying alien predator and a a. feminist empowerment cuz the alien is a. female oh the big one the mother one but.

this movie is so [ __ ] good it's so. good and it's so scary it's a great. sci-fi movie but it's also [ __ ] scary. like like you're talking about being. startled like and that that alien in. this movie is Elusive and intelligent. and traps people yeah and and and you. you get to see it in brief. glances and then in the new movies after. that like they like alien. it's kind of a different things going on. cuz you can kill them easy just blasting.

a bunch of them and then the mother's at. you but you got a robot body so you're. all good like so much Ridiculousness. that it just hurts my feelings have you. ever have you ever seen 1980 Brian the. Palma's dress to kill which is kind of a. precursor to all the transgender stuff. that we hear today have you seen that. movie no oh it's fantastic Michael Kane. Angie. Dickinson look you you're amazing Jamie. comes out you're a wizard you have to.

see this movie Joe is she supposedly. transgender in this no so what happens. is can I give away some stuff or yeah. it's a spoiler for the 20s 43 years old. you got. it well but if somebody wants to see it. so she is sexually frustrated with her. in her marriage so she goes to see a. psychiatrist played by Michael Kain who. as she's telling him her sto her sexual. stories is becoming aroused but he turns. out to be a guy who wants to become a. transexual him the psychiatrist and so.

he doesn't like the idea of being. aroused as a male because it is then you. know attacking his desire to to make the. transition into being a female and so. Dressed to Kill the movie is him. dressing up as a there you go that's. Michael Kane oh my God it's phenomenal I. saw it as a 15-year-old I think that was. my first exposure to you know. transsexual operations and so on oh my. God yeah oh wow yeah yeah yeah this is.

this is an amazing movie I highly highly. recommend it 1980 1980 15 years old wow. this was the Year by the way that year. when my not this is a weird segue but. when my parents were freed in Lebanon. after having been kidnapped by fat in. 1980 wow yeah yeah yeah so I remember I. was 15 years old another thing that. happened to me when I was 15 years old I. broke my nose in soccer and then had to. have it reset by the the surgeon and so.

for about a week I wore a face. cast did you get it fixed where you can. breathe out of both nostrils I think I. can yeah uh but yeah it was uh that is. so important if anybody out here is. listening and you have a deviated septum. get that fixed if you can if you're it's. safe to do because it's like the the the. benefits of being able to breathe out of. your. nose oh speaking of Athletics I remember. many years ago I had come on the show.

where I was singing The Glory of yeah. Leonel Messi and you were like who who's. Lono Messi and then you mentioned some. MMA fighter that I'd never heard of and. I remember your exact response you said. you looked at me and said how dare you. sir uh let me flip it back to you how. dare you so are you now you are a Messi. fan finally you've come around to the to. the truth well he's amazing soccer. player I mean oh that goal. there's no denying okay well let me.

since I'm on the number one show in the. world a wizard didn't they offer him. like some [ __ ] insane amount of money. and he just said no Saudi Arabia how. much they offer a different guy just got. offered a billion dollars for one year. yeah mbapp mbae mbappe what a billion. for a year 330 of that is so that he can. transfer to the team and then 771 is for. his services to play soccer for a year. they're buying everybody the Saud LeBron. Jesus LeBron said if offer them each. [ __ ] take off and they have so much. money but let me tell you something.

LeBron will become Saudi Arabian king He. he'll be he'll be the king of basketball. over there that's right what that is so. crazy yep yep the December 18th 2022. World Cup final you talk about the the. power the emotional power of sports. right my family and I were sitting and. watching the World Cup final and we had. the the extent to which we were. emotionally vested Ed in Messi winning. the World Cup can only be can only.

demonstrate the beauty of sports right. because here's a guy that right we've. never met him we we're not Argentinian. right he doesn't know that we're alive. and yet it's life and death for us that. he should I mean it was so harrowing I. don't know if you watched the game that. at one point my son who's 11 years old. said I I can't watch this anymore I'm. going to have a heart attack uh that's. the the power of sports that it can pull. us in and it can make us truly Tri and. on my case before you before you.

interject it was kind of driven my. desire for him to win was driven by a. really a purity strand it was that it. seemed cosmically unjust for the. greatest socer player of all time to not. have won the World Cup so when he won it. to me it seemed like the world is Right. Beauty has. won I get it look at this that's awesome. and I I should add what a guy right. humble sweet family man what's.

fascinating to me is as happy as they. are the people in the other team that. were rooting for the other team they're. devastated right now yeah that's that's. the weird thing about sports you can get. so attached to what's happening that a. loss is like really a loss yeah can't. believe we [ __ ] lost to Kansas. City well in in in my first book ever. 2007 evolutionary basic consumption I. talk about studies not my studies I was. citing other works that looked at what.

happens to the testosterone levels of. fans as a function of whether their team. wins or loses of course how do you test. that well well it's been tested uh you. just take salivary assays of fans as. their team is winning or losing you can. get the testosterone levels from that. yeah yeah yeah that's interesting yeah. and so now what it's not surprising as. you would know as a as a fighter that if. you and I fight and you defeat me your. testosterone level goes up my. testosterone level goes down like a. video game like a video game uh except.

What's Happening Here is that there is a. vicarious endocrinological response the. fans are having the same increases in. their testosterone levels or decreases. as a function of their team winning or. not that's quite extraord and that shows. you why it we become so bonded to our. favorite players and so on we are really. going through this battle with them yeah. that's it's really the case with. Fighters when people have a fight that. they're really a giant fan of and that. person gets beaten in a devastating.

manner it's heartbreaking there's even. Studies by the way that have looked at. what happens to sexual behavior of fans. after their team wins or loses so if if. let's say you if your wife is upset that. you're not you haven't been producing in. the bedroom she should pray that the. husband's favorite team wins because if. he wins he has an in increase in. testosterone level increases their.

libidinal drive and so we're animals. it's just it's just attaching so much of. your own emotions to something. completely out of your control just. rooting on it exactly but do do you have. a a fan in any sport where you've ever. been that vested in well there was one. time I remember when I was a kid um I. was a giant fan of Donald Curry Donald. Curry was the welterweight boxing. champion at the time and he uh had a.

rivalry with his other guy Milt McCory. and uh Donald Curry knocked him out he. became like my favorite boxer and then. Donald Curry he got beat by this guy. Lloyd Hunan it was a devastating loss. like people couldn't believe Lloyd Hunan. beat Donald Curry and it was like Donald. Curry might be on the Downs slide but I. was still like a giant fan of his and. then Donald Curry fought Mike mallum and. Mike mallum hit him with a left hook to. the body and a left hook to the chin and. put him out like out cold and I couldn't.

believe it and I I ran here it is right. here I ran out of the house watch this. boom so the the the one with the black. shorts is your guy right the guy down. it's my guy. okay so I. I I misremembered it it wasn't a left. hook to the body it was like he goes. with a right hand and and then a left. hook behind it but he just he koed koed.

Donald Curry and I couldn't believe it. and so I put up my running shoes I. couldn't stay home I I just couldn't. deal with it I couldn't deal with it and. I went running in the snow and I ran man. no when was in the. snow I'm thinking of another story there. was another time when someone lost I. went running in the snow I don't think. it was in the snow I think it was warm I. what I don't remember but I remember I. went running and as I'm running and I'm. running down the road I'm thinking to. myself I am never going to be this. invested in someone else winning or. losing ever again I was so devastated.

that he lost well what was the bond what. what why why technique his technique was. perfect he was crisp like he was coiled. they called him his his what was his. nickname something. Cobra Here Comes. Jamie I forget what his nickname. was but his his technique was so crisp. Lone Star Cobra Lone Star Cobra there. you go he was out of Fort.

Worth and his technique was so sharp I. just really I always admired guys who. were able to find like the shortest path. to connecting with a shot where it's. just like the technique is so dialed in. yeah you there's guys that like dvon. Davis is like that their technique so. dialed in that when you watch them. uncork it's like oh my God the. efficiency of it the way and so I was. just just a giant fan of the guy I just. loved as a person who like really.

enjoyed technique I like watching. someone who's exceptional at it I. recently put I I don't maybe a few. months ago I put out a a sort of a. hypothetical what if scenario where I I. think this was on Twitter where I asked. you know people who follow me would I be. able to step on an NFL. field and under any circumstance simply. get a single yard. as a running back right so in other. words right right so now for example if.

I go into a boxing ring with someone the. only way I'm going to survive is if I. keep running around long enough cuz the. singular time that they hit me I'm. unlikely to be able to withstand that. right so that's I'm gone right if I play. basketball I think I have enough skills. that I can receive the ball and pass it. off to someone right and so then I. started thinking what about other sports. could the average person who doesn't. play that sport survive long enough to.

do something I'm obviously not going to. get 100 yards but a single yard what are. your thoughts I I thought maybe I was. being presumptuous maybe now I'm I'm an. old guy but I thought that it could be. possible for the front line to make. enough of a hole for me to run through. for one yard and I would just draw I. just need to get a single yard yeah it's. possible and but a lot of people thought. there is no chance that that would. happen because they would catch you in. the in the back field they would tackle. you and then you would die mhm well they. probably could do that too that could. happen as well but if the defense is so.

strong that they can just create a small. enough opening for you to go one yard I. think that's reasonable yeah you it. would suck for you though dude they're. going a pile on top of you you're never. going to be the same especially since. I've lost so much weight at least before. I looked like a linebacker a fat. linebacker yeah that was you don't want. that happening to you just happened. there watch watch watch again watch this. guy this is the running back trying to. get the ball to get one yard watch this. bam his helmet's off and he's hurt oh my.

goodness oh my God he got attacked. that's one of five guys that are going. to try to stop you from doing that. attack old these guys are so powerful So. Jamie is in the camp of I'm not getting. a single yard there's a lot of there's a. lot of other variables but it is. possible that the defense could have. prevented that if the defense is. extraordinary and the guys are on point. and there's there's you know games. things happen right people are trying to. control things and people are charging. forward it's possible that there's an. opening just big enough for anyone to.

get three yards right or one yard rather. three feet do you think you could step. on a soccer field and look anything. short of a complete [ __ ] no no possible. now I actually saw you recently and I. was really delighted to hear that where. you were singing the Praises of how fit. soccer players are oh my God we went to. see the the games here in Austin and. when you watch professionals first of. all here's one reason why why soccer's. problematic for television they don't. get breaks yeah so there's no breaks.

like you know we'll be right back with. another word from nisco you know there's. none of that so if you have commercials. like you have to interrupt the play of. the game and then people have to catch. up and then it's not is it not live now. or you going to like have half of a. commercial and half of the game like. what are you going to do how are you. going to do that because they don't stop. they just keep going and you have to be. insanely fit those guys look like. thoroughbreds like they're lit were just. [ __ ] shredded so there was a study a. few years ago I can't cite what it was.

that looked at who were the fittest. athletes number one was soccer it has to. be you know what number two was no. squash players why I I'm guessing. because there are a lot of those very. very quick accelerations that you have. to engage in to be able to get the the. ball is very dead right and so you. really have to have this incredible. quickness to be able so I what a weird. thing for an elite athlete to choose uh. Jamie can we check the ranks I could.

describe. squash you know I tried to play it I got. very claustrophobic really I'm being. serious cuz let me see what it looks. like well okay show me a squash game. it's like a in it's like a racket ball. right no but with a with a ball that's. more dead racket ball the ball has a lot. more give um it bounces more I was just. trying to look I found other sports that. sound like they would be more but I. didn't find it on a scientific study my. my wife has been trying to get me into. pickle ball what are what are our.

thoughts about. that uh I hear people like it have have. I just lost a few points no come on man. people like pickle. ball well apparently there's a whole. craze of pickle ball now because it's. not quite as difficult as tennis you. don't have to cover as much ground it's. still a racket game it looks like a lot. of damage to the knees son that's what. I'm looking at right there in terms of. squash we're talking you're running. around yeah yeah yeah a lot of explosive. movements for old guys like us yeah yeah. yeah best stick to.

yoga your pickle ball you can play with. a beer in your hand so yeah pickle ball. pickle ball is the way to go son but by. the way and I'm not going to say call it. pingpong table tennis oh my God insane I. I watch a lot of it when I was when I. was a graduate student uh there was a. fellow student who we were roughly the. same level so we could have these wrong. long rallies we play for 2 three hours. we'd be drenched oh it's very very very. athletic it's also amazing to watch like. their reads like knowing where the.

ball's coming and to be able to get to. the side of the table and the walk it. over there and then it step sideways and. dudes are hitting them behind their. backs like it's wild it's wild beautiful. those exchanges are so fast yeah yeah. yeah it's a and you're just this little. ball just tracking this little ball. whacking it with your thing and now I. just now that you said that you went to. a soccer match here that's because. Austin has a team right oh yeah they. have a it's the only real professional. team in so are you willing on your show. to commit to inviting Dr gsad to a game.

when inter Miami comes over because God. should see Messi in in person I would be. happy to do that if I am going to be. here while that is happening so I have a. lot of commitments you know I don't. necessarily know that I'll I don't know. when that is you know but would you. would you want to go but if yes yes yes. yes if I was free I 100% want to go with. you I really enjoyed it yeah I really. enjoyed it that's amazing you just made.

my day you made me happy Matthew MCC. who's the coolest such a good guy he's. one of the owners too so so he's there. of Austin yeah oh is that right yeah. yeah yeah I don't I'm not miss saying. that right I don't think so but yet they. just actually played here right before. Messi joined the team I don't want to. like misstate his position he he's. something I think he's one of the owners. I don't pay I unfortunately don't pay. attention to that but I do pay attention. to him he's a super cool guy yeah and he. you know was with us explaining it to us. like he had he loves it he [ __ ] loves.

it you know who else is surprisingly. into soccer do you know the Canadian. actor Ryan Reynolds oh no [ __ ] have you. heard he is the part owner of re he's. coowner okay can you I knew I knew he. was I just wanted to be sure let's do. Ryan. rexim W X yeah Ryan Reynolds and they. purchased a team right what a wild. baller move I'm going to purchase a. sports team they got. good they got they got good after they.

purchased him speaking Got The Magic. Touch speaking of Blake Lively I. actually have her in the current book. that came out today as a a manifestation. of a truly beautiful woman do we do we. agree on that oh she's gorgeous she's. phenomenal yeah truly beautiful and. exudes that's like a duh yeah depend if. you like that type there's there's like. a level of beauty Beauty and then. everything else is just different. versions of that. yeah that's what I think yeah I think. people are too picky first of all and I. also think that there like a level of.

beauty that's like you hit a level of. like Beauty and it's like everything. else is just different so who for on a. on a man who would be a guy uh that you. would think is kind of the epitome of. gorgeous Jason Mamoa Jason Mamoa is that. right he's perfect he's beautiful he's. tall tall big from an an island he's got. tan skin look he's always smiling it's. like a man's man this is not the sign. ific study but I was just trying to find. where soccer lists on this rank this is. the most overall Fitness rating but this.

is based off of physical demands it has. number one is water polo 25 what 26 oh. oh come. on you know you never wrestled did you. that's yeah the other thing I had had. wrestling Bo okay first of all let me. hit the brakes um martial arts being. number five and then boxing being number. six that is way too General you can't. say martial arts cuz martial arts is. Jiu-Jitsu and it's also like [ __ ]. karate at the mall and then if you go.

down go go down I don't I can't speak to. rugby league but you know I talk to guys. like volkanovski used to play it's. [ __ ] hardcore [ __ ] that's all. believable but why is wrestling keep. going down keep going down why is. wrestling way down below basketball. squash TI but whatever it is shut the. [ __ ] up this a [ __ ] stud shut the. [ __ ] up let me tell you something number. one is wrestling number one is that. right 100% put it at number one GRE.

Roman wrestling you mean whether it's. Greco Roman or whether it's freestyle or. whatever it is folk style whatever. wrestling that is the most physically. demanding sport for sure it's so hard to. do it's so hard and to be at an elite. level like like a like a Daniel Cormier. level. like I'm going to pretend I know who. that is but go ahead two division UFC. world champion oh okay he was also. Olympic wrestler nice there's there's. levels that these guys are at that is.

their [ __ ] Fitness is off the charts. their athleticism is off the charts well. you know my I I think we probably. discussed this before this is not. wrestling but my brother was an Olympic. judoka oh well that's another one man. Judo is. Hardcore I've I've trained a bunch with. Judo guys they're ridiculously strong. because they're throwing bodies around. all the time and that throwing bodies. around when they grab a hold of you it's. a totally different feeling so I'm sure. I've said this story number one what's.

that boxing and wrestling number one. boxing 2 yeah that's that's how it. should be soccer that that's what is. this website this website's a good. website athletic build yes I don't yeah. that's that website if it agrees with my. thinking it's a good website if it. doesn't it's a [ __ ] website okay. what where's soccer there Jimmy this was. number nine on this list yeah wrestling. MMA that's that's accurate that's. accurate because if you look at guys. like uh Kellan Alexander Kellan who is. the scariest [ __ ] wrestler of all.

time like if anybody says like who's the. scariest wrestler of all time it's. Kellin he they used to call him the. experiment CU his his parent or his. parents were like normal size like kind. of tiny like 5'7 and he's a [ __ ]. Panther like a human Panther 6'2 300 lb. and you know what his move is he throws. people around he picks them up and beats. them with the Earth he's the most. terrifying wrestler ever cuz he would. just hoist them up in the air and look. at that picture see that picture I have.

that picture framed in on metal printed. on metal in the gym just to remind me of. what a [ __ ] I am you should always know. that dudes like that have existed and. probably still exist today okay so he. was [ __ ] terrified let's play the the. football game of can I get a yard you go. in with this zero chance not winning how. long can you last I'd have to run away. it would just be as until he catches me. okay I would have to run away and I. probably wouldn't be able to run away. he's faster than me he's big and fast.

the thing about Kellin was he was 300 lb. but he moved like a cat he had crazy. flexibility like ridiculous flexibility. and Mobility he did all these Mobility. drills if you watch his workouts they. were. extraordinary cuz like he's doing a lot. of things like Shield cast with giant. steel plates so he's doing a lot of this. [ __ ] so it's like rotational muscles his. ability to manipulate things in awkward. positions was off the charts it was all.

like heavy kettle bell work wow that guy. was a freak and his Mobility he would. show all these Mobility drills and. different things like look what he's. doing oh my goodness look at this I mean. this is a [ __ ] Olympic gold medalist. wrestler What er is this. 80s I think his last wrestling matches. were around I want to say before 2000. because he did have offers he he had. like one fasi MMA fight it was like a.

fake MMA fight cuz they did a few of. those in ch in Japan they used still. they had a weird sort of symbiosis with. pro wrestling and MMA and so there was. MMA fights in Japan that are allegedly. fixed and they look fixed you watch me. going get the [ __ ] out of here like it's. like you you see like a fake tap you see. like someone giving their arm up or. something there was some of that going. on and so it's seems like he got. involved in one of those where they gave. him a [ __ ] ton of money and they said. come over here it's kind of pro.

wrestling but kind of not we'll say it's. an MMA fight it's one of those deals but. if he did fight MMA everyone would be. [ __ ] everyone wow everyone would be. [ __ ] and if you figured out how to. strike Oh my Jesus you know I I I'm not. sure if i' we've talked about this. before but uh the pre cursor of MMA I. had had that conversation with my. brother the Judo guy because we would go. out to nightclubs and he would he's very. very small guy probably 5 foot three but.

built like a pitbull and he'd he'd kind. of interact with the world as though. he's 6'8 the bouncers and so on and I. once asked him do you think you can take. these guys and he said if I can get them. like if they knock me out before I get. to them then they knock me out but if I. get them and I can bring them down then. they're dead and I think from my very. very limited knowledge of MMA the guys. who us usually win are precisely those. guys who can do exactly what he said. right yeah sort of but kind of everybody.

knows how to defend that now it's just. how well can you defend and how good of. a striker is that wrestler because this. is this gentleman who's uh coming up on. the scene right now his name is Bo. nickel and he's an elite like Blue Chip. wrestler like Elite wrestler like. Olympic caliber wrestler and now he's. competing in MMA and his last fight was. a a first round knockout with his hands. and he showed that he's got sick boxing. skills too which is the most terrifying.

thing when you got a guy who's above and. beyond you in grappling like once he. gets a hold of you you're [ __ ] Ville. there's no way you have [ __ ] one way. tiet the [ __ ] fille he's going to slam. you to the ground he's going to control. you he's going to beat your ass they're. just too good at wrestling right and. then also he can [ __ ] you up standing. that's where it gets really dangerous so. if a guy like Kellan learned how to. stand up that would have been the end. cuz there's certain freaks that like you. just like athletic freaks you're just. like I don't what are you going to do.

with that what are you going to do with. that so in the MMA in the history of the. MMA is there someone that is akin to. Messi in terms of like a Michael Jordan. or a Messi in the MMA there's a few. there's a few that are in that. conversation I think the number one. consensus greatest of all time is Jon. Jones because Jon Jones just went up and. easily won the heavyweight title with. the first round submission easily just. took the guy down strangled him quick. and the way he did it was like so. extraordinary his control of distance. his management of the space like the way. he set it.

up it's it's really tough to argue that. he's not the greatest of all time. undefeated as a light heavyweight had. one defeat that was a disqualification. that's 100% [ __ ] he was on top of. this guy smashing him beating the [ __ ]. out of him but they said that he did 12. to six elbows which are the dumbest. [ __ ]. ever rule in MMA cuz what if it's 1205. what if it's 125 sorry what does that. mean I I don't oh I'm sorry from the. position the clock an elbow straight. down is illegal oh I see doesn't make. any sense you have you have to do it.

sideways how do you do you do it at an. angle but it's literally because the. athletic commissions that were. sanctioning MMA initially they said you. know we've seen those things on ESPN. where people break bricks with their. elbows you can't do that it's too. dangerous so you can't do that on the. ground you can't even do it standing up. I don't believe I think if someone comes. straight at you and Tomahawk elbows you. I believe that's illegal I'm not sure. about that but on the ground it's most. certainly illegal and it's the dumbest. rule it doesn't make any sense a regular.

elbow is just as hard an elbow like this. is just as hard it might be more hard. because you can kind of get more of your. shoulder into it or this might be a more. Awkward move that I mean I don't I'm not. the best at this but I would think that. this is not as good as this this seems. like I'm getting a lot of weight into. that I'm getting the torque off my hips. this I'm kind of coming up and down I. feel like I have more ability to. generate Force going sideways going into. it like that so I don't I think if you.

measured it I bet it would be I bet this. elbow stronger for like the elite. Fighters so it's not a matter of like. whether or not it makes sense it's a. dumb Rule and that's the only he ever. got he got disqualified the only time he. ever lost other than that like he's like. at certain point in times in his career. he was like playing with his food like. he let fights go on too long where he's. like almost disinterested and Eng like. he wanted to try standing up with guys. who are supposedly great strikkers just. decided not to try to take people down. just try to do whatever the [ __ ] he.

wanted to do cuz he's so much better. than everybody he was getting bored and. then when he has like big challenges. like this second Daniel Cormier fight. stopped Cormier with a head kick like. jees he's so [ __ ] good I mean he's. beaten so many people and the way he. beat him he fought Leota Macha and was. one of the most cold blooded finishes in. the history of the sport he has Macha in. a he he grabs him at the the at the cage. presses him against the cage and gets. him in this perfect power Guillotine.

puts him to sleep and then drops him and. walks. away watch this watch this so he grabs a. hold of him they get this exchange and. John catches this he gets him in this. knee to the body and then he catches him. in this standing crank so see how he's. doing that he's compressing macha's head. to his chest completely putting him out. like there's nowhere to go he's 100% out. cold and so look at that it just drops. oh my goodness and walks away cold.

blooded cold blooded that's the goat. that's the greatest of all time and when. he's challenged that's when like I said. the D the second Daniel Cormier fight. there was so much bad blood between them. when he's challenged really challenged. that's when you see how good he really. is right the problem is he's so much. better than almost everybody that ever. has done the sport that he at certain. times just got too distracted partying a. lot [ __ ] awful lot but do you think. there are any personality traits that.

predict people who are likely to be. interested in MMA fighting versus other. sports there's so many personalities. it's really interesting the the. diversity in Personalities in MMA is. really fascinating to me as a person. who's an analyst like there are people. that are very calm and disciplined and. religious like people like the greatest. like khabib norov who's also in the. conversation of who's the greatest of. all he's also in that conversation he. aeran or what is he dagistan dagistan. okay he's he's in the conversation of.

the greatest of all time cuz it's not. even a matter of whether he lost cuz he. never lost he was 29 and0 it's a matter. of did he ever lose a round and he lost. maybe one round in the Conor McGregor. fight because in the Conor McGregor. fight he was uh in one round it looked. like he was kind of taking a round off. to really put the heat on him he was. slowing Conor down and then he just he. was just taking him down and beating the. [ __ ] out of him beating the [ __ ] out of. him yelling at him let's talk now let's. talk cuz he was so much like trash talk. during and you know it was it was a very.

emotionally charged fight and I think he. might have lost one round in that fight. where Conor got the best of him standing. CU Connor's still an elite [ __ ]. but other than that his whole career is. just domination there's one fight that. he had with glaz and tbal that was a. controversial fight it was a close fight. but that's very early in his career when. you look at him against guys like. worldclass competition you know guys. like Edson Barbosa guys like Michael. Johnson like the the domination that he. showed on these guys was just [ __ ].

off the charts he would just take them. down Mount them tie their legs up with. his legs and beat the [ __ ] out of them. and he did it to everybody he did it to. everybody what's your preference in. terms of do you like the showy trash. stalkers or do you I have no preference. I love them all I love it all I love the. guys that talk a lot of [ __ ] and I love. the guys that are like khabib that are. stoic and just get the job done see. because in soccer of course you've had. this perennial discussion about you know.

Messi versus Ronaldo I I don't really. think there is a debate Messi is much. better but I also am I admire his. humility right because if there ever was. someone who should have a chip on his. shoulder should be Messi probably the. most famous person in the world who's. done it all and yet he really walks. around as though he's he's nobody on the. other hand Ronaldo is a big Showboat if. you ask Ronaldo who's the greatest. player ever he'll say it's me me whereas. if you ask Messi he'll list 10 people. and he won't put himself on that list. and so there there is there is a way by.

which he engages in his personal conduct. that I think is really admirable that. you know he truly is a role model right. yeah that's beautiful so so I'm. wondering so from the perspective of. because there's a lot of showboating in. in for Fighters right I'm the greatest. ever and you know I'm going to knock you. out uh I would have thought that you'd. probably be more into the understated. guys no no I'm all into whatever the. [ __ ] you're into like I like that Conor. McGregor wears Diamond en crusted.

watches and drives around a Lamborghini. yacht I [ __ ] love it I know I know. that dude grew up poor that dude was uh. was struggling early in his MMA career. and wasn't even sure if he was going to. continue fighting right you know um I. became a fan of his watching him fight. in the UK I uh watched him fight on on. YouTube and I reached out to him like. 2013 I sent him a message saying I hope. uh one day you come over to the UFC love. to love to see your fights might have.

been earlier than. 2013 but I was like I think he's I knew. he was legit like back then there was. something special he's been on this show. many times no he hasn't been on the show. ever oh no kidding no I definitely have. him on though I love the guy I love that. he's wild I love it I like wild guys I. like Jon Jones and he was wild I think. he did some questionable [ __ ] that's no. doubt some things that he shouldn't have. done do you are are many of your closest. Fighters I have a lot of friends that. are in all walks of life but most of my. friends most of my close friends do.

risky [ __ ] either they they do martial. arts or they do standup comedy or they. do something they do how about. intellectual risk taking yeah well you. do those you do those things for sure. what year was that 2013 yeah so I. tweeted to. him yeah he's he was amazing but I knew. that back then but I'd like I like that. he's a wild fow I like that he's [ __ ]. wearing ridiculous expensive suits and. [ __ ] giant watches and crocodile skin. shoes [ __ ] yeah [ __ ] yeah I like it I.

like when people go hard that's good. good enjoy it enjoy it enjoy the [ __ ]. out of it I like when Floyd Mayweather. does it enjoy it you earned it you. deserve it enjoy it enjoy it did you see. the there's a u I think it's an HBO. documentary coming out of the the. Mexican boxer I can't remember his name. which one um I guess yeah exactly ah. have you have you have you heard that. there is a no I have not heard that I. think it's coming in August and I I seem. to be I mean from the little trailer.

that I saw I think there is quite a bit. of personal demons that he's had to face. in his life and so it seems like a. gripping story apparently he likes to. party oh is that right yeah you mean. with the ladies or with the I was. meaning with uh but I don't know these. are just rumors you know some conrolled. substances he's had some issues yeah uh. public issues oh there you go yeah some. isues with uh yeah rehab drinking drugs. and women holla this might be the most. interventions by Jamie on any show that.

I've been on N he always does it yeah. Jamie knows how to [ __ ] load him up. he's the all-time greatest uh truth. Checker well he's the goat of podcast. producers for sure he's the messy of. podcast 100% but there's no Ronaldo out. there so he's what am I the messy of or. what is M always be about you why we. keep turning around to you man you know. I said two words this podcast that's not. true at all i' literally if someone does. a Content analysis of our conversation.

so far they wouldn't know that I'm here. I've just sat and smiled at your. beautiful face oh. sweetie that can't be true I can just. look at the the words I'm seeing on my. recording it's like 50/50 in the last. few minutes it is not 5050 how dare you. sir dare you got a little testy there I. got you not at all I'm just having fun. uh so what else up what's going on in. the what's going on I don't know man I'm. more worri what's upsetting you what's.

making you happy what's I'm more worried. than ever about the the cultural. narratives I'm more worried than ever. about like the the [ __ ] divide in. this country yeah it seems so uh. accelerated whether it's climate change. or Ukraine or whatever the subject De. Jour is yeah it's everyone's so. stereotypically on one side or the other. have you lost any personal friendships.

because of ideological issues no not. real friendships okay good maybe. acquaintances okay but that was okay. those are good if you can clean those up. exact yeah you find out who who you. really who's really your friend you know. even people that I like vehemently. disagreed with about certain policies. that were in place during the pandemic. yeah they're still my friends. right we can have disagreements I know. who the core of you is and people think. about things differently we're free to.

think about things differently some. people are free to have a a perspective. that I don't agree with it's like and. you might be able to back it up with. some facts yeah you might be able to or. you might be intolerant to the other. opposition views because some of them. are full [ __ ] maybe that's true too. there's a lot going on but it's very. hard for people to when especially in. times of Crisis like when during the. pandemic you kind of found. out how human beings are very malleable.

and and very quick to pick a narrative. that they support and especially if that. narrative offers a promise yeah of going. back to normal you know and that was. what was weird about that it was like. this is a a. psychological like test study if you. wanted to do a test study of how a. population even a free supposedly free. free thinking free freedom of expression. freedom of speech is literally in the.

the doctrine that we've run the the law. by and to have people willing to throw. that away quickly under something that. was wasn't even it's not we're not. talking about a nuclear war but we're. talking about something that's like. relatively in terms of the amount of. people that die every year it's not good. it's certainly wasn't a good thing to. Happ anybody. 99.7% uh survival rate yeah and yeah I. mean again it's not a good thing right. it's not good to get any kind of cold.

any kind of disease any kind of like. illness it's not good but there's a lot. of [ __ ] that's killing people also and. there's almost no effort to stop that. like there's no no effort to stop the. comorbidities that caused a lot of the. problems that a lot of those people that. didn't survive had there's no effort to. stop that in terms of like what we. understand about health and wellness and. promoting that you you're referring to. obesity larg not just obesity but like. malnutrition vitamin deficiencies like.

so many people are eating but they're. they're malnourished sure there it's a. giant portion of our population that is. not getting the proper nutrients every. day and there's a host of diseases that. come along with that yeah and it's just. not being discussed I mean it's it's. it's not like the epidemic that it. really is it's not being discussed like. the epidemic that it really is do you. think that a lot of the governmental. policies that were instituted stem from. the fog of War during the pandemic and. so it was driven by ignorance or do you. are are you of the view that there is.

kind of a Dr Evil uh you know nefarious. thing behind this whole. thing I am very reluctant to go with the. Dr Evil narrative I think I think. there's certainly people that you would. consider evil that will take advantage. when things happen but if do I think. that like they released the pandemic on. purpose no no there's like pretty clear. evidence that people working in the lab. got sick and that those people spread it. no but let's say the the ad hoc policies.

that they would come up with you could. only be four people on a boat you can do. this you can't do that my my feeling is. I don't have any proof of it it's just. I'm speculating is that a lot of it. really came from the fog of War people. were and I'm not trying to be charitable. but I think that most people were. well-meaning they didn't know what the. hell they're talking about they they. didn't exhibit any epistemic humility. right they they they made it seem as. though they knew what they're talking. about but they were trying their best I. don't think there was kind of this Grand. conspiracy where this is our chance to.

take over the freedoms that people still. uh you know adhere to I would be more. inclined to believe what you're saying. yeah exactly I think I think it's many. factors and I think when we want to look. at like what why people did what they. did we try to look at it one way or but. I think there's many many things going. on and also for sure governments that. are really good at crafting laws that. allow them to gain power and they've. done that with the the the the all the.

the bills that they passed after 911 you. know the Patriot Act Patriot Act 2 the. ndaa all that crazy [ __ ] they whenever. something happens they find new ways to. control and they do it because it's an. opportunity it's an opportunity to pass. laws that people were reluctant to pass. before it happens yeah happens all the. time it's normal Al that's their job. that's what they do what they do is. they're they're in control they're in. power like that's the game that they're.

playing the game that you're playing is. I want to keep my freedom and like we. have to figure out a way to like. establish like real clear rules to how. this game works yeah cuz if you could. just cheat and lie and then delete. things off social media and have a bunch. of bots saying a bunch of [ __ ] to stir. people up and you you're literally. funding this yeah like who's doing that. is how many of that how many of them are. coming from America itself and how many. of them are coming from foreign agents. who are trying to disrupt American. politics and try trying to disrupt.

American narratives I wonder I wonder. like what is the ratio of [ __ ] posting. like people that are like what would you. call it bot posting what was what's the. level of disingenuous non-human non. non-real person posting as relating to. co or anything you anything I think it's. all the social things that are that are. coming up right now. anything you see a lot of these wacky. fake accounts like I wonder how many of. them are they there was an FBI analyst.

that said that somewhere he believed. there somewhere around 80 what did he. say 80% he said 80% 80% of uh Twitter's. users are Bots it could be as high as. 80%. wow what that's crazy what you imagine. Twitter just becomes Bots arguing with. Bots and they finally realize like no. one's on it but uh I has have you felt. that your I mean your experience with. Twitter has radically changed as a. function of the pre and post Elon mus.

coming in or hasn't changed much you. feel more free like you can post things. that are controversial and not worry. about you know having your account. limited yeah because if you were posting. things about like first of all there's. things you couldn't post like you would. not post a story about the hunter Biden. laptop you couldn't even send it to me. in a DM yeah there was certain things I. tried to send people DMS they wouldn't. allow me to send them that's amazing. like this is wild this is weird it's. just confusing it's like why would you.

think this is a good idea well I. remember I I had been contacted by I. don't know if you've had him on the show. do you know who Matt Ridley is Matt. Ridley why do I know that name he's a. he's an evolutionary biologist he was in. the House of Lords in Britain he's been. on my show a few times he wrote a book a. few years ago with a co-author I can't. remember her name where they were. arguing for the lab leak Theory and and. when he had when his people had reached. out to me to come on the show I I very. frankly said look I'm I'm someone who. very much speaks my mind I don't care.

but let's be pragmatic about this if you. come on my show and we spend an hour and. a half chatting it's going to be taken. town this was at the time when YouTube. did not allow that and I've always kind. of struggled with that decision because. I was being pragmatic and saying look. we're just going to waste our time first. of all it's not going to appear they're. going to take it down they're probably. going to put a strike on my channel if. not remove my channel and there is a. real problem with that and so we ended. up never doing the show but just the.

fact that they can get to me someone who. really defines his identity as being. irreverent and I just do whatever I want. yet they still found a way to get me to. modulate my behavior to think about it. therefore they won against me yeah it's. it's self-censorship that people do out. of survival yeah it and it it it always. sat badly with me because you know I. always thought no matter what I'm always. going to speak my mind but here was a. case where I actually felt prey to that. uh what's crazy is the also the goals.

shift the goal post shifts so I think. you could talk about a lab leak Theory. now yeah because it's kind of. established science and there's more. evidence that points to the fact that it. leaked from a lab then there's there's. almost no evidence of natural spill over. there's also evidence of manipulation of. the the virus itself to make it more. more contagious to human beings it's. some real wackiness man yeah it's really. it's crazy how but it took so long for. people to think that that could even be. a possibility like remember when John.

Stewart was on the coar show and coar. kept trying to block him from joking. around about it no I don't I don't saw. that no I didn't see that oh my God you. never se you have to see this it's kind. of amazing because John Stewart bless. his heart he sticks to the bit yeah and. coar like trying to [ __ ] block the joke. he's not he's trying to stop him from. ranting so you can clearly see John. Stewart is in the middle of a bit he's. like literally doing it to the audience. like he's doing a bit like watch watch. this it's it's pretty.

fun I guess this is it this is a a a. delight to have you here my friend oh my. God there's nothing I wanted to do more. than breathe everyone's. air well here's the thing here's the. thing this is what I know about you this. is what I know about you we are we are. truly dear friends and yet this is the. first time I've seen you in the flesh in. 15 months that is that is that is. correct right and I am so really.

happy and I know we're all vaccinated. and I'm not going to get covid but I'm. going to get something I'm I I I'm. honestly these people did not take good. care of themselves during the pandemic. last time well actually the first time. we talked during Co I was still in South. Carolina and that's right you were you. were locked I was locked down down there. and the family Evie and the kids were. the actual crew from that's right that's. how we were doing it we're doing it in a.

little unused little bedroom with cables. through the window and a satellite truck. on our lawn and I mean like the room was. twice the size of this desk I think I'm. not joking Chris can tell you it's. really really tiny but the whole the. point was like just get it done to get. something out there we really wanted to. do the show and when when I interviewed. you for it you were talking about how. little progress we've made in science in. combating pandemics because in 1918 the. advice was wear a mask wash your hands.

that's right and 100 years later 103. years later wear a mask wash your hands. it was so crushing to find that I was. really hoping that like in 1918 they'd. be like drink a tincture of mercury and. Butterfly juice like you I was hoping. it'd be like some bizarre thing and I'm. like we've come a long way baby it's the. exact same how do you feel about the. science now though so I will say. this I I and I honestly mean this I. think we owe a great debt of. gratitude to science science has in many.

ways helped ease uh the suffering of. this pandemic. uh which was more than likely caused by. science uhoh look at go bear and that's. kind of hold on second no no no no no no. no no. no listen it's coffee I wouldn't do that. to I wouldn't do that to.

you what what what do you mean by do you. mean like perhaps there was a chance. that this was created in a lab there's. an investigation a chance well I I I I. my there's evidence I'd love to hear I. there's a novel respiratory Corona virus. overtaking Wuhan China what do we do oh. you know who we could ask the Wuhan. novel respiratory Corona virus lab the. disease is the same name as the. lab that's just that's just a little too.

weird don't you think and then they. asked those scientists they're like how. did this so wait a minute you work at. the Wuhan respiratory Corona virus lab. how did this happen and they're like a. Pangolin kissed the. turtle and you're like no I the name of. your lab if you look at the name look at. the name can I let me see your business. card show me your business C so when is. this look at coar though look at coar. coar keeps open his. mouth in woan oh cuz there's a Corona.

virus Loos in Wuhan how did that happen. maybe a bat flew into the CLA of a. turkey and then it sneezed into my chili. and now we all have Corona like wait. wait a second wait a second what about. this what about this second listen to. this wait a second see all right John oh. my god he has to stand up there's been. an outbreak of chocolatey goodness near.

Hershey Pennsylvania what do you think. happened like oh I don't know maybe a. steam shovel made it with a cocoa bean. or it's the Chocolate Factory maybe. that's it that could be look at John. Stewart but you see how many times Co be. tried to [ __ ] block his bit but so this. happened when this was uh look they have. the covid-19 vaccine link there two. years ago so this is in the heart of. everything and the chaos of it all yeah.

well you know in in Montreal uh you. probably know that we had some of the. most authoritarian stuff on Co we we. late into the pandemic we there was a. curfew that you weren't allowed to walk. your dog in your neighborhood after you. know 8:00 p.m. or 10: p.m. or whatever. it was now people really there was an. out cried so they rescinded it but just. the fact that they did that I mean what. what would be the scientific evidence. that suggests that walking your dog.

outside in the middle of super spreader. event right no but I I genuinely think. though and I it's not I'm not someone. who just gives people a past to be. charitable I genuinely don't think it. was something nefarious I think that it. was just the fog of War people are. acting like idiots thinking like they. know what they're doing and they may I'm. sure there's going to be a thousand. doctrinal dissertations written about. the the failure of public policy without. it necessarily being a whole evil. orchestrated thing that's my sense I.

think I think there's certainly a lot of. that and then there's certainly a lot of. people that um never really had the. power to dictate what people can and. can't do before like Mayors and and. governors they really didn't have the. the ability to shut down businesses. before and I think something there's. something creepy and weird about having. that ability and that people especially. if their income doesn't change at all. yeah they did not seem to have. unscientific things that people froming. M like shutting down outdoor dining that.

didn't make any sense and they did it. and they did it for Optics yeah and the. fact that that that kind of stuff can. happen like it's when you when you get. it it gets real strange when people have. power to do things because some people. are just going to start doing those. things you know there's a there's an. interesting conversation to be had about. what's going on in Canada right now with. um assisted suicide yeah because all you. have to do is go to a doctor I believe.

the doctor recommends it and then one. other doctor has to recommend it so I. don't know the the the the specific me. find out what the specific mechanisms. are um. but you know people that are depressed. are getting this as an. option 2021 the law was changed to. include that those with serious and. chronic physical conditions even if that. condition was non-life-threatening. it's been available for adults uh since. 2016 okay so and since 2016 Canada's.

medical assistance in dying program. known by the acronym maid has been. available for adults with terminal. illness okay and in 2021 the law was. changed to include those with serious. and chronic physical conditions even if. that condition was non-life-threatening. what would constitute that if I have. severe back pain does that fit under. that yeah you could well I think even. depression I think is illness yeah it's. considered an illness right yeah so if. someone could. like instead of discouraging people.

instead of saying you know having a. suicide hotline instead of like having. people that have nowhere to go to. somewhere they can reach out and find. help instead of that you're saying okay. we'll help you kill yourself like that. is that's a weird one man that's a weird. one to get behind because I'm all for. people that have terminal illnesses and. don't want to I mean we do it to our. dogs right if our dog is dying we we. have the dog put down it's it's a a. humane way to take care of something. that you love and care for you don't. want them to I went through that 5 years.

ago was like the worst thing that I've. ever gone through it's horrible it's. devastating is how's your I see some. photos he's good he's doing well he's. the sweetest uh yeah he's the best well. you know in Canada uh there are all. sorts of problems we're facing I don't. know if you heard about the story of the. guy who just committed suicide uh. because he was being bullied by the. diversity inclusion and Equity have you. heard about the story no I didn't hear. about one a 60-year-old man who from. everything that I've heard was an. exemplary. principal uh he had been told that he.

has to take some you know diversity. inclusion Equity stuff and in one of. those meetings I I don't know the exact. details but he had sort of raised some. concerns shouldn't we be judging people. based on you know am meritocratic ethos. and so on because he said that right he. he's actually quite a liberal person. from what I have heard but just the fact. that he questioned the DI cult the. diversity inclusion Equity they started. hounding him harassing him he's a racist. he's got to take a you know remedial.

course his sensitivity he ended up. committing suicide I'm sure Jamie you. can pull it up just recently in the last. week or two Jordan Peterson wrote. something about um cancellation Ro that. that's kin to being diagnosed with like. a terminal illness Yeah Yeah. well yeah I mean or a horrible illness I. forget what he said but you know what. what a what a lot of people have tried. to cancel me now some sometimes people. say oh it's because you're tenur that.

you know you can be courageous because. otherwise you wouldn't be courageous the. reality is I get tons of death threats I. I mean last year I received for the. first time ever a inperson death threat. while walking with my son necessitating. that the uh Montreal police get involved. so there are many ways by which people. can try to get you to modulate what you. say and so on it's a real problem uh. what is the number one thing that people. are upset at you. about probably and I haven't done it in. a while just because I kind of lost.

interest Pro the most violent would be. any criticism of Islam and in this case. it was I think someone who was of that. Faith because he looked like uh he came. from that background and so uh people. will get upset at me for all sorts of. things Valerie Bertinelli got upset at. me once because I tweeted something. about my wife having an uncomfortable. interaction with someone a barista who. was transgender and she got super upset. and two days later 26 million tweets. later all the as Dave Chappelle CM the.

alphabet people were really coming after. me but that doesn't have the timber of. you know we want to kill you when you. start criticizing uh some Islamic stuff. then it can get pretty hairy um and I. think that's one of the things that's. maybe different about say Jordan and and. me I think he he receives a lot more uh. hate than I do but some of the hate that. I receive is really unique in that it's. both Jew related and he actually.

mentioned this recently that you know I. you I'm in a unique unique position in. that I receive a lot of hate that's. related to my being Jewish so cover. being Jewish and then criticizing some. Islamic tenants so for example I've seen. at times when I've come on the show and. we've talked about I remember one time I. talked to you about the hatred of black. dogs as uh sanctioned by Muhammad. himself and then all sorts of people. started saying he's making this stuff up. he's [ __ ] why don't you bring a real. Islamic person on the show you can just.

look it up I mean Jamie can now check it. that there is within Islam a hatred for. uh black dogs so even the most you know. is that a translation issue does does. that mean the color black for sure it's. it's it's black dogs yes specifically. black dogs now I think it comes from the. fact I don't know the exact theological. reason but I think that Muhammad himself. had had a a fear of black dogs and so he. s you know he sanctioned it as a kind of. divine prescription I it's not it.

couldn't possibly mean something else. meaning what you mean the color black. meaning something else um the alleged. Hadith which regards black dogs as evil. has been rejected by the majority of. Islamic scholars has fabricated. nevertheless Islamic scholars have. tended to regard dog saliva as impure. yeah so that Bas that comes by the way. so fabricated just well but pretty much. anything that you say someone will say. oh it's fabricated so in in in Islam.

there's a thing called NES which is like. impure things right so for example the. kufar the non-muslim is himself impure. well urine is impure the dog saliva is. impure so if you were to be licked by a. dog or something then you'd have to redo. your your Purity ritual before you pray. because you've been touched by nees by. something that is impure M so there are. many debates depending on the Hadith as. to whether something is authentic or not. but there is certainly as Jamie just.

pulled out the fact that there is within. certain uh Islamic thought that black. dogs are uniquely bad and so just if I. say that on your show there'll be some. Islamic guy who says you know the Jew is. making the stuff up and so on and so uh. it's now I I've stayed away from it. recently not because uh I'm trying to. shy away from it just because I've said. all that I have to say about the matter. and I've moved on uh but the hatred. comes from all forms I can criticize.

feminism I'll get women's group. attacking me if I attack something about. transgender issues I'll get criticized. and so the the hate is. endless that's a horrible thing to. experience it's a horrible thing to. experience especially from a guy like. you that literally fled it yeah yeah. well I mean and and when I would F I. think in our earlier chats many years. ago we've talked about you know Islamic.

immigration and so on and I I hold zero. hatred I think you know me enough to. know that I mean I have tons of uh. Muslim friends I probably know more. Muslim guys than most people will ever. meet I never criticize individuals I. criticize ideologies right so you know. does Islam codify the right of people to. criticize Islam or not if you're an. Islamic country well the answer to that. is very clear and the answer is not one. that promotes freedom of speech me. saying that doesn't imply that I'm being.

hateful towards Muslims I'm just. literally talking about the the Islamic. doctrines just like there are doctrines. in theonomy that we can you and I can. decide to criticize right and I think. most Muslims even some of whom are. students in my class who've heard me. talk about these things not in a. classroom setting but in public are very. fair and they'll say you know you're. very fair guy you never but other ones. will send me emails and stuff that are. just brutal that are really really and I.

I have to say I'm someone who's if I can. speak of myself quite courageous but. that in-person uh threat that I received. when I was walking with my son was. really truly harrowing because I could. never rise to that threat right because. the way that guy was speaking to me he. always had more you know I had more to. lose than him and so there was never. going to be a situ situation where if he. decided to act on his hatred I could. have ever lived up to that challenge and. so for several weeks I was really being.

careful going around you know trying to. avoid that street and it doesn't make. sense that in the 21st century uh a. professor in Canada should have to worry. about you know which street he walks on. because some idiot is threatening him in. front of his 10-year-old son it's. incredible yeah is is very terrifying. when you think about rigid things that. are in um certain religious do. um what do you think the roots of some. like the Forbidden foods do you think. the The Roots were initially that those.

Foods got people sick there was. pandemics attached to them oh I what a. great question thank you in in the. consuming Instinct one of my earlier. books 2011 I have a whole analysis of. certain kosher laws from an evolutionary. biological perspective and it's exactly. what you just intimated so pork so pork. right so the idea so so imagine. uh ancient Jews walking around in an. environment where there's no. Refrigeration where the the shellfish.

that might be uh tainted with a. particular uh pathogen or not you can't. smell it you can't see it all that you. know is that some people ingested and. Dro dead and others don't there is no. mechanism by which I can learn the. statistical regularities between A and B. therefore the only possible conclusion. that I can come to is that it's a Divine. prohibition there must be some Divine. reason so even that theological.

prescription I can analyze it from an. evolutionary perspective now when I did. that let's say for kosher laws I didn't. get rabbis writing to me saying how dare. you we're going to kill you for arguing. that it's not Divine if I do the exact. same thing with some Islamic Doctrine. you know very respectfully very properly. most Muslims will hear it and say yeah. fair enough Professor s but a few will. say how dare you you should be killed. and that makes no sense in a free. Society no it doesn't and it doesn't.

mean that the root of any of these. religious doctrines weren't from God. himself like it does like who knows who. knows what the root of the stuff is but. the root of most of. them for sure has gone through people. and the conversations have gone through. people like like real clear in the Bible. especially in the New Testament we we. know the people that but the the origins. of it is what's the most fascinating to.

me yeah it's like where did it start. from like what were the when the first. guy wrote it down like especially when. you're talking about ancient. Christianity or or what whatever it was. before it was even called Christianity. you know um when I was in uh Greece I. was with uh Brian M rescu and he wrote. this book about the ucini Mysteries. called um the immortality key it's an. amazing book and in this book it all. details these these rituals that they.

used to do in you know thousands of. years ago where they were drinking wine. that were laced with psychedelics and. coming up with democracy and like the. the the the RO when you're in those kind. of environments when you're in a place. that like used to be this like amazing. utopian society or at least. transformative society that never. existed before and then you're walking. around the ruins like I wonder if they. saw it coming I wonder if they saw the. end coming yeah cuz are we seeing the.

end coming cuz it doesn't seem I hope. not I hope not know I mean do you know I. mean when you see like and you realize. they built they built the Parthenon when. you're there looking at that thing. you're like yeah it's amazing what did. you do yeah how did you do this how did. you do this 2,000 plus years ago and. it's all designed with the golden ratio. in mind and yeah it's wild craftsmanship. I actually talk about in in in my. current happiness book I talk about. different correlates with happiness how.

how does personality correlate with. happiness how does culture correlate. with happiness marriage and so on one of. the sections I talk about religiosity. and happiness are religious people on. average happier and the answer turns out. that there is a moderate positive. correlation between. religiosity and happiness now that makes. perfect sense in that religion provides. me with structure it provides me with. greater communality it creates a nice.

demarcation between ingroup and outgroup. therefore people in my ingroup I can. cooperate with I have greater coh so. there are very functional Earthly. reasons for why if I am religious it's. going to lead to Greater happiness but. what I try to also argue in the book is. that that shouldn't cause people who are. not religious to despair that they're. not going to be as happy because and I'm. not sure what your religious views are. but you know I'm I'm very much rooted in. my Jewish identity but in a cultural. sense I'm not very much of a Believer.

but I am very much someone who sees the. Divine in things right uh my having a. friendship with you being able to text. you to for me to come on this show is a. Divine thing my being able to bond with. my Belgian Shepherds in the way in this. Pure Love is a Divine thing meeting a. random stranger with whom I have this. fantastic conversation for 30 minutes is. a manifestation of the Divine so I think. we can be quite spiritual in our. day-to-day without necessarily couching.

it in some Supernatural you know. religious narrative what are your. thoughts I I would agree with that but I. would also say that for a lot of people. those religious narratives um are like a. scaffolding yeah for which they can. establish a better life yeah and I meet. a lot of people that are devoutly. religious particularly devoutly. Christian or devoutly Muslim that are. very disciplined and live their life. because of this like extreme belief live. their life in a very dis and often very. successful way and I think there's a.

peace that they have in in a true belief. there's a peace that you have that. there's a a God that's got a a plan for. this whole thing and just worship that. God and do the right thing and you're. going to be okay but do you I mean so. for again from a purist. perspective I think it's less impressive. for me to do the right thing because. otherwise there is a big guy who is who. is judging me than to do the right thing.

for no other reason than it being the. right thing to do I think the latter is. a lot more impressive right do you agree. sure but the big guy is a part of you. and you're judging you so you're not. just doing something so that he doesn't. judge you you're doing something so that. you don't judge you fair enough so it's. you are also God cuz you are also. watching you do this thing well I've. evolved a moral compass to use an. evolution thing for social species it. makes perfect sense for us to for us to.

have evolved a distinction between right. and wrong if you wrong me there's going. to be retribution so we evolve that. emotion so I often get frustrated when. religious people say sure Evolution. explains a lot of things but it can't. explain morality that's simply not true. there's a lot of very clear evolutionary. reasons for why a social species would. have evolved a moral compass that makes. sense yeah that it's not something that. exists outside of the purview of of. Science and I think I mean there are.

several people I think that have been on. the show that have you know Michael. shurmer uh Sam Harris that have written. about the fact that you know the the mor. the moral compass can is totally within. the purview of science it it it. completely makes sense there's a moral. compass and it also makes sense you're. talking about these Divine moments I. think I think it's all these things and. then some I think it's all these things. and then some I think to. just sort.

of rationalize it down to survival. instincts and and you know sort of. having that dismissive reductionist view. of what it means to be a person and have. these experiences in life and what life. is in I think we're trying to label. something that is almost impossible to. believe is true that I'm saying sounds. with my mouth and you know what I'm. thinking we're like sharing a context. and a language and we we have all these. words that are connected to very.

specific things that we're very aware of. Meanwhile we're hurling through Infinity. on an organic spaceship that's spinning. a thousand miles an hour in a shooting. gallery of asteroids comets and this is. all these things are true and we're. finite life forms that are constantly. innovating and and trying to escape the. boundaries of our eventual demise phys. physically psychologically we're trying. to connect each other on the internet. and put chips in our brains and it's. wild what's happening and in the middle.

of all this there's a battle a true. battle in 2023 over censorship a real. battle like the likes of which I've. never seen because as a kid growing up. there was no arguments against freedom. of speech in America right I do not. remember ever seeing someone argue. against freedom speech it certainly. wouldn't have been someone on the left. yeah so go sorry no I'm saying just that. that alone is it's a terrifying thing.

it's like people are literally crafting. the shackles that are going to. eventually contain them and they're. they're doing so greedily and and. enthusiastically so can I offer a. philosophical explanation for why I. think that's happening sure uh some of. your viewers may have heard me mention. this elsewhere but it's worth repeating. so in in my last book in the parastic. mind I talk about two ethical systems. deontological ethics and. consequentialist ethics theological.

ethics is an absolute statement for. example if I say it is never okay to lie. that is a de logical statement if I say. it is okay to lie to spare someone's. feelings so the the example that I often. give is if your spouse asks you do I. look fat in those genes then put on your. consequentialist hat really quickly and. then right so for most things most most. of us are going to be consequentialist. but when it comes to certain fundamental. principles that Define say Western. values those have to be deontological.

yeah right and so as to your point until. very recently we all agreed that. presumption of innocence was a. deontological statement that that can't. have a butt Associated you can't say I. believe in presumption of innocence but. not for Brett Kavanaugh I believe in. Freedom of speech but not for Donald. Trump and so we one of the reasons why. I've gotten into a beef with someone. that we both know well is because that.

person has repeatedly violated what he. should know better which is that. deontological principles by definition. should never have the butt qualifier but. now it has become perfectly okay when it. when talking about freedom of speech to. tackle it from a consequentialist. perspective don't criticize Islam. because that means you're hurting people. people's feelings therefore shut your. mouth right no you can criticize Islam. you can criticize Judaism you can. criticize Evolution you could do. whatever there is no but right and I.

think if we can ever return to. understanding the distinction between. deontological and consequentialist I. think we'll be back on the right. track what do you think got us on the. wrong track in the first place so I. think it's the distinction between. reason and feelings we we we're both a. reasoning animal and a thinking animal. but there's been now too much emphasis. placed on feelings feelings right so if. I tell a truth that is hurtful to.

someone then I should not tell the truth. so I've often when I went in front of. the Canadian Senate as the Jordan I for. Bill c16 the the transgender Bill. neither of us was arguing that. transgender people shouldn't live with. full dignity and so on but what we were. arguing is that in the pursuit of that. Noble goal you don't murder truth right. right so if I were to say it's insane. for. 6'4 biological males to walk into female.

spaces that makes no sense I'm not. erasing transgender people right but if. the optimization metric is make sure to. not hurt people's feelings you start. conflating these things yeah does that. make sense yeah is. also there's no way to stop someone. from like if someone is a legitimate. pervert and all they have to do is say. they're a woman and now they can go to. the woman's bathroom there's no way to.

stop that I'm not saying that that's the. majority of people I'm not I'm saying. there are human beings that are like. that and this does not in any way. discount trans people this just says. there's people that will game the system. and there's no safeguards in place so if. you want to protect people from that I. don't don't know how you would do it. other than having some sort of security. in each women's bathroom to make sure. that no one's creeping on people which.

is outside impossible you cannot have. that well and I mean think about again. deontological principles until 3 minutes. ago 117 billion people had existed that. that's roughly the estimate of how many. people have ever existed who fully. understood that there were two. phenotypes in the human species called. male and female and nobody dis agreed as. to what that was but suddenly now it is. really controversial to argue that and. that's why I do some of the satire and.

sarcasm on social media it's not to be. mean or flippant it's because the only. way you can handle some of the lunacy. we're saying is through derision through. mockery because it's insane I mean we we. are the product of 117 billion people. who exactly knew how coupling works but. now we could no longer say it we when we. refer to Leah Thomas the 6' four swimmer. we can't say that that's a male because. that's a female because she said so it's. insane it is insane and it's it's wild.

to watch it's wild to watch young people. just adopt it. wholesale because um if you're a female. athlete it's not good well it's not good. it's unfair and I mean that's the exact. idea right because people talk about. it's unfair to this transgender athlete. what about the unfairness to all of the. biological females who are being screwed. by this right yeah there was a woman who. came on trigonometry recently and she. had a very detailed uh depiction of all.

the different advantages that with even. with a reduction of testosterone that. the the male frame. has particularly in developing power. power related things the shape of the. hips the the the the angle from the hips. down to the knees Joe I've had. conversations with Physicians not that. you need a physician to confirm that. there's male or female. but how could you be a medical doctor. and actually espouse some of the. nonsense such as there are no sex. differences between men and women I've.

had. anesthesiologists I've had gynecologists. who argued that transgender medicine. recognizes that the Antiquated binary is. no longer valid that's insane how could. you be a gynecologist and practice. Gynecology not knowing that maybe you're. on ketamine just [ __ ] I don't know I. don't know how things got this Bonkers. but I think that if you have a group. where you can't question anything about. it you're you're going to have problems.

because then you have a protected group. and crazy people can join that group and. that that is a real Factor we've seen it. it's a thing you see it with uh these. cases where these males with fully. intact penises are wandering around. women's locker rooms and women are. freaking out and they're like no I'm a. woman and like what can you say if you. there's this thing that Matt Walsh did. an interview with this guy he's a. politician let me let me find this. because it's so crazy so this guy who is.

a uh a biological male here I'll send. you this Jamie I'll send you this uh. this story behind it but there's a video. of him talking to Matt Walsh and on the. documentary no it's on a documentary. here so this guy we we'll pull up the. story so he is a biological male who has. come out as a uh a woman of color who's. a lesbian and he does it with a fuling. it facetiously I've seen that he's doing.

it with a full straight face and the the. way when you hear them talk it's yes. it's amazing because it's. Checkmate and they're saying if this was. true we would be clapping an applauding. him but we don't think it's true yeah. but this this like throws the whole. thing find um the actual uh interview if. you could online because it's amazing. the way this guy does this guy deserves.

he he should be in the next Tarantino. movie he's an amazing actor yeah but the. way he lays it down is so perfect and he. does it fully straight-faced and now. they're saying if this was true we would. be appla applauding him but he's it's. not. true and but that's the problem with the. whole thing so you think in deep. recesses of all those folks's Minds Who. come out as in support of men who have. penises are women do you think in the. Deep they know that it's [ __ ] or.

have they been so parasitized that they. actually believe their nonsense I think. a lot of them believe it and I think a. lot of them that belief is confirmed by. their social groups or who also not just. believe it but enforce belief in it. there's a social pressure to enforce. belief in it and I've seen it I've seen. it in action I've seen women have. arguments with people that are you know. uh protr rights and you know and these. women are arguing that there's there.

there's protr rights and then there's. erasing women's rights including like. the athletic argument including the the. the female spaces like intimate spaces. locker rooms. bathrooms it's it's a very controversial. subject in this strange culture we live. in and it's one thing that people can. subscribe to one side or the other and. find a group willingly vly opposed to. their position so they engage in. instantaneous conflict so they're. involved in this psychic war with uh. competing ideologies and it gives them.

meaning and that's a real problem with. human beings that we do attach ourselves. to things even if those things don't. involve you or your life you decide like. this is the movement that I'm going to. get behind stand behind and I'm going to. tell you and it gives you meaning yeah. like you're you're a social justice. Warrior for the rights of the. disenfranchised you know and there's. something to be said for actually doing. that of course something to be said for. actually standing up for people who. don't have a voice and doing the right. thing there is something to be said for. that but there's also something to be. said. for to be able to look at this from both.

sides and if you're an 11-year-old girl. and there's some guy's dick in your face. in the girl's bathroom like what this. guy's walking around naked in the locker. room and you're a kid like is that okay. yeah I mean how do you know what's. happening here like what're would you. know are you sure yeah like and some. cases when someone's like so feminine. and so so like seems like a woman you we. would have any problem with it right.

well I mean there is a normal. distribution for example when it comes. to you know women who are very masculine. men who are very feminine we've always. recognized that but we've never taken. the step into the abyss of infinite luny. where we say sometimes women can have. penises I mean that's I mean and that's. why I wrote the parasitic mind the last. book right because I am I was really. literally arguing that human Minds can. be parasitized by ideological worms in.

the way that you can be parasitized by. actual brain worms right because there. is no rational mechanism by which you. can take a sexually reproducing species. involving two phenotypes there aren't. any more than two there's male and. there's female nothing else and then. argue that that's simply not true it's. Antiquated to argue that boys have. penises and women girls have vagina I. actually satirically put out a tweet. where I argued for finger fluidity and. finger diversity I argued that if you're.

born con congenitally with nine fingers. or nine toes then we should no longer be. teaching in Biology class that boys and. girls are born with 10 fingers I was. being factious but that's exactly the. logic that they're using right of course. there are some people who are born inter. sex and of course they they they have. the right to live a dignified Life free. of bigotry that doesn't mean though that. we have to go back and rewrite the. anatomy and biology books and I mean and.

that's why I fight all this these. battles online and so on because I truly. am allergic to [ __ ] I am very. deontological when it comes to truth and. I get personally offended when I see. people espousing all that nonsense what. is it that Dennis Prager was just. talking about it was just just there was. some video that came across my uh. Instagram feed there was him saying that. whatever medical. organization is. recommending that children not be.

labeled uh male or female right because. they don't they don't have the ability. to to choose yeah right they can't they. can't tell you how they identify that's. and have you what is let's find out. because it's it's something crazy yeah. yeah I remember reading it going I'm not. ready for this I have [ __ ] to do I. can't or watch now children are being. taught that you know medical. professionals to the best of their. ability take a educated guess as to the.

sex of a child really so until 3 minutes. ago 117 PE billion people knew exactly. how to assort into male and female but. now we no longer abide by those. Antiquated binaries I mean it's insane. so why can't why can't we chew gum and. walk at the same time I could be all I. think both you and I are very socially. liberal I I don't care one way or the. other about what happen What transgender. people do that doesn't mean that I have. to accept the fact that a guy with a.

penis can call themselves a girl and I. have to just say Amen it's yeah it's it. seems crazy to have to agree to. that and it's not that's not discounting. the idea of trans people it's real but. it seems crazy to force everyone to go. along with what was called gender dis. Foria up until very recently exactly and. there was a psychological condition that. they would talk about an issue that. people had well and to the point.

remember earlier we I put up the dress. or Jamie put up the dress to Gill movie. in the past when you wanted to have a. sex change operation the number of steps. that you had to go through before you. were accepted for sex change. reassignment was quite assiduous and it. made perfect sense because it's a really. you know. it's something that you can't undo and. so it made perfect sense that you'd have. to go through and now a 5-year-old can. say that they are of and you you're not.

allowed to question it it's really it's. just it's insane and you can put them on. hormone blockers and you can put them on. hor exactly and there's so many problems. how they're finding now the people that. are have hormone blockers ch ch Reese. theone uh adopts two kids from Africa. two boys and it turns out statistically. that it's perfectly reasonable that both. of them are now girls have you have you. seen. that I saw some meme I wasn't sure that. it was true uh if that is true that.

seems very unlikely statistically. doesn't it no of course I mean already. what what are what are the odds so I. think it's one in something like 10,000. that you have like full-blown gender. disphoria in the order of that magnitude. so if you have two so it's two. independent events so it's 1 out of. 10,000 Time 1 out of 10,000 that's a. very small number let's steel man this. okay what's what's the most charitable. explanation for.

this that she why she's doing this why. this is the case why this is the case. that she adopts two kids and that. they're they turn out to be girls so I. don't think it's a charitable. explanation but I think it's the correct. one and I talk about it in the last book. so I talk about Munch Housen syndrome by. proxy so Munch Housen syndrome is when I. fake an illness myself to Garner. sympathy and empathy Munch Housen. syndrome by proxy is when I harm someone. under my care to Garner the empathy by. proxy so it could be my child it could.

be my dog it could be my elderly parent. and so I've argued that transgenderism. as by as exhibited by many of these. Progressive is a form of munch Housen. syndrome by proxy look at me the super. Progressive woman who's got two. transgender kids so it's a very very. diabolically narcissistic I I don't. pretend to be psychoanalyzing her but. you ask me for my prediction or opinion. I think that's what it is yeah I was. trying to find uh is there an.

explanation that would make like I would. like to know like what is what is. someone who truly believes that that's. normal what do they think who believes. that what is noral that it's just normal. that those two boys turned out to be. girls it's people who live in lalan. because we know that statistically it's. it's it's just imposs it's like winning. the lottery right but people do win the. lottery right yeah so what what would be. your most charitable explanation that. would be the most charitable it's just.

it just turned out that these two these. two boys but there's there a lot of. evidence that if you like especially. with boys that exhibit that they turn. out to be gay and feminine gay men yeah. which used to be fine yeah and now it's. like you know like Tim Dylan has an. argument about it that a lot of this is. really homophobic yeah exactly you know. yeah I get that argument yeah it's an. interesting argument because the the the. guy the progenitor of of this kind of. stuff is I don't know if you know him.

John money do you know who that is no. John money was a psychologist at John's. Hopkins University who's really the the. the father of social constructivism who. argued basically that you know you could. take any boy and any girl raised them in. the opposite uh you know uh gender role. and then they would be that and the. classic example which you may have heard. of was David Rhymer whose penis was. botched during a circumcision they put a. dress on him said call him whatever.

Linda and then he ended up committing. suicide while the guy who started all. that was John money at John's Hopkins. and so we can really lay the him as the. original culprit because a lot of. Surgeons would go to John money for his. expert advice question about this story. sorry uh I saw this meme around to this. is where it came from right this picture. yeah when I'm looking up the story about. her adopting kids yeah all I'm seeing is. that she had adopted one daughter and.

that in 2019 the other one said that she. was not a boy and that she is a daughter. also and so that they're both daughters. so one of them is a biological girl one. is a real daughter that's why I was. trying to find out the actual I I come. like digging through the stories nothing. actually. says what biological anything at all. well then I really appreciate jilles. you're uh you're careful when you you. know at the start you said I don't know. if that's true or not yeah so that I. turned out it's not true that's one of. the reasons why I think a lot of people.

listen to you because exactly of that. careful thing I I mean you can get upset. at it and you could also there's a lot. of people that I know that will say. their child is LBGTQ because their child. is they call themselves non-binary I've. seen this happen before like people they. wave it like a flag that it's like this. amazing thing that they have a queer. child yeah and the kid is just like no. I'm just non I don't [ __ ] nothing I. don't want to be this whatever or. they're just identifying as it because.

the identity thing is very new and when. you give kids an opportunity to. distinguish them from other people. whether it's there's a lot of things. that people do that with they they they. get into certain things they get into. certain social groups get into certain. like hobbies and sports together but. there was a thing that's that happened. recently in where they did a study in. New Jersey Jersey they found out that. there's a 4,000% increase in kids. calling themselves. non-binary which is like I mean at what.

point in time do we examine whether or. not social pressures are playing part. that's the Lisa is it Lisa Litman or. Lisa Litman she was a researcher at. Brown University who argued for the the. rapid onset of trans uh gender thing as. a social contagion and I don't know if. you remember I I talked about this in my. last book at first Brown University you. know had put out all these you know uh. promotional alerts about you know here's. one of our researchers publishing this. great paper in a top journal and so on.

and then the transgender uh activists. came after her because how dare you be. arguing that it's a social contagion. that it's not a real thing and I I'm not. sure if they pulled the paper maybe. Jamie can tell us but uh uh she really I. had I'd even invited her on my show to. to offer her a platform to you know to. support her and uh she had laid low. because of the blow she was getting well. Abigail shrier has experienced a. tremendous amount of that and she was. one of the first people to talk about it. and when she talked about it on the. podcast I.

was I I wasn't aware that it was that. big of an issue yeah and that there's so. many uh particularly like young autistic. girls that dive into this yeah and that. also there's a certain thing that. happens when they start injecting. testosterone that it gives them this. like feeling of euphoria you know and. that it does a devate some anx because. it has an effect physiological effect on. on and so they think this is what I've. been missing my whole lifea which is. really kind of crazy to think.

that I mean it's it's a weird thing it's. like this either especially when it. comes to like encouraging. surgery as encouraging it for really. young people are we when when did we. stop believing that young people are. impressionable right when did we stop. believing that young people should not. make life-changing choices when they're. really young because they don't know. what the [ __ ] is going on we've always. said that with tattoos we've always said. that with you know body modifications.

but and look at the cognitive. inconsistency when it comes to age. because if if a progressive will say. that a 17-year-old who's 17 years old. 364 days so in one day he's going to be. 18 who lies in weight kills his parents. to to pick up the insurance the. Progressive will argue well you can't. put him in prison for life he's just a. child his brain is still going to. develop until he's 25 so for that issue.

from this side of my mouth I say that. that he's too young but from this side. of my mouth I'll say that a. four-year-old is perfectly capable of. saying I am in the opposite body and. shut up don't question it those two. things can't coexist yeah someone has to. be a horrible monster for people to. agree that this person needs to be tried. as an adult right you know like some boy. stabs his whole family to death like. crazy [ __ ] like that right and which. does happen I think there was a case of. something like that recently where kid. stabbed his mother to death and they.

tried him as an adult I think he stabbed. a girl to death now I'm I'm screwing it. up I think he stabbed a girl that he. went to high school with to death and. left her in the woods that's what it is. I think there been a bunch of those guys. stab their parents I just watched a. documentary on the dating show serial. killer have you seen this guy do you. know this story no. the dating show Jamie I'm sure he going. to pull it out it's a guy who was really. diabolical I mean he was attacking. 8-year-old girls he was attacking 25y.

old what year was this this would be 70s. oh yeah we did talk about this once yeah. then he appeared on a on the famous. dating show where you know a woman is. interviewing three guy that's guy that's. the guy yes I remember that I do. remember that yeah and it's funny. because he won that show. and then the woman decided not to go out. with him because she found him creepy so. she had the right antenna to pick up his.

creepiness whereas other people didn't. and paid so he was a serial killer he. was a but but not just a Serial Killer. Joe because he he did not have a you. know a unique demographic group right. typically serial killers will focus I. only go after boys I only go after this. guy had was caught in the act of. suffering ating an 8-year-old girl and. she didn't pass away and he was I think. sexually assaulting her but he's also. done it to 25y olds so this guy was now.

this is not the now Progressive will. tell you that this guy is like that. because something happened in his. background that made him that way he. couldn't have been born damaged right. it's the social constructivist argument. we're all born empty slate and it's only. society that either makes us good or bad. yeah and therefore they would want to. rehabil and by the way the the justice. system released him several times when. in a real deontological world that guy. would have been executed by the way I. support the death penalty for guys like.

that I I support it if the legal system. was clear yeah there's just too many. people that get accused and we've had a. bunch of them on they get accused of. crimes that they didn't commit and spend. decades in prison for murders they. didn't commit I've actually had a guy on. my show arguably the the the the the. most remarkable story I've ever heard on. my show and I discuss it actually in in. my current book on happiness talking. about gratitude he spent 29 years in. prison for a murder that he was. eventually exonerated of on the show I.

asked him how is it that you go about. your life you you're so put together. you're not full of vengefulness you. don't want to destroy the world you must. be Buddha you're a much better man than. I am and his answer really speaks to the. mindset of being a happy person and. having gratitude he said well I have a. sister who's been bedridden with. cerebral py for much of her life and yet. she manages to smile and be happy so I. don't really have much to complain about. so here's a guy who who has had three.

decades stolen from him and yet he still. had the grace and dignity I think we can. all learn a lot from that. lesson yeah so that's why I have a hard. time supporting the death penalty yeah. because I think there's a lot of like. very corrupt prosecutors and a lot of. very corrupt lawers and the the whole. thing is it's it's human but couldn't we. just restrict it to the most so if I. find your DNA in the body of five dead.

children that's the only time I will use. the death penalty why not make it so. extreme that your concern doesn't apply. I I could agree with that I I I see it. at least on paper that I could agree. with that but the problem is people plan. evidence. and you know it's you could see like if. there's a video of someone in the act of. doing something especially now with deep. fakes that's a problem again right right.

but yeah if someone was especially if. they're saying they're guilty they show. No Remorse yeah like why should they be. alive but I just wish that we knew for. sure that everybody who's locked up in. jail for a crime was actually guilty of. that crime and that's not the case so. that's not cas context where you would. ever sign up for the death penalty as it. stands I I just think you're giving. people the kind of power for sure if. someone does something we know they did. it you want that yeah but it's a sort of.

it akin to maybe the principles of free. speech Free Speech applies even to. people that you disagree with the. Holocaust deniers right yeah the the the. insane people Nazis like that was what. the uh the ADL used to support right. I think that if we were living in a. world where there was no lies and there. there the all the prosecutors and all. the judges were all above board and and.

just impeccable sense of ethics and. morals and you could trust them to know. the truth then yeah but that's not the. case yeah so in a flawed Society like. the one that we live in I I can't. support something that's killing. innocent people right even if it's. killing guilty people too yeah it's like. if it kills 10 guilty guys and one. innocent guy we [ __ ] up yeah and I. think that I don't know what the number. is of people that are unjustly accused.

but it's got to be high yeah you know. and and then there's people that are in. jail for things that are very minor and. then while in jail wind up killing. somebody well I mean to your point I. think the Innocence Project uh has. demonstrated that they have been men who. were on death row who were exonerated so. that speaks to your point many cases and. my good friend Josh Dubin has worked. with a lot of these different people and. through the show a few of them have. actually wind up being exonerated wow.

yeah he's a fascinating guy and he's. dedicated himself to finding these cases. and helping these people and he's gotten. a bunch of them out and their stories. are insane and because of that because. knowing that those exist I can't support. something that's going to possibly kill. those people just doesn't there's just. too much corruption there's too much you. can demonstrate the you could see it. there's cases After Case After Case a. prosecut is getting arrested da getting.

arrested and lawyers and it's too. there's too much [ __ ] yeah it's a. human issue you know and unless we knew. that humans were telling the truth we. you know you. can't it's just too it's too much of a. and to do it imagine if you're the. person who executes this person then you. find out that person was innocent like. oh my that's right God you got to live. with that that person not only did you. steal three decades of your life but. then you took their life for something. they didn't even do that's the reason. why in isn't it in firing squads when.

you have a whole bunch of people and. they're exactly yeah but what about. lethal injection yeah there is someone. who's literally doing knows what's going. on there you oh we do it with a computer. okay whatever you [ __ ] you know what. you're doing you know what you're doing. I mean you can find all sorts of ways to. rationalize it yeah but moral of course. you'd want that person removed from. society if you found you found out that. someone in your community back in the. day in the tribal days was raping. children you'd want to kill them exactly.

and justly. so yeah we actually I was I can't. remember who actually yesterday I did uh. the guys that came over at the hotel we. were talking about uh you know uh. parenting with the with the threat of. you know protecting your children from a. pedophile and I've argued that my. approach to parenting has been I don't. trust anyone with my children precisely. because the one who is going to commit. those infractions is not someone that.

has you know hidden horns that you can. see it is your uncle it is Grandpa it is. the really sweet neighbor it is the. person and so and I've actually had uh. not he but you know disagreements with. my wife where she thought I was being. too paranoid about this and my answer is. my job is to always air on the side of. safety so there's no sleepovers there's. no sleep away camp because there is. going to be this this the counselor.

there who is a pig and then I would have. miserably failed in my job and so my job. while you are under my protection is to. make sure that I never put you in a. position where this could happen what. happens after when you're an adult. that's your business what what are your. thoughts I I think no I think I I feel. what you're saying I think you also have. to let let your children expose them. they have to like they have to be in the. real world they have to experience. different kinds of people and to protect. them too much is actually damaging to. their development so there's a fine.

dance that you do so that's the anti. fragility stuff yeah there's a fine. dance as of and you know you think about. just your experience I mean it's. horrible to say that any bad experiences. were good for you but often times they. you develop character through a lot of. adversity your life oh I completely. agree how much adversity do you want to. expose your children to and then there's. the the question of things like. Predators I I've actually argued in in. the happiness book I argued that what I.

went through in the Lebanese Civil War. paradoxically makes me a happier person. because anytime that I start whining. about something that's pissing me off I. can always pull back from my memory I. had the miracle of escaping the Middle. East intact so what am I whining. so you're exactly on point that the fact. that I've gone through those Horrors. makes me the happier person I am today. yeah I think um perspective you know. that's the thing about anyone that I've.

met that's come from some War torn part. of the world when they make it to. America especially if they're in a place. that's safe and and nice yeah they just. have an immense appreciation and their. perspective is very different they're. also like people that come from comist. countries in particular they are just so. allergic to that horeshit yeah yeah when. they see it coming any Marxist ideology. they see it coming they're like [ __ ] you. yeah [ __ ] you we know where this goes. this goes to you have to give up all.

your possessions and everything goes to. the state and everything gets. distributed evenly like how do you. enforce that like what do who gets to. choose like what the [ __ ] are you. signing up for but these idealistic kids. that think that the world could be a. better place with socialism if that we. all just like no one should I I saw this. thing argued that guy argued online no. one should ever be able to make a. million dollars and that you should be. restricted to a certain amount of income. that allows you to have a certain like.

you specified the certain size apartment. that you should be allowed and anything. else is in excessing and that it's you. know an attack on the freedoms of others. it's like there's this fascinating. takedown by this like you know super. Progressive probably college kid well. had these ideas I've seen it what so I. think last year when I came on the show. I might have been right in the throws of. uh having all my book royalties stolen.

from my last book from the tax. authorities right and so I was really. pissed about it and whenever I would. post a tweet sort of condemning the. parasitic taxation system there would be. people who would write to me with. complete entitlement Canadians and. saying well why should you get to keep. the money in instead of you not being a. selfish Pig and sharing it with others. so my book royalties my thoughts my. ideas my humor is not M as a matter of. fact in the according to the Canan. government about 58% is owned by them.

but it really comes from having this. idea inculcated in you which is that we. should all have equality of outcomes it. is a Cancer and it is a an affront to. human meritocracy it's. unbelievable the argument against that. would be that there's a certain reality. to the way you were uh the the the way. you're living in this life and that you.

have resources available and you have. things available that other people don't. have and it would be better if you had. less and then it balanced out so if you. give a little bit more and then. eventually balance out the problem is. it's not balancing out the problem is. like where is it where's the money going. right well the money is going to the. government and they get to decide how. it's spent and they get to pass laws and. dictate and send a little here and well. there's a war so we're going to need. more and then there's inflation this. comes with the war it's the price of gas.

and food and everything goes up and all. this is happening and you can't say [ __ ]. about it yeah and you're in this. position where you're like well if you. complain well you're a man of privilege. ex you're you're privileged and you. should be giving that up and if you gave. it up the world be a better. place I don't don't have any faith in. their ability to use my taxes to make. the world a better place I have zero. faith I willingly and happily pay my. taxes because I think it's part of being.

an American you contribute even if the. system is flawed you contribute to at. least some of it is going to fixing. roads and some of it is going to you. know education and health care or. whatever whatever it is some of it it's. got to be going to people that care and. are really trying to make the world a. better place some of it to be going to. whatever whatever organizations that are. doing a good job. but the idea that if you just keep like. some people think they should have a 90%.

tax bracket yeah it's like if you're a. billionaire you don't deserve to have a. billion you should just give up well. guess what they're not going to work. yeah exactly people are going to get. upset they're they're not they're not. going to innovate you don't have a. quality of effort there's a lot of a. quality when people talk about equality. there's not an equality of effort. there's not an equality of intelligence. there's not equality of skill of talent. and it's genuinely anti-human nature and. I I'm not sure if I've said this before. on this show but EO Wilson the famous. Harvard biologist who he's passed away.

now last year I think uh he studied. social ants and in Social ants everybody. is equal other than the reproductive. Queen so when he was asked about. socialism communism his answer which I. love to always quote was great idea. wrong species right which perfectly. captures right we're not all equal some. of us are taller shorter harder working. less harder working so there is no. reason why we should all have the. quality of outcomes it is anti- human. nature it just it's not realistic yeah.

it's not realistic to expect people to. work as hard as some people you don't. they don't have to you know you don't. want to be Michael Jordan guess well. don't [ __ ] practice 12 hours a day. you don't have to be Michael Jordan like. if you you're happy as being a guy who. works a job and likes to go hiking and. likes to go fishing or something that's. great there's nothing wrong with that. but there's all kinds of people and some. people are going to be that guy yeah and. when they are that guy like you can't. say you have to give up all your money. it's hard to be that it's hard to be. Michael Jordan he deserves all that.

money it's [ __ ] impossible to be only. one guy pulled it off and you deserve. all the money you make my friend let's. not let's leave me out of this try to. skirt around. that but if you want it to be fair and. send some to the gotad trust fund uh. what do you use your trust fund money. for. I would use it to be able to use as. escape velocity so that I don't have to. answer to anybody have you uh because of. the oppressive nature of the Canadian.

government have you ever thought about. jumping ship oh my God I think we've. discussed in the past I think about it. probably 30 times a day wow uh I haven't. been able to for two main reasons Joe. number one both my family and my wife's. family are in Montreal so that's number. one that keeps us there number two it's. very very hard to walk away from a 10e. professorship I mean that's that's the. truth Montreal is a great City too it's. a beautiful place to live it is it's. like it's a perfect amount of cold. weather that develops adversity and. character I've heard you say that before.

but that's spoken from a a guy who's. lived in Southern California and then. Austin for too many years I think you. forgotten how bad the oh I remember I. lived in Boston I remember it sucks. sucks hard sucks but I'm not saying that. it's good I think it's good for you yeah. like cold plunges are good for you you. know they don't it's not good why you're. doing it sucks but I think it's good for. you and I think there's something about. being at the the you at the mercy of. nature for many months at a time yeah. for there's many months from November.

until when does it start warming up. around April yeah a mid April yeah it. can get cold as [ __ ] in March cold as. [ __ ] in March full snowstorm yeah so. there's so many months where it's so. godamn cold that I think there's a. certain humility that comes with that. there's a certain of appreciations of. the summer days because the summer days. are they're enormously novel it's like. what a beautiful thing like we we just. six months ago we're just digging. ourselves out to try to drive to the.

grocery store you to dig yourself out of. 3 feet of [ __ ] snow that's true. everybody remembers that well and that's. why Montreal it's there's kind of an. orgiastic party feel during the summer. months because we're making up for. cocooning exactly yes I used to love. doing comedy up there we used to do the. Montreal Comedy Festival and it was in. the summer and everybody was so happy. that's right right and I I really. clearly remember thinking that that. there's something to the kind of. character that comes out of people that. live in that place it's not all of them. of course some there's [ __ ] at.

every corner of the world but I just. think there's something cool about that. City and it's also like it's very. European even though it's Canadian just. a lot well thank you you're making me. feel good that I'm I'm still there I. love it up there it's a great place it's. great I just don't love the kind of. direction that the government is trying. to take control of the country that's. what freaks me out taking control of. narratives and taking control. of what people say on social media and. stopping protests and what they did with.

the Canadian truckers yeah well I think. and again to not to blow smoke up your. behind but uh one of the things that I. think people appreciate about you is. that you do change your opinion in light. of new evidence and I remember very. vividly the the first time that you and. I spoke about Justin Trudeau you were. quite a fan and then you revised your. opinion well I felt I felt he's a very. handsome man very good speaker but he's. not really a good speaker um on the cuff. off the cuff it's really like when he. has like a speech there's a template.

yeah and you know he's a good-looking. guy it's like when you see like a. handsome fellow with nice hair it's like. huh I want him to be good but you know. it's funny that you say he's. good-looking because Megan Kelly came on. my show and her view and you would we. would think that she would know how to. judge the masculinity of someone she. said I would never want want that guy on. top of me he doesn't exude any mess I. mean literally almost exactly that to. the word I'm sure that Jam's going to. pull it up any second now but that's. also him now right where you know who he.

really is I think uh he's a girly girl. you think so we had a boxing match hadit. a boxing match with some other. politician did you ever see it I did not. not terrible yeah not terrible I mean. I'll I'll defer to your boxing exper. Terri they threw some pans you know is. that [ __ ] him going after it yeah um but. the what disturbs me is the the way he's. willing to discredit people that uh. disagree with him like the Canadian. truckers he's saying that they're often. misogynistic and racist like like what.

are you talking about man the fact that. they froze the bank accounts of people. who donated money that's insane insane. that's that's like Banana Republic [ __ ]. yeah that's scary that's scary. totalitarian [ __ ] I had the spokesperson. of the trucker Convoy on my show uh yeah. it's it's unbel case for yeah for. totalitarian government tactics and they. did not fail they did not pass that test. they failed that test and to the great. discredit of my fellow Canadians we've.

now three times I mean you you don't you. don't vote for him you vote for the. party in a parliamentary system but it's. three times now that he's he's in and. each time he's gotten I think no more. than about 30 something per of the vote. so that's one of the dangers of a. parliamentary system even though. two-thirds of the people don't want you. there you he's now been prime minister. since 2015 how does that work well. you're basically voting for the party. and then depending on how many seats are. taken in the in the parliament that's.

who becomes the majority so it's not. like the American system where I am. voting for Donald Trump or Hillary. Clinton you're voting for a platform in. your writing right so if I'm voting for. the liberal party I'm voting for the. liberal candidate in my writing and now. that is tallied up and since he's the. Prime Minister the leader of that party. he then becomes the Prime Minister and. does anyone primary him do they have. that sort of a situation where someone. tries to challenge him from the same. party only only in the when you're.

deciding who's going to be the leader of. the party so once someone's leader of. the party they no longer challenge that. person that's right uh so I don't know. the exact details so as long as that. party is in power he's in power he's in. power for how long there is no I don't. think there's a statute of U not statute. what is it called the term limitations. term limitations thank you I don't think. there is so he could be dictator forever. for like the next 4,000 years it's. unbelievable yeah great one of the other. reasons why I'd like to leave uh Canada.

and move to greener pastures yeah it's. just not good for people to have that. kind of power yeah it's almost never. good and especially when they start. using it in that way they start you know. using it the way they're using it up. there it's like the clamping down of. free speech is never done by the good. guys yeah it's just not it's it's not. what it is and when you're you're being. fed propaganda and you know you're being. fed propaganda and now you're expected. to not say it and not talk about it and. just accept it that's not good for.

anybody that's not good for and it's. only good for the people that are in. power and it's only good for as long as. they're alive because what they're going. to leave behind is going to be a. disaster and if new people that are from. the opposing party get into control. they're going to expand their control. even further and this is a terrible. cycle that if you don't have very rigid. rules on what can and can't be done. you open the door for tyranny and that's. that's what they're doing and the worst. part is that it's cloaked under the robe. of progressivism right it says he will. be prime minister until 2025 they broke.

it a deal what does it say at the top it. says they broke it a deal that will keep. minority government in power until the. next election yeah why they say minority. government what does that mean so that. means minority liberal government that's. the minority of the people in this in. the country no it's in terms of the. number of seats in the parliament I. don't know the exact number but you. could either be a majority government or. minority government usually when you're. a minority government it's because.

you've you've set up an agreement with. another party allowing you to right so. in this case it's the NDP so the whole. part is behind him which is a problem. yeah and that's what would it take for. someone from another party to. win get the enough seats in the writings. to to overturn this. [ __ ] uh right now the top guy in the. conservative party is Pierre POV I don't. know if you've heard of him I I think. Jordan Peterson uh had him on his show.

uh I'm not a huge fan I don't know. enough about his policy so I don't want. to misspeak but I I'm traditionally I. don't like someone who spent their. entire career in politics and nothing. else I like the guys who you know they. were surgeons or they were lawyers or. they were businessmen and then they come. into Politics as a SE. act to their lives whereas this guy. meaning the Pierre guy has always been. in politics and so for that reason alone. I would prefer someone to be coming in. from the outside but short of that I.

don't know anything about. him it just doesn't seem like it's. moving in a good direction in terms of. people's ability to express themselves. indeed yeah it seems uh very very uh. very much a thing that's in danger up. there yeah it's weird yeah well have you. what what has has Jordan been a I think. he's a supporter of his right have you. yeah Jordan is supporter of his yeah. I've I've watched some interviews with. them well there is another guy who uh uh.

broke from the Conservative Party named. Maxim Bernier who started a new uh uh. party called the I don't know what the P. PPC or something I can't remember what. it is uh but it's very very hard to get. it off the ground so I don't even think. they got one person to sit in uh the. parliament. despite the fact that many of his. positions we both probably you and I. would agree with but it's just very hard. to introduce a new. party yeah so it's kind. of it's kind of how it is in America as.

well right exactly like Cornell West. just branched off and he's in another. party right now right oh is that right. what party is he. in Cornell West left the Democrats to. run for president under another. party yeah as an independent or what the. green party green part party okay yeah. so that's interesting because there's a. lot of people that are Cornell West. supporters they're thinking would. ordinarily vote for the Democrat whoever. the Democrat is like there's blue no. matter who people there's a certain. percentage in this country and there's.

many of those who might look at Cornell. West and go you know what I'm more. aligned with what he's saying right and. they might vote for him and it might you. know sway votes in one way or another. they're were very worried about that. sort of like what Ross perau did I was. just going to say exactly that yeah Ross. perau was like conservative yeah. um but also. 92 it was when Clinton got in office. because uh they thought you know Ross. perau was like he was saying he took out.

ads so this is what people don't. understand there was no way to get your. word out back then it's hard to imagine. in this day of YouTube and the the web. if you grew up with it this is going to. sound so alien to you but no one really. understood how the IRS system worked or. the Federal Reserve worked or any of. these things work and Ross perau was so. wealthy that he bought an hour of TV. time yeah so instead of like whatever.

would normally be on whatever Channel he. did it he he literally bought he goes. how much do it cost how about the whole. [ __ ] thing he was a Texas crazy. billionaire dude and little dude right. little dude little dude I got a big c. and I'll [ __ ] you up and he just didn't. tolerate anybody's [ __ ] and this guy. laid out I forget what exactly he talked. about but he laid it out of the way with. charts and explaining to people like how. you getting [ __ ] yeah and I remember. the conversations that I would have the.

people I was working with back then. would all sit around like did you. [ __ ] watch that [ __ ] like what is. this like is that is all true then. people start researching it and buying. books and you got to read this book and. like what is what is this and a lot of. people wanted him to win and they. thought like yeah let's have something. different like someone who understands. how to run a [ __ ] business right. someone who understands all the waste. and Corruption and the all the the evil. [ __ ] that's going on behind the. scenes come on get in there Ross and. that's probably how Bill Clinton got. elected that's right cuz he split the.

the Republicans because most of the. people that were for Ross perau were. like you know fairly conservative-minded. people who wanted No Nonsense this No. Nonsense Texas billionaire comes along. explains everything he's been very. financially you know successful are you. ready to make a prediction of for the. 2020 24 election I don't here's my. prediction I don't think Biden runs okay. I think I don't know what's going on. with all this stuff stuff with son and. with with the the the evidence of.

corruption how valid it is I I I see all. these articles about all these. conversations that they had and the. money that was being transferred back. and forth I'm thinking it's pretty valid. it's it seems real valid but it also. seems like if this is all coming out. like that what a good way yeah to remove. a president that seems mentally. compromised yeah cuz it seems like if. you were in the Democratic party and you. thought like listen there's a certain. amount of people that are going to vote.

blue no matter who right we we just need. a better representation because you you. could not have Cala Harris she would not. win people would be very very reluctant. to vote for her for president I think. after just listening to her talk for the. last three years like what and so who. else and they would have to a reason for. that who else so she would have to step. down it's californ Justin Trudeau it's. Gavin Nome the problem is uh he did such. a bad job with California it's so.

they're so vulnerable like he he does. spit out some good propaganda he just. starts talking about I'm very high on. California and all the [ __ ] companies. that have come from this and all the. money that's generated and all the. intellectuals and all the yeah but you. got to know the real stats of like how. many of them feel stuck because if you. ask people on the street and California. the I think the number was four out of. 10 people they surveyed are thinking. about moving out of California which is. most people don't have the ability to up. and move yeah I was very fortunate when. all the [ __ ] was going down in.

California in whatever it was May of. 2020 when I first started thinking about. moving yeah I was like this ain't going. in a good direction and I [ __ ] smell. chaos. and I got out early but if you don't get. out early and you don't have the ability. to get out early like you don't have the. financial ability maybe your your. parents live there maybe you're taking. care of someone maybe your job depends. on you staying there it's a good job. you're [ __ ] yeah and that's a lot of. people I wasn't [ __ ] so I got out and.

um I don't like where it's going because. I don't with with letting people out of. jail and all this this craziness about. no bail like letting people out they. they arrest them when they commit a. crime and put them right back on the. street no Bail no cash bail it's not a. felony if it's under 950. all that stuff is crazy when you go to. CVS you see like what it looks like at. these stores in San Francisco it's. [ __ ] Madness clo there's so many. businesses that are closing down they. don't want to be a part of it anymore.

they're getting out of these States. they're getting out of Portland they're. getting out of Seattle they're getting. out of these places because they're like. this is [ __ ] and it ain't getting. better and that's what I don't like I. don't like when I don't see any course. correction I don't see any Readjustment. I don't see anything like hey we need to. uh take care of disenfranchise people. but we also need to make our streets. safe and we have to stop crime okay so. we need to figure out a way to you know. have these things you know mutually. beneficial to everybody sure and there's. no none of that there's like more.

ridiculous laws more lack on crime more. money for the homeless people give them. free drug give them needles they need. clean needles like what yeah well I was. camp out anywhere I was asking you. offline when we were on the show if you. regret moving here and you what you said. was you even love it more here than you. did last year when we I love it yeah. Texas Texas is great and Austin is. particularly great because it's a pro. it's a progressiv minded City that's. surrounded by Red States right like. there's a there's a t-shirt that says.

Keep Austin Weird and. surrounded there's something about being. surrounded by the rest of like the real. [ __ ] Texas Texas people like even the. progressives here are more reasonable. it's the the the like whatever the chart. is like where the middle is like there's. so many people that you would even think. as conservative or you think of as. Progressive because they're socially. Progressive or conservative but they're. kind of more in the middle in terms of. the way California was right California. was like radical leftism and then like.

if you were a conservative you had to. hide it or you're a Nazi or you live in. Orange County you know there's like. certain places where the conservatives. thrived and that was fine but the. overwhelming amount of people who are in. the the the big Urban are like. specifically San Francisco and Los. Angeles they're in the [ __ ] fog of it. they're in the fog of it they they they. believe all sorts of wacky [ __ ] and they.

were the first persons that were like. happy that we were locking down the. first person's happy there was a mass. mandate and a vaccine mandate and they. were they were happy to go along with it. all I'm going to I don't know if you've. heard of the Commonwealth club which is. this big shii event to talk about this. book and it's in San Francisco oh boy so. maybe I need to be wearing a hazmat suit. or something yeah you need to wear. something like n95 type deal just the. poop smell in the air exactly yeah it's. uh I don't know how you fix that that's.

the thing I don't think we've ever seen. a city fall apart like we've seen Los. Angeles and San Francisco fall apart and. then have it be brought back I mean it. can be done clearly but how and how much. time so you think think it's a death. spiral it's I'm worried that it's a. death spir I'm worried that it's going. to turn worse like you could have never. imagined when I used to go to San. Francisco in the 90s and to to do. standup all the time um I would at the. original Cap City which is this cool. little club that seated like 150 people.

it was great you could walk around the. city and cool places to eat and cool. bars to go to was a [ __ ] lovely city. filled with culture and artists and. interesting people and smart people it's. like where the smart people were like. not the people that were interested in. Show Business and the the vapid pursuit. of stardom those are the people up there. there were the tech people the artists. and the musicians and so much cool [ __ ]. came from San Francisco amazing food the. restaurants just like the just the. walking around the streets people were.

cool and now it's a hell hole Yeah it's. the same place just 30 years later it's. a [ __ ] hell hole how ideologies have. consequences well San frano is a really. good uh documenting of that Michael. shellenberg show he's amazing he's. amazing and Michael shellenberger who. used to you know lo used to be like a. hardcore Progressive so he understands. the mentality behind it and the. sentiment behind it he's like a super. sweet kind guy he's a lovely guy and his.

book is amazing because it really. documents and it's about how progressiv. you ruin cities yeah and it it uses San. Francisco as an amazing example of it. and it's unfortunate because I think. these people all have the right. intentions they a lot of them at least. do they have good intentions they have. this they think this ideology is a. Kinder more inclusive more gentle but. the the consequences of the way they're. enacting laws and allowing people to. ruin everything around them like that is.

real Financial consequences yeah and in. the parasitic mind I actually talk about. the fact that all of those parasitic. ideas start with a noble goal and then. in the pursuit of that Noble goal things. go arai GH so arai I mean how do you. turn that around like like who could be. elected to mayor of San Francisco that. could turn that around and how would it. even be tolerated and do you even have. the resources well it's hard when you. have a super majority like you do in. California right it's also hard when you.

have like it's very like it takes a long. time to build a building yeah it's. really easy to light it on fire yeah. takes just a few minutes yeah just throw. gasoline on throw like step away that. [ __ ] building's gone and to rebuild. is quite difficult yeah and when you. have a city that's just overwhelmed with. homelessness and crime and Chaos did you. see that video of these kids that stole. a car and drove it off a cliff no in San. Francisco no you didn't see it no.

yeah I don't know the story behind this. other than the fact that it was a stolen. car but it is wild footage of this car. going off the side of like a like a very. Steep Hill in San Francisco watch this. so here comes the. car stolen. car watch this this is wild so look to. the upper left hand side that's where.

it's going to come from. yeah this isn't the video I saw oh this. isn't the video of this is a long ass. video this is like unedited okay they're. joy riding what are they doing seems. like it here oh. oh my sorry they jumped out of the car. before this happened or they're in the. car as the video continues people try to. help them get out of the car and they. sort of all get out of the car and then.

at least two of them run away oh my. God I to skip. ahead a few people are now out of the. car they're climbing out here oh my. goodness and then you can see him. climbing the stairs does that lady say I. love you well yeah there's something. going on I it's very. confusing I saw it on Twitter last night. wow wow is that a person that was in the.

car I believe so so she's saying I love. you it's I don't know who's talking I I. love you but I'm getting the [ __ ] out of. Dodge is that what she's saying could be. is she one of the people that opened the. door again it's hard to say who's here. back it up a little so we could see we. what you investigative journalists I. know I don't know who's talking. I'm sorry so someone's hurt bad yeah. yeah. yeah yikes oh so that's the person. driving the car you see the position.

that she's in that's the front of the. car yeah so that's the driver no that's. not the case cuz then the oh yeah no. that's the back. seat right wow I don't know is that the. front seat I'm. uh which way back car hold. on the front's up here that's the front. no so that's the back the front's and. the it it does a the front is like no. down oh my God this is so crazy look at.

how it goes down boom okay well I'm I'm. I'm looking forward to my uh yeah so. that was some in the back seat that was. in the back passenger seat of course. look how the doors open du um. but whatever the [ __ ] happened that. lady's like I'm out [ __ ] love you I got. to go you got [ __ ] up. yikes we've covered a lot of ground San. Francisco carjacking wish me luck they. they carjacked that car and drove it. over the cliff there's a video of it.

going over the cliff too there's a video. of it going straight down the street and. going through a fence and just launching. that's happened to somebody I know. really yeah they got he stopped them. from actually stealing it and it like. the car flipped over they got out and. shot at him oh my God not in San. Francisco though where was that Ohio. Columbus godamn Columbus it's Wilder too. that's a gritty gritty gritty town right. I love Columbus is that right yeah it's. F fun place do stand up fun people Blue. Collar yeah yeah yeah fun fun people but.

you know like all all places took a hit. during the pandemic all places took a. hit economically they they took a hit. with violence and crime and you know and. the uh mostly peaceful. protests that's right mostly peaceful. protests is a great great meme yeah yeah. yeah that's for that was on CNN right I. think it was on a lot of places I think. a lot of places the original one was. he's saying that and with the fire. behind mostly peaceful protest yeah.

that's the thing that is the truth. though but if if you do light some. buildings on fire and most of the people. are not lighting buildings on fire it's. mostly peaceful well that's one of the. things by the way that I think Canada we. have better than you guys and that we. are less violent uh right like except. with hockey you guys [ __ ] people up in. hockey there is no place in Montreal. that you truly would be afraid to take a. wrong turn oh well that's nice that's. cuz the cold weeds weeds out the.

week the cold weeds out the week up. there I remember coming from Boston. thinking how [ __ ] cold it is up there. like whoa this is another level another. level like walking from my hotel to get. something to eat I remember we walked a. couple blocks like this is an adventure. yeah an adventure and not dying when. you're walking to a restaurant like holy. shit- 40 yeah and then when you get. inside every was like holy [ __ ] holy. [ __ ] but there's a a warmth and.

Hospitality to like going to a place. when it's warm inside and it's cold. outside and everyone's very appreciative. of the warmth yeah it's very different. than going into a cool place when it's. hot out right going to a cool place when. it's hot out it's nice it's nice but it. doesn't feel the same nice as like you. could [ __ ] die out there that's right. I've by the way when I was 13 they had. stopped school I think the only time. ever because it was too cold usually. it's because it's too snowy and it was I.

think -70 with wind chill and I decided. to walk out just to to say as I am now. that I did it and I lasted maybe 10 MERS. wow it was your my face was burning so. basically it was like playing football. in the NFL you lasted about. what a nice way to bring it back the. same way you would walk out with a. football God it gets so cold but I I. mean I don't think it's necessary to. develop character but I certainly think. it helps yeah like I felt that about.

Boston like I love the people that live. there because there's a certain like. [ __ ] roughness to those people. they've dealt with some [ __ ] you know. they know how to deal with some [ __ ]. when is your next visit to Montreal I. don't know I've been a Canada since all. this [ __ ] went down till I couldn't. cross the border if I was unvaccinated. oh right true and I'm like you guys are. out of your [ __ ] mind yeah I mean. still was in America until May you. couldn't come here you. were we were like the last country to.

hang in there with that. yeah weird just weird to be going. through this well I remember the last. time that at least that I knew that you. came you you were kindly invited me to. one of your standup at the corona. theater across from Joe Beef we're. giving a lot of plugs iing he's your. friend yeah yeah well the the yeah both. of those guys they're that's an. incredible restaurant it is yeah I I. think it was voted in the top.

restaurants in Canada yeah should be. Montreal is just an amazing place for. culture in general it's just a beautiful. city it's great great old architecture. it's just it's a lovely city I'm feeling. better by the second about being there. if you're going to live in Canada it's a. great spot it is it's a great spot that. cold much less antiseptic than Toronto. that's for sure yeah yeah it's just um. you know those kind of the kind of. policies that are in place that that. stop the freedom of expression they're.

they're troubling because I always. thought of Canada as being like this. really openminded liberal place and. incidentally there's a unique dynamic in. Quebec that's different from Canada. which is the protection of the French. language and in doing that you do end up. also infringing on people's intrinsic. rights right so I'm I'm fully anone so. it's not as though I've got a I'm. perfectly happy to speak French but you. shouldn't have to mandate that by. instituting Draconian laws so you get. all sorts of immigrants that come to. Quebec that you otherwise should want to.

have in Quebec but because they can't. pass some French test they end up. leaving is that really good for society. but question according to the Quebec. government it is because Quebec is a. distinct Society that's surrounded by. evil you know English language we need. to do whatever we can to protect it in. my view you shouldn't it's it is. fascinating that there's a segment of. your country that speaks primarily. French amazing isn't it and by the way. as as you leave Montreal it becomes.

almost exclusively French really and and. in Montreal historically the more you. went West it was more English the more. you went East the more French it was uh. but outside of Montreal 20 25 30 40. minutes you could pretty much only speak. French and you know wow yeah so kind of. cool cool to visit kind of cool come and. see us we miss you up there well uh you. know you got to stay there and keep it.

down hold it down you're one of the the. few reasonable voices from up there it's. like yelling from the rooftops well. thank you and you've been at the front. lines for a long time my friend you you. were sounding out about the dangers of. all this stuff before anybody really. recognized where it could go oh thank. you you and Jordan you know I mean you. were even before him some of the the. criticisms that you experienced back. then I thought like wow this is weird. that people have this perspective like. don't they see that he's making so much. sense yeah he's so I mean everything.

you're saying is so rational and. reasonable and well thought out like oh. he's a Nazi wa he's a Jewish Nazi who. escaped Lebanon what are you talking. about right right it's it's weird where. people try to categorize people and and. you in a lot of the ways because of who. you are and because of your academic. background because you're so articulate. and the books you've written you've. managed to like avoid a lot of the. pitfalls that some other people have. fallen into because you're so undeniably.

respected as an intellectual and when. you're talking about these things you're. talking about them from a place of like. you have a deep understanding of the. literature you have deep understanding. of like where these problems come from. like what's the source of them how do. they arise and how do they permeate. through Society in it's sort of as you. say parasitic way thank you those are. very sweet words I really appreciate. them yeah well you're a very important. voice my friend you really are and uh I. think that your your work has been uh. instrumental for helping other people.

form arguments against some of this. nonsense too because you sort of laid it. out where it could just repeat what. you've said like you know wait a minute. you know the Godfather's got some points. here thank you I really appr my pleasure. brother and your new book is available. right now as of today unfortunately. these [ __ ] Knuckleheads didn't allow. you to do the audio but you can read the. book and and hear it in your sweet and. sultry voice uh the sad truth about. happiness eight secrets to Leading The. Good Life available now thank you so. much Jo thank you let's do it again.

anytime anytime we do it again all right. love you thank you bye. [Music].