Georges St-Pierre: The Science of Fighting | Lex Fridman Podcast #179

the following is a conversation with. george st pierre considered by many to. be the greatest fighter in the history. of ufc and mma but even more than that. one of the greatest martial artists ever. quick mention of our sponsors all form. expressvpn. blinkist theragun and the information. check them out in the description to. support this podcast as a side note let. me say that getting the chance to hang. out with george talk to him on the.

podcast record a quick self-defense. video that i'll release soon all while. both of us wearing suits was one of the. most memorable days of my life. in setting all this up i talked to joe. rogan and originally we couldn't. schedule a chat with him and george on. the jre. which allowed me to pretend for a brief. time that george came down to austin. just to see me. who the hell am i. in truth him and joe probably conspired. to make me feel special but that's the.

point it's inspiring to see george and. joe. who are at the top of their field treat. others as equals as human beings no. matter who they are. even silly russians in a suit. meeting george was an honor for me. beyond words. this is a lex friedman podcast and. here's my conversation with my long time. martial arts hero and now my friend. mr george sampire. in your fighting career where you're.

more motivated by the love of winning. or the fear and hatred of losing i like. to win better than i hate to lose. because if it would not have been the. case. i would never have fought in the first. place because i don't like to fight at. all. but you talked about the anxiety the. fear that you experience leading up to a. fight so. to you ultimately the reason to go. through that.

difficult process is because it feels. damn good to have your hand raised. there is that there is also the fact. that. martial art i've been introduced when i. was very young and it's probably the. best. thing i can do in my life fighting it's. that's what i do best. also it provides me. of freedom. of access of things that. most of people do not have.

but all that as a price and a lot of. money i made a lot of money of course. with it. i was. maybe predisposed with certain abilities. i. met incredible mentors. throughout my life. i worked really hard. and of course i had a lot of chances the. the stars were all aligned. and. in order to to kept keep that those.

advantages. of freedom money and glory and excess of. things that most people don't have and. have the these. dream life that i have. i had to sacrifice myself and fight in. order to keep it. it's very hard to understand. because i also believe most fighters are. not like me. they a lot of guys because i. corner a lot of guys and it seems to me. that they love their job they enjoyed.

to to go fight in a cage i love to train. i love the science of fighting the sport. the to to be in good shape the. confidence that training in mixed. martial art give me. however i do not like the feeling. of uncertainty the stress. that i have. not knowing if i will be. badly injured. or. humiliated or. winning the fight it's to me unbearable.

and it. that's what takes the most out of me. more than brain damage more than. anything that's what takes the most out. of me. but the thing you get from it is the. freedom. that you get. because uh because of the money but. because of the celebrity because of. everything that comes with it so you can. be the best version of yourself because. of fighting but at the same time you've. said that. quote i don't believe there's pleasure. in life. i believe there's only a relief from. pain we have to suffer to be on top.

so isn't there something to just the. suffering in itself just doing really. difficult shit just to get to the top. to explain that and so people can relate. to it because not everybody is a fighter. i think. the best example i can. [Music]. gives is. let's say you're. you haven't eat for a long time and. you're craving right so you're suffering. and then when it's time to eat finally.

you're about to eat your favorite dish. it's gonna taste so much better. so that's why i believe. there's always a some sort of sacrifice. before the pleasure and the more. sacrifice you do. like they say in fighting the bigger the. risk. bigger is the reward and i feel that's. that's how it is for me yeah i feel that. with uh i've started fasting a little. bit in the past couple of years and uh. there's nothing as amazing.

as a delicious meal or anything actually. anything any food when you haven't eaten. for several days it's it's kind of. incredible uh it's not incred it's not. incredible in this simple way of finally. i get to eat. it's you get to truly experience the the. beauty of of. what it is to be alive like that little. piece of food you see. all the flavors. you you you feel just the experience of. it is uh ultimately.

of gratitude of how awesome it is to be. alive. but when you eat many times a day and. you're pigging out and. you don't get to experience that and. it's fascinating it's re it's really. like fasting. is one of the most accessible things for. people i think to experience that kind. of. uh pairing of hardship to pleasure. i agree and. in my case it changed my life on a good. good way i cannot recommend it to people. because everybody is different. but.

after my. to to fight michael bisping my last. fight was against uh. the champion in the heavier weight class. that i used to compete at so. i thought that. if i would gain weight. it would increase my performance yeah. and i struggled a lot to gain weight i. gained a lot about eight to 10 10 pounds. normally i walk around 185 pounds and. for that fight i was walking around 195. however.

i forced myself to eat like six times a. day i was on a very. strict diet and i didn't feel. it didn't feel right to me because. i feel like i. i was carrying like a little bit like i. was carrying a bag on my shoulder. and. i think it was a bad idea for me. because when i. did the weight the weigh-in and i i go. went on a scale at 185 i couldn't go.

back to my initial weight that was 180. 195 that i worked so hard for several. months to get there. so i was 190 pounds but i couldn't get. back and the morning of the fight i i i. got i got sick i had like uh. we didn't know what what it was and the. beginning. because in order to know to find out. what it was i needed to do what they. call a colonoscopy they put a camera. inside of you and to do that. they give you um.

[Music]. something that makes that empty you and. i was trying to gain weight not to lose. weight. so i i told myself. i'm gonna wait after the fight whatever. it is because it was pretty bad it was. blood and i i didn't know what i was i. was very concerned concerned i thought i. had maybe cancer i was freaking out. so i said i'm gonna do that fight and. then after right away i'm gonna make a. checkup so i did that fight everything. went well i won the fight i went back. home i did a colonoscopy and i i got.

diagnosed with ulcer colitis. then i got on very severe medication. to get better and i'm not a big fan of. medication i was trying to look for more. natural way to to. to get better and i found out about. fasting. and. it really changed my life i met dr jason. fong. was one of the. one i'm one of the world authority of. fasting he treat diabetes patient with.

fasting. and he gave me a program of fasting. and. it really changed my life and right away. what i did is i went in in a cat scan. to see the difference because it was. right after my fight with michael. bisping and i i did the cat scan so i. had. my uh muscle mass bone density uh fat. percentage water retention it's pretty. amazing it can show you which harm has. more muscle than it than the other it's.

very precise and i did it like uh two. two months after. yeah so i i started doing um time. restricted eating uh sixteen eight but. right that right away. when i started i did three days water. fast and the doctor jason funk says. because i like to train during those. days. i cons i consume himalayan salt to make. sure because when you sweat there's a. lot of minerals to to make sure you. don't depleted your mineral. and um.

when i went when i compare the two. results in the cat scan i found out my. biggest concern was to lose muscle mass. i found out that i did not lose muscle. mass instead of losing it i it increased. a little bit. even though my. weight on the scale. was lighter. i i kept the same muscle mass even. increases a little bit my bone density. increases a little bit. my water retention is the biggest thing. that decrease so the my inflammation and.

my fat percentage so basically the. by looking at the data i found out that. by eating. so much trying to gain weight for to. fight michael bisping i only increases. my water retention which is not good. because it's like dead weight and. inflammation on you. so what uh. was the actual process of fasting she. said 16 8. time restricted so intermittent fasting. but you also mentioned the three out of.

the three day water fast what did that. feel like and you also said training. during the three day yeah how did that. feel oh can you give me some details of. absolutely this is fascinating so i do. three days water fast. uh four times a year nice for me i do it. everybody is different but for me i do. it after uh new year's because during. the the early days that's when i i eat. bad foods and i drink i see it more like.

a like a cleansing you know like a like. like a detox so to speak mental too like. psychologically yes i do it. after the new years right before the. summer. cut for the beach yeah. yeah yeah after the summer because of. the summer i've been partying a little. bit sometime let myself go and right. before the the holidays. and um. i've tried the doc dr fungi says to me. say george everybody is different. because i'm a very active person and. everybody has a different genetics so so.

for me i i feel that. three days is the sweet spot. because i still train during those three. days the first day the first two days i. don't change nothing i i train regularly. on every on my regular schedule however. on the on the third day. i modify a little bit i i do something. more. [Music]. more easy. and that's how i do it and i've tried. before because i when i say three days. is my sweet spot i've tried to go up to.

five days but the problems is after my. third days i i found out that i had a. big problem sleeping i i get into a. hyperactive mode yeah they call that the. hunter-gatherer uh. mode you know like you you you you your. brain i mean it's amazing your. creativity is at its peak. but you cannot sleep very well and. sleeping. for me i think it's very important so. that's why i do three days for me it's. my sweet spot that's interesting you're.

right it's the four or five days when. you start. see sleep is not important for me so the. creativity is really important so it's. very interesting with the places your. mind goes after a few days you're right. but uh. i mean what does it do to your mind so. you mentioned your body likes it in. terms of training does it um. do you find that it helps you focus and. think i mean you're one of the. great strategic thinkers in terms of. martial arts does it help with learning. does it help with thinking does it help.

with strategizing and all that well. unfortunately i got into fasting. after i retired i wish i would have i. really wish people. asked me would you have done it during. the time that you competed and the. answer is yes. i think we live in a society that. we're bombarded by publicity oh buy this. eat protein. this that and. fasting nobody makes money with it. because there's nothing to sell you know.

i think that's why. a lot of people have not heard about it. and even my for myself if someone would. have talked to me about fast the. benefits of fasting. when i was training before i got sick i. would probably have ignored. ignored him because it i'm not you know. it was. it's hard to believe sorry it sounds. ridiculous. yes it's going to help your mind and. you're going to gain muscle potentially.

exactly and and. perhaps people have talked to me about. it but i kind of it went in one of my. hair and got out from the other side you. know. but uh it really changed my my life and. dying i i was diagnosed with ulcer. colitis and. it helps me get rid of all my symptoms. what i do is i know a lot of people have. ulcer colitis and and. for me i cannot recommend it to to other. people because everybody is it's. different but for me.

i made a a lot of research of how people. from those circulations got better and i. found out that a lot of people that got. that condition. get better in the natural way fasting. eating fermented food collagen. and like bone broth and stuff all i got. and it made a huge difference in my life. i just wish i would have known that. before so do you have a specific diet. wise. stuff you like so you know i've recently. another ridiculous sounding thing but it.

makes me feel really good it's very low. carbs so. you know keto even carnivore it sounds. ridiculous it doesn't make any sense but. it makes me feel really good even for. performance. is rogan has an influence you know he's. a no carnivore diet i was influenced. actually by people yeah well he. there's i'll tell you where cause i was. doing it before he was doing it uh is. there's it was uh popular in the. endurance athlete community. where it was fat adapted athletes it's.

people who insane people who run 50. miles 100 miles. they figured out that they could fuel. their. body by. with fat they can go to fat as the. source of energy as opposed to carbs so. and i remember. hoping that i'll be able to learn how to. run 50 miles and so on i've never done. more than 22 but. it i i just remember. switching away from carbs. and feeling really.

liberated like i wasn't thinking about. food as much i'm able to eat once a day. and feel really good i mean it i think. every everybody's body is different but. i think carbs make me lazy. maybe it's because uh. yeah it's the crash but also just. psychologically something. it uh it forces me to also think about. food too much like it starts becoming. you know art just like you said our. society is so much about food there's so. many so much advertisement and so much.

of our social life is about food and so. it's very easy to live life. like live day to day thinking when is. the next meal like what am i gonna eat. for lunch what am i gonna eat for dinner. what am i gonna eat for breakfast. and uh. if you're not careful that's going to. get in the way of you doing cool shit. for like. liberating yourself and thinking like. what am i actually passionate about in. this life like creating and forgetting. to eat those kinds of things and still. being able to fuel your body i don't.

know it's been fascinating. to to figure out like later in life that. carbs aren't necessary to function well. it makes me think like we don't know. anything about nutrition that's right. yes. you know um. personally. i. don't think i could have a diet without. carbs i love chocolate too much. for me eating it's a it's a pleasure of. life i love my carbs i love my sugar. however if you talk about that i don't.

have a specific diet. but. recently i. what i'm trying to do is. the days that i do not work out. i only eat. once. that's kind of my rules plus i try to. respect. sixteen eight and do my three day fast. four time years and but the rest of the. thing i i. i i let myself lose because i i don't. think i would be happy if i if i uh.

if i if i don't give myself the the the. right to to eat for me personally i love. to eat so much next and um. you talk about diet carnivore diet is. very interesting because i. a few years ago i went to africa in. masai mara and. it's a tribe in. in east africa. and. i went to visit them i did a safari. and i talked to them.

and these guys they their diet is 99. carnivore they that's crazy and you. should see they're very beautiful people. shredded like yeah some people would say. oh it's genetic i'm like yeah maybe it's. genetic but i mean. and think about the eskimos also that. like most of their diet is on on fish. right they so. i believe it can be done you know like i. believe it can be done like an exclusive. carnivore diet and i. i think i'm gonna try it pretty soon.

just to have the experience you know to. see how it feels like where you're gonna. hang out with joe. be careful bringing it up because he'll. convince you to uh forever switch to. carnivore definitely he loves it i mean. but just like you. i think he loves. food so he's he can't ever stay on. carnivore it was funny because we went. to an italian restaurant together and i. still only eat meat like i love um. i love the constraints of discipline.

that's that's partially why i like. carnivore i like saying no to food that. is delicious. [Laughter]. but a part of the problem is that i. don't know how to moderate you said. chocolate i don't know how to have one. chocolate is that something you're able. to do. have like. in moderation no it's when it when i. have an opportunity i do it i don't have. any i'm an extremist person alex i i. that's the thing i. when i when i have a chance i i like i i.

just eat i go too much and that's why i. like about my life you know that's what. i like about fasting because probably if. i would not have discovered fasting. eating chocolate would give me cramps. and all sorts of problems yeah because. people on ulcer colitis normally they. cannot eat chocolate they cannot drink. alcohol but i believe. because i'm fasting that's the reason. why i'm i'm medication. medicine medication free i can eat. whatever i want whenever i want but i.

have to do that that fasting you know. and now it becomes to it became to a. point that it's no longer hard for me. it's it's like normal i don't even force. myself yeah i don't it's easy you know. what i mean. some of my friend thinks i'm think i'm. i'm insane you know. but i tell them it's like with when you. get used to it it becomes like an abbot. and i'm and i know that hunter-gatherer. like our ancestor did not eat three. times a day it's it's. it's not true they they ate when they.

they could and when they eat they they. they. they feed themselves as much as they can. until that because the next time because. they didn't know when. they could eat again right. so it's uh i think that's how we're. we're built you know to to to have this. similar lifestyle. if we could take a step back to the. discussion about fear a little bit so. mike tyson talks about. this process of him walking to the ring.

he sounds similar to you in many ways of. the anxiety and the fear that he. experiences. and uh he has this uh. sort of story that he tells about. walking to the ring and being supremely. afraid. but as he walks and gets closer and. steps in he finds the confidence and. becomes supremely confident i think he. calls himself like a god i feel like a. god in the ring. is is do you go through a similar. process of finding the confidence. well it yes.

and um. i usually i use a james lange theory. they they did. so what i do is because i'm i'm. i'm not afraid to admit that i'm afraid. and uh. in the beginning of my of my career. i really thought i asked myself. because i was very good. in mixed martial but i i i really. thought i wasn't made for this because. the idea of fighting didn't.

was was didn't make me happy it's. something like i i was i was forced to. do in order to. keep that lifestyle that i have. and achieve my goal perhaps one day to. make enough money to retire and you know. that that was my dream. but when i was looking around. the gym where i was training most of my. training partner they were happy they. were excited and sometimes i corner i. corner a lot of guys and they're happy. and they're in the locker room they. don't react the same way i do.

some perhaps. does but. if you see me in the locker room. like when i get like my last fight with. michael bisping just to give you an. example in my last fight with michael. bisping. because it's fresh it's the one that is. the most recent. and but it's always the same thing my. last fight. and my thing i get in the locker room. i had like. three guys that i trained with mickey. gall emin zahabi and uh joseph duffy. they all lost it was like like my locker.

room was basically cursed. you know the when you're in the locker. room and. people from your locker room leave for a. fight and then they come back it's kind. of a momentum you know you you shake and. yeah good job now it's my you know it's. kind of a team brotherhood sort of thing. so the. the the. the atmosphere in my locker room was. pretty bad it was like uh going to a. you know like a funeral.

so i was very scared and ever before. every fight i i asked myself i i asked. myself always shit what the hell i'm. doing here why did i choose to come back. oh my god and i'm freaking out. however. i'm putting on a mask. like i'm acting. because if i don't do that it will. reflect on my coaches and if my coach my. the confidence of my coaches is affected. it will reflect reflect on me so i need.

to feel strong. i need to make them believe that. i'm excited to be there and i'm happy to. be there so this sort of play. start when i get when i first step in. the locker room even though i feel. completely different but that's how i. play it. normally the day the fight day i never. felt. feel 100 i always feel exhausted tired. my highs are hitching because i don't.

sleep enough the few nights before. because i'm constantly rehearse. rehearsing scenarios that might happen. and i find. so. mentally it's not that. i'm not on top but you keep all that to. yourself i keep it to myself and i'm. lying to everybody around me. but everybody knows you know. for us john denahar they they know. freddie roach they've been with me for a. long time so they know what's going on. but at least i'm lying to them i'm like. i'm feeling great so and seeing all my.

training partner. like very disappointed because they lost. their fight some were were badly hurt as. well. it was hard so and i remember i get i. get more i get. i start to warm up and everything and as. you start to warm up. you become a different person. because you know. certain we know that certain posture and. yoga can have affects your men your. mental state but it's i would say it's a. little bit the same thing in in fighting. you know like when you start hitting the.

pads you your your muscle memory your. instincts comes back and and you. remember that you're good at this you. know and your confidence start to grow. and as seeing your trainers holding the. pad and repeating your moves. it makes you also remember all the. sacrifice you have done through your. your training camp and. confidence come from how you prepared. yourself and even you're afraid you can. be confident confident in the same time. being afraid and being confidence is two.

different thing. and before every. fight just right before i walk in. it's when i'm scared i go in in the. bathroom. and i look at myself in the mirror i. used to have a bandana and a ghee but. now i it no more i didn't have this this. for my last fight because of the. the the new reebok deal they had. but i did the same rehearsal that i. always do i look at myself in the mirror. and i start to complement myself like. even if i don't believe it.

i'm starting to trying to believe it as. i am i'm finding all the reason why i'm. going to win the fight. and and all my trainer knows that before. every fight when when the guy from the. ufc goes and steppen maroon says saint. pierre are you up next i always take a. few minutes to do that that same. rehearsal and i tell myself i'm gonna. win this fight because i'm better and. and i'm very cocky about myself i'm. telling all the reasons that i'm gonna. you know when i'm i got a better team i. made more sacrifice you know i'm i'm. faster i'm more powerful way more.

athletic my fighting iq is better than. him i got a strategy on point that he's. never going to be able to keep up with. and and this and that. and i'm and be i was telling myself hey. i'm going to show these young kids how. things should be done you know i'm. trying to boost myself yeah yeah try to. to boost yourself and you start to. believe in it you become a different. person so when you walk out the bathroom. now rock and roll now. i really believe it for real you know. like i'm still scared but i believe it.

for real and that's the transformation. that happened for me right there and. from that from now. from from there to the fight it's until. the fight is over it's called i call it. cruise control. because i do not have time to think in a. fight if you're trying to think you're. missing the opportunity so that's how i. see it for myself so at that point you. stop thinking and you just go cruise. control autopilot trust yourself you. know trust yourself because you you. repeated all the scenarios you know so. everything that you have done it's it's.

inside that your computer your computer. your brain is programmed to react. accordingly to certain situations. and the it's not the the night of the. fight that you you'll you'll tell. yourself oh finally i'm gonna do this if. you do this now now if you have not. practiced it before you're screwed. it the preparation the repetition that. makes it happen you know what about like. the really difficult moments in a fight. where you. are tested to your limits essentially.

usually it's cardio related exhaustion. right where you have to ask yourself. that same questions like why the hell am. i doing this. yeah. do you do do you experience those or are. you able to ride through the autopilot. and if you do like what do you do in. those moments never in a fight when i'm. in a fight when it's the the when the. fight is is on i never change my mind i. go. until the end. however. for example my first fight would be. japan.

i had a terrible first round so i had to. switch gear. that happened sometime but it's part of. my plan i always have a plan b plans. plan a plan b plan c. you need to have that if fighters goes. into a fight thinking oh what i'm gonna. do this is this and they don't have a. plan b if this doesn't work that's mean. they're not well prepared if you talk to. me before every fight i can like in 30. seconds give you my old strategy. you know for for bj penn my first fight.

would be japan was i'm gonna keep it. standing up. keep the fight from the outside you know. because i'm faster than him then the. fight would be japan's start i found out. that i was not faster than him and i. found out that. his reaction time was better than than. than mine so. i got beat up the first round and i got. the bloody nose and everything so my. plan b was now i'm gonna wrestle him you. know i'm gonna wrestle him and.

you know make him tired and trying to. put him down and that's how i beat him. because i switch gear you know but if. you can't do that if you cannot find a. way to become the perfect nemesis to. your opponent you you you might win if. you fight but you. you're gonna find a uh you're gonna. fight someone sooner or later that will. that will give you a lot of uh uh a lot. of trouble so that's where the anxiety. pays off you're anticipating all the. ways it goes wrong so you develop the. plan b and plan c.

hi you know we talked a lot with uh. like john donahue who you work with it's. interesting i don't think i've heard him. talk about plan b and plan c he usually. has a really clear plan a. an entire system of plan a i don't think. i've heard him we've had uh we had a. a good discussion about it in um. uh over some cheeseburgers. and he's uh he was kind of espousing the. value of mastering escapes so.

when you find yourself in bad situations. being exceptionally good at finding ways. out of those bad situations and that's a. way of dominance. there's nothing. there's no better way to dominate your. opponent according to him than to show. that they can't possibly hurt you no. matter how bad the position is. uh it's like it's a as opposed to a. physical dominance it's a psychological. dominance it's very interesting. but i wonder. if he has plan b and plan c in his mind.

too. you know in uh mixed martial arts. sometimes it's like in science something. you can make a mis like a mistake you. know like. every human can make mistakes you know. there's certain sport or a certain. situation that you. if there's a mistake made you're you're. you're that's it exactly sometimes it's. the case in mma. but sometimes you able to redeem. yourself. and uh. if you look the fight with bj pen.

one that i had which was probably one of. the most competitive fight i and it was. probably the it was the fight that i got. the most. damage. and i was messed up it took me three. days like two three days to recuperate. from that fight i was really damaged. and my first fight versus my second. fight i made a lot of adjustment because. i i've learned from my first fight. and also i had a guy. one thing people don't know like they. talk about fighters having secret. weapons see for me my secret weapons was.

not. like some is that they used like certain. like different things for me was. knowledge. i had a guy in montreal he was measuring. frames he's not a scientist is he's a. friend of uh ferrous and i and what he. does he you watch fight. and he measure frames the way he does it. is when you watch a fight and one of the. guy throw a punch he cut the picture by. frame the video by frame. so he's able to see. which fighter has better reaction time.

than others. and bjpen he found out that bjpen penn. evolved the ufc roster at the time when. he was in his prime he had probably the. best reaction time of all. according to him lyoto meshido was the. second one. but bj penn was the first one so. i knew that if i would try to go first. because i always been the fastest guy. normally when i fight someone. but when i fought big japan i tried to. go first and he was always able to.

like i never was never able to to touch. him with my jab and he came back with a. counter punch. however. because of what he told me i knew that. big japan has a very fast reaction time. but had a very poor reset time. to him the way he described it to me is. like your nervous system is like a. muscle. bj pen was so fast but he's like more. like a sprinter so what i did the second. fight i when i fought with japan i made. him flinch like i fake a lot so i make.

him react and flinch so all that that. reaction time. that he used to flinch. was not used properly to avoid my. punches so he i burn i i load up his his. nervous system with a lot of information. and fit and fake and to make him flinch. and pretending i was kicking and. wrestling. so he got overwhelmed and he got tired. very very fast. so that's how i beat him people. sometimes they don't know really what's. the strategy behind the thing they only.

see the physical part but when you fight. someone if i fight you i look at you in. the eyes. there's a lot of things that going on. between you and i i can look down here. pump jab you in the face. the audience will not see this little. detail. but you will see it and that's what it. makes the magic during a fight the. relation that you have with the opponent. you know like like the mental game what. you you make him believe those little. things i use. a lot of those if you talk to a lot of. my opponent they'll tell you like i use.

a lot of these little thing you know. like i look down a banana i go i go up. or i'm pretending i want to attack you. so i'm i'm making flinch but in reality. i'm just doing this. because i want to rest i want to. recuperate and i'm tired. how much is you know people talk about. that with poker for example how much is. the value of this. you know so like some people argue that. poker is more about the betting. you know it's just the money it's just. how much you bet and so on so that would. be more.

like uh the analogy there with with. fighting would be just strictly the. physical movement of your body and then. a lot of people argue that there's a lot. here in the way you look in the little. movements in the face so do you think. there's do you think you're. communicating with your opponent when. you look at them. there's no way to know for sure 100 and. i'm by no no mean psychic nothing like. that and i don't believe in that at all. the only thing is i know to. looking through the eyes of my opponent.

when he's afraid and when he gives up on. me yeah i've been accused very often in. my career. to not take enough risk to not finish my. opponent but the reason why i didn't. finish my opponent is because i saw in. his eyes that he gave up he gave me the. fight and i'm winning the fight. so. it's not up to me. it's not to me to make it to try to. sacrifice myself trying to finish him. perhaps if i do that i will open up. from for him to to.

to capitalize on my mistake. it's up to him to make a risk. so people sometimes they they don't. understand that this is the art of. fighting my friend you know like if i'm. winning the fight like in aki and isaac. if you're winning the game and it's the. third period. it's at the end of the third period. you're not gonna take out your. goaltender trying to score another goal. because winning. uh. uh five to three or five to four. is the same thing same thing in mma we. make a living out of this.

and sometimes. you know as sad as bad as it can be you. want to save yourself for another day. you know you want to minimize the damage. but. if he knows he's losing the fight it's. up to you him to take the risk it's not. up to me. so i'm having i'm a good counter fighter. i use a lot of my attack or counter. strike or uh. reactive techno proactive take down. that's my specialty so i'm not gonna i. i'd have no desire to sacrifice myself. trying to to trying to finish my.

opponent if he want to. if if if perhaps i might give him the. opportunity to capitalize on me. it's it's not it's not smart to do that. and very often when i fight someone i. can read him i see the fear in his eyes. now i'm like i got you now he's very. desperate that doesn't mean i have to. put my guard down because he's getting. he's going to be desperate but i know. i'm beating you and i know i'm beating. you i'm just going to do what i need you. know if i have a chance of course i'll. knock him out but i'm not gonna try to.

sacrifice myself to knock you out. and if you do that. maybe one day you'll make a mistake and. you'll get dropped and you're you'll. you'll tell yourself i shoot i just. got brain damage maybe i'm never gonna. come back the same maybe you know i i. ruin my career or you know it's a it's a. very serious. game that we're playing it's very. dangerous. in the face of that. risk. i mean uh mike tyson talked about you. know when the opponent looks away.

he knows he's got him. right that uh that. he's broken. for a person like me who. has trouble making eye contact with. people there's there's truth to that i. mean there there's truth to that that. there's there's an animal nature to us. looking away i mean you could see that. the way the body language the way the. eyes move between two animals going at. it. uh in in the wild when like two lions. fight or to whatever fight.

there's a certain. beta move when you've you've been. defeated yes or one thing when i know. that that when it happened one of the. sign. is when i just like made a faint and the. guy flinched like crazy that's mean he's. really scared of me it's a little bit. like you're you're you're you're doing. this that guy flinch a little bit or. you're doing this he's flint like. that's mean you hurt him. and he doesn't want to get hurt again so. he's really trying to run away and.

not. not winning the fight anymore but not. losing sort of surviving the the five. round and it's hard to to finish a guy. who does doesn't want to fight a guy. who's not fighting anymore to win and. he's fighting to not lose and the proof. of that if you don't believe me just. look the reign of all the greatest. champion in ufc i don't care who they. are jon jones or. uh. like you could clearly see that in the. beginning of their rank they could you. know finish a lot of their opponents the. same as me in the beginning i was.

finishing all of my opponent but there's. a time that the entire ufc roster is. studying you. and they found ways to perhaps not. beating you but they found a way to. navigate to. the the fight in a way that they. minimize the damage you know what i mean. so it's a big difference between. fighting to win and fighting to not lose. you said that there's a difference. between a fighter and a martial artist. so now we were talking about fighting. you're considered by many to be one of.

the greatest fighters of all time but. you've said that there's a difference. between. a fighter and a martial artist a fighter. is training for a purpose he has a fight. i'm. i'm a martial artist i don't train for a. fight i train for myself i'm training. all the time my goal is perfection. but i will never reach perfection. so what do you does it mean to be a. martial artist. martial artist is because that lifestyle.

that i have has been introduced to me. and the seed has been planted to my mind. a long long time ago by my father. i am. i do not train. because i have a fight i will always. train even now it kind of amused me that. to see that. a lot of people because i'm still. training because i love the science of. fighting i do not like to fight but i. love the science of it and i will always. do it as long as i can do it.

people think i'm going to make a. comeback and everything i'm i'm about to. get to have 40 years old you know like. it's. i have you know like. well mike i want to fight in a cage at. 40 years old i mean some people have. done it they did it very well but i i'm. not one of them i'm i feel a little bit. to me that. and you never say never. i feel like to me like it's a little. like a kid that you play with this train. when he's young like.

he's five years old brother six years. old or seven years old eight years old. and then i was like. what the hell i'm doing here and i'm too. old for this like i said i i. have done it you know and and and i got. out of it. on top and i'm i'm healthy which is the. most important thing right now i'm. touching wood and i'm i'm wealthy. i beat the game you know what i mean in. a way like i that's not to be cocky but. i did it and i wish more. more fighters could do the same thing i.

wish. but. it's unfortunate because a lot of them. they stay there and hang out for too. long and and they get badly hurt they. get. beaten and and and broken you know and. they finish broke as well because the. lifestyle you have when you're a pro. athlete it's crazy you know it's it's. it's unbelievable. however everything that goes up in life. goes down and you need to plan your. future you know so.

for for me what if some guys have the. same mentality as me and they're. watching us right now i would say. if you do it because you're just good at. it you like the money the the advantage. the freedom that it gives you but you. don't necessarily like to fight. when you're done you finish on top you. know. go go cash out and get out of here walk. away this is hard to do however lex it's. not everybody that does it for that. reason some people generally love to. fight love to compete so they do it. because i love it you know or they do it.

because of the money but if you don't. love it if you don't like to fight. because it's very stressful and you. don't enjoy you you enjoy the training. perhaps but you don't like to fight you. do it because it's part of what you need. to do in order to keep that lifestyle. yeah and. you know like. you don't need the money get out of here. man if you're in your you're in your. prime get out of here because if you. don't you you you'll hurt your own. legacy your damage your your health it's. it's very sad and and. it's a it's a it's a sad business you.

know what i mean i i. it's like a lot of uh. one one of the place where is the the mo. the mo one of the most happiest place. for me to go and the most the saddest. place for me to go it's on the gym to. try sorry montreal because it's one of. the happiest place for me to go because. i can go train and do what i love to do. but it's also a very sad place for me. because after when i'm about to leave. there's always a bunch of young kid that.

comes or guys that are around 30 33. years old and they come to me hey george. you have some advice for me. and i look at them. and. if they're my friend they're real close. friend of mine i'll tell them the truth. in their face and i've done it many. times and it was not well received but. if they're not my friend i have to you. know. you know there's always an advice about. fighting and i answer their their. question it's my pleasure but the truth. if they. they want me to tell the truth.

the big majority of them. i would tell them i said listen man. you're in a maybe a three like an a on a. losing streak of three fight. you're. 30 33 years old you know i think you. should think about doing something else. in your life you know have other goals. you know because. you're not gonna make it and you know. i've seen that movie before and it's a. very sad ending. and i'm i'm sad to tell you the truth. because.

you're not going to make the money just. choose some but if i tell them that. they're going to be angry at me because. they're going to be like oh you you make. it and you think i cannot make it so. it's kind of they're going to think i'm. cocky. but i was lucky to make it you know what. the star were all annoying but at one. point you need to be able to. to have a plan b you know like like some. parent they come to see me with their. kids. hey this is the future world champion. and then in ufc and what advice would. you give him i always tell the same. thing and it doesn't not make everybody.

happy when i said i say i go to the case. say. are you good at school. say stay at school school is very. important for you stay educated yeah. do boxing martial arts a great sport. stay in shape. but don't put your eggs all in the same. basket. and the parents sometimes are angry when. i'm not angry but i can see in their. eyes they're like. they kind of. surprise. and. it's not because i made it that i will. tell their kid to follow the same path.

that i did i went to school too i i've. studied. i i dropped off school when i had my. first world championship fight against. matt hughes. but before that i was school so i had. another you know a a a a another way to. go if things would not have gone the. same the the way i wanted. but the problem and i'm saying that it's. not only about boxing in mma i'm talking. about hockey basketball baseball same. same thing maybe it's the one on the 100. 000 that make it and i'm saying.

i'm saying that make it when i'm saying. make it that's mean they can retire and. have enough money for the rest of his. life because. it's a sad story the only people only. heard about the people that makes it. but a lot of fighter even a ufc champion. in boxing champion even in football. basketball i don't i don't care the big. names when they retire they have zero. they're bankrupt my friend and it's a. very sad. sad story and a sad reality that most. people are not aware of. but having other paths in life actually.

can also. increase the chance of you. dominating and like reaching the highest. peak uh in your main thing i mean jimmy. pedro i don't know if you know who that. is as a judo coach in uh. in america. he was uh he says that to all of his. athletes is to make sure that you go he. has a lot of you know kayla harrison. two-time olympic gold medalist he has a. lot of uh olympic medalists but. basically there's something about going. to school like having a. forget school any other avenue in life.

that gives you the freedom to go all out. in your main. like that you know you're doing it for. the right reasons you're not stuck. it clears the mind to where you're free. to be the best in the world yes as. opposed to. kind of you have to i mean different. people are motivated by different things. so sometimes some people like. having their back to the wall and that's. the only option they have but. most people i think excel when you have. other options i think it's a distraction.

and i think it's important to have a. distraction. uh when you say that i think about one. of my coach john danaher he put his. academic background experience into jiu. jitsu and that for me that's why he's. the best teacher i ever had he's. incredible. he started. teaching me when i even couldn't speak. much english at the time and i was able. to communicate and understand you know. that's how good he is.

but i i. truly believe that most of athlete. especially in sport like mixed martial. art. trained way too much. if i could go back. and talk to a young george i would tell. him say. you do way too much volume. you train way too hard train smarter. it's more important. and i think sometimes we. underestimate the benefit of uh. recuperation. because you i think we assimilate the.

information that we learn. during a training. when we recuperate and not during the. training itself. and this whole mentality of harder. heavier you know like like. it's. it's good for someone who's lazy. but if you're an elite athlete most of. the time you know like you're not always. but most of the times because you're not. lazy. and a lot of guys sometimes they're. elite athlete. champions and you hear people say.

oh i can't believe he's very gifted but. he doesn't work but perhaps it's not. really because perhaps it's because we. don't understand perhaps he's doing the. right thing and it's us. who's working too much and too hard. that's what i think. there's a guy i train with he's uh. he made me think about about it his name. is mansoor bernawi he's going to be a. future star is he's an incredible. fighter he trained once a day.

and he asked me some time advice when he. came in montreal he's from france you'll. hear about him he's he's very good. and. i i saw him in the morning at tristar. and i said okay i'll see you perhaps. later in the other 20s oh no i only. train once a day. and he kind of wait for me to give him. like like like not not an approval but. like. to see how i react or or you know i. don't know. it was kind of a strange feeling but i i. told myself at that point i kind of i.

had an awakening and i and i told myself. man. maybe he's doing the right thing. because a lot a lot of people would say. for example oh that's a lazy way of. doing it but perhaps it's the best way. to do it i'm not saying training once a. day is the the best way to do it that's. what i'm saying i'm saying that. everybody is different but for him it. works beautifully and i wouldn't change. anything you know like if i would be him. because he is improving like crazy.

yeah and ultimately the bigger picture. there is to do something that everyone. else's uh says is stupid it's like the. fasting thing. that that a lot of people would say a. lot of nutritional experts would say. that that's. that's a dumb way. you know if you want to be an mma. fighter you should be eating like many. times a day you should be starting every. day with oatmeal you should be carbing. up constantly. but that's not necessarily true for. everybody and it's possible i'm sure.

there's actually now a few mma fighters. that are carnivore only it's possible. i i used to eat. right before training and i it didn't. bother me. however now. i. my first training. that i do normally in average around. noon 11 a.m. i'm uh i'm. i haven't eat anything when i do my. first training and it feels to me that. i'm much. i'm much more clear and much more clear.

in my mind i'm much more creative. i feel better yeah yeah it's a big. difference i just wish i would have. known that before you know well it's. fascinating the role of the mind and all. this how important. is it for your mind to be clear to. really think deeply i. there's a. there's a judoka american named travis. stevens i remember he said something. that. the right kind of practice is when your.

mind is exhausted at the end of it. that you were constantly thinking. through things. like your body shouldn't be exhausted. first your mind should be exhausted. first. it's really fascinating so people think. about training hard. you know a successful practice is where. you walk away. just overwhelmed how much you have to. think. it's fascinating framing of. of a successful practice it's true. travis stephen was one of my main.

training partners when i got ready for. my fight with. nick diaz and carlos conditt. he drove. every. friday. from i believe boston. it's like a six hour drive. drive. to the gym in montreal. train with us. an hour and a half. drive back. he's got such an amazing discipline i.

was so happy for him when he won the. medal at the olympic game man. what a well-deserved uh. you know uh accomplishment it's. unbelievable it paid off you know i'm i. was so happy for him and every time we. we got to the the gym it was waiting for. me in a in in in the kneeling position. like a soldier. i was like my god this guy he's made of. steel you know.

and and after training i always have to. offer him i say hey travis i know you. you you like to train with that because. in montreal they have very good judo. team nicholas gill and all that that was. guy. and i say if you want to stay i'll get. you the hotel you know like every. anything you want is like no no i gotta. go back i have another training later. i'm like not only that he trained with. with us he had to go back because he had. another training i'm like this is insane. and he's gone through a huge number of. injuries so he's also an innovator. because.

i. mean it's difficult to say but for. american judo there's not many. high-level judoka so if you want to be. the like. fight with the best in the world you're. you have to be alone it's a lonely. journey actually it's kind of sad uh. it's much easier to be in japan where. everybody's a killer when you're alone. at it it's uh it's a difficult journey. and you know it's it's funny we talked. about. kind of there's some sports where a. mistake. is um.

that's it you know you can't recover. from a mistake i think judo oftentimes. is one of those sports and added on top. of that. is um. the olympics. only every four years. and travis's story he's the reason why. uh when i saw him in 2008 as i i started. martial arts uh i switched from like. wrestling and. street fighting. to doing jiu jitsu and judo. and i just saw so much guts and the in.

2000. i might be messing up the years here but. in the next olympics he fought. and he lost. on just the referee call yeah and just. he went to war and he just so much guts. and just. everything on the line and to lose and. then to still persevere through all. their injuries to all that through. incredibly difficult training sessions. to go another four years and then. compete and then win a medal i mean that. guy is just.

and like he clearly could have been very. successful. he's also an incredible jiu jitsu. competitor so he could have switched to. that but he's stuck. in in. a lot of sport. when you're in elite. like for example in canada i saw he's. the number one sport in the country. kids when they're in elite when they're. young they get chosen and they're kind. of already. um known as a superstar you know in the.

the school where they go and on the. program they follow like i'm sure it's. the same thing in us and basketball. baseball perhaps uh. american football. because they already chosen so they grew. up with that uh that it that itsy kid. that that uh superstar stardom so to. speak and it's already gla glass sort of. glamorous you know. however in. in mma there's no mma judo.

wrestling like in america because it's. not our national sport it's it actually. it's it's not like. even when i first started was not really. well received by the media. there's no glamour into it. now i don't know it seems like it's. another era now. and i feel sometimes. that some people do it for the wrong. reason. you know some people. do it because of the glamour because of. the money. but even if you're an elite and very.

good the glamour and the money. won't come. in the beginning. it's a very long grind. before you know it start it start to. come in and you need to make those. sacrifices and it's a it's a journey. that where you will be tested you will. be hurt. repetitively. and you're gonna have to to. reach the down deep and come back up and. then once you finally think you made it.

you're gonna go back in the down deep. again it's a very exhausting and. decorating um. adventure sometimes but if you hold on. to your dream and you believe in it. you know and you have the the the stars. are aligned you're gonna make it. that's why it's only a few people that. that make it you know. and and um that's why i feel i feel. sometimes. the new a lot of people in the new. generation do it for the wrong reason in. my in my generation because a sport at.

first it was there were no rules. i thought it was more pure the people. that did it was really. because of the passion that we didn't. seek money and. fame. we did it because we wanted to be i did. it because i wanted to be the man you. know i i like. to have the confidence that when i walk. somewhere i'm you know i have the. confidence that you know it's an. illusion because nobody is faster than a. bullet yes. but i wanted to achieve it for myself. and i. which today now because i don't know if.

it's social media and all that that. the world has changed. the glamour the you know it's i feel. it's a different thing right now. yeah the uh if you get in it for the. glamour or the money you may not have. the right the right amount of fuel to. persevere through all the ups and downs. yeah sure you know when you talk about. motivation. of uh money and glamour. the a guy comes to mind and i don't know.

how many wrestlers you know but. in russia. there's a guy named uh beauvoisiers of. the city of brothers one of the greatest. uh freestyle wrestlers of all time but. he also has um. it's funny he doesn't have many. interviews one of my goals is to go out. and talk to him in russian do an. interview with him because he's. exceptionally poetic and a deep thinker. he's uh the kind of martial artist that. you are in the way that it's not just. about the the different battles he's.

been through or whatever it's about the. philosophy behind the way he approaches. life. and he he's spoken quite a bit about. that the the glamour the fame the money. are all things that get in the way. of um. the purity of the experience the art. that the way to achieve greatness is to. just. lose yourself in the art of the actual. combat in this case it's wrestling and. then. kind of not to worry and actively make.

sure that you block out anybody who. you know. feeds you the narrative where you're. supposed to be this famous person it's. all those kinds of things that he. basically says let others write your. story. i. make sure that you just focus on the art. and now another person from that side of. the world is of course khabib. so he represents that side of the world. and we were talking about walking away. and most people not being able to walk.

away at the top. as you have but also now. could be has it looks like. incredibly so so i mean maybe you can. comment about what your thoughts are. about uh khabib nurmagomedov being able. to just walk away you know we talk about. the goat very often. khabib is you know one of. isn't the argument because. he has. the most dominant carrier of all martial. art guy.

you know some guys can be named the goat. for different reasons but khabib for. that reason and he's undefeated he'd. i don't even know if he lost. he might have lost round. but he'd dominate all his opponent it. was ridiculous. and such an incredible career that he. had. um. i love to watch him fight he's. incredible um. and when you talk about the art when you. say mixed martial art.

the idea. of a. flawless performance for me. everybody often when we say flawless. performance thinks about a knockout a. brutal knockout. but for me it's. it's to be able to showcase. beautiful technique. like a beautiful take down beautiful. submission be like something beautiful. that.

you know when you you look at. for example uh. wayne gretzky or. michael jordan or. like stephen curry or. even if you don't know nothing about. basketball and you watch michael jordan. you'll be like wow that's beautiful what. you just did. like we talked about fighting and and. trying to say. the the word beautiful and fighting for. certain people it could sound kind of. crazy you know but but i'm talking about. the technique.

a beautiful technique. you know for me that's the goal you know. when i was fighting it's not only to to. have a brutal knockout because some. people are more gifted than others and. so i'm saying gifted some people are. better than others in certain. phases of fighting. but for me it was that it was to. showcase to win of course but to. showcase. some beautiful technique that that you. can watch the watch it and be like wow. that was incredible the timing he did it. that. and.

when i talk up when i think about kabir. norma gomanov. i see all the detail that that of his. work especially when he got he's got his. opponent against defense that's like. that's his area of expertise where he's. to me he's the best that ever did it in. in terms of. that. fighting style that that particular. expertise that he has it's just. the the flawless execution of that. particular set of techniques yes. conor mcgregor had the the accuracy.

the spider anderson silver was like was. i would say the most flamboyant of all. you know like he was moving like the. matrix. john jones was incredible in terms of. creativity spinning elbows and that and. he faced incredible. adversity. symmetry johnson was. so complete you could you could bring. like he was slamming a guy to an armbar. it was just unbelievable like like he. was like the complete fighter. bj penn was like so flexible he he did.

stuff with his body then like nobody. could do his dick the dexterity of his. hips was just unbelievable. um dominic cruz to me was incredible his. footwork his distance control. so when you talk about like the goat. royce gracie another one he did things. that i think for me is not number one. because yeah i gotta i gotta and. starting to interrupt the hoist is a. fascinating one i'd love to hear what. you think about them but. many people. consider you.

most people consider you to be the. number one. greatest mixed martial arts fighter. ever. so it's fascinating to remove you from. that list. and continue this discussion and asking. like who do you think is the greatest. fighter ever you listed some amazing. ones hois. you somehow skipped fedor it's as i'm. very as a russian i'm very offended no i. was going to there's so many fedoras one. as well fedor i think in his prime was. like when you say when you talk about a.

name for example like. we talked about him when he was in his. prime like when i talked for example. about anderson silva i'm not talking. about the andersons of who fought his. last fight. against urayo hall i'm talking about. anderson servo who knocked out victor. belfor yes. bg pen same thing. the problem is when fighters. hang on for too long in the sport that's. what happened they kind of. make make. people forget how good they were.

and it's very sad we talk about fedor. and just just think about uh stephen. yochich. me which is probably the greatest. heavyweight of all time with fedor i. would really wonder who would have won. this fight the both guys in their prime. i tend to lean towards fedor because my. heart was with fever the fedor but he. could have gone the other way but just. because meow chich. lose his last fight now everybody's like. oh yeah they forgot about him. it's crazy man it's one fight you zig.

when you shoot zag boom it's. that's the reality of mixed martial art. well that's why the thing is the. mixed martial arts isn't just the. performance the strictly who won and who. lost it's also the stories we tell. ourselves and so. i mean there's beautiful stories being. weaved and that also is part of uh who. is the greatest of all time is. what what were the battles what what. what had to be overcome. what was the.

the flavor of the flawless performances. you know all of that. plays into it and you're right being. able to walk away at the top is also. part of that. a lot of people ask me about khabib. and. that fight. i want it to happen. khabib wanted to happen but ufc did not. want to happen between you and khabib. yes and we tried to make it like about. three three years ago when i when i. retired two you know three no it was.

after two years ago. and it didn't never came to fruition the. ufc were clear they said they would they. have their plan for khabib and it makes. sense to for the business standpoint. because they want to keep the ball. rolling. now can be retired and like everybody. else after just justin gaitrey i was. doing the comment theater in french for. the ufc and i have butterfly i thought. he was going to call me out. if there's one guy that i would have. said yes it would be him because for a.

fighter the most exciting thing things. to do it's often the scariest one. and khabib was. you know where is the scariest matchup. yes. but it was worth the risk because nobody. have ever been able to solve them how. would you solve the khabib nurmagomedov. puzzle well. khabib is very good against the fans. i would have to establish a game plan. and everything but i think.

what i would needed to do is take the. center of the octagon right away use a. lot of fake and fate. keep the fight. all the way all the way out or all the. wind and when i sell the win is when you. close the gap use my proactive and. reactive take down and my perhaps my. superior explosivity to put them down. i like to use those proactive and cr and. reactive technology because for me i. feel it's more economical. khabib is a much better chain wrestler. than me chain where stories when he got.

the guys to defense it's pure wrestling. what makes my takedown very efficient. it's my karate it's not my wrestling. it's i'm a i'm very good at timing my. opponent and getting in. with with my explosivity so if you watch. at my takedown it does not demand often. it does not demand a lot of work when i. use the i call it proactive takedown. when um. he's coming to punch me and i react so.

i mean proactive is when when i i'm. faking it so i i i i instigate the. attack down by a fake then i take take. him down and reactive is when he's i'm. baiting him to throw something and then. he then have a counter yeah yeah yes but. all might take down in the center of the. octagon yes my takedowns are more in the. center of the octagon like for example. another guy that does it well is gleeson. tebow that did it well in his best days. you know. khabib has more a style of chain. wrestling i would say like kamaru uzman.

or sort of speak kind of kind of guy. it's a different style you cannot. compare both town. and that's the kind of takedown i'm good. and i would if i would have fight kevin. that's one of the strategies i would. have done i would not have been afraid. because everybody that i thought i was. able to put them down and and. and i have the pedigree to prove it in. my fight resume. so you would have perhaps see him on his. back and i would have perhaps be on my. back as well so it would have been a. very interesting fight and how hard do. you think he is to take down i mean.

a lot of people speak about his. wrestling being just it has nothing to. do with it like the wrestling because. let's do the correct if i get that. timing and i got my boat hand around. around his knees he's going down. everybody goes down yeah yes yes this. goes down and and and i had a lot of uh. that's what i would have done i would. not have been afraid of his wrestling uh. i would have be the instigator i would. have forced the fight forward and that's. what that's how i would have approached. that fight which.

i believe most of his opponent. were afraid of his wrestling because. they didn't have the tools that i have. to put him down. i would not have forced the wrestling i. would have in in the clinch i would have. tried to disengage i have many ways to. disengage the clinch. i would have wanted to force the fight. in in that in a in a fighting distance. you know like in in a shoot box distance. not in that in a wrestling distance. is it possible. this fight still happens.

i. you're young look great in a suit. well. there's a lot of problems now. and the thing is. now i made peace with it. i. no longer don't wanna fight and i don't. it's not gonna happen ufc was not. interested and i'm bound by contract. with the ufc. and by exclusivity there there's some. people says to me oh how about if. russians are a crazy uh. wealthy russian guy come with money yeah.

i i i said i have the i'm gonna be uh. in court with ufc. and and also. i'm older now and when i go home man i'm. like. i don't want to do this you know like. and we're always. i don't want to do this but like for. example i was training with freddie. roach a few days ago and i'm hitting. pads you know. and freddie is looking at me and he's. like hey you have the hitch back i'm. like yeah if dana white would walk in. the room in the in the gym at that.

precise moment with a with a ufc. contract i would sign it sign it in the. blink of an eye. but then after i go home i'm like hell. no. my belly is full my my you know i'm. healthy i'm wealthy why would i want to. fight for i made peace with it but the. minute i go back in the gym because i. still get it inside me when i train with. the young guys i still get it and a lot. of guys think hey. tell me the truth you're preparing a. comeback because i still get it you know.

i'm a little bit older but i i get more. knowledge i can compensate. i i i become a different animal because. you know it changed you. but then after you go home and you. you you're like man uh no way i'm doing. this. yeah it's very hard to explain you need. to be acquired one to understand that. it's very very hard to explain. well from your perspective i think. khabib. is one of the rare one of the few. fascinating scientific puzzles yet to be.

solved so from that aspect as a martial. artist. it's just a fascinating journey to try. to solve that puzzle there is a thing. too like say oh who's the best part of. our people. lex they don't like i unders i i. realized that. later in my life and i'm sure a lot of. young guys will say oh i said it's not. don't speak for me but i'm telling you. right now what i'm about to say you will. realize it later. when i was young i think you can. proclaim yourself the.

more the badass man on the planet you. know like nobody can beat you at. it's an illusion man that's the sad. thing about for example dc. uh. daniel cormier does probably one of the. greatest if not the greatest of. all time you said miyotis but like. it's almost because of that little. matchup with jon jones it's it's. difficult for people to conceive of him. as the greatest of all time it's all. about matchup it's all about timing and. also you make a fight.

you make both guys fight 10 times. the result might be different. like. like every time you know. i mean maybe he's gonna win eight out of. ten. but that knight is gonna he's gonna lose. why because we don't know the the. universe made it like that you know. maybe he got sick maybe he had the. emotional issues he didn't sleep well. and. he makes him uh lose focus and he got. caught. you don't we don't know but it's it's.

that's the thing with people ask me. would you have done it with khabib what. would happen i don't know maybe out of. 10 time i don't know maybe as a fighter. i hope i would have win. more than him he thinks the opposite is. only one way to find out but. that night if there's a fight. the guy gonna win doesn't mean he's the. best fighter that's mean. the. the he's the one that fought the best. the night of the fight same thing in. basketball or aki the team that wins the. game it's not necessarily the best team.

is the team. that play the best the the night of the. game and fighting is no different so. being the baddest man on the planet it's. an illusion. i mean that's the tragic thing about it. is uh on any one night. anything can happen and then that tells. a story for all of human history it is. it's. uh. it's that it's sad to think about but. that's what makes it beautiful that. there's so much at stake like entire. lives all the dreams you've had growing.

up all the hard work all of it is. decided in a single night even though. that means nothing in terms of who's. actually better it's uh i mean that's. the beauty that's why people love the. olympics especially because it happens. so rarely. and dreams are broken. or uh like triumph is achieved by the. unlikely hero all like. right there. i mean that's that's why we love it. right that's why. that's why i love it if we would know. always the result before it would be.

boring that's why we do it you know. uh you watch the odds you know like like. sometimes i like to watch the odds uh. before a fight you know. because. you know. there's things you know i believe in. causality you know i believe in. everybody believe different things but i. believe everything is because there's a. there's a cause to everything that's. personally what i believe. i don't believe that. i i have like free will i think i have.

the illusion of free will but i believe. there's a cause for everything and if. i'm doing something because of something. because of a cause by definition there's. no free will in a way you know if. there's a cause by definition. there's not how does that make you feel. by the way like the idea that if we just. look. uh outside of even just human psychology. and fighting and so on if we look at. like physics if everything is. predetermined if all of these little. molecules interacting. it's already like your story is already. written i mean it depends it's it's.

written but i would need to know all the. data and it's impossible right like it's. it's. i it's kind of weird i gotta say but i. don't. to me. i don't see any argument. to counter that idea i i i i can i don't. maybe i'm i'm ignorant but i haven't. seen nobody and everything from that. i've read so far there's nothing that. countered that idea that that. because in a mechanical world.

if your car broke or. you know we don't say oh the car decided. to broke or a three a tree is fall. there's reason why the tree is falling. we don't say the trees decide to fall. right so because us human being i think. it's our ego we decide and i'm no. different than anybody when i make a. decision i decided to do this i choose. to do this. but i'm aware that. there is causes.

that make me do certain things. and by definition i think if there is a. cause. there is no free will by definition. right. yes but the thing is just like you said. we understand so little about human. intelligence the human mind and. especially consciousness. that. the. this giant. mystery this darkness that we don't. understand how how it. how it feels like to be something to be. a conscious being.

that. because of that we're not able to really. even reason about free will or not. because there might be some magic. that comes from consciousness the you. know the the consciousness might be the. thing that makes us different from a car. that breaks down. there might be something. uh totally. fascinating totally. undiscovered yet that will make us. realize that free will is actually real.

and somehow fundamental to the human. experience so. it's sometimes i think. we forget when we talk about. free will and. physics and it all seeming to be. predetermined. we forget how little we actually. understand about the world. and i think. in that mystery that could be. totally new ideas that are yet to be. discovered and will make us realize that. it's not just an illusion. it is something that is like.

at the core of how the universe works. some people believe that consciousness. is a. fundamental property of the universe. like it's a it's a one of the forces of. physics like consciousness permeates. everything it's in everything like this. table is conscious but it's not. as conscious as us and we're this little. peak of consciousness and if that's true. and if we get to understand that maybe. there's something. there's an extra bonus we get in terms.

of free will. once you become one of those entities. that are super conscious. so. i i tend to be sort of humbled by the. mystery of it. do you believe. one day with. with the technology that keep improving. we will. make. a. robot that will be able to. be somehow conscious. absolutely i that's been my dream that's. been i hope i hope to do just that.

first of all i believe that. all people are capable and want to be. good to each other. and. i think love is uh is a really powerful. thing that connects us and can create. better and better worlds sort of like. uh. create better and better societies that. improve both the technology the quality. of life and just the basics of human. experience and i think. creating ai systems that are conscious.

that are human-like. can enable us to. be better to each other like they can. it's almost like adding more and more. kindness to the world through the. systems we interact with will inspire us. to be better and better to each other. in terms of them being conscious i think. that is a an absolute requirement. that entities we interact with. communicate some element. of consciousness to us like that's how.

we connect to each other the reason we. you and i connect is that we believe. that each of us are conscious. and to me what consciousness means is. the ability to hurt ability to. to suffer. to uh to struggle in this world. because just like you said uh. with with without the struggle you don't. have the love you don't have the. pleasure. and. ultimately consciousness is an entity's. ability. to struggle to suffer.

and. from that arises the pleasure and us. together being able to. appreciate sort of uh. appreciate the highs. and. experience together at the lows that's. how we form the deep connections. i personally think we can create that in. robots and i i personally believe it's a. lot easier than uh than we think does it. make you afraid sometimes. about.

the fact that. one day hey hi like intelligence. artificial intelligence could be. you know could hurt us or or you know. like because we're you know because of. hollywood of course you know the movies. we watch but but it seems like when i. hear sometimes elon musk talking you. know like. yeah so. elon talks about with ai we're summoning. the demon. he is very concerned and i talked to him. about it quite a bit he's very concerned. about all the different ways ai could.

hurt us humans. i tend to believe that there's a lot. more ways in which ai can make our lives. better and. can make life awesome for humans i think. humans. are the ones that can do a lot of evil. things. so i'm less worried about i am more. worried about humans. if i look at what you men have done on. on the course of history. you know for for example. in regards to the planet to the the.

scale of the universe. i think. what i'm afraid is that we have more. of a. destructive force than a beneficial. force so if a height take that and cause. the duration in order to. protect us against ourselves. it could. hurt us in a way i don't know if you if. you understand what like. what do you think about that does it. makes you afraid sometimes not because. of a hype but because of what humans are. doing.

that heihei could do to us to prevent us. of hurting. ourselves you know yeah no i mean. definitely it can bring out the the. worst in human nature and uh. provide tools for evil people to do evil. things at a larger scale but i just. think. it depends what you think human beings. are i tend to believe. that as we get more intelligent. we.

we start to see the value. the evolutionary value and the value in. terms of happiness of being good to each. other and i think ai if if you look at. ai as an optimization problem of how to. create a civilization that works well. and expands throughout the universe. i think love. is much uh more effective so ai will. help us. maximize that. i think there's going to be always. spikes throughout as it has been through. human history where charismatic leaders.

will do evil onto the world in the name. of good you have the stalin and the. hitlers and all of that. but. ultimately. over time i think technology will give. the good. uh the good people power and the evil. people. less power. now there's a lot of ways in that in uh. that that won't be the case there's a. lot of ways for it to go wrong and elon. talks about them but.

i i honestly think in terms of. intelligent ai that's going to bring. more love to the world the thing i'm. concerned about is dumb ai. so there's been a lot of discussion. between china and the united states. recently on autonomous weapons system. this is something people don't. they're afraid to talk about but. there's now a race. uh where. the united states has officially said. that they're not against adding ai to.

its weapon systems so now. the us military. is adding automation. adding intelligence. to its drones. to its uh. anything that can create damage. and so of course and they did this so in. response to china doing that. so you can imagine this is this is. terminator. you think about terminators intel. intelligent systems they're not they're. pretty dumb. the the point is.

they're efficient at doing what they do. and in the space of war. efficient at doing what you do means. killing. so. that i'm really afraid of but those are. dumb ai those aren't your. uh. loving. deep. fulfilling relationships that's like. uh efficiently being able to fly to plan. the trajectory of dropping bombs of. missiles of how to do counter attacks of. how to maximize the destruction of a.

particular facility instead of. individuals. and then. that can just escalate. and as opposed to the cold war with the. with the soviet union this could be a. hot war. and then. the consequences. once you allow. it's kind of terrifying because. currently the drones are operated by. humans so. you know you have say you have. information. about uh intelligence gives you. information about a particular terrorist.

located at this area. and then. you use drones to. maybe uh. the automation there is to help you. figure out what is the best trajectory. to. strike at that location so. you still have a human that pulls the. trigger at the end. dropping the bomb now automation and ai. in autonomous weapons systems. might be where you say. there's a bad guy over here. you figure out how to get rid of the bad.

guy okay so then of course the systems. will be very good at finding the right. trajectory and so on. but. there's bugs that can happen unexpected. bugs that the system might figure out. that there is. this bad guy might actually be in these. other. five locations so mike's might make. sense to cover the entire area right. and you see you might just drop bombs on. the entire area and then. you know that's just okay so that's.

going to lead to a lot of destruction of. the scale of a city but then you can. immediately take that to nuclear weapons. if you add automation to uh responding. to counterattacks to nuclear weapons. somebody you might get information that. somebody's planning a nuclear attack on. the united states and the ai system will. immediately respond. and you know it can respond at a scale. of launching nuclear weapons itself and. so there's all of these possibilities. that don't require much intelligence and.

that's exceptionally that's. exceptionally concerning i i'm like you. i do not believe there is. babies that are born bad i think people. do bad things because of their. experience. however. if i look. to my experience and from what i can see. some very often. men's of power. wants more power. that's what makes me afraid with yeah no.

absolutely i. listen i've been uh i've come from the. soviet union. uh stalin is arguably one of the most. powerful humans in history uh he's not. talked often enough about by the evils. he's done hitler gets all the attention. yeah but stalin has done arguably much. more evil than uh than hitler yeah well. this is this is human nature it wants. power. we see that with institutions we see. that with governments and nations. i think. you see you see this with the internet.

people are really hungry. for the distribution of power. like you see that people are very much. distrustful of centralized places of. power of institutions and so on so i. think successful organizations. successful companies. successful governments. will be run by people who distribute the. power. like i don't trust myself with power at. all yeah and i think you have to. build into the system. that no one person can have power.

and that you distribute it that's where. you have in the financial sector you. have cryptocurrency right now with. bitcoin and all those kinds of things. people are exploring how can we avoid. the central bank. to have the control how do you put the. power in the hands of people uh. thousands of people millions of people. and in the same way with uh with. military with um any kind of. uh with technology. i think the future looks very. distributed so what do you think about.

militarizing space. [Laughter]. the uh space force i i i don't think. about it often because right now i'm. filled with excitement about space. exploration which is the positive aspect. so elon. you know i was born. in an era where it was exciting i don't. know about you but for me it's exciting. to look up to the stars and. dream about us humans ex you know uh.

colonizing mars colonizing other planets. expanding onto the galaxy into the. universe that's really exciting. uh so. i'm um. the the the possibilities there are. endless i don't think. because the also the resources are. endless. and so i think we get into trouble with. militarization with wars when the. resources are very constrained. so i think for a while we're not going. to be fighting. the the only wars we'll be fighting in.

space are the ones that kind of um. another nation to compete yeah who goes. to the moon first i guess that's those. those are kind of those kinds of things. or maybe for satellites and all those. kinds of communication and uh maybe in. assistance for like cyber warfare which. is also very dangerous but in terms of. space. wars out in space i think. i think everything out in space will be. positive and inspiring it's very hard.

but. all good things are hard i think. this is where i've been i've been. talking to a bunch of people about um. extraterrestrial life. i'm really excited by. i don't know it's the other thing um. when i look out to the stars it's. exciting to me i know i think you've. spoken about it being scary. but to me it's exciting that there's. intelligent creatures out there. far beyond perhaps the intelligence of. our own. that uh are just too far away to explore.

yet but we might one day come in contact. with them. so uh that that to me is the ultimate. motivator is to meet other intelligence. life forms out there and connect with. them. have you ever meet jacques valley. no but i've been in communication i want. to i hope to talk to him he's amazing. french yeah i am. i know that there are many theories. about yes. you know if there is alien we don't know. right but but some people think it's. from another star systems.

and jaguar is a like to make a long. story short he has a different theory he. thinks it's perhaps. beans that. could be living in a different dimension. than us and the reason why he says that. is. when he makes an experiment when there. is a signings very often of a ufo. let's say i'm i'm the ufo that you have. three guys. and one they they are looking at the ufo.

very often. one experiment that. you can do and sometimes that that is. the case you asked your two friend to. walk on the side and there's a at a. point that it's like a corridor you see. the ufo and then you stop seeing like a. corridor and. that's one of the reason why he's saying. that. it's perhaps a dimension and i found. that fascinating you know i. this is what you know to the discussion. of consciousness and all that it it. feels like we might be just experiencing. a very particular slice of this universe.

we might not be understanding what's at. the higher dimensions or. yeah i mean higher dimensions in. whatever form that means you know. there's all these physical theories now. that describe a world with dimensions. that's much higher than the four. dimensions of the three-dimensional. space in one dimension of time. so. whatever the hell is going on in those. other dimensions it could be. something. unfortunately this is the sad part it. might be something we can't even. comprehend with our human brains.

that the limitations are just um. i mean we're built we're just. descendants of apes so like it might not. be possible to even understand is there. alien is there another dimension are. they a human from the future is there. perhaps chinese or another. you know what i mean a group of people. that are working with a technology far. behind but you know what lex i had a. chance to meet you know because of the. sport i'm doing. i met a lot of. people in military and politics.

sometimes that i i asked them every time. i met i met one this week and and um. i i i asked him i say is it true about. the the uf who is there is there and he. says to me is like. before even before i ask him i say. sorry i have to ask you a question. i wasn't in los angeles. sorry i have to ask you questions oh you. want to ask me about ufo right away you. knew i said yes you saw it in your eyes. say yeah there is things that flies that. we don't know but it does it didn't tell.

me he doesn't know it they don't know if. it's you know whatever but there's. things apparently that. are detected and i know you met uh. forever you know like flavors. fascinating. crazy it makes me sad that we live in a. different area now that that it's used. to be a. subject that was ridiculed and now it's. so cool that it's you know i'm very. excited to live in to that that era you. know yeah it's really exciting but still. the governments are kind of behind the. times on that aspect is.

they're not transparent and they don't. communicate well. you know it saddens me to think the. possibility that that. you know like the us government might be. in possession of something that they. don't tell the world about because. they're just scared. it's because they don't know what the. hell it is and they don't want the. chinese to gain the technology or all. those kinds of things. do you think the president of the united. states for example because the president. comes and go every right four or eight.

years do you think he would know all the. secret or. it would be a guy like for example. vladimir putin with no. much of a you know. i don't think the president even know. like even can he knows all all the the. secrets the u.s president yeah i don't. think so because he goes they go back. and forth you know every four years you. know they have the terms right. so i you know i i wasn't sure before but. i think i could trust the previous. united states president of donald trump.

that if he knew. he would probably tweet about it so. perhaps. so. i yeah i i think. from from the con you know i've worked. with darpa i work with uh dod at. clearance and. i think from the perspective. if you if you see the world as. fundamentally a dangerous world. where. secrets are important to have from a. military perspective. i think it's very unsafe to tell.

the president in the united states. that you have this kind of technology so. if you think of the world in that way i. i hate that that's how that world is. viewed because ultimately i think what's. more powerful than the military secrets. and i hope that actually is what will. happen in the 21st century. because what's more powerful. is inspire people. inspire the the young elon musks of the. world. to to create cool new things if we have. technology that we've.

come have encountered that we don't. understand that should only be. inspiration. to uh develop that kind of stuff it. shouldn't be seen as military. as a military threat as a secret to hold. on to. i think secrets um. i hope. we more and more let go of the idea that. there are secrets that give us advantage. you know like in the tech sector people. are more and more releasing the software.

they're making an open source. like secrets don't make sense. they share the knowledge right share the. share the knowledge like share like. being afraid to share the knowledge i. think i hope is an old idea it's more. yeah when you make it things more. compartmentalized you know yes. well yeah what that's the other thing is. the bureaucracy of government is like. people only know their own little thing. and they don't spread the information it. doesn't travel well i mean there's a lot. of just inefficiencies that are it makes. me sad it makes me sad because uh.

the. the science the engineering that happens. in governments like lockheed martin. developing the different. airplanes that they use for military. applications is some of the most. incredible engineering ever and it's. secret because they're afraid to share. it with the russians and the chinese and. so on. but on that topic i do think somebody. like vladimir putin window probably. knows some stuff. my god my god i would i would love to.

know what he knows but then again you. never know because even he is you know. people think of him as an exceptionally. powerful person. but he's also just managing a bunch of. tribes. his power is very limited he's trying to. hold together. uh a bunch of greedy. power-hungry. mad men that's right okay and he's. trying to establish a balance. he might not know everything so. i i hope this changes because i think. there's nothing more exciting about.

i don't even know if there is a human. that knows you know what i mean like. this idea that. there's some civilization alien. civilization that that land on the white. house and say hi i come to meet the. prison and like. why would they do that you know what i. mean. it's kind of absurd you know well i i do. think that actually i mean that's one. possibility right is lart. you know if an alien civilization really. wanted to contact us i think everybody.

would know. so i think what we're. if if there's any kind of interaction. between humans. and aliens i think most likely what. we're interacting with is the crappy. like probe drone thing. that kind of just like like it's like. this. yeah. yeah. this dumb thing you know we're not. interacting with the aliens i think just. like. just like for us. i think humans aren't when we uh venture. out into space.

the first thing that's going to mean. aliens is our robots it's not us humans. because we keep sending robots out so. they're going to like. they're going to make decisions about. humans by looking at the robots. i say their famous greys. the greys maybe they're our robots maybe. it's all bs2 you know yeah yeah so i i. don't know. i don't know what uh that interaction. actually would look like if aliens. really wanted to reach out really. communicate and i don't know if we're.

able to actually communicate with them. that's one of the sad things we might. not be able to. that we might the aliens might already. be here and we might just not even. know. know how to see them or know how to. communicate with them. there's so much. misinformation and sometimes there is. people. that are very credible that that. that made crazy claims you know like. like you don't know what to believe you. know like paul ellior the the.

the. minister of defense of canada i've said. like some. that there is many alien race that ever. that that's what he says research it and. then. did that that scientists. from i think israel recently have said. something about trump he was keeping. secret or medvedev you're from russia. they have been caught in there like. during a break. in between interviews to talks about. like oh it's like men in blacks over to. speak i don't know he didn't look like. he was joking but.

i don't know if he didn't know about. this yeah you can check on youtube it'd. say it's it's it's it went viral yeah. there's a lot of things like that. sometime like. or or bob lazar i'm like. imagine if it's true man yeah. you might imagine if we if we're like a. fish in the water we live in our own. world and sometimes there's a. fisherman that grabbed the fish yeah. take him out of the water and threw it. back in the water and the fish goes back. to the other fish and say. hey. there's someone that that take me out of.

the water then i've seen uh things that. i did not like imagine if it's true like. we like. yeah and and one other thing like. i wanted to ask you because you were. consciousness how about dreams what is a. dream yeah well i i more and more i. don't know if you're paying attention to. this there's now it's become more. acceptable in the scientific community. to do large-scale studies of. psychedelics for example and there's a. lot of connection between psychedelics. and dreams it's very similar states. there's. there's a lot our mind does.

when it detaches itself from reality. that it can just explore a lot of. different ideas it's very possible that. dreams is you're traveling somewhere and. the same thing with psychedelics you're. traveling somewhere. in a different. not traveling through physical space. it's the other dimensions that we're. talking about you're traveling some. other. through some other dimension to meet. some other creature people talk with dmt. that they meet some elves i've never. done i i'd like to i don't know if. there's a safe legal way to do it but uh.

they all talk about meeting elves. and they're like creatures like entities. and like who are who are they. what's. what is this is it because they're high. or it's because. they're actually meeting something and. maybe there's no difference i mean that. uh who knows exactly and that takes us. right back to us not being able to. really understand how our mind works. you know i work in artificial. intelligence. it's clear that we understand so little.

about intelligence some basic things. about intelligence. just at the at the very sort of basic uh. first principles level we don't. understand what it means. to to reason. to think. to assimilate pieces of knowledge. together. from the from the basics to the complex. we don't understand it we don't. understand how the human mind does it. we don't understand how the human mind. is able to take incredible waterfall of. information and filter cleanly into just.

like. clean you only see the things that are. important and are able to jump together. and be able to reason about the world. and at the same time have moments of. like genius of creativity like what what. is that that also you know people. writers talk about that that they're you. know they're almost like communicating. with the muse like where do ideas come. from yeah this is the joe rogan. philosophy but but i i do know that past. civilization were a lot of them were. based on shamanism.

and you know what i think it's sad is. if someone. drink alcohol. and when he's drunk he's going to commit. like. create like like murders or something. we're going to blame the person right. we're going to say that's his fault it's. not the fault of alcohol however if. someone does psychedelic or any things. that is illegal and do something crazy. now we're gonna. put the fault on on psychedelic you know. what i mean and perhaps the person.

itself is the. the reason why you know he's been doing. these things you know what i mean. so. yeah it's fascinating how like society. you know like in canada they just. legalized marijuana. oh yeah. but before that before they did it like. if you talk for example to my dad my dad. is against it like because the whole. mentality is like it's drug it's bad at. that but drinking a glass you know. drinking a beer it's fine i mean.

what is you know what i mean what is. good what is bad and. i guess you think chocolate could be bad. as well for your health or i mean i'm. going to the extreme now but yeah what. is good what is bad if you use it for. recreation you use it for an experience. for to learn about yourself. it's like it it said that the line is. very. tiny you know there are some countries. that. drugs are all legals you know what i. mean and i i don't know the the the. stats but i would i would be interesting.

to know if. they have more. crimes there than. other countries where it's more strict i. would that would be interesting to know. about that it's fascinate me you know. yeah and i mean we humans kind of just. come up with the arbitrary lines of. what's good what's bad that applies with. drugs that applies with anything uh that. applies with animals for example we. talked about carnivore diet. maybe the time we live and now will be. remembered for. the cruelty to animals for example.

and i believe. this the 21st century will be remembered. for our cruelty to robots. that uh eventually. there will be a civil rights movement. for robots where the the ones who uh. choose to be conscious the ones who have. consciousness will say we deserve rights. too. we deserve to be treated with respect. too. how about the people we put in jail.

people put in jail i mean if i think in. the future we'll look back. and we'll. think of ourselves being stupid to. you know to put people in jail instead. of you know like. trying to fix the problem in in in. at the base you know of course now we're. or i guess it's our endurance that made. it in a way that we cannot sort. sometimes understand what makes uh. sometimes a psychopath a psychopath or a. murder or murderer but. you know if we can pinpoint the problem.

and take care of it before you know what. i mean. or made it in the way that we can. reestablish that person in the society. you know who knows you know what was. their future is old it's interesting we. live in an interesting time. you mentioned your father. what have you learned from your dad you. mentioned he was an important part of. your childhood my dad is amazing. i grew up we didn't have a lot of money. but it doesn't mean if i'm born in a. nice country that always nice thing.

happen you know. my dad for me is a big role model. because i see him through. to my life facing a lot of adversity you. know he um. he stopped drinking when i was a. teenager he was an alcoholic. and i seen him struggle through that you. know and it was very very hard and um. i've seen him. work. like crazy hours.

like come leave in the morning come home. at night burned out because of work. through almost all his life. to the point that it became. a slave of the system yes. it became a habit and a normal way of. living. and it made me realize that i've learned. a lot through my father. he taught me perseverance hard work you. know. when you face adversity you know to. never give up until you achieve it.

but also he. it taught me a lesson that. in a way that i don't want to be like. him even if he is happy. it's because i realize i don't think he. knows anything else like he works. through all his life. and. i don't want to live to work i want to. work for it for you know what i mean i. want to decide when i work you know i. feel like like he. he lived to work instead of working for. a living.

and. perhaps it's because he did not have. choice. he he was the older of his family they. had they were nine kid his dad. my grandfather died when he was young so. he had to become the father of the. family and and work to put money on the. table. so perhaps that what. made him that way and he became like. like a habit for him. my dad taught me uh when i was at school. i was bullied at school. he's the first one to initiate me to a.

martial art he taught me kyrati my dad. my dad was a black belt in kyokushin. karate as well very nice but because he. was working too much he didn't have time. to teach me and i needed self defense in. order to defend myself. i have a winning a great carrier and. mixed martial art but in the in the. schoolyard. that's so good my mixed record. my my record is not very good. when you're a kid.

and you're about. seven eight years old and you're facing. bullied. bullies that are. two to three years older than than. yourself. it's not the same thing than when you're. 25 and the guy is 28 so there is a big. discrepancy in terms of maturity. so. my dad taught me introduced me to karate. danny i didn't he didn't have time to. teach me then he put me.

in a school. with an a teacher that said it was jean. kutzer. and i grew up with a lot of anger. and uh there were two. person that was afraid growing up. it was my dad my dad was very severe. very strict with me. and i'm glad he was because i i could. have become very bad i could have become. chosen on a different path people see me. as a nice guy and i'm gonna i am a nice. guy i try to be a good role model.

but i could easily have turned towards. our around there's darkness somewhere in. there yes they are a lot and a lot of my. friends have chosen that pat and. unfortunately. you know they they are they are. they are not with me today. even if i'm from canada and canada seems. like the nicest country in the world. like i said it's even if you live in a. nice country not always nice thing it. depend of the situation.

but that's what my dad taught me you. know and he gave me that. to. to. because i i'm very good at learning by. observing people and by observing him i. i see the the struggle he had with. alcoholism and what he did the the the. pain sometimes that even flick. to to to us to my family but. how he. turned. he did that 180 degree. and. i really admire that and i know it was.

uh very very hard for him and he did it. you know and uh for me uh that's a great. role model for me. so with your dad being an engine of. basically hard work and you finding a. balance of being able to work your ass. off. but also to be able to enjoy a piece of. chocolate. what is the perfect day. in the life of georgetown pierre look. like. so like. if you were to go through a day that's. very productive but also want to.

make you sit back and enjoy and say that. was a good day what's that look like. what are we talking about when do you. wake up what do you eat. what do you do it changed over the years. when i was younger i have a good day it. was like a good training session or you. know achieving good thing in my training. you know and that's why i was very good. at it because. when i i was obsessed you know i think. to be good at something you need to. become obsessed and to me. performing in my training was everything.

you know like. when i had a bad training session. i didn't tell my training partner i was. acting like a like because of the my ego. i didn't you know i didn't tell nobody i. was like hey then i go in the locker. room i'm like. man. then then i'm playing the the the. the training in my mind you know i'm. saying okay i should have done this. shouldn't have done and it hunt me. it hunt me man it's a training and it. hunt me. until the next running session on when i. can redeem myself.

that's how it is. when we used to train in. all together back in a day. in canada we had. david luizo we had patrick. we had uh dennis kang. uh steven. jonathan there was all like the best guy. in canada that were training with each. other before we were training in. different gyms but once a week. i made it in a way that i contact.

everybody that we all join for us and we. exchange ideas and we train with each. other so a friendly i would say friendly. competition it was not. malicious but it was hard training you. know like not our goal is was to improve. you know but it wasn't. very competitive. and when. that day you used to get out of the. training session with a bad performance. for me. he used to hunt me until the following. week when i could give it back and and. perform better with the guy that i had.

the most trouble with. that's how it was and that's how you get. better you know but but. it was not a training where it it it. would we were trying to do malicious. thing to one another you know what i. mean. you need to be playful but playful but. competitive. that when i had a good training session. because aspiring was on a friday. i had the best weekend and what i was. going out with my friend drinking and. partying and have fun that was. that was my my my my ideal day back in.

the day. today is strange you know my my my life. has changed you know like um. i. i am not the same person i used to be. when i go went on my knees and begged. the ufc for a title shot you know what i. mean i i am uh. i'm wealthy. i'm healthy most importantly that's the. most important thing. and. as man i'm gonna tell you the truth as.

good as my career was. man my private life man is a million. times better man. i i and and people ask me sometime they. always wonder they they try to ask me. and it's normal it's a lot of people is. curious and they're the reporter. and. in the sport. of mixed martial art we say we play. basketball we play soccer but you don't. play fighting. so when you expose your private life.

we've seen that happen in the fight week. sometime conor mcgregor and khabib. your competitor. knows that he cannot get to use what he. will do he will try to get to someone. that you love. so may i never expose my my private life. i never post instagram of my family of. my stuff. that's the reason why because i mean. i'm in a business of fighting. and people know that they cannot get to. me. and i believe.

because i was bullied when i was young. i didn't realize that when i was young. but it helps me deal with the mental. warfare that i need that i had to face. later on in my life in mixed martial art. because it's a very egotistic sport and. there's a lot of. a lot and a lot of. intimidation and i was used to i've been. used to this thing when i was young so. it does not get to me. however the good way to get to me.

go go go go try to get to someone i i. love now man. i'm gonna go crazy you know what i mean. and i'm aware of that so in order to. protect myself. i always because i'm aware i'm a public. person. so i try to always keep my surrounding. like in a private. yeah one of the ways that like uh your. your friend of mine joe rogan has. been an inspiration that he he's got.

like an incredible family and he for the. most part is starting to change recently. actually it's kind of interesting but. for the most part throughout his life he. kept it pretty secret. doesn't talk about it and he's calm he's. a comedian comedians talk about. everything he doesn't really talk about. it. and there's something to that it like. preserves the magic of this the silence. of the private life and i think it can. affect the. the development of the kid. if the kid grew up being oh he's the son.

of. that guy instead of being his own person. you know what i mean. so so for me it's very important. like my parents are older it's fine. but it taught me a big lesson. when i'm with my friend at the dinner or. anything i talk with person always share. a thing but when i'm talking i'm aware. of of the audience who i'm in front. yeah and i mean but oftentimes those. people are just incredible it kind of. makes me sad. that uh. you know there's a lot of people that.

love you right and they're a lot of. really incredible people and you'll. never get to really know their story. that's right i mean i don't know for me. it makes me sad you see them like at. airports and stuff people will tell me. they listen to this podcast or something. like that. and they're i could tell they're. incredible people and it makes me it's. like a little goodbye. of a possible friend i don't know it. makes me sad it's right it makes me. it's lonely it's almost like celebrity. is a lonely thing so the higher the. celebrity the more lonely you become.

in some kind of way but of course you. have that little gem of a private life. where you can personally i believe every. relationship i i. like i don't like to use this term but. it's always a give and take relationship. you know. like you can gain something and the. person like it it could be something. like not material is materialistic like. something always a good confident like. you're someone that they can give me. good advice or or.

it's a word i would say like extensional. like if a pilot as a co-pilot is the. co-pilot is extend as a extensional. relationship with him you know so he. knows if he gets sick or he faint he's. there to make sure you know he is there. to help. and i think in every relation. it's about compatibility but it's about. extensionality right in a way that if. that person is extensional. and sometimes we talk about about love. you know like. sometimes i think is is it is it a bs.

word or not because i myself sometimes. look at. i look at myself in the mirror. and when i do s. stupid thing. sometimes i love myself a lot and. sometimes i don't you know what i mean. because i'm angry at myself i've done. stupid thing. so that means sometimes you could love. could be fluctuating you know what i. mean. how about in relationships sometimes you. people they say oh they love each other. but then when they divorce they go oh i. want the house and the dog and the kids. stay with me and you know what i mean.

if you love if by definition if you. really love someone. and let's say you're an old man and you. love a woman and she decided to leave. you for a younger man if you really love. her. you're gonna help her pack and leave but. in our society sometimes we we want to. hone something to me love includes. the missing somebody. losing somebody the anger at somebody. it's all the passion feelings towards. somebody that's all love okay i you know.

it's all part of the thing it's the ups. and downs. it's uh. the sad thing is when the feelings. towards the person the ups and downs go. away they're forgetting. yeah that's that's the opposite of love. so the opposite of love isn't hate the. to me the opposite of love is forgetting. and and that's that's a much bigger. that's like the depth of human. connection that's how i see love so. sometimes i try to stay positive and. i've been asked. how i try to because i have the image of.

someone who's positive but i go to my. own demon as well sometime. however. we talk about love. when i was young. you know like. like i didn't love. who i was at first that's how i love i. learned to kind of love myself. like i didn't and then when i was going. to to bullying i was i believe i was. bullied because i didn't love myself i i. because i project a very bad image.

of what i think of myself i was a kid. that lacked a lot of confidence i was. looking down when i was walking i. shrugged my shoulder. when someone was talking to me i was. avoiding eye contact. so i was a very easy target for the. bullies and. i think bullies are like in predatory. animal in nature they will hunt the the. easier prey they would don't they don't. go the lion don't go. for the the alpha bull they go for the.

one who's old or who's sick the weakest. one and bullies are the same in society. i believe. and i didn't like. to be bullied of course but i didn't. like the the person that i was. but i found out through martial art. the respect. and. my my coach was extraordinary to me he. taught me discipline and self strength. self strength and i found out that i. needed to in order to love myself i.

needed to change myself. because i didn't when i looked at my son. in the mirror i didn't like what i saw. so i decided to become. like someone that i would love. so. i tried to. look people straight up. and and trying to. showcase. a more confident image. that i had and it was hard in the. beginning because i didn't really. believe in it but i. i faked it. until kind of i make it so when i was.

walking. at school. more and more i was learning how to. become more confident and i was like. taking charge when the teacher was. asking questions i was at first i was. never answering i was like this waiting. always to be the last then i was hey i i. i know what the answer this is the. answer i got out. of my. comfort zone so to speak. and i wish i would tell you that i got. out of bullying. because a hollywood story i use martial.

art to beat up all the bullies but it's. not how it happened to me it happened. because i changed myself from the inside. out. and. i learned how to. because i didn't love myself in the. beginning. i learned. how to become. like someone that i love and even now. like i'm by no mean perfect i do a lot. of stupid thing. but i learn. as a person and even i do have something.

stupid i'm like shoot i did something. stupid i. at least i can apologize to the person. if i realize and then. i know that i'm not the person i was in. the past. i'm the person. that i am right now so i can learn. and become that image of the person that. i love so in in a way. the reason i'm trying to be positive and. i and i am able to stay positive. sometime in life. is because i'm always trying. to be like that person that i love yeah.

and i think if you don't look yourself. in the mirror and don't love yourself or. don't see any positive future for. yourself. how can you change your environment if. you cannot change yourself you know what. i mean you would never be happy if. you're not happy when you look at. yourself in the mirror. so change yourself first then change. your you know it's not the environment. you're gonna change for yourself it's. you have to go from the inside out you. know. this this i learned to martial art i.

have a i had a coach who was incredible. used to drill these ideas in my head and. and give me confidence you know like. like this telling me all these these. beautiful. things about myself and how i. he's dead now unfortunately peace peace. to him but uh he was incredible. incredible he was very very strict i was. afraid of him i was afraid of my dad and. afraid of him he couldn't teach nowadays. like he used to teach me because he. would be in probably in jail you know. but i'm glad he did it because for that.

time being that's what i needed it. and i would never have had that the. career i had in mixed martial art. without this. because i would i would never have got. out of my. comfort zone would have been impossible. and in order to improve in life. you need to get out of your comfort zone. it's hard it's very hard to do. and and strive to be the person that you. can love i i does that's that's. beautifully put george if you were to. give advice to a young person today.

about life what would you tell him. if he. takes. life. with the same. mentality that i do. if he has the same. taste of things that i have. i would tell him. you know for for for sport for life in. general i would say. if you will have a dream.

you know like. make everything in your power and work. very hard you know never take no for an. answer. and go through hell in order to achieve. it. don't work. hard only but work smart. that's i think the problems with a lot. of people they work hard they can work. hard they burn themselves they don't. work smart.

whether it is in. in science and business they make. bad choices or they are badly informed. in sport. how many guys i've seen ruin their. career in the gyms. they they spar so hard they they ruined. themself in the gyms they leave their. career in the gyms. what i would say to for example because. my field of expertise and it's in sport. of mixed martial art. i would say to.

you young. kid. make your training playful. you know when you get ready for. for competition you need to trying to. recreate those. elements that makes you. go outside of your comfort zone. but in every days life in general make. your training playful. don't makes it like a hardcore. competition about who's who's winning. who's losing make make it playful so.

it will increase. because your. know you will not be afraid of. getting hurt. or losing. you will be tent. to trying more things. and be you it will make you become more. create creative. you know. that brings up another question about. learning. so you. you value knowledge. and you're exceptional at. basically being very good at learning.

and figuring stuff out new things. or going deeper on the things you. already know so what advice would you. have for how to learn. effectively how you know you say work. smart. how do you. figure this game out i believe the best. way to learn. is learning from other people's mistake. [Laughter]. however. i'm not perfect and i've learned from my. mistakes as well and sometimes i've.

i it took it took me a few mistakes. to learn the same thing. but. especially in the sport of mixed martial. art because we're talking about. the the failure. could have very serious uh outcome on. someone's life and well-being. so it's crucial. to trying to learn from other people's. mistakes do you study others. do. every every fight.

i'm studying my opponent and i've. studied myself as well to know. what. how my strength. mix. versus my opponent weaknesses and how. can i. make the fight. go in a way that i'm taking my opponent. outside of his comfort zone. very often people are good at studying. their opponent but they're not good at. looking at themselves in the mirror and. knowing what they should do in order to. to maximize their.

their odds of success right. that's why i always thought. for me. it was important to not be the best at. one thing. but be. very good at everything. that's why i always seek. advice. advices from. the best and every discipline like i. wrestle with the best wrestler i i i. could be with. i box with the best boxers i i.

practice karate with the best karate. fighters uh same thing in jiu-jitsu i. trained jiu jitsu with the best best. jiu-jitsu guys. however when i mix. everything and mix martial art. if i if i'm because i'm very confident. in every areas so when i'm fighting. someone. i'm very good at and that the. identifying. where is the less competent. and i know for a fact that because i'm. competent everywhere i can.

if i can bring the fight where he's. outside of his comfort zone it increased. my odds of winning there is no certainty. it's all about odds i believe because. there is always x factor that you do not. control yeah it's fascinating to see you. actually because you've been a student. of movement. uh you've been exploring all kinds i. mean gymnastics all that kind of stuff. there there's something reminiscent to. um. like uh conor mcgregor is one other. martial artist that's kind of explored.

movement been a scholar of movement. um at least from my perspective it's. very sort of bruce lee like. it's almost making a study of the human. body and all the possible things you can. do is there a philosophy behind that. that you have. you talk about bruce lee man. he changes my my life too. he was ahead of his time. yeah incredible a lot of people talked. to me and asked me hey is brucy would. have been able to fight in ufc i.

look i don't think so you know i don't. know. i think he was a you know he was a. martial artist he could have defended. himself but. to say that he could have compete in. amongst the elite of the elite fighter. perhaps in his time but if for sure if. you put him in ufc right now. you know the sport hasn't improved. incredibly since then. but. in terms of philosophy yeah bruce was. amazing like one thing that just to.

prove that he was ahead of his time he. was talking about using your longest. weapon against your opponent nearest. point and we see that that that kick. that um. it. it got popular popularized by jon jones. you know the the sidekick to the time. it's longest weapon against your nearest. point in boxing is the jab but in mma. when you can use it all your weapon. that's the kick to the tie. and. there is. i feel there is like kind of three.

dimension in martial art there is the. philosopher like bruce lee. there is the correct choreography the. choreograph. people like for example you see in. movies the stunned people they're. incredible like or the one that does. like forms and karate like jumping spin. kick bad kick like acrobatic stuff mixed. martial art they are unbelievable and. there's also the the. the one that compete in fighting like. that's what i do that i personally.

specialize in well you also do the. philosophy i do a little bit of. philosophy but that's. you know consequence we are all i guess. we are all ever like we all practice the. three dimension because. martial art is i would say it's it. whether you want it or not you have to. touch these three dimensions. but you will specialize in one i. specialize to my life in fighting like. the real thing in terms of fighting. competition. and of course if you do martial art.

you'll be able to defend yourself. because it's a self defense however you. might not be able to fight as an elite. and the most prestigious organization. and you might not be able to perform the. stunt that for example the stuntmen have. done in in the the syriza was playing in. the falcon and winter soldier these guys. are incredible they're like real life. superhero things they do it's to me. like it's it's fascinating it's amazing. and also bruce lee the philosophy.

how many hours he. he took like. thinking about this stuff you know i'm. sure he did not just came out of out of. nowhere you know like he was thinking. like that's mean he slept on on this. he. how many hours it's just unbelievable. he's like water my friend exactly how. many times has he thought about water. going to bed yeah before he said that uh. well let me ask a very important. fundamental question about martial arts. we're both wearing a suit and tie.

uh joe rogan thinks that wearing a tie. is a huge disadvantage. is it a clip-on or is it an actual tie. are you controlled by another one. so do you agree or disagree with joe. rogan that wearing a tie is a is a. martial art. significant disadvantage. in terms of combat in a combat scenario. in a fight i think it would be a. dissonant disadvantage yes okay but i i. work as a as a security bouncer in. nightclubs and event when i was 18 years.

old yes. and um. sometime i had to work in certain event. that i was in suit and tie. i never had to. use. my force to take someone out when i. wasn't super untie but if i would have. had to before going to the table to. physically take the guy out i would have. removed my tie and i would have removed. my vest for sure and i would have called. back up for sure. and i would have probably used the.

element of surprise to. be first on the guy yes. uh when you're in a bar same thing you. call back up first. and and and you make sure you ask the. way the waitress before to clean the. table before you go yeah and when you go. you have to use the element of surprise. yeah. because fighting. fighting that makes martial and fighting. in the street it's two different things. and yes i'm a mix i'm a mixed martial. art competitor that's what i've done all.

my life but i had a lot of street fight. in my life a lot when i was in what's. the difference what's like that oh my. god it's a huge difference. there is guys that. if i would have a choice. you know to fight like for example. certain guys and you have seen a street. fight and fight. like other guys that are not in ufc i. would maybe sometimes pick guys that are. not in ufc not necessarily because in in. in a street fight there's no referee. that says go it's the element of. surprise and when you're a nice guy.

you're not the aggressor. you always have the element of surprise. that's what it taught me oh interesting. yes because. if. aggression in your second person will. not come punch you without warning it. needs to it needs to trigger some it's. something need to be triggered before. so if someone comes because he's looking. for trouble. there's a sign that is looking for. trouble. so i was just talking with fast food and. this weekend about it and i saw that.

every every martial art yeah. comes from like some martial arts are. from exclusive week for competition yes. like sport karate uh. like certain martial art but traditional. martial art are for the street are for. self defense. and i start my background in kyokushin. karate so it's for and and i did. japanese jiu jitsu so my background. before i even start. training for mixed martial art my. background is in self defense. and it's very important to understand.

that in a street fight the element of. surprise is everything and there are no. rules you can go for the eyes the necks. it surprises everything. total ball game you know what i mean you. have the the chair the beard there's so. much more thing going on. so the idea of. because you are a ufc fighter you think. you're invincible this is bs. anybody can come like if if a big guy. who punched very hard most people don't. know how to punch by the way they don't.

know how to make a fist and throw it in. a forward direction but if someone knows. how to do it i don't care who you are if. you could be francis and genu someone. come behind your head and. whang or. there's an argument and you get. surprised by a punch you can beat you up. and lose a fight that doesn't matter. yeah the element of surprise is. everything so you were saying remove all. the sources of the elements the surprise. all the. clear the bar remove the tie i still. disagree with you about the tablet.

just for your information if someone. comes. looking for trouble and you see me do. this. and and going sideways yeah that's my. position that i'm i'm thinking there you. go maybe something will happen and i'm. about that's. see to flip the table on you then. wearing a tie. is communicating the nice guy image so. it actually gives you the freedom for.

more elements of surprise by wearing the. tie if you take it off that's more. you're limiting your options because. nobody's going to expect the guy in the. tie to do anything i'm a big believer. that sometimes it's not only. materialism. it's what you project that's true like i. had troubles in a bar. and i was able to deflect. the guy was looking for trouble talking. to me and i was able to deflect his. whole aggressivity by saying like. hey man that's a nice shirt where did.

you get it. like saying like something was stupid. like this then it it kind of break break. the momentum and he you know but the guy. was looking for trouble i don't want to. fight you. i don't want to fight you but i'm not. going to wait. until you pull you make the first move. because the first the minute you you. touch me you push me or you you touch me. you declare war and the war is unleashed. my friend and i'm i'm taking you out of. order with the necessary force of course.

you know i mean that's. the thing with martial art if you use. the necessary force to take out a. problem. it's okay but if you. you know you you take advantage of it. that's when it's not all right because. it's a weapon. so if someone comes up to me. that's my position and now i'm i'm. assessing the situation you know. that's that's how they teach in self. defense here never put your hands down i. wasn't there. because i'm brown or boom like like what.

this is this is. very important and you never. you always your center line on the side. ah yeah. like this if someone knows martial art. he will recognize that pattern but if. you go like if someone talk to you and. you go like this. that's mean you're telling the guy that. you want to fight you don't want to do. that you don't want to oh yeah um that's. that's interesting you know that's. that's the position because your hands. are here you know whatever you can do. you're here well also your ear tells the. story.

it's not everybody that knows that. however it some people might might think. that it's my mom grabbed me by the air. and pulled me because i didn't listen to. her you know. a real fight in the stream and a fight. in in mixed martial is a different ball. game. what do you think is the best martial. art to prepare you for street fighting. you know people often kind of have this. discussion of jiu jitsu maybe boxing. maybe wrestling. do you think. when you talk about a young person. studying martial arts to prepare. themselves for um a street fight.

it's often much different than a mixed. martial art fight. and. i know there is a lot of bs in the world. of martial art like self defense stuff. that like but. i believe. self defense is is very important in a. way to understand. the the situation to understand those. those. situations that might accurate how to. deal with it because not necessarily the. the.

we talk about the technicality we talk. about the tacticality the tactics you. know like when i'm talking to you about. the element of surprise it's important. this is not technique a technique is a. punch or or. techniques that i physically will use to. enable my my my opponent my my aggressor. tactic is the tactic i'm telling you. about is in a street fight if someone is. looking for trouble and i feel the heat. rising as the conversation goes that's. the position i'm gonna take and.

i have to be first. i cannot let him go first so i have to. strike first or do something this is the. first thing that generally and i have to. to. to agree on. um. after that of course there is the the. knowledge if you're a professional. fighter you have a. huge advantage once the fight is started. the war is declared now it's everything. goes. but. generally speaking the person that will. intervene physically that will have the.

first blower the first you know the. first punch. will have a huge disa use advantage it's. like doing a 100 meter race and having a. head start you know and and that you. don't you can't prepare for with any. martial arts yeah and if i'm a smart guy. i know how to fight if a guy like uh. an heavyweight champion comes to me or. like like like a. you know i know i know what to do to. this this ebola like boom or hair and or. the neck you know like and if you.

if you blind them what is it going to do. you know what i mean. so so or a bottle you know what i mean. so so the element of surprise is it's. everything so that's why it's always. always good to be the nice guy and not. looking for trouble because if you're. not looking for trouble. you have the head start you have the. option of having a head start so what. you're saying is being a nice guy is the. is the best form of self-defense maybe a. little humor. yeah. you know i have learned that i've. learned that when i was a kid yeah i was.

about. maybe seven. six six years old we used to to play in. montreal there's a lot of snow we used. to play king of the mountain yeah. that's the first combat lesson that i've. learned in my life. and i managed somehow it was a lot of. kid i managed to get on the top of the. mountain and uh. another guy came come in on the top of. the mountain and he was angry that. before. i was there before him and. when you played king of the mountain it. was a mountain of snow you don't strike. each other we just wrestle and push and.

i managed to be first and when he came. he says to me say. okay you wanna you wanna fight and i. said yeah i don't know what it means. like i wanna fight you wanna wrestle you. say i i say yes. he punched me right in the face boom and. then i and then i fall on on the bottom. of the mountain but then i when i fall. down. i remember that vision in my life. because it it it's it's. i will remember that for the rest of my. life. i'm about to stand up and i see the.

blood coming out of my nose see the the. snow is red because my nose is bleeding. now i i remember. the element of surprises everything. my first street fight i've lost i got i. didn't get knocked out but i i got. dropped on the bottom of the snow. mountain and i was like uh he got me. because i was not expecting my hand i. was not expecting a punch. so from there when i felt the the the. eat of an in during an argument or.

something was not right i always stroke. first. i didn't win all my fight because. sometimes there were more than one guys. on on me you know. but. i think it's important. to not be the aggressor so you have the. element of surprise and i always use. that in your favor that's so brilliant. let me uh go from the very practical to. the the most impractically huge question. about the meaning of life you said that. uh when great. depths. of unrelenting sorrow punctuated by.

great peaks of joy and liberation. the result is delicious. so uh what do you think is the meaning. of this whole. journey that we're on this life what. makes life delicious. to me. you know. satisfaction is. the end for me like like i always. if i'm satisfied that's mean i have no. nothing to live for. i'm talking i'm not talking only about.

my career about talking about my life. what i what do you want in your life you. want you want kids you want a family you. want to be champion what do you want in. your life you have like a long-term goal. short-term goal. in mixed martial art i achieved what i. needed to achieve. i'm sad cespar. i'm no longer the same josh schneider. than when i was on begging for a title. shot on my knees. i move on for it from it. now i had a chance to go into movies.

now that same. insane. that same insane. drive that i had to be. the champion in the world now i put it. into acting. like i'm having a lot of acting class. now and luckily for me. the timing was amazing i got i got. casper the the falcon and the winter. soldier was that is on disney plus. channel. it's a huge huge project to be part of.

for me because it's like. you play basketball you have a chance to. go for the nba right away i was very. lucky. the timing was just too perfect. and so. you need to constantly. challenging yourself and having goals to. achieve you know like that keep your. brain. activated i keep working. and the proof of that is that. you see sometimes some old people. like when they retire very often.

sometimes you see that they they got. sick and they die or because they they. it's either because sometimes we think. we we. we certainly make benefits. we do something good for them by. making not work and giving them a break. so in our mind we're like oh it's gonna. be able to relax. but. in their mind it's not good because. they're not busy they have nothing to. live for like like my dad is used to. work all the time and he has always.

something to do. is retire now. i myself now. call him by force to find him some job. hey dad okay. can you come in my house have this thing. to repair i don't know how to do it so. he gives him it gives him a reason not. not to live on because he has other. things to do but but. what i mean is also in life i think. you always don't be afraid to aim high. don't don't be afraid to fix your.

objective very high and never be able to. reach it. be afraid of reaching your goals. essentially i mean you always have to. keep moving it out you think there's a. it's an interesting question because. you've been acting in some really. exciting things. do you think there's a a dramatic role. where. it's basically. you know you go full robert de niro and. taxi uh driver do you think they'll be a. full length feature film with george st. pierre i. liken there's level to this thing i'm.

aware that i have to restart as a white. belt. and for some people it could be. discouraging but for me man it's great i. love it i freaking love it i embrace it. because everybody told me like i would. never be able to do it and it's fine. but. the and also the outcome of a failure. in the sport of mixed martial art is. much more serious. than the outcome of a failure for a. movie for example for for if you zig.

when you shoot zag in a fight you get. knocked out if you zig when you shoot. zagging on set oh cut we'll do it again. and. i know that i will be most likely. be. chosen for action martial art roles. because that's my background there is. this new trend in hollywood now when. they want someone to play. an italian guy they're gonna choose a. real italian person when they want. someone to play a russian guy they're. gonna choose someone who has a real.

russian background. now they want a real martial art fighter. i've done fighting all my life i just. need to improve my acting skill. but when i train in acting. i get myself out of my comfort zone i'm. not playing a role of a martial argument. i'm playing like romance comedy drama. so when i go on set and playing. the role of uh of a badass martial art. guy it's it's easier so like in training.

for a fight i always make my preparation. harder than the actual task i would love. to see where i don't know if you've seen. the wrestler with uh mickey work. oh yeah those types of films i would. love to uh i would love to you do. something like that. if not now then in 10 20 years i could. see that that would be amazing there's. levels to the game right yes it's. gradual and i don't and i'm aware that i. i don't want to take something on my.

shoulder that i won't be able to deliver. it's like a fighter wants to go for a. title shot right away could it could. very well break him. you know what i'm and i don't want to do. that because i know. i've done some gigs in the past but i. was not focusing on it because i was. focusing on competing as a martial art. martial artists and competition in mma. but now i take it very seriously so i. cannot do the same mistake again because. i've done some stuff i've done it for. the money and it was good.

it was fun to to to be beat up by jacob. van damme. and everything but but my acting. was not on point you know at that time. so if i ever every time i'm gonna come. back from now on on on screen. you need to be sharp because you cannot. mess it up if you mess it up it's like a. loss on your record. you're not taken seriously. so so that's how i see it and. it's very fun because i i had a chance. to talk to a lot of guys and on top of. all the class that i'm having.

like a few days ago i was with dani. trujo. and i i always seek the advice of actors. when i when i see some of them that. because i really admire how they do you. know how they project their emotion and. i asked him danny true i said i said to. him he is an amazing guy by the way very. nice guy. and i asked him i say him how. how do you do to be. because you scared the hell out of me. how do you do to be so scary like what.

is your trick. and he tells me he's like george if. you're threatening if you threat someone. and you scream at him. i'm gonna kill you wherever. it's not as scary if you're smiling and. you say. i'm gonna kill you. like and he says also to me that another. advice he gave me is like when you say. this. think about you killing him for real. that how you hate him and how you gonna.

kill him so the camera will take the. emotion out don't try physically to do. that that's the mistake i used to do. before i used to physically show that. i'm strong and angry and and to be mean. so these are the just an example of. tricks that i. learned sometimes when i met an actor i. always try to learn from everybody that. i met in my life it's a difficult. journey because then you have to go to. some dark places as a person because you. really have to imagine. imagine some dark things.

that's fascinating actually i i think a. lot of the actors they have. sometimes problems because of that beca. because now i understand why it's like. if you work on your bicep your by itself. will grow right it's a it because it. it it's that stress that you put on it. that will make it grow right. emotions are i believe are the same way. if you're used to. dig inside of you down deep to to to to. make your negative emotion.

depressive emotion comes out. if something. bad in your life happen you will fall. into those emotions much more rapidly. that's someone who does not that every. day you know what i mean because it will. it's like a muscle memory like if you. program yourself to react a certain way. you will reach that point very often so. that's why sometimes you see some some. guys they. we often blame it on drugs but i think. it's also because of the acting they are. used to be so.

on the hopped up and sometimes they go. to the down deep so they. they they're they they're both extreme. you know you got to be psychologically. tough and that's life this is so. exciting to see you challenge yourself. in that direction. that's one thing that i'm a. a little bit afraid. that happened to me i i i really hope. i'll i'll always be uh. you know like a problem having a problem. to control my emotion be oh yeah much. extreme. i hope it does not happen to me and and.

if i feel that i'm going towards that. i'm going to you know give up on on my. new objective and find something else to. to achieve. but in your personal life you want to be. real with your emotions you don't want. to it doesn't you know you're just just. like with biceps you don't want biceps. that are too big you you are real but. you. are extreme really and and that's that. that's the. that's what i think something that could.

happen to actors sometimes when they go. too much into their emotion like we talk. about like sometimes guys that that that. commit commit suicide perhaps you know i. don't know it's because i don't know. their real life but it could be. something that. they get so much into their character i. didn't understand it at first because i. never had acting class but after a while. that you have acting class now you start. to realize that yeah okay you understand. why some actors get. caught up in their emotion because. that can have an influence on their life.

right. you're on a fascinating journey uh. george i can't tell you how much it. means to me that you'll be so nice to me. that you'll give me so much respect just. that that tells everything i need to. know about you as a human being with. everything you've accomplished. you waste all your time and you're so. nice. to me just as a fellow human being man i. have so much respect i'm so honored and. the energy you give me by just even. showing up here i'll carry that forward. for a long time to come george i love it.

thank you so much for talking today now. thank you lex for having me on the show. you know i've been looking to talk to. you for a long time. for me talking to a guy like you it's a. it's a great learning experience because. i always learn. and uh it's life is fascinating to me. and. all the experience that we have and. lives you know it's something that can. make us grow and this experience for me. just you know make me grow as a as well. you know plus we look pretty damn sharp. today so man and black my friend.

thanks george. nice. thanks for listening to this. conversation with george st pierre and. thank you to all form expressvpn. blinkist theragun and the information. check them out in the description to. support this podcast. and now let me leave you with some words. from miyamoto musashi. think lightly of yourself and deeply of. the world. thank you for listening and hope to see. you next time.

you.