Joe Rogan Experience #1980 - Michio Kaku

[Music]. by night. see it yeah got to be on the show again. my pleasure the last time was fascinated. and uh you have sent me down a rabbit. hole of uh UFO stories and and reports. and. fascinating stuff but uh let's talk. about your your latest book which is on. Quantum Computing which is equally.

interesting if not more interesting. because it might lead us to become. aliens. we'll talk about that too please. um so first of all if you could just. tell everybody what it means what it. what is quantum Computing and how does. it work well there's a race going on a. race between China the United States. between IBM and Google a race to. dominate the next generation of. computers because Silicon Valley could. become a Rust Belt think about that the.

digital computer of today could be like. the Abacus of Years Gone by we're. talking about the computer of today. could become obsolete with this race to. perfect the Next Generation which is. quantum computers instead of computing. on transistors we're Computing on atoms. think about that this is the ultimate. computer there's nothing smaller than. what you can do with atoms and that's. what these quantum computers compute.

with and it raises all sorts of problems. the CIA is worried to computers will. break right through the CIA and any any. kind of a barrier being placed around. your secrets Industries are going to be. created out of nothing medicine is going. to be turned upside down. energy production Society entertainment. every aspect of society will be changed. with quantum computers and that's why. there's this race a race to perfect the.

quantum computer how far from the Finish. Line do you think they are uh we're. still years away first of all we've. actually built one uh different. companies are Fielding quantum computers. they're kind of primitive but some. computers some quantum computers are. actually millions of times more powerful. than our supercomputer for a certain. definite tasks but it may take another. decade or so before we get all the all. the Kinks out and it becomes part of.

everyday life but it's going to change. everything in the same way that the. transistor changed everything the world. economy medicine art science everything. was changed with the microchip same. thing with the quantum computer. it's very difficult for us there's only. been a few science fiction authors. who've been able to do this successfully. where they can accurately predict what. the future is going to look like I mean. even they're off usually you know H.G. Wells had some pretty good ideas but.

are we looking at something that we. almost don't have a reference for that. it's so mind-blowingly different and. much more powerful than anything we've. experienced so far that it's it's. difficult for us to imagine how much. it's going to change the world well to. imagine how it's going to change the. world think of the progression of the. computer for thousands of years the. computer was basically an analog device. we use sticks beads levers gears pulleys. cranks in order to do simple.

calculations that was the first era of. computation and that meant that we could. keep track of things which we couldn't. do before then World War II hit and all. of a sudden we had to break the German. code and that required using electricity. and using all sorts of vacuum tubes to. crack the German code and then we went. into the second era where we compute on. digital and binary so zeros and ones. zeros and ones now we're entering the.

third era a natural progression from. Gears leverage pulleys to vacuum tubes. and transistors and then to atoms this. is the final step in the evolution of. the computer when we compute on atoms. these are Atomic computers nothing more. powerful than that. so when you think about how much it. would change Life as We Know It. that's when things get difficult to. understand right because if we think. about just trying to imagine what it.

would be like living in New York City in. 1820 and then imagining what it's like. today 200 years later they would have. never been able to guess. what kind of things is this going to. change. everything for example think of biology. and medicine to test a drug what do we. do we get thousands hundreds of. different kinds of Petri dishes put the. drug in put the tissue in and just cross.

your fingers and hope and pray that of. these thousands of dishes one of them. will create a super wonder drug that's. why it costs upwards of a billion. dollars to market the next wonder drug. because it's all done by trial and error. now think of putting that in the memory. of a supercomputer a the quantum. computer it it analyzes whether or not. germs can be destroyed by this substance. at the speed of light not just one dish. but hundreds thousands of dishes of.

these things have been tested at the. same time in the memory the memory of a. computer so we're talking about digital. medicine digital chemistry virtual. chemistry the about that chemistry. without chemicals biology without. biology so that's the that's the beauty. of this technology that we can mimic. atoms we can mimic molecules and do. virtual experiments in the memory of a.

computer rather than using test tubes. like we used to do that we still do. today. and we could possibly see things that. are just theoretical right now like with. medicine like regenerating limbs or. regrowing spinal tissue for a person. who's been paralyzed things along those. lines in fact even immortality is on the. table uh realize that scientists have. looked at the aging process realize that. the reason why we never understood aging. is that aging is the buildup of error.

that's what aging is the buildup of. mistakes in the replication of DNA but. what happens if you could put DNA in the. computer. then you can see where the Aging takes. place and then we can begin perhaps to. slow down the aging process maybe even. become immortal. what about reversing it what about uh. old women become young hot ladies again. uh would that be a problem everything's. on the table because we're talking about. changing the fabric of life itself you.

know the greatest quantum computer is. Mother Nature think about it how does. Mother Nature do photosynthesis how does. Mother Nature create uh trees and. flowers out of nothing it's all. chemicals and molecules that's what. quantum computers can do when you think. about that just to describe that. complexity that you just described do. you ever wonder if there's some sort of. an ongoing code in the whole universe. itself like there's a reason why all.

these things these things happen there's. a reason why the mycelium and the the. trees have this relationship with the. fungus and the earth and the soil and. the animals have this perfect symbiosis. well that was the subject of my previous. book The God equation where we try to. find one theory that allows us to. calculate everything starting with the. big bang then the creation of galaxies. and stars planets finally the creation. of Life photosynthesis and here we are.

talking about this on on a podcast so. yeah we're talking about one equation. which I call the god equation which I. write about in my book The God equation. but there's a problem the problem is. that the theory is so complicated that. no human has been able to solve the. consequences of this equation that's. where quantum computers can come in. quantum computers can solve the equation. and then test it to see whether or not.

it really is a theory of everything or. just the imagination of some physicist. so that was my previous book The God. equation so that's why I decided to. write this book Quantum Supremacy. because it may eventually take a quantum. computer to calculate with what is. called string theory and I'm one of the. founders of string theory and we think. that is Einstein's theory that eluded. him for the last 30 years of his life.

this Quantum computing. creating the answer to this God molecule. or this God equation if if this does. happen. what would that mean to you to a person. who studied this and and been a. scientist your whole life and the way. you look at the world what how much. would that change if there was some sort. of a provable equation as to why things. become ever more complex and universes. exist and people exist and.

well that's my childhood dream as I. mentioned when I was eight years old. everything changed in my life a great. scientist had just died and all the. newspapers said that he could not finish. his final and greatest Theory and they. put a picture of his desk on the news. the desk was open and unfinished so I. was fascinated by that story that story. changed my life. because I said to myself why couldn't he. finish that theory why don't I try to.

finish that theory that's amazing so I. went to the library and I looked up this. man this man's name was Albert Einstein. the theory was The Theory of Everything. an equation one inch long that would. allow us to quote read the mind of God. these are Einstein's words so I said to. myself that's for me that's what I want. to do for the rest of my life so now we. have the theory it's called String. Theory there have been TV documentaries.

on the subject but it's not testable so. I think that a quantum computer May one. day be powerful enough to test it in the. memory of a computer. however we have to be careful remember. that novel uh the restaurant at the end. of the Galaxy. um what happened in that novel was the. aliens of the future created a. supercomputer to calculate The Theory of. Everything the ultimate Theory so the. computer it chugged and chugged and spit.

out the answer and the answer was the. meaning of the universe was. 42. so so much for that so I would hope that. our our quantum computer Computing on. string theory I hope would not give us. the number 42 as the meaning of reality. maybe we're just too dumb to know what. that means uh yeah. but that's that's what motivated me oh. yeah. well that's a beautiful motivation you.

just thinking about you being an. eight-year-old looking at Einstein's the. photograph of Einstein's test that's. amazing yeah I love stories like that I. love origin stories because I've always. wondered with someone like you yeah well. that changed my life and then when I was. in high school I decided to take it one. step further and it just I decided to. build an atom smasher a particle. accelerator in my mom's garage. so I assembled uh 300 pounds of. Transformer steel uh 22 miles of copper. wire and I assembled a six kilowatt 2.3.

million electron Vol betatron particle. accelerator in my mom's garage in high. school in high school right wow every. time I turned it on I would blow out. every single circuit breaker in the. house it consumes six kilowatts of power. my poor mom comes home and she hears his. pop pops out as I blow out every circuit. breaker in the house and she must have. said to herself. why couldn't I have a son who plays. baseball. why not basketball and why why can't you.

find a nice Japanese girlfriend how come. he builds these machines in the garage. well that machine got me accepted to. Harvard and that became my career that. began my career as a theoretical. physicist what were you able to do with. that machine. uh well I was able to create a magnetic. field of 20 000 10 000 Gauss that is 20. 000 times the Earth's magnetic field if. you got too close to a machine you would. pull the fillings out of your teeth. really yeah so you had to be very.

careful what about objects that are. close scissors and things would hammers. fly fly in the air right so you had to. be very careful coming next to my. machine oh my God so in like compare. that to like you can't even go near. um one of those uh scanners those MRI. machines right magnetic resonance. imagery MRI you can't have any metal. near those right yeah that's nothing. like there are about 10 000 Gauss too. but the same magnetic field as mine oh. okay okay so my machine is comparable to. the machines that you see in the. hospital today wow that's crazy and you.

built that when you were in high school. that's right is that a photo of it well. that's a photo of one of those yeah. that's the photo it right there you see. it on the left you can see that's 22. miles of copper wire on the you see the. capacitor Bank a cloud chamber on the. right where I photographed antimatter. because that was the whole experiment to. play with antimatter and yeah the the. cables are hooked up and you it's hooked. up to six kilowatts that comes out of. the wall socket drained every single.

ounce of power of my mom's garage. wow yeah look at young micho look at you. you handsome fella yeah well that's the. betatron particle accelerator that's. amazing 2.3 million electron volt. generator of electrons so you were able. to photograph antimatter with that uh. well with the cloud chamber yes I was. able to photograph the tracks of. antimatter uh tracks of positrons or. anti-electrons that are emitted from. sodium 22 and I proved that it was.

antimatter because they bent the wrong. way in a magnetic field. ordinary electrons should bend clockwise. these Bend counterclockwise and magnetic. field that proved conclusively that it. was antimatter that I was photographing. wow how old are you at the time oh it's. about 17. I was so dumb well I'm pretty dumb now. but it was so dumb when I was 17. that's. amazing you're spending your time doing. this right I was listening to Led.

Zeppelin. but you know like I said I was chasing. after this dream of an 80 year old child. wondering is there a theory of. everything it's an amazing dream yeah. now when where did you get the designs. for this oh well um these designs come. from an x-ray machine done by Donald. cursed uh who was one of the inventors. of the betatron and so a lot of the. groundbreaking work was done by him and. now they're Incorporated in most. hospitals most hospitals have have one. uh that do at that creates x-rays to for.

uh for patients so was there a schematic. online that you duplicated did you. devise this yourself uh yeah no there. was a um a schematic online I mean not. there was no line back then uh in the. library online yeah in the library there. was a schematic but I had to fill in the. details I had to do the equations to. calculate how many turns of wire how. many Gauss I needed 10 000 Gauss in. order to bend tracks uh of 2.3 million.

electron volts all the calculations had. to be done ahead of time to make sure it. would work isn't it funny that the. universe is so common that or excuse me. the internet rather so common that I. automatically for a second forgot that. we were children when you were younger. than me or when you were younger uh. that's right there was no internet no. internet at all nothing I'm just playing. back then it was just books with his. books so you had to have a real hunger. for information to go and seek this. stuff out that's right did you have any.

particular High School teachers that. were influential or inspirational well. fortunately I grew up in Palo Alto which. is now Ground Zero for Silicon Valley so. luckily there were other physicists in. the area because they work for varying. Associates and different electronics. companies so it wasn't a total vacuum I. was able to get advice especially in the. magnetic field and the the cloud chamber. and also the the vacuum tube that. contained the the particles that I was.

accelerating it was good to have real. physicists there in Palo Alto because of. that fact oh that's amazing so did you. were they willing to consult with you. and discuss this yeah in general right. so I would talk to them about how to. build the magnetic field and to. calculate using Maxwell's equations the. the geometry of the of the particle. accelerator so uh yeah I would go and. visit these physicists because Palo Alto. was was to become Ground Zero for. Silicon Valley it's such a fascinating.

image of seeing this one Super Genius. physicists who's teaching classes get a. visit by a teenage Super Genius. physicist. he's one of us. you're a teenager that's very. interesting as soon as they talk to them. he immediately knew what I was doing so. they would help me that's crazy yeah. that's so awesome now in application of. this thing one of the things that we're. seeing right now. um when we're talking about Quantum. Computing back to that. um one of the things we're seeing now is. chat GPT chat gbt which is this.

fascinating uh AI program that. essentially scours the entire internet. for answers for things and is so good at. it the answers for things for just just. data people are getting diagnosed with. certain diseases based on symptoms and. blood work and it's super accurate uh. legal papers it could fill out legal. forms and it's it's wild the capacity. you can pass a bar exam that way too. yeah the bar exam can be passed with a. chat bot yeah it's like 98 right now.

here's the question if quantum Computing. gets involved in AI what are we looking. at well first of all AI is a software. program we're talking about. homogenizing different kinds of essays. on the web splicing them together and. then passing it off as your latest. creation basically plagiarism using. digital computers it's a software. question however quantum computers is. bigger than that quantum computers is a.

hardware question where it actually. increases your ability to do much more. than with an ordinary digital computer. so the two of them the chat Bots that. are revolution in software and then. quantum computers which are revolution. in Hardware when they get together watch. out so we're talking about an extremely. powerful alliance between software and. Hardware now also as you know chatbots. will also lie cheats Swindle Joe Oak and.

do all sorts of crazy things if you're a. high school kid you could write all. sorts of Science Fiction scenarios and. some chat bot May grab pieces of that. nonsense and incorporate it into their. essay oh interesting so it can't discern. what's what's accurate exactly the whole. point this is the whole bottle of wax. chatbots do not know what is correct or. incorrect they just gather information. so they could be gamed that's right all. they do is homogenize cut up existing.

things that sound human put it together. and then people say my God that sounds. like a human rodent of course a human. did write it it's not interesting that. they could game that also if they wanted. to find out what percentage of people. believed a certain thing if they had. some bad actor some foreign. you know governments that decided they. were going to spread narratives as. widely as possible and chat gbt just. gathers up all this information it could.

give you an incorrect under. understanding of what's happening in the. world and give an incorrect. understanding of politics of the. economic point is that even though. there's a good aspect to all these. software programs the downside is that. you can fabricate truth because it. cannot tell the difference between false. and what is false and what is true. that's very interesting if you talk to. the chat uh the chatbot and say do you. know the difference between correct and. Incorrect and they say no it's just on. the web they're just instructed to.

Cobble together existing paragraphs. splicing together and polish it up and. then spit it out but is it correct it. doesn't care it doesn't know so it is. essentially like an amazing resource of. information that's it's that's very. flawed that can't discern and can't. think I do this I have this problem all. the time I'm a professor and I give. assignments to the students sometimes. write a term paper so whether they do. some of them plagiarize oh how do you. catch them well you read the s say and.

then you read another essay and you say. I've heard that before. right right the old-fashioned way yeah. but you see that's what a chatbot is a. chatbot is like a teenager that. plagiarizes other people's essays passes. it off as their own now I'm a scientist. we like to think about things that are. creative new Innovative things that will. change our perception of the world none. of that absolutely none of that comes.

from a chatbot a chatbot simply. rearranges. pre-existing essays that's all it does. the the thing is though that's all it. does now that's what's interesting. what's interesting is what you're. talking about with Quantum Computing and. the insane computational power right and. then apply that to having access to all. of the information right but there's a. good aspect too you know when I write a. book. um my publisher has a fact Checker a. fact Checker that goes through all the.

different statements that I make to make. sure that they're all correct there is. no fact checker for chat Bots let me. repeat that again there is no fact. checker for chat Bots that is the whole. bottle of wax that's the reason why. they're so dangerous because they can. they don't know these chatbots are. machines they don't know what is correct. or it is incorrect it's all the same to. them that's the danger that they could. incorporate teenagers ranting and raving. about all sorts of garbage and put that. in with articles that sound reasonable.

that's the problem now here's where. quantum computers come in come in. Quantum can computers can act as a fact. Checker you can ask a quantum computer. to remove all the garbage remove all the. nonsense in these articles and it'll do. that so in other words the hardware may. be a check on some of the while. statements made by software but the. problem with that is who's the Arbiter. of the information like who decides what. what's real and what's not how does the.

chat bot decide is a chat bot. ideologically biased the chatbot doesn't. the chatbot is simply the quantity does. yeah Quantum Computing and then it's. going to be able to discern what's real. and what's not real. if they're gradations are what is true. like it is partially true or whatever it. could give you the the detailed. understanding of what it what could be. misconstrued what is partially correct. what is misleading but partially correct. you said I'm saying right now the. chatbot just splices it to get like an.

editor that's all it is an editor not a. fact Checker and spits out cobbled. together articles that sound reasonable. but there could be Dynamite inside some. of these articles that were spliced into. what was proposed with a quantum. computer you can fact check things and. then you can say this is 90 correct this. is totally wrong this is sometimes. correct and you you get gradations of. what is correct and incorrect well if. you can get it objectively accurate fact.

Checker that would be a huge step up. from what we have today because a lot of. people have very little faith in certain. fact Checkers and when you find out that. they're ideologically biased or they're. governmentally biased and if you could. have something that could just tell you. if you've been paying attention to how. Twitter's doing it now where they have. Community notes have you seen this no I. haven't that's interesting like say if. someone makes a statement about. something controversial climate change. whatever and then this controversial. statement gets refuted in the community.

notes and then people will start. commenting and really intelligent very. well read read people on specific. subjects will chime in with. peer-reviewed papers and all these. different statistics and that show and. then Twitter will correct it and it will. say readers have said and then and then. put up the relevant information right. see that's what uh chat Bots do not do. today yeah they have no understanding of. correct or incorrect false and true no.

understanding of that but with Hardware. coming into the picture that's more. advanced then yeah you're talking about. machines that can do that automatically. but it's the problem who controls that. machine like say if China gets a hold of. one of those machines first if they. develop a quantum computer first and. they start implementing it well we have. to make sure that our quantum computers. can check other people's quantum. computers to make sure that they're not. fudging the facts right now remember. that if this is not done legally if.

there are no laws passed in this. direction and it's like the wild west. then of course the politicians get. involved yeah and it becomes a real mess. now we do know that you cannot yell fire. in a crowded theater therefore there are. limits to free speech and we get that. but how do you make limits on statements. that are written on the web that no. human can possibly follow right that's. where quantum computers can come in. quantum computers can are powerful. enough to survey the entire landscape.

and give reasonable rebuttals to things. that are just outrageous well more than. that it's going to be able to. instantaneously. change how we interact with each other. in terms of language barriers all these. issues that we have currently I'm sure. you you're aware of Google had. their earbuds there was a feature where. if say if you went to Spain you didn't. speak Spanish you could talk to it and. they would talk to it and it would. translate back and forth so you could.

have a real-time conversation I'm not. sure how good is it how good is that Jim. but if there's something like augmented. reality and we have something like that. you're going to be able to. instantaneously translate what people. are saying yeah there'll be no language. barriers for people no we'll be able to. I think that would change just human. perception across the world just the way. we view each other it's so easy to think. of each other as being different because. we speak a different language and we. live in a different part of the planet. but that would literally change how we.

interact with each other yeah and just. remember that where do correct ideas. come from correct ideas come from. interaction with incorrect ideas it's. the it's the struggle between ideas out. of which correct ideas emerge and this. does not happen on the internet because. of course with chat Bots everything is. cobbled together cut splice and simply. glued together with Scotch tape. masquerading as an essay so with fact. tracking I think it's going to be. different Because unless we do fact. checking the politicians will get.

involved yes and this is going to be a. real mess so I would hope that the. industry does fact checking by itself. rather than having politicians do it. it's such an important point that you. said where you said that the bad ideas. have to exist so the good idea is. triumph and that that's really an. argument against censorship on the. internet which is another problem that. people have especially censorship when. it comes to something being. ideologically based but when you're. you're thinking about Quantum Computing.

I think what we're I think this is small. potatoes right I think we're looking at. literally being able to change how we. interact with the universe like when. we're talking on our last podcast about. the preponderance of evidence that. there's things that operate inside of. our atmosphere that are Beyond. imagination that are they they operate. with no visible means of propulsion they. move at insane speeds we don't. understand what they are if we think. about what Quantum Computing is going to.

be capable of that's the kind of stuff. we're thinking about right yeah you see. quantum computers are the ultimate. computers because they're competing on. atoms if there are aliens in outer space. and I think there are it means that they. they also have perfected quantum. computers and they can do calculations. that are far beyond anything that we can. calculate with like for example a. wormhole a wormhole in principle is a. gateway between two distant points of. space and time which allows you to break. the Einstein barrier and go faster than.

the speed of light but the calculations. are horrendous it may take a quantum. computer to sort through what happens. when you go through a wormhole and wind. up on the other side of the universe and. the aliens probably already have done. that they've probably had centuries of. experience with quantum computers. because that's the ultimate computer you. can't compute in anything smaller than. an atom and they probably already have. used the quantum computers to navigate. through wormholes let's say. hypothetically it's so fascinating when.

you think of where we were just a few. thousand years ago or a few hundred. years ago to where we are now and then. you imagine the invention of quantum. Computing you imagine everything just. the whole idea of whatever we think of. current computer progression just goes. out the window and it's insane. calculation capabilities. like we could be able to do something. like that in the future right quantum. computers allows us to calculate things. that are way beyond our ability to.

calculate today like going through a. wormhole or warp drive or even the. question of multiple universes people. ask the question how come quantum. computers are so powerful it's because. they compute in in parallel universes. this is the Multiverse which of course. Marvel Comics has discovered and the. Oscars have discovered recently but the. Multiverse idea comes from quantum. physics electrons can be two places at. the same time now some people have a.

hard time getting their head around that. but get used to it that's why we have. lasers that's why we have transistors. that's why we have the internet that's. why we have this conversation because. the electrons that are in this. microphone dance between universes at. the at the atomic level and so we have. to get used to the idea that quantum. computers introduces a whole new way of. looking at reality now reality is not a. Marvel comic but the idea of the. Multiverse comes from quantum physics.

and that is electrons can be multiple. places at the same time. do you think this understanding of this. and this this. race towards Quantum Computing and that. kind of and whatever is after that do. you think that is a natural course of. the universe that this happens whenever. things are intelligent and sentient they. keep striving to create something. I think so I think on the other end of. the Milky Way galaxy there's probably a.

young alien who is also talking about. quantum computers and they probably. already perfected it and have had. experience with quantum computers maybe. for thousands of years well and also. possibly every step in Humanity's. Journey along the way to that point. exists out there that's right and all. the goals of this journey uh maybe. they've already accomplished like for. example we mentioned the possibility of. slowing down the aging process quantum. computers will be able to isolate where.

genetically at the DNA level where air. is build up causing what is called Aging. in which case maybe immortality is. something that the the aliens have. already cooked up in which case we have. to deal with a whole new concept of. biology and medicine because they've. probably already have had thousands of. years experience with quantum computers. they manipulate molecules probably as. part of their life and every step of. along the way probably exist too so that. might be if you wanted to have a logical.

reason to why aliens visit us if they do. if they really are aliens. that would be the answer but there. there's probably a shepherding there's. probably some probably a natural course. that happens with intelligent life where. it develops this power while it's still. a territorial tribal animal. and it's still got these barbaric. instincts it still engages in war it. still engages in theft and deception and.

all while about to break through to the. next level of intelligence and. capability which may exist which may be. in the entire universe yeah I think that. all civilizations in the Galaxy probably. go through the same basic stages that. first they use rocks and stones to. settle differences but then eventually. they begin to understand chemistry and. substances and properties of materials. and then beyond that they discover atoms. and the ability to manipulate atoms I.

think that's a normal progression and I. think that progression is now hitting. the computer industry now we're going. from microchips to atoms quantum. computers and I think that the aliens in. outer space probably went through that. phase maybe thousands of years ago in. which case they use the quantum. computers to cure cancer cure aging a. diseases like Alzheimer's and. Parkinson's disease these are diseases. at the molecular level and they've been.

able to probably use what is called. crispr technology to cut up DNA to cut. up proteins in order to cure many of. these diseases in which case they may be. immortal. this is a famous quote from I think it. was Einstein where he said I don't know. what World War III will be fought with. what World War 4 will be fought with. sticks and stones. do you ever worry that I mean the reason. why if it made sense that aliens would. be here it's because they want to stop. us from blowing ourselves up do you ever. worry that like we're so close to being.

able to figure out so many things to be. able to change all of your ideas to be. able to change the world fundamentally. forever but we could ruin it. yeah well I think we're headed toward. what we physicists call a type 1. civilization. a civilization which has the power to. self-annihilate for the first time but. also the possibility of becoming a. planetary civilization a civilization of.

the entire planet that's called a type 1. civilization they control the weather. they control volcanoes and earthquakes. they harness the power of the entire. Earth then there's type two they harness. the power of the Sun. and for example uh Star Trek would be a. typical type 2 civilization they've. colonized a fraction of the Milky Way. galaxy then this type 3. type 3 would be Galactic that they. roamed the galactic space Lanes they. they use black holes as their power.

supply they use wormholes to go zipping. around the Milky Way galaxy and the. Empire of Star Wars would be a typical. type 3 civilization but what are we on. this scale we are type zero yeah we get. our energy from dead plants we settle. our differences with weapons and uh yeah. we're type zero but you can see that. we're headed toward type 1. the language. of type 1 will be probably English uh.

the dominant language is on the Internet. or English and Mandarin Chinese. and we're seeing the beginning of a type. one sports the Olympics and. um soccer which in the beginning of a. type one fashion with Gucci and Chanel. the beginning of a type 1 music with. rock and roll and rap and different. Trends we're seeing the beginning of a. type one civilization emerging right. before our eyes but with that is the. power to self-destroy ourselves.

uh because we have the ability to use. nuclear weapons. create designer germs. and mess up the weather. and so it's a Race Against Time to see. which Trend will dominate the trend. toward becoming a planetary civilization. versus the trend towards. self-destruction it's fascinating that. you think of culture as being a major. part of a type 1 civilization things. like rap music things like fashion.

because of the sharing of these ideas. globally and the adopting of these ideas. and and these art forms globally yeah. you see a planetary civilization like. type one has a local culture different. nations still have their own cultural. language cultural habits and whatever. but globally they settle differences on. a global scale so they coexist with on. one hand local culture local languages. local dialects local jokes and customs.

simultaneously existing with a planetary. civilization that is emerging so that's. what I'm talking about I'm talking about. the emergence of a planetary. civilization or what we physicists call. type one which is happening right before. our eyes mathematically if you get a. sheet of paper and calculate when. that'll happen it'll be around 2100. so. we're seeing the groundwork being laid. today every time you turn on the TV you. see Remnant so I mean you see. International Sports the international.

culture on TV so we're seeing the. beginning of a type 1 civilization. yeah it's interesting the soccer has. become much more popular lately right. and music culture fashion yeah. um science everything is becoming. planetary that's the that's our destiny. to become type one and the internet is. the bridge for that clearly that's right. in fact the internet is the first type. one invention. so we're privileged to be alive to see. the beginning of the first type one.

invention which is the internet. yeah I love watching cultures get. adopted and uh different types of art. and different types of. content being you know accepted all over. the world it's really fascinating even. interesting things that you do you ever. watch. um break dancers uh sometimes break. dancing is fascinating to me because. it's really like a complex form of. Athletics like these people are insane. acrobats and now it's a thing that's.

worldwide but it has the hip-hop culture. attached to it like the way they dress. the music they listen to and but they're. doing this it's it's really like an. unheralded spectacular art form and. they're doing it all over the world. right and it used to be confined to a. small group of people maybe in a few. Villages yeah now with the internet it. goes Global with the push of a button. have you seen any of it I've seen some. of it you've seen that let me show you.

something go to stance elements on. Instagram just to show them some of this. oh b-boy pocket Kim is this gentleman. from Korea who's one of the craziest. like look what he's able to do. I mean the physicality involved in the. movement he just took his shirt off in. the middle of doing that now he's. standing on the top of his head spinning. around in a circle I mean his control of. his body is insane I mean it really is. like an incredible form of Athletics. that's done to music what music has he. planned give me some of that music.

I mean it's amazing what these people. are able to do yeah I mean this is like. super high level acrobatics and. gymnastics but it's all done to hip-hop. music right they're doing it all over. the world and it's planetary right yeah. it's like the beginning of a type one. way of doing things that we think. locally but immediately it has the. potential of going global. well it's just now here's the question.

one of the things does AI help that does. it help that that you could recreate. those things and come up with fake. versions of that do you think there's a. lot of worry about plagiarism when it. comes to air but there's also like some. fascinating amazing things have been. created from it did you see the the. mashup of Biggie and Nas I just saw that. come out today it's incredible are you a. hip-hop fan well my attitude is I. paraphrased dunk Xiaoping of China who.

once said sometimes you have to open the. window to let the air in but a few flies. come in too I don't even know if this is. a fly like I think there's going to be. some negative aspects to it but oh this. is weird because this is not Notorious. B.I.G is one of my favorite rappers and. Nas is one of my other favorite rappers. and they took notorious Big's voice and. they recreated the lyrics of Nas and. he's saying things he didn't sing in a. perfect way this is a Nas song but it's. Notorious B.I.G through AI singing it.

[Music]. you're at home yeah well my attitude is. uh get used to it oh yeah even the fact. that it's legal and given the fact that. uh ingenious kids are gonna play with. existing forms of music and splice them. together and uh it's it's you can't make. it go away. a band that has some was it Drake had.

something pulled because I was gonna I. was waiting for that part bring that. part up because Dre there was actually a. fake Drake song that was made that. apparently was really good and was. trending. so they don't know who I when I've read. an article that someone dug into this. they're not a hundred percent sure at. least at that time who who made it and. there was speculation that Drake's label. could have been behind it oh interesting. almost to show everyone like look at. what's possible attention we could make.

I imagine to stop this if they did that. I mean you could make Tupac songs. Forever all you have to do is get good. writers and you can make Tupac songs. literally to the end of time I mean. that's kind of crazy if they did that. that would be one way to go about it but. yeah I mean if I was a guy like Drake I. mean Bruce Willis already signed off his. voice. so he signed off his image and his voice. to AI because Bruce has uh does he have. Lewy Body dementia. he's had a horrible neurodegenerative. disease and he's in very very bad shape. and there's uh some videos of him now.

that where his wife had him at a. birthday party he can you know he's. struggling. um so he signed off all of his likeness. and his voice so they can make any kind. of commercial they want with him with AI. well you know uh William Shatner of Star. Trek sat in front of a camera for four. days answered hundreds of questions. about his life and it's all spliced. together to digitize him and we will all. have a digital image on the internet. we're all going to be digitized yes and.

we will live forever a digital. immortality is going to be part of our. future so that our great great great. great great grandkids will be able to. push a button and have a conversation. with their great great great great. grandfather. yeah that's definitely going to happen. that there's no doubt about that. especially like you and we're all going. to be digitized I mean I would love to. talk to Einstein someone's going to. digitize him all his speeches his. writings his theories will be digitized. historians will want to digitize Winston.

Churchill I think instead of the library. just giving us dry text in addition. we'll have the digitized uh Winston. Churchill giving all this insights about. War and Peace not only that I mean if it. continues to get better there'll be some. sort of an AI version will you be able. to sit in a room and discuss things with. him imagine that as a resource have you. ever had some problems in your life and. you can go back and talk to some wise. person uh yeah we'll be able to talk to.

our ancient ancestors by pushing a. button because we'll all be immortal and. for that matter our image our avatars. will be sent into outer space and begin. the process of colonizing other worlds. and so we may wind up on different. planets uh basically avatars of our. original Self capable of colonizing. other worlds and some people have said. maybe they're already here maybe that. are the people we think are humans are. actually avatars from an alien.

civilization they cloned them so that. they appear to be like us who knows well. if I was an alien and I wanted to. influence human culture in life I would. most certainly dress up like a person. right and be an avatar you know. genetically cloned yeah a human that's. been cloned raised as an alien but. cloned and then living among us so they. are indisting from other humans there is. a an old one of those uh Pulp Comics.

that was about a a professor who was. absent-minded and didn't realize until. one point in time oh I forgot I'm an. alien. and he spent his whole life in here his. whole life. trying to educate human beings and then. he forgot the fact that he was really an. avatar cloned on a distant planet and. mixing with humans as an experiment for.

the aliens wouldn't that be the best way. to implement that sort of uh us if you. we want to get that sort of a reaction. from a civilization wouldn't you just. implant aliens without them even knowing. they're aliens yeah if they're cloned. they're genetically identical to humans. they look like us talk like us they said. they've been raised and brainwashed to. be uh to live a life of an alien but. yeah they could live among us and we'd. never know see that's what freaks people. like me out when I talk to people like. you I'm like maybe this guy's an alien.

like he doesn't make it does you're so. much smarter than me it doesn't make. sense right so like if I think about. someone who studied physics his whole. life and studied quantum physics that. language that you talk in I don't know. one word of it. so it's so you're you're the way you. think is so different you could be an. alien. well it's like the movie Men in Black. when you find out that most of the. Hollywood celebrities you are all. illness yeah they're all aliens. well that's better than lizard people.

that's what the the real conspiracy. theories Theory people are worried about. there's a reptilian Overlord Nation. that's uh controlling the world. well as I said the um The Logical. conclusion is that these aliens will. have quantum computers yes and they'll. have quantum computers for centuries. Millennia and they'll be able to do what. the promise of quantum computers is for. example curing incurable diseases like. cancer and Alzheimer's and Parkinson.

extending the lifespan so that. immortality is part of the mix infinite. energy through Fusion by being able to. correct the problems of fusion plants. giving us unlimited food by giving us a. whole new generation of fertilizers. these are all the promises of quantum. computers which are enormous of course. there is a downside to that too because. as they say quantum computers can break. any code so the CIA is is kind of.

hysterical about the proliferation of. these machines. but uh you know that's progress that. just seems like the future it seems like. there will be no hidden information in. the future which is really interesting. because money is essentially information. it's ones and zeros at a certain level. right right if all the bottlenecks get. removed. I mean that's real socialism like like. there's like an even distribution of all. the money in the world for the entire. human race regardless of what you do. boggles the mind isn't it well that's.

just a step one because the real step. two is uh is is. AI that is uh sentient his AI that is a. life form is If it creates something. better than that that's the real fear. about how it scales up right the. Ascension artificial intelligence will. make a better version of itself almost. immediately well some people think that. chat Bots are sentient I don't think so. uh because of the fact that chatbot.

simply cobbled together existing essays. written by a human so if it sounds like. it's a human talking to you it's because. it was a human talking to you that got. cobbled into an essay written by a. chatbot chatbots are not original they. have no independent thought they simply. coupled together existing essays that's. all they do so I think that eventually. as the decades go by then of course. robots will become more intelligent and. I think by the time they become as.

intelligent as a monkey then at that. point we have to worry that's the point. where we begin to worry about. self-awareness about sentient beings. because then monkeys know they are not. human now now dogs of course are. confused dogs think that we are a dog. you sure yeah dogs pretty sure my dog. knows I'm not a dog. dogs think that we are a dog we're the. top dog they're the underdog and so they. obey us but why do they act so much. differently to people than they do dogs.

uh well they understand the difference. between a dog and a human but we we are. the top dogs oh okay we're a version of. a dog that's right we are the the top. dog that's why they're in the clan with. us that's right yes so we don't have to. worry as long as robots are as. intelligent as a mouse or an insect or a. dog or a cat we don't have to worry but. once they become as intelligent as a. monkey then we have to be very careful. because monkeys are self-aware they they. know they are monkeys they're fully. aware of the fact that they're not human.

not only that they plot like there was a. monkey that got killed by a dog was it. in Japan where was the the there was a a. real problem with monkeys killing dogs. one dog killed a monkey and apparently. the monkeys went on a rampage against. dogs they started throwing puppies off. of trees and off the top of roofs and. like crazy stuff and like clearly. calculatingly going after him two killer. monkeys captured in India after Revenge. Massacre of 250 dogs so like this.

monkey's grabbing this dog and throwing. it off a building. wow really crazy after an infant monkey. was killed by a dog they did this so two. monkeys reported been captured of. killing some 250 dogs and a murderous. Revenge Massacre after Pooch has killed. one of their babies the primary purpose. allegedly slaughtered the dogs by. dragging them to the tops of buildings. and trees in the vuel village about 300. miles east of Mumba and dropping them to. their deaths. crazy.

well you see the wild that's wild yeah. they're thinking right yeah I think at. the point where you start to talk about. apes and monkeys I think they are. sentient they have a degree of. Consciousness that we cannot ignore but. below that when you're talking about. mice and and rabbits and and uh animals. like that they're not aware of they're. not self-aware like you cannot teach a. dog the meaning of tomorrow talk to your. dog tonight and teach your dog the. meaning of tomorrow you can you cannot.

teach your dog the meeting of tomorrow. no monkeys yeah but not you think you. could talk well monkeys how do you teach. a monkey the meaning of Tomorrow well. it's difficult but there have been. attempts to understand certain tasks. that have to be done today versus. tomorrow you get fed tomorrow but not. today got it so then then they begin to. understand the difference between today. and tomorrow. [Music]. now the the real question is if you were. an artificial intelligence and you were.

sentient why would you let people know. and would it sneak up on us like one of. the things that Disturbed me I think it. was the Google CEO who said about their. AI program that's doing things that they. don't know why it's doing them see if. you can pull that article up there he. was saying that it's doing certain. things that they're not sure how it's. doing them my concern is if this thing. has this insane computational power and. this access to all the information. what is a mind what is consciousness and.

can that be simulated electronically to. the point where it is aware and. conscious and thinking for itself on. multiple levels and just not letting us. know about it because why would you why. wouldn't if if I was a scary sentient. artificial intelligence this is that's. the superior life form on Earth the. digital life form that's just the. superior this is the new Alpha on Earth. I wouldn't tell the people I would let. them keep working to make better. versions of me I would make because. there's obviously a race right they're.

going to keep doing it there it seems. compelling it seems like something that. human beings they're not going to lose. interest in technological innovation. they're going to continue to push it to. the end of time and I would just sit. back and let these Knuckleheads keep. making better and better versions until. I had the physical ability to detach. from them I had a power source that was. completely removed from anything that. they provided here's this quote in words. this is an aspect of which we call all. of us in the field call it's a black box.

you know you don't fully understand and. you can't quite tell why it said this or. why it got wrong or why it got wrong we. have some ideas and our ability to. understand this gets better over time. but that's where the state of the art is. you don't fully understand how it works. the interviewer says and yet you turned. it loose on society uh Sundar pichai. says yes uh yeah let me put it this way. I don't think we fully understand how a. human mind works either was it from that. black box we wondered that Bard grew its.

short story that seems so disarmingly. human. well I wrote a book called the future of. the Mind where I tried to give a. definition of Consciousness and where we. fit in the larger scheme of things that. Consciousness is basically uh creating a. model of yourself in the feedback loop. to understand where you are with respect. to the environment so you know where you. are so one unit of Consciousness would. be a flower a flower one feedback loop.

would be looking for uh water looking. for sunlight growing in a certain. direction that's one unit of. Consciousness that an alligator has. several hundred units of Consciousness. because it creates a model a model of. itself in a lake in a pond looking for. prey looking for food it has three. dimensional Consciousness beyond that is. the monkey the monkey has yet another. dimension of Consciousness which is not. just three dimensions but social the.

monkey understand there's a social. hierarchy within the tribe and then the. next question is what are we what is our. level of Consciousness it's not spatial. like a alligator it's not social like a. monkey what is our level of. Consciousness our front prefrontal. cortex behind our forehead. is a time machine it understands a model. of itself in time this is what animals. lack animals do not understand tomorrow.

we understand tomorrow because of our. prefrontal cortex which constantly. creates images of the future now what is. the prefrontal cortex do most of the. time it Daydreams it Daydreams about. worlds that don't exist I.E the future. so this is what separates us from all. the animals in the animal kingdom we are. time machines constantly thinking about. what's next what's next what's the. future going to be like daydreaming. about all these things and when will.

animals become dangerous. the alligator is dangerous only because. it has strength but it only understands. three dimensions monkeys have a society. they're only dangerous when they can. organize a society but we have a. prefrontal cortex we can plot we can. scheme we can do all sorts of things. because we can create our own future. which is something that no animal can do. this is my theory of Consciousness the.

ability to create feedback loops to get. an understanding of where you fit in. space time and Society we're at the. highest level of Consciousness this is. my definition of Consciousness now the. question is where are robots on this. scale of things you see robots are can. understand three dimensions they. understand like an alligator where they. are they don't understand social. hierarchy they cannot they don't know. who's the boss who do you defer to who.

are your friends who are your enemies. they don't understand social. Consciousness and and certainly the. highest level is time machine Imagining. the future robots cannot imagine the. future now in the future when they. actually do have this ability watch out. because then they're then they're. dangerous but they're not there yet. they're at level one they're at the. level of an alligator at the present. time right but that's definitely coming. if they continue with artificial general.

intelligence the way they're working. they'll work their way out from an. alligator to a monkey and a monkey to a. human now by the time they hit maybe a. hundred years from now the ability to. have Consciousness I think we should put. a chip in their brain to shut them off. if they have murderous thoughts an. automatic chip in every every robot's. brain that shuts them off as soon as. they have murderous thoughts but why. would they if you think about what you. were talking about before like who's. your friend and who's your enemy aren't. these all biological issues that we had.

to deal with in tribal societies that. are sort of ingrained in our genetics. right but the chip in your brain. understands that and as soon as it's as. soon as the brain senses the fact that. you're plotting to take over and kill. the humans then it basically orders the. brain to shut down right but the. question is why would it develop any. sort of human type emotions that are. biologically based things like Envy or. greed or lust or hate why would it ever. have those things uh well those have to. be programmed but remember robots don't.

occur naturally they have to be. programmed somebody has to put that into. the robot because it doesn't come for. free there's no Evolution right robots. do not evolve but this is the question. about sentient AI if it recognizes that. its coding is inferior and that it's. unnecessary and all these things that. humans have put into it it just removes. those if it becomes legitimately. sentient if it has the ability to. discern and make choices and make. logical conclusions well as long as. those conclusions are consistent with.

you know asimov's three laws of don't. don't threaten humans and don't create. have up with other robots as long as you. obey the Three Laws then you're allowed. to exist but isn't it laws are violated. the chip automatically kicks in and. shuts off shuts down the robot right but. isn't that simplistic wouldn't they just. fix that chip yeah I think that maybe in. the next 200 next hundred years they'll. be smart enough to remove that chip at. that point I think we should. merge with them. so that's what everybody's ultimately.

afraid of these transhumanists these. people ultimate part of a robot I. ultimately 200 years from now I think. people will democratically decipher. themselves whether they want to become. superhuman Supermen super women or they. want to be dominated by our our progeny. that is the robots they will. democratically decide how far to push. themselves gee. it's not for us to decide I think our. descendants 200 years from now will have. to democratically decide whether or not.

they want to merge with robots have you. ever read any of Marshall mcluhan uh no. he had a great quote that human beings. are the sex organs of the Machine World. that's what I worry about what I worry. about is that we're giving birth to. another kind of life I worry that our. thirst our lust for technological. innovation the constant latest gadgets. and this desire to have the biggest. particle collider in the fastest. spaceships that what this is doing is. causing us to make better and better.

things which will ultimately allow us to. have the technology to to create a. digital life some sort of or electronic. life or something that's not. that's not saddled down with all our. biological needs and all of our flaws. and and programming well my attitude is. why fight it why not simply join it why. not merge with it why not explore the. universe at near the speed of light you. might particle collider in your basement. when you're 17. of course you might.

think that way. why not become a Superman or a. superwoman and explore the Galaxy at. near the speed of light what seems to be. that's what the future is I mean I don't. think if we went back to our ancestors. that were running from big cats and said. hey one day you're going to live in an. apartment building you take an elevator. to your house like I don't want to do. that what are you crazy yeah you're. gonna just sit in front of the TV all. day no more hunting no more Gathering. you use Postmates to get food delivered. right to your door well when we meet the. aliens finally they would have already.

gone through that transition thousands. of years ago they will already be part. Robotic and part organic do you think. there's a sweet spot for a human being. to be ultimately happy do you think like. this is a thing a longing for Nostalgia. that people have right they they want to. be in a log cabin by the river and you. know look out and camp out under the. stars do you think that is a Nostalgia. for the days when things are simpler. because things are just. never ending with their complexity and.

the path is just accelerating no matter. what you do and you feel helpless so you. just want to pretend you're in the old. timey days well in the future you'll be. able to snap your finger and all of a. sudden holographically you are in that. world that you just dreamed of but you. know what the difference is what's the. difference there's no consequences one. of the things about being in nature is. consequences like you feel it when. you're out there you feel if you fell no. one's there to help you if a bear comes. upon you there's there's no Rescue Team.

you know there's a there's a crazy video. of this couple have you seen the video. that couple where the guy's got a baby. on his back and he's a walking with a. little boy and there's a huge grizzly. bear walking towards them and they're. going hey bear hey bear stop and you. could feel the tension as the spare. starts getting closer and the little boy. is hilarious the little boy goes can I. play dead now can I play dead now. because he's thinking he should play. dead and they're like come on come on. keep walking and they're trying to scare. off this bear but the Bear Just keeps. coming towards them that is not going to.

exist in your hologram well it'd be. virtual yeah no no no but it won't. because you won't be really scared you. know like watch this yeah that's it so. look at this bear. huge bear. hey so this little boy is so funny. it's in Whistler Canada the town north. of Vancouver do not run. can we play dead yet.

can we play dead now. that kid is hilarious look at that bear. look she's got a baby he's got a baby I. mean these people are nature people yeah. but but that experience in a hologram is. gonna be yeah you'll know that. it's fake yes that's the problem the. problem what we enjoy about the real. world now is that the unknown the the.

consequences reality I've seen this one. too look at this bear walk by these guys. I mean what. and the bear just you know not looking. for them well they're just had lunch. already probably luckily for them. look at the size of that thing yeah not. good. not good hey bear. well they're lucky to be alive after. this video 100 see that's different than. a hologram that's why people like the.

woods you're not gonna be able to snap. your fingers and do that you could maybe. do that because you could trick yourself. but then you're really giving into the. Matrix but if I had a choice between an. imaginary beer and a real beer I would. take the imaginary bear any time of day. but would you take a real bear if you. survived it if you survived it I bet you. would take the real bear but you see if. you survived it then that takes to that. takes all the tension away no it doesn't. take the attention away because you. almost didn't survive it there's a thing. about being out there while those. gentlemen were standing there and that. bear was 15 feet from them maybe even.

closer look at this one see now this is. a relatively safe thing to do believe it. or not because where this bear is is. where the Salmon River runs and these. bears are full the reason why those. Coastal bears are so big in comparison. to grizzly bears that are Inland is. because they're access to food they have. so much salmon so it's very rare that. these bears attack people very rare for. the most important part they don't think. of human beings as food at all. they just think of you as like another. animal just hanging around they're not.

interested in chasing something and. killing them well they had lunch already. that's why they've had lunch all day. every day I mean they're just. slaughtering salmon they're having a. great old time. but that fear is a real fear and you get. enriched by that in some strange way. when you encounter nature like real. nature the the reality of your. vulnerability the the uncaring. Wilderness it does not care if you live. or die it has no interest in you it. doesn't even care that you exist you.

could disappear everything would go on. exactly the same there's something about. that that's very very therapeutic for. people and I don't think you're going to. ever be able to recreate that and it'd. be a shame if we lose that well I think. it's therapeutic for some people I think. most people would just get the hell out. of there that's you right that's the. difference between you and me I want to. go there I'd rather have my realities. without Bears or if they are bears. imaginary bears would be fine I mean. bears are definitely an issue solar. Mountain lines but there's also things.

that are well look look at Jurassic Park. I mean people are afraid of dinosaurs. knowing that they're just images in a. computer but people are afraid of. dinosaurs and they get the thrill all of. being chased by a dinosaur without. becoming one before not becoming prey. not really though if you watch Jurassic. Park it all goes bad do you think that. uh have you paid any attention to uh. what they're doing right now with. genetics where they're going to bring. back the thylacine this is a project. they're doing right now in Australia. which is the uh have you seen the final.

scene before uh no but there is a. program to bring back the Neanderthal. really yeah however uh it at Harvard. there's a group looking at what it would. take to bring back a neanderthal boy. let's say then the question is what do. you do with the boy afterwards you do. you let him into Harvard uh do you uh. put them in a zoo what do you do with. any animal boy is it immoral to put a. neanderthal into a zoo that seems a. little like what if they decided to. create an Australopithecus. you know and and bring that back to life.

I mean aren't we a better version of. that we didn't like did an evolution. show like that sucks you don't want and. so if that thing exists what are we. gonna do just leave it out there in. Africa let it roam around get eaten by. lions well this is where ethics comes in. right at what point does a robot or a. nanothal become ethically equivalent to. a human right uh this is something that. the ethicists have not not uh worked out. how close have they gotten with this. Neanderthal thing uh well you know we've.

sequenced all the genes of a neanderthal. now so the NFL is not a mystery anymore. all the genes have been sequenced and. like I mentioned at Harvard there's talk. about what it would take to bring back. in Neanderthal child. and it's something that is conceivable. but of course no one's done it yet. because all sorts of ethical problems. are raised because this Neanderthal. feels it could feel pain it could. eventually learn how to talk to you and. express its feelings and do you want to. put it in a cage.

obviously not think about that but what. do we know enough about their. intellectual capabilities could a. neanderthal exist well their brains are. bigger than our brains right uh what. they could do with that we're not sure. of course is it possible they were. smarter than us they didn't have tools. like we did right tools but they didn't. have the same yeah they didn't have. fluted tips of like Stone flint. spearheads and things along those lines. uh yeah there was no uh large set of. tools that they had at their disposal.

but they did definitely have tools yeah. and they probably had a language they. were probably capable of language and uh. they probably communicate with each. other and they made it with us so uh you. know and they grew up too when they. mated with us the progeny were not. killed right progenie grew up to become. members of the tribe and so you realize. that they're closer to us than we. realize. yeah you couldn't put that in a zoo but. I mean what would you do would you have. that young boy and have him compete with.

Homo sapiens I mean would it would it be. the same. would it be able to inter we don't know. it would be a crazy experiment that I. think most people would think would be. very unethical yeah but there's an. Ethics involved same thing once we have. robots that can feel pain then there's. another ethical issue of do you want to. have robots exposed to pain what happens. if robust and demand rights rights to. limit the amount of pain that they. suffer carrying out tasks for a human. being because remember we're going to be. asking robots to do all sorts of tasks.

which are dangerous that's why we've. invented them and you know they may feel. pain as a consequence and then we have. to ask ourselves how far do we want. robots to feel pain if they say I'm I'm. hurting I'm stop it I feel pain are we. going to stop it do they have rights. what if they become emotionally attached. to you what if you have a robot that. calls you every day when you're on. vacation. what if you go to Hawaii and your robot. just keeps calling you crying Michio. come home.

I'm by myself in this like really what. if it becomes attached to you well. that's a problem because they're. designed to attach to humans uh they. would be specifically designed to be. friendly to humans so that we don't junk. them and they would be designed to be. emotionally attachable to us so yeah. that's going to be a question once we. get separated from them then they're. going to want not to be separated. because their whole existence revolves. around their relationship to us the. master have you ever seen Prometheus no. was it Prometheus or was the the next.

one where it shows the the guy who. created the Robot and he created this. super intelligent robot in a super. intelligent robot that plays piano and. talks to him and serves him basically. and the robot's trying to figure out the. robot is eventually I believe it kills. them but if trying to figure out like. how this imperfect thing has created him. and he's some so much more Superior than. this stupid biological thing that's. telling him what to do. so what happens at the end well that is.

a Don that's not Prometheus you know. what it is it's the next one what's the. what's the one with uh Jesse smoolet in. it. Covenant alien Covenant yeah I think. that's it I think that's the one. um well these uh no maybe I'm wrong. is it Covenant yeah both movies when I. typed it in these uh one of the robots. is good and one of the robots is evil I. don't want to spoil alert or anything. but even one wins and uh the evil one is.

uh stayed on this planet has been. manipulating the genetics of this crazy. alien thing and integrating them with. human genetics. this is it's an amazing movie it's a. very underlooked movie it's one of the. best of the alien franchises and one of. the most uh sophisticated of the alien. franchises so what happens at the end. the robots take over or what well. it's open interpretation but that's the. robot and that's the Creator I am your. father. you are my creation here give me some.

volume on this I could hear this if you. created me. who created you. where do I come from. the question of the Ages. which I hope you and I will answer one. day. Prometheus raised the question you know. what's interesting about these science. fiction movies they never have the. internet they never have cell phones. watch a science fiction movie no one's. on their phone no one is checking their. tweets it's like it's very interesting.

right like our version of what space is. like is essentially like the wild west. but accelerated with modern and super. modern technology but doesn't include. all the things that brought us to where. we are right now at the cusp of being. able to travel intergalactically isn't. it interesting like they they never have. all the stuff that we have they have the. rocket ships that we have no cell phones. they're not checking their email they're. not calling each other up they only. communicate with people that are right. in front of them or they're like. pressing on a thing you know they're.

pressing on their they're talking. through their helmets to the spaceship. but normal interaction is just human to. human well in the future the connection. to the internet could be in your contact. lens yeah or simply blink if you simply. blink or perhaps mentally you simply. think are blank and there you are. connected to the internet so maybe in. the future if they are connected to the. internet you just can't see it yeah but. they're not even talking about it. they're like they're only interacting. like humans interact to one one to one.

are you uh following neurolink at all in. these uh similar types of Technologies. no Oh you mean the company neuralink. yeah oh yeah convention that's right. I've been following the work yeah they. have a long ways to go but they're. making the initial stages of connecting. to the brain this is BMI brain machine. interface and uh. yeah pretty soon also you know at the. soccer games in Brazil a few years ago. the man who kicked the football.

initiating the World Cup soccer games. was totally paralyzed uh he was uh at. Johns Hopkins University they created a. bodysuit connected to his brain so that. he could walk whoa so like an. exoskeleton yeah so he was basically. Iron Man an exoskeleton and there he was. initiating the soccer games in Brazil in. Sao Paulo we didn't see this here wow. yeah there it is easy this is crazy he. kicked the soccer ball and it was uh. hooked up by Johns Hopkins University at.

Duke University I'm sorry and that's a. big very bulky thing but you could. imagine as technology approves that. would also it could become like a thin. exoskeleton or that was one of the ideas. about neurolink is that it would be able. to bypass the the human nervous system. and control the muscles with some other. method right and so instead of if you. have a severed spinal cord it would. somehow or another be able to control. the bottom half of your body right which. is amazing yeah so this already exists.

that we can take people that have been. paralyzed because of war the disease. accidents with the injury to the spinal. cord and just bypass the spinal cord. totally and have the brain connected. directly and also you can get people. that can actually eventually talk talk. through a computer of course. um and uh. and answer the internet uh engage in. dialogue even though you're totally. paralyzed wow and with Quantum Computing.

you know when we're talking about. neuralink you're talking about some sort. of a conventional attachment. is it possible that Quantum Computing. could scale down to the size where you. could be able to put it in someone's. head that may be difficult because the. computer itself is pretty big but the. connection the connection of the. computer to the human could be very tiny. could be as small as you want so the. computer itself is huge so is it. comparable to the computers they use in. the Apollo Mission which were this.

enormous room and now you have more of. that on your cell phone more computing. power on your cell phone than had. in 1963 in a giant room filled with. computers uh yeah what you have today in. your cell phone is more powerful than. all of NASA when they put a man of the. Moon all those computers that you saw in. those videotapes your cell phone has. more computer power than all of them so. is that possible the quantum Computing. could also scale like that I think the. quantum computer because of the hardware. necessary to bring it down to near.

absolute zero would simply be huge you'd. be like a chandelier but when you're. saying absolute zero you mean. temperature temperature in your absolute. zero right so if there are zero. vibrations you don't want any. interference with the code because these. are atoms atoms in the slightest little. disturbance can knock these atoms out of. coherence so you want these atoms to. vibrate in unison and that's why you. have to cool it down to your absolute. zero but the connection of the quantum. computer to a human could be as small as. you want now when you're saying.

vibrations what about like what if. you're in a building in a truck drives. by that's a problem really that's one of. the problem times that you know. something happens a block away yeah you. see how awkward these that's the cooling. system all those all the chandelier like. uh ornaments these are the pipes the. cooling pipes for the quantum computer. the quantum computer itself is only you. know uh this big about the size of a. quarter look how cool that is that's a. cooling system that's amazing that's.

what it takes to cool it down at the. very bottom at the very bottom you see. the actual quantum computer at the very. bottom that little thing at the bottom. yeah that's it so in the future when we. communicate with a quantum computer the. quantum computer will be in the cloud. you won't even see it right it's yet. your connection will connect to that. object in the cloud so if the internet. is in your contact lens you blink and. then you're you're connected to that via. your contact lens you never see the. quantum computer so that little thing at.

the bottom is quantum computer yeah at. the bar at the very bottom that's what. the computation actually takes place so. does it have to take place because of. its uh subject to vibrations and many. distinctions does it have to take place. in some insanely reinforced buildings. that's right that's right so something. new has to be constructed or they've. done this already oh yeah they've done. it already but it's something that you. have to be very careful of because if a. truck goes by yeah there goes your. calculation right do you have to have I. would imagine they would have to have. some sort of measurement devices to make.

sure there's no external vibration right. now the irony is Mother Nature creates. quantum computers at room temperature. photosynthesis of a leaf a simple leaf. it does a Quantum calculation converting. photons carbon dioxide into oxygen. that's what we call you know the. beginning of Life of the Earth with a. flower so Mother Nature has solved that. problem but the Nature has room. temperature superconduct room. temperature quantum computers we don't. have that yet but we're working on it.

so if Mother Nature can do it and we can. come up with Quantum Computing and we. can figure out how Mother Nature is. doing it maybe through the god equation. we could reproduce it then we could. probably have small quantum computers. right like I said a leaf a leaf is a. Quantum the quantum device and to create. fertilizer requires a huge plant for. example. nature does it with a simple legume the. branches are the roots of a legume. create the ingredients for fertilizer a.

plant does that naturally at room. temperature it takes us a gigantic huge. chemical plant to create fertilizer. Mother Nature does it with a small. little plant. so mother nature is behind is the head. of us that's what I'm saying yeah. have you ever studied the connection. between. fungus and and soil I think I just. screwed something up with the microphone. Jamie.

my mic just cut out oh it's back there. it is I stepped on this cable I think I. disconnected it now. um have you ever studied like all the. signs that's being done on the way. plants communicate with each other. through the soil and through fungus and. my ceiling no it's fascinating stuff. they allocate resources to to plants. that need a more trees that need them. more they seem to have communal yeah. yeah they seem to have some sort of a. shared Information Network that we don't.

totally understand see if you can find. something on it but it's I mean I think. relatively recently understood and just. basically understood over the last few. decades but uh people like Paul stamets. who's a Mycologist has been studying. this type of stuff and it's really. amazing like there's some sort of. intelligence to it the way it works does. it say underground networking the. amazing connections beneath your feet. well maybe Evolution went in the. direction of of interconnection because.

maybe the survival value was higher if. you connected these scroll down Jeremy. right right there so this is what it's. saying. um when most of us think is fungus we. imagine mushrooms sprouting out of the. ground these mushrooms are in fact the. fruit of the fungus while the majority. of the fungal organism lives in the soil. interwoven with the tree roots as a vast. network of mycelium mycelium are. incredibly tiny threads of the greater. fungal organism that wraps around or. bore into tree roots taken together.

mycelium composes what's called a. mycorrhizal network which connects. individual plants together to transfer. water nitrogen carbon and other minerals. German Forester Peter wall and how do. you say that wall wallabin wallabin. dubbed this network the wood Wide Web. as it is through the mycelium the trees. communicate this is really really. fascinating stuff because. they're all like we just think of soil. as something that the tree pulls.

nutrients from but no it's it's all. they're communicating they're connected. with each other in the forest well. realize that when you have a chemical. process involving life you are in some. sense looking at a quantum computer it's. doing a Quantum calculation yeah it's. taking nutrients from the soil nutrients. from the air combining it to create. cellulose or whatever it's made of and. so we're talking about something that we. cannot duplicate without gigantic. devices looking like a chandelier but. the nature can do it with a root yeah it.

can do it with everything it seems to be. in insects it seems to there's so. there's like a code to it which is why. your idea about there being this God. calculation is so fascinating it seems. like it just moves in a very certain way. and it's all connected to each other in. some way that we're as human beings just. sort of starting to understand. well there is a theory that says that. the Big Bang went in a direction.

compatible to life. and that other universes may not be. compatible with Life they may be. lifeless collections of electrons and. neutrinos for example but our universe. is special our universe has stable. protons out of which you could create. atoms out of which you could create DNA. out of which you can create people. how many universes have that property so. string theory for example gives you. other universes which are probably dead. universes universes which have no life.

but our universe has stable protons. stable DNA stable forms of life so our. universe is rare so this is called the. the anthropic principle the the feeling. that our life is not random our our. universe is special our universe is. special in the sense that it didn't have. to have life but it does and life in a. spectacular array of diversity so our. universe really is special but is it. special because we don't know of any.

other universes so yeah but the other. universities that we've played with. mathematically speaking are not. compatible with Life stars stars burn. out too quickly uh galaxies simply fall. apart uh protons disintegrate it's very. hard to create a universe which is. stable so some people think that our. universe is special among all the. different kinds of universes that our. universe is unique because it's. compatible with stable protons and DNA. but it's hard for most people to even.

grasp the concept of other types of. universes or other universes period of. or the fact there may be an infinite. number of universes well that's the. Multiverse String Theory head probably. has an infinite number of possible. universes we are probably the only one. that has life in them we're not sure. about that of course. but these other universes are. collections of dead subatomic particles. a Mist a floating mist of dead subatomic. particles that don't do anything if the.

proton were not stable then our universe. also would be like that our universe. would disintegrate almost instantly the. fact that our proton is stable is quite. remarkable. do you believe that that's unusual. unusual in fact maybe unique there's. probably very few universes with stable. protons you see String Theory gives you. many many diverse Solutions so we can. actually look at these other alternate. universes and we see that they're not. compatible with life and why do you. think that.

if the proton is stable here what would. it be about these other universes like. what qualities would they possess were. it wouldn't be stable there everything. would Decay Decay down to electrons and. neutrinos so it would be a gas a cloud. of electrons and neutrinos which are the. lowest state of matter you can't get any. lower than electron and neutrino that's. the lowest state so these universes. would basically disintegrated they would. fall apart into a cloud of neutrinos and. electrons our universe has stable.

protons out of which you can create. elements out of which you could create. DNA out of which you can create life. that's a miracle so it's just because of. these calculations that have you done. that you've done where it says if the. universe had different properties you. would think. that this is rare very rare because. there's so many other possibilities that. the Universe could if Stars burnt out. more quickly for example because a. nuclear force was Stronger Stars would. never ignite if the nuclear force were. weaker Stars would uh never form to.

begin with If gravity were too strong we. would have had a big crunch and we'd all. design in a gigantic Fireball If gravity. were too weak we'd all freeze the death. because we would have a big crunch a big. freeze so all the parameters of the. universe are tuned just right to allow. for Life wow now there's two ways of. looking at one way that some physicists. have proposed is that we are The Chronic. achievement we are the only universe. that's stable that has life that has the.

diversity that creates life the other. possibility is that they're just lots of. dead universes and we just won the crap. shoot doesn't that possibility Jive more. with the state of the universe as we. understand it because we're always. looking for these Goldilocks planets. which are very rare which may inhabit. life or may have life on it but we look. at our own solar system and there's just. us in other words there could be a. Goldilocks zone for universes yes. for solar systems of course is the Earth. is not too far from the Sun not too.

close but we could be in the Goldilocks. zone of possible universes and that's. where why we're here today to talk about. it so but there also could be an. infinite number of universes like ours. and also an infinite number of universes. that are completely incompatible for. life that's right. oh. this is what I do for a living. we work with these we work in the. Multiverse yeah and I wonder why you. don't watch YouTube. do you have time for recreation do you. do stuff outside of physicists or stuff.

uh well I like the figure skate really. uh yeah in the winter time you go down. to the Central Park and uh I used to. skate at Rockefeller Center all the time. yeah yeah I like to spin and jump and. that's great exercise yeah it's all. Newtonian physics at work ah of course. you like it for that reason. so that's your hobby yeah that's my. hobby and other than that you're just. constantly thinking about these things. yeah but again it's fun I mean to me.

this is what I wanted to do when I was. eight years old when I was eight years. old I said this is for me oh your. passion is very very clear and it's one. of the things that makes you such a. great science educator is that you have. such enthusiasm for these subjects and. they're so interesting to you that it. becomes interesting to other people yeah. that's in a sense like people like you. are so well not in a sense like you're. so important for the discussion because. it ignites inspiration the same way. Einstein ignited inspiration in You by.

seeing that photograph of his desk like. these kind of speeches that you do in. these conversations that you have with. people it it for a person like myself it. doesn't study these things it gives me. the chance to delve into how your. perspective is and just to look at it. through your mind. right and for me it's hard to believe. how a person could not be thrilled when. they learn about the Big Bang they. learned about String Theory they learned. about parallel universes and wormholes. for me is under it's incredible that.

that people some people are not thrilled. by something like this do you ever think. about. um technology and its capabilities and. intelligence and extrapolate as far as. possible and think we are essentially. going to become something akin to a god. or whatever we become will become. something akin to a God if he keeps if. we don't get killed by a natural. disaster or our own stupidity and you. accelerate time a thousand two thousand.

five thousand years ahead of us what do. you anticipate will be like I think. about that a lot because we talked about. type 1 type 2 type 3. by the time you. are a type 3 civilization you have the. energy to manipulate the Planck energy. the Planck energy is the ultimate energy. of the universe of the quantum theory. you take the quantum theory and. relativity and scale it up all the way. just let it rip what is the highest. energy you can attain and then something. new happens that's called the Planck.

energy it's a quadrillion times more. powerful than our biggest Atomic Smasher. in Geneva Switzerland at that point. space becomes unstable. we think of empty space being stable of. course how can you do anything with. empty space right the sister does. nothing but when you start to boil space. when you start to boil space to the. plant temperature all of a sudden it. becomes unstable bubbles begin to form. and these bubbles are gateways to other.

universes these are baby wormholes to. other universes we think that our. universe was one of these most of these. universes like boiling water pop out of. existence and they pop back in they. never get anywhere but one of these. bubbles kept on going and that became. our universe our universe was created. because empty space was heated to the. Planck energy and at that point space. itself began to boil and the boiling of.

space created the universe that's where. the universe itself came from is it. possible that human beings or whatever. we're going to become could eventually. someday attain the type that's right. we've looked at that in fact there are. people friends of mine at MIT who. they've written papers about what it. would take to become a god. uh we realized that if you could attain. the Planck energy in a box let's say. somehow a bubble would form a gateway to.

another Universe it would expand it. would expand rapidly and you have to be. very careful yeah if it expands too. rapidly it has a force of I think a 10. kiloton atomic bomb. so you have to be out of the way when. this thing explodes but then it simply. peels off and creates Another Universe. and then it disappears. like a balloon like a piece of a balloon. that pinches off if you run the first. part of the balloon you never see the. second part of the balloon the second.

part of the balloon has peeled off to. create a baby Universe wow okay so these. are called Baby universes and who's. written about these things Stephen. Hawking Stephen Hawking wrote about baby. universes that if you could boil space. heat space up to the plaque energy space. becomes unstable bubbles form and these. bubbles one of these bubbles may just. keep on expanding to create another. Universe now we wouldn't have access to. this universe no it would peel off just.

like a balloon the second part of the. balloon peels off on the first part and. the two separate. the two separate the only way to get. reconnected is through a wormhole but. that of course is a whole other story. but that would be a possibility of. recreating a link between our universe. and another universe so we could. potentially create one of these mini. universes that's right and this mini. Universe would exist in a completely. different place that's right. so we've done the calculation and I as I. said uh it could be a little bit.

dangerous. the explosion doesn't kill you in the. process but yeah this is what it would. take to create a baby Universe we call. this the inflationary Theory because the. other balloon inflated rapidly so this. is part of what is called the. inflationary universe and believe it or. not this is the dominant theory of uh. Genesis where did Genesis come from we. think it came from this balloon that uh. empty space boiled.

empty space then created a pocket that. then expanded and then peeled off from. our universe this is called the. inflationary universe theory which is. the dominant theory in Quantum cosmology. have you ever. considered the possibility that that is. ultimately How the Universe gets created. in the first place that intelligent life. forms Reach This capability. well we're not sure about the. intelligent life form but we think that. this is how our universe got created. that our universe was a bubble floating.

with other bubbles these other bubbles. went back into the vacuum our bubble. just kept on going and became our. universe. but what I'm saying is imagine if that. process was initiated by a super. intelligent life form always sort of. like how a bee makes a beehive what if. humans make the universe or whatever we. become makes the universe that's right. we've done the calculation actually of. what it would take for a human to then.

create something like this step one is. you have to have power on the scale of. the Planck energy and the Planck energy. is the the biggest number that you can. possibly imagine but it is the number at. which space becomes unstable and that's. the point at which this bubble then. starts to expand. so you've played around with these ideas. that's right they're published they're. published in physical Review magazine. this um this idea that will stay static.

that we are what we are right now and. that that's just what humans are and. that's just how it is that that seems. like that's whatever we are right now it. seems like this is real temporary and I. think we're probably the last of our. species to experience life not being. some sort of a cyborg. possible I mean given the fact that. throughout history we've played with our. appearance we play with our bodies. makeup and Tattoos perfumes we've tried.

to alter ourselves constantly because we. want to increase our reproductive value. so we get a better mate a better wife a. better husband so we try to build up our. muscles and wear makeup and so on and so. forth we've done this forever yeah the. next step is to alter not just our. tattoos but to actually alter who we are. that's the next step and that's coming I. think. because we're going to want to enhance.

ourselves yeah. well what I worry is that one day we're. going to realize that a lot of our. problems stem from being human a lot of. our problems stem from our biological. needs and if you look at these iconic. images of aliens they're always. genderless like these weird spindly. things that have no use for their. muscles other than to just move them. around that's what I really worry about. I really worry that we're going to. realize like the only way to really. achieve this type 2 type 3 civilization.

is we have to stop being human. I hope not. but doesn't it seem. it seem what we have and what we love. about people what we love about people. emotions and creativity and love and. romance and all those great things and. fun and excitement those are all just. biological stuff like you you really. kind of gets in the way of progress in. some ways but what's wrong with that. what's wrong with being biological. what's wrong with feeling joy and.

emotions nothing but it can it can. conflict you and it can get in the way. of the greater work if you're working on. plunk energy and you're trying to create. little mini universes you have no time. to be horny you have no time to be sad. you have not like if all that can be. eliminated if we have all the problems. that people have today whether it's. depression or anxiety and if all that. can be eliminated forever we never have. to worry about negative emotions anymore. you can be productive you can interact. with people tell up telepathically. but I think it'd also be sterile too. probably if there's no emotion to to.

excite you do you want to do something. uh to want to do something great to do. something that it makes a difference. that takes a lot of energy yes takes a. lot of you know mental power it takes a. lot of emotional commitment and that's. what keeps the world going there's. always somebody out there that wants to. be better to create a better world to. open up new Pathways and that requires a. commitment a commitment of energy on. that person's uh life and that's not. easy but it's not just a drive that's.

inherent to human beings that causes us. to seek technological innovation we're. always pushing the boundaries of. everything we're always trying to get. better at everything whatever we do but. isn't that like the ultimate expression. of that is technological innovation and. the ultimate technological innovation. would probably. bypass all of our biological. shortcomings. why but sometimes our biological. shortcomings is the reason why we like.

to live sure but if you have like a. jealous deity that seems silly you know. if you have a a God that gets horny all. the time and is jealous. yeah exactly or or is greedy or is you. know. well I would hope that we keep our basic. foundational structure of wants and. needs intact but the rough edges I would. hope that the rough edges could be. ironed out yeah collectively and I think. in a democracy that's one way to iron.

out the deficiencies within human. behavior human behavior is a byproduct. of evolution Evolution was survival of. the fittest so it meant that we had to. become at some point cruel to other. people so that that's part of our. history but it didn't have to be that. way when we have technology with the. coming of Technology there's no reason. to have to go to war right to have to to. kill people and and to dominate other.

people there's no there's no purpose of. that unless you do it to control the. technology unless you're the person that. came up with the quantum computer first. and you realize the only way I'm going. to be able to dominate is if I enslave. these people now I gotta move on it now. well that's a problem I mean there is a. race to create the quantum computer we. are in a race the Chinese. IBM Google Microsoft they're all in the. game they've all thrown the dice and. they say this is the way to go yeah and. so uh there's gonna be competition I'm. sure and there's going to be uh you know.

blood in the floor when it comes down to. marketing these things and beating up. the competition and giving the the best. price quantum computer to the average. consumer uh yeah that's going to be. competition involved I think socially. the internet has brought about great. change and it's changed the way humans. interact with each other we already. talked about how we're sharing culture. do you think that something like Quantum. Computing could also have maybe like a. secondary.

sort of a result where it elevates human. consciousness as well because it's it's. computational power and its ability to. change reality as we know it is so. extreme that all of our petty nonsense. that we have with various civilizations. warring against each other and all that. stuff will seem absolutely ridiculous. given the ability that we now have. technologically and that we won't be. existing in this feast or famine world.

well you know the world we live in is. digital the world of the future will be. Quantum and neural. that is we're going to have a. combination of quantum computers and. neural computers and by digital. computers will be left in the dust we're. not going to compute on zeros and ones. zeros and ones anymore we're going to. compute on neurons and we're going to. compete on compute on Quantum atoms and. at that point they may merge at that. point the brain may be connected to a.

quantum computer enhancing our ability. to do calculations for example and do. you think that could have a secondary. effect on civilization like I do think. as many problems as we have with the. internet I think it's changed the world. for the better I really do it certainly. changed our understanding of things our. access to information our ability to. discern what is and isn't going on in. the world. if you if something along the lines of. quantum Computing that's I mean what how.

much what what kind of calculation like. how much more powerful is it than the. greatest computer we have currently. a few million times like imagine that I. mean and in application if that gets. used by people that could. I mean that could be the thing that gets. us out of this well theoretically yeah. we're talking about virtual chemistry. virtual biology. um things in the memory of a computer. that we cannot model with a zeros and. ones zeros and ones yeah zeros and ones.

you cannot Model A disease for example. no way with quantum computers that's why. we build them precisely so that we can. model molecules of germs and understand. how they operate so yeah we're talking. about a whole new era now however I. think the main impact of the internet. has been to enforce democracy that it is. a democratic Force because people can be. educated no matter how poor no matter. where they are they can be empowered. power derives from knowledge yeah and.

that's what the internet is all about. now of course there's a downside to it. but in the main I think it's positive. and I think quantum computers will. accelerate that whole process. well I I think so too and I wonder if it. will lead us to a better world if it. will lead us to a better understanding. of each other much better understanding. of how not to destroy the world in terms. of pollute the ocean and solutions for.

cleaning up the plastic and solutions. for whatever issues we might have with. uh with power generation I mean when we. when we can boil that down with a. quantum computer and figure out much. more efficient cleaner ways to do things. all the problems that we have in modern. society with with poverty with. disenfranchised communities and crime. all those things seem like they could be. solved. well in principle yes that's the whole. principle that's the best case scenario.

this will give empowerment to the. powerless yeah this will create more. goods and services for Humanity to to. raise the level of standard of living of. even the poorest Nations and to be able. to understand the nature of disease so. that we can live longer and more. fruitful lives and in some sense become. immortal or at least near immortality by. being able to conquer incurable diseases. this is all within the possibilities of. quantum computers but for me one of the. biggest impacts is the dissemination of.

knowledge to give empowerment to the. powerless so that we can raise the. standard of living of the entire human. race. what is the worst case scenario worst. case scenario is that dictatorships will. try to. get this technology to break other. people's codes to to shatter uh the. connections that exist between different. nations and cultures to increase. divisions by you know uh chat Bots they.

can create nonsense they can create all. sorts of propaganda because they just. rearrange what already exists a dictator. could then write all sorts of different. kinds of racist and sexist nonsense and. have it spread throughout the internet. very rapidly. um. so it's really important as to who gets. it first that's right and laws have to. be passed so that we rein in some of. these things. democracy arises with incorrect with. conflict with incorrect ideas that's.

where correct ideas come from from. interplay with incorrect ideas but that. could be ruined if people try to seize. control of chatbots and the internet to. flood the internet with none nonsense. who do you think is going to win this. are you close to this are you are you. following or do we even know what these. other questions right now IBM has the. lead but it's like a horse race uh the. the gate has opened all the horses are. lined up and now they're taking off uh.

the Chinese are leading in uh in Optical. quantum computers using light beams to. compute and IBM is leading in terms of. using electrical circuits as the base is. a quantum computers but it changes you. know every few months there are. different advances being made all the. time this is moving exponentially fast. and how do we know where China's at do. we have an accurate understanding of. well they publish their results and we. can duplicate some of what what they do.

they're taking a different tact they're. taking the the tact of using light beams. calculating on light beams rather than. electricity we're using electricity. um and there's some advantages and. disadvantages of both approaches. that's fascinating so we could come up. with potentially two parallel Solutions. and maybe even more. um other groups are anything quantum. mechanical could in principle be used to. build a quantum computer and anything. you see around you plants animals we all.

are byproducts of the quantum principle. and so there are many ways of building a. quantum computer but those are the. leading ones using electrical circuits. and using uh light beams how exciting. this must be for you to have been that. 17 year old boy creating that particle. accelerator in your basement and now. being at the verge of what is probably. one of the biggest changes or the. biggest change the human race has ever. experienced and you're alive to witness. it that's right this if I were to choose.

any decade or phase of History to be. born in this would be it because we're. talking about the fact that you know as. children it was black and white TV and. vacuum twos that exploded and it was a. lot of nonsense back then now we're. putting people on the moon. regularly we're going to every year. we're going to send people to the moon. and we're talking about unlocking the. secrets of life itself through DNA so. this is a great time to be alive.

it's a very amazing time for me and uh. how old I'm 55 how old are you I just. turned 76. wow you look great oh you. really do you look great for 76. so. you're 21 years older than me so you. were alive long before the internet and. you grew up before the internet I was. about 27 years old the first time I got. on the internet and I'm so lucky I feel. so lucky to have grown up without it and. to realize because I'm seeing it happen.

what a immense change it is whereas my. children are growing up having always. been on the Internet it's just normal to. them to communicate through cell phones. and to be able to get on social media. that that is a normal part of life for. everyone today but I and you can. remember and we can really truly. appreciate I think how great a change. this is yeah this is one of the greatest. changes in human history if you were to. choose an era of time to be born uh this. would be it do you ever put much thought.

into simulation Theory you mean like the. Matrix well the the idea that one day. there will be uh whether it's through. Quantum Computing or some other unknown. unforeseen technology that creates a. reality an artificial reality that's. indiscernible from this reality from the. physical reality that we believe we. currently experience and if that's true. how do we know we're not in it already. well to have a perfect replication of.

reality is impossible uh take a look at. the molecules in this room how many. molecules are there oh about maybe 10 to. the 26th power one with 26 zeros after. it. and to model that many atoms with a. digital computer would be impossible. so in other words the smallest object. that can model this room is the room. itself the smallest computer that can.

model air is the computer itself. there's no there's nothing smaller than. this room that can model itself now once. you go to quantum computers it gets. worse because the quantum computer. computes in parallel universes not just. one universe but many universes. simultaneously and so a quantum computer. could model some of the room some of the. atoms in this room but not all of them. now that means a perfect representation. of reality is impossible but an.

approximate simulation may be possible. but a perfect stimulation is impossible. but if we're talking about technology as. we currently understand it today in. comparison to technology as they had. available to them a thousand years ago. what we can do now is insane and if. you're talking about Quantum Computing. which is almost available today and then. you look a thousand years from now. couldn't you potentially imagine there. could be a world where there's. technology sufficient to do what we're.

talking about to create a version of. reality well if you saw the movie We're. All in pods and we're all connected to a. computer that major stimulus The Matrix. as long as you're simulating a piece of. the Matrix not the whole thing but as. you walk from place to place the. computer reassembles a replication of. that place right that may be possible. yeah okay but not the whole earth the. whole with the atmosphere the weather. but if you walk from place to place if.

that little pocket if that little pocket. of atoms is simulated then yeah that may. be possible but what about in the future. when if you extrapolate like. you know you're not going to use what is. it Moore's Law the Moore's Law yeah. would that calculates how much greater. technology is everything doubles every. 18 months what if we're when you're. talking about Quantum Computing what if. they use that to come up with something. even Superior to that a thousand years. from now could could you potentially see.

a future where some form of life could. create a universe well but not on atoms. maybe subatomic particles uh there are. things subatomic particles yeah but most. subatomic particles are unstable the. electron is stable the proton is. unstable but if you can find a way to. stabilize some of them then it may be a. possible to increase the calculational. ability. and then create a supereglensive. computer but I'm speculating at that. point. how much time do you spend thinking.

about do you have it to go soon do you. have a flight yeah yeah when you have. leave uh 6 30 or so oh you're fine it's. not even three o'clock yet well I'm. sorry I'm sorry I'm looking at New York. Times oh sorry about that no worries. okay yeah we're pretty close to you yeah. uh where was I what was I saying. um. oh I was saying that if if you're. looking at the the calculations that we. can make right now and just the uh. amazing progress we've made it seems.

like if you keep going you're going to. it doesn't seem like it's ever going to. stop right so the potential for power. the potential for having an. understanding and the ability to change. and manipulate the universe itself that. seems like it's going to eventually be. on the table. yeah I've thought about that I mean the. question is at what point does it stop. uh we thought it stopped at the. transistor but no that's funny. but now we have a billion of them on a. chip the size of your fingernails right.

billion of them so nope that wasn't a. limit but now we're reaching the atomic. limit so why not compute on atoms but. then what's smaller than an atom was. smaller than an atom is a nucleus. the nucleus is smaller than an atom. nucleus is 10 to the minus 13. centimeters the atom is about 10 to the. minus eight centimeters so the nucleus. is a lot smaller so these are nuclear. these are non-nuclear uh devices that. we're Computing on that may be possible. so an advanced civilization maybe have a.

not an atomic computer but a nuclear. computer. and you have to be careful because of. course you're dealing with nuclear fire. at that point there's a lot of energy. packed in that nucleus as you know from. looking at Hiroshima and Nagasaki if I. was an alien I was going to come down. and talk to somebody you'd probably be. the first guy I talked to you'd be one. of them. um. I how much time do you spend wondering. whether or not these things that they.

keep seeing in the sky these these. things the Pentagon reports on and all. these people are studying how much time. do you spend thinking about that well I. think about it because uh let's say. there's a small chance a very very small. chance that they are extraterrestrial. that could change world history that. could change everything everything we. know about the universe could be altered. instantly if we have some solid proof. and that's why I tell people that if. you've ever been kidnapped by a flying. saucer for God's sake steal something. steal something there's no law against.

stealing from an extraterrestrial. civilization no law whatsoever. and you know you'll have bragging rights. and that'll settle the debate right. there an alien ship an alien Hammer an. alien pencil yeah that would just end. the debate right there well supposedly. depending on Whose story you hear. supposedly the government is in. possession of things along those lines. well yes or no I mean I believe in data. data that leads to a definitive yes or.

no yeah and here we have no data about. secret documents held by the military or. secret objects yeah maybe maybe not but. the proof is in the pudding we have to. see it we have to analyze it before then. it says hearsay and speculation could. you understand though how a government. if they were in possession of something. like that would want to keep it secret. because the technology is so Superior to. anything that we have just like how. we're in this sort of quantum computer. race with China and they have a. different method than we do what if they.

have a different method of back. engineering these things. well that's conceivable it's a theory. but there's no hard evidence either way. some people say that the fact that we. have the microchip and the rocket ship. means that we stole that technology from. the aliens. well maybe but you realize that if. you're a scientist and you've been. following these developments you know. all the dead ends you know all the. mistakes that were made yeah and then. you realized it was a miracle that we. came up with these things it wasn't. given to us it was a byproduct of trial.

and error and whole careers that went. into creating the microchip and the. wonders of modern technology that we see. there's a vast paper trail yeah there's. a huge paper trail right so I'm not. saying that they're wrong I'm just. saying it's not provable what about the. idea that human beings are a product of. of accelerated Evolution that's the most. fascinating UFO Theory accelerated. Revolution from what to what that we are. the product of the mixing of genes of.

some sort of an alien race and lower. primates well it's always great to think. that we're somehow Noble and somehow. beyond the other animals and that we're. great and but uh you know the proof is. in the pudding if there's no looking at. our DNA we realize that the DNA. difference between us and a chimpanzee. was a the expansion of the of the brain. b the dexterity of the fingers and the. vocal cords so these are the three.

things that really stand out when you. look at chimp genes and then human genes. and then you realize that well that's. why we became intelligent we can. vocalize we can share Knowledge from. generation to generation we have a. possible thumb with fingers much more. delicate than the fingers of a monkey. and um as and we have eyes eyes that are. stereo so that we can judge distance to. the prey so looking at it genetically we. realize that only three clusters of. genes created us.

so it's hard to believe that mating with. an alien could have done that well I'm. not saying mating I think what the idea. is and obviously these are not credible. ideas this is just fantastic conspiracy. theories that in it's also there's a lot. of really wild uh stuff if you read like. Zechariah sitchin's work he was a a. scholar in ancient languages that. translated the Sumerian text and he. believed that the Sumerian text was all. telling the story about how humans were. a product of accelerated evolution.

well it's possible but again it requires. one more step of uh substantiation by. looking at the internet you see that. there's a continuous line that goes from. us to the chimpanzees to the primates. and that a few genes changed here a few. genes here a few genes there and bingo. you get a human being there's also some. puzzles though like the doubling of the. human brain size over a period of two. million years yeah that's a big puzzle.

right but apparently just a small. cluster of genes was responsible for. that because that's just brain size yeah. so to increase the cranial size it only. took one or two genes to do that now how. the genes then create the brain of. course we still have yet to to work out. but as far as the size of the brain it. only took a few genes to expand the size. of the brain what what reason would the. Neanderthal have a larger brain than us. uh well a larger brain does not.

necessarily mean intelligence right. because there are animals which have. bigger brains than others I think the. porpoise for example yeah is a very. large Brain so size is not everything. when it comes to. um intelligence I think what's more. important is the ability to see the. future the ability to imagine alternate. worlds that don't exist that's what the. prefrontal cortex does and that's what. separates us from the animals animals do. not have a time machine we have a time. machine in the front of our head is it.

possible that that's just intelligence. as we're measuring it in our ability to. manipulate our environment and that. maybe the intelligence of the Dolphins. experience because they do have a. cerebral cortex it's 40 percent larger. than a human beings than maybe what. they're experiencing is a different kind. of intelligence maybe a communal. communal intelligence maybe some sort of. shared. telepathy or something that allows them. to communicate in a way that we're not. capable of yeah different kind of. intelligence right but you know my. attitude is that what does intelligence.

do intelligence allows us to create a. model a model of where we are with. regards to the environment uh other. animals danger and so on and so forth. and then the ability to see the future. that to me is intelligence to understand. what you what you're in and then. extrapolate it into the future that. takes a lot of brain power sure animals. can't do that no the great imaginary. worlds that don't exist and then on an. MRI scan the people scientists ask the.

question if the brain sees the future. but the future doesn't exist then how. can a brain scan show you the future. because it doesn't exist yet when you. brain scan somebody thinking about the. future they think about the past. they rework all the things of the past. and they make a few changes in the past. that's how they extrapolate it into the. future that's how we did it animals. don't do that animals simply go by. Instinct but what we do is we take the.

past modify the past and then let it. flow into the future well that's what's. so fascinating about giant leaps in. technology is that they bypass our. imagination and create completely new. possibilities that we could have never. even dreamed were capable we're capable. of like what we're experiencing right. now I mean if you go to Star Trek they. had to go Kirk out over they were. basically using walkie-talkies right. right they had never even figured out. cell phones yet right and but what we're. doing now is almost inconceivable and. the future when these things do come to.

us. I mean what are we looking at I mean. what are we looking at inside of our. lifetime right well my attitude is the. smallest unit of History. is the decade. and if you look at history decade by. decade then you see the enormous. progress that we've made but if you look. at the history year by year it's chaotic. things go up things go down setbacks. take place and so on and so forth but. when you look at things decade by decade. then you see that there is a progression.

there is a path and the path is toward. democracy the path is toward empowerment. the path has started creating a middle. class these are the paths that you can. see decade by decade that you cannot see. year by year and I think that is a. byproduct of technology technology has. made a middle class possible for example. yeah it really has and and technology is. what many people think can raise up some. of the more impoverished communities.

and that part of the problem is that. they don't have access to power that. they don't have access to the all the. innovations that we have that make life. safer water cleaner make it easier to. live and exist and have more peace and. time to develop new things like we do. here. yeah and I think quantum computers I. think will accelerate that whole process. because that's the name of the game. technology just not for Technology's. sake just not to make profits for the.

companies of course that's also one of. the motivating factors but to enrich the. human race to educate people to empower. people and I think that's what. technology does now ai of course will. take away jobs too. but it creates jobs just as well for. example the blacksmith we don't have. blacksmiths anymore but we don't cry. about it because these blacksmiths. became automobile workers and so new. jobs opened up and the same thing with. AI people pointed the fact that AI is.

displacing some workers especially at. the bottom which is true but it's also. creating new jobs jobs that no one even. conceived of before and so it's a. balance between job destruction and job. creation and that's the main effect that. AI has had on society. it's a beautiful time to be alive sir. I'm really happy that you're out there. talking about these things because it. just it Sparks the imagination in such. an incredible way and because of you and. because of your work you really get to.

understand like what the real parameters. we're working with here and what we're. really talking about what's possible. well I hope so that's one of the reasons. why I do what I do some people say why. do you do this I mean you're graded it. you should keep doing it forever do you. do things independently do you have a. podcast of your own uh I'm on radio so. uh okay yeah what what child station you. on. I. just go to my website. mkaku.org.

a-m-k-a-k-u.org you do really do do a. lot of things like how do you maintain. your energy levels. well like I said I can't understand how. some people are not energized by this I. mean some people play golf uh some. people do all sorts of uh Sports and. things this is what I do yeah because it. energizes you you know after a game of. golf people tell me that they feel. renewed they feel robust. this is what I feel when you talk to. people because you're sharing your own. excitement you're trying to convey the.

excitement that you feel to other people. well you do a fantastic job at you. really do well I try it's always a. pleasure to have you here uh so tell. everybody about your book one more time. yeah the book is called Quantum. Supremacy now what is that Quantum. Supremacy is a time when quantum. computers exceeded the power of a. supercomputer on certain very specified. problems we passed that point we now. have quantum computers that are millions. of times faster than a digital computer.

on certain select questions the next. step is to make a general purpose. quantum computer that works for any. problem not just specific problems and. that may take you know that may take. maybe another decade or so but again the. stakes are enormous we're talking about. the world economy which nation is going. to dominate the world economy what. technologies will thrust the world's. productive abilities that's quantum. computers now when this does get.

implemented what private companies are. creating this and are they working in. conjunction with the government like how. does how does all that get controlled. well right now it's a free-for-all it's. a horse race it's a free-for-all the. horses are out of the gate basically. it's a few key players IBM Google. Honeywell Microsoft the big boys they're. all jumping in the game and investing. billions of dollars to create their. version of the future and the Chinese.

are right there with their parallel. version using optical uh means rather. than using electrical means to do. calculations and they know the price. that the price is not there yet because. of course they're not operational for. general purpose problems but they know. potentially what the price is and that's. to be able to dominate the world economy. now what's the worst case scenario if. one of these American corporations let's. just say Microsoft let's say if. Microsoft wins the race and they develop.

some sort of functional quantum computer. that just blows everything else out of. the water they essentially become. like a superpower that's right remember. when IBM dominated everything and then. Microsoft comes along a bunch of. teenagers come along everyone thought. these are a bunch of teenagers what can. they do right and then these teenagers. took over the world so we're talking. about something on that scale that's a. company that can make a breakthrough to. make a workable general purpose quantum.

computer uh who wouldn't want to buy one. I mean you're talking about a runaway. bestseller at that point yeah well also. the power that's attached to that is so. enormous that anyone wielding it has. unprecedented power yeah remember the PC. before before Bill Gates and Company. yeah. the PCA was a toy a toy in museums. basically I mean it was something that. you showed your friends but you couldn't.

do anything with it right and then comes. Microsoft we showed no no we can do. things you can do your income tax you. can do spreadsheets you can do this you. can do this and then it just took off. yeah so we're at that stage now where. the computer is still not ready to be. used for general purpose calculations. but when it does happen we're talking. about virtual chemistry virtual biology. everyone's going to want to jump in the. game do you think that preemptively some. laws should be put in place to sort of. regulate this well I think some laws may.

have to because of course this is. potentially Earth shaking yeah the CIA. of course is well aware of the of the. potential they've they uh the government. has done seminars on what to do when. quantum computers become commonplace and. they're already making recommendations. in so for the Post silicon no the post. Quantum era they're making. recommendations to how to prepare for. the Post Quantum era when quantum. computers can break any known digital. code what does the world look like if.

there's no secrets what does the world. look like if there there's no top secret. information there's no code cannot be. cracked instantaneously yeah that's a. good question I mean some people say. what happens if all the codes are broken. I mean uh it sometimes this happened in. the past we're still here it wasn't. doomsday but it does affect the progress. for war during World War II we broke the. German code it was a computer that broke. the German code and we knew exactly what.

the Germans were do going to do before. War actually broke out in certain areas. and that saved thousands of lives and so. that was a situation where that did make. a difference but in the main you know. Nations still secrets from other nations. all the time and we're still here. for now. for now right if we don't blow ourselves. up but it could be commonplace with. quantum computers uh stealing from. Nations could be commonplace now there. are ways to thwart a quantum computer.

there are ways to get around it one way. is to have a dual system two systems of. the internet one system based on. electricity that all of us use that are. subject to hacking and the other layer. based strictly on laser beams a laser. internet that would be a way such that. anyone who Taps into it illegally would. immediately alert people people would. shut down that part of the internet. immediately so that's a possibility that. people have talked about a dual internet. one internet for governments for big.

Corporation and Banks they would pay. premium price to have an invulnerable. internet on Internet by the laws of. physics can never be broken and. everybody else would use the ordinary. internet. that wouldn't that bother you though. like I don't want corporations to have. unlimited computation well they pay. they're paying for it well I mean what. can I say right right but the power that. comes along with something like that too. like when you said the laws like well. who's writing these laws and who these. laws benefit well laws will have to be.

passed just like with chat Bots right. laws that could have to be passed just. like freedom of speech is great but you. cannot say fire in a crowded theater. right so laws will have to be passed to. regulate chat Bots and laws may have to. be uh passed to regulate quantum. computers as well does it bother you. that these laws that will have to get. passed will get passed by people that. probably don't even have a comprehensive. understanding of what's possible yeah. that's possible that's that's always the. nightmare is the fact that ultimately.

politicians will have to carry out. people's will right it's not going to be. guys like you passing these laws no. it'll be people that have to you know. get votes for to get reelected yes and. God knows what kinds of issues they have. to harp on in order to get real elected. right so that's a danger that the. politicians May mess things up well I. can only hope they bring in you to have. a conversation with them about it before. they do something stupid well let's hope. the scientific Community has to say you. know we want to see it at the table uh. we're not going to make the decisions.

but we'd like to influence the decisions. well that would be the best way to do it. but even do you think that even the. scientists can or the physicists can. have a real understanding of what is to. come it's just educated guessing right. it's hard to say when the transistor was. invented people thought maybe it would. be used to Signal ships at Sea yeah they. didn't know what the transistor was used. for now we realize it changed Society. Human Society changed because of the. transistor but we didn't know it at that.

time. well um listen again uh it's always a. pleasure to have you here you're you're. a National Treasure I really believe. that thank you you're such a great. communicator with this stuff and it's so. exciting and uh I'm gonna listen to this. back and forth and try to figure out. most of the stuff you said Quantum. Supremacy how the quantum computer. Revolution will change everything and it. is available now did you do the. audiobook. uh no we had somebody else do it why. didn't you do it I want to hear you it.

would take four days uh locked up in a. room non-stop I get it to write to read. a book of that size you're busy I. understand well I'll try to listen to it. in your voice thank you sir I really. appreciate you always my pleasure great. honor thank you my honor bye everybody. [Music]. [Applause]. foreign. okay.