If You Only Watch One Video Today, Make It This One

Today on the Mel Robbins podcast, one of. the most motivational episodes you will. ever experience. In fact, I'm going to. go on the record and say this is my. favorite episode to date. You are not. prepared and neither was I for the. absolute force of nature that is Emma. Greed. Anything is possible if you really put. your mind to it. And this is the big. thing that I want specifically women to. understand. When you have nothing and I. have been there, how you do anything is.

how you do everything. When I, you know, made sandwiches in a deli, I made the. best sandwich. When I worked in the. cupboard packing clothes, I would do it. with excellence. I love you so much. There's just a grit to you and there's. grit plus an amazingly huge heart. I was brought up in East London, which. is a bit like the rough side of the. tracks. I'm the oldest of four girls, raised by a wonderful single mom. Life.

was a little bit tough. You know, my mom. did the best that she could with the. little that she had. I wanted to live a. different life and work in something. that was enjoyable because again, where. I grew up, everyone did a job to pay. their bills. I had spent 10 years. building my career at the intersection. of brands and fashion. I had a fantastic. understanding of what works in fashion. and where the white space was. I really. understood what was missing. Where was.

there a problem that I could find a. solution for? And Good American was a. solution. Most women are massively. underserved by the fashion industry. And. so I pitched Chris and Chloe, pull up a. chair and put us in the meeting in terms. of how that meeting went. I really approached that meeting saying, "Hey, I have this golden brilliant thing. and this is going to be the next big. thing in fashion." So, what happened. next?

>> It's a disaster. Mel, >> what is kind of the biggest lesson from. your experience launching Good American? >> I would say that my biggest learning has. actually been that might not be what. people want to hear, but that is the. truth. >> That's what they need to hear. Welcome to the Mel Robbins podcast. >> Thank you so much for having me. I am so. happy to be here. >> I am so excited to have you here. I. can't wait to learn from you. And I know.

the person that is here with us is. excited too. And so I'd love to start by. having you just share with the person. who's here. What could they experience that could be. different about their life or their. future if they take everything that. you're about to teach us and share with. us today to heart? I love that as a. place to start. I honestly think about. my life and more specifically my career. as a bit of a blueprint for what happens.

when you a. take responsibility. for yourself and when you really manage. your thoughts carefully. And I think if. there's anything that I've learned, it's. that the combination of those two things. will take you really really far in life. So taking responsibility. for yourself and your life. >> Yeah. And choosing your thoughts really. carefully. >> Choosing your thoughts really carefully. >> It's a choice.

>> And when you do that, what happens? >> You know, when you do that, somehow your. life starts to align. And it's really. interesting because it's a practice. Like I feel like I'm in practice to be. the woman that I want to be constantly. And so I have to really think about. those things. And so when you bring. those two things together, it allows you. to be really really purposeful and the. outcome starts to just manifest. Like it. starts to actually happen. So a lot of. people know that you're a judge on Shark.

Tank. You are the co-founder of several. billion dollar companies. Congratulations on making the Forbes 100. self-made women list. >> Thank you. >> But most people don't know where this. all began. And so I want to go back to. the beginning to East London and talk. about what life looked like when you. were little. >> Well, you know, I was brought up in East. London, which is a bit like, you know, if you were born in Harlem or Crenaw or.

something like that, like maybe, you. know, the rough side of the tracks if. you want to see it like that. Um, I'm. the oldest of four girls raised by a. wonderful, wonderful single mom. And you. know, we um I guess life was a little. bit tough. You know, my mom did the best. that she could with the little that she. had. And you know, I always think about. our relationship dynamics is like, you. know, she was the dad, I was the mom, and we had three kids together. You know, I was a very uh parentified. child, if you like to say it that way.

And um I have a very very close. relationship with my three sisters as a. result of that because I was really part. of raising them and you know, looking. after them. I used to get up in the. morning and iron three school shirts and. make three-pack lunches and send them. off to school. And sometimes, you know, I wouldn't go to school myself. I'd be. exhausted by that point. You know, I was. really raised by a family. Like my mom's. family, her sisters, her mom were huge, huge parts of of our life. It checks out. honestly because you're so driven and.

you are the kind of person that I feel. like you see something, you just do it. How do you think your childhood and that. experience of taking care of your little. sisters has impacted and shaped who you. are today? >> You know, in so many ways and good and. bad if I'm honest. You know, I learned. at a very young age to take a lot of. responsibility for myself, but I was. always on very high alert, right? Where. I lived wasn't particularly safe and so. you had to think a few steps ahead. constantly. But it also gave me this.

idea that I needed to get far away from. where I was. I was very aware that my. circumstances would be limited if I. stayed where I was from. And so I had. this idea that I would need to work. really, really hard to get out of this. place, >> but I knew I would in a way. I just felt. like I don't know what I'm going to do. I don't know how this is going to work, but I've got to get out of here. >> I think a lot of people feel like that. >> Oh, yeah. Totally. And so if the person. that's listening or watching right now. feels that way but they are not sure.

that they're going to get out, >> what would you say to them? Because you. have already said two things. You got to. take responsibility for yourself, for. your life, for where you're going. And. you got to choose your thoughts. So if. you have this sense like there's more. for me. I got to get out of here. I want. to have something different. But then. your thoughts are like, uh, it worked. for Emma, but I'm not that kind of. person. What would you say? >> Well, you know, the other thing is, Mel, so many people that come from a place.

like where I come from, there's this. sense that you'll be abandoning where. you come from. That actually it's the. wrong thought to have. You're like, this. this is who I am. This is where I come. from. This is part of me. And what I. would say to that person is you don't. have to leave where you come from in. your heart. I'm still the girl I always. was. I'm the girl from Plasau. I will. always be that girl. I just left that. place. And so you don't have to give up. who you are and what made you you if you. leave that physical space. You can still.

be and have that heart of gold and that. sense of scrainess and whatever made you. great. And I think that that is really. really important because that's what. troubled me so much that I would leave. the people that made me me. that I would. leave those family members and those. friends that were so pivotal to me as I. grew up. The truth is that those people. are with me every single day. Like. that's just who I am. And I would say. that you know anything is possible if.

you really put your mind to it. But you. are not going to manifest your way out. of anything. You have to take those. thoughts and everything that you want. and you've got to couple it with. something. And for me that has been hard. work. There is no secret. The secret is. I had the vision and I put it together. with some really really hard work and. that's what you have to do. >> I love you so much. I I I really do. because there is a there's just a grit. to you and there's grit plus an.

amazingly huge heart. And so what a. beautiful thing to say that you can. change where you are but that doesn't. change who you are. >> Exactly. me you clearly you know you also said. something earlier about how you are. constantly asking yourself and reminding. yourself. >> about the woman you want to be what kind. of woman do you want to be like when you. think about it well you know I think. that for me what's been really important.

and actually you get to a place where. you're successful and there's this sense. of responsibility in me right that and. again I think it comes from where I come. from that I think if you are still that. person inside because I still feel like. 15year-old Emma who was like hanging. around on the streets just making you. know things up in her head and dreaming. of what could happen. I want to impact. those people. I want to get everything. that I've learned and everything that. I've have and figure out how could there.

be a million more Emmers. Like that's. what consumes me now. That's what I. think about every single day. That's. what we're going to do with this. conversation because there is so much to. learn from your story cuz you took a. very unconventional path to success. >> You could say that, Mel. >> Yeah. So, were you good at school? >> I was terrible at school. I was so bad. at school. And you know, the interesting. thing is I'm severely dyslexic and I. didn't find out that I was dyslexic.

until I was in my early 20s. And so, school for me was just always a. struggle. It wasn't that I was. particularly like naughty or. disobedient. It just was so hard. And. for me at that point in my life, I was. like, if it's difficult, like, I'm just. going to push it away. I'm just going to. react to it. And if I'm really honest, you know, I had some anger issues that I. had to work through because where I come. from, if something wasn't working, if. something was hitting you in a place of. like uncomfortableness, you were just. you were going to smack it out of the. way, you know? And that's what I.

learned. I learned over and over again. to react with anger. And so, I really. had to train that piece of me out. and. I've done a lot of work and I've been in. therapy since I was 19 years old. figuring those things out. >> What were you angry about? >> I think that I grew up in a place where. blame was just part of the culture. Like. nothing was ever our fault. It was. always about somebody else over there, this neighbor, the government, nothing. You were ne I was never taught to like.

take responsibility and figure something. out. And I feel like they're the. cornerstones of my personality now. It's. like I tell my kids, you know, every I'm. like, "Figure it out." Like, "Just. figure it out." And taking. responsibility is something that I've. just it's ingrained in me now, but it. wasn't then. And I was angry that there. was seemingly no easy path for me. I. thought it should have been easier. I. thought that because I was working so. hard, it should have happened faster. And you have to imagine, you know, I'm. 42 now. I've done a job that I love for.

5 years, not longer. For five years, I've spent my entire career doing things. that have been okay and I've enjoyed, but I never had like the dream of the. dream job. I've just kept going and. going and going to get closer to the. thing that it is that I love. And I. think that that is maybe not something. that we talk about enough in, you know, in media, in society right now. You are. on a journey. Like it doesn't just.

happen. this idea of overnight success. that we've built especially around. entrepreneurialism and around starting a. business like it's a lovely story but. it's not a career path and it's not. really truthful and so I thought I was. owed something and it wasn't until I. kind of got to about 19 I was like. nobody owes you nothing that things. started to fall into place for me. >> I think I just heard the person who's. watching and listening share share share. because we can spot not that attitude.

and other people like I I would imagine. because I have two people in my mind. right now that I'm like that's the issue. they're sitting around pissed off. blaming the world. >> when they are fully capable of picking. themselves up exactly where they are and. figuring it out. What would you say to somebody who is. stuck in that blame, does think that. they are owed something? Because it's so. easy to kind of get stuck in that place.

yourself where you convince yourself. that it's not going to be easy or you. convince yourself that you owed. something and then the anger does. consume you. And let's be honest, like. some people are dealt an unfair hand. Sometimes you've got stuff to be angry. about. Sometimes it's not something that. you made up in your head. It's your. reality. You know, I'm a woman. I'm. black. I grew up poor. I think I had. something to be a little bit mad about. Right? Having said that, it wasn't. serving me. And I think at the end of.

this, we've got to say, is this thing. that I'm holding on to, is it optimal? Is it working for me? And if it ain't, you got to let it go. And that's just. that. Because what is useful to us is. the idea that we're going to like have. this baggage, but we're going to leave. it and we're going to use what is in us. to propel ourselves forward. If what. you've got is keeping you stuck, leave. it. Like walk away. >> How the hell do you do that? >> I think the real way that you do it is.

by having some acceptance of it and. saying, you know what, this is what it. is and I accept that. >> and that's okay and I'm still going to. move forward. I'm still not going to. allow this to hold me back. That is not. my story. It's just not what I want. >> And did you know what you wanted? >> Yeah. >> What did you want? >> You know, I just wanted to I wanted to. escape my situation. You know, I've been. obsessed with fashion since before I can. even remember. But for me, it was a.

means of escape. It was like, you know, I grew up in London. It was all about. the supermodels, Naomi Campbell and Kate. Moss and all the cool designers. And I. used that and you know that industry, those people looking in the magazines as. a means of escapism. There was something. to dream for, something to you know look. forward to, something to aspire to. I. wanted to get out of where I was so bad. me like I can't even tell you. I wanted. to live a different life and work in.

something that was enjoyable because. again where I grew up everyone did a job. to pay their bills. >> I didn't know anyone who had a. fulfilling career, >> you know, it just wasn't even part of. the vernacular then. So I for me it's. like I just wanted to get closer to. something that I loved. >> That is such a universal experience. >> Oh yes, it is. And it's really important. to recognize that if you're feeling that. way to lean into the desire, you know,

you don't have to love fashion. You. don't have to want to do a podcast, but. there's something about recognizing that. you want more. >> That is where this all begins. Oh, yeah. >> Cuz until you do, you can't take. responsibility for what that more might. be. >> It's so true. It's, you know, again, I'm. a mom of four now and the only thing I. care about is that my kids care about. something. You've got to have something. that you feel strongly about. And for. me, it is, was, and and will ever be.

always be fashion. That's just what I. loved. But it's always we have to. remember that we have to have something. to hope for. Like that can be anything. But you got to have something in your. sights that you are striving for. And I. think that that's really important just. as a basic human emotion. You got to. have a a thing, a goal, an expectation, but something that drives you. And if. you cannot figure out what that is, if. you don't know what you should pursue,

you should pursue yourself. You should. figure out how do I make myself better? How do I eat better? How do I exercise. better? How do I get better habits? How. do I get better? And that thing will. figure itself out. >> Why is that important? It's the key of. life because we're all on a journey and. if that journey is not to leave the. world better than you found it for you. to be better than you were when you. started, then what are we all doing, right? We're in a lifelong journey. You. know, I'm obsessed with quotes and one. of my favorite ones is the more you.

learn, the more you earn. It's a Warren. Buffett quote and I love Warren. I'm. obsessed. Um, but I think about that all. the time and I am a person that has and. again despite my dyslexia, I'm gobbling. up information all the time. But it is. in an effort to make myself better to. grow myself to expand the way that I. think. And so I say to people all the. time like that is what you should do. You should pursue the highest version of. yourself that you can possibly be and. within that you will figure it all out.

I'm in. >> Well, you definitely are in, Mel. I like. what you're doing every day. >> Well, what's interesting, Emma, is. you're so on fire that I'm I I keep. forgetting that that I should ask you a. question because I'm like, is there more. coming? Cuz keep going, Emma. >> I'm like, I'm on the Mount Robin show. >> Oh my god. Well, you know, one of the. things that I was curious about because. I I do agree with you that if you can, you have to have something. And the. other thing I wanted to say about it is.

I have no interest in fashion. And I'm. saying that because what you're. interested in personally. doesn't have to make sense to somebody. else. >> No. >> Because it's not for somebody else. No, >> it's for you. >> And if you don't have that thing that. gets you out of bed, whether it's a. distraction or an interest or a passion. or a person, then make yourself the. reason why. Mhm. >> What is the first step of that journey. to pursuing yourself?

>> So, it's really interesting because I. think there's a couple of things that. you can do. So, let's just put health. and wellness to the side for one second. It's a huge part of it, but let's talk. about what it means to be excellent, >> right? To be excellent. >> I really understand the power of like. how you do anything is how you do. everything. And this idea of excellence, of taking it seriously how you wake up. in the morning, of taking it seriously.

how you prepare your breakfast, taking. it seriously how you show up in work, how you see people. Like do you go. morning or do you go morning, how are. you? And do you listen and respond back? Like all of these things matter. They. matter to who you are. They matter to. how you're seen. And they matter to how. you you're viewed. When I, you know, made sandwiches in a deli, I made the. best sandwich. When I worked in the. cupboard in a PR agency packing clothes, I would fold those clothes beautifully.

My boxes, my tissue was amazing, my. sticker was in the middle. I would do it. with excellence. Every little thing, because that is what makes people. gravitate towards you. When you take. everything that you do seriously and you. take an element of pride in anything, it. draws people in. And you know, you have. to work a lot of dog jobs before you get. the thing. Life is very, very long and. it goes in chapters. And so, what I say. to people is be excellent at where.

you're at, at whatever you're doing, because that has some kind of invisible. magnetic pull. Terry Cruz tells this. incredible story about being dead broke. after getting out of the NFL and he's. moved his wife and four kids to LA and. he thinks he's going to be an. illustrator and then all of a sudden the. like digital illustration stuff is. happening and he is at the end of his.

rope, depressed, can't get work and he. gets a job sweeping. literally a custodian on a on like a. movie lot and he kept himself going by. saying, "How would I sweep this floor if. somebody was paying me a million dollars. to do it?". And to me, what you're saying is, if you. simply don't know where to start, you. just gave the most brilliant advice on. the planet. What would it look like to.

wake up tomorrow morning and start the. day with excellence? What would it look. like to wake up tomorrow morning and how. would you do it if somebody was paying. you a million dollars to just get out of. bed and make your bed? What would your. morning look like? >> What happens internally? Because there there is the thing that. people are drawn to you because it is. true because the vibration within you. literally changes like you vibrate a. different energy. If you wake up with a. smile on your face and you say maybe if.

somebody's in the bed with you, "Good. morning, darling. I made you a cup of. tea. Like, what does that say? That says. I value you. The morning is good and. here we are together and I just. acknowledged you. Like, who doesn't want. to wake up like that? And if nobody's. next to you and you stretch your arms. like this and you put nice pajamas on. because you care about yourself and you. make your bed and you walk away and. you're like, "Look at that bed." Like, that is like that's the dream. That's. and that's what I say to my kids. I. remake their beds, by the way. But.

that's not the point. You know that it's. it's like how you do anything is how you. do everything. And that is the key. You. got to start you've got to sweat the. small stuff and you have to start. somewhere. And when you have nothing and. I have been there, that works because. that starts to set the tone and people. notice. They really, really notice. >> I want to go back in time. >> What is this smell? It's a photo of you when you were 17.

years old. >> Oh, look. And these two are still my. darling. I'm literally having dinner. with these two in London next week, Stella and Chanel. >> Well, I'm going to I'm going to give you. that photo as a as your present for. being here on the podcast. You're 17. years old. You had just left. >> Yeah. I just So, tell us about that. moment and. >> what was happening in your life. Well, you know, I have to say that was a. crushing time for me because I left home. when I was 16. The circumstances at my.

house had just become untenable and I. left home and home was an hour and a. half away from where I lived. So, I get. this like terrible, you know, high-rise. apartment. I had no fridge, no oven. We. kept our milk on the on the balcony cuz. in London it's that cold that you could. kind of keep milk fresh for two days if. you left it on the balcony. And um I. enrolled at the London College of. Fashion. So this for you guys is what. you would call senior high. I'm 16, dropped out at 17. And you can imagine I.

fought so hard to get into that college. And so to drop out wasn't like I can't. be bothered. It was that I couldn't. continue. I couldn't make ends meet. I. couldn't figure out the train fair. I. couldn't figure out how I would eat, how, you know, the the couple of days a. week that I had to work because you're. in college four days and then I was. working every day. I just couldn't make. it work. The math wasn't mathing as we. would say now. And so it was a bit of. disappointment. But what was interesting.

is that actually that's when my life. started to fall into place because for. me I was like okay, how do I keep. learning? How do I keep close to the. dream? And in those days, you could go. around and find work placements. And so. I thought to myself, I'll just work for. free. I'll get as close as I can to the. career that I think I want. And I went. from, you know, PR agency to design a. showroom, like from one terrible bottom. of the barrel job to another. And um,

you know, Mel, I would do everything I. could to get these work placements. like. I was sending, you know, because again. in those days there wasn't email so it. was just sending letters out and nobody. was responding to my letters and so I. started handd delivering letters cuz I. was like maybe they're just not getting. them. >> It was kind of ridiculous and every now. and again there would be a break. >> Kind of brilliant actually. >> I mean you know for me it was just. tenacity and I couldn't even imagine. that it was because of me you know I.

never took it personally. I didn't think. I'm not good enough. I didn't think, you. know, I'm not worthy. I thought they. didn't get the letter because I'm so. good and I have so much to offer and I'm. going to work so hard. They just must. not know yet. And so I just kept going. and going and going and going until. somebody said, "Yes, okay." Like, "Come. in. You can work here for free for a. couple of weeks." And for somebody who's. listening who's like, "I need that. I. need that tenacity because I send an. email and then I sit back and then I.

think something's wrong with me. It's. never about you, Mel. It's never ever. about you. And this is the big thing. that I want specifically women to. understand. We are have become as a as a group. obsessed with this idea of perfection. that it always has to be perfect that it. always has to be as it is in the movies. and that is just not it's not my. experience. My whole journey has not. been linear. It has been, you know, one.

great thing happened and then like. nothing, like literally nothing. In. fact, sometimes it just went down. But. you cannot take it personally because. it's never about you. You know, you can. fail and it's just the thing that thing. didn't work out. It is not that you. don't work. It is not that you have. something wrong with you. So for me, I. would just like dust myself off. I'll be. like, "That wasn't my moment. That. wasn't for me. It's not my time." And. just keep going. Well, I would also. imagine that if you're also feeling the.

pressure. >> of buying food and paying rent, you also. don't have a choice. Like there's a. certain level of stress that you feel. >> if you cannot make the ends meet or you. barely do because you can't stop. >> You have no choice. >> You have no choice. >> You have no choice. And so one thing I. wanted to ask you because. what you said about excellence was. mind-blowing.

and 1,000% accurate. How do you pursue. excellence. versus the trap of being perfect? Like. what's the difference between excellence. and that perfectionism trap that women. get stuck in? >> That is such a beautiful question. I. think that you have to learn and this is. going to sound and I don't want it to. sound self-limiting. We all have. a different measuring stick, right? >> Yeah. >> What is perfect to you is not perfect to. me.

>> And I think that we have to be realistic. with ourselves. >> And so what I've done in my life is. really think about myself. >> I'm not thinking I'm not looking in the. media. I'm not on social. I'm not in a. magazine trying to live up to that. version. I'm like, what is my version of. excellence based on where I come from. and who I am? What's good enough for me? Cuz I'm not comparing myself to anyone. else. You know, you and I both love that.

same quote, right? It's like it's you. against you. That's it. And that's where. you have to be very, very honest and. very self-reflective because if you are. going to be in the comparison game, you. will never be satisfied. you will never. be happy. >> Okay, I think I just got it. I want to. extract what you just said and give it. back to you and see if we if you if I. heard you correctly cuz I think I just. got the difference. You ready? So, perfectionism. is when you are focused on the outside.

Perfectionism is when you are measuring. what other people are going to think. about what you just did. Excellence is. on the inside because excellence is. about the effort in and whether or not. the effort that you put in is good. enough for you. That right there, ma'am, that's really a. great distinction. I've never thought. about it that way cuz I' I've always.

thought about like perfectionism because. so many women in particular struggle. with it as something that you're doing. internally. >> No, it's it all it's coming at you. >> Yes. from every angle all the time. And. you have to be very very careful as a. woman that that doesn't start to define. you, that that doesn't seep into you, right? Because the minute that goes. inside you, you're in trouble. And you. know, I have this great friend Diane. Vonenberg. She's the most insane and. incredible woman ever. But she talks.

about this idea of the most important. relationship you'll ever have is the. relationship you have with yourself. And. so you got to be real careful that your. biggest enemy isn't living between your. two ears, right? It's like this. conversation that goes on all day that's. relentless. Has to be kind. It has to be. compassionate. It has to be empathetic. These are all things that we give away. to other people if you're a good person. all the time. But it starts with you.

You have to give that stuff to yourself. first and foremost. And when you start. to do that and when you start a daily. practice that says I am going to behave. like this to myself when I speak to. myself this is how I'm going to be that. rewires you. >> Well even talking to yourself that way. is in itself its own form of excellence. >> Yes. >> Right. Because you operate that way in. the world that level of excellence with. other people. And so it's a beautiful. way to think about talking to yourself.

in a kind and cheering and empathetic. way is a form of excellence with. yourself. I love that. What would you. say to somebody that is kind of at the. beginning of the journey in their career. right now trying to figure it out? >> You know, Mel, honestly, what I would. say is that everything you want is on. the other side of what you're working. towards. You just got to be working. It's all there. Everything you want is. there. It's just got to find you working.

and that's it. You can't think your way. into what you want. You can't wish it. You can't hope for it. You got to do. And that's where this perfectionist trap. is poisonous for us because if you think. that you have to do it perfectly or it. has to come in some, you know, spectacular way or this thing that you. want to do has to be really big, it. doesn't. It's like just start just do something. and know that if you are doing if you.

have forward momentum if you are moving. in the correct direction of travel you. will get there but you have to be moving. >> and what about if you don't know if. you're in the right direction like I'm. I'm. >> then you just go because I never knew I. never knew and the fact is sometimes I. wasn't going in the right direction. but at least I was going somewhere. because what happens is you pick up all. this information along the way if you're. smart and when you make mistakes again. it comes back to that idea of like how.

am I speaking to myself because if. you're if you treat yourself like a good. friend. >> imagine that your friend messes up right. she messes up you don't go you absolute. silly cow you go darling let's talk. about this what happened I love you. anyway let's go through it where were. the mistakes how are we going to do. things differently next time that's what. you have to do for yourself so know that. that is inevitable And you know I've. kind of trained myself around this rule. of thirds that I have in my head and. that has really really really helped me.

to rule. So the rule of thirds is. something that I remember hearing this. when I was a bit younger and it's like I. almost live by it. So if you are doing. something difficult, if you're chasing a. dream, if you are on the road to. whatever it is, you are going to be. happy about a third of the time. And the. other third of the time you are going to. be like h you know life is kind of all. right and the final third of the time. you're going to feel terrible now.

>> it sounds like a marriage. >> you're going basically it can be applied. to marriage too but you know the point. is that we shouldn't feel good all the. time. >> right it's just part of how we're. conditioned right now to imagine that. like life is this like you know. Instagram reel of wonderfulness and that. ain't the truth. So, if you can learn to. accept, do you know what? On those. really bad days when you feel really. crappy, you're like, that's okay. In.

fact, I'm exactly where I need to be. because I'm going to have those days and. I'm going to have some of the middling. days and then I'm going to have these. great days. And so, if you go off track, that's all right cuz you have to know. that you can come back. And when you're. on fire, you also better be real humble. cuz you're going to know that those. stinky times are coming, too. So, it's a. really lovely way to keep yourself in. balance. And I think about it probably. daily. A third and a third and a third. >> The rule of thirds. I love it. Now, I'm. going to think about it daily. And I. know that the person that is listening.

is going to think about it daily. And. share that rule of third with the people. that they care about because it is true. that when you're going through the. crappy part, you think this is going to. be that way forever. >> Yes. >> And yeah, we all hear, "Oh, it's. temporary." But I love a rule. >> Yeah. I love a rule. I love. >> a lava roll. >> A lava roll. >> And so I love being able to say to. myself even though it's been a crappy. decade. >> This is just a third of a third. Like.

it's it's just onethird of what I'm. going to experience. >> I love that you say a decade because. people tend to overestimate what they. can do in a year and underestimate what. can actually happen in a decade. I have. been in America for eight years this. July 4th and I'm a different Emma, right? Like that eight years didn't just. happen in 8 years. It happened the 30. years before the 40 years almost before, right? So we have to think about like.

what it actually takes and time and I. feel like as a young person you can be. in such a rush. It's like don't be in a. rush. Life is long. Life happens in. chapters. And so as a young person, all. you need to say to yourself is, I am. willing to work and I'm willing to. accept the direction of travel and it. will be going forward some of the time. and it will be standing on a spot some. of the time and it will be going. backwards some of the other time and all. of it is fine. >> Could you speak to the pressure that.

people feel when they're young to just. jam it all in? Like one of the things. that I see from especially people in. their 20s and early 30s is that I got to. do it all. I got to travel. I got to do. this. I got to find the person. I gotta. figure out my dream career. >> Yeah. >> And I love that you're saying when you. are young just slow down. >> Well, let me tell you what I really. believe works. Tell me.

We are in too much of a rush. Having. said that, your 20s is the time to try. some stuff. And that is what I really. believe in. I could look at all of my. friends now. Got a couple of them in. front of me. And I could draw a line. down the middle of those that are. successful now in their 40s and what. they did in their 20s. Did they did they. like go for it? Did they take a bunch of. risks? Did they work really hard? Did. they try a bunch of stuff? and those.

that perhaps, you know, kept the. partying going maybe a little too long. When you don't have responsibility, right, most of us have children a little. bit later now. You don't take on. responsibilities in terms of financial. responsibilities like a mortgage until a. little bit later now. Your 20s are the. time to try. And I remember a lot of. people saying to me in my 20s, like, you. work too hard. You need to have more. fun. The truth is, if I didn't do the. 20s I did, I wouldn't be where I am now.

>> Yes. And so you've got to try a few. things. And again, don't think that. they're all going to work out, but there. is a time in your life where it makes. sense to put a few bets out there, to. throw a few things at the wall, to like. go outside of your comfort zone. Like. that is the moment. That's the decade. because you're going to spend your 30s. like figuring it out like what do I. actually want to do and putting in the. hard work. And then hopefully by the. time that you get to your 40s, you've. become proficient at something and you. can start to choose your choice. But in. my experience, not before that.

>> Well, what's interesting is I'm sitting. here looking at you and you're 42 and. I'm thinking, "God, at 42, I was $800,000 in debt. I had leans on. the house, my husband's restaurant. business was going over. I was. unemployed, three kids under 10, about. to lose." Like, that's when my life fell. apart. >> And look at you now. >> No So, it took some time. >> Yeah. Take takes some time. And one of. the other things I want to point out. though is you're 42 and when you drop.

out of college, that's 25 years ago. And. I want to remind you as you're listening. and watching that you also said in the. very beginning, I've only really enjoyed. what I'm doing for the last 5 years. Facts. And it's really important because. we don't talk about it enough that it. isn't going to be fun. >> It isn't going to be a party the whole. time. You are not going to feel like you.

are pursuing your passion as you are on. the journey and figuring it out. And one. of the things that also is interesting. about your career though is it took you. 10 years. between that moment where you dropped. out and you're hustling and you're. trying to find anybody that will let you. just be somewhat near fashion for free. >> for free. >> doing anything so you can be close to. the thing that you want. Would you speak. to that moment where you feel like, oh.

my god, like I've been at this for a. while and I'm just not getting traction. and the job that I have is paying the. bills. Grateful to be able to pay my. bills. Like I'm not going to like diss. the job that's paying the bills, but. it's not aligned with where I thought I. would be. >> How do you stay motivated? How do you. keep the dream alive when the first. things that you're doing don't really. feel like they're going anywhere? >> Yeah. And let's be honest, we all have.

those times. I had a lot of jobs like. that. I really, really did. And what. I've always tried to do is find maybe. make up a little bit in my head, but. I've tried to find the glimmers, right? Like where is something in here useful? So, you're working, you know, like an. office job with some kind of clerical. role. You are learning to be organized. You are learning what it takes to be the.

back office support. You are looking at. everything that's happening around you. And let me tell you, Mel, and I know. this for sure, the fact that I have done. all the bad jobs, the fact that I have. been there is what makes me a great. leader. Because today, not only can I. appreciate every single person around. me, I've done those jobs. I know not. just what it takes, but I know how it. feels. And my staff know that I know how.

it feels. And there is a different. appreciation level for somebody who. comes into leadership having done all of. the things. And so, not only do I look. for those glimmers and tell somebody. that, you know, this job that you're. doing that feels pretty mundane isn't. because there is value in all work, you. just have to find that and you take. small pieces. And I think about my. experience now as it's a collective of. all the things that I've learned. I. learned customer service when I was.

making the sandwiches. And when I was. delivering the papers, I learned the. power of the mornings. And when I worked. in the closet at the fashion company, I. learned how to do a really horrible job. with a smile on my face. Just put it on. And it's like all of those little pieces. will take you somewhere. And you have to. keep in your head and tell yourself, life is long. >> and whatever I'm doing, it all adds up. to something. You know, just like all. your relationship experiences. And it. can feel hard when you're in them, but.

you can look back and say, "There was a. reason that thing happened." But you've. got to understand, hindsight isn't just. a fine thing. It's the thing. It's what. makes us who we are eventually. So, you've just got to keep that in the. front of your mind that this is leading. somewhere. >> Everything is leading somewhere. Everything. All parts of it. >> Absolutely. You know, you started. pushing on doors early. I mean, you. literally would just walk right into. the room and many rooms where you. probably felt like you didn't belong.

>> What gave you the confidence. to stay when you would get into a room. where you're like, I'm not sure I belong. here or I'm not sure this is going to. work. The way I was raised was really. interesting because confidence has never. really been my problem. I was raised by, you know, my wonderful mom and she. taught me, you know, she was like, "Emma, you're not better than anybody. else, but nor is anyone better than. you.". >> And that stayed with me. And so when I. walk into a room now then,

>> even though with my terrible education, leaving school before I should, even. though I'm highly dyslexic, I know my. gifts. I know my strengths. And I know. that whatever it is that any of us has. to bring is valuable. There is value in. all of us. And so again, you have to. really like anchor into that piece of. you. Like you have to you have to. believe that you have something special, unique, and even if it's not special and.

unique, it's what you have to bring. So. make the most of it. >> Figure it out. Figure it out. package it. up and go in with some confidence that. at least there's just not another you, right? There's not another you in that. room. So, whatever you are bringing into. that space is something that's not there. because there isn't another you. And you. have to think deeply and carefully about. what those things are and what you add. to an organization. And I've done all of. that. But in the beginning, you've just. got to believe that you have something.

unique to bring. Well, you also touched. on this earlier about excellence and how. when you operate with a level of. excellence, even if it's managing the. energy at the crappy job you can't. stand, >> people are drawn to it. >> Yes. >> Drawn to it. >> They really are. >> Do you have any advice for. how you can get yourself into a room? You know what I mean? Like there's a lot. of people that are aspiring to launch a. business or raise some money or. >> uh just put their art out there or be.

noticed or get the interview. Is there. something some move that you can make or. some way that you have found or maybe an. example of somebody that got your. attention about how you get into a room. because you were literally like I just. want to be adjacent to whatever I'm. going to knock on that door. I'm not and. >> Yeah. I mean, the first thing, Mel, is. you got to get out of your own head. Cuz. I speak to a lot of people like, I've. been trying this thing and I've been. like thinking about this for a long. time. It's like, what did you do? Like, what did you do? Did you call the store?

You want to sell your thing in the. store? Do you call them or do you just. hoping for somebody to notice you? Did. you like you want to be an artist? Like, are you making art? Are you putting your. work out there? Again, like nobody is. like looking for you. No one. So you. again have to take responsibility and. start like get out of the starting. blocks and go and do something. And. again it comes down to this idea of. fearing what is on the other side. Fear. of rejection, fear of being told no,

fear that it won't work. So you got to. get past that point and know that that's. all there and that may well happen, but. that's okay too. And I honestly think. that the big uh the the big block that. people have is getting started. >> Feeling so vulnerable that they can't. even start. You can't write a business. plan and then file that business plan. >> and then go, I'm going to I'm going to. start this business because I've got a.

plan. It's like what's in the plan? You've got to go. You got to get the. thing made. You have to write the email. You have to ask the question and you. cannot network your way into starting. That doesn't work. People right now. always say to me, you know, I wish I was. invited to this networking event. It's. like that's not the thing. A network is. a tool, a way of getting things done. The things that make the difference. between starting and not starting is. never really what you think. It's never. the people that you think. When I look.

at my business and my life and think who. are the people that have made the. biggest differences, I go back. It's. like I didn't know anyone that was going. to give me money to start a business. I. went to my clients to people that I. worked with and explained like I am. going to start this thing and I'm going. to need some capital to do it. When I. needed advice and a mentor, I didn't. know anyone who like had a business in. East London, like not a legit or legal. one anyway. you know, it was like,

"Okay, guys, like we that's not the type. of business advice I need." So, again, I. went to clients and at the end of. pitching the marketing campaign I was. there, I would just ask a couple of. questions. Like, you got to take your. chance, shoot your shot. Don't walk. around looking for a mentor. Walk around. asking questions. That's what you have. to do. And you have to realize that your. network will never be what you think it. is. It will be the factory, the vendors, your bank uh relationship, your lawyer, like that is your network. So work with.

whatever you've got. Stop looking at. what you don't have and look at what you. do have and make that the network. But. you have to start. You've got to start. somewhere. >> You know, I keep thinking about the fact. that it is so easy to talk. It's so easy. to make a plan. It's so easy to, you. know, network with people. >> But the real differentiator is what can. you show me that you've done? If if. somebody if you can't take out your. phone and show someone a photograph of.

the thing that you did, you haven't done. anything. >> Yes. You said ask questions. Are there. questions that are better than others? >> There are questions that are better than. others. And I also think that what. happens with a lot of founders is that. they get obsessed with their idea. They. get obsessed with their individual. thing. And often I will be in a. situation, somebody is pitching an idea. or trying to get advice from me and I.

will ask about their space, the. competition, their market, and they. don't know anything. So when you start. something, it's not just about the thing. that you're doing. You have to be. obsessed with everything else that is. adjacent with your entire category. Obsess the price. Obsess the. distribution. Obsess every single part. and every dynamic of that thing because. that's what that's what counts. You're. bringing your thing into that space. And.

so that becomes the barrier between what. you're starting with and where that. thing is going to go. You've got to be. really open to what's happening around. you because that is the truth of. business. You are in a fight from day. one. You open your doors, you start your. website, it's like it's a fight. It's a. fight for attention. It's a fight for. that customer. And you need to be. willing and have a real understanding of. what problem you're solving for and what.

it is that you bring uniquely. And that. means an understanding of everything. else that is around you. >> What was the first thing that you. started? >> So the first thing to say is I always. had a job. From 12, I've had a job. I. delivered the papers. I did the. babysitting. It's like I worked in the. Delhi. I worked in a million different. clothes shops. It's like I've been. working forever and ever and ever. And. so it's like I drop out of college um. and I landed in this strange year of. just work placement. So I just went from. place to place to place essentially. figuring out what I didn't want to do.

but getting closer to the idea of like. what is the fashion business? How does. it work? I landed in a fashion show. production company. Sounds glamorous. Absolutely was not. You're building the. catwalk shows. So, you know, a designer. has this like grand idea of what it is. that they want to do, and you have to. build it. The show goes up. You spend. three months planning it. The show goes. up and down in 10 minutes. You don't see. it cuz you're backstage. Everybody goes. off to a party that you're not invited. to. And you have to deigg.

That was my life for 5 years. But in. that, I met everybody. I understood what. the business of fashion was, why we were. putting on the shows, and I knew. everybody. And so I essentially took the. what I had created there, which was just. my reputation as being someone who. understood fashion and loved fashion. And I started doing deals for fashion. designers with brands. So everybody had. this grand idea of what show they wanted. to put on, but no budget because they. weren't really making sales. And so I.

would do brand partnerships between. designers and brands. And I created an. agency eventually after like you know. one deal here, one deal there, a little. commission there, a little commission. there. Um I became like the girl that. did this in London and I started an. agency when I was 24. The agency I was. in for 10 years. I grew it. I had an. office in London, an office in New York, an office in LA, closed the office in. LA. Grew, grew, grew and I essentially. built this agency group that started. acquiring rights, licensing rights and.

brand rights. We did product placement. in movies. We put celebrities into. campaign. >> So if I don't understand what that. means. >> Yes. >> What what does that mean that you do. brand? >> So So we So my agency was an. entertainment marketing agency. So we. represented a brand's interests in the. world of entertainment. So my client. could be let's call it Mercedes-Benz and. Mercedes-Benz want to put that car into. a movie or they would like to have.

Claudia Schiffer in their campaign or. they would like to do a partnership with. a fashion designer and have the. interiors of the car looking all. gorgeous. I was the girl representing. the brands making those marketing deals. happen. I want to make sure that as. you're listening or watching right now, you actually got a couple really key. takeaways and pieces of advice that are. buried in the story so far. >> So, you have this vision. You know what you. want to do. You want to be in fashion.

And so, you do everything you can to get. yourself in as close a proximity as you. can to the thing that you're interested. in. So, you're volunteering first. You. ultimately end up with this crappy job. >> Crappy job. >> Crappy job. But you are in the industry. >> I'm in the mix. >> You're in the mix. So, number one, I. don't care if you don't know what you. want to do. Get a damn job. >> And you said for an entire year you did. everything you could in these jobs you. did for free. But you also were working. and making money in deli and everything.

else. >> Seven days a week. I worked in the clove. shop and then I would work doing my work. experience. I was exhausted. But here's. something you said that I want to make. sure that that as you're listening, you. do not miss. Every single crappy job. that you hated actually told you what. you didn't want to do. So everything. you're doing right now that you don't. like is so important because it's. getting you closer to understanding what. you do like. >> Exactly. >> And that's really important. And I also.

love the fact that you kept yourself. super busy. The more crappy jobs you. have, the faster you're going to figure. out what you're actually good at and. what you like. >> Oh, and Mel, this is a key point cuz. people ask me all the time, like, "How. do I figure out what I'm good at?" Cuz. I'm like, "What you need to do is lean. in to where you're good." I don't know. what I'm good at. It's very, very. simple. If it gives you energy, you are. good at it. If it takes your energy away. and you feel exhausted and depleted, that's what you're bad at. Make it.

simple. So for me in negotiations, in. like contract negotiations, I am on. fire. Even the bad ones, I am on fire. That's what I'm good at. You give me an. Excel sheet with a bunch of numbers, it's like, "Kill me now. Kill me now. That's what I'm not so good at.". >> So you really start to understand, and. it's in that understanding of yourself. that you get closer and closer to where. you need to be and figuring out what. you're good at. You don't try to chase a. passion. You don't try to find like what.

am I supposed to be doing like what is. my purpose? No, no, no. Lean in to what. you are good at. I am an excellent. negotiator and that's where I I've ended. up where I am today. That's it. The. second thing that I want to extract from. that story is that in that job of. assembling catwalks and like being. treated like garbage and not being part. of the fun stuff, your network appeared. >> and it wasn't who you thought it was. going to be.

>> Not in the slightest. >> Not in the slightest. And so it's in the. doing of all the stuff and keeping. yourself busy because if you don't keep. yourself busy, you're going to get stuck. in your head. That's how you get. started. just get a bunch of jobs and. you're going to start to figure it out. But the network appears and then all of. a sudden you realize, wait a minute, >> like they're not making money. So maybe. I could get like a little brand involved. like Parker Mercedes out front and they. would pay to do that and I have a buddy. who works at the dealership down there.

So it doesn't start with the corporate. brand, it starts with the local thing. cuz that's your network. >> And it didn't start with the fashion. brands in my head. I was like, I'm going. to work in fashion. Remember, I didn't. have any fashion clients for the first. two years. >> I had a bunch of corporate brands. because my contacts when you work in. production, it wasn't the PRs and the. models and the designers. My contacts. were the lighting designers and the. riggers and the people that built the. stage. And they're like, well, you know, I know the CMO over at, you know, Volvo. I was like, great. Well, give me her. number then. You know, so it's like you.

just have to go where the energy is and. you take whatever you can take and you. just keep your eyes on the prize because. you can pivot. When you have choices, you can pivot. And when you don't have. choices, you do whatever is in front of. you. >> You're now 34 years old. You've been. like running this incredible agency, wheeling and dealing and negotiating and. like having all this not having fun yet. because it's only the last 5 years that. you really love what you're doing. and. you have this idea and you end up in a.

room with Chris Jenner. >> and what happened? >> Well, you know, I think the important. thing for people to understand is that I. had spent 10 years building my career at. the intersection of brands and fashion. >> And so I had a fantastic understanding. of what works in fashion and where the. whites space was. I really understood. what was missing. So, so when I talk. about white space, it's where the. opportunity is. What wasn't out there? Where was there a problem that I could.

find a solution for? And Good American. was a solution. It was that, you know, most women are massively underserved by. the fashion industry. 68% of women in. America are above a size 16. And yet, when you go into a mall, there's maybe. two or three shops out of the hundreds. of stores that will actually cater to. that size. Now we're going back 10 years. ago, right? When I first had this idea. So the landscape had shifted a bit. largely because Good American has. impacted it. But back then there were.

very very few options and all the. options quite honestly were bad. They. were ugly. And I had come from a place. you know in East London all my family. are big curvy women and they have. confidence and they feel good about. themselves. And especially you know you. think about black culture it's like the. bigger the butt the better. And so we. were very much my idea of beauty was. much much broader than what was being. shown in the media. And so I had this. idea and I just decided I was like I'm. going to do this. I have spent the last.

10 years building value for all of my. clients. And I was very well renumerated. and I had a fantastic business and I. managed to sell that first business. But. I wanted to do something that was for. myself that I owned and that I could. feel very proud of and start a brand. instead of helping all of these other. brands. >> And so what happened is I had seen how. celebrity endorsement can really. accelerate a brand because 10 years. working on all of those campaigns, you.

know, Natalie Portman for Dior or. putting people in L'Oreal commercials or. whatever it was I was doing, I. understood how that worked. I understood. that talent was a key to unlocking an. audience. And so I was like, great, I'm. going to start this brand. I'm going to. fill the white space, do something that. isn't out there, and I'm going to couple. it with the talent to make it explode. And so I pitched Chris and Chloe. Um, now feels like a legendary meeting. At. the time, honestly, it didn't feel like. a legendary meeting to me. At the time,

I really knew that I had something. special and I had spent a long time. figuring out why this was going to be so. successful. And you know, if I go back 8. years now, Good American was a complete. trailblazer. There was nothing like it. There was a reason that we did a million. dollars on day one. And it wasn't. because people were like, "Oh, you know, this sounds like a good idea." It's. because they could feel the difference. They understood that we saw them.

>> They felt seen. They felt heard. And. they felt represented. And it was a. magical moment in my career because it. was an idea that I'd come up with. It. was an idea that didn't exist that I'd. started from scratch and it was. resonating. It was working. And then I. realized I know nothing. I know nothing. about running an apparel company. All of. my agency experience and opening offices. all over the world meant nothing because. I was in the garmentto business and I. was not a garmentto. I knew nothing.

about making clothes. And so it was. like, you know, I had this on the. outside this huge success that was. getting so much press and so much. attention and growing on social and yet. I had no idea how to run that business. >> I want to go back to this meeting and. the idea. >> So the idea was. to how did you frame the idea eight. years ago because it it was absolutely a. trailblazer. So, you've got this whites.

space idea that isn't this is not like. everybody's got that uncle who's like I. thought Uber like Uh-huh. Okay. Sure. >> Did you do it? >> But no, you you you had been building. toward this moment. >> Yes. >> For well over a decade. And so you not. only had an idea, you had obsessed. around the industry, you knew that you. were going to do this. Didn't matter if. Chris Jenner and Khloe or anybody said. yes cuz you were going to do this.

>> Oh, I was going to do it. >> Oh, hell yes you were. And so tell me. though what was the pitch and pull up a. chair and put us in the meeting in terms. of how that meeting went. >> So you have to imagine that for the 10. years previously I had been in practice, >> right? I'd pitched the world's biggest. CMOs. I'd put the biggest celebrities in. the world in the biggest campaigns in. the world. I had been on set with the.

most famous men and women on the planet. And I had won awards in my agency. I was. a trailblazer in that business of. celebrity, fashion, entertainment. My. agency was the best agency doing what it. did. And so in a way, Mel, when I got. into that meeting, I thought I had a. gift in my hand and I was ready and. willing to share my gift because I knew. I had an idea that was golden.

>> And I really approached that meeting. saying, "Hey, I have this golden. brilliant thing that I have researched. and I understand and I'd gone out and. made, you know, I had a pair of jeans. and this is going to be the next big. thing." in fashion. And so my mindset. was that this is done. I am launching. this thing. It comes out in October. Where do we go from here? And I think. that there was something so special in.

that moment because everybody could see. it. Everybody understood. The reason I. was able to attract the right investors. and the right partners and the right. retailers is because the idea and the. execution and what led up to it was so. incredibly special. I had done my. homework. I knew the difference between. me and everybody else. I had obsessed. the price point. I could tell you the. price of every single pair of jeans that. sat on the Nordstrom denim floor. And I. could tell you what the content of those.

jeans were. And I could tell you how my. jeans were made differently and why when. a woman put them on, she felt a certain. way in them because I was obsessed. Obsessed beyond anything that would be. reasonable. Because in my head, I had to. succeed at something that was mine. Because when you spend your life as a. consultant making everybody else look. good and being the person behind the. scenes and not taking credit for it, there's only so much of that that an ego. like mine can take. Quite honestly, I.

was like, "Wow, look at that campaign. That's their idea again, you know, that. I came up with." And so for me, I was. ready to take credit and to do something. that meant something to a group of women. that I admired, that I felt. >> had been overlooked. and the love that I. got back. Mel, I cannot tell. The best. thing about Good American wasn't the. milliondoll first day. Wasn't that you. know, all the praise we got, it's the. women on the streets, the women that. would stop me, you know, I would go into.

Nordstrom and people cuz I used to, you. know, I was like, I'm going to work in. Nordstrom, going to just hang around. until a customer comes and I'd be like, have you seen this brand, Good American? And they be, oh my god, I just bought a. pair of Good American. I'm back to buy. my second pair, my third pair. You know, it was feverish. And I could tell from. all the feedback that I was getting that. we had done something really, really. special. >> You know what this is? It's excellence. >> Thank you. Thanks so much. >> I'm really proud of you.

>> Thank you. You're so lovely. >> So, what happened next? >> It's a disaster, Mel. >> Oh my god. You know, it never feels like. you think it's going to feel to get. everything you've ever wanted. No, it. was a disaster. >> That's what they don't tell you. >> That's what they don't tell you. Yeah. And it really, when I say it was a. disaster, the first, you know, I will, if you go back to launch day, it was. amazing actually because, you know, you've got your Shopify site. I was in, you know, my husband had an office in LA. at that time. I was like just sitting at.

a conference table with the two people. that I'd hired around that conference. day, room table. And so we had the. Shopify screen up and you can see like. the customers are starting to come in. and people are starting to purchase and. everyone was like, "Emma, you're a. genius. You're going to like have. amazing sales today." This is like 9:00. and I'm like, "I'm so clever." And then. 10:00 rolls around and they're like, "Well, you know, you're out of uh all. the size whatevers this through this.". And I'm like, "It's okay. You know, we'll replenish." And this wonderful. woman, I will never forget, she still.

works with me to this day, Melissa. Anderson, she says, "You do know that. we're off calendar." And I thought, why. is this woman talking about calendar? Well, that's the problem now cuz you're. not in fashion, so you wouldn't know. what offcal means. But I was in fashion. and I still didn't know what offcal. meant. And if I'd have known, I wouldn't. have had the problems that I had. So my. naivity kind of hit me right there cuz. she was like, you don't have more. inventory. If you sell through what is. here today, it's going to take months to. get back into stock and we are not.

holding any fabric and we don't have the. vendors lined up. because in my head. there is no way that you would sell. through that much inventory. It was a. brand new brand. It was a brand new. idea. You know, even retailers when we. pitched it to them didn't fully. understand the concept of carrying all. of those sizes. So, long story short, I. remember everybody by about 11:00 they. stopped celebrating me. And by 12 it was. like, maybe you're not fit to be the CEO. of this company. And I thought, maybe. I'm not for about 30 seconds. And I was.

like, everybody needs to calm down. And. at that point, it was like a lesson in. customer service because I had started. to disappoint people because people were. coming on the website and they couldn't. get their size. They couldn't get what. they wanted. And so I started calling. people. And at that point, of course, it's all email. There were no phone. numbers. So I was like, "What is your. phone number? Hi Sally from Michigan. I'm so sorry. I can get you a pair of. jeans in about 13 weeks." And I just. went and I went and I went and I emailed.

and I phoned and I called. And that's. when I started to really fundamentally. understand the business that I was in. because I had to go backwards before I. could go forwards. I had to figure out. how is this juggernaut going to actually. work and function because I don't. understand it. What's so interesting. about that story is you would think that. selling out of your entire inventory on. day one would be a great problem. it would be a great problem if you could. get some more inventory in the next. couple of weeks, but if you're out of,

you know, again, attention span is very, very short. And I knew that two great. things. Number one, the majority of my. customers couldn't just go elsewhere, right? There was a there was a limit. But at the end of the day, there were a. lot of women buying Good American that. could go to any brand. And if you want. something, you're going to go elsewhere. And so I had to figure out a way of. creating community around what we was. doing so that I could be in conversation. with my customer. >> That's pretty unbelievable. So how so.

because you know it would also be pretty. arrogant though, wouldn't it? Isn't it. irresponsible to run a business thinking. you're going to sell through all that. stuff that fast and then have all that. inventory sitting around? >> Well, yeah. Look, I never imagined you. know it was expensive product. I didn't. think people would swarm us like that. And you know, there's always a little. bit of me again because of where I come. from. I'm responsible. I treat money. like money. To me, it's not just like a. number on a piece of paper. I'm like, that's a hundred bucks right there.

That's a lot of money to part with. And. so, in my head, I wasn't going to do. something irresponsible and put myself. in a situation that I couldn't claw. myself out of. And for me, it was about. managing expectations and doing things. responsibly. And also I was very very. lucky because I had surrounded myself. with real business people. And if you go. back to though that kind of time it was. all about direct to consumer businesses. growth growth growth doing things just. chasing a customer and I was like you. know what I'm going to make a profitable.

business cuz that's what I understand. I. know that money on the bottom line. equates to optionality. Meaning that if. you are making money, everything that. you want to do is possible. And if you. don't make any money, your choices are. limited. Yes. End off. It's really basic. math. You have to know that. And so for. me, it was important to do something at. a level that made sense to me, that I. could control, and that I felt. comfortable with. And again, I say I I I. because it all fell on me. Again, it's. about responsibility. I took.

responsibility for my investors money. I. took responsibility for those customers. and what their needs were. I took that. responsibility extremely seriously from. day one. What is kind of the biggest lesson from. your experience. launching Good American? I would say that my biggest learning. has actually been uncovering who is.

really useful to you when you're. building something like that. I don't know that coming from an agency. background that I had. an intricate understanding of financial. modeling of how pivotal a relationship. with my bank was going to be of how this. thing called a factor which is a lending. facility between you and your retailer. was going to be. >> of how those retailer relationships you. know I was so lucky from the beginning. that I had pitched to Pete Nordstrom and.

Pete Nordstrom got it and he was my. champion I didn't understand how. valuable that was. Um, and those. relationships are what allow me to be in. business in the way that I am with. hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of. millions of dollars of sales today. Those relationships, it weren't the. press. It ain't the celebrities. It's. not like it's none of that. It's none of. the things that I was like, "Oh, this is. none of that. It's all of the behind the. scenes stuff. It's all of the.

foundational people and relationships. that allow you to go where you need to. go. >> It's the unsexy stuff. It's it's it's. honestly goes all the way back to you. working at that crappy job building. catwalks because it was all the people. behind the scenes that is the network. and we're all so busy chasing the shiny. stuff that to your point, you've already. said it. Look at what's right in front. of you. Work with what you have. >> Work with what you have. >> and go from there. Um, how did Skiims. come to start?

>> Well, Skiims was a bit different because. that was Kim's idea. Kim had the idea of. starting this shapewear company and I. think that I was a trusted partner of. the family that by that point and I just. again when I get excited about something. now I'm like this is the best idea ever. You know, that's one of those products. It's just like that makes so much sense. and it is so obviously the right thing. to do and so on brand and so needed and.

solves a problem and just. Yeah. Well, I I should say Skiims is a. sponsor of this podcast. >> Yes, it's only bras I wear. >> Go Skiims. You did not You did not pay. me to do that. Um, well, let's talk. though about your experience investing. and being a judge on Shark Tank because. you've got to have seen some amazing. pitches and some really horrible ones. >> Um,

you know, everybody wants to take their. shot, >> right? What advice do you have for somebody who. can get into the room or. happens to be introduced to somebody and. you want to take your shot and make your. pitch? How do you do it without being. overbearing or inappropriate or you know. what I'm saying? >> Yeah, totally. So, let's just talk about this for a. second in terms of what is most.

important for a pitch. Right? Because. that's the first thing that people get. wrong. A lot of fantastic, brilliant, successful entrepreneurs are excellent. storytellers. So, they're not coming. into you going like, "Hey, I've got this. thing and it's 5.99 and it does.". They're telling you a story. They are. weaving a narrative in your mind for. what this thing does, for the solution, for how it came to be. And they're going. all around that, but they are taking you.

on a journey. and you're like you're in. you're in like you're being red. Goldilocks, right? It's like and you're. eating it up. And that is the starting. point because to be an incredible. entrepreneur, you've got to be able to. sell and you got to be able to. storytell. And those two things are the. things that I think people don't think. about enough. When you can craft a story. and a narrative that is compelling to. your customers, you got them. You got. them hooked. That is your sales pitch.

So really figuring that out and. practicing it. I can't tell you how many. times I sat down in a mirror and spoke. about Good American before I met Pete. Nordstrom. Like. maybe 50 times. I did that pitch over. and over and over and over again. Remember Mel, I knew nothing about. constru construction of denim. I was a. marketing kid who went into product. So, I had to like really finesse it and I. had to again, you know, I'm not a. plus-sized woman, but I had to embody my.

customer and embody who I was solving. for. So, the first thing is like get. your storytelling down and make sure. you're not just flogging a product, you. are telling an interesting, compelling. narrative. And then you got to work out. your timing because if you're in a. party, if you are at a social event, if. you're on a quick ride, that's not the. time. That's not it. And you would be. better saying, I've got something that. would be really interesting to you and I. wonder if you've got a good five minutes. to do it. Because if you get that timing.

off right, the person is not there to. receive your thing. My next thing is. about your attitude. You can be excited. You can be exuberant. You can actually. even be a little bit arrogant, right? That that is fine so long as you know. your And you really need to know. it. You really need to know. And when I. say you need to know it, you need to. know your competition. You need to know. what you're up against. You need to have. figured all of those things out because. when you have your chance, you have to.

be ready. >> There is no practice. There is no It's. like that's your moment. So, you got to. figure those things out way ahead of. time. That's how you do a really great. and really compelling pitch. >> Excellence again. >> We're back to it. >> We're back to it. We're back to it. >> We're back to excellence. And excellence. can be practiced, right? Like if you it. actually needs excellence does not show. up. >> No, you've got to you've got to try and. you've got to sit in front of someone. and and fake pitch it. You know, you've. got to do that. You've and you've got to.

be willing to take the feedback. You. know, everyone used to say to me, Emma, you're fantastic. You just speak really. fast. And I'll be like, I do really? What do you mean I speak too fast? You. know, and so I had to learn to slow it. down a little bit. But you have to be. willing to take that feedback. >> So for someone who wants to start a. business, what's the best piece of. advice. to give them? >> I think my best advice. is that and this is uh this is where I.

want to be really honest. Mel, not everybody. should start a business, right? And so I. think that you have to really think. about what you're optimizing for. What. are you trying to do here? We are in. America. America is an incredible place. to be successful. And that isn't always. about starting a business. We've. romanticized this idea of what it means. to be a founder. It might be that you. are the type of person that thrives on.

comfort and you need to know what's. happening next month and the month. after. That's not a founder. That's not. an entrepreneur. And you would be better. working for one of the great companies. that we have in this country. You can. have a fantastic, beautiful, ambitious, entrepreneurial corporate career in this. country. And so you really need to be. honest with yourself about who are you. and what are you trying to optimize for?

Do you want to be that? Are you somebody. that is risk adverse? Are you somebody. that's willing to put it all on the. line? Are you at the stage in your life. where that's even an option for you? Or. do you have kids and a mortgage and. parents that you're looking after? So, the first thing is let's just be honest. and not go around telling everyone that. everyone should start a business and. everyone's an entrepreneur because. they're just not. That might not be what. people want to hear, but that is the. truth. >> That's what they need to hear. That's. what they need to hear. That is. fantastic honest advice. What's the.

worst thing that somebody could do if. they know, okay, I can handle the. uncertainty. I cannot let this thing go. I am going to do this thing. What's the. worst thing that they could do? Be. shortsighted. You have to be longterm. >> I don't know any business that does what. it does in the movies. It takes time. It. takes so much time. and for you to get.

in your stride and be good at something. and start hiring people and those people. to work out and your thing to start. tracking and the retailers to take. notice and then the press to set up. That takes time. So you have to know. that nothing happens overnight. And are. you willing to commit yourself to this. thing for the next few years? >> 10 years. >> Like that's honestly that's what it. takes. >> That's what it takes. >> That's what it takes. >> That's what it takes. >> And if you're not willing to do it for. 10 years, then you're not actually. committed to it. >> Yeah. We overestimate what we can do in.

a year. >> It's true. It's true. So, you know, if. if somebody is listening right now or. they have someone in their life that. either just lost their job because. there's a lot of people losing their. jobs right now or maybe they just want a. pivot. They're thinking about. reinvention or they want to start a. business. If you had to really name the skill that. you believe is going to be the most. marketable and important in the next few.

years, what do you think that skill is. that somebody should either focus on or. learn or double down on? So the first thing is. you have to figure out what you really. care about, what you uniquely. can get obsessed over and then you're. going to have to work out how AI is. going to disrupt that business and learn.

it. And I talk about this all the time. because by and large male women missed. out on the first tech boom, right? There. are far too few female engineers. There. are far too few female coders because we. weren't in it in the same way that the. guys were in it from the beginning. And. then the education followed that path. and the training and the jobs and the. seniority. It all went that way. We must. not miss out on this AI boom. If you. ain't using it, use it now. And I'm not. talking chat GPT as your search engine.

default instead of Google. I'm talking. about whatever it is that you do. If you. are an editor, if you are working in. planning or merchandising in a fashion. company, whatever it is that your job is. now, figure out the way you can utilize. AI tools and start learning them and. force yourself to learn them because. that's the future. That's where we're. going. And you know, I know that so many. people are like, "Oh my goodness, I. don't want more technology in my life. I'm just trying to not use my phone as.

much. I want to get back to real life. and real people." You can't avoid it. We've never been able to stop progress. and nor should we want to. And there's. going to be a lot of great stuff that. comes out of this AI. Boom. And you have. to be at the forefront of it. So, it's. like start to figure out how you can. ingratiate it into your life and your. work now. And something will start to. emerge. You'll start to understand it, see where the gaps are, get into that. white space. You'll start to learn. something differently. And it will.

become habitual for you. I could not agree more. How are you. using it? >> Oh, in so many different ways. Well, you. know, because for my own podcast, the. team is minuscule. So, we're using it in a lot of ways, whether it's for research or. transcribing or pulling certain clips. like but there's so many ways. And you. know what I did actually two years ago. um in the office was really say to. everyone, whoever can use AI in their. department, here's a bonus. We have a. bonus system. And it was so interesting,

you know, you think it would come like. from the marketing department or the. real creative departments. Absolutely. not. It was the accounts team that fa. found a way to um systematically figure. out chargebacks, which is a huge part of. our business, right? And and I was like, are you kidding? Not only saving the. company actually hundreds of thousands. of dollars, but coming out of the. department that you would think is less. dynamic. And so I think when you start. to challenge people to find efficiencies. in the way they work, it really is like. the best thing that's happened to us.

Emma, if the person who is hanging on. every single amazing word that comes out. of your mouth takes. one thing and does one thing today out. of everything that you've shared, what. is the one thing that is the most. important thing to do? You have to get. out of your head. You have to change the narrative.

that fills you with the fear. that stops you from moving. And I say. that because I've been there. I've been. in a job where I've been dreaming of. something else for the longest time and. I've written proposals and I've done. presentations and I've filed them on my. desktop and then I left them and I. didn't see the light of day. And guess what? The first one I did is.

the one that you're wearing today. You're wearing the jeans. You're wearing. the idea that made it off of my desktop. That's it. And if I can do it, anyone. can do it. M. Anyone. Emma. Agreed. What are your parting. words? >> You know, honestly, M, I'm so grateful. to you. I'm so unbelievably grateful. that you would ask me to come here. And.

you know, I wish I had something better. to say, but my honest truth is that I. dreamt of being who I am now. >> But I just didn't let the dreams stay a. dream. Right? It's like I just decided. that I would have to get up and make it. a reality. that if I worked and if I. tried and if I was willing to kind of. sit with the failure and the knockbacks. that that would be okay because.

eventually it would come. And so I just. want to say the same to everyone else. Eventually your time will come. >> That's it. You have to know that about. yourself. That is just it. >> Well, here's what I know about you. You. are a force to be reckoned with. >> Thank you. and you understood the. assignment and you showed up and lit the. biggest fire not only inside the person. that has been listening and watching but.

also inside me. I think you are a gift. You deserve every single bit of success. that you have worked your ass off for. >> Thank you. And there's no doubt in my. mind that there will be a million other. Emma Greeds that are inspired by your. story and the generosity of the wisdom. that you have shared with us today. I. love you. I am so grateful to have met. you, to have learned from you, to feel. so inspired by you, and thank you. Thank. you for being here.

>> Thank you for having me. It's been a. joy. Thank you, M. >> And thank you. Thank you for listening. to something that I know will change the. course of your life because this. particular episode is going to change. the course of mine. Like I literally. want to stop talking and go do. something. I am so fired up after being. with Emma and being with you. And so. take this gift, share it with everybody. you know and then make yourself get to.

work. And in case nobody else has told. you, let me be the first person to say. as your friend that I love you and I. believe in you and I believe in your. ability to aspire to amazing things to. get to work to figure it out. And Emma. just taught you exactly what to do to. put it in motion. Now go do it because. you know your friend Mel is going to be. cheering you on every step of the way. All righty. She lit a fire under my ass, so I got to get out of here. I will see. you in the very next episode the moment.

you hit play. All righty. I got to get. out of here because I got to go do. something now that Emma has just poured. all this into us. And I know you're. feeling the same way. And what you. probably want to do is watch another. video. So, I'm going to recommend that. you go to this one. You're going to love. it. And I'll be waiting to welcome you. in the moment you hit play. I'll see you. there.