WWE Wrestler Murdered by Ex-Wife, New Lover Just 3 Days After Divorce: Cops

Two arrests have officially been made in. connection with the shooting death of. former WWE NXT wrestler Knuckles Madson. We are laying out competing versions of. what authorities say happened versus. what the suspects say happened, but it. may be what the victim allegedly said. right before he died that may decide. this whole case. Welcome [music] to. Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm. Jesse Weber. By the way, before we get into this. more, I got to ask something. It just. happened to me the other day. Have you. ever been in a meeting and at the end of. it after 30 minutes after an hour you.

say to yourself what do we just talk. about for that? Like what do we decide? If so, if you're like me, I got to tell. you about this. Okay, the pod no pimp. This tiny AI powered device. It is more. than just a recorder. It is like a. hands-free AI secretary that you can. carry with you every day. So whether. it's meetings, interviews, brainstorms, the notepin doesn't just catch. everything. It also identifies key. points. It expands into summaries. that. delivers ro specific action items to. keep your whole team aligned. And the. best feature I think ask plaud because.

instead of going through all these hours. of notes, you can ask it to hunt for. answers like, "Hey Plaude, what hot. trials did we talk about covering next. year?" And Plaude will pull up that. conversation. So if you're over messy. notes, it's time to try Plaude Notepin. right now. You can get 20% off with code. sidebar 20. Just click the link below or. scan the QR code. Former WWE NXT. superstar Knuckles Madson was shot to. death over the summer. He was found. along Highway 12 in Benton County, Arkansas. This is back on July 11th. suffering from a gunshot wound to the.

stomach. He was rushed to the hospital, but he died. The 41-year-old. professional wrestler, real named Kevin. Nickel, wrestled in the WWE NXT between. 2012 and 2013. This is kind of like a. training ground for the performers. before they fully make their way to the. main stage of the WWE roster. From. there, he wrestled in Ozark Mountain. Wrestling under the name Ivan Warsaw. Apparently owned it. This was a. horrible, horrible situation with no. arrest for quite some time, leaving his. 8-year-old son without a father. But.

now, the US Marshall Service announced. two people have been arrested. So, while. the Benton County Sheriff's Office took. the lead in this case, it was the United. States Marshall Service that was brought. in for the warrants. The warrants of. Michael Hogue, 51 years old, he was. arrested in Fort Smith and 40-year-old. Amanda Penny arrested in Rogers. Hogue. facing a first-degree murder charge. Penny facing accomplice to first-degree. murder. And they both face firearm. possession charges. Now, do you know who.

Penny is? Penny is Kevin's ex-wife. and. Kevin was killed, get this, 3 days after. their divorce was finalized. They were. married for reportedly 13 years, even. apparently high school sweethearts. They. met in 2010, got married in 2012. Hog is. apparently, by the way, Penny's new. boyfriend. And authorities think he's. the trigger man. So, hence the slight. disparity in the charges, and we're. going to talk about them. But when it. came to their divorce, Kevin's mom, Susan Kinderman, told 5 News that Penny. was Kevin's first friend in high school.

They got married. They were happy. But. then they probably grew apart. As for. Hogue, Kinderman said she doesn't know a. lot about him, and by the sound of it, she has no interest in knowing more. Now, Hogue was granted $750,000 in bail, Penny, 500,000. And through the. statements of the prosecuting attorney. here and a probable cause affidavit, we. are getting a lot more details about. what authorities allege that led up to. the shooting, what happened in the. shooting, how it may have all went down, what evidence they have against these.

two. And let me say this, there is one. piece of potential evidence that you. almost never get. A dying declaration. from the victim. An alleged dying. declaration from the victim. Oh, and by. the way, there is something about Penny. that is happening right now that I got. to say, honestly, I don't know how they. can prosecute her right now. Let's talk. about it. All right, let me bring on. John Phillips right now, victim's rights. lawyer, to get to the bottom of all. this. So, John, thanks for coming on. I.

want to start with the charges. Why the. difference here, right? Why is Hogue. charged with murder and Penny as an. accomplice? The prosecuting attorney, Josh Robinson, said the charge is. functionally the same. In Arkansas, it's. a distinction without a difference. A. person is always subject to accomplice. liability whether they're charged with. it specifically or not. And the. classification for the crime and the. punishment is exactly the same as a. primary. The affidavit indicates that. the evidence shows that Michael is the. one who pulled the trigger and that. Amanda would have been working in. concert with him when that crime was.

committed. Why the difference there? >> You know, prosecutors have indicated. investigators that it's a distinction. without a difference. But generally what. you're looking for first and who gets. charged, you know, the highest when. you're dealing with an incon crime is. the trigger person, the person who. actually did the shooting, the stabbing, the killing. And then the co-conspirator. kind of tucks under that person. And so. I I would assume here that Michael Hogue. was was kind of the main murderer,

right, for lack of a better way to put. it. and the the ex- spouse Amanda Perry. would have been um you know kind of. conspiring with him to to kill her very. recent ex-husband. >> Yeah. And um you know I'll say I've said. this in every case allegedly, but really. allegedly here because I I am very. interested in what the defense is and. what their narrative of it is. But. you're right. So, when it comes to bail, prosecuting attorney Robinson indicated. that the reason you see such high bail. amounts, it wasn't just the strength of.

the case that was a factor and the. potential punishment, so the risk of. flight. But both of these individuals. are apparently habitual offenders, have. criminal histories, and Hogue has a. particular past of violent activity. But. here's the shocker. John came out in. court yesterday. Apparently, Penny is 7. months pregnant under the care of a. doctor outside the Benton County jail. How does this work? If you're pregnant. in jail, going to be prosecuted, is.

there a delay? It seems not to have an. effect on the bail analysis. It's still. a high bail. 500,000. >> for sure. You know, usually you wave. speedy trial when you're when you're, you know, seven months pregnant. It kind. of depends on the attorneys and how they. want their client to present here. I. want as far away from that pregnancy as. possible because it adds additional. motive. It adds additional Well, okay. So, you know, now you've got this new. family starting, very dysfunctional, but.

new family starting. And it's unusual in. these cases. First of all, I'm so tired. of seeing divorce murders, right? like. it just it happens so often now. I mean, it's always happened, but just the. reporting of these high-profile crimes. where a couple's divorcing and it ends. in murder. I think somebody said along. the way that that divorce ends two ways. and separation or death. Um, but yeah, you you you certainly have grounds for a.

continuence for a few months for her to. get, you know, the baby born and in in a. good state. But again, you're you're the. that baby's going to be born in in. hospital facilities. >> and maybe given to the family or the. state services. But I if not, if it's. not continued and she's in jail, I. assume she gets certain services while. awaiting trial, it's kind of. unbelievable to be thinking about, but I. guess that's the reality. Um, there is. something else I wanted your opinion on. So, there's a lot more details I want to. talk about, but I I'm just curious what.

you make of this statement. So, while. both Hogue and Penny's next court dates. are set for January 5th, 2026, Prosecutor Robinson said, quote, "My. office will be doing a more thorough. review of the file to make a formal. charging decision. We always want to. make sure that we have as much. information as possible, so we're making. the most informed decision. That's part. of the reason the investigation took a. while in the case was because of the. thoroughess of the investigation, waiting on autopsy results and different. search warrants and things like that.". What does that mean to you? >> I'm not quite sure. You know, you and I.

are used to analyzing cases all over the. country, and sometimes it's hard to. compare apples to grapefruit, and we're. talking about a fairly small town in. Arkansas with what has become a fairly. highprofile murder case because of the. deedants affiliation with professional. wrestling. He was a celebrity. And so, a. lot of times, and I I hate to use the. word podunk, but I'm going to go ahead. and do it because I'm from the south and. I'm allowed. you have fairly small town. prosecutors that are thrown into the.

limelight and realize, uh-oh, you know, not only is is my case going to be. reported, but any mistakes I make are. going to be reported, too. So, and the. trial and so you you you want to you. want to extremely button up and make. sure you're doing your best effort when. the world is essentially watching. >> Yeah. So, it'll be interesting if the. charges are upgraded or modified uh in. some way what that's going to look like. um what they'll be formalized to be. But. I want to get into this these two.

different narratives here, what. potential defenses. So this is from. reporting by uh Northwest Arkansas. Democrat uh Democrat Gazette. And there. are also more details from a probable. cause affidavit that's part of this. case. So on the day of the shooting, Kevin reported to a sheriff's deputy. that Hogue had been around his son, that. this is apparently a violation of the. divorce decree that he had with Penny. And actually, according to Nickel, the. child can't be around somebody who has. criminal convictions or pending criminal.

cases. This was his apparent objection. to Hogue being around. And one of the. reasons that he reported this to the. deputy or allegedly reported this to the. deputy is because Kevin was concerned. that Hogue would want to fight him over. this. Later on that night, Penny. apparently reports that Kevin had broken. into their home, obstructed the security. camera with spray paint, took some. things, destroyed others, and then left. Now, this John is all the buildup to the. shooting and we will talk about the. circumstances of the shooting because. there's two competing narratives here.

How do we make sense of that and and. what what do you make of those two. different uh narratives? Could both. things be true at once? Is one side. telling the truth and the other's not? But you're seeing a buildup here. you. are seeing a buildup, you know, which is. which is another reason why I think this. case got amplified is is you you have, you know, you have professional. wrestling script coming to reality with. tension. Hog's head, he has like the. classic head tattoo. You have the. villain that you want here. And at the.

end of the day, the divorce court and. the prosecutors and investigators will. kind of figure out about security. cameras. But again, even if you know, Knuckles Madson was the bad guy and. spray painting security cameras, you. can't go murder him. >> But this will all be part of a case, right? This is not going to be just. about what happened on that highway. It's also going to be about everything. that was leading up to it. So, it's. almost not a mini trial, but this is. going to be maybe a larger trial than we.

imagined. It's going to be building up. to what was going on. Certainly, and. some of it might be kept out via motion. and lemony, but you know, at the end of. the day, it's pretty clear you've got. most people want to tie a bow at the end. of a divorce. Divorce is finalized. Everybody moves on. But here, the. wrestler's spouse was impregnated. There. was tensions with this criminal new. boyfriend and it intersected their other. child's relationship. And so, you know, it there was tension. There's no. question there was tension. I think.

there were some text messages. Um, and. and you know, normally that can be. resolved, but it it seems like you just. had, you know, a out of the ordinary. aggression, which which led to a. shooting. >> This goes to intent, right? It goes to. the circumstances of a potential. self-defense case, cuz that's what I. want to get into, right? Okay. So, you. fast forward a couple hours later, and. there is this 911 call about the. shooting. A deputy apparently saw Kevin. responds to the scene. Apparently saw.

Kevin throw a revolver at the deputy's. car. The deputy sees the gunshot wound. This is where Kevin allegedly told the. deputy, this is big, told the deputy. that it was Hogue who shot him. And it. should be noted that the medical. examiner would confirm that Kevin died. from the gunshot wound to the abdomen. The testing on the gun that Kevin. allegedly threw and the bullet taken out. of his body did in fact show that the. bullet was fired from the gun. John, isn't this what we call in the law a. dying declaration? Right. So, normally.

to have a statement from the victim, that would be hearsay. But what are we. talking about? If I mean, this seems to. be a classic example of a dying. declaration. Am I right? Explain to our. viewers if I'm right and and if that's. uh and what that is. >> Right. Certainly. So, hearsay has a. bunch of different exceptions. hearsay. is the classic out of court statement. that you usually keep out of court. because it rings as true if it's brought. into court. >> and there's no way to verify it like you. there's a liability particularly with a.

deedent and so those words are often. more protected because what somebody. says you just want to keep it out as. secondary information but a dying. declaration an excited utterance certain. types of things have hallmarks of truth. and reliability that the courts let them. in and so you had gap from the time that. Nickel was shot in the abdomen to the. time he dies and he identifies what. happened to him. And that has extra. reliability. They'll they'll piece it. together with the the scientific.

evidence and and I think it comes in. >> and it all becomes down to whether or. not the jury believes this deputy and. whether the defense will probably say, "Are you sure that's what you heard? What was the state in which uh you know. Kevin said this to you? Was he mumbling? Did he seem coherent? Did he know what. he was saying? And you know, they'll. probably question whether or not he was. telling the truth. And that's tough, right? Cuz I'm anticipating what the. defense may argue. But they may say, and. we'll get into what this potential. self-defense argument is. They may say,

"You can't believe Kevin in that moment. He was putting the blame on Hogue. I. will tell you though, everything I just. said is consistent with what prosecutor. Robinson had also said. He confirmed. that there was an argument that led to. the shooting. Told 5 News, quote, after. being shot, Mr. Nickel was able to. obtain the firearm and go seek help from. somebody driving down the road nearby. Unfortunately, he was not able to be. saved and confirmed that Kevin Nickel. did actually admit that it was Hog who. did this to him. Allegedly did this to. him. But now you go to the affidavit. So. Hogue presented a different narrative to.

authorities about what happened. Maybe. not surprising here. He alleged that he. and Penny were driving when they see. Kevin at the bottom of the hill at. Beavershores Road in Arkansas 12. And. that is where Hoe claims that Kevin. pulled out a gun, they start fighting, the gun goes off, and after the shooting. happens, he and Penny go back to their. home. So, you wonder, is this a case of. self-defense? Now, according to the. affidavit, there are messages between. Kevin and Hogue where they are insulting. each other and discussing meeting at.

quote, "the bottom of the hill.". According to the affidavit, Penny. supports this narrative and apparently. told the deputy that she tried to step. in and break up the fight. says both of. them were covered in blood, that Kevin. put his arm around her neck at one. point. However, I will tell you that the. affidavit notes that it didn't look like. Penny had any visible injuries on her. neck. Now, reportedly, she says that she. saw Kevin walk away after the gun went. off. It's also been alleged that Penny. apparently called Kevin's mother, told. her that Hog shot him. Now, to be clear,

she claims neither she nor Hog ever. brought a gun. There's an issue here, though. The affidavit notes that. apparently investigators got video. surveillance and they can see Kevin in. this area walking around before the. shooting. Their analysis is that he's. walking around and he doesn't appear to. have a gun in his hands. And the. affidavit also notes that there were two. baseball bats found near the scene. And. by the way, Kevin and Penny's son. confirmed that one of those bats was.

his. John, I knew I threw a lot of. details at you, but the question. becomes, >> is self-defense possible here? >> I I I don't like self-defense here. You. know, you you've got you've you've just. got too many leaps that you have to take. because let's just say that they were. meeting to fight. And that's knowing, right? You're intending to go to a fight. with Knuckles Madson, you know, Kevin. Nickel. Meanwhile, that doesn't. eliminate the possibility of. self-defense if one person brings a gun. to a bat fight, right? But there's no.

gun from Kevin's perspective. Either way. you tie this, somebody shot their way. out of a fight. And I just find it hard. to believe that Amanda and Michael were. just traveling down the road and stopped. at this fight when they could have kept. going and it escalated and the person. that they wanted dead is dead. It's just. all too coincidental. And I think that's. why prosecutors are kind of just just.

holding on to determine what level of of. death is this first degree, second. degree, you know, what what's going on. But but this also kind of explains why. it took so long for there to be arrests. here, right? I mean, it seemed like they. really needed to do almost like a crime. scene analysis, a reconstruction of the. events that happened. And they might. have believed that there was a struggle. where the gun went off and, you know, this wasn't a case of murder. But it. seems like the history, the messages,

perhaps it's their accounts don't match. up with other evidence where they think. that this is a murder charge. But is it. is it clear-cut? Is it clear? You know, because if this is I've seen other cases. before where you, you know, the. defendants are accused of luring someone. out, open fire, the victim has no idea. what's coming, comes out of nowhere. If. they can establish that there was a. struggle, there was a fight, this case. could get a little bit more complicated. I totally agree and and oftentimes I'm.

commenting on cases that I kind of. predict the result and so I can I can. comfortably take more of a side here. I. could argue either side. I've done. criminal defense. I've done victim's. rights and I like the perspective that. prosecutors have a little bit more here. because of the nature of the history and. the escalation. But like you said, the defense would. simply characterize the victim, Kevin. Nickel, as this hothead professional. wrestler who was escalating. And so. either way, we've just got to see how.

everything shakes out. And as a. prosecutor, you know, you don't have to. win them all, particularly in small. towns. But you do have to give juries. the right to hear the cases that are. close or a crime. And so they're going. to make their statements and do their. thing, but it ultimately becomes, you. know, a jury of the peers that that. decides whether this was what level of. crime this was, if it was one. >> Well, it's being reported that these two. defendants, their arraignments are. scheduled for 8:00 a.m. January 5th. The.

judge ordered both of them not to have. any contact with Kevin Nichols family. and the minor child in this case, which. is not surprising here, right, John? >> No, not surprising at all. My law. partner does family law and he loves. family law. I love and and I don't mean. it in a bad way. I love juicy wrongful. death. Like it just it touches my heart. to help families. And rarely do our. worlds intersect. But in cases like. this, they intersect. And it's just. horrible, horrible circumstances when we. just wish people could figure out their.

relationship issues without it ending in. abuse, death, harm to children. Because. at the end of the day, you you've got a. father that's dead and you've got, you. know, uh other parents that that are. facing the criminal justice system. And. so there's there's just no winners. >> You're right. There's no winners. There. is a loss. It it becomes the question of. what is justice in this case. Uh what. happened in this case? But you you. mentioned family, right? So Kevin's. mother, Susan Kinderman, told 5 News,

quote, I just hope that we have a lot of. answers. I know that the justice system. will work. Whatever penalty they get, I'm fine with. But instead of that, I. want to make sure that we know exactly. what happened and why. I would like to. hear it from them. I don't know if I. will, but I would rather hear from those. two. And we'll just have to see how that. comes out. By the way, John, it seems to. me if this goes to trial, both of them. would have to explain what happened. They would have to take the stand. They. don't have to. You know, it's not. mandatory. It's their decision. But to. explain away what happened, I feel like.

them getting on the stand and trying to. uh you know give their narrative about. what happened is important for a jury to. hear. >> Exactly. You you've especially since. they have to confront Again, the reason. it's hearsay that we were talking about. is because Kevin is no longer able to. say it in court himself. So it's got to. come through a deputy. But to the extent. they've got to confront the deedent. Kevin Nichols statement about how this. happened, they've got to address that. And I think you got to address it pretty. head on. >> Now, let me just end on this. This guy,

Kevin Nickel, was beloved. Okay, the. Ozark Mountain Wrestling shared a. tribute to Facebook on July 12th, mourned him. Quote, "The shock of his. loss is felt deeply by everyone who knew. and loved him. He was an amazing friend. and had a fierce love for his family, especially his beloved son." And Ozark. Mountain Wrestling held a tribute show. in Kevin's honor July 19th in Rogers. The National Wrestling Alliance, the NWA. Texas, released a statement saying, "NWA. Texas is saddened to learn of the. passing of Kevin Nickel, professionally. known as Ivan Warsaw and Knuckles.

Madson. His contributions to. professional wrestling will never be. forgotten. Our thoughts and prayers are. with his family and friends during this. time. Rest in peace." And then you have. a friend of his, [clears throat] Logan. Pendergraft, who said, "Yeah, he was. like my brother. Said he was the best. guy I ever knew." Family is obviously. distraught and trying to make sense of. what has happened here. John Phillips, thank you so much for taking the time. Good to see you. >> My pleasure. Great to see you. >> And that's all we have for you right now. here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so. much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple.

Podcast, Spotify, wherever you should. get your podcasts. You can follow me. [music] on X or Instagram. I'm Jesse. Weber. I'll speak to you next time.