Michelle Obama Upstages Barack, Euros Love America, and 2028 Rumblings, with Lowry and Cooke

Hey everyone, I'm Megan Kelly. Welcome. to the Megan Kelly show. A lot of news. to get to you today, including leftists. hating America, while Europeans who are. coming over for the World Cup are. discovering how amazing our country is. What's wrong with that picture? Uh, but. we begin today with the politics. unfolding around the Iran deal. Vice. President JD Vance told us a bit about. what's in the agreement yesterday. Uh, and it's not sitting well with the. president's newfound buddies. Uh the. never Trump crowd that's more hawkish.

that now has been embracing him is. having second thoughts. The admin is. under pressure uh from the more hawkish. neocon right about what some are now. dubbing the Vance peace deal. This is. the Vance peace deal. Uh President Trump. today obviously feeling the pressure at. the G7 in France because he was. downplaying the agreement saying it's. not final and that bombs could even be. dropping again soon. Watch. >> Is the tax to the agreement now final or. are you still.

>> No, it's not final. It's a memorandum of. understanding. And if I don't like it, we'll go back to shooting at them, dropping bombs on their head. >> When do you expect the word? >> If I don't like it, if they don't. behave, we'll go right back to dropping. bombs right smack in the middle of their. head. Okay? Because they've misbehaved. for 47 years. All right? Joining me now to react is a couple of. great are a couple of guys we love from.

National Review because it's an NR day. here at the MK show. National Review. editor Rich Lowry, National Review. senior editor Charles CW Cook. Don't miss a moment. Subscribe to this. show on YouTube and follow me on Insta, Facebook, and X. Let me tell you. something. When you sign your insurance. policy, for some brokers, that's it. They're done. They got their commission. They like you a lot, but goodbye. They've got somebody else to sell to. You may not hear from them again until. it's time for renewal. Your business.

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it's because I hadn't signed in. I am an. NR plus member. If you sign in, suddenly. magically all the articles become. available to you to be read by this. lovely audio AI voice thanks to Rich. Lowry. So go ahead, become a member, support their journalism, and get the. audio read to you. That way you can get. all the news while you're doing your. makeup, doing your household chores, unloading the dishwasher. Thank you for. that, Rich Lowry. Nice to see you. Nice. to see you too, Charlie.

>> Going well. There's a lot going on. So, I think it's very interest the the. dynamics of the Iran deal are very. interesting, aren't they? Like, we. talked at length about this thing. yesterday. I opened the show with the. reported deal terms, which have turned. out to be the deal terms. The. administration is now saying those. aren't necessarily the the deal terms. Okay. I mean, like, if they're not the. deal terms, literally everybody who's. connected to the agreement who's put.

them out is wrong. That could be the. case. But I'm going to go with these are. the deal terms minus a couple of tweaks. that we might get from the admin. Um, and JD Vance didn't seem to have any. problem with, you know, my recitation of. what they were either. Okay. So, let's. assume those are the deal terms. If you. want to hear them, you can go back and. listen to the yesterday's show open. Uh. but what's happening around it, Rich, is. even more interesting to me because. clearly the more hawkish right hates. this deal, hates it and would like it to.

be undone. And you know, the more. isolationist wing of the part is like, fine, whatever. Let's let's get out. This hasn't worked out well. Let's just. put a period at the end of it and stop. the bleeding. Cut our losses. In other. words, and you could hear in that. soundbite that President Trump is. feeling the pressure, right? Like he. wouldn't have said that, Rich, if he. weren't getting a lot of phone calls. from that first group I just referenced. So, what do you make of it? >> Yeah, but it's also it's not the kind of.

thing that's surprising to hear from. him. And is, by the way, technically a. violation of the first provision in this. deal, which is that you can't threaten. force. And it, of course, he's. threatening force. So, look, I'm I'm not. as I think it's a disappointing deal, but I'm not as shock shocked and. outraged by it as some of my hawkish. friends, just because I thought this is. where we were headed for a very long. time. I I I got bored talking about this. on our own podcast because uh we're. constantly talking about at least I was, Charlie was, MBD was. This is going to. be a disappointing outcome because we.

didn't win the war. or winning the war. would have required at least freeing up. the straight of her moves by force of. arms which would have been very. complicated, risky and protacted. operation that it became pretty clear. early on that Trump just wasn't going to. undertake. So then you're dealing not. over the nuclear program fundamentally. you're dealing over reopening the. straight and my reading of this is it's. basically a skinny deal. It's a trade of. a reopening of the straight maybe with. some form of tolling. the the the e the. memorandum of understanding doesn't say.

anything about tolling one way or the. other in exchange for lifting the. blockade and for letting for us letting. them sell oil. Now the other provisions. you read them at first blush they're. pretty horrifying but then you read them. with a lawyer's eye and nothing's been. agreed to. It's all pending progress. It's all a we're undertaking to come up. with a plan. It's all pending the final. agreement. And I'm not sure any of that. is going to happen. Now, there might be. pressure for it to happen because.

Trump's now said this deal is so great. You know, maybe he's vested in it. Iran. still has leverage over the straight, but my guess is you get a reopening of. both the blockade and the straight. And. I'm not sure anything else is going to. happen. Certainly, this is not going to. be resolved in 60 days. There's going to. be an extension. >> That is the best analysis I have heard. of what actually happened here. Honestly, thank you for that clarity. I. think that's exactly right. We we. decided to leave is what happened. Thank. God because it wasn't going well and it.

wasn't going anywhere. It could only get. worse, you know, like the escalation. trap and before you know it, we've got. boots on the ground or you know the. there was a report that Trump had. mentioned the nuclear possibility. No, no, no. Right. So, we decided to get out. and we needed to open the straight for. world energy purposes. So, we cut a deal. that would allow that to happen. We'll. pull out the blockade. You open the. straight. We'll give you some economic. incentives to do that and to not toll. people at least for 60 days and maybe.

some additional economic incentives for. you to continue not doing that, not. doing the tolling. And they said, "Okay, that sounds good for now." And then we. tabled all the really ugly stuff like, "Can you pursue nuclear? What's going to. happen to nuclear dust? What kind of. inspections if you can enrich? To what. extent?" all that stuff that they spent. I think 18 months negotiating Charlie. under the Obama JCPOA that Trump said he. hated and he tore up. He doesn't even. want to kind of go there and I get why.

people who are very worried about Iran. don't like it but we we lost our. leverage and so like we kind of don't. have the muscle to force them to agree. to anything right now. Instead, Trump. came in with a bunch of carrots, saying, "On phase two, if you're good boys and. girls over there, we might make it worth. your your while financially.". >> I agree with pretty much all of that, and this isn't being pedantic. The one. thing I would disagree with is you said. we don't have the muscle. We do have the. muscle, but we don't have the will to.

use that muscle. Donald Trump is on this. issue. >> a lot more hawkish than the American. public is. Now, I think that's probably. a fact of where Americans are, but also. he made absolutely no effort to alter. that. He didn't make a case to the. public. He didn't try and sway them. initially. And so, he ended up in a much. more hawkish position than the. electorate. And that left him stranded. where he'd gone in uh he had made some.

grand pronouncements about what we were. going to achieve, most of which I. thought were worthwhile in a vacuum. getting rid of the terrible Iranian. government, taking out their nuclear. program and so forth. But then when they. used their agency to fight back, mostly. by closing the straight of Hormuz, Trump. had a choice. He either escalated it, which would probably have included uh. boots on the ground and some more. American losses, um or he got out. And I.

think that's what's happened. They've. decided to get out because they're just. not willing to pay that price. Now the. one caveat I have which I keep repeating. is that in one sense is a failure of. what they were trying to do. But I don't. think it necessarily follows that we are. in a worse place now than we were prior. to this or at least prior to our bombing. of the Iranian nuclear facilities before. this fora in. >> well that's a diff that's a different. story. is a different story. But I think. that to end up with, which is where we. seem to be headed, an Obama style Iran.

deal plus having taken out their nuclear. facilities is better than just an Obama. style Iran deal. But that doesn't change. the fact that what Trump was talking. about in the early days of this has not. come to fruition. And he misjudged his. own or the American public's willingness. to take this to its conclusion. >> Yep. I agree. We could have had the. bombing of the nuclear facilities and an. Obama style JCPOA. Trump version without launching this.

war. We were negotiating it when we. bombed them. Yeah. You know that that. was the frustration of many of us like. what what are we doing? We that the June. strike was good. We took out the three. facilities. We like that the nuclear. dust is buried. We like that too. What. why are we going back over there? Like. we're going to sink their navy. Were we. ever really worried about the Iran Navy? I don't I don't think we were. I mean. Rich. wasn't like something that kept the. Pentagon up at night. That was one of. the weakest talking points through this. whole thing is a total strategic. irrelevance and we fell into the trap. We've fallen into it before during. Vietnam. I'm not comparing this to.

Vietnam, but there's a trap of just. counting up how much stuff you've hit. and therefore saying you're winning and. you're achieving your strategic. objectives when those things are not. necessarily related as we found out. here. So I think there there at least. three key misconceptions here. One, you. take out the Ayatollah and the regime. falls and ended up not being true. two. that you could just do a four six week. campaign and then just close up shop. when you're ready to and you know say. goodbye we're done which we couldn't do. once they'd uh taken the straight and.

then three in some ways the original sin. of this was not making any public case. for it not going to Congress for a vote. because when you're engaged in kind of a. limited war like this one of the key. constraints is how much political. support you have and when you don't have. any political support or limited. political support going in it's going to. limit your options. So again, reopening the straight would. have been the kind of the crux of of the. war as it developed, but we couldn't do. it because it would have probably. required troops on the ground. You might. have lost a ship or two, god forbid,

helicopters, maybe you lose a PS or two. And just there's no way Trump was going. to do that on behalf of of what was at. the outset an unpopular war that was. steadily becoming more unpopular. Now. look, I agree with Charlie. I think the. core achievement here is destroying. their nuclear infrastructure such as if. they just wanted to start again right. now, they couldn't. Now, you could have. done that with a more robust 12-day war, something short of what we did here. And. just final point, I think killing the. Ayatollah, even though I was glad when.

it happened, and I understand the. temptation to take that shot, I think it. was a key mistake because we got nothing. from it strategically. The regime didn't. collapse. The regime didn't moderate. And it signaled from the outset, this is. an existential fight, right? Do. everything you can. Go close the. straight. Whereas, if it had been a more. limited campaign at the outset where you. said, we're not targeting the. leadership. We've seen this before. We. did a version of it last year, but if. you go after the straight, then we. target your leadership. Then we know. where all the bunkers are, and you guys.

are going to die in the middle of the. night. Then maybe they don't close the. straight. But once they closed the. straight and we hadn't properly prepared. for it, a mistake that really goes to. the top and Trump's over optimism about. everything. He was overoptimistic about. the war. Now he's overoptimistic about. the peace deal. Once that happened, we're headed to inevitably I think to a. disappointing outcome. >> Well, that's another reason. I mean, the. the number one reason that that we I. think are lamenting the fact that this. was launched to begin with is the loss. of our our troops, our our 13 military. personnel. But but the other thing is.

the straight was open before we launched. this war, you know. So after that June. bombing 12 months ago of their nuclear. facilities, we had we had what we needed. that there was really no reason to go. back in there and we could have just. said we could have continued the. negotiation that Whit and Kushner were. doing, come up with some again like. JCPOA Trump version where they agree and. we have monitoring which we haven't been. having since Trump tore up the JCPOA. that Obama negotiated. haven't been. having um monitoring, which is one of.

the reasons why we had to bomb them. But. we could have renewed monitoring. We. could have had like some sort of we. could have done all these deals like. with the carrots and so on. We could. have done that without all the carnage. And we wouldn't have had to worry about. the straight now being o open but. controlled by Iran, you know, like prior. to this war, that wasn't a thing. And. now we're going to have to deal with. this forever more. And unfortunately, it's it's almost like set an example for. the world around that the the waterways. are a leverage point in war in.

international relations. You know, Charlie, that wasn't a thing prior to. now and now it is a thing. So, I don't. know. If you were talking to Trump a. week ago, would you have said, "Do this, like, let's just wrap it up." Or would. you have said, "We we have to wrap it up. in a prettier way to appease more people. because you're going to lose support if. you don't if you can't clearly emerge as. quote the victor.".

Well, I don't think it would have. mattered what I said to Donald Trump. because quite literally every single. thing that he does, he casts as the. greatest thing that has happened since. the creation of the earth. So, this is. very much in his wheelhouse. This will. have been a smashing victory. Uh, the. war will have been a smashing victory. The peace will have been a smashing. victory. And if you look back a few. years ago, he basically reratified. NAFTA, but called it the Donald Trump. free trade deal and wrote how beautiful. it was and how awful the status quo ante.

was. So we we we'll get that here. Uh. again, uh not to be pedantic, but the. the the issue here, Megan, is that we're. just not prepared to pay the price. Uh. you were saying, well, we didn't have. this problem with the waterways before. Uh the US Navy plays largely the role in. the world that the British Navy did. prior to 1945. that's keeping these. waterways open. The British Empire was. quite willing to send gunboats and just. shell anyone who got in the way of. international trade. The US Navy has. been as well, but this one is a little. bit different because this is not just.

the quotidian maintenance of the seas. This is quite obviously the product of. the war. And that I think is is the the. fatal problem that Trump encountered uh. and where Iran recognized the pressure. point that you described because there's. only really two things that Americans. would care about. They're right to care. about both of these things. Uh one is. losing American soldiers. Two is gas. prices. If Trump had gone into Iran and.

we hadn't lost any American soldiers and. gas prices had stayed precisely the. same, if there had been no economic. fallout whatsoever from this, I don't. think the average person would have. cared. Maybe they should, maybe they. shouldn't, but I don't think they would. have. I don't think the abstract. criticisms of this sort of adventurism. resonate with most people. They just get. on with their lives. But he just. couldn't pay those two prices. Um, and I. just I don't think that the triumphalism. of which he is so fond uh was going to. get him out of that. He he's learning.

here that there is only so much reality. distortion that he is capable of. Uh, and it's come late in his presidency. Uh, but he's not managed to sell the. war. He didn't really try. And he's not. managed to sell the piece either. Uh, and he's going to have to take his lumps. on this one. And I say that as somebody. who really wanted this to work out, but. he's just going to have to take his. lumps. And I think if I were giving him. advice, back to your question, that's. what I would say to him. And then I'd. say, move on. And please, for God's. sake, if we're leaving Iran, if this is.

done now, please talk about the economy. >> Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. We've got, you know, how many months now? What? June and. happens in November. So five months, four and a half for him to focus like a. laser on the economy. The gas prices, the oil prices are coming down. on the. gas prices have come down a little and. he's just got to keep that rolling like. strongly through the summer and and. telegraph to the American people like. I'm on it. He he Trump would never say. I'm sorry, right? That I was I was. focused on something else. He he will.

triple down and quadruple on they were. going to get a nuclear weapon and I I'm. the one who stopped it. Okay, whatever. But he's just got to make people. actually feel he's focused on their. issues. But before we leave the politics. of this, Rich, um I love Brian Kilme. I. think he's a great guy. He's actually a. dear friend, but I did think it was. interesting. He's more a hawkish guy. And here's how he was speaking about the. deal on Fox and Friends this morning. Take a listen. >> Israel has to, I guess, stop fighting.

back against Hezbollah, who's lobbing. missiles at the northern part of their. country. This makes absolutely no sense. >> It makes no sense. >> Is everything that you said I think the. president would say? I'm just wondering. if the people that negotiated this have. informed the president about what's in. the page and a half he's going to read. publicly on Friday. >> And I would just say we were in a much. better place before we saw the details. of thisou and um unless President Trump. can change this at the last minute and. get good deals here. Um I would say that. this memorandum of understanding is is.

worse than not having it. >> Right. Uh in the next 24 hours he could. go in and do that. I hope he does. Sorry, that wasn't actually the. soundbite that I was referring to, but. there was one earlier on the curvy couch. where Brian said it was the Vance peace. deal and said, "I really hope he said. this is not President Trump's peace. deal. It's it's JD Vance's." And I. really hope that JD Vance hasn't. disappointed the president here because.

there's only so much President Trump can. do. and he really entrusted, you know, Vance with this and he better have. served him well. >> The MAU calls for the straight of Hermuz. to be reopened in the near term. All. right. The MOU stipulates, quote, that. Iran will make arrangements using its. best efforts for the safe passage of. commercial vessels with no charge for 60. days. Hold on here. Best efforts? What. do you mean best efforts? Just back out. of there. We'll pick up the mines. Not.

best efforts. That's a that's a specific. ne uh vague language. And what happens. after 60 days? Word is they're going to. get together with Oman and uh Iran's. going to get with Oman and charge tolls. If that's the case, that's unacceptable. for everybody. >> Well, the good news is gas prices have. gone down. So, that's great. If the. straight is open, that helps. That helps. with gas prices globally. Here's the. thing, though, Brian. You're reading a a. list of what you think the deal looks. like possibly. There's another list here.

in front of me. There's another list. here in front of you. What does the real. deal say? >> What I just said, what I just said was. read to me from the from the memory of. understanding from someone who was. holding it in his hand. >> Okay. All right. >> Well, that seems very vague then. Very. vague. >> Very vague and concerning. All I'm going. to say is the vice president was here. did a wonderful job on every outlet. including the view. But this is his. deal. >> It's not the president's deal. and it's. his deal and Steve Woodco and Jared. Kushner together. I just hope they.

didn't let the president down because. the president's putting a lot of stock. in them, right? And he has to he can't. do everything himself. I just hope they. didn't let him down. >> And I do think that's we're starting to. see like like Mark Tissson too, my old. pal from the Kelly file. He called it. the Vance peace deal yesterday there or. deal Vance deal. I'm not calling it. peace. Um, and there does seem to be an. attempt here, Rich, to carve out some. space for JD Vance to get all the blame. for this terrible deal. And even Vance. to me yesterday was like, "Oh, gee,

isn't that interesting how they're. that's that's what they're calling it.". And I wonder why. And I think we all we. all know why, right? It's an attempt to. like protect the president from the. political fallout here. >> Yeah. So, I'm friends with both Brian. and Mark, so I want to address what they. said. I I'll say what I I think about. this. I don't get it at all. It's not. the Vance Peace deal. It's only. happening because Trump is so desperate. for the the peace deals. But we've seen. this, I think, from both sides within. the right and both factions. He launches the war. People say, "Oh, he's manipulated by BB Netanyahu into.

it. He's ending the war and they're. saying, "Oh, he's being manipulated into. by JD Vance into it." No, it's all. Trump, you know, he wouldn't have. launched the war if he didn't want to do. it and he was over optimistic about it. He wouldn't do this peace deal if he. weren't desperate to do it and he's over. optimistic about it. Now, I think that. the potential downside to JD, I mean, fundamentally, he needs to be a loyal. soldier. And I I think as far as anyone. can tell from the outside, he's tiptoed. through the raindrops. He apparently. made it clear at the the last meeting. about this. He didn't he wouldn't do it. if he were president, but he'd support. Trump. He's been a loyal soldier, and.

it's very the thing he has to do for. 2028 for his nomination purposes, stay. on the right side, Trump. So all. indications he's done that. But I do. think he's created some hostages to. fortune by being so um optimistic about. this. The thing he said the other day, oh it's really cool to see this regime, you know, now they realize this 47 years. of hostility towards the United States. was was a mistake. I'll believe that. when I see it, I'm very skeptical. But. but you know, he's got to reflect what. the guy at the the top does. So Trump.

would never just say, "Well, look, this. is the best we could do. It's not it's. not perfect. I wish it were different. You know, maybe it won't even work out, but this is the best we can do. You. know, half a loaf. It's got to be the. best thing ever. And they got to be. rational people now who and and also, by. the way, the regime change stuff. We. talked about this in the past, right? He. still insists the regime has changed. At. the same time, he's now saying he also. never cared about regime change. So, which is it? You know, he's just this. sooie generous figure that is totally. unique. He's not an isolationist. He's.

not a neocon. He's a he's a little both. and neither at the same time. It's it's. just Trump and when he says I'm MAGA, you know, and I define MAGA foreign. policy, there's just a huge element of. truth to that. >> It's very interesting to me because all. these figures that, you know, were very. proTrump when he launched this who. hadn't who hadn't backed him in 16, 20, or even 24. He wasn't their their first. choice at all. But suddenly they loved. him because he was gonna bomb Iran. I. went back and looked that I trust the. president. I trust our president. trust.

the president. And now this week, where's the memorandum of Afghanistan. standing? We need to see it. This deal. looks terrible. It's a disaster. If it's. it's true, like this is a nightmare. We. would have been better off never going. into the first. What happened to I trust. the president? What happened? And. honestly, Charlie, it kind of puts the. lie to the whole nonsense of like around. this whole controversy, which is you're. either with the president or you're. against him. It It's like only.

true deep partisan hacks are just. knee-jerk with the president or any. politician in our business where you're. a journalist and you're a commentator on. the news. I think you'll probably be. with him sometimes and you'll be against. him other times. You'll have varying. opinions depending on what he does. But. I would submit to you that that that the. the people who were backing Trump who. really wanted this war did not look at. people like yours truly and say it's.

okay to not back this. You're entitled. to your opinion. I feel like they. they're entitled to their opinion. You. guys came on the first day this launched. and I said my husband agrees with you. I. I have no judgment for people who are. who feel differently than I do, but it's. been very eyeopening to watch the right. eat itself because you weren't allowed. to not support this war. But I guess now. you are allowed to not support the peace. agreement notwithstanding your I trust. the president mantra. >> Well, you're singing my song. I've been.

writing this for 11 years because people. are so irritating when it comes to. Trump. And I've said over and over again. that the one phrase that I've never. understood is, "Are you on the Trump. train?" What's that mean? What do I. mean? Like permanently. It's I I don't. really like him, but he's right a lot. Does good things. So, I say that and. then sometimes he's wrong and then I say. he's really bad on this. And that's how. you're supposed to be as a free citizen. If you do anything else, you're just. offloading your conscience and your mind. to someone else, which is a really.

bizarre and really evil uh thing to do. Uh so the phrase, you know, well, I'll. just trust the president, that really. should not uh leave the lips of anyone, especially an American, uh given our. mistrust of government. Uh it's odd. though that uh Trump uh has been trying. that line out. He's never quite. expressed what it's for, but in recent. weeks, he's been putting it out on. social media where he says, "Be quiet. Uh you know, trust me, it'll work out.

It always does." That's an almost. verbatim. uh recitation of these strange tweets. Um no uh that's not how it works. Uh you. could say that at election time you have. to make a decision. It's yes or no. And. you can say that you should respect the. office of the president. Uh but the. president should not be telling people. to stay quiet and trust him because it. will always work out either. >> That's the thing. You can't can't.

silence dissenting voices or or just. overcome objections to the president. reversing himself on a campaign promise. that was explicit and made repeatedly by. saying trust the president. Just trust. him. And if you don't, you're some sort. of hater. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no. I heard all the promises that we. weren't going to do this. I I understand. he he always said Iran can't have a. nuclear weapon, but there are some of us. who don't believe that's what we're. going into Iran for because we know he.

bombed their three nuclear facilities. the previous June. We we backed him on. that. We supported that. There are many. people who said that was a good idea, but this war wasn't. And you can't just. overcome legitimate objections by being. like, I trust the president and you. don't and therefore you're a hater. It's. just it's been a very annoying thing. But here's what interests me, Rich, about the divide now between. Republicans, right? I mean, we're always. going to be fighting the left for all. the reasons the three of us have been. discussing for six years, but.

what's going to happen? Because I, as I. said to JD Vance yesterday, as soon as. those midterms are over, 2028 is on, >> and the candidates are going to start. claiming their lanes, going on book tours. Some are at it even. sooner. um you know going to state fairs. and what have you just to make sure. they're out there and they're getting. their name and so on. And at the moment. the right is incredibly divided. And I. think you know my my short form judgment.

is the neocons would prefer a Marco. Rubio and the non-interventionalists. would prefer a JD Vance and that fight. will play out. But I do wonder whether. the right can come together to support. any candidate like whether the neocons. could ever vote for a JD Vance, whether. the non-interventional. non-interventionists. could ever vote for a Marco Rubio or an. or a greater hawk, you know, someone who. like a Tom Cotton or a Ted Cruz. I like.

I just don't know. Maybe I'm being. naive. Maybe they've come together over. fights bigger than this in the past. Nothing's coming to mind. I don't. remember one where the right was this. divided as we head into election season. >> Oh, there have been lots of divides over. time. Just in a general election, when. you have two choices, the partisan. gravity to get on board with your. candidate because let's say it's Marco. and non-interventionists aren't. particularly happy. Are they really. going to prefer AOC or Gavin Newsome or. Kla Harris? Same thing with JD. He has.

the highest chances obviously of winning. the nomination, but are happier with a. let me just throw let me just throw one. other curveball for your analysis before. you go any further. >> I agree with you. Mo the vast majority. of Republicans would prefer a a righty. to a lefty, but there's also a. contingent that would stay home just. like I'm not motivated at all and I. can't cast a vote for this person. But. but putting that to the side, I predict. there's going to be a third kind of. candidate and I think the person will.

probably run as a Republican and I think. it's going to be a Tulsi Gabbard. >> independent general election candidate. >> Yeah. Even like a Tucker Carlson, somebody who represents the more. isolationist wing who's going to say aox. on both their houses. These were. campaign promises that were near and. dear to millions of people's hearts. And. that person could they're not going to. get any neocon support, but that person. could get Democrat support if they were.

to get the nomination. But I I predict. this will be a new and important strain. in the 2828 election versus what we've. seen in years past. So yeah, it wouldn't. shock me if there's a Americaonly MTG. style candidate in the the Republican. primary. It's unlikely to see who who. could, you know, wi win the nomination. coming out of that that wing. But but JD. wants to, you know, he he's he's more. over on on that side than he is with the. the neocons, obviously. But as he said.

with you, you know, you know, I I don't. disagree. I I disagree with John Pador's. criticisms of this deal, but of course. he has a place in the Republican party. So someone who wants to be president of. the United States needs to to sound like. that. It can't be a factional leader. But again, I just think that the threat. from the Democrats is going to be so. grave next time around. If they get. unified control of uh Washington, there's going to be a serious attempt to. limit eliminate the filibuster, impact. the Supreme Court, and add states. I. mean, it's it's it's a near existential. question for our our system. So, and I.

also think most ordinary voters, we care. a lot about these foreign policy. questions. We we debate them a lot. I'm. not sure how central they are for. average Republicans. Um I I I just I. just don't think they're doctrinal. enough on on that to say, "Oh, you know, it's Marco. He's more neocon than JD. I'm with Tulsi in an independent bid." I. I just don't see that happening. Uh the only reason to disagree with that.

and I don't I'm not sure I do is uh the. polling on Iran which is it's incredibly. unpopular. It's unpopular with. Republicans. It's unpopular. hugely imposs unpopular with Democrats. but the independents are all against it. too. So it there's I don't know there's. definitely a large strain of people who. voted for Trump in 2024 from the. independent lane in particular and some. of those low propensity voters who got. out for him that are mad. They're mad. over this. They're mad over Epste.

They're mostly mad over the economy, Charlie. and um they might be. open-minded to somebody who's even more. of an economic populace than Trump and. also is promising not to get us into any. foreign entanglements and can could. really sell the I can't be bought by any. interest group, you know, Thomas Massie. style. Uh I don't know. I'm not sure. whether that person can win on a. national level, but I do think it could. be a potential spoiler in the Republican. primaries. >> Well, I think that the risk is much. greater in the general election. the.

primary election is. uh going to be fought between people who. are really interested in politics. I. would push back against your groups. because I think neocon versus. non-interventionist. uh those are those are groups but. they're not the only two. They're not. the biggest two. I I would say most. people now aren't neocons. Neocon was a. really it was a particular point in.

time. Uh not only are neocons and. non-interventionists not the main. categories. Uh but I would suggest that. most people who identify as. conservatives or who vote Republican uh. sort of sit somewhere in the middle. Don't particularly care, but they sit. somewhere in the middle of those things. Um Trump himself. >> depends on the conflict. Well, it does, but it also Trump himself uh sounds like. both of them. You know, sometimes Trump.

sounds very hawkish as he has here. Sometimes he sounds like a Jonian. Sometimes he sounds like a. non-interventionist or even an. isolationist. He's been called all sorts. of names and that's cuz he contains. multitudes. So, um I I don't. particularly like the the the setup. because I I don't think those are the. groups. What I do think is possible, not. necessarily because of this Iran war, but the the situation you suppose where. a third party comes along, um I think. it's possible as a general matter.

because more and more Americans have. moved into a nonpartisan camp and that. has left the two parties uh more on the. wings. uh and primaries tend to elevate. the people who are the most enthusiastic. about politics within those two parties. So, at some point, it does seem possible. to me that someone will come along in. the middle, maybe using some of this. populist energy, uh and spoil an. election. I don't think they'd win, but. spoil an election. That said, the US.

does have a two-party system, not. because there are some shadowy figures. on the wings who are dictating that, but. just because of the way our system is. set up. Um, and it's quite difficult uh. for that third party. I mean, Ross Perau. tried twice. He may have played spoiler. >> Well, Elon, if Elon Musk can't get it. going with his trillion dollars, which. he did consider, you know. >> Well, I mean, Elon Musk, >> it's not the average Joe is not going to. make it happen. >> Yeah. And and Elon Musk has the. unfortunate uh position, Megan, of of.

taking the view of politics that I hold, which is shared by about 3% of the. public, right? Which is that we need to. get our fiscal house in order. um which. involves uh balancing budgets and uh. cutting benefits and reforming social. security. Yeah, no one wants no one. wants to do that. Uh and and so, you. know, Elon Musk is looking at it as an. engineer. Uh but engineers don't make. good politicians. So, um yeah, it could. happen. Uh but I I just think I I don't. want to discount politics as somebody. who writes about it for a living. Well,

I but I'm not even suggesting a third. party run because I mean it maybe you. could get on the ticket by going Green. Party or Libertarian, but I I'm thinking. this will happen within the Republican. party in the fight for and it'll. especially happen if JD chooses not to. run. That's what I mean. He can't run again, but that's that's what has already. happened within the Republican party. That's what 2016 was. looked at all of those people on the. stage, the other 16 people and said, "Yeah, yeah, all of your categories are.

bunk. I'm a populist and common sense. guy and I'm taking over the party." And. I I just. >> I guess what I'm saying is this person. would really mean it. Like this person. really would be a non-interventionist in. across the board. would would definitely. be making an is Israel an issue. >> which it is now for all Democrats, most. independents, some Republicans. >> and run as an economic populist as well. I mean like those three I named I think. all three of them would do it and MTG. too and Thomas Massie was another like I.

anyone could fill this particular niche. and if they do do it JD Vance is going. to have to fend off that challenge more. than a Marco Rubio is almost like I. think there's only one spot for that. this person I want to keep going because. to your point. >> we're gonna have that contest we're. gonna come up with a Republican nominee. and some faction of the GOP is going to. be unhappy. and thinking maybe I'm just. going to sit on my sofa come November. that'll be my middle finger to the world. and then they might see this. I'm going.

stick with you for this Charlie. They. might see this and you tell me if you. were sitting on your couch contrary to. what you just told us your plan your. plans are. You got to you know whatever. two-party system and you saw this would. it get you off the couch and down to. your local polling station. uh SAT 30. this just happened on Tuesday. >> as the governor said is where we should. be unstoppable in knowing that there is. so much that has already been done.

and can be done. >> what make the difference in a way that. builds industries and creates. efficiencies. and creates leadership around helping. the people see what can eaten on a. burned violet. >> It has been. Is she drunk? She sounds. drunk. >> Totally. >> Do you know what that looks like? It. looks like a parody of public access. television from the '9s.

>> The background that they're switching. out the mics even though the mic was. working. >> I don't know. Did they think that the. microphone was making her slur her. words? So, quick get her a new one. >> They thought the mic was the problem. >> She actually needed a coffee. She was. with Arnold Schwarzenegger at a climate. speech in Austria and who the hell knows. what point she was trying to make. If. you listen to the longer version, it. doesn't get any better. But she hasn't. changed, Charlie. She has not changed at. all. You'll be glad to know. And you.

know, people think the reason she's. doing these events is because and the. book and the book tour, she really does. believe she could get out there. So to. your point, that would be a big. motivator no matter who they nominate on. team red. >> Yeah. And and also I mean not to. relitigate the last conversation, but I. think that the parties are not entirely. rational, but they're quite rationally. sorted. Um so what you've described. probably doesn't have enough purchase.

within the Republican party to win the. Republican nomination precisely because. it's so well represented on the other. side. and uh partisanship or negative. partisanship, which I don't think is a. bad thing. Incidentally, I think I I'm. not in favor of mindless partisanship, but you hear this line in our politics. that being against things is bad. You. need to be for things. You should be for. things. I'm for things. Being against. things is also totally fine. It is. totally rational uh and acceptable. within a democracy to say, "I don't want.

that. I don't like that person. I don't. want to change this. I don't want to. increase that tax. I don't want to open. the border." You don't have to be you. don't have to provide some alternative. You can just say no. In fact, it it's. often a sign of great satisfaction. A. lot of uh politics in the 1990s when. people were pretty happy and the economy. was well was just don't do that. Um so I. think she she would provide a massive. don't do that uh for anyone who's on the. center right. >> Whatever you do. Now, while we're on the.

subject of presidential politics, Rich, I've got to ask you about the Obama. library. Okay. You're not going to. believe this. I don't know if you saw. this, but the Obama Library is going to. be the official home of the latest Obama. portrait that has just been unveiled. It. will be hung in the museum's hope and. change lobby. Hope and change lobby. Uh it opens on. Thursday. It's going to cost you a mere. $30 to get in. So, you can see this in.

person. And you will be greeted, wait. until you see this, by a 9x10 foot work. by artist Jadeeka Akuniel Crosby. It's a. drawing. All right. Now, at first blush, I don't. know if you've seen this. You tell me is. does anything jump out at you as a. little off about this portrait which is. for the President Barack Obama Library.

and Museum. Rich, >> are you referring to the figures not. being quite completed toward towards. >> he's sitting at the back? >> He's in the back. >> Oh yeah. Yeah. Michelle, >> she looks like she was president and he. looks like he was first partner as. typical in presidential portraits to. have the first lady with you. Maybe it. is. Yeah. But she's very prominent and. it's so self-important with all the. symbolism. about plants. I know there are certain. plants associated with the Obamas. It's. all about things in her past, you know,

are in the background. Her dad's car. >> Yes. >> All all this stuff. >> And let me tell you, it's not by. accident. Okay, here's the story. Um, this Crosby artiste says the portrait is. about putting Michelle on the same level. as Barack. Quote, I was thinking of a. composition that would not preference. one Obama over the other, but to treat. them equally. It's like, yes, he was the. president and she is this incredible,

powerful, amazing, super respected. person. They are like equal, says the. artist. And that's what's going to greet. you in the hope and change lobby, Rich. >> There you go. Yeah. I know maybe it's. necessary to keep the marriage together. I don't judge other people's marriages, but uh she's a talented artist, this. this lady, but I think the portrait is. is absurd. Now, the likenesses are are. good, but but otherwise, all all the. stuff in the background and it's it's. just way too self-important, but but I. think technically well done, unlike the.

statue. I I I don't know whether you. have an image of of the statue of both. of them. Of course, uh e equal standing. that's going to be part of this Obama. plex, but it's very poorly done. Um you. know, someone said at Lafayette, he was. a statue looking for a pedestal. Maybe. that's true of both Brock and and. Michelle, but uh they're not going to. look very good on their pedestal. >> Here's what um author Joshua Lysk wrote. on X Charlie. that Michelle's in front as you noted.

She's facing the viewer directly. Barack. is in back. Michelle's in the seat of. power. Barack is leaning into Michelle, right? Not like in he's in the. supportive role. Michelle's centered. Barack's offc center. Michelle is in a. more dominant masculine pose with like. the arms out, the elbows out to the. side, you know, like just try it. Just. try it. And um.

and then then he points out that this is. this is not going to help with her. nickname basically. Um but you know, she's in this more masculine pose and. he's in more sort of a feminine on the. table. He doesn't even have a chair. And. yeah, you would think that she were the. president of the United States. And by. the way, you won't be shocked to hear. Michelle is the one who picked this. Crosby for the product, >> saying she's wanted her for to work with. them for for a while now. Now we see. why. >> So, I'm going to get in trouble for. saying this, but she seems to hate him.

Michelle Obama seems to hate Barack. Obama. Like, everything she says on her. podcast. >> is horrible. I mean, she she I'm not. saying, of course, your wife doesn't. view you as the greatest person who's. ever lived because she lives with you. and she knows all of your flaws, but I. mean, he's an intelligent guy. He's a. sort of tall guy. He doesn't seem to. have stepped out in his family. He was. president of the United States twice. But she talks about him like he's a. total You know, the complaint you. hear from men about sitcom dads,

>> that they're always idiots, that there's. never a positive role model in sitcoms. Um, she talks about him a little bit. like that. Um, and it's I I just think. it's weird that that she spends all of. her time on her podcast complaining. about having been first lady, complaining about having been married to. Obama, saying fairly mean things about. Obama, and then they suddenly have a. portrait together for the opening of his. library, and he's in the back. It seems. >> very pretty much selected to be the. sitcom dad, right? That that was his.

role, and he he fulfilled it very very. well. But Obama, you know, I'm not an. Obama fan, but he has a certain swagger. to him, but you would you wouldn't guess. it from that portrait. >> He used to. Yeah, exactly. He used to. And then they showed a picture. They put. out a picture of the two of them looking. at the picture. Um. >> I love this. >> for the first time, I guess, in the hope. and change lobby. And look at this. They're miserable. In the portrait that. was drawn of them, they're they're. smileless. And now the two of them. actually looking at the portrait, they.

are smileless. Like they put this out. They they want to project we're not. joyful. We're kind of pissed off. They're in all black by the way. Like. she's got this long black dress on. He. appears to be wearing a dark suit. Either black or the darkest gray. So the. whole thing is sort of macob rich, which. doveetales perfectly with what we've. heard from him and her since they left. office. You know, her confessional about. how she burst out into tears when she. was in the helicopter leaving the. inauguration of Trump. Um because it was.

just so hard what we expected of them. because they were black. This is a black. reference. >> because they were black. She had to be. perfect, you know, because no other. first lady has ever felt that way. Just. she did because she was black and you. know the racist American people got. lectured to thereafter about how braids. she wore her braids in her first um. portrait in 2022. Um saying, "I did this because I I. wanted I have this in front of me. the I I wanted to send a message. We.

have this as a Yeah, here it is. Okay. Yeah, this is what she said. She's so. burdened. >> As black women, we deal with it. The. whole thing about do you show up with. your natural hair, you know, um braid, y'all, you know, but but you know, as first. lady, I did not wear braids being. the first black. Yeah. Yeah. I I just we. got to ease up on the people, you know, just like cuz I thought about.

it. I was like, it would be easier. Nope. Nope. They're not ready. They're not ready. Whitey is not ready. White racist America. She could take a. lesson rich from the Europeans, from the. German guy touring the country right. now. >> Yeah, it's a it's a lovely place. She. makes it sound as though she's one of. the most victimized people in America. when she's really one of the most. privileged people in America. You know,

working-class upbringing, but great. parents. I love her stories about her. dad given every advantage in and. privilege on her way up in education and. early employment. And then she's a. worldconquering celebrity, not really. having done anything, right? She didn't. start a business. She didn't come up. with any new idea. She was Brock's wife. become quite a skilled communicator, but. uh um that that's not the biggest thing. in the world, right? >> So So are you. >> Yeah. So care about her being a skilled. communicator if she weren't Brock's.

wife. And here she is, you know, in a. painting in the hope and change lounge. and has a statute and everyone's hanging. on her every word. What What is What is. there for her to be unhappy about? >> Can I just add to this because this is. him. This is the thing that annoys me. the most about the Obamas is that the. thing that I liked the most about Barack. Obama is he's black. By which I mean. that I really do think it was a. remarkable and beautiful thing that in. 2008, a country that had had Jim Crow. and slavery elected a black man as.

president. I think that was an. affirmation of the Declaration of. Independence and the American Creed. That's the thing I liked about him. And. then everything else he ever did I. hated. So, it's really quite irritating. being told, "Oh, well, you just did.". You used to get this in the Obama. administration at National Review. People would say, "Well, whatever Obama. does, you'll oppose it." And I wrote. this piece once saying, "Just think. about what you've just said." Do you. really think that if Barack Obama woke. up tomorrow morning and said, "You know. what? I've now realized that my politics. were wrong. I'm now a pro- free market,

pro-life, uh, pro-constitution. conservative. I love the Second. Amendment. for small government and federalism and. I think we should do the Paul Ryan tax. plan. Do you think we'd have gone, oh. no, now we have to be against all of. those things. I mean, it would have been. the greatest day in the world. We'd have. got the champagne out at 11:00 a.m. So, this idea that the reason that people. disliked him was because of that. I just. think it's very annoying. That was the. thing I liked about him the most. >> Here, our our crack team, since we do. cover this beat a fair amount, it's not.

my fault. They keep putting themselves. out there. remember when Barack Obama. went and lectured all the men in in uh. was it middle America about how they. were misogynists if they didn't get. behind Kla Harris? Like they both had. prominent speaking roles at the. Democratic National Convention. He was. out there this week ripping on Trump in. this Iran deal. I like they keep putting. themselves out there. So fine, let's. talk about it. But here to your point, Charlie, is what she said about them. recently. It's one of the reasons why. she's so miserable. And even in my. marriage now, you know, you go through.

the period of I want him to be. different. I want him to do this. differently. I've grown to know I don't. have control over him just like he. doesn't have control over me. So, let me. do my work and let him do our work and. together we come together as whole. people. I go to therapy. We've been in. couples therapy. I believe in the. practice of having those conversations. with objective people who help you piece. through that stuff. And it's a constant.

it's it's constant work. >> Is that how you talk about your wives? Did. >> everyone's in therapy. It's non-stop. work. This. >> Did you notice the construction? She. said, "Let me do my work. Let him do our. work." and then together. >> Not quite sure that came out right. >> I don't I don't think that would fly in. my marriage. I'm not I'm not sure how it. would go in yours. But I'm sure Doug. would really not appreciate me.

constantly being out there telling. everybody all of his flaws, how much. work the marriage is, how I can't stand. him doing this, that, the other, and. never a word of praise. That's the other. thing. She never says, "But he's great. in this way. But he takes such good care. of me. But he made me a household name. No, nothing. Same for our country. Our. country and Barack Obama are in the same. place in Michelle Obama's heart down at. the bottom. Uh with a with a dark hue. around them and u something to be.

disdained. Okay, got to take a break. We're going to come back with Rich and. Charlie and there's plenty more to. discuss. Don't don't go away. Hey, thanks for watching today's full. episode. If you're new here, throw us a. subscribe. See what you think. Stay in. touch. There's plenty more goodness. where this one came from. As always, we. really do value your feedback. So, email. me too. Meganmelly.com. or just leave a comment down below. I do. read them. I meander over and I scroll. through and I find them very. entertaining and really appreciate the. feedback. But in any event, join the.

community by becoming a subscriber so. you miss nothing. We value your support. We may not always agree on positions, but as you know, I'm very open-minded to. people who disagree with me. That's how. I learn. So thanks and thanks for. trusting us to always talk about it. openly, honestly, and with provocative. conversations. For 250 years, Americans. have believed in a powerful idea that we. were meant to live free. Free to work. hard, to move, to enjoy life without. being held back. But if everyday aches.

and pains are slowing you down, it might. be time to declare your independence. from pain. Relief Factor is a 100%. drug-free research-based formula. designed to help your body fight. inflammation, which is one of the root. causes of pain. It's not a quick fix or. a temporary mask. It works from the. inside out, at the source. Relief Factor. was created so people could get back to. living life on their terms, walking, working, exercising, and enjoying the. moments that matter. And I have felt the.

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referred outside of the Obama Library, and at first glance, I didn't know what. you were talking about. It's like the. two of them walking in a walking shot. for the listening audience. They've got. like their arms around each other and. their other their free hands are waving. to imaginary crowds. >> And uh then we zoomed in, Rich. Then we. zoomed in on their faces. And this is. not. >> an accurate. >> or flattering likeness. >> at all. You could argue it's almost. racist, right? If it were done by a.

critic of Obama, you'd say it's it's. racist. He's weirdly elongated his his. arms as well. >> Not the face looks like. >> Ron Howard looks like Ron Howard, >> doesn't it? That was. >> and we zeroed in on her face. And I. don't know who she looks like, but I can. tell you this. It's not Michelle Obama. I maybe Sally Fields.

>> Sally Field. >> Two for two. Two for two. That's what I. was going with, too. >> Right. I don't know. >> I knew some someone once who was uh uh. he he was a fairly wealthy, successful. businessman. He liked art. So, he he got. all these replicas of famous pieces of. of of western paintings, but they're all. done in China. So, so everyone had. slightly slanty eyes. You the Mona Lisa. was slanty eyes. this guy. Yeah, he he must not have been. working off pictures of Michelle and and.

Baracker. I I don't know what happened. >> I mean, at least in these they're. smiling. You would think they'd want to. smile for their official portrait in the. hope and change lobby. Like, you want to. telegraph hopefulness, which is not the. dower, angry, you know, grimace, but it. it was true to life. I'll give him that. Now, um Michelle Obama is kind of in the. news in connection with our next story, which is the meltdown over the UFC event. on the White House lawn continues on the.

left. The latest is from Cheryl Crowe. So, people are mad. They're mad that. that one fighter said Michelle Obama is. a man at the end of his fight. They. don't like that. I get it. That's not a. nice thing to say. And if you're a. Michelle Obama fan, you definitely don't. like it. I mean, it was a joke. whatever. Um, but they're not really mad. about that's not why they're ripping on. this thing. They're mad that UFC. fighters were on the White House lawn. that President Trump had this big event.

that he's in office for the 250th. They're mad about that. They don't want. him as the MC of this celebration. And. that brings me to Cheryl Crowe. So, she. get my readers for this because there's. a lot. She posted the following online. Okay. She said uh she wrote to stay. quiet in response to this means to turn. a blind eye. And so I am saying this. What happened on the lawn of the White. House was disgraceful and void of.

decency. Powerful rich people filled the. lawn to watch a violent sport that ended. with a vile and racist comment. All. while the average American cannot afford. healthcare, gas, and cost of living. Do. not be fooled. This administration is. corrupt and does not give a damn about. the American people. It only cares about. making money handover fist as the at the. expense and in spite of our democracy. If we continue to support this kind of. distraction from reality, we are no. better than them. Let's be better,

America. And it wasn't just Cheryl. Crowe, guys. Um there is. uh a guy posted this on the Daily Wire. It was a great article called Leftists. Hate Americans Who Love America. And he. pointed out that. Mark Tissson, back to Mark, had been. praising the UFC event as Trump opening. the doors to regular Americans, the kind. who enjoy motocross rallies and monster. truck shows. New York Times columnist.

Michelle Goldberg, we've discussed her. before, responded by sneering that if. you're okay with that, you're an elitist. snob in reverse. quote, "Like Ultimate. Fighting, porn is extremely popular, but. I somehow doubt Tissson would defend a. Democratic president who invited a bunch. of Only Fans creators to the Oval Office. while he was losing a war.". Then there's Jim Acasta who had on his. show historian Heather Cox Richardson. who's extremely popular with leftists um.

who said the following quote it's not. really a stretch to say that the same. impulse that created the UFC fight on. the White House lawn is the impulse that. really pushed lynching in the late 19th. century. Wait, we have that on camera? Let's watch that together. In the Gilded. Age, you did not have this open display. of uh denigration of American symbols. and American values. And that, you know,

for all the facts you might have. disagreed with Carnegie about how you. should build up the United States or. with JD Rockefeller, they still argued. that they were offering a way forward. for the United States that would make it. um better for everybody. Now, and they. were quite open about that. that I mean. again you don't have to agree with them. but they at least said that what you are. watching Trump do right now is. deliberately tear that apart and he is. doing so on the same cultural argument. of course that people uh use to back the.

first guilded age that is these cultural. wars that turn white Americans against. marginalized people of color right. >> that's the the bottom line there so I. mean I mean it's not really a stretch to. say that the same impulse that created. the UFC fight on the White House lawn is. the impulse that really pushed lynching. in the late 19th century. >> against black Americans overwhelmingly. >> I love Acasta's reaction.

>> Make it make sense. >> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. >> So wise. Look, we talked about this the. other day in our podcast. I wouldn't do. it. I think it's a little go. I would. just do Easter egg rolls and Christmas. decorations and signing ceremonies. But. we we passed that a long time ago. They. light up the White House for different. colors for different events, etc. And. the imagery around this thing is just. extraordinary. The ones you you showed, they're they're so well done, right? They're so patriotic. And this is a.

mainstream American sport that's. extremely popular. O overtook prize. fighting a long time ago. And it wasn't. just Jeff Bezos there. I know Zuckerberg. was there, but it wasn't billionaires. It was a lot of military guys. and uh. >> a lot of military guys, >> people got tickets through a lottery or. whatever it was. We have a colleague in. in Washington DC who's not a big uh UFC. fan, but managed to go. Her her. boyfriend invited her and had a great. time. And by the way, something that's. been weirdly underappreciated or. underplayed. There was, no kidding,

really serious, as far as we can tell, terror plot around this event to attack. this event. and not just a lone wolf, one crazy person that apparently was a. really serious cell that had a. multi-layered plan to create maym and. and death around event that ultimately, yeah, it's about Trump and glamorizing. himself and doing what he likes. That's. his character and his persona, but also. the flyovers and the flags. It's it's. patriotic imagery that shouldn't be. partisan, but unfortunately is.

>> Yeah. It's just like I what? Slavery and. Jim Crow to have the UFC. >> So, >> okay. What do you think of it, Charlie? >> All of those people are crazy with the. exception of Heather Cox Richardson, who's a disgraceful cynic. Heather Cox. Richardson's job is to tell credulous. upper middle class white women, including Jim Aosta, that their. conception of this president is backed. by the worst parts of American history.

That is what Heather Cox Richardson. does. She finds things from history and. then connects them to what's happening. today and tells people who've never. thought about history in any serious way. that their instincts are correct. Now, I. wouldn't have done this because I don't. want our imperial presidency, you know, my views on this. I'm a Calvin Culage. guy. I would like the president to be. quiet. >> But it didn't matter. I don't like it, but it didn't matter. It's a bit like. the Kennedy Center. I don't think Trump.

should have put his name on it. I think. it's probably illegal, but it's not the. most important thing in the world. Jim. Aosta, did you see the video of him. outside the Kennedy Center when they. were supposed to be taking Trump's name. off it? So, this behavior you've just. seen with this UFC fight is is now. reflexive. Jim Aosta was there late at. night waiting for the construction crew. to take Trump's name off. He's got a. camera on him and he says two things in. quick succession. one he says this is. just like being at the fall of the.

Berlin wall and then he says. >> it's unbelievable. >> and then he says that this shows the. what we can do when mankind and then he. corrects himself and says I mean. humankind because of course you can't. say mankind he says when humankind. stands up to tyranny so the problem is. not people who are criticizing having a. UFC site UFC fight on the lawn and it's. not people who don't think the Kennedy. center should be the Trump Kennedy. center. The problem is the escalation of.

these very small and unimportant things. to that comparing them to Jim Crow and. lynching and the East German walls and. tyranny. I mean it it's it's this is one. reason incidentally I think Trump was. president twice. It's just no one can. ever hold their fire. They can they can. never put what Trump actually does in. context and tell their allies to shut up. about everything else. It's It's just. stupid. >> I mean, well, the whole Kennedy Center.

thing, like, it didn't go well. I I. grant you. But Trump was trying to fix a. center that had been pandering to the. left for decades. All the acts that went. there were Democrats who who had. supported the most recent Democrat in. whatever election we'd had. Um, the. people who got honored every year were. open and committed Democrats. Once in a. rare blue moon, you'd see a. right-leaning person over there, but. almost never. Nothing's coming to mind. I think the reason I mean, yes, Trump. loves to have his name on everything. We.

we all know that about Trump, but I. think he was also trying to telegraph. there's a new sheriff in town. This is. not your grandfather's Kennedy Center. Like, hey, conservatives, give us a shot. because you're going to see your people. here now that we've re renamed it and. Rick Rennell is running it. I was trying. to get the word out, but of course, his. worst detractors always go to the most. negative place with him. It's all about. self agrandisement and I realize with. Trump there is an element of that but. the no credit for just trying to. actually maybe reach out to a wider. audience which again is what he was.

trying to do on the White House lawn. with UFC not in any way some homage to. Jim Crow which is like freaking crazy. talk. Now speaking of Crow uh Cheryl. Crowe this isn't her first foray into. politics. I was at the 2008. um. coronation of Barack Obama at Invesco. Field out in Denver when he accepted the. nomination with the Greek columns, remember? >> And um she was there. She played she so.

she's and so did James Taylor. He's. always at these Democrat things. >> Um but she Wait a minute. Who was the. guest? It was James Patterson came on. the show last Friday and told me that he. worked in a psychiatric facility. And. when he was there, James Taylor was. there as a young man in the psychiatric. facility singing songs. This was before. he was famous. I never really got to. find out what was he doing in the. psychiatric facility. Whatever. Back to. Cheryl Crowe. She posted this video not. long ago on her social media of her.

waving goodbye to her, wait for it, Tesla, remember in 2025. That's crazy. Watch this. Okay. So, now she wants us to understand. like she's the person who's going to be. the spokesperson rich for like. workingass Americans and their plight.

And that's why this whole thing was so. inappropriate at the White House. >> Meanwhile, she waved goodbye to her what. $70,000 $60,000 automobile. >> because of the politics perceived of the. owner of the company. Not Not many. people can do that. >> Yeah. Your car shouldn't be political. If it's a wonderful car, if you liked it. enough to to buy it, it's quite pricey. enough that it price matters to her. It's probably subsidized by by the. government. Wh why are you getting rid. of it just because you don't like Elon. Musk? And and and by the way, that the.

idea that Cheryl Crowe is lecturing us. about how a UFC fight isn't workingass. You know, who someone who's never been. to a a UFC fight, whereas this is a. sport that indeed has a lot of. working-class appeal. It just it just. gets to how this celebrity politics is. so twisted and so out of touch. You. know, another element of the Obama plex, Obama library thing we could hit on. He's got legit like A-list singing. talent performing at at the opening or. whatever it is, right? In a way that. Trump never could score. So, it's always.

good for them putting on shows, but it. also misleads them because they think. that's the real world and they think. people actually listen to what those. people say and follow their political. directions and they just they just don't. ever. >> It's a very good point. Let's talk about. that terror plot that was thwarted. because that really was disturbing. I. like I hate to draw too much attention. to it because you don't want to give. anybody ideas. Um, but I mean to me it's. part of the just assassination culture.

that we're sadly living in in 2026. America. Um, the this is from CNBC. Tyson Proper, 19-year-old Ohio man. charged in connection with an alleged. plot to attack the UFC event at the. White House on Sunday. uh citing court. documents, investigators said the. alleged plan involved explosiveladen. drones near the arena and shooters who. were then going to target people as they. fled. Um there's some scuffle between. the Secret Service and Cash Patel at the. FBI. They're mad he quote jumped the gun.

on disclosing details of what had been a. sealed and continuing investigation. But. in any event, the FBI disrupted the. alleged plot, thank thankfully. And uh. it says that it was a a detailed plan. that these guys had with these drones. and so on. Um let's see, the complaint. was signed June 12th, 2 days before. Trump hosted the event. So they were on. to these people. They never actually got. onto the White House South Lawn. But. they report that a search of this guy.

proper's iPhone revealed encrypted group. chats that laid out detailed plans to. conduct an attack on DC with several. unidentified Confederates and um that it. was rather sophisticated. It forced it. was going to force spectators and quote. high value targets to evacuate again. where they would then be shot. They. thought this would be a jump start of a. revolution in the United States. I don't. know, guys. This is like. this is dark. And the the drone.

technology, you know, >> sadly, that's what they used in Iran. We're seeing it used by the Ukrainians. to fight Russia. And I guess it's just a. matter of time before we see it. unleashed on innocents domestically in. some piece of this assassination culture. or the latest iteration of mass terror. events here. Your thoughts on it? Well, well, it's awful. You know, with I. oppose all violence, obviously, but it's. at a diff different level than.

assassination, right? Because they're. not even targeting Trump. They're just. targeting people who happen to be at. this event that Trump has sponsored, totally innocent people. Not that Trump. obviously, but but the the uh turpitude. of it is horrible. And then, you know, we have to learn more. But the what. seems to be the the sophistication of at. least the planning, we have seen a. couple of these. There's there's one a. year or so ago that didn't get a ton of. attention down in Texas where there's. kind of a protrans anti-ICE cell and.

this was seven or eight young people who. like this. It was kind of elaborate. They they uh staged some sort of. disturbance in the parking lot to in the. hopes the ICE guys would run out of the. facility and then they shot at them from. from the woods. So, this is no kidding. domestic terrorism. And I think you're. right. It's only a matter of time till. something like this succeeds, but it's. it's an ongoing threat. >> and it is like further evidence that I. the FBI in particular has has had a.

black eye over the past few years and I. know you're no fan of it either, Charlie, but there is a role for federal. law enforcement uh in and this is. exactly what that role is, by the way. >> Well, and and especially in Washington. DC, which is a federal district. So you. would have to have some sort of federal. law enforcement there. Whatever you did. with the FBI, I mean that you uh. mentioned the part of this that scares. me the most, which is drones. I'm a. technophile. I think drones can be very. useful, but they are going to force us,

if we haven't already, to rethink. security. And if you take the obvious. example of an NFL stadium or Disney. World, these are protected. assuming there are no drones. I mean, the assumption is that you have to keep. people who might do harm out of the. perimeter and so you act accordingly. But a drone just flies up, drops in. And. uh the United States is really virtuous.

in the way it treats its airspace. We're. very open society compared to most. We. don't have draconian restrictions on. airspace in most places. Uh and pretty. much anyone without having to file. permission slips can get in an airplane, take off and land at any airport. providing uh they radio the tower. Well, uh drones complicate this. And uh I just. hope and I know nothing about this of. course, but I hope that the security.

services have cottoned on to this. because there's a difference between. stopping a plot like this before it. happens because you hear about it or you. infiltrated or you intercept the. messages and stopping this happening. once it has been put into motion. And I. really don't want to see what that. latter circumstance looks like. >> Yeah, I agreed. I I was we were on. vacation with our family three or four. years ago and u the last leg we were in. France of the tour brought us to this.

beautiful resort on a hillside and I was. out there in the morning having my. coffee and it's the morning so I just I. have my robe on and that's it. Um no. hair, makeup, whatever. It's vacay and. sitting there enjoying myself having a. moment of zen with a beautiful view in. France. up comes a drone right over me. and you don't know. >> what it is who it is. >> who's controlling it. You know, my my. suspicion at the time was like.

paparazzi, right? Cuz like if they get. wind that you're on vacation, they've. taken pictures of my family and me. before and then the next thing you know. your vacation is public and you never. know who you're telegraphing to. But. like, who wants to be spied on and have. their pictures splashed all over. newspapers. at during their morning coffee while on. vacation? It's just like, and that's to. say nothing of the actual security risks. of these things. If they're carrying. something dangerous, some makeshift pipe. bomb, what have you, it's just yet.

another thing we're going to have to. deal with as we move into, you know, further into the 21st century. Um, oh, joy. Hopefully, you're a technopile, Charlie. Hopefully, we'll find a like. sort of Iron Dome ways. >> for America of not stopping this. Certainly at places like a Disneyland or. Disney World where like you can't like. there's some sort of imaginary wall. there that's manned by lasers, etc. That's too smart for these guys. That's. my hope. I, you know, technology should.

help us in this situation more than it. hurts us. Um, okay. Want to keep going. We mentioned these people who hate. America who we were talking about like. the whatever the ones who can't stand. the USC and think it's an example of. modern day slavery whatever it is that. is contrasted as I pointed out with. these Europeans who are coming through. for the World Cup. I heard you guys. discuss this on the editors too. They're. so joyful. It's so great to listen to. these guys because they're experiencing. our country, experiencing our country. for the first time. And so it gives you.

the chance to see some of the things we. take for granted. through fresh eyes and it's wonderful. And wokeness online put together a. montage of some of these guys. Watch SAT. 23B. >> Everybody's so friendly. Southern. hospitality. The air smells nice. >> When you're in the UK, okay, if you're. next to the beach, it smells. The beach. doesn't smell here, right? >> No. Everything's for you. >> Yeah. I want to talk to you, too.

>> I can refill this a thousand times. >> Yeah, but you won't drink 1,000 cups of. co and it's free. >> You paid for it. You paid it. >> once. >> Bro, slow down. >> Free refills. >> It's the best burger. Honestly, it's so. good. And then I also got the animal. style fries. and burger diet lemonade for balance.

It's pink. >> I just love it here. Like and they give. to fight human trafficking which is. awesome. They have Bible verses on the. bottom of their cup. Never. if you can see. But yeah, look at that. burger. It's so good. And then we've got. the sunset. I love America. I can never. leave. >> The German guy, he's been amazing. I.

think it was, is that the guy who was on. Jake Tapper? The the German guy, you. guys? Yeah, we'll watch a little. He. went on Jake Taber South 22. >> What do you make of all the viral. content coming out of this tournament. and and all the love for the European. tourists uh from the American people as. you show us our country with fresh eyes? Yeah, I mean I know Freddy, he's a nice. guy. He's from he's from like close to. me. So I've been talking to him. He's. loving it. He's more touring the south. I did Chicago and I think it's more like.

because in Europe we have a lot of um. rather negative news about the Americans. in the last 5 years. Let's say that. And. I think we are all enjoying like the. fact that this country is so great to. visit. The people are amazing, so. welcoming. The culture is amazing. It's. like Europeans are getting a new view of. America right now. I think through also. through our continent. That's cool. I. think. >> so. This has just been so great, right? Because it's like they're seeing places. like Waffle House, which I know that's. that's down by you in Florida, right, Charlie? Waffle House. We don't have.

those really up by me. Bies, >> and and they're falling in love with how. big and like the the facilities are, the. offerings, the the meals, and so on. And. it's like I've seen a lot of people say. this online and I totally second it. which is wait till you get a load of our. diners. Wait until you get a load of. like the corner bar, the corner pub, Charlie Cook, that's your favorite. place. Like the real America too. Like. once you dig a little deeper has all. that charm and more. And the the.

testimonials about the people have been. so great. Just how friendly they are. How they Americans they make eye. contact. They offer to help you if you. ask for directions. They they'll walk. you to the next spot. There was a French. guy being like, "This does not happen in. France." Uh, trust me. So, it's ah it's. just such a feel-good moment, Charlie. >> Yeah. So, I I love this because this is. how I feel, of course, as well. But the. thing that I like the most about it is. less that Americans who didn't like.

America to start with is seeing people. like America. uh they should have. already known but the the Europeans who. are coming here are having the. propaganda they've been sold wiped away. I couple of weeks ago was in New York. and we took the kids to the Statue of. Liberty in Ellis Island and there's this. plaque there and it has a story on it of. a woman from Russia and uh she said that. when she went up to a cop when she first. moved to the United States, she was.

shocked that he didn't hit her because. they'd been told in the Soviet Union uh. that that's what American cops would do, right? It was supposed to be this sort. of barbaric place. And it's not quite on. that level, but I really must implore. Americans to understand that what. Europeans are told about America all the. time by the news, but also by. entertainment is relentlessly negative. It bears no resemblance to what America. is actually like, to what Americans are.

actually like. And so when the German. guy in that clip says, you know, what we. have heard in the last 5 years is very. negative. Yeah, it will have been. it. will have been everywhere. And then to. come to the United States and see what. it's actually like uh must be absolutely. astonishing. In one way, it must. completely rewire your worldview. I I. saw an English guy on Twitter yesterday. who ended up in an American hospital. I. don't think he did anything stupid, but. he just he needed to use a hospital. while he was here. And he was amazed too. because I think what he'd been told is.

either we don't have any or that they. take your credit card when you walk in. and you know all everyone in there uh is. is sort of corrupt or redneck. I don't. know what he thought but but he said it. was a really nice hospital. I had a. really good visit to the hospital and I. thought well yeah cuz you're in a very. technologically advanced innovative rich. country uh which is actually ahead of. most of Europe uh in its technology in. medicine. So, it's just great to watch. this because the only way you can really. get past all of that negative propaganda.

is to come and visit yourself. >> You know, Rich, it's kind of reminding. me um just because I'm in the middle of. this, I I for for some reason I decided. to order and read the autobiography of. Katherine Heppern. Um I just always. thought she was cool and I wanted to. know more about her. She was born in. 1907 and uh she was one of six, second. child, was raised in Connecticut, where. I live now, and was the daughter of a.

suffragette, like remembers actively. campaigning for women to get the vote. Anyway, she came up at a time that. wasn't great, I would say, versus today. for women, you know, like she didn't. quite have the same right. She couldn't. even vote. Her parents, her mother. couldn't vote when she was a child. >> Zero complaints. Mhm. >> She had an attitude which I've been. talking to Doug about like every page is. like life is so amazing. It's so. exciting. There's so many opportunities. >> And she loved Connecticut. Loved love. love love. I love the change of seasons.

too. But it's like she she talks about. it like all the things that are so. beautiful about it. And sometimes you. need that reminder whether it's from a. book like this or our German friend or. the people from France, what have you, >> of how lucky you are just in the amazing. gifts that are all around you just by. virtue of the fact that you won the. lottery and were born in the United. States of America. >> Totally. This guy Freddy, what a trek. he's on. He was he was posting videos. yesterday of getting a tour of the. Artemis rocket. I mean, someone's going. to make a movie.

It's it's unbelievable. But yeah, there's they're they're stunned, especially given, as Charlie points out, what they hear from the European press, which is all guns, violence, you know, things they don't like about Trump, to. come here in this land that's so. abundant, that's so open, that's so. convenient, that's so friendly. And. you're so right that none of us created. any of this really. Some of us have done. our little bits, you know, across our. careers or whatever, but it was. bequeathed to us by being Americans,

right? And one of the most depressing. things about the country last week or. two, we've had this polling, this NBC. poll over the weekend. It shows pride in. the country. People are extremely very. proud of America is down, I think, a new. low 56% if you had those two categories. up. And the the Democrats numbers are. just in the toilet. You This kind of. goes back to the Michelle Obama. conversation. You should just be so. filled with gratitude for being here in. this country at this time and place. And. if it takes Europeans coming over here.

and discovering free refills and that. you can actually get ice in your soda to. to remind us of it, so be it. It's a. great thing. >> Yeah. Amen. It I I want to see way more. of all of these guys. It's just a great. reminder. And I love the things that. they're pointing out because they are. great. You know, it's like it is. amazing. You go to the Waffle House, like whatever your h heart desires, it's. right there. and the all you can eat. buffets. It's like you could keep going. And honestly, for me too, having spent.

the last 17 years in Manhattan, so many. wonderful little shops less thanks to. Delasio and now Mom Donnie. It's really. I can't blame mom Donnie. It was really. Bill Delasio tried to ruin New York. But. those mom and popop shops, those small. delies, the bakeries, the small shops. that you know the shopkeepers put up, whether they're bookstores or clothing. stores, just so much charm, so much. character. Uh I love that stuff about. our big cities as well. We don't we. don't have the European age uh in terms.

of the buildings and so on. And not all. of our modern architecture is that. beautiful, but man, we have culture. galore and it's it's ours. It's uniquely. ours. So, all right, we're going to take. a quick break. We're going to come back. There's a lot more to discuss. Don't go. anywhere. When it comes to your dogs, why does there always seem to be a. compromise when we're talking about. their food? It's either fresh and. healthy or easy to store and surf. With. Sundays for dogs, you get both, and your. dog gets the best. Founded by Dr. Tory.

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visiting simplysafe.com/megan. That's simply spelled s i m p l. i.com/megan. There is no safe like simplysafe. So guys, there's been a controversy. involving um the San Francisco Giants. Rich, you're the baseball fan. Okay. I. knew it was San Francisco and uh they of. course it being San Francisco and this. was happening in like a lot of MLB not. too long ago. They decided to recognize.

Pride Month by making the SF on the caps. um rainbow. Taste the rainbow as they. say. And a couple of players decided, they didn't, you know, object, but they. added a reference to a Bible verse that. actually does talk about rainbows. It's. um Genesis 9:12-16. The verse reads as follows. And God. said, "This is the sign of the covenant. that I make between me and you and every.

living creature that is with you for all. future generations. I have set my bow in. the cloud, and it shall be a sign of the. covenant between me and the earth. When. I bring clouds over the earth, and the. bow is seen in the clouds, I will. remember my covenant that is between me. and you and every living creature of all. flesh. And the water shall never again. become a flood to destroy all flesh. When the bow is in the clouds, I will. see it and remember the everlasting. covenant between God and every living. creature of all flesh that is on the. earth. So, this is obviously some.

Christian players deciding to reframe. what the rainbow that was forced upon. them in those letter in those letters. means to them, which seems perfectly. reasonable. They didn't get to decide. whether they had their logo changed. And. here was the reaction from the worst. person in America. Truly, this guy is my. least favorite.

>> politician or soontobe American um US. congressman. He's going to win Nancy. Pelosy's old seat. Scott Weiner, the. vile, awful Scott Weiner. Here's his. response. Oh, sorry. No, it's written. This is those are actually old Those are. actually old um quotes from him. I'll. find it. But he is angry. Where is this? Is this an AM update, you guys? Trying. to find it. Um, he's very pissed off.

that they've done this and he thinks the. San Francisco Giants need to do. something about this, that they need to. crack down somehow on these players. I'll find it. And until I do, Rich, your. thoughts? >> Yeah. So he said something like, "Of all. days, why why couldn't they have done. this on some other the 364 other days. rather than writing this Bible verse on. this day on on Pride night, which gets. totally wrong who the aggressor is here, right? They they these players are being. made to wear a social and political.

symbol that they don't support that's. counter to their Christian values. So, it's a form of enforced speech and this. is their descent from that enforced. speech. So, look, if you're San. Francisco Giants, you're probably going. to have a pride night. You know, I. wouldn't do it. I I don't particularly. like it, but changing the uniform and. making that a symbol. NHL teams have. done this as well. That that's a step. beyond. It's it's making these people. ascent to it. And that's at the end of.

the day, that's a big part of the the. point here. There's a council member out. there who had a a a tweet thread thread. on X where he was saying if you're not. okay with this and you're causing so. much dissension on the team that you're. writing your Bible verse or one of these. guys just wore the traditional cap. rather than wearing the rainbow cap, maybe you don't belong in the major. leagues. Like how how crazy and. despicable ill and authoritarian is. that? These guys work their whole lives, literally since they were kids, to get.

highly proficient at this uh sport. that's extremely difficult to perform at. the highest level. And they're not. supposed to play for a major league team. unless they're on board with rainbow. symbols. And these guys, they are taking a career. risk because two or three years ago, there's a Blue Jays pitcher who just. liked an Instagram post. Remember there. was a anti-target. uh boycott having to do with this this. sort of stuff. And he was literally cut. from the team from again a guy named.

Anthony Bass. >> That is crazy. All right, I found it. Here's what he said. Uh he's criticizing. the Giants and the several players who. he claims defaced their Pride Night ball. caps with a biblical passage that the. the biblical passages defaced the Pride. messaging. Unbelievable, Charlie. He. goes on to say, uh, several players. deface their pride caps with a biblical. passage that has been hijacked by.

homophobes to take back the rainbow from. LGBTQ people. I'm pretty sure he's got. the order of events wrong. >> I just think the argument in general is. disingenuous. The argument runs a little. bit like this, that it's a private. institution. It sort of is. uh they do. have a federal exemption from antitrust. law but it's a private institution and. uh this is the uniform and if you play. for the team then you wear the uniform.

Okay, sounds innocuous enough but the. next step is well there's nothing wrong. with adding the pride night uh. paraphernalia to the uniform because. it's a constitutional right. Okay. Uh, well, so's the Second Amendment, but if. a team put, you know, Second Amendment. stuff on their uniform and then told. everyone to wear it. I I think some. people would would disagree. They would. descent. That's fine. Um, and the same. people who are now complaining would say.

that that was their free speech right. That's why you don't do this, right? That's why you shouldn't accept in. extreme circumstances something that. genuinely ought to be completely. unifying and uncontroversial like you. know America 250 or July 4th patch or. something. That's why you just shouldn't. do this as institutions. And as Rich. says there is a big difference between. hosting a theme night whether that's. pride night or not and changing the. uniform. It's the uniform part of this.

uh that makes this a bit ugly. Then. Major League Baseball saying that. there'll be consequences uh for further. altering uh the uniform. I I think that. and I say this as somebody who's pretty. progay and has always been in favor of. gay marriage, although I thought the. Supreme Court decision in a burger fell. was a disaster and is wrong, but I'm not. somebody who is is hostile uh toward gay. people. But I think some of the. skepticism you're seeing not just toward. Pride Month but toward gay marriage uh. that has popped up in the last five.

years a reversal of approval of such. things is the product of exactly this. sort of conduct because the winning. argument was why do you care? You do. your thing, we'll do our thing. Let's. leave each other alone. that prevailed, that was quite popular. And now there's. a lot of coercion and you get. representatives saying that this is a. disgrace and you get people calling for. Major League Baseball to kick these. people out. And I think people hate it. and I think they should.

>> Yeah. You will celebrate my thing. That's that's the new messaging. You you. must uh Okay, got to get this in before. we leave. Emily Rodikowski, she's a model. She's got she's an. actress, too. She was in Gone Girl. She. uh has 28 million Instagram followers. and she's out now with um this new. magazine piece in New York magazines The. Cut and it's entitled Mother Effer.

After being a after becoming a single. mom, I began compulsively dating in. order to figure out what kind of woman I. wanted to be. The cover of the piece. shows her topless. She's got a top on, but it's open and her breasts are. hanging out and it looks like a real. baby, but we're told it's actually a. doll who she has posed as though he's. breastfeeding off of one of her breasts. And the whole piece is about how after. she gave birth to her son, um, six months later,

she and her husband stopped having sex. and she became the thing she never. wanted to be, which was a single mother. And she writes about this process in the. most vile and crude terms. I mean, honestly, like I don't I don't even know. if I can read her description of having. her son. She makes it so disgusting and. awful. You know, it's like that's not I. think most women remember some pain. around the birth, but like when you ask.

them about the birth, they might say, "Oh yeah, I was in a lot of pain." But. then the very very next thing they'd say. is how wonderful the baby is and what. it's like to become a mother and the. miracle of that first moment. That's not. really how she describes it. She's. talking a lot about what happened um. down south in Rio that needed to be. mended up later after the fact. So, she. talks now about how she um. she's now become a really is that. that's what she's decided to do to as a. soothing bomb, I guess. And talks about.

how she never had had a one night stand. prior to her separation, but now she. wants to be a I decided to f my. way into a new kind of woman. I wanted. to destroy the Madonna, the special girl. I'd worked so hard to be before an. eight-pound baby had torn my vagina in. two, and replace her with the And. she's celebrating how now she goes to. bed with anyone, but she does make it. home in time for her son to wake up at. 6:00 a.m., no matter how many martinis.

she's had and how many men she's had. And I guess Rich, we're supposed to. celebrate this as a an example of female. empowerment. And by the way, it's from. the same woman who wrote a whole thing. about how she hates hates being se. sexually objectified by men, contrary to. the photos you're seeing on your screen, which you would be forgiven for. misunderstanding as a desperate request. to be objectified. >> Yeah, this is clearly a luxury.

lifestyle. I don't think this is a. reaction of most people to becoming. single moms as as having this uh. extraordinary run of promiscuity as she. describes it. Also, most people don't. have available to them just being able. to go out to to to bars and sleep around. and someone else uh some unnamed person. is watching their children. It's also. kind of laughable when she says that. what what these guys find attractive. about her is actually her motherhood. It. it turns out I I'm not sure that's what. they're they're really attracted to. here. So, so, so this is is bizarre and.

unworthy and let's hope she has enough. wisdom 10 years from now, whatever, is. to look back at this piece and and and. her behavior and be ashamed. Let's hope. her. >> can I say, Charlie, like shame on the. cut for running this. It's like young. girls who don't have Emily Emily's. followers on Instagram or her money or. her name. Sadly, some faction of them. may be inspired by this. Like, oh yeah, she seems much happier now. in her own. words, becoming a.

>> Maybe I should try it. >> Well, I agree with you. I'm not sure you. can put shame on The Cut. The Cut is a. source of the most crazy and silly. stories of the last 5 years. Um, you. remember that story in The Cut about the. lady who put $50,000 in a shoe box. because she got some scam text message. >> That was a great one. You and I. discussed that. >> Yeah. But she she she was like a finance. writer. She was like a financial advice. writer. So the cut really does find.

these these stories and and and puts. them out there. So I sort of expect it. from them. The the the bad behavior is. more from her. Um and uh I I re I really. don't know much much more to say than. that, Megan. I think we all. instinctively agree it's gross. >> Um yeah, I'm just looking at their. headlines right now. The Obamas still. believe in hope and change. Um, let's. see. How does Kalista Gingrich's hair do.

that? I mean, that's a legitimate. question. My first orgasm cost $10,000. >> That's why she put 50 grand in a shoe. box. >> Wrote a book to convince you his wife. doesn't hate him. That's basically what. you're going to get over there. What you. say? >> They said if it's $10,000 in orgasm, she. put $50,000 in a shoe box. Maybe that. piece now makes more sense. Did you see the picture of Kalista? >> I'm not even sure we get to 10 grand. >> A picture of Kalista and Trump the other. day with their hair looking exactly the. same. >> Yes. It doesn't blow.

>> It's amazing. >> You know what Kalista Gingrich's hair. reminds me of? My friend and former. makeup artist Moren used to say this. Fondant on a wedding cake. >> Totally. Uh-huh. >> You know. >> Yeah. >> It's not real icing. It's just like this. weird thing that doesn't ever move. And. she's had it like that for decades. I've. never seen a hair out of place. Like in. the whipping winds, it holds. Like she. should be working with NASA, Rich. >> Same with Trump. Trump's occasionally.

moves. It's bad when it moves, but it. but it usually doesn't. >> It's true. I don't I feel like um. Michelle Obama thinks we're obsessed. with her braids and we're not. And. Kalista Gingri doesn't think we care. about her hair and we do, you know, like. it it's actually something to be. respected honestly. Guys, great to see. you. Everybody, go subi sign sign up for. NR and become a premium member like I. am. You won't be sorry you did.