The Weekend Democrats Went to War — Against Each Other

from The New York Times I'm Michael. babbaro this is the. [Music]. daing over the past few days a routine. debate over Government funding has. exploded into an angry Showdown over the. Democratic party's identity in the Trump. era and whether its current leadership. is right for the moment today I speak. with my colleagues Congressional.

reporter Katie Edmonson and National. political correspondent Shane goldmacher. about the weekend that rocked the. Democratic. [Music]. party it's Monday March. [Music]. 17th hey there Kitty hey Michael you. have many options of how to spend your. Sunday appreciate you spending it with.

us thanks for having. me so Katy pretty much from the moment. that Donald Trump was inaugurated for. the second term there has been this. low-grade debate playing out inside the. Democratic party about how to counter. him and what Democrats can do and should. do about his really aggressive strategy. of firing thousands of government. workers shutting down agencies. circumventing Congress in the process. and the question has been when would. that internal debate really come to a.

head and become a public battle and the. answer it seems is right now because it. all really just became a public brawl. over the past few days and that all. seems to revolve around the actions of. the Senate minority leader Chuck Schumer. of New York yeah that's right I mean. look I think there was behind the scenes. for weeks now a lot of quiet agonizing. over how to counter the Trump. Administration and that sort of quiet.

agonizing turned into very public anger. this. week and it all burst out into the open. this week when Senator Chuck Schumer. made a judgment call essentially about. the best way to combat the Trump. Administration right now and immediately. that decision faced blowback from sort. of all corners of the democratic party. right who said basically we think you. made the wrong call that's right as of. now there is at least one major liberal. activist group gr off of Capitol Hill.

indivisible that has called for Senator. Schumer to step down as the party's. leader in the Senate good afternoon and. perhaps most interesting at least to me. was you saw some dissension from his. counterpart over in the house is it time. for new leadership in the Senate next. question representative Hakeem Jeff of. New York was pressed multiple times at a. news conference on Capitol Hill on. Friday as to whether he still had. confidence in Schumer as is the Senate.

minority leader have you lost confidence. in him the fact that you guys see this. so differently and Congressman Jeff. response each time was the same which. was to say next question next question. right a remarkable moment where. basically the number two Democrat in. Congress won't say whether he supports. the number one Senate Democrat that's a. huge huge deal it was a stunning moment. and it was really remarkable to see this. very public fissure.

well tell us how we got to this moment. in such a short period of time where. Democrats are truly it seems at each. other's throat about the best way to. operate in this first phase of the Trump. Administration so it starts with a. fairly typical procedure up here on the. hill which is we're staring down another. Government funding deadline lawmakers. need to pass something to ensure the. government government doesn't shut down.

right we've only covered this un and I. Kae I don't know 10 times in the last. four years something like that yeah. exactly although This Time The Script. sort of flips right because normally. what you and I are talking about is how. these funding decisions pit Republican. against Republican but what happened. here is actually the opposite is that. for once House Republicans were able to. unite around this spending bill that. speaker Mike Johnson unveiled and the. reason they were able to unite around. this is sort of for two reasons one is.

because it was an entirely Republican. written Bill Democrats had no input into. what this bill looked like at all but. two is because a lot of them were saying. look it would be bad for president Trump. if the government shut down let's ensure. that he can continue the great work his. administration is doing and that is. actually what happened House Republicans. were able to pass this stop Gap spending. bill with really minimal drama on their. side which is I think a fact that. shocked a lot of Democrats and in fact.

all Democrats except one vote against it. because they want to show that they are. standing up to president Trump and that. they're taking a principled stand right. and normally it's Democrats who end up. being needed they end up being summoned. to rescue these spending bills to avoid. a shutdown you're saying in this case. suddenly they're just kind of left off. to the sidelines yeah that's absolutely. right and that infuriates a lot of. Democrats they actually fundamentally. hate this bill they say that this is a.

piece of legislation that doesn't have. the sort of narrow spending instructions. that Congress normally gives the. executive branch and so the argument is. essentially this bill creates a lot of. slush funds for the administration to be. able to use however they want got it in. other words it empowers the Trump. administration at a moment where. Democrats would like to do anything they. can to disempower it and at a moment. where Democratic members of Congress. already feel that the executive branch. is running absolute rough shot over sort.

of congressional spending prerogatives. yes got it so naturally the bill then. moves over to the Senate where. Republicans are in control but not so. much control that they can just pass a. spending Bill necessarily on their own. that's right in order to get a final. vote on the spending Bill Republicans. need to be able to break a filibuster. which means if the bill is allowed to. proceed it's going to require Democratic. support right and based on everything. you've said so far I have to think that. Senate Democrats are thinking to.

themselves well we can't support this. either well that is the early indication. funding the government should be a. bipartisan effort in fact Senator. Schumer early in the week comes out and. says Republicans chose a partisan path. drafting their continuing resolution. without any input any input from. congressional. Democrats because of that this is not. something Democratic senators can. support let's try to draft some sort of.

bipartisan bill that we can all get. behind our caucus is Unified on a clean. CR that will keep the government open. and give Congress time to negotiate. bipartisan legislation that can pass but. clearly that's something Republicans. don't want to do and instead what. Democratic senators find themselves. faced with is what many of them describe. to me as a really agonizing decision. agonizing why so they're faced with this.

dilemma which is which path gives Trump. the least amount of. Leverage a lot of them I think viewed. this as a moment to be able to use sort. of the little remaining power they have. left in Congress in the minority to say. we're going to shut the government down. we are not going to vote to allow Trump. to continue the status quo right we are. going to throw sand in the gears here we. will not lend our votes to support what. you're doing right just as the house. done but without any real leverage.

that's right now the other option that. senators are weighing is a lot of them. are very concerned that if they do in. fact vote to filibuster this bill. Democrats will be blamed for shutting. the government down right which is. something that we know voters hate but. there's a deeper fear which is that by. shutting the government down you. actually empower the Trump. Administration even more how so well in. a shutdown the Trump Administration and. specifically the Office of Management.

and budget which is run by a real. conservative hardliner gets to decide. which federal workers are deemed. essential and which are deemed. non-essential so there was a real fear. by a number of Democratic senators that. this could essentially lead to mass. furlows could accelerate the mass. layoffs we've been seeing of federal. workers basically turbocharge Doge. exactly and there's a second fear which. is if you shut the government down how. can you ever get it back open and. there's a specific fear that under the.

Trump Administration and with this. Republican Congress maybe they end up. opening only the parts of government. they like and letting the parts of. government they don't like remain. permanently shut down in fact Senate. Democrats met 3 days in a row for these. luncheons that dragged on and you could. actually hear sort of them debating. right yelling during these lons because. this was a truly difficult decision for. so many of them but it seems like the. way that the room is leaning.

increasingly is that it is leaning. toward a shutdown right and as agonized. as they are they know that their leader. Chuck Schumer has their. back well leader Schumer in fact on. Thursday at this luncheon shocks many of. his members when he stands up and makes. the announcement that he is in fact. reversing himself and has made the. calculation that it is going to be. better for Democrats to vote to support. this legislation to clear the way for.

this bill that shutting down the. government is a bad option for democrats. for all of the reasons Michael that we. talked about it would actually empower. the Trump Administration and he also. indicates that he has lined up enough. support from other Democrats of which he. only needs a handful to basically clear. the way to make sure this bill can pass. right this is a. genuinely surprising moment and this is. when the anger that we have been.

referring to since the very beginning of. this conversation really begins to. explode this is the moment when a lot of. democratic heads. explode I think Senate Democrats I think. the Senate leader uh made an enormous. miscalculation this is not a time where. we should be bending the knee to Donald. Trump and there is just immediate Fury. people feel like this was a moment that. was a test for all of our leadership and.

not to Blink and not to Cave if you. remember all house Democrats except one. banded together stayed United to show. that they were opposing The Spill MH and. it's not about being Progressive it's. not about being moderate it's about who. is going to be in this fight and push. back and fight back and then you have. one high-profile house Democrat. congresswoman Alexandria Okio Cortez who. goes on to CNN Chuck Schumer I guess. your Senator said he is going to vote to.

allow there to be a simple majority vote. you think that's wrong I believe that's. a tremendous mistake and says. essentially that Schumer is making a. huge mistake to me it is almost. Unthinkable why Senate Democrats would. vote to hand the the few pieces of. Leverage that we have away for free when. we've been sent here to protect and then. you have Senate Democrats who. essentially hear Schumer's call and say. thank you very much I will will be. voting against this bill and post videos.

on social media saying that they wrote. their own partisan bill they filled it. with all sorts of right-wing I'm. voting no I am a no I am a. [Music]. no basically saying in the most public. way imaginable I disagree with the. Senate Democratic leader that's right. and then you have kind of the cherry on. top which is when Hakeem Jeffrey is the. Democratic leader comes back to.

Washington and gives that press. conference in which he refuses to say. whether or not he has confidence in. Schumer's leadership by Friday evening. when Schumer actually has to take this. vote out on the floor to allow this. spending Bill to pass that in fact only. nine other members of the democratic. caucus vote to join him M and so you. have a very Stark split screen in which. a majority of his caucus actually votes. to block the spending Bill vote against. his decision right and when you put that.

together with the house what you. basically see is the majority of. congressional Democrats the vast. majority of them not doing what Chuck. Schumer did in fact doing the opposite. that's right and look I do want to say. in the Senate just based off of some of. the private conversations I was having. with Democrats I do think there were a. number of them who sort of the old adage. is vote no hope yes hoping that there. would not be a shutdown but knew that.

their constituents their voters wanted. to see them putting up a good fight. against Trump but I think the bottom. line is elsewhere in the Democratic. party off of the hill over in the house. you see some real rage directed here at. Senator Schumer I can't tell you how. many Democratic lawmakers I've spoken to. who have said that since the vote they. have had calls from their constituents. saying you know what are you doing if. this is how Trump's government is going. to run we' rather you shut it down H all.

of which suggests that the Democratic. base and a fair number of democratic. lawmakers who voted against us they. wanted their party to take a stand here. and are quite upset that at the last. minute at the direction of Senator. Schumer the party did not yeah that's. right I mean look I think this is going. to be the defining question for the. Democratic Party in the next weeks and. months to come I don't know how it plays. out. but what I do know is that there is a.

very visceral real level of Anger from. the Democratic base right. now it's actually I think more akin to. some of the moments we've seen in the. past from the Republican Grassroots MH. and so I think that's in part why this. is such a startling moment for. Democratic. officials I mean they're not used to. this from their voters particularly on. this issue and I think they're still. trying to figure out out exactly how to.

deal with. it well Katie thank you very much thanks. Michael after the break Shane goldmacher. on how this surge of Anger from. democratic voters and lawmakers could. change the Democratic. party we'll be right back.

Shane happy Sunday happy Sunday to you. Shane you've been watching everything. that Katy Edinson just described. especially the anger from democratic. voters with their leaders which as Katie. just put it is something we tend to. associate much more with Republicans. than Democratic voters and you have a. provocative thought about that and what. it could potentially.

represent yeah it's actually a question. that I was down in Washington DC this. week asking Democratic lawmakers and. Democratic officials even before this. shutdown fight. exploded and the question I was asking. is whether the Democratic party is. facing its own tea party moment well. just expl just explain that its own tea. party moment for years and years it's. been the Republican voters who have been. been angry and they've been angry at.

their own party and they've been angry. at the Democratic party and for the. first time in many years Democrats are. describing that same kind of anger. they're saying that at their Town Halls. even in deep flu districts voters are. coming up upset and angry and wanting. more more fight more action more. something and the parallel is really the. first year of Barack Obama's first term. right when the Tea Party actually.

emerges yeah just take us back there. because I think for this provocative. question to really make sense we're. going to need to be reminded of that. history so Barack Obama. wins and the Democrats have then just as. the Republicans do now complete control. of the federal government Obama's. Victory coupled with massive gains in. Congress puts Democrats firmly in. control of Washington by both Chambers. of Commerce in the White House and the.

Republican voters were almost. immediately angry help us do something. about the economy they're angry at. having lost I am angry at the waste of. money in DC they're angry at the scale. of the defeat and if we don't stand up. now God help us and then they're angry. at the Obama agenda the American. Recovery and reinvestment act that I. will sign today Obama gets this massive. stimulus package passed is the most. sweeping economic recovery package in.

our history and they're angry at how. much of the agenda he's. enacting and how much Republicans are. failing to stop it right to many. Republicans their leadership especially. in Congress is feeling ineffectual not. up to the task of opposing this powerful. president from the opposing party. so you start to see this anger at public. forums I called your office and I was. told I could have have the m to speak.

and then I was lied to Republicans. shouting down Democratic lawmakers about. their agenda what are you going to do to. restore this country back to what our. Founders created according to the. Constitution and real activism and you. see this anger and activism expressed in. Republican primaries all across the. country. mhm begin though with the major. political upset for one of the most. powerful Republicans in the country Eric. caner the number two GOP lawmaker in the.

house beaten in the primary by a Tea. Party candidate we're Outsider younger. and angrier candidates are suddenly. winning it's not about Dave brat winning. tonight it's about returning the country. to constitutional. principles they're beating the old guard. of the Republican party in ways that the. party just didn't expect and this anger. was changing the Republican party from. within and one one of the people elected. in this Changing of the Guard of the.

Republican party was Senator Ted Cruz of. Texas and if there's one moment that. crystallizes the Tea Party strategy. during those years it's what Ted Cruz. did in the fall of. 2013 why senator from Texas because this. is when he pushed his Republican. colleagues to shut down the federal. government as a last ditch effort to. stop Obamacare Madam president I intend. to speak in opposition to Obamacare I.

intend to speak in support of defunding. Obamacare until I am no longer able to. stand and it was clear at the time that. Ted Cruz had no path to Victory here. that Barack Obama was not going to sign. a measure to unwind his signature. achievement but the tactic it was to. fight it was to fight and it was to. mobilize that anger and say I am out. here with you I am willing to have this. fight even if we can't win. [Music].

and suddenly you see Democrats in the. same place this last week they were. talking about using the exact same tool. shutting down the federal government. without necessarily an endgame that the. fight itself was worth having because if. you didn't have the fight you weren't. actually speaking to where Democratic. voters are right and and so this. explains why your provocative question. isn't necessarily that provocative. you're seeing evidence you're saying.

that the Democratic party's. mindset especially among a group of. Voters has changed and suddenly they're. asking the question should we be a party. where fighting is the point even if it. means potentially shutting down the. government in order to fight president. Trump it's anything to avoid the current. status quo and to be clear. this energy and this Dynamic was there.

before this shutdown fight and this. split inside the Democratic party it. sort of begins generationally it's the. younger generation of democratic. officials who are expressing the. greatest level of frustration in the. House of Representatives there's a. private text messaging chain among. Democrats whove served for five terms or. fewer that means they've only served in. the post Trump era the only Republic. party that they have seen is the changed.

post tea party Republican party right. the fight fight Republican party and. they want to change the Democratic Party. from within and they're looking to push. out and defeat older Democrats in. primaries potentially in open seats and. even on Capitol Hill this actually began. before Trump was sworn in in these. obscure races to be the top Democrat on. various policy committees there were. three more senior Democrats at the end.

of last year who are all ousted by. younger lawmakers who said we need a new. face a more engaged fighter and they won. right and Trump's arrival only. accelerated that energy on Capitol Hill. and on the campaign Trail where I'm. already hearing about Congressional. primary challenges on a generational. basis in multiple States across the. country fascinating but of course if. we're going to stick with the Tea Party.

model here of internal Insurgency that. we might start to see on the Democratic. side I want to reflect on the fact that. the tea party's overall message was. profoundly anti-government right it was. the government is too big the government. is too invasive and that's not the. Democratic party's brand Democratic. party's brand is generally quite. supportive of the government and of its. workers that's partly why some Democrats.

were so alarmed by the idea of pushing. the government into a shutdown over the. past few days that's hard for a lot of. Democrats to swallow so how do these. Democrats who perhaps view the tea party. as a model for change reconcile that I. think this younger generation of. Democrats share something else in common. which is that they are experiencing a. dimming of the American dream that it is. harder to buy a house that it is harder. to pay for child care that they no.

longer believe that they or their. children are going to have better. Futures than their parents and they. approach this with an urgency and a need. to have a kind of agenda that is more. proactive to solve those problems they. want to see the Democratic party not. just fight harder but propose bigger. solutions that meet the kind of. frustrations that voters have the same. anger at the system that helped bring. about Donald Trump they want to be able. to tap into that anger and say we're not.

just for the status quo we're not just. defending institutions we want to. rebuild them and we have a very specific. plan and vision to do it and frankly. they haven't unified behind one yet. right we're talking about this as a. hypothetical but there is the germs of. we need bigger and Bolder ideas and it. really is a genuine open question inside. the Democratic party of which. ideological Wing will end up winning out. to Define what the party actually stands. for so this still pretty incoit vision.

of a democratic Insurgency so far is. fight fight but not just fight for its. own sake fight with an alternative. Democratic agenda than what the existing. Democratic Leadership offers and I'm. guessing many of them believe the. absence of which doomed President Biden. and vice president KLA Harris in the. last election in which they were seen. the whole party was seen as Protectors. of the status quo yeah the idea is okay.

Elon Musk and Donald Trump want to. dismantle the Department of Education. right so the Democratic party doesn't. just want to defend the Department of. Education they need a proactive plan for. what the Department of Education will. actually do for you for your children. they want a plan that says we're not. just defending the Department of. Education to exist because we're for the. bureaucracy right but a plan for how to. make that bureaucracy actually work for. people and in fact after I wrote a story.

about this generational divide of the. democratic party this week the most. common email I got from people was older. readers saying hey wait a second I'm. pissed off too right and of course there. are old Democrats who have the same. energy and they're young Democrats who. are more cautious but in general it's. this newer group of Democrats who would. begin changing the party Shane the. reality is that the next Congressional. primaries for Democrats that will reveal. whether or not something like a tea.

party Insurgency is happening within the. party they're not for another year and a. lot can happen between now and then and. therefore just to be transparent it's. impossible for us to know whether we're. at the beginning of something really big. happening in this party just as it would. have been really hard to predict that. Obama's election in. 2008 and what he did in 2009 2010 was. going to lead to the birth of the Tea. Party. absolutely but what we do see here is. the possibility. of an inflection point this spending.

fight is likely to be long forgotten in. a sea of future spending fights and big. changes that Donald Trump is making. right but for Democrats who are already. running or considering running in. 2026 this does have the feeling of a. potential moment where the party was. galvanized to say hey the way the old. guard of the party has been doing this. we don't want that anymore. yes Chuck Schumer might have been.

painted into a losing corner but we. wanted the fight. anyway Chuck Schumer might have made a. decision that was strategic that was. protecting his party for Worse outcomes. in the short term or even the medium. term but that action could have. long-term consequences for the way the. Democratic party behaves far into the. [Music]. future well Shane thank you very much I. appreciate it thank.

[Music]. you on Sunday a new poll found that an. overwhelming majority of Democrats want. their party to fight president Trump by. a 2:1 margin registered Democrats told. NBC news that they want Democrats in. Congress to stick with their positions. even if that creates gridlock in. Washington rather than make compromises.

with. [Music]. Trump we'll be right. [Music]. back here's what else you need to. another day the Trump Administration has. deported dozens of alleged Venezuelan. gang members without a hearing. potentially in violation of an order.

over the weekend from a US federal judge. Trump sent the suspected gang members to. a notorious prison in El Salvador by. invoking the alien enemies Act of 1798. which allows the US to summarily expel. people from countries at war with the us. but the US is not at war with Venezuela. and on Saturday night a federal judge. ruled that the deportations were illegal. and that any planes taking the suspects.

to El Salvador must be turned around and. returned to the US yet it does not. appear that any of the flights were in. fact. stopped and Trump has signed an. executive order dismantling the agency. that oversees Voice of America which for. decades has transmitted news into mostly. authoritarian countries with no. independent news media soon soon after. hundreds of journalists for Voice of.

America were put on leave and many radio. frequencies that carry its programming. overseas began playing music instead of. [Music]. news today's episode was produced by muj. zadii and Nina Feldman with help from. Carlos PRI it was edited by Rachel quer. and Lexi di contains original music by. Maran Lozano Rowan nisto and Pat. mccusker and was engineered by Chris.

Wood our theme music is by Jim brunberg. and Ben lansberg of. [Music]. Wonderland that's it for the daily I'm. Michael B. boaro see you tomorrow. [Music].