Dana White, Donald Trump and the Rise of Cage-Match Politics

hey it's Sabrina before we get started a. few details about a major developing. story that's still being pieced together. according to investigators in the early. hours of Wednesday morning an armed man. driving a rented pickup truck. deliberately plowed into a crowd. celebrating New Year's Eve in New. Orleans killing at least 15 people and. injuring dozens more in a short speech. last night President Biden said that the. driver a US Army veteran who died during.

the attack had been inspired by the. Islamic State and had expressed a clear. desire to kill investigators said that. they are still trying to determine. whether he had acted alone or had any. help from individuals or a group these. are the key facts we know for now we'll. be following developments over the next. few hours and we'll bring them to you as. soon as we can okay here's Today's. show this is daily producer Olivia. Nat I am Las Vegas outside an arena.

where tonight there is going to be a UFC. championship. fight I am notoriously squeamish so I'm. really excited to talk to people about. why they like this sport why they're. here. tonight and I'm going to go talk to some. of. them it is a microphone do you have a. couple minutes to answer some questions. oh hell yeah yeah let's get some. questions going let's get some questions. going why are you guys here tonight what.

do you like about watching fights the. combat. is love it like you never know it's two. men in a cage it's Man versus Man Beast. versus Beast I really enjoy the special. moments where people like get knocked. out it's live action it lets you know. who you are I've never been to a fight. before what should I expect tonight. you're going to go uhhuh nice expect. somebody's going to get knocked out. choked out you know anything can happen. in in this octagon.

you will enjoy this I promise you you. will enjoy. this from The New York Times I'm Sabrina. tavernes and this is the. daily all right walking over to the. octagon and it sounds like the first. fights have just kicked. off baby you can do it.

over the past 5 years one sports league. has gained popularity faster than any. other the Ultimate Fighting Championship. or. UFC today my colleague Matt flegenheimer. on The Man Behind the league and how his. longtime friendship with Donald Trump. has transformed what was once a fringe. sport into a cultural and political. power Powerhouse oh [ __ ] it's Thursday.

January 2nd let's. [Music]. go Matt flagen Heimer Sabrina tavernese. welcome to the show thank you so much. for having me so Matt we're going to. talk today about UFC but I have. something to admit to you by all means. I've actually never watched. it so let's start with the basics Matt. tell us what the UFC is sure UFC stands.

for Ultimate Fighting Championship it's. the sort of primary promotion associated. with mixed martial arts it is a cage. fighting Enterprise which combines. elements of kickboxing wrestling. Jiu-Jitsu into this kind of very painful. medley of activities in what they call. the Octagon this eight-sided cage where. two fighters convene and beat each other. up over a course of rounds okay that. probably explains why I've never heard. of it it also has been one of the.

fastest growing Sports huge audience. internationally was acquired for $4. billion in 2016 is only grown since not. just in the sports world but culturally. and politically as well and really has a. kind of crowning moment in November and. what happens in November so. president-elect Trump really fresh off. his election win attends a fight at. Madison Square Garden in New York City. Trump is sort of waiting in the wings. with his Entourage and walks out almost.

as if he is the fighter making to the. world famous octagon by UFC CEO Dana. White 45 soon to be 47 President elect. Donald Trump president and CEO of the. UFC Dana White is to his left Elon Musk. is with him Mike Johnson is with him. Robert Kennedy alongside various cabinet. members to be if he has his way so loud. in here it is so loud.

and the crowd just loses its mind it's. always loud when he comes here but now. that he's won now that he's the. president again oh my God and Trump is. taking this all in this is obviously uh. a very friendly room for him and he has. chosen this as a major postelection. Victory lap space yeah and he got the. reception that he. wanted in American history under Donald. Trump's leadership so they're showing. this video on the. Jumbotron of the Octagon showing various.

triumphant moments for the president. elect God spared my life for a reason. and as the video ends you see the number. 45 flash across the screen and then it. moves to. 47 showing his presidency and his. presidency to be okay so this is an. extraordinary scene and I want you to. tell me Matt how we got here like how. did Trump choose a UFC fight for his.

coming out party as president-elect you. know I think it's actually a pretty. Natural Choice for Trump if you think. about the Arc of trump and the UFC. across really 20 plus years at this. point U and that Arc begins with Dana. White white has been a close friend and. Ally of Trump's and they've kind of. risen in parallel and have kind of. developed an understanding not just as. people who are in business who are. transactional but I think beyond that. there's a sort of visceral understanding. mutually about what it means to succeed. in this American moment without having.

kind of establishment forces behind you. every step of the way I think white. understands that about Trump and I think. Trump understands that about white okay. so tell me about Dana White um so he's. from Boston he sort of bounces around in. his youth he's kind of a serial Scofflaw. by his own account he's a hotel Bellman. for a bit trains to be a boxer becomes a. boxing trainer winds up moving to Vegas. continues training and eventually. managing. Fighters and really becomes sort of. enthralled with with the UFC and this is.

the sort of mid to late 1990s it's a. moment where the UFC is very much On The. Fringe it is a young fledgling league. with a quite bad reputation across a lot. of the American mainstream we're live. from the mile high city of Denver. Colorado eight of the deadliest fighters. in the world will meet in a No Holds. Barred combat to and as a viewing. experience the sort of production values. were low the venues were pretty grungy. this was not Saturday night at Madison. Square Garden be fored there are no. rules no judges scores and no the UFC's.

own tagline for a time was there are no. rules that was sort of the pitch um so. really bloody bloody and Lawless eight. Street tough Warriors wage combat in a. battle where anything can happen and. probably will John McCain calls it human. [ __ ] fighting states are Banning it by. the Dozen venues don't want to host. fights but despite all of that you know. Dan White really sees some potential in. the UFC and he.

a sort of appetite in the American. audience and beyond for a level of. violence through sports that I think the. expectation was prior to that maybe. people didn't quite have the stomach for. okay so he sees a path to it despite the. fact that people like John McCain say. it's human [ __ ] fighting and states are. Banning it yeah I think to White this is. an opportunity so what he does is talks. to a couple of high school buddies from. a family of cassino operators and. convinces them to put up $2 million to. buy the UFC at this moment when it's. certainly not a premium property and to.

put him in charge and give him a stake. and really let him kind of execute the. vision that he has for what the sport. can become so what happens given that no. one really wants to host the. thing they find someone who does want to. host the thing or is at least. willing welcome to magnificent Atlantic. City New Jersey somebody with a long. history of Hosting fights at least. boxing the spectacular Trump tajal and. that is is the future president and.

president- elects Donald Trump gathered. here in this building here tonight some. of the greatest Y2K Gladiators in the. world set in February 2001 at a moment. when as white would say later nobody was. taking them seriously Donald Trump took. them. seriously so in this Grand love story of. Dana White and Donald Trump this fight. in Atlantic City is really the meat cute. moment this is the moment and obviously. white was grateful to be posted by Trump.

to have the sort of legitimacy that came. with having a major fight night at a. trump venue at that time with that said. this is not an overnight success by any. stretch they're losing money it's not. taking off in any kind of rocket ship. way but you can see some sort of early. signs that Trump and white understand. each other Trump invites one of the. fighters onto the Celebrity Apprentice. for a season and reality TV really plays. a substantial role in the UFC's. arc on this season of the ultimate. fighter in 2005 there's a reality show.

the ultimate fighter that debuts do you. want to be a fighter that's the question. that's why I'm here it's not about. living in a house it's about do you want. to be a fighter and only you know that. it really helps Drive interest and. complete the picture of these Fighters. for viewers they get attached to these. sort of biographies these compelling. stories apparently Diego Sanchez is. doing some kind of yoga bodybuilding. pose down with uh baby oil all over his. body.

you don't want to face this R that's. just not my style and it does really. help the fights themselves get a sort of. wider audience and gain more. traction what a war between these two. guys so you want to be an Ultimate. Fighter 5. [Applause]. Seconds ohow what a. finish to such an extent as the UFC. grows that Trump gets a little jealous. um what do he do so in 200 8 Trump. announces he's investing in his own.

rival Mixed Martial Arts Enterprise and. you know he's trying to sort of harness. some of the energy that the UFC is. clearly channeling but his group is not. long for this world and his operation. collapses pretty quickly but it's really. a testament to the Trump white. friendship the two of them are not. necessarily the type to take kindly to. business threats in their respective. fields and they stay on very good terms. here and in 2011 the UFC signs a big te. contract Trump sees an article about it.

takes it writes a message on it and. sends it to White um saying you know. congratulations I always knew you were. going to do it like he's a proud mom or. something and and sort of you know it's. both a compliment and self-regarding. about his own instincts that the Trump. trump saw it coming as well he spotted. it too they spotted it together okay so. clearly these two have a lot in common. right they're businessmen they both have. this reality TV thing they both see the. potential in this very violent sport.

what about their politics you know in. some ways they approached politics from. kind of a similar vantage point if you. think about Trump before he was. president it's very transactional not. ideological you know frankly as the. commissioner of a league that's trying. to appeal to as many people as possible. in general those sorts of figures. wouldn't necessarily want to engage in. partisan politics because the country is. pretty evenly split and you're trying to. cast a wide net you would alienate half. your audience sure but then Trump runs. for office in 2016. and he has a request when he becomes the.

Republican nominee which is that Dana. White speak at his convention that. summer which obviously would Place him. very much in the middle of partisan. politics in a way that had not been a. part of his profile previously he has. said he was advised against doing it for. all the reasons you would expect that it. would alienate potential sponsors it. would alienate fans so it was kind of. high stakes for him because potentially. it could alienate half his audience sure. but he does speak at that. convention what's up GOP. and white himself leaned into the idea.

that it was sort of strange that he was. there than you I'm sure most of you are. wondering what are you doing here you're. probably wondering what are you doing. here was kind of his opening and I. wanted to show up and tell you about my. friend Donald Trump the Donald Trump. that I know and he talked about the. chance that Trump took on him in the UFC. in 2001 is loyalty his fighter instincts. he was the sort of validating voice that. Trump wanted to have in that moment I me. tell tell you something I've been in the.

fight business my whole life I know. Fighters ladies and gentlemen Donald. Trump is a fighter and I know he will. fight for this. country so what's the effect of all of. this like does it actually have. repercussions on his business the sky. doesn't fall right and I think that's an. important lesson that he learns in that. moment he goes out on this limb he's. advised against doing something much in. the way that he was in his telling advis. against giving it all to the UFC at the.

beginning in this case Dan gives the. speech at the RNC it goes fine and as a. matter of fact Trump's elected president. and now he knows the President right so. the lesson is go with your gut trust. your gut and I think the lesson was that. Dana White believed then and believes. now that he knows his audience better. than anyone and to him that audience. respects somebody who will do what he. believes in or at least project that he. is doing what he believes in he has been. somebody with an antenna for this stuff.

and for knowing where his audience would. be across the. decades this is. all in the. UFC if you're in section 11 that'll be. on your left section 12 will be on your. right do you follow Dana White at all oh. hell yeah I love Dan White what do you. love about him the fact that the man. took over the sport when everyone.

thought it was going to go. downhill you know some people Rich. famous people are certain level they. they're higher class they look down on. people he's like in it so he knows what. real people. [Applause]. want I feel like UFC really allows. people to speak their minds and I know. Uncle Dan kind of allows that he's the. [Applause]. goat okay end of round one. going into round.

[Music]. two we'll be right. back okay so white backs Trump and as. you said this guy doesn't fall and in. fact it boosts his status and his League. status what's the next thing he does. that really propels this league well it. comes during a pretty dark time across. the sports landscape and otherwise and. it's co obviously L sports are sort of.

shut down across the board people are. thirsting for any kind of content of any. sort right because remember it was Co. everything shut down stopped playing NBA. stopped playing and there is this real. appetite to get something fresh and live. on the air and Dan White sees an. opportunity he's trying to find. workarounds and he finds it in Florida. An Empty Arena in Jacksonville the UFC. becomes the first major American Pro. sporting event in the co age to reopen. and certainly the expert consensus and.

the medical consensus was that this was. not necessarily a fantastic idea he is. sort of bulldozing through that concern. and it was a moment when obviously the. sports landscape was Barren he had a. pretty captive audience and it was. really a showcase opportunity for the. UFC so in part it catches on because. nothing else is on that's a huge piece. of it but it's interesting white. obviously for years despite the speech. in 2016 at the convention had kind of. positioned the UFC as the apolitical. sport in contrast to. what he and I think a lot of UFC fans.

saw as kind of an overt intrusion of. politics and protests and social justice. initiatives into the NBA the NFL the UFC. was supposed to be sort of insulated. from that of course in this case Co. became a great piece of the culture war. and by opening reopening it all that's a. political stance and certainly was. aligned with where Trump was in that. moment as he was pushing for a kind of. broad reopening of the economy so.

suddenly there starts to be some real. overlap between the UFC and MAA World. absolutely and it's been building for. some time but this is the moment that. really establishes white as a magga. superstar of the highest order in a way. that even the convention speech didn't. and you see the Trump orbit and the UFC. orbit the white orbit kind of merge and. this cultural moment starts to form. around disaffected men who feel slighted. who feel like the world has not been. conspiring in their favor for some time.

this is like the manosphere the. manosphere and these fights become a. gathering place for the leading lights. of that intellectual space um this sort. of amorphous right-wing anti-woke. anti-establishment uh sentiment and in. his period of not being the president. anymore starting in 2021 Trump is kind. of one of those figures he become. somebody who shows up at these fights. frankly in moments of sort of public. turmoil for himself one of the first.

public appearances he makes in his. period of being kind of a pariah after. January 6th in 2021 is at a UFC fight. interesting huh after he's indicted he. goes to a UFC fight it becomes a sort of. balm and he's walking in and getting a. giant Ovation among a lot of his. supporters and that obviously expanded. over the course of these four years in. between his terms so back to your larger. point this is more than a sports League. absolutely and white has accumulated a. ton of cultural capital and political.

capital from being this Grand figure in. that space and he knows when and how to. use it and I think the most interesting. example of this in recent times is with. Bud Light like the beer the the beer Bud. Light the beer um are you familiar with. Bud Light as a as a brand Matt keep. going um hi impressive carrying skills. right I got some Bud Lights for us so in. the spring of 2023 you see the. beginnings of a huge backlash to. budlight on the political right this.

month I celebrated my day 365 of. Womanhood and budlight sent me possibly. the best gift ever a can with my face on. it over a promotion they did involving a. transgender. influencer let me uh say something to. all you and be as clear and concise as. possible [ __ ] budlight and [ __ ] anheiser. Bush so across conservative media people. are just hammering but L Bud Light has.

just released a commemorative can. celebrating a man and dresses up like a. woman this is another example of woke. corporations and how they completely. ignore everything that they really stand. for and the people that actually buy. their product I just don't understand. that as a marketing tool and Dana White. is in the process of negotiating a beer. sponsorship with an iser Bush Bud Lights. pairing company and he's in a tough. position because he's sort of stands. accused of selling out for associating. with Bud Light after this major backlash.

but obviously the sponsorship is. lucrative for the UFC today's guest is. an entrepreneur he's a. renegade he's a business moggle and he. is the head of the UFC so what he does. is he sets about trying to uncanceled. light you know people are talking [ __ ]. now sellout and all the [ __ ] they'll. [ __ ] say believe me I'm the furthest. [ __ ] thing from a sellout yeah and. what white does is call himself as a. character witness Bud Light is the right.

move for me they're exactly who I want. to be with right now and uh we are very. aligned as far as core values go he goes. on with Tucker Carlson with Sean Hannity. with Charlie Kirk if you consider. yourself a patriot you should be. drinking [ __ ] barrels of budlight the. message being essentially if budlight. wants to do business with me like that. tells you all you need to know and. privately he is back channeling with a. lot of these figures Kid Rock who had.

been a part of this effort to protest B. light he is talking to the anheiser bush. CEO in White's green room and they're. sort of talking it out and finding a way. forward and then Trump himself even. months after that is continuing to sort. of hammer Bud Light on social media and. white speaks to him on the phone and. after that phone call Trump posts a sort. of follow-up saying that the company. deserves a second chance going through a. lot of talking points that Ekko. fs and lo and behold about a year after.

boycotts began and a few weeks after. Trump has backed down I attend a fight. in Miami and the fighters are out there. bleeding all across the budlight logo on. the canvas so white gets what he wants. it's hard to see another figure say to. get that intersection of culture and. politics and sports who could have. pulled off what white pulled off. here so here you have Dana White. convincing Trump to backtrack and it. really just shows how much power white.

has in this relationship which is kind. of pretty surprising based on everything. we know about Trump absolutely and. they're both well positioned to do each. other some good and certainly Trump can. call in white to help him in moments of. political need as well and we see that. in this last campaign so what happens in. the campaign exactly with white a couple. of things I mean again he's speaking of. the convention so that's the sort of. explicit overt you know endorsement and. nobody was surprised he was there this. time but the sort of. kind of role he plays in this is as this.

kind of Master of Ceremonies white for. this entire universe of people the. fights become gathering places and he. can make connections between Trump and. these figures in the manosphere whether. that's Joe Rogan whose podcast he ends. up doing the nek boys his other. podcasters theovon white is in the. middle of all of that a kind of Chief. Ambassador moving between Trump and. these worlds and the Trump campaign as. part of strategy sees a lot of Voters.

who don't necessarily engage with. politics who are not following the news. closely a really Target demographic for. them they're going after people who. often skew younger and male who are not. necessarily ideological or don't sort of. fall on ideological lines on the issues. in the way that you would expect. traditionally and a lot of those people. watch the UFC and a lot of people in. that world respect Dana White's opinion. and so Trump is appearing on a lot of. these podcasts he's speaking to these. audiences right and just to remind. people this was the Holy Grail.

demographic right because in part it was. so hard to reach the people who don't. ordinarily follow politics and really. don't necessarily vote that much yeah. and it's been traditionally hard to. break through to that demographic and. the Trump campaign had a lot of success. welcome to UFC unfiltered Matt and I the. Trump campaign is really trying to meet. them where they are I mean Trump did a. UFC fan podcast and wasn't talking about. any kind of policy are you good at. making picks I no matter how many fights. I watch I'm terrible at making picks I'm. always raw well this this sport is.

interesting like I watched Usman I think. he's a terrific guy by the way terrific. person this was a guy talking about. fights and having actually a really. interesting level of recall about. specific fights and the history of it. the intricacies of the UFC be that you. know I look at like UFC or boxing or any. of these things even Sports generally. it's sort of a microcosm of life it's. actually about as close to contemplative. as I've heard him get he gives this. answer talking about fights it's sort of. a microcosm of life it's the sort of.

binary thing there are winners and. losers and you can sort of see how that. maps onto his political worldview you. know it's it's so interesting but the. nice part it's over in a period of a. half an hour 45 minutes it's all over. and you sort of see a decision but it's. a little bit like life when you think. about it and obviously Trump wins the. election in November and he and his team. are well aware of how integral that. strategy was and White's role in it and. on Election night after midnight as he's. giving his victory speech we also have a.

Manda white who has done some job does. he pull up on stage to the microphone to. give some remarks but Mr Dana. White and white proceeds to give a. speech that is not surprising to anybody. who's listened to him or Trump talk. about these recent years it's heavy on. the sort of expert consensus being wrong. this is what happens when the machine. comes after you what you've seen over. and he shouts out these figures I I I. want to thank some people real quick I. want to thank the N boys Aiden Ross from.

this universe sort of presides over in. some ways and last but not least the. mighty and Powerful Joe. Rogan so once again these two men are. validated in their instincts to Buck the. system like to go with their gut really. in the most extraordinary way and and in. the end kind of shock The Establishment. absolutely I think both of them have. learned that lesson time and again in. their public lives that expert consensus.

is often nonsense that their instincts. are to be trusted what you've seen I. think from both of them is a sort of. recognition that they can be their. purest basist selves and that that would. be rewarded so these two have learned. all the same lessons up to this point. but I guess Matt looking forward you. know if Politics As We Know is. Downstream from culture and Trump is. clearly identifying the UFC as a very. valuable part of culture to him. politically then what can we learn about.

where we're headed looking at where the. UFC is now what does it tell us about. the future I think white and Trump both. saw around the corner here about what. the UFC could become in the cultural and. political space that it has become and. there's no reason to think now that it. will be any less important it'll. probably be even more. important and the way that the two of. them see the world mean that their. worldview will matter quite a bit and. what do really articul ated his. worldview quite.

clearly to quote him America has become. so soft if you have even this much. Savage in you everything out there right. now is for the taking wow and that. sounds like Trump there's a reason. they're. [Music]. friends Matt thank you thank you. Sabrina why do you think the violence. appeals to you I just like how brutal it.

is it's different than boxing it's very. relaxing to. me because of the violence of. it I could watch it every. day why do you think this is a thing. that men are so. into I feel like it's just embedded in. every guy like every every guy's DNA. it's like uh instinctual type [ __ ] right. like I mean this is what we used to do. like hundreds of years ago you know we. were gladiators. you know it's it's just part of.

us I've never seen a head do that before. I like the fact that a man can be a man. and he can put his hands on another man. and not go to jail do you feel like it's. an outlet for something you don't get to. express in other areas of your life hell. yes yes you can let the rage out and not. get in trouble so 100%.

we'll be right. back here's what else you should know. today Ukraine's leader has followed. through and his threat to shut down the. last major pipeline that carried natural. gas from Russia to. Europe by closing the pipeline Ukraine. hopes to undermine Russia's ability to. fund its war against Ukraine and use.

energy as a weapon against Europe before. it stopped operating on Wednesday the. pipeline had brought Russia more than $6. billion in Revenue a year Ukraine's. energy Minister called the closure a. quote historical. event today's episode was produced by. Nina Feldman Olivia Nat Sydney Harper. and CLA tennis skar with help from Shen. and Lynn relle Banja and AA.

chatra it was edited by Lexi di with. help from Michael benois contains. original music by Dan Powell and Marian. Lozano and was engineered by Chris Wood. our theme music is by Jim brunberg and. Ben Lanser of wonderly special thanks to. Joseph Bernstein. [Music]. [Music].

that's it for the daily I'm Sabrina. Tavern see you tomorrow. [Music].