Oprah and Kristin Cabot in an Exclusive Interview about the Coldplay Kiss Cam

Either they're having an affair or. they're just very shy. This would be the only on-camera. interview that you're planning to give. Why did you decide to be here today? So, Coldplay's Kiss Cam just broke the. internet. You've seen this video, right? >> Uh 1,000 times. >> Yes, I think everyone [music] has seen. it. >> Take us back to the night of the. Coldplay concert. >> Growing fallout from the Kiss Cam moment. seen around the world, sparking dozens. of memes and videos. It is crazy how big.

this is. [music]. >> That was the first time you all had. physically touched. That's what you said. to us earlier. You hadn't even touched. >> This has captured [music] my imagination. so much. I have been watching it like if. it was porn, over and over and over. again. I did not know the crucial part. of that story that was [music] missing. from all of the TikToks. I'm going to. let you share that. Sometimes people. call just to harass her and call her a. home wrecker. Do you Do you still talk. to Andy Byron, your former boss? Death. threats.

Who Who's sending death threats over. this? Why do you think there was so much hate? >> [sighs]. [music]. >> Hi there, and thank you for joining me. here on the Oprah podcast. My guest. today is Kristin Cavallari. And while. you may not recognize her name, I am. guessing that you will recognize her. face from the most viewed video of 2025, the so-called Coldplay Kiss Cam. Either.

they're having an affair or they're just. very shy. has been watched 300. billion times. Doesn't that shock you? It shocked me, and when I was told that I Your mouth is. open. That's exactly That's exactly what. I did. When I was told it'd been watched. 300 billion times, I said, "How is that. possible? There's only 8 billion of us. on the planet." Well, it's because. people watch it over and over and over. It was made into countless Tik Tok memes. and recreated at sporting events and.

concerts around the world. And in just. 15 seconds of footage, Kristen found. herself in the eye of a public. spectacle, a storm that swept the. internet in a matter of hours. And she. is the woman seen on the Jumbotron at a. Coldplay concert in Boston in the arms. of her boss and CEO, Andy Byron. And. Kristen was the head of HR. And for.

Kristen, those 15 viral seconds, really, 15 viral seconds opened up an. unstoppable. floodgate of people mocking her, vitriol, and even death threats. And. this past December, she first broke her. silence to Lisa Miller of the New York. Times. And the headline read, "The. Ritual Shaming of the Woman at the. Coldplay Concert." Kristen Cabott,

welcome. Thank you for agreeing to do. this. >> for having me. Thank you for having. [applause and cheering] Thank you. So, after reading Lisa Miller's article, I asked my team to to reach out to you. and you were hesitant, but then. we had a conversation on Zoom and you. decided that this would be the only. on-camera interview that you're planning. to give. Why did you decide to be here. today? Yeah, first I want to thank you. for having me. I I was reluctant to.

come, but I'm really grateful to be. here. For me, my mom always taught us silence is. acceptance. I think I mentioned that in. the article. And for me. and my family, what happened was not. okay. And I felt like by remaining. silent, it was somehow accepting what. had happened. And I really [clears throat] felt also. there's a a of people out there that. experienced something similar that. didn't either have the strength to come. forward or were too traumatized or lost. their lives due to some of the things I. experienced and I feel a sense of.

responsibility for those people to speak. out and share what it's really like when. people carelessly comment forward, click, like, and the damage that it can. really do. So, yes, you and I spoke on. Zoom. I said, first of all, before the. story in The Times, I didn't know the. story. I I was like everybody else. I. didn't watch it hundreds of times or. even more than once, but I made the. judgment that you had made a mistake in. your out with your boss. And I did not.

know the crucial part of that story that. was left missing from all of the TikToks. that were shared. Uh I'm going to let let you share that. So, take us back to the to to the night. of the Coldplay concert and the decision. to go to the Coldplay concert. Yeah, that's great question. Um so, uh. I had been going through I'll go a. little bit before that if that's okay. So, maybe four or six weeks prior to the. Coldplay concert, um.

my husband and I had decided to separate. and were living apart and planning for a. divorce and. um Andy Byron, my boss at the time, he. and I um had a very close working. relationship. For anyone that's worked. in tech in a high-growth startup, they'll understand that the chief people. officer and the CEO are partners. We. work side by side. around the clock. It was a It was a a. high-growth startup that was growing at. 100% year over year. We were hiring like. crazy. Um and so, we were really in it um.

together and spent a ton of time. together. And it was it was about it was. about around the time that Andrew and I, uh my husband, had separated and and. Andy, I have the same name, so forgive. me. Try to keep up here. Um. Andy and I, um had gone out to grab. sandwiches during the work day and he he. asked me. I seemed a little off and he just said, "What's going on?" And I said, "Well, my. my husband and I are separating and. planning a divorce." And um he. immediately let me know that he was in. the exact same situation. That he and. his wife were living apart, they were. planning for a divorce, and it had been.

uh many years in the making. Hm. So, that became like a really instant kind. of point of connection for us. And over. the next, you know, few weeks to months, that was a place that was really great. for me to be able to go to talk about. what I was going through. And I was a. good safe space for him. Um and I think. probably my friends. >> talk about what it was like going. through the separation? >> was where we we started to build a bit. of a stronger connection. And I, you. know, I was really surprised when he. told me. Um I just We didn't talk a lot. about our personal lives prior to that.

So, I didn't expect to hear that from. him. Right. >> Um he'd been married a long time. So, I. just assumed all was well. So, we. leading up to the concert, like at that. point we started talking a lot more. about personal things and kids and how. it's going and all of that, um in. addition to the busy and frequent work. conversations. And. >> having more lunches? Was it becoming. >> Yeah. Yes, we were. We It just felt like. a really familiar, like safe place to. talk about what was going on. And it's. so much easier when someone else is in.

it in the same experience. We could. share that. So, so we developed feelings. for each other during that time, for. sure. >> were you were attracted to each other? >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Yes, absolutely. Um. and that's why I like, you know, when. people would say, "Oh, they didn't look. like friends on the video." Like that. was the culmination point of feelings. that had developed over the course of. you know, four to six weeks, I would. say. >> when we spoke over Zoom, you said that. was the first time you all had done. anything. >> Yeah. publicly. That's the first time. you'd actually shared any kind of. physical touch. >> physical touch.

>> Yeah. Yeah, so what happened. >> concert, first time he touched you? Yes. I'll explain. I'll explain. I'm I'm here. to share what really happened. So, Okay. >> I know. There's a lot of There's a lot. of context there. So, um I had friends. that had gotten tickets to the show. They asked if I wanted to join. They had. two extra seats. I never go out, so it's. kind of a joke amongst my friends, let. alone on a weeknight. I'm usually with. my kids or I'm working. And. I had been just gone through a pretty. tough period and I was like, "You know. what? It's summer. It's a weeknight.

Like, I'm going to go see I love. Coldplay. I'm going to go." Or I loved. Coldplay, but that kind of got ruined. for me. I'll be honest. Like, not the. biggest fan anymore. Um but and it was It was like such a. no-brainer to invite Andy. We just we we. When I say we would talk like 10 times a. day, that was even before this. connection started. It's just the nature. of our job and our working relationship. Plus, we were, you know, enjoying. spending time together and it just. seemed like. we've been. I just want to be clear. What time had. you spent together before? >> Lunches. We would.

lunches at work with I live. >> had been business up until the Coldplay. concert. >> Yes. >> Whoa. Absolutely. Though, we'd had a lot. of personal conversation and had. acknowledged that we had feelings for. each other. >> Okay. Also, it was becoming apparent to. me that we were putting ourselves in a. situation where it was going to get. risky from a work standpoint. I mean, I. reported to him. It's, you know, it's my role is to. actually like be aware of those things. happening at work and flagging when it. might cause Yeah. >> So, was there I always say that there's.

a whisper and then there's a pebble and. a brick and a brick and a Was there a. little whisper saying, "We should. tell somebody or we should. >> more than a whisper. It was like a real. conversation where we sat down and said, like, we have to figure out a plan for. this because we're these feelings were. real. This wasn't like a fleeting thing. And. we decided that we put kind of a plan. together, but we wanted to propose to. our board of directors that would change. the reporting structure. Um Didn't you. tell me that you were thinking about. going to the board or you all were going. to go to the board? >> ironically met probably.

uh five or six days before the concert. We had We had a lunch that was a lengthy. lunch to talk about this and to make a. plan. Um and. >> to go to the board. >> board and let them know that we had. developed feelings for one another and. that we wanted to change. >> And that it was consensual. It was. consensual and which is an important. point, 100% and we wanted to propose a. plan for what might work to make, you. know, to take this reporting line out of. the equation. Meaning you reporting to. him. Meaning no longer reporting to him.

and perhaps reporting to one of our. investors, something like that. >> that makes sense. It seemed like it made. sense at the time. It felt It felt like. the right thing to do. Um and. yeah, and then I got the invitation to. Coldplay. I invited him to come. Um it. was sort of a non-decision. It was just. kind of like, "Hey, we got tickets. Do. you want to come?" And he's like, "Great, let's go." And I thought, you. know, we've we've kept it Why didn't you. ask one of your girlfriends? Well, I was. already going with my. two best friends who may or may not be. in the audience right now. They were Um. one of them was already going and the. other one is the one that offered me the.

tickets. >> Okay, yeah. >> And it just He's the one I wanted to. hang out with. We had a blast together. >> Okay. Okay. Um and we'd been keeping it. together. Like I I can go to work and be. normal. I can go to a concert and be. normal until I couldn't, obviously. Um but it was just um it seemed like a. fun plan. Got it. So, he said yes. >> He said yes. >> Obviously. And this was the first time. socially. >> done something socially other than. meeting for lunches and discussing. business and.

>> drinks after work with colleagues and. things like that, yeah. >> you get to the concert and what. happened? >> Well, I was walking into the concert and. my daughter messaged me and said, "Oh, it's so great that you and Andrew are. both at Coldplay." So, she let me know. that my estranged husband was also at. the concert. >> think it's very important, this is what. I did not know before the story and. y'all can obviously didn't know either. that she was separated from her husband. and that her boss was also separated or.

said he was separated from his wife. Did. y'all know that? Okay? All right. Or that Or that her husband. was there. This is the This is the thing. So, you. get texted You get texted from one of. your children. >> Yeah, my daughter was like, "This is so. fun. Great." I was like, and in my mind. I thought, "Well, that's. is this going to be weird if he sees me. with Andy?" Like that crossed my. >> run into him. Yeah, if I run into him.

But then I was like, "I'm in Gillette. Stadium. There's 55,000 people here. I'm. probably not going to run into him.". But doesn't matter. I mean, that would. have been better at the end of the day. if I just run into him. Um but. it's you know, he knows he knows how. closely Andy and I work together. He. knows we social like got lunches and got. drinks. It It was fine. >> So, he knew that there was a. relationship there. >> He knows the nature of my work and the. way the really I've shared desks with. the CEOs I've worked with. Like it's. just a very close and so it didn't. matter to me. I got to get to the.

moment. You all hadn't touched. You That's what. you said to us earlier. You hadn't even. touched. Well, we did that evening. before we got I mean, we started to. touch before it was on camera, but that. Yeah. Okay, but that was the first time. you all had physically touched. >> Correct. Correct. Correct. >> Okay. Other than like a you know, tap. you know, when you're chatting with. someone and you Okay. Yeah. So, what. made you do it then? I had [laughter] a really big crush on. him, Oprah. And so did he. I mean, we. These These were like really.

incredible feelings and I don't know. women that could relate to this, but I. had been going through a really tough. time. I was coming out of a separation. and it felt really good to get attention. and affection from an awesome man. You. know, that It felt good. >> out a key point here that you shared. with me on the Zoom. High Noons. I would love to talk about. the High Noons. Can we Can we take a. moment? Look Look at Gayle going, "What. is that?". >> [laughter]. >> Gayle Gayle is Gayle has never drank. anything other than uh. >> What? like a good Shirley Temple. Oh,

she likes a good Shirley Temple. >> [laughter]. >> So, she just looked at I saw you look. What is a High Noon? I want to talk. about the High Noons cuz that became a. big big topic on the internet for some. reason. I told Lisa Miller in the New. York Times article that, you know, I had. a couple of High Noons and we were. dancing and we got swept up in the. moment. Yes. >> I only had two. So, Well, I mean, a a. two that make you feel like. >> They're Well, that's Gail used Gail used. to ask me all the time, "I see you. getting yourself all liquored up. What. does it do for you?" Yeah. I'm not getting liquored up, Gail. It's. just a vodka tonic, okay? So, it does.

make you, Gail. Alcohol makes you feel a. little looser, okay? >> Frisky. >> [laughter]. >> Whiskey. Frisky. Not even frisky. It's. just It's just a little looser. >> looser. And my only Yeah. my only point. in mentioning it to Lisa Miller, had I. known what would have happened that, you. know, because suddenly I'm blaming it on. alcohol and suddenly I don't None of. that is true. I simply mentioned it to. like set the tone of the vibe. Yes, I. got it. You're at a concert, it's. summer, a couple High Noons, you're. dancing, you're having fun. Everybody,

maybe except for you, Gail, has done. that and knows what I mean. Like, it's a. good It's just an easy like a fun. feeling and that's that was the vibe. that that we had. That's why I shared. it. And by the way, I think. >> Well, Gail will have said, "Do you have. a lemonade with with And could you add a. dash of cranberry juice?" Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. wild So, a couple of High Noons, you're feeling really great and you're. at a concert and you love Coldplay and. everything's going well. >> Felt really good. >> Yes. It also, I should note, it felt really. anonymous and I feel like I need to.

explain that to you because it didn't. look that way on the video. Where we. were was at the complete opposite end of. Gillette Stadium from the stage. We were. in an area called, um, I think it was. called the Pavilion, but it's a big. general It's a It's a sectioned off area. where there's no seats. It's general. admission in this section and it holds. about 250 people. So, we were in in area. and we were kind of up at the front of. the near the railing, but we were with a. like with a group and with friends. So, we were dancing and talking, and it was. really dark, and it just we got very.

swept up, and it didn't feel. in any way that we were risking being. and it wasn't even calculated where we. thought to ourselves like no one's. looking. Let's like. put our hands on each other. It wasn't. that. It was just. it just was a natural Okay, so let's go. to that moment that we have all seen. Have you all seen it? Okay, let's go to. the moment we've all seen. So, you're. swaying. I don't even remember the song. Do you? Yes. >> [laughter]. >> What was the song? >> Yellow. Okay.

You're. Look at Get Let's go. >> yellow. I used to love yellow, Gail. >> Yeah. So, you're swaying to the song, and then you suddenly see yourself on. the Jumbotron. You turned around. He ducked. Okay, so you see yourself Take us to. that moment. >> Yeah. That was a moment of total horror. is really the best way I can describe. it. My immediate thought was, "Oh my. god, my husband's in the building.". Um he he was there with someone else,

and I knew that, and that is that was. great and fine, but he and I were in the. midst of our separation, incredibly. amicable. Like to this day, he's been. the one of the biggest supporters of me. through all of this. He's an incredible. man. >> Mhm. And the last thing I wanted to do. was embarrass him, and that was my first. thought when I saw myself in that. in that um moment. >> Isn't there an instance when you're. looking at yourself uh on the Jumbotron. cuz I remember Gail and I had gone to an. event, Gail Marie Shriver and I, and for. the Pope, and there was.

uh Gail on the Remember you were saw. yourself, and you said, "Who's that. red-haired woman?". >> [laughter]. >> And I go, "That red-haired black woman? That would be you.". >> [laughter]. >> And so, is there a moment when you say. to yourself, "Oh my god, that's me.". >> Yes. Yeah. there was like a split second. where it was like almost I mean, to me. it's like a surreal. I can't even really. remember, but I I do remember looking. and being like, "Oh my god." Like I said.

worse than that. I mean it in my head. But my initial thought was, "Oh my god, Andrew's here." And my second thought. was, "Oh my god, I'm in the arms of my. boss and I'm the head of HR." Like this. is a really bad look. Yeah. Everybody. assumed I was horrified cuz it meant. somehow I got busted having an affair. Like that is not what was happening. I. felt like those two reasons were big. enough for me in that moment to be. really horrified. >> even hear. >> No. So, I wanted to share that, too. So, we were all like dancing and you know. when there's music playing and you're. talking, you're kind of whispering in. people's ears or yelling in their ears. We were talking and with my friends,

too, and we didn't hear Chris Martin. say, "We're going to pan the audience.". Like we never heard him warn that he was. doing that and we never heard him say, "They must be shy or they're having an. affair." I had no idea he said that. until like days later. Mhm. >> Um or the next day. I don't remember. from It was a blur after that night. But. I didn't know that at all. I whipped. around like Oprah. If we were at a. Celtics game and we got put on the. Jumbotron, I'm going to whip around I'm. not a Jumbotron girl. Even on my best. days. It's not my thing. So, I would.

have probably done some version of that. But in that moment I was just horrified. at. >> And your first thought was Andrew, your. husband. >> And yeah, and on and and I irony of the. whole thing or the naivete of the whole. thing is the entire ride home we were in. an SUV with a few of a few group of us. I was all I was worried about was. Andrew. I kept saying, "Maybe he left. early. Maybe he didn't see it." That was. what I thought was the biggest problem. I had my head in my hands. >> you worried if you were already. separated? >> Because we were in the middle of going. through our divorce planning and he.

it was going really We were doing it in. a really amicable way. >> He was there with somebody. He was there. with somebody, but I didn't Andrew comes. from an incredibly private family um the. Boston area and. I just knew in my head like the public. embarrassment is not something that. would have Yeah. Okay. um So, your first. thought was Andrew. What did you all do. immediately afterwards? So, you turned. around and. Andy Byron ducked, your boss at the. time, ducked. Yes. >> And then did you all immediately leave.

this. >> Yeah, so so he and I left um the area, the general admission area behind that. had indoors, had like a bar area and. some like tables set up. Did you leave. with your friends or did you. >> No, he and I left the standing room. area, went through the doors, and sat. down at one of those tables and we're. just like, "What just happened? Okay, what is going what could this. what is going to happen?" And or what. what is what happened? Yeah. I don't. know how to explain. And that's when I. was like, "Oh my god, And- you know, he. was going through his head of what he. was worried about." I was thinking about.

my stuff. And then the It was really. towards the end of the concert and then. by the. the end of that song, I think, my. friends came through the door and. they're like, "Let's just get out of. here.". And so we all left the stadium. And what. were they thinking? They were just like, "Oh my god, I cannot believe this. This. is like getting struck by lightning. Yeah. How did this even how on earth and. I can't believe that just happened to. you. That's like the worst luck." And. then we were in the elevator heading. down and a woman in the elevator was. like, "Wait, was that you on the. jumbotron?" And I was like, "No.".

And then my friend Elena looked at me. and was like, "Is that what we're. saying? I feel like are we we're saying. no, that wasn't you? Like what do we. should we huddle up on this? Like I But. we just didn't know what we had no. concept that this was going to. >> you were worried about your. your husband who you're separating from. Yes. >> and the woman that he's there I wasn't. really worried about that I I was just I. didn't want to embarrass him and Okay, so you were worried about your husband, you were worried about your husband that. you are now separated from. Was he worried about anything?

No. You mean what do you mean? >> Andy Andy Andy Byron. >> Oh, yes. What did he say He was worried. about. >> I don't want to speak for him, but I I. think, you know, we live in that area. I. think, you know, he's going through his. own separation and divorce. I think he's. not looking to embarrass us. >> That was the other big I mean, it's it's. really not it's really bad in our roles. to have been caught in that position. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that. was, you know, we live we do live in the. area. The company was based in New York, but we've both had.

25 or so 30 years in our career in that. area and know people. >> thing I want to share with you all when. I had I've had only one other. conversation with Christian um. on Zoom uh prior to this interview uh. couple months ago now. >> Yeah. And the one thing that I. appreciated in that conversation, which. you can share here, is that you kept. saying, "I made a mistake. It was a. mistake. I shouldn't have been out with. my boss, but it wasn't a mistake that I. deserved to die for. Correct. It wasn't.

a mistake that I deserved to have people. coming up to me on the street and saying. I should die because of it. It wasn't a. mistake that deserved people threatening. me and threatening my children. It was a. mistake. So, that's what you told me. Do you still. feel that that it was it was a mistake? >> I've been telling anyone that will. listen, you know, I I own the poor. decision that I made in that moment and. I've paid a unimaginable price for that. Um I also, you know, that was why I.

chose to leave my job because. I think I put the company in a position, given how viral and toxic this became, a. position you can't come back from. >> Okay, so let's go back to it. So, just. walk us through it. You all leave. You're like, "What just happened?" And. then what happened? So, we all piled. into a SUV we had all ridden together. and there were six of us. And I mean, it. was a pretty tense car ride home, but it. was I was hand-wringing over. my. Andrew C. I mean, it was just so. ridiculous looking at it now what I was.

most worried about. Um Andy was pretty. quiet in the car. Yeah. And our friends, nobody. nobody saw it. It was like, oh, that was such bad luck. Like, hopefully no one really saw it. >> Okay, so tell tell tell everybody you. get home and you're thinking we're going. to tell the board tomorrow. We're going. to go to the board and tell them. So, you all didn't you come up with the. >> apartment, Andy did, and we were like, we have to. Come up with a statement.

>> to talk to the board immediately. >> Yeah. Did you come up with a statement? >> No, we. drafted an email to send together to. send to the board from both of us to say. we need to speak very first thing in the. morning. Most of our board, actually all. all but one were on the West Coast, so. we wanted to make sure Drafted an email. to send to the board. >> That's right. And then you go home and. you. Go to sleep. >> Go to sleep. Again, not Really. And. >> Thinking, yeah. >> And in the middle of the night In the. middle of the night I got a message from. Andrew.

Um, my husband. I feel like I need to. keep qualifying because they're the same. the same name. >> Um, and he sent me a text with a. snapshot of a Tik Tok of the Tik Tok. video and said, I you need to basic I. don't remember the exact words, but it. was like, there's a like, Houston, we. have a problem here, you know. Um, and. he really wanted to get to me so I could. get to my kids before they who were. teenagers before they woke up and got on. their phones and saw it. Right. So, your. teenagers or not his children. Correct. Yes, but your children have a great. relationship with Incredible.

>> Yeah, cuz you all had been married how. many years? Oh, less than two years. We. met during COVID and he immediately. built an incredible bond with my kids. and they're they're very close still. today. Okay, so how did you find out. that the video had blown up the. internet? I'm trying to remember. It's like such a. wild that next day was so hard. Um So, when Andrew calls you and says We have. there's like this is happening on Tik. Tok. I'm not on any of those apps, so I. didn't see it I couldn't see it.

personally. I had no sense for it. initially personally. Um I don't I've never had TikTok or. anything like that, but he let me know. >> what it was. >> Yeah, and then in the morning by 7:00 or. or 8:00 a.m. >> Can you all imagine this? Can you imagine? It just my phone. started, you know, a lot of phone calls started. coming in from my friends. All my close. friends were just like we you know, this. is something's going on here and it I. can't Yeah, I wish I could remember how. long it took from being kind of a. problem to like realizing. it was.

No need to hit send to the board. Yeah. Well, we did. We did have a call with. the board immediately. Um and they had. already heard about it at that point. Um. But we had they were they were actually. really understanding and we had a really. good conversation about it and they were. very um He resigned. He hadn't resigned. yet. He did that a few days later. Um. >> Okay. And then did they offer you they wanted. you to stay? >> Yes. Yes. They wanted you to stay? >> Yes. Yes, they did. >> going to stay? Well, that's the problem. I mean that was the conversation I had.

with them. Had it not gone so viral and. gotten so toxic, I would have gone back. in and taken the punch and stood up in. front of the company and said I'm you. know, I'm a human I made a really poor. choice, but we're building something. incredible and like let's get back to. it. >> Mhm. Um and hope that they would be okay. with that, but I had it I that was not. an option. Um I did not feel like I. could go in and say. hey everybody like do as I say, but not. as I do and I felt like that it would. put everybody in such a bad situation. and just wasn't fair to the employees. Um I appreciated that the board was.

behind me and I appreciated you know, they did go through an HR investigation. and it yielded nothing and I appreciated. that at least internally there I got. that Um that support. Yeah. But it. wasn't viable. It wasn't fair to ask the. employees to So why do you think that. this went off like a like a bomb? Was it. Chris Martin's comments in that moment. that maybe you were having an affair, was it the fact that Andy Byron ducked. or that you turned around, was it that.

he was the CEO and you're the head of. HR? What is it What is. >> it was a I thought a lot about that. I. think it was a whole combination I was a. combination of all of those things. I. felt in the in the initial moments, I'm. sure it was funny to people. You know, I. can appreciate that. I've certainly seen. funny things online and forwarded them. around and clicked on them. I just don't. think people think people really stop. and think about there's real humans. behind this. >> a life there. >> And it is incredibly. um. destructive um and and I I you know,

listen, I've I've seen funny things and. sent them around too, probably not. giving it a ton of thought before this. happened. I'm very thinking very. differently now than I was. Um but I think people thought it was. funny. I think our world is, you know, uh news is a really sad thing to watch. I think we are constantly inundated with. bad news and this seems to. >> people say that that video seen 300. billion times by only 8 billion people. on the on the planet was the thing that. united people, that people were united.

in their judgment. >> Mhm. And I feel bad for us as human beings. that that's what we did to you. Thank. you. We were all united in the judgment of. whatever it is you were doing, you. shouldn't have been doing it and we. could all actually agree on that. >> Mhm. without knowing the story behind the. story. >> And I heard that there were people that. advised you that everything would blow. over in 3 days. Who the hell told you. that? >> [laughter]. >> I wish I could say cuz you'd all be.

shocked, but it's a very prominent. person in public relations that I spoke. to that that said to me, you have triggered such an avalanche of. hate for whatever reason that people are. not going to be open to hearing from you. right now. They're not going to believe. what you say. Your best bet is to stay. quiet, keep your head down and then let. some time pass, and then speak up. And I. I I This is not my world. I don't know. And I I really believed what she said. And I I guess it makes sense. I could. tell that there was so much hate. I I. thought maybe this Maybe that is better. >> Why do you think there was so much hate?

>> [sighs]. >> That's been one of the hardest things. for me to reconcile because none of the. Nobody knows me. There's Nobody that. judged this knows me. So, it wasn't me. Um you know, it it was I think it was. I I Listen, I think a lot of people have. had not great interactions with HR. I. think there's some piece of it that's. like stick it to the HR lady. Like I get. it. Um that's kind of funny. I think, you. know, it was incredibly cliche on every. level like the CEO and the Chief People.

Officer. And I think, you know, I don't know. I just think people. Hurt people hurt people. And I think. There's a lot of hurt people 300 billion. times. So, the New York Times wrote that. she's been called the quote, she's been. called a mhm. a homewrecker, mhm a gold digger, a side. piece, mhm the usual tags for shaming. women is what Lisa Miller wrote. And you.

told me that you believe that women are. apt to quote eat each other alive. Mhm. And that most of your criticism has. actually come from other women that. other women are the only ones who dare. to come up to your face and say horrible. things. >> That's right. That was for me, I think, one of other than obviously my concern. for what my kids experienced, that was. to me the most upsetting piece of all of. this was. I had no idea how. how unwell we are as a gender still.

Um. I think I I was living in a really. lovely, naive bubble in some ways where. I have surrounded myself with and I'm so. fortunate to be surrounded by incredible. women. Mhm. That support have supported. me, you know, through thick and thin. I. do the same for them and I I. I don't know women that tear each other. down. That's not been my own experience. And at work, like I've been really. intentional about the women that work. with and for me, like bringing them. along in their career, giving.

opportunity, mentoring, and helping. them. Um it's just not it wasn't it was. a such a shock to me. I think I was told. that 90% of the online comments and hate. came from women. Every single interaction I had in. person, and there were many, were all. women, like you said. You know, uh since. we had our conversation, I was thinking. about this. Um and I say this, you know, not just because of Gayle was here, but. it's. pretty publicly known that Gayle went. through a divorce and her husband had an. affair. And Gayle always says that there. is a lot of members of that club.

There's a lot of women who are a part of. that club of. uh who with partners who betrayed them. with other women. >> Mhm. And I think that for a lot of. women, you became the face of that. Do. you all think that that you became the. face of the woman who took my husband, the woman who would take my husband, the. woman who That's where the hate was. coming from. And I also think that if. you look differently,

you would have probably had another. outcome, you know? I think you are the. blonde ideal, the girl next door, the. all all of that. Am I Am I being. truthful here or what? >> Yeah. I think it's I think it's the whole. package. It's not one thing, it's. everything. >> I do think there was something people. attached to me that triggered things. within themselves. I don't I don't. think, you know, now that I sit here, I. don't think they don't know me. It can't. really be me, but it's something I. represent and I Yeah. Um. yeah, I I think that, you know, when I. think about my own triggers and things. that are like unhealed inside of me, I.

try to think of like what's what makes. me feel a certain way or what It's my. own fears that are that are not quite. healed, I think, when I So, the question. is did he get the same kind of vitriol. Andy Byron, your boss did? People were. people coming up to him? But No. Not at all. Attacking him, attacking his children? >> No. Yeah. >> And I mean just thinking about, you. know, starting from the very beginning. I was every single part of my physical. appearance was picked apart. Um.

there were stories written about jewelry. I was wearing and who bought it for me. and how much it cost when one of my best. friends is a jewelry designer and I. bought everything for myself and that. she made me and it's, you know, my. hairdresser somebody found and that. turned into a whole thing where she was. dragged for giving me crappy root or. crappy highlights and. >> Yeah. she got lit up for that. And just. everything about how I looked to how I. was dressed to how I behaved to, you. know, the sleeping my way to the top to. the gold digger to this, you know, all. the words that Lisa used, the husband. stealer. Which by the way, I just that. expression really bugs me and I I'm not.

trying to make light, obviously, of. adultery. It's it's it's not that, but. this notion of women stealing men. Like. I would walk in and duct tape and zip. tie a guy and like unwittingly drag him. out and steal. Like the man has no role. in this. Mhm. >> you know, and for me like I I was the. face of all of this. There was no one. talking about Andy's hair, shirt, watch. There was no one questioning, in a I. mean maybe anyone here can correct me, I. never read or heard anything about wow, did he become a CEO by sleeping his way. to the top? No. And that's all anyone would say.

about me. It was unfathomable that I. might have achieved and worked and. hustled and built a a career I'm. incredibly proud of. That was not on the. table. Your best friend, I heard told. you that these people hated you before. they even knew anything about you. >> Mhm. Uh. do you think that's true? What do you. think that is? >> Yeah, I think that's what you touched on. a few minutes ago. I think it's I. represented something for people that. they were afraid of in that moment. And. I I can have empathy for that. I think. if you're going to snap to a judgment. you're going to have I don't have.

empathy for people snapping to a quick. judgment and just assuming and using. zero critical thinking skills, but I do. have empathy or I I do have. understanding for why that would trigger. people. Um so I'm trying to Cuz you look. like you look. No, because I think, you. know, I'm. the way the story was narrated for me. without my input was I'm, you know, having an affair with my boss and we're. running around and we're on the company. credit card buying to It's probably what. a lot of women worry about when their. husbands are out on You know, I get. that. I can understand that.

>> Yeah. So you share custody of your your. two children with your first husband. >> Mhm. And how has this impacted your. children? That's This is the tough one. Um. It's It's It was a nightmare. >> How old are your kids? >> They're almost 15 and almost 17. So they're at an age where everything, you know, pit pat. >> 14 and 16 when this happened. >> 14 and 16. We're still in it. Um they're really. they're doing really well. Um. Tell us about the place you went some. place you went some place and your.

daughter said, "Mom, can we just leave?". Because. >> Yeah, we were at the the local pool. This was a few weeks after I decided it. was probably in later August when I felt. like safe to I tried tried to going out, you know, trying to go out. My daughter. and I went to the pool. Big hat glasses, all the things. And um. a woman at the pool started taking our. picture in a really not subtle way. And. my daughter just she just lost it and. she's like, "We need to just leave." And. I was like, "I'm so sorry." I. And I didn't you know, I was not in a.

position That's funny. The the version. of me before this concert I would have. marched right up to her and grabbed her. I mean, I'm not a shrinking violet. But. in I became, you know, a very a. different version of myself. And I I. just we packed up and left. >> think that you were taking on the guilt. and shame that other people were trying. to put on you? Um yes and no. Um I felt tremendous. guilt for. the effect it was having on my family. and I felt responsible for that, but I. did not I knew what really happened and.

I didn't feel shame for something I. didn't do. I wasn't questioning my I knew the. mistake I made. I was really clear on. what that was, but I was also really. clear that it doesn't deserve the. treatment that I got. It doesn't. deserve, you know, being made to feel that you should die. >> Can you share with us what those first. um. hours, days, and then weeks were like? I. mean, how how low did you go? I I mean, yeah, those it was.

dark. The first weekend after the concert, I I. rented an Airbnb and went up to the. mountains in New Hampshire with my dog. thinking I was just going to let it blow. over and come back. I really didn't. understand cuz I cut off all access to. the internet and social media and. everything. I did I I went away. thinking, oh, it was sort of like the. beginning of COVID when you're like, we'll close the office for the week and. we'll see in a week and then you're. like, see you in 2 years. It was sort of. like that. I thought, I'll just go and. disappear for the weekend. But when I.

came back. >> day. >> Yeah, I was like, I'm just going to. regroup and relax and not. >> And you thought it would blow over in a. few days as you had been told. >> been told. >> Yes. That definitely didn't happen, but. I I came back to my house that had was a. place that was really like my safe space. as your home home typically is. And it. became a place that was as unsafe as any. place could be because a local radio. station gave out my address on the air. and for whatever reason the whole world.

has access to my phone number and I. guess that I don't know how people do. that, but so from that day I returned, there was well, there was paparazzi. there for weeks. They wouldn't leave. There was. I had people trespassing and looking in. my windows. We had people doing. drive-bys and yelling and honking. We had my phone. >> home? >> Yes, with my children home. My my phone. was ringing around the clock and just. vile text messages and voicemails. That's probably a couple days in when.

the death threats started, but they were. also just perverse, disgusting messages. I've I got emails constantly. Um Were. you afraid? Were you scared? >> was really I was terrified. >> children were really scared because your. children overheard you speaking to your. mom. They did and they heard one of the. death threats. Um I Mhm. My kids asked me not to spend too much. time talking about them today. Um but. I'm there's I'm comfortable talking. about portions of it and that's one of. them. They were terrified for me. Um.

they're really protective of me, but. they were also really scared for what. this meant for all of us. Um. We're not used to having We're really. private. Like When your kids are hearing. that you're getting death threats, kids. think we're going to lose our mom. >> Yeah. Mhm. That's what kids think. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly what happened. and. >> going to lose our mom. >> Yeah. Then they have to now be afraid. for you. That's right. >> Yeah. That's right. And you know, I've. been a single mom for a while and they I. think already lean in to taking care of. me more than I'd like them to do at. their age. Like I've got it, you know, until I'm good, but I they've always.

been They're really like sweet and. um. I don't know, empathic people. So they. really like they're always kind of. keeping an eye and making sure I'm okay. So this kind of elevated all of that. >> You know, in all this I mean I. every I think a lot of people at this. point have experienced online vitriol or. people saying horrible things. >> Yeah. And sometimes there's something. that just is said. and it it just it cuts you. Yeah. Especially if it's untrue.

Did you Did you have one of those. moments where something is was said and. it just like brought you to your knees. or you made you not want to get out of. bed or. >> Yeah, it was and there's actually a few. Um but the one that just came to mind. first was was the piece around sleeping. my way to the top at work. Mhm. I've. spent I've worked in advertising and. technology which are really male. dominated industries and I've spent my. entire career fighting against the. stereotype of you know I must be. sleeping with someone or you know. there's. and I I've been so intentional about how. I move through my work life. I've never.

been involved with anyone I've worked. with before. I have been working since I was 13 and. you know my mom had us out really. legally working early on and um I never. stopped and my career was my identity. for better or worse and this has been a. wake-up call around that but that was my. I had tremendous pride in what I had. built. I I love what I do and for that. to be. a whole entire narrative to be written. that takes that away from me. um felt. it just gutted me in a way that I can't.

explain. So it was really that one I. think. you know obviously being called all. these horrible names is it hurts. um. I have a friend that said to me recently. like why would you take criticism from. people you would not take advice from. And that really hit home for me. um and I thought about him like it's a. great point. I don't but I did. >> point but when you're in the middle of. it it's hard to feel that. >> And it hurts like the you know and it's. easy to say oh ignore the trolls or.

ignore the but it's really hard you know. I mean you have to it's really hard to. ignore that and it gets really personal. >> Yeah. Where's your did you have family. that were there for you and all? >> family's incredible and I just you know. you asked earlier like how how low did. it get and. I do need to say that if I didn't have. the family that I have and the friends. that just wrapped a big warm blanket. around me like I don't know that I would. have made it through this. And had I. been the 25-year-old version of myself I. would not be sitting here. There's no. way. Yeah. It was really horrific. Cuz.

yeah when you hear the number I think it. was you who told me the 300 billion when. you hear the 300 how is that even. possible? >> doesn't include social media that's just. the internet. How wild did it get on I. don't know how wild it got on social, but I think it was wilder than just like. the you know, different tabloid. websites. But that 300 billion is on the. websites alone. Yeah. That's really. disturbing. And so, how did you get your children. through it? When your when your children. when you become the meme Mhm. and.

everybody knows it's your mom. >> Yeah. How how did you how did you get. them through that? >> tough. I mean, we we had a lot of. conversation. In the beginning though, I. mean, I was I I I was not. momming to the best of my abilities. It. was I was pretty broken down. We had a lot for better or worse, we had. a lot of family visiting last summer. I. had a lot of people staying at my house, my brother and his family and. a lot of guests. So, I tried to kind of. pivot to just like. life as usual as best I could after. maybe the first month. And we tried to.

just get back to it. Like go to the. beach, like try to do some normal. things. Um it was hard because. people were not shy to come up to me in. front of my kids. And I had a group of. women. um. that I was at my son's where he works. He works at a surf shop at the beach. near our house and a group of women. surrounded my car. and in front of my son and started to, you know, harass me verbally and um kind of make. it hard for me to move [clears throat]. my car away from where they were. Um. and.

it it was it was hard to explain that to. my kids. You know, they were they were. really lucky to have their peers show up. for them in a really supportive way, but. they were struck by how horrific. grown-ups were acting. And that's a. really hard thing for me to explain to. kids that. you know, why are why cuz I didn't even. >> even understand why yeah, that cuz how. do you explain to them why the people. are hating you so much? >> Right. I tried to explain to them what. kind of what you described like I think. I'm representative of something that. touches at a lot of fear in people. I. don't and I didn't know, you know, I was. trying to figure it out myself and I.

wish I could have showed up for them. in better ways than I did, but I did the. best I could do in in those moments, I. it was really hard. Going back to school. for them was really hard. I they didn't. want me on their campuses for the first. semester or trimester. So, I missed, you know, I didn't go to. games. I didn't go to parent. conferences. I couldn't go to parents. weekend at my son's school. Um but the. schools were wonderful. I worked with. them closely to make sure the kids were. supported. Um and like I said, their. friends were great. Do you still talk to. Andy Byron, your former boss? No. I I um.

ended communication with Andy in. mid-fall. Mhm. Um there was a. a big miss on honesty and integrity. Um. I don't he didn't he wasn't the person. he represented himself to be to me and. lying is not a non-negotiable for me. >> that mean actually? >> I don't, you know, there was. he missed the mark on being as honest as. he could have been with me and at the. end of the day, Oprah, like I was the. one left holding the. >> separated that because what you're.

implying to me, what I'm hearing is that. he really wasn't separated. I. >> what you're trying to say or not? >> to be really careful because the world. spoke for me and on my behalf and I. don't want to do that to somebody else. in their family. I don't feel. comfortable, but I will say like a lot. of what was represented to me was not. true. Okay. >> Um I also want to say that being left. >> But will you verify again, as you said. to us earlier, that he had told you, when you told him you were separated, he. had said to you he's going through the. same thing? >> Unequivocally. Okay.

Unequivocally. So, you believed when you. were standing with him at the Coldplay. concert. that he was separated. >> Absolutely. Zero doubt. Zero doubt. Okay. Um but I was left holding the bag. um and I don't, you know, being the one that was attacked for this. with, you know, he's remained silent. Um. to me, that's not a quality that I would. look for in a friend or a partner or a. boss. Um. so, we have no relationship now. >> would you have wanted him to do or say?

I I mean, the entire trajectory of this would have. changed if he would have just made a. quick statement to say my wife and I. were separated at the time of the. concert. Just like my husband did. But it didn't matter when he was great. that Andrew did that, but it also still. I was still left with, you know, the. tone changed a little bit. Okay, so she. was separated, but he wasn't, so she's. still a homewrecker. Okay, one moment and it's one moment and. one split-second decision can change the.

trajectory of anybody's life. Why do you, you know, I'm always. whenever something, particularly this. big, happens, I say, "What are you. trying to teach me, God?" I know. You. didn't have to use this big a lesson. Yeah. [laughter]. I could have gotten with something. smaller. Have you looked at this in the bigger. picture of your life? What Why did this. show up in your life this way? And what. is it here to teach you? Yeah, I mean, that's the million-dollar question. I. think about that every single day. And I.

do believe, like, I got knocked off my course for for a. reason. Like some There's something to. learn here. And there's bits and pieces. that are coming into the light for me. Um I'm really understanding, and I had. no concept of this, how. when something goes this viral, how the. technology companies are benefiting from. this and how we don't know that when we. are forwarding and liking and clicking, we are putting billions of dollars in. their pockets. Creating an algorithm.

>> And creating an algorithm that feeds it. And the more pain someone like me is in, the more money they're going to make. And it fuels it and feeds it. And I. think there's accountability there that. um needs to be looked at. I think. I'm heartbroken at how women are. treating other women. Like I'm I want to. One thing I don't know the answer to. yet, but is like how can my experience. turn into something positive to keep. that conversation alive and try to. figure out like why are we doing this to. each other? We're so much stronger together. What.

Why are we eating each other alive? It. Yeah. Um and holding each other back. And why do we take such a joy in seeing. other people suffer? Yeah. It's really. scary. >> interesting, once you've been through. something like this, when you see. somebody else going through it, it. creates an empathetic moment for you to. want to reach out and say, I know what. that's like, or I That's right. Yeah. That's right. I did that. I reached out. to a family. There was a girl who was I. don't know if you heard about this. She. was 4 years old receiving. zillions of death threats because she. was helping her dad, who's a radio.

personality, pick out football teams. >> Mhm. And she started to miss the mark on. the choices, and people started. threatening her life because she was. screwing up their gambling. Publicly, they were threatening this. 4-year-old girl, and I reached out to. her family. And they were lovely, and I I I mean, it's so scary what they're going. through. I mean, it's just it it's it's. happening all the time. It's also I I I my producer said that. what Daryl Hannah recently released a. >> statement. >> Yes. about what was going on in the the. the Kennedy love story. >> That's right.

>> Yeah. I actually brought I wanted to. share a quote, if I could, from that. I. don't know if anyone has If you haven't. read her essay in the New York Times. this past week, it's it's a beautifully. written piece, but it was it struck me. deeply. Um and there was a part where. she talks about um how Jackie Onassis. used to say to her, like, there's going. to be horrible things in the news. It's. going to you know. >> Cuz Daryl Hannah was dating. >> Was dating John F. Kennedy Jr., and. Jackie O said, "If you're going to. People are going to write horrible. things about you, but don't worry about. it. It'll be lining a birdcage. tomorrow." And people will feel You. know, the newspapers will be lining. birdcages. Don't worry. And she wrote,

and I I quote, this was from on the 6th. of March, "In the digital age, stories. do not disappear. Yesterday's news is. not tossed out with the morning paper, and lies live online forever. They are. archived, streamed, clipped, memed, and. resurfaced endlessly. A dramatized. portrayal can become, for millions of. viewers, the definitive version of a. real person's life.". >> They think that that's history. >> That's right. >> Yeah. So that I mean that's exactly like. it I wish I knew Daryn so I could give. her a huge hug, but she was she wrote. about was encapsulated my experience to.

a T. Yeah. So where are you now in the healing. process for you and for your family? You're supporting yourself, you're. supporting your children. Have you. started to look for work again? Has Andy. Byer and I heard it has has gotten. offers from other places. >> Lots of interest. >> Lots of interest. >> he has the luxury of staying silent and. he can go back to work when he's ready. I don't. I feel I have to remind myself. I'm not on trial, but I have to in order. for me to get back on my feet I have to. come out and explain. And I think that's.

a stark difference between the man and. the woman in this situation. I have to. explain and explain and justify and and. I feel like people when I speak up they. think I'm trying to be famous. If I. don't speak I must be guilty. Um, so I'm trying to figure out the. right balance there. And for me I'm you. know I'm raising my kids alone. I'm. financially responsible for my kids. alone and I need to get back to work. >> people are going to criticize you for. like why are you talking and why. >> I'm trying to prolong my 15 minutes of. fame. If I'm not talking I'm you know. Yeah. So again you decided to talk.

because Because I felt like I said in. the beginning like I can't stay silent. and um, accept what has happened and I. do feel like it's important that people. understand the real story and also how. harmful it is to just make assumptions. and judge and and feed and fuel. something that created this narrative. But you're so right. It you know, I knew. that Andrew had Andrew your husband that. you're getting a divorce from had made a. statement saying that you all were.

separated at the time. >> Mhm. But you're right. We never heard. from Andy Byer and if Andy Byer and had. done that it would have changed. everything I think. Yes. That's right. That's right. >> Don't y'all think so? Everybody would. have thought oh, they're both separated. Okay." Still her boss, still HR, still. not great. >> But a lot less interesting to the. general public, I think. >> Yeah, a lot lot lot And I think I do. think, you know, Chris Martin being a.

celebrity and and that adding to it, I. think helped with this, you know, this. thing going viral, for sure. I think. when you bring a celebrity into the mix. with private people, it I think it gives. it more. Yeah. And before we go, uh I I said to you backstage, which I do. with all interviews that are important, um. uh all interviews are important, but not. as important as you wanting to make this. statement here. I always ask people. before every show, and I've been doing. this since 1989, actually. I ask people. before we go out, what is your.

intention? Because I want you to be able. to fulfill exactly the reason that you. came. Thank you. >> I'm glad that you came. I'm glad that. you were willing to have your first, and. you say only interview, with me. But. most important, I want you to be able to. say. and fully not get home and say, "Oh, I should have said." Or "Oh, she didn't. ask me." What is it you feel. that you need to say, or that you want. people to know before we leave?

>> Yeah, I want people to know that I'm. just a regular person. I'm a private. person. I didn't ask for this. Um I. didn't ask to be famous and and I've I. have no experience dealing with all of. this. And I'm just I'm a mom that takes. my kids to school and picks them up at. practices and tries to juggle work and. or I was work and parenting and I'm. someone's daughter and sister and friend. and. I really want people to understand. what. what happened and what harm it does to.

real people's lives when you mindlessly. fuel a fire like this. It's incredibly. dangerous. And I'm so grateful I have. the tools I have that I can sit here and. talk about it because so many people. don't make it through it. And it's. tragic. Um And I just I want people to, you know, just be kind. And I, you know, it sounds so simple. >> Especially women to women. I know you. were upset because you felt that there. were other women who came out and should. have been more supportive, you felt. >> Yeah, I just think we're holding each. other back. Like, let's stop. And I. think it's a conversation that needs to.

be had over and over right now. Like, what is going on with us as a gender. that give that you know, we take such. pleasure in in holding each other back. and hurting each other. Yeah. >> It's really strange. >> you were upset when there was a. commercial that Gwyneth did. Gwyneth. Paltrow. Yeah. Yeah, that was really. disappointing to me. Um I felt like. Gwyneth someone whose company is is. founded on or framed around uplifting. women and women's well-being. Mhm. >> And she doesn't need the money. I don't. know why she felt she needed to throw.

gas on the fire and get involved. [clears throat] in all of this. Um it. was it just felt really hypocritical to. me and unnecessary. >> Mhm. And I think, you know, I don't want. to let Ryan Reynolds off the hook. either. Uh he produced the ad, he. created it. And his wife has just gone. through something really similar over. the last year. And I I find it really. kind of astounding that he thought this. was a great way to. to lead, you know. >> Well, I will tell you that um I called. Gwyneth and I asked her about this. And. so this isn't an official statement, but.

I did ask her if it was okay if I if if. I shared what she shared with me. And. she said that she was told that you and. Andy Byron had signed off on that. commercial. >> Mhm. And and she said um she would have done. it if she hadn't heard that you had. signed off on the commercial. Had you. signed off on the commercial? Um no. Yeah. I said. >> that to me as well. Okay. Cuz she also. said, I was going to say she also said. that she sent you a sent sent you an. email and that she hadn't heard back.

from the email. So, I just wanted to say that. Okay? Mhm. Thank you. Okay. Um so when that commercial came out, did. you feel that that was just fuel on the. fire? >> Absolutely. I mean, it made everything. in that moment and for, you know, ensuing days or weeks, it made. everything harder. Um. it was made it a lot harder for my kids, too. Um I think when when a celebrity. gets involved like that, that's hard. They're teenagers, like I said, they. know who she is. They know. um and it it made it just added to it in.

a way that was so unnecessary. Mhm. Um. but people have their own needs and I. can't speculate as to what those are. So, it happened and. I can just. And you're saying that you've been most. disappointed by the reaction from other. women. >> That's been the biggest thing for me. Um. and I. I don't know. I wish I could fix it. I. wish I could understand it. And. honestly, I'd love to sit with some of. these women that are so angry at me and. really listen and try to understand what. it is about me or what it is it What. could I have What would they like to.

have seen, you know, what I don't know. I'd love to have a real conversation. about what it is that makes them so. angry. >> that happen if you want to. >> I really would love it. I I I'm being. deadly serious on this. I don't I I have. a real need to try to. understand and have empathy for people. that are hurting. And I'm feeling so. much hurt that I I can't fix it, but I. would love to understand it. That would. help me heal, too, to better understand. why. um why people are so angry. Yeah. Is there anybody here who had seen the.

video who was angry? Yes. So, were you one of those angry. people? I wasn't angry at you. I My the. first thing that came to my mind when I. saw that video was everything that in. darkness comes to light. And I passed. judgment and I own I take ownership for. that. It was not It wasn't nice. And. it's not the type of example that I. should make for my children. Um as a mom, I empathize with your plight. tremendously because, unfortunately, children are.

the the casualties of these they take. the brunt of a lot of this. >> Yeah. Um but one thing that I think is. really important and I was I was the. woman who was at home and who didn't. know. Okay, after 17 years of marriage. So. when I saw that it really hit home. >> Yeah. But. the most important thing that I've. learned through my journey is that the. only person that can define who I am. is me. Yeah.

That's right. I love that. Yeah. [applause]. Yeah. I I I think that's really true, but I also as as a person who is um. you know, throughout the internet uh. you know, people say horrible things. There's no need for that. >> horrible things all the time and it is. very very different if you're up on a. Jumbotron that becomes the most watched. video of the entire year. It is and I.

and I there is that distinction, but for. a person who's going through a very. public situation in their own microcosm, which is a Jumbotron for them, it's. different. But again, so my apologies. for the judgment that I passed based on. what I had read. >> Cuz you didn't know that she was. separated. >> know that you were separated. >> that he was separated. >> No, it was because that's not I went by. the narrative. >> a major factor. But irrespective of. that, I would have never ever ever said. something mean or wished that the like.

that's just that's just unacceptable. There's no need for that. >> this this is thank you so much for. sharing that and thank you for so much. for being willing to admit that you were. in judgment because the whole world was. actually and I would have to say that in. this moment, I think it's really. important for. we as the human species to look at. how we are participating. in the comments and the global. discussions because does a person. deserve death threats because they made.

a mistake? Think of all the mistakes we've made in. our lives. Think of all the things you. wish had not been seen or you wish you. hadn't have done that or said that or. whatever and it gets you know. replicated 300 billion times and now. people are threatening your life and the. life of your children and they're. parked outside your house and your. number is all over the world. I mean. just think about that for a moment. Yeah. I am really sorry that you had to go. through that. >> Thank you.

Thank you for allowing me to talk about. it. And I I know it took a lot for you. to do this today. I do have to say if I. can interrupt and I'm sorry. I. at the center of the like trauma for me. is how. women have treated me and it was really. scary to come here and sit in the center. of a room full of primarily women just. kind of looking at me like this is. really really terrifying. Yeah. Um but I. have to say like I do feel a lot of. warmth in the room so I want to thank. the people here. Um this was. it was almost I could almost couldn't do.

it because of the audience. >> And you still you still said yes. >> Well, my daughter told me yesterday. morning when I dropped her at school and. I was like I'm so nervous and she's like. mom this will be like therapy for you. You can do it. Aw. >> like oh thank you. Yeah. Yeah. >> It does feel good. Well, it does feel. good. >> feel good. >> So I thank you for allowing me to be. your first interview. Thank you. Thank. you. >> [applause].

>> Thank you those of you who are watching. I'll see you next time. Go well. everybody. Go well. Good job. >> [cheering]. >> Thank you. [applause]. Thank you. Good job. Good job. >> [applause]. >> Good job. Well done. Well done. >> [applause and cheering]. >> Well done. Well done. Well done. Well done. >> Well done. Yes, you can take our picture. now. >> [laughter]. >> Yeah, you can take our picture now. Yeah. I hope you like Coldplay again. because honestly God.

Chris Martin honestly he's one of the. most empathetic people and. he had known he never would have done. that. The problem is you both look like. you had been busted. So when you look like you've been busted. you know we didn't those judgements. weren't made out of nowhere it's because. both of you looked oh my God we've been. caught. And if both And you. yes you. not for what you thought. And you do. want to work again right? >> I'm dying to go I'm so bored I like I. have so I said to Gayle I have so much. gas left in the tank I'm dying to get. back to work. I don't.

>> got job offers and you haven't that's. that's wow. I do just want to say like. me sitting here I was getting chills. from you speaking like it really. honestly like hearing your perspective. you know seeing it on social media. seeing all these different things and. people making their own narratives you. speaking out I'm sure all the women in. this room feel this way like after. hearing your story like we empathize. with you like it really does. Like now. it's Thank you. >> [applause]. >> You can subscribe to the Oprah podcast. on YouTube and follow us on Spotify.

Apple podcasts or wherever you listen. I'll see you next week. Thanks. everybody.