Three Undecided Voters, Two Swing States, One Big Decision

hey it's Michael before we get started a. few details about a major developing. story that's still being pieced together. the FBI is investigating what appears to. be another attempted assassination of. former president Trump this time as he. played golf at one of his clubs in West. Palm Beach on Sunday afternoon Trump who. was unharmed in the incident was golfing. at around 1:30 p.m. when according to. law enforcement Secret Service agents.

spotted an armed man hiding in the. bushes surrounding the golf course. agents then fired at the man who fled. the scene in a car but was later. apprehended on a nearby Highway it was. not immediately clear if the suspect had. fired any shots police said they found a. rifle with a scope near where the man. was spotted along with a camera and two. backpacks a law enforcement official. identified the suspect as 58y y- old.

Ryan Wesley ralth of Hawaii last year. ralth told the times that he had. recently traveled to Ukraine as a. volunteer fighter in the country's war. against. Russia these are the key facts that we. know for now we'll be following. developments over the next few hours and. we'll bring them to you as soon as we. can okay here's Today's. show from the New York Times I'm Michael. babbaro this is the daily.

as everyone saw two nights ago we had a. Monumental victory over comrade Camala. Harris in the presidential debate from. the moment that Donald Trump and kamla. Harris walked off the debate stage last. week you saw a president for All America. in KLA Harris you saw the confidence you. saw the vision you saw the Poise both. their campaigns and The Wider political. world have argued over who won during. their Showdown what was your take on the.

debate Michael she spanked that. ass her whole strategy was to distract. by mocking Donald Trump so she didn't. have to talk about her record or her. policies whoever did debate prep for. Donald Trump should be fired but the. real question is what their first and. perhaps only debate meant to a small. sliver of undecided voters in a handful. of key swing States whose ballots could. determine the outcome of the.

election today my colleagues Campbell. Robertson and Stella tan speak to three. such voters about what they saw during. the debate and how much closer it's. brought them to a. decision it's Monday September. [Music]. 16th Campbell tell us about Bob and. Sharon Reed and where they fit into this.

group of undecided American voters at. this pretty late moment in the. presidential race so before I get to the. reads to step back the undecided vote at. this stage of the race is pretty small. when I say small I mean about 10% of. Voters told us in times polling that. they're genuinely uncertain about. whether they'll be voting for Trump or. Harris some say it's even smaller like. 5% either way it's not that many people.

but in States like Pennsylvania. Wisconsin they punch way above their. weight because these states are so. important and the margins are so narrow. that how these voters make up their mind. could swing the whole race right they're. a pretty diverse group they're you know. older voters younger voters voters of. color white voters they tend to be by. definition pretty moderate on the issues. a lot of undecided voters when you. really start talking to them you'll pick. up pretty quickly that they're really.

actually not that undecided they might. really know who they're going to vote. for they're just waiting to get the. convincing case or they're just not. plugged in at all but Bob and Sharon. Reed are truly undecided I've been. tracking them for months now as part of. a project that the national desk of the. times has undertaken to hear from. undecided voters and at every stage of. the race the Reeds have not been ready. to say who they will vote for at all. they have serious reservations about.

both Trump first Biden and now Harris so. just describe the reads for us what we. need to know about them to understand. how it is that they remain undecided so. the reeds are a lovely couple they uh. are both retired School teachers I had. 35.6 of high school but then I taught 15. or 17 years to college he taught math. and I taught 32 years in the public. school and then I did 17 years at the.

college she taught special education. they live on a small farm corn hay and. Al Alfa sayy just say just say hey in. north central Pennsylvania the single. most important swing state in the. country they retired from school. teaching a few years ago so they're. living on their pensions and they said. that inflation has hit them hard their. fixed income has not kept up with. inflation so that is on their mind and. what would you describe their political.

leanings and past voting as being like. have have y'all always at the. presidential level voted. Republican most times yeah yes so. they're Republicans in presidential. elections they have voted Republican. pretty Faithfully they've voted for. Trump in. 2016 they voted for him in 2020 but. particularly uh Sharon really thinks. he's gone downhill since 2020 they think.

of him as unpredictable even when he. talks about policies they like they. don't think he'll carry him out so I. mean is he gonna spend time going after. vindictive is he gonna be vindictive and. go after his quote enemies or people. that done him wrong that worries me in. this year's Republican primary she was. so fed up with Trump that she voted for. Nikki. Haley Bob grudgingly voted for Trump.

but they've both told me they are. totally open to voting for a Democrat. even though they are Republicans and. they prefer Republican policies they. voted for Josh Shapiro for governor the. moderate Democratic governor of. Pennsylvania and they like him so much. that Sharon was a little worried he'd. get picked as Harris's running mate and. he'd have to leave Pennsylvania so how. do they think about this presidential. debate heading into it last week so. given all their concerns about Trump.

they really hoped that Harris was going. to make it easy for them in the debate. that she would give a plan she would. give specifics and even if they didn't. agree with all of it there would be. enough of it that they agreed with that. they could look at each other and say. you know what we're just going to vote. for Harris so they watched it very. closely and the minute it was over I. gave them a call first of all Bob how. was your birthday oh good I went. swimming up in kobal then we went to. Texas Texas Roadhouse and went to see.

the movie Reagan I liked it I thought it. was good I thought it was fair it's. Dennis Quid right and as soon as we. started talking about the debate it was. clear that the Reeds didn't get what. they wanted out of it I think she tried. a couple times to say I'm I want to do. this and I want to do that and that's. nice promises I hope she can get them to. Congress but you know overall I think. they were still swiping at each other a. lot.

they really didn't think either. candidate delivered a plan that met them. where they are what do you mean well I. thought haris would come out with all. these programs and I would like like. three4 of them or something like that. and uh I thought maybe Trump would lay. out some economic plans but they didn't. seem to come out with any Trump just. seemed to attack and attack and Harris. was trying to say I'm the stable person. in the room well what did were either of.

them make of some of the specific. economic policies that both candidates. talked about because they did talk about. a few specific policies well Trump. talked about tariffs tariff and stuff I. sort of didn't like that because you put. tariffs on we all pay more Bob thought. well this is just going to make. everything more expensive so he wrote. that off now Harris mentioned her. policies and she mentioned three in. particular which were tax credits for. home buyers for people having children.

and for people starting businesses. doesn't help us and both of the reads. were like well that's not g to help us. gonna help me I'm not a firsttime home. buyer you know I'm I'm not going to be. burying any children um you know none of. that's going to help me at all they're. in their 70s they're on a fixed income. and inflation's hurting them and they. didn't hear anything from her that would. address those concerns. specifically how are you going to deal.

with rising cost how are you going to. deal with that and I didn't hear any. answers from either one of them on those. kind of things so basically they're. hearing a bunch of from Harris in. particular specific policies that are. aimed at much younger people in the. economy just starting off in their kind. of adult economic lives and that's just. not them so basically they're not. hearing anything for themselves get on. these issues you mentioned the economy. you didn't hear anything from anybody. that reassuring he stuck to his.

terrorist he talked about spending but. on virtually every other answer Trump. talked about immigration did you feel. any progress in sort of understanding. that or is it just kind. of she didn't say what she would do and. he was just. slamming the Biden Administration for. letting them in while the economy is. their number one priority they've both. brought up immigration as an issue. that's important and they both came away. disappointed was you know Trump killed.

that border bill right and he did it. because he wanted it to be an issue in. the election Sharon does blame Trump for. killing the Border Bill country when. they question him on that boy he just. kind of skirted that but she didn't. believe that Harris really had a plan to. really get things under control in part. because of what she saw is happening. under the Biden. Administration and he said he was going. to go down and nationalize the guard and.

and take these people and move out of. the country and that's really upsetting. or up upheaval for everybody Bob has. been turned off every time he's heard. Trump talk about this plan to round up. and Deport millions of undocumented. immigrants you've been here 10 years are. going to National Guard's going to come. to your house and load you up in a van. and take you out because you're not an. American citizen that doesn't seem. realistic he thinks it's a terrible idea. and wouldn't work so here you have the.

reads on their two biggest issues not. getting satisfying or sufficient answers. from either candidate on this debate. stage I'm curious what else Campbell. struck you from what Bob and Sharon took. from this debate well I think their. views of the candidates is most St when. you hear how they talk about the war in. Ukraine H I don't know there's there's. part of me that says I could see him. giving Ukraine to tr to Putin because he.

thinks he's so great Sharon is worried. Trump is just going to give Putin. whatever he wants that he'll cozy up to. him she doesn't like the way he talks. about him and I don't know if she can. she has the ability to the diplomacy to. end it and has to respect of the people. to do it but she's doubtful that Harris. is g to stand up to him that she's going. to be tough enough when she's facing. down some of these dictators how much. how much does the January 6 stuff play.

in your thinking about him a lot it was. also striking how they reacted to. January 6 anytime he's asked about it he. had no. responsibility even at that debate oh I. was just asked to give a speech the. Reeds really don't like that they have. real concerns about January 6 and it. just highlighted everything that turns. them off Trump because you've described. the reads as Republicans who have become.

disillusioned with Trump I wonder what. they made out of Harris's efforts in the. debate to make some pretty overt. gestures to Republicans who have soured. on Trump for example she mentions that. many prominent. Republicans have backed her because they. don't like Trump and does that mean. anything to the reads as seemingly of a. target audience for that kind of message. I actually think that gets right to.

their dilemma well I'm not surprised as. Cheney's support because you know Cheney. hasn't liked Trump from the very. beginning they see these other. Republicans as as turned off by Trump as. they are that's not the issue they don't. like Trump and these other Republicans. don't either he votes I mean that's not. going to tell me how I'm going to. vote um I'm still more on the issues but. that doesn't to them give them a case. for Harris H so what I'm hearing is.

Trump's performance in this debate. clearly feeds into their discomfort with. him but it doesn't quite push them into. the hands of KLA. Harris because they don't hear enough. specifics and they don't know in their. hearts yet that she's ready for the job. that and they're Republicans they prefer. Republican policies. and while they don't want to vote for.

Trump it's going to take more convincing. for them to vote for a Democrat right. more convincing than the what we. understand to be last confrontation. between them on a debate stage which was. really probably Harris's best chance to. win over the reads and Trump's best. chance to alleviate some of their. concerns as far as we know. [Music]. yeah and at the end of that phone call. as I do after all the phone calls I've.

had with him this summer I asked them. did this move you one way or the. other I didn't hear anything tonight. that. would push us one way or another well. and they basically said no you know I am. no. farther to voting for either one of them. that I was. before and Bob you still like 51% Trump.

yeah yeah. yeah yeah not anymore not 52 but just 51. or 50 and a half or something. like Sharon is still completely. undecided she has no idea what she's. going to do in November and Bob is ever. so slightly leaning toward Trump but he. doesn't love. it listen I i'. drag you across these coals too often.

too late at night so I appreciate this. again you all have a great weekend and. thanks again for all this I really do. appreciate thank you for making it sound. [Laughter]. good all right thank youall have a good. one you have a good one too. [Music]. byee oh Campbell thank you very much. thank you. Michael after the break my colleague. Stella tan speaks to an undecided voter.

who says that the debate brought her. much closer to a. [Music]. decision we'll be right. back a few weeks ago on the show we. spoke to an undecided voter named Emily. who lives in Dunn County Wisconsin a. purple District in a crucial swing state.

she's 43 years old works for a small. business in Wisconsin's manufacturing. sector and is the mom of two teenage. daughters I've voted since I was 18. since I've been able to vote I've been. able to come to a decision this is. honestly the first election where I just. don't know who I'm going to vote for I. need to I need to vote I don't want to. it makes me. [Music]. sick like Bob and Sharon Reed Emily is a. longtime Republican voter a lot of my.

just values in general have aligned more. with the Republicans but right now. there's too many extremes who found. herself deeply dissatisfied with her. choices in this election you know I have. seriously thought about just writing in. a candidate at this point too because. our options are now looking good so like. Sharon Emily voted for Nikki Haley not. Trump during the Republican primary even. though by that point Haley had dropped. out of the race I want to see people who.

are going to be willing to work with. each other and back to let's take care. of the middle class and let's stop. fighting and in July with Trump as the. Republican nominee and Joe Biden. suddenly out of the race we asked Emily. if she was open to voting for KLA Harris. I I really don't know enough about her. as a candidate for president to say one. way or the other it'll be interesting to. see how she performs in debates and. things coming up to see if she can keep.

her composure for her the debate was. going to be crucial so when it was over. daily producer Stella tan called Emily. back to see whether the debate had. changed any of her. [Music]. thinking hello hello is this Emily yes. it is how how are you doing not too bad.

how about you I'm doing pretty good um. you know I really appreciate you talking. to me again and letting me sort of show. up on your metaphorical doorstep. again. um so when we talked over the summer it. was right when Biden dropped out and. Harris had just become the presumptive. nominee and you were still kind of. getting oriented on her and I'm. wondering right now how close are are. you to making up your mind on who to.

vote for for. president um I'm still I I'm still. struggling I'm still kind of torn I mean. it is it's kind of tricky um I do come. from a pretty conservative family and it. this hasn't been easy for them either I. think they're struggling too with which. way to go it's like kind of coming down. to what's you know do you compromise on. some of your beliefs and some of your. policy positions in order to help to.

preserve democracy and bring us back to. some level of decorum and Civility and I. think that's kind of gotten to be an. issue and so what were the moments that. most stood out for you from the debate. and what did they leave you thinking and. feeling. so maybe like an overall impression I. guess of the debate that actually left. me very frustrated with former president. Trump was just his overall decorum his.

rhetoric my 16-year-old daughter was. watching with me and a big thing that we. came back to was the opening of the. debate and the fact that he made a beine. for the podium rather than trying to. meet in the middle and handshake and she. had to initiate that and then throughout. the debate I can't recall a time when he. actually made eye contact with her or. looked at her and then the way say that. he continued to refer to they they and.

that may have been part of his strategy. is to continue to try to tie her to. Biden but in doing that without looking. at her without going in for that. handshake without actually addressing. her to me it was very demeaning so that. really bothered me and then the fact. that to be honest for the majority of. the datat he looked like my daughter's. did when they were Toddlers and they.

were not getting their own way or they. had gotten yelled at and were sitting. and pouting in the. corner you know a lot of people have. been remarking on Harris's facial. expressions and gestures in response to. some of the things that Trump was saying. I'm curious how her Expressions landed. with you especially in this context of. you wanting a president who can work. across the aisle and sort of lower the. temperature on the rhetoric for me I. guess some of it just kind of made me. laugh honestly it was just like okay.

she's making this face and I'm making. the same face here at home like what did. you just say like how is this you know. did that actually come out and I didn't. think it was over the top I didn't think. she was disrespectful in any way so it. didn't really sway me one way or the. other I wanted to ask you about a couple. of things you mentioned to me when we. had our conversation before yep you. mentioned that the economy was a big. issue for you yes you know is that still. true and can you talk a little bit about.

how the debate affected your thinking on. how the candidates would approach. economic issues yep no definitely the. economy is still a major issue for me to. be honest I was really disappointed in. both candidates I was really hoping to. hear something more for me Donald Trump. all he was talking about was tariffs and. that's not going to fix the economy in. and of itself and so there was nothing. else there from him and kamla while she.

did have her three points you know she. was talking about small business she was. talking about $25,000 for firsttime. homeowners $6,000 for families in the. first year of life and I'm sure there's. people out there for that that was. wonderful and they were happy to hear. that I I'm a college educated woman work. in class in my 40s I own a home and I. have teenage children M so for me this. is all great you know she's focusing on. how to help people get.

started how do you help all of the. millions of Americans who are already. small business owners I work for a small. business owner you know for homeowners. in the last 5 to seven years our. homeowners insurance is basically. doubled so what are you going to do for. homeowners how are you going to help us. to continue to live in our homes to. maintain our. homes those are the things I really. would have liked to have seen from her. last night and I didn't.

mhm so um there was one more thing you. mentioned Reproductive Rights in our. conversation last time do you kind of. lean toward one or the other on that. issue. so this is one of those I think too. where I kind of struggle because people. want they want to pigeon hole you. into one view or the other you know if. you're conservative you view it this way. and if you're liberal you view it this. way and I when it comes to you know. Reproductive Rights and specifically.

abortion I do have very strong feelings. about the manner in which that should be. utilized I do consider myself pro-life. so more of a conservative you know I I. don't view that as a means of birth. control but I do also understand and can. appreciate through different experiences. life experiences of my own I can. understand where this is not a black and.

white issue and there has to be room for. that there has to be Exceptions there. has to be places where this can happen. and so I'm still struggling personally. with like yes I don't want to see it. used in this way but I don't want to see. people being stuck in a position where. they have no choices and so um she kind. of backed away from answering how she. felt about late term abortion and I was. kind of wishing she would have talked. about that but by the same token I was.

thoroughly disgusted by his comment you. know he kept calling it abortion after. birth but if a child is born it's not. abortion like it's just by definition. and so essentially you're talking about. you know execution of children and I to. me that was just so off-the-wall and so. I mean and and for him to continue. spewing that is just. sickening I I know you said earlier that. you were still struggling but did the.

debate help you make up your mind on who. to vote. for. um. I I don't know if I'm comfortable like. even like with myself to myself yet I'm. not sure that I'm comfortable saying yes. or no to that one way or the other I'm. not sure what I'm hoping to hear yet you. know I I don't I don't know if there's. something that I I'm wanting to hear um. whether it's right or wrong or makes any. sense when you grow up certain way.

whether you grow up liberal or you grow. up conservative I think it is hard for a. lot of people if that's what you've. always been and that's what you've known. and you've been very comfortable in that. I think there is just some level of. uncomfortableness and I don't know you. know if subconscious if you feel like. you're betraying what you are and where. you you've been even though that's not. true you know people grow and people. evolve and I wouldn't say that like I. would be changing necessarily my values. or where I necessarily see things. falling on policy but it's it's coming.

down to more of a matter of let's. restore some Civility and decorum into. the White House the sanctity of the. president of the United States that. office what that means what that stands. for and let's try to start bringing. people back together you know one thing. she said last night was let the. divisiveness be on the policy issues not. on all of this other unimportant steps. that we're trying to make into issues. and that's essentially dividing us well. well there's not a whole lot of time. till the election and I know you said.

that you're not quite sure what you're. hoping to hear but I'm wondering if it. gets to be November 5th what do you. think you'll do do you think you'll go. to the voting booth and make the call. there or is there a chance you might. stay home or no I definitely will not. stay home I definitely will Vote or. writing in you know yeah no I know we. had talked about writing in a candidate. I think after last night I would feel. more comfortable making a decision. versus writing someone in off the ca I.

would say that it. definitely pushed me in One. Direction after watching him and. listening to him and the attempts to. find you know ways to continue to divide. us and the way that he treated her last. night and the way that he treated the. American public it it definit definely. pushed me to vote for.

[Music]. K this was so interesting Emily I'm. really really grateful to you for. talking to me well I thank you for your. time I appreciate it all right take care. Emily you too have a good night you too. bye thanks byebye. [Music].

over the next 49 days we'll keep in. touch with Bob Sharon and Emily to learn. who they ultimately chose to vote for. and why. [Music].

we'll be right. back here's what else you need to. another day the American Media totally. ignored this stuff until Donald Trump. and I started talking about cat memes if. I have in an interview on Sunday with. CNN Senator JD Vance of Ohio the. Republican Vice Presidential nominee. said that he stood by the debunked.

claims spread by he and Donald Trump. that Haitian migrants in his state were. eating people's. pets to create stories so that the. American Media actually pays attention. to the suffering of the American people. then that's what I'm going to do Dana. because you guys moments later on the. same network the Democratic governor of. Pennsylvania Josh Shapiro scold advance. for standing by those false.

claims I mean Dana that was Bonkers. listen um the governor of Ohio the mayor. of that town in Ohio has said this is. all made up these are all lies there is. no truth to it and the United States. senator from Ohio just came on your show. and blamed his own constituents for his. own lies this guy's so pathetic but the. [Music].

thing today's episode was produced by. Stella tan Luke Vander pluk Eric krupy. mu zi and Nina Feldman with help from. Diana win it was edited by Patricia. willins and Ben Calhoun with help from. MJ Davis Lynn contains original music by. Marian Lozano Alicia bitu and Dan Powell. and was engineered by Chris Wood our. theme music is by Jim brunberg and Ben.

lurk of. wonderly special thanks to Megan luded. and Mary. [Music]. [Music]. Su that's it for the daily I'm Michael. babbaro see you tomorrow. [Music].