Trump Freezes Trillions. Chaos Ensues.

from The New York Times I'm Sabrina. tavernes and this is the. [Music]. daily this week president Donald Trump. made one of the most audacious moves. since he took office freezing trillions. of dollars in federal money everything. from anti-poverty programs to foreign. aid in order to purge the government of. what he called woke ideology.

today my colleague White House reporter. Mike Shear on that order the chaos that. it prompted and whether it is likely to. survive in. [Music]. [Applause]. court it's Wednesday January 29th.

[Music]. so Mike president Trump has done. something pretty remarkable all of. Washington where you are right now is. talking about it I'm wondering if you. can lay out for listeners exactly what. he did and what's unfolded in the days. since right it really was remarkable. essentially late in the day on Monday. president Trump's budget office which is. called the Office of Management and. budget it reports directly to the.

president they put out a memo a really. short memo it was just two pages but it. essentially exploded in Washington the. minute it went out because what it did. was it said that every single federal. program that involves the delivery of. money in the form of a grant or in the. form of a loan to any organization any. entity across the country had to be. paused and I I'm just going to read. directly from the memo and it said the.

use of federal resources to advance. Marxist equity transgenderism and green. New Deal Social Engineering policies is. a waste of taxpayer dollars that does. not improve the day-to-day lives of. those we serve it said that all of the. agencies had to pause the funds while. they reviewed whether the programs in. question the loans and the grants were. quote consistent with the president's. policies okay so basically the memo is.

saying all these federal funds go out to. all of these programs all over the. country they need to be put on hold to. make sure that none of them are actually. at odds with the administration's agenda. that's right and this is a lot of money. according to the administration's own. figures as much as $3 trillion and the. agenda that the memo says these programs. must adhere to was really laid out by. the president in a series of executive. orders that we've all seen him announce.

over the course of the eight or nine. days that he's been in office and we. know what those executive orders have. tried to do right root out wokness in. the government as the president would. put it and really align all of the. government's spending with this sort of. Maga agenda that seeks to kind of wipe. out some of the efforts that have been. made by previous administrations over. the past several years so exactly how. does the memo proposed that this is. going to work what the memo says is that. over the course of the next two weeks.

starting Tuesday at 5:00 p.m. all of. these federal agencies are supposed to. fill out a spreadsheet the spreadsheet. has every single Federal Grant and. Federal Loan and apparently what the. Office of Management and budget will do. is essentially go through that. spreadsheet if they find programs that. don't violate the orders that the. president has done those will be safe. the funding will continue but that in. some fashion if identify the programs.

that they think are funding things that. President Trump would not want to fund. or are blocked by these executive orders. that funding would be then at risk so. which programs exactly will be affected. here what do we know about that well the. memo is quite Broad and it's clear that. it is intended to cover the vast sweep. of most government programs there's. literally hundreds and hundreds of Grant. programs and federal loan programs that. provide money to to organizations.

nonprofits State agencies State programs. local programs across the country just. to give you a sense of how far- ranging. this could be it's everything from Head. Start programs for early childhood. education grants that cover Renewable. Energy Research and clean energy. demonstrations there are special. education grants all of those would have. to be subject to this order there are. some exceptions one exception for. example says that nothing in this memo.

should be construed to impact Medicare. or Social Security benefits they go on. to explain that it's any type of. assistance that's directly received by. individuals wouldn't be affected so that. leaves this sort of vast other area. where the money is provided not directly. to people but to organizations or States. or other programs that provide benefits. to Americans but not in a direct way. okay so this memo as you say is quite a.

bombshell in Washington what happens. next well what happens next is kind of a. freakout right across the country people. begin to wonder what impact this is. going to have who's on the list that's. the big question that's sort of. ricocheting across Washington but also. across the country and all of these. programs that rely on the federal. government for money they wake up and. are trying to figure out is my program. affected you know if so how do I deal. with that and so by midday Tuesday after. after all of the angst in the country.

the White House decides it needs to. respond good to see all of you Carolyn. levit who is the new White House Press. Secretary for Mr Trump has her first. press briefing for the White House Press. Corp and she really tries to push back. well I think there's only uncertainty in. this room amongst the media there's no. uncertainty in this building so let me. provide the certainty and the clarity. that all of you need you know she really. tries to explain that no there's a lot. of these programs that are not going to. be effective.

Social Security benefits Medicare. benefits uh food stamps welfare benefits. assistance that is going directly to. individuals will not be impacted by this. pause and I want to it's essentially the. White House trying to kind of reassure. its own people that this big dramatic. action by the president isn't going to. sort of hit them in the pocketbooks. directly but the questions keep piling. up how long is this pause going to last. and do you think there will be a list of. who is affected and how much money is.

affected health Medicaid is that. affected I what about Medicaid the. health insurance program for low-income. people that's funded through money sent. to the states by the federal government. are you guaranteeing here that no. individual now on Medicaid would see a. cut off because of the PA I'll check. back on that and get back to you John. the White House later says that Medicaid. is not impacted by the memo but the. problem is that the reality is actually. happening more quickly than their. statements can keep up with so you have.

the system by which State Medicaid. offices log in to get their money from. the federal government not only goes. down so all these states are locked out. but it goes down with a big red banner. across the top that says the system is. down and we're delaying or cancelling. payments based on the president's. executive orders so it becomes very. clear very quickly that this memo has. actually begun to have real world.

[Music]. implications how should we make sense of. that disconnect I mean the White House. is saying Medicaid not affected but. Medicaid clearly was affected I mean was. the White House just not being. forthcoming I'm not sure we know 100%. the answer to that question I mean in.

some ways it's kind of a feature not a. bug of the Trump presidency is that he. Embraces the chaos he likes the sense. that the American people feel like he's. just out there you know kind of and like. a wrecking ball essentially right like. from president Trump's perspective from. the perspective of his supporters they. want him to come in like a bull in a. china shop and kind of disrupt. everything and so I think in some ways. the Trump Administration isn't so. concerned about not having the answers. to all the questions but I think that.

one of the repercussions of that is for. the rest of the country and especially. in this case the vast numbers of. organizations that rely upon this. funding and they need the money to pay. rent to pay salaries to pay out benefits. to people all of that has to happen in. an organized and methodical way and this. is anything but to that point what are. those thousands upon thousands of. organizations and grantees saying what's.

happening over the course of the day. well it's been a mixed bag and you know. our reporters have sort of reached out. broadly across the Spectrum and some of. them have not seen any direct impact yet. but they're essentially ringing their. hands right they're worried that maybe. their research Grant is funded by the. federal government and they're not sure. whether that will continue or perhaps. they have a program that provides. benefits to migrants and they're not. sure if that's going to pass muster so.

there has been a lot of hand ringing and. then there have been some examples of. actual impact uh one of my colleagues. talked to a woman who runs Head Start. programs in Michigan she has something. like 41 schools that have about 600. students that come every day when all of. this started going down on Tuesday she. decided to cancel class for Wednesday. essentially worried that if funding. dried up from the federal government it. was unclear whether she could continue.

and so there have been those kinds of. examples where people have actually. taken steps to to stop what they're. doing out of fear that continuing could. sort of violate these executive orders. or what president Trump wants to do. right so it sounds like Mass confusion. is at least the bare minimum of what was. happening yeah chaos confusion across. the. country but at the same time another. thing is. happening a real effort to try to stop.

this whole thing from moving forward. both politically and. [Music]. legally we'll be right. back so Mike tell us about the fights. that have been brewing over this order. since it was issued so the first fight. that immediately happened was the. political.

one the scope of the damage that will be. done is enormous the Democrats on. Capitol Hill immediately seized on this. so as we stand here today people should. think about the mom who doesn't know if. she can get her kid to child care today. there's a dagger at the heart of the. average American family in red States in. blue States in cities in suburbs in. rural areas it is just outrageous a. asserting in a really forceful way that.

what the president had done would affect. Americans would hurt Americans this. decision is. Lawless dangerous. destructive cruel it's illegal it's. unconstitutional the idea on the part of. the Democrats was that not only would. this have a really terrible impact on. people who rely on this Federal money. but they also question whether it would. even be constitutional I spoke to my.

attorney general this morning she's Head. of the State Attorneys General. Association they're going to court right. away on this. Hara and on Tuesday you had many. Democratic State Attorneys General. coming together to file a lawsuit to try. to block the president's order from. going into effect and keep the money. flowing you had Progressive groups who. filed separate lawsuits trying to do the. same the goal for all of them to try to.

block president Trump from moving. forward with his actions regarding all. of this Federal money okay so you did. have these legal challenges coming out. pretty much right away what were they. arguing exactly well essentially the the. gist from all of the different law suits. boil down to a general argument that. what the president had done with this. memo essentially violates the heart of. the Constitution which gives Congress. the power of the purse it says Congress.

has the ability to decide how much money. is spent where is that money is spent. and that you know essentially the. executive in this case president Trump. and his administration is required and. that the language in the constitution is. to Faithfully execute the laws that are. passed right and that by essentially. holding back this money president Trump. was violating that basic precept of. constitutional law so in other words the. argument is Trump and the executive. branch can't just suddenly take on a.

power that's always belonged to Congress. that's right and and then another. argument actually goes to a much more. specific law and that was the. impoundment act of 1974 and okay you're. going to have to Define that for people. I do not know what that is right that. was essentially part of the reform. efforts after President Nixon had really. pursued aggressively a kind of imperial. presidency in which he would pick and. choose. the laws and the spending that he wanted.

to put into action after Congress had. passed them that essentially provided. the impetus for Congress to reassert its. Authority and say no no no if you had. any doubt that the constitution. actually mandates that the executive. branch must put into effect the laws. that we passed we're going to pass a law. that actually says that and makes that. very clear and Mike what is the Trump. Administration say to these kinds of.

arguments that what he's doing here is. illegal essentially they waved them. aside Carolyn levit the press secretary. and her press briefing essentially said. we disagree our lawyers think that what. the president has done is perfectly. legal and part of their argument relies. I think on the temporary nature of the. pause and you know whether they're right. or the other folks right obviously is up. for argument will be argued in courts. but essentially the White House position.

was we don't put any stock in the legal. arguments against this we're very. confident and to underscore that point. Carolyn levit said at the briefing today. that the White House fully intends to. defend what the president did all the. way to the Supreme Court if necessary so. Mike we are talking at about 6:30 p.m. on Tuesday and we already have some. updates on these lawsuits tell us how. the lawsuits have started to make their. way through the legal system right so. we're really at the very very beginning. but late Tuesday a judge in the District.

of Columbia did rule at least. temporarily on one of the cases brought. by a progressive group essentially. putting a temporary stay on the. president's order that means that the. White House the administration is unable. to move forward in enforcing the order. the judge said that she would rule in a. more permanent way on February 3rd so. essentially for a number of days the. president. effort here is at least temporarily.

blocked so does that mean a full pause. on this entire effort it does at least. for the moment and you said they already. mentioned that they were ready for this. to go all the way up to the Supreme. Court might it go that far and what do. you think will happen if it does so this. feels like one of those moments in. Washington where there is a real. fundamental issue at stake right the. question of the power of an executive to.

make a sweeping decision like this. versus the power of congress to. essentially control and mandate that. their laws are Faithfully executed in. those moments when there are real. clashes between executive and. legislative power is tends to be where. the federal court system really does. engage and they do engage typically in a. quick way so it's hard to predict 100%. what will happen and how this will play.

out but I think most people we've talked. to believe that this will make its way. pretty quickly to the Supreme Court and. that the Supreme Court Justices will. likely take it up because it is in their. interest to clarify and to rule on you. know a pretty fundamental question of. Presidential Power and do we have a. sense of how the Supreme Court might. rule well it's always hard to know but I. did talk to our colleague Adam lipac who. is our exceptional supreme court. reporter Adam is always cautious not to.

make too many predictions but I think. that he generally thinks that the. president's probably favor Congress in. this fight and that the clarity with. which Congress over the years has. described that power probably means that. the courts will rule against the. president but you know that's to be seen. right I mean I guess it raises the. question though you know if the memo. isn't really likely to survive a court. challenge ultimately if it goes away in.

a matter of days or weeks the Trump. Administration presumably would have. seen that coming so what was the point. of all of this what were they actually. up. to well so I think that you know they. are serious about pushing through. changes to federal law when they can you. know I don't think they would have. embarked on this effort if they thought. that it was not possible that they could. win but they also recognize that if they.

don't ultimately win on a kind of legal. basis and this memo either has to be. scaled back or changed or maybe it never. gets implemented at all I think from. their perspective they still have sent a. really strong message to the country to. especially president Trump's most Ardent. supporters that he is trying right that. he isn't somebody who's going to come in. and Tinker around the edges that he. really wants to fundamentally change the.

country and that message that political. message is almost as important as. succeeding in the end for them you know. he won't win all the time and I think. they know that but that is sort of. besides the point Mike as we prepared. for a potential second Trump. Administration reporting really. suggested that Trump 2.0 was going to be. very different than Trump 1.0 it would. be more organized it would be more. effective you know Trump knows how the. government works now he has lawyers who.

have executive orders written ready to. go but this memo today and the chaos it. sparked would seem to kind of undercut. that idea so how do you make sense of. that you know it's actually I I was. thinking about this today it today was. the first time that it really felt like. the first Trump term which I covered. from the beginning I recall covering the. white house uh the first Trump White. House. at the end of the first week when.

President Trump signed the travel ban on. several majority Muslim countries the. chaos there was very similar in the. sense that people didn't understand what. was happening I remember talking to. Trump Administration officials late into. the night asking them for details about. what the executive order meant how it. would be implemented they didn't have. any of the answers but I think what's a. bit different here from the chaos of the. first Trump term is that. that now Trump has a a bit more of an.

intention you know not only to have kind. of political power and to you know have. a presidency for another four years but. it's to reshape this whole government. that he sees as having been filled with. woke ideology and liberal ideology and. to purge it of all of that and remake It. In His Image in the you know make. America great movement ideology that's. you know for him president Trump is all.

about making sure that he leaves a. legacy that the country has been you. know and certainly the government has. been remade In His Image and the. question is will the institutions hold. it's always the question. [Music]. right the question was asked the first. time around during the first four years. and I think what we see in what's. happened over the last8 or n days and. especially what's happened from Monday. night forward is that President Trump is.

absolutely willing and determined to. test the boundaries to test the. institutions of government and see how. far he can get in his efforts to remake. the government in His image and he will. continue to push and the institutions uh. will continue to push back and I think. the American people will be watching the. outcome of that for the days weeks. months and probably years to come. [Music].

Mike thank you sure happy. [Music]. too we'll be right. back here's what else you should know. today president Trump moved toward. pushing transgender people out of the. military by telling the Pentagon that. anyone who openly identified that way. should be seen as having an impediment.

to the physical and mental well-being. necessary for military service while the. order did not immediately exclude anyone. from the military it gave the Pentagon. 60 days to update its policy on medical. standards and 30 days to come forward. with revised guidance on how to. implement Trump's. vision and also on Tuesday the Trump. Administration offered roughly 2 million. federal workers the option to resign and. still be paid through the end of.

September the message came in the form. of an email from the office of personnel. management which oversees the federal. Workforce it had the subject line fork. in the road and said that a majority of. federal agencies would probably be. downsized and that a substantial number. of employees would be furloughed or. reclassified to a status that would make. them easier to fire the effort was meant. to reduce the size of the federal. Workforce and to help push out people. who do not support president Trump's.

political. [Music]. agenda today's episode was produced by. Rob zipco and will Reed with help from. Sydney Harper Carlos prto and Michael. Simon Johnson it was edited by MJ Davis. Lynn contains original music by Dan pal. and Marian Lozano and was engineered by. Chris Wood our theme music is by. brunberg and Ben Lanser of.

[Music]. [Music]. wonderly that's it for the daily I'm. Sabrina tavernes see you tomorrow. [Music].